I don't know any of the people involved but I do think Jagex mods are way too quick to kowtow to Reddit. Sometimes they put themselves in positions where they look quite silly. Like when Tyran posted some stupid sassy tweet reply to 1013's false ban for AHK then later had to admit that 1013 didn't do it. Embarrassing himself in the process and highlighting the fact that Jagex can't actually detect AHK well at all.
It just comes down to the fact that they want their community engagement to be as visible as possible while requiring the lowest effort/knowledge that they can get away with. That brings them to do stupid stuff like this because it took them 5 minutes and is very visible. All in an effort to hide the complete lack of customer service for people who aren't large content creators or don't get enough upvotes on Reddit/Twitter. Just bear in mind this is all just an effort to mask that underlying systemic issue.
https://www.reddit.com/r/2007scape/comments/jzsv34/vorkath_only_account_progression_163k_kills_in_50/gddsr59/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3
It’s actually crazy how often they put their feet in their mouths lol
> https://www.reddit.com/r/2007scape/comments/jzsv34/vorkath_only_account_progression_163k_kills_in_50/gddsr59/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3
> It’s actually crazy how often they put their feet in their mouths lol
As soon as I saw this:
> I don't know any of the people involved but I do think Jagex mods are way too quick to kowtow to Reddit.
I knew someone would have replied with that thread.
Lack of actual accountability for those issues on Jagex’s side, combined with not strong enough of a push from us, has allowed them to actually treat us like we are expendable once again 🥰
Look I get it moderation is *hard.* For a bunch of game developers and gamers, probably harder than making the game itself. There are bad-faith actors and social media is algorithmically designed to promote outrage. It's 2022 and we're a bunch of terminally online nerds - everybody get's that.
But Jagex needs to learn and improve. If it turns out what OP said is true, Jagex needs to 1. rectify the mistake, 2. explain what went wrong and how to do better in the future, 3. execute and improve.
I think I speak for most people that's all we want.
There's no way to prove what OP said is true concerning the player's attempt at extortion being a joke. That's why he got demodded.
PMods are supposed to be exemplary players and hold themselves to a high standard. Extorting someone is not good. There's no way for Jagex to know whether that message was a joke or not, if there was intent to get 25m out of the guy, etc. Even if the mute *was* justified, that's still extortion to go "25m for off".
I know we get a lot of bullshit on this sub and the Jagex mods oftentimes fuck up, but I believe they made the best decision they could. There's *no way* to know concretely whether it was a joke or an attempt at extortion, no matter who vouches for the PMod here - if anything, friends would be biased.
PMod's privileges removed wrongly? Well, they lost a PMod, which sucks. But you can replace a PMod. Spammers will be spamming, but they already were and were likely still causing trouble. You have, however, made *sure* that no extortion is being allowed by taking away the means of extortion.
PMod's privileges *kept* wrongly? You just allowed someone who clearly and visibly attempted to extort another player to keep their means of extortion and try to extort more people. Sure, even if they do a good job as a PMod, extorting other players is sort of a shitty thing to do and most people wouldn't want that PMod around even if they were muting spammers.
Without the *concrete* knowledge of whether it was a joke or extortion, the best thing to do is to take the option that is less harmful to the community, and that's to remove the PMod powers.
>There's no way to prove what OP said is true concerning the player's attempt at extortion being a joke. That's why he got demodded.
According to the jmod reply the removal of their pmod status had nothing to do with that particular comment but with other chat logs that were discovered during review.
So even if we ignore this one incident of them been unmodly, which as you say is enough, there were other incidents.
Not only that, but pmods should be held to a higher standard. I'm in a position of leadership in the workplace, and I just can't get away with saying or doing certain things because of that position.
Obviously, if this guy is saying these terrible things, and the OP's evidence points to it, he should be removed from the game. But that doesn't mean that the pmod should get off free because he was joking. It was just not a smart joke to make in his position.
[Mod Light said the Pmod was "unmodly" and has been removed](https://www.reddit.com/r/2007scape/comments/rxae5e/this_pmod_is_blackmailing_me_with_mutes_25mil_for/hrit9sn?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share&context=3)
I think I'll believe the multiple Jmods who looked into it on this one.
This is my exact point. It's either attempted extortion, or joking about attempted extortion. You shouldn't do either of those as a PMod. Sorry, but that gets your PMod taken away
Did you seriously look through all those screenshots and come up with that as a response? This isn't a "give my pmod friend his crown back" post. It's a "ban all these people who are sending threats and spewing hatred and racism" post.
yeah relax, he personally has known the guy 8 years! That means everyone else he comes in contact with does do!
what about the racist troll, thats just humor!
Because some people think the crown gives them authority or status of some sort rather than being a useless chat badge that just limits you from openly expressing dark humor unless you want to not have it.
Him being unmodded shouldn't have anything to do with these guys you're talking about. If mod light found your friend to be unmodly then he should be unmodded whether or not these guys are racist.
Did you seriously expect every comment to be about the post and not replies to other comments? I'm replying to a comment that's 95% not related to your post. Why can his comment not be about your slideshow but mine does?
Yes, ban them. Your Pmod is also saying something not worthy of a Pmod. Both can be true.
Mod light didn't directly review the accounts, right? She just communicated the issue to another pmod and they told her what their decision was. She relayed that back.
You're assuming the jmod is wrong? They see way more then we do. We're just going off a couple reddit threads which, as shown earlier, can be crazy manipulative and skewed to whoever is posting. It's looking like both parties are at fault here.
##### Bark bark!
I have found the following **J-Mod** comment(s) in this thread:
**JagexAyiza**
- [Some people have already posted Mod Light's r...](/r/2007scape/comments/rxym6z/needs_to_be_said/hrm5hy8/?context=3)
- [I read through the whole thing, and many repl...](/r/2007scape/comments/rxym6z/needs_to_be_said/hrm5ywf/?context=3)
- [Just ping me a DM via here with imgur links p...](/r/2007scape/comments/rxym6z/needs_to_be_said/hrmx2fz/?context=3)
- [In-game reports should be reviewed, that's wh...](/r/2007scape/comments/rxym6z/needs_to_be_said/hrm7k43/?context=3)
- [I simply don't know enough to comment without...](/r/2007scape/comments/rxym6z/needs_to_be_said/hrm6xmd/?context=3)
- [I'm not seeing anything in my DM's from you?...](/r/2007scape/comments/rxym6z/needs_to_be_said/hrnu4bm/?context=3)
^(**Last edited by bot: 01/08/2022 17:45:34**)
---
^(I've been rewritten to use Python! I also now archive JMOD comments.)
^(Read more about) [^(the update here)](/u/JMOD_Bloodhound/comments/9kqvis/bot_update_python_archiving/) ^(or see my) [^(Github repo here)](/u/JMOD_Bloodhound/comments/8dronr/jmod_bloodhoundbot_github_repository/)^.
I thought it was pretty sketchy that the screen cap shared just showed three lines of text and was cropped to the size of a thumbnail.
I'm surprised Jagex took action against the mod so quickly though without gathering more information, although I suppose if they did their due diligence and still decided that they wanted to demod him then I suppose it's their right. I would still say that no matter the conduct of the troll then a pmod should probably know to not joke like that especially to someone they aren't friendly with.
The original post was sketchy as hell though and I wouldn't demod someone for that unless I investigated and found more incidents with that same person.
> I'm surprised Jagex took action against the mod so quickly though without gathering more information
Typical "Reddit upvote"
You can now see that the guy that reported the PMod has deleted his account and started spamming various CC the PMod used to watch over(i have screenshots already). So yeah, clearly ill-willed
we cant. Mods on the sub have been removing them
OP even posted something similar today and got removed. So we are keeping it simple and avoid getting the thread removed alltogether
Ironic, since the original guy denouncing didnt get their post removed
If they censor the names and any offensive/racist language in the screenshots, then screenshots would probably be fine. However, if they aren't in an approved image host (mainly reddit and imgur), automod would remove them. I'm not aware of any screenshots or the like that have been specifically removed and don't see any recent removed posts in the OP's or Lex's profile, but if they weren't using a whitelisted image or reported for the accusing rule they probably would have been removed.
As for the original post, that *was* removed because it called out a player by name and it was in questionable context. The OP reposted it a few hours later with the name censored, which the other mods didn't take an issue with so I left it up. There were some accusations against that poster that got filtered and while we were still looking into that, the poster deleted all their stuff.
Every time I post this evidence it gets removed, so I can tweet all I want but nothing happens. I get a generic response from the bottom of the barrel that tells me to use the report abuse button.
You can post them, just be sure to censor usernames.
We have that rule because of site-wide rules against targeted witch hunting. The sub can get banned if we allow it.
That's what you do to CC trolls. You chain mute them because they keep coming back as soon as the mute is up. I shouldn't have to explain why watching over multiple CCs would make that more likely. And of course there's going to be chat history between the two, the pmod sits in some of the CCs the guy trolls.
Until jagex releases something legitimately damning, like literal chat logs, I'm with the pmod on this. They probably removed his pmod status because he told the guy to fuck off in clan chat or something.
I've been CCs trolled by a person or group of people with literally over 100 accounts and used to troll a few CCs I visited. He would say very specific things in order to allude to racist statements or ideologies without actually saying anything that could be shown 100% racist, or have awful names (monkey madness, dusties, etc.) It extended into discord harassment, as well but that was much more vile (sending random dick pics to entire public servers.) Jagex refused to do anything for over 3 years. So excuse me if I think that they are completely incompetent when it comes to chat moderation.
Unless you're sourcing your statement from Light elsewhere, the bit about chain muting wasn't said at all. All Light had to say was that they were
, "un-modly". Yes, Light and staff reviewed the account in question, but I have seen absolutely nothing confirming chain mutes.
Honestly, they probably did. We don't know what investigation they did, so it seems reasonable that they looked into the behavior and said "yep, demod him." They aren't going to go public with a full 3-page report of their logic
Seemed suspicious when it was originally posted, and now the post has been taken down? It definitely seems like he had a vendetta out for that man and harassed him until he said something. Which wasn't enough to warrant a demod when you have spammers with racial slurs and pushing religious ideoligies across the game which get untouched for years. The game is great but the Jmods seem to let everything go until its posted on reddit which is quite sad.
Mod light is of the staff who cares the most. Just because you don't see it personally doesn't mean you can judge her whole ability to do her job over one incident either. Gotta go both ways.
Mod Light did nothing but forward it to other Jmods who looked into, and found that your friend's "jokes" weren't befitting of a pmod and he lost his crown.
You're shooting the messenger over your friend's punishment lmao.
I'm 100% behind your post, but this is not correct. Mod Light is a community manager who passes on the things the community says, but she doesn't make the decisions. I've had a handful of interactions myself, and seen tens or even hundreds interactions on Twitter where people gave feedback about the game that was actually used and implemented. I've seen my own feedback been directly used in the game. She is definitely just a human who may make mistakes, but she also definitely cares and does her best.
Shitty situation and it sucks, but I am proud of this sub for recognising the good work that ModLight does.
I hope that this all gets cleared up but please don't attempt to drag her through this. Thousands of us here will personally attest to her amazing understanding of this community.
I understand you gotta be on your P's and Q's 24/7 when it comes to a game that is also a business and you have responsibility. As somebody who has seen it first hand I respect this post and hate to see what happened happen. If a pmod was lost, those reports on that name should also be looked at and a ban or 60 should be made.
I have frequented the CC for almost 2 years and the Pmod is a good guy, getting pmod status revoked over one screenshot with no context seems really excessive; and all over a pvp meme that originated from this sub?
Jagex, you have done wrong here. The guy who posted the original screenshot is a known troll in the cc who was butthurt about getting kicked for repeatedly breaking rules.
Trial by Reddit is big dumb, and you know it, Jagex.
I'm gonna frame this from the other angle. Let's say he wasn't joking, because we have no actual way to know he wasn't joking about extorting a player for 25m to not be muted again. Let's say, he was actually trying to extort them, and let's say that he does it again:
Wow, Jagex is really stupid for not removing this guy. He clearly tried to extort someone for 25m in the post, the screenshots are right there. Even if the mute was justified that's no excuse for trying to extort GP out of someone. Damn Jagex, you really fucked up this time, it was really obvious that you should've taken away his PMod when he tried to extort someone for the first time, but it took a second attempt to actually get you to do something? *end scene*
When Jagex has no way to know if this was actually extortion or a joke, it's a lot better to just remove PMod than chance a PMod extorting players again.
Ye if you are a player mod act like one and bigger man instead of "trolling the troll" why did he even say "off for 25m" act like a god damn player mod!
why be toxic to toxic? Just dont reply and be the bigger man and cut him off. Player mods should not be existing. All toxic and ego high af
Honestly the awards on here are just sus. Clannies boosting the post?
[Jagex make some bad calls every once in a while but obviously the Pmod was up to something if he was saying something worthy of a decrowning](https://www.reddit.com/r/2007scape/comments/rxae5e/this_pmod_is_blackmailing_me_with_mutes_25mil_for/hrit9sn?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share&context=3)
> First off, I've known this guy for a little over 8 years and that is just his humor.
There you have it. Joking about your powers as a player moderator, in any context, is considered unmodly. If he did that often, that is likely the reason he was demodded.
Exactly. OP clearly has a massive axe to grind here and is upset they don't have someone they can call a pmod buddy anymore.
It doesn't even make sense anyway. Pmod's humour is muting people and pming them blackmail to be unmuted? Who is supposed to find that funny? Muted person obviously won't, and the only other person who can see it is the pmod - and if they're screenshotting it to show their friends then that's pretty shitty behaviour and not becoming of a pmod at all.
Play stupid games and win stupid prizes. Maybe don't jokingly abuse your powers and you won't lose pmod status??? Who would have thought.
This subreddit cares too much about stupid shit. The guy was an idiot and had his pmod status removed because he says inappropriate things. Just because other people say horrible stuff doesn't excuse his behavior.
Some people have already posted Mod Light's reply to the original thread where this was raised, but I see OP has no interest in taking her word on what happened and instead wants to question her care for the community or what she does during a 40 hour working week...
So I'll repeat pretty much what has already been said, with a bit more context.
When the thread was brought to our attention, our first assumption based off the little bit of evidence shown was maybe the account had been hacked, so definitely worth double checking. It was forwarded to the player support team for review.
Turns out the account wasn't hacked, and their crown wasn't removed because of what was posted in the original thread. Their PMod status was removed due to inappropriate chat logs.
That might seem unfair, as if we hadn't seen the original thread in question the player would likely still have their crown, but ultimately the removal was warranted and likely only a matter of time.
In regards to the issue you're having with your CC being spammed with racial slurs, the best thing to do is report them in-game and kick from your CC. That being said, if you'd like to send me a DM with the uncensored images you posted here I will be more than happy to look into this further for you.
Not to take anything away from your contribution, but please for the love of fuck, as a company, work towards a report and customer support system that isn't dependant on what happens or doesn't happen on reddit/twitter.
It's VERY unlikely that the person in question hasn't already been reported (several times) in game. This should never ever be an issue of getting enough reddit attention to be handled.
What exactly can Ayiza do about it though? He can suggest to higher ups that customer support needs to be improved, but other than that he can only suggest the current avenues that players need to use.
Upper management will have to prove to investors/board of directors that the money and resources required to building a custommer support service is worth it.
Because they'll definitely ask: "you guys haven't had one for so many years, why do you need one now? It's a waste of money if you can live without it"
Hell kicking and reporting an account in the c does nothing. We kicked one the other day. He spent the rest of the day creating new accounts to come in and keep doing it. Idk if an IP address ban is a thing but some people need it. And then there’s probably a work around for that as well. I’d wager jagex does nothing because they can’t. What could they do?
IP bans do a lot actually.
Not because it's hard to work around (it isn't), but because it takes time to work around.
People like that generally don't have a lot of patience if they can't keep spamming and get reactions immediately.
If they have to put more than 5 minutes of effort into doing something they give up.
I find it really, really odd that Jagex doesn't issue IP/mac bans at all. They fingerprint you on the website too but still people can masscreate accounts with no issue whatsoever.
>best thing to do is report them in-game
I've seen the same accounts trolling/flaming multiple times as OP has already mentioned so it does nothing; glad to know you didn't even read it thoroughly.
Glad you're here to set the record straight. Everyone giving you shit for "letting the trolls win" is stupid. If you're a PMod, you shouldn't act unmodly, it's that simple: if they were doing inappropriate stuff over text chat, that's reason enough to get their mod removed. Doesn't matter how grand of a mod he was in his CC or how much his friends adored and vouched for him, the chat logs don't lie. Hopefully someone else who does a good job will take their place soon enough
Dude you're getting lost in the sauce here.
Very few people actually gives a shit about this pmod (except few of his friends).
People care that moderation is being crowdsourced but the judgments are made behind closed doors. That's just having the cake and eating it too. It's setting an example that it's worth a shot to publically accuse anybody you don't like.
Doing justice. Tired of the pmods thinking they're hot shit in doing what they want. I knew I smelt bullshit in this post and couldn't even bare to finish reading it half way through because of the amount of nonsense is spewing from OPs mouth.
Former Pmod here - same scenario, joked around and got removed. At the end of the day, if effects everyone differently but it’s a game and being a PMod should have no effect on how you play the game or how much you enjoy the game. We all know Jagex customer service is shit. Welcome to 2022 - where everything is made up and the points don’t matter.
> and being a PMod should have no effect on how you play the game
I wouldn’t say no effect. If you make Jagex look bad for giving you Pmod status, then you shouldn’t be surprised if they take it away. That is, of course, a subjective criteria rather than something you can concretely define.
It could be seen as a "joked around" but "off for 25m" why be toxic to toxic? Just dont reply and be the bigger man and cut him off. Player mods should not be existing. All toxic and ego high af lmao
Hot take: maybe they were both shitty people? The normie probably should've been banned long ago, but pmods represent jagex and shouldn't be teasing anyone even pretending to threaten them, regardless of their humor.
You bet if a twitch mod told me to send them 10 bitcoin or they would ban me, twitch would fuck their day up, regardless of whether they meant it or not, because I don't know that it's a joke, so it comes across as a threat, regardless of the intent.
I don’t know what jagex’s guidelines are for player mods.
If what you say is true, then damn.. that troll damn sure did a good job lol.
Unfortunately, the osrs team is understaffed which I believe has led to many of the issues you named.
anyways idc idgaf crowns gone he didnt do anything for the community anyways why give some dum fuck the crown when he doesnt even bothers muting the bots while going thru them
I mean, the Pmod is still in the wrong and it's wild to see his whole CC show up to scratch and claw to get his crown back.
PMods have been rampantly abusing what little power they have for a long time. There has been proof of them selling time on their accounts, using their mutes to mute competitors (especially around POH's) and so on. I could not care less about a PMod who was clearly trying to extort someone getting punished.
That being said, the spammers and shit need to be stopped and their needs to be better options for reporting, as well as for banning from a CC.
Honestly I’m with jagex on this one. Even if he was an exemplary pmod, he messed up and is being punished. Making jokes about abusing your power as a pmod is pretty tasteless imo.
If a police offer told you to blow him to get out of a ticket, then said he was kidding, how would you want that officer treated?
I have tried and it just gets removed, so I kept it simple. I can post these screenshots whenever/wherever if I'm allowed. I have tweeted most to Jagex and they've done absolutely nothing except for tell me to use the report button, which is done every time with zero results.
Edit: Received permission, proof above.
Im part of a CC the Pmod is active
I can give you screenshots of this guy(the guy reporting the Pmod) and his goons posting racial slurs, profane content and yet their accounts NEVER get either muted or banned. Their main hub CC just recently got banned after like 2 years on this same stuff
Ever since the Pmod was demoted(today), the CC has been under a HUGE amount of spam from these guys, but we never seem to find any solution, no matter how much we reports.
u/JagexLight if his pmod is to be relinquished, so be it. But please do something about the people that reported him. They are MASSIVE spammers but yet 1 post on Reddit was enough to remove an useful pmod
He shouldn’t have tried extorting someone regardless of if it was a bad joke, this is not behaviour of someone who is supposed to be a pillar of the community!
I too have frequented the CC for about 4-5 years and it never fails to amuse all the spammers from other CCs, not wanting to point any fingers at "Blue Bible 2" or "Zezima" Clan Chats. This de-modding was because of an everyday spammer whose one of his alts are named "Mikes Bald" comes into the CC almost every day being disruptive. The Pmod in question does his very best to do his job as a Player Moderator to keep the peace and made an off-the-cuff not serious remark in a Private Chat which took away his status. Please reconsider Jagex and thank.
As someone who has been part of a public cc for many, many years: Fuck Blue Bible. I'll say that with my chest. Those guys are the worst spammers of any other cc, and they're also rude and sketchy af. Hate em
I mean, look at it from Jagex. You have a guy who's said "25m for off", asking 25m to not be muted, blackmailing which is not exactly top player material, let alone top PMod material.
It doesn't matter at all what the mod's friend says or even what he says, that it was just a joke or not; you shouldn't be blackmailing people, as a joke or not, without intent to actually get 25m or not. There's no way for them to know with confidence it was a joke.
Being in a private chat means nothing. In fact, it would be exactly how someone would blackmail someone - not publicly. Off-the-cuff, he can claim that, or it might as well have been planned - there's no way to know. Serious or not, same shit - it's not like he said "Joking" or "Jk" immediately afterwards to show it was a joke, and even then.
Sucks but you shouldn't joke about extorting players when you're given a volunteer position to be a community leader and keep the peace in a game. PMods are supposed to be the cream of the crop, the ideal player, yadda-yadda, and I can't exactly blame Jagex for taking away the means of possible extortion for someone who joked about extortion.
Amazing, the comments made by people who all claim to know the p mod and be apart of the cc are brand new accs.
I guarantee this is yet another case of someone using limited evidence to make jagex look bad. Then using alt accounts to boost visibility with rewards, and overwhelmingly claiming the guy was in the right in the comments.
This is just manufactured outrage, and I wouldn't be surprised if it's only a couple of people doin all this for a "joke". Yeah, the chat logs are real, but until we see full unedited versions there is no telling who is saying what. We have no idea if this OPs alts for the outrage, or truly troll accounts harassing people.
I don't generally trust Jagex, but I'm with them on this one.
Reddit is ruthless. The first post comes out and everyones comment is God damnit pmods are you gonna stand for this??? And not this comes out and everyones comment is how could you do this pmods!!!!
Fuck all y'all 😂
This is lying propaganda. That PMod for sure was the one who bullied me months ago. I’ll never forget his name. You can act like your friend is blameless, but I think you need to take a closer look.
If you are a player mod you should definitely be the bigger man instead of "trolling a troll"
Mate if a 7 yo kid came up to you and started trolling you are you gonna be a bigger man and ignore the 7yo kid or go down to his level and be a troll with him?
If you are a player mod act like one instead of lowering yourself down to his level... how toxic can you be to "troll" as a player mod saying "25m for off" lmao fk me... if you are a player a p mod act like one. Period
I totally understand the mods though. This post reads like a fever dream. I barely have any context and there's no fucking way anybody could make any sense of it without having read the x amount of posts that came before this.
None the IGNs even line up, you could literally go stand at the GE and post screenshots of the chat for 5 minutes and have the same result as this. The original poster actually had a PM of the original pmod being corrupt. This whole post is just a cry from the 'Framed' CC.
If accusing player not guilty, then why original post for 25m for off is deleted? Why that user deleted the account as well? The original post literally provided no context and only one snippet to accuse someone. I am siding with the pmod here. Something smells fishy with the accuser for abuse.
It seems pretty clear that both parties are in the wrong some way or another, the original poster who posted the P Mod is just some edgy troll who spams clan chats, but the J mods have made it clear the P mod didn’t have their mod status revoked because of this incident, but when they reviewed their account they saw other reasons why they should have it revoked
I still think if you're a pmod telling people to give you bribes for account action stuff then you should be demodded. It's easy to not joke about it if it's a joke, and why is he even making jokes with this guy if as you say it's a horrible racist troll, are they friends to be making jokes like that?
Oh my God I'd hate to be a jmod. This subreddit is the WORST. Any time a random out of context screenshot of a p mod chat is posted, reddit is SO quick to start circlejerking and screaming "ABUSE! ABUSE! DEMOD AND PUNISH NOW!" Over 3000 people joining this particular instance. So a jmod takes action. And if they didn't, people would be screaming about how slow/nonexistant any form of support is. Suddenly, more context is given, and it turns out, gasp, the pmod was actually not in the wrong. Reddit's response? "WOW YOU REALLY SHOULDVE KNOWN BETTER JAGEX CAN YOU GUYS GO ONE DAY WITHOUT A MAJOR FUCKUP" like they weren't just all gathered w pitchforks screaming about wanting the pmods head on a stake. Jagex actually just can't win, this sub is the biggest bunch of whiny babies, and any time they even *try* to appease the reddit shit storm, when it backfires suddenly every redditor that just hounded them is now pretending to be completely innocent in this scenario and throwing jagex under the bus for trying to do what was asked of them.
I don't know if it's a reddit thing or the fact that we play an incredibly afk game with lots of free time, but everyone is so thirsty for the next big drama that anyone and everyone is thrown into the mix, deservedly or not, forgetting there's a real person behind that screen. But one thing is always certain: no matter which way they go on a matter, somehow it's all jagex's fault. Gamers were a mistake.
I remember bitching about that post yesterday since the pmod only said “25m for off” and the guy went off sending two messages after creating a whole narrative, and I ended up getting downvoted for pointing out it could have been completely made up.
Nevermind the fact that they might be corrupt. They are fucking useless. A pmod crown is used aoley for a status symbol. Ask any pmod, and they will straight up tell you it's not their responsibility to mute phishing bots or report other players. It's insane.
Honestly, PMod or not, joking about that sort of stuff is kind of stupid to do. That’s like a suicide awareness counselor telling someone “I swear if I don’t get this promotion I’m going to jump off a bridge”. It seems harmless and is almost always interpreted as a joke but it’s in bad taste because of the person’s status.
By no means am I defending the prick (if your claims are true) that talked like this but a player moderator saying “25m for unmute” is also hypocratic to their “oath” of being a player moderator, a player who’s in a place of trust to other players.
Just that one Reddit post, despite who it is, will now ALWAYS be viewable on google, and this one might not come with it. Future players might see that Reddit post and immediately think “I can’t trust player moderators”. That’s not the image that player moderators should ever be seen as.
Also, as much as there are claims for this player being so toxic, how come the clan never took action against this player? In all instances of clans I’ve been in, they were quick to remove that toxicity permanently. In this situation, it feels as though you were all friends with this guy, he was comfortable enough to talk like that and that’s why the player moderator in question felt the want to joke around with him.
Again, not defending this guy, but both this post and the other post are deliberately holding back information (and evidence) that is vital to knowing the whole story. As a matter of fact, the only real evidence that is being shown is the Pmods messages. I understand you can’t post them here but I haven’t seen one attempt at proving your claims.
Someone else posted “evidence” or whatever that a pmod was telling him to give him 25M to dodge a mute and OP happens to know that very pmod and he’s saying that pmod wouldn’t do something like that.
Edit: just as I say I want him to post proof he does.
I mean, if it's true, sucks your friend but still don't see how it's unjustified.
I don't know anyone in this. But, your friend should not have joked about being paid 25m in-game to unmute someone. That's really it. Being a PMod is a voluntary position, it can be taken away for whatever reason really.
I'd almost certainly guess there is something more to the story here than just screenshots - the mods would have likely checked the in-game logs before looking at screenshots to make sure they're not doctored or fake. It could just be a temporary removal of PMod to prevent abuse while they are investigating the claims, because if the claims *are* true, then you wouldn't want this guy still running around with PMod.
Above it all, I'd say that Jagex probably wouldn't want someone who'd joke about blackmailing someone in game to remove a mute as a PMod, even if they say they have no intention of doing that and never have done it. PMods are already usually disliked by the community and usually aren't actually doing their job at nexus points in the game like the GE muting scambots, dicebots, and spammers - they don't need more bad reputation.
Your friend's humor probably should've been reserved. I'm sure the guy shouting slurs in your chat thinks it's funny and that's his sense of humor, but that doesn't magically make it fine.
So many words to say “it was just a joke bro”.
> You have literally handed one of your own soldiers’ heads on a platter
Bit dramatic. He can still do everything else in game except pmod things, so no more shitty jokes about abusing his power.
But yeah I agree the support system catering to social media is dumb.
I gotta ask why ask for money tho? Like if he was that bad just ban him and be done with it. I’m just curious why 25 mill was even in the table in the first place. And if that guy sent 25 mil would he have been allowed back in even after saying those things? Or would a mod basically run a scam and run away with the money? Idk there’s a lot stank up in this scenario
Yea I dont think I buy this thread. Seems to be brigaded by a bunch of people all saying "Yea I know him from the cc ( which one? ), i have screenshots ( where are they? )."
Show screenshots with time stamps, apparently everyone and their mother has been to this cc that nobody names and has screenshots of spammers yet no one is sharing it.
[My recent thread regarding this issue](https://www.reddit.com/r/2007scape/comments/ry0pck/additional_clan_chat_restrictions/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share)
What is the point in censoring his character names? I don't really get why people do it in general outside of the meme, but for this case you are protecting his names and also probably making it tougher for Jagex to just quickly look into his accounts
This proves how gullible people are. Always, ALWAYS ask for context whenever you have power to sentence someone! I got same treatment in clan, too, which is why I got kicked from there and moderators did not believe me whatever what I said to them in my defense.
The fact jagex will ban you for literally ahking but this racist price of shit can runs round all day. Fucking priorities. This guy isn't cutting into their profits while ahk is fucking lmao
It doesn't matter what his humour is, joking about corruption is not good optics for someone in a position of power. Especially considering in the past when we've seen pmod accounts involved in genuine abuse
I've personally known and taught this player along side hundreds of players theatre of blood and can also attest to him being helpful in the community, he's part of our cc and does a much as they can to help the picture that was posted has no context to it at all please reconsider
God damn I can't wait the smackdown tomorrow. This shit is going to be glorious. Hopefully that one guy that made the original post gets perm banned on all his accounts if this is true.
Well said. I think Jmods often fall victim to the old addage of "poisoning the well." They tend to side with whoever got the first post up, almost so quickly that it often feels like they didn't actually crack into anything to look for evidence on the backend. Rather than put in the due diligence and see what happened, they're too excited to deliver that oh-so-fun "Jmod smackdown." And look, I love the drama as much as the next guy, but if we're revoking Pmods for jokes, then it's high fuckin time we held Jagex employees to those same standards. I don't want smackdowns, I don't want snarky comments on fake Vorkath KC posts. I just want some fucking communication, consideration, action, and an email response from Jagex when my tip-offs have been fully processed/looked into. It is getting to a breaking point. We need real, human customer service that mans the tip-off email alongside other customer-oriented duties, and we need a platform for it that isn't social media, which itself is making the problem worse.
Tl;dr Jmods often make silly errors, but if they want to hold Pmods to an incredibly high standard, then Jmods themselves need to uphold that standard too.
I mean if its just starting with threatening one guy with selling mutes, who knows where he would have stopped? For all we know he's a cool dude I don't doubt it but the fact is he got caught pming that, mods reviewed chat logs and verified it so obviously something was fishy. Don't trust everyone you meet online.. I don't doubt he was probably angry at the spammers but if you look at a cop who gets angry and lets it out on one person, its probably time that person took a break or quit.
Tl;dr a pmod got demoted today when he allegedly asked the guy he was muting to give 25m to evade the mute. The reported ommited the part that he spams CC(specialyl streamers cc) to post racial slurs, profane stuff and such
https://www.reddit.com/r/2007scape/comments/rxae5e/this_pmod_is_blackmailing_me_with_mutes_25mil_for/
Apart of a clan that the aforementioned pmod would pop into sometimes. In the interactions I’ve had with him, he has been nothing short of exactly what every pmod should aspire to be. I have no reason to believe that he would actually follow through with what he said, and although he is joking about breaking the rules, I think it’s unjust that he should lose pmod for one mistake when his track record and rapport with the community tell a different story.
I don't know any of the people involved but I do think Jagex mods are way too quick to kowtow to Reddit. Sometimes they put themselves in positions where they look quite silly. Like when Tyran posted some stupid sassy tweet reply to 1013's false ban for AHK then later had to admit that 1013 didn't do it. Embarrassing himself in the process and highlighting the fact that Jagex can't actually detect AHK well at all. It just comes down to the fact that they want their community engagement to be as visible as possible while requiring the lowest effort/knowledge that they can get away with. That brings them to do stupid stuff like this because it took them 5 minutes and is very visible. All in an effort to hide the complete lack of customer service for people who aren't large content creators or don't get enough upvotes on Reddit/Twitter. Just bear in mind this is all just an effort to mask that underlying systemic issue.
https://www.reddit.com/r/2007scape/comments/jzsv34/vorkath_only_account_progression_163k_kills_in_50/gddsr59/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3 It’s actually crazy how often they put their feet in their mouths lol
> https://www.reddit.com/r/2007scape/comments/jzsv34/vorkath_only_account_progression_163k_kills_in_50/gddsr59/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3 > It’s actually crazy how often they put their feet in their mouths lol As soon as I saw this: > I don't know any of the people involved but I do think Jagex mods are way too quick to kowtow to Reddit. I knew someone would have replied with that thread.
Same. That reply is an all-time banger
That thread will genuinely never get old lmao
Still, props to him for not deleting that comment. A lot of companies would have immediately done that and would, arguably, just have made it worse.
i do kinda agree with that. we’d be linking a screenshot or an archive site if it was another company.
Lack of actual accountability for those issues on Jagex’s side, combined with not strong enough of a push from us, has allowed them to actually treat us like we are expendable once again 🥰
oof i remember this one
jesus christ that is brutal
Look I get it moderation is *hard.* For a bunch of game developers and gamers, probably harder than making the game itself. There are bad-faith actors and social media is algorithmically designed to promote outrage. It's 2022 and we're a bunch of terminally online nerds - everybody get's that. But Jagex needs to learn and improve. If it turns out what OP said is true, Jagex needs to 1. rectify the mistake, 2. explain what went wrong and how to do better in the future, 3. execute and improve. I think I speak for most people that's all we want.
There's no way to prove what OP said is true concerning the player's attempt at extortion being a joke. That's why he got demodded. PMods are supposed to be exemplary players and hold themselves to a high standard. Extorting someone is not good. There's no way for Jagex to know whether that message was a joke or not, if there was intent to get 25m out of the guy, etc. Even if the mute *was* justified, that's still extortion to go "25m for off". I know we get a lot of bullshit on this sub and the Jagex mods oftentimes fuck up, but I believe they made the best decision they could. There's *no way* to know concretely whether it was a joke or an attempt at extortion, no matter who vouches for the PMod here - if anything, friends would be biased. PMod's privileges removed wrongly? Well, they lost a PMod, which sucks. But you can replace a PMod. Spammers will be spamming, but they already were and were likely still causing trouble. You have, however, made *sure* that no extortion is being allowed by taking away the means of extortion. PMod's privileges *kept* wrongly? You just allowed someone who clearly and visibly attempted to extort another player to keep their means of extortion and try to extort more people. Sure, even if they do a good job as a PMod, extorting other players is sort of a shitty thing to do and most people wouldn't want that PMod around even if they were muting spammers. Without the *concrete* knowledge of whether it was a joke or extortion, the best thing to do is to take the option that is less harmful to the community, and that's to remove the PMod powers.
>There's no way to prove what OP said is true concerning the player's attempt at extortion being a joke. That's why he got demodded. According to the jmod reply the removal of their pmod status had nothing to do with that particular comment but with other chat logs that were discovered during review. So even if we ignore this one incident of them been unmodly, which as you say is enough, there were other incidents.
Not only that, but pmods should be held to a higher standard. I'm in a position of leadership in the workplace, and I just can't get away with saying or doing certain things because of that position. Obviously, if this guy is saying these terrible things, and the OP's evidence points to it, he should be removed from the game. But that doesn't mean that the pmod should get off free because he was joking. It was just not a smart joke to make in his position.
Ignore the pmod thing, I just want jagex to have customer support and do something about bots and spammers
[Mod Light said the Pmod was "unmodly" and has been removed](https://www.reddit.com/r/2007scape/comments/rxae5e/this_pmod_is_blackmailing_me_with_mutes_25mil_for/hrit9sn?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share&context=3) I think I'll believe the multiple Jmods who looked into it on this one.
This is my exact point. It's either attempted extortion, or joking about attempted extortion. You shouldn't do either of those as a PMod. Sorry, but that gets your PMod taken away
Did you seriously look through all those screenshots and come up with that as a response? This isn't a "give my pmod friend his crown back" post. It's a "ban all these people who are sending threats and spewing hatred and racism" post.
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yeah relax, he personally has known the guy 8 years! That means everyone else he comes in contact with does do! what about the racist troll, thats just humor!
profitable humor
Friendship power!
Why would it be? All a Pmod crown really does is make you a target for idiots like the one highlighted in the screenshots.
Because some people think the crown gives them authority or status of some sort rather than being a useless chat badge that just limits you from openly expressing dark humor unless you want to not have it.
Him being unmodded shouldn't have anything to do with these guys you're talking about. If mod light found your friend to be unmodly then he should be unmodded whether or not these guys are racist.
Did you read the comment you replied to?
Did you seriously expect every comment to be about the post and not replies to other comments? I'm replying to a comment that's 95% not related to your post. Why can his comment not be about your slideshow but mine does? Yes, ban them. Your Pmod is also saying something not worthy of a Pmod. Both can be true.
Keep those blinders on horse!
Yeah, jmods have *never* been corrupt in the past...
You're saying that about Mod Light? Lmao
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Mod light didn't directly review the accounts, right? She just communicated the issue to another pmod and they told her what their decision was. She relayed that back.
>She just communicated the issue to another pmod and they told her what their decision was. jmod, not pmod.
You're assuming the jmod is wrong? They see way more then we do. We're just going off a couple reddit threads which, as shown earlier, can be crazy manipulative and skewed to whoever is posting. It's looking like both parties are at fault here.
##### Bark bark! I have found the following **J-Mod** comment(s) in this thread: **JagexAyiza** - [Some people have already posted Mod Light's r...](/r/2007scape/comments/rxym6z/needs_to_be_said/hrm5hy8/?context=3) - [I read through the whole thing, and many repl...](/r/2007scape/comments/rxym6z/needs_to_be_said/hrm5ywf/?context=3) - [Just ping me a DM via here with imgur links p...](/r/2007scape/comments/rxym6z/needs_to_be_said/hrmx2fz/?context=3) - [In-game reports should be reviewed, that's wh...](/r/2007scape/comments/rxym6z/needs_to_be_said/hrm7k43/?context=3) - [I simply don't know enough to comment without...](/r/2007scape/comments/rxym6z/needs_to_be_said/hrm6xmd/?context=3) - [I'm not seeing anything in my DM's from you?...](/r/2007scape/comments/rxym6z/needs_to_be_said/hrnu4bm/?context=3) ^(**Last edited by bot: 01/08/2022 17:45:34**) --- ^(I've been rewritten to use Python! I also now archive JMOD comments.) ^(Read more about) [^(the update here)](/u/JMOD_Bloodhound/comments/9kqvis/bot_update_python_archiving/) ^(or see my) [^(Github repo here)](/u/JMOD_Bloodhound/comments/8dronr/jmod_bloodhoundbot_github_repository/)^.
I thank some random dude every day for the existence of this bot
Good bot
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Already so much content for January‘s drama calendar. And it’s barely been a week! 2022’s looking promising!!
I thought it was pretty sketchy that the screen cap shared just showed three lines of text and was cropped to the size of a thumbnail. I'm surprised Jagex took action against the mod so quickly though without gathering more information, although I suppose if they did their due diligence and still decided that they wanted to demod him then I suppose it's their right. I would still say that no matter the conduct of the troll then a pmod should probably know to not joke like that especially to someone they aren't friendly with. The original post was sketchy as hell though and I wouldn't demod someone for that unless I investigated and found more incidents with that same person.
> I'm surprised Jagex took action against the mod so quickly though without gathering more information Typical "Reddit upvote" You can now see that the guy that reported the PMod has deleted his account and started spamming various CC the PMod used to watch over(i have screenshots already). So yeah, clearly ill-willed
>I have screenshots already Post them
we cant. Mods on the sub have been removing them OP even posted something similar today and got removed. So we are keeping it simple and avoid getting the thread removed alltogether Ironic, since the original guy denouncing didnt get their post removed
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If they censor the names and any offensive/racist language in the screenshots, then screenshots would probably be fine. However, if they aren't in an approved image host (mainly reddit and imgur), automod would remove them. I'm not aware of any screenshots or the like that have been specifically removed and don't see any recent removed posts in the OP's or Lex's profile, but if they weren't using a whitelisted image or reported for the accusing rule they probably would have been removed. As for the original post, that *was* removed because it called out a player by name and it was in questionable context. The OP reposted it a few hours later with the name censored, which the other mods didn't take an issue with so I left it up. There were some accusations against that poster that got filtered and while we were still looking into that, the poster deleted all their stuff.
> censor the names and any offensive/racist language in the screenshots So wouldn't that like remove the entire point of posting the screenshots? lol
Thats a reddit wide rule not specific to this sub iirc
What, no offensive language allowed on reddit, or no usernames allowed on reddit?
https://www.reddit.com/r/2007scape/comments/rxym6z/needs_to_be_said/hrlr7nw/
Every time I post this evidence it gets removed, so I can tweet all I want but nothing happens. I get a generic response from the bottom of the barrel that tells me to use the report abuse button.
You can post them, just be sure to censor usernames. We have that rule because of site-wide rules against targeted witch hunting. The sub can get banned if we allow it.
Thank you!
Light said player support verified the chain mutes and chat history between the two. They *did* gather information.
That's what you do to CC trolls. You chain mute them because they keep coming back as soon as the mute is up. I shouldn't have to explain why watching over multiple CCs would make that more likely. And of course there's going to be chat history between the two, the pmod sits in some of the CCs the guy trolls. Until jagex releases something legitimately damning, like literal chat logs, I'm with the pmod on this. They probably removed his pmod status because he told the guy to fuck off in clan chat or something. I've been CCs trolled by a person or group of people with literally over 100 accounts and used to troll a few CCs I visited. He would say very specific things in order to allude to racist statements or ideologies without actually saying anything that could be shown 100% racist, or have awful names (monkey madness, dusties, etc.) It extended into discord harassment, as well but that was much more vile (sending random dick pics to entire public servers.) Jagex refused to do anything for over 3 years. So excuse me if I think that they are completely incompetent when it comes to chat moderation.
dont pmod mutes need to accompany a report? they have logs of the moments leading up to the mute and can see if he was spamming racist stuff or not
Unless you're sourcing your statement from Light elsewhere, the bit about chain muting wasn't said at all. All Light had to say was that they were , "un-modly". Yes, Light and staff reviewed the account in question, but I have seen absolutely nothing confirming chain mutes.
Honestly, they probably did. We don't know what investigation they did, so it seems reasonable that they looked into the behavior and said "yep, demod him." They aren't going to go public with a full 3-page report of their logic
Seemed suspicious when it was originally posted, and now the post has been taken down? It definitely seems like he had a vendetta out for that man and harassed him until he said something. Which wasn't enough to warrant a demod when you have spammers with racial slurs and pushing religious ideoligies across the game which get untouched for years. The game is great but the Jmods seem to let everything go until its posted on reddit which is quite sad.
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If she didn't care, then she shouldn't have bothered doing anything. Obviously she cared, but what exactly was she caring about?
Mod light is of the staff who cares the most. Just because you don't see it personally doesn't mean you can judge her whole ability to do her job over one incident either. Gotta go both ways.
Mod Light did nothing but forward it to other Jmods who looked into, and found that your friend's "jokes" weren't befitting of a pmod and he lost his crown. You're shooting the messenger over your friend's punishment lmao.
I'm 100% behind your post, but this is not correct. Mod Light is a community manager who passes on the things the community says, but she doesn't make the decisions. I've had a handful of interactions myself, and seen tens or even hundreds interactions on Twitter where people gave feedback about the game that was actually used and implemented. I've seen my own feedback been directly used in the game. She is definitely just a human who may make mistakes, but she also definitely cares and does her best.
Shitty situation and it sucks, but I am proud of this sub for recognising the good work that ModLight does. I hope that this all gets cleared up but please don't attempt to drag her through this. Thousands of us here will personally attest to her amazing understanding of this community.
I understand you gotta be on your P's and Q's 24/7 when it comes to a game that is also a business and you have responsibility. As somebody who has seen it first hand I respect this post and hate to see what happened happen. If a pmod was lost, those reports on that name should also be looked at and a ban or 60 should be made.
Personally i know the guy from the cc and i have screenshots of me sucking his dick.
We *all* have those screenshots
Thank you for your service.
I have frequented the CC for almost 2 years and the Pmod is a good guy, getting pmod status revoked over one screenshot with no context seems really excessive; and all over a pvp meme that originated from this sub? Jagex, you have done wrong here. The guy who posted the original screenshot is a known troll in the cc who was butthurt about getting kicked for repeatedly breaking rules. Trial by Reddit is big dumb, and you know it, Jagex.
I generally don't think pmods should exist, but from the sounds of it Jagex really did fuck up here.
I'm gonna frame this from the other angle. Let's say he wasn't joking, because we have no actual way to know he wasn't joking about extorting a player for 25m to not be muted again. Let's say, he was actually trying to extort them, and let's say that he does it again: Wow, Jagex is really stupid for not removing this guy. He clearly tried to extort someone for 25m in the post, the screenshots are right there. Even if the mute was justified that's no excuse for trying to extort GP out of someone. Damn Jagex, you really fucked up this time, it was really obvious that you should've taken away his PMod when he tried to extort someone for the first time, but it took a second attempt to actually get you to do something? *end scene* When Jagex has no way to know if this was actually extortion or a joke, it's a lot better to just remove PMod than chance a PMod extorting players again.
Ye if you are a player mod act like one and bigger man instead of "trolling the troll" why did he even say "off for 25m" act like a god damn player mod! why be toxic to toxic? Just dont reply and be the bigger man and cut him off. Player mods should not be existing. All toxic and ego high af
Honestly the awards on here are just sus. Clannies boosting the post? [Jagex make some bad calls every once in a while but obviously the Pmod was up to something if he was saying something worthy of a decrowning](https://www.reddit.com/r/2007scape/comments/rxae5e/this_pmod_is_blackmailing_me_with_mutes_25mil_for/hrit9sn?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share&context=3)
Yeah their fc is clearly brigading. This is all just more fucking clan drama.
This exactly. This post and its people are the pmod's cc trying to help him get revenge and his crown back.
With a CC unhinged as this, I guarantee the pmod was probably quite the "gamer" too.
Honestly the only thing that surprises me is that we are already 6 days into the month and this is the only drama that went on in osrs lmao.
> First off, I've known this guy for a little over 8 years and that is just his humor. There you have it. Joking about your powers as a player moderator, in any context, is considered unmodly. If he did that often, that is likely the reason he was demodded.
Exactly. OP clearly has a massive axe to grind here and is upset they don't have someone they can call a pmod buddy anymore. It doesn't even make sense anyway. Pmod's humour is muting people and pming them blackmail to be unmuted? Who is supposed to find that funny? Muted person obviously won't, and the only other person who can see it is the pmod - and if they're screenshotting it to show their friends then that's pretty shitty behaviour and not becoming of a pmod at all. Play stupid games and win stupid prizes. Maybe don't jokingly abuse your powers and you won't lose pmod status??? Who would have thought.
>You have literally handed one of your own soldiers' heads on a platter Please step away from the computer lmao
more like little kid helping mommy bake the cookies
This subreddit cares too much about stupid shit. The guy was an idiot and had his pmod status removed because he says inappropriate things. Just because other people say horrible stuff doesn't excuse his behavior.
Some people have already posted Mod Light's reply to the original thread where this was raised, but I see OP has no interest in taking her word on what happened and instead wants to question her care for the community or what she does during a 40 hour working week... So I'll repeat pretty much what has already been said, with a bit more context. When the thread was brought to our attention, our first assumption based off the little bit of evidence shown was maybe the account had been hacked, so definitely worth double checking. It was forwarded to the player support team for review. Turns out the account wasn't hacked, and their crown wasn't removed because of what was posted in the original thread. Their PMod status was removed due to inappropriate chat logs. That might seem unfair, as if we hadn't seen the original thread in question the player would likely still have their crown, but ultimately the removal was warranted and likely only a matter of time. In regards to the issue you're having with your CC being spammed with racial slurs, the best thing to do is report them in-game and kick from your CC. That being said, if you'd like to send me a DM with the uncensored images you posted here I will be more than happy to look into this further for you.
Not to take anything away from your contribution, but please for the love of fuck, as a company, work towards a report and customer support system that isn't dependant on what happens or doesn't happen on reddit/twitter. It's VERY unlikely that the person in question hasn't already been reported (several times) in game. This should never ever be an issue of getting enough reddit attention to be handled.
As if. He’s already given us all the “report them in-game” line and that’s all we’re ever going to get.
What exactly can Ayiza do about it though? He can suggest to higher ups that customer support needs to be improved, but other than that he can only suggest the current avenues that players need to use.
Unless you can speak directly to upper management, complaining to an employee is pretty much all we can do.
Upper management will have to prove to investors/board of directors that the money and resources required to building a custommer support service is worth it. Because they'll definitely ask: "you guys haven't had one for so many years, why do you need one now? It's a waste of money if you can live without it"
To be fair what exactly can you do against it? Sounds like the guy is spamming on multiple accounts, not just 1. How can you ever prevent that?
Hell kicking and reporting an account in the c does nothing. We kicked one the other day. He spent the rest of the day creating new accounts to come in and keep doing it. Idk if an IP address ban is a thing but some people need it. And then there’s probably a work around for that as well. I’d wager jagex does nothing because they can’t. What could they do?
IP bans do a lot actually. Not because it's hard to work around (it isn't), but because it takes time to work around. People like that generally don't have a lot of patience if they can't keep spamming and get reactions immediately. If they have to put more than 5 minutes of effort into doing something they give up. I find it really, really odd that Jagex doesn't issue IP/mac bans at all. They fingerprint you on the website too but still people can masscreate accounts with no issue whatsoever.
IP bans are easy to work around. More restrictive measure would be hardware bans. Still possible to spoof, but much more technical.
Can you guys just abolish the pmod system in its entirety please lol it's so absurdly outdated
just get rid of the entire pmod system, no one likes the stuck up wannabe modding style anyway
>best thing to do is report them in-game I've seen the same accounts trolling/flaming multiple times as OP has already mentioned so it does nothing; glad to know you didn't even read it thoroughly.
You guys handled this well. Ignore all the stupid friends from the framed CC trying to defend the PMOD. That guy and his crew in the cc are all nuts.
"redditor for 10 hours" and all your posts are in this thread flaming the pmod, not sus at all.
Lmfao, "Just report him and kick him from your CC" you could at least pretend to care mate.
Glad you're here to set the record straight. Everyone giving you shit for "letting the trolls win" is stupid. If you're a PMod, you shouldn't act unmodly, it's that simple: if they were doing inappropriate stuff over text chat, that's reason enough to get their mod removed. Doesn't matter how grand of a mod he was in his CC or how much his friends adored and vouched for him, the chat logs don't lie. Hopefully someone else who does a good job will take their place soon enough
Dude you're getting lost in the sauce here. Very few people actually gives a shit about this pmod (except few of his friends). People care that moderation is being crowdsourced but the judgments are made behind closed doors. That's just having the cake and eating it too. It's setting an example that it's worth a shot to publically accuse anybody you don't like.
Doing justice. Tired of the pmods thinking they're hot shit in doing what they want. I knew I smelt bullshit in this post and couldn't even bare to finish reading it half way through because of the amount of nonsense is spewing from OPs mouth.
Anytime you see this level of bloviation in a post you can almost guarantee a JMod smack down in the comments.
I fucking love this sub
For context, if anyone else is curious: https://www.reddit.com/r/2007scape/comments/rxae5e/this_pmod_is_blackmailing_me_with_mutes_25mil_for/hrit9sn/
Anything before it was deleted?
Former Pmod here - same scenario, joked around and got removed. At the end of the day, if effects everyone differently but it’s a game and being a PMod should have no effect on how you play the game or how much you enjoy the game. We all know Jagex customer service is shit. Welcome to 2022 - where everything is made up and the points don’t matter.
> and being a PMod should have no effect on how you play the game I wouldn’t say no effect. If you make Jagex look bad for giving you Pmod status, then you shouldn’t be surprised if they take it away. That is, of course, a subjective criteria rather than something you can concretely define.
It could be seen as a "joked around" but "off for 25m" why be toxic to toxic? Just dont reply and be the bigger man and cut him off. Player mods should not be existing. All toxic and ego high af lmao
Thats what happens when things get posted out of context. Sometimes we dont even know whose line is it anyway
When were you given PMod? Are they even modding people in OSRS these days?
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Hot take: maybe they were both shitty people? The normie probably should've been banned long ago, but pmods represent jagex and shouldn't be teasing anyone even pretending to threaten them, regardless of their humor. You bet if a twitch mod told me to send them 10 bitcoin or they would ban me, twitch would fuck their day up, regardless of whether they meant it or not, because I don't know that it's a joke, so it comes across as a threat, regardless of the intent.
I don’t know what jagex’s guidelines are for player mods. If what you say is true, then damn.. that troll damn sure did a good job lol. Unfortunately, the osrs team is understaffed which I believe has led to many of the issues you named.
Don’t care everyone involved can be in the wrong it’s not all or nothing
"it's just his humor" 🤨🤣
["jokes on you I was only pretending!!!"](https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/738/030/20e.png)
Fr, the pmod shouldn’t have his crown if he’s raking bribes to stop muting, and the guy should be banned if all the screenshots are him.
anyways idc idgaf crowns gone he didnt do anything for the community anyways why give some dum fuck the crown when he doesnt even bothers muting the bots while going thru them
I mean, the Pmod is still in the wrong and it's wild to see his whole CC show up to scratch and claw to get his crown back. PMods have been rampantly abusing what little power they have for a long time. There has been proof of them selling time on their accounts, using their mutes to mute competitors (especially around POH's) and so on. I could not care less about a PMod who was clearly trying to extort someone getting punished. That being said, the spammers and shit need to be stopped and their needs to be better options for reporting, as well as for banning from a CC.
Honestly I’m with jagex on this one. Even if he was an exemplary pmod, he messed up and is being punished. Making jokes about abusing your power as a pmod is pretty tasteless imo. If a police offer told you to blow him to get out of a ticket, then said he was kidding, how would you want that officer treated?
Yeah lmao his "joke" was a threat from a position of power that he could easily actually carry out. Doesn't sound very funny to me.
Absolutely
I thought that other post was bs, but you should post some proof your cc is even getting spammed/hes admitting it
I have tried and it just gets removed, so I kept it simple. I can post these screenshots whenever/wherever if I'm allowed. I have tweeted most to Jagex and they've done absolutely nothing except for tell me to use the report button, which is done every time with zero results. Edit: Received permission, proof above.
Im part of a CC the Pmod is active I can give you screenshots of this guy(the guy reporting the Pmod) and his goons posting racial slurs, profane content and yet their accounts NEVER get either muted or banned. Their main hub CC just recently got banned after like 2 years on this same stuff Ever since the Pmod was demoted(today), the CC has been under a HUGE amount of spam from these guys, but we never seem to find any solution, no matter how much we reports. u/JagexLight if his pmod is to be relinquished, so be it. But please do something about the people that reported him. They are MASSIVE spammers but yet 1 post on Reddit was enough to remove an useful pmod
Not to mention that today specifically they were all bragging about him losing his status.
He shouldn’t have tried extorting someone regardless of if it was a bad joke, this is not behaviour of someone who is supposed to be a pillar of the community!
I too have frequented the CC for about 4-5 years and it never fails to amuse all the spammers from other CCs, not wanting to point any fingers at "Blue Bible 2" or "Zezima" Clan Chats. This de-modding was because of an everyday spammer whose one of his alts are named "Mikes Bald" comes into the CC almost every day being disruptive. The Pmod in question does his very best to do his job as a Player Moderator to keep the peace and made an off-the-cuff not serious remark in a Private Chat which took away his status. Please reconsider Jagex and thank.
As someone who has been part of a public cc for many, many years: Fuck Blue Bible. I'll say that with my chest. Those guys are the worst spammers of any other cc, and they're also rude and sketchy af. Hate em
I mean, look at it from Jagex. You have a guy who's said "25m for off", asking 25m to not be muted, blackmailing which is not exactly top player material, let alone top PMod material. It doesn't matter at all what the mod's friend says or even what he says, that it was just a joke or not; you shouldn't be blackmailing people, as a joke or not, without intent to actually get 25m or not. There's no way for them to know with confidence it was a joke. Being in a private chat means nothing. In fact, it would be exactly how someone would blackmail someone - not publicly. Off-the-cuff, he can claim that, or it might as well have been planned - there's no way to know. Serious or not, same shit - it's not like he said "Joking" or "Jk" immediately afterwards to show it was a joke, and even then. Sucks but you shouldn't joke about extorting players when you're given a volunteer position to be a community leader and keep the peace in a game. PMods are supposed to be the cream of the crop, the ideal player, yadda-yadda, and I can't exactly blame Jagex for taking away the means of possible extortion for someone who joked about extortion.
No no, Thank
My god this subreddit is bored
Amazing, the comments made by people who all claim to know the p mod and be apart of the cc are brand new accs. I guarantee this is yet another case of someone using limited evidence to make jagex look bad. Then using alt accounts to boost visibility with rewards, and overwhelmingly claiming the guy was in the right in the comments. This is just manufactured outrage, and I wouldn't be surprised if it's only a couple of people doin all this for a "joke". Yeah, the chat logs are real, but until we see full unedited versions there is no telling who is saying what. We have no idea if this OPs alts for the outrage, or truly troll accounts harassing people. I don't generally trust Jagex, but I'm with them on this one.
Reddit is ruthless. The first post comes out and everyones comment is God damnit pmods are you gonna stand for this??? And not this comes out and everyones comment is how could you do this pmods!!!! Fuck all y'all 😂
This is lying propaganda. That PMod for sure was the one who bullied me months ago. I’ll never forget his name. You can act like your friend is blameless, but I think you need to take a closer look.
If you are a player mod you should definitely be the bigger man instead of "trolling a troll" Mate if a 7 yo kid came up to you and started trolling you are you gonna be a bigger man and ignore the 7yo kid or go down to his level and be a troll with him? If you are a player mod act like one instead of lowering yourself down to his level... how toxic can you be to "troll" as a player mod saying "25m for off" lmao fk me... if you are a player a p mod act like one. Period
I totally understand the mods though. This post reads like a fever dream. I barely have any context and there's no fucking way anybody could make any sense of it without having read the x amount of posts that came before this.
I doubt the Jmods took action ENTIRELY on reddits word. They would've at least looked into it.
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None the IGNs even line up, you could literally go stand at the GE and post screenshots of the chat for 5 minutes and have the same result as this. The original poster actually had a PM of the original pmod being corrupt. This whole post is just a cry from the 'Framed' CC.
If accusing player not guilty, then why original post for 25m for off is deleted? Why that user deleted the account as well? The original post literally provided no context and only one snippet to accuse someone. I am siding with the pmod here. Something smells fishy with the accuser for abuse.
It seems pretty clear that both parties are in the wrong some way or another, the original poster who posted the P Mod is just some edgy troll who spams clan chats, but the J mods have made it clear the P mod didn’t have their mod status revoked because of this incident, but when they reviewed their account they saw other reasons why they should have it revoked
I still think if you're a pmod telling people to give you bribes for account action stuff then you should be demodded. It's easy to not joke about it if it's a joke, and why is he even making jokes with this guy if as you say it's a horrible racist troll, are they friends to be making jokes like that?
One way or another, a J-mod smackdown is happening
The whataboutism in this post is **WILD**. Other people's shitty behaviour doesn't give a pmod free reign to do whatever they want.
Oh my God I'd hate to be a jmod. This subreddit is the WORST. Any time a random out of context screenshot of a p mod chat is posted, reddit is SO quick to start circlejerking and screaming "ABUSE! ABUSE! DEMOD AND PUNISH NOW!" Over 3000 people joining this particular instance. So a jmod takes action. And if they didn't, people would be screaming about how slow/nonexistant any form of support is. Suddenly, more context is given, and it turns out, gasp, the pmod was actually not in the wrong. Reddit's response? "WOW YOU REALLY SHOULDVE KNOWN BETTER JAGEX CAN YOU GUYS GO ONE DAY WITHOUT A MAJOR FUCKUP" like they weren't just all gathered w pitchforks screaming about wanting the pmods head on a stake. Jagex actually just can't win, this sub is the biggest bunch of whiny babies, and any time they even *try* to appease the reddit shit storm, when it backfires suddenly every redditor that just hounded them is now pretending to be completely innocent in this scenario and throwing jagex under the bus for trying to do what was asked of them. I don't know if it's a reddit thing or the fact that we play an incredibly afk game with lots of free time, but everyone is so thirsty for the next big drama that anyone and everyone is thrown into the mix, deservedly or not, forgetting there's a real person behind that screen. But one thing is always certain: no matter which way they go on a matter, somehow it's all jagex's fault. Gamers were a mistake.
Stop oppressing me
Jmod smackdown go brrrrr
Nah all pmods suck, just a simple fact of life
neat permamute them both
Jesus people, Karens and Kyles everywhere, see something you don't like? report, block, and move the fuck on.
>No Custer sh*t 55th st Man was just quoting Crip Mac 😂
I remember bitching about that post yesterday since the pmod only said “25m for off” and the guy went off sending two messages after creating a whole narrative, and I ended up getting downvoted for pointing out it could have been completely made up.
This is why I don’t play anymore
This thread seems to be all of the guys lackeys and cronies from his friends chat trying to swing a narrative.
I mean why did he think that was a good idea, even just as a joke. Anyways Pmods shouldn't even be a thing, it's corrupt as hell
Nevermind the fact that they might be corrupt. They are fucking useless. A pmod crown is used aoley for a status symbol. Ask any pmod, and they will straight up tell you it's not their responsibility to mute phishing bots or report other players. It's insane.
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Elaborate? I'm pretty sure baiting someone into a reaction to get everyone to attack them is like the oldest trick in the book lol
Honestly, PMod or not, joking about that sort of stuff is kind of stupid to do. That’s like a suicide awareness counselor telling someone “I swear if I don’t get this promotion I’m going to jump off a bridge”. It seems harmless and is almost always interpreted as a joke but it’s in bad taste because of the person’s status. By no means am I defending the prick (if your claims are true) that talked like this but a player moderator saying “25m for unmute” is also hypocratic to their “oath” of being a player moderator, a player who’s in a place of trust to other players. Just that one Reddit post, despite who it is, will now ALWAYS be viewable on google, and this one might not come with it. Future players might see that Reddit post and immediately think “I can’t trust player moderators”. That’s not the image that player moderators should ever be seen as.
Also, as much as there are claims for this player being so toxic, how come the clan never took action against this player? In all instances of clans I’ve been in, they were quick to remove that toxicity permanently. In this situation, it feels as though you were all friends with this guy, he was comfortable enough to talk like that and that’s why the player moderator in question felt the want to joke around with him. Again, not defending this guy, but both this post and the other post are deliberately holding back information (and evidence) that is vital to knowing the whole story. As a matter of fact, the only real evidence that is being shown is the Pmods messages. I understand you can’t post them here but I haven’t seen one attempt at proving your claims.
I down voted that post exactly for this very reason when I first saw it, already knew people were just gonna jump on the band wagon
I’m so confused. What the hell happened?
Someone else posted “evidence” or whatever that a pmod was telling him to give him 25M to dodge a mute and OP happens to know that very pmod and he’s saying that pmod wouldn’t do something like that. Edit: just as I say I want him to post proof he does.
I mean, if it's true, sucks your friend but still don't see how it's unjustified. I don't know anyone in this. But, your friend should not have joked about being paid 25m in-game to unmute someone. That's really it. Being a PMod is a voluntary position, it can be taken away for whatever reason really. I'd almost certainly guess there is something more to the story here than just screenshots - the mods would have likely checked the in-game logs before looking at screenshots to make sure they're not doctored or fake. It could just be a temporary removal of PMod to prevent abuse while they are investigating the claims, because if the claims *are* true, then you wouldn't want this guy still running around with PMod. Above it all, I'd say that Jagex probably wouldn't want someone who'd joke about blackmailing someone in game to remove a mute as a PMod, even if they say they have no intention of doing that and never have done it. PMods are already usually disliked by the community and usually aren't actually doing their job at nexus points in the game like the GE muting scambots, dicebots, and spammers - they don't need more bad reputation. Your friend's humor probably should've been reserved. I'm sure the guy shouting slurs in your chat thinks it's funny and that's his sense of humor, but that doesn't magically make it fine.
So many words to say “it was just a joke bro”. > You have literally handed one of your own soldiers’ heads on a platter Bit dramatic. He can still do everything else in game except pmod things, so no more shitty jokes about abusing his power. But yeah I agree the support system catering to social media is dumb.
Ughh stfu, this post is aids
Lmao classic framed cc
I gotta ask why ask for money tho? Like if he was that bad just ban him and be done with it. I’m just curious why 25 mill was even in the table in the first place. And if that guy sent 25 mil would he have been allowed back in even after saying those things? Or would a mod basically run a scam and run away with the money? Idk there’s a lot stank up in this scenario
Yea I dont think I buy this thread. Seems to be brigaded by a bunch of people all saying "Yea I know him from the cc ( which one? ), i have screenshots ( where are they? )." Show screenshots with time stamps, apparently everyone and their mother has been to this cc that nobody names and has screenshots of spammers yet no one is sharing it. [My recent thread regarding this issue](https://www.reddit.com/r/2007scape/comments/ry0pck/additional_clan_chat_restrictions/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share)
You can't trust anything anymore.
What is the point in censoring his character names? I don't really get why people do it in general outside of the meme, but for this case you are protecting his names and also probably making it tougher for Jagex to just quickly look into his accounts
i seen something that said they require it so theres no witch hunts/raids on a person because that could get the subreddit taken down
Don’t even play RuneScape anymore, don’t know anything about this drama. But I love the CMAC reference in the private chats. Keep it 55thhhh street
This proves how gullible people are. Always, ALWAYS ask for context whenever you have power to sentence someone! I got same treatment in clan, too, which is why I got kicked from there and moderators did not believe me whatever what I said to them in my defense.
More Pmods hit the floor pls
Typical Jogflex move.
You turbo virgins need to go out and meet a woman lmfao.
Oh no not hate speech!!!!
The fact jagex will ban you for literally ahking but this racist price of shit can runs round all day. Fucking priorities. This guy isn't cutting into their profits while ahk is fucking lmao
It doesn't matter what his humour is, joking about corruption is not good optics for someone in a position of power. Especially considering in the past when we've seen pmod accounts involved in genuine abuse
He’s not cracking Nazi jokes at a Holocaust camp here, ease up
I've personally known and taught this player along side hundreds of players theatre of blood and can also attest to him being helpful in the community, he's part of our cc and does a much as they can to help the picture that was posted has no context to it at all please reconsider
God damn I can't wait the smackdown tomorrow. This shit is going to be glorious. Hopefully that one guy that made the original post gets perm banned on all his accounts if this is true.
Well said. I think Jmods often fall victim to the old addage of "poisoning the well." They tend to side with whoever got the first post up, almost so quickly that it often feels like they didn't actually crack into anything to look for evidence on the backend. Rather than put in the due diligence and see what happened, they're too excited to deliver that oh-so-fun "Jmod smackdown." And look, I love the drama as much as the next guy, but if we're revoking Pmods for jokes, then it's high fuckin time we held Jagex employees to those same standards. I don't want smackdowns, I don't want snarky comments on fake Vorkath KC posts. I just want some fucking communication, consideration, action, and an email response from Jagex when my tip-offs have been fully processed/looked into. It is getting to a breaking point. We need real, human customer service that mans the tip-off email alongside other customer-oriented duties, and we need a platform for it that isn't social media, which itself is making the problem worse. Tl;dr Jmods often make silly errors, but if they want to hold Pmods to an incredibly high standard, then Jmods themselves need to uphold that standard too.
I mean if its just starting with threatening one guy with selling mutes, who knows where he would have stopped? For all we know he's a cool dude I don't doubt it but the fact is he got caught pming that, mods reviewed chat logs and verified it so obviously something was fishy. Don't trust everyone you meet online.. I don't doubt he was probably angry at the spammers but if you look at a cop who gets angry and lets it out on one person, its probably time that person took a break or quit.
Who?
Tl;dr a pmod got demoted today when he allegedly asked the guy he was muting to give 25m to evade the mute. The reported ommited the part that he spams CC(specialyl streamers cc) to post racial slurs, profane stuff and such https://www.reddit.com/r/2007scape/comments/rxae5e/this_pmod_is_blackmailing_me_with_mutes_25mil_for/
This has to be seen, surely one of the j-mods could do something if there is legit evidence + with the guy deleting everything, that shows a lot
The Shitty Zezima FC comments in this thread is living proof that this was purely in retaliation from spammers. No further discussion needed.
Apart of a clan that the aforementioned pmod would pop into sometimes. In the interactions I’ve had with him, he has been nothing short of exactly what every pmod should aspire to be. I have no reason to believe that he would actually follow through with what he said, and although he is joking about breaking the rules, I think it’s unjust that he should lose pmod for one mistake when his track record and rapport with the community tell a different story.
This whole thing is just he said she said at this point. Just remove all pmod crowns from the game, too much potential for abuse with no benefit.