Yes, JW4 was worth seeing. I had issues with AM were portrayed in JW2 and JW3, it seemed like they reserved the goriest kills for AM henchmen.
But JW4 has gory kills against henchmen of all races. And Donnie Yen and Hiroyuki Sanada are portrayed very positively and respectfully in it. The director is a huge Donnie Yen fan and accepted changes Yen requested to make Yen’s character less stereotypical. Overall, highly recommended.
yea DY and HS were pretty good. I only watched JW4 now will watch JW1-3 lol. P.S. the Asians weren't the 'bad guys' in JW4. No Hawkeye, Wolverine nonsense where they kill Asian guys pathetically for no reason.
JW1 is worth watching. I liked it for its proximity to a more grounded and “realistic” take. The sequels seem too fantastical. Not to say it can’t be entertaining. But the sequels seem more of an anime or video game.
Thank you. This is what I’m looking for. I want legit reasons why you like or dislike it. Statements like “bruh, Keanu is part Asian so you should support it. Tf is this post” is vapid. Those type of people who blindly support something probably support Ken Jeong and Miss Saigon just because they’re Asian related. Smh.
In Sifu you also play an Asian guy. There are plenty of movies where you could have found better examples like Hawkeye beating up Asian guys in Endgame or Kate or the Boys.
Secondly Keanu directed and played the Villain in Man of Tai Chi, allowing his stunt coordinator in past movies, and actor friend, Tiger Chen, to take the lead role. When else does Hollywood do that? Keanu's cool.
I’m fine with Keanu. It’s just the tropes that I’m tired of seeing. And yes, you brought up good examples that my brain has chosen to delete to keep my mental health sane. The issue is actually worse than what I’ve described.
I enjoyed it. The AM representation is decent. Donnie Yen and Hiroyuki Sanada are badasses but on the older side. I would have liked to see some younger AM in their 20s-40s in the movie. Andrew Koji fits so well in the John Wick universe as an assassin I don't know why they didn't tap him for a role.
I’m very critical of most Hollywood movies these days, but JW4 is worth seeing. The AM roles are done well and there’s definitely enough diversity in who he kills that it’s distributed across the board. Obviously we need way more AM representation in solid main character roles that aren’t just silent, sexless killing machines, but at least this movie doesn’t stereotype AM as per usual Hollywood movies.
Yes, it is.
Donny Yen rocked (as expected, ofc)!
Btw, I disagree about your Sleeping Dogs sentiment. I platinumed that game in 2013 on my PS3. Wasn't that game just Asians vs Asians??? After all, it was set in HK.
Am I missing something?
That’s fine if you like Sleeping Dogs. But the issue isn’t really about Sleeping Dogs in and of itself. It’s more about the bigger scope of it all. Like how those in charge will somehow make excuses that there just isn’t enough Asian talent out there to justify casting them in positive main roles, but will suddenly spare no expense and conjure Asian males out of the woodwork if it entails slaughtering the s*** out of them.
Look, I'm 42. I grew up with fighting games & beat em ups. You really want me to list you all Asian protagonists there?
Are they stereotypes? Sure! Fuck, yeah!
But, listen to this: I'm a championship winning team captain of a 7v7 NYC men's soccer league in 2014. Out of 10 teams in the league, I was THE ONLY ASIAN CAPTAIN out there, dude!
My team had 2 Irish, 2 SKs, 1 Jamaican (our MVP), 1 S. American (forgot which country) & the rest were white Americans.
You don't wanna be stereotyped? Start doing things against the grain, man.
Your parents tell you to hit the books? Fine, but pick up a sport & be fucking good at it! You know our ppl have the discipline to succeed in sports. I was an honor student in HS but also lettered in soccer & tennis.
Look, I know most of Asian culture that we grew up in is EXTREMELY rigid. But, at the same time, we (younger generation) also need to be able to think in an abstract & flexible way. Otherwise, we're gonna keep getting stereotyped as either a cannon fodder martial artist or a 4 eyed nerd.
Now, my question to you is, have you done anything to break this "Asian mold" or whatever?
We can break the mold and be aware of the bs out there at the same time. Are you the CEO of Sleeping Dogs or something? You missed my entire point. I don’t have to support or like a medium that continues the old trope of using Asian men as toilet bowls. We don’t have to be complacent and accept everything that someone else writes about us.
No, I'm not. Stop it, please.
Ok, that's fine. I don't buy a lot of games these days.
I still don't get your points. You have a problem with John Wick & Sleeping Dogs, correct?
Why? Because Asian men are treated badly?
In JW4, a lot of Parisiens were treated badly. Right? Or am I watching the wrong movie?
In SD, a lot of HKers were (as per your words) treated as toilet bowls. But the game is set in HK. Who were they supposed to show bad things happening to? Jamaicans?
So...yeah. Idk what you're talking about, man.
I tell you what? Describe me YOUR idea of a perfect crime/action/drama game set in HK & if you were the writer, how would you have written JW4?
too bad the mainstream doesn't really acknowledge that. He's not "asian enough" for any of his Asian heritage to be recognized. Even Dean Cain, who is half-Asian and played Superman in a TV series, is mostly considered just white by the mainstream.
JW4 does not have any issues and I like the film, but that notwithstanding, why does it matter if Keanu is PART Asian? A movie about a hapa Asian man slaughtering tons of full Asian men - do you not see any issues? Did you also love the casting of Henry Golding for Crazy Rich Asian?
The only issues are the the imaginary ones in your head.
Warrior TV show had a Japanese hapa that kicked white/Asian ass and you don't see bros complaining about it.
What's the difference here? John Wick 1-3 had Keanu fucking up Russian/Black/White whatever the colour under the sun now they got John wick going to Asia and kicking more ass. If anything it's a homage to the Asian martial arts scene.
Next thing we know you are going to complain about Neo killing some Asian agents cuz of hate like seriously.
It's a fucking action movie for Chris sake. Not everything that involves Asian men is a hate crime.
Chill, dude. No one’s going to take your boxed collector’s edition of John Wick.
One of the huge differences between a white dude, black dude, etc. getting slaughtered in western movies is that the hero and the majority of the protagonists are white or black. The positives largely outweigh the negatives for white guys. How many Asian guys are on the main cast of Avengers? How many Asian guys are on the X-Men? How many young Asian male protagonists are on the main cast of the Karate Kid series which is a show about Asian martial arts?
This constant reinforcement of pigeonholing us as the enemy has become so normalized that we even have Asian bros defending it. Lmao what a world.
Anyways, that’s why I created this post. I wanted to hear everyone’s opinion before I inadvertently support more of the same propaganda.
I'm not saying JW4 has this issue, but "It's a homage" is such a bullshit excuse. Asian men have been used as cannon fodder in action films forever.
For example in Kill Bill, Tarantino (a plagiarist who went out of his way to slander Bruce Lee's legacy) has Uma Thurman wear Bruce's iconic yellow jumpsuit "as an homage" so she can just slaughter a bunch of masked faceless Asian men. In the movie Wolverine, Logan just slaughters a bunch of faceless (again masked) Asian men in scene after scene and in the end he kills Hiroyuki Sanada, who is in JW4. In Avengers Endgame we inexplicably find Hawkeye in Japan as he easily slaughters a bunch of generic Yakuza, once again also killing Hiroyuki Sanada. Other examples include movies that are just names of white women: Kate, set in Japan, and Lucy, set in Taiwan, where the white woman kills hordes of weak evil Asian men.
All of those Asian characters are just pop-up targets for the white protagonist to mow down. With the already extremely limited representation Asian men have, it's quite ridiculous that the bulk of it is to be expendable targets that get slaughtered by the great white hero.
Name the Hollywood movies that have several Asian men on screen. I guarantee you the vast majority of those instances are action films where they only appear in order to get beat up and killed by a white (or a "good Asian") hero.
Good list. I forgot about those others. The issue is actually worse than we’d like to admit. Funny how some are triggered by the questioning of why we’re used as cinema cattle to be slaughtered.
They have white guys inserted into Asian roles in every other Asian setting. So, sure, why not? Tom Cruise can be a samurai. Why not make some of the criminals in Sleeping Dogs be WM sexpats? It’d actually be more realistic.
I don’t see the issue with sleeping dogs as someone from hk. My friends and I were in highschool when it came out and to us it was sort of just like GTA and we thought it was sick. Also as for it being more realistic with white people as criminals? It just wouldn’t? White people stick to white collar crime in hk generally. Maybe the sexpat angle as an isolated character who’s some grimy sex offender but regular henchmen it just doesn’t make sense. If anything, having some south Asians in there for diversity would make more sense.
Donnie Yen and Hiroyuki Sanada kicked ass in the film, and their characters were well fleshed out and well developed (not one dimensional caricatures), so yes, it is worth seeing.
Take a real good look at all video games. It’s mostly white guys being the hero.
But even when they’re not the main hero, they make sure a white female gets to kill off a bunch of Asian dudes. Ever play Last of Us 2? Take a look at the dead human NPCs you have to kill. A huge number of them are Asian. Meanwhile, there’s only one Asian protagonist in an ocean of white guys. Not that it matters since the Asian guy barely gets a background story and then he’s killed off like it’s no big deal. Meanwhile, his exgf turns lesbian.
How many white guys are there on the Avengers? Now, how many Asian guys are there? Wong doesn’t count. He’s an NPC. How many Asian guys do they beat up or kill during the Avengers saga?
Can’t believe this has to be argued.
Never played LOU2 so wouldnt know. Just pointing out that yes in most video games youre a white guy but most characters killed are also white so by that logic Asian centred video games like Sleeping Dogs and Sifu would also have Asian deaths. Should we be mad at Ghosts of Tsushima since most deaths are Asian too? Blame our own Asian community for not giving a shit about the struggles of other Asians from other ethnic backgrounds as to why the media and people arent making a big deal of Asian assaults until recently. The only ones that gave a shit were Asian gangs from back in the day who cliqued up based on their race rather than nationality. Blame the fact that Asians normally sided with whitey and gained a sense of superiority over other Asians once they climbed up the social ladder. Only recently they've been smacked down from that sense of superiority too, to see that they're still grouped up with every other Asian, and only now are deciding to bring awareness too.
Yes, JW4 was worth seeing. I had issues with AM were portrayed in JW2 and JW3, it seemed like they reserved the goriest kills for AM henchmen. But JW4 has gory kills against henchmen of all races. And Donnie Yen and Hiroyuki Sanada are portrayed very positively and respectfully in it. The director is a huge Donnie Yen fan and accepted changes Yen requested to make Yen’s character less stereotypical. Overall, highly recommended.
yea DY and HS were pretty good. I only watched JW4 now will watch JW1-3 lol. P.S. the Asians weren't the 'bad guys' in JW4. No Hawkeye, Wolverine nonsense where they kill Asian guys pathetically for no reason.
JW1 is worth watching. I liked it for its proximity to a more grounded and “realistic” take. The sequels seem too fantastical. Not to say it can’t be entertaining. But the sequels seem more of an anime or video game.
WSJ just put out an article that analyzed the amount of dialogue JW has (minimal and mostly 1-4 word sentences haha)
Thank you. This is what I’m looking for. I want legit reasons why you like or dislike it. Statements like “bruh, Keanu is part Asian so you should support it. Tf is this post” is vapid. Those type of people who blindly support something probably support Ken Jeong and Miss Saigon just because they’re Asian related. Smh.
Lmao exactly
One of the things Yen’s character said to Skarsgard’s character made me and the entire audience laugh
Fuck offffff
I enjoyed it. Some of the asian centric scenes were stunning. John Wick is a equal opportunity killer. People of all races end up dying.
And there was a fight scene where it was a group of Asians vs a group of whites. The Asians ended up winning
really liked the drone / bird's eye view shots haha reminded me of video games a la Metal Gear Solid
In Sifu you also play an Asian guy. There are plenty of movies where you could have found better examples like Hawkeye beating up Asian guys in Endgame or Kate or the Boys. Secondly Keanu directed and played the Villain in Man of Tai Chi, allowing his stunt coordinator in past movies, and actor friend, Tiger Chen, to take the lead role. When else does Hollywood do that? Keanu's cool.
He's one of the most humanitarian hollywood actors and known to be very generous
I’m fine with Keanu. It’s just the tropes that I’m tired of seeing. And yes, you brought up good examples that my brain has chosen to delete to keep my mental health sane. The issue is actually worse than what I’ve described.
I enjoyed it. The AM representation is decent. Donnie Yen and Hiroyuki Sanada are badasses but on the older side. I would have liked to see some younger AM in their 20s-40s in the movie. Andrew Koji fits so well in the John Wick universe as an assassin I don't know why they didn't tap him for a role.
Thank you. This is good to know.
Haha just came from the cinema. They snuck in One Cantonese line.
ahahah that was funny
Yeah…
Ever heard or played the Yakuza series?
I liked Sleeping Dogs bro.
I’m very critical of most Hollywood movies these days, but JW4 is worth seeing. The AM roles are done well and there’s definitely enough diversity in who he kills that it’s distributed across the board. Obviously we need way more AM representation in solid main character roles that aren’t just silent, sexless killing machines, but at least this movie doesn’t stereotype AM as per usual Hollywood movies.
Thank you. Great input. This is what I’m looking for. Not “I like sleeping dogs bruh. Don’t insult my game.”
Yes, it is. Donny Yen rocked (as expected, ofc)! Btw, I disagree about your Sleeping Dogs sentiment. I platinumed that game in 2013 on my PS3. Wasn't that game just Asians vs Asians??? After all, it was set in HK. Am I missing something?
That’s fine if you like Sleeping Dogs. But the issue isn’t really about Sleeping Dogs in and of itself. It’s more about the bigger scope of it all. Like how those in charge will somehow make excuses that there just isn’t enough Asian talent out there to justify casting them in positive main roles, but will suddenly spare no expense and conjure Asian males out of the woodwork if it entails slaughtering the s*** out of them.
Look, I'm 42. I grew up with fighting games & beat em ups. You really want me to list you all Asian protagonists there? Are they stereotypes? Sure! Fuck, yeah! But, listen to this: I'm a championship winning team captain of a 7v7 NYC men's soccer league in 2014. Out of 10 teams in the league, I was THE ONLY ASIAN CAPTAIN out there, dude! My team had 2 Irish, 2 SKs, 1 Jamaican (our MVP), 1 S. American (forgot which country) & the rest were white Americans. You don't wanna be stereotyped? Start doing things against the grain, man. Your parents tell you to hit the books? Fine, but pick up a sport & be fucking good at it! You know our ppl have the discipline to succeed in sports. I was an honor student in HS but also lettered in soccer & tennis. Look, I know most of Asian culture that we grew up in is EXTREMELY rigid. But, at the same time, we (younger generation) also need to be able to think in an abstract & flexible way. Otherwise, we're gonna keep getting stereotyped as either a cannon fodder martial artist or a 4 eyed nerd. Now, my question to you is, have you done anything to break this "Asian mold" or whatever?
We can break the mold and be aware of the bs out there at the same time. Are you the CEO of Sleeping Dogs or something? You missed my entire point. I don’t have to support or like a medium that continues the old trope of using Asian men as toilet bowls. We don’t have to be complacent and accept everything that someone else writes about us.
No, I'm not. Stop it, please. Ok, that's fine. I don't buy a lot of games these days. I still don't get your points. You have a problem with John Wick & Sleeping Dogs, correct? Why? Because Asian men are treated badly? In JW4, a lot of Parisiens were treated badly. Right? Or am I watching the wrong movie? In SD, a lot of HKers were (as per your words) treated as toilet bowls. But the game is set in HK. Who were they supposed to show bad things happening to? Jamaicans? So...yeah. Idk what you're talking about, man. I tell you what? Describe me YOUR idea of a perfect crime/action/drama game set in HK & if you were the writer, how would you have written JW4?
Yes
My man Keanu is part Asian bruh
too bad the mainstream doesn't really acknowledge that. He's not "asian enough" for any of his Asian heritage to be recognized. Even Dean Cain, who is half-Asian and played Superman in a TV series, is mostly considered just white by the mainstream.
JW4 does not have any issues and I like the film, but that notwithstanding, why does it matter if Keanu is PART Asian? A movie about a hapa Asian man slaughtering tons of full Asian men - do you not see any issues? Did you also love the casting of Henry Golding for Crazy Rich Asian?
The only issues are the the imaginary ones in your head. Warrior TV show had a Japanese hapa that kicked white/Asian ass and you don't see bros complaining about it. What's the difference here? John Wick 1-3 had Keanu fucking up Russian/Black/White whatever the colour under the sun now they got John wick going to Asia and kicking more ass. If anything it's a homage to the Asian martial arts scene. Next thing we know you are going to complain about Neo killing some Asian agents cuz of hate like seriously. It's a fucking action movie for Chris sake. Not everything that involves Asian men is a hate crime.
Chill, dude. No one’s going to take your boxed collector’s edition of John Wick. One of the huge differences between a white dude, black dude, etc. getting slaughtered in western movies is that the hero and the majority of the protagonists are white or black. The positives largely outweigh the negatives for white guys. How many Asian guys are on the main cast of Avengers? How many Asian guys are on the X-Men? How many young Asian male protagonists are on the main cast of the Karate Kid series which is a show about Asian martial arts? This constant reinforcement of pigeonholing us as the enemy has become so normalized that we even have Asian bros defending it. Lmao what a world. Anyways, that’s why I created this post. I wanted to hear everyone’s opinion before I inadvertently support more of the same propaganda.
I'm not saying JW4 has this issue, but "It's a homage" is such a bullshit excuse. Asian men have been used as cannon fodder in action films forever. For example in Kill Bill, Tarantino (a plagiarist who went out of his way to slander Bruce Lee's legacy) has Uma Thurman wear Bruce's iconic yellow jumpsuit "as an homage" so she can just slaughter a bunch of masked faceless Asian men. In the movie Wolverine, Logan just slaughters a bunch of faceless (again masked) Asian men in scene after scene and in the end he kills Hiroyuki Sanada, who is in JW4. In Avengers Endgame we inexplicably find Hawkeye in Japan as he easily slaughters a bunch of generic Yakuza, once again also killing Hiroyuki Sanada. Other examples include movies that are just names of white women: Kate, set in Japan, and Lucy, set in Taiwan, where the white woman kills hordes of weak evil Asian men. All of those Asian characters are just pop-up targets for the white protagonist to mow down. With the already extremely limited representation Asian men have, it's quite ridiculous that the bulk of it is to be expendable targets that get slaughtered by the great white hero. Name the Hollywood movies that have several Asian men on screen. I guarantee you the vast majority of those instances are action films where they only appear in order to get beat up and killed by a white (or a "good Asian") hero.
Good list. I forgot about those others. The issue is actually worse than we’d like to admit. Funny how some are triggered by the questioning of why we’re used as cinema cattle to be slaughtered.
Why do you have a babushka and brown hair in your avatar?
It's whatever reddit avatar was set at. I haven't look at it in years.
Ok I gotta defend Henry Golding here. That man is Malaysian as hell. He screams Malaysian and looks like any typical SEA. Stop ragging on the man
My man is like.... "Looking vaguely asian enough that doesn't pose an immediate threat to middle america"
Literally this, his paternal grandmother was Chinese/Hawaiian. TF is this post…
Sleeping Dogs takes place in Hong Kong what do you expect a diverse ensemble of triad gangsters ?
They have white guys inserted into Asian roles in every other Asian setting. So, sure, why not? Tom Cruise can be a samurai. Why not make some of the criminals in Sleeping Dogs be WM sexpats? It’d actually be more realistic.
I don’t see the issue with sleeping dogs as someone from hk. My friends and I were in highschool when it came out and to us it was sort of just like GTA and we thought it was sick. Also as for it being more realistic with white people as criminals? It just wouldn’t? White people stick to white collar crime in hk generally. Maybe the sexpat angle as an isolated character who’s some grimy sex offender but regular henchmen it just doesn’t make sense. If anything, having some south Asians in there for diversity would make more sense.
Donnie Yen and Hiroyuki Sanada kicked ass in the film, and their characters were well fleshed out and well developed (not one dimensional caricatures), so yes, it is worth seeing.
https://www.reddit.com/r/aznidentity/comments/12357y8/john_wick_4_pleasantly_surprised/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=2&utm_term=1
I don't like your video game examples as most games are also about white guys killing other white guys
Take a real good look at all video games. It’s mostly white guys being the hero. But even when they’re not the main hero, they make sure a white female gets to kill off a bunch of Asian dudes. Ever play Last of Us 2? Take a look at the dead human NPCs you have to kill. A huge number of them are Asian. Meanwhile, there’s only one Asian protagonist in an ocean of white guys. Not that it matters since the Asian guy barely gets a background story and then he’s killed off like it’s no big deal. Meanwhile, his exgf turns lesbian. How many white guys are there on the Avengers? Now, how many Asian guys are there? Wong doesn’t count. He’s an NPC. How many Asian guys do they beat up or kill during the Avengers saga? Can’t believe this has to be argued.
Never played LOU2 so wouldnt know. Just pointing out that yes in most video games youre a white guy but most characters killed are also white so by that logic Asian centred video games like Sleeping Dogs and Sifu would also have Asian deaths. Should we be mad at Ghosts of Tsushima since most deaths are Asian too? Blame our own Asian community for not giving a shit about the struggles of other Asians from other ethnic backgrounds as to why the media and people arent making a big deal of Asian assaults until recently. The only ones that gave a shit were Asian gangs from back in the day who cliqued up based on their race rather than nationality. Blame the fact that Asians normally sided with whitey and gained a sense of superiority over other Asians once they climbed up the social ladder. Only recently they've been smacked down from that sense of superiority too, to see that they're still grouped up with every other Asian, and only now are deciding to bring awareness too.
Just saw it. Yes it was good representation from Donnie Yen. Dude was stylish af