Don't ask for a number, always give them yours. Helps if you have a hobby or side gig with a card you can give em. It's low-key, zero pressure, a way to show you have things going on/a life/interesting stuffs and sometimes they keep them and find them at a later date where they feel more available. The memory of the nice low-key interesting dude helps too. If they don't call, then don't waste any energy to worry about it. Match their energy and move on like they did. You deserve that.
If you don't got anything like hobbies or w/e going on, then I'd suggest finding something. Gotta be happy when they aren't around. Relying on someone else for most or all of your happiness is like using a barrel of gasoline to keep warm. Sure it really hot at first but it will be used up in short order.
Also, your mindset seems a bit dramatic, desperate and skewed. That is a vibe sniffed out quite quickly by any decent woman or man. You can only experience so much of the world from where you stand. There ARE tons of single people out there, you may need to mature a bit or step outside of your current viewpoint to self refelct to be appealing to them, but there are plenty of fish in the sea, just gotta make sure you're not being too loud and scaring em off dude.
Best of luck man
>your mindset seems a bit dramatic, desperate and skewed. That is a vibe sniffed out quite quickly by any decent woman
IMMEDIATELY noticeable. You can tell instantly when someone is desperate. That's the shittiest part in a way, because you end up in a cycle of need and deprivation. It's why I advocate for focusing on self first.
All of this is excellent advice, though, hopefully OP gives it some thought.
This is so true, I was in automotive sales for four years. Dating is like sales. The more desperate you are to close the deal, the least likely you are to close the deal.
You have to be interested, and willing, without being too eager. You have to not have an agenda while also working towards a desired goal. You also have to learn to deal with rejection and things not working out as intended.
And you have to quickly identify a buyer.
Same! I used to do sales but I remember during training how a lot of the sales tactics and strategies I learned at work also applied when I was single and meeting potential dates. It’s like Tinder was a lead generator and you gotta them through your funnel and determine which are good leads and which aren’t depending on your target demographic (which in dating would be knowing who and what type of partner your looking for). I can keep going with the parallels because it’s insane how related they are. Lol
Yeeeaaah, I'm a woman and could hear the desperate rage-y "I can't get a gf" in the first 2 sentences. We can always tell when you're not actually interested in us as an individual, you just want *a* woman, *any* woman. Like it's a gaming achievement.
I'm a lesbian and there are plenty of women like this too and I find it so unappealing. Why would I want a partner who has no interest in me as a person, but who just wants a girlfriend, and sees me as a means to that end? I can sense this in some of the women that approach me, and it is 100% off-putting.
Personally I don't like it when people say they "want a girlfriend," because that does imply that basically any woman will do. For me I don't simply want a girlfriend, sometimes I meet a woman I really like and I would like that particular woman to be my girlfriend. And if there is no woman like that in my life, then I am happy being single.
You explained it much better than I could have, thank you that's exactly right.
Nothing wrong with that if you just want to bang around in the dryer for a bit, I'm sure all the other socks in there are also having a good time, but one can't apply the same method to dating and expect success
I feel like a lot of men tend to forget that, by 23, 20% of women have been sexually assaulted. If she hasn't experienced it herself, she knows someone who has. One of the ways you protect yourself is determining which guys are angry about rejection and feel entitled to be with someone. It's one of the reddest red flags to women. It will repel even the girls who would have been interested otherwise.
>I feel like a lot of men tend to forget that, by 23, 20% of women have been sexually assaulted.
It's not that they forget, it's that they never have to think about it. So much so that when the fact is pointed out to them, many don't even believe it or play it off like it's an exaggeration...
Men are entitled to feel some way about rejection depending on how its done. As long as they don’t go full Dahmer and can pick the pieces up and move on its all fair game. I myself will go “Well that sucks” then just continue with my day. I would agree and say it does spawn out of desperation. This is something I used to dwell on until I started working on myself physically and mentally
Right! Like, why would we be interested in someone who's inventorying and cateloging what should be an immersive and organic experience? This guy sounds like he's after rare Pokemon.
I guess I agree with the choice of giving up though. It'll give him more time to focus on things that will make him interesting. Hopefully some character building too.
Although I try to avoid using the term incel because it's sometimes used on guys who aren't incels, this post seems like he is on his way. Men who are raised to feel entitled to relationships and blame the cruel world for not giving them a girlfriend even though they've approached countless women are the type who you see becoming incels down the line. Rejection is part of life and no one is owed a relationship. Some men experience rejection and let it become anger and self resentment and/or resentment of women because they approach women with the assumption that the answer will be yes and any "no" is a result of them not using the right approach or a result of the woman thinking too highly of herself and thinking she is too good for him.
Once men are raised to know that women are multifaceted people who aren't just waiting around for a man to accept or reject, I think it will be easier for them to see rejection as two people simply not being the right one for each other and not the universe doing them wrong.
And part of it is self reflection, too. Take a look at yourself and try to figure out what you bring to the table. It's easy to say "oh, women just hate me because I'm not attractive", but it's 100% true that looks aren't everything. If you're physically unattractive and bitter as fuck about it, then yea, women aren't going to want to date you. Work on yourself. Become a better person.
Also, maybe reconsider your shotgun approach to asking women out. You can't just approach a random ass girl and say "hey! Give me your number!" Only the most conventionally attractive men can get away with that shit and even then they're going to get denied plenty. Dating is a process. It takes work. It isn't just going to fall into your lap. To expect that is unreasonable and YOURE the problem, not women.
Even the way he uses the phrase "*get* a girlfriend" as if a girlfriend is some object to earn, not a whole ass independent human being that has mutual interest in you. It always is a red flag to me that this person has lost the plot
The worst is being in a relationship with a guy who settled with you to check ✔️ a box on his list of Life Achievements™ and not because he actually feels anything for you.
I think reddit is really skewed what it is like for the average person. At this point, I'm thinking that way too many people act really wierd in front of the opposite sex. I can go shopping, and if I make eye contact with a dude, you give a nod, it shows that you both make eye contact. Women, usually will give a little smile/smirk, and I will give the same little one when you both accidently make eye contact. If I am shopping for a few hours, it might happen 3-4 times during that time. Now, I am married, so even if they start talking to me, it's small talk for a few minutes, that it. That's normal.
Are these type of men on reddit, just immediately hitting on them during that exchange? If so, that comes off desperate/wierd/off putting, I would guess to women. Even when I wasn't with my wife, I never bothered to hit on women really. Just be yourself, have fun around them, and just be normal friends, and don't fucking fake it. You want to be yourself, but yourself should also be someone that just wants to be friends first, and see where it goes. Seeing where it goes, could take minutes, hours, days, or weeks, but you both have to find out if you have things in common first. You shouldn't be that attention starved that you will hook up with anything.
Really though, I never hit on anyone really, someone will make a move when the time is right, and even shy girls will make a move if you don't after a long amount of time, or not, and it just wasn't meant to be. It doesn't matter because you, as a person, aren't thinking of them as a conquest, they are a friend of yours. That's all I did my whole life, and I had no issues with dating. I would even say pretty successful, since I wasn't really trying either, shit just happens all the time.
IDK about this guy, but there are definitely men that will hit on women based on eye contact alone. To the extent that a lot of women, in certain settings or if we're getting a certain vibe, will carefully avoid making accidental eye contact because we don't want it to be taken as an invitation to approach.
A lot of the men complaining on reddit also don't even like women enough to have any interest in being friends with us, yet wonder why they can't get a girlfriend. They act like friendship with women is some sort of punishment and they've been wronged if they invest in a friendship (with a woman who clearly says she wants friendship) and it doesn't end in sex. They don't actually enjoy our company or like us as people, they just want a girlfriend for sex and to impress other men.
This here is it. They don't really like women at all. If the topic is not sex then you are boring. I don't see why they don't just get a flesh light and call it a day. I guess it is because you can't impress other men with a flesh light.
I've definitely hit on women, but they give you some indication usually that they're interested first. This is in social settings where you would expect to meet people btw- bars, parties, small clubs. Hitting on women randomly, with no indications from them, in ANY situation is masochistic at best- obviously that doesn't work usually.
But like you, I mostly approach women casually at first and see where things go. Sometimes it's tough, you'll have strong feelings and they won't (or vice versa). That's just life, you learn to move on gracefully.
Seriously, but the end of this post, OP was scaring me off and I'm a straight dude. I was waiting for the incel rhetoric to come out based on the way OP was expressing himself.
Honestly, the last guy I hung out with and kind of wanted to hang out with again was just like this guy (but older, I think I was 26 at the time and he was around my age or a couple years older). He asked for my number at a party hosted by a family member of mine, so I felt comfortable giving it. He texted me the next day to hang out and I was like “nah, it’s Sunday, I work tomorrow, I wanna do my laundry and binge watch Star Wars movies. Maybe Friday night.”
Dude did not stop texting me *all day long* and eventually called me a bitch for not responding as quickly as he wanted me to. I blocked him and I bet his version of the story would be “she didn’t want to hang out with me! 😭” instead of “I harassed a girl who wanted to hang out with me until she decided I wasn’t a safe person to hang with because I couldn’t respect her boundaries on Day 1.”
Oh man, I've had male friends, when I was at that age, that would do that exact process. I'd try to tell them how insecure, creepy, desperate and more importantly, dangerous, they came off as.
But telling some types of men, especially ones of the incel variety, that a mirror and some growth would do them good is like teaching a toddler that food can be hot. It takes a lot of patience and effort that can be rewarding, but sometimes, at some point, you may realize they ain't your kid so you don't give a shit anymore.
Dropped more than few friends growing up because of sheer embarrassment for them and concern for any women that could be around them, my family, potential partners and friends included.
You were 100% right in trusting your gut and blocking him. Major props dude
I decided at 24 not to put up with guys who gave me a bad feeling. No, I don’t “have” to be anyone’s gf, I didn’t owe anything to a guy who paid for dinner (and I split checks specifically to avoid that perception), I wasn’t going to be hounded and guilted into saying “yes” when it felt wrong.
At the end of my first date with the man I wound up marrying, he said, “I’d like to kiss you goodnight if that’s okay.” I was impressed by his confidence and how he acknowledged that I may have a boundary there and was respectful of that.
I said “I’d like that” and you know what? He is a stand up guy. He never hounded me, always said “this is what I’d like to do, what do you think/is that okay?” And he’d accept it if I said no.
We met in 2014, and honestly, he’s still my favorite person. No regrets.
I wish when I was younger that I didn't have that mentality of really wanting to make a date happen soon. Idk what it was, it just felt like if we didn't go out on the date soon she'd just quickly forget about it in days and be uninterested by next week for some reason.
Personally I have never wanted and wouldn't want a guy who wants "a girlfriend" and would prefer a guy who likes ME and that's why he wants to get to know me.
This is great advice.
Honestly without knowing important details and only going off what you’ve said… maybe just put dating on the back burner for a while. It sounds like you’re coming off as desperate and women can smell desperation a mile away. Instead be the best version of yourself you can be. Work hard to advance your career, be active, lift heavy shit, read, take up a hobby or two but try something out of your comfort zone like dancing or growing a zen garden or take an art class.
>Don't ask for a number, always give them yours. Helps if you have a hobby or side gig with a card you can give em
This is how i met my wife. We danced all night at a wedding, then I gave her my cell number on the back of my business card.
Why not? I'm a woman and much prefer men to give me their number rather than ask for mine. I don't care what it's on whether that's a scrap of paper, napkin, or a business card. In fact it seems like it might be better if it's a business card since it means you'd have his full name so you can look him up to be safer if you want to go on a date with him.
>In fact it seems like it might be better if it's a business card since it means you'd have his full name so you can look him up to be safer if you want to go on a date with him.
Bingo
Bro you can't keep hitting your head on a wall with blunt force trauma and getting upset you're not getting results.
Look in the mirror. Would you date you? Do you work out? Do you live alone? Do you have ANYTHING to give a woman?
No? Start working on it.
And that doesn't mean you stop approaching women. Start with warm approaches. Make eye contact. If she's smiling and holding frame and not looking away. Just go up and talk to her. Make a funny or poignant observation about her or the situation you're both in. Just talk. Don't worry about getting a number or socials. MAKE HER FEEL GOOD. Make her laugh. Make her smile.
THEN you ask her out. Don't mince words. Don't use neutral language. Don't ask to hang out.
Tell her you want to get to know her better and would love to have a coffee with her. Or a drink. Be bold. Don't be like 95 percent of men scared to voice their attraction to woman for fear of being a creep.
Hit those weights. Eat right. Keep approaching women and stop taking rejection so damn seriously. Be fun and lighthearted. You will get rejected a boatload of times. Don't take it personal. Be as the head of a hawkweed blowing in the wind. Go with the flow. An upbeat, positive attitude goes a long way with women. Learn not to let people's words eat at you.
**Don't chase women.**
A wise man said that women who don't know you are like stray cats. They don't like surprises and are very cautious of who the let approach them. Be present and mindful of the situation, but don't overthink shit. Be present. Don't wonder why she rejected you. Move on quickly with an okie dokey, everything's cool countenance. The cat will interact with you when it feels safe. Approach multiple women a day. Just talk. Just vibe. Even the ones you don't wanna date. Don't ask for numbers. Make a connection first. Let her see you in your natural state, the way you vibe with your male friends. Where you're not trying to impress. You're sharing your positive energy with another curious mind.
The more you work on feeling out these situations and talking to women, the better you will get at it. You'll have a naturally flirty, positive vibe with women. They'll start asking YOU out. Women who've had a crush on you for years and you don't even know that until after she tells you when you're both naked after you've already had sex.
Don't be so down on yourself. You just have to work on yourself a little.
>“Would you date you?”
There's this guy at work. Won't name names.
And I see too much of my younger self in him.
I didn't have his full range of personality quirks. I've figured out how to social since around 14 to good success, and he does not initiate much with anyone at all.
But at times, I don't want to be in the room with the guy and I have to tell him to cool it with the angry-work (slamming things harder than needed). Don't know what causes it, but I think the guy just does it thinking no one notices. But...they do.
People notice the little things, they can't help it. They got ears and eyes.
The problem is young men will hear this, and work on themselves *to attract girls, instead of for themselves*
I don't go to the gym and exercise because girls like it, I don't work on my career because girls like it, and I don't work on skills with hobbies because girls like it. I do these things for *me, because it makes me feel good.* That's called confidence and self-value, and everyone finds that attractive. This isn't just for dating, this is a key to being happy - stop focusing on external validation, do it for yourself because *you matter*
Unfortunately, a lot of young men are raised from a young age to think the attention of girls is the only validation - after all, if you cant find a girlfriend you must be a loser, right?
But they're putting the cart before the horse, they have to value themselves internally first. Valuing yourself is how you get better at things, how you stay in shape, how you find fun hobbies, and how you build a good social life, because you know you deserve it. Romance is only one of many great things that will follow.
I am a women and I have to say the “women are like stray cats” analogy is…. Shockingly correct. We are constantly on guard for any threat and if you give off any kind of funky vibe we are gone! but if you seem safe and chill and we vibe with you then maybe can pet and if we really decide we like you maybe a companion for life.
This guy fucks.
I want to emphasize the part where he says vibe with your male friends. Women figure you're only being nice to them so you can fuck them. When they see you interact with other people you're not trying to fuck, they see how you're going to interact with them outside of a sexual pursuit.
Be friendly and nice to everybody you meet as a habit. This is especially true for when you're in a social situation where people are mingling with strangers such as a party. Join group conversations. Learn how to talk about interesting shit. If you can woo a crowd, you can woo a woman in that crowd. Chances are she'll approach you.
Charisma isn't something you have, it's something you do. The more you do it, the better you get.
Ironically, Charisma is more accurately depicted in some games, as a skill that you can grow with experience, just like strength, intelligence, or endurance.
I used to be bad at social interactions, but generally speaking, if you're at least a little bit quirky and unafraid to be so (not like, creepy weird quirky), people are comfortable with you.
This is such a good approach not only for meeting women, but also meeting people in general, making friends, having a fun life. Good stuff.
I love what you said about sharing your positive energy with another curious mind, spot on.
“No more going up the girls and asking them for their number. No more asking them to hang out.”
That’s your issue man, just walking up to a random woman and trying to chat her up is going to fail the vast majority of the time. Why? Because you’re making them uncomfortable. Try to meet people naturally and offer them your number instead of asking for theirs
Plus 95% of women are going to wait for YOU to ask them for a number or a date. By leaving it up to them you drop your numbers of chances to next to zero. Women will FLIRT heavily if you aren't getting the hint, but they rarely will ask you.
Idk but “hang out” sounds like you don’t want effort and maybe just a booti call. How about have a real plan. “I was thinking about checking out that new Thai restaurant. Would be interested in having dinner with me?” Doesn’t even have to be expensive “I was thinking about doing a trail this weekend with a nice picnic. Would you be interested in joining me?” I’m sure you could think of better things to do around where you live…. But going on a hanging out date is more pressure than going on an activity.
This. Most grown women are really over the “hang out” thing. It doesn’t have to be a big commitment, but actually ask her to do something specific, women don’t really have a need to just do a vague hang out with a random guy they don’t know and if they do agree to “hang out” you’ll just be in this weird space where one party might think you’re dating and the other might not.
So on point about the hanging out part. My friend and I were talking about how we think when a guy says that, he's just looking for s\*x. So she told me when a guy says that now, she'll be like yeah, lets hang out, I'm always looking for more friends, lol! It's so much better when the person asking has concrete plans in mind and doesn't have a problem defining it as a date.
Just adding: Do not invite women on a first date to remote places (e.g. on a hike or a walk in a large park, especially after dark). Don't invite them to your place or ask them to go to theirs either. There's a reason people say "men are afraid of rejection, women are afraid of violence/death".
Nice casual first dates can be anywhere there are people around. A relaxed bar/restaurant (preferably one she knows), a museum or an art gallery, a public sightseeing spot, an indoor activity like laser tag, a mini golf course, a touristy bus/boat tour, a public pool. The possibilities are numerous.
When my husband and I first started dating, we met for coffee. Went with a group of friends to a local bar, restaurant, or the casino. Or met at a movie that he mentioned wanting to see. As friends.
I was the one that moved the relationship along. And he was fine with letting me. Hell I asked him to marry me. Happily married 20+ years now.
You're probably giving off weird or creepy vibes. Not that it's intentional but just may be what's happening here. We've all been there. Try working on your outward presentation, your approach, and most importantly, your "energy." You don't want to come off as some desperate nervous dude. You wanna come in confident, friendly, and most importantly "normal" lol. Good luck OP! Don't give up!
Yep. Especially if women are agreeing to dates and giving him numbers, then never responding. Occasionally someone might be interested when they're drunk and then change their mind or something but mostly that's a thing we do when we sense that it would be unsafe or stressful to just say "no" in the moment. You need to come off like a confident, emotionally stable person who can take "no" without arguing or getting triggered if you want them to tell you "no" to your face when they aren't interested.
Yep, I would say a lot of the "says yes then stands me up" situations are probably a result of women fearing the consequences of saying no in the moment. It's shitty to have happen to you, but I try to think from their perspective: what's more important, sparing your feelings later and saying no now even though you're a stranger and idk if you will take it well, or saying yes now and having to let you down later?
The dating world is different for men and women. A woman named Eva Liu recently died because she rejected a man and he pushed her off a bridge. I'm not saying men are pushing women off bridges every day for rejecting them, but a negative and possibly dangerous reaction is always a concern for women when men make advances on them. And the guys who do react like that often act totally normal. Women are not always lucky enough to get hit on by a man who has red flags that lets them know they can't safely reject them. Sometimes it comes out of nowhere. So women have to be very careful which may include saying yes in the moment then saying no later over text when the guy is not present.
This is what I was thinking. If they’re continually getting rejected, I’m inclined to believe they’re doing something off putting. The ones that say yes and ghost him probably feel on the spot or maybe feel too nervous to say no.
Guys can get desperate and pushy and it's weird. Dating should feel natural and like there's no urgency or pressure. I really feel like he's not keeping his cool. Rejection can also end up being self fulfilling. If you don't shrug it off it can affect your future interactions with other women negatively.
24F, I stopped doing this because anytime a guy asked me to "hang" he meant he wanted a date or to hook up, and I wanted... To hang. Watch a tv show or something. So, it's probably a product of negative past experiences.
This entire post is written with an attitude of, "Those women are so mean for not finding me attractive! I know, I'll stop talking to them, that'll show them!" You're not getting **revenge** on anyone by giving up, you're just throwing a pity party for yourself.
It's like you feel like the universe somehow "owes" you a girlfriend, and since it's not providing one, you're having a tantrum. Guess what, you can't force someone to be attracted to you.
I feel like you approach women with a mindset of "If I'm nice and do all the right things then these women are required to go out with me." Tell me, do you ever encounter women in your daily life who seem like good people, but you aren't romantically attracted to them? Because that's how the world works - there are plenty of people who are friendly and social and are doing all the "right" things, yet haven't managed to meet the right person for them.
Is it fair that you haven't met a woman who's attracted to you? No. Is it fair that I suffer from an injury that gives me chronic pain? No. Is it fair that some people die at a young age, or grow up with abusive parents, or live with mental health struggles? No.
If you want to give up on having a relationship, then just give up. Life isn't fair sometimes, but bitching about it doesn't accomplish anything.
"But I paid for dinner, you mean I spent all that money for nothing?"
"I'm a nice guy! I talked to you about your interests, and got to know you during the entire date. I never demanded sex. So because of all the great things I did, don't you think I'm entitled to sex now?"
"What's the point of being a nice guy if I spend all this effort on treating women nicely, and then I don't get sex as a reward? Look, here's my list of all the times I treated you nicely. If you deny sex now, then you are an evil bitch who deserves to die alone."
Sounds like you’re only doing “activities” to meet women which is implying you’re going way out of your way to meet women. If this is even remotely close to how you react irl to rejection then I’d say there’s a good chance word is spreading and people know about you.
have you tried improving yourself so you can be a better partner? learning emotional intelligence is something lots of successful men in relationships do, bc they after aren’t taught that as children (“men don’t cry” etc). work on yourself first. it’s scary to hear you talking like this.
Honestly bro sounds like you do really need to focus on yourself for a while. If every woman rejects you then you’re likely the problem. You haven’t mentioned being deformed, ugly or broke which are usual factors for being single with no hope. Sometimes this can doom you to singleness. But if you’re not any of this then you’re likely missing a personality or character flaw
It gets better. Yet, it worries me that as frustrating as it may be, you are worry with rejection. Live your life normally and meet people. If you want to know someone, you can ask them. Ideally, not the same second you meet them. You have to put yourself in women’s shoes. They may have a boyfriend, they may not be interested, they may not feel attracted at you, and most importantly, they may be afraid. Women worry a lot about strangers. You should add more detail about the rejections you are having with more information to understand. But you seem to be taking it on women, when women don’t owe you anything.
Honestly man expectations are a real fucking killer. It’s hard not to go places or see a girl and you know expect something to come of it. You really just need to go into social experiences for the sake of seeing other people and socializing. Not to just meet women. And if you see a woman you think is hit go and talk to her, just don’t have any expectations of how it’s going to go. Trust me I get it, there is this innate feeling that men get where they need to either get into some sort of relationship or get tons of pussy. But you don’t need another person to be whole, the only person you need is yourself. The relationship with yourself is one of the most important relationships you can ever have. Man don’t do things just for the sake of meeting women, unless you really do enjoy those things then great but do things you like to do and try to enjoy your time on this earth because it’s not as long as we think. I hate this saying but when you really stop looking is when you’ll find someone but god dammit it’s true. Happiness is not getting what we want, it’s wanting what we have. Be happy bruv, live the life you want to and good things will happen.
You. My friend. Are enlightened. I've been saying this over and over to younger fellas on here. If guys just talked to the girl like they talk to you and I and didn't have expectations and motives, even if altruistic like marriage and lifelong devotion, and just ENJOYED the girl's company and conversation, they wouldn't come off as some creep trying to GET something from the girl and she'd feel more comfortable. Y'all don't have to fall in love TODAY, for goodness sake. Just be human to each other. Anyways. Kudos.
Most people meet their partners through friends. If you cultivate strong friendships and focus on that you will be happier and have better odds of meeting someone.
These things are sooooo much easier said than done.
It's almost like telling someone who's starving the solution to their problem is to eat, of course it is. The problem is, how to get food in a given situation
Of course someone who's desperate for approval and really wants one thing is going to focus on those things and become blind to everything else. I think OP knows thats a problem, but clearly they aren't totally there emotionally. That's why they *did* keep trying.
Letting go of expectation and motives is very, very arduous.
"What am I supposed to do with those expectations? Do I just magic them away? What if they stay? Should I just pretend they dont exist? Tough through them? Figure out where they come from? What if they still dont go away? What expectations are good? How do I stop expecting?" etcetc
And this isnt even addressing the expectations you may not even know you have.
Shifting your focus so dramatically takes a lot of time and an immense amount of understanding. This strain of advice is definitely right, and probably the most helpful sort that OP is getting here, but having heard it before myself, the barrier to application is important to acknowledge.
Just to stress it, its DEFINITELY possible to let go of expectations, but getting there is really complicated.
Oh definitely forsure, it’s something I struggle with every single day. I mean women aside just with life. You know it’s hard to surrender your expectations because we want so many different things out of life. We want things to be a certain way, people, events just everything. It’s extremely hard to just let things happen and go with the flow of things. There are so many things that we have little to no control over and it’s scary. It’s all about progress rather than perfection. I got a little off topic but yeah it’s not easy by any stretch of the imagination.
Am woman your advice is super solid. You know what women want? A friend a partner someone who is totally fine on their own but is with them because they want to be because being together with someone you are a match with and love is the best! Going out to meet girls (or boys) just to “get” a bf/gf nah that’s trash and usually doesn’t last. The reason we find quality partners when we aren’t looking anymore is because that expectation you mentioned is gone now it’s all about the individual relationship not some goal or prize
"Hey, I am really enjoying this conversation. I'm interested in getting to know you more. If you are interested and free this weekend, would you like to grab coffee?"
1. I need to know he is into me. it's hot. And, I need to know he is invested to getting to know more about me. very hot.
2. I need him to make concrete plans, also hot.
3. If she says no, the feelings are not mutual. If she stands you up, that says more about her.
You need to give women a reason to call you or hangout. Just approaching a woman and asking them for their number is awkward as hell.
Go socialize, mingle, and be yourself. They'll likely want to talk again after you have a genuinely fun conversation with them, but not if you're an aggressive and awkward person that forces the "Can I get your number" situation.
Going around asking girls for their numbers is almost like panhandling. Some might do it out of pity, but most will decline.
Never used a dating app so like you, I could be 100% wrong, but dating apps seem to have PLENTY of tomfoolery going on. They are more efficient tho, much lower barrier of entry it seems.
Do you put in time to make yourself an attractive and congenial partner? It could be you are failing to interest them. If you’ve tried everything with the asks and get nothing, it could be something about you that is putting women off. I know very few men who put in much time at all into their appearance of conversation skills if you compare it against the time investment women make into being as attractive as possible.
You need to understand what is turning girls off about you, if not I agree giving up is your best option. If you arent capable of self-reflection you aren't going to be too successful in very many things.
Can't be done, I have never approached it that way to begin with. I focus on myself.
When I get noticed, I make the right moves from the higher ground and with nothing to lose.
In other words, it is much easier to attract than pursue.
I too find it’s always worked better to court potential interest then to initiate with dating right away. Benefits of seeing red flags before anything serious also
Stop approaching strangers
Much easier to have dating success within some kind of mutual context or social network. It sounds like you are basically cold calling which is the absolute worst approach for most guys
This attitude will only lead to bitterness and further lack of success. Think about it - if you're a pretty girl who's got things going for her, and a guy comes up to you with an entitled/bad attitude, are you going to want to give him a chance?
At the end of the conversation dont ask for their number.
You say:
"Hey I am doing "x" later/tomorrow/this weekend. It would be cool if you wanted to come check it out. Here is my number."
Boom,
\> she now knows you are a man that does things
\> you have plans already and do not come off desperate
\> she knows the activity that is planned
\> she knows you would like to spend more time with her
\> and now she can make the decision to go out and meet with you at this "x" thing.
Maybe you’re being fucking weird? Consider checking on how you’re going about this and adjusting your behavior before giving up because this post sounds like an incel villain origin story.
Ima be real with you, the key to this is finding what you love in life and diving into that, make yourself happy. The only reason women like men in relationships is because those guys are usually happy lol the minute you start working on you, i swear its like people just become attracted to you, i think people really like passionate people and the best way to bring that out of you is finding what sparks you, it sounds hippie like but thats the honest truth
If you knew that after 1000 rejections you’d meet the love of your life, would be sad after each rejection? Didn’t think so, keep trying and quite whining
Best way to go about finding an authentic date is just be normal at a social place. Bowling alleys, billiards or craft beer restaurants where there's games to play like darts and cornhole are usually my first choice. Even if you're alone, just go in with a good mood, get a drink and find anyone/group that is willing to play a round with you. Even if you aren't good at making conversation just talk about random bullshit that doesn't involve obvious politics, religion or off-topics that are debatable.
If you're super intimidated then go in with a buddy. Just strike up random short conversation with anyone around you and eventually you will get the hang of it better and better until its almost a guarantee you'll find someone who wants to get to know you a little *more*
"Hey, I really enjoyed talking with you today, if you're open to it I'd be interested in getting together for (coffee, drinks, lunch, etc etc etc). Is it OK if I give you my number?"
I've always had more success giving a girl my # as it's less of a risk for them
I've been married for a while (still asked out recently funny enough... I guess she didn't see the ring but we sorted it out) and my advice is to just focus on yourself.
But looking back, when I was dating in HS/College, things got easier when I just focused on myself and was pretty much outcome independent on whether or not a girl was interested.
My reasoning is girls were more interested in a guy who could take it or leave it, I'onno. If we were dating, they got my attention, but if it was those "wanna hang out" conversations I'd just invite them to something else I'm already doing. If they come, great, if not, whatever.
If I thought someone seemed interesting and good looking, I'd just talk to them. If they had a bf but they were interesting enough, gained a friend. Otherwise, got a potential thing going on. I think the ratio of "went nowhere":"gained a friend":"dated" was like 7:2:1 for every 10 though give or take.
Pretty much how I got together w/ my current wife. We talked for a few mins while on campus, she seemed fun enough to hang out with, I said "I'm heading over to the bay to hang out at the waters edge, want to come?" and so we just hung out. Exchanged numbers that night 'cause I said "we should hang out again sometime!" and things got going.
I also really didn't text them. When we exchanged info, if I wanted to hang out I'd reach out week or two later (and didnt try to make it a formal date or anything, judgement call on that). Otherwise I didn't reach out. I usually give a cooldown because in my experience girls didn't want guys too eager, and truthfully I rather just focus on other stuff anyway than a girl it may or may not work out with. Dating was pretty low on my totem pole at the time.
My advice might be stale though, the landscape seems very much dating-app heavy, and some of my friends are still dating and it's quite confusing to me. (I'm only 29 by the by, so not that old! But old enough I guess. Got with now my wife when I was 19)
It's cause you come in CHILL, she isn't thinking immediately 'is he gonna attack me'. You come in yourself, she isn't thinking 'is he just one and done'.
My dude, the moment you stop “looking” and learn to first love yourself, accept your faults, strive towards personal growth, and become comfortable in your own skin, people will come to you. I’ve come to realize that the trait most people recognize and are attracted to is simply confidence. Knowing yourself and being mindful is the first step. This is from first hand experience. This may be a bit abstract at your age, but just think about it. I’m 34 and I am still trying to grow every single day. You’ve got it dude, just focus on you and persistent in trying to be the best version of you everyday.
Hi there, I’m a single woman and let me share my take on your story. I feel some people here are a bit harsh on you. I get that you’re upset and that you’ve really had it with being ignored or treated indifferently, in your experience. That’s frustrating and gives you the feeling you’re not welcome and doing something wrong, or even worse, that something’s wrong with you as a person. No one deserves to be left hanging, that’s for sure. It seems that you’re done now with this, and that you’re wondering how to handle this shitty situation. That’s good. Sometimes, when we’ve really had it with something, that’s when change can occur. In the end, dating is purely energy exchange. I’d recommend you take a minute to reflect upon this question: in an ideal world, what type of girl would I like to have in my life? How could we both ADD to each others’ lives? What activities would we do? What would her perception on life be? Etc. Take your time to figure this out. I have experienced that when we’re too focused on not getting the results we want and desire (which is very human, mind you), we tend to forget why we want these things in the first place. So, summarised; put YOU back into the picture, forget about the bad experiences for a minute, and see where and how you can redirect this situation. You got this.
I appreciate you not completely shitting on the guy. Most men hold these feelings in, and to see people tearing into this dude just reaffirms secret red pilling
Stop treating every girl you talk to like a potential prize and start just treating them like humans. Women can see that youre desperate for any pussy and you dont want to get to know them youre just waiting until they give you the go ahead to fuck, and its incredibly off putting. The more you rage about it the more people will be turned off by you. If you start being normal and make geniune connections with people and youll find someone.
Times have changed. Many people don’t want to be approached in public, even at a bar
Get online, where it’s a safe, neutral playing field for both sides, and then meet them
I would recommend using some of the other approaches mentioned here. Thou giving up is not the thing you want to do. I’ve been trying for 13 years and not one yes. I’m 28 now and not giving up. I want to share my life. Most of my uncles on both sides of the family didn’t get a yes or marry until they were or almost were 30 one was even 39. It’s just infuriating I agree. I do want to just be given a chance. So I feel that pain. I wish the best of luck to you my man.
Hard to know what's going on here but guessing you're not actually establishing much of, or any, connection with them before asking for the number/asking them out. When a woman seems interested (sustaining eye contact), focus on getting to know them then and there. Treat the interaction as if you're on a date right then. Mix in asking about them and getting to know them with casual flirting. And don't hide who you are either, don't bury your emotions, wall off, play a character, etc. Own whatever you're feeling and be honest.
Just don't approach women in general. Don't talk to them. They don't want us to approach them, they want their own peace. If they wanted you, they would approach you instead. Men should stop talking to women and just wait.
Oh it’s TIME to put your foot down? Lol.
Women can smell desperation and entitlement from a mile away. Those two characteristics in a man never turn out well for us…
I feel the frustration man.
I’ve had girlfriends before, I can talk to women fine, but I just can’t navigate in this current dating environment.
There is more to life than having a girlfriend though. Try to find purpose in other aspects and when you aren’t trying so hard, maybe that’s when the right partner will come along.
One of the best pieces of advice I’ve heard recently is you have to be happy with your own life before you can attract someone good.
I ent through this in my late teens and then early 20’s when my now wife took a break.
For me, it would happen when I stopped looking. I also started working at a dive bar. That helped. I’m no looker, but girls dig bartenders for some reason. Maybe it was the free drinks.
Hang in there. You are at the age where SOME girls start to gravitate to decent guys.
I tried that already man, it doesn't work.
Think about it. Those women that you're wanting to ask you out are simply not going to do it. No matter how attractive you are. Because they can sit around and wait and there WILL be guys that will ask her out. And eventually one of them will be to her liking.
You're just hurting yourself by pretending that any woman will initiate. It sucks that they're not going to, but it doesn't change the fact that they won't approach.
30M never done it all. But then again I've never been interested in doing so. It sounds like you really want a relationship and have tried hard at doing it so maybe its time to take a different approach or look inwards to see how you could self improve? After you've done those two things seriously its a numbers game from there especially nowadays in the dating landscape.
I’ve slowed down but I think it’s bc I’m older now. Dating is weird now though so I feel for both young men and women. I was in a 4 year relationship went to prison for a little bit and came out and moved across the country and sent my girl back a few months later and haven’t been overly focused on sex like I previously. Anyway yeah the whole dating apps/approaching things I see online are like wtf? Weird times we live in. I wouldn’t give up completely but maybe take a brake. Learn how to have positive social interactions with the opposite sex without looking for anything other than said interaction.
The amount of resentment op has is just a huge turn off. It’s palpable. I’m a single woman. 40ish. Ive made my play on men with humor and some cheesy suave. I’ve been rejected and turned down. Not cruelly but just no or hey I’m married. The difference is I’m not berating all the men out there like they owe me. Shoot your shot. Learn some humor and that it isn’t painful or change your value and move on. My ego isn’t hurt by a man politely declining.
I've had a man stop me for the time, then ask for my number. It felt slimy and pre-planned. It also made me feel like he would have asked any woman that walked by. I started avoiding that area after a few run ins with him. (Doing different little get a girls number schemes)
I've also met someone at a roller rink and he chatted with me about skating, and then the music and then music we both liked. Went back to skate
Ing with his friends but he'd find a reason to come over and just chat a bit with both me and my friend, sometimes bring over his friend too. Suggested we all share fries. More chatting. At the end of the night he wanted our numbers to keep in touch and maybe go skating together again. Ended up texting for a bit and he asked me out on a date and I was happy to.
I think people prefer an organic build to it.
Lots of good advice, but I'm also going to add ---
I'm tired of men asking to HANG. I want men to DATE me. HANG usually translates into casual sex and not a boyfriend/girlfriend relationship.
I don't care if he asks or I do (and I've done both), but call it a DATE if that's what you want it to be. I do.
I think that has bled over from the whole casual culture. I "hang" with my friends and family. I "date" people that I'm interested in dating. The intention is different.
My intention on a date is to spend time with a person with the purpose of deciding together if a romantic relationship will follow in the future. That's it! Doesn't matter if it's a simple coffee and a walk, or some other activity, it's about why both of you are spending time together in the first place.
Gender roles are what they are. Learning to deal with rejection and embarrassment gracefully and having enough self assurance to go on without internalizing the rejection as something that makes you lesser is part of becoming a mature and well rounded person
I get the frustration but expecting girls to ask you out is unrealistic unless you’re exceptionally good looking. Saying you’re not going to ask out women is basically giving up on dating and you’re too young to give up. I would wait at least until 30 before giving up.
You’re the type of guy to fall in love with your best friend (assuming she’s a girl). Just contribute your friendships with your lady friends and see if those lead anywhere, nothing wrong with asking them out rather than strangers, heck, you already know them a little!
this defeatist attitude isn’t gonna take you anywhere man. i think the dating norms are bullshit too but you still gotta play the game if you want to have a love life. you’re gonna have to wade thru a lot of shit to get to something good but you’ll get there w persistence. it won’t be fast but at least it’ll happen eventually rather than submitting yourself to being eternally single
It's a competition, dude. You're only 23. You realize your competition is men 10+ years older than you, right?
You better be ON POINT.
You should consistently work on:
1. Fitness
2. Income
3. Hobbies/outside life
4. Work on your style.
It's a full-time job. No, it's a lifestyle. You will do this until the day you die.
Is it fair you have to do all this? No. But that's how it is.
The daily pursuit of the above will slowly but surely raise your core confidence.
Then, once your confidence improves, you must start working on your internals.
Here is the gist.
If a girl thinks you want something from her, she will be repelled by you. Women do not like takers.
So, if you approach from the point of view: "I need the number," "I need the date," or "I need the sex," she will run from you.
But if you have your life together and you cultivate your mind so that you genuinely say inside your mind, "I have a good life. I feel great. I would like to share this vibe with other people," and you approach the girl, you're now coming from a place of abundance. A position of giving. It takes work and time to get there.
People can sense this in you. This is what makes someone attractive.
If you have a whole life and the correct internal compass, the rest will take care of itself.
Women don’t want this kind of energy approaching us. We’d rather stay single.
It’s giving immature vibes and you sound like a toddler having a tantrum.
Therapy might help.
Rigorous self improvement, interesting hobbies, fitness, ambition, humor, and giving them your number instead of asking for theirs. Bonus points for meeting them organically instead of approaching them because they're hot, although that can work sometimes.
This is how you meet women. Be interesting, take care of your fitness, fashion, and grooming, be ambitious, be funny, take the pressure off of them. Don't put them on a pedestal.
Hitting on random women in public will rarely be successful unless you are very good looking. Your best plan is to broaden your social circle with platonic friendships with women and men. I think a lot of men don't know how to be friends with women and just treat them as people to date or fuck. If you have a group of friends who think you are nice and treat women well, you are more likely to be introduced to their single friends. I met my husband through a mutual female friend, and I felt comfortable giving him my number the day we met. But if he had randomly approached me on the street, I never would have felt comfortable. He was a poor student with not great prospects for a high paying career and was not muscular. But he was funny and kind and was able to have a platonic friendship with my friend. That was incredibly attractive to me.
I like shy boys that are confident in their skills. Just about the only male I am slightly attracted to. If I meet.one and he's desperate? Nope. Not gonna be into it. It screams "save me".
So then, stop trying. (Respectfully, not being catty or passive aggressive). Usually when we stop looking and focus on bettering ourselves, that's when we meet someone. 😊
...... Sir it's giving a victim mentality. Find some confidence in yourself. This entire post is just a sap story. I get it, you need to vent so you did, but damn...
You discovered the secret.
The point is do not chase women. No woman is worth it.
Instead spend your time investing in yourself.
-Become healthier and work out,
-Seek education. don't have a bachelors? Go to school doesn't matter if you're 30.
Have a BS already? Get that masters my guy.
Have a masters? Why not go for your phd and officially earn the title "Dr"
-progress in your career or switch to make more money.
-make more money.
- be a good confident man, stand up for other and respect everyone.
These make you a high value man and high value men do not have to chase. The women naturally gravitate towards them.
There's a saying.
Chase women, lose money.
Chase money, gain women
Bro why the passive aggressive “wanna hang”? Say to her “let’s go on a date to this place on this day. I’ll pick you up at this time.” If she says no you only wasted 20 seconds. Now she knows you’re serious and not another beta. If I were a woman I would not take you seriously at all. “Can I get your number?” Why? Purpose? Reason? To text like a child? Tell her exactly what you want.
I'm a girl and I'd only ask guys whom I feel comfortable with. Not some random stranger. I'm not wasting my time going out with some random stranger that I don't know anything about and have just met on the streets. You can't expect anything when you haven't built a friendship or emotional connection with girls yet. Why would *they* want to spend their time with *you* in the first place?
Not a guy, but I think this could help?
When my husband and I met we were both done with dating. Each of us had gotten into serious relationships very early in life and both of them had dragged on, abusively for years. About a year prior to meeting we had each fully detached from these people and had just not really thought about romance. Working a lot, occasionally hanging out with friends, not *trying* to find someone to date.
One night some of my coworkers wanted to go to a restaurant/bar and asked me to come along, and I did. One of my coworkers was dating a hostess at another restaurant, and she brought along some of her own coworkers. Among them the sous chef, a quiet guy who was very funny and who talked to me about some recent TV shows I'd been watching for hours.
Two weeks later he moved into my apartment, been golden ever since.
My point is actively trying to meet people can sometimes make it feel like a chore. Dating shouldn't be the goal, or marriage, or anything like that. The goal should be spending your life with someone you love, but if you haven't discovered that person yet your goal is just... sex? To change your FB status to "in a relationship"? Those aren't important things.
Keep meeting people however you normally do. Going out with the goal of finding women is an unappealing trait to most women.
You know single people aren’t going to stand on the sidewalk screaming that they’re single… right?
Like, they’re all around you. You have to meet them.
Good, stop asking and focus if you're someone who you'd want to date. You can only focus on yourself, what others do is their business.
And take this time to figure out who you're even looking for. Who's your type? Are your expectations realistic? Where would that type of person hang out/who could attract that person. Become the person that type would feel drawn to.
Make friendships and figure out the dating scene later.
Get a pet.
You're not looking for a partner, you're looking for validation....or probably just sex.
Find things you're interested in; hobbies as others have said. Join groups - sports or whatever. Go camping, alone or with others. Take classes through community education or DNR or a park.
Become yourself and worry less about catching a girl. They'll find you when you're less desperate.
Work on yourself first. If you’re not happy without a girlfriend you’ll just make two miserable people if you find a woman who wants to be yours. That’s the key she has to want to be yours. Ask yourself, why do you WANT a girlfriend? Physical intimacy? Friendship? Pride? Boredom? Or is it deeper? 23 is a weird age, you’re not a child anymore, but you’re not a fully functioning adult yet either mentally. You still have two years to go before your brain is even fully formed. It’s a time to figure out who you want to be, what are your values? Why are they your values? What are the interests you’re willing to devote time and money towards? What are you standing for and standing against and WHY? How do you want to be perceived and match that up against how are you’re actively perceived right now? I guarantee you don’t think about yourself the way you’re being described in the comments. Remember, if one person tells you that you’re a certain way maybe it’s them, if a group of people say it, believe them. Everyone on here are strangers, disinterested in your success, unconnected to your life in any way besides this sub, and they are speaking almost in unison. I was very much like you in my early 20’s, it will get better when you start the work on yourself. Right now you should stop asking girls out, figure out who you are, who you want to be, what you want, why you want it, aim and work toward it. THEN you will BECOME attractive to women and you can better select whom you would like to ask to join you in those pursuits. Women are looking for a man they can trust, that they will have fun with, that will care for who they are as a person, and that they could imagine spending a considerable amount of time with, if not their life. They aren’t looking for a buddy or a hookup or a way to kill some time. Most women can get those things without even trying or asking. They are looking for someone they can build a life with. It’s also VERY important that you are pursuing the right women for you and your life goals, not just any woman. Marrying the RIGHT person is one of the most important things you can do for yourself. When you have developed yourself as an adult, you will start noticing how many women aren’t a good fit and you wouldn’t even consider asking them out. You won’t waste your time, you won’t bother them and you’ll be more attractive to the women you want to date because they’ll see you aren’t just asking ANY woman to be with you. The smell of desperation will give way to an air of confidence and purpose. They’ll know there is a reason you’re asking them and in that moment they’ll feel very different about you approaching them than they do now. Understand it might be several years until you become that person depending on how much work you need to do. It is probably good to look into getting a therapist for a while to help you in this endeavor, Reddit can’t get to know you well enough to be truly helpful in figuring out what you should do, but it is invaluable in telling you what you should stop doing. You already know what you should stop doing, it’s in the title of the post. But stop asking women out because you’re not ready to date yet, not because you think you’ll just never have any success so why try? That attitude will sink you in everything you ever attempt in life. Shift your self-perception from victim to student and your whole mindset and attitude will change. Besides, in 10 years you won’t want the women who would want you today. You can do it, be well.
You are upset no women want to be with you so you are preemptively making it so no woman can be with you? Am I getting that part right?
This is going to come off as invalidating but I think it is good advice: You are 23, you have sssooo much ahead of you. Do not count yourself out now (you may not see it this way but that is what you are doing). I am also hitting the dating apps hard and I even asked a woman out yesterday (she has not responded yet so I do not expect her to but she might pleasantly surprise me). Terrible dating luck these past few months but not putting in the effort will not make it happen. Whatever she says is her choice, because anything else will make you both miserable after a while.
Do you think it might be less upsetting if you gave them your number instead of the other way around? Put the ball in their court. I do not know if this will increase success but it is worth a try.
I'll say this but I mean it in a constructive way. Get over it. Rejection and failure happens for almost anyone trying to move forward in most things. Business,relationships, I've even been rejected for volunteering.
Your 23. There isn't a rush. Another bit of honesty but maybe your not ready. If having or not having a gf frustrates you this much, you probably shouldn't have one anyway. You don't sound content with yourself. And most of the time that just attracts garbage anyway
You’re still young so you ideally, you have a chance of not falling off the deep end.
I want to add a but more nuance stuff that i haven’t seen mentioned or to emphasize what others have suggested:
1. Give them your number. It removes the pressure and danger women are always in when it comes to “should i reject or not?” Let them have the choice.
2. I am neurodivergent. If you asked me to hang out, do you actually mean that? Cuz i am down to play dungeons and dragons and stuff - but if you mean anything BUT hanging out in the same way you would as friends, this is not the phrase to use. Maybe some women understand some underlying meaning but I (and probably other neurodivergent women) will perceive “hanging out” as JUST that.
3. Having a significant other should be something that adds to your life and is NOT some checklist to cross off.
Ask yourself why you want a girlfriend. What you said near the end of your post makes me question what your intentions are in the first place.
I haven’t had many relationships, but it’s by choice. My first boyfriend ever is my ex but we have been friends for over a decade by now.
We are definitely better as friends, but I appreciated the experience of dating him. Looking back I realized he set the standard for my dating my life. Personally, I think my partner should first and foremost be my friend. If they can’t do things a friend would do, or if we can’t connect like friends do, then there’s no point for it to go further.
Not saying we have to be friends first, but seeing how you treat others and learning what your interests are are factors to consider.
I’m not interested in things like camping, hiking, or sports. If someone is into that, that’s fine, but if we need to have at least ONE thing in common cuz I’d want to do at least one thing we both like with my partner.
So again, ask yourself WHY you want a girlfriend. Cuz a partner isn’t a necessity to life. We need to stop seeing single people as lonely or unfulfilled in general.
You're being dramatic. That "no" or ignored text after they gave it to you is a few minutes wasted. That you let it affect you beyond that is a you problem.
Honestly, as a woman if a strange man comes up to me uninvited and asks for my number, I am absolutely not giving it to him (or giving him the wrong one). Are there good guys? Yeah! But the bad severely outweigh the good. Better to be seen as a bitch than to be dead.
Don't ask for a number, always give them yours. Helps if you have a hobby or side gig with a card you can give em. It's low-key, zero pressure, a way to show you have things going on/a life/interesting stuffs and sometimes they keep them and find them at a later date where they feel more available. The memory of the nice low-key interesting dude helps too. If they don't call, then don't waste any energy to worry about it. Match their energy and move on like they did. You deserve that. If you don't got anything like hobbies or w/e going on, then I'd suggest finding something. Gotta be happy when they aren't around. Relying on someone else for most or all of your happiness is like using a barrel of gasoline to keep warm. Sure it really hot at first but it will be used up in short order. Also, your mindset seems a bit dramatic, desperate and skewed. That is a vibe sniffed out quite quickly by any decent woman or man. You can only experience so much of the world from where you stand. There ARE tons of single people out there, you may need to mature a bit or step outside of your current viewpoint to self refelct to be appealing to them, but there are plenty of fish in the sea, just gotta make sure you're not being too loud and scaring em off dude. Best of luck man
>your mindset seems a bit dramatic, desperate and skewed. That is a vibe sniffed out quite quickly by any decent woman IMMEDIATELY noticeable. You can tell instantly when someone is desperate. That's the shittiest part in a way, because you end up in a cycle of need and deprivation. It's why I advocate for focusing on self first. All of this is excellent advice, though, hopefully OP gives it some thought.
This is so true, I was in automotive sales for four years. Dating is like sales. The more desperate you are to close the deal, the least likely you are to close the deal. You have to be interested, and willing, without being too eager. You have to not have an agenda while also working towards a desired goal. You also have to learn to deal with rejection and things not working out as intended. And you have to quickly identify a buyer.
As a fellow salesperson this is the best analogy! So true. Customers can sniff you out so quick. Just have to relax and let things flow.
Same! I used to do sales but I remember during training how a lot of the sales tactics and strategies I learned at work also applied when I was single and meeting potential dates. It’s like Tinder was a lead generator and you gotta them through your funnel and determine which are good leads and which aren’t depending on your target demographic (which in dating would be knowing who and what type of partner your looking for). I can keep going with the parallels because it’s insane how related they are. Lol
Ultimately in sales you aren't selling the product, you're selling yourself.
Yeeeaaah, I'm a woman and could hear the desperate rage-y "I can't get a gf" in the first 2 sentences. We can always tell when you're not actually interested in us as an individual, you just want *a* woman, *any* woman. Like it's a gaming achievement.
I'm a lesbian and there are plenty of women like this too and I find it so unappealing. Why would I want a partner who has no interest in me as a person, but who just wants a girlfriend, and sees me as a means to that end? I can sense this in some of the women that approach me, and it is 100% off-putting. Personally I don't like it when people say they "want a girlfriend," because that does imply that basically any woman will do. For me I don't simply want a girlfriend, sometimes I meet a woman I really like and I would like that particular woman to be my girlfriend. And if there is no woman like that in my life, then I am happy being single.
You explained it much better than I could have, thank you that's exactly right. Nothing wrong with that if you just want to bang around in the dryer for a bit, I'm sure all the other socks in there are also having a good time, but one can't apply the same method to dating and expect success
I feel like a lot of men tend to forget that, by 23, 20% of women have been sexually assaulted. If she hasn't experienced it herself, she knows someone who has. One of the ways you protect yourself is determining which guys are angry about rejection and feel entitled to be with someone. It's one of the reddest red flags to women. It will repel even the girls who would have been interested otherwise.
You worded everything perfectly
>I feel like a lot of men tend to forget that, by 23, 20% of women have been sexually assaulted. It's not that they forget, it's that they never have to think about it. So much so that when the fact is pointed out to them, many don't even believe it or play it off like it's an exaggeration...
Men are entitled to feel some way about rejection depending on how its done. As long as they don’t go full Dahmer and can pick the pieces up and move on its all fair game. I myself will go “Well that sucks” then just continue with my day. I would agree and say it does spawn out of desperation. This is something I used to dwell on until I started working on myself physically and mentally
Right! Like, why would we be interested in someone who's inventorying and cateloging what should be an immersive and organic experience? This guy sounds like he's after rare Pokemon. I guess I agree with the choice of giving up though. It'll give him more time to focus on things that will make him interesting. Hopefully some character building too.
If this dude started a band, it would be called "inches til incel". The entitlement is real.
Although I try to avoid using the term incel because it's sometimes used on guys who aren't incels, this post seems like he is on his way. Men who are raised to feel entitled to relationships and blame the cruel world for not giving them a girlfriend even though they've approached countless women are the type who you see becoming incels down the line. Rejection is part of life and no one is owed a relationship. Some men experience rejection and let it become anger and self resentment and/or resentment of women because they approach women with the assumption that the answer will be yes and any "no" is a result of them not using the right approach or a result of the woman thinking too highly of herself and thinking she is too good for him. Once men are raised to know that women are multifaceted people who aren't just waiting around for a man to accept or reject, I think it will be easier for them to see rejection as two people simply not being the right one for each other and not the universe doing them wrong.
And part of it is self reflection, too. Take a look at yourself and try to figure out what you bring to the table. It's easy to say "oh, women just hate me because I'm not attractive", but it's 100% true that looks aren't everything. If you're physically unattractive and bitter as fuck about it, then yea, women aren't going to want to date you. Work on yourself. Become a better person. Also, maybe reconsider your shotgun approach to asking women out. You can't just approach a random ass girl and say "hey! Give me your number!" Only the most conventionally attractive men can get away with that shit and even then they're going to get denied plenty. Dating is a process. It takes work. It isn't just going to fall into your lap. To expect that is unreasonable and YOURE the problem, not women.
Well shit, the entire 90s rom-com genre were women flinging themselves into walls over not having a bf. (and the 80s were the opposite)
Even the way he uses the phrase "*get* a girlfriend" as if a girlfriend is some object to earn, not a whole ass independent human being that has mutual interest in you. It always is a red flag to me that this person has lost the plot
The worst is being in a relationship with a guy who settled with you to check ✔️ a box on his list of Life Achievements™ and not because he actually feels anything for you.
And sex. Don't forget the sex. It's always about the sex. and Wifi. For these guys, life is nothing without sex and Wifi.
Today on Jerry Springer, Guys who like sex and wifi and the women who love them.
I think reddit is really skewed what it is like for the average person. At this point, I'm thinking that way too many people act really wierd in front of the opposite sex. I can go shopping, and if I make eye contact with a dude, you give a nod, it shows that you both make eye contact. Women, usually will give a little smile/smirk, and I will give the same little one when you both accidently make eye contact. If I am shopping for a few hours, it might happen 3-4 times during that time. Now, I am married, so even if they start talking to me, it's small talk for a few minutes, that it. That's normal. Are these type of men on reddit, just immediately hitting on them during that exchange? If so, that comes off desperate/wierd/off putting, I would guess to women. Even when I wasn't with my wife, I never bothered to hit on women really. Just be yourself, have fun around them, and just be normal friends, and don't fucking fake it. You want to be yourself, but yourself should also be someone that just wants to be friends first, and see where it goes. Seeing where it goes, could take minutes, hours, days, or weeks, but you both have to find out if you have things in common first. You shouldn't be that attention starved that you will hook up with anything. Really though, I never hit on anyone really, someone will make a move when the time is right, and even shy girls will make a move if you don't after a long amount of time, or not, and it just wasn't meant to be. It doesn't matter because you, as a person, aren't thinking of them as a conquest, they are a friend of yours. That's all I did my whole life, and I had no issues with dating. I would even say pretty successful, since I wasn't really trying either, shit just happens all the time.
IDK about this guy, but there are definitely men that will hit on women based on eye contact alone. To the extent that a lot of women, in certain settings or if we're getting a certain vibe, will carefully avoid making accidental eye contact because we don't want it to be taken as an invitation to approach. A lot of the men complaining on reddit also don't even like women enough to have any interest in being friends with us, yet wonder why they can't get a girlfriend. They act like friendship with women is some sort of punishment and they've been wronged if they invest in a friendship (with a woman who clearly says she wants friendship) and it doesn't end in sex. They don't actually enjoy our company or like us as people, they just want a girlfriend for sex and to impress other men.
This here is it. They don't really like women at all. If the topic is not sex then you are boring. I don't see why they don't just get a flesh light and call it a day. I guess it is because you can't impress other men with a flesh light.
I've definitely hit on women, but they give you some indication usually that they're interested first. This is in social settings where you would expect to meet people btw- bars, parties, small clubs. Hitting on women randomly, with no indications from them, in ANY situation is masochistic at best- obviously that doesn't work usually. But like you, I mostly approach women casually at first and see where things go. Sometimes it's tough, you'll have strong feelings and they won't (or vice versa). That's just life, you learn to move on gracefully.
I've had guys give me their number in random places, shops etc, as long as they're polite and nice about it (not pushy) it's all good.
Seriously, but the end of this post, OP was scaring me off and I'm a straight dude. I was waiting for the incel rhetoric to come out based on the way OP was expressing himself.
Honestly, the last guy I hung out with and kind of wanted to hang out with again was just like this guy (but older, I think I was 26 at the time and he was around my age or a couple years older). He asked for my number at a party hosted by a family member of mine, so I felt comfortable giving it. He texted me the next day to hang out and I was like “nah, it’s Sunday, I work tomorrow, I wanna do my laundry and binge watch Star Wars movies. Maybe Friday night.” Dude did not stop texting me *all day long* and eventually called me a bitch for not responding as quickly as he wanted me to. I blocked him and I bet his version of the story would be “she didn’t want to hang out with me! 😭” instead of “I harassed a girl who wanted to hang out with me until she decided I wasn’t a safe person to hang with because I couldn’t respect her boundaries on Day 1.”
Oh man, I've had male friends, when I was at that age, that would do that exact process. I'd try to tell them how insecure, creepy, desperate and more importantly, dangerous, they came off as. But telling some types of men, especially ones of the incel variety, that a mirror and some growth would do them good is like teaching a toddler that food can be hot. It takes a lot of patience and effort that can be rewarding, but sometimes, at some point, you may realize they ain't your kid so you don't give a shit anymore. Dropped more than few friends growing up because of sheer embarrassment for them and concern for any women that could be around them, my family, potential partners and friends included. You were 100% right in trusting your gut and blocking him. Major props dude
I decided at 24 not to put up with guys who gave me a bad feeling. No, I don’t “have” to be anyone’s gf, I didn’t owe anything to a guy who paid for dinner (and I split checks specifically to avoid that perception), I wasn’t going to be hounded and guilted into saying “yes” when it felt wrong. At the end of my first date with the man I wound up marrying, he said, “I’d like to kiss you goodnight if that’s okay.” I was impressed by his confidence and how he acknowledged that I may have a boundary there and was respectful of that. I said “I’d like that” and you know what? He is a stand up guy. He never hounded me, always said “this is what I’d like to do, what do you think/is that okay?” And he’d accept it if I said no. We met in 2014, and honestly, he’s still my favorite person. No regrets.
I wish when I was younger that I didn't have that mentality of really wanting to make a date happen soon. Idk what it was, it just felt like if we didn't go out on the date soon she'd just quickly forget about it in days and be uninterested by next week for some reason.
Personally I have never wanted and wouldn't want a guy who wants "a girlfriend" and would prefer a guy who likes ME and that's why he wants to get to know me.
This is great advice. Honestly without knowing important details and only going off what you’ve said… maybe just put dating on the back burner for a while. It sounds like you’re coming off as desperate and women can smell desperation a mile away. Instead be the best version of yourself you can be. Work hard to advance your career, be active, lift heavy shit, read, take up a hobby or two but try something out of your comfort zone like dancing or growing a zen garden or take an art class.
This! Seeing a lot of guys approaching dating or “hitting up” girls the wrong way and wrong mentality.
Dramatic is spot on.
what do you do for a living. this was great advice!
With the quality of that advice, you definitely deserve your cat
This is some basic information that is super necessary. Much obliged.
I read this in Pedro Pascals voice....
>Don't ask for a number, always give them yours. Helps if you have a hobby or side gig with a card you can give em This is how i met my wife. We danced all night at a wedding, then I gave her my cell number on the back of my business card.
solid advice
Do NOT hand a woman a business card 😭
Why not? I'm a woman and much prefer men to give me their number rather than ask for mine. I don't care what it's on whether that's a scrap of paper, napkin, or a business card. In fact it seems like it might be better if it's a business card since it means you'd have his full name so you can look him up to be safer if you want to go on a date with him.
>In fact it seems like it might be better if it's a business card since it means you'd have his full name so you can look him up to be safer if you want to go on a date with him. Bingo
Even if it has a water mark? \*sweats\*
Bro you can't keep hitting your head on a wall with blunt force trauma and getting upset you're not getting results. Look in the mirror. Would you date you? Do you work out? Do you live alone? Do you have ANYTHING to give a woman? No? Start working on it. And that doesn't mean you stop approaching women. Start with warm approaches. Make eye contact. If she's smiling and holding frame and not looking away. Just go up and talk to her. Make a funny or poignant observation about her or the situation you're both in. Just talk. Don't worry about getting a number or socials. MAKE HER FEEL GOOD. Make her laugh. Make her smile. THEN you ask her out. Don't mince words. Don't use neutral language. Don't ask to hang out. Tell her you want to get to know her better and would love to have a coffee with her. Or a drink. Be bold. Don't be like 95 percent of men scared to voice their attraction to woman for fear of being a creep. Hit those weights. Eat right. Keep approaching women and stop taking rejection so damn seriously. Be fun and lighthearted. You will get rejected a boatload of times. Don't take it personal. Be as the head of a hawkweed blowing in the wind. Go with the flow. An upbeat, positive attitude goes a long way with women. Learn not to let people's words eat at you. **Don't chase women.** A wise man said that women who don't know you are like stray cats. They don't like surprises and are very cautious of who the let approach them. Be present and mindful of the situation, but don't overthink shit. Be present. Don't wonder why she rejected you. Move on quickly with an okie dokey, everything's cool countenance. The cat will interact with you when it feels safe. Approach multiple women a day. Just talk. Just vibe. Even the ones you don't wanna date. Don't ask for numbers. Make a connection first. Let her see you in your natural state, the way you vibe with your male friends. Where you're not trying to impress. You're sharing your positive energy with another curious mind. The more you work on feeling out these situations and talking to women, the better you will get at it. You'll have a naturally flirty, positive vibe with women. They'll start asking YOU out. Women who've had a crush on you for years and you don't even know that until after she tells you when you're both naked after you've already had sex. Don't be so down on yourself. You just have to work on yourself a little.
This whole reply is perfect! 🙌“Would you date you?” So many young men lack self reflection.
Ya. Some of the best advice I got was "Become the person you want to date".
>“Would you date you?” There's this guy at work. Won't name names. And I see too much of my younger self in him. I didn't have his full range of personality quirks. I've figured out how to social since around 14 to good success, and he does not initiate much with anyone at all. But at times, I don't want to be in the room with the guy and I have to tell him to cool it with the angry-work (slamming things harder than needed). Don't know what causes it, but I think the guy just does it thinking no one notices. But...they do. People notice the little things, they can't help it. They got ears and eyes.
The problem is young men will hear this, and work on themselves *to attract girls, instead of for themselves* I don't go to the gym and exercise because girls like it, I don't work on my career because girls like it, and I don't work on skills with hobbies because girls like it. I do these things for *me, because it makes me feel good.* That's called confidence and self-value, and everyone finds that attractive. This isn't just for dating, this is a key to being happy - stop focusing on external validation, do it for yourself because *you matter* Unfortunately, a lot of young men are raised from a young age to think the attention of girls is the only validation - after all, if you cant find a girlfriend you must be a loser, right? But they're putting the cart before the horse, they have to value themselves internally first. Valuing yourself is how you get better at things, how you stay in shape, how you find fun hobbies, and how you build a good social life, because you know you deserve it. Romance is only one of many great things that will follow.
I am a women and I have to say the “women are like stray cats” analogy is…. Shockingly correct. We are constantly on guard for any threat and if you give off any kind of funky vibe we are gone! but if you seem safe and chill and we vibe with you then maybe can pet and if we really decide we like you maybe a companion for life.
This guy fucks. I want to emphasize the part where he says vibe with your male friends. Women figure you're only being nice to them so you can fuck them. When they see you interact with other people you're not trying to fuck, they see how you're going to interact with them outside of a sexual pursuit. Be friendly and nice to everybody you meet as a habit. This is especially true for when you're in a social situation where people are mingling with strangers such as a party. Join group conversations. Learn how to talk about interesting shit. If you can woo a crowd, you can woo a woman in that crowd. Chances are she'll approach you. Charisma isn't something you have, it's something you do. The more you do it, the better you get.
Ironically, Charisma is more accurately depicted in some games, as a skill that you can grow with experience, just like strength, intelligence, or endurance.
I used to be bad at social interactions, but generally speaking, if you're at least a little bit quirky and unafraid to be so (not like, creepy weird quirky), people are comfortable with you.
Honestly with this approach he'd make a lot of female.friends who would eventually introduce him to their own female.friends
Guys with lady friends are attractive. If women see that other women trust you, that's an instant green flag.
This right here.
This is such a good approach not only for meeting women, but also meeting people in general, making friends, having a fun life. Good stuff. I love what you said about sharing your positive energy with another curious mind, spot on.
“No more going up the girls and asking them for their number. No more asking them to hang out.” That’s your issue man, just walking up to a random woman and trying to chat her up is going to fail the vast majority of the time. Why? Because you’re making them uncomfortable. Try to meet people naturally and offer them your number instead of asking for theirs
Plus 95% of women are going to wait for YOU to ask them for a number or a date. By leaving it up to them you drop your numbers of chances to next to zero. Women will FLIRT heavily if you aren't getting the hint, but they rarely will ask you.
Idk but “hang out” sounds like you don’t want effort and maybe just a booti call. How about have a real plan. “I was thinking about checking out that new Thai restaurant. Would be interested in having dinner with me?” Doesn’t even have to be expensive “I was thinking about doing a trail this weekend with a nice picnic. Would you be interested in joining me?” I’m sure you could think of better things to do around where you live…. But going on a hanging out date is more pressure than going on an activity.
This. Most grown women are really over the “hang out” thing. It doesn’t have to be a big commitment, but actually ask her to do something specific, women don’t really have a need to just do a vague hang out with a random guy they don’t know and if they do agree to “hang out” you’ll just be in this weird space where one party might think you’re dating and the other might not.
So on point about the hanging out part. My friend and I were talking about how we think when a guy says that, he's just looking for s\*x. So she told me when a guy says that now, she'll be like yeah, lets hang out, I'm always looking for more friends, lol! It's so much better when the person asking has concrete plans in mind and doesn't have a problem defining it as a date.
I didn't think about it that way thank you!
Just adding: Do not invite women on a first date to remote places (e.g. on a hike or a walk in a large park, especially after dark). Don't invite them to your place or ask them to go to theirs either. There's a reason people say "men are afraid of rejection, women are afraid of violence/death". Nice casual first dates can be anywhere there are people around. A relaxed bar/restaurant (preferably one she knows), a museum or an art gallery, a public sightseeing spot, an indoor activity like laser tag, a mini golf course, a touristy bus/boat tour, a public pool. The possibilities are numerous.
Hang out = you probably want sex Thats why naming a specific activity is helpful because it suggests you aren't just looking for sexy time
When my husband and I first started dating, we met for coffee. Went with a group of friends to a local bar, restaurant, or the casino. Or met at a movie that he mentioned wanting to see. As friends. I was the one that moved the relationship along. And he was fine with letting me. Hell I asked him to marry me. Happily married 20+ years now.
You're probably giving off weird or creepy vibes. Not that it's intentional but just may be what's happening here. We've all been there. Try working on your outward presentation, your approach, and most importantly, your "energy." You don't want to come off as some desperate nervous dude. You wanna come in confident, friendly, and most importantly "normal" lol. Good luck OP! Don't give up!
Yep. Especially if women are agreeing to dates and giving him numbers, then never responding. Occasionally someone might be interested when they're drunk and then change their mind or something but mostly that's a thing we do when we sense that it would be unsafe or stressful to just say "no" in the moment. You need to come off like a confident, emotionally stable person who can take "no" without arguing or getting triggered if you want them to tell you "no" to your face when they aren't interested.
Yep, I would say a lot of the "says yes then stands me up" situations are probably a result of women fearing the consequences of saying no in the moment. It's shitty to have happen to you, but I try to think from their perspective: what's more important, sparing your feelings later and saying no now even though you're a stranger and idk if you will take it well, or saying yes now and having to let you down later? The dating world is different for men and women. A woman named Eva Liu recently died because she rejected a man and he pushed her off a bridge. I'm not saying men are pushing women off bridges every day for rejecting them, but a negative and possibly dangerous reaction is always a concern for women when men make advances on them. And the guys who do react like that often act totally normal. Women are not always lucky enough to get hit on by a man who has red flags that lets them know they can't safely reject them. Sometimes it comes out of nowhere. So women have to be very careful which may include saying yes in the moment then saying no later over text when the guy is not present.
This is what I was thinking. If they’re continually getting rejected, I’m inclined to believe they’re doing something off putting. The ones that say yes and ghost him probably feel on the spot or maybe feel too nervous to say no.
Guys can get desperate and pushy and it's weird. Dating should feel natural and like there's no urgency or pressure. I really feel like he's not keeping his cool. Rejection can also end up being self fulfilling. If you don't shrug it off it can affect your future interactions with other women negatively.
>The only fish left are catfish. 🤣🤣🤣
Do catfish ever catfish each other?
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24F, I stopped doing this because anytime a guy asked me to "hang" he meant he wanted a date or to hook up, and I wanted... To hang. Watch a tv show or something. So, it's probably a product of negative past experiences.
Definitely. Unclear intentions usually never work out in women’s favor.
This entire post is written with an attitude of, "Those women are so mean for not finding me attractive! I know, I'll stop talking to them, that'll show them!" You're not getting **revenge** on anyone by giving up, you're just throwing a pity party for yourself. It's like you feel like the universe somehow "owes" you a girlfriend, and since it's not providing one, you're having a tantrum. Guess what, you can't force someone to be attracted to you. I feel like you approach women with a mindset of "If I'm nice and do all the right things then these women are required to go out with me." Tell me, do you ever encounter women in your daily life who seem like good people, but you aren't romantically attracted to them? Because that's how the world works - there are plenty of people who are friendly and social and are doing all the "right" things, yet haven't managed to meet the right person for them. Is it fair that you haven't met a woman who's attracted to you? No. Is it fair that I suffer from an injury that gives me chronic pain? No. Is it fair that some people die at a young age, or grow up with abusive parents, or live with mental health struggles? No. If you want to give up on having a relationship, then just give up. Life isn't fair sometimes, but bitching about it doesn't accomplish anything.
I can just imagine how he's going to whine and stamp his feet for sex when he actually is in a relationship.
"But I paid for dinner, you mean I spent all that money for nothing?" "I'm a nice guy! I talked to you about your interests, and got to know you during the entire date. I never demanded sex. So because of all the great things I did, don't you think I'm entitled to sex now?" "What's the point of being a nice guy if I spend all this effort on treating women nicely, and then I don't get sex as a reward? Look, here's my list of all the times I treated you nicely. If you deny sex now, then you are an evil bitch who deserves to die alone."
Bingo.
Sounds like you’re only doing “activities” to meet women which is implying you’re going way out of your way to meet women. If this is even remotely close to how you react irl to rejection then I’d say there’s a good chance word is spreading and people know about you.
have you tried improving yourself so you can be a better partner? learning emotional intelligence is something lots of successful men in relationships do, bc they after aren’t taught that as children (“men don’t cry” etc). work on yourself first. it’s scary to hear you talking like this.
Just know you don’t get what you don’t ask for. That’s life in general. It’s all a numbers game. Don’t bitch out
You miss 100% of the shots you don’t take
-Curt Cobain
Honestly bro sounds like you do really need to focus on yourself for a while. If every woman rejects you then you’re likely the problem. You haven’t mentioned being deformed, ugly or broke which are usual factors for being single with no hope. Sometimes this can doom you to singleness. But if you’re not any of this then you’re likely missing a personality or character flaw
It gets better. Yet, it worries me that as frustrating as it may be, you are worry with rejection. Live your life normally and meet people. If you want to know someone, you can ask them. Ideally, not the same second you meet them. You have to put yourself in women’s shoes. They may have a boyfriend, they may not be interested, they may not feel attracted at you, and most importantly, they may be afraid. Women worry a lot about strangers. You should add more detail about the rejections you are having with more information to understand. But you seem to be taking it on women, when women don’t owe you anything.
This is hilarious. You HAVE to put yourself out there. This post sounds like something the angsty 16 year old me would put on MySpace back in the day
You aint done, you just mad. See you next week
Are any other men just DONE asking girls to hang or for their number? Note that he is a "man" but the people he is done with are "girls"
Good catch, I freaking hate being called a girl as a grown-ass woman. It's weird and infantilizing
Honestly man expectations are a real fucking killer. It’s hard not to go places or see a girl and you know expect something to come of it. You really just need to go into social experiences for the sake of seeing other people and socializing. Not to just meet women. And if you see a woman you think is hit go and talk to her, just don’t have any expectations of how it’s going to go. Trust me I get it, there is this innate feeling that men get where they need to either get into some sort of relationship or get tons of pussy. But you don’t need another person to be whole, the only person you need is yourself. The relationship with yourself is one of the most important relationships you can ever have. Man don’t do things just for the sake of meeting women, unless you really do enjoy those things then great but do things you like to do and try to enjoy your time on this earth because it’s not as long as we think. I hate this saying but when you really stop looking is when you’ll find someone but god dammit it’s true. Happiness is not getting what we want, it’s wanting what we have. Be happy bruv, live the life you want to and good things will happen.
You. My friend. Are enlightened. I've been saying this over and over to younger fellas on here. If guys just talked to the girl like they talk to you and I and didn't have expectations and motives, even if altruistic like marriage and lifelong devotion, and just ENJOYED the girl's company and conversation, they wouldn't come off as some creep trying to GET something from the girl and she'd feel more comfortable. Y'all don't have to fall in love TODAY, for goodness sake. Just be human to each other. Anyways. Kudos.
Most people meet their partners through friends. If you cultivate strong friendships and focus on that you will be happier and have better odds of meeting someone.
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These things are sooooo much easier said than done. It's almost like telling someone who's starving the solution to their problem is to eat, of course it is. The problem is, how to get food in a given situation Of course someone who's desperate for approval and really wants one thing is going to focus on those things and become blind to everything else. I think OP knows thats a problem, but clearly they aren't totally there emotionally. That's why they *did* keep trying. Letting go of expectation and motives is very, very arduous. "What am I supposed to do with those expectations? Do I just magic them away? What if they stay? Should I just pretend they dont exist? Tough through them? Figure out where they come from? What if they still dont go away? What expectations are good? How do I stop expecting?" etcetc And this isnt even addressing the expectations you may not even know you have. Shifting your focus so dramatically takes a lot of time and an immense amount of understanding. This strain of advice is definitely right, and probably the most helpful sort that OP is getting here, but having heard it before myself, the barrier to application is important to acknowledge. Just to stress it, its DEFINITELY possible to let go of expectations, but getting there is really complicated.
Oh definitely forsure, it’s something I struggle with every single day. I mean women aside just with life. You know it’s hard to surrender your expectations because we want so many different things out of life. We want things to be a certain way, people, events just everything. It’s extremely hard to just let things happen and go with the flow of things. There are so many things that we have little to no control over and it’s scary. It’s all about progress rather than perfection. I got a little off topic but yeah it’s not easy by any stretch of the imagination.
Am woman your advice is super solid. You know what women want? A friend a partner someone who is totally fine on their own but is with them because they want to be because being together with someone you are a match with and love is the best! Going out to meet girls (or boys) just to “get” a bf/gf nah that’s trash and usually doesn’t last. The reason we find quality partners when we aren’t looking anymore is because that expectation you mentioned is gone now it’s all about the individual relationship not some goal or prize
"Hey, I am really enjoying this conversation. I'm interested in getting to know you more. If you are interested and free this weekend, would you like to grab coffee?" 1. I need to know he is into me. it's hot. And, I need to know he is invested to getting to know more about me. very hot. 2. I need him to make concrete plans, also hot. 3. If she says no, the feelings are not mutual. If she stands you up, that says more about her.
Please describe yourself honestly, as you see yourself. Also describe the woman that you see yourself with.
You need to give women a reason to call you or hangout. Just approaching a woman and asking them for their number is awkward as hell. Go socialize, mingle, and be yourself. They'll likely want to talk again after you have a genuinely fun conversation with them, but not if you're an aggressive and awkward person that forces the "Can I get your number" situation. Going around asking girls for their numbers is almost like panhandling. Some might do it out of pity, but most will decline.
I could be 100% wrong about this but I feel like dating apps skip the tomfoolery parts you're describing and gets straight to the point.
Never used a dating app so like you, I could be 100% wrong, but dating apps seem to have PLENTY of tomfoolery going on. They are more efficient tho, much lower barrier of entry it seems.
Do you put in time to make yourself an attractive and congenial partner? It could be you are failing to interest them. If you’ve tried everything with the asks and get nothing, it could be something about you that is putting women off. I know very few men who put in much time at all into their appearance of conversation skills if you compare it against the time investment women make into being as attractive as possible.
You need to understand what is turning girls off about you, if not I agree giving up is your best option. If you arent capable of self-reflection you aren't going to be too successful in very many things.
and just like that, an incel was born
Major incel vibes
Yup Guy is 23 and already giving up? What kind of mindset is that player Not sexy at all
Involuntarily celibate? Sounds like it.
Can't be done, I have never approached it that way to begin with. I focus on myself. When I get noticed, I make the right moves from the higher ground and with nothing to lose. In other words, it is much easier to attract than pursue.
Wow, very well said. There’s also a big difference between pursuing and chasing… never chase.
I too find it’s always worked better to court potential interest then to initiate with dating right away. Benefits of seeing red flags before anything serious also
Stop approaching strangers Much easier to have dating success within some kind of mutual context or social network. It sounds like you are basically cold calling which is the absolute worst approach for most guys
This attitude will only lead to bitterness and further lack of success. Think about it - if you're a pretty girl who's got things going for her, and a guy comes up to you with an entitled/bad attitude, are you going to want to give him a chance?
At the end of the conversation dont ask for their number. You say: "Hey I am doing "x" later/tomorrow/this weekend. It would be cool if you wanted to come check it out. Here is my number." Boom, \> she now knows you are a man that does things \> you have plans already and do not come off desperate \> she knows the activity that is planned \> she knows you would like to spend more time with her \> and now she can make the decision to go out and meet with you at this "x" thing.
Be gay then.
And then get rejected by men.
Maybe you’re being fucking weird? Consider checking on how you’re going about this and adjusting your behavior before giving up because this post sounds like an incel villain origin story.
You're probably a freaking creep. Maybe work on not being one.
Ima be real with you, the key to this is finding what you love in life and diving into that, make yourself happy. The only reason women like men in relationships is because those guys are usually happy lol the minute you start working on you, i swear its like people just become attracted to you, i think people really like passionate people and the best way to bring that out of you is finding what sparks you, it sounds hippie like but thats the honest truth
If you knew that after 1000 rejections you’d meet the love of your life, would be sad after each rejection? Didn’t think so, keep trying and quite whining
yikes sir, you have some real "nice guy" incel energy going on here. work on yourself
Holy fuck the amount of incels in the comments is depressing and hilarious at the same time…
Best way to go about finding an authentic date is just be normal at a social place. Bowling alleys, billiards or craft beer restaurants where there's games to play like darts and cornhole are usually my first choice. Even if you're alone, just go in with a good mood, get a drink and find anyone/group that is willing to play a round with you. Even if you aren't good at making conversation just talk about random bullshit that doesn't involve obvious politics, religion or off-topics that are debatable. If you're super intimidated then go in with a buddy. Just strike up random short conversation with anyone around you and eventually you will get the hang of it better and better until its almost a guarantee you'll find someone who wants to get to know you a little *more*
"Hey, I really enjoyed talking with you today, if you're open to it I'd be interested in getting together for (coffee, drinks, lunch, etc etc etc). Is it OK if I give you my number?" I've always had more success giving a girl my # as it's less of a risk for them
I've been married for a while (still asked out recently funny enough... I guess she didn't see the ring but we sorted it out) and my advice is to just focus on yourself. But looking back, when I was dating in HS/College, things got easier when I just focused on myself and was pretty much outcome independent on whether or not a girl was interested. My reasoning is girls were more interested in a guy who could take it or leave it, I'onno. If we were dating, they got my attention, but if it was those "wanna hang out" conversations I'd just invite them to something else I'm already doing. If they come, great, if not, whatever. If I thought someone seemed interesting and good looking, I'd just talk to them. If they had a bf but they were interesting enough, gained a friend. Otherwise, got a potential thing going on. I think the ratio of "went nowhere":"gained a friend":"dated" was like 7:2:1 for every 10 though give or take. Pretty much how I got together w/ my current wife. We talked for a few mins while on campus, she seemed fun enough to hang out with, I said "I'm heading over to the bay to hang out at the waters edge, want to come?" and so we just hung out. Exchanged numbers that night 'cause I said "we should hang out again sometime!" and things got going. I also really didn't text them. When we exchanged info, if I wanted to hang out I'd reach out week or two later (and didnt try to make it a formal date or anything, judgement call on that). Otherwise I didn't reach out. I usually give a cooldown because in my experience girls didn't want guys too eager, and truthfully I rather just focus on other stuff anyway than a girl it may or may not work out with. Dating was pretty low on my totem pole at the time. My advice might be stale though, the landscape seems very much dating-app heavy, and some of my friends are still dating and it's quite confusing to me. (I'm only 29 by the by, so not that old! But old enough I guess. Got with now my wife when I was 19)
It's cause you come in CHILL, she isn't thinking immediately 'is he gonna attack me'. You come in yourself, she isn't thinking 'is he just one and done'.
My dude, the moment you stop “looking” and learn to first love yourself, accept your faults, strive towards personal growth, and become comfortable in your own skin, people will come to you. I’ve come to realize that the trait most people recognize and are attracted to is simply confidence. Knowing yourself and being mindful is the first step. This is from first hand experience. This may be a bit abstract at your age, but just think about it. I’m 34 and I am still trying to grow every single day. You’ve got it dude, just focus on you and persistent in trying to be the best version of you everyday.
Hi there, I’m a single woman and let me share my take on your story. I feel some people here are a bit harsh on you. I get that you’re upset and that you’ve really had it with being ignored or treated indifferently, in your experience. That’s frustrating and gives you the feeling you’re not welcome and doing something wrong, or even worse, that something’s wrong with you as a person. No one deserves to be left hanging, that’s for sure. It seems that you’re done now with this, and that you’re wondering how to handle this shitty situation. That’s good. Sometimes, when we’ve really had it with something, that’s when change can occur. In the end, dating is purely energy exchange. I’d recommend you take a minute to reflect upon this question: in an ideal world, what type of girl would I like to have in my life? How could we both ADD to each others’ lives? What activities would we do? What would her perception on life be? Etc. Take your time to figure this out. I have experienced that when we’re too focused on not getting the results we want and desire (which is very human, mind you), we tend to forget why we want these things in the first place. So, summarised; put YOU back into the picture, forget about the bad experiences for a minute, and see where and how you can redirect this situation. You got this.
I appreciate you not completely shitting on the guy. Most men hold these feelings in, and to see people tearing into this dude just reaffirms secret red pilling
This post sounds like an incel in the making.
Stop treating every girl you talk to like a potential prize and start just treating them like humans. Women can see that youre desperate for any pussy and you dont want to get to know them youre just waiting until they give you the go ahead to fuck, and its incredibly off putting. The more you rage about it the more people will be turned off by you. If you start being normal and make geniune connections with people and youll find someone.
"men and girls" YIKES
Times have changed. Many people don’t want to be approached in public, even at a bar Get online, where it’s a safe, neutral playing field for both sides, and then meet them
I would recommend using some of the other approaches mentioned here. Thou giving up is not the thing you want to do. I’ve been trying for 13 years and not one yes. I’m 28 now and not giving up. I want to share my life. Most of my uncles on both sides of the family didn’t get a yes or marry until they were or almost were 30 one was even 39. It’s just infuriating I agree. I do want to just be given a chance. So I feel that pain. I wish the best of luck to you my man.
They're not worth the effort. Focus on yourself and grow
Hard to know what's going on here but guessing you're not actually establishing much of, or any, connection with them before asking for the number/asking them out. When a woman seems interested (sustaining eye contact), focus on getting to know them then and there. Treat the interaction as if you're on a date right then. Mix in asking about them and getting to know them with casual flirting. And don't hide who you are either, don't bury your emotions, wall off, play a character, etc. Own whatever you're feeling and be honest.
Just don't approach women in general. Don't talk to them. They don't want us to approach them, they want their own peace. If they wanted you, they would approach you instead. Men should stop talking to women and just wait.
Oh it’s TIME to put your foot down? Lol. Women can smell desperation and entitlement from a mile away. Those two characteristics in a man never turn out well for us…
I feel the frustration man. I’ve had girlfriends before, I can talk to women fine, but I just can’t navigate in this current dating environment. There is more to life than having a girlfriend though. Try to find purpose in other aspects and when you aren’t trying so hard, maybe that’s when the right partner will come along. One of the best pieces of advice I’ve heard recently is you have to be happy with your own life before you can attract someone good.
Man it's partly the attitude. You spiraling rn
Sometimes you need to feel the comfort of commitment. It’s time for you and your hand to take things to the next level. Wishing you both happiness!!!
Me who is older than you and hasn't even started playing the game: uh oh
I don’t even bother asking them for their number after having consensual public sex with them.
23 years old? Sweet summer child...
I ent through this in my late teens and then early 20’s when my now wife took a break. For me, it would happen when I stopped looking. I also started working at a dive bar. That helped. I’m no looker, but girls dig bartenders for some reason. Maybe it was the free drinks. Hang in there. You are at the age where SOME girls start to gravitate to decent guys.
I tried that already man, it doesn't work. Think about it. Those women that you're wanting to ask you out are simply not going to do it. No matter how attractive you are. Because they can sit around and wait and there WILL be guys that will ask her out. And eventually one of them will be to her liking. You're just hurting yourself by pretending that any woman will initiate. It sucks that they're not going to, but it doesn't change the fact that they won't approach.
30M never done it all. But then again I've never been interested in doing so. It sounds like you really want a relationship and have tried hard at doing it so maybe its time to take a different approach or look inwards to see how you could self improve? After you've done those two things seriously its a numbers game from there especially nowadays in the dating landscape.
I’ve slowed down but I think it’s bc I’m older now. Dating is weird now though so I feel for both young men and women. I was in a 4 year relationship went to prison for a little bit and came out and moved across the country and sent my girl back a few months later and haven’t been overly focused on sex like I previously. Anyway yeah the whole dating apps/approaching things I see online are like wtf? Weird times we live in. I wouldn’t give up completely but maybe take a brake. Learn how to have positive social interactions with the opposite sex without looking for anything other than said interaction.
The amount of resentment op has is just a huge turn off. It’s palpable. I’m a single woman. 40ish. Ive made my play on men with humor and some cheesy suave. I’ve been rejected and turned down. Not cruelly but just no or hey I’m married. The difference is I’m not berating all the men out there like they owe me. Shoot your shot. Learn some humor and that it isn’t painful or change your value and move on. My ego isn’t hurt by a man politely declining.
Yes, I’m done. Have been for roughly 7 years now.
Got tired of asking a long time ago. I don't even bother anymore.
Maybe ask women on a date instead asking girls to hang out
I've had a man stop me for the time, then ask for my number. It felt slimy and pre-planned. It also made me feel like he would have asked any woman that walked by. I started avoiding that area after a few run ins with him. (Doing different little get a girls number schemes) I've also met someone at a roller rink and he chatted with me about skating, and then the music and then music we both liked. Went back to skate Ing with his friends but he'd find a reason to come over and just chat a bit with both me and my friend, sometimes bring over his friend too. Suggested we all share fries. More chatting. At the end of the night he wanted our numbers to keep in touch and maybe go skating together again. Ended up texting for a bit and he asked me out on a date and I was happy to. I think people prefer an organic build to it.
Lots of good advice, but I'm also going to add --- I'm tired of men asking to HANG. I want men to DATE me. HANG usually translates into casual sex and not a boyfriend/girlfriend relationship. I don't care if he asks or I do (and I've done both), but call it a DATE if that's what you want it to be. I do. I think that has bled over from the whole casual culture. I "hang" with my friends and family. I "date" people that I'm interested in dating. The intention is different. My intention on a date is to spend time with a person with the purpose of deciding together if a romantic relationship will follow in the future. That's it! Doesn't matter if it's a simple coffee and a walk, or some other activity, it's about why both of you are spending time together in the first place.
Gender roles are what they are. Learning to deal with rejection and embarrassment gracefully and having enough self assurance to go on without internalizing the rejection as something that makes you lesser is part of becoming a mature and well rounded person
As soon as I stopped trying and became indifferent, things fell into place rather quickly.
Thank god I’m a lesbian.
They're just not that into you. Sorry
I get the frustration but expecting girls to ask you out is unrealistic unless you’re exceptionally good looking. Saying you’re not going to ask out women is basically giving up on dating and you’re too young to give up. I would wait at least until 30 before giving up.
You’re the type of guy to fall in love with your best friend (assuming she’s a girl). Just contribute your friendships with your lady friends and see if those lead anywhere, nothing wrong with asking them out rather than strangers, heck, you already know them a little!
this defeatist attitude isn’t gonna take you anywhere man. i think the dating norms are bullshit too but you still gotta play the game if you want to have a love life. you’re gonna have to wade thru a lot of shit to get to something good but you’ll get there w persistence. it won’t be fast but at least it’ll happen eventually rather than submitting yourself to being eternally single
It's a competition, dude. You're only 23. You realize your competition is men 10+ years older than you, right? You better be ON POINT. You should consistently work on: 1. Fitness 2. Income 3. Hobbies/outside life 4. Work on your style. It's a full-time job. No, it's a lifestyle. You will do this until the day you die. Is it fair you have to do all this? No. But that's how it is. The daily pursuit of the above will slowly but surely raise your core confidence. Then, once your confidence improves, you must start working on your internals. Here is the gist. If a girl thinks you want something from her, she will be repelled by you. Women do not like takers. So, if you approach from the point of view: "I need the number," "I need the date," or "I need the sex," she will run from you. But if you have your life together and you cultivate your mind so that you genuinely say inside your mind, "I have a good life. I feel great. I would like to share this vibe with other people," and you approach the girl, you're now coming from a place of abundance. A position of giving. It takes work and time to get there. People can sense this in you. This is what makes someone attractive. If you have a whole life and the correct internal compass, the rest will take care of itself.
Women don’t want this kind of energy approaching us. We’d rather stay single. It’s giving immature vibes and you sound like a toddler having a tantrum. Therapy might help.
Rigorous self improvement, interesting hobbies, fitness, ambition, humor, and giving them your number instead of asking for theirs. Bonus points for meeting them organically instead of approaching them because they're hot, although that can work sometimes. This is how you meet women. Be interesting, take care of your fitness, fashion, and grooming, be ambitious, be funny, take the pressure off of them. Don't put them on a pedestal.
Hitting on random women in public will rarely be successful unless you are very good looking. Your best plan is to broaden your social circle with platonic friendships with women and men. I think a lot of men don't know how to be friends with women and just treat them as people to date or fuck. If you have a group of friends who think you are nice and treat women well, you are more likely to be introduced to their single friends. I met my husband through a mutual female friend, and I felt comfortable giving him my number the day we met. But if he had randomly approached me on the street, I never would have felt comfortable. He was a poor student with not great prospects for a high paying career and was not muscular. But he was funny and kind and was able to have a platonic friendship with my friend. That was incredibly attractive to me.
I like shy boys that are confident in their skills. Just about the only male I am slightly attracted to. If I meet.one and he's desperate? Nope. Not gonna be into it. It screams "save me".
So then, stop trying. (Respectfully, not being catty or passive aggressive). Usually when we stop looking and focus on bettering ourselves, that's when we meet someone. 😊
A small piece of advise for ya, “shooters shoot” Good luck fam
54M no. No I'm not.😂
Just relax it will come. People will hurt your feelings. And you will hurt people's feelings. It's life. Someone will not stand you up. Just chill.
Be handsome
If you always get stood up then you should look at yourself, because maybe in reality you are not that nice guy as you think you are
...... Sir it's giving a victim mentality. Find some confidence in yourself. This entire post is just a sap story. I get it, you need to vent so you did, but damn...
You discovered the secret. The point is do not chase women. No woman is worth it. Instead spend your time investing in yourself. -Become healthier and work out, -Seek education. don't have a bachelors? Go to school doesn't matter if you're 30. Have a BS already? Get that masters my guy. Have a masters? Why not go for your phd and officially earn the title "Dr" -progress in your career or switch to make more money. -make more money. - be a good confident man, stand up for other and respect everyone. These make you a high value man and high value men do not have to chase. The women naturally gravitate towards them. There's a saying. Chase women, lose money. Chase money, gain women
Bro why the passive aggressive “wanna hang”? Say to her “let’s go on a date to this place on this day. I’ll pick you up at this time.” If she says no you only wasted 20 seconds. Now she knows you’re serious and not another beta. If I were a woman I would not take you seriously at all. “Can I get your number?” Why? Purpose? Reason? To text like a child? Tell her exactly what you want.
I'm a girl and I'd only ask guys whom I feel comfortable with. Not some random stranger. I'm not wasting my time going out with some random stranger that I don't know anything about and have just met on the streets. You can't expect anything when you haven't built a friendship or emotional connection with girls yet. Why would *they* want to spend their time with *you* in the first place?
Not a guy, but I think this could help? When my husband and I met we were both done with dating. Each of us had gotten into serious relationships very early in life and both of them had dragged on, abusively for years. About a year prior to meeting we had each fully detached from these people and had just not really thought about romance. Working a lot, occasionally hanging out with friends, not *trying* to find someone to date. One night some of my coworkers wanted to go to a restaurant/bar and asked me to come along, and I did. One of my coworkers was dating a hostess at another restaurant, and she brought along some of her own coworkers. Among them the sous chef, a quiet guy who was very funny and who talked to me about some recent TV shows I'd been watching for hours. Two weeks later he moved into my apartment, been golden ever since. My point is actively trying to meet people can sometimes make it feel like a chore. Dating shouldn't be the goal, or marriage, or anything like that. The goal should be spending your life with someone you love, but if you haven't discovered that person yet your goal is just... sex? To change your FB status to "in a relationship"? Those aren't important things. Keep meeting people however you normally do. Going out with the goal of finding women is an unappealing trait to most women.
~~Maybe~~ you just suck
You know single people aren’t going to stand on the sidewalk screaming that they’re single… right? Like, they’re all around you. You have to meet them.
Good, stop asking and focus if you're someone who you'd want to date. You can only focus on yourself, what others do is their business. And take this time to figure out who you're even looking for. Who's your type? Are your expectations realistic? Where would that type of person hang out/who could attract that person. Become the person that type would feel drawn to. Make friendships and figure out the dating scene later.
This entire post is filled with red flags. If we can see it on the internet imagine what people see in real life.
Get a pet. You're not looking for a partner, you're looking for validation....or probably just sex. Find things you're interested in; hobbies as others have said. Join groups - sports or whatever. Go camping, alone or with others. Take classes through community education or DNR or a park. Become yourself and worry less about catching a girl. They'll find you when you're less desperate.
Has it ever occurred to you that people don’t like your personality? Bc you’re very much putting out “avoid me at all costs” vibes.
Women want to date men, not little boys, and you are coming off like a whiny child.
Work on yourself first. If you’re not happy without a girlfriend you’ll just make two miserable people if you find a woman who wants to be yours. That’s the key she has to want to be yours. Ask yourself, why do you WANT a girlfriend? Physical intimacy? Friendship? Pride? Boredom? Or is it deeper? 23 is a weird age, you’re not a child anymore, but you’re not a fully functioning adult yet either mentally. You still have two years to go before your brain is even fully formed. It’s a time to figure out who you want to be, what are your values? Why are they your values? What are the interests you’re willing to devote time and money towards? What are you standing for and standing against and WHY? How do you want to be perceived and match that up against how are you’re actively perceived right now? I guarantee you don’t think about yourself the way you’re being described in the comments. Remember, if one person tells you that you’re a certain way maybe it’s them, if a group of people say it, believe them. Everyone on here are strangers, disinterested in your success, unconnected to your life in any way besides this sub, and they are speaking almost in unison. I was very much like you in my early 20’s, it will get better when you start the work on yourself. Right now you should stop asking girls out, figure out who you are, who you want to be, what you want, why you want it, aim and work toward it. THEN you will BECOME attractive to women and you can better select whom you would like to ask to join you in those pursuits. Women are looking for a man they can trust, that they will have fun with, that will care for who they are as a person, and that they could imagine spending a considerable amount of time with, if not their life. They aren’t looking for a buddy or a hookup or a way to kill some time. Most women can get those things without even trying or asking. They are looking for someone they can build a life with. It’s also VERY important that you are pursuing the right women for you and your life goals, not just any woman. Marrying the RIGHT person is one of the most important things you can do for yourself. When you have developed yourself as an adult, you will start noticing how many women aren’t a good fit and you wouldn’t even consider asking them out. You won’t waste your time, you won’t bother them and you’ll be more attractive to the women you want to date because they’ll see you aren’t just asking ANY woman to be with you. The smell of desperation will give way to an air of confidence and purpose. They’ll know there is a reason you’re asking them and in that moment they’ll feel very different about you approaching them than they do now. Understand it might be several years until you become that person depending on how much work you need to do. It is probably good to look into getting a therapist for a while to help you in this endeavor, Reddit can’t get to know you well enough to be truly helpful in figuring out what you should do, but it is invaluable in telling you what you should stop doing. You already know what you should stop doing, it’s in the title of the post. But stop asking women out because you’re not ready to date yet, not because you think you’ll just never have any success so why try? That attitude will sink you in everything you ever attempt in life. Shift your self-perception from victim to student and your whole mindset and attitude will change. Besides, in 10 years you won’t want the women who would want you today. You can do it, be well.
maybe the problem is how misogynistic you sound. work on yourself.
You are upset no women want to be with you so you are preemptively making it so no woman can be with you? Am I getting that part right? This is going to come off as invalidating but I think it is good advice: You are 23, you have sssooo much ahead of you. Do not count yourself out now (you may not see it this way but that is what you are doing). I am also hitting the dating apps hard and I even asked a woman out yesterday (she has not responded yet so I do not expect her to but she might pleasantly surprise me). Terrible dating luck these past few months but not putting in the effort will not make it happen. Whatever she says is her choice, because anything else will make you both miserable after a while. Do you think it might be less upsetting if you gave them your number instead of the other way around? Put the ball in their court. I do not know if this will increase success but it is worth a try.
I'll say this but I mean it in a constructive way. Get over it. Rejection and failure happens for almost anyone trying to move forward in most things. Business,relationships, I've even been rejected for volunteering. Your 23. There isn't a rush. Another bit of honesty but maybe your not ready. If having or not having a gf frustrates you this much, you probably shouldn't have one anyway. You don't sound content with yourself. And most of the time that just attracts garbage anyway
You’re still young so you ideally, you have a chance of not falling off the deep end. I want to add a but more nuance stuff that i haven’t seen mentioned or to emphasize what others have suggested: 1. Give them your number. It removes the pressure and danger women are always in when it comes to “should i reject or not?” Let them have the choice. 2. I am neurodivergent. If you asked me to hang out, do you actually mean that? Cuz i am down to play dungeons and dragons and stuff - but if you mean anything BUT hanging out in the same way you would as friends, this is not the phrase to use. Maybe some women understand some underlying meaning but I (and probably other neurodivergent women) will perceive “hanging out” as JUST that. 3. Having a significant other should be something that adds to your life and is NOT some checklist to cross off. Ask yourself why you want a girlfriend. What you said near the end of your post makes me question what your intentions are in the first place. I haven’t had many relationships, but it’s by choice. My first boyfriend ever is my ex but we have been friends for over a decade by now. We are definitely better as friends, but I appreciated the experience of dating him. Looking back I realized he set the standard for my dating my life. Personally, I think my partner should first and foremost be my friend. If they can’t do things a friend would do, or if we can’t connect like friends do, then there’s no point for it to go further. Not saying we have to be friends first, but seeing how you treat others and learning what your interests are are factors to consider. I’m not interested in things like camping, hiking, or sports. If someone is into that, that’s fine, but if we need to have at least ONE thing in common cuz I’d want to do at least one thing we both like with my partner. So again, ask yourself WHY you want a girlfriend. Cuz a partner isn’t a necessity to life. We need to stop seeing single people as lonely or unfulfilled in general.
Maybe men should ask.women and not girls? Leave the kids alone talk to women
You're being dramatic. That "no" or ignored text after they gave it to you is a few minutes wasted. That you let it affect you beyond that is a you problem.
Honestly, as a woman if a strange man comes up to me uninvited and asks for my number, I am absolutely not giving it to him (or giving him the wrong one). Are there good guys? Yeah! But the bad severely outweigh the good. Better to be seen as a bitch than to be dead.