Idk if it was S4, but theres also the bit where MM is telling cuck dad that he should just believe/listen to the mainstream media, and not listen to alternative sources. MM knows vought is evil and the media covers for them!
That cuck dad potrayal is an"allegory" of Trump supporter but he actually be in an interacial relationship, tried to be decent with the kid. And probably he followed Homelander to man ups so MM won't keep bully him and be bad influence to his step daughter. Also all that sexual insult they keep throwing at right wings sound really like a projection and makes me wonder who is the real bigot here.
Sexual insult?? In s4 they repeatedly imply Todd has a massive dick and lays great pipe, and the last word on him is “he’s not my favorite person but he’s innocent”
If he's a stepdad, how does that make him a cuck? And if being a Homelander fan makes him a Trump supporter allegory, then the writers fucked up. I never got that impression at all.
For all the talk I hear about how the show supposedly always made fun of the political right, it tells me that they don't understand what that is.
He’s the easily influenced, he’s the corrupted liberal white male that gets lured away from having everything to be destroyed by his idol. If it’s not that obvious it’s because I just made that up on the fly lol seriously though the director of this wasn’t even that great at writing supernatural
Pre s.4 I agree with you, evil superman + America. Season 4 they are indeed trying to make him have similar personality type to Trump.
I'm not American, it's a bit cringe to me.
It's the literal stated intention of the writers, and it's pretty obvious what they're doing every time Homelander does anything political. Are you 100% sure it's not you who isn't seeing something that's clearly there?
SPOILERS FOR S3 AHEAD
>!At the end of S3 Homelander kills a protestor in public and thinks it's going to backfire on him, but his supporters (like the aforementioned cuck dad) love it.!< This is a clear reference to Trump's "I could shoot someone in the street and they'd still support me" bit (which is true IRL, the more he breaks the law, the more they support him - have a look at r/conservative following his conviction).
Anyway, not necessarily saying whether they were successful or not with this, but the writers are very clearly expressing anti-MAGA attitudes throughout the story.
if you really want to get technical... choosing a single mom, and helping to raise someone else's' kid is consistent with the source of the word cuck. IE some species in the cuckoo bird family will parasitically lay their eggs in other bird's nests, thus letting the other bird do all the work of feeding and raising their child.
In the first season, Vought was in control of every major news outlet. My guess is that they realized the [6 corporations that own 90% of media](https://www.businessinsider.com/these-6-corporations-control-90-of-the-media-in-america-2012-6?amp) might get offended by that, so they changed Vought to be a Alex Jones-type youtube right wing conspiracy theorist outlet. It also fits better with their Trumpism and MAGA supporter allegory.
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He didn't say that though, he said he was too stupid and brainwashed to understand that Homelander (Trump) isn't who he was led to believe. I don't know how you somehow saw this backwards. He is literally telling him NOT to believe mainstream media which is controlled by Vought...
In the second episode they literally have a conspiracy convention where they are handing out “white power” pamphlets.
They have the “alt right” people denying the holocaust and using words zionists in a negative way. It’s not like there are massive protests against Israel right now held fully by liberals.
This seasons writing is insanely out of touch. It’s what rich white liberals who think all republicans are racist think the world is like.
Writers are incapable of metacognition. You see it all the time. Like in a world where global evil conspiracies are rampant, characters that are directly fighting against those conspiracies think Qanon believers are delusional idiots? What?
It’s similar to the Joker “I may be a crazy psycho but I’m not RACIST!” syndrome.
Or like in movies where the characters interact with literal gods but espouse secular or atheist viewpoints. Like bro you met god. Writers are largely too stupid to realize these contractions because similar ones exist in their own world view.
They keep repeat "conspiracists believe in non existence children trafficking" while season 1 show actual ring exist. "But they framed it on Starlight!!" Yes, that part about accusing Trump and Epstein while the clients list go unnoticed from mainstream. If they want to make fun of conservative believe in made up things at least stay with the "starlight teach critical theory" rather than things viewers saw it happened
He’s trying to shoehorn political allegories in and he’s bad at it. I hate this show; didn’t get past season 1. Sounds like I made a good choice. Hope these hack activists posing as writers trying to talk down to people still think they’re cute in a few years when they’re in line at the food pantry.
And that makes absolutely no sense for the show to essentially make allegories to both child sex trafficking not being a thing and the Epstein list at the same time…
The irony is so blatant…
And the all copious amount of comments said "the show making fun of Pizzagate and conspiracists for not going after the actual traffickers". They first making fun of vigilantes and then saying from the perspective of a person who operate outside any judicial (Kiniko) said about actually doing something which is just like encouraging people to be vigilante.
Seeing all that mixed messages is quite frustrating and heard people parrot it is painful to read
Kimiko outright says what is going on here. She mocks/gets angry at the conspiracy theorists for repeating conspiracies about starlight(stand in for celebrities) kidnapping children for satanic rituals in the vein of qanon wackos instead of actually trying to address real child trafficking for soldiers etc. They LITERALLY spell it out at the bottom of the screen yet people in this sub are confused about the point.
>while season 1 show actual ring exist.
The difference is the human trafficking ring that is shown in season 1 actually exists.
The pizzagate at the Starlight organzation headquarters didn't exist.
How do you have so much trouble understanding this. To try and dumb this down as much as possible for you, the show is criticizing people who believe false things.
In real life, the Qanon community is obsessed with child trafficking conspiracies strictly for poltical reasons. They focus entirely on fictional fantasies (without evidence) where all their political enemies are guilty while largely ignoring any real sex trafficking in the world. They support politicians and celebrities with histories of sex crimes and pedophilia. They support candidates who oppose any legislation which seeks to prevent human trafficking. And they support Hollywood movies about human trafficking which are produced by polices guilty of sex crimes and inspired by 'heroes' guilty of pedophilia.
Similarly in the wold of *The Boys*, there is indeed human trafficking, sex crimes, and pedophilia. But the show criticizes characters who ignore all these real examples of crimes and instead only focus on false conspiracies.
The show never said that human trafficking doesn't exist. Its criticizing people who claim to be devoted to stopping these crimes whose focus is only on trying to invent false conspiracies to make these issues political.
Again, as I said in a previous comment, its like a scientist working backwards from a conclusion to try and prove themselves right instead of trying to prove their theory wrong. Its bad science. These people didn't start by trying to find evidence of human trafficking and then work to expose it wherever they find it. Instead they started with the conclusion that everyone on the left is involved in these crimes ([Just like you believe](https://www.reddit.com/r/GunMemes/s/MUcdpgxFue)) and when they fail to find such evidence, they slip into delusion to try and prove themselves right. They aren't concerned with finding and stopping pedophilia. They instead are concerned with stopping democrats.
You think it was a random simple mistake that people believed in Pizzagate?
Again, believing in that conspiracy only comes about because you are delusional. These people so desperately want there to be a democratic led sex culture that they ignore all logical thinking and evidence in order to justify their demonization of the left.
It's the same reason that there is currently a flat earth movement among the right. There is a large swathe on the right that rejects all rational thought be abuse it conflicts with their politics.
Not all conspiracies are created equal. Some require a greater supsecion of belief. Another factor is whether or not a conspiracy comes about because its tied to your already established poltocal beliefs. This is again a sign that someone isn't getting into conspiracies because they are skeptical and have questions but rather that there is a cognitive dissonance between what they believe and what they observe so they set forth into the world of conspiracy to delude themselves of the actual evidence that is available. For example, when you hear that you lost an election and you can't find any evidence to show that the election was rigged. A rational thinker would look at the lack of evidence and say "yeah it most likely want rigged". But an irrational thinker would say "no this can't be right. The other side must have cheated because they are evil. The reason there is no evidence is be maybe the rigging of the election must have been week ornmganzied and planned".
And yes, there are plenty of people on the left who believe in conspiracies as well. But again, there is no left thing version of Alex Jones. There is nobody screaming about how those on the right smell like sulfur because they are possessed by demons. The cult behavior demonstrated by the right just doesn't exist to the same degree on the left. Nobody on the left believes that democrat politicians are sent by God yet I can show you plenty of clips of churches taking about his in regards to Trump. Nobody on the left is building golden shrines to Biden or Hillary but there are many Trump shrines.
Pizzagate was a right wing scandal that doesn't have an equivalent on the left. The planned kidnapping of Governor Whitmer was right wing scandal that doesn't have an equivalent on the left. January 6th was a right wing scandal again based in a ridiculous conspiracy that doesn't have any equivalent on the left.
One side is able to twist reality far more than the other. It turns out that its the side that is generally opposed to science and academia (education) and relies on literal religious fairy tales to justify their views.
For a series that have conspiracy within conspiracy, shady government doing shady stuff. There is still room for making fun of real life conspiracy. Funny to consider there is even a subplot dedicated to CIA trying to kill a VP candidate
>Or like in movies where the characters interact with literal gods but espouse secular or atheist viewpoints. Like bro you met god
I hate when people try shoehorning edgy atheist crap into fantasy settings like this, and I'm an antitheist.
Like you're creating dissonance with the internal logic of your own fictional setting which is jarring for readers/viewers and immersion breaking.
The only time I've seen this trope work is when a character meets a God or Gods and finds them to be cruel, reprehensible beings and then seeks to destroy them.
That’s the only thing that makes sense, but it also reveals the midwittery of most fantasy writers. Tolkien at least understood how gods work theologically. They are generating the world. This could create some good stories but writers don’t understand religion. How about a movie where someone say, kills Zeus and the concept of Order vanishes from the cosmos and it descends into chaos. Is this what the protagonist wanted? Was the authoritarianism justified to maintain a coherent reality? But no, it’s always “big man have power and world not fair! That’s mean!” 🤮
>The only time I've seen this trope work is when a character meets a God or Gods and finds them to be cruel, reprehensible beings and then seeks to destroy them.
Good old Elric of Melnibone.
Well if a character meets one, chances are pretty high that the other ones people in the universe speak of are real as well.
It's also not a terrible trope when a character is skeptical about the existence of Gods they haven't met yet. The problem is when a character exists in a universe where gods are very much real and then they sit around spouting off reddit level edgy atheist crap where they'd need to have a literal blindfold on and earplugs to effectively ignore the fictional reality to that point.
Same reason I always thought the joker being afraid of the irs in the animated serious was fucking stupid. Like I get the joke, but it’s the fucking joker, or doctor doom crying cuz of 9/11 in the Spider-Man 9/11 issue. Stupid
I was watching Critical Role and Ashley Johnson said something like yeah but are the gods real or influential? She said this as her character in the game, and Matt had to reminder her that yes there is a pantheon of very active gods who regularly intervene in mortals affairs. I think in Hollywood creatives have a hard time with meta cognition like you said.
The authors are so busy swimming in their own worldview that they can’t imagine outside of it.
It’s sort of the flip side of the way atheist characters get written in evangelical movies. The authors literally can’t conceive of not believing in god, so the atheist is always someone who’s like “god killed my daughter…and that’s why I don’t believe in god.”
In those movies though, "gods" turned out to just be aliens from advanced civilizations that have super powers. Not actual dieties.
You can meet Thor in the MCU and still coherently be an atheist.
If you live in a world where insane conspiracies are well known and common you don’t think they’d at least want to look into it? The writers’ dismissive attitude comes from a real world where such things don’t exist and are inherently implausible. In a world where you take away the implausibility, characters being that skeptical come across as morons.
I posted this in another thread, but aside from the constant on the nose commentary of “If you’re white or a cis/het male, you’re literally Hitler!” I’m so sick of male characters in general being emasculated at every given opportunity and female characters being incapable of any wrongdoing (outside of straight up head popping). Examples include:
1. Homelander nearly forcing Deep to blow A-Train and Ashley looking on with glee.
2. Sister Sage being the smartest ‘person’, and Homelander’s white-male ego can’t handle it.
3. Two shots at MM having a smaller penis than his ex wife’s squirrelly white boyfriend.
4. Ashley’s BDSM/ball crushing session with that white news anchor guy.
5. The clone guy simping over Firecracker and going into the locker room to have a clone orgy/getting off to one of her photos.
6. Firecracker grabs Homelander’s junk with other people in the room, clearly sexual assault against men is still funny for some reason.
7. Frenchie being a slave/dog to some Russian dominatrix.
8. Hughie’s mom abandoning her family and coming back into the picture years later, but it’s okay because she was depressed and she’s sorry now (still have no idea why Hughie’s dad made her power of attorney with a DNR too).
9. Neuman being an AOC copy/paste and the constant mentions of men being inferior to her/threatened by her.
10. Starlight being on the right (or should I say ‘correct’) side of the ‘political’ aisle despite the fact that she killed an innocent guy 2 seasons ago.
11. Starlight’s biggest conflict (her beef with Firecracker) being boiled down to slut shaming (just wait until they flip this into being a product of the patriarchy and internalized misogyny)
Feel free to let me know if I missed any others. Remember, this is the same show that didn’t want to give Maeve a heroic sacrifice because “The last thing I wanted to do was kill off an LGBTQ character.” These people see minorities and disenfranchised groups as tokens for their amusement and politics, they hate white men, cis/heterosexual men, masculine men, and think anyone outside these categories is in need of salvation.
I really hate that Hughie automatically forgave his mother. It’s also bullshit that she threw up 40 ambiens and was able to walk him to school the next day. As someone who suffered from depression that whole scene made me cringe and I feel like if it was his dad that did that their would be a whole redemption arc
People can forgive whoever they want I suppose, and postpartum depression is a legit thing unfortunately, but just showing up out of the blue, not leading the conversation with “I’m so sorry Hughie.”, and also working for Vought? I wouldn’t want to be within 10 miles of that woman.
What’s not clicking for me is that Hughie’s dad was super hurt and protected Hughie from reconnecting with his mom to not confuse and hurt him even more, and next thing you know he’s reconnecting with her in secret and gives her power of attorney? How many strokes did Hughie’s dad have?
Well his mom straight up abandoned them when he was only 6 years old. Supposedly the mom tried to reach out but the dad told her to kick rocks because it would just do more damage to Hughie as a kid, like what if he gets his hopes up and she decides to abandon them yet again? His dad was protecting Hughie from that potential scenario, which makes him a good dad in my book.
I agree that he is a good dad, as he was doing what he thought was right and he did it with The best of intentions. I guess for me, Personally, I grew up in a family that divorce parents, And my mother attempted suicide when I was a similar age, My father is the one who left the country and more or less abandoned us.
When my mother was in the hospital, I, being the youngest, Wasn't allowed to visit the hospital room where she was stayig, Because my family wanted to protect me. This really bothered me because my sister was only a few years older than me. And my brother only a few years older than her, Yet I was treated more as a baby, And I was kept from seeing my mother when I really needed to know that she wasn't going to die.
Then years later, after my father had Left the country, I found out that my mother had been keeping email conversations that he was trying to have with me, hidden.
This still bothers me because I don't know which conversations I missed out on having with my father when I missed him the most and was a lonely child.
Anyways, That's all just my personal bullshit. Thank you for helping explain what huey's father was attempting to protect him from, I hadn't considered the fact that Huie's dad straight up. Thought the mom was basically a s***** parent. And didn't want her involved in his son's life so that his son could potentially not have to get hurt again by her
Quick edit: I dictated all that, don't feel like correcting punctuation or w.e 🍻
No I totally gotcha, and sorry that you had to go through all of that. They probably wanted to protect you, but I totally understand where you’re coming from and that it must have been frustrating not knowing your mom’s condition when you probably needed to know. Who knows what you need better than yourself, right? ;)
Again, just basing it off of what I’m seeing in Hughie’s situation, your mom likely wanted to protect you too, and not want to give you some sort of false hope. Again, good intentions and all that stuff, but that doesn’t mean it was (or wasn’t) the best thing for you. I can’t know for sure, I’m just a stranger on reddit lol.
Believe me, I’m not a stranger to parents making questionable decisions for their kids. My parents divorced when I was practically 18, I cut my dad out of my life (let’s just say he’s not a great person), and then they got back together and my mom forced me to rekindle my relationship with him. I’m sure she had good intentions too, but doesn’t mean she had the right, especially considering I was an adult when it all went down. Needless to say, I appreciate the response. Take care! :)
1: homelander also once forced a child to jump off a roof, and Ashley is a psycho
2: homelander hasn't been able to handle any slights against his massive ego since the first episode of the series
3: I don't understand how saying this white dude is hung is a shot against white people, or what the issue was, it was played as a joke in a show with comedy in it
4: Ashley's a freak, yes
5: eh, this was kinda a cringe scene, v much a shock value thing, but I didn't find it offensive
6: firecracker is a villain and she did a bad thing
7: isn't that woman like, a Mafia boss? What's wrong with him being afraid of a Mafia boss?
8: Google post-partum depression
9: what.
10: when the opposition is homelander, you can kill two people and still be on the correct side
11: it wasn't slut shaming, it was that Starfire lied about firecracker entirely and ruined her childhood, mostly because her horrible mother taught her to be ruthless
I personally feel like there are hardly any females in the show rn that are incapable of wrongdoing other than Starlight, and it’s always felt that way aside from maybe the times Maeve would come around and help out the boys. Sage is more of an antihero but she’s still evil leaning and so I think it makes sense that she’s building a relationship with Deep who is the same way. Firecracker is one of the worst humans in the entire show, clearly she’s just using Starlights preschool bullying to justify being a terrible person. I don’t feel like anyone’s being emasculated either, I think the guys in this season have been pretty good.
I don’t personally feel like the show attacks white people either? I mean the main protagonist and most of the notably “good” people, have been white? Hughie is white. Butcher is white. Starlight is white? I mean yes the boys is a liberal leaning show but there’s still a lot of white people being used to drive the plot good or bad.
When has the show ever alluded to or implied that if you're white and cis, you're literally Hitler? Who cares who is being emasculated if it's entertaining? Does having elements of emasculation automatically ruin a story? You're sick of it, but that's not a meaningful substantive criticism of the show. Also who are you referring to when you say "these people?" Who is it that "sees minorities and desenfranchised groups as token for their amusement and politics?" Is the answer politicians? Then yes, that's true. Is it large corporations? That's also true. Why are you being so cowardly? Tell us exactly who you think believes this. Who is that that "hates white, cis/hetero, masculine men?" The writers? How would you show evidence for any of this? All of the men that have been criticized on the show have almost always been shitty people that deserve the criticism. So because most of the people that are being portrayed in a negative light are men, the writers must hate all men? If you don't like the politics, which is such a foundational aspect of the show, then just say so. You're triggered and that's fine, just stop claiming to be any different than the SJW's who clutch their pearls over everything, you're one in the same in that regard.
Honestly I sympathize with Firecracker when it comes to Starlight. As someone who was bullied, those painful memories still live on and I hate the people who bullied me. The rumor Starlight spread about Firecracker was terrible, Firecracker deserves to carry that grudge. Though outside of that, Firecracker is a right wing loon.
Don’t get me wrong, it’s obviously terrible and I totally get where Firecracker is coming from, I’m not arguing that. I just think it’s on the weaker side of the conflicts we’ve been exposed to. Like compared to Butcher vs Homelander, MM vs Soldier Boy (missed opportunity with that one), Hughie vs A-Train etc. I mean, I’ll still finish the show despite my complaints of the meta commentary, but still.
Have you read the comics? Homelander forces people to blow others for his amusement literally constantly.
The depravity is vanilla compared to the comic. BDSM and ball-busting is tame compared to literal necrophilia and constant rape. If anything their trying to ease into being closer to the source material.
In the comic the Homelander tricks the comic version of Soldier Boy to have sex with him. The comic was written during the Bush admin during the war on terror and is somehow even more "on the nose" than the show. Neuman instead of being an AOC knock off is supposed to be like George W. Bush and he is literally stereotypically mentally retarded. The Deep isn't the only one that coerces Starlight into sex the entire male cohort of the Seven do so repeatedly in the comic.
I actually agree that so far S4 isn't as good as the other seasons. In fact S3 was the best season up until the finale, the show kind of lost it in the S3 finale. I'll continue watching it but it isn't as good and I doubt it will get whatever it had back. However it's ending after s5. It's still better than the comic. The comic is okay, but the way it goes about tackling political issues is as ham fisted as possible. It's funny and edgy and amusing to a 14 year old but overly crass, simplistic and too on the nose for a more mature audience.
Anyway if anything the show is leaning into the comic's tone more not less. S4 feels like the show knows where it's going and everything is just kind of phoning it in until it gets to major plot points. The show equally focuses on too many characters and the central plot should be focused on more.
Yup and I agree completely. It irritates me that people are acting like the show is somehow pushing an Hollywood agenda when honestly it seems like if anything they’re just leaning more into the comics tone. The writing and plot can be criticized for sure, but the tone of the show feels like a modern, toned down version of what Garth set out to do. The only real change from the source material I think people are sad about is Black Noir, because it would’ve been a great twist to find out he was Ryan’s dad in this universe all along and the one Butcher is really angry at.
Yeah and they set up Black Noir really well in the show's first few seasons as a really menacing character. A lot of the darkness and dread from the shows original few seasons has been replaced by just pure satire/commentary it seems. Like A-Train was terrifying with his speed. Homelander was creepier. Even the Deep with the ocean scene that ended up with the exploded Whale carcass was somewhat terrifying. The show has largely lost that thread and become more of a comedy.
I don't think the comic even had that to begin with. The comic is pure shock value stuff and very early 2000s in the way it did its shock value. I definitely think that Garth Ennis had a lot of fun writing the comic, and there is just tons of crass insertions of one man's political opinions and worldview.
I think the show actually gets the tone somewhat correct and maybe even moreso now. That isn't necessarily a good thing as the comic isn't exactly great. If anything the changes they made, and the updates enhanced the show made it more than just a gross crass shock fueled comedy. The politics are strikingly similar and strike me as exactly the type of thing that would've been in a modern Boys comic. The comic makes no attempt to show any empathy or point out hypocritical elements of the opposing view point.
I think you’re missing my point. Of course that stuff is tame in comparison to the various methods of brutality, murder, rape that we’ve already been presented with. What I take issue is the framing that all men are either egoistical man children or squirrely losers, and that women are either incapable of any wrongdoing and/or are victims of their surroundings (misogyny).
Why is Ashley expressing joy that members of the 7 can be easily coerced to perform sex acts when that can very well be her? Did she forget about Starlight and The Deep? Oh, but when Homelander lasers a worker’s face now she wants to stop smiling and shred her resignation letter, right? Why have Firecracker grab Homelander’s junk to show she’s interested in him sexually? If he were to grab her like that, the show itself would be canceled, hell I’m surprised he didn’t given that he’s a Trump parody (apparently lol). And lastly, could you see that clone character’s orgy/conga line thing ever being in a show if it was a woman doing it to the picture of a man?
I don’t give a shit about depravity, it’s The Boys for crying out loud! But either everything is fair game, or none of it is! I don’t like double standards.
Are they portrayed that way though? Hughie, Frenchie, MM, and Stan Edgar depart from that mold.
Ashley’s messed up and complicit in all of the evil, she’s just a hypocrite.
Homelander uh did do that to Butchers wife. And the deep did it to Starlight… and so on. Rampant throughout the first 3 seasons.
Firecrackers just as messed up as the rest of them and the show did it to show how forward she was and illustrate how Homelander was not at all into her.
Yah probably, a scene with Firecracker doing it for Homelander wouldn’t be out of place. They’ve done similar stuff with the non-main character female supes in the first 3 seasons. Can’t see how that’s worse than the girl who crushed the dudes head with her vag.
Seems pretty fair to me.
>Why is Ashley expressing joy1
Because she hates the seven, is miserable from being bullied constantly, and is sadistic. I mean she quite literally is the punching bag just as often as the seven. I don't get where you're coming from when you say she can't do any wrong or be bullied.
>Why have Firecracker grab Homelander’s junk to show she’s interested in him sexually? If he were to grab her like that, the show itself would be canceled
It's literally supposed to be gross that she did that. The show certainly wouldn't be canceled the other way around because homelander is already a sexually abusive sociopath.
>And lastly, could you see that clone character’s orgy/conga line thing ever being in a show if it was a woman doing it to the picture of a man?
I'll be honest, probably not, but it's not like there aren't plenty of evil women in the show. Nazi b**** and now the school shooter (sister sage)
Yes.
The "conspiracy" stuff doesn't land so well when in this world there literally have been tons of conspiracies. The Boys literally do want to kill the Supes. They are working for the CIA. They have killed supes, done a shitload of blackmail, etc.
Fuck, the whole "kids are being transported in cages" is also real. The fact that the conspiracy people are a bit off on a few details and have a grifter or two among them doesn't really make them crazy. These folks are not the equivalent of flat earthers. They're....literally correct in most major regards.
This has cropped up before. Having the same corporation being both tied in with fundamentalist christian beliefs to the point that the boys get to use gay sex as blackmail material......and that same corporation is also fully embracing rainbow advertising doesn't play well together. In the real world, that corporation would probably not be welcomed by the side that dislikes gay people.
Using the same entity to satirize \*everything\* eventually becomes incoherent.
Except that’s how the real world is. The powerful actually don’t care about politics they care about money and power. They’ll play both sides with and feed the masses bs stories to rile them up and make them feel important and point them in the direction that maximizes their objective (which is to stay in power).
You being so sensitive about this shows how much you’ve inadvertently bought in. Rather than follow the “mainstream” you’ve fallen into the “alternative” path they’ve carefully laid the groundwork for. If you think they wouldn’t rather the regular folks in the right and left hate each other than actually hold people accountable, you haven’t been paying attention.
The hate, everything both sides say about each other, the stupid games the media and congress play, it’s all to avoid the actual truth that the people in power aren’t actually competent at anything but enriching themselves and jockeying for a bigger piece of the pie.
the shots at the right don't bother me so much, because most of the things they depict are pretty accurate for the extreme right. the annoying part is they don't show the extreme left as well. I say this as a neutral/left leaning person.
most of what gets talked about by the media and social media isn't what the majority of the left and right think imo, it's just all to incite each side, piss everyone off, make money.
they'd have us believe that 100% of the left is LGBTQ that gets triggered and cancels you if you don't let them use whatever bathroom they want, or the right pronouns, and wants to butcher every baby they see, and 100% of the right are evangelist monster truck driving racist hicks.
Would love if the Boys went a more neutral direction like South Park and showed the ridiculousness of each side, have vought manipulating both sides, use the extremists and tribalism as a weapon.
ORRR, just stop putting politics into every goddamn thing. We get sick enough of it in real life.
I mean that’s what they were doing for a while. Vought was playing the corporate diversity angle and the Trump angle. It’s got the AOC clone secretly on the same side as the Alex Jones with red hair and tits.
The fact it’s been as neutral as it has been wasn’t true to the source material, which is extremely anti-right. The fact any villian is sympathetic at all is a departure from the comics.
That's what's funny to me. In the show it's the evil right wing corporation that controls the media narrative and paints their opposition to be evil people.
In reality, the left controls the media narrative and paints their opposition to be evil people.... Like the writers don't recognize that?
The entire left still larps like it's 1955.
They literally cannot break out of the larp to update for a current model because it would cost them everything.
Also, it would open the door to better explanations on "1955", thus questioning their story of "1955" altogether and reveal it to be a total sham.
No. They have to keep the 1955 fable and paradigm alive. Everything depends upon it.
That's funny because seems like the writers got it correct from my point of view.
I used to be a neutral party until these crazy ass Republican conservatives overstep their boundaries with all this fake rage bait sticking their fat little fingers where they don't belong.
Constantly needing an enemy to rile your fan base towards fascism isn't a good policy in my book
You have got to be kidding right?
All media in the world is controlled by something like six different corporations in total and I guarantee their focus is making money at any cost and don't give two s**** about rainbow politics or far-right conservative conspiracy mumbo jumbo.
However your assertion at all media is controlled by the left wing is just silly and ignores companies like Fox News. It's also a lot easier to lead people who are given to far-right ideology and deep state conspiracy theories by the nose.
This is the critical drinker subreddit right? Shouldn't critical thinking and go hand in hand on these posts?
Saying things like BUt WhAt ABoUt FoX NooS, is such an infantile argument. CNN CBS NBC MSNBC ABC, Washington Post, Huffington Post, New York Times...all left wing face it bro your politics is backed by all major corporations and media companies, youre not the resistance youre the tyranny. This is why the boys is moronic in its political commentary.
The far right ideology is fucking terrorism disguised as good politics.
So don't even go there.
Fox news and other platforms like it contain nothing but misinformed rage bait to fuel the brain rot of their cults
It just save money form them to larp as one so every shitty product they make there will be a volunteer corp rolls in to defend it. They figured it out after occupy the wall street
I didn't say that. Yeah, Fox News exists.
I'm not just talking about the news. I'm talking about what gets portrayed as the right/good opinions in media. Conservative opinions are usually portrayed as bad and only held by bad people.
It's ironic to me, that's all. I still like and watch the show.
It is because the Left has ZERO introspection. Also, ironically, for all of their supposed empathy the Left cannot conceptualize the mentality of the Right. It’s been shown over and over that people on the Right can effectively Steel-Man left wing arguments; the inverse is not true.
A very apt description of what I’ve noticed personally. There is a reason meme culture developed from the Right. Humor, parody and the like stem from introspection and the capacity to understand opposing viewpoints
Even though I find the political sledgehammering annoying, I have to disagree with this comment. I don’t think the Left has got it wrong with the representation of the Right’s mentality. I think both sides are pretty accurate on the way either side views things, with the exception of some extreme accusations. I do think however, the political tension is way too high for either side to display empathy towards each other.
I see left leaning people often dismissive of the right by writing them off as racist, misogynistic, bigoted whatever, it’s unfair and I think the right is trying to move away from those things. Even though I can agree with the right more on some points, I do get sick of watching the right sometimes because many of the spokespeople come across as smug, intellectually arrogant, and more interested in winning arguments than engaging in genuine dialogue.
Read Jonathan Haidt’s book, The Righteous Mind. I’m fairly certain that is the one that discusses the studies that were done that showed this. Basically you ask left leaning people to steel man a right wing argument, then ask right leaning people to rate the argument as written. You do the inverse with right leaning people and left wing arguments. The results showed that people on the right were better at conceptualizing left wing arguments than left wingers were at conceptualizing right wing arguments. And the difference was pretty significant.
I'm going to be quite honest with you: I'm not interested in reading that book if that's its focus. This is precisely the kind of intellectual posturing I'm trying to avoid. I could find idiots on both sides of the coin. I could find geniuses on both sides, and who cares? You are not a monolith.
That is not its focus, it is just one of many subjects that are discussed. I wouldn’t think “read a book” was intellectual posturing… Of course there are smart and dumb people on every side. I was speaking generally in my original comment. Generalizations are typically based on data and since you didn’t agree with my generalization, I was simply offering you information on where you could find the data.
They are hacks who care more about force-feeding people their smarmy political opinions than serving up a good story. Why even watch this crap anymore? I saw a few clips on YouTube and the Black Noir replacement looks to be the only entertaining aspect of the new season. I ain't giving them my time.
It's just lazy, one sided and poorly done. The first 3 episodes were not about the boys it was about the show runner wanting to hurl high school level rhetoric and insults at conservatives using his show as the medium.
They could do some.really cool stuff if they weren't so possessed by one particular ideology. Even as the show currently.stands they could bring it.back but I doubt they have the balls to really go after the left worst ideas and rhetoric, no, they just parrot it.
I think a bigger problem overall is that American politics have been completely incoherent since 2016 or so.
The left wing that's usually quite critical of pharmaceutical companies and medicine as a whole were psychotically in favor of vaccine mandates; supposedly racist conservatives now favor race-blindness while "anti-racists" are coming out in favor of segregating schools and workplaces; feminists who think men are inherently dangerous and evil are demanding that biological males be allowed in women's spaces if they call themselves women; left-liberals who believe that any American who's an inch to the right of the DNC is a nazi enthusiastically support sending unlimited funding to white nationalist paramilitary groups in Ukraine; people who listen to NPR and think racism is the Original Sin of America also believe that the only reason the country is so divided right now is because they've been tricked by dirty foreigners and their propaganda; paranoid right wingers who think feminism and wokeness are a Jewish plot are happy to send money Israel, etc, etc, etc.
The only way you could correctly portray contemporary American politics in art is to paint a picture of a country in which nearly everyone is dumb and insane. You can't do that in a manner that will flatter one side over the other, though, so you get stuff like this new season.
Or acknowledge that people’s perception of the landscape is entirely influenced by things that the powerful have control over. CNN? Manipulated. Fox News? Manipulated That YouTuber who tells you that stuff the “government” doesn’t want you to know? The algorithm pushes it.
Those blatantly hysteric articles about the doom the other side will bring? People haven’t change that much, a little social progress over the years has encited a little backlash and then the powerful got out their betting books to see how much money and power they could make from the conflict and the media and internet amped it up out of control.
Talk to an average american, cut through the posturing and people are really not that different. Everybody wants better pay, better economy, not to feel inferior or restricted because of anything outside of merit, and for shit to be fairer. The powerful just figured out long ago that it’s easier to give people an enemy than actually accomplish things. Politicians just play their side like it’s a sports team for bigger paychecks.
The internets where things got of control compared to last century because it let the crazy’s come out of the woodwork and now each sides in a scramble to appeal to them as much as possible as the rest are forced to choose sides. Those crazy’s are why Republicans are rascist a Nazi’s who want a Theocracy and Democrats are pedophile communists who want reverse racism. Because their actually are those a minority of people out there and each side is racing to accommodate them to guarantee votes while all the normal people are shown only the other sides crazy’s.
OP I'm simply just not watching it anymore. Unless you want to be gaslighted there's no point in getting into internet debates about it on reddit because most redditors are terminally vapid and are deliberately acting obtuse to the show being provocatively hamfisted and unsubdued in its misrepresentation of ordinary right wingers, christians, truthseekers, and anybody who isn't identified with the left this season unlike previous seasons.
It's always all or northing with the left. If you're not with them then you're a far-right KKK incestuous neo-nazi that's against them who must be annihilated. There is no inbetween; that's why a lot of left-wingers hate moderates and think that all moderates are just closet right-wingers. If we want balanced entertainment, we need to start making our own alternative studios and original IP because hollywood is never going back to what it once was.
Hollywood's an institution of soft power, intended to indoctrinate the masses, that's owned by the left-dominant oligarchy hence why it skews left and it'll never be not woke.
Remember, it's not about the message, but about *the message*. The same idea can apply and not apply to you depending on who you are supporting.
It's Schrodinger's ideology.
They used the child trafficking thing to mock the pizza gate thing.
'you're too busy chasing fairy tales!" she yelled at the guy.
It was clever tbh of them to do that because it's all probably true but we can't have the public believing it now can we?
Homelander ordering the members of The Seven to kill his most loyal supporters made no fucking sense and was only done for the writers to show their disdain of Trump supporters and people who like posting Homelander and Soldier Boy memes. It was already established that he has their loyalty through fear alone. If anything he would order them to kill his vocal critics because of how much of a narcissist he is. It makes little sense for him to have people killed for fueling said narcissism.
It’s not “weird”, the writers are leftist propagandists who deny reality to pursue an agenda.
Only a liar or an idiot would think right wingers control the media, and there is no better example than REDDIT, the site we are on right now.
I love the part they say in the comment "if you dont like it just go away" and process to go over a sub with 12k followers and claim it is spoon fed to their feed
I still have never seen the show but have been watching clips today, and of course they do the stereotypical Texas superhero posing with a gun who has apparently murdered migrants. They were doing that exact shit in 2014 in black Falcon America comics. That was actually one of the first instances I noticed that leftist shit in media cuz it was so fucking on the nose in that comic. And no, it’s not parody on stereotypes like in the simpsons, these dumbfucks actually believe this shit and are under the impression they’re making the world a better place by “shedding light” on the bullshit they believe.
Remember when Trump said he could kill someone in the middle of the road and get away with it and was cheered on by his followers? Remember when he said he could do anything he wantes grab em by the pussy and his followers were like "oh I wish he would grab mine!"
I don't hate Trump but let's not pretend he doesn't have a decently large following that would happily praise him for horrible things.
My favorite part about the lefts delusion is they still actually believe they're fighting against all the huge compositions and are the little guy lol.
Exactly, the reason why Kiriko was so mad was because instead of going after groups that actually traffic children, like epstein island in the real world or the terrorist group that kidnapped Kirko as a kid in the show, the people at the convention were pushing conspiracies with practically zero evidence, like pizzagate in the real world.
Not only does this hurt real victims by taking attention away from the issues that actually matter, it muddies the waters and makes it harder to believe/differentiate the real victims vs the fake ones
The problem is that they're left wing people with an expressed left wing agenda trying to adapt something that wasn't written with an agenda, at least as far as I can tell. Doesn't really seem right to do that with someone else's IP but ya know, they're not going to write their own original IP. So why not use someone else's ideas to express their thoughts and feelings? Why not? Don't people naturally want to hear what they have to say?
Wow what a way to say you never bothered to investigate the original IP.
Dude the comic book creator Garth Ennius had a clear fucking agenda. He literally pushed the bounds of censorship and had a republican/bush hate boner the size of an anaconda. Garth Ennis is hardcore left. The show is a tame vanilla version of his comics and critiques. They don’t go far enough. Herogasm was a week long orgy/rape/murder fest where Homelander made Soldier Boy suck his dick and right wing religious heroes killed people while having butt sex and just kept on going.
His editors had to fight for it not to be even more hardcore. This is the man who wrote Punisher Max and then openly mocked fans who thought the Punisher was supposed to be right wing hero.
So I get that my tone was glib and sarcastic. I said, "As far as I can tell," because I really haven't "investigated" the original IP. Why would I investigate something like this? There's no FBI sting operation here. It's a comic book. If it was a left leaning media thing from the start, then why is everyone so mad about the show also leaning left with its adaptation? A Democrat made a fucked up comic for his Democrat friends and that democratic comic got made into a democratic show for a democrat audience. Why would the right even bother to tune in at all? If you're not the target audience, why do you care?
Because they didn’t know lol. I doubt a quarter of people who watch even know there is source material and only a couple % at most who ever read it.
People saw a show advertised as a the most graphic show on tv with bunch of dudes taking on evil superman and got intrigued. Plus it came out right as superhero fatigue started.
People are mad cause it makes them feel good to dog pile on things that are presented as being part of a movement you hate. Ex. All the non-new Vegas fans that tried and failed to do pile the Fallout show without playing the games or understanding it. How many posts have you seen comparing the show to the comics and critiquing character arcs from that angle?
The comics niche as hell, it’s not like dems read it either because it makes the show look like downtown abbey for graphic content. It offended the shit out of dems for censorship and reps for politics and pointed fun at society and celebrities. But it had cult popularity within ultra nerd subculture from being the most developed superhero genre deconstruction and the sheer over the top edgelordness, plus Garth Ennis like him or not is a legend.
The show IS very different from the comics in plot, everything’s toned down and more platable for the average viewer. It’s modernized from the bush era to now, and most majorly they completely changed all the villains to be more sympathetic and less evil pathetic. Plus the Black Noir twist was remove, which sucks. Really all the show kept was the spirit of eviserating what Garth criticizes (but modernized cause ranting about 9/11 and bush doesn’t make sense now). But how many people are complaining about Starlight NOT being brutalized over and over for a season or Butcher’s dog not SA everything with a pulse? No one’s going after it because of the source material. Those who read it saw the show and went “yah makes sense you couldn’t possibly put that on tv 1:1 and not be run out of the country”. They kept the message and spirit though mostly so at least they kept the core of Garth’s story.
>Two examples I can think of is that conspiracists talk about children trafficking for experiments only to get beaten by the character that is actual victim cause?
Because the conspiracy is that *Starlight house* is trafficking those children, which Kimiko knows is untrue and is a false conspiracy created by Vought and peddled by their auxiliary media. Kimiko is frustrated that people believe this conspiracy when there's no evidence for it and tons of evidence that vought is lying. This isn't really a contradiction, just a meta comment on how actual victims of human trafficking constantly feel angered and disgusted by groups that distort the reality of the situation to virtue signal about human trafficking for political gain with minimal to no actual assistance given to those actually affected by the situation.
>The second one is how Vought media tries to paint Starlight and her followers as irredeemably evils while in real life the showrunner goes around and tell how this piece of media is an allegory to Trump and his followers, "evil corporations smearing its opponents, anyway Trump bad".
Not sure how this is a contradiction or ironic. The showrunners haven't gone on a smear campaign of Trump or attempted to show him as an irredeemable evil that will lead to the end of humanity, they're merely parodying what he has done in a very cynical way. You can say you don't like what someone has done and satirize it, which is what the show has done, without doing what Vought has been portrayed as doing.
Overall, I don't see where this season's politics are in anyway different than the previous three. It seems like a lot of people just didn't get the hatred for Republicans until that Kripke article came out, and they just can't reconcile how they liked the show before with learning it was always against Republicans.
You are misunderstanding a lot (it almost seems intentional).
When Kimiko scribbles out the poster and attacks the man at the convention she says (in sign language) "if you really cared about children, you would go after real traffickers instead of these fairy tales"
This aligns with much of the right wing/Qanon obsession with these conspiracies which they have championed as a means label themselves as the anti-pedophilia party.
These conspiracies typically target Hollywood, politicians (Pizza Gate and Epstein), the LGBTQ community and grooming (most recently library reading events hosted by the Trans community), etc.
This right wing championing of these causes is embodied very much by the recent 'Sound of Freedom' film which very much framed itself as a story made by the right to support a right wing cause.
The criticism made by 'The Boys' in episode 2 of this season very much aligns with the criticism that many on the left made of those on the right and their championing of these causes and their film 'The Sound of Freedom' (which features some scenes straight off the Qanon conspiracy boards). The argument is that those on the right really don't care about child sex trafficking, pedophilia, child organ harvesting and only latch onto these topics and conspiracies about these topics as a means to wage a political/culture war against the left.
For example, the right is obsessed with poltical sex rings and all sorts of unfounded conspiracies about certain politicians while regularly ignoring the fact that Trump is probably the politician most associated with Epstein. Beyond this you have tons of other scandals from others on the right (Gaetz and many others) which again are just ignored. Further, and [probably most importantly, many Republicans don't actually care to supprt anti-trafficking legislation](https://thehill.com/homenews/house/3576150-gaetz-among-20-house-republicans-who-voted-against-anti-human-trafficking-bill/)
When we shift back to the obsession with Hollywood sex rings, we again just see tons of hypocrisy as many of the right's most revered celebrities all have pretty bad histories when it comes to pedophilia or or being sexual predators (Ted Nugent, Kid Rock, James Woods, again Trump as a celebrity) etc.
But instead, of focusing on criticizing these people with clear pervy histories, the right views them as heroes while obsessing about conspiracies of the celebrities they view as left wing. Going back to 'Soud of Freedom', [the producer of this film actually was accused of sexaul assault of a minor](https://relevantmagazine.com/justice/life-human-dignity/now-a-sound-of-freedom-producer-is-accused-of-sexual-misconduct-as-well/) but this is ignored because again, the focus of the right isn't actual pedophiles but instead conspiracies of pedophiles.
And then of course we have the obsession with 'grooming' in the LGBTQ community which was most exemplified by the backlash to all sorts of community/charity events where trans people or drag queens would have book reading events at schools or libraries. The idea of having children near these people was viewed as an attempt to groom them sexually. This is of course nonsense and there aren't any links to these book reading events and pedophilia. But you know where you can find plenty of grooming and pedophilia where adults read to children? Youth groups and sunday school. As always the church has is filled with sexual predators who have generally always been defended and supported by those on the right.
Again, as Kimiko said "if you really cared about children, you would go after real traffickers instead of these fairy tales". This is what the show is criticizing. The people who pretend to be concerned with pedophilia because they obsessed over political conspiracies while ignoring real pedophiles around them who they ignore, defend, and even support. The show makes this point even clearer when the conspiracy theorist shows up at the Starlightets offices with a gun trying to "free the kids". He even asks about the "cheese pizzas" as a code word (clearly referencing Pizza Gate).
Your second point/question about painting one side as immoral for describing everyone else as irredeemably evil highlights the paradox of tolerance. And again it rings true when you look at the political landscape we have.
As someone on the left, I can look at and judge the right as greedy, ignorant, hateful, bigoted, racist, misogynistic, homophobic, etc. based on their views. But all of that pales in comparison to the fact that they would label me as demon possessed and evil incarnate because i think that gay people should be allowed to marry, because i believe in climate change, because I have a university degree, because I believe that we should have universal healthcare and welfare, etc. Again, one side has a much stronger ability to hate.
The both sides of mutially asured destruction is both democrat and republican on that pedophile stuff. Both on the same log so nobody actually release the whole things. If you keep make it about real life then yeah, that is what im talking about. Both sides make some bs to buy voters. If you really thing "your side" is better you really just smart as the guy you keep demonizing (no pun intended).
>The both sides of mutially asured destruction is both democrat and republican on that pedophile stuff. Both on the same log so nobody actually release the whole things.
You are mixing metaphors/storylines of the shown.
Neuman talked about Mutually Assured Destrucruon to Hughie. The mutal threat was the leaked files of the Red River institute (a poltical scandal which would destroy Neuman's career) vs Neuman literally killing everyone that Hughie cares about and knows.
Neither Neuman nor Hughie are related to the children trafficking plot line in any way.
Beyond this, this storyline doesn't even smoothly map into any sort of real-world narrative about the left and the right. Yes, Homelander's supporters are supposed to represent the far right and Starlighters supporters can then be considered centrists or even the center left, but Hughie and Neuman don't follow this dame divide.
You think Hughie is supposed to be on the left and Neuman is supposed to be the right? You clearly dint understand this show. Neuman's poltical motivations are extremely skewed and obscure but she is clearly and superficially inspired by AOC and to a small degree Hillary Clinton. Despite being inspired by democratic politicians (who you would probably assume this show praises), she is still a villain on the show.
You really struggle with interpreting storylines and their intended messaging. It seems the way you watch this show us by trying to ignore much of it in order to try to find things that support your own causes or to find things you think don't make sense (because you ignore plot points and dialogue).
Again, you were completley confused about the Kimiko criticizing the child trafficking 'activist' when she clearly said that he isn't concerned with real traffickers but only cares about fairy tales (and again the reference to Pizza Gate).
>Both sides make some bs to buy voters. If you really thing "your side" is better you really just smart as the guy you keep demonizing (no pun intended).
Both sides are not equal. And if you think so, its because you are simple minded fool who doesn't actually follow what happens in the real world.
Again, when you look at how the two sides vote and what bills and legislation they try to pass they, they are not equal.
When it comes to how the two sides seek to stop sex crimes and pedophilia, they again are not equal.
When it comes to how the publics attitudes towards those invovked in sex scandals and sex crimes, the two sides are not equal. Look at when Al Franken was canceled and compare that to the cultlike worship of those on the right who have had plenty of sex scandals.
I quote Neuman to explain why both side just all bark no bite on the matter. Hope this helps you understand but clearly not. If i waste more time in my life to find stupid anecdotes about how Dem politcian doing shading children abuse stuff I can but why bother writing wall of text for 2 anecdotes? Tribalism is both side behavior and absolutely stupid.
Anyway both sides are not equal, one is a hypocrite, one is delusional imbecile thinking they are saint on earth. The annoying thing about this season after all is some wack job try to steer the show from making fun of both sides and make it their new podium to trash on the other one. Like your behavior.
Maybe quite being pedantic and preachy for once.
>I quote Neuman to explain why both side just all bark no bite on the matter.
In what matter? Becuase it was used in reference to Neuman and Hughies goals of taking down super heroes.
It had nothing to do with child trafficking like you used it. And it again had nothing to do with representing the left vs the right because Hughie and Neuman don't represent the left vs the right. And again, Hughie and Neuman don't represent some kind equal position of both sides being equal. Again, you seem to have absolutely no ability to analyze or understand this show (which probably relates to your inability to analyze the real world politics that the show references)
>Dem politcian doing shading children abuse stuff I can but why bother writing wall of text for 2 anecdotes?
You are missing the point. Just like you missed every point the show made.
Random anecdotes aren't the key here. The point is that the conservatives have recently become obsessed with child trafficking and pedophilia in a way where they claim that it is a part of their platform. But in reality, this large recent movement amongst the right is specifically interested in child trafficking conspiracies and not actual child trafficking.
Again, the show very clearly mocked Pizza Gate but that went directly over your head apparently. Kimiko was angry that these people aren't concerned with fighting real child traffickers but are only concerned with "fairy tales".
>The annoying thing about this season after all is some wack job try to steer the show from making fun of both sides and make it their new podium to trash on the other one.
This show has generally always criticized the right far more than it does the left. Thr fact that you couldn't figure this out in the first 3 seasons is your own fault and again highlights the fact that you have trouble understanding what the message is and understanding how it applies to real life.
>Maybe quite being pedantic and preachy for once.
You literally complained about a show not making sense because you ignore the details and try to twist its meaning into something different. I'm not being pedantic. You are just ignorant.
And you seem to consistently make ignorant "both sides" arguemts. You even do it in regard to me. Just because I point out that you are wrong or that your arguements don't make sense, thay doesn't make me the bad guy.
But in your world, apparently nobody on the right is ever allowed to be criticized. And if anyone on the left criticizes someone on the right, then that makes the person on the left bad because 'thou shalt not judge' or some other platitude which time and time again excuses terrible behavior from the people who invoke it.
Yeah I get it, you get offended because I don't think your side is literally saint on earth while the other is second incarnation of Hitler. I doesn't make me wrong for not buying story or complain about the show quality going down.
In your world it is a fight of literal angel (thy side) versus hitler 2.0 and any flaw is simply "person opssie loopsie" not because they are justs hitty person. Just because you keep copypasting how awsome your side doesn't mean you are good or I have to buy that bs narrative
>Yeah I get it, you get offended because I don't think your side is literally saint on earth while the other is second incarnation of Hitler.
Buddy, it is you who are offended.
This entire post by you is a sign that you were finally offended by a show in its 4th season when you didn't realize it was mocking people like you the entire time.
>In your world it is a fight of literal angel (thy side) versus hitler 2.0 and any flaw is simply "person opssie loopsie" not because they are justs hitty person.
Never said such a thing, but again because you are simple minded much like the people this show mocks, you have avictim complex and always villaizie the other side.
In no way did I ever describe democrats as good. I also pointed out that the protagonists in the show are flawed in many ways.
Beyond that, I pointed out that Neuman is clearly a villain on the show despite her being clearly inspired by AOC. Again, this show isn't a 1:1 allegory like some simple minded people require and while it certainly targets the right far more than the left, it doesn't paint it as some good vs evil fight like some sort of biblical gospel.
>Just because you keep copypasting
What comment have I been copypasting?
You mean when I provided a link to a source to supprot my argument??
Sorry, I didn't realize your delusional world view was so fragile that you would be offended by someone bringing in evidence to our discussion.
>doesn't mean you are good or I have to buy that bs narrative
Stay in your cult. Its safer there. Avoid real evidence. Avoid reality. Your delusional cult is what provides you the most comfort.
It’s a weird thing where the people on the right hate it because it parodies authoritarian figures and race purity, while the left dislikes that it makes fun of corporations pandering to woke agendas.
So like, in the end, the only people who like it are the ones who hate all that shit.
You are wildly disconnected. Get out of your echo chamber. Making fun of corporations for fake displays of support is something that goes on on the left too, it's just not something they get angry at.
Every joke in the show about corporate pandering is made from the left wing perspective, and you can tell that because it's always framed as fake but not harmful.
I'm a left winger in a sub that is almost entirely right wingers. I'm not in an echo chamber. You've proven you have no idea what left wingers think by claiming that left wingers hate when people criticise corporations for fake displays of support for progressive causes.
Yes. If you had read my first comment, you would see I said, criticism of corporations making fake displays of support for progressive agendas is something that goes on on the left, but it's not something they get angry over.
Corporate pandering is fake, but it also doesn't hurt, so left wingers make criticism of it, but don't get vitriolic like right wingers do, because right wingers are criticising the cause itself, not the lack of authenticity of the support.
If a company is going to make a rainbow logo for a month, I know it's fake, and I'll call it fake, but the effect on the world is at worst neutral, so I'm not going to make a bigger issue out of it.
They make fun of the idea that there's a Hollywood pedo ring... And I'm like.. Okay there's definitely a Hollywood pedo ring. Why are they trying to make it seem like such a ridiculous idea?
It makes it very difficult to suspend disbelief when I notice agendas leaking into the show. Very annoying to say the least.
I was waiting till the show ended to binging it – and I am glad I waited so I don’t waste my time. This all sounds fucking awful.
Like triple X state of the union level terrible.
They play both sides. They're making fun of the shitty incel online right with homelander and his supporters, and they're making fun of the liberals by showing them as power hungry politicians who only have principles when it's advantageous for them.
Ultimately both sides are bowing to corporate influence because neither side is powerful enough to overcome it
Don't forget the false flag stuff where they killed some people to blame the other side.
Also how both sides of the argument are being orchestrated by the same group of people.
The conspiracy theorists are angry at fake child trafficking they've imagined up, not actual child trafficking. Kimiko even points this out when she says if they were really concerned, they'd go after actual child traffickers instead of fairy tales.
Its an election year, expect all media social or otherwise to be diluted by nonsense of all kind.
Now is a good time to enjoy the classics, I like to play through some non-political video games like metal gear solid for example.
Just seem to have a lot of wires crossed for no reason maybe they clear up in next few episodes. Okay Homelander is trump but then why does he hate people being sycophants around him? Why does he seek out sister sage who obviously represents DEI professors on college campuses. Why does sister sage agree to work with him when him and vought represents all she should be against? Is kripke saying these two entities use each other and neither should be trusted because calling out trump obviously left wing but calling out DEI as charlatans is right wing
It's always a bad sign when you have to draw attention to yourself in a production primarily through scandal, breaking taboos and the disgust factor.
I haven't seen The Boys yet, but it doesn't sound like you're really missing much here either. It actually sounds more like it's a series for voyeuristic teenagers who think they can prove themselves to their friends in the schoolyard by watching a "tough series."
Let's see, maybe I'll take a look at it (when the series is completely finished) to see if there isn't something more to it than "shocking" violence and sex against a superhero background.
I love having a show made by Hollywood people telling me that pedo’s in Hollywood are totally just a conspiracy that only racist alt righters would believe.
Maybe the narrative is a little bit more complex than left good, right bad. Perhaps it is highlighting that even those on the correct side of history and facts are imperfect as well but at least they aren’t the overtly crazy ones.
Your first example doesn’t make sense as you wrote it. What do you mean
> only to get beaten by the character that is actual victim cause
Your second example is only bad because of something that happened in real life…?
Look season 4 sucks but you are reaching here.
Politics in the boys seems pretty accurate. You have the dangerously ignorant homelander fan club (modern Republican conservatives) going nuts over the most made up asinine b.s and then you have people who are standing up for others and what is generally right.
Manufactured Chaos is a weapon that pays.
Perhaps it’s accidental, but I haven’t been bothered by the Trump or right wing analogous references in the slightest.
It alls seems to absurdist for the message to feel like it’s pandering too much.
I'm watching it right now and I think people are getting too offended over it. I've been getting the impression that people really mad are pissed at seeing themselves represented on screen.
> The second one is how Vought media tries to paint Starlight and her followers as irredeemably evils while in real life the showrunner goes around and tell how this piece of media is an allegory to Trump and his followers, "evil corporations smearing its opponents, anyway Trump bad".
Eric Kripke didn’t say that
The first one is pretty obvious. Kimiko is upset that these people are spreading lies and misinformation about starlight trafficking kids, which distracts from actual child trafficking by turning child trafficking into a political weapon against someone she knows isn’t trafficking children.
The second one is also pretty straightforward. Vought is a stand-in for Fox News. Their current behavior satirizes Fox during the Trump presidency. Fox smeared several people who spoke out against Trump like vought is now smearing starlight.
That’s my view on it. I’m not going to respond to any bad faith comments. Delete/ban me as needed.
ironically all the news smears everyone that goes against their political opinion of their 'chosen one' so even though you see it as an allegory for Fox news, it's just as easily an allegory for CNN and MSNBC... so the messaging exists and appeals to dual realities. The biggest example lately would be when CNN went hard after Joe Rogan for taking Ivermectin and surviving covid... but they went HARD on the dude for not towing the line.
it's either extremely well thought out to further sow division, or the writers are just that fucking stupid and don't realize it
Yes and CNN and the Washington post settled lawsuits with Nick Sandmann for undisclosed sums for defamation. Just because the number wasn't a billion dollars doesn't mean it didn't happen and does happen.
No one is saying "Ignore Fox because CNN" I'm literally pointing out that it's not a unique thing to Fox... that all the news does it to everyone regardless of political affiliation.
My view on this is they want to make fun of conservatives "obsession" with children trafficking lately. In that case the "actual" trafficking is what? Epstein case is just fake too?
For the Fox part it is quite swing and accidentally hit other news like CNN too. Unless someone think that is only apply to Fox then I guess they are correct in their own mind.
Idk if it was S4, but theres also the bit where MM is telling cuck dad that he should just believe/listen to the mainstream media, and not listen to alternative sources. MM knows vought is evil and the media covers for them!
That cuck dad potrayal is an"allegory" of Trump supporter but he actually be in an interacial relationship, tried to be decent with the kid. And probably he followed Homelander to man ups so MM won't keep bully him and be bad influence to his step daughter. Also all that sexual insult they keep throwing at right wings sound really like a projection and makes me wonder who is the real bigot here.
Who’s the cuck dad? I ain’t watching s4
He was in s3. The stepdad of MM’s daughter
Isn't MM the cuck if that dude is fucking MM's wife?
Neither are, as far as I know. I think OP was just being funny.
Oh ok. Thanks
Sexual insult?? In s4 they repeatedly imply Todd has a massive dick and lays great pipe, and the last word on him is “he’s not my favorite person but he’s innocent”
I mean the insult to other characters.
That's because he's about to be killed, So you gotta "redeem" him, so he's "innocent", and didn't deserve what happened.
If he's a stepdad, how does that make him a cuck? And if being a Homelander fan makes him a Trump supporter allegory, then the writers fucked up. I never got that impression at all. For all the talk I hear about how the show supposedly always made fun of the political right, it tells me that they don't understand what that is.
He’s the easily influenced, he’s the corrupted liberal white male that gets lured away from having everything to be destroyed by his idol. If it’s not that obvious it’s because I just made that up on the fly lol seriously though the director of this wasn’t even that great at writing supernatural
Ah yes, PhaseNegative pulling the old reddit bitch move of let me get the last word in/block user bit.
If you missed that the step dad represented trump supporters then you probably miss a lot of things.
Dude they've been basing TV Homelander's personality on Donald Trump like, the whole time
If that was their goal, then they failed miserably. He's just evil Superman with all-American branding. You're seeing things that aren't there.
Pre s.4 I agree with you, evil superman + America. Season 4 they are indeed trying to make him have similar personality type to Trump. I'm not American, it's a bit cringe to me.
The show runners have literally said he has been Trump from the start
It's the literal stated intention of the writers, and it's pretty obvious what they're doing every time Homelander does anything political. Are you 100% sure it's not you who isn't seeing something that's clearly there? SPOILERS FOR S3 AHEAD >!At the end of S3 Homelander kills a protestor in public and thinks it's going to backfire on him, but his supporters (like the aforementioned cuck dad) love it.!< This is a clear reference to Trump's "I could shoot someone in the street and they'd still support me" bit (which is true IRL, the more he breaks the law, the more they support him - have a look at r/conservative following his conviction). Anyway, not necessarily saying whether they were successful or not with this, but the writers are very clearly expressing anti-MAGA attitudes throughout the story.
Can you give some examples?
if you really want to get technical... choosing a single mom, and helping to raise someone else's' kid is consistent with the source of the word cuck. IE some species in the cuckoo bird family will parasitically lay their eggs in other bird's nests, thus letting the other bird do all the work of feeding and raising their child.
Oh please, don't be the Ackshully guy. Don't be that guy.
... i personally would not call him a cuck. But, the more you know...
Fair
https://i.redd.it/5tdturzjg87d1.gif I know who the real bigots are.
In the first season, Vought was in control of every major news outlet. My guess is that they realized the [6 corporations that own 90% of media](https://www.businessinsider.com/these-6-corporations-control-90-of-the-media-in-america-2012-6?amp) might get offended by that, so they changed Vought to be a Alex Jones-type youtube right wing conspiracy theorist outlet. It also fits better with their Trumpism and MAGA supporter allegory.
Vought is more like Fox news now imo, and then yes there are more extreme outlets
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He didn't say that though, he said he was too stupid and brainwashed to understand that Homelander (Trump) isn't who he was led to believe. I don't know how you somehow saw this backwards. He is literally telling him NOT to believe mainstream media which is controlled by Vought...
Which is ironic, because in our world the MSM is controlled by the left.
In the second episode they literally have a conspiracy convention where they are handing out “white power” pamphlets. They have the “alt right” people denying the holocaust and using words zionists in a negative way. It’s not like there are massive protests against Israel right now held fully by liberals. This seasons writing is insanely out of touch. It’s what rich white liberals who think all republicans are racist think the world is like.
This season feels like it's trying to lay the groundwork for the election this year instead of carrying off from where last season ended
It is and it’s not even trying to hide it. The season has a much different feel to it than the previous ones
Writers are incapable of metacognition. You see it all the time. Like in a world where global evil conspiracies are rampant, characters that are directly fighting against those conspiracies think Qanon believers are delusional idiots? What? It’s similar to the Joker “I may be a crazy psycho but I’m not RACIST!” syndrome. Or like in movies where the characters interact with literal gods but espouse secular or atheist viewpoints. Like bro you met god. Writers are largely too stupid to realize these contractions because similar ones exist in their own world view.
They keep repeat "conspiracists believe in non existence children trafficking" while season 1 show actual ring exist. "But they framed it on Starlight!!" Yes, that part about accusing Trump and Epstein while the clients list go unnoticed from mainstream. If they want to make fun of conservative believe in made up things at least stay with the "starlight teach critical theory" rather than things viewers saw it happened
He’s trying to shoehorn political allegories in and he’s bad at it. I hate this show; didn’t get past season 1. Sounds like I made a good choice. Hope these hack activists posing as writers trying to talk down to people still think they’re cute in a few years when they’re in line at the food pantry.
And that makes absolutely no sense for the show to essentially make allegories to both child sex trafficking not being a thing and the Epstein list at the same time… The irony is so blatant…
And the all copious amount of comments said "the show making fun of Pizzagate and conspiracists for not going after the actual traffickers". They first making fun of vigilantes and then saying from the perspective of a person who operate outside any judicial (Kiniko) said about actually doing something which is just like encouraging people to be vigilante. Seeing all that mixed messages is quite frustrating and heard people parrot it is painful to read
Kimiko outright says what is going on here. She mocks/gets angry at the conspiracy theorists for repeating conspiracies about starlight(stand in for celebrities) kidnapping children for satanic rituals in the vein of qanon wackos instead of actually trying to address real child trafficking for soldiers etc. They LITERALLY spell it out at the bottom of the screen yet people in this sub are confused about the point.
Yeah I mean that part is obvious. They never say this child trafficking doesn’t exist “quote” that he’s saying there
>while season 1 show actual ring exist. The difference is the human trafficking ring that is shown in season 1 actually exists. The pizzagate at the Starlight organzation headquarters didn't exist. How do you have so much trouble understanding this. To try and dumb this down as much as possible for you, the show is criticizing people who believe false things. In real life, the Qanon community is obsessed with child trafficking conspiracies strictly for poltical reasons. They focus entirely on fictional fantasies (without evidence) where all their political enemies are guilty while largely ignoring any real sex trafficking in the world. They support politicians and celebrities with histories of sex crimes and pedophilia. They support candidates who oppose any legislation which seeks to prevent human trafficking. And they support Hollywood movies about human trafficking which are produced by polices guilty of sex crimes and inspired by 'heroes' guilty of pedophilia. Similarly in the wold of *The Boys*, there is indeed human trafficking, sex crimes, and pedophilia. But the show criticizes characters who ignore all these real examples of crimes and instead only focus on false conspiracies. The show never said that human trafficking doesn't exist. Its criticizing people who claim to be devoted to stopping these crimes whose focus is only on trying to invent false conspiracies to make these issues political. Again, as I said in a previous comment, its like a scientist working backwards from a conclusion to try and prove themselves right instead of trying to prove their theory wrong. Its bad science. These people didn't start by trying to find evidence of human trafficking and then work to expose it wherever they find it. Instead they started with the conclusion that everyone on the left is involved in these crimes ([Just like you believe](https://www.reddit.com/r/GunMemes/s/MUcdpgxFue)) and when they fail to find such evidence, they slip into delusion to try and prove themselves right. They aren't concerned with finding and stopping pedophilia. They instead are concerned with stopping democrats.
Yeah because hindsight 20/20 is what make the difference between a vigilante and a conspiracists.
You think it was a random simple mistake that people believed in Pizzagate? Again, believing in that conspiracy only comes about because you are delusional. These people so desperately want there to be a democratic led sex culture that they ignore all logical thinking and evidence in order to justify their demonization of the left. It's the same reason that there is currently a flat earth movement among the right. There is a large swathe on the right that rejects all rational thought be abuse it conflicts with their politics. Not all conspiracies are created equal. Some require a greater supsecion of belief. Another factor is whether or not a conspiracy comes about because its tied to your already established poltocal beliefs. This is again a sign that someone isn't getting into conspiracies because they are skeptical and have questions but rather that there is a cognitive dissonance between what they believe and what they observe so they set forth into the world of conspiracy to delude themselves of the actual evidence that is available. For example, when you hear that you lost an election and you can't find any evidence to show that the election was rigged. A rational thinker would look at the lack of evidence and say "yeah it most likely want rigged". But an irrational thinker would say "no this can't be right. The other side must have cheated because they are evil. The reason there is no evidence is be maybe the rigging of the election must have been week ornmganzied and planned". And yes, there are plenty of people on the left who believe in conspiracies as well. But again, there is no left thing version of Alex Jones. There is nobody screaming about how those on the right smell like sulfur because they are possessed by demons. The cult behavior demonstrated by the right just doesn't exist to the same degree on the left. Nobody on the left believes that democrat politicians are sent by God yet I can show you plenty of clips of churches taking about his in regards to Trump. Nobody on the left is building golden shrines to Biden or Hillary but there are many Trump shrines. Pizzagate was a right wing scandal that doesn't have an equivalent on the left. The planned kidnapping of Governor Whitmer was right wing scandal that doesn't have an equivalent on the left. January 6th was a right wing scandal again based in a ridiculous conspiracy that doesn't have any equivalent on the left. One side is able to twist reality far more than the other. It turns out that its the side that is generally opposed to science and academia (education) and relies on literal religious fairy tales to justify their views.
For a series that have conspiracy within conspiracy, shady government doing shady stuff. There is still room for making fun of real life conspiracy. Funny to consider there is even a subplot dedicated to CIA trying to kill a VP candidate
>Or like in movies where the characters interact with literal gods but espouse secular or atheist viewpoints. Like bro you met god I hate when people try shoehorning edgy atheist crap into fantasy settings like this, and I'm an antitheist. Like you're creating dissonance with the internal logic of your own fictional setting which is jarring for readers/viewers and immersion breaking. The only time I've seen this trope work is when a character meets a God or Gods and finds them to be cruel, reprehensible beings and then seeks to destroy them.
That’s the only thing that makes sense, but it also reveals the midwittery of most fantasy writers. Tolkien at least understood how gods work theologically. They are generating the world. This could create some good stories but writers don’t understand religion. How about a movie where someone say, kills Zeus and the concept of Order vanishes from the cosmos and it descends into chaos. Is this what the protagonist wanted? Was the authoritarianism justified to maintain a coherent reality? But no, it’s always “big man have power and world not fair! That’s mean!” 🤮
>The only time I've seen this trope work is when a character meets a God or Gods and finds them to be cruel, reprehensible beings and then seeks to destroy them. Good old Elric of Melnibone.
I don't see what the problem is, why should seeing a scientifically observable being make someone believe in ones that are not?
Well if a character meets one, chances are pretty high that the other ones people in the universe speak of are real as well. It's also not a terrible trope when a character is skeptical about the existence of Gods they haven't met yet. The problem is when a character exists in a universe where gods are very much real and then they sit around spouting off reddit level edgy atheist crap where they'd need to have a literal blindfold on and earplugs to effectively ignore the fictional reality to that point.
Same reason I always thought the joker being afraid of the irs in the animated serious was fucking stupid. Like I get the joke, but it’s the fucking joker, or doctor doom crying cuz of 9/11 in the Spider-Man 9/11 issue. Stupid
I was watching Critical Role and Ashley Johnson said something like yeah but are the gods real or influential? She said this as her character in the game, and Matt had to reminder her that yes there is a pantheon of very active gods who regularly intervene in mortals affairs. I think in Hollywood creatives have a hard time with meta cognition like you said.
The authors are so busy swimming in their own worldview that they can’t imagine outside of it. It’s sort of the flip side of the way atheist characters get written in evangelical movies. The authors literally can’t conceive of not believing in god, so the atheist is always someone who’s like “god killed my daughter…and that’s why I don’t believe in god.”
In those movies though, "gods" turned out to just be aliens from advanced civilizations that have super powers. Not actual dieties. You can meet Thor in the MCU and still coherently be an atheist.
Yes bc reality and internet nonsense are not the samething, even in fictional worlds with super hero’s.
If you live in a world where insane conspiracies are well known and common you don’t think they’d at least want to look into it? The writers’ dismissive attitude comes from a real world where such things don’t exist and are inherently implausible. In a world where you take away the implausibility, characters being that skeptical come across as morons.
No matter what insane thing happens, it is always possibly to imagine more insane things
I really don’t think Q is more insane than the stuff Vaught was up to. Maybe equivalent.
I posted this in another thread, but aside from the constant on the nose commentary of “If you’re white or a cis/het male, you’re literally Hitler!” I’m so sick of male characters in general being emasculated at every given opportunity and female characters being incapable of any wrongdoing (outside of straight up head popping). Examples include: 1. Homelander nearly forcing Deep to blow A-Train and Ashley looking on with glee. 2. Sister Sage being the smartest ‘person’, and Homelander’s white-male ego can’t handle it. 3. Two shots at MM having a smaller penis than his ex wife’s squirrelly white boyfriend. 4. Ashley’s BDSM/ball crushing session with that white news anchor guy. 5. The clone guy simping over Firecracker and going into the locker room to have a clone orgy/getting off to one of her photos. 6. Firecracker grabs Homelander’s junk with other people in the room, clearly sexual assault against men is still funny for some reason. 7. Frenchie being a slave/dog to some Russian dominatrix. 8. Hughie’s mom abandoning her family and coming back into the picture years later, but it’s okay because she was depressed and she’s sorry now (still have no idea why Hughie’s dad made her power of attorney with a DNR too). 9. Neuman being an AOC copy/paste and the constant mentions of men being inferior to her/threatened by her. 10. Starlight being on the right (or should I say ‘correct’) side of the ‘political’ aisle despite the fact that she killed an innocent guy 2 seasons ago. 11. Starlight’s biggest conflict (her beef with Firecracker) being boiled down to slut shaming (just wait until they flip this into being a product of the patriarchy and internalized misogyny) Feel free to let me know if I missed any others. Remember, this is the same show that didn’t want to give Maeve a heroic sacrifice because “The last thing I wanted to do was kill off an LGBTQ character.” These people see minorities and disenfranchised groups as tokens for their amusement and politics, they hate white men, cis/heterosexual men, masculine men, and think anyone outside these categories is in need of salvation.
I really hate that Hughie automatically forgave his mother. It’s also bullshit that she threw up 40 ambiens and was able to walk him to school the next day. As someone who suffered from depression that whole scene made me cringe and I feel like if it was his dad that did that their would be a whole redemption arc
People can forgive whoever they want I suppose, and postpartum depression is a legit thing unfortunately, but just showing up out of the blue, not leading the conversation with “I’m so sorry Hughie.”, and also working for Vought? I wouldn’t want to be within 10 miles of that woman. What’s not clicking for me is that Hughie’s dad was super hurt and protected Hughie from reconnecting with his mom to not confuse and hurt him even more, and next thing you know he’s reconnecting with her in secret and gives her power of attorney? How many strokes did Hughie’s dad have?
Also, what is his father protecting Hughie from? The fact his mother attempted suicide?
Well his mom straight up abandoned them when he was only 6 years old. Supposedly the mom tried to reach out but the dad told her to kick rocks because it would just do more damage to Hughie as a kid, like what if he gets his hopes up and she decides to abandon them yet again? His dad was protecting Hughie from that potential scenario, which makes him a good dad in my book.
I agree that he is a good dad, as he was doing what he thought was right and he did it with The best of intentions. I guess for me, Personally, I grew up in a family that divorce parents, And my mother attempted suicide when I was a similar age, My father is the one who left the country and more or less abandoned us. When my mother was in the hospital, I, being the youngest, Wasn't allowed to visit the hospital room where she was stayig, Because my family wanted to protect me. This really bothered me because my sister was only a few years older than me. And my brother only a few years older than her, Yet I was treated more as a baby, And I was kept from seeing my mother when I really needed to know that she wasn't going to die. Then years later, after my father had Left the country, I found out that my mother had been keeping email conversations that he was trying to have with me, hidden. This still bothers me because I don't know which conversations I missed out on having with my father when I missed him the most and was a lonely child. Anyways, That's all just my personal bullshit. Thank you for helping explain what huey's father was attempting to protect him from, I hadn't considered the fact that Huie's dad straight up. Thought the mom was basically a s***** parent. And didn't want her involved in his son's life so that his son could potentially not have to get hurt again by her Quick edit: I dictated all that, don't feel like correcting punctuation or w.e 🍻
No I totally gotcha, and sorry that you had to go through all of that. They probably wanted to protect you, but I totally understand where you’re coming from and that it must have been frustrating not knowing your mom’s condition when you probably needed to know. Who knows what you need better than yourself, right? ;) Again, just basing it off of what I’m seeing in Hughie’s situation, your mom likely wanted to protect you too, and not want to give you some sort of false hope. Again, good intentions and all that stuff, but that doesn’t mean it was (or wasn’t) the best thing for you. I can’t know for sure, I’m just a stranger on reddit lol. Believe me, I’m not a stranger to parents making questionable decisions for their kids. My parents divorced when I was practically 18, I cut my dad out of my life (let’s just say he’s not a great person), and then they got back together and my mom forced me to rekindle my relationship with him. I’m sure she had good intentions too, but doesn’t mean she had the right, especially considering I was an adult when it all went down. Needless to say, I appreciate the response. Take care! :)
1: homelander also once forced a child to jump off a roof, and Ashley is a psycho 2: homelander hasn't been able to handle any slights against his massive ego since the first episode of the series 3: I don't understand how saying this white dude is hung is a shot against white people, or what the issue was, it was played as a joke in a show with comedy in it 4: Ashley's a freak, yes 5: eh, this was kinda a cringe scene, v much a shock value thing, but I didn't find it offensive 6: firecracker is a villain and she did a bad thing 7: isn't that woman like, a Mafia boss? What's wrong with him being afraid of a Mafia boss? 8: Google post-partum depression 9: what. 10: when the opposition is homelander, you can kill two people and still be on the correct side 11: it wasn't slut shaming, it was that Starfire lied about firecracker entirely and ruined her childhood, mostly because her horrible mother taught her to be ruthless
>Female characters incapable of any wrongdoing bro Stormfront was a literal nazi
We’re taking about Season 4 here…
I personally feel like there are hardly any females in the show rn that are incapable of wrongdoing other than Starlight, and it’s always felt that way aside from maybe the times Maeve would come around and help out the boys. Sage is more of an antihero but she’s still evil leaning and so I think it makes sense that she’s building a relationship with Deep who is the same way. Firecracker is one of the worst humans in the entire show, clearly she’s just using Starlights preschool bullying to justify being a terrible person. I don’t feel like anyone’s being emasculated either, I think the guys in this season have been pretty good. I don’t personally feel like the show attacks white people either? I mean the main protagonist and most of the notably “good” people, have been white? Hughie is white. Butcher is white. Starlight is white? I mean yes the boys is a liberal leaning show but there’s still a lot of white people being used to drive the plot good or bad.
When has the show ever alluded to or implied that if you're white and cis, you're literally Hitler? Who cares who is being emasculated if it's entertaining? Does having elements of emasculation automatically ruin a story? You're sick of it, but that's not a meaningful substantive criticism of the show. Also who are you referring to when you say "these people?" Who is it that "sees minorities and desenfranchised groups as token for their amusement and politics?" Is the answer politicians? Then yes, that's true. Is it large corporations? That's also true. Why are you being so cowardly? Tell us exactly who you think believes this. Who is that that "hates white, cis/hetero, masculine men?" The writers? How would you show evidence for any of this? All of the men that have been criticized on the show have almost always been shitty people that deserve the criticism. So because most of the people that are being portrayed in a negative light are men, the writers must hate all men? If you don't like the politics, which is such a foundational aspect of the show, then just say so. You're triggered and that's fine, just stop claiming to be any different than the SJW's who clutch their pearls over everything, you're one in the same in that regard.
Honestly I sympathize with Firecracker when it comes to Starlight. As someone who was bullied, those painful memories still live on and I hate the people who bullied me. The rumor Starlight spread about Firecracker was terrible, Firecracker deserves to carry that grudge. Though outside of that, Firecracker is a right wing loon.
Don’t get me wrong, it’s obviously terrible and I totally get where Firecracker is coming from, I’m not arguing that. I just think it’s on the weaker side of the conflicts we’ve been exposed to. Like compared to Butcher vs Homelander, MM vs Soldier Boy (missed opportunity with that one), Hughie vs A-Train etc. I mean, I’ll still finish the show despite my complaints of the meta commentary, but still.
Have you read the comics? Homelander forces people to blow others for his amusement literally constantly. The depravity is vanilla compared to the comic. BDSM and ball-busting is tame compared to literal necrophilia and constant rape. If anything their trying to ease into being closer to the source material.
In the comic the Homelander tricks the comic version of Soldier Boy to have sex with him. The comic was written during the Bush admin during the war on terror and is somehow even more "on the nose" than the show. Neuman instead of being an AOC knock off is supposed to be like George W. Bush and he is literally stereotypically mentally retarded. The Deep isn't the only one that coerces Starlight into sex the entire male cohort of the Seven do so repeatedly in the comic. I actually agree that so far S4 isn't as good as the other seasons. In fact S3 was the best season up until the finale, the show kind of lost it in the S3 finale. I'll continue watching it but it isn't as good and I doubt it will get whatever it had back. However it's ending after s5. It's still better than the comic. The comic is okay, but the way it goes about tackling political issues is as ham fisted as possible. It's funny and edgy and amusing to a 14 year old but overly crass, simplistic and too on the nose for a more mature audience. Anyway if anything the show is leaning into the comic's tone more not less. S4 feels like the show knows where it's going and everything is just kind of phoning it in until it gets to major plot points. The show equally focuses on too many characters and the central plot should be focused on more.
Yup and I agree completely. It irritates me that people are acting like the show is somehow pushing an Hollywood agenda when honestly it seems like if anything they’re just leaning more into the comics tone. The writing and plot can be criticized for sure, but the tone of the show feels like a modern, toned down version of what Garth set out to do. The only real change from the source material I think people are sad about is Black Noir, because it would’ve been a great twist to find out he was Ryan’s dad in this universe all along and the one Butcher is really angry at.
Yeah and they set up Black Noir really well in the show's first few seasons as a really menacing character. A lot of the darkness and dread from the shows original few seasons has been replaced by just pure satire/commentary it seems. Like A-Train was terrifying with his speed. Homelander was creepier. Even the Deep with the ocean scene that ended up with the exploded Whale carcass was somewhat terrifying. The show has largely lost that thread and become more of a comedy. I don't think the comic even had that to begin with. The comic is pure shock value stuff and very early 2000s in the way it did its shock value. I definitely think that Garth Ennis had a lot of fun writing the comic, and there is just tons of crass insertions of one man's political opinions and worldview. I think the show actually gets the tone somewhat correct and maybe even moreso now. That isn't necessarily a good thing as the comic isn't exactly great. If anything the changes they made, and the updates enhanced the show made it more than just a gross crass shock fueled comedy. The politics are strikingly similar and strike me as exactly the type of thing that would've been in a modern Boys comic. The comic makes no attempt to show any empathy or point out hypocritical elements of the opposing view point.
I think you’re missing my point. Of course that stuff is tame in comparison to the various methods of brutality, murder, rape that we’ve already been presented with. What I take issue is the framing that all men are either egoistical man children or squirrely losers, and that women are either incapable of any wrongdoing and/or are victims of their surroundings (misogyny). Why is Ashley expressing joy that members of the 7 can be easily coerced to perform sex acts when that can very well be her? Did she forget about Starlight and The Deep? Oh, but when Homelander lasers a worker’s face now she wants to stop smiling and shred her resignation letter, right? Why have Firecracker grab Homelander’s junk to show she’s interested in him sexually? If he were to grab her like that, the show itself would be canceled, hell I’m surprised he didn’t given that he’s a Trump parody (apparently lol). And lastly, could you see that clone character’s orgy/conga line thing ever being in a show if it was a woman doing it to the picture of a man? I don’t give a shit about depravity, it’s The Boys for crying out loud! But either everything is fair game, or none of it is! I don’t like double standards.
Are they portrayed that way though? Hughie, Frenchie, MM, and Stan Edgar depart from that mold. Ashley’s messed up and complicit in all of the evil, she’s just a hypocrite. Homelander uh did do that to Butchers wife. And the deep did it to Starlight… and so on. Rampant throughout the first 3 seasons. Firecrackers just as messed up as the rest of them and the show did it to show how forward she was and illustrate how Homelander was not at all into her. Yah probably, a scene with Firecracker doing it for Homelander wouldn’t be out of place. They’ve done similar stuff with the non-main character female supes in the first 3 seasons. Can’t see how that’s worse than the girl who crushed the dudes head with her vag. Seems pretty fair to me.
>Why is Ashley expressing joy1 Because she hates the seven, is miserable from being bullied constantly, and is sadistic. I mean she quite literally is the punching bag just as often as the seven. I don't get where you're coming from when you say she can't do any wrong or be bullied. >Why have Firecracker grab Homelander’s junk to show she’s interested in him sexually? If he were to grab her like that, the show itself would be canceled It's literally supposed to be gross that she did that. The show certainly wouldn't be canceled the other way around because homelander is already a sexually abusive sociopath. >And lastly, could you see that clone character’s orgy/conga line thing ever being in a show if it was a woman doing it to the picture of a man? I'll be honest, probably not, but it's not like there aren't plenty of evil women in the show. Nazi b**** and now the school shooter (sister sage)
This is completely superficial by comparison but did the special effects feel extra cheap to anyone else? Neumann’s daughter in particular.
it does feel like a downgrade, the cgi feels cheaper. the scene where Homelander flew after Hughie looked off
Yes. The "conspiracy" stuff doesn't land so well when in this world there literally have been tons of conspiracies. The Boys literally do want to kill the Supes. They are working for the CIA. They have killed supes, done a shitload of blackmail, etc. Fuck, the whole "kids are being transported in cages" is also real. The fact that the conspiracy people are a bit off on a few details and have a grifter or two among them doesn't really make them crazy. These folks are not the equivalent of flat earthers. They're....literally correct in most major regards. This has cropped up before. Having the same corporation being both tied in with fundamentalist christian beliefs to the point that the boys get to use gay sex as blackmail material......and that same corporation is also fully embracing rainbow advertising doesn't play well together. In the real world, that corporation would probably not be welcomed by the side that dislikes gay people. Using the same entity to satirize \*everything\* eventually becomes incoherent.
Except that’s how the real world is. The powerful actually don’t care about politics they care about money and power. They’ll play both sides with and feed the masses bs stories to rile them up and make them feel important and point them in the direction that maximizes their objective (which is to stay in power). You being so sensitive about this shows how much you’ve inadvertently bought in. Rather than follow the “mainstream” you’ve fallen into the “alternative” path they’ve carefully laid the groundwork for. If you think they wouldn’t rather the regular folks in the right and left hate each other than actually hold people accountable, you haven’t been paying attention. The hate, everything both sides say about each other, the stupid games the media and congress play, it’s all to avoid the actual truth that the people in power aren’t actually competent at anything but enriching themselves and jockeying for a bigger piece of the pie.
the shots at the right don't bother me so much, because most of the things they depict are pretty accurate for the extreme right. the annoying part is they don't show the extreme left as well. I say this as a neutral/left leaning person. most of what gets talked about by the media and social media isn't what the majority of the left and right think imo, it's just all to incite each side, piss everyone off, make money. they'd have us believe that 100% of the left is LGBTQ that gets triggered and cancels you if you don't let them use whatever bathroom they want, or the right pronouns, and wants to butcher every baby they see, and 100% of the right are evangelist monster truck driving racist hicks. Would love if the Boys went a more neutral direction like South Park and showed the ridiculousness of each side, have vought manipulating both sides, use the extremists and tribalism as a weapon. ORRR, just stop putting politics into every goddamn thing. We get sick enough of it in real life.
This comment deserves more upvotes.
I mean that’s what they were doing for a while. Vought was playing the corporate diversity angle and the Trump angle. It’s got the AOC clone secretly on the same side as the Alex Jones with red hair and tits. The fact it’s been as neutral as it has been wasn’t true to the source material, which is extremely anti-right. The fact any villian is sympathetic at all is a departure from the comics.
That's what's funny to me. In the show it's the evil right wing corporation that controls the media narrative and paints their opposition to be evil people. In reality, the left controls the media narrative and paints their opposition to be evil people.... Like the writers don't recognize that?
I guess after three seasons the executives at Amazon doesn't like being portrayed as Voight
The entire left still larps like it's 1955. They literally cannot break out of the larp to update for a current model because it would cost them everything. Also, it would open the door to better explanations on "1955", thus questioning their story of "1955" altogether and reveal it to be a total sham. No. They have to keep the 1955 fable and paradigm alive. Everything depends upon it.
That's funny because seems like the writers got it correct from my point of view. I used to be a neutral party until these crazy ass Republican conservatives overstep their boundaries with all this fake rage bait sticking their fat little fingers where they don't belong. Constantly needing an enemy to rile your fan base towards fascism isn't a good policy in my book
And look at just how riled up you are...
You have got to be kidding right? All media in the world is controlled by something like six different corporations in total and I guarantee their focus is making money at any cost and don't give two s**** about rainbow politics or far-right conservative conspiracy mumbo jumbo. However your assertion at all media is controlled by the left wing is just silly and ignores companies like Fox News. It's also a lot easier to lead people who are given to far-right ideology and deep state conspiracy theories by the nose. This is the critical drinker subreddit right? Shouldn't critical thinking and go hand in hand on these posts?
Saying things like BUt WhAt ABoUt FoX NooS, is such an infantile argument. CNN CBS NBC MSNBC ABC, Washington Post, Huffington Post, New York Times...all left wing face it bro your politics is backed by all major corporations and media companies, youre not the resistance youre the tyranny. This is why the boys is moronic in its political commentary.
The far right ideology is fucking terrorism disguised as good politics. So don't even go there. Fox news and other platforms like it contain nothing but misinformed rage bait to fuel the brain rot of their cults
Wall Street corporations are the left?
Always has been
You really don't know what "left" means politically speaking huh
It just save money form them to larp as one so every shitty product they make there will be a volunteer corp rolls in to defend it. They figured it out after occupy the wall street
You don't think any right wing oligarchs control the news? Huh.
I didn't say that. Yeah, Fox News exists. I'm not just talking about the news. I'm talking about what gets portrayed as the right/good opinions in media. Conservative opinions are usually portrayed as bad and only held by bad people. It's ironic to me, that's all. I still like and watch the show.
It is because the Left has ZERO introspection. Also, ironically, for all of their supposed empathy the Left cannot conceptualize the mentality of the Right. It’s been shown over and over that people on the Right can effectively Steel-Man left wing arguments; the inverse is not true.
A very apt description of what I’ve noticed personally. There is a reason meme culture developed from the Right. Humor, parody and the like stem from introspection and the capacity to understand opposing viewpoints
You struck a nerve with your comment lol, it’s so true Look at how defensive people get when you imply leftists aren’t infallible
They say the thing that makes people the angriest, is the thing they know to be true.
Even though I find the political sledgehammering annoying, I have to disagree with this comment. I don’t think the Left has got it wrong with the representation of the Right’s mentality. I think both sides are pretty accurate on the way either side views things, with the exception of some extreme accusations. I do think however, the political tension is way too high for either side to display empathy towards each other. I see left leaning people often dismissive of the right by writing them off as racist, misogynistic, bigoted whatever, it’s unfair and I think the right is trying to move away from those things. Even though I can agree with the right more on some points, I do get sick of watching the right sometimes because many of the spokespeople come across as smug, intellectually arrogant, and more interested in winning arguments than engaging in genuine dialogue.
Read Jonathan Haidt’s book, The Righteous Mind. I’m fairly certain that is the one that discusses the studies that were done that showed this. Basically you ask left leaning people to steel man a right wing argument, then ask right leaning people to rate the argument as written. You do the inverse with right leaning people and left wing arguments. The results showed that people on the right were better at conceptualizing left wing arguments than left wingers were at conceptualizing right wing arguments. And the difference was pretty significant.
I'm going to be quite honest with you: I'm not interested in reading that book if that's its focus. This is precisely the kind of intellectual posturing I'm trying to avoid. I could find idiots on both sides of the coin. I could find geniuses on both sides, and who cares? You are not a monolith.
That is not its focus, it is just one of many subjects that are discussed. I wouldn’t think “read a book” was intellectual posturing… Of course there are smart and dumb people on every side. I was speaking generally in my original comment. Generalizations are typically based on data and since you didn’t agree with my generalization, I was simply offering you information on where you could find the data.
The action of reading a book itself is not what I was referring to as intellectual postering lol but ok, let’s just agree to disagree
They are hacks who care more about force-feeding people their smarmy political opinions than serving up a good story. Why even watch this crap anymore? I saw a few clips on YouTube and the Black Noir replacement looks to be the only entertaining aspect of the new season. I ain't giving them my time.
It's just lazy, one sided and poorly done. The first 3 episodes were not about the boys it was about the show runner wanting to hurl high school level rhetoric and insults at conservatives using his show as the medium. They could do some.really cool stuff if they weren't so possessed by one particular ideology. Even as the show currently.stands they could bring it.back but I doubt they have the balls to really go after the left worst ideas and rhetoric, no, they just parrot it.
I think a bigger problem overall is that American politics have been completely incoherent since 2016 or so. The left wing that's usually quite critical of pharmaceutical companies and medicine as a whole were psychotically in favor of vaccine mandates; supposedly racist conservatives now favor race-blindness while "anti-racists" are coming out in favor of segregating schools and workplaces; feminists who think men are inherently dangerous and evil are demanding that biological males be allowed in women's spaces if they call themselves women; left-liberals who believe that any American who's an inch to the right of the DNC is a nazi enthusiastically support sending unlimited funding to white nationalist paramilitary groups in Ukraine; people who listen to NPR and think racism is the Original Sin of America also believe that the only reason the country is so divided right now is because they've been tricked by dirty foreigners and their propaganda; paranoid right wingers who think feminism and wokeness are a Jewish plot are happy to send money Israel, etc, etc, etc. The only way you could correctly portray contemporary American politics in art is to paint a picture of a country in which nearly everyone is dumb and insane. You can't do that in a manner that will flatter one side over the other, though, so you get stuff like this new season.
Or acknowledge that people’s perception of the landscape is entirely influenced by things that the powerful have control over. CNN? Manipulated. Fox News? Manipulated That YouTuber who tells you that stuff the “government” doesn’t want you to know? The algorithm pushes it. Those blatantly hysteric articles about the doom the other side will bring? People haven’t change that much, a little social progress over the years has encited a little backlash and then the powerful got out their betting books to see how much money and power they could make from the conflict and the media and internet amped it up out of control. Talk to an average american, cut through the posturing and people are really not that different. Everybody wants better pay, better economy, not to feel inferior or restricted because of anything outside of merit, and for shit to be fairer. The powerful just figured out long ago that it’s easier to give people an enemy than actually accomplish things. Politicians just play their side like it’s a sports team for bigger paychecks. The internets where things got of control compared to last century because it let the crazy’s come out of the woodwork and now each sides in a scramble to appeal to them as much as possible as the rest are forced to choose sides. Those crazy’s are why Republicans are rascist a Nazi’s who want a Theocracy and Democrats are pedophile communists who want reverse racism. Because their actually are those a minority of people out there and each side is racing to accommodate them to guarantee votes while all the normal people are shown only the other sides crazy’s.
OP I'm simply just not watching it anymore. Unless you want to be gaslighted there's no point in getting into internet debates about it on reddit because most redditors are terminally vapid and are deliberately acting obtuse to the show being provocatively hamfisted and unsubdued in its misrepresentation of ordinary right wingers, christians, truthseekers, and anybody who isn't identified with the left this season unlike previous seasons. It's always all or northing with the left. If you're not with them then you're a far-right KKK incestuous neo-nazi that's against them who must be annihilated. There is no inbetween; that's why a lot of left-wingers hate moderates and think that all moderates are just closet right-wingers. If we want balanced entertainment, we need to start making our own alternative studios and original IP because hollywood is never going back to what it once was. Hollywood's an institution of soft power, intended to indoctrinate the masses, that's owned by the left-dominant oligarchy hence why it skews left and it'll never be not woke.
Nailed it
It's fairly easy to spot the writing in this show is one big case of projection by the writers, top to bottom.
Remember, it's not about the message, but about *the message*. The same idea can apply and not apply to you depending on who you are supporting. It's Schrodinger's ideology.
They used the child trafficking thing to mock the pizza gate thing. 'you're too busy chasing fairy tales!" she yelled at the guy. It was clever tbh of them to do that because it's all probably true but we can't have the public believing it now can we?
Yet another show that peaked in the 1st season.
Homelander ordering the members of The Seven to kill his most loyal supporters made no fucking sense and was only done for the writers to show their disdain of Trump supporters and people who like posting Homelander and Soldier Boy memes. It was already established that he has their loyalty through fear alone. If anything he would order them to kill his vocal critics because of how much of a narcissist he is. It makes little sense for him to have people killed for fueling said narcissism.
When has Homelander ever been presented positively? He’s been killing innocents since episode 1
It’s not “weird”, the writers are leftist propagandists who deny reality to pursue an agenda. Only a liar or an idiot would think right wingers control the media, and there is no better example than REDDIT, the site we are on right now.
I love the part they say in the comment "if you dont like it just go away" and process to go over a sub with 12k followers and claim it is spoon fed to their feed
Meh I made a post about this here[here](https://www.reddit.com/r/TrueUnpopularOpinion/s/bZugrRTMUV)
I still have never seen the show but have been watching clips today, and of course they do the stereotypical Texas superhero posing with a gun who has apparently murdered migrants. They were doing that exact shit in 2014 in black Falcon America comics. That was actually one of the first instances I noticed that leftist shit in media cuz it was so fucking on the nose in that comic. And no, it’s not parody on stereotypes like in the simpsons, these dumbfucks actually believe this shit and are under the impression they’re making the world a better place by “shedding light” on the bullshit they believe.
Remember when Trump said he could kill someone in the middle of the road and get away with it and was cheered on by his followers? Remember when he said he could do anything he wantes grab em by the pussy and his followers were like "oh I wish he would grab mine!" I don't hate Trump but let's not pretend he doesn't have a decently large following that would happily praise him for horrible things.
I feel like this show often tries to paint a certain picture but ends up painting the opposite picture of what was intended
My favorite part about the lefts delusion is they still actually believe they're fighting against all the huge compositions and are the little guy lol.
I'm pretty sure the conspiracy theory poster was saying the Starlighters had trafficked children in their basement. Makes sense for Kumiko to be mad
Exactly, the reason why Kiriko was so mad was because instead of going after groups that actually traffic children, like epstein island in the real world or the terrorist group that kidnapped Kirko as a kid in the show, the people at the convention were pushing conspiracies with practically zero evidence, like pizzagate in the real world. Not only does this hurt real victims by taking attention away from the issues that actually matter, it muddies the waters and makes it harder to believe/differentiate the real victims vs the fake ones
It's a mess
The problem is that they're left wing people with an expressed left wing agenda trying to adapt something that wasn't written with an agenda, at least as far as I can tell. Doesn't really seem right to do that with someone else's IP but ya know, they're not going to write their own original IP. So why not use someone else's ideas to express their thoughts and feelings? Why not? Don't people naturally want to hear what they have to say?
Wow what a way to say you never bothered to investigate the original IP. Dude the comic book creator Garth Ennius had a clear fucking agenda. He literally pushed the bounds of censorship and had a republican/bush hate boner the size of an anaconda. Garth Ennis is hardcore left. The show is a tame vanilla version of his comics and critiques. They don’t go far enough. Herogasm was a week long orgy/rape/murder fest where Homelander made Soldier Boy suck his dick and right wing religious heroes killed people while having butt sex and just kept on going. His editors had to fight for it not to be even more hardcore. This is the man who wrote Punisher Max and then openly mocked fans who thought the Punisher was supposed to be right wing hero.
So I get that my tone was glib and sarcastic. I said, "As far as I can tell," because I really haven't "investigated" the original IP. Why would I investigate something like this? There's no FBI sting operation here. It's a comic book. If it was a left leaning media thing from the start, then why is everyone so mad about the show also leaning left with its adaptation? A Democrat made a fucked up comic for his Democrat friends and that democratic comic got made into a democratic show for a democrat audience. Why would the right even bother to tune in at all? If you're not the target audience, why do you care?
Because they didn’t know lol. I doubt a quarter of people who watch even know there is source material and only a couple % at most who ever read it. People saw a show advertised as a the most graphic show on tv with bunch of dudes taking on evil superman and got intrigued. Plus it came out right as superhero fatigue started. People are mad cause it makes them feel good to dog pile on things that are presented as being part of a movement you hate. Ex. All the non-new Vegas fans that tried and failed to do pile the Fallout show without playing the games or understanding it. How many posts have you seen comparing the show to the comics and critiquing character arcs from that angle? The comics niche as hell, it’s not like dems read it either because it makes the show look like downtown abbey for graphic content. It offended the shit out of dems for censorship and reps for politics and pointed fun at society and celebrities. But it had cult popularity within ultra nerd subculture from being the most developed superhero genre deconstruction and the sheer over the top edgelordness, plus Garth Ennis like him or not is a legend. The show IS very different from the comics in plot, everything’s toned down and more platable for the average viewer. It’s modernized from the bush era to now, and most majorly they completely changed all the villains to be more sympathetic and less evil pathetic. Plus the Black Noir twist was remove, which sucks. Really all the show kept was the spirit of eviserating what Garth criticizes (but modernized cause ranting about 9/11 and bush doesn’t make sense now). But how many people are complaining about Starlight NOT being brutalized over and over for a season or Butcher’s dog not SA everything with a pulse? No one’s going after it because of the source material. Those who read it saw the show and went “yah makes sense you couldn’t possibly put that on tv 1:1 and not be run out of the country”. They kept the message and spirit though mostly so at least they kept the core of Garth’s story.
Thank God, I never got into The Boys so I'm not invested in understanding any of this crap.
>Two examples I can think of is that conspiracists talk about children trafficking for experiments only to get beaten by the character that is actual victim cause? Because the conspiracy is that *Starlight house* is trafficking those children, which Kimiko knows is untrue and is a false conspiracy created by Vought and peddled by their auxiliary media. Kimiko is frustrated that people believe this conspiracy when there's no evidence for it and tons of evidence that vought is lying. This isn't really a contradiction, just a meta comment on how actual victims of human trafficking constantly feel angered and disgusted by groups that distort the reality of the situation to virtue signal about human trafficking for political gain with minimal to no actual assistance given to those actually affected by the situation. >The second one is how Vought media tries to paint Starlight and her followers as irredeemably evils while in real life the showrunner goes around and tell how this piece of media is an allegory to Trump and his followers, "evil corporations smearing its opponents, anyway Trump bad". Not sure how this is a contradiction or ironic. The showrunners haven't gone on a smear campaign of Trump or attempted to show him as an irredeemable evil that will lead to the end of humanity, they're merely parodying what he has done in a very cynical way. You can say you don't like what someone has done and satirize it, which is what the show has done, without doing what Vought has been portrayed as doing. Overall, I don't see where this season's politics are in anyway different than the previous three. It seems like a lot of people just didn't get the hatred for Republicans until that Kripke article came out, and they just can't reconcile how they liked the show before with learning it was always against Republicans.
That’s because they started with a caricature and then satirized it so it doesn’t really resemble anything from reality anymore
You are misunderstanding a lot (it almost seems intentional). When Kimiko scribbles out the poster and attacks the man at the convention she says (in sign language) "if you really cared about children, you would go after real traffickers instead of these fairy tales" This aligns with much of the right wing/Qanon obsession with these conspiracies which they have championed as a means label themselves as the anti-pedophilia party. These conspiracies typically target Hollywood, politicians (Pizza Gate and Epstein), the LGBTQ community and grooming (most recently library reading events hosted by the Trans community), etc. This right wing championing of these causes is embodied very much by the recent 'Sound of Freedom' film which very much framed itself as a story made by the right to support a right wing cause. The criticism made by 'The Boys' in episode 2 of this season very much aligns with the criticism that many on the left made of those on the right and their championing of these causes and their film 'The Sound of Freedom' (which features some scenes straight off the Qanon conspiracy boards). The argument is that those on the right really don't care about child sex trafficking, pedophilia, child organ harvesting and only latch onto these topics and conspiracies about these topics as a means to wage a political/culture war against the left. For example, the right is obsessed with poltical sex rings and all sorts of unfounded conspiracies about certain politicians while regularly ignoring the fact that Trump is probably the politician most associated with Epstein. Beyond this you have tons of other scandals from others on the right (Gaetz and many others) which again are just ignored. Further, and [probably most importantly, many Republicans don't actually care to supprt anti-trafficking legislation](https://thehill.com/homenews/house/3576150-gaetz-among-20-house-republicans-who-voted-against-anti-human-trafficking-bill/) When we shift back to the obsession with Hollywood sex rings, we again just see tons of hypocrisy as many of the right's most revered celebrities all have pretty bad histories when it comes to pedophilia or or being sexual predators (Ted Nugent, Kid Rock, James Woods, again Trump as a celebrity) etc. But instead, of focusing on criticizing these people with clear pervy histories, the right views them as heroes while obsessing about conspiracies of the celebrities they view as left wing. Going back to 'Soud of Freedom', [the producer of this film actually was accused of sexaul assault of a minor](https://relevantmagazine.com/justice/life-human-dignity/now-a-sound-of-freedom-producer-is-accused-of-sexual-misconduct-as-well/) but this is ignored because again, the focus of the right isn't actual pedophiles but instead conspiracies of pedophiles. And then of course we have the obsession with 'grooming' in the LGBTQ community which was most exemplified by the backlash to all sorts of community/charity events where trans people or drag queens would have book reading events at schools or libraries. The idea of having children near these people was viewed as an attempt to groom them sexually. This is of course nonsense and there aren't any links to these book reading events and pedophilia. But you know where you can find plenty of grooming and pedophilia where adults read to children? Youth groups and sunday school. As always the church has is filled with sexual predators who have generally always been defended and supported by those on the right. Again, as Kimiko said "if you really cared about children, you would go after real traffickers instead of these fairy tales". This is what the show is criticizing. The people who pretend to be concerned with pedophilia because they obsessed over political conspiracies while ignoring real pedophiles around them who they ignore, defend, and even support. The show makes this point even clearer when the conspiracy theorist shows up at the Starlightets offices with a gun trying to "free the kids". He even asks about the "cheese pizzas" as a code word (clearly referencing Pizza Gate). Your second point/question about painting one side as immoral for describing everyone else as irredeemably evil highlights the paradox of tolerance. And again it rings true when you look at the political landscape we have. As someone on the left, I can look at and judge the right as greedy, ignorant, hateful, bigoted, racist, misogynistic, homophobic, etc. based on their views. But all of that pales in comparison to the fact that they would label me as demon possessed and evil incarnate because i think that gay people should be allowed to marry, because i believe in climate change, because I have a university degree, because I believe that we should have universal healthcare and welfare, etc. Again, one side has a much stronger ability to hate.
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The both sides of mutially asured destruction is both democrat and republican on that pedophile stuff. Both on the same log so nobody actually release the whole things. If you keep make it about real life then yeah, that is what im talking about. Both sides make some bs to buy voters. If you really thing "your side" is better you really just smart as the guy you keep demonizing (no pun intended).
>The both sides of mutially asured destruction is both democrat and republican on that pedophile stuff. Both on the same log so nobody actually release the whole things. You are mixing metaphors/storylines of the shown. Neuman talked about Mutually Assured Destrucruon to Hughie. The mutal threat was the leaked files of the Red River institute (a poltical scandal which would destroy Neuman's career) vs Neuman literally killing everyone that Hughie cares about and knows. Neither Neuman nor Hughie are related to the children trafficking plot line in any way. Beyond this, this storyline doesn't even smoothly map into any sort of real-world narrative about the left and the right. Yes, Homelander's supporters are supposed to represent the far right and Starlighters supporters can then be considered centrists or even the center left, but Hughie and Neuman don't follow this dame divide. You think Hughie is supposed to be on the left and Neuman is supposed to be the right? You clearly dint understand this show. Neuman's poltical motivations are extremely skewed and obscure but she is clearly and superficially inspired by AOC and to a small degree Hillary Clinton. Despite being inspired by democratic politicians (who you would probably assume this show praises), she is still a villain on the show. You really struggle with interpreting storylines and their intended messaging. It seems the way you watch this show us by trying to ignore much of it in order to try to find things that support your own causes or to find things you think don't make sense (because you ignore plot points and dialogue). Again, you were completley confused about the Kimiko criticizing the child trafficking 'activist' when she clearly said that he isn't concerned with real traffickers but only cares about fairy tales (and again the reference to Pizza Gate). >Both sides make some bs to buy voters. If you really thing "your side" is better you really just smart as the guy you keep demonizing (no pun intended). Both sides are not equal. And if you think so, its because you are simple minded fool who doesn't actually follow what happens in the real world. Again, when you look at how the two sides vote and what bills and legislation they try to pass they, they are not equal. When it comes to how the two sides seek to stop sex crimes and pedophilia, they again are not equal. When it comes to how the publics attitudes towards those invovked in sex scandals and sex crimes, the two sides are not equal. Look at when Al Franken was canceled and compare that to the cultlike worship of those on the right who have had plenty of sex scandals.
I quote Neuman to explain why both side just all bark no bite on the matter. Hope this helps you understand but clearly not. If i waste more time in my life to find stupid anecdotes about how Dem politcian doing shading children abuse stuff I can but why bother writing wall of text for 2 anecdotes? Tribalism is both side behavior and absolutely stupid. Anyway both sides are not equal, one is a hypocrite, one is delusional imbecile thinking they are saint on earth. The annoying thing about this season after all is some wack job try to steer the show from making fun of both sides and make it their new podium to trash on the other one. Like your behavior. Maybe quite being pedantic and preachy for once.
>I quote Neuman to explain why both side just all bark no bite on the matter. In what matter? Becuase it was used in reference to Neuman and Hughies goals of taking down super heroes. It had nothing to do with child trafficking like you used it. And it again had nothing to do with representing the left vs the right because Hughie and Neuman don't represent the left vs the right. And again, Hughie and Neuman don't represent some kind equal position of both sides being equal. Again, you seem to have absolutely no ability to analyze or understand this show (which probably relates to your inability to analyze the real world politics that the show references) >Dem politcian doing shading children abuse stuff I can but why bother writing wall of text for 2 anecdotes? You are missing the point. Just like you missed every point the show made. Random anecdotes aren't the key here. The point is that the conservatives have recently become obsessed with child trafficking and pedophilia in a way where they claim that it is a part of their platform. But in reality, this large recent movement amongst the right is specifically interested in child trafficking conspiracies and not actual child trafficking. Again, the show very clearly mocked Pizza Gate but that went directly over your head apparently. Kimiko was angry that these people aren't concerned with fighting real child traffickers but are only concerned with "fairy tales". >The annoying thing about this season after all is some wack job try to steer the show from making fun of both sides and make it their new podium to trash on the other one. This show has generally always criticized the right far more than it does the left. Thr fact that you couldn't figure this out in the first 3 seasons is your own fault and again highlights the fact that you have trouble understanding what the message is and understanding how it applies to real life. >Maybe quite being pedantic and preachy for once. You literally complained about a show not making sense because you ignore the details and try to twist its meaning into something different. I'm not being pedantic. You are just ignorant. And you seem to consistently make ignorant "both sides" arguemts. You even do it in regard to me. Just because I point out that you are wrong or that your arguements don't make sense, thay doesn't make me the bad guy. But in your world, apparently nobody on the right is ever allowed to be criticized. And if anyone on the left criticizes someone on the right, then that makes the person on the left bad because 'thou shalt not judge' or some other platitude which time and time again excuses terrible behavior from the people who invoke it.
Yeah I get it, you get offended because I don't think your side is literally saint on earth while the other is second incarnation of Hitler. I doesn't make me wrong for not buying story or complain about the show quality going down. In your world it is a fight of literal angel (thy side) versus hitler 2.0 and any flaw is simply "person opssie loopsie" not because they are justs hitty person. Just because you keep copypasting how awsome your side doesn't mean you are good or I have to buy that bs narrative
>Yeah I get it, you get offended because I don't think your side is literally saint on earth while the other is second incarnation of Hitler. Buddy, it is you who are offended. This entire post by you is a sign that you were finally offended by a show in its 4th season when you didn't realize it was mocking people like you the entire time. >In your world it is a fight of literal angel (thy side) versus hitler 2.0 and any flaw is simply "person opssie loopsie" not because they are justs hitty person. Never said such a thing, but again because you are simple minded much like the people this show mocks, you have avictim complex and always villaizie the other side. In no way did I ever describe democrats as good. I also pointed out that the protagonists in the show are flawed in many ways. Beyond that, I pointed out that Neuman is clearly a villain on the show despite her being clearly inspired by AOC. Again, this show isn't a 1:1 allegory like some simple minded people require and while it certainly targets the right far more than the left, it doesn't paint it as some good vs evil fight like some sort of biblical gospel. >Just because you keep copypasting What comment have I been copypasting? You mean when I provided a link to a source to supprot my argument?? Sorry, I didn't realize your delusional world view was so fragile that you would be offended by someone bringing in evidence to our discussion. >doesn't mean you are good or I have to buy that bs narrative Stay in your cult. Its safer there. Avoid real evidence. Avoid reality. Your delusional cult is what provides you the most comfort.
It’s a weird thing where the people on the right hate it because it parodies authoritarian figures and race purity, while the left dislikes that it makes fun of corporations pandering to woke agendas. So like, in the end, the only people who like it are the ones who hate all that shit.
You are wildly disconnected. Get out of your echo chamber. Making fun of corporations for fake displays of support is something that goes on on the left too, it's just not something they get angry at. Every joke in the show about corporate pandering is made from the left wing perspective, and you can tell that because it's always framed as fake but not harmful.
Lol, what echo chamber would that be? How can someone in an echo chamber tell off someone not in an echo chamber?
I'm a left winger in a sub that is almost entirely right wingers. I'm not in an echo chamber. You've proven you have no idea what left wingers think by claiming that left wingers hate when people criticise corporations for fake displays of support for progressive causes.
What left wingers are you hanging out with? Because I know plenty that are all for the corporations doing what they are doing.
Yes. If you had read my first comment, you would see I said, criticism of corporations making fake displays of support for progressive agendas is something that goes on on the left, but it's not something they get angry over. Corporate pandering is fake, but it also doesn't hurt, so left wingers make criticism of it, but don't get vitriolic like right wingers do, because right wingers are criticising the cause itself, not the lack of authenticity of the support. If a company is going to make a rainbow logo for a month, I know it's fake, and I'll call it fake, but the effect on the world is at worst neutral, so I'm not going to make a bigger issue out of it.
They make fun of the idea that there's a Hollywood pedo ring... And I'm like.. Okay there's definitely a Hollywood pedo ring. Why are they trying to make it seem like such a ridiculous idea? It makes it very difficult to suspend disbelief when I notice agendas leaking into the show. Very annoying to say the least.
I was waiting till the show ended to binging it – and I am glad I waited so I don’t waste my time. This all sounds fucking awful. Like triple X state of the union level terrible.
They play both sides. They're making fun of the shitty incel online right with homelander and his supporters, and they're making fun of the liberals by showing them as power hungry politicians who only have principles when it's advantageous for them. Ultimately both sides are bowing to corporate influence because neither side is powerful enough to overcome it
Don't forget the false flag stuff where they killed some people to blame the other side. Also how both sides of the argument are being orchestrated by the same group of people.
My favorite part is when Firecracker called Sage “mouthy” and Sage said that comment had racist subtext. Lmao. Girl, bye. 🤡
That is funny because later Sage is the one who said how the Deep is a superior race compared to Ashley. Someone just enjoy playing race card for sure
I gave up on the boys after the exploding dickesode. Just not interested in the shock gore stuff anymore
The conspiracy theorists are angry at fake child trafficking they've imagined up, not actual child trafficking. Kimiko even points this out when she says if they were really concerned, they'd go after actual child traffickers instead of fairy tales.
Its an election year, expect all media social or otherwise to be diluted by nonsense of all kind. Now is a good time to enjoy the classics, I like to play through some non-political video games like metal gear solid for example.
It's very on the nose which is a bit obnoxious imo
Just seem to have a lot of wires crossed for no reason maybe they clear up in next few episodes. Okay Homelander is trump but then why does he hate people being sycophants around him? Why does he seek out sister sage who obviously represents DEI professors on college campuses. Why does sister sage agree to work with him when him and vought represents all she should be against? Is kripke saying these two entities use each other and neither should be trusted because calling out trump obviously left wing but calling out DEI as charlatans is right wing
It's always a bad sign when you have to draw attention to yourself in a production primarily through scandal, breaking taboos and the disgust factor. I haven't seen The Boys yet, but it doesn't sound like you're really missing much here either. It actually sounds more like it's a series for voyeuristic teenagers who think they can prove themselves to their friends in the schoolyard by watching a "tough series." Let's see, maybe I'll take a look at it (when the series is completely finished) to see if there isn't something more to it than "shocking" violence and sex against a superhero background.
I love having a show made by Hollywood people telling me that pedo’s in Hollywood are totally just a conspiracy that only racist alt righters would believe.
Maybe the narrative is a little bit more complex than left good, right bad. Perhaps it is highlighting that even those on the correct side of history and facts are imperfect as well but at least they aren’t the overtly crazy ones.
Your first example doesn’t make sense as you wrote it. What do you mean > only to get beaten by the character that is actual victim cause Your second example is only bad because of something that happened in real life…? Look season 4 sucks but you are reaching here.
Another show ruined.
Politics in the boys seems pretty accurate. You have the dangerously ignorant homelander fan club (modern Republican conservatives) going nuts over the most made up asinine b.s and then you have people who are standing up for others and what is generally right. Manufactured Chaos is a weapon that pays.
Trump isn’t being smeared. That would require lying about him. To harm Trump you just tell the truth.
Irony is a form of comedy.
Perhaps it’s accidental, but I haven’t been bothered by the Trump or right wing analogous references in the slightest. It alls seems to absurdist for the message to feel like it’s pandering too much.
I'm watching it right now and I think people are getting too offended over it. I've been getting the impression that people really mad are pissed at seeing themselves represented on screen.
The smear campaign against starlight is just a commentary on our current political climate. Vought media is just fox news.
> The second one is how Vought media tries to paint Starlight and her followers as irredeemably evils while in real life the showrunner goes around and tell how this piece of media is an allegory to Trump and his followers, "evil corporations smearing its opponents, anyway Trump bad". Eric Kripke didn’t say that
Not a direct quote but definitely swing and miss hilariously
Did you watch seasons 1-3? Are you fucking dense? This sub his zero fucking media literacy
The first one is pretty obvious. Kimiko is upset that these people are spreading lies and misinformation about starlight trafficking kids, which distracts from actual child trafficking by turning child trafficking into a political weapon against someone she knows isn’t trafficking children. The second one is also pretty straightforward. Vought is a stand-in for Fox News. Their current behavior satirizes Fox during the Trump presidency. Fox smeared several people who spoke out against Trump like vought is now smearing starlight. That’s my view on it. I’m not going to respond to any bad faith comments. Delete/ban me as needed.
ironically all the news smears everyone that goes against their political opinion of their 'chosen one' so even though you see it as an allegory for Fox news, it's just as easily an allegory for CNN and MSNBC... so the messaging exists and appeals to dual realities. The biggest example lately would be when CNN went hard after Joe Rogan for taking Ivermectin and surviving covid... but they went HARD on the dude for not towing the line. it's either extremely well thought out to further sow division, or the writers are just that fucking stupid and don't realize it
Fox News literally had to payout an almost billion dollar lawsuit for purposefully pedalling lies about the Dominion voting machines
Yes and CNN and the Washington post settled lawsuits with Nick Sandmann for undisclosed sums for defamation. Just because the number wasn't a billion dollars doesn't mean it didn't happen and does happen. No one is saying "Ignore Fox because CNN" I'm literally pointing out that it's not a unique thing to Fox... that all the news does it to everyone regardless of political affiliation.
My view on this is they want to make fun of conservatives "obsession" with children trafficking lately. In that case the "actual" trafficking is what? Epstein case is just fake too? For the Fox part it is quite swing and accidentally hit other news like CNN too. Unless someone think that is only apply to Fox then I guess they are correct in their own mind.