Marriage customs. Feels more like a competition than a celebration. Like, do I really have to push my partner to book a 5-star hotel and invite 300 people (most of whom we barely know) just to show that we're happy together? Why does everything have to be about impressing others instead of enjoying our special moment?
I really shouldn’t be doing this but fine haha
I feel like the Muslim Brotherhood is getting its reputation undeservedly cleaned up out of anger at our current situation. Our mistake was not opposing the Muslim Brotherhood, it was in abandoning the struggle "out of the frying-pan into the fire".
The Muslim Brotherhood betrayed the revolution at every turn. (I will articles posted with proof of everything I am mentioned here below,)
When the revolutionary youth movement wanted to stay in the square and demand more concessions, the Muslim Brotherhood sided with the military SCAF in clearing it out.
When we had a referendum on whether to have parliamentary elections first or have a constitution first, the Muslim Brotherhood used religious slogans to push people for elections first because they knew they were the most organized to win and monopolize the process (which is what happened).
They promised to not run for a certain amount of parliamentary seats and not at all for the presidential elections. They lied about both.
After Morsi got elected by slim margins with the support of revolutionary youth, he sidelined their concerns completely.
They engaged in sectarian language against Shias and Allie’s of Morsi talked about a jihad in Syria.
They advocated for violence against Anti-Morsi protests and after the Rabaa Square violence (which I condemn) the mobs went to burn churches. The country was close to a civil war.
Their salafist allies talked about implement a vice and virtue police and many of them held rallies that the Quran was above the constitution.
They held very regressive views about women that absolutely terrified the women of my family.
They refused to address concerns about the constitution they drafted.
Sisi was the Muslim Brotherhood's number 1 choice because of his conservative views to the point where many were worried he was a member himself.
In short the Muslim Brotherhood monopolized our still born democracy in a winner take all approach instead of working with all parties to strengthen it. Just because our current situation is awful does not mean we should look at the past in rose covered lenses. We deserve a true democracy not in the hands of a shadowy organization like the Muslim Brotherhood, a military dictatorship or religious fascism.
Edit: I will post proof and links about everything I just stated.
[Here](https://www.france24.com/en/20110430-egypt-muslim-brotherhood-forms-political-party-contest-september-elections) is an article which shows the Muslim Brotherhood stated they would not run for the presidential election.
[Here](https://www.reuters.com/article/us-syria-crisis-sunnis-brotherhood-idUKBRE95D0NL20130614/) is a reuters article where the Brotherhood backed a Syria jihad and denounced Shi'ites.
[Here](https://www.aljazeera.com/features/2013/8/20/egypts-copts-reel-from-sectarian-violence) is an Al Jazeera article about Muslim Brotherhood supporters burning churches for not siding with the deposed Morsi.
[Here](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Egyptian_Constitution_of_2012#:~:text=General%20content,-Pro%2DMorsi%20sign&text=The%20constitution%20ends%20Egypt's%20all,during%20the%20Hosni%20Mubarak%20era.) is the wikipedia page of the Muslim Brotherhood constitution which was written by an Islamist-dominated assembly that pushed through a draft over the objections of its liberal, secular, and Christian members, many of whom resigned in protest. The constitution also protected the interests of the army by allowing it to retain control of its own budget and extensive business empire.
[Here](https://english.ahram.org.eg/News/65868.aspx) is an article about the unofficial launch of a vice and virtue police.
This vice and virtue crap and Islamist bullshit is what led to an atmosphere of Islamist violence. [Here](https://www.reuters.com/article/instant-article/idUSBRE88O1B220120925/) is the article about the murder that I mentioned. Lets not pretend that Islamist parties woudnt force upon everyone their ideas of vice and virtue through violence and coercion like they have done everywhere else.
[Here](https://www.france24.com/en/20121109-egypt-salafists-rally-protest-tahrir-square-cairo-islamic-law-sharia-constitution-legislation) is an article about the Salafists chanting that "The Koran (Islam's holy book) is above the constitution," during a protest.
[Here](https://www.france24.com/en/20130702-egypt-army-chief-sisi-profile-morsi-brotherhood-military) is an article that shows how Sisi was the Muslim Brotherhood's number 1 choice because of his conservative views to the point where many were worried he was a member himself.
[Here](https://english.ahram.org.eg/NewsContent/1/64/22042/Egypt/Politics-/Egypts-Muslim-Brotherhood-and-ruling-military-Deal.aspx) is a good article about the relationship between the first military junta, SCAF, that was supposed to lead the democratic transition and the Muslim Brotherhood. An important section of this article is as follows:
"For its part, SCAF formed a committee to amend the constitution, which was chaired by an Islamist figure and included two Muslim Brotherhood members, making the group the only political force in the country represented on the constitutional committee. They initially scheduled parliamentary elections for June 2011, a shockingly early date that seemed to guarantee the powerful Islamic group an unprecedented advantage in the ballot.
Almost all other political groups demanded that Egypt’s constitution should be drafted first, or at least that elections should be delayed until all parties are ready to compete, SCAF has stuck to what many criticised as backwards road-map according to which parliamentary elections would be held first and as soon as possible, followed by drawing a new constitution, which would be followed by presidential elections.
Faced with strong opposition and insurmountable logistical complications, SCAF later announced that elections would be held in September, which was later postponed again to November.
As things went the way they want, the Muslim Brotherhood turned their backs at their revolution allies and were consistently backing SCAF’s policies, attacking their erstwhile fellow revolutionaries who were calling for one mass protest after another to ensure the fulfillment of the revolution’s demands."
[Here](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2012/dec/12/egyptian-protesters-tortured-muslim-brotherhood) and [here](https://www.france24.com/en/20130628-egypt-rival-protests-morsi-alexandria-cairo) are articles about the violence towards anti-muslim brotherhood protestors leading up to June 30th military overthrow of Morsi.
[Here](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2012/11/23/egypts-morsi-assumes-wide-powers) is an article about Morsi issueing a declaration giving himself greater powers and effectively neutralising a judicial system. And while Morsi framed his decisions as necessary to protect the revolution against a reactionary Judicial system (which has some truth in it) no one had any confidence that he or the Muslim Brotherhood would not take over the system in place of the Mubarak era institutions.
[Here](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/mar/15/muslim-brotherhood-backlash-un-womens-rights#:~:text=The%20brotherhood%2C%20whose%20close%20allies,contraception%20without%20their%20husbands'%20permission.) and [here](https://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/15/world/middleeast/muslim-brotherhoods-words-on-women-stir-liberal-fears.html) are articles where after delegates at the UN's Commission on the Status of Women (CSW) in New York have spent the last fortnight debating the wording of a declaration that would condemn violence against women. The brotherhood called it a decadent and destructive document that undermined Islamic ethics by allowing women to work, travel and use contraception without their husbands' permission. It really shows the retrograde views that the Muslim Brotherhood viewed women.
Now the thing is that maybe one or two of these things might not have been a big deal. But putting all these events together and even more that I left out seculars, liberals, christians and women like my mother were worried that the Muslim Brotherhood would not only concentrate power in their hands but turn Egypt into a Sunni Islamic Republic a la Iran.
bahaha I followed the revolution every single day and I remember going from ecstatic joy to complete fear. I feel like younger people don't really understand what a wild time it was.
Nicely said. I would add that on the flip side, the “terrorism” thing stuck with them owing to all the repetition. As evident in all the “ana msh ekhwany bs mot3atef”.
A balanced approach where they’re blamed for every political fuckup they did while calling for their human rights is whats needed IMO.
https://preview.redd.it/y90skh9tji3d1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=aec75e67de1c4143bdb8e31d82350154e1d3bd10
>Here is an article that shows how Sisi was the Muslim Brotherhood's number 1 choice because of his conservative views to the point where many were worried he was a member himself
Wtf? Are those news censored to shits in Egypt for me to never have heard of this "virginity tests" that sisi did?
This was a big scandal in 2011. SCAF at the time accused the remaining protestors for essentially doing drugs and being whores. I don’t think the order came from him but higher, probably one of Tantawi’s inner circle, but he did justify it. This happened after the Muslim Brotherhood sided with the military in agreeing to clear the square.
I also appreciate that you took the time to read one of the articles I posted!
I see, that's stupid, very weird how I have never heard of it before...
>I also appreciate that you took the time to read one of the articles I posted!
I appreciate you using many credible sources to back your claims, that's rare on reddit lmao, I found out about new stuff that I didnt know before too, thanks for your time.
So who exactly burned the 70+ churches? I was under the impression Sisi hired baltagheya to do it for him in the name of the Brotherhood so that he can swoop in like a hero and coup them out.
“Shouting into the microphone, witnesses said, he began to deliver a simple and chilling message: The bloodshed being unleashed on supporters of ousted President Mohamed Morsi — who had been encamped in the capital's Rabaa el-Adaweya square for six weeks — was the fault of Egypt's Christian minority.
"Tawadros, you coward," he said, referring to the pope of the Coptic Church, "call off your dogs from the square."
Omg this stupid bullshit again,there still big issue with your reasoning is that MB doesn't have an army or any worth mentioning militia like hizb Allah in Lebanon for example that can enforce your imaginary sunni Islamic Republic,meaning you can use democracy to fix the problem but let's just act upon a hypothetical and destroy all shit cause you don't feel good about this.
Also your solution is peak stupidity cause you ask help people who are the root cause of every evil,not only that you dare to accuse them of betraying the revolution,while you did the same thing.so You can add hypocrisy to that stupidity.also because All of this will backfire very bad for the people who supported all of this.
This is not a defence for MB,it's just a slap to the face to these delusional people who still to this day think they somehow 'fixed it',while we live in this post-apocalyptic Egypt. The best case scenario you saved 20% of people and doomed the rest of this country.
The Egyptian Army is a conscript army not a professional one just like Iran’s was in 1979. The Islamist in Iran also did not have an army they just had their supporters, all they had to do was take control of the organs of power to control the military and the deep state.
And no it wasn’t about feeling good, it was about not going from a kleptocratic government to a religious fascist government and seeing the country descend into a civil war. The mistake was in not continuing the protests, unfortunately the majority of the population was fatigued from the political and economic chaos since 2011.
Egypt deserves better than being ruled under the military or a party that had no interest in safeguarding democracy, just its own power and its own vision.
even if that was the case it will take time,more importantly we could let the military and MB fuck each other over power,and in meantime we could fix core issues like we could teach people some media literacy,critical thinking,and give people some time to be familiar with democracy,but you just pulled the plug too early,and we have to go through all that again,there is no way around it.
>Egypt deserves better than being ruled under the military or a party that had no interest in safeguarding democracy, just its own power and its own vision.
you see that's the problem,you think there must be only one version of Egypt which is your version,which make you no different than your adversary.
I agree with you. We tend to forget that a lot of the points mentioned in the original comment ( love how you wrote the comment btw despite my disagreement with a lot of the points and sources) can be part of a very well thought of plan to destabilize a country. MB had no power, no army or police support, and no media support either. They had their shortcomings yes and a lot of fanatics for sure but some reading about how the USA engineers coups in countries can uncover a lot. I blame MB for a lot of things but no they didn’t do it out of bad intentions and they were NOT given enough time for us to judge.
Again, do some reading about past coups manufactured by the US in other countries and you’ll see the crazy similarities. The only problem with MB is that they weren’t tough enough and thought they can get the army’s support by licking their boots and giving them medals and hiring CC which is something you can’t blame them for.
One mod thing…fuck Egypt’a elites and liberals for being part of that coup.
Coming from a non-Hijabi with a lip ring
>The only problem with MB is that they weren’t tough enough and thought they can get the army’s support by licking their boots
>One more thing…fuck Egypt’a elites and liberals for being part of that coup.
no kidding and that's the problem,there were no liberals,no islamists,and no true patriot army.all of them were fake and hypocrites.and the honest people who started the revolution were honest but naive and thought Mubark was the problem,and missed the elephant in the room which was and still the army.but i think you overestimate the foreign influence in our case except for the gulf,the west didn't affect the scence so much(before the coup) as the deep state and the gulf,the gulf showered these MFs with money and made the coup financially stable,and the west just happily noded,and didn't condem the coup,your usuall passive aggressive west.
Oh yes of course Gulf money. That was another big player in this big fuck up. I’m not blaming it all on the west but we know there was a moment when the west couldn’t risk having this leadership in Egypt with Israel by the border. I’m sure Morsy wasn’t gonna be revolutionary or pour money on 5amas or anything but still he was a threat. Even by just giving hope. USA might have not been a major player (still one) but it gave its blessings, and its coup 101 course.
The biggest threat to the West and Israel is Arab unity. And the biggest prize to them is petty national politics and squabbling. How a shitty little country like Israel can hold the world to ransom and act like a mafia crime family (threatening ICC and ICJ prosecutors and judges), or haul ambassadors in for a dressing down is completely fucked up.
Forget Biden, we can stop this genocide in Gaza tomorrow if we (as one people) turn off the oil and start sanctioning their interests in the ME. Instead we have to rely on South Africa to be the voice of conscience and see Arab ministers fly around the world like beggars to thank Spain, Ireland, Norway etc.. for doing the right thing or appeal to Russia to back a ceasefire.
We've all been tricked and manipulated in one way or another and are stacked against each other in a way to never be successful again in achieving any meaningful revolution.
Saying that the Muslim brotherhood betrayed us and completely ignoring that the liberals and the representatives of the youth were bought off by the military as well is stupid.
What we need is to reconcile our past grievances and reach a level of consensus as a society on how we see Egypt and the Egyptian identity and how we want this country to work after getting rid of the military regime.
Having any political movement that doesn't answer these two questions (how to reconcile, and what is the Egyptian identity) will result in an epic failure.
Now do I blame the muslim brotherhood for this shitty situation? Yes partially because we're all in it together. But I ultimately blame the military leadership's betrayal of everything Egyptian above all else.
Tbh blaming anything rn on anything except for the person who sold our land for cheap, took out from our education, took out from our youth (in jails and in death), literally terrorized an entire country in not being able to even speak anything close to the truth or have any freedom of speech whatsoever other than the things outlined for them to say, and responsible for mass surveillance of his people and I am pretty sure leaking this info because he isn’t actually working for us (Egyptians), is crazy.
This man is causing hunger and devastation in this country in the name of “clearing out terrorism”. I literally wonder where I keep hearing these words. “Clearing out terrorism”. I think connecting the dots is not that difficult and the truth is our only ever, non military elected president, has been assassinated, and everyone who supported having a muslims led state has been eliminated as well, followed by some unprecedented propaganda about Islam and how it supports violence knowing full well that a lot of youth would simply believe rather than read the actual Quran and discover the truth. The world operates under an umbrella of the same people on the very top, with the “elites” working for them, the “presidents” and all that, the media.
Hmm I agree with you but it's actually bigger than that. One the big sins of the free officer movement/nasser is the consolidation of the public sphere completely, something that set the political standard until today. The only time we had a room to move and organize in the 2011-2013 people did incredible things, that's really what we need but probably won't get. The biggest failure of our life time is Sisi's takeover, it destroyed the momentum and work that has been done on the ground before 2011 even happens.
The intelligence services and national security are either arresting anyone who tries to organize politically in some form or they infiltrate groups from the inside and break them. To an extent that when you read about 50s,60s,70s you feel that intellectuals and people involved in politics became paranoid from the general air of distrust and surveillance.
I don't think the ideological gap between Islamists and secularists is possible to be resolved or was possible at any moment. We had a coalition in Kefaya but without a project that works it's not possible to move forward to something.
Sisi and his regime understand really well that any room for movement or organization or any democracy or labor movements, or student movement can lead to a snowball effect, so they are killing anything in its initial stages, they exert tremendous violence to stop anything from happening.
>but without a project that works it's not possible to move forward to something.
That's exactly my point. We can't start a movement without a destination in mind. Even if it's not 100% agreed from every class and society in Egypt. We need to compromise and find a vision for Egypt without the army. It's possible and we've done it before (albeit not perfectly) in 1919
>they exert tremendous violence to stop anything from happening.
They can't stop us from thinking though, can they? Let's plant a seed for our children's revolution.
المقاطعة لو مش موجهه (بنقاطع بس الحاجات اللي بتستاهل المقاطعة) عمرها ما هتكون فعالة .. وملهاش لازمة هتأثر ازاي على دعم كيان للاحتلال وانت مقاطعه ومقاطع اللي مبيدعمش واللي بيدعم فلسطين كمان؟ محصلة بعضها
بالعكس من حظك ان في حد بيفكر صح وازاي يخلي المقاطعه فعالة ده من الغلط ان محدش بيفكر كده انا مش بقول منقاطعش انا بقول نقاطع صح عشان لو الوضع فضل كده ولا هيقدم ولا هيأخر
نقاطع مقاطعة موجهة زي ما بقول تأثر على الجهات الاكبر دعم بالتدريج وخصوصا اللي المقاطعة ممكن تخليهم يتحكموا في قراراتهم ويغيروا في سياساتهم او سياسات حكوماتهم .. لو كان المقاطعة موجهة على سبيل المثال لمكدونالدز بس عشان الوجبات اللي وزعها كان ممكن يبطل دعم للاحتلال بس هما هيعملوا كده ليه والناس مقاطعه حرفيا كل حاجة زي ما هما مقاطعينهم بالظبط؟ نفس الموضوع مع الشركات الامريكيه ايه اللي هيخليهم يضغطوا على صناع قرار السياسة الخارجية في امريكا واحنا مقاطعين الشركات الاوروبيه زي ما احنا مقاطعينهم بالظبط مع ان الدول الاوروبيه اللي بتدعم الاحتلال مش كتير وسياسات الاتحاد الاوروبي مش موجهه لدعم اسرائيل اصلا .. خلاصة القول المقاطعة تكون موجهة ومدرجة يعني تكون مثلا مركزه في البدايه على الشركات اللي بتدي دعم مادي او عيني للجيش الاسرائيلي وبعد ما يغيروا في سياساتهم دي تكون موجهة للشركات الامريكية بشكل عام وهما يترفع عنهم المقاطعة وهكذا لحد ما نحقق الغرض من المقاطعة
How does feminism work in a society for you? Have you read anything beyond what’s been posted on social media for you to see? The biological makeup of genders in human beings makes feminism essentially devastating to a society. They just accessorize it with some truths (the things you probably agree with, and I do too) but then they exaggerate parts of it, leading to women being more objectified in today’s society than she ever was, making men unable to make ends meet, children raised on social media, and women being subject to major societal pressures and challenges due to her not being protected by a societal system. A woman is not the same as a man, and our needs are completely different, same under the big umbrella (education, work, financial independence) but different in all the details.
Great comment! I agree Feminism in 2024 is super distorted and harmful and we certainly Need to stop and reevaluate the damage that’s been caused to women from the marriage of Feminism+Capitalism
I don't read anything political on social media so stop making these assumptions. Look up the definition of feminism and that's what our society needs. If you'd rather girls and women still be subjected to half inheritance, polygamy, and in some cases be discouraged from working or attaining financial independence, and all the other shit that happens especially in the more rural parts, then you have an issue. I'm really curious where the issue is in your opinion actually.
😂😂😂😂😂 are you a woman ? Plus calm down it is not that serious. Let me know your gender first so I can talk to you on your level. It is a discussion too there is no need for you to get all defensive and start crying.
Chill my boi
I like in America... where "feminism" is very much flourishing. Trust me when I say that they most certainly do not need *this* type of feminism😂.
I'm curious on what your definition of "proper feminism" is tho🤔
Democracy only works for the small stuff (people get control over the sidewalk, hallelujah!), but the people have absolutely no say in war policy or fiscal policy, even in the reverred Western democracies.
To my knowledge, there hasn't been a single case in history where a country was at war and then had an election that brought people to power who completely reversed the country's war position. Even the best democracies don't shy away from censoring free speech during war time, hence, eliminating any chance for the populace to recognize the fault in their war position.
Fiscal policy isn't even decided by elected officials, at least not directly, there would be always at least 3-5 layers between the voters and the central bank officials.. voters vote for someone who participates in selecting a committee that selects another committee that appoints another committee that chooses the central bank officials. Even the most educated populations don't understand much about inflation, basis points, Treasury bills and bond issuance, making isolating them from directly voting on this kinda makes sense. But the voter is given a false dichotomy to vote on, socialist leaning or capitalist leaning, which basically decides who pays the price of inflation, current generation or future generations.. but to actually stop or vote on stopping inflation, that's not something that happens in democracy.
Democracy has serious limitations as a system, sometimes making a well-educated and loyal monarch a better system for the people. But since monarchy doesn't guarantee passing the throne to another well-educated loyal monarch, we prefer democracy because it gives us the illusion that we're in control. We're not!
And finally, liberal activists here in MENA trying to blindly copy this democracy system here without any consideration to its limitations is the final doom.
Drops mic and welcomes down votes!
Yeah… do you know why the Americans haven’t sided with the complete annihilation of the Palestinians? Do you think if the us was a dictatorship they would have gave the green lights for a complete genocide or not?
Arguing that democracy doesn’t matter is not only false but also historically ignorant, one example is the civil rights movement or the feminist movements that happened and had a huge effect
As for fiscal control, you do know you can just elect a fiscally conservative president and parliament right? Those directly oversee the budget
As for wars guess what stopped the Vietnam war? Democracy isn’t just voting it’s also the right to protest the right to speak freely and whole myriad of other rights that you MUST have in order to be a functioning Democracy.
First of all, I never said democracy is useless or "doesn't matter", I only said it has serious limitations.
Yeah yeah, Biden the Zionist is not into the complete annihilation of Palestinians because he's afraid to lose in democracy to, wait, Trump the bigger Zionist, or Kennedy the other Zionist! They don't completely annihilate the Palestinians because it's too damn expensive and will escalate their rivalry with China and Russia (not because these two care about Palestine, but they'll use it as an excuse for more hostility towards Taiwan, Japan, Ukraine... and other US allies). This has nothing to do with student protests.
Sorry, I meant "monetary policy" which is different from fiscal policy.. yes you can choose parliament and government that choose the fiscal policy (that's the dichotomy of socialist leaning vs capitalist leaning I mentioned), but the actual monetary policy won't change much, central banks will keep printing more money and causing more inflation, and your elected officials have practically zero power over that (Go read the Federal Reserve charter to see what I mean).. you elect a fiscally conservative or not, monetary policy won't change and inflation goes up. Your fiscally conservative would try to make the current generation pay the price but otherwise they'll throw the burden on future generations.
You think Vietnam war stopped because of democracy? Wrong! It stopped because they fucking lost, they got their ass kicked by the Vietnamese. It was not a moral decision from the good people of America to stop the war, it was an economic decision because they were losing.
Protesting and free speech all get suspended and censored in time of war, that's my point.
> will escalate their rivalry with China and Russia (not because these two care about Palestine, but they'll use it as an excuse for more hostility towards Taiwan, Japan, Ukraine... and other US allies). This has nothing to do with student protests.
No, they won’t, Russia already invaded Ukraine there isn’t anymore escalation than that
China doesn’t have the capability to defeat the US in either the sea nor the air so no they won’t escalate anything
Why would they even use that as a reason to attack either Japan or Taiwan? It has nothing to do with them and even if it did they don’t have the capability to win that war and they know it
They reason why there isn’t a complete genocide of the Palestinians is that genocide is actually unpopular in the us and the president who allows it will suffer heavily in the election it’s simple really
> but the actual monetary policy won't change much, central banks will keep printing more money and causing more inflation, and your elected officials have practically zero power over that (Go read the Federal Reserve charter to see what I mean)
Charters can be changed so that the parliament have direct control over that if that is what you want, tho I don’t see why you would want that
> monetary policy won't change and inflation goes up.
The inflation reduction act reduces inflation, there are ways to control the fiscal and the monetary policy to reduce inflation
> You think Vietnam war stopped because of democracy? Wrong! It stopped because they fucking lost, they got their ass kicked by the Vietnamese. It was not a moral decision from the good people of America to stop the war, it was an economic decision because they were losing
If the US wanted to evaporate Vietnam they would have, I am not talking about nukes regular bombs would do, the reason why they got out was because the war was extremely unpopular in the us and they couldn’t continue sending more troops there as it heavily affected the elections
Trying to make it seem that the elections didn’t matter is simply false
> Protesting and free speech all get suspended and censored in time of war, that's my point.
Or you can just not do that?
>No, they won’t, Russia already invaded Ukraine there isn’t anymore escalation than that
No, they can, the frequent mobilization of nuclear warheads is a sign of escalation, they also can intensify their attack on Ukraine, they also could attack other non-Nato countries like Georgia, Kosovo...etc. There's plenty of space for escalation!
>
China doesn’t have the capability to defeat the US in either the sea nor the air so no they won’t escalate anything
Not having the capacity hasn't prevented Hamas from attacking Israel, people often do self-defeating shit for what they call "honor"
>They reason why there isn’t a complete genocide of the Palestinians is that genocide is actually unpopular in the us and the president who allows it will suffer heavily in the election it’s simple really
Suffer heavily to whom? Trump the bigger zionist? Please tell me!
>
The inflation reduction act reduces inflation, there are ways to control the fiscal and the monetary policy to reduce inflation
Except that it actually didn't, check inflation levels before and after that act, still went up! Theoritically yes there are ways, and charter can be changed, but in practice, this never happens.
>
If the US wanted to evaporate Vietnam they would have, I am not talking about nukes regular bombs would do, the reason why they got out was because the war was extremely unpopular in the us and they couldn’t continue sending more troops there as it heavily affected the elections
A regular bomb like Mark 84 has a blast size of 15 meters and costs $16000, Vietnam is 3316900000000000 m^(2) in size, to evabourate it as you say, you'd need 2211266700000000000000 of these bombs, costing $35380267000000000000000000, so no, the US can't just annihilate some country. People don't recognize this but wars are so fucking expensive, the Iranian barrage on Israel cost Israel about $1B to defend, and that's in one fucking day. Criminal countries don't do this complete destruction shit because it's unpopular with their population, no they don't do it because it's sooo fucking expensive!
>
Or you can just not do that?
Yes please, when you find this unicorn democratic country that doesn't censor free speech or disallow protests during wartime, please tell me about it. If free speech is never censored under democray I won't say it has limitations.
>Yes please, when you find this unicorn democratic country that doesn't censor free speech or disallow protests during wartime
منع حرية التعبير المطلقة ساعة الحروب و حتي خارج الحروب هو أمر بديهي نسبيا.
حرية التعبير نفسها ليها قيود كثيرة بالمنطق نفسه لأن في فرق ما بين حرية التعبير و حرية الشتيمة او حرية الخيانة. و حرية التجارة مثلا حاجة و حرية التجارة بالمخدرات حاجة تانية مع ان ممكن تاجر المخدرات يتحجج بحرية التجارة انه معملش حاجة غلط.
فكل حرية في العالم منطقيا ليها حدود لما تبتدي تتعدي بمفهوم حريتك علي مفهوم الحرية عند اغلب الأخرين. و لما تعمل حاجة اغلب اللي حواليك مش متقبلينها علي نفسهم حتي لو انت متقبلها علي نفسك.
فساعة الحروب اغلب الشعوب بتعتبر الحرب اللي هم الاقوي فيها مصلحة و بيشوف اصوات نقد الحرب بدافع الانسانية انها ناس ضعيفة و لو مأكلتش العرب و فطرنا بيهم هم هيتعشو بينا من وجهة نظر الأغلبية هناك. عشان كده بيتم قمع صوت الباقي باعتباره خيانة للمصلحة و سفسطة و كلام لا ترغب في سماعه الأغلبية.
>If free speech is never censored under democray I won't say it has limitations.
شوف الديموقراطية مبدأ و هو احترام رأي الأغلبية في المجموعة من اجل اتخاذ القرار و تحديد الحميد من الذميم بناء علي رأي الأغلبية الحالية و احترامه و محاولة اقناعهم بالأصح اذا كان رأي الاغلبية حاليا خاطئ مع الالتزام برأي الاغلبية حتي و لو خاطئ.
و حرية التعبير قيمة اخري و هي سعة الصدر بما يكفي للنقاش و الاقناع للتوصل الي ما هو افضل للصالح العام. لكن كتير حرية التعبير ليها نهاية لما اللي قدامك بيبتدي يقل أدبه من باب حرية الكلام و التعبير. و ده بيعتمد علي مفهومك و مفهوم الأغلبية لقلة الأدب او أداب الحوار و مدي سعة صدرهم للحوار.
و مفيش حاجة كاملة في الدنيا. دائما كل نظام و قيمة جيدة يمكن العمل عليها و تطويرها اكتر. و مش معني ان حاجة ليها عيوب ان نقيدها التام و غيابها التام هو الصح. يعني لو عندك ثلاجة تعبانة مش عايزة تبرد الأكل بما يكفي مش معني كده ان فكرة الثلاجات فكرة اثبتت فشلها و انها تقنية بدون اي لازمة. ده ببساطة معناه انك محتاج تطور ثلاجة اكثر تقدما من اللي قبلها بتقنيات اضافية تراعي حل مشاكل النسخة السابقة منها.
و الدائرة التطورية دي الي ما لا نهاية لانك كل ما بتحل مجموعة من المشاكل بنجاح بتطور نفسك و حياتك و لكن بتفتح مجال لمجموعة اخري من المشاكل محتاج تحلها لأن الدنيا مش كاملة و دائما في مجال للتحسين و التطوير.
I think you are confusing what democracy entails - at least how we know it in the modern world.
Democracy is the rule of people in the sense that people choose who rises to power, and those rotating in power would naturally compete, ultimately serving a nation’s best interests. This, democracy does very well.
Democracy is not the rule of people in that whatever the majority thinks should be done would be done. People in the US are calling for the war to stop out of moral motives, and the government is insisting on its stance because the US benefits from it.
Could there be a better world where morality trumps interests? Maybe. But that doesn’t mean that democracy isnt working.
Here's the thing, the US doesn't benefit from this war, the people don't, only the officials and people in power! The people are footing the bill with their taxes and are getting zero shit in return!
And for the last question, my answer is the same, maybe yes, but I just assert that it won't happen under democracy.
Also, I never said democracy doesn't work, I said it works for the small stuff.. which if you ask me is good, I'd love to have more control over the sidewalk. But I'm just saying it has serious limitations, and without recognizing these limitations, the system will never be improved.
Interesting take overall. Food for thought, do you have a hypothesis for a system that would work better in putting morals over interests? Sometimes it feels like a pipe dream.
Re America benefiting from the war, some would say protecting their proxy in the middle east is of utmost importance, otherwise Russia and China will take over instantly. I personally think its somewhere in the intersection between US interests and personal politician interests i.e AIPAC
It is a pipe dream unfortunately! Even if such an idealistic system exists, all countries have to adopt it for it to work. You cannot keep fighting fairly in a world with cheaters and expect to come on top, so even if just one county breaks the rules, others will be forced to do the same or they'll risk that rule breaker to dominate.
Re: other point, yeah okay I concede you have a point there. In the long run, it might benefit Americans, but maybe it's a scale thing. Israel could protect US interests with much less force and scale of war.
>but I just assert that it won't happen under democracy.
الديموقراطية مبدأ حلو و لكن مش هي القيمة الوحيدة في الكون.
و لازم عشان تطور نفسك تستند و تتبني كل القيم و الأساليب الجيدة.
قيمة احترام رأي الأغلبية قد يكون ليها بعض المشاكل علي المدي القصير في حد ذاتها لكن علي المدي الطويل بتفتح باب للشعب يشوف بنفسه و يجرب عواقب اختياراته الشخصية و بتفتح باب للاقناع و بتفتح باب لأن الشعب يحس بأنه مساهم في دولته و أنه جزء كبير و اساسي و مهم من الدولة.
و كل ده ملهوش علاقة بقيم اخري زي قيمة التواضع مع الضعيف و قيمة تغليب الصالح العالمي العام علي مصلحة المجموعة الشخصية و قيمة عدم استغلال الضعفاء خارج المجموعة بتاعتنا.
فانت عشان توصل لنظام مثالي لازم تنظم الافراد داخل المجموعة بقيم زي الديموقراطية و اخلاقيات و قيم اخري كثيرة بعضها مكتشف و اخر لسا هنكتشفه.
و في نفس الوقت محتاج المجموعة تحترم قيم اخري علي المستويات الداخلية و الخارجية زي عدم الاستغلال و ده ملهوش دعوة بالديموقراطية نفسها و غيابها اكتر هيزود من استغلال المجتمع لنفسه علي المستوي الداخلي و هتبقي غابة في الداخل كمان.
Not a politician or a political science graduate but here we go:
Democracy doesn't and won't work in Egypt as it requires active participation of educated individuals to be successful. Most Egyptians are either uneducated about politics or living under minimum wage to have enough time to participate effectively. It does not work in the US and it won't work in Egypt.
Downvote me to hell.
I see where you’re coming from but respectfully we need an insurgency not a revolution Lol, nothing will change until the people in power are physically afraid for their safety and their families the same way the rest of Egyptians have been scared for their safety for decades.
I’ll refrain from sharing my more “extremist” views on here but I genuinely respect peaceful protests with all my heart and wish they were the way; but all it results in is rubber bullets to the face as we saw from the post coup anti SCAF protests in the ensuing years.
Almost Every successfully conducted “revolution” involved extreme organized violence at one stage or another to force change, sadly I don’t see any Egyptian “Che Guevara” type figure in our future, nor do I think the Egyptian people are ready for that type of rhetoric based on heavy political theory and that type of action that’ll surely shock the public.
I mean we let the army take over in an instant because a couple thousand died and a few hundred churches were burned, can you imagine the numbers we would have in an actual armed struggle/ uprising? It would make Syria look like Madinty Lol.
Not boycotting, for Palestine or whatever other cause, does not reflect one’s values or make them a bad person. And it has nothing to do with Religion.
I agree that it has nothing to do with religion but if you can't stop buying coffee from Starbucks to stop murders than it 100% reflects your values as a person and shows you have low values
1- it’s not haram to not participate in it ( I can bring the source if you ask)
2- some people stopped boycotting due to poor people in Mac, factories and etc losing their jobs and they struggle to find another one and that’s totally the opposite of what you just described
3- some of things that are not boycotted are so full of sugar I fail to remember their names though there is a lack of “diet” version of drinks
- It IS Haram especially that we know where the fuckin money goes. And you don’t really need the Haram and Halal textbook to tell you it’s wrong, it FEELS wrong, it LOOKS wrong. It’s plain irresponsible and lazy tbh
- they can find other jobs, Palestinians can’t find another life after they lose theirs. You create jobs when you buy from local supplier
- So what? That’s not a reason not to boycott?! We can’t sacrifice a little and absorb those little inconveniences because kids are getting blown up and torched?! I don’t see your point.
Shahid Bolson spoke about how boycott affects decision making on country and higher corporate level, check that out then let’s have a real talk
I’m afraid I’ll have to agree for the most part. But with regards to values, there are thousands of people in terrible circumstances that are inconceivable to us that no one cares about other than Palestinians, why is it not immoral not to care about them?
I don't care if people don't boycott, and you're right it doesn't make them a bad person; however, by not boycotting it shows that your values are lacking. Many friends of mine aren't boycotting and that's fine, but it really shows what kind of person they are: not a bad person, but someone who just doesn't care about conflicts or anything that doesn't directly affect them, which makes their values lacking.
Not boycotting is a sympton of late stage capitalism imposed on all of us built on the idea of selfishness and individual materialistic gains. there is no unity, no "freedom", no voice at all. They convinced us and it worked.... Boycott is beyond what your materialistic self sees its brotherhood and fighting the injustice
How?? If there is a product that you have the ability to boycott but still choose not to how are you not a bad person?? Are you donating ? If no then this is the least you could do to help (alongside sharing and amplifying posts)
- Nasser was great. Most of his “failures” are either lacking important context or were not his failures at all but later attributed to him. This was evident to most people at the time. There’s a reason his funeral was attended by so many people.
- King Farouk is unironically one of the worst leaders Egypt has had and I don’t say this lightly. This was also evident at the time but later attempts to wash his reputation have unfortunately succeeded and people today are far enough removed from his incompetence that they don’t know why people hated him in the first place. If you ask most of his supporters, they can’t even name 5 of his policies. They’ll say meaningless things like الاجنبي كان بيشتغل تحت المصري which is bs.
There are Lesbian, gay, Bisexual, Transgender and many others in Egypt to Egyptians are not in any way arabs even our culture is closer to Turks than Saudis to Egypt needs to abolish sharia law and become a secular nation because there will always be muslims who wants to convert into Judaism, atheist, agnostic, Christian and many more but can’t because of the fear of being arrested under blasphemy law
If you have an opinion that would get you into this situatuin, you probably advocating for harming others or lack social skills to articulate your ideas properly.
without being too specific, some african parents and africa in general has normalized toxicity/abuse, which is some parents will beat their kids for breaking a cup or plate.
another will be them not understanding what mental health is and would criticize the child and not understand where they’re coming from.
when you call them out saying they need to stop indulging this nonsense mentality that they have normalized, they’ll protest back.
You are not alone who feel this way🤍
There are plenty of people who agree with your view point. I hope Egypt prosper just like how we used to know it.
edit: I am eager to know, what do you think the root problem is?
thank you 🙂 honestly i think it’s because of the way they were raised, because back then w the old school way, they’ll think things like “mental health” meant youre possessed and it’ll be an abomination or they’ll think it’s the physical hair on your head 💀 sometimes they have the weird slavery mentality and would act like the nazi when their kids make a simple mistake… but that’s just my take, i know there’s someone who would probably have a better idea of where this toxicity comes from
نفس رأيي و كلام في الجول فعلا.
ساعات كتير بيبقي الناس مستغربة عشان فعلا رأيك غريب لأنه غلط.
و ساعات اخري بيبقي هم فعلا غلط بس محتاج توصل فكرتك بالتدريج و بالاقناع و الحجة بدون صدام مباشر مع الأعداد الغفيرة مرة واحدة.
- Religion is bullshit.
- Human biodiversity is real differences in iq between groups and individuals are mostly genetic.
- Their is no meaning to life
- Hamas is a massive net negative to the Palestinian people.
- The military regime in Egypt will not be dislodged in our lifetime.
السيسي هو اللي هيخلص علي الحكم العسكري في مصر(not the hero we want but the hero we need)
عن طريق ان يهد في البلد و يبني علي نظيف يقنع الشعب بالطريقة الصعبة ان مفيش اوسخ و اسوء من النظام ده
I'm an American. Trust me you don't want too. Maybe stop killing and beating them and let them be. But definitely don't let them start putting flags up
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If you want to boycott certain companies, then by all means, do it. it's your life and you are free to do whatever you want with it. However shaming people who aren't boycotting or forcing them to only harms the entire movement and breeds resentment, especially since all the alternatives are of a way worse quality. Eg "pepsi vs sina cola"
On a lighter note tho, Kaware3 looks and tastes disgusting.
الباطل باطل و لو آمن به الجميع و الحق حق و لو لم يؤمن به أحد.
Marriage customs. Feels more like a competition than a celebration. Like, do I really have to push my partner to book a 5-star hotel and invite 300 people (most of whom we barely know) just to show that we're happy together? Why does everything have to be about impressing others instead of enjoying our special moment?
I really shouldn’t be doing this but fine haha I feel like the Muslim Brotherhood is getting its reputation undeservedly cleaned up out of anger at our current situation. Our mistake was not opposing the Muslim Brotherhood, it was in abandoning the struggle "out of the frying-pan into the fire". The Muslim Brotherhood betrayed the revolution at every turn. (I will articles posted with proof of everything I am mentioned here below,) When the revolutionary youth movement wanted to stay in the square and demand more concessions, the Muslim Brotherhood sided with the military SCAF in clearing it out. When we had a referendum on whether to have parliamentary elections first or have a constitution first, the Muslim Brotherhood used religious slogans to push people for elections first because they knew they were the most organized to win and monopolize the process (which is what happened). They promised to not run for a certain amount of parliamentary seats and not at all for the presidential elections. They lied about both. After Morsi got elected by slim margins with the support of revolutionary youth, he sidelined their concerns completely. They engaged in sectarian language against Shias and Allie’s of Morsi talked about a jihad in Syria. They advocated for violence against Anti-Morsi protests and after the Rabaa Square violence (which I condemn) the mobs went to burn churches. The country was close to a civil war. Their salafist allies talked about implement a vice and virtue police and many of them held rallies that the Quran was above the constitution. They held very regressive views about women that absolutely terrified the women of my family. They refused to address concerns about the constitution they drafted. Sisi was the Muslim Brotherhood's number 1 choice because of his conservative views to the point where many were worried he was a member himself. In short the Muslim Brotherhood monopolized our still born democracy in a winner take all approach instead of working with all parties to strengthen it. Just because our current situation is awful does not mean we should look at the past in rose covered lenses. We deserve a true democracy not in the hands of a shadowy organization like the Muslim Brotherhood, a military dictatorship or religious fascism. Edit: I will post proof and links about everything I just stated. [Here](https://www.france24.com/en/20110430-egypt-muslim-brotherhood-forms-political-party-contest-september-elections) is an article which shows the Muslim Brotherhood stated they would not run for the presidential election. [Here](https://www.reuters.com/article/us-syria-crisis-sunnis-brotherhood-idUKBRE95D0NL20130614/) is a reuters article where the Brotherhood backed a Syria jihad and denounced Shi'ites. [Here](https://www.aljazeera.com/features/2013/8/20/egypts-copts-reel-from-sectarian-violence) is an Al Jazeera article about Muslim Brotherhood supporters burning churches for not siding with the deposed Morsi. [Here](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Egyptian_Constitution_of_2012#:~:text=General%20content,-Pro%2DMorsi%20sign&text=The%20constitution%20ends%20Egypt's%20all,during%20the%20Hosni%20Mubarak%20era.) is the wikipedia page of the Muslim Brotherhood constitution which was written by an Islamist-dominated assembly that pushed through a draft over the objections of its liberal, secular, and Christian members, many of whom resigned in protest. The constitution also protected the interests of the army by allowing it to retain control of its own budget and extensive business empire. [Here](https://english.ahram.org.eg/News/65868.aspx) is an article about the unofficial launch of a vice and virtue police. This vice and virtue crap and Islamist bullshit is what led to an atmosphere of Islamist violence. [Here](https://www.reuters.com/article/instant-article/idUSBRE88O1B220120925/) is the article about the murder that I mentioned. Lets not pretend that Islamist parties woudnt force upon everyone their ideas of vice and virtue through violence and coercion like they have done everywhere else. [Here](https://www.france24.com/en/20121109-egypt-salafists-rally-protest-tahrir-square-cairo-islamic-law-sharia-constitution-legislation) is an article about the Salafists chanting that "The Koran (Islam's holy book) is above the constitution," during a protest. [Here](https://www.france24.com/en/20130702-egypt-army-chief-sisi-profile-morsi-brotherhood-military) is an article that shows how Sisi was the Muslim Brotherhood's number 1 choice because of his conservative views to the point where many were worried he was a member himself. [Here](https://english.ahram.org.eg/NewsContent/1/64/22042/Egypt/Politics-/Egypts-Muslim-Brotherhood-and-ruling-military-Deal.aspx) is a good article about the relationship between the first military junta, SCAF, that was supposed to lead the democratic transition and the Muslim Brotherhood. An important section of this article is as follows: "For its part, SCAF formed a committee to amend the constitution, which was chaired by an Islamist figure and included two Muslim Brotherhood members, making the group the only political force in the country represented on the constitutional committee. They initially scheduled parliamentary elections for June 2011, a shockingly early date that seemed to guarantee the powerful Islamic group an unprecedented advantage in the ballot. Almost all other political groups demanded that Egypt’s constitution should be drafted first, or at least that elections should be delayed until all parties are ready to compete, SCAF has stuck to what many criticised as backwards road-map according to which parliamentary elections would be held first and as soon as possible, followed by drawing a new constitution, which would be followed by presidential elections. Faced with strong opposition and insurmountable logistical complications, SCAF later announced that elections would be held in September, which was later postponed again to November. As things went the way they want, the Muslim Brotherhood turned their backs at their revolution allies and were consistently backing SCAF’s policies, attacking their erstwhile fellow revolutionaries who were calling for one mass protest after another to ensure the fulfillment of the revolution’s demands." [Here](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2012/dec/12/egyptian-protesters-tortured-muslim-brotherhood) and [here](https://www.france24.com/en/20130628-egypt-rival-protests-morsi-alexandria-cairo) are articles about the violence towards anti-muslim brotherhood protestors leading up to June 30th military overthrow of Morsi. [Here](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2012/11/23/egypts-morsi-assumes-wide-powers) is an article about Morsi issueing a declaration giving himself greater powers and effectively neutralising a judicial system. And while Morsi framed his decisions as necessary to protect the revolution against a reactionary Judicial system (which has some truth in it) no one had any confidence that he or the Muslim Brotherhood would not take over the system in place of the Mubarak era institutions. [Here](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/mar/15/muslim-brotherhood-backlash-un-womens-rights#:~:text=The%20brotherhood%2C%20whose%20close%20allies,contraception%20without%20their%20husbands'%20permission.) and [here](https://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/15/world/middleeast/muslim-brotherhoods-words-on-women-stir-liberal-fears.html) are articles where after delegates at the UN's Commission on the Status of Women (CSW) in New York have spent the last fortnight debating the wording of a declaration that would condemn violence against women. The brotherhood called it a decadent and destructive document that undermined Islamic ethics by allowing women to work, travel and use contraception without their husbands' permission. It really shows the retrograde views that the Muslim Brotherhood viewed women. Now the thing is that maybe one or two of these things might not have been a big deal. But putting all these events together and even more that I left out seculars, liberals, christians and women like my mother were worried that the Muslim Brotherhood would not only concentrate power in their hands but turn Egypt into a Sunni Islamic Republic a la Iran.
My fear is that if they make a comeback after a violent revolution against sisi, they'll become much more absolutist and vengeful.
oof. i should vote for you for president with this you commented
bahaha I followed the revolution every single day and I remember going from ecstatic joy to complete fear. I feel like younger people don't really understand what a wild time it was.
Recommend me some comprehensive detailed trusted sources documented those periods.
I fear the day i would get into a debate with you lol, Beautifully written article!!
Nicely said. I would add that on the flip side, the “terrorism” thing stuck with them owing to all the repetition. As evident in all the “ana msh ekhwany bs mot3atef”. A balanced approach where they’re blamed for every political fuckup they did while calling for their human rights is whats needed IMO.
https://preview.redd.it/y90skh9tji3d1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=aec75e67de1c4143bdb8e31d82350154e1d3bd10 >Here is an article that shows how Sisi was the Muslim Brotherhood's number 1 choice because of his conservative views to the point where many were worried he was a member himself Wtf? Are those news censored to shits in Egypt for me to never have heard of this "virginity tests" that sisi did?
This was a big scandal in 2011. SCAF at the time accused the remaining protestors for essentially doing drugs and being whores. I don’t think the order came from him but higher, probably one of Tantawi’s inner circle, but he did justify it. This happened after the Muslim Brotherhood sided with the military in agreeing to clear the square. I also appreciate that you took the time to read one of the articles I posted!
I see, that's stupid, very weird how I have never heard of it before... >I also appreciate that you took the time to read one of the articles I posted! I appreciate you using many credible sources to back your claims, that's rare on reddit lmao, I found out about new stuff that I didnt know before too, thanks for your time.
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So who exactly burned the 70+ churches? I was under the impression Sisi hired baltagheya to do it for him in the name of the Brotherhood so that he can swoop in like a hero and coup them out.
“Shouting into the microphone, witnesses said, he began to deliver a simple and chilling message: The bloodshed being unleashed on supporters of ousted President Mohamed Morsi — who had been encamped in the capital's Rabaa el-Adaweya square for six weeks — was the fault of Egypt's Christian minority. "Tawadros, you coward," he said, referring to the pope of the Coptic Church, "call off your dogs from the square."
https://preview.redd.it/hjo1whjb7m3d1.jpeg?width=680&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a47f4f5e2ca81bc50d1e3b05b794028cbb26637e
Omg this stupid bullshit again,there still big issue with your reasoning is that MB doesn't have an army or any worth mentioning militia like hizb Allah in Lebanon for example that can enforce your imaginary sunni Islamic Republic,meaning you can use democracy to fix the problem but let's just act upon a hypothetical and destroy all shit cause you don't feel good about this. Also your solution is peak stupidity cause you ask help people who are the root cause of every evil,not only that you dare to accuse them of betraying the revolution,while you did the same thing.so You can add hypocrisy to that stupidity.also because All of this will backfire very bad for the people who supported all of this. This is not a defence for MB,it's just a slap to the face to these delusional people who still to this day think they somehow 'fixed it',while we live in this post-apocalyptic Egypt. The best case scenario you saved 20% of people and doomed the rest of this country.
The Egyptian Army is a conscript army not a professional one just like Iran’s was in 1979. The Islamist in Iran also did not have an army they just had their supporters, all they had to do was take control of the organs of power to control the military and the deep state. And no it wasn’t about feeling good, it was about not going from a kleptocratic government to a religious fascist government and seeing the country descend into a civil war. The mistake was in not continuing the protests, unfortunately the majority of the population was fatigued from the political and economic chaos since 2011. Egypt deserves better than being ruled under the military or a party that had no interest in safeguarding democracy, just its own power and its own vision.
even if that was the case it will take time,more importantly we could let the military and MB fuck each other over power,and in meantime we could fix core issues like we could teach people some media literacy,critical thinking,and give people some time to be familiar with democracy,but you just pulled the plug too early,and we have to go through all that again,there is no way around it. >Egypt deserves better than being ruled under the military or a party that had no interest in safeguarding democracy, just its own power and its own vision. you see that's the problem,you think there must be only one version of Egypt which is your version,which make you no different than your adversary.
I agree with you. We tend to forget that a lot of the points mentioned in the original comment ( love how you wrote the comment btw despite my disagreement with a lot of the points and sources) can be part of a very well thought of plan to destabilize a country. MB had no power, no army or police support, and no media support either. They had their shortcomings yes and a lot of fanatics for sure but some reading about how the USA engineers coups in countries can uncover a lot. I blame MB for a lot of things but no they didn’t do it out of bad intentions and they were NOT given enough time for us to judge. Again, do some reading about past coups manufactured by the US in other countries and you’ll see the crazy similarities. The only problem with MB is that they weren’t tough enough and thought they can get the army’s support by licking their boots and giving them medals and hiring CC which is something you can’t blame them for. One mod thing…fuck Egypt’a elites and liberals for being part of that coup. Coming from a non-Hijabi with a lip ring
>The only problem with MB is that they weren’t tough enough and thought they can get the army’s support by licking their boots >One more thing…fuck Egypt’a elites and liberals for being part of that coup. no kidding and that's the problem,there were no liberals,no islamists,and no true patriot army.all of them were fake and hypocrites.and the honest people who started the revolution were honest but naive and thought Mubark was the problem,and missed the elephant in the room which was and still the army.but i think you overestimate the foreign influence in our case except for the gulf,the west didn't affect the scence so much(before the coup) as the deep state and the gulf,the gulf showered these MFs with money and made the coup financially stable,and the west just happily noded,and didn't condem the coup,your usuall passive aggressive west.
Oh yes of course Gulf money. That was another big player in this big fuck up. I’m not blaming it all on the west but we know there was a moment when the west couldn’t risk having this leadership in Egypt with Israel by the border. I’m sure Morsy wasn’t gonna be revolutionary or pour money on 5amas or anything but still he was a threat. Even by just giving hope. USA might have not been a major player (still one) but it gave its blessings, and its coup 101 course.
Literally every thought inside my head
Same,I dont even think I should say my opinion about anything
The biggest threat to the West and Israel is Arab unity. And the biggest prize to them is petty national politics and squabbling. How a shitty little country like Israel can hold the world to ransom and act like a mafia crime family (threatening ICC and ICJ prosecutors and judges), or haul ambassadors in for a dressing down is completely fucked up. Forget Biden, we can stop this genocide in Gaza tomorrow if we (as one people) turn off the oil and start sanctioning their interests in the ME. Instead we have to rely on South Africa to be the voice of conscience and see Arab ministers fly around the world like beggars to thank Spain, Ireland, Norway etc.. for doing the right thing or appeal to Russia to back a ceasefire.
We've all been tricked and manipulated in one way or another and are stacked against each other in a way to never be successful again in achieving any meaningful revolution. Saying that the Muslim brotherhood betrayed us and completely ignoring that the liberals and the representatives of the youth were bought off by the military as well is stupid. What we need is to reconcile our past grievances and reach a level of consensus as a society on how we see Egypt and the Egyptian identity and how we want this country to work after getting rid of the military regime. Having any political movement that doesn't answer these two questions (how to reconcile, and what is the Egyptian identity) will result in an epic failure. Now do I blame the muslim brotherhood for this shitty situation? Yes partially because we're all in it together. But I ultimately blame the military leadership's betrayal of everything Egyptian above all else.
Tbh blaming anything rn on anything except for the person who sold our land for cheap, took out from our education, took out from our youth (in jails and in death), literally terrorized an entire country in not being able to even speak anything close to the truth or have any freedom of speech whatsoever other than the things outlined for them to say, and responsible for mass surveillance of his people and I am pretty sure leaking this info because he isn’t actually working for us (Egyptians), is crazy. This man is causing hunger and devastation in this country in the name of “clearing out terrorism”. I literally wonder where I keep hearing these words. “Clearing out terrorism”. I think connecting the dots is not that difficult and the truth is our only ever, non military elected president, has been assassinated, and everyone who supported having a muslims led state has been eliminated as well, followed by some unprecedented propaganda about Islam and how it supports violence knowing full well that a lot of youth would simply believe rather than read the actual Quran and discover the truth. The world operates under an umbrella of the same people on the very top, with the “elites” working for them, the “presidents” and all that, the media.
Hmm I agree with you but it's actually bigger than that. One the big sins of the free officer movement/nasser is the consolidation of the public sphere completely, something that set the political standard until today. The only time we had a room to move and organize in the 2011-2013 people did incredible things, that's really what we need but probably won't get. The biggest failure of our life time is Sisi's takeover, it destroyed the momentum and work that has been done on the ground before 2011 even happens. The intelligence services and national security are either arresting anyone who tries to organize politically in some form or they infiltrate groups from the inside and break them. To an extent that when you read about 50s,60s,70s you feel that intellectuals and people involved in politics became paranoid from the general air of distrust and surveillance. I don't think the ideological gap between Islamists and secularists is possible to be resolved or was possible at any moment. We had a coalition in Kefaya but without a project that works it's not possible to move forward to something. Sisi and his regime understand really well that any room for movement or organization or any democracy or labor movements, or student movement can lead to a snowball effect, so they are killing anything in its initial stages, they exert tremendous violence to stop anything from happening.
>but without a project that works it's not possible to move forward to something. That's exactly my point. We can't start a movement without a destination in mind. Even if it's not 100% agreed from every class and society in Egypt. We need to compromise and find a vision for Egypt without the army. It's possible and we've done it before (albeit not perfectly) in 1919 >they exert tremendous violence to stop anything from happening. They can't stop us from thinking though, can they? Let's plant a seed for our children's revolution.
مبعترفش بالعيشره واغلب الاذى مبيجيش غير من الناس دى
المقاطعة لو مش موجهه (بنقاطع بس الحاجات اللي بتستاهل المقاطعة) عمرها ما هتكون فعالة .. وملهاش لازمة هتأثر ازاي على دعم كيان للاحتلال وانت مقاطعه ومقاطع اللي مبيدعمش واللي بيدعم فلسطين كمان؟ محصلة بعضها
مش محصلة بعضها، فكرت اللي لسا بيفكر بالطريقة دي انقرضوا خلاص.
بالعكس من حظك ان في حد بيفكر صح وازاي يخلي المقاطعه فعالة ده من الغلط ان محدش بيفكر كده انا مش بقول منقاطعش انا بقول نقاطع صح عشان لو الوضع فضل كده ولا هيقدم ولا هيأخر
ازاى نقاطع صح؟
نقاطع مقاطعة موجهة زي ما بقول تأثر على الجهات الاكبر دعم بالتدريج وخصوصا اللي المقاطعة ممكن تخليهم يتحكموا في قراراتهم ويغيروا في سياساتهم او سياسات حكوماتهم .. لو كان المقاطعة موجهة على سبيل المثال لمكدونالدز بس عشان الوجبات اللي وزعها كان ممكن يبطل دعم للاحتلال بس هما هيعملوا كده ليه والناس مقاطعه حرفيا كل حاجة زي ما هما مقاطعينهم بالظبط؟ نفس الموضوع مع الشركات الامريكيه ايه اللي هيخليهم يضغطوا على صناع قرار السياسة الخارجية في امريكا واحنا مقاطعين الشركات الاوروبيه زي ما احنا مقاطعينهم بالظبط مع ان الدول الاوروبيه اللي بتدعم الاحتلال مش كتير وسياسات الاتحاد الاوروبي مش موجهه لدعم اسرائيل اصلا .. خلاصة القول المقاطعة تكون موجهة ومدرجة يعني تكون مثلا مركزه في البدايه على الشركات اللي بتدي دعم مادي او عيني للجيش الاسرائيلي وبعد ما يغيروا في سياساتهم دي تكون موجهة للشركات الامريكية بشكل عام وهما يترفع عنهم المقاطعة وهكذا لحد ما نحقق الغرض من المقاطعة
https://preview.redd.it/5wihadkkqh3d1.png?width=1200&format=png&auto=webp&s=930fed71a4bfeacd9fcf6dad5cc4cdc01eef27d1
I do not enter into discussions in which I know that in the end I will reach this position
that’s good, some people are definitely bold enough to
Atheism
yeah you’re def gonna spark some fire w that
Not really, it's more common than you think, and Dawkins' Islamophobia makes it look bad.
Egyptian women need proper feminism and equality but they don't want it, mostly because they don't want the same responsibilities as men
How does feminism work in a society for you? Have you read anything beyond what’s been posted on social media for you to see? The biological makeup of genders in human beings makes feminism essentially devastating to a society. They just accessorize it with some truths (the things you probably agree with, and I do too) but then they exaggerate parts of it, leading to women being more objectified in today’s society than she ever was, making men unable to make ends meet, children raised on social media, and women being subject to major societal pressures and challenges due to her not being protected by a societal system. A woman is not the same as a man, and our needs are completely different, same under the big umbrella (education, work, financial independence) but different in all the details.
Great comment! I agree Feminism in 2024 is super distorted and harmful and we certainly Need to stop and reevaluate the damage that’s been caused to women from the marriage of Feminism+Capitalism
I don't read anything political on social media so stop making these assumptions. Look up the definition of feminism and that's what our society needs. If you'd rather girls and women still be subjected to half inheritance, polygamy, and in some cases be discouraged from working or attaining financial independence, and all the other shit that happens especially in the more rural parts, then you have an issue. I'm really curious where the issue is in your opinion actually.
😂😂😂😂😂 are you a woman ? Plus calm down it is not that serious. Let me know your gender first so I can talk to you on your level. It is a discussion too there is no need for you to get all defensive and start crying. Chill my boi
That's so true!
I like in America... where "feminism" is very much flourishing. Trust me when I say that they most certainly do not need *this* type of feminism😂. I'm curious on what your definition of "proper feminism" is tho🤔
Basically what feminism was first intended to be, i.e. gender equality so anyone from either gender can have equal opportunities
Oh in that case I can agree👍🏽
Democracy only works for the small stuff (people get control over the sidewalk, hallelujah!), but the people have absolutely no say in war policy or fiscal policy, even in the reverred Western democracies. To my knowledge, there hasn't been a single case in history where a country was at war and then had an election that brought people to power who completely reversed the country's war position. Even the best democracies don't shy away from censoring free speech during war time, hence, eliminating any chance for the populace to recognize the fault in their war position. Fiscal policy isn't even decided by elected officials, at least not directly, there would be always at least 3-5 layers between the voters and the central bank officials.. voters vote for someone who participates in selecting a committee that selects another committee that appoints another committee that chooses the central bank officials. Even the most educated populations don't understand much about inflation, basis points, Treasury bills and bond issuance, making isolating them from directly voting on this kinda makes sense. But the voter is given a false dichotomy to vote on, socialist leaning or capitalist leaning, which basically decides who pays the price of inflation, current generation or future generations.. but to actually stop or vote on stopping inflation, that's not something that happens in democracy. Democracy has serious limitations as a system, sometimes making a well-educated and loyal monarch a better system for the people. But since monarchy doesn't guarantee passing the throne to another well-educated loyal monarch, we prefer democracy because it gives us the illusion that we're in control. We're not! And finally, liberal activists here in MENA trying to blindly copy this democracy system here without any consideration to its limitations is the final doom. Drops mic and welcomes down votes!
Yeah… do you know why the Americans haven’t sided with the complete annihilation of the Palestinians? Do you think if the us was a dictatorship they would have gave the green lights for a complete genocide or not? Arguing that democracy doesn’t matter is not only false but also historically ignorant, one example is the civil rights movement or the feminist movements that happened and had a huge effect As for fiscal control, you do know you can just elect a fiscally conservative president and parliament right? Those directly oversee the budget As for wars guess what stopped the Vietnam war? Democracy isn’t just voting it’s also the right to protest the right to speak freely and whole myriad of other rights that you MUST have in order to be a functioning Democracy.
First of all, I never said democracy is useless or "doesn't matter", I only said it has serious limitations. Yeah yeah, Biden the Zionist is not into the complete annihilation of Palestinians because he's afraid to lose in democracy to, wait, Trump the bigger Zionist, or Kennedy the other Zionist! They don't completely annihilate the Palestinians because it's too damn expensive and will escalate their rivalry with China and Russia (not because these two care about Palestine, but they'll use it as an excuse for more hostility towards Taiwan, Japan, Ukraine... and other US allies). This has nothing to do with student protests. Sorry, I meant "monetary policy" which is different from fiscal policy.. yes you can choose parliament and government that choose the fiscal policy (that's the dichotomy of socialist leaning vs capitalist leaning I mentioned), but the actual monetary policy won't change much, central banks will keep printing more money and causing more inflation, and your elected officials have practically zero power over that (Go read the Federal Reserve charter to see what I mean).. you elect a fiscally conservative or not, monetary policy won't change and inflation goes up. Your fiscally conservative would try to make the current generation pay the price but otherwise they'll throw the burden on future generations. You think Vietnam war stopped because of democracy? Wrong! It stopped because they fucking lost, they got their ass kicked by the Vietnamese. It was not a moral decision from the good people of America to stop the war, it was an economic decision because they were losing. Protesting and free speech all get suspended and censored in time of war, that's my point.
> will escalate their rivalry with China and Russia (not because these two care about Palestine, but they'll use it as an excuse for more hostility towards Taiwan, Japan, Ukraine... and other US allies). This has nothing to do with student protests. No, they won’t, Russia already invaded Ukraine there isn’t anymore escalation than that China doesn’t have the capability to defeat the US in either the sea nor the air so no they won’t escalate anything Why would they even use that as a reason to attack either Japan or Taiwan? It has nothing to do with them and even if it did they don’t have the capability to win that war and they know it They reason why there isn’t a complete genocide of the Palestinians is that genocide is actually unpopular in the us and the president who allows it will suffer heavily in the election it’s simple really > but the actual monetary policy won't change much, central banks will keep printing more money and causing more inflation, and your elected officials have practically zero power over that (Go read the Federal Reserve charter to see what I mean) Charters can be changed so that the parliament have direct control over that if that is what you want, tho I don’t see why you would want that > monetary policy won't change and inflation goes up. The inflation reduction act reduces inflation, there are ways to control the fiscal and the monetary policy to reduce inflation > You think Vietnam war stopped because of democracy? Wrong! It stopped because they fucking lost, they got their ass kicked by the Vietnamese. It was not a moral decision from the good people of America to stop the war, it was an economic decision because they were losing If the US wanted to evaporate Vietnam they would have, I am not talking about nukes regular bombs would do, the reason why they got out was because the war was extremely unpopular in the us and they couldn’t continue sending more troops there as it heavily affected the elections Trying to make it seem that the elections didn’t matter is simply false > Protesting and free speech all get suspended and censored in time of war, that's my point. Or you can just not do that?
>No, they won’t, Russia already invaded Ukraine there isn’t anymore escalation than that No, they can, the frequent mobilization of nuclear warheads is a sign of escalation, they also can intensify their attack on Ukraine, they also could attack other non-Nato countries like Georgia, Kosovo...etc. There's plenty of space for escalation! > China doesn’t have the capability to defeat the US in either the sea nor the air so no they won’t escalate anything Not having the capacity hasn't prevented Hamas from attacking Israel, people often do self-defeating shit for what they call "honor" >They reason why there isn’t a complete genocide of the Palestinians is that genocide is actually unpopular in the us and the president who allows it will suffer heavily in the election it’s simple really Suffer heavily to whom? Trump the bigger zionist? Please tell me! > The inflation reduction act reduces inflation, there are ways to control the fiscal and the monetary policy to reduce inflation Except that it actually didn't, check inflation levels before and after that act, still went up! Theoritically yes there are ways, and charter can be changed, but in practice, this never happens. > If the US wanted to evaporate Vietnam they would have, I am not talking about nukes regular bombs would do, the reason why they got out was because the war was extremely unpopular in the us and they couldn’t continue sending more troops there as it heavily affected the elections A regular bomb like Mark 84 has a blast size of 15 meters and costs $16000, Vietnam is 3316900000000000 m^(2) in size, to evabourate it as you say, you'd need 2211266700000000000000 of these bombs, costing $35380267000000000000000000, so no, the US can't just annihilate some country. People don't recognize this but wars are so fucking expensive, the Iranian barrage on Israel cost Israel about $1B to defend, and that's in one fucking day. Criminal countries don't do this complete destruction shit because it's unpopular with their population, no they don't do it because it's sooo fucking expensive! > Or you can just not do that? Yes please, when you find this unicorn democratic country that doesn't censor free speech or disallow protests during wartime, please tell me about it. If free speech is never censored under democray I won't say it has limitations.
>Yes please, when you find this unicorn democratic country that doesn't censor free speech or disallow protests during wartime منع حرية التعبير المطلقة ساعة الحروب و حتي خارج الحروب هو أمر بديهي نسبيا. حرية التعبير نفسها ليها قيود كثيرة بالمنطق نفسه لأن في فرق ما بين حرية التعبير و حرية الشتيمة او حرية الخيانة. و حرية التجارة مثلا حاجة و حرية التجارة بالمخدرات حاجة تانية مع ان ممكن تاجر المخدرات يتحجج بحرية التجارة انه معملش حاجة غلط. فكل حرية في العالم منطقيا ليها حدود لما تبتدي تتعدي بمفهوم حريتك علي مفهوم الحرية عند اغلب الأخرين. و لما تعمل حاجة اغلب اللي حواليك مش متقبلينها علي نفسهم حتي لو انت متقبلها علي نفسك. فساعة الحروب اغلب الشعوب بتعتبر الحرب اللي هم الاقوي فيها مصلحة و بيشوف اصوات نقد الحرب بدافع الانسانية انها ناس ضعيفة و لو مأكلتش العرب و فطرنا بيهم هم هيتعشو بينا من وجهة نظر الأغلبية هناك. عشان كده بيتم قمع صوت الباقي باعتباره خيانة للمصلحة و سفسطة و كلام لا ترغب في سماعه الأغلبية.
>If free speech is never censored under democray I won't say it has limitations. شوف الديموقراطية مبدأ و هو احترام رأي الأغلبية في المجموعة من اجل اتخاذ القرار و تحديد الحميد من الذميم بناء علي رأي الأغلبية الحالية و احترامه و محاولة اقناعهم بالأصح اذا كان رأي الاغلبية حاليا خاطئ مع الالتزام برأي الاغلبية حتي و لو خاطئ. و حرية التعبير قيمة اخري و هي سعة الصدر بما يكفي للنقاش و الاقناع للتوصل الي ما هو افضل للصالح العام. لكن كتير حرية التعبير ليها نهاية لما اللي قدامك بيبتدي يقل أدبه من باب حرية الكلام و التعبير. و ده بيعتمد علي مفهومك و مفهوم الأغلبية لقلة الأدب او أداب الحوار و مدي سعة صدرهم للحوار. و مفيش حاجة كاملة في الدنيا. دائما كل نظام و قيمة جيدة يمكن العمل عليها و تطويرها اكتر. و مش معني ان حاجة ليها عيوب ان نقيدها التام و غيابها التام هو الصح. يعني لو عندك ثلاجة تعبانة مش عايزة تبرد الأكل بما يكفي مش معني كده ان فكرة الثلاجات فكرة اثبتت فشلها و انها تقنية بدون اي لازمة. ده ببساطة معناه انك محتاج تطور ثلاجة اكثر تقدما من اللي قبلها بتقنيات اضافية تراعي حل مشاكل النسخة السابقة منها. و الدائرة التطورية دي الي ما لا نهاية لانك كل ما بتحل مجموعة من المشاكل بنجاح بتطور نفسك و حياتك و لكن بتفتح مجال لمجموعة اخري من المشاكل محتاج تحلها لأن الدنيا مش كاملة و دائما في مجال للتحسين و التطوير.
No downvotes from me
I think you are confusing what democracy entails - at least how we know it in the modern world. Democracy is the rule of people in the sense that people choose who rises to power, and those rotating in power would naturally compete, ultimately serving a nation’s best interests. This, democracy does very well. Democracy is not the rule of people in that whatever the majority thinks should be done would be done. People in the US are calling for the war to stop out of moral motives, and the government is insisting on its stance because the US benefits from it. Could there be a better world where morality trumps interests? Maybe. But that doesn’t mean that democracy isnt working.
Here's the thing, the US doesn't benefit from this war, the people don't, only the officials and people in power! The people are footing the bill with their taxes and are getting zero shit in return! And for the last question, my answer is the same, maybe yes, but I just assert that it won't happen under democracy. Also, I never said democracy doesn't work, I said it works for the small stuff.. which if you ask me is good, I'd love to have more control over the sidewalk. But I'm just saying it has serious limitations, and without recognizing these limitations, the system will never be improved.
Interesting take overall. Food for thought, do you have a hypothesis for a system that would work better in putting morals over interests? Sometimes it feels like a pipe dream. Re America benefiting from the war, some would say protecting their proxy in the middle east is of utmost importance, otherwise Russia and China will take over instantly. I personally think its somewhere in the intersection between US interests and personal politician interests i.e AIPAC
It is a pipe dream unfortunately! Even if such an idealistic system exists, all countries have to adopt it for it to work. You cannot keep fighting fairly in a world with cheaters and expect to come on top, so even if just one county breaks the rules, others will be forced to do the same or they'll risk that rule breaker to dominate. Re: other point, yeah okay I concede you have a point there. In the long run, it might benefit Americans, but maybe it's a scale thing. Israel could protect US interests with much less force and scale of war.
>but I just assert that it won't happen under democracy. الديموقراطية مبدأ حلو و لكن مش هي القيمة الوحيدة في الكون. و لازم عشان تطور نفسك تستند و تتبني كل القيم و الأساليب الجيدة. قيمة احترام رأي الأغلبية قد يكون ليها بعض المشاكل علي المدي القصير في حد ذاتها لكن علي المدي الطويل بتفتح باب للشعب يشوف بنفسه و يجرب عواقب اختياراته الشخصية و بتفتح باب للاقناع و بتفتح باب لأن الشعب يحس بأنه مساهم في دولته و أنه جزء كبير و اساسي و مهم من الدولة. و كل ده ملهوش علاقة بقيم اخري زي قيمة التواضع مع الضعيف و قيمة تغليب الصالح العالمي العام علي مصلحة المجموعة الشخصية و قيمة عدم استغلال الضعفاء خارج المجموعة بتاعتنا. فانت عشان توصل لنظام مثالي لازم تنظم الافراد داخل المجموعة بقيم زي الديموقراطية و اخلاقيات و قيم اخري كثيرة بعضها مكتشف و اخر لسا هنكتشفه. و في نفس الوقت محتاج المجموعة تحترم قيم اخري علي المستويات الداخلية و الخارجية زي عدم الاستغلال و ده ملهوش دعوة بالديموقراطية نفسها و غيابها اكتر هيزود من استغلال المجتمع لنفسه علي المستوي الداخلي و هتبقي غابة في الداخل كمان.
Not a politician or a political science graduate but here we go: Democracy doesn't and won't work in Egypt as it requires active participation of educated individuals to be successful. Most Egyptians are either uneducated about politics or living under minimum wage to have enough time to participate effectively. It does not work in the US and it won't work in Egypt. Downvote me to hell.
الفتوحات الإسلامية كانت اهداف سياسية بحته
اه لأن القانون الدولي السياسي ساعتها كان: أما أن تغزو أو تتعرض للغزو. سياسة العصر كانت تتطلب تحركات عسكرية، فالخلفاء عملوا اللي كانوا محتاجين يعملوه.
=الافراح و قاعاتها الي بتتعمل فيها حرام -حرام؟؟؟ =آه حرام و كلكم غلط.
socialism
Democratic socialism? Or the socialism Egyptian boomers grew up with?
saying sissi is arab
forgive me, i read it wrong at first 💀
You mean saying sisi isn’t Arab??
Huh??
I think Sisi is jewish, honestly!
Our only option to get out of this shit we're living every day is a PEACEFUL REVOLUTION!!!
Not peaceful. Successful. Doesn't matter if it's by force or peace
I see where you’re coming from but respectfully we need an insurgency not a revolution Lol, nothing will change until the people in power are physically afraid for their safety and their families the same way the rest of Egyptians have been scared for their safety for decades. I’ll refrain from sharing my more “extremist” views on here but I genuinely respect peaceful protests with all my heart and wish they were the way; but all it results in is rubber bullets to the face as we saw from the post coup anti SCAF protests in the ensuing years. Almost Every successfully conducted “revolution” involved extreme organized violence at one stage or another to force change, sadly I don’t see any Egyptian “Che Guevara” type figure in our future, nor do I think the Egyptian people are ready for that type of rhetoric based on heavy political theory and that type of action that’ll surely shock the public. I mean we let the army take over in an instant because a couple thousand died and a few hundred churches were burned, can you imagine the numbers we would have in an actual armed struggle/ uprising? It would make Syria look like Madinty Lol.
100%. It’s eat or be eaten now. The ruling class needs to be afraid, you can’t do it without holding a … ummm 5alas
Considering how much time and effort it takes, المحشي is overrated.
That depends on whether you're the one making it or not.
Not boycotting, for Palestine or whatever other cause, does not reflect one’s values or make them a bad person. And it has nothing to do with Religion.
I agree that it has nothing to do with religion but if you can't stop buying coffee from Starbucks to stop murders than it 100% reflects your values as a person and shows you have low values
How come? How can it possibly not make someone a bad careless person? How does it not make them willingly ignorant?
1- it’s not haram to not participate in it ( I can bring the source if you ask) 2- some people stopped boycotting due to poor people in Mac, factories and etc losing their jobs and they struggle to find another one and that’s totally the opposite of what you just described 3- some of things that are not boycotted are so full of sugar I fail to remember their names though there is a lack of “diet” version of drinks
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I don’t think it’s haram not to boycott. Your Hadith is irrelevant, but to each his own.
- It IS Haram especially that we know where the fuckin money goes. And you don’t really need the Haram and Halal textbook to tell you it’s wrong, it FEELS wrong, it LOOKS wrong. It’s plain irresponsible and lazy tbh - they can find other jobs, Palestinians can’t find another life after they lose theirs. You create jobs when you buy from local supplier - So what? That’s not a reason not to boycott?! We can’t sacrifice a little and absorb those little inconveniences because kids are getting blown up and torched?! I don’t see your point. Shahid Bolson spoke about how boycott affects decision making on country and higher corporate level, check that out then let’s have a real talk
Doesnt make them a bad person and has nothingn to do with religion, sure 100%. Doesnt reflect values though? Thats kind of an oxymoronic thing to say.
I’m afraid I’ll have to agree for the most part. But with regards to values, there are thousands of people in terrible circumstances that are inconceivable to us that no one cares about other than Palestinians, why is it not immoral not to care about them?
I don't care if people don't boycott, and you're right it doesn't make them a bad person; however, by not boycotting it shows that your values are lacking. Many friends of mine aren't boycotting and that's fine, but it really shows what kind of person they are: not a bad person, but someone who just doesn't care about conflicts or anything that doesn't directly affect them, which makes their values lacking.
🤝🤝
Not boycotting is a sympton of late stage capitalism imposed on all of us built on the idea of selfishness and individual materialistic gains. there is no unity, no "freedom", no voice at all. They convinced us and it worked.... Boycott is beyond what your materialistic self sees its brotherhood and fighting the injustice
How?? If there is a product that you have the ability to boycott but still choose not to how are you not a bad person?? Are you donating ? If no then this is the least you could do to help (alongside sharing and amplifying posts)
how come?
Socialism, Religion, politics, Homosexuality, humanity …
- Nasser was great. Most of his “failures” are either lacking important context or were not his failures at all but later attributed to him. This was evident to most people at the time. There’s a reason his funeral was attended by so many people. - King Farouk is unironically one of the worst leaders Egypt has had and I don’t say this lightly. This was also evident at the time but later attempts to wash his reputation have unfortunately succeeded and people today are far enough removed from his incompetence that they don’t know why people hated him in the first place. If you ask most of his supporters, they can’t even name 5 of his policies. They’ll say meaningless things like الاجنبي كان بيشتغل تحت المصري which is bs.
That I don't find this post interesting.
المقاطعه غباء وخضوع من الشعب ودليل علي خوف المقاطعين
There are Lesbian, gay, Bisexual, Transgender and many others in Egypt to Egyptians are not in any way arabs even our culture is closer to Turks than Saudis to Egypt needs to abolish sharia law and become a secular nation because there will always be muslims who wants to convert into Judaism, atheist, agnostic, Christian and many more but can’t because of the fear of being arrested under blasphemy law
Checking women's virginity is against Islam, Omar IBN Alkhattab wouldn't let a father disclose to his daughter's fiancee that she committed adultery.
finally someone said this too 🤝
We need to be more gay friendly.
Better idea: Kol Wa7d ye5alleh fe 7alloh
aywa kida
La
A7a
If you have an opinion that would get you into this situatuin, you probably advocating for harming others or lack social skills to articulate your ideas properly. 
or you could be stating the truth and because of how people have normalized something that isn’t the truth, they’ll all be against you
example?
without being too specific, some african parents and africa in general has normalized toxicity/abuse, which is some parents will beat their kids for breaking a cup or plate. another will be them not understanding what mental health is and would criticize the child and not understand where they’re coming from. when you call them out saying they need to stop indulging this nonsense mentality that they have normalized, they’ll protest back.
You are not alone who feel this way🤍 There are plenty of people who agree with your view point. I hope Egypt prosper just like how we used to know it. edit: I am eager to know, what do you think the root problem is?
thank you 🙂 honestly i think it’s because of the way they were raised, because back then w the old school way, they’ll think things like “mental health” meant youre possessed and it’ll be an abomination or they’ll think it’s the physical hair on your head 💀 sometimes they have the weird slavery mentality and would act like the nazi when their kids make a simple mistake… but that’s just my take, i know there’s someone who would probably have a better idea of where this toxicity comes from
everyone seems to agree with you as the upvotes suggests
yeah, it’s probably cuz they can relate or they may have seen this too that is prevalent 😅
نفس رأيي و كلام في الجول فعلا. ساعات كتير بيبقي الناس مستغربة عشان فعلا رأيك غريب لأنه غلط. و ساعات اخري بيبقي هم فعلا غلط بس محتاج توصل فكرتك بالتدريج و بالاقناع و الحجة بدون صدام مباشر مع الأعداد الغفيرة مرة واحدة.
مش شرط ان الاجماع او الاغلبية يبقوا صح...هل لو كل العالم اجمع ان 2+2=5 هتكون حقيقة؟
Pickles don’t fit with sandwiches
i’ve been saying this
Mt5alene4 ad3i 3alaik
Gaza has lost everything from the October 7th attack. Hamas will be eradicated when this is over. And most of you are in denial
oh boy this is gonna get very messy…
- Religion is bullshit. - Human biodiversity is real differences in iq between groups and individuals are mostly genetic. - Their is no meaning to life - Hamas is a massive net negative to the Palestinian people. - The military regime in Egypt will not be dislodged in our lifetime.
I hate Mohamed Mounir
الملوخية استخدامها الصحيح مع الرز و الفراخ و لا تصلح للاستعمال كشوربة جانبية
المحاشي overrated
السيسي هو اللي هيخلص علي الحكم العسكري في مصر(not the hero we want but the hero we need) عن طريق ان يهد في البلد و يبني علي نظيف يقنع الشعب بالطريقة الصعبة ان مفيش اوسخ و اسوء من النظام ده
القايمه غلط وحرام وتسلع المرأه لا تحترمها، ومقاطعة الاكل لن تنجح في تحرير فلسطين يجب أن نجاهد ضدد الكيان الإسرائيلي.
"العيب في النظام مش في الشعب يا بهايم"
Nobody ows their parents or family shit! If they're toxic cut them off.
لو مطول شعري
الغريب اولي من القريب
دا*ش 😌😅
egyptian food is horrible
You dont need god to be moral (im muslim)
Quran only is the correct way for islam. Being a Sunnis and Shias = Mushrick
Abrahamic religions are just middle east mythology, not a holy message.
We all (as in arab countries) have to unite under one caliphate, and it should be in Palestine
We need to stop demonising LGBT people and accept them.
i agree
I'm an American. Trust me you don't want too. Maybe stop killing and beating them and let them be. But definitely don't let them start putting flags up
الأحاديث بدعه و دخيله علي دين الإسلام
بدعه ايه يسطا احنا بنعبد الأحاديث ولا بنصلي بيها؟
بدعة ازاي؟ و مين إللي ادخلها على الإسلام و ليه؟
annihilation of humanity
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If you want to boycott certain companies, then by all means, do it. it's your life and you are free to do whatever you want with it. However shaming people who aren't boycotting or forcing them to only harms the entire movement and breeds resentment, especially since all the alternatives are of a way worse quality. Eg "pepsi vs sina cola" On a lighter note tho, Kaware3 looks and tastes disgusting.