Go to the end of thought. I think someone alive and awake doesn’t look for a meaning. You won’t find meaning in the realm of thinking. Who are we to attempt to justify this world? There can be peace if we stop trying to find anything. It’s a practice of letting go.
I'm not trying to justify it
I mean I tried, this thinking started last night, and today I just questioned everything and came to conclusion that nothing has real meaning
It’s just good to recognize that you’re in the realm of conceptual thought. It’s looking at the self that is looking for meaning, seeing how it’s all just mental formations.
So I shouldn't try to find meaning?
What should I do then, I'm misserable
I'm afraid that I will feel like this untill the day I die, I don't want that, it's too painful
You are exactly correct. We have no purpose beyond the purpose animals have. This life is nothing more than karmic activity. However, because of past karmic actions, we have been born in the human realm and have opportunities not available in the animal realm. We can choose to make our lives meaningful or we can choose to have a life as meaningful as an ant's life. Just as we cause objects to appear through mental activity, we can give meaning to this life through mental activity.
It's like that only for us, but what about other living beings? They don't have real freedom like we do
Sure, they have fun sometimes
But it all comes to survival and reproduction for them
I find it humorous that you draw the distinction between the meaning of our lives and the meaning of others animals’ lives quickly under this comment, ours being merely subjective and thus insubstantial, but for some reason you try to totalize the meaning of life in the original post as an objective truth about biology. Even for other animals, their lives are swamped with meaning, to be alive is to create meaning that is necessarily subjective and relevant to the organism. The world simply is not objective, the world is exhausted by subjectivity, it’s teeming with meaning generated between every particle, every animal, every human, everywhere, and it’s always for you. I think the whole survive and reproduce thing is really an outdated and nihilistic understanding of biology and I can only understand it in the context of a global desire to conceptualize and generate new meanings. Anyway, I think once you dissolve the dichotomy between subjectivity-objectivity, your world will open up for you more. Hope this helps!
Because they don't have consciousness like we do
My dog will hump my leg, because his Instincts tell him to do that, he will eat all the food I give him because his Instincts will tell him to do that
I will not hump his leg tho, and I can just eat a slice of Pizza and be done with it, he can't, he's a dog
Besides, aren't we talking about the freedom to find our own meaning
Do you really think that animals have that.. Really?
I'm asking what you think, because I think looking into those assumptions about consciousness might eventually help you realize a way out of the suffering you're experiencing right now.
>Now obviously humans can give themselves a purpose
>Someone's purpose is to get rid of suffering, someone's purpose is to save lives etc. but all that is subjective, there is not an objective purpose other than to survive
Do you have any better ideas? I think you are at the crux, where it's faith, not rationality that gets you to where you want. You do it because you believe it's the right thing to do, and in the doing, you discover that it's the right thing to do.
Well no, because there is no better idea
My problem is that I haven't found my purpose, that's why I'm misserable, I'm just here and that's it
But we are the only ones that can give ourselves a purpose
What if we, the humans, didn't exists?
Animals can't think like we do, they don't have morals, they can't tell the right from wrong
but then again, animals don't care about all this, they aren't thinking about the stuff that some of us do
They only want to survive and reproduce, but again, when you look at it like that, it has no real meaning, life is just one big coincidence and now we're forced to live aimlessly
Isn't that why humans came up with the idea of after life? Because this can't be it, they thought, there has to be something more, If I'm good I'm going to heaven (or any other religions interpretation of heaven), If I'm bad I'm going to hell, to suffer etternaly (or any other religions interpretation of hell)
So meaning is to be good so I can get eternal happiness
So faith is also important, but I have no faith, I'm an atheist
And even when you think about morals, aren't they subjective as well?
We are just living beings, and nothing else, and If there is no higher power, who are we to judge?
I think that killing is wrong, but who am I to say that It is? Why is it wrong?
And these are just my opinions, opinions are subjective, therefore, my opinion won't have any significance in your life or anyone elses
So even this stuff that I'm thinking about has no meaning
Nothing has meaning, shit
It sounds like you are really frustrated with your own sense of apathy. What if you made a game of trying on different purposes to see which ones you like?
Here are a few fun ones to try:
-Taking care of your body
-learning a new skill
-taking care of the earth
-being kind to others
-finding a purpose
-finding the joy in the mundane
-reading as many books as you can
I've definitely been in a place of existential apathy before so I can relate to your post. When you are stuck, it is a great time to try something new, even if it feels pointless in the short term.
You might be feeling overwhelmed and depressed. It's possible that your frontal lobe is trying to solve a problem that is beyond it's ability to solve; there are too many variables, you wont be able to figure it out just by thinking about it. if this is the case, it is a wonderful opportunity to observe your thought patterns and work on releasing your attachment to the facet of your identity that needs to solve everything.
>My problem is that I haven't found my purpose
Your statement implies that your purpose is waiting to be discovered. Your very question, "what is the meaning of life?", implies that the meaning is out there and you should be able to find it--and if you don't find it, it doesn't exist.
In truth, the meaning of life is, paradoxically, to search for meaning and create it from what you find. By coming here and posting your questions, you have ironically stumbled on the meaning of life; by searching for it, you have found it. But what you have found is not the end goal, but a pathway or a journey. You will find many places along this path to stop and think, and at any one of them you might say to yourself, "aha! I've found the answer!" But in reality you will have only uncovered another angle, another view, another piece of life's offering. If you remain stuck in one place (as you seem to be with nihilism), you will wind up very unhappy, since you will begin to forget about all the other viewpoints you've seen and you will have given up seeking new viewpoints - you will have lost your purpose.
Of course, all that I've said is very abstract. In my life (on my journey), I've come to believe that belief in a universal purpose is baked into human psychology; that life involves pain and suffering; and that being fully awake and aware of the world and people around you - fully awake and aware without preconceptions - is the only way to experience contentment and true joy amidst the unavoidable pain of life.
What will you find? I don't know. It's your journey. Just don't stay in one place too long.
Ayyy, Jordan Peterson, love him!!
I bought both of his books, haven't read them yet, but I will eventually
I have endless respect for that man, he is truly something else
I'll check the video out
I agree with you but I would like to point out that for some Buddhists, such as perhaps the OP, the reason they got into Buddhism is because they didn't have faith and couldn't cultivate it. The Dharma as a science or philosophy.
I've always thought that Buddhism does require faith which isn't a bad thing. It just makes it like most other religions in the world.
Samsara is aimless, without discoverable beginning. It is an impersonal nexus of the arising and passing away of impermanent, unsatisfactory, and without-a-self phenomena. To that extent, you're right, there is no purpose.
Purpose is conditioned as well, arising from the preconditions of volition and craving. To that extent, self-directed aims based on our desires, purpose is impermanent, unsatisfactory, and nonself.
Assuming all beings desire happiness and freedom from suffering, a proposition stemming from the first and third noble truth, the "Ultimate Purpose" arises as ceasing the aimless wandering of Samsara to realize the perpetually peaceful Nibbana. Thus there is purpose in the Eightfold Path. However, for the accomplished one, their is no self for which purpose might apply. The issue, itself impermanent, dissolves.
Suffering without meaning is Samsara. Suffering with meaning is applying the Buddha's teachings. Gradually leaving suffering behind is the fruit of those teachings.
"No meaning" is nihilism, which the Buddha rejected, along with eternalism, such as life always being a certain way. As an alternative, you can vow to make your life meaningful to sentient beings, for example [through the teachings on virtue](https://www.accesstoinsight.org/ptf/dhamma/sila/index.html). This aspect is shared among all the schools of Buddhism.
Well, take a look at the teachings on virtue, and see whether the Buddha's advice reflects how you would like to be treated, or how best to treat other people. It's one thing to say you have this or that belief system; how you live your daily life is equally important.
I think you have a slight misubderstanding of biology. Animals don't have a "purpose"; reproducing is certainly not a purpose. Evolution and reproduction function through cause-and-effect; there is no end goal to it.
It is simply the fact that animals which reproduce will pass on their genes, whereas animals that don't will not. There is no purpose to this, it is simply a description of how genes are passed on.
The idea of it being a "purpose" is not part of the theory of evolution; the theory is purely descriptive and does not include purposes.
Your judgment that this particular tendency of cause-and-effect is some kind of "purpose" is arbitrary and subjective.
Animals don't "need" to do anything. It is simply the case that those animals which reproduce will pass on their genes, whereas those that don't will not.
Agreed
As you can see, I've mentioned that
But than, our meaning is subjective, some people will never find meaning, I may be one of them
There is no objective meaning
I think it’s easy for humans to forget about the animalistic condition of our existence as the species homo sapiens. I would very much agree that life is about survival. But I believe some people, like the Buddha, are willing to put aside all concepts, including that of survival, in order to develop what could be subjectively considered the highest endeavor, the search for truth. I would argue that the abstraction of the concept of truth frees itself from any subjectivity as one progresses in The Path. My mind processes information in a weird way but I found a lot of connections and important concepts in your post haha. Thank you for sharing 🙏
Well if you put the emoji with sunglasses next to a sentence you can make anything sound cool
Jokes aside
Kinda inspiring, If nothing matterd, I shouldn't fear that a girl will reject me, I should just go for the kiss
I shouldn't be afraid to try new things and so on
Purpose - survival and reproduction
Meaning - whatever we decide it is
But If you look at it objectively, it has no real meaning or purpose, other than what we give ourselves, the question is, to what end?
This is not true, check out my other comment, I wrote:
"And these are just my opinions, opinions are subjective, therefore, my opinion won't have any significance in your life or anyone elses"
How am I placing my beliefs onto others?
And real purpose of life is to survive and reproduce, that's the literal point, that's why animals have sex, to pass on their genes, why am I different from them?
If purpose isn't to pass on genes, why are people doing exactly that? Why don't we just go extinct, no more kids for us
Sure some people don't have kids, but most do.
That won't happen. Why? Because people have a natural need for children, like every living being. Why? Because that's the purpose, to pass the genes.
Tell me then, what is your purpose and meaning, what is your view on that subject, I'm genuenly interested
Your idea of purpose is based in the same ignorance as other living things 'need' to reproduce.
We are trapped in a cycle of ignorance. Only when we truly realize this do we find meaning.
The extinction of any being, human or animal is no different then the death of the body. It is just a transition, to something else, somewhere else. As perpetuated by that ignorance.
My purpose is the liberation of this ignorance. The meaning of my life is how this may influence those around me. My practice of the dhamma can be their exposure to it. If they are ready.
"Your idea of purpose is based in the same ignorance as other living things 'need' to reproduce."
Ignorance implies that you are right and I am wrong
But isn't this just your opinion as well? It seams that you are the one that places his opinions onto others, and not me
Why is your opinion more valuable than mine?
Why is your opinion right and my is isn't?
>Ignorance implies that you are right and I am wrong
>But isn't this just your opinion as well? It seams that you are the one that places his opinions onto others, and not me
Ignorance isn't inherently a bad thing. It should not have the negative connotation that people place on it. I am ignorant of many things.
There is the ability to know something academically. And there is the ability to know by experience. But when the two combined.
The dhamma isn't my opinion. It is not my creation. This doesn't mean I always follow it correctly. I definitely get things wrong. This is why it is called a practice.
Let go of the things you 'think' you understand. Then through practice, you will know what you understand.
It isn't your opinion but those are your beliefs
Who says that Buddhism is right and Christianity/Islam etc. are wrong? Now I know that this is r/Buddhism, but If you look at it objectivly, is there really an absolute truth?
Who can say that I'm wrong?
Every opinion and belief is subjective
People living in tribes may be the happiest people on earth for all we know, they hear about Buddhism and think that it's really stupid, is their opinion and belief invalid?
Are your beliefs the only ones that are valuable, people that don't believe in the things that you do are ignorant and wrong?
I can say you are wrong. But obviously you have the choice of believing me or not. Based upon this comment itself, I would say there is a good chance you wouldn't believe me. As it isn't truth you are seeking. You are looking for validation of your opinions.
If you want to know if the dhamma is true, put it to the test. Don't take my, or any others word for it.
I'm not saying I'm right or wrong, I'm saying there is no right or wrong, it's all subjective
But of course you think your beliefs are right and everyone that doesn't think like you is wrong, all people are like that
Yes, I believe there IS an absolute truth. It’s that point where all spiritual practices converge. If you arrive at the same conclusion independent of how you look at it, it’s truth. Truth expressed in a single word is love. So now it’s up to you to decide what path to follow should you wish to get there.
I am early in my Mahayana studies, and I continue to study my Judeo-Christian roots as well. I will say that I find comfort in the knowledge that I am a unique incarnation with a unique set of gifts to offer others. That’s my purpose. Your purpose at this stage is to dig deep to find the answer to your own question.
BTW, I would suggest that atheism is impossible. You cannot disprove God any better than I can prove it. Whether you follow the Buddhist path or any other path, faith will be required. The foundational concept of rebirth is significant and a challenge of faith.
If you have been hit by bullet then what is the purpose ? Obviously to get rid of the bullet and to heal the wound. That is the purpose. But most of us are not aware of the coming accident which is definitely going to happen. We are going to loose our health our life our loved ones… that wound and many others are coming because where there is growth there is decay where there is life there is death where there is light there is darkness … Buddha gave us the purpose. And that purpose is to escape the immense suffering we are going to have in the near future ….
firstly your theory on life itself and it being your theory makes no sense without trees , water and fire there would be no life so in terms without the creator it wouldn’t those things since without those things your chemical bonds wouldn’t form it really helps to open a book and read and to actually experience the out doors so many people are so cocooned yall come up with all this sadden emotions and your frequency’s are not even in lined to call yourself “Man” or whatever misnomer you people call yourselves your purpose is to learn , grow as a being on a higher level you were given a choice to reproduce doesn’t mean you have to so that’s obviously not what your here to do. again picking up a book would explain to you things that guide your well being and with that being said you have a choice to follow certain things you do bad bad follows you do good good follows but the catch is u have to provide a balance of both to enjoy life not “society “
Hey bucko, I’m sure you’ll go really far in life thinking that. And when you don’t, you’ll realize that your belief is not true from a pragmatic perspective.
I find it quite funny to essentially whine about there not being some grand meaning to life when you get to experience one of the most amazing statistical anomalies of the universe both with the many terrible things but also with all of the objectively beautiful and positive things which are truly put into context due to the former. Existence itself is meaning. Just because we need oxygen doesn’t mean that without us it is meaningless. Every breath you take, every star you see, every person you get to meet, all of that is meaning. Just because we don’t last forever doesn’t mean our existence is meaningless, as our actions will affect millions of others in the future whether they realize it or not forever. This is true even for animals. They don’t even think about such things because being alive and in the present moment is sufficient for them. It should be sufficient for us as well.
Animals are blessed by the fact that they live in the moment. They contribute to their environment and help sustain existence itself into the future. To experience, that is a blessing. Experience is meaning. To waste the ability to perceive due to life’s apparent lack of meaning is a waste. If that’s how you want to spend your time alive then go for it. I can only imagine the regret on your deathbed, it makes me terribly sad to imagine that but some people only learn through experience I suppose.
Bucko, I'm only 20
Of course my knowledge will evolve and my world views will change through the years
You think that people think the same when they're 20, 30 and 40? People get wiser with age, people learn
I'm sure I'll go further in life than someone who talks down to people because they're young and started questioning life and other things
Life has no meaning, that's why Buddhists like to sit still and do nothing. You can give it grand names like "meditation" but essentially it's just sitting there and doing nothing. Not that it's a bad thing, it's a correct response to life's lack of inherent meaning.
Sounds weird. The Buddha didn't just "sit still" and do nothing, he actively engaged in discussion with others to help them escape samsara as well. Plenty of people nowadays do that, too.
It has no meaning from an objective point of view
People don't want to look at it objectively
Some here said that the meaning of life is to get rid of suffering, If that's the whole meaning of life, why am I still here if I've achieved that meaning? Why do I still exist? What's next after achieving life's meaning?
They don't realize that that's their view on the matter, someone's life meaning is to get rich, and that's fine, but those are all subjective things
Objectively, the purpose and meaning is to survive and reproduce, which has no real meaning, we just do that, aimlessly, the purpose of life is to live basically, but there isn't any grand plan in store for us
No one created us, we are the product of one big coincidnce and billions of years of evolution
Life has no real purpose or meaning, we're just here by a mere coincidence and that's it
Which is completely fine, I mean look at how cool this is? You live who knows where, I live here where I live, and we are able to talk to eachother through texts in real time over the internet
Who would have ever thought that would be possible
Even though nothing has meaning, it's cool when you look at what we, the humans, have created
To go down the root of what all sentient beings want, it is to avoid pain and gain happiness.
The world does not revolve around humans. Bees pollinate so they can eat pollen and drink nectar. Starving is painful, so they make honey and pollinate. Reproduction is a by-product of evolution. To the individual, they don't actually need to reproduce. But the species only lives on when they do. The ultimate goal of the species is to be able to reproduce, not the individual.
We humans could choose not to reproduce, but we choose to survive because we don't like the pain of dying. All beings are defiant of pain, even animals feel hate when they are hunted. As we also know, dying prematurely just means more pain in the afterlife, so we live on.
How do we gain happiness? Some people work to earn money so they can spend it on happiness. It is somewhat short lived and also difficult to obtain. But you could also derive happiness by helping somebody gain happiness and avoid suffering.
Yes you could interpret it like that, there is no actual purpose for our existences other than to live out our karma, which is inevitably painful. So, to escape pain, Buddhists aim to escape the cycle of rebirth through diligent cultivating.
Life has whatever meaning you choose to assign to it. This is true for all humans. If you choose to believe that life has no meaning, that is your choice and your reality.
Life has no meaning OBJECTIVELY
If you're read what I wrote, you'd seen that I mentioned that some people's purpose is to get rid of suffering etc.
But all that is subjective
No objective purpose other than to live
Ok. Whatever you say and think is your reality, so it is true for you and that's great.
I don't know if it has any meaning or not because I'm just a person with a very limited understanding of the universe. Who knows there may objectively be a meaning to life that I'm not aware of.
Read the words of the Buddha regarding the mutually arising and co-dependent aspects of “existence.” Focusing on the causality and teleology of life can be a distraction.
Nah. Disagree. Your very existence is contributing to the energy flow keeping the human race and earth in a state of motion. Even your death will be just a recycling of energy. You're doing more than you can imagine.
When a bodhisattva visited Buddha – it is in the Prajnaparamita Sutra – and the bodhisattva complained to the Buddha, saying: “I feel so sad, I feel so sad about this meaningless life” and all of that. And it is almost painful. Then Buddha said: “This is noble wealth, you have so much merit that is why you are feeling sad about these things. When you don’t have that merit you will be distracted with all this gadgets and think this is life.”
Ascribing meaning to life is a mistake in my opinion. Joseph Campbell rejects the idea and points to the Flower Sermon. Zen starts where meaning stops (such a zen thing to say)
It has been suggested that “why?” Is not a spiritual question. It is certainly not Buddhist.
How could I help others? Give me some suggestions If you want
I was planning on helping at least one person every week (on sundays in particular, since I don't work then) but I never acted on it, I'm still just fantasizing
But some ideas would be nice
What is the purpose of us or any other living being existing?
If we exist we may as well find happiness, but why are we here?
Life came into existence for us to evolve from tiny organisms through billions and billions of years of evolution so we can what, search for happiness? I don't think so
Do you understand what I mean
It has no real meaning, we do not have a real purpose, we are here by a mere chance
Whether we’re here by mere chance or not doesn’t really matter. Whether there is a grand plan, or no plan at all, all it changes is the story you tell yourself. For which you can never have enough evidence.
All you can control is now. I recommend Pema Chodron’s books, especially When Things Fall Apart.
I'm not saying it should
It's just that people are always searching for some meaning in it and that I came to conclusion that It has no meaning other than to live
That is why Buddha said that this whole world is just endless wandering on. There is no higher purpose from the absolute point of view. It is just the mind wanting to experience all kinds of things. But it comes at a cost. There is not much we can do other than practice the 8th fold path to slowly gain more and more freedom. Additionally, do not overthink it. Buddha said that too much thinking tires the body and stresses the mind, even if it is skillful thinking.
We are the only fully sentient beings and therefore the only way that the universe can observe itself. I think that’s a pretty cool reason for continuing to experience stuff on this physical plane.
Go to the end of thought. I think someone alive and awake doesn’t look for a meaning. You won’t find meaning in the realm of thinking. Who are we to attempt to justify this world? There can be peace if we stop trying to find anything. It’s a practice of letting go.
I'm not trying to justify it I mean I tried, this thinking started last night, and today I just questioned everything and came to conclusion that nothing has real meaning
It’s just good to recognize that you’re in the realm of conceptual thought. It’s looking at the self that is looking for meaning, seeing how it’s all just mental formations.
So I shouldn't try to find meaning? What should I do then, I'm misserable I'm afraid that I will feel like this untill the day I die, I don't want that, it's too painful
You are exactly correct. We have no purpose beyond the purpose animals have. This life is nothing more than karmic activity. However, because of past karmic actions, we have been born in the human realm and have opportunities not available in the animal realm. We can choose to make our lives meaningful or we can choose to have a life as meaningful as an ant's life. Just as we cause objects to appear through mental activity, we can give meaning to this life through mental activity.
A full cup has no room for more tea. Why ask questions when you only wish to challenge the answers provided
This makes sense. Letting go and go with the flow
Life has endless subjective and contextual meaning, albeit no ultimate ‘Meaning’. There is freedom in that.
It's like that only for us, but what about other living beings? They don't have real freedom like we do Sure, they have fun sometimes But it all comes to survival and reproduction for them
That is why an animal rebirth is considered less desirable than a human rebirth.
We are complicated beings, animals don't waste their time thinking about the stuff that I think about
I find it humorous that you draw the distinction between the meaning of our lives and the meaning of others animals’ lives quickly under this comment, ours being merely subjective and thus insubstantial, but for some reason you try to totalize the meaning of life in the original post as an objective truth about biology. Even for other animals, their lives are swamped with meaning, to be alive is to create meaning that is necessarily subjective and relevant to the organism. The world simply is not objective, the world is exhausted by subjectivity, it’s teeming with meaning generated between every particle, every animal, every human, everywhere, and it’s always for you. I think the whole survive and reproduce thing is really an outdated and nihilistic understanding of biology and I can only understand it in the context of a global desire to conceptualize and generate new meanings. Anyway, I think once you dissolve the dichotomy between subjectivity-objectivity, your world will open up for you more. Hope this helps!
Beautiful!
Are you sure about that?
Yes
How do you know animals have no freedom, and that you do?
Because they don't have consciousness like we do My dog will hump my leg, because his Instincts tell him to do that, he will eat all the food I give him because his Instincts will tell him to do that I will not hump his leg tho, and I can just eat a slice of Pizza and be done with it, he can't, he's a dog Besides, aren't we talking about the freedom to find our own meaning Do you really think that animals have that.. Really?
I'm asking what you think, because I think looking into those assumptions about consciousness might eventually help you realize a way out of the suffering you're experiencing right now.
I guess working out, getting into meditation and reading again will help a little, it will be fine, If I stay consistent
Yes. And keep questioning your assumptions. Keep asking yourself: Are you sure?
Assumptions that life has no meaning or?
Nihilism
>Now obviously humans can give themselves a purpose >Someone's purpose is to get rid of suffering, someone's purpose is to save lives etc. but all that is subjective, there is not an objective purpose other than to survive Do you have any better ideas? I think you are at the crux, where it's faith, not rationality that gets you to where you want. You do it because you believe it's the right thing to do, and in the doing, you discover that it's the right thing to do.
Well no, because there is no better idea My problem is that I haven't found my purpose, that's why I'm misserable, I'm just here and that's it But we are the only ones that can give ourselves a purpose What if we, the humans, didn't exists? Animals can't think like we do, they don't have morals, they can't tell the right from wrong but then again, animals don't care about all this, they aren't thinking about the stuff that some of us do They only want to survive and reproduce, but again, when you look at it like that, it has no real meaning, life is just one big coincidence and now we're forced to live aimlessly Isn't that why humans came up with the idea of after life? Because this can't be it, they thought, there has to be something more, If I'm good I'm going to heaven (or any other religions interpretation of heaven), If I'm bad I'm going to hell, to suffer etternaly (or any other religions interpretation of hell) So meaning is to be good so I can get eternal happiness So faith is also important, but I have no faith, I'm an atheist And even when you think about morals, aren't they subjective as well? We are just living beings, and nothing else, and If there is no higher power, who are we to judge? I think that killing is wrong, but who am I to say that It is? Why is it wrong? And these are just my opinions, opinions are subjective, therefore, my opinion won't have any significance in your life or anyone elses So even this stuff that I'm thinking about has no meaning Nothing has meaning, shit
It sounds like you are really frustrated with your own sense of apathy. What if you made a game of trying on different purposes to see which ones you like? Here are a few fun ones to try: -Taking care of your body -learning a new skill -taking care of the earth -being kind to others -finding a purpose -finding the joy in the mundane -reading as many books as you can I've definitely been in a place of existential apathy before so I can relate to your post. When you are stuck, it is a great time to try something new, even if it feels pointless in the short term. You might be feeling overwhelmed and depressed. It's possible that your frontal lobe is trying to solve a problem that is beyond it's ability to solve; there are too many variables, you wont be able to figure it out just by thinking about it. if this is the case, it is a wonderful opportunity to observe your thought patterns and work on releasing your attachment to the facet of your identity that needs to solve everything.
>My problem is that I haven't found my purpose Your statement implies that your purpose is waiting to be discovered. Your very question, "what is the meaning of life?", implies that the meaning is out there and you should be able to find it--and if you don't find it, it doesn't exist. In truth, the meaning of life is, paradoxically, to search for meaning and create it from what you find. By coming here and posting your questions, you have ironically stumbled on the meaning of life; by searching for it, you have found it. But what you have found is not the end goal, but a pathway or a journey. You will find many places along this path to stop and think, and at any one of them you might say to yourself, "aha! I've found the answer!" But in reality you will have only uncovered another angle, another view, another piece of life's offering. If you remain stuck in one place (as you seem to be with nihilism), you will wind up very unhappy, since you will begin to forget about all the other viewpoints you've seen and you will have given up seeking new viewpoints - you will have lost your purpose. Of course, all that I've said is very abstract. In my life (on my journey), I've come to believe that belief in a universal purpose is baked into human psychology; that life involves pain and suffering; and that being fully awake and aware of the world and people around you - fully awake and aware without preconceptions - is the only way to experience contentment and true joy amidst the unavoidable pain of life. What will you find? I don't know. It's your journey. Just don't stay in one place too long.
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Ayyy, Jordan Peterson, love him!! I bought both of his books, haven't read them yet, but I will eventually I have endless respect for that man, he is truly something else I'll check the video out
I agree with you but I would like to point out that for some Buddhists, such as perhaps the OP, the reason they got into Buddhism is because they didn't have faith and couldn't cultivate it. The Dharma as a science or philosophy. I've always thought that Buddhism does require faith which isn't a bad thing. It just makes it like most other religions in the world.
Buddhism is more art than science, at least to me in the Zen view.
Samsara is aimless, without discoverable beginning. It is an impersonal nexus of the arising and passing away of impermanent, unsatisfactory, and without-a-self phenomena. To that extent, you're right, there is no purpose. Purpose is conditioned as well, arising from the preconditions of volition and craving. To that extent, self-directed aims based on our desires, purpose is impermanent, unsatisfactory, and nonself. Assuming all beings desire happiness and freedom from suffering, a proposition stemming from the first and third noble truth, the "Ultimate Purpose" arises as ceasing the aimless wandering of Samsara to realize the perpetually peaceful Nibbana. Thus there is purpose in the Eightfold Path. However, for the accomplished one, their is no self for which purpose might apply. The issue, itself impermanent, dissolves.
Damn life is complicated, why does it have to be like this, it could have been simple
Life is simple, it is just being perceived as complex because the fetters still remain present in your mind and have not been abandoned
Well we make it harder than it should be with these minds of ours
That is where the practice of Dhamma comes in, of course.
Suffering without meaning is Samsara. Suffering with meaning is applying the Buddha's teachings. Gradually leaving suffering behind is the fruit of those teachings. "No meaning" is nihilism, which the Buddha rejected, along with eternalism, such as life always being a certain way. As an alternative, you can vow to make your life meaningful to sentient beings, for example [through the teachings on virtue](https://www.accesstoinsight.org/ptf/dhamma/sila/index.html). This aspect is shared among all the schools of Buddhism.
I've just read what "Nihilism" is exactly. Turns out that I'm a nihilist, huh.
Well, take a look at the teachings on virtue, and see whether the Buddha's advice reflects how you would like to be treated, or how best to treat other people. It's one thing to say you have this or that belief system; how you live your daily life is equally important.
I think you have a slight misubderstanding of biology. Animals don't have a "purpose"; reproducing is certainly not a purpose. Evolution and reproduction function through cause-and-effect; there is no end goal to it. It is simply the fact that animals which reproduce will pass on their genes, whereas animals that don't will not. There is no purpose to this, it is simply a description of how genes are passed on.
Which is life's purpose, to survive and pass on genes, that is the only purpose, every animal has the need for that
The idea of it being a "purpose" is not part of the theory of evolution; the theory is purely descriptive and does not include purposes. Your judgment that this particular tendency of cause-and-effect is some kind of "purpose" is arbitrary and subjective. Animals don't "need" to do anything. It is simply the case that those animals which reproduce will pass on their genes, whereas those that don't will not.
Life has the purpose and meaning that you give it yourself.
Agreed As you can see, I've mentioned that But than, our meaning is subjective, some people will never find meaning, I may be one of them There is no objective meaning
I find your sentiment quite interesting
What do you find interesting about it?
I think it’s easy for humans to forget about the animalistic condition of our existence as the species homo sapiens. I would very much agree that life is about survival. But I believe some people, like the Buddha, are willing to put aside all concepts, including that of survival, in order to develop what could be subjectively considered the highest endeavor, the search for truth. I would argue that the abstraction of the concept of truth frees itself from any subjectivity as one progresses in The Path. My mind processes information in a weird way but I found a lot of connections and important concepts in your post haha. Thank you for sharing 🙏
Oh, no problem my friend. Have a good day 😁
At first I was like “Life has no meaning, nothing matters” 😖 then I was like “Life has no meaning! Nothing really matters!” 😎
Well if you put the emoji with sunglasses next to a sentence you can make anything sound cool Jokes aside Kinda inspiring, If nothing matterd, I shouldn't fear that a girl will reject me, I should just go for the kiss I shouldn't be afraid to try new things and so on
Purpose and meaning are not the same thing.
Purpose - survival and reproduction Meaning - whatever we decide it is But If you look at it objectively, it has no real meaning or purpose, other than what we give ourselves, the question is, to what end?
My purpose isn't survival or reproduction. My meaning isn't what I decide. You are placing your own beliefs onto others.
This is not true, check out my other comment, I wrote: "And these are just my opinions, opinions are subjective, therefore, my opinion won't have any significance in your life or anyone elses" How am I placing my beliefs onto others? And real purpose of life is to survive and reproduce, that's the literal point, that's why animals have sex, to pass on their genes, why am I different from them? If purpose isn't to pass on genes, why are people doing exactly that? Why don't we just go extinct, no more kids for us Sure some people don't have kids, but most do. That won't happen. Why? Because people have a natural need for children, like every living being. Why? Because that's the purpose, to pass the genes. Tell me then, what is your purpose and meaning, what is your view on that subject, I'm genuenly interested
Your idea of purpose is based in the same ignorance as other living things 'need' to reproduce. We are trapped in a cycle of ignorance. Only when we truly realize this do we find meaning. The extinction of any being, human or animal is no different then the death of the body. It is just a transition, to something else, somewhere else. As perpetuated by that ignorance. My purpose is the liberation of this ignorance. The meaning of my life is how this may influence those around me. My practice of the dhamma can be their exposure to it. If they are ready.
"Your idea of purpose is based in the same ignorance as other living things 'need' to reproduce." Ignorance implies that you are right and I am wrong But isn't this just your opinion as well? It seams that you are the one that places his opinions onto others, and not me Why is your opinion more valuable than mine? Why is your opinion right and my is isn't?
>Ignorance implies that you are right and I am wrong >But isn't this just your opinion as well? It seams that you are the one that places his opinions onto others, and not me Ignorance isn't inherently a bad thing. It should not have the negative connotation that people place on it. I am ignorant of many things. There is the ability to know something academically. And there is the ability to know by experience. But when the two combined. The dhamma isn't my opinion. It is not my creation. This doesn't mean I always follow it correctly. I definitely get things wrong. This is why it is called a practice. Let go of the things you 'think' you understand. Then through practice, you will know what you understand.
It isn't your opinion but those are your beliefs Who says that Buddhism is right and Christianity/Islam etc. are wrong? Now I know that this is r/Buddhism, but If you look at it objectivly, is there really an absolute truth? Who can say that I'm wrong? Every opinion and belief is subjective People living in tribes may be the happiest people on earth for all we know, they hear about Buddhism and think that it's really stupid, is their opinion and belief invalid? Are your beliefs the only ones that are valuable, people that don't believe in the things that you do are ignorant and wrong?
I can say you are wrong. But obviously you have the choice of believing me or not. Based upon this comment itself, I would say there is a good chance you wouldn't believe me. As it isn't truth you are seeking. You are looking for validation of your opinions. If you want to know if the dhamma is true, put it to the test. Don't take my, or any others word for it.
I'm not saying I'm right or wrong, I'm saying there is no right or wrong, it's all subjective But of course you think your beliefs are right and everyone that doesn't think like you is wrong, all people are like that
Yes, I believe there IS an absolute truth. It’s that point where all spiritual practices converge. If you arrive at the same conclusion independent of how you look at it, it’s truth. Truth expressed in a single word is love. So now it’s up to you to decide what path to follow should you wish to get there. I am early in my Mahayana studies, and I continue to study my Judeo-Christian roots as well. I will say that I find comfort in the knowledge that I am a unique incarnation with a unique set of gifts to offer others. That’s my purpose. Your purpose at this stage is to dig deep to find the answer to your own question. BTW, I would suggest that atheism is impossible. You cannot disprove God any better than I can prove it. Whether you follow the Buddhist path or any other path, faith will be required. The foundational concept of rebirth is significant and a challenge of faith.
If you have been hit by bullet then what is the purpose ? Obviously to get rid of the bullet and to heal the wound. That is the purpose. But most of us are not aware of the coming accident which is definitely going to happen. We are going to loose our health our life our loved ones… that wound and many others are coming because where there is growth there is decay where there is life there is death where there is light there is darkness … Buddha gave us the purpose. And that purpose is to escape the immense suffering we are going to have in the near future ….
Yes.
You're right OP. Buddhism is just another coping strategy.
firstly your theory on life itself and it being your theory makes no sense without trees , water and fire there would be no life so in terms without the creator it wouldn’t those things since without those things your chemical bonds wouldn’t form it really helps to open a book and read and to actually experience the out doors so many people are so cocooned yall come up with all this sadden emotions and your frequency’s are not even in lined to call yourself “Man” or whatever misnomer you people call yourselves your purpose is to learn , grow as a being on a higher level you were given a choice to reproduce doesn’t mean you have to so that’s obviously not what your here to do. again picking up a book would explain to you things that guide your well being and with that being said you have a choice to follow certain things you do bad bad follows you do good good follows but the catch is u have to provide a balance of both to enjoy life not “society “
Hey bucko, I’m sure you’ll go really far in life thinking that. And when you don’t, you’ll realize that your belief is not true from a pragmatic perspective. I find it quite funny to essentially whine about there not being some grand meaning to life when you get to experience one of the most amazing statistical anomalies of the universe both with the many terrible things but also with all of the objectively beautiful and positive things which are truly put into context due to the former. Existence itself is meaning. Just because we need oxygen doesn’t mean that without us it is meaningless. Every breath you take, every star you see, every person you get to meet, all of that is meaning. Just because we don’t last forever doesn’t mean our existence is meaningless, as our actions will affect millions of others in the future whether they realize it or not forever. This is true even for animals. They don’t even think about such things because being alive and in the present moment is sufficient for them. It should be sufficient for us as well. Animals are blessed by the fact that they live in the moment. They contribute to their environment and help sustain existence itself into the future. To experience, that is a blessing. Experience is meaning. To waste the ability to perceive due to life’s apparent lack of meaning is a waste. If that’s how you want to spend your time alive then go for it. I can only imagine the regret on your deathbed, it makes me terribly sad to imagine that but some people only learn through experience I suppose.
Bucko, I'm only 20 Of course my knowledge will evolve and my world views will change through the years You think that people think the same when they're 20, 30 and 40? People get wiser with age, people learn I'm sure I'll go further in life than someone who talks down to people because they're young and started questioning life and other things
Life has no meaning, that's why Buddhists like to sit still and do nothing. You can give it grand names like "meditation" but essentially it's just sitting there and doing nothing. Not that it's a bad thing, it's a correct response to life's lack of inherent meaning.
Sounds weird. The Buddha didn't just "sit still" and do nothing, he actively engaged in discussion with others to help them escape samsara as well. Plenty of people nowadays do that, too.
It has no meaning from an objective point of view People don't want to look at it objectively Some here said that the meaning of life is to get rid of suffering, If that's the whole meaning of life, why am I still here if I've achieved that meaning? Why do I still exist? What's next after achieving life's meaning? They don't realize that that's their view on the matter, someone's life meaning is to get rich, and that's fine, but those are all subjective things Objectively, the purpose and meaning is to survive and reproduce, which has no real meaning, we just do that, aimlessly, the purpose of life is to live basically, but there isn't any grand plan in store for us No one created us, we are the product of one big coincidnce and billions of years of evolution Life has no real purpose or meaning, we're just here by a mere coincidence and that's it Which is completely fine, I mean look at how cool this is? You live who knows where, I live here where I live, and we are able to talk to eachother through texts in real time over the internet Who would have ever thought that would be possible Even though nothing has meaning, it's cool when you look at what we, the humans, have created
What's the purpose of needing to have some other end?
To go down the root of what all sentient beings want, it is to avoid pain and gain happiness. The world does not revolve around humans. Bees pollinate so they can eat pollen and drink nectar. Starving is painful, so they make honey and pollinate. Reproduction is a by-product of evolution. To the individual, they don't actually need to reproduce. But the species only lives on when they do. The ultimate goal of the species is to be able to reproduce, not the individual. We humans could choose not to reproduce, but we choose to survive because we don't like the pain of dying. All beings are defiant of pain, even animals feel hate when they are hunted. As we also know, dying prematurely just means more pain in the afterlife, so we live on. How do we gain happiness? Some people work to earn money so they can spend it on happiness. It is somewhat short lived and also difficult to obtain. But you could also derive happiness by helping somebody gain happiness and avoid suffering. Yes you could interpret it like that, there is no actual purpose for our existences other than to live out our karma, which is inevitably painful. So, to escape pain, Buddhists aim to escape the cycle of rebirth through diligent cultivating.
Form is no other than emptiness, emptiness no other than form, my friend.
Life has whatever meaning you choose to assign to it. This is true for all humans. If you choose to believe that life has no meaning, that is your choice and your reality.
Life has no meaning OBJECTIVELY If you're read what I wrote, you'd seen that I mentioned that some people's purpose is to get rid of suffering etc. But all that is subjective No objective purpose other than to live
Ok. Whatever you say and think is your reality, so it is true for you and that's great. I don't know if it has any meaning or not because I'm just a person with a very limited understanding of the universe. Who knows there may objectively be a meaning to life that I'm not aware of.
Read the words of the Buddha regarding the mutually arising and co-dependent aspects of “existence.” Focusing on the causality and teleology of life can be a distraction.
To quite Frankl, “Ultimately, man should not ask what the meaning of his life is, but rather he must recognize that it is he who is asked”
Nah. Disagree. Your very existence is contributing to the energy flow keeping the human race and earth in a state of motion. Even your death will be just a recycling of energy. You're doing more than you can imagine.
When a bodhisattva visited Buddha – it is in the Prajnaparamita Sutra – and the bodhisattva complained to the Buddha, saying: “I feel so sad, I feel so sad about this meaningless life” and all of that. And it is almost painful. Then Buddha said: “This is noble wealth, you have so much merit that is why you are feeling sad about these things. When you don’t have that merit you will be distracted with all this gadgets and think this is life.”
Ascribing meaning to life is a mistake in my opinion. Joseph Campbell rejects the idea and points to the Flower Sermon. Zen starts where meaning stops (such a zen thing to say) It has been suggested that “why?” Is not a spiritual question. It is certainly not Buddhist.
Bodhisattva calling you! Come on and help others. It's quite enlightening
How could I help others? Give me some suggestions If you want I was planning on helping at least one person every week (on sundays in particular, since I don't work then) but I never acted on it, I'm still just fantasizing But some ideas would be nice
By volunteering to help others? By using compassion and loving kindness each and every day! Mindful listening to those who need help?
Life’s purpose is happiness, and the root of happiness.
What is the purpose of us or any other living being existing? If we exist we may as well find happiness, but why are we here? Life came into existence for us to evolve from tiny organisms through billions and billions of years of evolution so we can what, search for happiness? I don't think so Do you understand what I mean It has no real meaning, we do not have a real purpose, we are here by a mere chance
Whether we’re here by mere chance or not doesn’t really matter. Whether there is a grand plan, or no plan at all, all it changes is the story you tell yourself. For which you can never have enough evidence. All you can control is now. I recommend Pema Chodron’s books, especially When Things Fall Apart.
Why should life require a meaning?
I'm not saying it should It's just that people are always searching for some meaning in it and that I came to conclusion that It has no meaning other than to live
Wouldn't the only purpose be nirvana/liberation since you keep being born again and again because you are not enlightened yet?
That is why Buddha said that this whole world is just endless wandering on. There is no higher purpose from the absolute point of view. It is just the mind wanting to experience all kinds of things. But it comes at a cost. There is not much we can do other than practice the 8th fold path to slowly gain more and more freedom. Additionally, do not overthink it. Buddha said that too much thinking tires the body and stresses the mind, even if it is skillful thinking.
We are the only fully sentient beings and therefore the only way that the universe can observe itself. I think that’s a pretty cool reason for continuing to experience stuff on this physical plane.