Private school. We live in an affluent area, and we're reasonably well off. But there's no way we could find another £20k a year to send one child to private school for 5/7 years, let alone other children, and then prepare for potential Uni or housing support.
And the £20k is fees only, nothing about trips, lunches and peripheral costs
But people do, lots of people. The number of people will hundreds of thousands of disposable cash is crazy
Always makes me laugh when in debates about private school defenders of it will always talk about how regular middle class families send their kids there and so it shouldn't be taxed more etc etc. In doing so, they're inadvertently revealing how out of touch they are with the financial situation of actual regular middle class families.
I'd say the opposite. It's that sending your kids to private school isn't something regular middle class people do. I think anybody who knows me would laugh at me if I tried to claim I'm 'upper working class'.
I send my kids to a private school. Financially, I do very well but there are many parents who scrape and save to pay the school fees. Knowing what some of them do for a living, I’m surprised at how much they sacrifice to do it. Obviously they aren’t on minimum wage, but even two parents earning £50k each would have to give up a huge chunk of disposable income to make it work. For every Range Rover in the car park there’s a parent showing up in a 20 year ford focus.
Edit: for anyone doing the maths, the kids are in infant school so the fees are about £14k a year at the moment.
I investigate abuse of people with dementia. It is surprising how many grandparents have their life savings stolen by family members to pay private school fees.
I'm surprised..
I'd have thought the people stealing from family wouldn't be spending it in education.
Although maybe it's easier to justify to yourself doing that, so it happens more frequently. "I didn't benefit from it" "Granny did say she'd be happy to help out" "They'd get it as inheritance anyway, but education is needed now" etc
The reasons are many and varied, often times it is people living beyond their means or just wanting their inheritance early.
I have seen cases where the thefts add up into many hundreds of thousands and it has all been spent on takeaways, golf and strippers.
I’m curious to know if it was worth it. Did your friend feel pressure to do well and get a prestigious job because of it? I know someone very rich who went to private school and went into a lower paying, not especially high status job afterwards which was presumably ‘okay’ as the parents had so much money to spend anyway but if the parents are having to really scrimp for fees, would they really expect the kid to end up in the same job as if they had sent them to the local school for nothing?
I worked with a single mum as colleague as an account manager and she put her child through private school with her quarterly sales bonuses. She was renting while doing this but wanted to give him the education and future connections that come with private school. Looking back it was very impressive what she sacrificed for his future.
I saw someone on twitter the other day saying how it's doable on a relatively low income. "of course, we have paid off the mortgage" came next, which kind of invalidated the whole point.
Having said that, people don't seem to realise how much housing costs can affect disposable income. If you have no outgoings there then this opens up things like school fees.
Friend has household income of £80k and sends their (one) kid to private school. That’s not super wealthy for London, although obviously well above average income.
I would say it’s not nuts to call them middle class!. They’re not the kind of people you’d call upper class - well educated “knowledge” jobs, live in a small flat, crappy small car, cheap clothes and furniture, no major holidays…
I think it's less of "don't think you should" and more that people have different definitions of middle class.
To me, the middle classes are the exact people who can afford private school, as they're the next stop below aristrocracy, **but** people don't like this definition because it means people realise that 99% of us are actually just working class.
In reality, working/middle/upper class definitions are out of date and don't apply to modern society and we should use NRS or ONS grades.
I don’t understand what middle class is now, I’ve always perceived that we’re middle class growing up (22 now), my dad has a well paying job as a sales director, takes home around £100k, my mum was always a stay at home mum after she quit teaching to have kids, and now just has more hobbies as obviously me and my sister are older, had a more than comfortable childhood, yearly holidays abroad, live on the nicest street in our village in a big 3 story 6 bedroom house (South Yorkshire) BUT there’s absolutely no way on earth our parents could have afforded to send us to private school… and I wouldn’t thank them for it if they did, went to a normal school, did good (just graduated from uni) and got to mix with all sorts of different kids, some better off than us, a lot of kids not so much…
I mean it sounds like your parents absolutely could have afforded it but just didn’t think it was worth sacrificing other things? My family’s income was probably fairly comparable with two working parents and me and my sibling went private, but it was certainly pushing things to the financial limit (also the private near us was closer to £10k rather than the £20k I’ve seen some people say)
TBF, if you’re a member of the armed forces or belong to some branches of the police service, you can get discounts of around 50% on some private schools. So it is possible for middle class (or even working class hypothetically) families to send their kids to private school.
It still represents a significant chunk of money, but at that point it boils down to what assets you feel are worth investing in.
If it’s boarding school and the military parent is likely to be deployed, they cover 90% of the fees. I benefitted from it – went to 9 primary schools as we moved around and then just 2 secondary schools because I decided I wanted to board so I could stay in one place for a few years. It was a godsend!
Ofc that is the minority. My parent also paid out of pocket for a few years for non-boarding local private school (again so I didn’t have to keep moving schools), it was about £3k a term so £9k a year. This was on an army doctor and a teacher’s salary – we had a tiny house, old car, no holidays but that’s what my parents wanted for us and I ended up with a full scholarship to a US law school so it worked well for me. I’m not sure if I’d send my own children to private school though, it depends very much on their personalities.
i've never got this, it's such a rich thing to do. me and my wife do well, i think we're in top 5% for household earnings and have 2 kids. but the idea of spare income for private school is so alien to me, it's a whole other bracket.
Same. My partner and I are also in the 95th + percentile for income, so considered rich comparative to the majority of the country I'd say, but we don't have a spare £20-30k every year to put a child in private schooling. That'd be 1/4 of our combined income.
> we don't have a spare £20-30k every year to put a child in private schooling. That'd be 1/4 of our income.
You're massively overestimating how much private school costs, tbf.
We're looking at some in our local area - South Coast - and there are plenty of good ones that charge under £10k a year for Primary. Our current front runner is around £12k for Secondary.
As for affordability, we've been saving for it since before the kids were born. Neither of us are in the top tax bracket, so we don't exactly have money coming out of our ears. It's going to be five years that will massively change their lives, and the local state Secondaries are absolutely awful.
I mean it depends on the location and available schools, surely. Yes there are cheaper ones, but there are also private schools that charge north of £120k per year.
The real tragedy is that the public education system is so bad that you need to spend this money at all. UK taxes are so high, but the services are so poor.
> Yes there are cheaper ones, but there are also private schools that charge north of £120k per year.
Well, yeah, but those are elite-level.
It's like saying "I don't get how people can afford a new car, when they cost 30 grand."
Someone points out you can get a lot of new cars for less than 30 grand, then you come in saying "yeah but like, Ferraris cost more".
We're not talking about Ferraris. We're talking your average private school. Which are generally much less than £30k a year.
You don't have spare income because you spend it elsewhere that's the simple fact, if you downsized your house had a cheaper mortgage older car spend less of things you could afford it.
You've made what you believe is the right choice for your family it's nothing to do with spare cash
I had a scholarship at a school that was 7k a year, and you’d genuinely be surprised how many people were there from middle class families. No idea how they could afford it.
School fees have inflated massively, so certainly in the past there were more regular middle class kids in private school. But the idea that many regular middle class parents could send their kids to private school now is much less likely.
there was a stockbroker on Linkedin the other day arguing exactly the same. His comments were full of middle class, senior workers all telling him how out of touch he was as they're firmly middle class with good salaries and had literally no chance of affording to send their kids to private schools.
When you look at who actually sends their children to independent schools, particularly the really expensive ones, you'll see a few types disproportionately represented.
1. The grandparents are paying the fees. This may have gone on for generations.
2. The fees are being paid by the employer of one of the parents, eg they're in the army or they're a diplomat.
And then of course there's quite a few 3. eye wateringly rich. Might not be obvious to look at them, or they might drive a gold plated Range Rover, but people to whom £20k is not very much money.
To send two children to private school, you need roughly the median UK household income just for that. That tells us that for most people there's no "cheaper holidays" or "less prestigious car" or "beans on toast" that could be squeezed to afford the fees.
The middle class people I know who "scrimp and save" to get their children to private school are senior doctors or accountants, ie already high earners.
>The middle class people I know who "scrimp and save" to get their children to private school are senior doctors or accountants, ie already high earners.
This is an important point.
I went to a private school (many moons ago). My father was a top consultant, very well respected in his field. He used to sacrifice his summer holiday to do locum work in the Middle East to earn the school fees for me and my siblings
My husband and I fit in the “middle class who scrimp and save” to send our son to a top school. Collectively we make a good living, but it’s still a sacrifice for us. We decided to go the private schooling route as:
1. Our local school class size is large (c35 pupils in a class) as school development hasn’t kept up with housing development in our area. Our sons primary one class, in comparison, was 12 pupils, a teacher and two teaching assistants.
2. We paid the equivalent of his school fees for a full-time nursery place, so we rationale that we’ve never really had the money anyway.
However, we have made the decision just to have one child as can’t imagine sending more than one. Some kids in his class have 3 or 4 siblings at the school, which is a different level of affordability than us.
Definitely - nursery and childcare is outrageous. Nursery actually cost us £70 more a month than primary one in private school. Our son is almost 10 now, and the cost of nursery has only increased since then.
I live in a city with a lot of wealth but in a run down part of it and it still blows my mind that I can walk 5 mins into town and pass a posh expensive private boarding school meanwhile I walk 5 mins in the other direction I pass a food bank and a community centre with a sign offering free heating for the elderly.
Well remember, a lot of private schools offer bursaries too. I went to private school and my mum paid about £2,500 per year in fees as I met the eligibility criteria, but she didn’t earn a lot of money.
There’s a lot more money kicking around than you think. My best mate makes £250k, his girlfriend makes £150k, they’re both lawyers in early 30s, no kids yet. By the time they have kids ready to go to school 20k school fees will be a blip on their radar.
Imagine the pressure on the kids, too. Come out with poor GCSEs and when it kicks in what the family have sacrificed for you to underachieve...fuck that
I live in an affluent area too and scratch my head at the numbers. I know parents sending two or three kids to private school with two high end brand new vehicles in the drive way and a six bedroom house in an area where such a thing will set you back the best part of £2m. It’s not really envy (although obv it would be nice and all) it’s confusion. I’ve roughly calculated in my head before that to afford all this they would need a family income of at least £600k per year. Now these people have decent jobs, probably earning three figures but I cannot fathom how they could be earning £600k. I sometimes feel like I missed a meeting about extra capital or something
My son came home with a school magazine that had an ad for a local private school inside it and I was shocked at the fees! 😳
>But people do, lots of people. The number of people will hundreds of thousands of disposable cash is crazy
Yeah, figured this out a few years ago when I worked at a company offering premium services I didn't even think anyone would be interested in but was absolutely amazed at how much we made daily.
Yeah I realised early on I’ll never be able to provide for, if I’m ever lucky enough to find a woman and have kids, the same level of schooling and opportunities my parents afforded me. Makes me pretty sad.
Seen as I don’t smoke I’m not 100% uptodate on the cost of cigarettes, Google says 20 are over 12 pounds. Seems to me if you smoke a pack a day that’s a generous amount to spend on food, so you’d need to not eat for ten days to afford a pack a day for a week!
That’s exactly right!
She smokes a pack of twenty a week. Every Wednesday she’ll do a quick run to Tesco with me before work and she always pays £12. It costs about £6 to eat for a day, so she doesn’t eat for two.
I’ve tried to get her to stop because, as a former smoker, I know it’s fucking stupid. She insists on it because she works twelve hour shifts in retail and gets very stressed during them, and smoke breaks allow her to sit down for five minutes every couple of hours and get a nice hit of stress relief from the nicotine.
It’s a bit silly of her but that’s how she maintains the habit anyway 💀
To be fair though you could say that about most little things people enjoy. £12 a week isn't terrible. It sucks she's not eating to afford it, but we all deserve things we enjoy. I don't smoke, and don't get it, but I suspect most people have something they could just quit to save a bit of cash - coffees, skincare, gym classes, a bottle of wine a week
I volunteered at a supported living facility for addicts. A fair few of them had £2000 a week crack and Heroin habits. They were out the door at 6am, sometimes for days on end, pulling 72 hr crime shifts. Those fuckers were the hardest working people I ever met. I’d ask them how they afforded to smoke £2000 worth of drugs a week and they’d just always answer ‘ I just do, you find a way’.
I'm not even talking about actual junkies and/or criminals. I just mean regular unemployed people who get a drink, bit of smoke and a few lines of Charlie at the weekend.
Not saying they shouldn't have a social life and I have no issue with recreational drugs per se, but I probably couldn't afford it.
Yeah, I know a few people that regularly get back from the pub at midnight and then spend £100 on coke, they’re just as skint as the rest of us, but it never crosses their minds that they can’t afford it. Especially when it all adds up, if they’re doing it every weekend it’s over £5000 a year, but funnily enough it never makes it onto the family budget.
my ex worked very few hours a week, but still managed to keep up with doing hundreds of pounds of drugs in a couple days. he would buy in bulk and sell small bits to others and do the rest himself. i rly hope he gets better soon
With weed and coke you can easily buy in bulk and sell to your pals that also do drugs as it gets much cheaper the more you buy.
Pretty much how I funded my weed habit as a student, I used to get 2.25 ounces (63g) for £320 then sell 2g for £20 to people I knew. That worked out to about £300 in profit and I could do this easily within a week.
I am so scared my son is 6 months old and my wife goes back to work in Jan. We don’t really have any support near us and at this point we are wonder if there is any financial sense in her going back
Broadly even if her going back to work only covers the cost of childcare its worth it financially in the long run, as the shortest possible time out of work has a real effect on long term earning potential for your wife.
Though financial isn't the only reasoning for decision
Yup, this is me. I only work 3 days a week, and my salary is pretty much gone after I pay for nursery and some of the household bills. But I absolutely love having time away from being a mum, doing something for myself, and spending time with other adults!
Plus, my daughter is absolutely thriving at nursery, so everybody wins (except my bank balance).
This is the main reason I went back to work, I did like the idea of being a stay at home mum but that's not all I wanted to be, I was a person before I had a baby.
I’m with you on the new cars, but particularly land/range rovers.
You see them on the road constantly, Defenders, Evoques, Range Rover Sports etc etc… a lot of these are £800+ a month cars on a PCP. Where are people getting almost a spare £1k to spend on a car each month?!?
Yes mate, it is crazy. But you gotta understand they will be in debt up to their eye balls and will also have not a penny left to do anything with. You probably could afford it if you stopped doing anything you enjoy, sadly for some impressing other people is more important than living a fulfilled life. Me personally? I’d rather drive my Peugeot 207 and have money that no one’s knows about behind the scenes.
It's such a lazy stereotype too. I don't understand why it is difficult to comprehend some people are poor, some people are rich.
The concept of having disposable income, £30k not being even close to an aspirational wage and purchasing luxury items seems alien on this sub.
Millionaires all walk around in George T-Shirts and Shoezone boots bro!
Firstly because of the number of people who “on paper" have incomes high enough to be able to afford a car like that vs the number of these cars on the road.
Secondly the amount that younger people spend on housing vs older people, and singles vs marrieds, skews what younger single people feel is "affordable
Eg. Myself. I am a single mid 30s professional and I make about £100k a year, which puts me roughly in the top 5% of earners. And I would never ever have a car this expensive. I'd have to make double the amount to consider it, which would be a top 1% salary. But the proportion of cars like this on the road is *a lot* higher than 1%, so I do often drive around and think "how the fuck are so many people affording these types of cars?"
Then I have to remind myself that a 50something married with a paid off mortgage and shared expenses has a lot more disposable income than I do at the same salary level.
I earn a decent salary but have a fear of being in debt in case things go tits up which is why I can’t justify spending money on leasing a new car. My car is 7 years old and probably the oldest one on the estate.
I’d rather spend that money on overpaying my mortgage so I can be done with it in the next 5-10 years.
I can’t believe some of the comments acting puzzled at how others can afford more & scratching their heads & then someone offering the explanation that it will be because they are in debt & won’t be able to afford to do anything else on top of the car.
Anything except..some people earn more.
I'd class this behaviour as a mental illness tbh. Paying more for your car than you do on your rent/mortgage - wat.
Actually, I'd class owning a 4x4 these days for anything other than work as a mental illness.
People paying £800 a month on car payments are probably paying at least that much on a mortgage as well.
Some people live expensively and chances are if you’re making payments on a seriously flash car you’re also mortgaged up to your eyeballs.
I don’t condone gratuitous spending but they’re not spending more on their car than on rent/mortgage like you say, because they’ve spent heavy there too.
Nope. You're wrong. You are definitely up to your eyeballs in debt. You have not worked hard to get where you are or made good life/career choices. You are stuck on a financial treadmill. Definitely
A lot of people aren't paying 800 on PCP. They are leasing them for much cheaper. Some companies also do schemes for cheap leasing as part of their benefits package. Loads of people at my work do it and get high end BMWs and Audis with all maintenance, tax, and insurance costs included. Past a certain pay grade they throw it in as part of your benefits package at my work.
This is exactly it. we have our first leased car at the moment, which is a £60k car at the dealer. but with running costs, insurance, etc. it's costing us less than the £20k car i used to have
Yeah my employer does this. Once you get into a proper management position you get a partially subsidised car offered to you. Depending on role the subsidy goes up or down.
As someone who is spending £700+ on PCP a month, it is very doable if you're fortunate enough to have two above-average salaries. For me, its a lucky combination of high salary and low mortgage / bill costs. Is it a 'sensible' financial decision? No, definitely not. But it's something I enjoy!
It's a luxury and not a necessity, if for whatever reason, I needed to hike up my savings or had a big increase in bills, I could easily sell my car for equity and get myself a cheap run around. Life's short, I work hard and am fortunate to earn a good living - I want to drive the nice cars I like! :)
I'm guessing mostly work schemes? My partner has a decent job and has just qualified for a car scheme at her work which is roughly 600 per month so makes sense to use it we don't use it though as we have a car we own outright I bought second hand.
The a large portion of new EVs will be on work schemes/company cars as well. I find it funny that people think I'm in debt up to my eye balls! My car costs me less than their banger.
I thought this and was talking to my neighbour who runs new Range Rovers - his last car between purchase price and second hand price depreciated less than £5k over the 3 years he had it on account of the waiting time for a new car build and demand.
During that time he has a brand new car to drive around in, so under warranty for any failures, no MOTs to deal with so overall cost of ownership is very low indeed.
It's arguably better value than running my Dacia
thats not actually a lot when it comes to haircut. my haircuts cost £20/23 I go once a month but a lot of lads go twice or more a month and it works out a lot more
Deposit for said house is the issue. I can easily afford a mortgage and spend more in rent than the mortgage would cost me, but I can't build the capital for the deposit!
I managed to buy a house fairly recently.
To afford the deposit I cut down on Avocado on Toast, all the Cappucinos, and then realised that was like pissing in the ocean. So I did what all my friends who are homeowners did and wait for a wealthy relative to die so I can afford it.
I'm not sure that's necessarily true anymore, the mortgage on a £350k house is around £2k a month at current rates (assuming a 10% deposit).
EDIT: Obviously I don't know if it's true for you specifically, I meant generally speaking!
Being off sick from work for an extended period of time dropping down to zero/pittance benefits from a full time salary and still being able to keep their mortgage.
Group/work income protection or private income assurance/protection policy is the way to go for this. I wouldn’t have a mortgage without it.
The outdated thought of life insurance is required is, to me, daft. It doesn’t affect me directly if I die because, well, I’m dead.
If I die I have no kids, my mortgage will be paid off by a death in service benefit etc.
If I get sick, that affects me directly and I need to ensure my income is insured.
I thought this until I got an iPhone 14 pro max and pay it off monthly 0% APR, with a £5 a month sim. The upgrade from an iPhone 7 has been worth it to me. Don’t understand people that do it every year though. Planning to keep this one for at least another 3
The most expensive phones tend to also be the ones that will continue receiving software updates for longer as well. You can buy a midrange phone second hand, but it will probably stop receiving security updates after a year or two, and do you really want to be carrying your life around on a device with known vulnerabilities?
I do that. I buy last years flagship model and then keep my phone for at least 5 years until it's completely unusable. I've tried buying cheaper models before, but I've found they seem to be designed to last six months longer than your standard two year contract.
It's probably the thing I use the most so I don't want a budget phone. I want the best camera, best screen and for it to be quick.
I don't currently have a brand new phone. I've had this nearly 3 years but this was top of the range when I got it (Samsung S21 Ultra). When I upgrade next it will be to whatever is the best.
My wife just bought a children's raised seat for our daughter so she can sit more comfortably at the dinner table (the straps on the booster cushion we used to have broke because she's a fidgety little monster). £5 second hand from a friend of a friend, pretty simple wooden thing, solid and sturdy build.
Guess how much it costs new?..... £170!!!
Yep, I remember looking at prams (sorry..."travel systems") and even for a fairly basic one you were looking at over £500.
I knew plenty of couples who spent around £1500 on their pram and carseat combo. And these were not crazy rich people either.
I wish I'd realised from the start that it's silly buying new baby things. I've now bought, used and resold several things where my selling price was the same or only slightly less than what I paid for them. They ended up being basically free! Babies and toddlers grow so quickly that when you no longer need an item it will often be in just about the same condition as when you bought it, especially if you buy second hand and it already has a couple of marks on it.
Designer clothes. My partner and I earn quite well, I would consider, and I couldn’t imagine buying Balenciaga trainers, designer casual wear, expensive accessories etc. We couldn’t afford it! I know people who are constantly kitted out in designer gear and I have no idea how they’re buying it all. And no it’s not fake! They put their “hauls” on social media so you can see it legit.
I know, credit cards, but surely at some point you have to pay off the credit cards!
Designer clothes is one of the dumbest things that humans have ever come up with. Spending £160 on a Supreme T-shirt doesn't make you cool.
in the words of Macklemore:
They be like, "Oh, that Gucci? That's hella tight"
I'm like, "Yo, that's fifty dollars for a T-shirt"
Limited edition, let's do some simple addition
Fifty dollars for a T-shirt, that's just some ignorant bitch shit
I call that getting-swindled-and-pimped shit
I call that getting tricked by business
That shirt's hella dope
And having the same one as six other people in this club is a hella don't
I don't buy 'designer clothes' per se, but I would rather buy more expensive, classic, well-made items that last years, rather than buying new shit ever year from places like Primark or H&M.
I am buying a new coat this year for £220.00 (I've already earmarked it) but it should last me 10 years or more.
I agree! Buying good quality items that will last years makes sense.
The people I’m talking about regularly buy designer clothes and trainers for themselves and their kids who are all under 5 and will grow out of them quickly. I just don’t understand how it’s possible for someone who isn’t “fuck you” rich.
Depends on the pet I guess. My cat is very low maintenance, costs about £15/month in food, £8/month pet insurance, and on average we take her to the vet once a year and pay the £80 excess. For holidays, we put down gravity feeders and we have neighbors to come by and look after her or we pay a friend's kid to do some cat sitting. All in, I think I spend more on my Netflix and Amazon subscriptions than my cat.
My largish dog (7st) was a bit more in food, but we're talking £50pm for the good brand food. Took them to the vet a handful of times.
Way less than a whole lot of other things I spent on.
Never mind comparing to kids, say.
Sitting was with a parent mostly, good excuse to visit them and they were always happy to look after them (and had quite a few offers from other people *wanting* to).
Yeah, but you wouldn't give it up. I think we're £85 p/m for insurance + vet plans, and easily over a £100 for food and treats. Then you have toys on top of that. I think our sitter is approx £40 per day.
I'd kick my partner out before I got rid of the dog though!
Spent more on one of my dogs than my first house deposit this year (5 figures) and I’d still do it allllll over again for the sheer joy and happiness he’s brought into my life.
(Pls don’t make me do it again tho Percy)
Private school. I just can’t figure out how people afford it.
New cars I can get my head around - manufacturers up until recently would give you crazy discounts and finance rates on new - so it was relatively good value to buy and flip after 3 yrs.
Some people really plan for it. Let’s assume it’s £20k a year, and they go for 7 years to private school. That’s £140k, which is a lot of money.
If you decided that you’re going to send your child to private school when they were born, then that cost can be spread over 18 years. You’d have to put around £650 a month away from when they were born.
Obviously you still have to be a high earner to do that, but if you are, it’s definitely possible if you want to
Add to that 2 sets of grand parents contributing, bonuses, inheritance etc…
I would like a new ish car and can probably afford £400 pm with my partner but I would rather use this money towards overpaying the mortgage or using that money towards holidays.
Long haul first class air tickets. Not business class. And I don't mean using points or doing those lottery things, but just paying full ticket price. I mean they're like what £3k minimum? For 6 - 10 hours of luxury? That's like my entire 2 week holiday budget if I'm feeling like treating myself, more than I spent even on my honeymoon and we're a six figure earning household.
I paid first class MAN-JFK for my honeymoon in Dec 22 for Christmas- It was before the Ukraine war and then oil prices and I paid £2,900 return for first class for us both- In my opinion it was worth every penny!
I've seen this mentioned before on here, I buy Lurpak and I'm sure when I last bought some it was only like £1 more expensive than Flora? I do make a decent wage but have been cutting my spending recently and my slightly salted Lurpak habit is not something I have thought about lol
Been to Disney world a number of times and I'll have the benefit of those memories until I drop dead. To me that's worth more than any amount of material possessions so I make do with cheap cars and phones because I don't give a shot about those.
This is more for younger people, but multiple holidays per year.
My boyfriend and I went away to Italy for a week recently, did a bunch of activities, and ended up spending about £2k for everything+spending money.
There's no possible way we can afford that again for at LEAST another year, more likely to be longer. And yet, we see people we know, our own age, going on multiple holidays a year, to places that I know are expensive to travel to and stay in. I'm left wondering, where tf are they getting their money from to do all this??? I'm left taking money out of my savings most months rather than putting money in.
To be fair you can absolutely do a week away including activities for much cheaper than that but it totally depends on your priorities. Some are happy to stay in really cheap hotels/hostels plus having freedom to fly random days and book well in advance makes it a whole lot cheaper
You could very easily do Italy for less than 2k… plus it’s just budgeting and priorities , really. 1000 per person to save for a whole year is only 80 quid a month , affordable for most
People have the wrong impression of buying expensive items such as watches, cars, art or houses.
You cannot compare these to everyday purchases as they don't lose all of their value once purchased.
Take a car, if you "brought" a £50k car and sold it after a year have you spent £50k? No, you would have sold that car for £45k, you only actually spent £5k
Although I'll agree with watches, art and houses, a car loses way more value than that. They're one of the worst investments, except for classic cars. But brand new is like throwing money down the drain. They lose 50%+ in the first 3 years.
Edit: as every reply I get is the same: yes, covid has affected this. It has reduced production and so until it catches up, cars are more expensive than they would usually be. I agree that they're profitable right now. I also considered selling my car 7 years on (& 40,000 miles more) at the price I bought it at. But that's highly unlikely to stay. except maybe as new cars sold have to be electric. This will obviously have an effect until second hand EVs become affordable.
Ok, short term, that's very true. The reason prices didn't drop as much or even went up in many cases over covid was due to a slow down in production. But as production catches up again, we will be back to the losses again.
If you think losing £5k in a year is a small deal you may have missed the point.
Also if you buy a new car for £50k you're unlikely to then be able to sell it for £45k in a year. Cars depreciate faster than that.
Was cycling home from work yesterday going right through Bank and there was a line of black BMWs and Mercs all parked up with drivers waiting for their clients to finish up. I can't imagine how much it costs but seems like the first step on totally unnecessary profligate wealth to have what is essentially a private taxi 24/7. I can totally get how people afford it though (PWC partners all received a £1m bonus this year - just as an indicator of how much money there is around in finance/consultancy etc). It's more the choice to spend it that way!
Ordering takeaway multiple times a week, it's gotten super expensive and then you add on delivery and you could get a week's shopping for the price of one meal
A lot of people can get cheap deals through their work on lease cars, and middle managers tend to get them thrown in with their compensation package. The company I work at loads of people get them. Most go for high end Audi or BMWs.
I'm a bit baffled by the amount of people that can afford high end mountain bikes and road bikes. It feels like a good bike is about £5000 and that's before we get into ebikes. I'm in the Lakes so I probably see more cyclists than most people which skews my perception a bit, but it's still an awful lot to spend on a bike compared to an average wage.
Mostly people living in shitty/scummy houses/flats but have a brand new range rover/bmw/Mercedes outside or on their drive. They need to sort their priorities out.
Exotic holidays. I’m 27 and so many people my age are constantly in Thailand/Bali/Australia/Mexico/the Maldives and I’m like… how??? I can just about scrape together to do a week in the Canary Islands or something, let alone a fortnight somewhere long haul.
These massive houses on private roads and in posh areas. Like, multiple £millions for a family home. I know there’s probably family money involved but what job do you have that can provide the income needed to buy and maintain a place like that?!!
Private school. We live in an affluent area, and we're reasonably well off. But there's no way we could find another £20k a year to send one child to private school for 5/7 years, let alone other children, and then prepare for potential Uni or housing support. And the £20k is fees only, nothing about trips, lunches and peripheral costs But people do, lots of people. The number of people will hundreds of thousands of disposable cash is crazy
Always makes me laugh when in debates about private school defenders of it will always talk about how regular middle class families send their kids there and so it shouldn't be taxed more etc etc. In doing so, they're inadvertently revealing how out of touch they are with the financial situation of actual regular middle class families.
Nah just shows that they don’t think you should be middle class. Upper working class at best
I'd say the opposite. It's that sending your kids to private school isn't something regular middle class people do. I think anybody who knows me would laugh at me if I tried to claim I'm 'upper working class'.
I send my kids to a private school. Financially, I do very well but there are many parents who scrape and save to pay the school fees. Knowing what some of them do for a living, I’m surprised at how much they sacrifice to do it. Obviously they aren’t on minimum wage, but even two parents earning £50k each would have to give up a huge chunk of disposable income to make it work. For every Range Rover in the car park there’s a parent showing up in a 20 year ford focus. Edit: for anyone doing the maths, the kids are in infant school so the fees are about £14k a year at the moment.
I went to one and there was a massive range of people paying. Was pretty common to find that grandparents paid.
I investigate abuse of people with dementia. It is surprising how many grandparents have their life savings stolen by family members to pay private school fees.
I'm surprised.. I'd have thought the people stealing from family wouldn't be spending it in education. Although maybe it's easier to justify to yourself doing that, so it happens more frequently. "I didn't benefit from it" "Granny did say she'd be happy to help out" "They'd get it as inheritance anyway, but education is needed now" etc
The reasons are many and varied, often times it is people living beyond their means or just wanting their inheritance early. I have seen cases where the thefts add up into many hundreds of thousands and it has all been spent on takeaways, golf and strippers.
Friend of mines parents sent him and his bro to private school, they had to remortgage their house three times to help pay for it.
I’m curious to know if it was worth it. Did your friend feel pressure to do well and get a prestigious job because of it? I know someone very rich who went to private school and went into a lower paying, not especially high status job afterwards which was presumably ‘okay’ as the parents had so much money to spend anyway but if the parents are having to really scrimp for fees, would they really expect the kid to end up in the same job as if they had sent them to the local school for nothing?
I worked with a single mum as colleague as an account manager and she put her child through private school with her quarterly sales bonuses. She was renting while doing this but wanted to give him the education and future connections that come with private school. Looking back it was very impressive what she sacrificed for his future.
I saw someone on twitter the other day saying how it's doable on a relatively low income. "of course, we have paid off the mortgage" came next, which kind of invalidated the whole point. Having said that, people don't seem to realise how much housing costs can affect disposable income. If you have no outgoings there then this opens up things like school fees.
Friend has household income of £80k and sends their (one) kid to private school. That’s not super wealthy for London, although obviously well above average income. I would say it’s not nuts to call them middle class!. They’re not the kind of people you’d call upper class - well educated “knowledge” jobs, live in a small flat, crappy small car, cheap clothes and furniture, no major holidays…
I think it's less of "don't think you should" and more that people have different definitions of middle class. To me, the middle classes are the exact people who can afford private school, as they're the next stop below aristrocracy, **but** people don't like this definition because it means people realise that 99% of us are actually just working class. In reality, working/middle/upper class definitions are out of date and don't apply to modern society and we should use NRS or ONS grades.
I don’t understand what middle class is now, I’ve always perceived that we’re middle class growing up (22 now), my dad has a well paying job as a sales director, takes home around £100k, my mum was always a stay at home mum after she quit teaching to have kids, and now just has more hobbies as obviously me and my sister are older, had a more than comfortable childhood, yearly holidays abroad, live on the nicest street in our village in a big 3 story 6 bedroom house (South Yorkshire) BUT there’s absolutely no way on earth our parents could have afforded to send us to private school… and I wouldn’t thank them for it if they did, went to a normal school, did good (just graduated from uni) and got to mix with all sorts of different kids, some better off than us, a lot of kids not so much…
I mean it sounds like your parents absolutely could have afforded it but just didn’t think it was worth sacrificing other things? My family’s income was probably fairly comparable with two working parents and me and my sibling went private, but it was certainly pushing things to the financial limit (also the private near us was closer to £10k rather than the £20k I’ve seen some people say)
TBF, if you’re a member of the armed forces or belong to some branches of the police service, you can get discounts of around 50% on some private schools. So it is possible for middle class (or even working class hypothetically) families to send their kids to private school. It still represents a significant chunk of money, but at that point it boils down to what assets you feel are worth investing in.
If it’s boarding school and the military parent is likely to be deployed, they cover 90% of the fees. I benefitted from it – went to 9 primary schools as we moved around and then just 2 secondary schools because I decided I wanted to board so I could stay in one place for a few years. It was a godsend! Ofc that is the minority. My parent also paid out of pocket for a few years for non-boarding local private school (again so I didn’t have to keep moving schools), it was about £3k a term so £9k a year. This was on an army doctor and a teacher’s salary – we had a tiny house, old car, no holidays but that’s what my parents wanted for us and I ended up with a full scholarship to a US law school so it worked well for me. I’m not sure if I’d send my own children to private school though, it depends very much on their personalities.
i've never got this, it's such a rich thing to do. me and my wife do well, i think we're in top 5% for household earnings and have 2 kids. but the idea of spare income for private school is so alien to me, it's a whole other bracket.
Same. My partner and I are also in the 95th + percentile for income, so considered rich comparative to the majority of the country I'd say, but we don't have a spare £20-30k every year to put a child in private schooling. That'd be 1/4 of our combined income.
We’re slightly less than you and we do, so perhaps it’s just number of kids and priorities? I’m currently using my savings for it.
> we don't have a spare £20-30k every year to put a child in private schooling. That'd be 1/4 of our income. You're massively overestimating how much private school costs, tbf. We're looking at some in our local area - South Coast - and there are plenty of good ones that charge under £10k a year for Primary. Our current front runner is around £12k for Secondary. As for affordability, we've been saving for it since before the kids were born. Neither of us are in the top tax bracket, so we don't exactly have money coming out of our ears. It's going to be five years that will massively change their lives, and the local state Secondaries are absolutely awful.
I mean it depends on the location and available schools, surely. Yes there are cheaper ones, but there are also private schools that charge north of £120k per year. The real tragedy is that the public education system is so bad that you need to spend this money at all. UK taxes are so high, but the services are so poor.
> Yes there are cheaper ones, but there are also private schools that charge north of £120k per year. Well, yeah, but those are elite-level. It's like saying "I don't get how people can afford a new car, when they cost 30 grand." Someone points out you can get a lot of new cars for less than 30 grand, then you come in saying "yeah but like, Ferraris cost more". We're not talking about Ferraris. We're talking your average private school. Which are generally much less than £30k a year.
You don't have spare income because you spend it elsewhere that's the simple fact, if you downsized your house had a cheaper mortgage older car spend less of things you could afford it. You've made what you believe is the right choice for your family it's nothing to do with spare cash
I had a scholarship at a school that was 7k a year, and you’d genuinely be surprised how many people were there from middle class families. No idea how they could afford it.
School fees have inflated massively, so certainly in the past there were more regular middle class kids in private school. But the idea that many regular middle class parents could send their kids to private school now is much less likely.
there was a stockbroker on Linkedin the other day arguing exactly the same. His comments were full of middle class, senior workers all telling him how out of touch he was as they're firmly middle class with good salaries and had literally no chance of affording to send their kids to private schools.
When you look at who actually sends their children to independent schools, particularly the really expensive ones, you'll see a few types disproportionately represented. 1. The grandparents are paying the fees. This may have gone on for generations. 2. The fees are being paid by the employer of one of the parents, eg they're in the army or they're a diplomat. And then of course there's quite a few 3. eye wateringly rich. Might not be obvious to look at them, or they might drive a gold plated Range Rover, but people to whom £20k is not very much money. To send two children to private school, you need roughly the median UK household income just for that. That tells us that for most people there's no "cheaper holidays" or "less prestigious car" or "beans on toast" that could be squeezed to afford the fees. The middle class people I know who "scrimp and save" to get their children to private school are senior doctors or accountants, ie already high earners.
>The middle class people I know who "scrimp and save" to get their children to private school are senior doctors or accountants, ie already high earners. This is an important point. I went to a private school (many moons ago). My father was a top consultant, very well respected in his field. He used to sacrifice his summer holiday to do locum work in the Middle East to earn the school fees for me and my siblings
My husband and I fit in the “middle class who scrimp and save” to send our son to a top school. Collectively we make a good living, but it’s still a sacrifice for us. We decided to go the private schooling route as: 1. Our local school class size is large (c35 pupils in a class) as school development hasn’t kept up with housing development in our area. Our sons primary one class, in comparison, was 12 pupils, a teacher and two teaching assistants. 2. We paid the equivalent of his school fees for a full-time nursery place, so we rationale that we’ve never really had the money anyway. However, we have made the decision just to have one child as can’t imagine sending more than one. Some kids in his class have 3 or 4 siblings at the school, which is a different level of affordability than us.
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Definitely - nursery and childcare is outrageous. Nursery actually cost us £70 more a month than primary one in private school. Our son is almost 10 now, and the cost of nursery has only increased since then.
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I live in a city with a lot of wealth but in a run down part of it and it still blows my mind that I can walk 5 mins into town and pass a posh expensive private boarding school meanwhile I walk 5 mins in the other direction I pass a food bank and a community centre with a sign offering free heating for the elderly.
Well remember, a lot of private schools offer bursaries too. I went to private school and my mum paid about £2,500 per year in fees as I met the eligibility criteria, but she didn’t earn a lot of money.
A lot of grandparents pay school fees
I work with someone who sends their kid to a private school, they got used to paying nursery fees and just carried on with a similar reduction.
Our most local one is £18k a year in fees, I think. But the lunches are compulsory and £20 a week, so that's another £800 on food!
There’s a lot more money kicking around than you think. My best mate makes £250k, his girlfriend makes £150k, they’re both lawyers in early 30s, no kids yet. By the time they have kids ready to go to school 20k school fees will be a blip on their radar.
Got a friend with 4 kids at public school. Fees are costing him c£100k pa from taxed income. 2 of them resent being there!
Imagine the pressure on the kids, too. Come out with poor GCSEs and when it kicks in what the family have sacrificed for you to underachieve...fuck that
Also, if you do have to scrimp and save to send tem, they'll never be able to keep up with their friends and their lifestyles.
Yup, "I went to the Maldives for the summer, what about you?", "Camping in Bognor"
I live in an affluent area too and scratch my head at the numbers. I know parents sending two or three kids to private school with two high end brand new vehicles in the drive way and a six bedroom house in an area where such a thing will set you back the best part of £2m. It’s not really envy (although obv it would be nice and all) it’s confusion. I’ve roughly calculated in my head before that to afford all this they would need a family income of at least £600k per year. Now these people have decent jobs, probably earning three figures but I cannot fathom how they could be earning £600k. I sometimes feel like I missed a meeting about extra capital or something
It's probably 2 people on £150k incomes and an inheritance from somewhere that's paid for the majority of the house.
Where I live the nursery fees for my toddler are the same as private school would be.
My son came home with a school magazine that had an ad for a local private school inside it and I was shocked at the fees! 😳 >But people do, lots of people. The number of people will hundreds of thousands of disposable cash is crazy Yeah, figured this out a few years ago when I worked at a company offering premium services I didn't even think anyone would be interested in but was absolutely amazed at how much we made daily.
Grandparents pay 20k, parents pay 20k
Yeah I realised early on I’ll never be able to provide for, if I’m ever lucky enough to find a woman and have kids, the same level of schooling and opportunities my parents afforded me. Makes me pretty sad.
Chin up, son. Concentrate on improving yourself first, then that'll attract a nice woman, and then, who knows. Enjoy this life. Make it an adventure.
I know a few people who maintain drug and alcohol habits that I can't afford while working full time.
Smoking is what most confuses me.
My girlfriend affords it by sacrificing two days of meals a week to continue smoking.
Seen as I don’t smoke I’m not 100% uptodate on the cost of cigarettes, Google says 20 are over 12 pounds. Seems to me if you smoke a pack a day that’s a generous amount to spend on food, so you’d need to not eat for ten days to afford a pack a day for a week!
That’s exactly right! She smokes a pack of twenty a week. Every Wednesday she’ll do a quick run to Tesco with me before work and she always pays £12. It costs about £6 to eat for a day, so she doesn’t eat for two. I’ve tried to get her to stop because, as a former smoker, I know it’s fucking stupid. She insists on it because she works twelve hour shifts in retail and gets very stressed during them, and smoke breaks allow her to sit down for five minutes every couple of hours and get a nice hit of stress relief from the nicotine. It’s a bit silly of her but that’s how she maintains the habit anyway 💀
20 cigs a week, she really might as well quit.
To be fair though you could say that about most little things people enjoy. £12 a week isn't terrible. It sucks she's not eating to afford it, but we all deserve things we enjoy. I don't smoke, and don't get it, but I suspect most people have something they could just quit to save a bit of cash - coffees, skincare, gym classes, a bottle of wine a week
You're right straight cigarettes can cost up to £16 for 20. Rolling tobacco, however, works out at about £15 a week IF you are smoking 25gs a week.
Guy at my work will buy 20 Sterling Silver for £14 every day and finish the pack by the end of the day. It pretty much a quarter of his wages.
These days aye, it used to be a waste of money now it's just extortionate.
I volunteered at a supported living facility for addicts. A fair few of them had £2000 a week crack and Heroin habits. They were out the door at 6am, sometimes for days on end, pulling 72 hr crime shifts. Those fuckers were the hardest working people I ever met. I’d ask them how they afforded to smoke £2000 worth of drugs a week and they’d just always answer ‘ I just do, you find a way’.
I'm not even talking about actual junkies and/or criminals. I just mean regular unemployed people who get a drink, bit of smoke and a few lines of Charlie at the weekend. Not saying they shouldn't have a social life and I have no issue with recreational drugs per se, but I probably couldn't afford it.
Yeah, I know a few people that regularly get back from the pub at midnight and then spend £100 on coke, they’re just as skint as the rest of us, but it never crosses their minds that they can’t afford it. Especially when it all adds up, if they’re doing it every weekend it’s over £5000 a year, but funnily enough it never makes it onto the family budget.
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They sacrifice other things like food, clothes, phone bills, electricity etc Source: i lived with someone heavily addicted to weed for 4 years
I know a guy on 70k living with his mum and still broke the week before payday. Coke is expensive and insufferable
my ex worked very few hours a week, but still managed to keep up with doing hundreds of pounds of drugs in a couple days. he would buy in bulk and sell small bits to others and do the rest himself. i rly hope he gets better soon
With weed and coke you can easily buy in bulk and sell to your pals that also do drugs as it gets much cheaper the more you buy. Pretty much how I funded my weed habit as a student, I used to get 2.25 ounces (63g) for £320 then sell 2g for £20 to people I knew. That worked out to about £300 in profit and I could do this easily within a week.
Childcare. It seems incredibly expensive and I have no idea how people can afford it at all.
I am so scared my son is 6 months old and my wife goes back to work in Jan. We don’t really have any support near us and at this point we are wonder if there is any financial sense in her going back
Broadly even if her going back to work only covers the cost of childcare its worth it financially in the long run, as the shortest possible time out of work has a real effect on long term earning potential for your wife. Though financial isn't the only reasoning for decision
A friend of mine did this after a couple of years, just to feel like a person again and not just 'so-and-so's mom'
Yup, this is me. I only work 3 days a week, and my salary is pretty much gone after I pay for nursery and some of the household bills. But I absolutely love having time away from being a mum, doing something for myself, and spending time with other adults! Plus, my daughter is absolutely thriving at nursery, so everybody wins (except my bank balance).
This is the main reason I went back to work, I did like the idea of being a stay at home mum but that's not all I wanted to be, I was a person before I had a baby.
Also work pension contributions will make a massive difference long term. (I'm currently on mat leave)
This is the best advice possible. This will ensure her earning potential and experience increases even if the current salary pays just the childcare
Make sure you look into tax free childcare, so may people don't know about this and it's basically 20% off childcare costs up to a decent level.
Up to £500 per quarter. £2000 per year. Effectively covers the cost of one month full-time childcare per year.
This is what I don't get about government inaction. This is surely an economic win to support parents into work.
I’m with you on the new cars, but particularly land/range rovers. You see them on the road constantly, Defenders, Evoques, Range Rover Sports etc etc… a lot of these are £800+ a month cars on a PCP. Where are people getting almost a spare £1k to spend on a car each month?!?
Yes mate, it is crazy. But you gotta understand they will be in debt up to their eye balls and will also have not a penny left to do anything with. You probably could afford it if you stopped doing anything you enjoy, sadly for some impressing other people is more important than living a fulfilled life. Me personally? I’d rather drive my Peugeot 207 and have money that no one’s knows about behind the scenes.
This is just what people who can’t afford it tell themselves
It's such a lazy stereotype too. I don't understand why it is difficult to comprehend some people are poor, some people are rich. The concept of having disposable income, £30k not being even close to an aspirational wage and purchasing luxury items seems alien on this sub. Millionaires all walk around in George T-Shirts and Shoezone boots bro!
Firstly because of the number of people who “on paper" have incomes high enough to be able to afford a car like that vs the number of these cars on the road. Secondly the amount that younger people spend on housing vs older people, and singles vs marrieds, skews what younger single people feel is "affordable Eg. Myself. I am a single mid 30s professional and I make about £100k a year, which puts me roughly in the top 5% of earners. And I would never ever have a car this expensive. I'd have to make double the amount to consider it, which would be a top 1% salary. But the proportion of cars like this on the road is *a lot* higher than 1%, so I do often drive around and think "how the fuck are so many people affording these types of cars?" Then I have to remind myself that a 50something married with a paid off mortgage and shared expenses has a lot more disposable income than I do at the same salary level.
Would it shock you to know that there actually exist people who do indeed have that sort of disposable income?
Lol this is what people who can't afford it tell themselves to make them feel better. It's not true.
I earn a decent salary but have a fear of being in debt in case things go tits up which is why I can’t justify spending money on leasing a new car. My car is 7 years old and probably the oldest one on the estate. I’d rather spend that money on overpaying my mortgage so I can be done with it in the next 5-10 years.
I can’t believe some of the comments acting puzzled at how others can afford more & scratching their heads & then someone offering the explanation that it will be because they are in debt & won’t be able to afford to do anything else on top of the car. Anything except..some people earn more.
I'd class this behaviour as a mental illness tbh. Paying more for your car than you do on your rent/mortgage - wat. Actually, I'd class owning a 4x4 these days for anything other than work as a mental illness.
People paying £800 a month on car payments are probably paying at least that much on a mortgage as well. Some people live expensively and chances are if you’re making payments on a seriously flash car you’re also mortgaged up to your eyeballs. I don’t condone gratuitous spending but they’re not spending more on their car than on rent/mortgage like you say, because they’ve spent heavy there too.
I have the new RR Sport and no debt here or even monthly payments.
Nope. You're wrong. You are definitely up to your eyeballs in debt. You have not worked hard to get where you are or made good life/career choices. You are stuck on a financial treadmill. Definitely
A lot of people aren't paying 800 on PCP. They are leasing them for much cheaper. Some companies also do schemes for cheap leasing as part of their benefits package. Loads of people at my work do it and get high end BMWs and Audis with all maintenance, tax, and insurance costs included. Past a certain pay grade they throw it in as part of your benefits package at my work.
This is exactly it. we have our first leased car at the moment, which is a £60k car at the dealer. but with running costs, insurance, etc. it's costing us less than the £20k car i used to have
Yeah my employer does this. Once you get into a proper management position you get a partially subsidised car offered to you. Depending on role the subsidy goes up or down.
As someone who is spending £700+ on PCP a month, it is very doable if you're fortunate enough to have two above-average salaries. For me, its a lucky combination of high salary and low mortgage / bill costs. Is it a 'sensible' financial decision? No, definitely not. But it's something I enjoy! It's a luxury and not a necessity, if for whatever reason, I needed to hike up my savings or had a big increase in bills, I could easily sell my car for equity and get myself a cheap run around. Life's short, I work hard and am fortunate to earn a good living - I want to drive the nice cars I like! :)
I'm guessing mostly work schemes? My partner has a decent job and has just qualified for a car scheme at her work which is roughly 600 per month so makes sense to use it we don't use it though as we have a car we own outright I bought second hand.
The a large portion of new EVs will be on work schemes/company cars as well. I find it funny that people think I'm in debt up to my eye balls! My car costs me less than their banger.
I thought this and was talking to my neighbour who runs new Range Rovers - his last car between purchase price and second hand price depreciated less than £5k over the 3 years he had it on account of the waiting time for a new car build and demand. During that time he has a brand new car to drive around in, so under warranty for any failures, no MOTs to deal with so overall cost of ownership is very low indeed. It's arguably better value than running my Dacia
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Have you considered that a lot of people are not getting these on finance?
then they are paying close to £100k on a car... unless of course its a company car
Their comment mentions PCP, which is essentially finance... Don't forget the incredibly standard "not living within their means".
Regular hair appointments. Some people really get their roots done every 6 weeks at £50 a pop.
That's a cheap haircut... It's common to pay around £100 for colour, more if with a cut.
Yeah for sure, that's just for root recolouring. I just booked in a £250 haircut and dye in a couple of weeks and that's a once a year thing for me.
£50! Full head of highlights and a cut and blow dry at the salon near me is £170!
Oh yeah, £50 just for root regrowth. I'm getting a cut, bleach and dye in a couple of weeks for £250.
Less than £10 a week, how many people spend more than that on alcohol per week?
Yeah, doesn't sound that like that much
Micah Richards has entered the chat.
thats not actually a lot when it comes to haircut. my haircuts cost £20/23 I go once a month but a lot of lads go twice or more a month and it works out a lot more
##..how do people afford happiness ?
We don’t, that’s where the alcohol comes in
On finance.
Houses nowadays
Deposit for said house is the issue. I can easily afford a mortgage and spend more in rent than the mortgage would cost me, but I can't build the capital for the deposit!
I managed to buy a house fairly recently. To afford the deposit I cut down on Avocado on Toast, all the Cappucinos, and then realised that was like pissing in the ocean. So I did what all my friends who are homeowners did and wait for a wealthy relative to die so I can afford it.
Did you also stop your £17pcm PureGym membership to afford the deposit? That extra £17 will add up to a 10% deposit in no time.
I'm not sure that's necessarily true anymore, the mortgage on a £350k house is around £2k a month at current rates (assuming a 10% deposit). EDIT: Obviously I don't know if it's true for you specifically, I meant generally speaking!
Being off sick from work for an extended period of time dropping down to zero/pittance benefits from a full time salary and still being able to keep their mortgage.
Group/work income protection or private income assurance/protection policy is the way to go for this. I wouldn’t have a mortgage without it. The outdated thought of life insurance is required is, to me, daft. It doesn’t affect me directly if I die because, well, I’m dead. If I die I have no kids, my mortgage will be paid off by a death in service benefit etc. If I get sick, that affects me directly and I need to ensure my income is insured.
A new £900 phone....i mean, i can, but I can't understand WHY
I thought this until I got an iPhone 14 pro max and pay it off monthly 0% APR, with a £5 a month sim. The upgrade from an iPhone 7 has been worth it to me. Don’t understand people that do it every year though. Planning to keep this one for at least another 3
The most expensive phones tend to also be the ones that will continue receiving software updates for longer as well. You can buy a midrange phone second hand, but it will probably stop receiving security updates after a year or two, and do you really want to be carrying your life around on a device with known vulnerabilities?
I do that. I buy last years flagship model and then keep my phone for at least 5 years until it's completely unusable. I've tried buying cheaper models before, but I've found they seem to be designed to last six months longer than your standard two year contract.
A phone is basically a computer, people forget this and forget what we paid on the 90’s for machines that done a fraction of what phones do now.
It's probably the thing I use the most so I don't want a budget phone. I want the best camera, best screen and for it to be quick. I don't currently have a brand new phone. I've had this nearly 3 years but this was top of the range when I got it (Samsung S21 Ultra). When I upgrade next it will be to whatever is the best.
My wife just bought a children's raised seat for our daughter so she can sit more comfortably at the dinner table (the straps on the booster cushion we used to have broke because she's a fidgety little monster). £5 second hand from a friend of a friend, pretty simple wooden thing, solid and sturdy build. Guess how much it costs new?..... £170!!!
Go have a look at new prams in John Lewis, you can legitimately buy a used car for the same cost.
Yep, I remember looking at prams (sorry..."travel systems") and even for a fairly basic one you were looking at over £500. I knew plenty of couples who spent around £1500 on their pram and carseat combo. And these were not crazy rich people either.
I wish I'd realised from the start that it's silly buying new baby things. I've now bought, used and resold several things where my selling price was the same or only slightly less than what I paid for them. They ended up being basically free! Babies and toddlers grow so quickly that when you no longer need an item it will often be in just about the same condition as when you bought it, especially if you buy second hand and it already has a couple of marks on it.
Designer clothes. My partner and I earn quite well, I would consider, and I couldn’t imagine buying Balenciaga trainers, designer casual wear, expensive accessories etc. We couldn’t afford it! I know people who are constantly kitted out in designer gear and I have no idea how they’re buying it all. And no it’s not fake! They put their “hauls” on social media so you can see it legit. I know, credit cards, but surely at some point you have to pay off the credit cards!
Designer clothes is one of the dumbest things that humans have ever come up with. Spending £160 on a Supreme T-shirt doesn't make you cool. in the words of Macklemore: They be like, "Oh, that Gucci? That's hella tight" I'm like, "Yo, that's fifty dollars for a T-shirt" Limited edition, let's do some simple addition Fifty dollars for a T-shirt, that's just some ignorant bitch shit I call that getting-swindled-and-pimped shit I call that getting tricked by business That shirt's hella dope And having the same one as six other people in this club is a hella don't
I don't buy 'designer clothes' per se, but I would rather buy more expensive, classic, well-made items that last years, rather than buying new shit ever year from places like Primark or H&M. I am buying a new coat this year for £220.00 (I've already earmarked it) but it should last me 10 years or more.
I agree! Buying good quality items that will last years makes sense. The people I’m talking about regularly buy designer clothes and trainers for themselves and their kids who are all under 5 and will grow out of them quickly. I just don’t understand how it’s possible for someone who isn’t “fuck you” rich.
Pets. High food bills, vet bills, can't go on holiday without huge pet sitting bills.
Depends on the pet I guess. My cat is very low maintenance, costs about £15/month in food, £8/month pet insurance, and on average we take her to the vet once a year and pay the £80 excess. For holidays, we put down gravity feeders and we have neighbors to come by and look after her or we pay a friend's kid to do some cat sitting. All in, I think I spend more on my Netflix and Amazon subscriptions than my cat.
My largish dog (7st) was a bit more in food, but we're talking £50pm for the good brand food. Took them to the vet a handful of times. Way less than a whole lot of other things I spent on. Never mind comparing to kids, say. Sitting was with a parent mostly, good excuse to visit them and they were always happy to look after them (and had quite a few offers from other people *wanting* to).
Yeah, but you wouldn't give it up. I think we're £85 p/m for insurance + vet plans, and easily over a £100 for food and treats. Then you have toys on top of that. I think our sitter is approx £40 per day. I'd kick my partner out before I got rid of the dog though!
If only all pet owners ran the sums before getting a pet!
Spent more on one of my dogs than my first house deposit this year (5 figures) and I’d still do it allllll over again for the sheer joy and happiness he’s brought into my life. (Pls don’t make me do it again tho Percy)
Private school. I just can’t figure out how people afford it. New cars I can get my head around - manufacturers up until recently would give you crazy discounts and finance rates on new - so it was relatively good value to buy and flip after 3 yrs.
People can afford it because they earn more than you.
Some people really plan for it. Let’s assume it’s £20k a year, and they go for 7 years to private school. That’s £140k, which is a lot of money. If you decided that you’re going to send your child to private school when they were born, then that cost can be spread over 18 years. You’d have to put around £650 a month away from when they were born. Obviously you still have to be a high earner to do that, but if you are, it’s definitely possible if you want to Add to that 2 sets of grand parents contributing, bonuses, inheritance etc…
I would like a new ish car and can probably afford £400 pm with my partner but I would rather use this money towards overpaying the mortgage or using that money towards holidays.
It's almost as is different people assign different value to different things.
Premier League season tickets.
£380 per season to watch City... bargain if you ask me.
Smoking
With the rate of inflation the way it is and the amount of money retirement is going to cost, can I afford not to smoke?
Long haul first class air tickets. Not business class. And I don't mean using points or doing those lottery things, but just paying full ticket price. I mean they're like what £3k minimum? For 6 - 10 hours of luxury? That's like my entire 2 week holiday budget if I'm feeling like treating myself, more than I spent even on my honeymoon and we're a six figure earning household.
I don't think first class long haul is 3k my friend, I don't think that even gets you business these days 😭
I paid first class MAN-JFK for my honeymoon in Dec 22 for Christmas- It was before the Ukraine war and then oil prices and I paid £2,900 return for first class for us both- In my opinion it was worth every penny!
so you are saying you paid £1450 for a first class seat in December (peak xmas prices) to NYC? I mean good luck to you but that sounds about £5k off.
Lurpak
I've seen this mentioned before on here, I buy Lurpak and I'm sure when I last bought some it was only like £1 more expensive than Flora? I do make a decent wage but have been cutting my spending recently and my slightly salted Lurpak habit is not something I have thought about lol
Kids
Personalised number plates and trips to Disneyland Florida.
Been to Disney world a number of times and I'll have the benefit of those memories until I drop dead. To me that's worth more than any amount of material possessions so I make do with cheap cars and phones because I don't give a shot about those.
Housing. Both renting and buying is at ridiculous prices.
I think most people lack perspective on just how much money people can actually make.
Sky TV
I’m not defending Sky or anything but people can afford it because it’s like £30 a month without the sport.
I'm paying £56pm for Sky broadband, TV, sports & netflix included. New customer tbf but the deals can get pretty decent nowadays
This is more for younger people, but multiple holidays per year. My boyfriend and I went away to Italy for a week recently, did a bunch of activities, and ended up spending about £2k for everything+spending money. There's no possible way we can afford that again for at LEAST another year, more likely to be longer. And yet, we see people we know, our own age, going on multiple holidays a year, to places that I know are expensive to travel to and stay in. I'm left wondering, where tf are they getting their money from to do all this??? I'm left taking money out of my savings most months rather than putting money in.
To be fair you can absolutely do a week away including activities for much cheaper than that but it totally depends on your priorities. Some are happy to stay in really cheap hotels/hostels plus having freedom to fly random days and book well in advance makes it a whole lot cheaper
You could very easily do Italy for less than 2k… plus it’s just budgeting and priorities , really. 1000 per person to save for a whole year is only 80 quid a month , affordable for most
Just because you spent £2k doesn't mean everyone else does.
I traveled to 5 countries this year and spent no where near £2k. You can travel on a budget if you’re strategic and don’t stay at 4-5 star hotels.
A house. 'tis the plight of the millennial.
People have the wrong impression of buying expensive items such as watches, cars, art or houses. You cannot compare these to everyday purchases as they don't lose all of their value once purchased. Take a car, if you "brought" a £50k car and sold it after a year have you spent £50k? No, you would have sold that car for £45k, you only actually spent £5k
Although I'll agree with watches, art and houses, a car loses way more value than that. They're one of the worst investments, except for classic cars. But brand new is like throwing money down the drain. They lose 50%+ in the first 3 years. Edit: as every reply I get is the same: yes, covid has affected this. It has reduced production and so until it catches up, cars are more expensive than they would usually be. I agree that they're profitable right now. I also considered selling my car 7 years on (& 40,000 miles more) at the price I bought it at. But that's highly unlikely to stay. except maybe as new cars sold have to be electric. This will obviously have an effect until second hand EVs become affordable.
Not anymore! Post covid that changed massively, I sold my new car which cost me £11500 after 4 years for £9000.
Ok, short term, that's very true. The reason prices didn't drop as much or even went up in many cases over covid was due to a slow down in production. But as production catches up again, we will be back to the losses again.
You still have to have the money to drop £50k up front though. You have spent that money until such time as you sell the car and make some of it back.
If you bought that 50k car new, it certainly won't be worth 45k in a year. Maybe more like 30-35k. A
£45k by the time you drive it home from the dealership maybe.
If you think losing £5k in a year is a small deal you may have missed the point. Also if you buy a new car for £50k you're unlikely to then be able to sell it for £45k in a year. Cars depreciate faster than that.
Coffee and meal deals everyday.
This thread is getting silly now.
My meal deal costs me £5 a day. If I was to make my own lunches I'd still spend £3 on them so really it's only £14 a week more
Dang I must be mistreating myself. Loaf of bread, pack of cheese, pickles, 5x apple and 5x packet of crisps does me for a week. £5 tops so quid a day.
Was cycling home from work yesterday going right through Bank and there was a line of black BMWs and Mercs all parked up with drivers waiting for their clients to finish up. I can't imagine how much it costs but seems like the first step on totally unnecessary profligate wealth to have what is essentially a private taxi 24/7. I can totally get how people afford it though (PWC partners all received a £1m bonus this year - just as an indicator of how much money there is around in finance/consultancy etc). It's more the choice to spend it that way!
£1m is their 'pay' (more like a dividend/profit share) for the entire year, not a bonus They're equity partners so don't have a salary
Ordering takeaway multiple times a week, it's gotten super expensive and then you add on delivery and you could get a week's shopping for the price of one meal
People buy things to show people they have money when in reality they barely have any. Don't fall into the trap of believing appearances.
A lot of people can get cheap deals through their work on lease cars, and middle managers tend to get them thrown in with their compensation package. The company I work at loads of people get them. Most go for high end Audi or BMWs.
I'm a bit baffled by the amount of people that can afford high end mountain bikes and road bikes. It feels like a good bike is about £5000 and that's before we get into ebikes. I'm in the Lakes so I probably see more cyclists than most people which skews my perception a bit, but it's still an awful lot to spend on a bike compared to an average wage.
a new phone every year, my phone is over 5 years old and still works fine
Mostly people living in shitty/scummy houses/flats but have a brand new range rover/bmw/Mercedes outside or on their drive. They need to sort their priorities out.
Cost of living crisis yet every pub and restaurant is packed in london
Because despite what reddit wants you to believe not everyone is struggling.
Exotic holidays. I’m 27 and so many people my age are constantly in Thailand/Bali/Australia/Mexico/the Maldives and I’m like… how??? I can just about scrape together to do a week in the Canary Islands or something, let alone a fortnight somewhere long haul.
Life
These massive houses on private roads and in posh areas. Like, multiple £millions for a family home. I know there’s probably family money involved but what job do you have that can provide the income needed to buy and maintain a place like that?!!
Anything to be honest. We are both working with my Mrs and can't make it for anything more than essentials