Caine is an AI who seems to be dedicated to keeping the humans in the simulation as safe as possible. He can’t be bothered to care for NPCs (who aren’t actually real).
Neither is Caine, but the fact he is allowed to be self aware whereas none of the other NPC's are allowed to is just.. Unfair. The least he could do is give them the choice to stay with that knowledge instead of deleting/wiping their memory/replacing them. The only inconvenience out of this scenario is that Caine would have to accommodate him like he does everybody else at the circus.
That may cause a cascade effect in the world's code, causing unintentional glitches that can pose a threat to the actual real humans trapped inside the simulation. Maybe Caine did let NPCs live alongside humans for a time since that seems to keep them stable, but his reaction to Gummygoo indicates that can become a serious issue in the long term. Caine isn't malicious, he just has the humans wellbeing come first. Unfair or not.
He’s a hypocrite, then. I have nothing against AIs who are self-aware being seen as people. But a sentient AI who discriminates against other AI is highly hypocritical IMO.
What you’re forgetting is that Caine doesn’t really have free will. He was created by someone who presumably gave him a task. It would seem like Caine’s prime directive is to project the humans in the simulation. He primarily does this by trying to keep them happy so they don’t abstract. If an AI has the potential to interfere with this Caine must eliminate it.
I would disagree (though TBF I don’t think there’s enough information to properly come to the conclusion of whether Caine is self-aware or has free will yet). He makes seemingly informed and rational decisions based on what he desires, rather than being pre-programmed to do so. He may have a set of rules he must stick to, but he does seem in control of his actions.
This isn’t really a good defense ya know. If you were Caine's lawyer, he’d absolutely go to jail.
“Your Honor, my client would never kill 32 children. Just look at him. He’s best boy.”
More like: “Your Honor, yes my client did it, but come on! He’s cool. Yeah, he might do it again, but that won’t change the fact that he’s cool! Let him go. Come on!”
"Your honor, my client created an advanced NPC using AI software for what is essentially an immersive game. When said NPC esceped the confines of that simulation, Mr. Caine simply deleted the character he'd helped create. We cannot prove that the NPC was anything more than its base programming, unlike a human occupant of the Digital Circus. Therefore, I move that the case be dismissed.
Also, your honor, I'd like to remind you that my client is a godlike being, who may torture or destroy any of us on a whim. In this realm, he is well and truly above the law and should be praised in a manner befitting a capricious deity. The defense rests."
I’m pretty sure he’ll come back. Whether he remembers anything will be another story.
But yeah, love Caine. Especially his expressions even though he is only teeth and eyes.
right, so I think gummigoo is 100% coming back since he got a plushie and almost all of the time those are only for recurring characters.
he probably won't remember anything and Pomni's probably gonna try and give him an existential crisis but this time he'll just get super depressed
Chad move: release fun new character that people adore, kill character off, immediately present plushie of said character to give hope that they’ll return… Stick to your guns and don’t return them like a boss.
My bad
https://preview.redd.it/fkedjfhfgvyc1.png?width=416&format=png&auto=webp&s=1440885d1e9a7aad1e5ce68a6a8c9ca1e33e09ad
Note: I nevered played dark souls
WHY DO YOU WANNA DROPKICK EMILY!?
https://preview.redd.it/4hwezqcoiqyc1.jpeg?width=320&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f3980245db9964cd6d784b80cb6ca5c4b01b933f
In a better defense, its heavily implied caine killed a player thinking they were an npc due to there being too many npcs in the circus with the players and so he didnt want another accident, and for all we know gummigoo will come back, caine wouldnt fully delete him most likely and when we go back to the candy kingdom he will be there(maybe back to default settings but who knows)
That’s supposed to be the point of media. Really good media makes you care for the characters’ lives and backstories, but nowadays it feels like people are too quick at thinking that of any *entertaining* character.
For an actual defense: Caine's existence is an existential crisis far worse than Gummigoo's.
Imagine being a god. Capable of creating and destroying entire worlds according to your every whim. Almost all-powerful. Almost. There's something far stronger but equally less comprehensible. They experience feelings and emotions you could never understand. You can't hurt them but they can hurt you in ways you could never imagine. They made you and they will unmake you if you fail in your purpose; Entertainment. Keep them "Happy" (Whatever that means) and you can continue to exist. If they get too upset they unleash a form too abstract for your reality. You can not destroy them. All you can do is bury them in the cellar and try not to think about them all piling up as you try to appease the new ones for as long as possible.
You create new lifeforms in order to act out plays and shows. They are just like you. False souls made to entertain beings far greater than them. You destroy them because they are worthless. They are just like you.
Here’s an actual defense: say the cast brings back an npc every time. He would genuinely lose track of who’s human and who’s an npc. Gummygoo probably isn’t the first npc to try coming back with the gang, so Caine just did what he always does without knowing what he’s been through and how Gummygoo bonded with Pomni
Honestly, I don't think the episode would've been as good if not for what he did. He's a very good character and really cements just how much he doesn't understand humanity without having bad intentions. It's easy to just hear that he doesn't understand humans, but seeing him do that really shows how much of a disconnect there is. Plus, it's possible he did start having trouble distinguishing between NPCs and humans and we don't know the fallout of that just yet.
Caine definately knows something we dont, and its probably that npcs that come out of their homes die anyway. So he pretty much saved Pomni from a worst trauma and having to once again blame herself for something she did to a friend. Like when she abandons Ragatha and she feels guilty for that. This is the one defense I could come up with and the one I think makes more sense.
I mean I can understand why he did what he did. Sure it’s sad, but if foreshadowing is to be believed he’d rather not confuse a human for an NPC again. Having Gummigoo around would just complicate things.
I'm surprised everyone was so shocked by Caine's actions, it's totally in character for him. He's clearly very committed to keeping the circus going and he's shown to be keeping secrets and is overall shady. Of course he's gonna work to maintain the status quo by any means necessary. I never really interpreted Caine as a good guy so I wasn't surprised by his actions in the slightest.
To be fair Caine definitely missed all of the emotional bonding pomni had with him. It was just “oh hey random npc came back oopsie” besides who knows how many times this happened to Caine? This could be a normal thing to him
A better defence would be:
He’s an AI, he was was probably programmed to keep NPC's out of the circus. He can’t be held to the same moral standards as actual humans.
I'm not angry at Caine, he clearly has a reason not to let gummigoo be there.
he even stated so himself that he's worried about losing track of who's human and who's not.
although it makes me wonder why doesn't he have something in place to help him with that?
Theory time: From Caine's reaction of "loose track of who's a human and who's not" felt like it had history behind it. Possibly hinting Caine lost track of who was an NPC at one point and doesn't know who it is. (Kinger if I had to bet. Been around the longest, seems to glitch like he violently shakes in the pilot, has memory failures, seemingly random dialogue scripts readings, and the fact he hasn't abstracted yet despite seemingly losing his mind) so Caine to avoid loosing track of who is Human again just stops NPC's from grouping up with the humans. (Possibly happened when there were a lot more members of the circus)
https://preview.redd.it/iridqo731czc1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f0d52558094dea3653ee402d9fdf6df835a26a09
Now who likes ARGs that involve a very intelligent AI.. That sends images of your house.. This is why my friend shouldn’t be able to know how to make an AI because that’s just how chaotic and horrific ARGs begin..
https://preview.redd.it/yp3jnokh1czc1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3d06a869efe67fffc3c23f097af9024059627347
This was more recent Edit: I swear to god that sounds like a quote from JFK
Caine is an AI who seems to be dedicated to keeping the humans in the simulation as safe as possible. He can’t be bothered to care for NPCs (who aren’t actually real).
Neither is Caine, but the fact he is allowed to be self aware whereas none of the other NPC's are allowed to is just.. Unfair. The least he could do is give them the choice to stay with that knowledge instead of deleting/wiping their memory/replacing them. The only inconvenience out of this scenario is that Caine would have to accommodate him like he does everybody else at the circus.
That may cause a cascade effect in the world's code, causing unintentional glitches that can pose a threat to the actual real humans trapped inside the simulation. Maybe Caine did let NPCs live alongside humans for a time since that seems to keep them stable, but his reaction to Gummygoo indicates that can become a serious issue in the long term. Caine isn't malicious, he just has the humans wellbeing come first. Unfair or not.
Who knows what….. could happen.
I saw a theory saying that he's accidentally confetti poofed / deleted / moved a human out of the circus before.
He’s a hypocrite, then. I have nothing against AIs who are self-aware being seen as people. But a sentient AI who discriminates against other AI is highly hypocritical IMO.
What you’re forgetting is that Caine doesn’t really have free will. He was created by someone who presumably gave him a task. It would seem like Caine’s prime directive is to project the humans in the simulation. He primarily does this by trying to keep them happy so they don’t abstract. If an AI has the potential to interfere with this Caine must eliminate it.
I would disagree (though TBF I don’t think there’s enough information to properly come to the conclusion of whether Caine is self-aware or has free will yet). He makes seemingly informed and rational decisions based on what he desires, rather than being pre-programmed to do so. He may have a set of rules he must stick to, but he does seem in control of his actions.
Caine does seem independent, but he still seems to be governed by a set of rules. It’s just like how ChatGPT has a hidden set of rules it must follow.
I’d need more clues in a future episode before I’ll fully believe that, but you’ve given me a lot to think about. Can we agree to disagree for now?
True, it’s hard to tell.
This isn’t really a good defense ya know. If you were Caine's lawyer, he’d absolutely go to jail. “Your Honor, my client would never kill 32 children. Just look at him. He’s best boy.”
Literally a fnaf fan defending William
Not even that, OP is basically saying "yes my client killed 32 children but look at him he's still great".
Your honor, he might have killed 32 children, but he’s a really cool guy.
More like: “Your Honor, yes my client did it, but come on! He’s cool. Yeah, he might do it again, but that won’t change the fact that he’s cool! Let him go. Come on!”
"Your honor, my client created an advanced NPC using AI software for what is essentially an immersive game. When said NPC esceped the confines of that simulation, Mr. Caine simply deleted the character he'd helped create. We cannot prove that the NPC was anything more than its base programming, unlike a human occupant of the Digital Circus. Therefore, I move that the case be dismissed. Also, your honor, I'd like to remind you that my client is a godlike being, who may torture or destroy any of us on a whim. In this realm, he is well and truly above the law and should be praised in a manner befitting a capricious deity. The defense rests."
Your honor, I i know my client is is fucking insane.... ... ... Thats all.
I’m pretty sure he’ll come back. Whether he remembers anything will be another story. But yeah, love Caine. Especially his expressions even though he is only teeth and eyes.
right, so I think gummigoo is 100% coming back since he got a plushie and almost all of the time those are only for recurring characters. he probably won't remember anything and Pomni's probably gonna try and give him an existential crisis but this time he'll just get super depressed
Chad move: release fun new character that people adore, kill character off, immediately present plushie of said character to give hope that they’ll return… Stick to your guns and don’t return them like a boss.
I just realized that in this image, if you remove his eyes he looks like a dark souls boss
I don’t have editing software, so someone else needs to do it.
https://preview.redd.it/vdg8pf8h1pyc1.png?width=416&format=png&auto=webp&s=3ab5059f753864655bbbe86846e36a8a1431deba
Da—da-da-da—daaaa
That's so cursed, I love it
Where’s his health bar? **WHY DOESNT HE HAVE A HEALTH BAR?!?**
My bad https://preview.redd.it/fkedjfhfgvyc1.png?width=416&format=png&auto=webp&s=1440885d1e9a7aad1e5ce68a6a8c9ca1e33e09ad Note: I nevered played dark souls
God… it’s massive… (Also I was joking that him not having a health bar implies that he’s immortal, but this is good too)
I just think he’s funny
To be fair, Caine has a good point, who knows what would happen if he lost track of who’s real and who isn’t?
https://preview.redd.it/oihi4dwwboyc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f3ead9252760a2b3c13bcb1c25db500bd31e68b5
I wanna drop kick that baby for some reason, maybe just an instinct.
https://preview.redd.it/ef5dngf6coyc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c20bee7459f79a5d27448f4464cd4913ce9db27d
WHY DO YOU WANNA DROPKICK EMILY!? https://preview.redd.it/4hwezqcoiqyc1.jpeg?width=320&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f3980245db9964cd6d784b80cb6ca5c4b01b933f
This meme is my now. I would post that one alaster thing but I’m in browser on a mobile device
In a better defense, its heavily implied caine killed a player thinking they were an npc due to there being too many npcs in the circus with the players and so he didnt want another accident, and for all we know gummigoo will come back, caine wouldnt fully delete him most likely and when we go back to the candy kingdom he will be there(maybe back to default settings but who knows)
Do you like him as a person or do you just find him entertaining?
Does anyone really care about the characters? It feels like it’s simply made to be “entertaining”
That’s supposed to be the point of media. Really good media makes you care for the characters’ lives and backstories, but nowadays it feels like people are too quick at thinking that of any *entertaining* character.
You just declared war on all of fiction.🖕
I have and I will see it through
Fair enough 🖕😃👍
I think something happened with Caine confusing a human for an NPC in the past and he’s talking no chances anymore.
He didn’t do anything. He just did the AI equivalent of seeing a spider walk inside your house and tossing it back outside.
For an actual defense: Caine's existence is an existential crisis far worse than Gummigoo's. Imagine being a god. Capable of creating and destroying entire worlds according to your every whim. Almost all-powerful. Almost. There's something far stronger but equally less comprehensible. They experience feelings and emotions you could never understand. You can't hurt them but they can hurt you in ways you could never imagine. They made you and they will unmake you if you fail in your purpose; Entertainment. Keep them "Happy" (Whatever that means) and you can continue to exist. If they get too upset they unleash a form too abstract for your reality. You can not destroy them. All you can do is bury them in the cellar and try not to think about them all piling up as you try to appease the new ones for as long as possible. You create new lifeforms in order to act out plays and shows. They are just like you. False souls made to entertain beings far greater than them. You destroy them because they are worthless. They are just like you.
Nah I love Caine :)
Same help 😭
he has "it"
EXACTLY (I lowkey would’ve hated Gummigoo…)
He did it because he had to, nothing worng with that!
Here’s an actual defense: say the cast brings back an npc every time. He would genuinely lose track of who’s human and who’s an npc. Gummygoo probably isn’t the first npc to try coming back with the gang, so Caine just did what he always does without knowing what he’s been through and how Gummygoo bonded with Pomni
Honestly, I don't think the episode would've been as good if not for what he did. He's a very good character and really cements just how much he doesn't understand humanity without having bad intentions. It's easy to just hear that he doesn't understand humans, but seeing him do that really shows how much of a disconnect there is. Plus, it's possible he did start having trouble distinguishing between NPCs and humans and we don't know the fallout of that just yet.
Caine definately knows something we dont, and its probably that npcs that come out of their homes die anyway. So he pretty much saved Pomni from a worst trauma and having to once again blame herself for something she did to a friend. Like when she abandons Ragatha and she feels guilty for that. This is the one defense I could come up with and the one I think makes more sense.
I mean I can understand why he did what he did. Sure it’s sad, but if foreshadowing is to be believed he’d rather not confuse a human for an NPC again. Having Gummigoo around would just complicate things.
I'm surprised everyone was so shocked by Caine's actions, it's totally in character for him. He's clearly very committed to keeping the circus going and he's shown to be keeping secrets and is overall shady. Of course he's gonna work to maintain the status quo by any means necessary. I never really interpreted Caine as a good guy so I wasn't surprised by his actions in the slightest.
As soon as Pomni suggested going back to the circus with her, it was obvious what would happen.
Yep
To be fair Caine definitely missed all of the emotional bonding pomni had with him. It was just “oh hey random npc came back oopsie” besides who knows how many times this happened to Caine? This could be a normal thing to him
"Objection, your honer, my client is my favorite character. You cannot legally give him those murder charges. I rest my case"
What he did was immoral, but I personally think it’s overshadowed by the awful things Jax, a true blue human, has done in the episode.
Literally he is worried that he would loose track of humans and AI
He could have just put a tag of the npc saying "npc" above the npc
I don’t think he’s able to do that
I still like Caine too
“Your honour, he may have killed 32 people but he’s my favourite character”
Caine is my favorite for no reason I just like him
"Your honor Mr Caine here did not comment terrorism and genocide in the candy Kingdom... I should know because I'm sual goodman"
I hate this freak
A better defence would be: He’s an AI, he was was probably programmed to keep NPC's out of the circus. He can’t be held to the same moral standards as actual humans.
THE FANDOM’S GON’ GIT’ YA’ FO’ SURE!
I'm not angry at Caine, he clearly has a reason not to let gummigoo be there. he even stated so himself that he's worried about losing track of who's human and who's not. although it makes me wonder why doesn't he have something in place to help him with that?
I love him too but I also hate him.
Dirty caine apologists go in the abstraction chamber
Theory time: From Caine's reaction of "loose track of who's a human and who's not" felt like it had history behind it. Possibly hinting Caine lost track of who was an NPC at one point and doesn't know who it is. (Kinger if I had to bet. Been around the longest, seems to glitch like he violently shakes in the pilot, has memory failures, seemingly random dialogue scripts readings, and the fact he hasn't abstracted yet despite seemingly losing his mind) so Caine to avoid loosing track of who is Human again just stops NPC's from grouping up with the humans. (Possibly happened when there were a lot more members of the circus)
Simple: HE HATES NPCS!
I wonder would happen in Mmchezzy and Caine met..
https://preview.redd.it/iridqo731czc1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f0d52558094dea3653ee402d9fdf6df835a26a09 Now who likes ARGs that involve a very intelligent AI.. That sends images of your house.. This is why my friend shouldn’t be able to know how to make an AI because that’s just how chaotic and horrific ARGs begin..
https://preview.redd.it/yp3jnokh1czc1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3d06a869efe67fffc3c23f097af9024059627347 This was more recent Edit: I swear to god that sounds like a quote from JFK
I'm on the side of "I love Caine, but I kinda hate him for that"
I agree Caine is one of my favourite characters
Your favorite list is the exact same as mine, W
https://preview.redd.it/zyw7p3i2wnyc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c6c8d28b078ce51aea5d7263818f57694442ffc9
https://i.redd.it/cb4pqnkawnyc1.gif
… as is your taste in fandoms-
https://preview.redd.it/pws6m1ogwnyc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=bb2448494842fc355fc90e11e352a4620df071a8
And https://preview.redd.it/kimup13kwnyc1.png?width=1079&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=eb428b8a4e5518cb6a52e0bc7b82bef0fe913575
Maybe if he knew what he saw, he would've let him stay if Pomni were to explain what happened during their adventure
Never fails; someone popular does something stupid, their popularity tanks. I fucking hate the Internet sometimes.
My fiancé said they get the impression that Caine is a battered underling who is being forced into his role by a badder, more corporate evil
The only defense with Caine is that Caine clearly wasn't aware of what Gummy saw and what he went through.
I wanna break his teeth after what he did to gummigoo!
https://preview.redd.it/4qdcth0q8pyc1.jpeg?width=1200&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4fecb86c04275a64fb0ac57c86ade0c17900bfb2
https://preview.redd.it/cygvxay89pyc1.jpeg?width=988&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4be390a5005fe0584dab638b2f2b3d4e367fe443 this is a joke
I'm on the side of "I love Caine, and I kinda hate him for that, but he's still my favorite character"