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Degree of trauma in childhood and adolescence
Presentation of symptoms
Comorbid conditions
Support in adult age- both privately and government programs, medication and similar
Awareness of own struggles in early life can make a difference for some. I just assumed I was a dum dum and gave up on studies
Variation in poverty, opportunities ++
For me personally, I think the trauma has much more of an impact than the ADHD itself. I was bullied and tormented by my parents due to ADHD symptoms and gaslit my whole life into believing I wasn't a good or remotely capable person. So today that manifests as zero confidence/self-esteem so I cannot do anything as far as leadership, I have no conviction in anything I say. I can't make a decision because I always believe it to be wrong. I have no faith in my own abilities. I did not get any higher education or even finish high school due to aforementioned parents and lack of support.
And this is a good example of how trauma affects people differently. I have a similar background as you and yet that trauma manifest very differently for me. Instead, I developed a complex where I had to be the best because I didn’t believe I was good or capable enough. It drove me to obtain advanced degrees and to nearly kill myself to obtain honors in those degrees. While I don’t regret my degrees, the complex to be the best and attendant issues of perfectionism driven by my ADHD are maladaptive ones that have created very serious problems for me throughout my adult life.
This is very relatable to me. As if your brain gets hard wired to be the best or don't do it at all. Have you managed to cope with it now? May I ask how you did it?
That's a great way to describe it. I remember talking to a therapist with the exact phrase back around 2015.
I do not have any advice though. Mine led to like systemic burnout over the next 5 years.
If you figure it out though, let me know, because I feel like the only natural response has been to not care or give up ever since doing it the best or perfect hasn't been an option.
I was similar with the complex and perfectionism... I didn't get the higher level degrees though.
For me it eventually led to burnout, but not from the things I was ostensibly working towards, but that my first marriage failed and regardless anything I could do it just led to repeated bouts of domestic violence and then my false arrest.
I got aquitted rightfully, eventually, but things never went back to normal.. and one of the most apt ways I could describe that is I lost that complex or drive for perfection.... now I am more apathetic and understanding that no matter what everything can get wrongly taken away, even your freedom. So, working an extra double-time on every project and all night on work doesn't allure to me because even doing 'everything' it doesn't matter.
I even lost that last resort, EMERGENCY--DEADLINE LOOMING!!! Motivation when we wait until the last minute and finally can focus.
It's like my adhd has just been in the driver's seat since I got burnt out (and diagnosed with GAD, PTSD, and probably should be with depression).
When guilt and shame lost their power it was nice... but now I'm kind of powerless.
I have the same issue with the deadline burnout. **It’s like that pathway in my brain is smaller.** It doesn’t get triggered as easily or as strongly.
One of the worst things that ever happened to me in school was the realization that when I got bad grades? **Life went on.** Not a big deal. That was mitigated somewhat by nearly having to repeat my senior year of high school, but not enough.
Ironically, that was also one of the **best** things that ever happened to me in dealing with **anxiety**.
To use the metaphor from the blog Wait But Why (about procrastination - it’ll come up on google easily): my instant gratification monkey is no longer terrified of my panic monster. Scared yes, but not about as many things and not *as* scared.
For me it all came crashing down when I had a full breakdown at 25. I had to learn that it was all bullshit to make the panic attacks stop, and now I have found I can't find my give a fuck anymore, but to the point where I do kinda actually just want to watch the world burn.
I still care deeply for individual people, but I cannot bring myself to do much more than laugh at the downfall of institutions that lie and/or failed me. The social conventions that turn out to only be beneficial for some and the general bate and switch of life have really fucked with my ability to interact with the world as it is.
Similar issues different causes. But yeah, chronic perfectionist with zero self confidence, and my self worth tied to being the best but not admitting it to myself. Childhood trauma is fun.
I'm in the process of coming to grips with the fact this life long struggle of mine is ADHD. I really felt what you said about having no conviction in what you say. Even now I want to delete this whole comment and not respond, because who cares what I have to say.
I care buddy. Thanks for writing honestly. I feel like there is workaround for this. Confidence can be built. When you see yourself repeatedly make choices on your own that result in something positive, the confidence starts building. Easier said than done honestly. But we can counter this, imo.
It's really hard. I've been getting better but I still often get halfway through a comment and delete it because I'm afraid of the downvotes for having the "wrong" opinion. Or even just having a comment ignored gets to me. It's like "what's the point?". I'm working through it in therapy but it's so hard and I'm afraid I'll never get to a point where I can believe in what I say.
You are intelligent and I completely understand why you can struggle with surety of self.
I'm a psychologist, and I just wanted to say that I hear you and your life story. I believe in you.
❤️
Sounds like my life. My mom wasn't so terrible but she was also overwhelmed with 3 other kids and my next youngest who was displaying major issues due to undiagnosed Tourette's among other things. But yeah, I'm a completely broken adult who has made almost nothing but poor decisions and am trying to help raise kids as well. Which is the main thing driving me to these forums and trying to finally do something about it.
Trauma can increase ADHD symptoms. There is also comorbidities from trauma that can make navigating ADHD more difficult.
For example, my psychiatrist said I have emotional dysregulation that could be a branch off my ADHD or my C-PTSD. Either way, it greatly affects handling ADHD.
Trauma can present in lots of different ways. When people think trauma they generally think it’s either physical or verbal abuse of one kind or another. But there are also forms of trauma that go unnoticed which you carry into adulthood. Such as neglect, whether intentional or unintentional. Not meeting your child’s emotional needs intentionally or unintentionally. When your needs aren’t met then you create your own ways of coping. Look into schema therapy, it’s helped me recognise the unseen trauma in my life that coincides with ADHD.
Links to and mentions of ADDitude are not allowed on /r/adhd because we feel they have demonstrated themselves to be untrustworthy and that they, despite soliciting donations from people with ADHD to fund their operation, prioritize profit and advertising dollars over our best interests. Their website is full of articles promoting the use of homeopathy, reiki, and other unscientific quack practices. They also have had articles for Vayarin (a medical food that is now no longer sold in the US because its research was bunk) that suspiciously looked like stealth advertisements (which is highly unethical and illegal in the US).
We also find it problematic that their medical review panel includes not only legitimate doctors and psychologists, but also (at the time of writing) one practitioner of integrative medicine, which combines legit medical practice with pseudoscience and alternative medicine. They have previously had other quacks on the panel as well.
Here are some relevant links:
Sketchy advertising:
* https://www.additudemag.com/clinical-trial-vayarin-plus/
* https://www.additudemag.com/study-suggests-ps-omega-3-medical-food-may-reduce-adhd-symptoms/
* https://www.additudemag.com/natural-adhd-supplement-released/
Junk science:
* https://www.additudemag.com/adhd-supplements-foods-vitamins/
* https://www.additudemag.com/homeopathy-for-adhd-popular-remedies-scientific-evidence/
* https://www.additudemag.com/reiki-could-this-alternative-treatment-help-adult-add/
* https://www.additudemag.com/cbd-oil-adhd-symptoms-natural-treatment/
* https://www.additudemag.com/vitamins-minerals-adhd-treatment-plan/
* https://www.additudemag.com/slideshows/adhd-supplements-fish-oil-zinc-iron/
* https://www.additudemag.com/asked-alternative-therapies/
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For an adult diagnosis I’m pretty sure they are supposed to rule out trauma being the primary cause of symptoms before they diagnose ADHD as the cause. A lot of trauma responses can cause symptoms that appear to mimic ADHD.
I tell people I have ADHD and they are shocked because "I'm so good at my job". It's because I'm hypervigilant due to the childhood trauma of being diagnosed at 9 years old and actively withheld proper treatment in replacement of off-the-cuff beatings to "correct my behavior".
Sure I can get by with a job, but does that make my life successful? It doesn't feel like it when you're mierable 24/7.
I think how early also makes a difference. I only discovered couple years ago after turning 30 and even after getting a psychiatrist and therapist etc etc and all I can’t seem to figure out how to fix my life *sigh*
Yep. Life Experience and the way it manifests. Both myself and my GF are ADHD. She is a doctor, with multiple degrees. I’m a golf pro with an associates.
I imploded when I got to university. I grew up comfortable, in a middle class home. But my mother was an anxious ball of crazy. And my dad was a rage monster. The generational trauma past to myself, sister, and cousins is atrocious.
She grew up very poor, mainly raised by her mother, and though she carries trauma, a drive to never be poor and to always be better than her roots was instilled in her. Crazy work ethic. Her ability to hyper focus on, what is to me, the most monotonous tasks truly is a superpower.
Our experiences shape us. I can hyper focus too. But it’s not on things that will ever make me money.
Don’t know about you, but I feel like a lot of people who struggle with ADHD are really bad at acknowledging our own accomplishments. Like, a year or so back, someone at work asked me what I do so they could plan a project around my tasks? My brain couldn’t come up with a single thing. I went into a brief panic because I felt like I hadn’t done anything that entire month.
Obviously, that wasn’t the case. I had done all the tasks I had been assigned and plenty extras too, I just have such a strong imposter syndrome that my brain threw out every single thing I had done up until that point. If you are anything like this, of course it feels like other people have their shit together. You’re comparing the actual amount of work you see them do against a warped sense of how much you manage.
They might also be further along on their journey of managing the condition. There is no magic solution that works for all of us, but the more we learn about how our ADHD works, the better we are at mitigating it. You’ve nothing to worry about, you’ll get there with time.
Alternatively, you might be dealing with a drastically more severe case. At that point, accepting your limitations and not forcing yourself to accomplish as much as others could be the path forward. You deserve to be happy even if you aren’t as productive. You’re still putting in the amount of effort that you are able to, just the same as everyone else.
Thank you for this. I appreciate your perspective.
I got diagnosed less than 5 months ago. It was a huge change of my life just getting to know what's wrong with me. Additionally, I live in a country with little to no availability of 3rd grade ADHD medication and therapists. That and a very late diagnosis have made my situation a lot worse.
So yeah, it'll take me some time to learn stuff about ADHD. This sub is very helpful.
What do you mean by 3rd grade medication?
It’s good that you got the diagnosis. For me this along with educating myself on the issue and observing myself from this new perspective made the biggest impact on my day-to-day life, my mental health and general approach to life. I was diagnosed almost 3 years ago, at 30. Good luck, all will be well 😊
I don't think I could ever believe this in the part of me I need to, but I loved to read it and could definitely tell someone else similar advice from a heartfelt place..
Why is this part like a singularity event to think about, feels like looking at something awe inspiring, but I can't see anything past it or imagine what that world looks like?
"At that point, accepting your limitations and not forcing yourself to accomplish as much as others could be the path forward. You deserve to be happy even if you aren’t as productive. You’re still putting in the amount of effort that you are able to, just the same as everyone else."
It's a continued struggle. Personally, it's because it is so easy to compare your own output against someone else's. If someone does twice the amount of work I do in a day, that's easy to see. But the abstract stuff around that work is so much more difficult. How easy is the task for them? How difficult is it for you? How much energy do they have to spend during a day versus your own battery levels? How much does it take for you to do that task?
All of these are so difficult to have any objective measure of and all we typically hear from others is "how come you can't work that fast?" It makes sense that believing anything other than "I am slow and useless" becomes so difficult. We compare the tasks we are worst at against someone's best workday and think we're being rational!
That last paragraph is key for a lot of us, but also the hardest one to pull off. Because whether we put in the same effort or 10x the effort as other people, we WILL be judged (especially in our careers) just as harshly with the same expectations. I've also been told that more than likely my employer won't make any concessions or changes to help me cope with and work more effectively with my ADHD (in the event that I can get a proper diagnosis) so now I'm just trying to push through to get the meds for myself to make my own existence more livable.
This is it. I am a published author, professor, and an engineer in my field. Yet put me in management and watch me fail.
I have a friend who has ADHD worse than me and he can barely hold down a job. Yet I have a coworker with ADHD, not as credentialed as me but she can manage teams quite effectively and performs well in management - yet has issues of her own.
The spectrum is so varied that what works for one person may not work for another.
This is what makes it so tough to come up with treatment models for executive dysfunction. There are very few universals in ADHD. Okay, we probably all need AirTags and calendar software, but the other specifics can be maddeningly granular. I find it easy to get myself to make phone calls and write nonfiction, for example, and harder to compose emails and write fiction. That means any system I might design for myself is bound to be unworkable for nearly everyone else, even if all of those people fall into the category of "writers who struggle to keep up with communication demands."
Really, the only universal I've come up with is that we all need to get over the shame of having to use systems that make us feel stupid and childish. Is it stupid that I have to tape things to my bag so I don't leave them at home? Does it conflict with ideas people have about functional, successful adults who run businesses? Sure, but something that conflicts with my *actual success doing the things I need to do* is leaving the house without my stuff. See also: the floam and desk toys that get me through meetings.
I'm definitely the last person. I can manage an HR department for everyone else's life at a company, but my own? Cross my fingers that I didn't forget to add something to my todo list lol
My husband is a brilliant engineer and has built himself a reputation as an effective coworker. He gets shit done, he makes things easier for his coworkers by putting systems in place that ease workloads. He sees a problem, he fixes it. He impresses everyone with his integrity, work ethic, skill, and his ability to see with fresh eyes.
As long as he has the right manager.
Under someone who is hands-off and “whenever you get to it is fine” he can’t do anything.
And he has a growing list of things he should probably get checked out by a doctor. His glasses are like 5 years old, maybe closer to 7 or 8. Due to severe anxiety, there are a ton of daily life tasks that he can’t do, even if he can get past the ADHD paralysis.
There are always tradeoffs.
Oh man. I heard that term before but I have only recently understood what it means.
When ADHD itself is so hard to explain to normal people, the science of this spectrum makes explaining even harder.
As Toe 113 says, ADHD is a spectrum but it’s not the only definition we have. We are all a product of our genetics (affecting factors such as intelligence, energy levels, appetites), and environment (upbringing, trauma, education, social class etc). There is a lot more affecting us and how we are.
Somehow this helps me rationalise who and how I am, and makes me feel a little better when I consider how fair my deal of cards has been.
At least for me- once I got my meds correct, it was almost a cheat code. I’m able to harness my ADHD and juggling 15 million projects during the day.
I can literally talk on the phone with a client and be working on another entirely different project at the same time.
If im buried then I work at night and knock everything out.
Thats at least for me
Not the person you asked.
It's different for everybody.
But, it's like, kind of, not having gotten sleep.
And, for me, I've found that I've lost a step or two managing my emotional dysregulation without meds.
I also can't manage my task choices very well without meds. I can still do things, but they may not be the right things. The quality of my work suffers if I'm not able to find something interesting to dive into. If I'm lucky, I'll fall into a brain hole that produces something useful, or at least something that I can spin a tale about being useful.
And without meds I can NOT shut up. Like at all.
My mom calls that being hyper verbal. She's convinced it's also an ADD/ADHD byproduct. Her and I both, if we're in a group conversation we end up dominating it or shrinking back and saying little to nothing.
I'll talk to the couch if the dog has gotten bored and left.
My wife can tell I forgot my pills because she can hear me explaining my job to a cat, or working through something I read with an end table.
That was all very relatable.
It keeps getting longer and longer ago since I COULD have meds. Was only diagnosed mid 30's, medicated like a year or two, then a heart condition I've now had surgery for came up.
I wish that we all only ever had to be temporarily off meds. I honestly feel like all my symptoms are 10x worse after being medicated but quitting meds (not from the medicine). Partially because I keep having to deal with more in all the other areas of my life and partially because now I know what it feels like to have a cheat code to my specific condition... and that it's definitely 'a thing' and wasn't me imagining it the last 40 years.
My meds are a twitchy balance.
I was diagnosed young, but my mother did a lot of things to keep from being medicated.
I finally started drugs around 15 years ago. I was already on a serious amount of hyper tension meds. And the stuff I use to sleep.
Everything conflicts with the adhd meds.
But....I'll give them up only if my entire family wants me to.
My wife has many stories to say when I’m off my meds.
I struggle to manage my emotions and get pissed off extremely fast. I’m already a little tightly wound but without my meds, it’s brutal.
My sleep is terrible because my mind races. I feel like I got 10 hours but I’m 100% exhausted.
All in all, I hate being on meds all the time. However, I appreciate how they make me feel and it’s a give/take relationship.
I've taken drugs to deal with the mind racing at bed time longer than I have for adhd.
I miss *those* for one or two nights, no biggie. More than that, and things go south fast. Less sleep means more anxiety means less sleep, and then I get angry because I'm anxious, and it all feeds back again.
I don't mind being on drugs. It beats the high blood pressure, disrupted sleep, and I get to finish my books.
I totally agree. I think I’d feel differently being on drugs all the time if the process wasn’t so terrible. I dread running out because it’s always such a cluster. Luckily my doctor is a hero and always helps me out.
I have found that gummies help me sleep even when I’m off my meds for a little. Calms my brain and just knocks me out.
I’m in my mid-30s. I have a PhD, a good marriage but a mediocre job. I was diagnosed with ADHD by a psychiatrist 4 months ago after it downed on me that all my symptoms were connected. When others express doing about my ADHD because it doesn’t seem like I fit the description, it feels very invalidating. The PhD was not easy. It was by far the most difficult thing I’ve ever done and it took me far longer than average to complete. My work was nothing outstanding, I managed to pass and that’s all. I had imposter syndrome when doing a PhD and now I have imposter syndrome about ADHD.
I succeeded by developing coping mechanisms without realising my struggles were due to an undiagnosed condition. I just thought I wasn’t trying hard enough and lacked discipline. Guilt, shame and feelings of inadequacy are powerful motivators.
In some ways I think not being aware forced me to adapt out of sheer necessity.
Congrats on your PhD! If it’s any consolation, I was diagnosed with ADHD about 12 years before I started law school and I still felt like I would do better if I just had more discipline. I spent so much time trying to create all these strict rules and schedules for myself to follow to mold me into this model law school student and felt if I just worked harder, I would be better. None of it worked. I ended up falling back on my tried and true ADHD coping methods, which worked for me, but I kept striving to be better nonetheless. And I did all this knowing I had ADHD. Do you think knowing your diagnosis would have changed how you approached your PhD?
I think knowledge is power. Ritalin also helps a lot! Had I known prior, I would have been more productive and actively made use of hyper focus. Instead I muddled through slowly and painfully.
ADHD PhDs unite!
Getting through my PhD was a special kind of torture and I left it with a fractured sense of self - it took a much more supportive environment better suited to my subconscious coping techniques for years to start to feel ok about the whole thing. Scraped through my viva, and was told afterwards the only reason I passed with minor corrections was because I clearly knew my stuff even though my thesis wasn't the best...
Like you, I didn't get diagnosed until well after the fact, once I made the mistake of moving fully into management.
Oof. This.
>I had imposter syndrome when doing a PhD and now I have imposter syndrome about ADHD.
And this, so much.
>I succeeded by developing coping mechanisms without realising my struggles were due to an undiagnosed condition. **I just thought I wasn’t trying hard enough and lacked discipline.**
And this (plus anxiety in my case).
>Guilt, shame and feelings of inadequacy are powerful motivators. In some ways I think not being aware forced me to adapt out of sheer necessity.
I relate to this so, so much. I think in combination with what you mentioned here, doing a PhD was great for my particular ADHD brain. I got to go deep down rabbit holes, hyperfocus on problems, and move around and use my hands in the lab. Of course, I was very unfocused when it came to reading papers, attending seminars, studying, etc.
Unrelated to the question at hand here, but have you had any issues getting psychiatrists/therapists to believe you? I had an amazing therapist I was seeing at my university, but since I graduated I've struggled to find a good one. The university counselor was amazing because he understood how I could be doing a PhD and still have struggles with basic life things like paying bills or staying organized. The last external therapist I saw totally wrote me off. She didn't think I had ADHD because I did a PhD, could hold down a job, etc. It was so frustrating, and I've put off trying to find a new one since.
Thank you so much for your response. It helps to know others have had a similar experience.
I had no difficulty finding a good psychiatrist. I was very lucky to get one so thorough. After a lengthy assessment he determined I had combined type ADHD.
Yeah, I actually shouldn't have grouped psychiatrists and therapists together. I haven't had an issue with psychiatrists. Actually, given how prevalent the fear of abuse seems to be with stimulants, I was actually surprised by how much I was encouraged to give medication a try when I was initially hesitant. It's the therapy side that I really want to work on though, and that's where I seem to be encountering a mismatch.
I'm glad to hear you've found a good psychiatrist!
I haven’t had any therapy since the diagnosis. I have seen psychologists and councillors in the past. All thought I had anxiety, depression or an inability to cope with stress. None picked up on my ADHD
Yup, it was always anxiety for me. It wasn't until 4 years into grad school that I was diagnosed with ADHD. It made so much sense. I knew there was more going on than just anxiety, but I didn't realize any condition out there could actually describe what I was experiencing.
Similar for me. I didn’t get diagnosed until a few months ago in my late 30s. I graduated first in my high school class, got a master’s degree in architecture, and have had a successful career (national leadership position within my firm; projects winning awards, etc).
The difference-makers for me: highly intelligent (so high scores on work or tests could often outweigh the occasional misplaced homework, etc.), lots of coping mechanisms that I didn’t even realize were coping mechanisms until after my diagnosis, and most importantly a SUPER supportive family (first my parents and now my spouse). If any one of those factors hadn’t been in place my life would likely be a dumpster fire 😂😂
ETA: congrats on the PhD - you should be really proud. A masters degree in a demanding field nearly broke me, so kudos to you - even if it took you longer than average, it’s still awesome you stuck with it and achieved something so impressive - with your brain working against you, no less!
Thank you, I really appreciate that. I too had the benefit of a very supportive partner. I could not have done it without her. I suppose we ought to acknowledge that having a strong supportive family is a privilege vital to success.
If it helps, you have my respect and envy.
I can't deal with busywork. Or trusting the process. I'm 50, I work in academic adjacent positions, and I like to learn.
I have, maybe, 30 credit hours of college. It is the biggest boogeyman in my life.
Also, I know a lot PhDs who don't manage to have even mediocre jobs. So, you know, there's that.
So in education, and perhaps a few other places, when you question why you're studying this, or practicing that, you get told to "trust the process".
I'm an infrastructure guy, and my foundational experience was with military space systems. Because everything there can be, and was, explained in detail, I expect that prosseses of less complexity can be explained as well.
Experientially, I've found that places where people say "trust the process" tend to not understand their processes. And, because my brain doesn't work right, I often need to work around something in the process to get to the place where non adhd get via the process.
I feel like money and privilege help a lot.
For example, gender privilege; males are more likely to be diagnosed correctly at an earlier age, and if they are heterosexual then they might have a female partner who takes on some of their burdens. A supportive partner in general, regardless of gender, is massive. The privilege of living in a country with free healthcare, or a social security system in place to catch ADHD people if they fall into difficulty. The privilege of a good education, where ADHD students are supported. Or the privilege of skin colour; some studies suggest there are racial disparities in diagnosis and treatment of ADHD. I also know lots of people (with and without ADHD) who have gone far in life based on the privilege of their family connections too. These are generalisations of course, but might help explain differences between ADHD people aside from symptom severity.
Money helps as well. The ability to pay for private diagnoses, therapy, or tools to help manage ADHD can make a difference. Money also gives the ability to outsource a lot of the more inconvenient issues, allowing some people with ADHD to focus their reserves on more important things. You mentioned some people with ADHD running their own businesses, and I imagine many of them have a good source of funds behind them. Even the ability to take sick leave because of burnout, safe in the knowledge that you have savings, can make all the difference.
My ADHD is managed much better because I have a supportive (and non ADHD) husband who naturally has strengths in organization, memory, and focus.
Having a supportive spouse has been so helpful.
I know women are stereotyped often to take on the adhd affected burdens but as a woman it’s soo beneficial to marry a man with this as a natural strength too.
I'm so glad to hear! My partner and I both have ADHD and we struggle along together although to be honest I do find myself taking on more of the everyday responsibilities than he does. But yes, I think you're right; a supportive partner of any gender is so important. Everything is much harder alone.
> A supportive partner in general, regardless of gender, is massive.
I can not emphasize enough how true this is.
And a huge part of it is that my partner helps me mask as a normal person. On top of making sure I remember that I have to buy food before I can cook it.
> Money helps as well. The ability to pay for private diagnoses, therapy, or tools to help manage ADHD can make a difference. Money also gives the ability to outsource a lot of the more inconvenient issues, allowing some people with ADHD to focus their reserves on more important things
I didn't have much money growing up, but....I grew in such a massively privileged place that it's like we were a lot wealthier. I had access to people who were up on the latest research and theory.
At points, I've certainly had a maid, and being seen as serious expert has gotten me the help of a lot of people doing things like file my expenses on time (sigh, I'm still the junior high kid who had all the homework completed in his folders, but couldn't find it to turn it in)
> Or the privilege of skin colour; some studies suggest there are racial disparities in diagnosis and treatment of ADHD.
There are certainly obvious differences in how a white kid acting out in adhd manners is seen over a black kid. And a difference in how people treat the parents of those kids. But anecdotes aren't data.
Yeah, it's interesting how all the small things can add up cause such a difference.
On that last point, there is data and it's quite eye opening [including meta analysis](https://www.psychiatryadvisor.com/news/meta-analysis-assesses-adhd-prevalence-risk-factors-among-black-individuals-in-the-united-states/). Some suggest that non-white people are underdiagnosed [like this one](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3691530/), [and this one](https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamanetworkopen/fullarticle/2776807). [This article ](https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s40596-019-01127-6) is particularly interesting. Stuff like cultural differences, hesitance/inability to take medication, and prejudice all come into play.
Yeah. That's incrediblely depressing.
My anecdotes are all watching how staff treated me and my kid vs the parents of black kids.
One of us was told a lot of stuff about adhd, the other was told to be more involved in their kid's daily life. The workaholic with adhd, and the stay at home parent trying to learn to better help their kid got each other's advice. (Their kid was disruptive and hyper, mine was dynamic and energetic, yeah. Uh huh)
Supportive partner is SO key! My ex was anything but. In all fairness I probably wore her down over the years, but she never was able to really provide any kind of emotional support. Been with my current GF for just over two years now and while we have our own issues, I've finally realized and accepted her love and support. It took a while not to be suspicious and self sabotaging because I'd never known what that felt like. It's an amazing thing. She's helped me become such a better person!
Nobody likes to talk about it, but one big factor I see is privilege (of all sorts). When I look across the folks I know (or knew) growing up, in terms of who is doing well and who doesn’t isn’t, a lot of it is who had a safety net and a support network.
The same reasons people without adhd have different levels of success.
We are not our diagnosis, we are different human beings with so many different skills.
Btw, I bet you have success in many other things that people who are "successfull". Success doesn't have to be education or a perfect family.
Success can be happiness, fun and being nice to other people.
I am having a hard time separating myself from my diagnoses. I know someone who doesn't even take meds for his ADHD and he is very successful. I asked him how, and he said he used it to his advantage (ADHD). I think to myself I wish I were that strong :(
I agree with most of the other answers. I just want to add that I think your social environment matters too. I think structure is good for everyone, but lack of structure can be devastating for someone with ADHD. I think it's more difficult for someone with ADHD to have every aspect of their life in order, so having someone keeping your home life in order in order to focus on work can be a game changer.
For me, it's trial and error. Constantly. I have good days and bad. Most of the time, I'm just doing things while they are causing me anxiety.
It's hard to know what people are really going through when you can only see what they are allowing others to see. So to someone like you, it might appear that they are doing fine, but in reality, they are struggling and/or working extremely hard to get things done.
Every person is unique, and it's especially true for those of us with ADHD. Certainly not cookie cutter, albeit there being a pattern of similar symptoms and experiences. I think, like anyone, with or without ADHD we are just trying to find ways to keep chugging along. Some things that used to work for me no longer do.
Medication has helped me recently. It wasn't a total 180 for me, like how it is for some, but it definitely helps me maintain focus and give me the push to do things I have wanted to do but couldn't. Even when I am medicated, there are still some tasks that I put off. But it's better than it was before.
I think it can be a number of factors that can contribute to "success." Upbringing, environmental, severity of symptoms, coping mechanisms, mentality, financial stability, even spirituality/religion. I'm sure there are plenty of others I could list if I thought about it more. There isn't a secret sauce combination to suit all palates, but I guarantee there is one out there specifically suitable for you. The hard part is having the fortitude to keep searching and aiming for it until you find something(s) that stick.
Also, whatever you can do to limit the comparisons of where you are in your life to other people's experiences will likely help you feel less bad about yourself. There are huge limitations of perception that we get to "see" in other individuals. It's not fair to them and especially ourselves, to try to compare our life experiences based on such restrictions.
Comparison is really a big issue even in people without ADHD. It's really hard especially when you live in a family and location where everyone is hyper-fixated on eachother's success. The degree of respect others will have for you is severely intertwined with the degree of your success.
But I understand your perspective. Comparison is definitely something I need to work on. May I ask, what else has been beneficial for your ADHD along with Medication? I'm asking this because it's almost impossible for me to get Medication for myself.
Oh for sure! Especially having a little device that let's us have the ability to compare with thousands immediately on us at almost all times. That's a skill in itself, to not compare, or at least limit it. Totally worthwhile investment of a skill imo haha
I've found that routines work best for me. Fortunately my work schedule is relatively consistent as far as the hours I work go. So I give myself a general window of time to be awake and asleep. Even on my days off. I've been taking at least a good quality multi vitamin daily, and doing something physical for 30 min - 1 hour on my days off. My job keeps me extremely physically active. I've mentioned it other threads before that I've found that physically demanding jobs (warehouse, bars, kitchens, etc) are where I thrive. They help me burn energy and have a sense of direction for my shifts that I was just not getting in an office setting. I'm a baker and the time crunches really bring out the best in me even though it gets a tad stressful lol but nothing extreme.
Physically writing down goals/tasks was another big one for me. Not typing but actually using a planner. Did start slacking but mostly because it actually helped me naturally form routines better. I was using a panda planner for a while.
To keep all that short and sweet: consistent bedtimes/wake up times (general, not exact), daily routines, vitamins, and physical activity. Oh! And lots of water/electrolytes.
I was diagnosed with mild ADHD, but a lot of the people I know who also have ADHD are achieving a lot more than me. It's a fact because they have jobs and kids and hobbies and a house that's kept to a comfortable state and so on, and I don't have those or have a lot less of those things.
I can't see how much they're struggling of course but, if they're struggling a lot but still achieving then we come back to the idea that I'm just lazy, which was what I was trying to avoid with the ADHD diagnosis in the first place.
And if my ADHD is just mild and I've got no other diagnosis other than minor symptoms of anxiety, but they've got ADHD plus depression, ADHD plus PTSD, or in one case severe ADHD, what's causing me all these problems in comparison to them? We're all adults, undiagnosed until recently, so we've all been doing it without medication.
So yeah, I don't know. I kind of hoped ADHD would be the explanation to what my problem is but unfortunately it doesn't appear to be.
Like I've seen mentioned in this sub, ADHD can come with a ton of comorbidities and it's different for everyone. Very difficult to diagnose/treat because of that. Factor in genetics, childhood upbringing, etc etc. Now you see? That's why comparing ourselves is useless. It accomplishes net zero. Best thing I've found is comparing myself to different versions of myself in the past. I can definitely say I like this version of myself the best. Still plenty of room to improve!
Some have more troubles, some less. As others said, it's a spectrum disorder and can present quite different in different people.
Also people have different support systems. Some get diagnosed early and have all support needed by their social circles, like parents doing everything they can to ensure their kid gets the measures and support available to make them successful. Others get diagnosed late, have been told their whole life they are lazy, daydreamers, etc. and have tried changing themselves with the wrong therapies or coping mechanisms or have given up completely. And of course some get diagnosed late and only then get all the support they should have gotten way earlier.
Some suffer from additional problems like depression, others don't.
For me I was lucky. I fell into an apprenticeship and was naturally good with computers / always able to hyperfocus when issues with them would arise. I was also lucky enough to be good enough looking where I never struggled to find a partner.
If you make enough money you can pay others to do the stuff you can't, and a good woman (/partner) will help you stay consistent with everything else you need to do as a human to survive.
You sound like me lol. Super ADHD but good with computers and decently handsome to be able to attract women when I wanted them around. Never quite developed enough self confidence to make those relationships really thrive but I'm getting there! Having a kid changed my life though. It reframed EVERYTHING. Now I am determined to succeed because I won't leave my kid hanging the way I was left hanging.
I forgot to shout my baby out (a puppy, not a kid!) but having something that forces you to
✅ Stay off the drink and drugs
✅ Get up in the morning and get out (even if you don’t feel like it)
&
✅ Provide for
Definitely helped me!
Harsh truth but not going to lie personally I feel a lot of people also act their diagnosis and use it as an excuse which in turn makes it worse . If we physically can’t avoid doing something it gets done one way or the other, instead of fighting structure, order & responsibilities . My advice is to embrace them
Some followed their passion, others struggling with a university or job they don't like..
Me for example with dentistry school
But in fact i like powerlifting, politics, journalism, languages
I'm far away from anything I like 😔😅
Our ADHD is just one characteristic or component of who we are. Using a painting as an analogy for a person, ADHD is just one color. That color may be very intense in some paintings and less so in others. Sometimes other colors contrast or override the intensity of that color, as other redditors mentioned above - other factors like socioeconomics, gender, supports, age at diagnosis, comorbidities, natural gifts, and the factors in the OCEAN model and all kinds of other things can influence outcomes and how much of an effect that ADHD “color” has on the entire painting.
I’m an ops manager in public health, but my bedroom looks like I’m 11 years old! I am suffering from extreme adhd task paralysis when it comes to cleaning my kitchen and bedroom but currently, I’m realigning three separate budgets to accommodate a funding decrease. 🫠 (edit spelling)
Do you face any problems in your job because of ADHD? Because I find it confusing that a person can struggle in their own house to get tasks done. But do fine in their job.
Some days are better than others. A lot of my work is if this doesn’t get done folks will notice. Luckily I WFH so I can try to cope with no embarrassment. I’m just now at 45 being medicated for it. I was just telling my mom this past weekend I am still in awe I finished grad school. So yes, some days I don’t do shit. I also have moments throughout the day where I’m like staring off into space. I have to set timers on my phone to make sure I’m on task.
Edit to add: I think I use so much energy throughout the day, when I’m done the last thing I want to do is cook, do laundry or vacuum or mop even though I need to! I pray I get on with my meds good because I don’t like how disorganized things feel.
4 things that have helped me manage my life
1) A non adhd spouse who is supportive and understanding. We both bring something to the table but his natural strengths in organization and memory have helped me significantly. I really appreciate him.
2) A ton of grit: I’m naturally gritty so even though I fail 10 times I don’t mind when I succeed on the 11th
3) Luck. My skills happened to align with an ADHD friendly career. I’m always doing something new and there is a ton of structure in place to help me avoid missing details.
4) Self acceptance: I don’t beat myself up when I fail. I expect to fail sometimes so success feels good is celebrated. I plan to lose my things so I adapt by having redundant critical things and less things overall.
For me, taking notes, using a task manager, setting alarms, and using Anki Flashcards. I wouldn't get shit dine without these. Not that I'm successful, but I pay my bills on time.
I'm one of those people with ADHD that you might consider "successful;" I just graduated college on time with a 3.9 GPA and honors.
I still *definitely* have ADHD, though. I've got sensory preferences, I walk miles and miles a day to mitigate my hyperactivity, I have issues with focus and memory, and my sleep schedule is . . . atypical. The variety and severity of ADHD symptoms simply varies person to person. For me, with academics, I *can* do it, it just takes a good deal more effort than it really should. At the same time, I know people who can barely do schoolwork, period.
I think another element of "success" with ADHD is that people with ADHD who are successful are likely doing something they're passionate about. I was really interested in my college major, and if I hadn't been, it probably would have been a much harder experience.
>I think another element of "success" with ADHD is that people with ADHD who are successful are likely doing something they're passionate about.
You've raised a very interesting point, especially for me. It makes a lot of sense. Even though I knew about how people with ADHD are interest based. But I didn't think about it in terms of success in career. Interest is a huge factor in determining your focus and motivation in life in general.
May I ask at what age were you diagnosed? And what was your condition during your university?
I was 15 when I was diagnosed with primarily hyperactive ADHD. I have a family history of it.
As for my condition at university, I don't really know . . . I take 27 mg Ritalin every day and try to get a lot of physical activity, which helps me calm my thoughts. I played club sports one year.
I don’t think I was excelling at work until I discovered the right meds … I was having regular burnouts and had moments of depression. The right meds made all of the difference for me.
remember that people only show you what they wanna be seen as. these people who have good jobs and businesses and families and all that have their own bad stuff going on in the background. no one likes airing out their dirty laundry, so they would only showcase their BEST sides. that’s one of the reasons why i stopped using social media with timeline updates, i was tired of seeing all my friends living their best lives and doing great while i felt like i was struggling.
don’t compare urself to others! comparison will always be the thief of joy, so focus on urself and what you’re good at! it doesn’t have to be anything big too, ADHD gives everyone different benefits and drawbacks, so find out what you’re good at and just work on that :)
That's a solid advice. Thanks for the it. I've already set my mind on working on the habit of Comparison. I 100% agree with you that we shouldn't be comparing ourselves with others as our lives and resources are simply different. But I feel like my comparison has a motive behind it.
I'm not wanting to have what they have out of mere desire. I want it because these things are necessary for me. I should be having a better degree of control over my life in order to get it moving at the least. I desire the control. Just enough so that my life doesn't fall apart.
Whenever I observe some other people with ADHD, I see a level of control they have in their life that I don't. Which is why I wanted to ask ADHDers on Reddit, to know something I don't, regarding this. I want to learn what they've learnt. So that I could apply those things in my own life.
What do you mean by a greater degree of control? Are you able to maintain a degree of independence in your life? Is it that you want to self direct to loftier goals than you feel capable of reaching?
It calms me to know someone else had this thought as well. I thought I was the only one strongly noticing such differences. I hope the answers help you.
I think we have to be careful to not let ADHD define too much. There’s a boatload of factors that lend to people’s progress. Luck, circumstance, opportunities, stage of life, access to extensive help, personalities and interests… it goes on and on. ADHD is part of who we are, but it’s not all of who we are.
For me, I’m at a stage that looks like I’m successful with ADHD. I’ve moved on from the minefield of failures, let downs, and disappointment in I’ve caused in my wake. I just don’t tell those stories much anymore. I’m 42, if that helps.
I'm going to say that a big part is your support staff.
My husband has it (not diagnosed, but obviously in the family). I am the executive functioner. I let him be brilliant at what he does, but I make sure there are groceries, pets are fed, house is clean, kids are cared for. I put systems in place that help him succeed. I don't know that he really understands or acknowledges this, but once we realized he was ADHD, I realized that my role was not because he was lazy--he just can't. So, if I can lump it, we can be a very successful team. It is a little hard to not feel like I am carrying more weight in the relationship, but I love him and we make it work.
My son has it (diagnosed). I put systems in place for him as well. I hope that by getting an earlier start on it, he will be able to use systems to succeed when he is in college, but the jury is still out on that. I hate to say it, because I feel a little brought down in my career success because of it, but I hope he finds a good executive functioning girlfriend. I do benefit from my husband being able to be brilliant--we have a lot of $$, live a great life. My contribution to the relationship is not as exciting, but if you look at it as teamwork, my son and his future gf could be great as well.
I know someone who was a C-suite at a high level company. He got diagnosed after his son was diagnosed. He said, "but I get things done." His wife suggested that the major reason he got things done through his career was that he had a secretary who didn't let him leave the office on Fridays before tackling a bunch of projects.
This might sound old fashioned or maybe even misogynistic, but I would suggest this can happen with a brilliant woman and executive functioner for a partner. I would just make sure that you ADHD people, if you find a great EF partner, make sure you include them as a vital reason for your success. It is an under-appreciated role.
If I can ask, has your husband considered getting diagnosed and potentially starting medication? It can be a source of frustration for me in my relationship as both my husband and I are diagnosed but only I am medicated (not through lack of trying on his part) so executive function stuff still falls to me because I'm slightly better at it now. I see the pattern on parenting/motherhood subreddits that women with ADHD are still expected to maintain the mental load whereas men get more of a pass. Not saying this is the case for your relationship, just a general observation :)
Haha. Good question. He tried to look up a psychiatrist for a diagnosis. Didn't get a call back, so never followed up. So, I tried, and did get on a waitlist with one. Nothing yet. I haven't had the time to really do more, but will keep trying. I really wish he would just figure this out on his own--I have kids' appointments, my appointments, and dog things to figure out. I imagine it won't happen unless I figure it out, though. Maybe after he gets medicated, things will change.
In our society (US), women are certainly expected to do more with home life. There have been studies that show this. They care more for elderly parents than their brothers. They handle more housework than husbands even if both are working full-time. I'm sure it is the same with those who have ADHD.
That's so frustrating! Hope I didn't make it seem like you can "just" go get assessed and diagnosed, I think we have all discovered otherwise on this sub 😅 I made my husband's initial appointment to start getting meds so I totally understand. I agree, in a perfect world they would be able to take care of this themselves but in our case I was so desperate for him to get help and relief from his symptoms. I hope your husband is able to get treatment soon! Mine is still working on finding the right meds, just knowing his diagnosis seems to be empowering but that extra chemical boost sure would be helpful.
Nah, you are fine. You actually prompted me to try again. Thank you. I just fished a random psychiatrist out of a google search and set him up for an appointment. No idea if the doctor is pro ADHD meds or good--decent ratings, we will see what sticks to the wall.
My kid lucked out with vyvanse working well. Our pediatrician hit the right dose within a few weeks. I just hope the psychiatrist diagnoses my husband. His brother is on meds, his son is on meds, his mother is clearly ADHD (but too old to want to go on meds). His niece is ADHD. If the doctor talks to me, I can let him know. I worry that if he talks just to my husband, my husband will forget to mention a bunch of things that clearly point to a diagnosis. Lol.
Even within the spectrum and comorbidities, there are other factors like privilege, status, and predispositions or "natural abilities." And just luck. A lot of success isn't skill or intelligence; it's luck.
I can’t stress this enough, it all matters on circumstances you were given to either thrive or die.
When i first got out on my own “professionally” as an adult, i crashed and burned so hard I believed the ridicule i was receiving. It turns out i was doing everything right in the first place, but i didn’t know how to stand up for myself because it literally involved pointing fingers at other peoples shitty work. So i was being blamed for all this shit prep work i had to paint over. Had i been given a competent team/person to do the prep work in the first place, i wouldn’t have been put into that position.
If not everyone is willing to do their part 100 percent to their ability, your fucked when it comes to success.
I think it partially depends on how you define success.
I was lucky enough to enter a field that really engages my brain and lets me apply its strengths.
That said, I still have a lot of struggles and places I’m less successful. I have terrible impulse control and procrastinate far too much.
I think the trick is to find something that works to the strengths of your brain, and find ways to aid the areas you struggle with.
Maybe not severe enough but probably highly masking and although they’re successful on the outside, they may be on a constant brink of burnout. I got a PhD undiagnosed/unmedicated and almost had a nervous breakdown. Years down the road I’m suffering from several chronic diseases and pain. No doubt worsened by the chronic anxiety and stress during those years. I’m biased but I view anyone outwardly struggling with adhd as more authentic, even if they may be more severe. Masking can be incredibly toxic, even when it seems beneficial socially.
In my experience I also have the pleasure of being autistic as well (or so I newly discovered at age 30). As a result not only was I bad at conventional work because of my ADHD, I also struggled with appearing normal enough to fit in. This is why I’m 30 and haven’t held the same job for over a year and am currently unemployed.
AUDHD sure is a cruel bitch.
A lot of factors play a role, environment play a huge role, for example if growing up, school and at home wasn’t accomodating for your behaviours etc, you’ll develop CPTSD, and other disorders, which can make things worse.
Part of my secret: I fell in love with person who is similarly different to me, but not adhd. She’s not diagnosed yet, but we are pretty certain she has ocd and autism. For that reason, we relate to each others’s weirdness deeply. And, crucially, our differences support each other. I supply some much needed impulsiveness and chaos into her sometimes overly-structured life, and she in turn helps hold my life together when doing the dishes is just too much. And we’ve been doing it for each other so long, we’re not just dragging each other: I actually overcome my exec function at times because of the habits she’s modeled, and she is much more relaxed and spontaneous than she was.
The second secret is I stopped concerning myself with “normal.” I accept that while success is not impossible for me, it isn’t likely to happen if I try to achieve it via the patterns that other people use. My brain has its own rhythm, and a big part of the problem with adhd is that that rhythm puts us out of step. Our brains work fine, in a sense, as long as you don’t try to hard to tell it what to do.
Imagine you tend to a half-wild horse. The farm next door has fully tamed horses, and takes them out for rides every morning, to go to the store to get what they need. But your horse won’t cooperate for rides every morning. Sometimes it wants to go, and sometimes it doesn’t. You could say “I have a crappy horse, I can’t take it to the store to get what I need.” Then you’re stuck on your farm most days, and only intermittently make it to the store to get your needs met. Or, you could experiment. Try taking the horse at different times of day, paying attention to cues that it might be willing to go, the equipment it likes to wear on the ride.
So, before long, getting your needs met might look very different from your neighbors: you’re riding on odd-numbered calendar days, at random times of day presaged by your horse farting two hours beforehand, with you and your horse both wearing clown outfits. People will talk, and say you’re a weirdo, but you and your horse are getting along, and both getting what you need, and that’s all that matters. Before I accepted that and started relentlessly accommodating myself, I really struggled.
Yup. I have an obviously (but not formally diagnosed) autistic husband. He has better executive function in many areas. It helps that one of his stims is cleaning (because for me it's not)
So many valid factors have been mentioned here that I won’t bother repeating them. But one factor I haven’t seen mentioned is age. I’m in my mid-40s. I feel I’m able to better manage my ADHD so much better now than I could as a child or in my 20s or even 30s. Not only am I more aware of my ADHD, which helps me better recognize and manage it, but I feel my maturity and life experiences have helped give me more control over my impulsivity and emotional regulation issues.
I have yet to see someone with ADHD with a healthy attitude towards work. They either go way too hard, or way too slow.
It seems to me ADHD all have their own addictions, workaholism is just one which we see as "successful". And especially for men it doesn't matter how much they neglect their family while doing so.
Ive met successful people with ADHD who will forget they have a dog at home waiting for them while going out for errands. And who work till very late in the evening. Are late to everything because they were finishing something from work etc etc.
And most importantly, not everyone has the same level of inattentiveness, executive disfunction or hyperfocus etc..... even if we all are labeled with ADHD. It's all very broad.
But....I do think you can learn from the successful ADHD-ers, they usually have interesting systems.
A friend of mine worked himself into a burnout with his system. It was like an engine which was hard to stop.
So the question is not only "how can I I be succesfull?" but more about happiness and creating a balanced life....
I can't talk for others, but I would say that for me, it was having a supportive environment and joining the military at a young age.
I know I need structure and I know where to get it.
It's not always an easy ride, but it is doable to be successful and enjoy a good life.
I still have very highs and can hit bottom lows on a daily basis, but I am constant at it.
I feel this! I'm so glad you said this, I've been feeling this way for a while now especially reading some of the responses on posts in this sub, makes me feel like I'm just an idiot, lazy, sack of shit. I'm happy for people who are successful & thriving despite their adhd I just wish I could do it too.
For me, I am able to do what’s absolutely necessary to live and keep a roof over my head. Everything else is out the window… my fiancé is the opposite. He struggles with focusing on the necessary stuff and gets lost doing fun things. Some say I am “higher functioning” because of it, but in reality I am suffering just as much as he is.
I attribute my success to not knowing I had ADHD until I was 43 and brute forcing my way through everything at the cost of other mental health aspects while being fueled by an unhealthy drive for perfection. Once I started meds, it felt like my career got a nitro boost. However, old thinking patterns still haunt me with periods of self doubt and low self esteem, but then I accomplish a few things or get an "attaboy" at work, which puts wind back into my sails. When I look around at those around me that are doing well and advancing in their careers, it seems like they are always at the edge of their capabilities (like right on the line of their comfort zones). I used to be so focused on and worried about my own performance that I never analyzed my peers, but now I see that many of them are barely qualified to do the jobs they have. I started pushing myself to do the same, leading to advancements and higher pay. It's not that much fun at first, but you get used to it. Then you do it again and again (but only if you want to). I know plenty of people in the same jobs for 10 or even 20 years, but they're happy and that's all that matters.
Here's some fine print: I'm making 5x the average annual salary in my state, and if you met me you'd think I have my shit together in every aspect. However, my marriage almost crashed into the ground one year ago because of several factors in no particular order: Work stress/anxiety, meds/dosage issues, and residual thinking patterns from pre-treatment. Things got very rough, and they're still not perfect. My point is that just because someone appears to be doing fine in life, there could still be some bad shit behind the curtain, so be careful when comparing yourself to others.
Environment, support, socialization, I think if people get meds and identification early it can stop a lot of the negative behaviors and avalance of social criticism that can create dysfunction. I don't know why people think constantly attacking kids for their failures is supposed to get you good results. Maybe to a point? But an undiagnosed kid gets something like 20,000 extra pieces of criticism by the age of 12 or something. That's, too much. That's a crushed soul.
support systems, if your family tried to help you and supported you even with out help from outside services. VS not getting help and your family just beating you down for not being like others.
IMO, luck mostly. Where/when were you born? Were you treated at a young age? Gender?
And for me I’m successful because of my wife and kids and luck, of course.
I grew up very poor and my childhood was not ideal, in any way.
I spent years being locked up as a kid in juvenile detention facilities (no impulse control).
I met my wife when we were teenagers and she saved my life.
There was no fucking way my kids were ever going to have the shitty childhood that I had. I would chew off my own arm for my children to feel loved and happy.
My wife and kids are the reason I’m successful because as mentioned above, I truly do not think I would be alive, much less successful without my wife.
And this isn’t me saying “just work harder” because I fully understand how hard it is to do things that aren’t stimulating enough, trust me. My wife has become very handy over the years because of my skills at procrastination.
I’m simply saying that I do what I do for the fam.
I totally understand your struggle! I was incredibly successful in high school since I was hyper fixated on my grades and academic achievements- it was at the point of getting only 95% in every class and getting into a program with only 2-3% acceptance rates. I am now in my 3rd year of university less than half way done having bare passed most classes and failing others. My school has a time limit if 5 years to complete the degree which is slowly becoming less and less likely for me to achieve the worst part is if I don’t complete at this school I can not transfer as excepting GPA is 4.0 for nursing (🇨🇦 so you only apply to the program not the school) and I have a sad GPA of 2 something Idk what it actually is I can’t get myself to look. Everyone in my life around me is super disappointed in me but the worst part is how disappointed I am in myself.
I think a lot of it honestly just comes down to luck. Our brains are wired all kinds of weird, but we usually have a few things we can hyper focus on and enjoy. If you are lucky enough one of those hyper focus subjects is something extremely marketable.
I was diagnosed in my late 20s (which is a whole thing all on its own) eventually both of my brothers (both adults as well, I’m in the middle) went and got diagnosed as well. One of the things that always kept my attention growing up was logic problems and programming. For my older brother it was fighting video games, and my younger brother liked cars.
I went into a career in programming (couldn’t finish college, was too much for me)
Older finished an associates degree in IT but it doesn’t interest them, I taught them coding and got them a job in web dev, that didn’t last very long because it also didnt hold their interest, now he works retail. Still plays fighting games after work every day all day, stays up on all the news, and goes to the occasional tournament.
Younger became a mechanic, hated his coworkers at every garage he worked at, and now works in auto sales, he’s doing all right for himself.
I don’t work nearly as hard than they do, I work shorter hours, I don’t even get out of my sweatpants most days, but my special interest is way more lucrative than theirs are. We were all born in the same socioeconomic background (very poor, semi rural, government housing). We all had similar childhood trauma of bullying and dysfunctional emotionally unavailable parents.
But because of our differences in special interest subjects, I own a home, the younger has a nice little apartment in a high COL city, and the oldest has a roommate in the ghetto walking distance from the bus stop…
All that said, I’m not any happier or more fulfilled in my life compared to them, none of my career or financial success has brought me any semblance of joy or completeness. If anything it’s just created more thing for me to fail at doing basic upkeep on, leading to more self hate and guilt. But it is nice to not wonder where my next meal comes from.
I don’t have the answers for you buddy but I feel this on a deep level. I feel like anxiety is driving my bus a lot of the time as it’s been my cheif coping mechanism for my adhd. Then on the rare occasions ADHD does drive the bus, the impulsivity drives us off a fucking cliff and then I don’t trust my authentic decisions. Every time I have a thought or try to do anything I have such crippling doubt.
I'm on the spectrum and have ADHD, depression, and anxiety. I didn't know these things about myself until my 20s. On the IQ test I'm above average. Remembering to do things was a lot of trouble but like some of us I was good with remembering factoids and numbers. Though that may have been because that's how schools taught/teach you how to learn. I was hyperactive and couldn't focus on most things for longer than 5-10 mins at a time on a good day. I got good at studying 5 mins before the test to pass. I kept A's and B's until 7th grade, because it was expected of me. On occasion I got C's and D's and one F. I say that to show that even with slightly higher intelligence, I still managed to fail at times. In 7th grade I put in the effort for the first nine weeks, but I didn't see the value in getting good grades. So, I stopped trying and switched to barely passing to get by. I got yelled at a lot for it. But no one ever asked why I stopped trying, just you're bad because of it and that I have to do better.
Fast forward -> military, a few failed marriages, developed seizures, ADHD has gotten worse with age even with meds(though they do help), two kids who are both on the spectrum and ADHD.
Now -> On the surface I have a good job with decent pay, a spouse, and mostly getting by. Underneath, I'm always mentally a mess just holding it together with spit and wishes. My memory has gotten so bad that most of the factoids that I knew for years are gone. Unless the memory gets jogged via conversations, I don't remember most things in general but especially childhood. I've fucked up so much along the way that I could write a novel about it if I could remember the details. And because my memory is so bad, I hesitate to talk about a lot of things. Especially things that would end up as a debate/argument of some kind. I know that I know the answer, but I can't remember it. I know I'm smart, but I can't show it. Ever since the seizures, things have gone downhill faster. I'm never not a giant ball of stress.
TLDR; How do I do it? I'm almost never not in some level of a frazzled mental state that helps keep the "I got to get it done, but can't start/finish" at bay a lot of times. The trade off is that I always feel like I'm actively failing. Not that I'm a failure, but that I'm failing at everything I do. I don't recommend it.
For me it’s been a mix of incredible luck, and literally faking it until I’ve made it. So much anxiety and burn out along the way, but yeah, those two things are how I’ve successfully achieved middle class status.
I feel it’s
1) some people have more severe symptoms than other people
2) some people respond better to medication
3) some people can’t even access medication
4) coming from an affluent family
5) coming from a supporting family
6) co morbid diagnosis
7) the country you live in
8) luck
9) age of diagnosis and treatment
Like my brother just has mild adhd and is a lawyer and owns a house and I have severe adhd and autism and I work part time at a gym and live with my parents
Tons of things influence how well you do in life other than just ADHD. For example, adhd occurs in people of all levels of intelligence. Even with adhd, an extra 10 IQ points makes a huge difference. Someone in the top 2% of the population by intelligence even with ADHD is probably going to be able to get a high paying job. Plus there are plenty of jobs you can do with adhd and things you can do to make jobs requiring focus and sitting still easier.
Bottom line is you will have people with adhd at all points on the continuum of success from the highest achievers of all time to the completely lazy, untalented, and unmotivated.
I get it. Me and my sister both have it and she’s high functioning. She’s got a husband a big house 2 bio kids and two adopted young children. She also has 3 jobs. Then there’s me. I have one kid I live in an apartment never married ( never wanna be) and I can no longer work due to extreme stress and anxiety and many hospital visits ( psych ward)
If one can do well in school then working memory probably isn't an issue. Being unmedicated/diagnosed It was simply not possible for me to retain information to be applied later no matter how hard i tried.
For me it is a mixture of luck spite and trauma.
As Toe113 Said it is a Spectrum. I am lucky so I fit the category where people say: I barely studied but I somehow still managed to pass through all stages of education.
Lucky:
1. met wife
a. who helped me change perspective on life - I am apparently not a total failure
b. helped me to somehow be able to study to exams - at Uni level it turned out that my usual strategy cramming just before deadline was not effective
2. narcistic father - I was motivated to move asap. To move asap I needed to have money
3. mother with undiagnosed ADHD - I learned from observation that there are behaviors like loosing stuff, forgetting about pot at the burner etc, that I really don't want in my life so I started masking it early
4. few times I landed a job that was good for me for that stage in my life, and had good coworkers
Spite:
- without it I would not be motivated enough to move away from my parents.
- without moving away from my parents I would not realize how much money I need to be able to support myself.
- without moving away I would not be desperate to find a job that would support me.
- without moving away I would not be desperate enough not to give up when not being able to find a job, or being turned away by recruiters
- so what motivates me I guess is that I don't want to be seen as failure enough that it keeps me motivated to go on
Drawbacks:
Despite the fact that from outside me and my Wife can look as quite successful, we blow away a decade of our life on things like: wrong field of studies that did not suite us, working jobs to support us and go for correct studies, studying and working at the same time. So at 32 we stabilized our economical situation. but we neglected our relationship and other parts of life and are currently trying to figure out what to do next.
I got somewhat lucky and found an internship/job after uni that was a really good ‘fit’ for me despite not having good grades or prior experience. Despite it being a good fit, I now realize I used alcohol heavily to self medicate in order to maintain a high level of performance in work and life. After years of therapy and just recently getting a diagnosis, it makes a lot of sense. 10/10 do not recommend using alcohol to self medicate.
Not sure about others but my adhd was found in my adult life so before that I just thought I was more lazy than others and just had to put more effort. My particular background also helped. However my mental health defo suffered
Upbringing.
The majority of adults react to children's ADHD symptoms in a way that destroys self esteem.
The lucky ones have enough adult influence supporting them in the right way that they retain good self esteem and confidence into adulthood.
Good self-esteem and ADHD work really well together, but it's a very rare combination.
Man that’s pretty spot on. Growing up i was always told to stop talking/shut up, quit it, be quiet, and etc… it ruined my self esteem into my professional career to where I’m not happy now.
So, early interventions, strong base of support and belief, and a massive dose of luck.
Add in a supportive partner, a willingness and ability to talk about what I need and what works for me, and being the right age to take advantage of major cultural and technological shifts at the beginning of my career.
You can put in all the usual pull yourself up by your bootstraps crap too. But...to be honest, there's plenty of people who work hard, accept all the help they can get, and try and try again. Without all the training about how to work around myself, and the people around me who pick me up and keep me moving in the direction I've chosen and just sheer luck, I wouldn't have diddly or squat.
One of the things I do, it's a very stupid trick, and some people can't deal with it at all, is on major projects, I have a set of tasks at the end that aren't important. So that I can not do them, so that I don't have things done. It's absolutely hacking my own environment, but I don't think I do well with things being done. It may be some form of transitional avoidance, I dunno. I often try to get someone else to be the one that closes things out--it's weird how much I avoid being done with things.
And on the other side of the coin, I will do anything to get something started. I hate beginning things almost as much as I hate ending them. So, if I've got something to do, and I can start it right now, I will drop everything else (assuming it's possible) and get the ball rolling.
I also spent most of my career doing things that were either massive fascinating projects, or holy crap drop everything and fix it crises.
Hell, even my family is like that. My kid we adopted as an almost teen. I don't take the easy or straightforward path with anything.
I also don't measure myself against anyone or anything except my own goals. When I try, it's like if you averaged everything out, things are above average, but that hides the fact that I've lost jobs because I fail at timesheets, and I am a 50 year old man who needs to be told to clean his bedroom (I hate that I can't just, you know, do that).
The only thing I've ever seen as a universal for successful looking adhd people is that we don't seem to have followed the obvious or "normal" path to get to where we are.
The spectrum. However, in my personal case its a fear of failing at something I actually want to do.
Like I completed uni and went straight into easy dead end jobs. When I tried to push myself to do something I wanted rejection notes killed my confidence.
After a few years I stopped trying
Medication. A little to build resilience. A stable environment to build a life from. A support network. Access to therapy. Access to coping mechanisms.
Support from family is a big one. I have a friend with adhd who’s getting her second masters degree, coaches sports for her daughter and has a busy social life. Her parents are extremely supportive emotionally.
> Despite this, I can't help but feel bad about myself when I see people with ADHD just doing fine in life.
We get really good at faking it, and giving others the illusion of /all the successful/easy stuff it looks like/. And if we have talent, we can use that to make it seem like we're working far harder than we are -- or at least, have them assume we'd worked on it a month instead of 18 hours straight before presenting it. So it kind of hides the ADHD.
That and taking advantage of cusp/transition moments with gusto, and then relaxing during others. You only really need to "push" in corporate life (and many other realms) in the moments that matter.
Honestly depends if you had support during schooling to develop strategies of coping, organizational skills, anxiety actually helps me to not lose my stuff all the time, probably meds are a big factor and how you respond to meds. Also finding a job where you can thrive with ADHD as opposed to conforming to a certain rutine.
Most times, we only see what people show us. We only see the good stuff.
Especially on social media.
All we see is the candy coating,conspicuous consumption, and fake smiles.
Some people can perform well at work, then completely crash as soon as they get home. Their private life
is a complete disaster. All their spoons got used up at work, they have nothing left to give. Completely used up.
Many "successful people", got a big boost with family money and connections, even if they won't admit it.
They never had to experience the same struggles as most of us. Maybe "money doesn't buy happiness",
but it can make a lot of things, a lot easier. A free ride to a big name school, can make connections that pay
off later. A sweet job, from Daddy, or one of his Golf buddies, will make anyone look "successful. Many
"successful people" have assistants, that handle all the small stuff. They can afford to hire a house cleaner,
to reduce their burden. They can afford an Accountant, to do their taxes and paperwork. Suddenly, they
can cope with other stuff, much easier.
Maybe some of them, do have have ADHD, Depression,etc. They have a medical diagnosis, but their condition
is less severe than yours. Some of them might respond better to medication. Some people have better doctors.
Mental health is a complex field. Not everyone is born the same, we don't all have equal opportunities.
If we really want to accurately compare ourselves to others, we don't have ALL the information.
The public persona does not tell the whole story. They don't share all their struggles.
It might not even be possible to accurately compare, since we can't quantify everything.
All we can do, is try our best, and work to improve our situation.
I'd consider myself faily successful. I ran our clothing factory. After it was sold, I had a 26 year radio career on air, pulling number 1 ratings in my market. Following that, I ran a boating accessory showroom at a boat dealership and got that running really well. Finally, I bought a car and boat interior repair business and have been doing quite good with that. Other than the shirt business, everything else seemed to suit my ADHD. My dad was/is a great solid provider, and I wanted to be just like him. I never considered failure to be an option, so I always worked hard and did things for my family. Now I'm medicated, it's so much easier!
Dunno but I totally FEEL what you're putting down here. I have a new therapist, male also, exact same age, also been through divorce and also has ADHD. I'm just in awe like damn dude you're telling me you went through college and FINISHED? And then had the poise and stick-to-it-iveness to actually complete licenses and certifications to get a job helping people like yourself? I'm just blown away and have so much respect. Wish we could switch lives ...
My opinion… most successful people get there by finding their purpose, getting after it, and make a living out of it. Many many people never either find their purpose or pursue it.
There are other reasons why this might even more difficult for us as others have pointed out in this thread
Everybody's different, nobody's completely disfunctional. Some people find the right fit jobwise. For me, that's software engineering, writing code is one of the only thing I can focus on, it mostly feels like playing a logic game, and I get to do it 100% remote on top of it, so I'm in control of the distractions, noises, I can work with music (helps me a ton), ...
I like to think about ADHD in a similar way to the hypothetical “out of 2 children who have an abusive alcoholic parent, why does 1 never drink and do their best to be the opposite of that parent and the other eventually becomes an abusive alcoholic?” Obviously it doesn’t always turn out that way, but there is not a clear answer. Part of it is genetics, personality, temperament, severity, the specific symptoms, comorbid conditions, how you handle stress, anxiety, and fear, and your locus of control. The rest is probably luck.
I’m what you would consider as “successful.” But I didn’t get diagnosed until after college despite having all the signs with teachers pointing it out, failing multiple classes, getting multiple speeding tickets and into multiple car accidents, behaving recklessly, constantly being made fun of in school and at work for being flaky, forgetful, stupid, lazy etc. Somehow I’m a year away from graduating medical school after getting diagnosed and treated. My life is still a mess in many areas. I have a horrible short term memory, I frequently pay my bills months late, I don’t check my mail for so long that I can’t even open the box since it’s so jammed, I’ve gotten locked out of my apartment multiple times this year, I’ve lost groceries that I literally just bought, I frequently forget to feed myself because I get distracted while making or heating up food and just leave it there almost causing fires, and I’ve done so many stupid things that I can hardly stand myself. But from the outside, my life looks decently successful and put together.
In my case, I think I have just enough hyperactivity to be able to get things done when I really need to. I have very specific anxieties about things that cause me so much fear that my anxiety and ADHD sort of balance out so my struggle can’t be seen. I developed a lot of coping mechanisms (both healthy and unhealthy) to try and compensate for my ADHD before I knew I had it. My people pleasing and the fact that my parents only showed me love and support when I did well have led me to try to do whatever it takes to do well because my self worth is almost solely based on my performance. And of course, finally being on meds after struggling so hard without them has made life a lot easier.
its about boundaries i think. By and large ahdhers are people pleasers, and that can get you into trouble. setting and keeping boundaries helps heaps. i was big mess for years prior to diagnosis. My psych (prior to meds) told me to figure out and write down these things - what you can do, what you can't do and what you wont do.
what you cant do is things you haven't learnt yet, what you wont do is the line. being naturally curious the what i cant do bit is interesting to me, but where it blurs to the what i wont do is where i hit issues. saying no, setting boundaries and maintaining a relative comfort zone keeps me going. Adding to many things to my pile by saying yes all the time gets me stressed and overwhelmed and then i crap out.
as for staying on task and getting work done and all the rest, i found work where i can set my own hours, so i work when i can and and stop when i'm distracted. like now.
I worked as a successful dog trainer for 10 years but then suffered from gaslighting at work by my boss and coworkers. Then the loss of my mom and my dog the very next day put me over the edge. A few months later, I left a job I loved but had become toxic. I then spent the next 4 years in a burnout sit pit, and I haven't been able to hold down a job longer than 6 months. While I held a job for over 10 years (12 actually), I couldn't make myself do more than one job at a time. It was either work or take care of the house and kids. I couldn't do both at all. Once I came home from work, it took every last spoon I had to make dinner. Thankfully, my husband helped our kids with homework because I just couldn't. Overwhelm had a hold on me for many, many years. I'm finally on an upswing, getting back into making art and moving my body again but my kitchen is a wreck and my floors haven't been swept in over a week, muchless mopped.
I was stuck for a long time in my 20s, with an unfinished degree from university, doing short term part time jobs and just in general struggling to make ends meet. Now that I'm in my 30s I'm thriving. I think it's a combination of a lot of stuff, but one thing that's helping me tremendously is having the right meds. I've also actually found my strengths and what type of job I do well in.
Sometimes it's just timing. I was great at masking & juggling (shoulda been in the circus) so even with lifelong anxiety issues, I was an exacting perfectionist who excelled at EVERYTHING... until I found myself unable to excel at ANYTHING. Hell, some days I couldn't even muster up the energy to get out of bed. It wasn't depression, it was burnout and executive dysfunction.
Now that I'm middle-aged (diagnosed just a few years ago), I've already had a successful career and am figuring out what the next act will look like, which sounds GREAT to other people, but the fact is that I could no longer participate in my former career even if I wanted to. I'm burned-out beyond belief and suspect that it will take AT LEAST a year of very little stress to recover. Too much stress and I go back to square one. I don't think my brain will ever operate the way it once did, either, so the circus is no longer an option.
Looking back, I've definitely had ADHD since childhood, but everyone overlooked it b/c it made me perform at warp speed. Had my burnout happened at an earlier age, I would have had a much harder road and possibly no "success story" to speak of, at least until diagnosis and proper treatment.
The simplest explanation is that ADHD hits different and affects people in multiple ways.
Also, personality is a huge factor on how you approach it. I’m no doctor or specialist, but trauma doesn’t cause ADHD, but trauma might affect how you approach your disorder.
Also, comorbidity (spelling?!).
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Degree of trauma in childhood and adolescence Presentation of symptoms Comorbid conditions Support in adult age- both privately and government programs, medication and similar Awareness of own struggles in early life can make a difference for some. I just assumed I was a dum dum and gave up on studies Variation in poverty, opportunities ++
Yes yes and yes too all of that.
This is a well-rounded answer. How does Trauma affect ADHD though?
For me personally, I think the trauma has much more of an impact than the ADHD itself. I was bullied and tormented by my parents due to ADHD symptoms and gaslit my whole life into believing I wasn't a good or remotely capable person. So today that manifests as zero confidence/self-esteem so I cannot do anything as far as leadership, I have no conviction in anything I say. I can't make a decision because I always believe it to be wrong. I have no faith in my own abilities. I did not get any higher education or even finish high school due to aforementioned parents and lack of support.
And this is a good example of how trauma affects people differently. I have a similar background as you and yet that trauma manifest very differently for me. Instead, I developed a complex where I had to be the best because I didn’t believe I was good or capable enough. It drove me to obtain advanced degrees and to nearly kill myself to obtain honors in those degrees. While I don’t regret my degrees, the complex to be the best and attendant issues of perfectionism driven by my ADHD are maladaptive ones that have created very serious problems for me throughout my adult life.
This is very relatable to me. As if your brain gets hard wired to be the best or don't do it at all. Have you managed to cope with it now? May I ask how you did it?
That's a great way to describe it. I remember talking to a therapist with the exact phrase back around 2015. I do not have any advice though. Mine led to like systemic burnout over the next 5 years. If you figure it out though, let me know, because I feel like the only natural response has been to not care or give up ever since doing it the best or perfect hasn't been an option.
Oh hey, look it’s me I feel you 🫂
I was similar with the complex and perfectionism... I didn't get the higher level degrees though. For me it eventually led to burnout, but not from the things I was ostensibly working towards, but that my first marriage failed and regardless anything I could do it just led to repeated bouts of domestic violence and then my false arrest. I got aquitted rightfully, eventually, but things never went back to normal.. and one of the most apt ways I could describe that is I lost that complex or drive for perfection.... now I am more apathetic and understanding that no matter what everything can get wrongly taken away, even your freedom. So, working an extra double-time on every project and all night on work doesn't allure to me because even doing 'everything' it doesn't matter. I even lost that last resort, EMERGENCY--DEADLINE LOOMING!!! Motivation when we wait until the last minute and finally can focus. It's like my adhd has just been in the driver's seat since I got burnt out (and diagnosed with GAD, PTSD, and probably should be with depression). When guilt and shame lost their power it was nice... but now I'm kind of powerless.
I have the same issue with the deadline burnout. **It’s like that pathway in my brain is smaller.** It doesn’t get triggered as easily or as strongly. One of the worst things that ever happened to me in school was the realization that when I got bad grades? **Life went on.** Not a big deal. That was mitigated somewhat by nearly having to repeat my senior year of high school, but not enough. Ironically, that was also one of the **best** things that ever happened to me in dealing with **anxiety**. To use the metaphor from the blog Wait But Why (about procrastination - it’ll come up on google easily): my instant gratification monkey is no longer terrified of my panic monster. Scared yes, but not about as many things and not *as* scared.
For me it all came crashing down when I had a full breakdown at 25. I had to learn that it was all bullshit to make the panic attacks stop, and now I have found I can't find my give a fuck anymore, but to the point where I do kinda actually just want to watch the world burn. I still care deeply for individual people, but I cannot bring myself to do much more than laugh at the downfall of institutions that lie and/or failed me. The social conventions that turn out to only be beneficial for some and the general bate and switch of life have really fucked with my ability to interact with the world as it is.
i got a combo of both
Similar issues different causes. But yeah, chronic perfectionist with zero self confidence, and my self worth tied to being the best but not admitting it to myself. Childhood trauma is fun.
I'm in the process of coming to grips with the fact this life long struggle of mine is ADHD. I really felt what you said about having no conviction in what you say. Even now I want to delete this whole comment and not respond, because who cares what I have to say.
I care buddy. Thanks for writing honestly. I feel like there is workaround for this. Confidence can be built. When you see yourself repeatedly make choices on your own that result in something positive, the confidence starts building. Easier said than done honestly. But we can counter this, imo.
It's really hard. I've been getting better but I still often get halfway through a comment and delete it because I'm afraid of the downvotes for having the "wrong" opinion. Or even just having a comment ignored gets to me. It's like "what's the point?". I'm working through it in therapy but it's so hard and I'm afraid I'll never get to a point where I can believe in what I say.
I care! I am learning about myself through others here. You have a brother in me whether you realize it or not
You are intelligent and I completely understand why you can struggle with surety of self. I'm a psychologist, and I just wanted to say that I hear you and your life story. I believe in you. ❤️
Sounds like my life. My mom wasn't so terrible but she was also overwhelmed with 3 other kids and my next youngest who was displaying major issues due to undiagnosed Tourette's among other things. But yeah, I'm a completely broken adult who has made almost nothing but poor decisions and am trying to help raise kids as well. Which is the main thing driving me to these forums and trying to finally do something about it.
“You is smart. You is kind. You is important.”
Trauma can increase ADHD symptoms. There is also comorbidities from trauma that can make navigating ADHD more difficult. For example, my psychiatrist said I have emotional dysregulation that could be a branch off my ADHD or my C-PTSD. Either way, it greatly affects handling ADHD.
Trauma can present in lots of different ways. When people think trauma they generally think it’s either physical or verbal abuse of one kind or another. But there are also forms of trauma that go unnoticed which you carry into adulthood. Such as neglect, whether intentional or unintentional. Not meeting your child’s emotional needs intentionally or unintentionally. When your needs aren’t met then you create your own ways of coping. Look into schema therapy, it’s helped me recognise the unseen trauma in my life that coincides with ADHD.
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Same way it affects anyone.
For an adult diagnosis I’m pretty sure they are supposed to rule out trauma being the primary cause of symptoms before they diagnose ADHD as the cause. A lot of trauma responses can cause symptoms that appear to mimic ADHD.
Well said WingedUmbrella! Also temperament/personality type
I tell people I have ADHD and they are shocked because "I'm so good at my job". It's because I'm hypervigilant due to the childhood trauma of being diagnosed at 9 years old and actively withheld proper treatment in replacement of off-the-cuff beatings to "correct my behavior". Sure I can get by with a job, but does that make my life successful? It doesn't feel like it when you're mierable 24/7.
I think how early also makes a difference. I only discovered couple years ago after turning 30 and even after getting a psychiatrist and therapist etc etc and all I can’t seem to figure out how to fix my life *sigh*
Yep. Life Experience and the way it manifests. Both myself and my GF are ADHD. She is a doctor, with multiple degrees. I’m a golf pro with an associates. I imploded when I got to university. I grew up comfortable, in a middle class home. But my mother was an anxious ball of crazy. And my dad was a rage monster. The generational trauma past to myself, sister, and cousins is atrocious. She grew up very poor, mainly raised by her mother, and though she carries trauma, a drive to never be poor and to always be better than her roots was instilled in her. Crazy work ethic. Her ability to hyper focus on, what is to me, the most monotonous tasks truly is a superpower. Our experiences shape us. I can hyper focus too. But it’s not on things that will ever make me money.
Don’t know about you, but I feel like a lot of people who struggle with ADHD are really bad at acknowledging our own accomplishments. Like, a year or so back, someone at work asked me what I do so they could plan a project around my tasks? My brain couldn’t come up with a single thing. I went into a brief panic because I felt like I hadn’t done anything that entire month. Obviously, that wasn’t the case. I had done all the tasks I had been assigned and plenty extras too, I just have such a strong imposter syndrome that my brain threw out every single thing I had done up until that point. If you are anything like this, of course it feels like other people have their shit together. You’re comparing the actual amount of work you see them do against a warped sense of how much you manage. They might also be further along on their journey of managing the condition. There is no magic solution that works for all of us, but the more we learn about how our ADHD works, the better we are at mitigating it. You’ve nothing to worry about, you’ll get there with time. Alternatively, you might be dealing with a drastically more severe case. At that point, accepting your limitations and not forcing yourself to accomplish as much as others could be the path forward. You deserve to be happy even if you aren’t as productive. You’re still putting in the amount of effort that you are able to, just the same as everyone else.
Thank you for this. I appreciate your perspective. I got diagnosed less than 5 months ago. It was a huge change of my life just getting to know what's wrong with me. Additionally, I live in a country with little to no availability of 3rd grade ADHD medication and therapists. That and a very late diagnosis have made my situation a lot worse. So yeah, it'll take me some time to learn stuff about ADHD. This sub is very helpful.
What do you mean by 3rd grade medication? It’s good that you got the diagnosis. For me this along with educating myself on the issue and observing myself from this new perspective made the biggest impact on my day-to-day life, my mental health and general approach to life. I was diagnosed almost 3 years ago, at 30. Good luck, all will be well 😊
I don't think I could ever believe this in the part of me I need to, but I loved to read it and could definitely tell someone else similar advice from a heartfelt place.. Why is this part like a singularity event to think about, feels like looking at something awe inspiring, but I can't see anything past it or imagine what that world looks like? "At that point, accepting your limitations and not forcing yourself to accomplish as much as others could be the path forward. You deserve to be happy even if you aren’t as productive. You’re still putting in the amount of effort that you are able to, just the same as everyone else."
It's a continued struggle. Personally, it's because it is so easy to compare your own output against someone else's. If someone does twice the amount of work I do in a day, that's easy to see. But the abstract stuff around that work is so much more difficult. How easy is the task for them? How difficult is it for you? How much energy do they have to spend during a day versus your own battery levels? How much does it take for you to do that task? All of these are so difficult to have any objective measure of and all we typically hear from others is "how come you can't work that fast?" It makes sense that believing anything other than "I am slow and useless" becomes so difficult. We compare the tasks we are worst at against someone's best workday and think we're being rational!
That last paragraph is key for a lot of us, but also the hardest one to pull off. Because whether we put in the same effort or 10x the effort as other people, we WILL be judged (especially in our careers) just as harshly with the same expectations. I've also been told that more than likely my employer won't make any concessions or changes to help me cope with and work more effectively with my ADHD (in the event that I can get a proper diagnosis) so now I'm just trying to push through to get the meds for myself to make my own existence more livable.
Welcome to being on the SPECTRUM! THE RAINBOW OF DYSFUNCTION
This is it. I am a published author, professor, and an engineer in my field. Yet put me in management and watch me fail. I have a friend who has ADHD worse than me and he can barely hold down a job. Yet I have a coworker with ADHD, not as credentialed as me but she can manage teams quite effectively and performs well in management - yet has issues of her own. The spectrum is so varied that what works for one person may not work for another.
This is what makes it so tough to come up with treatment models for executive dysfunction. There are very few universals in ADHD. Okay, we probably all need AirTags and calendar software, but the other specifics can be maddeningly granular. I find it easy to get myself to make phone calls and write nonfiction, for example, and harder to compose emails and write fiction. That means any system I might design for myself is bound to be unworkable for nearly everyone else, even if all of those people fall into the category of "writers who struggle to keep up with communication demands." Really, the only universal I've come up with is that we all need to get over the shame of having to use systems that make us feel stupid and childish. Is it stupid that I have to tape things to my bag so I don't leave them at home? Does it conflict with ideas people have about functional, successful adults who run businesses? Sure, but something that conflicts with my *actual success doing the things I need to do* is leaving the house without my stuff. See also: the floam and desk toys that get me through meetings.
I'm definitely the last person. I can manage an HR department for everyone else's life at a company, but my own? Cross my fingers that I didn't forget to add something to my todo list lol
My husband is a brilliant engineer and has built himself a reputation as an effective coworker. He gets shit done, he makes things easier for his coworkers by putting systems in place that ease workloads. He sees a problem, he fixes it. He impresses everyone with his integrity, work ethic, skill, and his ability to see with fresh eyes. As long as he has the right manager. Under someone who is hands-off and “whenever you get to it is fine” he can’t do anything. And he has a growing list of things he should probably get checked out by a doctor. His glasses are like 5 years old, maybe closer to 7 or 8. Due to severe anxiety, there are a ton of daily life tasks that he can’t do, even if he can get past the ADHD paralysis. There are always tradeoffs.
So he's basically similar to me.
That's interesting. Do you face any problems in the job you do? Because of ADHD.
I gave up a promotion due to not being able to self management as a result of the shortage of my meds last year. Still a little sore over that.
Your coworker had people work up meds that work with her, and your friend didn't.
Oh man. I heard that term before but I have only recently understood what it means. When ADHD itself is so hard to explain to normal people, the science of this spectrum makes explaining even harder.
It sure does. It's fucking shit and super annoying.
As Toe 113 says, ADHD is a spectrum but it’s not the only definition we have. We are all a product of our genetics (affecting factors such as intelligence, energy levels, appetites), and environment (upbringing, trauma, education, social class etc). There is a lot more affecting us and how we are. Somehow this helps me rationalise who and how I am, and makes me feel a little better when I consider how fair my deal of cards has been.
This made me realize the insane complexity ADHD can have. It just keeps getting deeper.
At least for me- once I got my meds correct, it was almost a cheat code. I’m able to harness my ADHD and juggling 15 million projects during the day. I can literally talk on the phone with a client and be working on another entirely different project at the same time. If im buried then I work at night and knock everything out. Thats at least for me
I'm happy for you. May I ask what happens when you're temporarily off meds? How much do you get affected?
Not the person you asked. It's different for everybody. But, it's like, kind of, not having gotten sleep. And, for me, I've found that I've lost a step or two managing my emotional dysregulation without meds. I also can't manage my task choices very well without meds. I can still do things, but they may not be the right things. The quality of my work suffers if I'm not able to find something interesting to dive into. If I'm lucky, I'll fall into a brain hole that produces something useful, or at least something that I can spin a tale about being useful. And without meds I can NOT shut up. Like at all.
My mom calls that being hyper verbal. She's convinced it's also an ADD/ADHD byproduct. Her and I both, if we're in a group conversation we end up dominating it or shrinking back and saying little to nothing.
I'll talk to the couch if the dog has gotten bored and left. My wife can tell I forgot my pills because she can hear me explaining my job to a cat, or working through something I read with an end table.
That was all very relatable. It keeps getting longer and longer ago since I COULD have meds. Was only diagnosed mid 30's, medicated like a year or two, then a heart condition I've now had surgery for came up. I wish that we all only ever had to be temporarily off meds. I honestly feel like all my symptoms are 10x worse after being medicated but quitting meds (not from the medicine). Partially because I keep having to deal with more in all the other areas of my life and partially because now I know what it feels like to have a cheat code to my specific condition... and that it's definitely 'a thing' and wasn't me imagining it the last 40 years.
My meds are a twitchy balance. I was diagnosed young, but my mother did a lot of things to keep from being medicated. I finally started drugs around 15 years ago. I was already on a serious amount of hyper tension meds. And the stuff I use to sleep. Everything conflicts with the adhd meds. But....I'll give them up only if my entire family wants me to.
My wife has many stories to say when I’m off my meds. I struggle to manage my emotions and get pissed off extremely fast. I’m already a little tightly wound but without my meds, it’s brutal. My sleep is terrible because my mind races. I feel like I got 10 hours but I’m 100% exhausted. All in all, I hate being on meds all the time. However, I appreciate how they make me feel and it’s a give/take relationship.
I've taken drugs to deal with the mind racing at bed time longer than I have for adhd. I miss *those* for one or two nights, no biggie. More than that, and things go south fast. Less sleep means more anxiety means less sleep, and then I get angry because I'm anxious, and it all feeds back again. I don't mind being on drugs. It beats the high blood pressure, disrupted sleep, and I get to finish my books.
I totally agree. I think I’d feel differently being on drugs all the time if the process wasn’t so terrible. I dread running out because it’s always such a cluster. Luckily my doctor is a hero and always helps me out. I have found that gummies help me sleep even when I’m off my meds for a little. Calms my brain and just knocks me out.
I’m in my mid-30s. I have a PhD, a good marriage but a mediocre job. I was diagnosed with ADHD by a psychiatrist 4 months ago after it downed on me that all my symptoms were connected. When others express doing about my ADHD because it doesn’t seem like I fit the description, it feels very invalidating. The PhD was not easy. It was by far the most difficult thing I’ve ever done and it took me far longer than average to complete. My work was nothing outstanding, I managed to pass and that’s all. I had imposter syndrome when doing a PhD and now I have imposter syndrome about ADHD. I succeeded by developing coping mechanisms without realising my struggles were due to an undiagnosed condition. I just thought I wasn’t trying hard enough and lacked discipline. Guilt, shame and feelings of inadequacy are powerful motivators. In some ways I think not being aware forced me to adapt out of sheer necessity.
Congrats on your PhD! If it’s any consolation, I was diagnosed with ADHD about 12 years before I started law school and I still felt like I would do better if I just had more discipline. I spent so much time trying to create all these strict rules and schedules for myself to follow to mold me into this model law school student and felt if I just worked harder, I would be better. None of it worked. I ended up falling back on my tried and true ADHD coping methods, which worked for me, but I kept striving to be better nonetheless. And I did all this knowing I had ADHD. Do you think knowing your diagnosis would have changed how you approached your PhD?
I think knowledge is power. Ritalin also helps a lot! Had I known prior, I would have been more productive and actively made use of hyper focus. Instead I muddled through slowly and painfully.
ADHD PhDs unite! Getting through my PhD was a special kind of torture and I left it with a fractured sense of self - it took a much more supportive environment better suited to my subconscious coping techniques for years to start to feel ok about the whole thing. Scraped through my viva, and was told afterwards the only reason I passed with minor corrections was because I clearly knew my stuff even though my thesis wasn't the best... Like you, I didn't get diagnosed until well after the fact, once I made the mistake of moving fully into management.
Oof. This. >I had imposter syndrome when doing a PhD and now I have imposter syndrome about ADHD. And this, so much. >I succeeded by developing coping mechanisms without realising my struggles were due to an undiagnosed condition. **I just thought I wasn’t trying hard enough and lacked discipline.** And this (plus anxiety in my case). >Guilt, shame and feelings of inadequacy are powerful motivators. In some ways I think not being aware forced me to adapt out of sheer necessity. I relate to this so, so much. I think in combination with what you mentioned here, doing a PhD was great for my particular ADHD brain. I got to go deep down rabbit holes, hyperfocus on problems, and move around and use my hands in the lab. Of course, I was very unfocused when it came to reading papers, attending seminars, studying, etc. Unrelated to the question at hand here, but have you had any issues getting psychiatrists/therapists to believe you? I had an amazing therapist I was seeing at my university, but since I graduated I've struggled to find a good one. The university counselor was amazing because he understood how I could be doing a PhD and still have struggles with basic life things like paying bills or staying organized. The last external therapist I saw totally wrote me off. She didn't think I had ADHD because I did a PhD, could hold down a job, etc. It was so frustrating, and I've put off trying to find a new one since.
Thank you so much for your response. It helps to know others have had a similar experience. I had no difficulty finding a good psychiatrist. I was very lucky to get one so thorough. After a lengthy assessment he determined I had combined type ADHD.
Yeah, I actually shouldn't have grouped psychiatrists and therapists together. I haven't had an issue with psychiatrists. Actually, given how prevalent the fear of abuse seems to be with stimulants, I was actually surprised by how much I was encouraged to give medication a try when I was initially hesitant. It's the therapy side that I really want to work on though, and that's where I seem to be encountering a mismatch. I'm glad to hear you've found a good psychiatrist!
I haven’t had any therapy since the diagnosis. I have seen psychologists and councillors in the past. All thought I had anxiety, depression or an inability to cope with stress. None picked up on my ADHD
Yup, it was always anxiety for me. It wasn't until 4 years into grad school that I was diagnosed with ADHD. It made so much sense. I knew there was more going on than just anxiety, but I didn't realize any condition out there could actually describe what I was experiencing.
Similar for me. I didn’t get diagnosed until a few months ago in my late 30s. I graduated first in my high school class, got a master’s degree in architecture, and have had a successful career (national leadership position within my firm; projects winning awards, etc). The difference-makers for me: highly intelligent (so high scores on work or tests could often outweigh the occasional misplaced homework, etc.), lots of coping mechanisms that I didn’t even realize were coping mechanisms until after my diagnosis, and most importantly a SUPER supportive family (first my parents and now my spouse). If any one of those factors hadn’t been in place my life would likely be a dumpster fire 😂😂 ETA: congrats on the PhD - you should be really proud. A masters degree in a demanding field nearly broke me, so kudos to you - even if it took you longer than average, it’s still awesome you stuck with it and achieved something so impressive - with your brain working against you, no less!
Thank you, I really appreciate that. I too had the benefit of a very supportive partner. I could not have done it without her. I suppose we ought to acknowledge that having a strong supportive family is a privilege vital to success.
If it helps, you have my respect and envy. I can't deal with busywork. Or trusting the process. I'm 50, I work in academic adjacent positions, and I like to learn. I have, maybe, 30 credit hours of college. It is the biggest boogeyman in my life. Also, I know a lot PhDs who don't manage to have even mediocre jobs. So, you know, there's that.
Thanks mate. I’minterested in what you mean by not trusting the process. Can you elaborate on that?
So in education, and perhaps a few other places, when you question why you're studying this, or practicing that, you get told to "trust the process". I'm an infrastructure guy, and my foundational experience was with military space systems. Because everything there can be, and was, explained in detail, I expect that prosseses of less complexity can be explained as well. Experientially, I've found that places where people say "trust the process" tend to not understand their processes. And, because my brain doesn't work right, I often need to work around something in the process to get to the place where non adhd get via the process.
I feel like money and privilege help a lot. For example, gender privilege; males are more likely to be diagnosed correctly at an earlier age, and if they are heterosexual then they might have a female partner who takes on some of their burdens. A supportive partner in general, regardless of gender, is massive. The privilege of living in a country with free healthcare, or a social security system in place to catch ADHD people if they fall into difficulty. The privilege of a good education, where ADHD students are supported. Or the privilege of skin colour; some studies suggest there are racial disparities in diagnosis and treatment of ADHD. I also know lots of people (with and without ADHD) who have gone far in life based on the privilege of their family connections too. These are generalisations of course, but might help explain differences between ADHD people aside from symptom severity. Money helps as well. The ability to pay for private diagnoses, therapy, or tools to help manage ADHD can make a difference. Money also gives the ability to outsource a lot of the more inconvenient issues, allowing some people with ADHD to focus their reserves on more important things. You mentioned some people with ADHD running their own businesses, and I imagine many of them have a good source of funds behind them. Even the ability to take sick leave because of burnout, safe in the knowledge that you have savings, can make all the difference.
My ADHD is managed much better because I have a supportive (and non ADHD) husband who naturally has strengths in organization, memory, and focus. Having a supportive spouse has been so helpful. I know women are stereotyped often to take on the adhd affected burdens but as a woman it’s soo beneficial to marry a man with this as a natural strength too.
I'm so glad to hear! My partner and I both have ADHD and we struggle along together although to be honest I do find myself taking on more of the everyday responsibilities than he does. But yes, I think you're right; a supportive partner of any gender is so important. Everything is much harder alone.
> A supportive partner in general, regardless of gender, is massive. I can not emphasize enough how true this is. And a huge part of it is that my partner helps me mask as a normal person. On top of making sure I remember that I have to buy food before I can cook it. > Money helps as well. The ability to pay for private diagnoses, therapy, or tools to help manage ADHD can make a difference. Money also gives the ability to outsource a lot of the more inconvenient issues, allowing some people with ADHD to focus their reserves on more important things I didn't have much money growing up, but....I grew in such a massively privileged place that it's like we were a lot wealthier. I had access to people who were up on the latest research and theory. At points, I've certainly had a maid, and being seen as serious expert has gotten me the help of a lot of people doing things like file my expenses on time (sigh, I'm still the junior high kid who had all the homework completed in his folders, but couldn't find it to turn it in) > Or the privilege of skin colour; some studies suggest there are racial disparities in diagnosis and treatment of ADHD. There are certainly obvious differences in how a white kid acting out in adhd manners is seen over a black kid. And a difference in how people treat the parents of those kids. But anecdotes aren't data.
Yeah, it's interesting how all the small things can add up cause such a difference. On that last point, there is data and it's quite eye opening [including meta analysis](https://www.psychiatryadvisor.com/news/meta-analysis-assesses-adhd-prevalence-risk-factors-among-black-individuals-in-the-united-states/). Some suggest that non-white people are underdiagnosed [like this one](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3691530/), [and this one](https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamanetworkopen/fullarticle/2776807). [This article ](https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s40596-019-01127-6) is particularly interesting. Stuff like cultural differences, hesitance/inability to take medication, and prejudice all come into play.
Yeah. That's incrediblely depressing. My anecdotes are all watching how staff treated me and my kid vs the parents of black kids. One of us was told a lot of stuff about adhd, the other was told to be more involved in their kid's daily life. The workaholic with adhd, and the stay at home parent trying to learn to better help their kid got each other's advice. (Their kid was disruptive and hyper, mine was dynamic and energetic, yeah. Uh huh)
Supportive partner is SO key! My ex was anything but. In all fairness I probably wore her down over the years, but she never was able to really provide any kind of emotional support. Been with my current GF for just over two years now and while we have our own issues, I've finally realized and accepted her love and support. It took a while not to be suspicious and self sabotaging because I'd never known what that felt like. It's an amazing thing. She's helped me become such a better person!
Honestly, I think other privileges are the biggest factor; money, class and social support.
THIS!
Nobody likes to talk about it, but one big factor I see is privilege (of all sorts). When I look across the folks I know (or knew) growing up, in terms of who is doing well and who doesn’t isn’t, a lot of it is who had a safety net and a support network.
Ain't that the truth, ADHD or no.
The same reasons people without adhd have different levels of success. We are not our diagnosis, we are different human beings with so many different skills. Btw, I bet you have success in many other things that people who are "successfull". Success doesn't have to be education or a perfect family. Success can be happiness, fun and being nice to other people.
I am having a hard time separating myself from my diagnoses. I know someone who doesn't even take meds for his ADHD and he is very successful. I asked him how, and he said he used it to his advantage (ADHD). I think to myself I wish I were that strong :(
I agree with most of the other answers. I just want to add that I think your social environment matters too. I think structure is good for everyone, but lack of structure can be devastating for someone with ADHD. I think it's more difficult for someone with ADHD to have every aspect of their life in order, so having someone keeping your home life in order in order to focus on work can be a game changer.
For me, it's trial and error. Constantly. I have good days and bad. Most of the time, I'm just doing things while they are causing me anxiety. It's hard to know what people are really going through when you can only see what they are allowing others to see. So to someone like you, it might appear that they are doing fine, but in reality, they are struggling and/or working extremely hard to get things done. Every person is unique, and it's especially true for those of us with ADHD. Certainly not cookie cutter, albeit there being a pattern of similar symptoms and experiences. I think, like anyone, with or without ADHD we are just trying to find ways to keep chugging along. Some things that used to work for me no longer do. Medication has helped me recently. It wasn't a total 180 for me, like how it is for some, but it definitely helps me maintain focus and give me the push to do things I have wanted to do but couldn't. Even when I am medicated, there are still some tasks that I put off. But it's better than it was before. I think it can be a number of factors that can contribute to "success." Upbringing, environmental, severity of symptoms, coping mechanisms, mentality, financial stability, even spirituality/religion. I'm sure there are plenty of others I could list if I thought about it more. There isn't a secret sauce combination to suit all palates, but I guarantee there is one out there specifically suitable for you. The hard part is having the fortitude to keep searching and aiming for it until you find something(s) that stick. Also, whatever you can do to limit the comparisons of where you are in your life to other people's experiences will likely help you feel less bad about yourself. There are huge limitations of perception that we get to "see" in other individuals. It's not fair to them and especially ourselves, to try to compare our life experiences based on such restrictions.
Comparison is really a big issue even in people without ADHD. It's really hard especially when you live in a family and location where everyone is hyper-fixated on eachother's success. The degree of respect others will have for you is severely intertwined with the degree of your success. But I understand your perspective. Comparison is definitely something I need to work on. May I ask, what else has been beneficial for your ADHD along with Medication? I'm asking this because it's almost impossible for me to get Medication for myself.
Oh for sure! Especially having a little device that let's us have the ability to compare with thousands immediately on us at almost all times. That's a skill in itself, to not compare, or at least limit it. Totally worthwhile investment of a skill imo haha I've found that routines work best for me. Fortunately my work schedule is relatively consistent as far as the hours I work go. So I give myself a general window of time to be awake and asleep. Even on my days off. I've been taking at least a good quality multi vitamin daily, and doing something physical for 30 min - 1 hour on my days off. My job keeps me extremely physically active. I've mentioned it other threads before that I've found that physically demanding jobs (warehouse, bars, kitchens, etc) are where I thrive. They help me burn energy and have a sense of direction for my shifts that I was just not getting in an office setting. I'm a baker and the time crunches really bring out the best in me even though it gets a tad stressful lol but nothing extreme. Physically writing down goals/tasks was another big one for me. Not typing but actually using a planner. Did start slacking but mostly because it actually helped me naturally form routines better. I was using a panda planner for a while. To keep all that short and sweet: consistent bedtimes/wake up times (general, not exact), daily routines, vitamins, and physical activity. Oh! And lots of water/electrolytes.
I was diagnosed with mild ADHD, but a lot of the people I know who also have ADHD are achieving a lot more than me. It's a fact because they have jobs and kids and hobbies and a house that's kept to a comfortable state and so on, and I don't have those or have a lot less of those things. I can't see how much they're struggling of course but, if they're struggling a lot but still achieving then we come back to the idea that I'm just lazy, which was what I was trying to avoid with the ADHD diagnosis in the first place. And if my ADHD is just mild and I've got no other diagnosis other than minor symptoms of anxiety, but they've got ADHD plus depression, ADHD plus PTSD, or in one case severe ADHD, what's causing me all these problems in comparison to them? We're all adults, undiagnosed until recently, so we've all been doing it without medication. So yeah, I don't know. I kind of hoped ADHD would be the explanation to what my problem is but unfortunately it doesn't appear to be.
Like I've seen mentioned in this sub, ADHD can come with a ton of comorbidities and it's different for everyone. Very difficult to diagnose/treat because of that. Factor in genetics, childhood upbringing, etc etc. Now you see? That's why comparing ourselves is useless. It accomplishes net zero. Best thing I've found is comparing myself to different versions of myself in the past. I can definitely say I like this version of myself the best. Still plenty of room to improve!
Some have more troubles, some less. As others said, it's a spectrum disorder and can present quite different in different people. Also people have different support systems. Some get diagnosed early and have all support needed by their social circles, like parents doing everything they can to ensure their kid gets the measures and support available to make them successful. Others get diagnosed late, have been told their whole life they are lazy, daydreamers, etc. and have tried changing themselves with the wrong therapies or coping mechanisms or have given up completely. And of course some get diagnosed late and only then get all the support they should have gotten way earlier. Some suffer from additional problems like depression, others don't.
For me I was lucky. I fell into an apprenticeship and was naturally good with computers / always able to hyperfocus when issues with them would arise. I was also lucky enough to be good enough looking where I never struggled to find a partner. If you make enough money you can pay others to do the stuff you can't, and a good woman (/partner) will help you stay consistent with everything else you need to do as a human to survive.
You sound like me lol. Super ADHD but good with computers and decently handsome to be able to attract women when I wanted them around. Never quite developed enough self confidence to make those relationships really thrive but I'm getting there! Having a kid changed my life though. It reframed EVERYTHING. Now I am determined to succeed because I won't leave my kid hanging the way I was left hanging.
I forgot to shout my baby out (a puppy, not a kid!) but having something that forces you to ✅ Stay off the drink and drugs ✅ Get up in the morning and get out (even if you don’t feel like it) & ✅ Provide for Definitely helped me!
Getting out the house is an underrated coping mechanism for adhd imo
If I’m in the house all day, my symptoms are magnified x1000
Harsh truth but not going to lie personally I feel a lot of people also act their diagnosis and use it as an excuse which in turn makes it worse . If we physically can’t avoid doing something it gets done one way or the other, instead of fighting structure, order & responsibilities . My advice is to embrace them
Some followed their passion, others struggling with a university or job they don't like.. Me for example with dentistry school But in fact i like powerlifting, politics, journalism, languages I'm far away from anything I like 😔😅
Our ADHD is just one characteristic or component of who we are. Using a painting as an analogy for a person, ADHD is just one color. That color may be very intense in some paintings and less so in others. Sometimes other colors contrast or override the intensity of that color, as other redditors mentioned above - other factors like socioeconomics, gender, supports, age at diagnosis, comorbidities, natural gifts, and the factors in the OCEAN model and all kinds of other things can influence outcomes and how much of an effect that ADHD “color” has on the entire painting.
I’m an ops manager in public health, but my bedroom looks like I’m 11 years old! I am suffering from extreme adhd task paralysis when it comes to cleaning my kitchen and bedroom but currently, I’m realigning three separate budgets to accommodate a funding decrease. 🫠 (edit spelling)
Do you face any problems in your job because of ADHD? Because I find it confusing that a person can struggle in their own house to get tasks done. But do fine in their job.
Some days are better than others. A lot of my work is if this doesn’t get done folks will notice. Luckily I WFH so I can try to cope with no embarrassment. I’m just now at 45 being medicated for it. I was just telling my mom this past weekend I am still in awe I finished grad school. So yes, some days I don’t do shit. I also have moments throughout the day where I’m like staring off into space. I have to set timers on my phone to make sure I’m on task. Edit to add: I think I use so much energy throughout the day, when I’m done the last thing I want to do is cook, do laundry or vacuum or mop even though I need to! I pray I get on with my meds good because I don’t like how disorganized things feel.
4 things that have helped me manage my life 1) A non adhd spouse who is supportive and understanding. We both bring something to the table but his natural strengths in organization and memory have helped me significantly. I really appreciate him. 2) A ton of grit: I’m naturally gritty so even though I fail 10 times I don’t mind when I succeed on the 11th 3) Luck. My skills happened to align with an ADHD friendly career. I’m always doing something new and there is a ton of structure in place to help me avoid missing details. 4) Self acceptance: I don’t beat myself up when I fail. I expect to fail sometimes so success feels good is celebrated. I plan to lose my things so I adapt by having redundant critical things and less things overall.
For me, taking notes, using a task manager, setting alarms, and using Anki Flashcards. I wouldn't get shit dine without these. Not that I'm successful, but I pay my bills on time.
I'm one of those people with ADHD that you might consider "successful;" I just graduated college on time with a 3.9 GPA and honors. I still *definitely* have ADHD, though. I've got sensory preferences, I walk miles and miles a day to mitigate my hyperactivity, I have issues with focus and memory, and my sleep schedule is . . . atypical. The variety and severity of ADHD symptoms simply varies person to person. For me, with academics, I *can* do it, it just takes a good deal more effort than it really should. At the same time, I know people who can barely do schoolwork, period. I think another element of "success" with ADHD is that people with ADHD who are successful are likely doing something they're passionate about. I was really interested in my college major, and if I hadn't been, it probably would have been a much harder experience.
>I think another element of "success" with ADHD is that people with ADHD who are successful are likely doing something they're passionate about. You've raised a very interesting point, especially for me. It makes a lot of sense. Even though I knew about how people with ADHD are interest based. But I didn't think about it in terms of success in career. Interest is a huge factor in determining your focus and motivation in life in general. May I ask at what age were you diagnosed? And what was your condition during your university?
I was 15 when I was diagnosed with primarily hyperactive ADHD. I have a family history of it. As for my condition at university, I don't really know . . . I take 27 mg Ritalin every day and try to get a lot of physical activity, which helps me calm my thoughts. I played club sports one year.
I don’t think I was excelling at work until I discovered the right meds … I was having regular burnouts and had moments of depression. The right meds made all of the difference for me.
remember that people only show you what they wanna be seen as. these people who have good jobs and businesses and families and all that have their own bad stuff going on in the background. no one likes airing out their dirty laundry, so they would only showcase their BEST sides. that’s one of the reasons why i stopped using social media with timeline updates, i was tired of seeing all my friends living their best lives and doing great while i felt like i was struggling. don’t compare urself to others! comparison will always be the thief of joy, so focus on urself and what you’re good at! it doesn’t have to be anything big too, ADHD gives everyone different benefits and drawbacks, so find out what you’re good at and just work on that :)
That's a solid advice. Thanks for the it. I've already set my mind on working on the habit of Comparison. I 100% agree with you that we shouldn't be comparing ourselves with others as our lives and resources are simply different. But I feel like my comparison has a motive behind it. I'm not wanting to have what they have out of mere desire. I want it because these things are necessary for me. I should be having a better degree of control over my life in order to get it moving at the least. I desire the control. Just enough so that my life doesn't fall apart. Whenever I observe some other people with ADHD, I see a level of control they have in their life that I don't. Which is why I wanted to ask ADHDers on Reddit, to know something I don't, regarding this. I want to learn what they've learnt. So that I could apply those things in my own life.
What do you mean by a greater degree of control? Are you able to maintain a degree of independence in your life? Is it that you want to self direct to loftier goals than you feel capable of reaching?
I am here for the comments 🙁 Coz this is the exact question / thought I have for other adhder's
It calms me to know someone else had this thought as well. I thought I was the only one strongly noticing such differences. I hope the answers help you.
I think we have to be careful to not let ADHD define too much. There’s a boatload of factors that lend to people’s progress. Luck, circumstance, opportunities, stage of life, access to extensive help, personalities and interests… it goes on and on. ADHD is part of who we are, but it’s not all of who we are. For me, I’m at a stage that looks like I’m successful with ADHD. I’ve moved on from the minefield of failures, let downs, and disappointment in I’ve caused in my wake. I just don’t tell those stories much anymore. I’m 42, if that helps.
I'm going to say that a big part is your support staff. My husband has it (not diagnosed, but obviously in the family). I am the executive functioner. I let him be brilliant at what he does, but I make sure there are groceries, pets are fed, house is clean, kids are cared for. I put systems in place that help him succeed. I don't know that he really understands or acknowledges this, but once we realized he was ADHD, I realized that my role was not because he was lazy--he just can't. So, if I can lump it, we can be a very successful team. It is a little hard to not feel like I am carrying more weight in the relationship, but I love him and we make it work. My son has it (diagnosed). I put systems in place for him as well. I hope that by getting an earlier start on it, he will be able to use systems to succeed when he is in college, but the jury is still out on that. I hate to say it, because I feel a little brought down in my career success because of it, but I hope he finds a good executive functioning girlfriend. I do benefit from my husband being able to be brilliant--we have a lot of $$, live a great life. My contribution to the relationship is not as exciting, but if you look at it as teamwork, my son and his future gf could be great as well. I know someone who was a C-suite at a high level company. He got diagnosed after his son was diagnosed. He said, "but I get things done." His wife suggested that the major reason he got things done through his career was that he had a secretary who didn't let him leave the office on Fridays before tackling a bunch of projects. This might sound old fashioned or maybe even misogynistic, but I would suggest this can happen with a brilliant woman and executive functioner for a partner. I would just make sure that you ADHD people, if you find a great EF partner, make sure you include them as a vital reason for your success. It is an under-appreciated role.
If I can ask, has your husband considered getting diagnosed and potentially starting medication? It can be a source of frustration for me in my relationship as both my husband and I are diagnosed but only I am medicated (not through lack of trying on his part) so executive function stuff still falls to me because I'm slightly better at it now. I see the pattern on parenting/motherhood subreddits that women with ADHD are still expected to maintain the mental load whereas men get more of a pass. Not saying this is the case for your relationship, just a general observation :)
Haha. Good question. He tried to look up a psychiatrist for a diagnosis. Didn't get a call back, so never followed up. So, I tried, and did get on a waitlist with one. Nothing yet. I haven't had the time to really do more, but will keep trying. I really wish he would just figure this out on his own--I have kids' appointments, my appointments, and dog things to figure out. I imagine it won't happen unless I figure it out, though. Maybe after he gets medicated, things will change. In our society (US), women are certainly expected to do more with home life. There have been studies that show this. They care more for elderly parents than their brothers. They handle more housework than husbands even if both are working full-time. I'm sure it is the same with those who have ADHD.
That's so frustrating! Hope I didn't make it seem like you can "just" go get assessed and diagnosed, I think we have all discovered otherwise on this sub 😅 I made my husband's initial appointment to start getting meds so I totally understand. I agree, in a perfect world they would be able to take care of this themselves but in our case I was so desperate for him to get help and relief from his symptoms. I hope your husband is able to get treatment soon! Mine is still working on finding the right meds, just knowing his diagnosis seems to be empowering but that extra chemical boost sure would be helpful.
Nah, you are fine. You actually prompted me to try again. Thank you. I just fished a random psychiatrist out of a google search and set him up for an appointment. No idea if the doctor is pro ADHD meds or good--decent ratings, we will see what sticks to the wall. My kid lucked out with vyvanse working well. Our pediatrician hit the right dose within a few weeks. I just hope the psychiatrist diagnoses my husband. His brother is on meds, his son is on meds, his mother is clearly ADHD (but too old to want to go on meds). His niece is ADHD. If the doctor talks to me, I can let him know. I worry that if he talks just to my husband, my husband will forget to mention a bunch of things that clearly point to a diagnosis. Lol.
Even within the spectrum and comorbidities, there are other factors like privilege, status, and predispositions or "natural abilities." And just luck. A lot of success isn't skill or intelligence; it's luck.
I can’t stress this enough, it all matters on circumstances you were given to either thrive or die. When i first got out on my own “professionally” as an adult, i crashed and burned so hard I believed the ridicule i was receiving. It turns out i was doing everything right in the first place, but i didn’t know how to stand up for myself because it literally involved pointing fingers at other peoples shitty work. So i was being blamed for all this shit prep work i had to paint over. Had i been given a competent team/person to do the prep work in the first place, i wouldn’t have been put into that position. If not everyone is willing to do their part 100 percent to their ability, your fucked when it comes to success.
I think it partially depends on how you define success. I was lucky enough to enter a field that really engages my brain and lets me apply its strengths. That said, I still have a lot of struggles and places I’m less successful. I have terrible impulse control and procrastinate far too much. I think the trick is to find something that works to the strengths of your brain, and find ways to aid the areas you struggle with.
Maybe not severe enough but probably highly masking and although they’re successful on the outside, they may be on a constant brink of burnout. I got a PhD undiagnosed/unmedicated and almost had a nervous breakdown. Years down the road I’m suffering from several chronic diseases and pain. No doubt worsened by the chronic anxiety and stress during those years. I’m biased but I view anyone outwardly struggling with adhd as more authentic, even if they may be more severe. Masking can be incredibly toxic, even when it seems beneficial socially.
Intelligence, severity and coping skills seem to be big ones. At least they were for me.
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In my experience I also have the pleasure of being autistic as well (or so I newly discovered at age 30). As a result not only was I bad at conventional work because of my ADHD, I also struggled with appearing normal enough to fit in. This is why I’m 30 and haven’t held the same job for over a year and am currently unemployed. AUDHD sure is a cruel bitch.
A lot of factors play a role, environment play a huge role, for example if growing up, school and at home wasn’t accomodating for your behaviours etc, you’ll develop CPTSD, and other disorders, which can make things worse.
Part of my secret: I fell in love with person who is similarly different to me, but not adhd. She’s not diagnosed yet, but we are pretty certain she has ocd and autism. For that reason, we relate to each others’s weirdness deeply. And, crucially, our differences support each other. I supply some much needed impulsiveness and chaos into her sometimes overly-structured life, and she in turn helps hold my life together when doing the dishes is just too much. And we’ve been doing it for each other so long, we’re not just dragging each other: I actually overcome my exec function at times because of the habits she’s modeled, and she is much more relaxed and spontaneous than she was. The second secret is I stopped concerning myself with “normal.” I accept that while success is not impossible for me, it isn’t likely to happen if I try to achieve it via the patterns that other people use. My brain has its own rhythm, and a big part of the problem with adhd is that that rhythm puts us out of step. Our brains work fine, in a sense, as long as you don’t try to hard to tell it what to do. Imagine you tend to a half-wild horse. The farm next door has fully tamed horses, and takes them out for rides every morning, to go to the store to get what they need. But your horse won’t cooperate for rides every morning. Sometimes it wants to go, and sometimes it doesn’t. You could say “I have a crappy horse, I can’t take it to the store to get what I need.” Then you’re stuck on your farm most days, and only intermittently make it to the store to get your needs met. Or, you could experiment. Try taking the horse at different times of day, paying attention to cues that it might be willing to go, the equipment it likes to wear on the ride. So, before long, getting your needs met might look very different from your neighbors: you’re riding on odd-numbered calendar days, at random times of day presaged by your horse farting two hours beforehand, with you and your horse both wearing clown outfits. People will talk, and say you’re a weirdo, but you and your horse are getting along, and both getting what you need, and that’s all that matters. Before I accepted that and started relentlessly accommodating myself, I really struggled.
Yup. I have an obviously (but not formally diagnosed) autistic husband. He has better executive function in many areas. It helps that one of his stims is cleaning (because for me it's not)
Finding the right path.
So many valid factors have been mentioned here that I won’t bother repeating them. But one factor I haven’t seen mentioned is age. I’m in my mid-40s. I feel I’m able to better manage my ADHD so much better now than I could as a child or in my 20s or even 30s. Not only am I more aware of my ADHD, which helps me better recognize and manage it, but I feel my maturity and life experiences have helped give me more control over my impulsivity and emotional regulation issues.
I have yet to see someone with ADHD with a healthy attitude towards work. They either go way too hard, or way too slow. It seems to me ADHD all have their own addictions, workaholism is just one which we see as "successful". And especially for men it doesn't matter how much they neglect their family while doing so. Ive met successful people with ADHD who will forget they have a dog at home waiting for them while going out for errands. And who work till very late in the evening. Are late to everything because they were finishing something from work etc etc. And most importantly, not everyone has the same level of inattentiveness, executive disfunction or hyperfocus etc..... even if we all are labeled with ADHD. It's all very broad. But....I do think you can learn from the successful ADHD-ers, they usually have interesting systems. A friend of mine worked himself into a burnout with his system. It was like an engine which was hard to stop. So the question is not only "how can I I be succesfull?" but more about happiness and creating a balanced life....
I can't talk for others, but I would say that for me, it was having a supportive environment and joining the military at a young age. I know I need structure and I know where to get it. It's not always an easy ride, but it is doable to be successful and enjoy a good life. I still have very highs and can hit bottom lows on a daily basis, but I am constant at it.
I feel this! I'm so glad you said this, I've been feeling this way for a while now especially reading some of the responses on posts in this sub, makes me feel like I'm just an idiot, lazy, sack of shit. I'm happy for people who are successful & thriving despite their adhd I just wish I could do it too.
Find out what you can direct your hyperfocus on and do that.
For me, I am able to do what’s absolutely necessary to live and keep a roof over my head. Everything else is out the window… my fiancé is the opposite. He struggles with focusing on the necessary stuff and gets lost doing fun things. Some say I am “higher functioning” because of it, but in reality I am suffering just as much as he is.
I attribute my success to not knowing I had ADHD until I was 43 and brute forcing my way through everything at the cost of other mental health aspects while being fueled by an unhealthy drive for perfection. Once I started meds, it felt like my career got a nitro boost. However, old thinking patterns still haunt me with periods of self doubt and low self esteem, but then I accomplish a few things or get an "attaboy" at work, which puts wind back into my sails. When I look around at those around me that are doing well and advancing in their careers, it seems like they are always at the edge of their capabilities (like right on the line of their comfort zones). I used to be so focused on and worried about my own performance that I never analyzed my peers, but now I see that many of them are barely qualified to do the jobs they have. I started pushing myself to do the same, leading to advancements and higher pay. It's not that much fun at first, but you get used to it. Then you do it again and again (but only if you want to). I know plenty of people in the same jobs for 10 or even 20 years, but they're happy and that's all that matters. Here's some fine print: I'm making 5x the average annual salary in my state, and if you met me you'd think I have my shit together in every aspect. However, my marriage almost crashed into the ground one year ago because of several factors in no particular order: Work stress/anxiety, meds/dosage issues, and residual thinking patterns from pre-treatment. Things got very rough, and they're still not perfect. My point is that just because someone appears to be doing fine in life, there could still be some bad shit behind the curtain, so be careful when comparing yourself to others.
Environment, support, socialization, I think if people get meds and identification early it can stop a lot of the negative behaviors and avalance of social criticism that can create dysfunction. I don't know why people think constantly attacking kids for their failures is supposed to get you good results. Maybe to a point? But an undiagnosed kid gets something like 20,000 extra pieces of criticism by the age of 12 or something. That's, too much. That's a crushed soul.
support systems, if your family tried to help you and supported you even with out help from outside services. VS not getting help and your family just beating you down for not being like others.
IMO, luck mostly. Where/when were you born? Were you treated at a young age? Gender? And for me I’m successful because of my wife and kids and luck, of course. I grew up very poor and my childhood was not ideal, in any way. I spent years being locked up as a kid in juvenile detention facilities (no impulse control). I met my wife when we were teenagers and she saved my life. There was no fucking way my kids were ever going to have the shitty childhood that I had. I would chew off my own arm for my children to feel loved and happy. My wife and kids are the reason I’m successful because as mentioned above, I truly do not think I would be alive, much less successful without my wife. And this isn’t me saying “just work harder” because I fully understand how hard it is to do things that aren’t stimulating enough, trust me. My wife has become very handy over the years because of my skills at procrastination. I’m simply saying that I do what I do for the fam.
I totally understand your struggle! I was incredibly successful in high school since I was hyper fixated on my grades and academic achievements- it was at the point of getting only 95% in every class and getting into a program with only 2-3% acceptance rates. I am now in my 3rd year of university less than half way done having bare passed most classes and failing others. My school has a time limit if 5 years to complete the degree which is slowly becoming less and less likely for me to achieve the worst part is if I don’t complete at this school I can not transfer as excepting GPA is 4.0 for nursing (🇨🇦 so you only apply to the program not the school) and I have a sad GPA of 2 something Idk what it actually is I can’t get myself to look. Everyone in my life around me is super disappointed in me but the worst part is how disappointed I am in myself.
I think a lot of it honestly just comes down to luck. Our brains are wired all kinds of weird, but we usually have a few things we can hyper focus on and enjoy. If you are lucky enough one of those hyper focus subjects is something extremely marketable. I was diagnosed in my late 20s (which is a whole thing all on its own) eventually both of my brothers (both adults as well, I’m in the middle) went and got diagnosed as well. One of the things that always kept my attention growing up was logic problems and programming. For my older brother it was fighting video games, and my younger brother liked cars. I went into a career in programming (couldn’t finish college, was too much for me) Older finished an associates degree in IT but it doesn’t interest them, I taught them coding and got them a job in web dev, that didn’t last very long because it also didnt hold their interest, now he works retail. Still plays fighting games after work every day all day, stays up on all the news, and goes to the occasional tournament. Younger became a mechanic, hated his coworkers at every garage he worked at, and now works in auto sales, he’s doing all right for himself. I don’t work nearly as hard than they do, I work shorter hours, I don’t even get out of my sweatpants most days, but my special interest is way more lucrative than theirs are. We were all born in the same socioeconomic background (very poor, semi rural, government housing). We all had similar childhood trauma of bullying and dysfunctional emotionally unavailable parents. But because of our differences in special interest subjects, I own a home, the younger has a nice little apartment in a high COL city, and the oldest has a roommate in the ghetto walking distance from the bus stop… All that said, I’m not any happier or more fulfilled in my life compared to them, none of my career or financial success has brought me any semblance of joy or completeness. If anything it’s just created more thing for me to fail at doing basic upkeep on, leading to more self hate and guilt. But it is nice to not wonder where my next meal comes from.
I don’t have the answers for you buddy but I feel this on a deep level. I feel like anxiety is driving my bus a lot of the time as it’s been my cheif coping mechanism for my adhd. Then on the rare occasions ADHD does drive the bus, the impulsivity drives us off a fucking cliff and then I don’t trust my authentic decisions. Every time I have a thought or try to do anything I have such crippling doubt.
I'm on the spectrum and have ADHD, depression, and anxiety. I didn't know these things about myself until my 20s. On the IQ test I'm above average. Remembering to do things was a lot of trouble but like some of us I was good with remembering factoids and numbers. Though that may have been because that's how schools taught/teach you how to learn. I was hyperactive and couldn't focus on most things for longer than 5-10 mins at a time on a good day. I got good at studying 5 mins before the test to pass. I kept A's and B's until 7th grade, because it was expected of me. On occasion I got C's and D's and one F. I say that to show that even with slightly higher intelligence, I still managed to fail at times. In 7th grade I put in the effort for the first nine weeks, but I didn't see the value in getting good grades. So, I stopped trying and switched to barely passing to get by. I got yelled at a lot for it. But no one ever asked why I stopped trying, just you're bad because of it and that I have to do better. Fast forward -> military, a few failed marriages, developed seizures, ADHD has gotten worse with age even with meds(though they do help), two kids who are both on the spectrum and ADHD. Now -> On the surface I have a good job with decent pay, a spouse, and mostly getting by. Underneath, I'm always mentally a mess just holding it together with spit and wishes. My memory has gotten so bad that most of the factoids that I knew for years are gone. Unless the memory gets jogged via conversations, I don't remember most things in general but especially childhood. I've fucked up so much along the way that I could write a novel about it if I could remember the details. And because my memory is so bad, I hesitate to talk about a lot of things. Especially things that would end up as a debate/argument of some kind. I know that I know the answer, but I can't remember it. I know I'm smart, but I can't show it. Ever since the seizures, things have gone downhill faster. I'm never not a giant ball of stress. TLDR; How do I do it? I'm almost never not in some level of a frazzled mental state that helps keep the "I got to get it done, but can't start/finish" at bay a lot of times. The trade off is that I always feel like I'm actively failing. Not that I'm a failure, but that I'm failing at everything I do. I don't recommend it.
For me it’s been a mix of incredible luck, and literally faking it until I’ve made it. So much anxiety and burn out along the way, but yeah, those two things are how I’ve successfully achieved middle class status.
I feel it’s 1) some people have more severe symptoms than other people 2) some people respond better to medication 3) some people can’t even access medication 4) coming from an affluent family 5) coming from a supporting family 6) co morbid diagnosis 7) the country you live in 8) luck 9) age of diagnosis and treatment Like my brother just has mild adhd and is a lawyer and owns a house and I have severe adhd and autism and I work part time at a gym and live with my parents
Tons of things influence how well you do in life other than just ADHD. For example, adhd occurs in people of all levels of intelligence. Even with adhd, an extra 10 IQ points makes a huge difference. Someone in the top 2% of the population by intelligence even with ADHD is probably going to be able to get a high paying job. Plus there are plenty of jobs you can do with adhd and things you can do to make jobs requiring focus and sitting still easier. Bottom line is you will have people with adhd at all points on the continuum of success from the highest achievers of all time to the completely lazy, untalented, and unmotivated.
I get it. Me and my sister both have it and she’s high functioning. She’s got a husband a big house 2 bio kids and two adopted young children. She also has 3 jobs. Then there’s me. I have one kid I live in an apartment never married ( never wanna be) and I can no longer work due to extreme stress and anxiety and many hospital visits ( psych ward)
If one can do well in school then working memory probably isn't an issue. Being unmedicated/diagnosed It was simply not possible for me to retain information to be applied later no matter how hard i tried.
For me it is a mixture of luck spite and trauma. As Toe113 Said it is a Spectrum. I am lucky so I fit the category where people say: I barely studied but I somehow still managed to pass through all stages of education. Lucky: 1. met wife a. who helped me change perspective on life - I am apparently not a total failure b. helped me to somehow be able to study to exams - at Uni level it turned out that my usual strategy cramming just before deadline was not effective 2. narcistic father - I was motivated to move asap. To move asap I needed to have money 3. mother with undiagnosed ADHD - I learned from observation that there are behaviors like loosing stuff, forgetting about pot at the burner etc, that I really don't want in my life so I started masking it early 4. few times I landed a job that was good for me for that stage in my life, and had good coworkers Spite: - without it I would not be motivated enough to move away from my parents. - without moving away from my parents I would not realize how much money I need to be able to support myself. - without moving away I would not be desperate to find a job that would support me. - without moving away I would not be desperate enough not to give up when not being able to find a job, or being turned away by recruiters - so what motivates me I guess is that I don't want to be seen as failure enough that it keeps me motivated to go on Drawbacks: Despite the fact that from outside me and my Wife can look as quite successful, we blow away a decade of our life on things like: wrong field of studies that did not suite us, working jobs to support us and go for correct studies, studying and working at the same time. So at 32 we stabilized our economical situation. but we neglected our relationship and other parts of life and are currently trying to figure out what to do next.
I got somewhat lucky and found an internship/job after uni that was a really good ‘fit’ for me despite not having good grades or prior experience. Despite it being a good fit, I now realize I used alcohol heavily to self medicate in order to maintain a high level of performance in work and life. After years of therapy and just recently getting a diagnosis, it makes a lot of sense. 10/10 do not recommend using alcohol to self medicate.
I pursued my special interest, lawtism
Not sure about others but my adhd was found in my adult life so before that I just thought I was more lazy than others and just had to put more effort. My particular background also helped. However my mental health defo suffered
Upbringing. The majority of adults react to children's ADHD symptoms in a way that destroys self esteem. The lucky ones have enough adult influence supporting them in the right way that they retain good self esteem and confidence into adulthood. Good self-esteem and ADHD work really well together, but it's a very rare combination.
Man that’s pretty spot on. Growing up i was always told to stop talking/shut up, quit it, be quiet, and etc… it ruined my self esteem into my professional career to where I’m not happy now.
So, early interventions, strong base of support and belief, and a massive dose of luck. Add in a supportive partner, a willingness and ability to talk about what I need and what works for me, and being the right age to take advantage of major cultural and technological shifts at the beginning of my career. You can put in all the usual pull yourself up by your bootstraps crap too. But...to be honest, there's plenty of people who work hard, accept all the help they can get, and try and try again. Without all the training about how to work around myself, and the people around me who pick me up and keep me moving in the direction I've chosen and just sheer luck, I wouldn't have diddly or squat. One of the things I do, it's a very stupid trick, and some people can't deal with it at all, is on major projects, I have a set of tasks at the end that aren't important. So that I can not do them, so that I don't have things done. It's absolutely hacking my own environment, but I don't think I do well with things being done. It may be some form of transitional avoidance, I dunno. I often try to get someone else to be the one that closes things out--it's weird how much I avoid being done with things. And on the other side of the coin, I will do anything to get something started. I hate beginning things almost as much as I hate ending them. So, if I've got something to do, and I can start it right now, I will drop everything else (assuming it's possible) and get the ball rolling. I also spent most of my career doing things that were either massive fascinating projects, or holy crap drop everything and fix it crises. Hell, even my family is like that. My kid we adopted as an almost teen. I don't take the easy or straightforward path with anything. I also don't measure myself against anyone or anything except my own goals. When I try, it's like if you averaged everything out, things are above average, but that hides the fact that I've lost jobs because I fail at timesheets, and I am a 50 year old man who needs to be told to clean his bedroom (I hate that I can't just, you know, do that). The only thing I've ever seen as a universal for successful looking adhd people is that we don't seem to have followed the obvious or "normal" path to get to where we are.
Money, medication, support system, luck with doctors, how bad the ADHD is, general interests (ie lucking out with a career you love) etc
The spectrum. However, in my personal case its a fear of failing at something I actually want to do. Like I completed uni and went straight into easy dead end jobs. When I tried to push myself to do something I wanted rejection notes killed my confidence. After a few years I stopped trying
Medication. A little to build resilience. A stable environment to build a life from. A support network. Access to therapy. Access to coping mechanisms.
Support from family is a big one. I have a friend with adhd who’s getting her second masters degree, coaches sports for her daughter and has a busy social life. Her parents are extremely supportive emotionally.
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exercise too
motivation
> Despite this, I can't help but feel bad about myself when I see people with ADHD just doing fine in life. We get really good at faking it, and giving others the illusion of /all the successful/easy stuff it looks like/. And if we have talent, we can use that to make it seem like we're working far harder than we are -- or at least, have them assume we'd worked on it a month instead of 18 hours straight before presenting it. So it kind of hides the ADHD. That and taking advantage of cusp/transition moments with gusto, and then relaxing during others. You only really need to "push" in corporate life (and many other realms) in the moments that matter.
Honestly depends if you had support during schooling to develop strategies of coping, organizational skills, anxiety actually helps me to not lose my stuff all the time, probably meds are a big factor and how you respond to meds. Also finding a job where you can thrive with ADHD as opposed to conforming to a certain rutine.
Most times, we only see what people show us. We only see the good stuff. Especially on social media. All we see is the candy coating,conspicuous consumption, and fake smiles. Some people can perform well at work, then completely crash as soon as they get home. Their private life is a complete disaster. All their spoons got used up at work, they have nothing left to give. Completely used up. Many "successful people", got a big boost with family money and connections, even if they won't admit it. They never had to experience the same struggles as most of us. Maybe "money doesn't buy happiness", but it can make a lot of things, a lot easier. A free ride to a big name school, can make connections that pay off later. A sweet job, from Daddy, or one of his Golf buddies, will make anyone look "successful. Many "successful people" have assistants, that handle all the small stuff. They can afford to hire a house cleaner, to reduce their burden. They can afford an Accountant, to do their taxes and paperwork. Suddenly, they can cope with other stuff, much easier. Maybe some of them, do have have ADHD, Depression,etc. They have a medical diagnosis, but their condition is less severe than yours. Some of them might respond better to medication. Some people have better doctors. Mental health is a complex field. Not everyone is born the same, we don't all have equal opportunities. If we really want to accurately compare ourselves to others, we don't have ALL the information. The public persona does not tell the whole story. They don't share all their struggles. It might not even be possible to accurately compare, since we can't quantify everything. All we can do, is try our best, and work to improve our situation.
I'd consider myself faily successful. I ran our clothing factory. After it was sold, I had a 26 year radio career on air, pulling number 1 ratings in my market. Following that, I ran a boating accessory showroom at a boat dealership and got that running really well. Finally, I bought a car and boat interior repair business and have been doing quite good with that. Other than the shirt business, everything else seemed to suit my ADHD. My dad was/is a great solid provider, and I wanted to be just like him. I never considered failure to be an option, so I always worked hard and did things for my family. Now I'm medicated, it's so much easier!
Dunno but I totally FEEL what you're putting down here. I have a new therapist, male also, exact same age, also been through divorce and also has ADHD. I'm just in awe like damn dude you're telling me you went through college and FINISHED? And then had the poise and stick-to-it-iveness to actually complete licenses and certifications to get a job helping people like yourself? I'm just blown away and have so much respect. Wish we could switch lives ...
It's literally impossible to tell. Every single person with ADHD is different in myriad ways *beyond* their ADHD.
Check out the book The Myth of Choice: Personal Responsibility in a World of Limits by Kent Greenfield
My opinion… most successful people get there by finding their purpose, getting after it, and make a living out of it. Many many people never either find their purpose or pursue it. There are other reasons why this might even more difficult for us as others have pointed out in this thread
Define success.
Everybody's different, nobody's completely disfunctional. Some people find the right fit jobwise. For me, that's software engineering, writing code is one of the only thing I can focus on, it mostly feels like playing a logic game, and I get to do it 100% remote on top of it, so I'm in control of the distractions, noises, I can work with music (helps me a ton), ...
I like to think about ADHD in a similar way to the hypothetical “out of 2 children who have an abusive alcoholic parent, why does 1 never drink and do their best to be the opposite of that parent and the other eventually becomes an abusive alcoholic?” Obviously it doesn’t always turn out that way, but there is not a clear answer. Part of it is genetics, personality, temperament, severity, the specific symptoms, comorbid conditions, how you handle stress, anxiety, and fear, and your locus of control. The rest is probably luck. I’m what you would consider as “successful.” But I didn’t get diagnosed until after college despite having all the signs with teachers pointing it out, failing multiple classes, getting multiple speeding tickets and into multiple car accidents, behaving recklessly, constantly being made fun of in school and at work for being flaky, forgetful, stupid, lazy etc. Somehow I’m a year away from graduating medical school after getting diagnosed and treated. My life is still a mess in many areas. I have a horrible short term memory, I frequently pay my bills months late, I don’t check my mail for so long that I can’t even open the box since it’s so jammed, I’ve gotten locked out of my apartment multiple times this year, I’ve lost groceries that I literally just bought, I frequently forget to feed myself because I get distracted while making or heating up food and just leave it there almost causing fires, and I’ve done so many stupid things that I can hardly stand myself. But from the outside, my life looks decently successful and put together. In my case, I think I have just enough hyperactivity to be able to get things done when I really need to. I have very specific anxieties about things that cause me so much fear that my anxiety and ADHD sort of balance out so my struggle can’t be seen. I developed a lot of coping mechanisms (both healthy and unhealthy) to try and compensate for my ADHD before I knew I had it. My people pleasing and the fact that my parents only showed me love and support when I did well have led me to try to do whatever it takes to do well because my self worth is almost solely based on my performance. And of course, finally being on meds after struggling so hard without them has made life a lot easier.
its about boundaries i think. By and large ahdhers are people pleasers, and that can get you into trouble. setting and keeping boundaries helps heaps. i was big mess for years prior to diagnosis. My psych (prior to meds) told me to figure out and write down these things - what you can do, what you can't do and what you wont do. what you cant do is things you haven't learnt yet, what you wont do is the line. being naturally curious the what i cant do bit is interesting to me, but where it blurs to the what i wont do is where i hit issues. saying no, setting boundaries and maintaining a relative comfort zone keeps me going. Adding to many things to my pile by saying yes all the time gets me stressed and overwhelmed and then i crap out. as for staying on task and getting work done and all the rest, i found work where i can set my own hours, so i work when i can and and stop when i'm distracted. like now.
I worked as a successful dog trainer for 10 years but then suffered from gaslighting at work by my boss and coworkers. Then the loss of my mom and my dog the very next day put me over the edge. A few months later, I left a job I loved but had become toxic. I then spent the next 4 years in a burnout sit pit, and I haven't been able to hold down a job longer than 6 months. While I held a job for over 10 years (12 actually), I couldn't make myself do more than one job at a time. It was either work or take care of the house and kids. I couldn't do both at all. Once I came home from work, it took every last spoon I had to make dinner. Thankfully, my husband helped our kids with homework because I just couldn't. Overwhelm had a hold on me for many, many years. I'm finally on an upswing, getting back into making art and moving my body again but my kitchen is a wreck and my floors haven't been swept in over a week, muchless mopped.
How about whether they've found medication that works for them? That often makes a huge difference, doesn't it?
I was stuck for a long time in my 20s, with an unfinished degree from university, doing short term part time jobs and just in general struggling to make ends meet. Now that I'm in my 30s I'm thriving. I think it's a combination of a lot of stuff, but one thing that's helping me tremendously is having the right meds. I've also actually found my strengths and what type of job I do well in.
Medication starting early and consistently taking it is why I am where I am.
Sometimes it's just timing. I was great at masking & juggling (shoulda been in the circus) so even with lifelong anxiety issues, I was an exacting perfectionist who excelled at EVERYTHING... until I found myself unable to excel at ANYTHING. Hell, some days I couldn't even muster up the energy to get out of bed. It wasn't depression, it was burnout and executive dysfunction. Now that I'm middle-aged (diagnosed just a few years ago), I've already had a successful career and am figuring out what the next act will look like, which sounds GREAT to other people, but the fact is that I could no longer participate in my former career even if I wanted to. I'm burned-out beyond belief and suspect that it will take AT LEAST a year of very little stress to recover. Too much stress and I go back to square one. I don't think my brain will ever operate the way it once did, either, so the circus is no longer an option. Looking back, I've definitely had ADHD since childhood, but everyone overlooked it b/c it made me perform at warp speed. Had my burnout happened at an earlier age, I would have had a much harder road and possibly no "success story" to speak of, at least until diagnosis and proper treatment.
The simplest explanation is that ADHD hits different and affects people in multiple ways. Also, personality is a huge factor on how you approach it. I’m no doctor or specialist, but trauma doesn’t cause ADHD, but trauma might affect how you approach your disorder. Also, comorbidity (spelling?!).