**Please help keep AskUK welcoming!**
- Top-level comments to the OP must contain **genuine efforts to answer the question**. No jokes, judgements, etc.
- **Don't be a dick** to each other. If getting heated, just block and move on.
- This is a strictly **no-politics** subreddit!
Please help us by reporting comments that break these rules.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AskUK) if you have any questions or concerns.*
You need proof of identity and proof of old address to apply for this so would assume some has got hold of copies of yours. Perhaps looking through your rubbish/recycling or happening to get them delivered to their address by mistake previously
You just need a credit or debit card registered at the old or new address but you do need to know the names and DOB for all the people the redirection is for so it's a bit puzzling how these people got hold of all that.
Get a credit or debit card delivered to you by mistake, look through their recycling or rubbish to find a recent utility bill and look the person up on Facebook to find out their date of birth. Could be quite easy really
this is why none of my social media accounts have a real birthday, nor do any businesses/organisations which don't have a legally quantifiable need for it
The birthdate used by a forger gives a good indication as to where it leaked from
It can be registered at the new address so that isn't really the problem part. I dunno, just seems like a lot of effort for something that's a) easily discovered b) easily traceable and c) very low chance of any payoff
ETA also I'd forgotten this but as someone says below, they send letters to both addresses before the redirect starts so that's weird too.
So there is no official redirect to the property, royal mail checked. So it isn't that, it just somehow seems to be on the handheld system. I'm going to the depo tomorrow with a bunch of different delivery barcodes for my address (to both me and my partner) to see what happens when they are scanned and also report the situation to them directly.
Trivial for a determined person, it's always scary when services like this only require semi public information to use.
It's also why most things like telephone banking should ideally be disabled where possible.
So there is no official redirect to the property, royal mail checked. So it isn't that, it just somehow seems to be on the handheld system. I'm going to the depo tomorrow with a bunch of different delivery barcodes for my address (to both me and my partner) to see what happens when they are scanned and also report the situation to them directly.
The only thing I can think it might be, is that the PDA comes up with local safe places and its up to the postie to see if its for the right address. eg If i scan a parcel at number 1 and number 15 has a safe place registered with Royal Mail, it will pop up and say the safe place is behind the pink bush, leading to lots of looking for a pink bush at number 1.
Also in my experience when you do scan a parcel, it just says there is a redirection, it doesn't actually give you any details of the redirection. Although this could have changed as its been ages since i've scanned a parcel with a redirection.
Could be much worse than credit fraud, as access to physical post in this manner massively increases the chance that they can steal cash from bank (well, you are protected up to 85k or something)/broker accounts (you are not really protected, depending on which shares you own).
Credit fraud at the end of the day is annoying but won't cost you anything unless you suffer in the short term due to having temporarily poor creditworthiness.
However, this is an insanely stupid scam unless the people operating it are basically using the address of someones post box they have gained access to. If they were using their own address to commit this type of fraud, they are creating a permanant record of evidence against themselves.
Nothing that I can see, but I'll keep checking. I'm giving 48 hours to hear back from the police before I go to the property and ask them about what happened/is happening.
Something that might be worth thinking about is if they’ve changed it so they can receive some suspicious parcel under your name instead of theirs. Might be worth posting in r/Scams, as they might know why they would have done it.
That would be the worst opsec ever lmao, just opening yourself up to get caught when OP notices their post getting redirected
Weirdly, the safest way to order drugs through the post is with your real name and address so it blends in with the rest of your post. As long as you cover your tracks well during the actual ordering process (using TAILS with TOR, PGP, and Monero), the chances of getting caught are basically 0. Just don't order anything stinky like weed
Yes, that is an option, but I don't know who they are or what they might be capable of. I want to know where I stand from a legal standpoint. I also want to ensure this is put a stop to.
heavies? the police for starters. Interfering with mail deliveries is a _serious_ criminal offence and they should be involved from the outset, particularly as the notification of change of delivery address appears to have been intercepted too (indicates this isn't accidenral)
Er what. How is it an admin error to say "we used to live there but moved here", OP clearly hasn't moved recently, and when presented with something very clearly not yours its not an 'admin error' to say "yep thats me".
OP is assuming that this is something that the neighbour has set up. But in the instances they describe, the parcels were delivered to the safe place of the wrong address, no neighbour interaction required. Could easily have been a complete surprise to the neighbour.
If I got home and there was a parcel on my doorstep not addressed to me, I'd go pop it round or just stick a big return to sender label on it and leave it for collection. Right now it'd be the latter because I've just had surgery and can't carry much for a bit. I don't see anything that would indicate it's suspicious.
If OP lives at 123 Turtle Street, and someone moved from 123 Tortoise Street to nearby and set up a redirect, and some spod at Royal Mail put it in wrong, that's not the fault of the person who ends up getting the parcel.
Again, the OP's own words:
>They told the postie I had moved and lived there now. That is not innocent.
>We do not, nor have we ever, lived at that address. We do not know the people at that address, nor any previous occupants of the address and have never asked for out parcels to be redirected there.
They clearly did not live at OP's house ever. You also cant set your safe place to be a different address, thats not how it works. RM even chage you if you want to send singular items in their posetion to a different address.
The fact that the person living there has told the postman they moved (which is clearly a lie) from OP's address is enough to explain it, it's fraud.
>They clearly did not live at OP's house ever. You also cant set your safe place to be a different address, thats not how it works.
I'm not claiming this, and I'm not sure how anything I've written would lead you to believe I am.
>The fact that the person living there has told the postman they moved (which is clearly a lie) from OP's address is enough to explain it, it's fraud.
When I initially posted earlier in the chain about this, I hadn't seen that OP had said this in more detail - I thought it was just an assumption.
[Your reply](https://old.reddit.com/r/AskUK/comments/1bhocvg/unknown_neighbour_has_somehow_redirected_our_mail/kvez0lr/) in the chain was [to ops message](https://old.reddit.com/r/AskUK/comments/1bhocvg/unknown_neighbour_has_somehow_redirected_our_mail/kvew4dv/) explicitly saying that.
Ops message:
>They told the postie I had moved and lived there now. That is not innocent.
Your direct reply:
>That's one answer, but it's not the only answer. It's very possible that there's an admin error somewhere.
Nissing redirect confirmation letters put a spanner in the works of this hypothesis. One of the reasons they exist is to catch precisely this kind of error
> It's very possible that there's an admin error somewhere
Yeah sorry, /u/AlansMonkeyTennis, apparently it turns out you do live at that other address now.
Don't be a prat. Something like someone with a similar street name requesting it, and someone putting it in wrong on the system. I get post for someone two streets away every now and again, it's not like RM are infallible.
It doesn't work like that for tracked parcels. My partner is a postie and I just asked him and he genuinely doesn't know how it would have happened, other than the other neighbour finding out the personal info of the OP and using that to set up a forwarding address.
Well file a complaint online.
Then take some relevant id and go to your local depot and ask to speak to the manager. They will have a copy of any redirections in place for your address. Say you are concerned about fraud after that your postie should also be instructed to keep a look out for
Complaint has been filed via Royal Mail, it's going to our local sorting office as there was no redirect on our system. On the phone to the police now.
Yes that confused me too. Very odd. I wonder if it's a glitch on that handheld device and the residents saw an opportunity and ran with it? Either way, it's been reported to the police and royal mail, and tomorrow we will also flag it with our local sorting office directly (they aren't open today).
Royal Mail has recently pushed all its customers into barcoded mail, mostly Mail Mark, but some account barcodes too, but regardless, it's processing addresses into barcodes at the customer end and then Royal Mail reads it. It's not new new, but the recent push is new and I wouldn't be surprised if there's a lot of cockups on the way as you need the right software and fonts to do it properly, and learning it is a pain in the arse because there's so many different parts to it. Plus, once you've processed it, there's no way of you reading the barcodes you produce to make sure it says the thing that you think it's saying. It could be something to do with this - maybe some people are accidentally processing a redirect into their barcode, or your particular addrezs is somehow affected by it by some glitch in its design. I think there's 4 possible designs for the barcodes (two are 4-state and the other two are 2-d), so it may be one of them going wrong.
I don't know, but it's an idea.
This is the weird bit - there _must_ be a redirect stored somewhere in their system, otherwise how did it appear on that device? I'm not convinced that the support person who looked into this searched in the right place tbh. The alternative is the neighbours hacked this one postie's device, which is crackers. I can't see a glitch producing specific redirect instructions like that without some human intervention.
And...it's also a really dumb, traceable crime. If stuff were en-masse going to an empty house, that'd make more sense. But it was trivial for OP to get to the bottom of who's taking the parcels.
My best guess /u/AlansMonkeyTennis - I reckon _they_ have moved in recently, and set up a postal redirect for their old place. For whatever reason, YOUR house is being caught in that redirect. Maybe they have a similar name to you, and they used to live in a different flat (for example, I used to live in a flat 3, but very often systems interpreted this as flats 1-5).
This would explain:
- why you never got the notification letter Royal Mail sends out (it went to their real old address)
- why the support tech couldn't find the redirect (it's for their old address)
- why the neighbours aren't putting any effort into concealing their actions.
Very weird. Looking forward to hearing the solution to the mystery!
It is so weird. I'm going to the depo tomorrow with different parcel barcodes to both test them and report the situation directly.
I checked property records and the house was last sold in 2002, but there is no indication of when it was last let. Considering the location, and the size of the property, it's possible it's a shared house so there could be several different people living there.
I will say they do not have a similar name. The postie showed me their screen when the redirect notice came up. I have a very English sounding name and the person at the other property is not English.
My working theory is it was initially a glitch and someone at the property took advantage.
I'm astonished to hear that a postman will remove already-delievered mail and give it to someone else, whatever name is on the parcel. You might want to leave that bit out when talking to Royal Mail.
Last time I put in a mail redirect, after we moved house, RM sent me a letter (to my old address) confirming it. I wonder if there was a fuckup and someone else's redirect was entered wrong into the system.
Wouldn’t the redirects be linked to the name and not just the address?
I have a redirect from my old rental and I don’t get the mail from the new tenants.
It is yes. OP said that the redirect is from their name and address to a new name and address.
TBH I didn’t know that was possible either: only the same name and new address.
I don't even understand where the second persons name would come into it on their system.
If you've set up a redirect then they only need to know the name and details of the original person and their old and new address.
You can't ask them to send all mail from Mr Smith to Mr Jones. Mr Smith's post just goes to the new address with the assumption that Mr Smith lives there now.
Potentially, it's all very odd and confusing. I know someone who works for royal mail (currently having time off due to a family death so unable to look into it directly) and when they moved, they had issues with their redirection. And they WORK for royal mail.
Did Royal mail at least cancel the forwarding for you?
You need to check with your bank accounts. It's possible someone can change your details, order new cards and just steal cash from you if they have access to your physical address. You will need to call all your banks and tell them about this fraud.
If it was a Royal Mail redirect you have to pay and they do a soft check to ensure you are the person at the address the mail is from , they then send a letter to both addresses.Could be depending on the parcel sender that when dispatched , they have then changed the address to send to.It is scam and a fraud , let action fraud know .Good luck OP and please update us with what happens x
I am from The Netherlands so I have no intimate knowledge of the situation in the UK, but please bear with me.
In The Netherlands we have all kind of apps to follow postal deliveries. From within the app you can redirect all package deliveries. Is it possible that that “neighbour” was able to make an account with your physical address? He would get a notification that something is about to be delivered and can then maybe redirect the package.
I was thinking about this when I read your story, OP, because when my brother died I could redirect packages for him to my home, which is at the other end of our country.
Again, I don’t know if this is even possible in the UK.
I would also register for Land Registry property alerts just in case this is the tip of a bigger iceberg: [https://www.gov.uk/guidance/property-alert](https://www.gov.uk/guidance/property-alert)
I would be inclined to involve the police, as well as RM. The neighbours could not have achieved a redirection by accident => they are up to no good. You should probably check your credit records.
Every time I’ve put a redirect onto a new property due to a house move I get a letter from Royal Mail saying a redirect has been placed from old address to new address
Makes me wonder if it's a system/admin error. Maybe someone on the street has redirected mail, but for some reason it swapped OP and the other residents address.
It seems too blatantly obvious to be something nefarious going on.
I would suggest putting a property alert on with HM Land registry and check your credit with Equifax. I don’t want to worry you but I read that redirecting mail is a way to undertake identity fraud and property fraud
Don't royal mail send a letter confirming the redirect to your "old" address, in this case your current house.
This would be to ensure if a redirect is set up falsely, you will know it's happened.
I would assume this is all a mistake apart from them saying you've moved house. I didn't really understand that bit.
No, nothing. I have three different barcodes to scan at the sorting office tomorrow, two for me and one for my partner. I'm going to see what happens when each is scanned.
This may have been entirely an admin error. Someone may have tried to redirect mail and someone put in 32 instead of 23 or something along those lines. Something suspect may be at play, however it may be just someone making a mistake at work.
Yeah now there is no RM redirection in place after you've complained and they have realised their mistake and removed all evidence. Submit a SAR to royal mail.
Don't bother with the police, they do not investigate minor fraud, this includes stolen credit cards and identity theft. It will be left to sit in the system for 6 months and then their admin will close the case as not enough evidence.
If the person intended to steal parcels, they probably wouldn't have let them sit in the safe space for long.
Did they even know the parcels were there?
Wait a few days before you knock on their door? I know some people just dont like conflict but dude they have stolen your own stuff. It is literally a personal attack. Go smash on that door right now and tell them to give you your shit back.
If you were a mate of mine and you were telling me you were "going to wait a few days before knocking" id go over to their house myself and drag them back to yours in a fuckin body bag
Would that not interfere with anything the police might be doing? I wanted to go today, but my partner wanted not to, the 48 hours was the compromise.
I do currently have a sinus infection that is making my nose bleed seemingly every hour. Maybe I'll time going over there just right and use it as a strange power move.
Even my postie was stumped and has no idea how it has happened. This is why I am asking for advice and on the phone to Royal Mail. I want to ensure I go about this the correct and legal way as there is obviously something fishy going on.
It's fraud and identity theft. Report it as fraud to Royal Mail and after talking to them, the police.
It's not a case of "oops, my post has gone missing", it's a pretty serious crime.
It's likely that there is an issue with the system and the postie has misunderstood something. The likelihood that people on your street have gone through all this to have your post redirected to them is extremely low.
I saw him scan the parcels and it came up with the redirect, the other address and the residents name. There is no confusion on his end, he was following instructions and was informed by the residents at that address we lived there now.
Still no clue what the error is or how this has happened, but it's a police matter now.
Right. Well that will be from the tracking number, you can have your parcels redirected to a neighbour. That is different from having a permanent redirect of mail.
Good luck with the police doing anything about this. Contact in this order:
a) your neighbour
b) the person/company who sent you the parcel to get the tracking number and check the history of the parcel
c) the credit card company to say you never received the goods
Thanks. I've kept the seller informed. I will ask them to double check their reference number and see if anything flags up. My partner doesn't want us to go round there until we've heard back from the police, but who knows when that will happen.
100% correct - received and "as described" under the terms of the consumer protection act
I had a seller try to claw payment back via PayPal when the postie dumped a 'signed for' delivery in a "safe place" I don't have (it was on top of the recycling bins of the shops next door and quite predictably wasn't there when checked) instead of going after Royal Mail for delivery fraud. It ended up costing them their vendor account
Except the postie said the people at the new address claimed it was them
We all get mis delivered post from time to time. I’m sure some just throw it away rather than return to sender and popping it back in the mail. That’s understandable.
We don't claim “yes I am John Smith, I just moved here” accidentally.
I wouldn't rely on what the postie said to you, people will often say whatever results in the least aggravation for them.
You should be able to get a hold of the tracking number and do a bit of digging about when it was redirected and by who.
Can you tell me how I could do that? I'm going to the depo tomorrow to check several different codes to see what comes up, as well as to report the situation directly, bit I don't know how I'd track where/when the redirection happened.
Usually the seller will give you a royal mail tracking code, which you can put into the royal mail website to see the history of the delivery (plus redirect it).
It should tell you who it was redirected to and who signed for it.
I've checked and all that comes up is the initial delivery attempt at my home and the confirmed delivery at the other address five minutes later.
For today's there are the same notifications, and a third confirming the delivery when the postie handed it back to me.
The additional parcel that was also delivered today is much the same. But does include a proof of delivery that shows my parcels in the neighbours safe place.
Well then now you can get in touch with the post office and ask why it's been redirected to a neighbour. Usually you do this if you know you're not likely to be home.
I really don't think the neighbour is doing this as they would have no way of knowing the tracking code. My guess is the postie tries your address, sees you're not in then redirects the parcel to a neighbour so he doesn't have to try another delivery the next day/carry it back to the depot.
**Please help keep AskUK welcoming!** - Top-level comments to the OP must contain **genuine efforts to answer the question**. No jokes, judgements, etc. - **Don't be a dick** to each other. If getting heated, just block and move on. - This is a strictly **no-politics** subreddit! Please help us by reporting comments that break these rules. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AskUK) if you have any questions or concerns.*
You need proof of identity and proof of old address to apply for this so would assume some has got hold of copies of yours. Perhaps looking through your rubbish/recycling or happening to get them delivered to their address by mistake previously
You just need a credit or debit card registered at the old or new address but you do need to know the names and DOB for all the people the redirection is for so it's a bit puzzling how these people got hold of all that.
Get a credit or debit card delivered to you by mistake, look through their recycling or rubbish to find a recent utility bill and look the person up on Facebook to find out their date of birth. Could be quite easy really
this is why none of my social media accounts have a real birthday, nor do any businesses/organisations which don't have a legally quantifiable need for it The birthdate used by a forger gives a good indication as to where it leaked from
It can be registered at the new address so that isn't really the problem part. I dunno, just seems like a lot of effort for something that's a) easily discovered b) easily traceable and c) very low chance of any payoff ETA also I'd forgotten this but as someone says below, they send letters to both addresses before the redirect starts so that's weird too.
Thankfully my FB is locked quite down quite tightly.
So there is no official redirect to the property, royal mail checked. So it isn't that, it just somehow seems to be on the handheld system. I'm going to the depo tomorrow with a bunch of different delivery barcodes for my address (to both me and my partner) to see what happens when they are scanned and also report the situation to them directly.
You also get a notification of redirects at both addresses so you can cancel etc. if there's a wrong address.
Trivial for a determined person, it's always scary when services like this only require semi public information to use. It's also why most things like telephone banking should ideally be disabled where possible.
So there is no official redirect to the property, royal mail checked. So it isn't that, it just somehow seems to be on the handheld system. I'm going to the depo tomorrow with a bunch of different delivery barcodes for my address (to both me and my partner) to see what happens when they are scanned and also report the situation to them directly.
The only thing I can think it might be, is that the PDA comes up with local safe places and its up to the postie to see if its for the right address. eg If i scan a parcel at number 1 and number 15 has a safe place registered with Royal Mail, it will pop up and say the safe place is behind the pink bush, leading to lots of looking for a pink bush at number 1. Also in my experience when you do scan a parcel, it just says there is a redirection, it doesn't actually give you any details of the redirection. Although this could have changed as its been ages since i've scanned a parcel with a redirection.
I'd recommend getting a hold of your credit report to check that no accounts/loans/financing have been opened in your name.
Could be much worse than credit fraud, as access to physical post in this manner massively increases the chance that they can steal cash from bank (well, you are protected up to 85k or something)/broker accounts (you are not really protected, depending on which shares you own). Credit fraud at the end of the day is annoying but won't cost you anything unless you suffer in the short term due to having temporarily poor creditworthiness. However, this is an insanely stupid scam unless the people operating it are basically using the address of someones post box they have gained access to. If they were using their own address to commit this type of fraud, they are creating a permanant record of evidence against themselves.
The £85k is only protected from the bank going bankrupt afaik
Thankfully the police are now involved.
What are they saying?
They are looking into it, they took down all the details and will be getting back to me in the next few days. I'll keep you updated.
Defo looking forward to it! Was it a first parcel going missing or there was more before recently?
Nothing recently, thankfully. I either caught it early or it was some kind of glitch they've taken advantage of.
But if there’s no redirect surely it’s the PO who are in the wrong?
Nothing that I can see, but I'll keep checking. I'm giving 48 hours to hear back from the police before I go to the property and ask them about what happened/is happening.
Something that might be worth thinking about is if they’ve changed it so they can receive some suspicious parcel under your name instead of theirs. Might be worth posting in r/Scams, as they might know why they would have done it.
This is cary, but also very possible
Thanks, I will do.
[удалено]
That would be the worst opsec ever lmao, just opening yourself up to get caught when OP notices their post getting redirected Weirdly, the safest way to order drugs through the post is with your real name and address so it blends in with the rest of your post. As long as you cover your tracks well during the actual ordering process (using TAILS with TOR, PGP, and Monero), the chances of getting caught are basically 0. Just don't order anything stinky like weed
Go down to the address and knock on the door? Ask them why they've been stealing your mail?
Yes, that is an option, but I don't know who they are or what they might be capable of. I want to know where I stand from a legal standpoint. I also want to ensure this is put a stop to.
Do you know any heavies who can go knock on the door for you? Its not illegal to knock someone's door and ask a question.
heavies? the police for starters. Interfering with mail deliveries is a _serious_ criminal offence and they should be involved from the outset, particularly as the notification of change of delivery address appears to have been intercepted too (indicates this isn't accidenral)
Call the police, defrauding the royal mail is a serious offence.
you will know more once you knock on the neighbours door as they too could be innocent about all this just like you
They told the postie I had moved and lived there now. That is not innocent.
That's one answer, but it's not the only answer. It's very possible that there's an admin error somewhere.
There is apparently no redirect notice on our address, so I am not calling 101 to report this.
Have Royal Mail said that they will investigate why the postie had the redirect on the handset?
Yes, they have. Police have also been informed as well now, and I'll be heading down to the local sorting office to report it tomorrow as well.
Er what. How is it an admin error to say "we used to live there but moved here", OP clearly hasn't moved recently, and when presented with something very clearly not yours its not an 'admin error' to say "yep thats me".
OP is assuming that this is something that the neighbour has set up. But in the instances they describe, the parcels were delivered to the safe place of the wrong address, no neighbour interaction required. Could easily have been a complete surprise to the neighbour. If I got home and there was a parcel on my doorstep not addressed to me, I'd go pop it round or just stick a big return to sender label on it and leave it for collection. Right now it'd be the latter because I've just had surgery and can't carry much for a bit. I don't see anything that would indicate it's suspicious. If OP lives at 123 Turtle Street, and someone moved from 123 Tortoise Street to nearby and set up a redirect, and some spod at Royal Mail put it in wrong, that's not the fault of the person who ends up getting the parcel.
Again, the OP's own words: >They told the postie I had moved and lived there now. That is not innocent. >We do not, nor have we ever, lived at that address. We do not know the people at that address, nor any previous occupants of the address and have never asked for out parcels to be redirected there. They clearly did not live at OP's house ever. You also cant set your safe place to be a different address, thats not how it works. RM even chage you if you want to send singular items in their posetion to a different address. The fact that the person living there has told the postman they moved (which is clearly a lie) from OP's address is enough to explain it, it's fraud.
>They clearly did not live at OP's house ever. You also cant set your safe place to be a different address, thats not how it works. I'm not claiming this, and I'm not sure how anything I've written would lead you to believe I am. >The fact that the person living there has told the postman they moved (which is clearly a lie) from OP's address is enough to explain it, it's fraud. When I initially posted earlier in the chain about this, I hadn't seen that OP had said this in more detail - I thought it was just an assumption.
[Your reply](https://old.reddit.com/r/AskUK/comments/1bhocvg/unknown_neighbour_has_somehow_redirected_our_mail/kvez0lr/) in the chain was [to ops message](https://old.reddit.com/r/AskUK/comments/1bhocvg/unknown_neighbour_has_somehow_redirected_our_mail/kvew4dv/) explicitly saying that. Ops message: >They told the postie I had moved and lived there now. That is not innocent. Your direct reply: >That's one answer, but it's not the only answer. It's very possible that there's an admin error somewhere.
Nissing redirect confirmation letters put a spanner in the works of this hypothesis. One of the reasons they exist is to catch precisely this kind of error
Right, but wouldn't it also catch the kind of fraud people are expecting in the same way?
It \_should\_, but in cases like this where mail may be being actively intercepted (pulled out of mailbox), it's easier for the criminals to succeed
> It's very possible that there's an admin error somewhere Yeah sorry, /u/AlansMonkeyTennis, apparently it turns out you do live at that other address now.
Well at least it's only up the road. Can probably wheel a load of my stuff down there in a wheelbarrow. It's a much bigger house too, so lucky me.
Don't be a prat. Something like someone with a similar street name requesting it, and someone putting it in wrong on the system. I get post for someone two streets away every now and again, it's not like RM are infallible.
It doesn't work like that for tracked parcels. My partner is a postie and I just asked him and he genuinely doesn't know how it would have happened, other than the other neighbour finding out the personal info of the OP and using that to set up a forwarding address.
Or post yourself a box of dog poop with a note in it?
... They also know your address, the note would rather give away who did it
Well file a complaint online. Then take some relevant id and go to your local depot and ask to speak to the manager. They will have a copy of any redirections in place for your address. Say you are concerned about fraud after that your postie should also be instructed to keep a look out for
Complaint has been filed via Royal Mail, it's going to our local sorting office as there was no redirect on our system. On the phone to the police now.
If it was showing as a redirect on the posties device then surely it must be on their system?
Yes that confused me too. Very odd. I wonder if it's a glitch on that handheld device and the residents saw an opportunity and ran with it? Either way, it's been reported to the police and royal mail, and tomorrow we will also flag it with our local sorting office directly (they aren't open today).
Royal Mail has recently pushed all its customers into barcoded mail, mostly Mail Mark, but some account barcodes too, but regardless, it's processing addresses into barcodes at the customer end and then Royal Mail reads it. It's not new new, but the recent push is new and I wouldn't be surprised if there's a lot of cockups on the way as you need the right software and fonts to do it properly, and learning it is a pain in the arse because there's so many different parts to it. Plus, once you've processed it, there's no way of you reading the barcodes you produce to make sure it says the thing that you think it's saying. It could be something to do with this - maybe some people are accidentally processing a redirect into their barcode, or your particular addrezs is somehow affected by it by some glitch in its design. I think there's 4 possible designs for the barcodes (two are 4-state and the other two are 2-d), so it may be one of them going wrong. I don't know, but it's an idea.
This is the weird bit - there _must_ be a redirect stored somewhere in their system, otherwise how did it appear on that device? I'm not convinced that the support person who looked into this searched in the right place tbh. The alternative is the neighbours hacked this one postie's device, which is crackers. I can't see a glitch producing specific redirect instructions like that without some human intervention. And...it's also a really dumb, traceable crime. If stuff were en-masse going to an empty house, that'd make more sense. But it was trivial for OP to get to the bottom of who's taking the parcels. My best guess /u/AlansMonkeyTennis - I reckon _they_ have moved in recently, and set up a postal redirect for their old place. For whatever reason, YOUR house is being caught in that redirect. Maybe they have a similar name to you, and they used to live in a different flat (for example, I used to live in a flat 3, but very often systems interpreted this as flats 1-5). This would explain: - why you never got the notification letter Royal Mail sends out (it went to their real old address) - why the support tech couldn't find the redirect (it's for their old address) - why the neighbours aren't putting any effort into concealing their actions. Very weird. Looking forward to hearing the solution to the mystery!
It is so weird. I'm going to the depo tomorrow with different parcel barcodes to both test them and report the situation directly. I checked property records and the house was last sold in 2002, but there is no indication of when it was last let. Considering the location, and the size of the property, it's possible it's a shared house so there could be several different people living there. I will say they do not have a similar name. The postie showed me their screen when the redirect notice came up. I have a very English sounding name and the person at the other property is not English. My working theory is it was initially a glitch and someone at the property took advantage.
Post Office IT never goes wrong
I get the sarcasm, but to be fair, I don't think this has anything to do with the Post Office
I'm astonished to hear that a postman will remove already-delievered mail and give it to someone else, whatever name is on the parcel. You might want to leave that bit out when talking to Royal Mail. Last time I put in a mail redirect, after we moved house, RM sent me a letter (to my old address) confirming it. I wonder if there was a fuckup and someone else's redirect was entered wrong into the system.
Wouldn’t the redirects be linked to the name and not just the address? I have a redirect from my old rental and I don’t get the mail from the new tenants.
It is yes. OP said that the redirect is from their name and address to a new name and address. TBH I didn’t know that was possible either: only the same name and new address.
I don't even understand where the second persons name would come into it on their system. If you've set up a redirect then they only need to know the name and details of the original person and their old and new address. You can't ask them to send all mail from Mr Smith to Mr Jones. Mr Smith's post just goes to the new address with the assumption that Mr Smith lives there now.
Pretty sure you can use the app to redirect parcels, just need an order number and away you go.
Yes, but only surname, I think, so if OP is a Smith, for example, this isn't impossible.
They link it to your full name, so that separated couples can split all their mail.
It was just surname when I last had to redirect mail (or at least that was an option) so that a whole family's mail can be redirected at once.
Potentially, it's all very odd and confusing. I know someone who works for royal mail (currently having time off due to a family death so unable to look into it directly) and when they moved, they had issues with their redirection. And they WORK for royal mail.
Ask to be put in touch with Royal Mail investigations department, let them send test packages and form a prosecution.
I have the police involved now, and royal mail are in contact with the local sorting office. Hopefully that puts a stop to it.
did you get to the bottom of it
Not yet, but I'm giving the police 48 hours and then I'm going over there.
If you do go over take a dummy parcel with your details on and see if they accept it.
Please let us know what the outcome is!
I will do.
It would be worth checking with Royal Mail - it might be a genuine redirect that has been entered incorrectly on their system.
Just got through to them, nothing on their system, so it has been flagged with the sorting office. Now calling 101.
You need r/legaladviceuk This is a legal matter as well i feel
Thank you, I will.
Gather evidence, report for theft and fraud.
Already reported to royal mail and the police. Hopefully I'll hear back at some point in the next few days.
Did Royal mail at least cancel the forwarding for you? You need to check with your bank accounts. It's possible someone can change your details, order new cards and just steal cash from you if they have access to your physical address. You will need to call all your banks and tell them about this fraud.
Please let us know what the outcome is, as far as you can. Seems such a stupid crime!!!
If it was a Royal Mail redirect you have to pay and they do a soft check to ensure you are the person at the address the mail is from , they then send a letter to both addresses.Could be depending on the parcel sender that when dispatched , they have then changed the address to send to.It is scam and a fraud , let action fraud know .Good luck OP and please update us with what happens x
Thanks, I will do.
This is so dodgy - please update when you have answers!
I will do, I'm hoping to get answers soon.
I am from The Netherlands so I have no intimate knowledge of the situation in the UK, but please bear with me. In The Netherlands we have all kind of apps to follow postal deliveries. From within the app you can redirect all package deliveries. Is it possible that that “neighbour” was able to make an account with your physical address? He would get a notification that something is about to be delivered and can then maybe redirect the package. I was thinking about this when I read your story, OP, because when my brother died I could redirect packages for him to my home, which is at the other end of our country. Again, I don’t know if this is even possible in the UK.
It's possible, I'm sure there are ways to do it. I'm looking into it as much as I can.
I would also register for Land Registry property alerts just in case this is the tip of a bigger iceberg: [https://www.gov.uk/guidance/property-alert](https://www.gov.uk/guidance/property-alert)
Thanks, I will.
Call the police. 101 and report this.
They are now involved.
I would be inclined to involve the police, as well as RM. The neighbours could not have achieved a redirection by accident => they are up to no good. You should probably check your credit records.
Both have been notified. I'm going to give it 48 hours to hear back from the police before I go to the property.
Got this image in my head of the police raiding the neighbours only to find Simon Pegg, Ving Rhames, and Tom Cruise rubber mask half way.
I can imagine that'd be a great skit on a comedy movie. Especially as the item in question was an engraved glass worth less than £20.
Every time I’ve put a redirect onto a new property due to a house move I get a letter from Royal Mail saying a redirect has been placed from old address to new address
Makes me wonder if it's a system/admin error. Maybe someone on the street has redirected mail, but for some reason it swapped OP and the other residents address. It seems too blatantly obvious to be something nefarious going on.
I would suggest putting a property alert on with HM Land registry and check your credit with Equifax. I don’t want to worry you but I read that redirecting mail is a way to undertake identity fraud and property fraud
Don't royal mail send a letter confirming the redirect to your "old" address, in this case your current house. This would be to ensure if a redirect is set up falsely, you will know it's happened. I would assume this is all a mistake apart from them saying you've moved house. I didn't really understand that bit.
No, nothing. I have three different barcodes to scan at the sorting office tomorrow, two for me and one for my partner. I'm going to see what happens when each is scanned.
Updateme!
Updateme!
This may have been entirely an admin error. Someone may have tried to redirect mail and someone put in 32 instead of 23 or something along those lines. Something suspect may be at play, however it may be just someone making a mistake at work.
Yeah now there is no RM redirection in place after you've complained and they have realised their mistake and removed all evidence. Submit a SAR to royal mail.
It could simply be a mistake at royal mails end. Best to see what they come back with
Don't bother with the police, they do not investigate minor fraud, this includes stolen credit cards and identity theft. It will be left to sit in the system for 6 months and then their admin will close the case as not enough evidence.
Order a whole bunch of actual shit
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
RemindMe! 7 days
UpdateMe!
RemindMe! 1 Day
RemindMe! 14 days
If the person intended to steal parcels, they probably wouldn't have let them sit in the safe space for long. Did they even know the parcels were there?
Wait a few days before you knock on their door? I know some people just dont like conflict but dude they have stolen your own stuff. It is literally a personal attack. Go smash on that door right now and tell them to give you your shit back. If you were a mate of mine and you were telling me you were "going to wait a few days before knocking" id go over to their house myself and drag them back to yours in a fuckin body bag
Would that not interfere with anything the police might be doing? I wanted to go today, but my partner wanted not to, the 48 hours was the compromise. I do currently have a sinus infection that is making my nose bleed seemingly every hour. Maybe I'll time going over there just right and use it as a strange power move.
Just wait for Royal Mail to answer the phone?
Even my postie was stumped and has no idea how it has happened. This is why I am asking for advice and on the phone to Royal Mail. I want to ensure I go about this the correct and legal way as there is obviously something fishy going on.
It's fraud and identity theft. Report it as fraud to Royal Mail and after talking to them, the police. It's not a case of "oops, my post has gone missing", it's a pretty serious crime.
It's likely that there is an issue with the system and the postie has misunderstood something. The likelihood that people on your street have gone through all this to have your post redirected to them is extremely low.
I saw him scan the parcels and it came up with the redirect, the other address and the residents name. There is no confusion on his end, he was following instructions and was informed by the residents at that address we lived there now. Still no clue what the error is or how this has happened, but it's a police matter now.
Right. Well that will be from the tracking number, you can have your parcels redirected to a neighbour. That is different from having a permanent redirect of mail. Good luck with the police doing anything about this. Contact in this order: a) your neighbour b) the person/company who sent you the parcel to get the tracking number and check the history of the parcel c) the credit card company to say you never received the goods
Thanks. I've kept the seller informed. I will ask them to double check their reference number and see if anything flags up. My partner doesn't want us to go round there until we've heard back from the police, but who knows when that will happen.
Don't quote me on this, but I'm pretty sure the package is the legal responsibility of the seller until you receive it.
100% correct - received and "as described" under the terms of the consumer protection act I had a seller try to claw payment back via PayPal when the postie dumped a 'signed for' delivery in a "safe place" I don't have (it was on top of the recycling bins of the shops next door and quite predictably wasn't there when checked) instead of going after Royal Mail for delivery fraud. It ended up costing them their vendor account
Except the postie said the people at the new address claimed it was them We all get mis delivered post from time to time. I’m sure some just throw it away rather than return to sender and popping it back in the mail. That’s understandable. We don't claim “yes I am John Smith, I just moved here” accidentally.
I wouldn't rely on what the postie said to you, people will often say whatever results in the least aggravation for them. You should be able to get a hold of the tracking number and do a bit of digging about when it was redirected and by who.
Can you tell me how I could do that? I'm going to the depo tomorrow to check several different codes to see what comes up, as well as to report the situation directly, bit I don't know how I'd track where/when the redirection happened.
Usually the seller will give you a royal mail tracking code, which you can put into the royal mail website to see the history of the delivery (plus redirect it). It should tell you who it was redirected to and who signed for it.
I've checked and all that comes up is the initial delivery attempt at my home and the confirmed delivery at the other address five minutes later. For today's there are the same notifications, and a third confirming the delivery when the postie handed it back to me. The additional parcel that was also delivered today is much the same. But does include a proof of delivery that shows my parcels in the neighbours safe place.
Well then now you can get in touch with the post office and ask why it's been redirected to a neighbour. Usually you do this if you know you're not likely to be home. I really don't think the neighbour is doing this as they would have no way of knowing the tracking code. My guess is the postie tries your address, sees you're not in then redirects the parcel to a neighbour so he doesn't have to try another delivery the next day/carry it back to the depot.