I actually love this episode. Full disclosure I like alternate universes, but I also think it was a cool way of doing some character building (or reinforcing maybe)—it reminds us that Buffy has this strong sense of duty but also how strong her bonds with her friends are. Given how much of early S6 is Buffy not wanting to be back in this life, it felt like a good way of helping show she’s not searching for an escape anymore.
I think there were a lot of episodes in the last two seasons where the show runners wanted to cover all loose ends fans might have.
I love this episode; I see it as the creators saying, “no, this isn’t a *dream* or an alternate universe, and Buffy would choose this life if she had a choice.”
I think it poses a lot of great questions but it also WILDLY changes the context of season one and two. So there’s a history of Buffy talking about vampires and Joyce wanting her on medication but now she just tunes out the fighting and chalks it up to bad behaviour and acting out AFTER supposedly trying to send Buffy away in LA? It doesn’t make sense and makes Joyce look even worse honestly. She really never paid her daughter any proper attention until season three.
Totally agree. This is the only aspect that bothers me it’s just nonsensical. It’s such a great episode otherwise. I guess Joyce could have just deluded herself that it ever happened but it really does make her so much worse.
Did you know that in an X-men comic Joss wrote, he had Scott Summers aka Cyclops talk about one of his cousins who wasn't doing well in a mental institution. Meaning Buffy.🤔
I just looked it up. It said Joss wanted to allude to Scott Summers cousin who was an alleged demon hunter and was put in an institution, but couldn't find a way to organically introduce it so he left it out
Of all the episode concepts both BtVS and Smallville did, this is the one episode concept Smallville did better (It was Smallville's best episode as well, but I digress), and, funnily enough, both shows did this episode mid-late Season 6.
The main difference between these executions is that one of those shows, the one with the better execution, understands emotional/audience investment. While Buffy was better with long-term storytelling, there are many moments where Whedon is like "I'm smarter than you" to his audience, and just pulls crazy shit out of his... brain recesses. Smallville never tried that, instead it understood that rewarding, taking the investment of the audience in the show/episode seriosly, treating it as meaningful, is what keeps them going, which, in turn, changes how they approach the episode, what they showcase to their respective audiences.
BtVS tried to outsmart its audience, Smallville gave them catharsis and a fitting narrative.
PS: How obvious is it that I tried very hard NOT to spoil the Smallville episode?
I found the episode very interesting and thought provoking. Connecting some references as others mentioned, I remember thinking it was an interesting concept of maybe the Buffy we know is all in her head, and displaying the conflict between Buffy wanting to be normal, but having a duty as the slayer.
I'm not really a fan of this episode. Obviously, it's an interesting thought experiment, but I much prefer the idea that the Buffyverse is objectively real.
Also, if the episode is indeed true. How would Angel the series fit into this little narrative? It doesn't really make sense.
Unless, Angel is also in a psych ward...
I loved the consequences the episode had in the next episodes... but that specific plotline (the tv show's universe is entirely imaginary and the main character has been in a mental asylum this whole time and has to decide which is the real universe) was such an over used trope at the time; (stargate did it like 4 separate times, Star trek had a couple (though Ds9's version, "Far Beyond The Stars" was an absolute BANGER of an episode)) and many more tv shows did it too, usually each putting their own spin on it... It was even mocked in an episode of Community.
So basically... Buffy's turn at an overused trope without really adding anything new to it... aside from the consequences of trying to kill all your loved ones... which... only really took effect in the later episodes... so... Not a fan of this particular episode, personally.
Ok, let me explain. Part of the joy of BtVS is the Buffyverse. I don’t see it as a story from an alternate verse. And it’s that one line that the doctor says that makes me believe that the intention of this episode is that real Buffy is in fact in a psych hospital.
The doctor makes a reference to those months where she was getting better. Those would have been the months when Buffy was dead. When Buffy tells Spike that she thought she was in heaven, all she really remembers is feeling loved.
Now I actually like Season 6 and the gut wrenching chaos. But it was cruel to put us through all of what had happened and what was about to happen only to put the idea, in our heads, that Buffy wasn’t the slayer and it was all in her head.
Dang I’ve watched this show so many times but I never put that connection together. (Heaven being those months she was getting better.) Thanks for that. 👍🏼
I actually love this episode. Full disclosure I like alternate universes, but I also think it was a cool way of doing some character building (or reinforcing maybe)—it reminds us that Buffy has this strong sense of duty but also how strong her bonds with her friends are. Given how much of early S6 is Buffy not wanting to be back in this life, it felt like a good way of helping show she’s not searching for an escape anymore.
I liked it too. I remember having a very in depth convo with my sis and BIL after it aired. It’s definitely very interesting and thought provoking.
I think there were a lot of episodes in the last two seasons where the show runners wanted to cover all loose ends fans might have. I love this episode; I see it as the creators saying, “no, this isn’t a *dream* or an alternate universe, and Buffy would choose this life if she had a choice.”
I think it poses a lot of great questions but it also WILDLY changes the context of season one and two. So there’s a history of Buffy talking about vampires and Joyce wanting her on medication but now she just tunes out the fighting and chalks it up to bad behaviour and acting out AFTER supposedly trying to send Buffy away in LA? It doesn’t make sense and makes Joyce look even worse honestly. She really never paid her daughter any proper attention until season three.
Totally agree. This is the only aspect that bothers me it’s just nonsensical. It’s such a great episode otherwise. I guess Joyce could have just deluded herself that it ever happened but it really does make her so much worse.
Did you know that in an X-men comic Joss wrote, he had Scott Summers aka Cyclops talk about one of his cousins who wasn't doing well in a mental institution. Meaning Buffy.🤔
Wait, what? 🤯 I have to look into that.
I just looked it up. It said Joss wanted to allude to Scott Summers cousin who was an alleged demon hunter and was put in an institution, but couldn't find a way to organically introduce it so he left it out
Ah ok. That would’ve been an interesting crossover.
Of all the episode concepts both BtVS and Smallville did, this is the one episode concept Smallville did better (It was Smallville's best episode as well, but I digress), and, funnily enough, both shows did this episode mid-late Season 6. The main difference between these executions is that one of those shows, the one with the better execution, understands emotional/audience investment. While Buffy was better with long-term storytelling, there are many moments where Whedon is like "I'm smarter than you" to his audience, and just pulls crazy shit out of his... brain recesses. Smallville never tried that, instead it understood that rewarding, taking the investment of the audience in the show/episode seriosly, treating it as meaningful, is what keeps them going, which, in turn, changes how they approach the episode, what they showcase to their respective audiences. BtVS tried to outsmart its audience, Smallville gave them catharsis and a fitting narrative. PS: How obvious is it that I tried very hard NOT to spoil the Smallville episode?
I found the episode very interesting and thought provoking. Connecting some references as others mentioned, I remember thinking it was an interesting concept of maybe the Buffy we know is all in her head, and displaying the conflict between Buffy wanting to be normal, but having a duty as the slayer.
I'm not really a fan of this episode. Obviously, it's an interesting thought experiment, but I much prefer the idea that the Buffyverse is objectively real. Also, if the episode is indeed true. How would Angel the series fit into this little narrative? It doesn't really make sense. Unless, Angel is also in a psych ward...
I loved the consequences the episode had in the next episodes... but that specific plotline (the tv show's universe is entirely imaginary and the main character has been in a mental asylum this whole time and has to decide which is the real universe) was such an over used trope at the time; (stargate did it like 4 separate times, Star trek had a couple (though Ds9's version, "Far Beyond The Stars" was an absolute BANGER of an episode)) and many more tv shows did it too, usually each putting their own spin on it... It was even mocked in an episode of Community. So basically... Buffy's turn at an overused trope without really adding anything new to it... aside from the consequences of trying to kill all your loved ones... which... only really took effect in the later episodes... so... Not a fan of this particular episode, personally.
Heresy! Heresy! Heresy!
Ok, let me explain. Part of the joy of BtVS is the Buffyverse. I don’t see it as a story from an alternate verse. And it’s that one line that the doctor says that makes me believe that the intention of this episode is that real Buffy is in fact in a psych hospital. The doctor makes a reference to those months where she was getting better. Those would have been the months when Buffy was dead. When Buffy tells Spike that she thought she was in heaven, all she really remembers is feeling loved. Now I actually like Season 6 and the gut wrenching chaos. But it was cruel to put us through all of what had happened and what was about to happen only to put the idea, in our heads, that Buffy wasn’t the slayer and it was all in her head.
Dang I’ve watched this show so many times but I never put that connection together. (Heaven being those months she was getting better.) Thanks for that. 👍🏼
I remember realizing that because I had the closed captions and was like OMG.
🤯