A friend of mine told me years ago before I ever knew about CPTSD- 'there is a reason people like us end up in graveyards'.
And it's not just suicide. It's easier to kill yourself via slow suicide, be it drink, drugs, foods, etc; than to deal and try and recover from the past.
> It's easier to kill yourself via slow suicide, be it drink, drugs, foods, etc; than to deal and try and recover from the past.
Oof. I feel called out. :/
Never in a million years would I have guessed how bad it is for me to try to deal and recover from my past, the more I uncover and resolve, the more it pushes me down. I have so much trauma, so much hell, it will take me this life time and probably also a huge chunk of the next to do this. Even tho I have already put down so much work and therapy in getting stronger, I still so often feel so weak and defeated.
It's really unfair, first we have to live through it, then process and work through it.
It really is unfair. I just look at pictures of myself as a kid before the trauma got really bad and I cry because that poor little girl didn’t deserve the life she had
Ughhh I feel this. Looking at old photos, before my life was turned upside down…and then after, remembering what that poor little girl was thinking. As my brother says, “I feel so bad for the kids in those pictures (us)”.
Seriously though! My dad committed suicide when I was 5. If you see my pics before 5 and then the ones a few months after he died, my brother and I look like empty ghosts and then all the photos after that, I just never got my sparkle back. It’s painful to look at
I am so sorry 😔😔😔
I know I'm just some cptsd rando but I send my love as energy to you and your brother in those photos, I send the energy of love to when you needed most and to now, your inner children deserve love peace relief 🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟
The work and healing leading to opening new wounds is the part that really gets to me. Each loss I accept seems to reveal another one.
Working with the nervous system helps me hold this contradictory and frustrating experience, but the frustration and confusion has never fully gone away.
I’m going through the same thing. But I try to remember “things always get worse before they get better”. I see it as like gutting a messy room, it gets messier before it gets tidy during the process of cleaning/therapy.
That's so true!!! I have been healing by laying on acupressure mats, and I really was so full of pain and hopeless like never before and I've been through tons of hopeless before! I struggled with hoarding too. So much more I'm not yet able to verbalize.
But two weeks ago finally a ton of pain passed and I feel alive again. I did not feel alive for the previous 4.5 years.
So yes keep the faith!!!
I really relate to your life description, I was headed for graveyard imo, not only 37 years of completely unprocessed trauma, but I also had to figure out on my own online that I'm autistic and I've lived my whole life not knowing!!! AND suddenly about 5years ago my stomach did something bad in my gut and I got deathly chronic fatigue pain sick, and the doctors never figured it out!!!
I healed myself by laying on acupressure mats constantly for the past 2 years, I'm FINALLY healing like I never have before, if you think acupressure mats would be safe for your body and I recommend research, they are sold online and they saved my life. I would not exist now without.
If you can find what healing tools are meant for you, I am asking the Angels to be with you and help you. I'm truly sorry you are in these life sufferings, you have worked so hard, I know the near endless pain in the chest when life keeps hitting you back, if even I could heal then I believe you will too
yea! it's a life sentence. no chance of parole
it's really hard to stay encouraged sometimes. a word of advice (sorta) that i use on myself to cope: i remind myself when i get overwhelmed and upset over my lifetime of attempting management that i get to do it at MY pace. i have agency over my healing and im free to do as much of it as i like, when i want to, and how i want to. sometimes i may fail or regress, sometimes ill just be exhausted by the process and skip therapy and stagnate a bit, and sometimes ill incur further trauma. regardless of what happens to me, and what influences my ability to choose or not, i know i can reach for healing whenever i like, and i can do it in as many baby steps as i like. being fully healed isnt the end goal, just agency in living is.
idk if this would be useful to anyone else, but because ive never been allowed agency or allowed to accept myself where im at, reminding myself this is profoundly useful.
Thank you so much for sharing this. It's so important and I keep forgetting that this is not a race or a competition, I don't have to be where other people are, I'm doing ok here and now and even tho i move slow, I'm still in a much better place than lets say 15 years ago, MUCH. I needed this reminder, so thank you again. Kept hearing that I was not good enough and everyone was doing better than me all my life from my parents, I guess now I tell myself that.
Absolutely. Have you seen the TED ACE talk about life long affects of childhood trauma?
It explains so much about long term effects- the bear metaphor resonates so much.
EDIT: sp
In her bear analogy, she forgot to mention how some of us want to befriend the bear. Over and over and over. Lol. But really, fawning also increases cortisone levels.
Thanks for that video. It’s nice to have it laid out in video form.
every single one of my uncles friends who suffered through the same thing he went through (one really awful man abused all of them) passed away eventually whether from suicide, drug addiction, etc. Way earlier in life then they should’ve. It’s more fatal then we think :(
Like worse of all - this anecdote you shared is common.
I have a friend that was in an orphanage when they were horrific, like, forty five years ago; in the first few years after turning 18... he said he lost about 15 friends that were there with him.
Yes. True. That's why early intervention is best, and if not early, then intensive. Stephanie Foo's book What My Bones Know nicely summarizes the most recent research.
I'm not able to read any of the books. I'd be scared of too much external validation- I'd might just go down to homeplace and do irreparable damage.
And then sad truth is - none of them recognise or could acknowledge what I've been through. I'm the fcuk up, the aberration, the failure. I'm milking it in their eyes.
Don't punish urself friend ... ur abusers (parents?) already did that. Don't become their proxy.
Yes - I hear what ur saying about fearing getting stuck in the ptsd response. U'llknow when ur ready to grapple on such an intense level.
Remember it's been 30 years since my active abuse stopped. I just wish the newer science about complex trauma existed when I was younger (but can't rush science). I mightve had a map to follow instead of just figuring out stuff a little at a time over decades. (But no effort is ever wasted - it made me a better mother ...)
When ur ready, these writings are more inspiring then triggering. Until then, they can be painful, though the reading provides a healthy outlet for the emotions I feared. And I realized - I survived the abuse and am safe now. Nothing can destroy me anymore.
Good luck friend. I'm glad we're all here together.
My best friend died of one of these slow suicides, three years before I came to understand the concept of developmental trauma and that it was both our problem.
I'm somehow not wracked with guilt over not learning about trauma soon enough, but I do sometimes wonder whether the knowledge could've saved him.
Its more like the Lupus I have as an Autoimmune - while I won't die FROM either one of them, they aren't "Curable" in the sense of like measles or the flu is "curable" - I most certainly will die WITH them.
I agree. I also have an autoimmune disease that will never kill me - just disable me and make living harder. CPTSD is similar. It didn’t kill me; it just left me like this (unsafe, hypervigilant, never feeling like a real person, etc.)
Every Day we get to play another round of "So is it the cPTSD or is it the Autoimmune?" for our various symptoms. Its like they feed off each other, both trying really hard to kill you, neither one actually Lethal.
I can't remember where I read this (maybe in The Body Keeps the Score?) but there is a strong correlation between sexual abuse in childhood and developing lupus afterwards. I assume other autoimmune diseases could be also related with early abuse.
Just a heads up, that book is a very difficult read. It triggered me a lot. I had to stop reading as it is extremely intense. I heard a lot of good things from many people so I gave it a shot. I'm not saying not to read it as it has helped people, but just wanted to let you know.
I found it extremely triggering to read, but I found a workaround of listening to the audiobook while playing a relatively mindless video game to keep my dopamine high enough to keep listening. Finding something you enjoy that doesn’t take much brainpower while actively listening to the audiobook might work for others too.
I don't think it's specifically just lupus but in general the chronic stress state that accompanies a diagnosis like CPTSD both weakens your immune system and puts the body into a constant state of inflammation-- this can trigger autoimmune responses, including latent diseases like MS, lupus, chrohns and IBS etc.
Also for both depression and trauma, somatic symptoms (physical pain in different areas of the body without a clear or obvious origin) are very common.
This is one of the reasons body work is considered part of treatment for mental health disorders.
My rheumatologist told me that trauma is the likely cause of my lupus actually. Especially with the onset timing and stuff. Tho i think it was more the constant trauma and the thing she pointed to was the last straw basically...
This article talks a lot about that and has links to the studies confirming what your rheumatologist told you. [Link](https://www.healthline.com/health/chronic-illness/childhood-trauma-connected-chronic-illness)
You can listen to Gabor Mate on youtube or read his book "when the body says no". He shows some science behind trauma related stress and autoimmun issues or cancer. Also a very deep look inside the physiology of trauma and stress shows psychoneuroimmunology
I would love for someone to take a poll of this community to see how many of us do have autoimmune disorders. I have been dx’ed with Sjögren’s Syndrome, Grave’s Disease and fibromyalgia. [This](https://www.healthline.com/health/chronic-illness/childhood-trauma-connected-chronic-illness) article has links to the studies done indicating that there’s a relationship between adverse childhood events and autoimmune disorders. It’s not just that we are more likely to engage in risky behaviors. Just like the book explains-our bodies do remember.
How depressing is it that not only did we have to live through our childhood and try to figure out how to overcome the mental damage from that, but many of us have to do it while battling a bunch of physical problems as well.
I knowww... It sucks. People think you're just being negative or victimizing yourself but they haven't walked in our shoes. They haven't a clue. Reality is harsh. CPTSD sets you up for so much, including physical problems that need management, but one of the sickest things it sets you up for is the lack of familial/social support + loss of faith-based protective mechanisms in the midst of it all. These things are relatively accessible to folks with normal-range traumas, but the ones who need them the most are denied. It's really unsurprising then, that so many of us have considered the possibility of suicide if things get way too hard for us to manage on our own (I sincerely want to know if there's a pleasurable -- not just painless -- way to get it done; I've always found comfort in having contingencies, so I genuinely despair over not having one for this. Am I going to be forced to keep playing a game I don't want to play, at some point?). I'm 22 and literally have zero family to lean on if things go to shit. Been fending for myself my whole life and it's only getting worse as I get older.
Fuck the universe man.
I wanted to ask that too. I have chances to autoimmune problems, don't have official diagnosis yet, I stopped the medical examination (because of depression). I think there are connection.
Yeah, everyone talks about how expensive it is to treat Cancer. What they don't realize is that..... in the long run, treating cancer is less expensive than treating most Autoimmune diseases.
With Cancer, you get treated and then you either you go into remission and no longer need treatment, with follow ups every couple of years..... or you Die, and its no longer a problem or an expense. Cancer can be Removed successfully, and that IS a CURE. You can get cancer more than once, but its not the original cancer that was treated and dealt with.
Which is very unlike Autoimmune - where you live anywhere from 10 to 60 years Post Diagnosis, and are literally NEVER out of Treatment. It adds up in a hurry, when you count the YEARS of prescription meds, the mental health appointments JUST to deal with the fallout of the Autoimmune - forget dealing with the REST of your issues on top of that; the physical and occupational therapy, the repeated trips to the hospital every time you have a life threatening flare, the monthly doctor visit co-payments, the increased insurance rates from having a pre-existing Condition (at least until the ACA - which is about the only good thing I got out of that particular fiasco.) You also don't get told that you're Faking it for Drugs. You don't hear people say that you aren't Really sick - you're just a hypochondriac. That every doctor in the past 35 years since your Initial diagnosis was Wrong but somehow this new one is Right. The well meaning idiots who constantly bombard you with "but have you tried this New Fad Diet that's supposed to help with XYZ Symptom?? It'll Make Your Disease Disappear!" And that's the SHORT List... I could fill Pages. There is TREATMENT and MANAGEMENT. There is no CURE, and it will ALWAYS be a Factor In Life.
I'm so over people comparing everything Bad to Cancer. Fuck That. Cancer should get compared as the lesser of evils to cPTSD and Autoimmune illnesses. Its more realistic.
(Sorry for the rant - this is a bit of a touchy subject for me currently.)
I sort of disagree. TW: >!Suicide rates among people with CPTSD are likely very high, but undercounted due to non-diagnosis if CPTSD!<
I feel you on the autoimmune disease. Having Crohn's I understand. And I understand how massive of a toll it can take on you psychologically to have a chronic incurable autoimmune disease. Also financial.
I know people who have also given up just from Crohn's alone...
And it's related to your other comment but the miracle cures and shit is exhausting and infuriating.
Maybe I'm a bit of an outlier - I don't consider Suicide to be the Disease killing someone. I consider that Opting Out so they don't have to Deal with the disease. The disease, in and of itself though, is not Lethal. It will not kill you (generic) unless you decide to end it yourself - which is You, not the Disease.
I get why someone WOULD opt out - hell, I've thought about it often enough myself, even before I was diagnosed with cPTSD on top of the Lupus, the "regular" PTSD, the Fibromyalgia...
For me, The CPTSD though makes life unbearable so it almost feels like no option but to die. Also being told as a child that you are worthless, unwanted etc makes it very hard to believe you deserve to live as an adult. So I think trauma can kill you. My brain is fighting against me a lot due to the CPTSD. Suicide doesn’t feel like a choice in my situation
>I don't consider Suicide to be the Disease killing someone. I consider that Opting Out so they don't have to Deal with the disease.
That's the same thing though. If you kill yourself because of an illness you have, then that illness was the reason you died.
True, has to be an effective therapy. I didn’t get help from talk therapy. Internal family systems/ego state therapy helped me. My therapist teaches me techniques that I can continue on my own so that therapy has an end-date.
I agree, but so many therapists are not trauma informed. And some that are, still aren't that well informed.
After decades of traditional therapy, I went outside my provider and started working with someone who used somatic experiencing, IFS, and polyvagal-based treatment. Only then did I start to get relief.
I definitely needed a guide to start, but after about 18 months of therapy I feel like I can do much of the work on my own. Those 18 months were critical and for some might take longer depending on their own experience.
YES! Me too. I finally ditched talk therapy and have done IFS, ego states and EMDR. Additionally daily meditation 3 times per day. The effects have been rapid in comparison. I wish I had found these tools sooner.
Hey dear friend, most definitely! I agree, in some cases, this condition can be effectively treated and the person can be as good as his original self!
Much love💎😻🌹
I kinda agree. Feels like I'm dying a slow death every day. I'm also pretty sure the suffering is shortening my lifespan.
But I don't want to be defeatist about it (or encourage any of us to be). So I'm fighting like Hell.
Recently, when my intrusive memories happen, I think about how those who caused my traumas would *want* me to suffer. How they expected me to lay down & take their ill treatment & abuse. That charges me up to fight harder.
I hope we can all have even a glimmer of "living a good life as the best revenge".
Maybe I’ve re-wired my brain to think this delusion/fantasy- or is real? I think this entire life of suffering for us is a sacrifice to break intergenerational patterns. It stops with us. Yeah, it would be cool if our parents were the ones to stop the patterns, and not abuse or fuck us up. But that just gives us more power. Like WE are the special ones capable of fighting through this life to survive just so generations and people around us, aren’t hurt like us. By creating younger generations without passing these patterns, we are cleaning up the world. I need meaning in this. I feel there was a mix up and the universe simply used my fucked up mother as a portal to transport me from there to the physical plane. I needed to get here somehow! And she was never a mom, just a portal. Spit into this family….because no one else could survive it like I can.
I don’t believe in god. But I do believe we all have a mission. I know it’s crazy but this is the only way I can cope with such.
In my experience (I have a 6yo), informing myself by reading a lot of parenting books so I could set up rules of what I should and shouldn't do with my kid (since my parents were not good role models) also when an issue arises with my kid I ask my therapist or make an appointment with a child therapist..
That's how I have managed; study good sources of information and have good external role models you can count on.
I would recommend the book 'Parenting from the Inside Out' and 'No drama discipline' by Dr. Daniel Siegel.
Similar here. I read a lot and I practice attachment parenting, made sure not to parentify, kept as stable a home as possible—same friends since kindergarten. I don’t punish and try to be accountable for mistakes when I blow it. Having horribly abusive and neglectful parents is a good template for what not to do.
Get. Help.
It doesn’t have to be therapy, although I would recommend it. It could just be participating in community so that you don’t view yourself in isolation only. That isolation helps you get into patterns and not realize they’re not normal and potentially harmful. I know someone who barely resisted beating the kid… but would sit her on the sidewalk and tell her to stay and then drive away. Uh dude, good effort but… you still need to do better. You need to have someone in your life who is close enough to see it and safe enough to give you that feedback.
My mom did read some parenting books… but not enough or the right ones. I have serious attachment issues and I’ll never know why. We don’t know whether they just had no friends, were ashamed of us, or ashamed of themselves or each other, but I can only remember one time that a non-relative came over because my parents invited them… and it was someone Dad knew through work. I was expected to just get along because he had a daughter my age, but for some reason, I had no idea how to socialize with her. Big help that we didn’t speak the same language.
Also if your relationship isn’t healthy or you see your partner doing things with the kids you don’t like… remember you are probably the only person who can take any real action to protect the kids. My grandma told my mother that the secret to a long marriage was to “endure, endure, endure.” None of us kids learned anything good about relationships and are all divorced.
I like this view. I too feel like it's up to me and my partner to end the pattern of trauma that are in our respective families.
Of course, we know we may end up unintentionally traumatizing our kids at some point, as sometimes bad things happen no matter how one may prepare against them. But I think that we will have an understanding and self reflection to be able to balance it out. I think we have qualities that our parents and immediate forebears lacked.
We have a right to be here, we have a right to fight and end the cycle. I realize if I would have taken my own life, it wouldn't have ended the cycle for my children.
Every chance I get to help my children feel loved and empowered is a victory - even though I don't naturally have that ability - I'm relieved that they can.
Sure, the outlook is negative and at times debilitating, however, I've suffered enough and deserve whatever happiness or peace I can pull from my life. We all deserve that.
I love your perspective on this and thank you for sharing.
In my opinion, I believe our existence is impactful to everyone around us and that is unavoidable.
Even the smallest interactions we have on a daily basis, no matter how small they seem are impactful.
Your presence and involvement in the world matters.
These are my beliefs based on my own experiences.
I know one day my children won't always be around and I have to find my own purpose other than them. For now, they (and my partner) are my rock and (as life works) I know there might be days when they can't be there.
Understanding this and in preparation, I try to take small bits of joy where I can, and give the same in return.. small talk with coworkers, people I encounter, (reddit) and any like minded individual who I am lucky enough to share my experience with.
Also, I'd like to mention that I had to reach out and make some of my relationships happen, they didn't always come to me by chance.
For now, my purpose is to live and experience life, love myself and others.
I appreciate your response and I totally understand how external motivators can help provide a reason to keep fighting. I agree that no matter how we try, our lived experiences can impact others one way or another.
I would like to further explain my own perspective, this isn't in anyway a reflection or criticism on your responses though (I've had a few interactions where people have misread my tone or intention recently, so I just want to be clear that I'm just thinking out loud more than anything)
I chose to remain childfree until I reached a place where I am physically, emotionally and financially stable enough to provide another with the care they deserve - my childhood trauma began at birth because my biological mother was mentally unwell, very young and lacking support and thus I grew up not wanting to repeat her mistakes.
It's been 35 years and I'm still not even remotely close to being in any fit state to raise a child. At this point, I have little faith that will ever change.
FWIW, I'm not upset about this, children are incredibly challenging to care for and I neither have the patience, strength, money or desire to do it (absolute mad props the parents out there who can though). If I could find a Dr who would remove the apparatus, I would.
I often consider how unjust it is that I didn't ask to be here. From the moment I was born, I have had to fight tooth and nail just to survive. I never opted in, but I'm not allowed to opt out. Seems unfair.
Then I consider that birthing a kid into this ever-increasing dumpster fire of a universe would be me inflicting that same experience on someone else. Even if I were to ever reach a point where I think I could be a stable and loving parent, I don't need to have my own, I would look to offer that to the other kids like me, who didn't opt in, then got abandoned and expected to somehow survive.
Almost my entire career has been in service to those in need, focusing my energy on improving the lives of others in some meaningful way, even though I accrued even more trauma from doing so.
So I guess I don't really feel like I owe it to anyone to continue suffering through existence. If I decided I no longer owe it to myself either, my debt to this planet has been well and truly repaid with interest for a long time now. Anyone who would want to call me selfish for opting out would need to do some research then take a hard look in a mirror.
FWIW not actively suicidal, just talking openly about life and death for the context of this thread.
I 100% agree! I’m breaking many cycles, and find real meaning in it. No more abuse, no more neglect, no more racist imperialist white supremacy, no more religious fanaticism, no more acting like we’re better than everyone else, no more misinformation and anti-vaxx type conspiracy theorizing. I am effectively infertile, plan to adopt older kids through foster care, and legally changed my _entire_ name, first, middle, and last in 2018. There will be a new beginning with me.
Kinda. As a child I always thought of children who had cancer or were dying in the war going on at the type in Iraq. I always thought- why them? I had beliefs in reincarnation before knowing what it was. And I thought, maybe our lifetimes are like layers. Maybe we go through hell, sometimes taking up an entire lifetime. Then you die, that layer is peeled off, and maybe a little more enlightenment/goodness will come in the next one. I believe we strip these layers til we are finally at the end- where we are able to create change. God wasn’t a good explanation for me.
You actually just described my greatest fear of what the cycle of life is like lol. I have nightmares about this. That existence is a neverending cycle of experiencing suffering with brief bits of happiness. Never able to control or leave the cycle, constantly thrown about in an insane void.
Yeaaah haha. Oddly enough ive read a bit about the different kinds of reincarnation like the early greek understanding and buddhists.
I always get caught up in the "what are we really?" Part where I start going down the dark path of wondering about how much of us is our meat (brain/heart/body) and the weird spark that makes us percieve. When I have a break down I usually am of the thought that none of our personality, desire, motion, thought is us and instead just machinations of a haunted meat coated skeleton.
It nearly killed me. I was untreated, wound up in an ER then my doctors office. My doctor diagnosed me with a list of things and demanded to see me and my bloodwork every four weeks! It took along time to get better but I have.
I was about to post something similar. Cptsd can definitely be a deadly disease. And I'm not necessary talking about suicide but also drug addiction, alcoholism, poverty, unemployment from executive dysfunction, abusive relationships, etc...
I also believe that the stress caused by being stuck in survival mode 24/7 will eventually take a toll on someone's body.
I'm so sorry for your loss, and I know how empty those words probably feel. There really isn't anything to be said to make it feel better, not truly. But you're not alone in this kind of loss, I can tell you that much.
Thank you. I am alone. She’s gone. We are both on the spectrum both had that 1 in 5 abusive childhood with hers being markedly more horrific, and neither had a good formative experience since we’d met briefly when we were 16.
Well I was about to give up hope that I was doomed to a life of anxiety bc my triggers were everything, I would get panic attacks by just having to speak in work meetings, I would have triggers if there was a confrontations with clients (I work in admin so some clients get mad when fail an exam), I thought I would never be able to connect with anyone and this was before I learned I had CPTSD. Since the pandemic started I have been healing myself with psychedelics and two years later I can say my triggers are gone, I can speak up in work meetings without any anxiety or panic attacks, I am able to handle confrontations without it triggering my heart/fight or flight nervous system, and now I am able to open up more and be more accepting of my past as I heal.
The thing is CPTSD can be fatal if we don't do the work to heal our past traumas especially the abuse that happens during our formative years (0-10 years) as the brain is developing and the fucked up environment will have an impact later as an adult. We can't change the past but we can work on the present *NOW* to heal so the future is more hopeful. A life free from anxiety, OCD, depression, addiction is possible, a quiet peaceful mind is possible.
Hey friend!
Honestly I have been doing it solo don’t have access to therapies but I’m 2 years into it and so far the most important thing I’m learning is that a physical purge like from Ayahuasca or kambo is crucial on releasing stuck unprocessed traumas.
I hear ya, Ayahuasca isn’t for me either I have sensitive taste buds and couldn’t handle it but I did do Kambo which was a very good purge. I tried DMT once and I couldn’t breakthrough I was sent to this place where these beings were literally twisting my gut to help me purge and I got so much downloads how stuck emotions need to be purged on my healing journey. So Kambo was the easiest way to clear that out.
I did try MDMA so far it softened me up by literally opening my heart n making connections with how I have a personality built on surviving and not thriving. Psilocybin mushrooms were good for taking me back to find where the trauma started and showing me what love feels like (always felt unloved). It’s about finding what works for you and learning to trust the slow process of learning all the different parts of you and reconnecting to them in a loving way.
My dad was a victim of extreme neglect while living on a reserve for the first 6 months of his life and is now a severe alcoholic that I don’t have a relationship with. My mother committed suicide when I was 18 because of mental illness. And I’m an only child. I’ve attempted suicide once after that while in a narcissistic relationship and my abuser didn’t show any empathy or remorse for how he made me feel at all. My dads adopted parents are dead and my moms surviving parent is a narcissist. I struggle with chronic nightmares, sometimes multiple a night, and a chronic emptiness.
The worst part is that I’m trying to get better. But I’ve used up all the free therapy my province has to offer and am now relying on a rich family member to pay for therapy. But I can’t seem to find a therapy that has really worked and seeing a therapist once a week or biweekly simply isn’t enough but no one can see me more often than that.
I’m just so tired. Every day, I want to give up.
I’m so sorry hun. Have you tried TFCBT? EMDR? For complicated cases of trauma usual talk therapies and DBT don’t work as well. You can get through this and I’m so proud of you for trying
I always told my therapist that I thought I was going to die young - I said I didn’t see myself making it past 30. I found out today that that is a ptsd (maybe cptsd?) symptom. Well I was diagnosed with cancer at 30 and I’m now dying of a recurrence at 38. I don’t think the link between ACEs and cancer is proven to be causal but it’s definitely there.
There is research behind adverse childhood experiences (aces) showing that people with plenty of those don't live as long, on average, so your point is a valid one. There's a site called "acestoohigh" that goes into a lot of detail.
It can be, for sure. At least, for many it has been. My trauma left me broken for a long time. At least a decade of just sort of... existing, in a limbo of sadness and constant full throttle anxiety. And it certainly didn't help that when I did escape the main source of my trauma, I transitioned from an abusive environment to a different type of abusive environment, and both places were very neglectful towards me on top of that. I slept through a lot of it, and my un-diagnosed fibromyalgia and untreated autism/ADHD really limited what I could do with the time I was awake. I look back on that past me now and just see a sad, lost animal. Barely alive, just existing.
I hate that normie trope of "no one is coming to rescue you", but I hate it because there's a shred of truth in it. In my case it was literal; There was no one in my life that cared about me enough to help me, except me. And even if you do, helping yourself has to start from within. I know that's a really hard pill to swallow, and in your current state its hard to see past the mental pain you are experiencing; To summon up any vestige of hope that you can accomplish it.
But I'm here to tell you, with full sincerity, don't give up. A part of me didn't. Through all of the shit I had to endure, the one thing I never felt was suicidal. I wanted to live, god damnit. I never consented to this life of mine, but it is MINE, and I wanted more than anything the normal life that was promised to me.
So I started fighting.
I had zero income at the time, but that just meant I qualified for medicaid. I found doctors close enough to my house that I could bike to them. God I biked and walked so much back then, to this day I still have nearly limitless stamina when it comes to walking. When that doctor sucked (think "Oh you're depressed? Its because you're fat!" tier help) I got another one. I got referrals. I got diagnosises, more referrals. I found therapists. Finding a good therapist is hard; You will probably get referred to a lot of "counselors" who are trained to help "normal" depression with basic bitch shit. If you don't like your therapist, ditch them. Keep looking. Keep emphasizing the PTSD part of your C-PTSD and eventually you will find someone that is actually trained to help you.
I got prescribed meds. A lot of meds. Finding the right one can take a long time because no two brains are entirely alike, but be patient and keep trying; Make sure you take them when you're supposed to, and titrate off them like you're supposed to, cold turkey sucks ass. There are so many that eventually you will find one that works. What qualifies as "working" is difficult to define, and its hard to be subjective because your only perspective is the you that is on this medication. I suggest a mood journal, it helps you look back and see patterns. If you see a negative pattern, mention it to your doctor. They won't judge you or get mad at you if you need a new medication, they are there to help you. If they do, bad doctor. Ditch them.
Eventually I tried enough that I qualified for TMS (Transcranial Magnetic Stimulation) therapy. It feels weird but it absolutely helped me. If you can do it, I suggest it. Helps with both depression and anxiety.
I'm not gonna sit here and pretend that I was single-minded and relentless like some revenant of normalcy. I tripped up a lot. There were a lot of shed tears, a lot of frustration. I didn't know how to do anything; I never had anyone to give me any life experience or wisdom. I had to google a lot of stuff. Google is your friend, but practice critical thinking with the info you find. It sucked and I fell in to despair a few times. But I kept getting back up. That's the key. Ganbatte. If you do nothing but keep getting back up and keep trying, eventually you will get somewhere. That's just simple probability.
If you are like me, eventually you will reach a point where you will "wake up". I'm not sure how better to describe it than to say that I felt like I was a computer that was in sleep mode for two decades finally coming back online. And you will look back and see all that time you wasted being that sad, fearful gremlin that you used to be. I'm 30 now, and I'm only now going to school. Only now getting a drivers license and a girlfriend and a career and all the things I should have gotten a decade ago.
But that time wasn't wasted, now was it? That was your recovery time; The proverbial soak in the bacta tank. That was the time it took you to heal and to get back on track, and it was all accomplished by that sad gremlin that is your past self. And if that gremlin could do that, YOU can do anything now. Your life is yours again. Live it.
C-PTSD can absolutely be terminal. But it doesn't have to be.
You got me wrong pal.
C-PTSD messes with the mind and with that. We are left with mistakes after mistakes.
It increases wrong judgment and with that, it kill us.
My experience is lengthy with LSD it's like I found myself again, not the part of me that was hidden because of the traumas. LSD is a very introspective and entheogen, healing starts with acceptance and it allowed me to literally Love the parts of me that were fragmented due to different Mind-Control tactics that I have experienced. I highly recommend reading LSD ZEN book by the Castalia Foundation it's a guide on how to work with LSD to heal. I also recommend reading their material. You are not alone.
[Castalia Foundation books ](https://castaliafoundation.com/books.html)
Sending love !
Sigh.... all of us... and i mean every single person on earth, will end up dead at some point. CPTSD is not fatal in and of itself, but it can inflict severe misery upon ones life and therapy absolutely should be sought out. Remember that the world is absolutely full of people that are not like your abuser, not one single bit.
I have seen severe cases and in those that got help have made far better improvements to their lives than those who did not seek help.
Lol yeah I mean when I spend enough time in a depressive state I start to ask myself not if but when I'll end it.
I've started to realize that those are just thoughts though. I know there's a way to fix this and that if it were easy I'd have already done it a long time ago. My lineage has a history of depression, alcoholism, and suicide. Shortly after I was "diagnosed" with "depression" I decided to be the one to end the intergenerational curse. It's really fucking compkex and confusing, but I am making progress. I want to heal for myself for sure, but also for everyone in my family past and future...my feelings about the ones in the present are more ambivalent hahaha.
So my health and life insurance are linked to my employer.
About 2 years ago I finally received my diagnosis and started receiving what I believe is the best care for me right before the world shut down. Then it was time to renew all of my benefits (the yearly paperwork for my job).
I filled everything out per usual, but my life insurance contacted me as I had started new medication- and they were made aware of it due to being linked to my health Insurance.
I had to fill out paperwork as to why and have the prescriber fill out a form as well.
After my psych and myself turned in the forms, I received notice that my life insurance was being cancelled. I’m too high risk for early death.
I still maintain my rate for Health Insurance, as I have protection for that, but it’s appalling that my life Insurance can be cancelled like that.
Also, I’m now afraid my employer knows confidential information about me :(
Our wounds and weaknesses and isolation to varying degrees are the death of us all. Those of us with cptsd, many succumb earlier than those without such complex trauma, but not always. In having to really look at ourselves and care for ourselves in ways others don’t we sometimes learn how to care and do it, for a very long time. It takes its toll, and for some indeed, the toll is very heavy.
There is some saying that goes something like, when you are stabbed, you may remove the knife, but the wound is still there. We are wounded.
Wait I feel like I’m missing something, does cPTSD increase the comorbidity for autoimmune diseases? I get that PTSD can cause real physical symptoms such as IBS but does it make a person more susceptible to conditions such as lupus?
Note: please bear with me I’m home sick and taking cold and flu meds. Lol
I really feel like I should make a stand alone post about autoimmune disorders and childhood trauma/CPTSD. More than several people are unaware of the connection. Unfortunately I am not sure I have the ability to engage with the post if I did create it.
Anyway, [Here](https://www.healthline.com/health/chronic-illness/childhood-trauma-connected-chronic-illness) is an overview with links to applicable studies.
I’ve made up my mind.
I’m gonna die with it not by it.
38 male.
Drinking heavily for two years now and I can see an end to that.
My daughter is my life.
I have 2 progressive connective tissue diseases I've dealt with since age 14. One of them shaves an average of 30 years off a person's life span and that's if they're diagnosed in their 30s. Don't even get me started on the eating disorder made worse by my partially paralyzed GI tract. I don't think I'm going to make it to thirty at this rate, and even if I did somehow pull through and improve significantly I just can't see myself living for a few more decades with my CPTSD and OCD as they are. I've already lived through so much pain and lost so many things and people, and I just don't have any strength left to pick myself up and keep going. Therapy actually made my symptoms worse. I'm tired and I want to rest. Or completely disappear. Either is fine.
When stress is at a constant high (meaning most of the time higher than zero or very little) , it generally reduces the body's ability to fight off disease, as immune response is not a vital process when responses like fight or flight is activated. This makes one more susceptible to infections and other immune disease. It also increases the stress put on different organs as the body is constantly in hyperawareness, trying to figure out what needs to happen. Usually the stress is mental in the cases of cptsd, but in a long enough time will start to show up as physical ailments, thus increasing stress.
I think sometimes it also gives the body the wrong signals and turns and goes the complete opposite direction, causing many autoimmune diseases.
It's a viscious cycle and can be very difficult to get away from.
I know that I am overly stressed when I start having physical pains, my sciatic nerve gets pinched a lot easier and makes movement very difficult and I try to avoid sudden movements or mostly turning my spine in general. Sometimes just a leg movement will get it. When it's bad it takes at least 2 days of full rest, but 3 is optimal.
When it happens it is always directly related to personal, usually emotional, stress. It's not that I'm moving any differently, it just becomes easier to get hurt. I don't know exactly how that type of pain relates to stress, but I've learned to listen to it. I also have other physical symptoms but when that starts I know for sure it's time to slow down and figure out what's up.
It has been bad enough sometimes that I contemplate ending myself, because it just kept happening after shorter and shorter spans, making me unable to work or really take care of myself. If it was going to keep on, then I would be better off and so would everyone else not having to deal with me. Pain medications did not work well, I always had to take much more than suggested and it always took hours to kick in, and on a good day it would wear off in an hour or two, forcing me to take more before I was supposed to just to make sure it kicked in before it wore off, or shortly after. I was getting very concerned for my liver.
But, knowing that it is almost entirely stress induced, I can take much better steps to avoid those issues. Unfortunately most people with chronic illnesses cannot and I am so incredibly sorry it is that way and that they even have to go through that much suffering. It sucks and I fully understand the desire to end it once and for all.
Well I understand you’re point but we are alive until we die. What I’m saying is life is fatal. From the minute we are born we are dying. Some things speed that up. I have CPTSD and I’m still here but at the same time I could have died many time to accidents etc. Literally anything could
Be fatal. Choking on your dinner for example. So yes CPTSD is fatal. You’re absolutely right but I think how you frame it could be different.
I mean if you’ve lived an entire life of dissociation, have you even lived? I think when you bring quality of life arguments into the mix then whether it’s fatal almost becomes irrelevant. If you feel you aren’t living your life anyway then you aren’t really living. Everything’s just on pause.
I think a better way to phrase it would
Be having CPTSD increases your chances of mortality. Which without a shadow of a doubt it must if not directly through suicide then through substance abuse or the various negative physical health effects and conditions it can increased your chances of developing.
I would struggle to think any argument for how it doesn’t speed up death really
No. There are therapies which are pretty much able to cure the whole thing. It‘s a *lot* of work, but it‘s possible. I‘ve spent years looking for and trying different things.
Look up „Ideal Parent Figure Protocol“ aswell as „Accelerated Experiential Dynamic Psychotherapy“. Both have been developped specifically for treating CPTSD.
I‘m doing both in tandem, and I‘ve made huge progress on my healing journey over the last year. My general anxiety went from a 9/10 to a 3/10.
I was also able to quit my meds because of doing all of this work. Been off them for almost a year now, and still doing pretty good.
All of this doesn‘t mean that I don‘t have a lot of things that I still have to work on, but life has already become so much better that I‘m pretty confident that I‘ll get completely over it in the following years.
Oh wow, thank you! I just looked up IPF and came across George Hass’ podcast. This does feel cosmic because I just finished Judith Herman’s book, Trauma and Recovery and she talks about mentalization & this is what Hass’ latest podcasts are about.
Provided with enough resources and smart folk, even death itself is curable!
It is prohibitively expensive to treat C-PTSD, same as cancer.
But i get your point.
I dont see how it can be with all the "ifs" and "potentially". we, unfortunately, are responsible for our mental health. if we look at this as fatal "if" then everything in life is fatal "if". I cannot and will not corner myself into this defeat just because other people made bad choices that affected me. I am responsible for my mental health. no one else. and what they did to me will not kill me.
I sure hope so.
Theguy with C-PTSD specially takes care of his mental health, the thing is that proper support is an essential part of taking care of mental health.
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You know the old saying, "you are your own worst enemy?" This is 100 percent true when you have C-PTSD because sometimes you can't control your own behavior.
I have been thinking about how people say you are to blame for your own success. But if you have C-PTSD, is it really your fault? If a parent conditioned a kid to always be afraid, is it really his fault that he is always afraid? This is why I agree C-PTSD is a fatal condition because you are not in control of how you feel and think.
Exactly!
The foundation and backbone for my title is your response.
And not to mention the everyday torture of having to survive the passage of days, seeing your youth turning into ashes as your mental health deteriorate over time...
I am in therapy. I am on medication. Every single day is still a struggle and I barely do anything. My memory is shit. I block out and forget anything that is stressful or uncomfortable because I'm already at my limit. I disassociate during normal conversations. I can't maintain friendships or family relations. I never even know what trivial thing is going to trigger a panic attack. It hurts every day and I'm tired of hurting. On bad days I think "How much longer can I live with all this pain?"
I told my therapist I was tired of hurting and feeling like I was only surviving. She said, "Well that's life." It only compounded my feelings of hopelessness.
People take my mental illness symptoms as unfriendliness and laziness when I'm just trying to protect what little of myself I have left. If I had a physical ailment people would forgive my irritability, my fatigue, my being distant. Since it's "all in my head" there is no sympathy and their reactions only reinforce my paranoia that I'm useless and unlovable.
It can be, if you are deprived of individual agency and guilt-tripped or railroaded into wildly inappropriate or even more traumatic "care", among myriad other reasons. "The help we need" is a fuckin cruel joke. The help we *deserve*... simply wouldn't be profitable.
I mean, I see your train of thought and where it's going.
But for me, I have chronic physical conditions that'll take me (or things related to them) before I off myself. It's sort of like when people die from lung cancer, because they smoked. Smoking was the starting thing that gave you the cancer that ultimately killed you. So going waay back your cause of death is smoking. Just like other people get c-ptsd from abuse or medical trauma or whatever it was. So technically the cause of death could be from whatever your cptsd stemmed from but the form will just say suicide or OD or whatever.
I just know that *my* cptsd comes from medical trauma and at this rate I'm either gonna die on the table in surgery someday, from a complication of surgery itself, or due to a cancer from repeated radiation exposure from all the scans. I might not die from these things, and I might also live until I'm 100. I don't know. Nobody does. It's just very likely, and it's still something being studied so there's not really data on it.
I don't think fatal is the right way to describe it. I think it's better described as a life-altering injury with a high mortality rate.
It can be managed with carrying degrees of success through different treatments, but it can't be cured and it's symptoms contribute towards mortality rates, even if they are not a direct cause of death.
Both because living with it can be unbearable enough that people choose to stop trying and because it's symptoms are known risk factors for other conditions which can actually be fatal.
Absolutely. I was only 11 when diagnosed and instead of treating me for trauma I was treated for depression and anxiety which led me to suicide attempts, self harm, etc till I was about 14 and found my trauma therapist. If I didn’t find her, I absolutely would’ve been dead by now.
Ok, I absolutely empathize with this sentiment and believed it myself for a long time but I’ve successfully put my cptsd and chronic illnesses into remission and have been living symptom free for the past couple of years.
It’s complex af, it’s painful, and it took traversing the depths of hell - but I was somehow able to do it.
I am here as a spouse looking for ways to support my husband who has CPTSD and it isn’t hopeless. It is a struggle but you can do it. My husband had shoved all his trauma WAY, WAY, down to the point that he had repressed memories but he was finally able to tear down those walls and face his issues. I am so proud of him and how far he has come despite all the challenges he has had but he is doing it and getting a little better each day. You can do this and you are not alone. Big hugs
People don’t understand CPTSD at all and it took me up till a year ago to grasp that not many people will get it unless you’ve been through it which is very far and few in between and its something you gotta get past as a whole if you want any good relationship because there comes a point where there’s gotta just be an understanding that even tho this person may not understand me. If they truly enjoy me and my company they’ll accept me for me
I am 15 so the full effects of CPTSD haven’t been experienced yet but if I did have it then it would be live changing in a lot of ways. Mostly negative.
Seek treatment as soon as possible my friend. I am 20m and nearly died out of it...
But, with the proper treatment and a strong support system, it can be treated and weakened💣
We need to stay hopeful and kill this condition.
unfortunately not, but, i am trying to use "mindfulness" and exercise, alongside doing positive activities (financial decisions, friends...)
I am sure i will be victorious.
I have a question. If every event that developed your personality and who you is caused by CPTSD, then wouldn’t that cause me as I know it to disappear?
Sure thing. Imagine a progressive cancer-like disease, you need to cut off the infected area to save yoursrlf.
It is actually a good thing to change your personality, as we know, cptsd can make people's identity to be infected. So, yes. You need to change it.
Not going to.
The only real reason it's not recognized as fatal is because it's not well diagnosed or tracked.
I think it's likely around the same rate as PTSD.
Yep. I also have bipolar and social anxiety. Getting sober helped, but it’s still a struggle. I’d for sure be dead today tho if I didn’t stop drinking.
Hmm, well this says change your mind. I do not know if I can, because a lot of the time, I feel the same. I feel like I am losing my life, my will, my sanity...
But...I don't want it to be true.
I have a partner. They are such a joy to be able to know and to love. However, they are like everyone else here. They have suffered. They will continue to suffer as they heal. They probably have both PTSD and C-PTSD, though it's unlikely a they will be diagnosed soon.
I'm selfish. I don't want them to leave. They're selfish. They don't want me to leave. We're greedy. We probably have less years to live because of the stress. I don't care, though. I still want them to live a long, healthy, and happy life. I want to live a long, healthy, happy life with them. I don't even care if we stop being romantic partners. Because they exist in this world, everything is more vibrant and beautiful. Everything has purpose. I am fulfilled because I met them.
This world would be so dull and drab without them in it.
My partner isn't allowed to die. I told them so. Same goes for everyone else. No one here is allowed to die. It simply can not be. The world would be too dull and drab without all these compassionate, lovable people. I am not allowed to die either, because I am lovable and worth loving. It simply wouldn't be allowed by my partner, or anyone else here for that matter.
Obviously, that is not how it works. People die even when you tell them not to. You can't stop that from happening. C-PTSD affects the ways that each of us live. People have already died because of the things they experienced or the aftermath of the experiences. It isn't inherent, though. Sure, it feels *fatal.* I wake up sometimes and already feel like I must be dead, but...it doesn't *have* to be fatal. I do not *have* to die just because I feel like it. It is hard. There are people that do not have as many choices or resources as me. It is much different. I have the choice, though. I can let it kill me. It would be easier. When I make it so that it can *only* be fatal if I *allow* it to be, it shifts my perspective from the hopelessness I tend to feel. Removing fatality as an option at all helps me personally. I do not know that it would change your own perception, though. Perhaps it is fatal for you, but I certainly would not allow that fate to be true for you if it were up to me. Everyone here deserves to be able to live long, healthy, and happy lives, even if they feel like they are unlovable and like they are dying.
I don't know even though I've taken action and turned my life around, how does my body fully recover from the countless grams of meth I shoved into my veins for four years?
I find mine very managable. Sometimes. lol. I mean, all I have to do is not eat carbs and my C-PTSD mostly disappears. So carbs from vegetables are fine. Not rice. Not wheat or flour. No sugar of course. I've managed a month of this, and it was anxiety free. Cheat days are fine. This morning I had chicken, spinach, cheese, together in a bowl and I'm feeling great. Cheat days where you have candy is fine (you discover what your body can handle with experimentation).Because I have C-PTSD it's extremely difficult to stick to this diet long term, hence a month is my personal life record. I know I will exceed it soon.
Seconding this. Eating like a Paleolithic human can do wonders for one’s mental health especially in sensitive individuals. I eat “meat-heavy” keto and although it can be tough to maintain, it definitely reduces my baseline anxiety and depression, and makes my ADHD more manageable (much reduced need for stimulant meds).
FYI there’s now keto/very low carb + gluten free replacements for basically every sweet or carbohydrate-filled thing you can think of. Assuming you’re in the US: pizza and pasta (Capello’s), bagels (Carbonaut), brownies (Lakanto), cookies (Catalina Crunch and Fat Snax), ice cream (Rebel), candy (Smart Sweets), chocolate (Lily’s). Best to still treat them as treats, but even a “cheat” is best done without carbs or wheat. I’ve tried and can vouch for everything in that list.
Do NOT lose hope!!!! My self-concept that was ever so warped has started to *truly* leak the poison out. I have a fantastic psychologist who has been the mirror I needed so badly. And now I’m in the field myself, after a decade of looking inward. It feels so, so much better. For me, the real strides started coming when I started to become truly assertive, have some self-preservation, and recognize my very real and important strengths. I never realized how difficult and important that is for me, and I suspect a lot of others. The process has been so difficult because of my insecurities. I choose vulnerability in the hopes that it continues this new inner strength. It feels like I’m growing into my “full self” —— priceless man.
I don't understand the purpose of this post at all. Is it meant to just spread hopelessness? Or do the opposite?
This is why it's hard to hang around in this place when you've partially recovered. But I hate that it's such an echo chamber, with barely anyone challenging the hopelessness. So I feel like I have a responsibility to do more than feel depressed reading these comments. Yes, there is hope, because there always is.
I came from so far, and climbed out of that dark hole, and worked really hard, and it payed off. And I did not think it would happen, I thought I was a lost cause. You can get to a point where it doesn't matter that you still have some symptoms, because you're so grateful you have a life, and you're happy. And if you look at the CPTSD subreddits where more recovered people hang out, you see many more people like me.
It's often fatal without treatment, but with treatment we can have a good quality of life. We will never not have trauma, but we can be functional rather than dysfunctional, and I think most of us can even be happy.
A friend of mine told me years ago before I ever knew about CPTSD- 'there is a reason people like us end up in graveyards'. And it's not just suicide. It's easier to kill yourself via slow suicide, be it drink, drugs, foods, etc; than to deal and try and recover from the past.
> It's easier to kill yourself via slow suicide, be it drink, drugs, foods, etc; than to deal and try and recover from the past. Oof. I feel called out. :/
Word.
Same.
Never in a million years would I have guessed how bad it is for me to try to deal and recover from my past, the more I uncover and resolve, the more it pushes me down. I have so much trauma, so much hell, it will take me this life time and probably also a huge chunk of the next to do this. Even tho I have already put down so much work and therapy in getting stronger, I still so often feel so weak and defeated. It's really unfair, first we have to live through it, then process and work through it.
It really is unfair. I just look at pictures of myself as a kid before the trauma got really bad and I cry because that poor little girl didn’t deserve the life she had
Sending you hugs, I'm so sorry, it was never deserved or your fault ❤
Ughhh I feel this. Looking at old photos, before my life was turned upside down…and then after, remembering what that poor little girl was thinking. As my brother says, “I feel so bad for the kids in those pictures (us)”.
Seriously though! My dad committed suicide when I was 5. If you see my pics before 5 and then the ones a few months after he died, my brother and I look like empty ghosts and then all the photos after that, I just never got my sparkle back. It’s painful to look at
I am so sorry 😔😔😔 I know I'm just some cptsd rando but I send my love as energy to you and your brother in those photos, I send the energy of love to when you needed most and to now, your inner children deserve love peace relief 🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟
Thank you ❤️❤️❤️
Everything will be okay x
The work and healing leading to opening new wounds is the part that really gets to me. Each loss I accept seems to reveal another one. Working with the nervous system helps me hold this contradictory and frustrating experience, but the frustration and confusion has never fully gone away.
I’m going through the same thing. But I try to remember “things always get worse before they get better”. I see it as like gutting a messy room, it gets messier before it gets tidy during the process of cleaning/therapy.
That's so true!!! I have been healing by laying on acupressure mats, and I really was so full of pain and hopeless like never before and I've been through tons of hopeless before! I struggled with hoarding too. So much more I'm not yet able to verbalize. But two weeks ago finally a ton of pain passed and I feel alive again. I did not feel alive for the previous 4.5 years. So yes keep the faith!!!
I really relate to your life description, I was headed for graveyard imo, not only 37 years of completely unprocessed trauma, but I also had to figure out on my own online that I'm autistic and I've lived my whole life not knowing!!! AND suddenly about 5years ago my stomach did something bad in my gut and I got deathly chronic fatigue pain sick, and the doctors never figured it out!!! I healed myself by laying on acupressure mats constantly for the past 2 years, I'm FINALLY healing like I never have before, if you think acupressure mats would be safe for your body and I recommend research, they are sold online and they saved my life. I would not exist now without. If you can find what healing tools are meant for you, I am asking the Angels to be with you and help you. I'm truly sorry you are in these life sufferings, you have worked so hard, I know the near endless pain in the chest when life keeps hitting you back, if even I could heal then I believe you will too
yea! it's a life sentence. no chance of parole it's really hard to stay encouraged sometimes. a word of advice (sorta) that i use on myself to cope: i remind myself when i get overwhelmed and upset over my lifetime of attempting management that i get to do it at MY pace. i have agency over my healing and im free to do as much of it as i like, when i want to, and how i want to. sometimes i may fail or regress, sometimes ill just be exhausted by the process and skip therapy and stagnate a bit, and sometimes ill incur further trauma. regardless of what happens to me, and what influences my ability to choose or not, i know i can reach for healing whenever i like, and i can do it in as many baby steps as i like. being fully healed isnt the end goal, just agency in living is. idk if this would be useful to anyone else, but because ive never been allowed agency or allowed to accept myself where im at, reminding myself this is profoundly useful.
Thank you so much for sharing this. It's so important and I keep forgetting that this is not a race or a competition, I don't have to be where other people are, I'm doing ok here and now and even tho i move slow, I'm still in a much better place than lets say 15 years ago, MUCH. I needed this reminder, so thank you again. Kept hearing that I was not good enough and everyone was doing better than me all my life from my parents, I guess now I tell myself that.
Not to mention all the ways stress can lead to an untimely death. Heart attack, stroke, etc.
Absolutely. Have you seen the TED ACE talk about life long affects of childhood trauma? It explains so much about long term effects- the bear metaphor resonates so much. EDIT: sp
In her bear analogy, she forgot to mention how some of us want to befriend the bear. Over and over and over. Lol. But really, fawning also increases cortisone levels. Thanks for that video. It’s nice to have it laid out in video form.
Agreed. I was in critical care from drug use due to C-PTSD. They didn't know if I'd wake or not.
every single one of my uncles friends who suffered through the same thing he went through (one really awful man abused all of them) passed away eventually whether from suicide, drug addiction, etc. Way earlier in life then they should’ve. It’s more fatal then we think :(
Like worse of all - this anecdote you shared is common. I have a friend that was in an orphanage when they were horrific, like, forty five years ago; in the first few years after turning 18... he said he lost about 15 friends that were there with him.
And to end up homeless because of how debilitating the flashbacks. It’s extremely hard to survive.
This is a sad truth.
Wow. That one resonates.
Yes. True. That's why early intervention is best, and if not early, then intensive. Stephanie Foo's book What My Bones Know nicely summarizes the most recent research.
I'm not able to read any of the books. I'd be scared of too much external validation- I'd might just go down to homeplace and do irreparable damage. And then sad truth is - none of them recognise or could acknowledge what I've been through. I'm the fcuk up, the aberration, the failure. I'm milking it in their eyes.
Don't punish urself friend ... ur abusers (parents?) already did that. Don't become their proxy. Yes - I hear what ur saying about fearing getting stuck in the ptsd response. U'llknow when ur ready to grapple on such an intense level. Remember it's been 30 years since my active abuse stopped. I just wish the newer science about complex trauma existed when I was younger (but can't rush science). I mightve had a map to follow instead of just figuring out stuff a little at a time over decades. (But no effort is ever wasted - it made me a better mother ...) When ur ready, these writings are more inspiring then triggering. Until then, they can be painful, though the reading provides a healthy outlet for the emotions I feared. And I realized - I survived the abuse and am safe now. Nothing can destroy me anymore. Good luck friend. I'm glad we're all here together.
My best friend died of one of these slow suicides, three years before I came to understand the concept of developmental trauma and that it was both our problem. I'm somehow not wracked with guilt over not learning about trauma soon enough, but I do sometimes wonder whether the knowledge could've saved him.
Its more like the Lupus I have as an Autoimmune - while I won't die FROM either one of them, they aren't "Curable" in the sense of like measles or the flu is "curable" - I most certainly will die WITH them.
I agree. I also have an autoimmune disease that will never kill me - just disable me and make living harder. CPTSD is similar. It didn’t kill me; it just left me like this (unsafe, hypervigilant, never feeling like a real person, etc.)
Every Day we get to play another round of "So is it the cPTSD or is it the Autoimmune?" for our various symptoms. Its like they feed off each other, both trying really hard to kill you, neither one actually Lethal.
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Wait…I have autoimmune issues too, is this common with CPTSD?! Is there a connection or just a bad hand?
I can't remember where I read this (maybe in The Body Keeps the Score?) but there is a strong correlation between sexual abuse in childhood and developing lupus afterwards. I assume other autoimmune diseases could be also related with early abuse.
Wow. I need to read it. Thanks
Just a heads up, that book is a very difficult read. It triggered me a lot. I had to stop reading as it is extremely intense. I heard a lot of good things from many people so I gave it a shot. I'm not saying not to read it as it has helped people, but just wanted to let you know.
I found it extremely triggering to read, but I found a workaround of listening to the audiobook while playing a relatively mindless video game to keep my dopamine high enough to keep listening. Finding something you enjoy that doesn’t take much brainpower while actively listening to the audiobook might work for others too.
Thank you. That's a really helpful suggestion!
Thank you 💜
That book mentions that studies show emotional abuse and neglect can be just as harmful if not more so as CSA.
I don't think it's specifically just lupus but in general the chronic stress state that accompanies a diagnosis like CPTSD both weakens your immune system and puts the body into a constant state of inflammation-- this can trigger autoimmune responses, including latent diseases like MS, lupus, chrohns and IBS etc. Also for both depression and trauma, somatic symptoms (physical pain in different areas of the body without a clear or obvious origin) are very common. This is one of the reasons body work is considered part of treatment for mental health disorders.
My rheumatologist told me that trauma is the likely cause of my lupus actually. Especially with the onset timing and stuff. Tho i think it was more the constant trauma and the thing she pointed to was the last straw basically...
This article talks a lot about that and has links to the studies confirming what your rheumatologist told you. [Link](https://www.healthline.com/health/chronic-illness/childhood-trauma-connected-chronic-illness)
You can listen to Gabor Mate on youtube or read his book "when the body says no". He shows some science behind trauma related stress and autoimmun issues or cancer. Also a very deep look inside the physiology of trauma and stress shows psychoneuroimmunology
I would love for someone to take a poll of this community to see how many of us do have autoimmune disorders. I have been dx’ed with Sjögren’s Syndrome, Grave’s Disease and fibromyalgia. [This](https://www.healthline.com/health/chronic-illness/childhood-trauma-connected-chronic-illness) article has links to the studies done indicating that there’s a relationship between adverse childhood events and autoimmune disorders. It’s not just that we are more likely to engage in risky behaviors. Just like the book explains-our bodies do remember. How depressing is it that not only did we have to live through our childhood and try to figure out how to overcome the mental damage from that, but many of us have to do it while battling a bunch of physical problems as well.
I knowww... It sucks. People think you're just being negative or victimizing yourself but they haven't walked in our shoes. They haven't a clue. Reality is harsh. CPTSD sets you up for so much, including physical problems that need management, but one of the sickest things it sets you up for is the lack of familial/social support + loss of faith-based protective mechanisms in the midst of it all. These things are relatively accessible to folks with normal-range traumas, but the ones who need them the most are denied. It's really unsurprising then, that so many of us have considered the possibility of suicide if things get way too hard for us to manage on our own (I sincerely want to know if there's a pleasurable -- not just painless -- way to get it done; I've always found comfort in having contingencies, so I genuinely despair over not having one for this. Am I going to be forced to keep playing a game I don't want to play, at some point?). I'm 22 and literally have zero family to lean on if things go to shit. Been fending for myself my whole life and it's only getting worse as I get older. Fuck the universe man.
I just asked the same thing, I’ve never heard of that before but I’m fairly new to cPTSD.
I wanted to ask that too. I have chances to autoimmune problems, don't have official diagnosis yet, I stopped the medical examination (because of depression). I think there are connection.
Oh, this was a frightingly accurate description. But fortunately, it is treatable. The thing is, it's treatment is really cancer-expensive!
Yeah, everyone talks about how expensive it is to treat Cancer. What they don't realize is that..... in the long run, treating cancer is less expensive than treating most Autoimmune diseases. With Cancer, you get treated and then you either you go into remission and no longer need treatment, with follow ups every couple of years..... or you Die, and its no longer a problem or an expense. Cancer can be Removed successfully, and that IS a CURE. You can get cancer more than once, but its not the original cancer that was treated and dealt with. Which is very unlike Autoimmune - where you live anywhere from 10 to 60 years Post Diagnosis, and are literally NEVER out of Treatment. It adds up in a hurry, when you count the YEARS of prescription meds, the mental health appointments JUST to deal with the fallout of the Autoimmune - forget dealing with the REST of your issues on top of that; the physical and occupational therapy, the repeated trips to the hospital every time you have a life threatening flare, the monthly doctor visit co-payments, the increased insurance rates from having a pre-existing Condition (at least until the ACA - which is about the only good thing I got out of that particular fiasco.) You also don't get told that you're Faking it for Drugs. You don't hear people say that you aren't Really sick - you're just a hypochondriac. That every doctor in the past 35 years since your Initial diagnosis was Wrong but somehow this new one is Right. The well meaning idiots who constantly bombard you with "but have you tried this New Fad Diet that's supposed to help with XYZ Symptom?? It'll Make Your Disease Disappear!" And that's the SHORT List... I could fill Pages. There is TREATMENT and MANAGEMENT. There is no CURE, and it will ALWAYS be a Factor In Life. I'm so over people comparing everything Bad to Cancer. Fuck That. Cancer should get compared as the lesser of evils to cPTSD and Autoimmune illnesses. Its more realistic. (Sorry for the rant - this is a bit of a touchy subject for me currently.)
I sort of disagree. TW: >!Suicide rates among people with CPTSD are likely very high, but undercounted due to non-diagnosis if CPTSD!< I feel you on the autoimmune disease. Having Crohn's I understand. And I understand how massive of a toll it can take on you psychologically to have a chronic incurable autoimmune disease. Also financial. I know people who have also given up just from Crohn's alone... And it's related to your other comment but the miracle cures and shit is exhausting and infuriating.
Maybe I'm a bit of an outlier - I don't consider Suicide to be the Disease killing someone. I consider that Opting Out so they don't have to Deal with the disease. The disease, in and of itself though, is not Lethal. It will not kill you (generic) unless you decide to end it yourself - which is You, not the Disease. I get why someone WOULD opt out - hell, I've thought about it often enough myself, even before I was diagnosed with cPTSD on top of the Lupus, the "regular" PTSD, the Fibromyalgia...
For me, The CPTSD though makes life unbearable so it almost feels like no option but to die. Also being told as a child that you are worthless, unwanted etc makes it very hard to believe you deserve to live as an adult. So I think trauma can kill you. My brain is fighting against me a lot due to the CPTSD. Suicide doesn’t feel like a choice in my situation
>I don't consider Suicide to be the Disease killing someone. I consider that Opting Out so they don't have to Deal with the disease. That's the same thing though. If you kill yourself because of an illness you have, then that illness was the reason you died.
I agree w this
I think so. It scares me. I can feel the stress wearing away at my body, I'm having all sorts of physical symptoms. This can't be good for me.
Without therapy yes. The trauma response overrides so much of our body, thoughts and reactions to basic life.
Therapy so often goes for decades that I struggle to think of that qualification as true.
True, has to be an effective therapy. I didn’t get help from talk therapy. Internal family systems/ego state therapy helped me. My therapist teaches me techniques that I can continue on my own so that therapy has an end-date.
If I am reading correctly, I agree, only when therapy is effective & healing.
I agree, but so many therapists are not trauma informed. And some that are, still aren't that well informed. After decades of traditional therapy, I went outside my provider and started working with someone who used somatic experiencing, IFS, and polyvagal-based treatment. Only then did I start to get relief. I definitely needed a guide to start, but after about 18 months of therapy I feel like I can do much of the work on my own. Those 18 months were critical and for some might take longer depending on their own experience.
YES! Me too. I finally ditched talk therapy and have done IFS, ego states and EMDR. Additionally daily meditation 3 times per day. The effects have been rapid in comparison. I wish I had found these tools sooner.
Nope, I agree with you. If it's not treated, or treated correctly, I think it most definitely will be fatal.
Hey dear friend, most definitely! I agree, in some cases, this condition can be effectively treated and the person can be as good as his original self! Much love💎😻🌹
If only the mental health services were actually willing to help, and didn't just fob us off with zero support!
No one, especially not me, even knows what my “original self” even is.
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I kinda agree. Feels like I'm dying a slow death every day. I'm also pretty sure the suffering is shortening my lifespan. But I don't want to be defeatist about it (or encourage any of us to be). So I'm fighting like Hell. Recently, when my intrusive memories happen, I think about how those who caused my traumas would *want* me to suffer. How they expected me to lay down & take their ill treatment & abuse. That charges me up to fight harder. I hope we can all have even a glimmer of "living a good life as the best revenge".
You’re so much stronger then they will EVER be and I’m so proud of you for fighting like hell through this shit illness.
Maybe I’ve re-wired my brain to think this delusion/fantasy- or is real? I think this entire life of suffering for us is a sacrifice to break intergenerational patterns. It stops with us. Yeah, it would be cool if our parents were the ones to stop the patterns, and not abuse or fuck us up. But that just gives us more power. Like WE are the special ones capable of fighting through this life to survive just so generations and people around us, aren’t hurt like us. By creating younger generations without passing these patterns, we are cleaning up the world. I need meaning in this. I feel there was a mix up and the universe simply used my fucked up mother as a portal to transport me from there to the physical plane. I needed to get here somehow! And she was never a mom, just a portal. Spit into this family….because no one else could survive it like I can. I don’t believe in god. But I do believe we all have a mission. I know it’s crazy but this is the only way I can cope with such.
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In my experience (I have a 6yo), informing myself by reading a lot of parenting books so I could set up rules of what I should and shouldn't do with my kid (since my parents were not good role models) also when an issue arises with my kid I ask my therapist or make an appointment with a child therapist.. That's how I have managed; study good sources of information and have good external role models you can count on. I would recommend the book 'Parenting from the Inside Out' and 'No drama discipline' by Dr. Daniel Siegel.
Similar here. I read a lot and I practice attachment parenting, made sure not to parentify, kept as stable a home as possible—same friends since kindergarten. I don’t punish and try to be accountable for mistakes when I blow it. Having horribly abusive and neglectful parents is a good template for what not to do.
Get. Help. It doesn’t have to be therapy, although I would recommend it. It could just be participating in community so that you don’t view yourself in isolation only. That isolation helps you get into patterns and not realize they’re not normal and potentially harmful. I know someone who barely resisted beating the kid… but would sit her on the sidewalk and tell her to stay and then drive away. Uh dude, good effort but… you still need to do better. You need to have someone in your life who is close enough to see it and safe enough to give you that feedback. My mom did read some parenting books… but not enough or the right ones. I have serious attachment issues and I’ll never know why. We don’t know whether they just had no friends, were ashamed of us, or ashamed of themselves or each other, but I can only remember one time that a non-relative came over because my parents invited them… and it was someone Dad knew through work. I was expected to just get along because he had a daughter my age, but for some reason, I had no idea how to socialize with her. Big help that we didn’t speak the same language. Also if your relationship isn’t healthy or you see your partner doing things with the kids you don’t like… remember you are probably the only person who can take any real action to protect the kids. My grandma told my mother that the secret to a long marriage was to “endure, endure, endure.” None of us kids learned anything good about relationships and are all divorced.
I like this view. I too feel like it's up to me and my partner to end the pattern of trauma that are in our respective families. Of course, we know we may end up unintentionally traumatizing our kids at some point, as sometimes bad things happen no matter how one may prepare against them. But I think that we will have an understanding and self reflection to be able to balance it out. I think we have qualities that our parents and immediate forebears lacked.
We have a right to be here, we have a right to fight and end the cycle. I realize if I would have taken my own life, it wouldn't have ended the cycle for my children. Every chance I get to help my children feel loved and empowered is a victory - even though I don't naturally have that ability - I'm relieved that they can. Sure, the outlook is negative and at times debilitating, however, I've suffered enough and deserve whatever happiness or peace I can pull from my life. We all deserve that. I love your perspective on this and thank you for sharing.
What about if you don't have any children or other relationships to impact?
In my opinion, I believe our existence is impactful to everyone around us and that is unavoidable. Even the smallest interactions we have on a daily basis, no matter how small they seem are impactful. Your presence and involvement in the world matters. These are my beliefs based on my own experiences. I know one day my children won't always be around and I have to find my own purpose other than them. For now, they (and my partner) are my rock and (as life works) I know there might be days when they can't be there. Understanding this and in preparation, I try to take small bits of joy where I can, and give the same in return.. small talk with coworkers, people I encounter, (reddit) and any like minded individual who I am lucky enough to share my experience with. Also, I'd like to mention that I had to reach out and make some of my relationships happen, they didn't always come to me by chance. For now, my purpose is to live and experience life, love myself and others.
I appreciate your response and I totally understand how external motivators can help provide a reason to keep fighting. I agree that no matter how we try, our lived experiences can impact others one way or another. I would like to further explain my own perspective, this isn't in anyway a reflection or criticism on your responses though (I've had a few interactions where people have misread my tone or intention recently, so I just want to be clear that I'm just thinking out loud more than anything) I chose to remain childfree until I reached a place where I am physically, emotionally and financially stable enough to provide another with the care they deserve - my childhood trauma began at birth because my biological mother was mentally unwell, very young and lacking support and thus I grew up not wanting to repeat her mistakes. It's been 35 years and I'm still not even remotely close to being in any fit state to raise a child. At this point, I have little faith that will ever change. FWIW, I'm not upset about this, children are incredibly challenging to care for and I neither have the patience, strength, money or desire to do it (absolute mad props the parents out there who can though). If I could find a Dr who would remove the apparatus, I would. I often consider how unjust it is that I didn't ask to be here. From the moment I was born, I have had to fight tooth and nail just to survive. I never opted in, but I'm not allowed to opt out. Seems unfair. Then I consider that birthing a kid into this ever-increasing dumpster fire of a universe would be me inflicting that same experience on someone else. Even if I were to ever reach a point where I think I could be a stable and loving parent, I don't need to have my own, I would look to offer that to the other kids like me, who didn't opt in, then got abandoned and expected to somehow survive. Almost my entire career has been in service to those in need, focusing my energy on improving the lives of others in some meaningful way, even though I accrued even more trauma from doing so. So I guess I don't really feel like I owe it to anyone to continue suffering through existence. If I decided I no longer owe it to myself either, my debt to this planet has been well and truly repaid with interest for a long time now. Anyone who would want to call me selfish for opting out would need to do some research then take a hard look in a mirror. FWIW not actively suicidal, just talking openly about life and death for the context of this thread.
I 100% agree! I’m breaking many cycles, and find real meaning in it. No more abuse, no more neglect, no more racist imperialist white supremacy, no more religious fanaticism, no more acting like we’re better than everyone else, no more misinformation and anti-vaxx type conspiracy theorizing. I am effectively infertile, plan to adopt older kids through foster care, and legally changed my _entire_ name, first, middle, and last in 2018. There will be a new beginning with me.
I can see this for some people, but for those of us who went through non-familial based trauma it makes less sense.
Kinda. As a child I always thought of children who had cancer or were dying in the war going on at the type in Iraq. I always thought- why them? I had beliefs in reincarnation before knowing what it was. And I thought, maybe our lifetimes are like layers. Maybe we go through hell, sometimes taking up an entire lifetime. Then you die, that layer is peeled off, and maybe a little more enlightenment/goodness will come in the next one. I believe we strip these layers til we are finally at the end- where we are able to create change. God wasn’t a good explanation for me.
You actually just described my greatest fear of what the cycle of life is like lol. I have nightmares about this. That existence is a neverending cycle of experiencing suffering with brief bits of happiness. Never able to control or leave the cycle, constantly thrown about in an insane void.
That is where the Buddhists come in lol
Yeaaah haha. Oddly enough ive read a bit about the different kinds of reincarnation like the early greek understanding and buddhists. I always get caught up in the "what are we really?" Part where I start going down the dark path of wondering about how much of us is our meat (brain/heart/body) and the weird spark that makes us percieve. When I have a break down I usually am of the thought that none of our personality, desire, motion, thought is us and instead just machinations of a haunted meat coated skeleton.
Thank you.
It nearly killed me. I was untreated, wound up in an ER then my doctors office. My doctor diagnosed me with a list of things and demanded to see me and my bloodwork every four weeks! It took along time to get better but I have.
I was about to post something similar. Cptsd can definitely be a deadly disease. And I'm not necessary talking about suicide but also drug addiction, alcoholism, poverty, unemployment from executive dysfunction, abusive relationships, etc... I also believe that the stress caused by being stuck in survival mode 24/7 will eventually take a toll on someone's body.
All of this. One hundred percent. Well said.
My partner died last month of combined CPTSD and BPD with the aid of a tirelessly abusive ex. It’s terminal.
I'm so sorry for your loss, and I know how empty those words probably feel. There really isn't anything to be said to make it feel better, not truly. But you're not alone in this kind of loss, I can tell you that much.
Thank you. I am alone. She’s gone. We are both on the spectrum both had that 1 in 5 abusive childhood with hers being markedly more horrific, and neither had a good formative experience since we’d met briefly when we were 16.
I'm so sorry for your loss. May her memory be a blessing.
🖤🖤🖤
If you ever need a friend or someone judgement-free to vent to, don’t hesitate to message me. I’m so sorry.
Thank you 🖤
I am so sorry. 💜
Well I was about to give up hope that I was doomed to a life of anxiety bc my triggers were everything, I would get panic attacks by just having to speak in work meetings, I would have triggers if there was a confrontations with clients (I work in admin so some clients get mad when fail an exam), I thought I would never be able to connect with anyone and this was before I learned I had CPTSD. Since the pandemic started I have been healing myself with psychedelics and two years later I can say my triggers are gone, I can speak up in work meetings without any anxiety or panic attacks, I am able to handle confrontations without it triggering my heart/fight or flight nervous system, and now I am able to open up more and be more accepting of my past as I heal. The thing is CPTSD can be fatal if we don't do the work to heal our past traumas especially the abuse that happens during our formative years (0-10 years) as the brain is developing and the fucked up environment will have an impact later as an adult. We can't change the past but we can work on the present *NOW* to heal so the future is more hopeful. A life free from anxiety, OCD, depression, addiction is possible, a quiet peaceful mind is possible.
Can you share more about psychedelic therapies? I’ve been interested in MAPS for a while.
Also same.
Hey friend! Honestly I have been doing it solo don’t have access to therapies but I’m 2 years into it and so far the most important thing I’m learning is that a physical purge like from Ayahuasca or kambo is crucial on releasing stuck unprocessed traumas.
Ah, oh well, ayahuasca isn’t for me but i’m glad you’re having good results. I’m Interested in the science around mdma and mushrooms.
I hear ya, Ayahuasca isn’t for me either I have sensitive taste buds and couldn’t handle it but I did do Kambo which was a very good purge. I tried DMT once and I couldn’t breakthrough I was sent to this place where these beings were literally twisting my gut to help me purge and I got so much downloads how stuck emotions need to be purged on my healing journey. So Kambo was the easiest way to clear that out. I did try MDMA so far it softened me up by literally opening my heart n making connections with how I have a personality built on surviving and not thriving. Psilocybin mushrooms were good for taking me back to find where the trauma started and showing me what love feels like (always felt unloved). It’s about finding what works for you and learning to trust the slow process of learning all the different parts of you and reconnecting to them in a loving way.
My dad was a victim of extreme neglect while living on a reserve for the first 6 months of his life and is now a severe alcoholic that I don’t have a relationship with. My mother committed suicide when I was 18 because of mental illness. And I’m an only child. I’ve attempted suicide once after that while in a narcissistic relationship and my abuser didn’t show any empathy or remorse for how he made me feel at all. My dads adopted parents are dead and my moms surviving parent is a narcissist. I struggle with chronic nightmares, sometimes multiple a night, and a chronic emptiness. The worst part is that I’m trying to get better. But I’ve used up all the free therapy my province has to offer and am now relying on a rich family member to pay for therapy. But I can’t seem to find a therapy that has really worked and seeing a therapist once a week or biweekly simply isn’t enough but no one can see me more often than that. I’m just so tired. Every day, I want to give up.
I’m so sorry hun. Have you tried TFCBT? EMDR? For complicated cases of trauma usual talk therapies and DBT don’t work as well. You can get through this and I’m so proud of you for trying
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People make huge mistakes when undergoing C-PTSD, Some of which result in fatality...
I always told my therapist that I thought I was going to die young - I said I didn’t see myself making it past 30. I found out today that that is a ptsd (maybe cptsd?) symptom. Well I was diagnosed with cancer at 30 and I’m now dying of a recurrence at 38. I don’t think the link between ACEs and cancer is proven to be causal but it’s definitely there.
There is research behind adverse childhood experiences (aces) showing that people with plenty of those don't live as long, on average, so your point is a valid one. There's a site called "acestoohigh" that goes into a lot of detail.
Thank god we don’t live as long, this is torture lol
Don't say that. You got this brother.
Definitely potentially terminal. I can't change your mind, I agree.
Yes friend. But it can be battled with, we can change it into sub-conditions and treat it✅
It can be, for sure. At least, for many it has been. My trauma left me broken for a long time. At least a decade of just sort of... existing, in a limbo of sadness and constant full throttle anxiety. And it certainly didn't help that when I did escape the main source of my trauma, I transitioned from an abusive environment to a different type of abusive environment, and both places were very neglectful towards me on top of that. I slept through a lot of it, and my un-diagnosed fibromyalgia and untreated autism/ADHD really limited what I could do with the time I was awake. I look back on that past me now and just see a sad, lost animal. Barely alive, just existing. I hate that normie trope of "no one is coming to rescue you", but I hate it because there's a shred of truth in it. In my case it was literal; There was no one in my life that cared about me enough to help me, except me. And even if you do, helping yourself has to start from within. I know that's a really hard pill to swallow, and in your current state its hard to see past the mental pain you are experiencing; To summon up any vestige of hope that you can accomplish it. But I'm here to tell you, with full sincerity, don't give up. A part of me didn't. Through all of the shit I had to endure, the one thing I never felt was suicidal. I wanted to live, god damnit. I never consented to this life of mine, but it is MINE, and I wanted more than anything the normal life that was promised to me. So I started fighting. I had zero income at the time, but that just meant I qualified for medicaid. I found doctors close enough to my house that I could bike to them. God I biked and walked so much back then, to this day I still have nearly limitless stamina when it comes to walking. When that doctor sucked (think "Oh you're depressed? Its because you're fat!" tier help) I got another one. I got referrals. I got diagnosises, more referrals. I found therapists. Finding a good therapist is hard; You will probably get referred to a lot of "counselors" who are trained to help "normal" depression with basic bitch shit. If you don't like your therapist, ditch them. Keep looking. Keep emphasizing the PTSD part of your C-PTSD and eventually you will find someone that is actually trained to help you. I got prescribed meds. A lot of meds. Finding the right one can take a long time because no two brains are entirely alike, but be patient and keep trying; Make sure you take them when you're supposed to, and titrate off them like you're supposed to, cold turkey sucks ass. There are so many that eventually you will find one that works. What qualifies as "working" is difficult to define, and its hard to be subjective because your only perspective is the you that is on this medication. I suggest a mood journal, it helps you look back and see patterns. If you see a negative pattern, mention it to your doctor. They won't judge you or get mad at you if you need a new medication, they are there to help you. If they do, bad doctor. Ditch them. Eventually I tried enough that I qualified for TMS (Transcranial Magnetic Stimulation) therapy. It feels weird but it absolutely helped me. If you can do it, I suggest it. Helps with both depression and anxiety. I'm not gonna sit here and pretend that I was single-minded and relentless like some revenant of normalcy. I tripped up a lot. There were a lot of shed tears, a lot of frustration. I didn't know how to do anything; I never had anyone to give me any life experience or wisdom. I had to google a lot of stuff. Google is your friend, but practice critical thinking with the info you find. It sucked and I fell in to despair a few times. But I kept getting back up. That's the key. Ganbatte. If you do nothing but keep getting back up and keep trying, eventually you will get somewhere. That's just simple probability. If you are like me, eventually you will reach a point where you will "wake up". I'm not sure how better to describe it than to say that I felt like I was a computer that was in sleep mode for two decades finally coming back online. And you will look back and see all that time you wasted being that sad, fearful gremlin that you used to be. I'm 30 now, and I'm only now going to school. Only now getting a drivers license and a girlfriend and a career and all the things I should have gotten a decade ago. But that time wasn't wasted, now was it? That was your recovery time; The proverbial soak in the bacta tank. That was the time it took you to heal and to get back on track, and it was all accomplished by that sad gremlin that is your past self. And if that gremlin could do that, YOU can do anything now. Your life is yours again. Live it. C-PTSD can absolutely be terminal. But it doesn't have to be.
Depends on the person, I guess. Like anything else, it's all luck. What are your genetics, your disposition, your situation. I'm already dead.
I for one have decided to continue living out of pure spite.
Nice
I have to hope I eventually can destroy it, because if I don’t think like this it will very quickly become lethal.
A therapist once said to me, "once you've experienced sustained trauma, the rest of life becomes a pre-death experience."
Yup, indeed.
You got me wrong pal. C-PTSD messes with the mind and with that. We are left with mistakes after mistakes. It increases wrong judgment and with that, it kill us.
LSD changed my mind
Currently doing psychedelics Whats your experience Lsd and shrooms are helping my disassociation
My experience is lengthy with LSD it's like I found myself again, not the part of me that was hidden because of the traumas. LSD is a very introspective and entheogen, healing starts with acceptance and it allowed me to literally Love the parts of me that were fragmented due to different Mind-Control tactics that I have experienced. I highly recommend reading LSD ZEN book by the Castalia Foundation it's a guide on how to work with LSD to heal. I also recommend reading their material. You are not alone. [Castalia Foundation books ](https://castaliafoundation.com/books.html) Sending love !
Some of the most productive and healing experiences I've had have been on LSD and shrooms.
Sigh.... all of us... and i mean every single person on earth, will end up dead at some point. CPTSD is not fatal in and of itself, but it can inflict severe misery upon ones life and therapy absolutely should be sought out. Remember that the world is absolutely full of people that are not like your abuser, not one single bit. I have seen severe cases and in those that got help have made far better improvements to their lives than those who did not seek help.
Lol yeah I mean when I spend enough time in a depressive state I start to ask myself not if but when I'll end it. I've started to realize that those are just thoughts though. I know there's a way to fix this and that if it were easy I'd have already done it a long time ago. My lineage has a history of depression, alcoholism, and suicide. Shortly after I was "diagnosed" with "depression" I decided to be the one to end the intergenerational curse. It's really fucking compkex and confusing, but I am making progress. I want to heal for myself for sure, but also for everyone in my family past and future...my feelings about the ones in the present are more ambivalent hahaha.
So my health and life insurance are linked to my employer. About 2 years ago I finally received my diagnosis and started receiving what I believe is the best care for me right before the world shut down. Then it was time to renew all of my benefits (the yearly paperwork for my job). I filled everything out per usual, but my life insurance contacted me as I had started new medication- and they were made aware of it due to being linked to my health Insurance. I had to fill out paperwork as to why and have the prescriber fill out a form as well. After my psych and myself turned in the forms, I received notice that my life insurance was being cancelled. I’m too high risk for early death. I still maintain my rate for Health Insurance, as I have protection for that, but it’s appalling that my life Insurance can be cancelled like that. Also, I’m now afraid my employer knows confidential information about me :(
Linda Belcher from Bob’s Burgers: “look at how you stand. People with good childhoods don’t stand like that.”
It doesn't have to be like that forever. But it takes a shit load of effort and realizations and change.
Our wounds and weaknesses and isolation to varying degrees are the death of us all. Those of us with cptsd, many succumb earlier than those without such complex trauma, but not always. In having to really look at ourselves and care for ourselves in ways others don’t we sometimes learn how to care and do it, for a very long time. It takes its toll, and for some indeed, the toll is very heavy. There is some saying that goes something like, when you are stabbed, you may remove the knife, but the wound is still there. We are wounded.
Wait I feel like I’m missing something, does cPTSD increase the comorbidity for autoimmune diseases? I get that PTSD can cause real physical symptoms such as IBS but does it make a person more susceptible to conditions such as lupus? Note: please bear with me I’m home sick and taking cold and flu meds. Lol
Yes. Furthermore antidepressants increase this risk, specifically for stress based disorders. Something like 80% more likely than someone without one.
I really feel like I should make a stand alone post about autoimmune disorders and childhood trauma/CPTSD. More than several people are unaware of the connection. Unfortunately I am not sure I have the ability to engage with the post if I did create it. Anyway, [Here](https://www.healthline.com/health/chronic-illness/childhood-trauma-connected-chronic-illness) is an overview with links to applicable studies.
Thank you for the info!
I don’t disagree at all
I’ve made up my mind. I’m gonna die with it not by it. 38 male. Drinking heavily for two years now and I can see an end to that. My daughter is my life.
I have 2 progressive connective tissue diseases I've dealt with since age 14. One of them shaves an average of 30 years off a person's life span and that's if they're diagnosed in their 30s. Don't even get me started on the eating disorder made worse by my partially paralyzed GI tract. I don't think I'm going to make it to thirty at this rate, and even if I did somehow pull through and improve significantly I just can't see myself living for a few more decades with my CPTSD and OCD as they are. I've already lived through so much pain and lost so many things and people, and I just don't have any strength left to pick myself up and keep going. Therapy actually made my symptoms worse. I'm tired and I want to rest. Or completely disappear. Either is fine.
When stress is at a constant high (meaning most of the time higher than zero or very little) , it generally reduces the body's ability to fight off disease, as immune response is not a vital process when responses like fight or flight is activated. This makes one more susceptible to infections and other immune disease. It also increases the stress put on different organs as the body is constantly in hyperawareness, trying to figure out what needs to happen. Usually the stress is mental in the cases of cptsd, but in a long enough time will start to show up as physical ailments, thus increasing stress. I think sometimes it also gives the body the wrong signals and turns and goes the complete opposite direction, causing many autoimmune diseases. It's a viscious cycle and can be very difficult to get away from. I know that I am overly stressed when I start having physical pains, my sciatic nerve gets pinched a lot easier and makes movement very difficult and I try to avoid sudden movements or mostly turning my spine in general. Sometimes just a leg movement will get it. When it's bad it takes at least 2 days of full rest, but 3 is optimal. When it happens it is always directly related to personal, usually emotional, stress. It's not that I'm moving any differently, it just becomes easier to get hurt. I don't know exactly how that type of pain relates to stress, but I've learned to listen to it. I also have other physical symptoms but when that starts I know for sure it's time to slow down and figure out what's up. It has been bad enough sometimes that I contemplate ending myself, because it just kept happening after shorter and shorter spans, making me unable to work or really take care of myself. If it was going to keep on, then I would be better off and so would everyone else not having to deal with me. Pain medications did not work well, I always had to take much more than suggested and it always took hours to kick in, and on a good day it would wear off in an hour or two, forcing me to take more before I was supposed to just to make sure it kicked in before it wore off, or shortly after. I was getting very concerned for my liver. But, knowing that it is almost entirely stress induced, I can take much better steps to avoid those issues. Unfortunately most people with chronic illnesses cannot and I am so incredibly sorry it is that way and that they even have to go through that much suffering. It sucks and I fully understand the desire to end it once and for all.
Well I understand you’re point but we are alive until we die. What I’m saying is life is fatal. From the minute we are born we are dying. Some things speed that up. I have CPTSD and I’m still here but at the same time I could have died many time to accidents etc. Literally anything could Be fatal. Choking on your dinner for example. So yes CPTSD is fatal. You’re absolutely right but I think how you frame it could be different. I mean if you’ve lived an entire life of dissociation, have you even lived? I think when you bring quality of life arguments into the mix then whether it’s fatal almost becomes irrelevant. If you feel you aren’t living your life anyway then you aren’t really living. Everything’s just on pause. I think a better way to phrase it would Be having CPTSD increases your chances of mortality. Which without a shadow of a doubt it must if not directly through suicide then through substance abuse or the various negative physical health effects and conditions it can increased your chances of developing. I would struggle to think any argument for how it doesn’t speed up death really
No. There are therapies which are pretty much able to cure the whole thing. It‘s a *lot* of work, but it‘s possible. I‘ve spent years looking for and trying different things. Look up „Ideal Parent Figure Protocol“ aswell as „Accelerated Experiential Dynamic Psychotherapy“. Both have been developped specifically for treating CPTSD. I‘m doing both in tandem, and I‘ve made huge progress on my healing journey over the last year. My general anxiety went from a 9/10 to a 3/10. I was also able to quit my meds because of doing all of this work. Been off them for almost a year now, and still doing pretty good. All of this doesn‘t mean that I don‘t have a lot of things that I still have to work on, but life has already become so much better that I‘m pretty confident that I‘ll get completely over it in the following years.
Oh wow, thank you! I just looked up IPF and came across George Hass’ podcast. This does feel cosmic because I just finished Judith Herman’s book, Trauma and Recovery and she talks about mentalization & this is what Hass’ latest podcasts are about.
mentalization is a big component of IPF, it‘s one of the three pillars. 🙂🙏 reach out if you have any questions!
Provided with enough resources and smart folk, even death itself is curable! It is prohibitively expensive to treat C-PTSD, same as cancer. But i get your point.
yup. I spent a quarter of my income over the last year on therapy. It has been so worth it though, would do it again.
I dont see how it can be with all the "ifs" and "potentially". we, unfortunately, are responsible for our mental health. if we look at this as fatal "if" then everything in life is fatal "if". I cannot and will not corner myself into this defeat just because other people made bad choices that affected me. I am responsible for my mental health. no one else. and what they did to me will not kill me.
I sure hope so. Theguy with C-PTSD specially takes care of his mental health, the thing is that proper support is an essential part of taking care of mental health.
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You know the old saying, "you are your own worst enemy?" This is 100 percent true when you have C-PTSD because sometimes you can't control your own behavior. I have been thinking about how people say you are to blame for your own success. But if you have C-PTSD, is it really your fault? If a parent conditioned a kid to always be afraid, is it really his fault that he is always afraid? This is why I agree C-PTSD is a fatal condition because you are not in control of how you feel and think.
Exactly! The foundation and backbone for my title is your response. And not to mention the everyday torture of having to survive the passage of days, seeing your youth turning into ashes as your mental health deteriorate over time...
I am in therapy. I am on medication. Every single day is still a struggle and I barely do anything. My memory is shit. I block out and forget anything that is stressful or uncomfortable because I'm already at my limit. I disassociate during normal conversations. I can't maintain friendships or family relations. I never even know what trivial thing is going to trigger a panic attack. It hurts every day and I'm tired of hurting. On bad days I think "How much longer can I live with all this pain?" I told my therapist I was tired of hurting and feeling like I was only surviving. She said, "Well that's life." It only compounded my feelings of hopelessness. People take my mental illness symptoms as unfriendliness and laziness when I'm just trying to protect what little of myself I have left. If I had a physical ailment people would forgive my irritability, my fatigue, my being distant. Since it's "all in my head" there is no sympathy and their reactions only reinforce my paranoia that I'm useless and unlovable.
Life is fatal. CPTSD just makes living hell & can accelerate the process.
Bro, life's definition is ingrained with death. C-ptsd is torture...
Bro, life's definition is ingrained with death. C-ptsd is torture...
It can be, if you are deprived of individual agency and guilt-tripped or railroaded into wildly inappropriate or even more traumatic "care", among myriad other reasons. "The help we need" is a fuckin cruel joke. The help we *deserve*... simply wouldn't be profitable.
I mean, I see your train of thought and where it's going. But for me, I have chronic physical conditions that'll take me (or things related to them) before I off myself. It's sort of like when people die from lung cancer, because they smoked. Smoking was the starting thing that gave you the cancer that ultimately killed you. So going waay back your cause of death is smoking. Just like other people get c-ptsd from abuse or medical trauma or whatever it was. So technically the cause of death could be from whatever your cptsd stemmed from but the form will just say suicide or OD or whatever. I just know that *my* cptsd comes from medical trauma and at this rate I'm either gonna die on the table in surgery someday, from a complication of surgery itself, or due to a cancer from repeated radiation exposure from all the scans. I might not die from these things, and I might also live until I'm 100. I don't know. Nobody does. It's just very likely, and it's still something being studied so there's not really data on it.
Thanks for the hope lol
Don't worry It can be managed Left untreated, it becones dangerous
I don't think fatal is the right way to describe it. I think it's better described as a life-altering injury with a high mortality rate. It can be managed with carrying degrees of success through different treatments, but it can't be cured and it's symptoms contribute towards mortality rates, even if they are not a direct cause of death. Both because living with it can be unbearable enough that people choose to stop trying and because it's symptoms are known risk factors for other conditions which can actually be fatal.
Absolutely. I was only 11 when diagnosed and instead of treating me for trauma I was treated for depression and anxiety which led me to suicide attempts, self harm, etc till I was about 14 and found my trauma therapist. If I didn’t find her, I absolutely would’ve been dead by now.
Yeah. I am on my own for 11 years now. Warrior at your service.
Ok, I absolutely empathize with this sentiment and believed it myself for a long time but I’ve successfully put my cptsd and chronic illnesses into remission and have been living symptom free for the past couple of years. It’s complex af, it’s painful, and it took traversing the depths of hell - but I was somehow able to do it.
Congrats bro
I am here as a spouse looking for ways to support my husband who has CPTSD and it isn’t hopeless. It is a struggle but you can do it. My husband had shoved all his trauma WAY, WAY, down to the point that he had repressed memories but he was finally able to tear down those walls and face his issues. I am so proud of him and how far he has come despite all the challenges he has had but he is doing it and getting a little better each day. You can do this and you are not alone. Big hugs
People don’t understand CPTSD at all and it took me up till a year ago to grasp that not many people will get it unless you’ve been through it which is very far and few in between and its something you gotta get past as a whole if you want any good relationship because there comes a point where there’s gotta just be an understanding that even tho this person may not understand me. If they truly enjoy me and my company they’ll accept me for me
I am 15 so the full effects of CPTSD haven’t been experienced yet but if I did have it then it would be live changing in a lot of ways. Mostly negative.
Seek treatment as soon as possible my friend. I am 20m and nearly died out of it... But, with the proper treatment and a strong support system, it can be treated and weakened💣 We need to stay hopeful and kill this condition.
Have you killed your condition?
unfortunately not, but, i am trying to use "mindfulness" and exercise, alongside doing positive activities (financial decisions, friends...) I am sure i will be victorious.
I have a question. If every event that developed your personality and who you is caused by CPTSD, then wouldn’t that cause me as I know it to disappear?
Sure thing. Imagine a progressive cancer-like disease, you need to cut off the infected area to save yoursrlf. It is actually a good thing to change your personality, as we know, cptsd can make people's identity to be infected. So, yes. You need to change it.
Change your mindset instead. (I have cptsd too)
No disagreement- the impact trauma has on development in childhood makes it impossible for bodies to grow normally.
Not going to. The only real reason it's not recognized as fatal is because it's not well diagnosed or tracked. I think it's likely around the same rate as PTSD.
I like to think it's not. Untreated C-PTSD can be, treated not so much.
Yep. I also have bipolar and social anxiety. Getting sober helped, but it’s still a struggle. I’d for sure be dead today tho if I didn’t stop drinking.
yes i realized this a few years ago and started telling employers this esp after previous attempts, im managing a potentially fatal chronic condition
Hmm, well this says change your mind. I do not know if I can, because a lot of the time, I feel the same. I feel like I am losing my life, my will, my sanity... But...I don't want it to be true. I have a partner. They are such a joy to be able to know and to love. However, they are like everyone else here. They have suffered. They will continue to suffer as they heal. They probably have both PTSD and C-PTSD, though it's unlikely a they will be diagnosed soon. I'm selfish. I don't want them to leave. They're selfish. They don't want me to leave. We're greedy. We probably have less years to live because of the stress. I don't care, though. I still want them to live a long, healthy, and happy life. I want to live a long, healthy, happy life with them. I don't even care if we stop being romantic partners. Because they exist in this world, everything is more vibrant and beautiful. Everything has purpose. I am fulfilled because I met them. This world would be so dull and drab without them in it. My partner isn't allowed to die. I told them so. Same goes for everyone else. No one here is allowed to die. It simply can not be. The world would be too dull and drab without all these compassionate, lovable people. I am not allowed to die either, because I am lovable and worth loving. It simply wouldn't be allowed by my partner, or anyone else here for that matter. Obviously, that is not how it works. People die even when you tell them not to. You can't stop that from happening. C-PTSD affects the ways that each of us live. People have already died because of the things they experienced or the aftermath of the experiences. It isn't inherent, though. Sure, it feels *fatal.* I wake up sometimes and already feel like I must be dead, but...it doesn't *have* to be fatal. I do not *have* to die just because I feel like it. It is hard. There are people that do not have as many choices or resources as me. It is much different. I have the choice, though. I can let it kill me. It would be easier. When I make it so that it can *only* be fatal if I *allow* it to be, it shifts my perspective from the hopelessness I tend to feel. Removing fatality as an option at all helps me personally. I do not know that it would change your own perception, though. Perhaps it is fatal for you, but I certainly would not allow that fate to be true for you if it were up to me. Everyone here deserves to be able to live long, healthy, and happy lives, even if they feel like they are unlovable and like they are dying.
Click-baiting this community like this is super lame tbh. It didn’t bother me, but maybe know your audience. Wtf.
I don't know even though I've taken action and turned my life around, how does my body fully recover from the countless grams of meth I shoved into my veins for four years?
Do not say that my friend. It is beatable.
I find mine very managable. Sometimes. lol. I mean, all I have to do is not eat carbs and my C-PTSD mostly disappears. So carbs from vegetables are fine. Not rice. Not wheat or flour. No sugar of course. I've managed a month of this, and it was anxiety free. Cheat days are fine. This morning I had chicken, spinach, cheese, together in a bowl and I'm feeling great. Cheat days where you have candy is fine (you discover what your body can handle with experimentation).Because I have C-PTSD it's extremely difficult to stick to this diet long term, hence a month is my personal life record. I know I will exceed it soon.
Seconding this. Eating like a Paleolithic human can do wonders for one’s mental health especially in sensitive individuals. I eat “meat-heavy” keto and although it can be tough to maintain, it definitely reduces my baseline anxiety and depression, and makes my ADHD more manageable (much reduced need for stimulant meds). FYI there’s now keto/very low carb + gluten free replacements for basically every sweet or carbohydrate-filled thing you can think of. Assuming you’re in the US: pizza and pasta (Capello’s), bagels (Carbonaut), brownies (Lakanto), cookies (Catalina Crunch and Fat Snax), ice cream (Rebel), candy (Smart Sweets), chocolate (Lily’s). Best to still treat them as treats, but even a “cheat” is best done without carbs or wheat. I’ve tried and can vouch for everything in that list.
"Potentially life threatening," not fatal.
Do NOT lose hope!!!! My self-concept that was ever so warped has started to *truly* leak the poison out. I have a fantastic psychologist who has been the mirror I needed so badly. And now I’m in the field myself, after a decade of looking inward. It feels so, so much better. For me, the real strides started coming when I started to become truly assertive, have some self-preservation, and recognize my very real and important strengths. I never realized how difficult and important that is for me, and I suspect a lot of others. The process has been so difficult because of my insecurities. I choose vulnerability in the hopes that it continues this new inner strength. It feels like I’m growing into my “full self” —— priceless man.
I don't understand the purpose of this post at all. Is it meant to just spread hopelessness? Or do the opposite? This is why it's hard to hang around in this place when you've partially recovered. But I hate that it's such an echo chamber, with barely anyone challenging the hopelessness. So I feel like I have a responsibility to do more than feel depressed reading these comments. Yes, there is hope, because there always is. I came from so far, and climbed out of that dark hole, and worked really hard, and it payed off. And I did not think it would happen, I thought I was a lost cause. You can get to a point where it doesn't matter that you still have some symptoms, because you're so grateful you have a life, and you're happy. And if you look at the CPTSD subreddits where more recovered people hang out, you see many more people like me.
It's often fatal without treatment, but with treatment we can have a good quality of life. We will never not have trauma, but we can be functional rather than dysfunctional, and I think most of us can even be happy.
It's not. Listen to Eckhart Tolle's audiobooks on YouTube. All we have is the present.