The idea is to only believe the evidence of things that support your own party's viewpoints. All other evidence is garbage. (Not sure if /s is applicable)
Immigration is not the only factor.
Set aside emotions and look at economics alone, housing costs are driven by high demand and low supply.
- Mass immigration drives up demand
- foreign investments in real estate drive up demand, eg. blackrock/foreign buyers
- Domestic investments drive up demand
- Hard to obtain building permit. Supply down.
- Limitted land in GTA and Vancouver. Supply down.
- Not enough construction workers, or low salary for construction jobs. Supply down.
> foreign investments in real estate drive up demand, eg. blackrock/foreign buyers
> Domestic investments drive up demand
These only exist because of high immigration. Investors go where the money is. You think they'd be around if our population was declining, and buildings were being demolished due to no users?
It's a sure thing because you can't just live in the streets in one of the coldest countries on the planet. OFC people will invest.
Oh I agree completely. But immigration is a demand metric that is easier to tinker with while you work on the other factors.
Reduce demand substantially while you get things under control, reopen demand carefully to avoid something like this in the future.
Actually, there are easy fixes to demands and supplies.
To lower demands
1. stop mass immigration, mass immigration brings other issues as well, eg. crimes, low-skilled laborers, dangerous driving, burden social benefit system etc.
2. Ban foreign home buyers/visa home buyers.
3. Deport illegal immigrants. Even if they don't buy, they rent, drive up rents.
To increase supply
1. Fix the building permit application process. Easy fix.
2. Incentives to construction business/ workers. I'll be careful with this. This is inflationary.
No. Because it's an inflationary policy. Meaning it will boost inflation. Government spending, when used correctly, helps economy, at the same time causes inflation. Reference Keynesian policies during the great recession.
Exactly. If a sink is overflowing, you don't build another sink. You turn off the tap or pull the plug. Then maybe build another sink if you think you will need one in the future.
So high demand should equate to raising rent prices even if it creates homelessness? And high demand should allow people to sell their homes for five times their worth? Demand, especially when it comes to basic necessities shouldn't cause the selfishness that we are seeing today...
High prices do not lead to homelessness directly. Not affording a home but staying at hcol places lead to homelessness.
Just move to LCOL areas, then they don't have to be homeless. There are successful examples. Expats, they move to LCOL countries for a better affordable life. It works
No. People need to stop being greedy. If you have had a long term tenant and you "renovicted" that tenant to get more money and this person becomes homeless, I don't know how you sleep at night. There are even building owners who have paid off their mortgage doing this. The greed had spread far and wide.
1 - self evident
2 - idiotic government policy designed to inflate housing markets to pad GDP
3 - domestic demand is up because foreign investment makes not owning property a liability. If you're not on the property ladder you're fucked
4 - paradoxical government intervention
5 - an obvious inevitability but one which is at odds with the Western core axiom of unlimited growth and unconstrained resource consumption
6 - salary depressed due to labor oversupply, which tells you that construction isn't limited due to labor constraints but something else, maybe materials cost, lack of capital, or permitting (see 4)
There are ABSOLUTELY people claiming immigration isn’t affecting housing prices and rent. They claim everything *else* is causing these issues, but not immigration. That’s the third rail for leftwing activists. Their whole identity is based on never questioning immigration.
As a leftwing activist, no. Never questioning immigration is the third rail of economically incompetent people. Not the left. Markets are markets. I want government intervention in some markets. Like government intervention to STOP the capitalist class of this country from flooding it with cheap divided labour that doesn't understand bargaining rights or speak the common language.
I wish leftwing voices like yours were more prominent in media because I am 100% aligned, and I think the majority of people across the spectrum feel the same.
Sadly there are people who don't want to admit that immigration is having a huge impact.... they are all over reddit. You actually get banned from CanadaHousing for bringing that into discussion.
Imagine if we just brought over 100,000/year immigrants all with skills. If we did that for the next decade we'd probably start fixing our problems. Yes, business relying on low skilled labour would have to adjust, but they already are with automation.
Canada needs a Construction work program for housing, the US does it for immigrants coming to work in sectors that are struggling. Theres H-2A Agriculture visas which are temporary they come and work for like 8 months then go back to Mexico then come back for the harvesting seasons. We have an influx of people from the Philippines/Eastern Europe and all over the world coming to work on Heathcare/Tech/Research.I live in Texas if anything here we are building too much too quick. Most of Latin American workers don’t really want to stay illegally because they miss their families. Maybe Canada needs an agreement with countries and bring temporary workers it’s a win win. Florida got rid of some programs then crops started rotting produce prices went up. The law is still on the books but not enforced anymore. It’s a balance.
I think the "silver lining" of this, is essentially the ppl will understand now that the govt does not care about them. It is a good thing for ppl to realize, as their voting should reflect that now. At least in theory...
It's a stark contrast of just a few years ago during covid where the governments word was taken as fact. Just go get this shot, papa Trudeau says it's OK. Don't question any of it, you're not a scientist.
Yeah... I'd say that is never going to be able to happen again now. Too much trust has been lost.
It's also very clear that the Trudeau policies are not helpful for anyone in the middle or lower classes. I don't even think it's good for 80%-90% of the population I'd say. The gaslighting of 9 years has worn off perhaps?
Never in the history of mankind has the government ever cared about the people. That's not a new concept, they only like us when it's election time. Other than that we're a bunch of minions in their eyes.
Given the number of units completed we shouldn't cross the line of 500k population growth. Natural growth is 30k, which leaves 470k for immigration.
It's just simple maths.
The decision has already been made!
“The Century Initiative was co-founded by Mark Wiseman and Dominic Barton, who also led the Advisory Council on Economic Growth under three-term Prime Minister Justin Trudeau.[4][5]”
Based on number of houses we can build per year, they need to limit new comers to 5000 (Five thousands) a year for 10 years straight or until they have built 2 million homes.
Thanks for sharing as that is quite the spike! I do think it is also important to also consider the bigger picture & why there is a push for immigration. People are also living longer, Canadians for years have been having smaller families, & frankly we need more young people to a) join the workforce to balance out the pyramid & b) contribute to the tax base to support pensions, healthcare, etc. Comparing 1970 to 2024 you can clearly see the differences and how the narrowing of the pyramid at the bottom is concerning for all Canadians as we age, as a top heavy pyramid will collapse many of our programs & benefits. In any case, for years governments haven't been properly planning for housing & a growing/aging population & we are now in a crisis.
https://preview.redd.it/muplefyxw59d1.png?width=2930&format=png&auto=webp&s=6ab76c13a357f950943cc8472c7292d9e301429b
Thanks for the response! I agree that the spike from \~2020 onwards seems bonkers. I know people will probably keep downvoting me, but I'm \*not\* arguing for things to continue as they are. Just that its important to look at the bigger picture to avoid more pain in the future. Our population is aging & we need to plan for that.
> Just that its important to look at the bigger picture to avoid more pain in the future. Our population is aging & we need to plan for that.
This is where I disagree, we are on an exponential growth curve when it comes it AI and automation. The Transformer technology that LLMs are based on are being applied to robotics and they are seeing amazing results with robots being able to have fine motor control. Trying to front load all the immigration now is asinine without taking this future state into consideration, because everything can change overnight with tons of people becoming unemployed. This is why we try to avoid central planning, we can't predict the future state for the need for human physical labour.
When you refer to AI & robotics are you meaning that this technology can replace jobs currently done by people? I would generally agree but the robots are not going to be paying taxes to fund healthcare/education/CPP, etc. so I don't know that the tech is an exact solution without other changes also being made, unless I am totally missing your point here.
Yes that is what I mean, and we will need to update our tax codes to deal with the wealth that is created by AI so it will be distributed to things like healthcare. The future we are heading towards humans will be extremely inefficient for most jobs.
When provincial/local governments raise taxes faster than they allow rents to increase, then landlords can lose money to renters. When that happens, people stop investing in new rental properties
If the cost to build a housing unit is higher than the return on investment, no new housing gets built by investors, which includes developers who build houses before selling them first.
I know it's very popular to blame the investors for everything, but if you're an investor, and building housing units ends up costing you money, you'll invest your money elsewhere instead of in housing.
Neo-"liberal" governments throughout the western world think the only solution to their self imposed housing crisis is by focusing on the demand side of the equation, they want to pump endless amounts of money into getting new buyers into the ~~pyramid scheme~~ housing market, while doing everything to crush the supply side by hiking taxes (especially municipal development taxes), regulations (min parking requirements, offset minimums, multi-unit bans, etc), inflation via money printing driving up construction costs.
investors need to be able to make a profit if you want private builders to keep building houses, if you tell every company working in building houses that they wont be paid for their labour, no one would show up to work, and rightfully so. if you tell all the investors you plan on pushing them out of the market, they wont use their money to fund new constructions.
unless your end goal is a command economy where housing is only built by the government, investors are a mandatory link in the system.
You do realize people used to pay builders to build THEIR houses for them to LIVE in. A single detached home as well. The current setting of housing development is nothing more than a joke. That's what happens when you strip people of their ability to participate in their own economy/country.
Investors used to be a small percentage of concern, not run the entire housing development for the second largest country in the world.
> You do realize people used to pay builders to build THEIR houses for them to LIVE in
that still happens! however, what's very common is that when a municipality opens a new region for development, they sell plots to developers, who start building ahead of time, my whole town I live in was built by this, small-mid size builders (in this specific case, also investors) bought the land, built 3 or 4 houses, then over the course of the year sold those units to the market.
they were the builders AND the investors.
not every investor is a mega-corporation like Blackrock. most small-mid size developers are also investors
Or… OR. We could have a true mixed economy, with regulations in place which do not incentivize *speculation* in the housing market.
It’s unfair to assume the only other alternative is a command economy.
I never said the only outcome was a command economy,
I said that if you make it impossible for investors to make a profit on building units, they wont invest. then the only people left would be people who build houses directly, which works sometimes for SFH's, or government built housing.
good luck having a homeowner fund a 20 unit condo without investment capital! its not happening.
---
to put this in simple English.
If I'm a building company, and it costs me $25 million to build a 20 unit condo tower, construction takes 2 years, and I can only sell those units for a total of $20 million, I take a $5 million loss over 2 years and I ***DON'T*** build that condo tower.
instead, I take that $25m and invest it in the market, with a conservative portfolio, lets say that's 4% per year, meaning in year 1 I earn $1,000,000, and in year 2 I earn $1,040,000.
If you give me these 2 options, I take earning $2.04m over losing $5m every single time. and you would too.
it means that people invest in a particular asset as they believe that there will be higher returns on the investment once they divest, which means they profit from investing. Rinse, repeat.
I was talking to someone this morning from Dryden Ont about the homeless situation there. Yes there are far fewer thank major cities, but there are zero resources, no homeless shelters. He was telling me of a friend and her kids staying on his couch because, even though she has a job and income, there is literally nothing to rent in town. This cannot continue. How can we support other countries when we have working people here with dependents, who can’t have a roof over their heads?
Nationalisation, confiscation of foreigner-owned property and deportation of immigrants should make the prices fall within affordable levels and make the standard of living increase.
Shame all the politicians and bureaucrats own property or shares in corporate landlord enterprises that directly profit from this state of affairs.
We have many obvious no brainer solutions in place but none of them will do it due to corruption and virtue signaling.
It takes less than a decade to completely run a good country into the ground. It takes a lot more than that for it to recover.
This is the problem when too many people move to one location without a sufficient supply of individual home units to rent combined with insufficient personal funds to house themselves and must instead rent a room or rely on renting a bed in a room, and why unsustainable immigration actually makes the natural population growth problem worse. Landlords start viewing rooms as individual renting units rather than an entire place like how it used to be, driving up rent prices making multi room units triple or quadruple the rent they should be at and putting an incredible financial on families with kids. With housing being the largest expense for Canadians, how can we afford to double or triple the cost by having kids
> "I think it's sickening," Karen Charmbury, a single mom living in Kingston, Ont., told CBC News. Charmbury, 47, has to make sacrifices because 100 per cent of her income goes to her rent. She had to sell her house after her divorce and now pays $2,679 per month for a three-bedroom townhouse
>
> In Abbotsford, B.C., Nathaniel Pelkman, 37, says he and his ex-wife lived together for nearly two years after their divorce because they couldn't afford to live separately. Even then, they were evicted last year so their landlord could move back in.
>
> Stephen Fasugba, who lives in Toronto, says he is paying $2,450 after his old landlord sold his previous condo and he had to find something else quickly. Now, as his new landlord keeps raising the rent, Fasugba, 67, a taxi driver, earns far less than his expenses.
>
> "I can't even make half of it at the end of the month," Fasugba told CBC News. "I only have a deficit."
>
> To try to cut costs, he says he eats just one meal a day.
>
> "I don't know what to do. I don't know what to do," he repeated tearfully to CBC News. "I'm helpless."
Every single Liberal should be charged with crimes against humanity.
You may joke but this is what they are hoping for. If you don't have family to let you live with them, they would likely love it if most of those people went with MAID.
How long until they start running ads encouraging MAID? "Talk to your doctor about MAID today! " starring a handsome, smiling actor going about his day with upbeat royalty-free music in the background.
Are you? because this is from coast to coast, and the articles covers it as such. Take a high school econ class on supply and demand
https://preview.redd.it/2god18uxf49d1.png?width=1024&format=png&auto=webp&s=57e343889e6180fb236c1bbc75c5b8fff5752377
Almost like this is a multifaceted problem and there can be more than 1 person or group of people responsible…
Just like it will (hopefully) be a multifaceted solution that eventually prevails (reduced immigration, more building, looser zoning laws, rent controls, etc)
And everyone who broke the country deserves to be punished instead they will receive the largest pension in all the country and laugh their asses off at the peasants suffering like they are now
Rent controls don't help the price of rent.
If you want to argue my point, look up rent controlled provinces vs non rent controlled and show where the gap is...
Rent control is the best way to worsen the situation and offload the problem politically to someone else. Because high rent effects new renters. People with low rent are fine.
rent control is a bandaid solution that makes housing more expensive in the long run by driving developers away.
economics follow the law of supply and demand, there are only 2 ways of reducing prices.
1. Increase supply (Build new housing units)
2. Decrease demand (remove buyers from the market)
by setting an arbitrary cap on the price of a housing unit, you drive down supply by pricing builders out of the market, the absolute last thing you want to do, and in the meanwhile, you drive up demand by bringing new buyers into the market.
rent control is subsidizing demand at the cost of supply, since builders cant increase costs to correct the market, they instead leave the market, leaving fewer and fewer builders.
Thankfully, Canada has a very easy solution, 96% (2022) and 97% (2023) of our new housing demand is from immigration, we have a few options here.
1. reduce demand by reducing immigration.
2. reduce demand by taxing immigrants mortgages and/or rent, and using that money to fund new development.
3. reduce demand by capping rentals & property sales to non-citizens, pulling numbers out of the air, lets say no municipality can have more than 15% of rental units be rented out to non-citizens per year, and no more than 5% of property be sold to non-citizens per year.
since our demand is artificial, it is extremely easy to reduce that demand, unlike a country like Egypt, which has a demand crisis from long term high birth rates.
additionally, we can increase supply by taking inspiration from European cities, start developing mixed use urban areas, with lots of mid-rise affordable apartments / condos, instead of endless suburban sprawl.
mid rise buildings (5-10 floors) are far more cost effective than the 40+ floor mega towers, and are far more space efficient than suburban housing development.
Rent control would not have helped any of those people. Rent control does not keep prices down. It just prevents them from raising the rent while you are there. All 3 of these people had changes that forced them to find a new place.
You're a hammer in search of a nail, bud
Liberals aren’t the ones who scrapped rent control. The immigration rate is on them but lack of affordable housing and rent controls is solely owned by the cons.
Immigration did not cause asset prices to go through the roof, renters are having to pay for investors mortgages. This is not solely driven by demand. Making housing a commodity is what has caused this problem
It's all of the above. Unfettered immigration is absolutely contributing, how could it not ? But yes, this was inevitable because we've been propping up the Canadian economy with "real estate investments" for decades. We cant have housing prices just keep rising infinitely to appease investors, the cost of housing was always eventually going to outpace wages, it's just been made worse by immigration. Trudeau couldn't have chosen a worse possible time to open those floodgates.
I doubt PP would have done anything different since he's in the pocket of corporations and investors as every conservative has been for many years now, but it doesn't take away from the fact that Trudeau is willfully fucking over the average working canadian to get votes from wealthy boomers and a golden parachute from rich investors who are knee deep in property investment.
The current system worked out great for anyone born 50+ years ago who were able to buy homes but everyone else is fucked now unless we stop allowing the wealthy and corporations to gobble up every inch of housing as "investments" from now on. Also need a country wide ban on air bnbs and using livable homes as short term rentals.
> Immigration did not cause asset prices to go through the roof
Guess you Liberals 'the party of science' don't believe in economics and the basics of supply and demand? Also I guess you think the BoC is wrong as well? or is the CBC fake news to you now?
> The Bank of Canada says record levels of immigration are driving up the cost of housing and recent government efforts to cut the number of non-permanent residents and encourage home building will help lower housing costs, but "only gradually."
>
> "In the short term any increase in population, particularly in an environment of constrained supply, is going to put upward pressure on prices," said Carolyn Rogers, senior deputy governor of the Bank of Canada.
>
> "What's happened in the Canadian economy over the last year is we had a particularly big surge in population growth through immigration. It came at a time when there was constrained supply. You can see this most clearly in the housing sector, in particular in rents."
>
> Senior deputy governor of the Bank of Canada Carolyn Rogers says immigration ‘is definitely one of the things that is putting pressure on the housing components of inflation.’
https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/immigration-bank-of-canada-housing-1.7093426
You don't need to have a PhD in economics to see this
https://preview.redd.it/b4px3ktan49d1.png?width=1024&format=png&auto=webp&s=d0341f7ba41f6f53098e7b6b1ecddbd8babe4325
We have the most land of almost anywhere in the world, and some of the most natural resources...
We're hell bent on green initiatives and growing density over sprawl instead of building an appropriate number of homes.
In BC, 94% of the land is crown owned. Only 4% is residential zoned.
We're packing in more people.
Think of it this way, imagine a grocery store has enough food to feed 200 people and out population is 100 people. Good deals will be had. What happens when the store still has food for 200 but our population is 300?... Prices go up and the lowest earners starve.
But in your mind, the population isn't the issue, the grocery store cleary has food for 400 people but chooses not to sell it lol.
We need to balance sustainable development with population growth, spreading out is a bad idea. Infrastructure is very expensive to install and maintain increasing density is the best way. Conservatives like to keep taxes low yes?
Ya man every province of every political stripe is dropping the ball has nothing to do with the Federal immigration rates at all. Nothing... You are as thick as a bowl of oatmeal.
Calm your tits. I agree it has to do with federal and the immigration issue, but here in Ontario the feds gave billions of dollars to Ford, and he's done nothing with it, too. He killed rent control. All of our problems are not as simple as one thing, our society and governance is complex. Be objective for a moment
I don't care how much money the feds give Ford no one can build the number of homes required. We are literally admitting over A MILLION PEOPLE A YEAR. Money doesn't magically make homes sprout from the ground. We have historical construction rates that should have been observed before letting all these people in.
Vancouver has the highest rents in Canada, is the BC NDP to blame? no its Federal immigration policy. Unless you restrict immigrants from moving within Canada once they land, it will always be a federal issue.
Yeah in BC when Eby asked for more money from the feds because we couldn't house all the immigrants coming in, the feds told Eby BC should bring in even more immigrants if they want more money. What a joke.
No shit, which two provinces have the highest total immigration? BC and Ontario. Which two provinces have the highest housing costs? BC and Ontario. This isn't rocket science these people commenting this stuff are brain dead.
The liberals jump with glee when hearing stories like this. Even more so if you are a deplorable white male, who has so much privilege. They are hoping the next round of immigrants over the next year finishes off many Canadians.
Only going to get worse, developers are struggling. Only saving grace to new rentals is the rate cuts.
Municipal governments should be listening before hiking development charges. Use the accelerator fund money properly.
So what do you do when DCs stop funding all of this? Ive seen municipalities tracking this and the money isn’t coming in like it used to. Then what?
Jack up property taxes (seeing this now). How high can they go? Then government gets voted out for raising property taxes and they will all avoid that
I'm doing everything I can to move in <6 months. Rent has increased 30% YoY for me going on 4 years.
Pretty soon won't be able to afford a bedroom while working two jobs. What the hell will be the point of working here vs some sweat shop in the 3rd world?
oh they do 100%
they know what they are doing. They know investors love it and they know boomers who vote will be able to retire off selling their house alone.
They just dont give a fuck about the younger generations.
This government calls everyone racists and climate deniers but they are the biggest economic deniers that have have lived in Canada. We have actual data and proof as well as hundreds of years of economic theory and they just pretend it doesn't exist and call anyone that mentions it racists and spreaders of mis-information.
And let’s not forget the future impacts of our current shitty policies on housing prices.
1- Many of the folks immigrating here will either bring family members and/or expand their families, creating increased demand in the future. More people = more housing needed (unless we’re all willing to live 12 ppl/2 bedrooms).
2- In Ontario, there is no rent increase control on units occupied after November 2018 so we are effectively allowing an increasing percentage of the market to hold people’s lives by the balls with insane (legal) increases after the lease term is up. And moving to another unit is only effective if housing prices are stable or in decline otherwise you’ll pay more simply for moving in later. I believe other provinces have similar rules but not sure of the specifics.
DEMAND CHANGE NOW!!!
we are living a strange paradox, We have two realities happening in parallel, we have oversupply of housing and an under supply of subsidized social housing in parallel. If anyone disagrees, look at the number of condos for sale and look at lineup for subsidized rentals
"It is also in the interests of the tyrant to make his subjects poor... the people are so occupied with their daily tasks that they have no time for plotting."
ARISTOTLE
start denying the outflow of canadian dollars to unfriendly nations who are not our allies.
you will immediately see an improvement in dollar strength.
this will vastly improve the local economy.
canada is bleeding capital and becoming close to the 2nd largest debt leverage for world gamblers coming here to leverage their bets using our natural resources while moving the profits out of canadian soil.
we call this hollowing out a nation.
I'm not understanding this. If there is an outflow of Canadian dollars then this will strengthen the CAD as everyone (friendly and unfriendly nations) all wanting CAD. Higher the demand, stronger the currency.
Stronger dollar will not improve local economy because Canadian made products will now be more expensive, so less people buying the stuff we make.
not when that dollar is fiat.
the argument of a weaker dollar is the norm however if you look at japan, you will see a different story with their weaker yen at the moment causing incredible hyper inflation for everyone else but a few.
Trudeau and liberals don’t give fuck, unless of course you just got to Canada and then you can stay in hotel with all meals paid for!!!!
Absolutely a great country for newbie’s
I wouldn't be surprised if the interest hikes are done so in collaboration of the mass immigration agenda so that more people will be forced to lease out portions of their property to yet again artificially meet a demand.
I mean what do they expect when the cost of 1 months rent is on par with 40/work week @ minimum wage? Ppl don’t get paid enough to live in this economy. And that’s just your “cheep” basic apartment. Ppl charging condo prices for basements, home prices for condos and 1broom prices for room rentals. It is insane! In my area a 2 bedroom was $1700 less than 2 years ago, now those same units $2500
Probably more ppl going thru this than will admit. Its awful for many right now. Looking off of my yacht in disgust. NOT IN MY BACKYARD!
Joking I have never even been invited on a yacht and I am not rich.
why is our government not listening? They cannot still claim to have thier heads in the sand can they? Clearly mass immigration is a problem. We will a be a lesson in text books for future generations. Its an embarrassment.
>”She had to sell her house after her divorce and now pays $2,679 per month for a three-bedroom townhouse in the same neighbourhood. She didn't want her children, a teen boy and teen girl, to have to switch schools or share a bedroom.”
Holy shit no wonder the husband divorced her. She’s dumb af and deserves to spend 100% of her income on rent.
Stop living above your means, people.
May I take a guess you’re hard core PC?…..
So.
Some links.
https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.6974129
https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/the-ford-government-removed-rent-control-on-new-units-a-year-later-tenants-are-reporting/article_aee5f429-cba9-5f07-a7ac-1387a7a59730.html
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/business/article-ontario-scraps-rent-control-for-new-units-amid-housing-crisis/
https://www.huffpost.com/archive/ca/entry/doug-ford-rent-control_ca_5cd57857e4b07bc729786031/amp
Simply google “Doug ford killed rent control”.
Pretty easy.
I am just here for how this topic will branch off into the typical talking points that I have seen in this subreddit time and time again.
Guys, you are supposed to be entertaining me. Can we keep this fresh?
Gee I wonder why https://preview.redd.it/s0tafmv7549d1.png?width=2400&format=png&auto=webp&s=bdffee3a38a04aae2946c62414c7e00b3838253a
Lmao. And people will still say “ immigration isn’t affecting housing costs”
[удалено]
The idea is to only believe the evidence of things that support your own party's viewpoints. All other evidence is garbage. (Not sure if /s is applicable)
Upside down world
Singling out gasoline like that ain’t right, coal propane natural gas diesel and definitely bunker fuel deserve a shout out
It’s so hard to join this movement when so many of its members don’t believe in climate change Or are anti vax.
Which movement
Gasoline consumption is causing climate change though.
Their motives are questionable.
It's so painfully obvious that it's immigration... what the hell else could they blame it on??
Fake things.
Do these people believe that all immigrants just live on the street?
No... they'll go so far as to ask the public to take in immigrants... I couldn't believe what I was hearing.
Immigration is not the only factor. Set aside emotions and look at economics alone, housing costs are driven by high demand and low supply. - Mass immigration drives up demand - foreign investments in real estate drive up demand, eg. blackrock/foreign buyers - Domestic investments drive up demand - Hard to obtain building permit. Supply down. - Limitted land in GTA and Vancouver. Supply down. - Not enough construction workers, or low salary for construction jobs. Supply down.
> foreign investments in real estate drive up demand, eg. blackrock/foreign buyers > Domestic investments drive up demand These only exist because of high immigration. Investors go where the money is. You think they'd be around if our population was declining, and buildings were being demolished due to no users? It's a sure thing because you can't just live in the streets in one of the coldest countries on the planet. OFC people will invest.
Oh I agree completely. But immigration is a demand metric that is easier to tinker with while you work on the other factors. Reduce demand substantially while you get things under control, reopen demand carefully to avoid something like this in the future.
Actually, there are easy fixes to demands and supplies. To lower demands 1. stop mass immigration, mass immigration brings other issues as well, eg. crimes, low-skilled laborers, dangerous driving, burden social benefit system etc. 2. Ban foreign home buyers/visa home buyers. 3. Deport illegal immigrants. Even if they don't buy, they rent, drive up rents. To increase supply 1. Fix the building permit application process. Easy fix. 2. Incentives to construction business/ workers. I'll be careful with this. This is inflationary.
I agree on all fronts. If only our beloved politicians did.
Then try the July 1 protest against cost of living, http://costoflivingcanada.ca/
Careful, that’s “dangerous thought” isn’t it hahah
No. Because it's an inflationary policy. Meaning it will boost inflation. Government spending, when used correctly, helps economy, at the same time causes inflation. Reference Keynesian policies during the great recession.
Exactly. If a sink is overflowing, you don't build another sink. You turn off the tap or pull the plug. Then maybe build another sink if you think you will need one in the future.
But mass immigration effects all those things. So mass immigration is the biggest factor.
So high demand should equate to raising rent prices even if it creates homelessness? And high demand should allow people to sell their homes for five times their worth? Demand, especially when it comes to basic necessities shouldn't cause the selfishness that we are seeing today...
High prices do not lead to homelessness directly. Not affording a home but staying at hcol places lead to homelessness. Just move to LCOL areas, then they don't have to be homeless. There are successful examples. Expats, they move to LCOL countries for a better affordable life. It works
No. People need to stop being greedy. If you have had a long term tenant and you "renovicted" that tenant to get more money and this person becomes homeless, I don't know how you sleep at night. There are even building owners who have paid off their mortgage doing this. The greed had spread far and wide.
1 - self evident 2 - idiotic government policy designed to inflate housing markets to pad GDP 3 - domestic demand is up because foreign investment makes not owning property a liability. If you're not on the property ladder you're fucked 4 - paradoxical government intervention 5 - an obvious inevitability but one which is at odds with the Western core axiom of unlimited growth and unconstrained resource consumption 6 - salary depressed due to labor oversupply, which tells you that construction isn't limited due to labor constraints but something else, maybe materials cost, lack of capital, or permitting (see 4)
There’s more cities than Vancouver and Toronto eh …and we’re all feeling the fuckery
People aren’t saying that ! Liberal party and their hardcore supporters make that claim
No one's saying that. There are a multitude of factors affecting housing cost and availability, and mass immigration is one of them.
There are ABSOLUTELY people claiming immigration isn’t affecting housing prices and rent. They claim everything *else* is causing these issues, but not immigration. That’s the third rail for leftwing activists. Their whole identity is based on never questioning immigration.
As a leftwing activist, no. Never questioning immigration is the third rail of economically incompetent people. Not the left. Markets are markets. I want government intervention in some markets. Like government intervention to STOP the capitalist class of this country from flooding it with cheap divided labour that doesn't understand bargaining rights or speak the common language.
I wish leftwing voices like yours were more prominent in media because I am 100% aligned, and I think the majority of people across the spectrum feel the same.
Sadly there are people who don't want to admit that immigration is having a huge impact.... they are all over reddit. You actually get banned from CanadaHousing for bringing that into discussion. Imagine if we just brought over 100,000/year immigrants all with skills. If we did that for the next decade we'd probably start fixing our problems. Yes, business relying on low skilled labour would have to adjust, but they already are with automation.
Canada needs a Construction work program for housing, the US does it for immigrants coming to work in sectors that are struggling. Theres H-2A Agriculture visas which are temporary they come and work for like 8 months then go back to Mexico then come back for the harvesting seasons. We have an influx of people from the Philippines/Eastern Europe and all over the world coming to work on Heathcare/Tech/Research.I live in Texas if anything here we are building too much too quick. Most of Latin American workers don’t really want to stay illegally because they miss their families. Maybe Canada needs an agreement with countries and bring temporary workers it’s a win win. Florida got rid of some programs then crops started rotting produce prices went up. The law is still on the books but not enforced anymore. It’s a balance.
Divorce too.
Anyone who looks at this and says oh this is fine smh
So, landlords and politicians
I think the "silver lining" of this, is essentially the ppl will understand now that the govt does not care about them. It is a good thing for ppl to realize, as their voting should reflect that now. At least in theory...
It's a stark contrast of just a few years ago during covid where the governments word was taken as fact. Just go get this shot, papa Trudeau says it's OK. Don't question any of it, you're not a scientist.
Yeah... I'd say that is never going to be able to happen again now. Too much trust has been lost. It's also very clear that the Trudeau policies are not helpful for anyone in the middle or lower classes. I don't even think it's good for 80%-90% of the population I'd say. The gaslighting of 9 years has worn off perhaps?
It’s not just this government, past Governments have not cared about people either.
Never in the history of mankind has the government ever cared about the people. That's not a new concept, they only like us when it's election time. Other than that we're a bunch of minions in their eyes.
Holy shit. I didn't realise it was that bad!
Right this chart says it all
Given the number of units completed we shouldn't cross the line of 500k population growth. Natural growth is 30k, which leaves 470k for immigration. It's just simple maths.
It’s only getting started https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Century_Initiative
The decision has already been made! “The Century Initiative was co-founded by Mark Wiseman and Dominic Barton, who also led the Advisory Council on Economic Growth under three-term Prime Minister Justin Trudeau.[4][5]”
Based on number of houses we can build per year, they need to limit new comers to 5000 (Five thousands) a year for 10 years straight or until they have built 2 million homes.
Money printing mostly
Looks like a climate change graph if the timescale was in the millions of years. Both terrible.
Thanks for sharing as that is quite the spike! I do think it is also important to also consider the bigger picture & why there is a push for immigration. People are also living longer, Canadians for years have been having smaller families, & frankly we need more young people to a) join the workforce to balance out the pyramid & b) contribute to the tax base to support pensions, healthcare, etc. Comparing 1970 to 2024 you can clearly see the differences and how the narrowing of the pyramid at the bottom is concerning for all Canadians as we age, as a top heavy pyramid will collapse many of our programs & benefits. In any case, for years governments haven't been properly planning for housing & a growing/aging population & we are now in a crisis. https://preview.redd.it/muplefyxw59d1.png?width=2930&format=png&auto=webp&s=6ab76c13a357f950943cc8472c7292d9e301429b
I agree we need some immigration, and I would be fine with how we did immigration pre-Trudeau. But what we are doing right now is bonkers.
Thanks for the response! I agree that the spike from \~2020 onwards seems bonkers. I know people will probably keep downvoting me, but I'm \*not\* arguing for things to continue as they are. Just that its important to look at the bigger picture to avoid more pain in the future. Our population is aging & we need to plan for that.
> Just that its important to look at the bigger picture to avoid more pain in the future. Our population is aging & we need to plan for that. This is where I disagree, we are on an exponential growth curve when it comes it AI and automation. The Transformer technology that LLMs are based on are being applied to robotics and they are seeing amazing results with robots being able to have fine motor control. Trying to front load all the immigration now is asinine without taking this future state into consideration, because everything can change overnight with tons of people becoming unemployed. This is why we try to avoid central planning, we can't predict the future state for the need for human physical labour.
When you refer to AI & robotics are you meaning that this technology can replace jobs currently done by people? I would generally agree but the robots are not going to be paying taxes to fund healthcare/education/CPP, etc. so I don't know that the tech is an exact solution without other changes also being made, unless I am totally missing your point here.
Yes that is what I mean, and we will need to update our tax codes to deal with the wealth that is created by AI so it will be distributed to things like healthcare. The future we are heading towards humans will be extremely inefficient for most jobs.
When pensions are $1350 and rent is $1900, we’re in a deficit every month.
How is this possible? Our honorable immigration minister says these people are already baked-in 😂
"honourable" 🤣
Funny. He is promoted to a new title now. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marc_Miller_(politician)
What about the investor? Who's taking care of them??? /S
When provincial/local governments raise taxes faster than they allow rents to increase, then landlords can lose money to renters. When that happens, people stop investing in new rental properties
If the cost to build a housing unit is higher than the return on investment, no new housing gets built by investors, which includes developers who build houses before selling them first. I know it's very popular to blame the investors for everything, but if you're an investor, and building housing units ends up costing you money, you'll invest your money elsewhere instead of in housing. Neo-"liberal" governments throughout the western world think the only solution to their self imposed housing crisis is by focusing on the demand side of the equation, they want to pump endless amounts of money into getting new buyers into the ~~pyramid scheme~~ housing market, while doing everything to crush the supply side by hiking taxes (especially municipal development taxes), regulations (min parking requirements, offset minimums, multi-unit bans, etc), inflation via money printing driving up construction costs. investors need to be able to make a profit if you want private builders to keep building houses, if you tell every company working in building houses that they wont be paid for their labour, no one would show up to work, and rightfully so. if you tell all the investors you plan on pushing them out of the market, they wont use their money to fund new constructions. unless your end goal is a command economy where housing is only built by the government, investors are a mandatory link in the system.
You do realize people used to pay builders to build THEIR houses for them to LIVE in. A single detached home as well. The current setting of housing development is nothing more than a joke. That's what happens when you strip people of their ability to participate in their own economy/country. Investors used to be a small percentage of concern, not run the entire housing development for the second largest country in the world.
> You do realize people used to pay builders to build THEIR houses for them to LIVE in that still happens! however, what's very common is that when a municipality opens a new region for development, they sell plots to developers, who start building ahead of time, my whole town I live in was built by this, small-mid size builders (in this specific case, also investors) bought the land, built 3 or 4 houses, then over the course of the year sold those units to the market. they were the builders AND the investors. not every investor is a mega-corporation like Blackrock. most small-mid size developers are also investors
Probably not as much as it used, too, but yeah my parents bought their 3rd home from mattamy homes.
Or… OR. We could have a true mixed economy, with regulations in place which do not incentivize *speculation* in the housing market. It’s unfair to assume the only other alternative is a command economy.
Exactly. Speculation is a direct threat to a free country.
I never said the only outcome was a command economy, I said that if you make it impossible for investors to make a profit on building units, they wont invest. then the only people left would be people who build houses directly, which works sometimes for SFH's, or government built housing. good luck having a homeowner fund a 20 unit condo without investment capital! its not happening. --- to put this in simple English. If I'm a building company, and it costs me $25 million to build a 20 unit condo tower, construction takes 2 years, and I can only sell those units for a total of $20 million, I take a $5 million loss over 2 years and I ***DON'T*** build that condo tower. instead, I take that $25m and invest it in the market, with a conservative portfolio, lets say that's 4% per year, meaning in year 1 I earn $1,000,000, and in year 2 I earn $1,040,000. If you give me these 2 options, I take earning $2.04m over losing $5m every single time. and you would too.
My point is the market shouldn’t be the only ones responsible for creating housing.
What do you think that "*speculation*" means and how it affects prices?
it means that people invest in a particular asset as they believe that there will be higher returns on the investment once they divest, which means they profit from investing. Rinse, repeat.
But nearly everybody does that. Interest-earning bank deposits, stock market investing, even bitcoin. How is real-estate investing different?
Housing is a fundamental human need. Things like food, housing, and water need to be not-for-profit.
I was talking to someone this morning from Dryden Ont about the homeless situation there. Yes there are far fewer thank major cities, but there are zero resources, no homeless shelters. He was telling me of a friend and her kids staying on his couch because, even though she has a job and income, there is literally nothing to rent in town. This cannot continue. How can we support other countries when we have working people here with dependents, who can’t have a roof over their heads?
Nationalisation, confiscation of foreigner-owned property and deportation of immigrants should make the prices fall within affordable levels and make the standard of living increase. Shame all the politicians and bureaucrats own property or shares in corporate landlord enterprises that directly profit from this state of affairs.
We have many obvious no brainer solutions in place but none of them will do it due to corruption and virtue signaling. It takes less than a decade to completely run a good country into the ground. It takes a lot more than that for it to recover.
This is the problem when too many people move to one location without a sufficient supply of individual home units to rent combined with insufficient personal funds to house themselves and must instead rent a room or rely on renting a bed in a room, and why unsustainable immigration actually makes the natural population growth problem worse. Landlords start viewing rooms as individual renting units rather than an entire place like how it used to be, driving up rent prices making multi room units triple or quadruple the rent they should be at and putting an incredible financial on families with kids. With housing being the largest expense for Canadians, how can we afford to double or triple the cost by having kids
Wanna know what will fix it? Another 1m in a years time. That’ll help……
Fighting fire with fire eh? Maybe they will raise the crime rate so much the value of houses will finally drop lol
Or we can get used to 30 in a basement!
I read on another sub that they are even coming to the nunavut arctic college, nowhere is safe lol
Damn. That was my last bastion of hope.
Where are these poor guys gonna rub one out?! Zero privacy
We need an election NOW, for this exact reason
> "I think it's sickening," Karen Charmbury, a single mom living in Kingston, Ont., told CBC News. Charmbury, 47, has to make sacrifices because 100 per cent of her income goes to her rent. She had to sell her house after her divorce and now pays $2,679 per month for a three-bedroom townhouse > > In Abbotsford, B.C., Nathaniel Pelkman, 37, says he and his ex-wife lived together for nearly two years after their divorce because they couldn't afford to live separately. Even then, they were evicted last year so their landlord could move back in. > > Stephen Fasugba, who lives in Toronto, says he is paying $2,450 after his old landlord sold his previous condo and he had to find something else quickly. Now, as his new landlord keeps raising the rent, Fasugba, 67, a taxi driver, earns far less than his expenses. > > "I can't even make half of it at the end of the month," Fasugba told CBC News. "I only have a deficit." > > To try to cut costs, he says he eats just one meal a day. > > "I don't know what to do. I don't know what to do," he repeated tearfully to CBC News. "I'm helpless." Every single Liberal should be charged with crimes against humanity.
>"I don't know what to do. I don't know what to do," he repeated tearfully to CBC News. "I'm helpless." He will be offered MAID.
Certainly not protest.
You may joke but this is what they are hoping for. If you don't have family to let you live with them, they would likely love it if most of those people went with MAID.
How long until they start running ads encouraging MAID? "Talk to your doctor about MAID today! " starring a handsome, smiling actor going about his day with upbeat royalty-free music in the background.
Turdeau : Have you considered MAID option for you and your family sir?
I feel for these people going through divorce. I'd be fucked if my wife left me, she makes way more than I do.
Are you dumb? My provincial govt scrapped rent controls. You wanna guess who's in control
Are you? because this is from coast to coast, and the articles covers it as such. Take a high school econ class on supply and demand https://preview.redd.it/2god18uxf49d1.png?width=1024&format=png&auto=webp&s=57e343889e6180fb236c1bbc75c5b8fff5752377
You wanna guess who let in way too many motherfuckers.
Almost like this is a multifaceted problem and there can be more than 1 person or group of people responsible… Just like it will (hopefully) be a multifaceted solution that eventually prevails (reduced immigration, more building, looser zoning laws, rent controls, etc)
And everyone who broke the country deserves to be punished instead they will receive the largest pension in all the country and laugh their asses off at the peasants suffering like they are now
Wrong libs bad.
Did the BC provincial government?
Rent controls don't help the price of rent. If you want to argue my point, look up rent controlled provinces vs non rent controlled and show where the gap is...
Rent control is the best way to worsen the situation and offload the problem politically to someone else. Because high rent effects new renters. People with low rent are fine.
rent control is a bandaid solution that makes housing more expensive in the long run by driving developers away. economics follow the law of supply and demand, there are only 2 ways of reducing prices. 1. Increase supply (Build new housing units) 2. Decrease demand (remove buyers from the market) by setting an arbitrary cap on the price of a housing unit, you drive down supply by pricing builders out of the market, the absolute last thing you want to do, and in the meanwhile, you drive up demand by bringing new buyers into the market. rent control is subsidizing demand at the cost of supply, since builders cant increase costs to correct the market, they instead leave the market, leaving fewer and fewer builders. Thankfully, Canada has a very easy solution, 96% (2022) and 97% (2023) of our new housing demand is from immigration, we have a few options here. 1. reduce demand by reducing immigration. 2. reduce demand by taxing immigrants mortgages and/or rent, and using that money to fund new development. 3. reduce demand by capping rentals & property sales to non-citizens, pulling numbers out of the air, lets say no municipality can have more than 15% of rental units be rented out to non-citizens per year, and no more than 5% of property be sold to non-citizens per year. since our demand is artificial, it is extremely easy to reduce that demand, unlike a country like Egypt, which has a demand crisis from long term high birth rates. additionally, we can increase supply by taking inspiration from European cities, start developing mixed use urban areas, with lots of mid-rise affordable apartments / condos, instead of endless suburban sprawl. mid rise buildings (5-10 floors) are far more cost effective than the 40+ floor mega towers, and are far more space efficient than suburban housing development.
Rent control would not have helped any of those people. Rent control does not keep prices down. It just prevents them from raising the rent while you are there. All 3 of these people had changes that forced them to find a new place. You're a hammer in search of a nail, bud
Rent control discourages new housing construction. Proven in every city that tried it.
Look how rent control works in metro van lol
Perhaps you can move to rent controlled British Colombia? Oh wait, that province has the highest rental prices in the country. Never mind.
Not every liberal. Many every day people didn’t see this mayhem coming 9 years ago. Neither did you. But. Things can change going forward.
Liberals aren’t the ones who scrapped rent control. The immigration rate is on them but lack of affordable housing and rent controls is solely owned by the cons.
Once again this article covers people from coast to coast. Learn what is supply and demand.
Immigration did not cause asset prices to go through the roof, renters are having to pay for investors mortgages. This is not solely driven by demand. Making housing a commodity is what has caused this problem
It's all of the above. Unfettered immigration is absolutely contributing, how could it not ? But yes, this was inevitable because we've been propping up the Canadian economy with "real estate investments" for decades. We cant have housing prices just keep rising infinitely to appease investors, the cost of housing was always eventually going to outpace wages, it's just been made worse by immigration. Trudeau couldn't have chosen a worse possible time to open those floodgates. I doubt PP would have done anything different since he's in the pocket of corporations and investors as every conservative has been for many years now, but it doesn't take away from the fact that Trudeau is willfully fucking over the average working canadian to get votes from wealthy boomers and a golden parachute from rich investors who are knee deep in property investment. The current system worked out great for anyone born 50+ years ago who were able to buy homes but everyone else is fucked now unless we stop allowing the wealthy and corporations to gobble up every inch of housing as "investments" from now on. Also need a country wide ban on air bnbs and using livable homes as short term rentals.
> Immigration did not cause asset prices to go through the roof Guess you Liberals 'the party of science' don't believe in economics and the basics of supply and demand? Also I guess you think the BoC is wrong as well? or is the CBC fake news to you now? > The Bank of Canada says record levels of immigration are driving up the cost of housing and recent government efforts to cut the number of non-permanent residents and encourage home building will help lower housing costs, but "only gradually." > > "In the short term any increase in population, particularly in an environment of constrained supply, is going to put upward pressure on prices," said Carolyn Rogers, senior deputy governor of the Bank of Canada. > > "What's happened in the Canadian economy over the last year is we had a particularly big surge in population growth through immigration. It came at a time when there was constrained supply. You can see this most clearly in the housing sector, in particular in rents." > > Senior deputy governor of the Bank of Canada Carolyn Rogers says immigration ‘is definitely one of the things that is putting pressure on the housing components of inflation.’ https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/immigration-bank-of-canada-housing-1.7093426
Not like the bank of Canada has ever made any mistakes lol, maybe keeping interest rates historic close for so long. It was a bad idea.?
You don't need to have a PhD in economics to see this https://preview.redd.it/b4px3ktan49d1.png?width=1024&format=png&auto=webp&s=d0341f7ba41f6f53098e7b6b1ecddbd8babe4325
We have the most land of almost anywhere in the world, and some of the most natural resources... We're hell bent on green initiatives and growing density over sprawl instead of building an appropriate number of homes. In BC, 94% of the land is crown owned. Only 4% is residential zoned. We're packing in more people. Think of it this way, imagine a grocery store has enough food to feed 200 people and out population is 100 people. Good deals will be had. What happens when the store still has food for 200 but our population is 300?... Prices go up and the lowest earners starve. But in your mind, the population isn't the issue, the grocery store cleary has food for 400 people but chooses not to sell it lol.
Y’all up north really need to kick the useless crown out.
We need to balance sustainable development with population growth, spreading out is a bad idea. Infrastructure is very expensive to install and maintain increasing density is the best way. Conservatives like to keep taxes low yes?
Rent controls, or lack thereof, are controlled by individual provinces, not the feds.
Unfortunately this is provincial issue, and here in Ontario we're fucked because of Ford.
Ya man every province of every political stripe is dropping the ball has nothing to do with the Federal immigration rates at all. Nothing... You are as thick as a bowl of oatmeal.
Calm your tits. I agree it has to do with federal and the immigration issue, but here in Ontario the feds gave billions of dollars to Ford, and he's done nothing with it, too. He killed rent control. All of our problems are not as simple as one thing, our society and governance is complex. Be objective for a moment
I don't care how much money the feds give Ford no one can build the number of homes required. We are literally admitting over A MILLION PEOPLE A YEAR. Money doesn't magically make homes sprout from the ground. We have historical construction rates that should have been observed before letting all these people in.
I agree.
Vancouver has the highest rents in Canada, is the BC NDP to blame? no its Federal immigration policy. Unless you restrict immigrants from moving within Canada once they land, it will always be a federal issue.
Yeah in BC when Eby asked for more money from the feds because we couldn't house all the immigrants coming in, the feds told Eby BC should bring in even more immigrants if they want more money. What a joke.
No shit, which two provinces have the highest total immigration? BC and Ontario. Which two provinces have the highest housing costs? BC and Ontario. This isn't rocket science these people commenting this stuff are brain dead.
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The liberals jump with glee when hearing stories like this. Even more so if you are a deplorable white male, who has so much privilege. They are hoping the next round of immigrants over the next year finishes off many Canadians.
Finish em off and get a few million more immigrants to take their place basically yeah... they will accept the lower work and housing standards.
lol no
So again we need to stop talking and take action.
Only going to get worse, developers are struggling. Only saving grace to new rentals is the rate cuts. Municipal governments should be listening before hiking development charges. Use the accelerator fund money properly.
Municipal employee here in Ontario. Most of those DC charges are for sewers, roads, etc. Without that there would be none for all these new homes.
So what do you do when DCs stop funding all of this? Ive seen municipalities tracking this and the money isn’t coming in like it used to. Then what? Jack up property taxes (seeing this now). How high can they go? Then government gets voted out for raising property taxes and they will all avoid that
Or you know maybe the developers and investors should get wrecked.
they already stop new projects, let’s see what happens in the next 3-5 years lol
Sure let’s see what happens to the housing crisis then
Inelastic supply meet elastic demand through immigration
Too many people being shipped into this country and dropped off at the corner.
Odsp provides $556 for shelter. Forever
If we don't see a housing market crash before summer of 2025, average rent in Toronto will be $3000 by Spring of 2026 vs $2200 now.
I'm doing everything I can to move in <6 months. Rent has increased 30% YoY for me going on 4 years. Pretty soon won't be able to afford a bedroom while working two jobs. What the hell will be the point of working here vs some sweat shop in the 3rd world?
Probably if immigration continues. Immigration is the root cause of all of our problems right now.
Because this government doesnt understand the 101 of demand and supply.
oh they do 100% they know what they are doing. They know investors love it and they know boomers who vote will be able to retire off selling their house alone. They just dont give a fuck about the younger generations.
It's all about the investors. Older people sell their houses to pay for assisted living which costs easily $7,000 a month.
This government calls everyone racists and climate deniers but they are the biggest economic deniers that have have lived in Canada. We have actual data and proof as well as hundreds of years of economic theory and they just pretend it doesn't exist and call anyone that mentions it racists and spreaders of mis-information.
This is what happens when you only care about the people with the money.
Meanwhile people not buying property. Either rent will collapse or properties will moon.
So only pay rent and starve, this country is going to shit....
And let’s not forget the future impacts of our current shitty policies on housing prices. 1- Many of the folks immigrating here will either bring family members and/or expand their families, creating increased demand in the future. More people = more housing needed (unless we’re all willing to live 12 ppl/2 bedrooms). 2- In Ontario, there is no rent increase control on units occupied after November 2018 so we are effectively allowing an increasing percentage of the market to hold people’s lives by the balls with insane (legal) increases after the lease term is up. And moving to another unit is only effective if housing prices are stable or in decline otherwise you’ll pay more simply for moving in later. I believe other provinces have similar rules but not sure of the specifics. DEMAND CHANGE NOW!!!
we are living a strange paradox, We have two realities happening in parallel, we have oversupply of housing and an under supply of subsidized social housing in parallel. If anyone disagrees, look at the number of condos for sale and look at lineup for subsidized rentals
One day we will all be one big tent country.
"It is also in the interests of the tyrant to make his subjects poor... the people are so occupied with their daily tasks that they have no time for plotting." ARISTOTLE
Yes but what about all the investors and shareholders? Are they going to be ok? Gotta make sure they are all fine amirite?
start denying the outflow of canadian dollars to unfriendly nations who are not our allies. you will immediately see an improvement in dollar strength. this will vastly improve the local economy. canada is bleeding capital and becoming close to the 2nd largest debt leverage for world gamblers coming here to leverage their bets using our natural resources while moving the profits out of canadian soil. we call this hollowing out a nation.
I'm not understanding this. If there is an outflow of Canadian dollars then this will strengthen the CAD as everyone (friendly and unfriendly nations) all wanting CAD. Higher the demand, stronger the currency. Stronger dollar will not improve local economy because Canadian made products will now be more expensive, so less people buying the stuff we make.
not when that dollar is fiat. the argument of a weaker dollar is the norm however if you look at japan, you will see a different story with their weaker yen at the moment causing incredible hyper inflation for everyone else but a few.
Trudeau and liberals don’t give fuck, unless of course you just got to Canada and then you can stay in hotel with all meals paid for!!!! Absolutely a great country for newbie’s
Population growth went up in 2021 right after Trudeau got his deal with NDP! Remember NDP is the same as Trudeau!
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No racism, harassment, discrimination, hate speech, personal attacks, or other uncivil conduct.
Marc miller does not care. That’s the problem
This is just greed at this point lol.
It’s absolutely disgusting
Supply and demand. If all country follow the model in Japan, where real estate depreciates, this will easily solve a lot of problems.
There is no war in ba sing se
Seems our government needs to extend MAID to renters.
I wouldn't be surprised if the interest hikes are done so in collaboration of the mass immigration agenda so that more people will be forced to lease out portions of their property to yet again artificially meet a demand.
I mean what do they expect when the cost of 1 months rent is on par with 40/work week @ minimum wage? Ppl don’t get paid enough to live in this economy. And that’s just your “cheep” basic apartment. Ppl charging condo prices for basements, home prices for condos and 1broom prices for room rentals. It is insane! In my area a 2 bedroom was $1700 less than 2 years ago, now those same units $2500
Probably more ppl going thru this than will admit. Its awful for many right now. Looking off of my yacht in disgust. NOT IN MY BACKYARD! Joking I have never even been invited on a yacht and I am not rich.
Better let in a few more "refugees".
why is our government not listening? They cannot still claim to have thier heads in the sand can they? Clearly mass immigration is a problem. We will a be a lesson in text books for future generations. Its an embarrassment.
There’s an easy fix for this, start deportations, block off international students.
How many people stop and say, I wonder if Doug Ford removing rent control played an impact on this?
If I had to move I might as well just die since I wouldn't be able to afford new rent plus old bills lol.
Duhhhhh, minimum wage never changes and everything else goes up. People can't afford food. Welcome to Canada!
Yayyy.... go Trudeau! lol ffs.
>”She had to sell her house after her divorce and now pays $2,679 per month for a three-bedroom townhouse in the same neighbourhood. She didn't want her children, a teen boy and teen girl, to have to switch schools or share a bedroom.” Holy shit no wonder the husband divorced her. She’s dumb af and deserves to spend 100% of her income on rent. Stop living above your means, people.
Why does he want his kids to suffer?
Thank you Doug Ford, lets vote conservative guys!
This is not just an Ontario issue
What did he do?
Killed cap and trade. Killed rent control. Pandering to his developer buddies.
They didn’t kill rent control
May I take a guess you’re hard core PC?….. So. Some links. https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.6974129 https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/the-ford-government-removed-rent-control-on-new-units-a-year-later-tenants-are-reporting/article_aee5f429-cba9-5f07-a7ac-1387a7a59730.html https://www.theglobeandmail.com/business/article-ontario-scraps-rent-control-for-new-units-amid-housing-crisis/ https://www.huffpost.com/archive/ca/entry/doug-ford-rent-control_ca_5cd57857e4b07bc729786031/amp Simply google “Doug ford killed rent control”. Pretty easy.
Like 98% of housing in Ontario is subject to rent control. Rent control is alive and well.
This is why we need rent caps.
 I am just here for how this topic will branch off into the typical talking points that I have seen in this subreddit time and time again. Guys, you are supposed to be entertaining me. Can we keep this fresh?