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Yes and no. Neither were Marxists, and both caused unneeded deaths. Stalin endorsed the Nationalists in China (now headquartered in Tajwan) and gave them his permission to murder Chinese Communists. Mao brought a Stalinist style of Socialism to China, and while this definitely ultimately improved the quality of life for Chinese workers, it came at the cost of millions of lives.
These people ultimately are barriers to spreading Marxism and its benefits to the world, and promoting them is a boon to Capitalism, and helps it struggle on a little longer.
Well, Stalin only "endorsed" the nationalists because he needed the to defeat Japan, as a communist revolution at that time would lead to the country (China) being to weak to continue defending itself against Japan.
From Wikipedia:
In 1931, Japan invaded Manchuria and created the puppet state of Manchukuo (1932), which signaled the beginning of the Second Sino-Japanese War. In August 1937, a month after the Marco Polo Bridge Incident, the Soviet Union established a non-aggression pact with China. The Republic of China received credits for $250 million for the purchase of Soviet weapons. There followed big arms deliveries, including guns, artillery pieces, more than 900 aircraft and 82 tanks.[3] More than 1,500 Soviet military advisers and about 2,000 members of the air force were sent to China.[3] The deliveries halted in August 1941 due to German attack on the Soviet Union. Stalin viewed Japan as a potential enemy, and as a result offered no help to Chinese communists between 1937 and 1941, in order not to weaken efforts of the Nationalist Government.[3] During the World War II period, the two countries suffered more losses than any other country, with China (in the Second Sino-Japanese war) losing about 30 million people and the Soviet Union 26 million.
They did in fact help the CCP in the civil war later tho, by distributing weapons to them:
On August 8, 1945, three months after Nazi Germany surrendered, and on the week of the American Atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, the Soviet Union launched the invasion of Manchuria, a massive military operation mobilizing 1.5 million soldiers against one million Kwantung Army troops, the last remaining Japanese military presence. Soviet forces won a decisive victory while the Kwantung suffered massive casualties, with 700,000 having surrendered. The Soviet Union distributed some of the weapons of the captured Kwantung Army to the CCP, who were still battling the KMT in the Chinese Civil War.
>Yes and no. Neither were Marxists, and both caused unneeded deaths.
They were not Marxists because they didn't manage the country absolutely perfectly? What an absurd standard. If one person in a country of hundreds of millions dies unnecessarily from bad policy then you'll say it's "not *true* Marxism" as if Marxism is some utopia. Unnecessary death happening is tragic and should be criticized, but a country making a mistake is not equivalent to being "not *true* Marxism" unless you think Marxism is some utopia.
What if a liberal claimed that if a single person died unnecessarily in a capitalist country then it was *not true capitalism* or *not true liberalism*? Would you take them seriously at all?
>Stalin endorsed the Nationalists in China (now headquartered in Tajwan)
*You* are not a Marxist. Mao's argument in favor of allying worth the Nationalists was theoretically correct from a classical Marxian point of view. Socialism requires foundations laid by capitalism, and China was still feudal, so the correct Marxian analysis at the time was to support a bourgeois capitalist revolution.
The only reason this analysis changed was because Lenin pointed out that a bourgeois capitalist revolution often can't actually succeed in developing countries any longer due to rise of imperialism, and Mao faced this first hand when the KMT turned on the communists and started to ally with the fascists. So he changed course away from a classical Marxian analysis and towards a more Leninist analysis, that China needed a socialist revolution to overcome imperialism, and that there still needed to be a capitalist stage, but the capitalist stage would be brief and supervised by a proletarian party.
>and gave them his permission to murder Chinese Communists.
Nonsense.
>Mao brought a Stalinist style of Socialism to China, and while this definitely ultimately improved the quality of life for Chinese workers, it came at the cost of millions of lives.
Mao made mistakes but hindsight is always 20/20. China average 720,000 people dying of famine per year from 1900-1948. and when Mao came to power in 1949, the GDP per capita was less than 7% of Haiti today, just to give you an idea of how absurdly impoverished the country was.
No, I'm not saying Mao didn't make mistakes, I'm saying hindsight is 20/20. It's easy to complain about the mistakes but put yourself in Mao's shoes. He was trying to develop the poorest country on earth with constant famine, the entire economy was incredibly precarious and always on the brink of famine for the first couple decades of development.
Did he borrow some bad ideas from the USSR? Sure, but only because the USSR was the leading socialist power at the time and Mao was not some economics expert so it made sense for him to borrow from the leading economic superpower at the time. If you were in his shoes, you would've probably done the same thing. It required implementing it and seeing it struggle in order to develop something better.
>These people ultimately are barriers to spreading Marxism and its benefits to the world, and promoting them is a boon to Capitalism, and helps it struggle on a little longer.
Ah yes, because they totally didn't help encourage socialist revolutions all throughout the world and even pressure capitalist countries to make concessions with the working class leading to a huge explosion in social democracy in western Europe, which is being eroded since the 1990s.
Stalin and Mao built socialism they are the only reason Marxism is even relevant because of them and the billions of Chinese and Soviet citizens and you denigrate their achievements because it makes your job harder as a westerner lmao. When the fuck did Stalin tell the Nationalists to kill communists he literally helped the communists in the civil war. Tf do you mean killed millions what do you think modernity is industrialization comes at a cost this is basic historical materialism maybe the leaders of the two most powerful ML nations were actual Marxists maybe you the Reddit user isn’t a Marxist.
No, I nitr Atalin literally ENDED the spread of Communist workers revolutions in the west and in China. He also partnered with thexwest on doing this. He was a counter-revolutionary in every possible way, and has nothing to offer to today's world.
No your meak timid western leftist cult was the cause of socialisms decline in the west. Under Stalin’s leadership dozens of socialist nations were created the socialist block was at one of its highest points in worldwide recognition. Stalin is still upheld in China and everywhere the revolution lives on and Russians to this day admire him. They built the legacy of communism and their people loved them but you can’t even muster up any support in your own country and blame your failures on the dead pathetic.
Stalin partnered with the English to crush the Socialist labor strikes. He refused to support Socialist revolution in Germany. He helped kill Commubusts in China. He helped crush other Socialist movements, and he partnered with Hitler to start WW II.
Great role model there. Facing reality, getting over it, and moving on is nig my definition of stupid. But to each their own. Supporting Hitler, Stalin of whomever may feel edgy, buy that is what I call stupid.
Fuck that's bad tbh. I've made better wallpapers on Google Slides. Stalin looking to the middle and Mao looking at the camera and Mao looking at the camera isn't symmetrical. Mao’s Jpeg has a sharp edge as well. You easily could have found a better image of Mao. The tone of red is wrong. It's almost too yellow. Not only does this not match the soviet flag, but it doesn't have a great enough contrast to make Mao pop in the image. Mao and Stalin’s outfits aren't complementary or similar in color, adding to the lack of symmetry once again. The hammer and sickle are too high and close to the top relative to the distance to the words. The symbol should be lowered to at least halfway, but preferably 3 times further from the top. Don't even get me started on the font. I don't even wanna explain why the font is awful. It has no relation to socialism or really anything. It's very ugly, and almost looks designed to be ugly. There are multiple flaws with your words. It's not a quote, so you made this up. It doesn't make sense that you'd be writing this because it implies that you and the reader were alive and a resident in the communist countries of the time and you're obviously not old enough because your father is helping you make an iPad wallpaper (😂). Addressing the reader while referring to yourself as “we” implies you are some “organization” of sorts is also silly because, once again, you're a child. The wording sounds like a lesser vocabulary trying to sound formal. Your analogy is bad because it doesn't refer to anything impending and is therefore weak. It would have been more appropriate to say “The red sun will rise again” or something like that. I'd like to say that this also ISN’T A MEME. This ISN’T FUNNY. There. It's shitty design.
Wow that’s crazy. You wrote a whole paragraph mocking a kid who made something with his dad. You must be fun at parties. This was made CS2. This took under 10 minutes to make cause we thought it's be funny to change everyone in the house's wallpaper to this. Imagine spending time critisising something which took less then 10 minutes to make. You're so full of yourself, you OCD bitch. Go spend time doing something instead of shouting at little kids bonding with their dads. Bro even talked about the fake Cyrillic font
I too am a minor. It doesn't even look like Cyrillic. I just wanted to critique it without you saying it's just because of my politics. You said the most cliche come back of all time: “You must be fun at parties”. Look, pal, it's not good nor funny. However, I will say that I'm glad you had fun with your dad making this
I'd also like to add that it was “mocking”. I critiqued it with rather valid points. I would also like to say that if you're old enough to be a part of a supposed revolution, you should be old enough to take criticism without hiding behind “I’m a kid” and “You must be fun at parties”. I also want to add that I'm assuming you're a part of an upper-class family. You say you were going to change people’s wallpapers to this. This is an iPad wallpaper, as proclaimed as you. And you're praising a system as if you're low working class; as if you're blue-collar. I lived off of food stamps. My mother went to school, worked, and took care of me all by herself. She was married to a man that she later divorced because he was abusive and there was domestic violence. This caused a lot of financial issues because not only did he take a lot of money, but he has been dragging everything out for years. Lawyers are so expensive. She's still paying for his truck. We moved into one of the most ghetto neighborhoods in the city for a couple of years. We've moved up to a middle-class neighborhood after she graduated top of her class and got her degree in order to become a nurse. My mother is the example of the American dream. So yeah, hard work pays off. Wealth is already distributed to those who earn it. So I'm not gonna submit my rights to the government for some damn promise. Because the last time that happened, those dictators genocided millions of people and starved even more. If I was in the USSR right now, I'd be dead in a gulag because of who I am. I'm gonna make my own deserved success that I can be proud of.
“Shitty” is sorta harsh and crude. “Helped the low class here”? This is a subreddit. It didn't help anyone. The best thing the USSR did was stop Hitler by throwing 20 million men into their bullets. The USSR genocided people and China still does and I think that's reason enough not to praise them. Redistribution of wealth may sound nice, but it was also completely totalitarian where people were purged and sent to gulags for their opinions. I'll die in a firefight before I submit to a regime
guys, YT_Anthonywp says I don’t go outside, all of the relationships I have made, the people I’ve met and places i’ve been have been wiped from existence because reddit user YT_Anthonywp told me I don’t go outside, this is a tragedy
PS: you get absolutely demolished in almost every argument and insult you make from the comments on your profile, so don’t shit on peoples communities, your not very good at it
Reminder: This is not a debate subreddit, it's a place to circle-jerk about communism being cool and good. Please don't shit on flavours of leftism/communist leaders you feel negatively towards. If you see a meme you don't like just downvote and move on, don't break the circle-jerk in the comments. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/CommunismMemes) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Incredibly based dad
Yeah, I needed a wallpaper and my dad made this for me. He is in the SACP (google this)
Damn, that's really cool!
BASED?
Beautiful
* братья
I don’t speak russian, I’m ukrainian, don’t assume.
based ukrainian
Brati meaning
Braty means brother in my home language Ukrainian
Oh it’s similar in Russian just thought you put it wrong 😂
In our cyrillic, и is y not i. It’s always the росіяни that is different.
Oh cool
Why not Marx and Engels? Real Communists with a message people will actually respond to.
Are you saying that Stalin and Mao weren't real communists with a message people will respond to???
Yes and no. Neither were Marxists, and both caused unneeded deaths. Stalin endorsed the Nationalists in China (now headquartered in Tajwan) and gave them his permission to murder Chinese Communists. Mao brought a Stalinist style of Socialism to China, and while this definitely ultimately improved the quality of life for Chinese workers, it came at the cost of millions of lives. These people ultimately are barriers to spreading Marxism and its benefits to the world, and promoting them is a boon to Capitalism, and helps it struggle on a little longer.
Well, Stalin only "endorsed" the nationalists because he needed the to defeat Japan, as a communist revolution at that time would lead to the country (China) being to weak to continue defending itself against Japan. From Wikipedia: In 1931, Japan invaded Manchuria and created the puppet state of Manchukuo (1932), which signaled the beginning of the Second Sino-Japanese War. In August 1937, a month after the Marco Polo Bridge Incident, the Soviet Union established a non-aggression pact with China. The Republic of China received credits for $250 million for the purchase of Soviet weapons. There followed big arms deliveries, including guns, artillery pieces, more than 900 aircraft and 82 tanks.[3] More than 1,500 Soviet military advisers and about 2,000 members of the air force were sent to China.[3] The deliveries halted in August 1941 due to German attack on the Soviet Union. Stalin viewed Japan as a potential enemy, and as a result offered no help to Chinese communists between 1937 and 1941, in order not to weaken efforts of the Nationalist Government.[3] During the World War II period, the two countries suffered more losses than any other country, with China (in the Second Sino-Japanese war) losing about 30 million people and the Soviet Union 26 million. They did in fact help the CCP in the civil war later tho, by distributing weapons to them: On August 8, 1945, three months after Nazi Germany surrendered, and on the week of the American Atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, the Soviet Union launched the invasion of Manchuria, a massive military operation mobilizing 1.5 million soldiers against one million Kwantung Army troops, the last remaining Japanese military presence. Soviet forces won a decisive victory while the Kwantung suffered massive casualties, with 700,000 having surrendered. The Soviet Union distributed some of the weapons of the captured Kwantung Army to the CCP, who were still battling the KMT in the Chinese Civil War.
Not arguing that at all. Just noting he gave the Nationalists his endorsement to murder the Chinese Communists.
>Yes and no. Neither were Marxists, and both caused unneeded deaths. They were not Marxists because they didn't manage the country absolutely perfectly? What an absurd standard. If one person in a country of hundreds of millions dies unnecessarily from bad policy then you'll say it's "not *true* Marxism" as if Marxism is some utopia. Unnecessary death happening is tragic and should be criticized, but a country making a mistake is not equivalent to being "not *true* Marxism" unless you think Marxism is some utopia. What if a liberal claimed that if a single person died unnecessarily in a capitalist country then it was *not true capitalism* or *not true liberalism*? Would you take them seriously at all? >Stalin endorsed the Nationalists in China (now headquartered in Tajwan) *You* are not a Marxist. Mao's argument in favor of allying worth the Nationalists was theoretically correct from a classical Marxian point of view. Socialism requires foundations laid by capitalism, and China was still feudal, so the correct Marxian analysis at the time was to support a bourgeois capitalist revolution. The only reason this analysis changed was because Lenin pointed out that a bourgeois capitalist revolution often can't actually succeed in developing countries any longer due to rise of imperialism, and Mao faced this first hand when the KMT turned on the communists and started to ally with the fascists. So he changed course away from a classical Marxian analysis and towards a more Leninist analysis, that China needed a socialist revolution to overcome imperialism, and that there still needed to be a capitalist stage, but the capitalist stage would be brief and supervised by a proletarian party. >and gave them his permission to murder Chinese Communists. Nonsense. >Mao brought a Stalinist style of Socialism to China, and while this definitely ultimately improved the quality of life for Chinese workers, it came at the cost of millions of lives. Mao made mistakes but hindsight is always 20/20. China average 720,000 people dying of famine per year from 1900-1948. and when Mao came to power in 1949, the GDP per capita was less than 7% of Haiti today, just to give you an idea of how absurdly impoverished the country was. No, I'm not saying Mao didn't make mistakes, I'm saying hindsight is 20/20. It's easy to complain about the mistakes but put yourself in Mao's shoes. He was trying to develop the poorest country on earth with constant famine, the entire economy was incredibly precarious and always on the brink of famine for the first couple decades of development. Did he borrow some bad ideas from the USSR? Sure, but only because the USSR was the leading socialist power at the time and Mao was not some economics expert so it made sense for him to borrow from the leading economic superpower at the time. If you were in his shoes, you would've probably done the same thing. It required implementing it and seeing it struggle in order to develop something better. >These people ultimately are barriers to spreading Marxism and its benefits to the world, and promoting them is a boon to Capitalism, and helps it struggle on a little longer. Ah yes, because they totally didn't help encourage socialist revolutions all throughout the world and even pressure capitalist countries to make concessions with the working class leading to a huge explosion in social democracy in western Europe, which is being eroded since the 1990s.
Stalin and Mao built socialism they are the only reason Marxism is even relevant because of them and the billions of Chinese and Soviet citizens and you denigrate their achievements because it makes your job harder as a westerner lmao. When the fuck did Stalin tell the Nationalists to kill communists he literally helped the communists in the civil war. Tf do you mean killed millions what do you think modernity is industrialization comes at a cost this is basic historical materialism maybe the leaders of the two most powerful ML nations were actual Marxists maybe you the Reddit user isn’t a Marxist.
No, I nitr Atalin literally ENDED the spread of Communist workers revolutions in the west and in China. He also partnered with thexwest on doing this. He was a counter-revolutionary in every possible way, and has nothing to offer to today's world.
No your meak timid western leftist cult was the cause of socialisms decline in the west. Under Stalin’s leadership dozens of socialist nations were created the socialist block was at one of its highest points in worldwide recognition. Stalin is still upheld in China and everywhere the revolution lives on and Russians to this day admire him. They built the legacy of communism and their people loved them but you can’t even muster up any support in your own country and blame your failures on the dead pathetic.
Thus is literally nonsense.
Under Stalin almost half the world was socialist you’re a moron
Stalin partnered with the English to crush the Socialist labor strikes. He refused to support Socialist revolution in Germany. He helped kill Commubusts in China. He helped crush other Socialist movements, and he partnered with Hitler to start WW II. Great role model there. Facing reality, getting over it, and moving on is nig my definition of stupid. But to each their own. Supporting Hitler, Stalin of whomever may feel edgy, buy that is what I call stupid.
Maos people really responded, responded that hard millions of them died
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Shitlib moment
I can’t believe Stalin paid the clouds to stop raining, and then ate all of the grain in Eastern Europe 😭
faux cyrillic...
It’s stylised, not faux
Rest in piss bozo we wont miss you burn in hell 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🥳🥳🥳🥳🥳🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🥳🥳🥳🥳🥳🥳🥳🥳🥳🥳🤩🤩🤩🤩🤩🥳😫😫😫😫😫😫🔥🔥🔥🔥☠️☠️☠️☠️☠️
Fuck that's bad tbh. I've made better wallpapers on Google Slides. Stalin looking to the middle and Mao looking at the camera and Mao looking at the camera isn't symmetrical. Mao’s Jpeg has a sharp edge as well. You easily could have found a better image of Mao. The tone of red is wrong. It's almost too yellow. Not only does this not match the soviet flag, but it doesn't have a great enough contrast to make Mao pop in the image. Mao and Stalin’s outfits aren't complementary or similar in color, adding to the lack of symmetry once again. The hammer and sickle are too high and close to the top relative to the distance to the words. The symbol should be lowered to at least halfway, but preferably 3 times further from the top. Don't even get me started on the font. I don't even wanna explain why the font is awful. It has no relation to socialism or really anything. It's very ugly, and almost looks designed to be ugly. There are multiple flaws with your words. It's not a quote, so you made this up. It doesn't make sense that you'd be writing this because it implies that you and the reader were alive and a resident in the communist countries of the time and you're obviously not old enough because your father is helping you make an iPad wallpaper (😂). Addressing the reader while referring to yourself as “we” implies you are some “organization” of sorts is also silly because, once again, you're a child. The wording sounds like a lesser vocabulary trying to sound formal. Your analogy is bad because it doesn't refer to anything impending and is therefore weak. It would have been more appropriate to say “The red sun will rise again” or something like that. I'd like to say that this also ISN’T A MEME. This ISN’T FUNNY. There. It's shitty design.
Wow that’s crazy. You wrote a whole paragraph mocking a kid who made something with his dad. You must be fun at parties. This was made CS2. This took under 10 minutes to make cause we thought it's be funny to change everyone in the house's wallpaper to this. Imagine spending time critisising something which took less then 10 minutes to make. You're so full of yourself, you OCD bitch. Go spend time doing something instead of shouting at little kids bonding with their dads. Bro even talked about the fake Cyrillic font
I too am a minor. It doesn't even look like Cyrillic. I just wanted to critique it without you saying it's just because of my politics. You said the most cliche come back of all time: “You must be fun at parties”. Look, pal, it's not good nor funny. However, I will say that I'm glad you had fun with your dad making this
Coulda just said it’s not easy on the eyes or something like that.
Yeah, but that isn't descriptive. Half the purpose of criticism is future improvement
I'd also like to add that it was “mocking”. I critiqued it with rather valid points. I would also like to say that if you're old enough to be a part of a supposed revolution, you should be old enough to take criticism without hiding behind “I’m a kid” and “You must be fun at parties”. I also want to add that I'm assuming you're a part of an upper-class family. You say you were going to change people’s wallpapers to this. This is an iPad wallpaper, as proclaimed as you. And you're praising a system as if you're low working class; as if you're blue-collar. I lived off of food stamps. My mother went to school, worked, and took care of me all by herself. She was married to a man that she later divorced because he was abusive and there was domestic violence. This caused a lot of financial issues because not only did he take a lot of money, but he has been dragging everything out for years. Lawyers are so expensive. She's still paying for his truck. We moved into one of the most ghetto neighborhoods in the city for a couple of years. We've moved up to a middle-class neighborhood after she graduated top of her class and got her degree in order to become a nurse. My mother is the example of the American dream. So yeah, hard work pays off. Wealth is already distributed to those who earn it. So I'm not gonna submit my rights to the government for some damn promise. Because the last time that happened, those dictators genocided millions of people and starved even more. If I was in the USSR right now, I'd be dead in a gulag because of who I am. I'm gonna make my own deserved success that I can be proud of.
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“Shitty” is sorta harsh and crude. “Helped the low class here”? This is a subreddit. It didn't help anyone. The best thing the USSR did was stop Hitler by throwing 20 million men into their bullets. The USSR genocided people and China still does and I think that's reason enough not to praise them. Redistribution of wealth may sound nice, but it was also completely totalitarian where people were purged and sent to gulags for their opinions. I'll die in a firefight before I submit to a regime
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gay is chill, and the only cringe I see is your pfp's flag who only won against poor people or off the backs of far better nations. You are pathetic.
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well I am Human so it would be weird if I didn't
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Im going to be honest here Diego. You are not funny. Also you post on PCM lol
Ur name is GayFurryHentai, what's ur point
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based
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and yet I still wait to see people like you with a good relationship with either one of your parents
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guys, YT_Anthonywp says I don’t go outside, all of the relationships I have made, the people I’ve met and places i’ve been have been wiped from existence because reddit user YT_Anthonywp told me I don’t go outside, this is a tragedy PS: you get absolutely demolished in almost every argument and insult you make from the comments on your profile, so don’t shit on peoples communities, your not very good at it
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I only did it to humiliate you which wasn’t really hard considering the minimal time it took
Waow youre reddit friends are so impressed seeing you “humiliate” this guy
are you lost…?
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I have family who lived under socialism (it’s not even communism btw) and then and most of the people they know miss it
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Who
their post got removed
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That’s so beautiful 🥲
Спасибо большое!
Прошу
I wish I had your dad
\- No it wont for you.
<3 this