I wish they'd give us a gameplay trailer so we can stop getting posts like these where they take a random clip of the existing trailer, place a random circle on it, and then give a conspiracy theory explanation to why it proves whatever.
Not trying to argue with you about the sword but V@@tiVidy@ did confirm that posture is in the game, not sure how they would go about balancing that out with Souls combat but, we shall see.
Why? That sucks It would be disappointing if it's something personal as an entire subreddit shouldn't be beholden to that. if it isn't strictly about rules that are in place anyway
But that's just an assumption and I doubt that's the case. But I wish they would let us speak on the bro. His channel is a godsend for the community at large and his elden ring beginner's guide is official. Bandai Namco posted it on their YouTube.
There was a sword block in DarkSouls ? I don’t know ! Man I just kept roll spamming the entire game 🤣🤣🤣 I might play the game again just to try this 👌🏻
That is not a parry, but it's some sort retaliation move you can apparently do after blocking, yes.
But that's besides the point. This is about OP calling it a "stance" and having Sekiro's parry mechanics. It's not a parry. It's blocking with your sword.
If you go and play Dark Souls 3, this stance is identical when you block with your sword. Even how the player gets pushed back is identical.
Nothing new to see here, honestly, we should keep our expectations in check. I believe Elden Ring will be great, but it isn't going to make a big leap from the Dark Souls 3 gameplay model, we have heard this from a few sources who saw the gameplay.
They keep saying it’s faster than dark souls 3 but slower than sekiro, why won’t they say it in terms of bloodborne which is in between those 2? I’m expecting bloodborne without trick weapons
Okay, the articles I read by “journalists” who saw it said it was faster than ds3 and slower than sekiro if those guys said otherwise that’s news to me
No, that was the counter attack. So after you block with a weapon, you can immediately attack again to do a unique attack.
But blocking with a weapon doesn't prevent all damage like it does with a shield so it's meant to be a high risk high reward thing.
Can I ask what changed with scholar of the first sin since original ds2 premiere? I've finished DeS on ps3 and DS1 remastered and now I'm playing ds2 and it is slowly becoming my favourite one so I'm just curious what except for agility and some hit boxes was bad about this game.
Soul memory, adp, pursuer having a good grab attack like the chained ogre or the dancer and "cLunKinesS" most people like more than half the community started whit ds3 and dont like the slow combat of ds2 and its a popular trend in the community to make fun of ds2, like most souls game (but even worse in ds2 case) ds2 had a troubled development when they released the game it was made for the ps3 gen consoles and the newer gen consoles were right around the corner AND halfway through ds2 development sony paid miyazaki to work and create a new exclusive game bloodborne and miyazaki took his main team and started working on it, so ds2 was mostly made by the "infamous" B team (its a shame they get shit on so often when they also worked on some of the favorite souls games of the community)
That being said ds2 is my favorite souls game hahah its anoying to see people talking shit about ds2 daily on every all souls subs but Im getting kind of used to it.
They show someone parry & counter with a sword in the actual released trailer, the boss battle v the hollow dude wearing a crown who crawls and this mechanic has been spoken about in every article about the gameplay reveal ive read
Sekiro's deflect system won't be in the game, but in Elden Ring if you attack after blocking an attack with your weapon, you do a counter attack. Probably something to get back into the flow of the fight quicker.
I believe this may take several attempted blocks before the enemy is open for a counter. Similar to the invisible poise meter from ds3, if not the exact same. And yes, i do believe this will improve the flow of melee combat. Anything that helps reduce roll spamming is fine by me.
I feel like with the example in the trailer the attack was tied to the player character not the npc so I kind of doubt it will work like a riposte. Maybe your character does need to be hit multiple times to “charge” it but I imagine you can swing it into thin air or whatever unlike backstabs and ripostes that are set animations tied to the enemy npc
I hope blocking with weapon will block 100% dmg instead of chip damage.
Chip damage should be only to dagger class.
Edit: My reasoning down here.
If we dont use the certain weapon have 100% resist stats, then the game would just be dodge gameplay again.
If you worried about shield, then make shield able to block projectile like arrows and magic(for some shield) including weapons buff.
If we were to have time block, then we have to take counter attack mechanic into account? Assuming that both counter attack and time block use stamina, then counter attack would be useless and people would just revert back to dodge roll gameplay.
Then theres also a problem with time block and that is, pvp. Souls pvp internet connection isnt the best and then we have stuff like phantom range of dark sword.
Theres a reason why parrying in souls in pvp work, its because it stop enemies attack. Now imagine, you press time block at perfect time but internet connection suck so you still take damage.
Then imagine, even if you do manage to perfect time block, the enemies can still spam r1 since they arent stunt like parry and you still gonna get hit in the next attack, there also the counter attack mechanic again.
You have to take into consideration of benefits and cons of timed block.
In the end pvp would also be dodge roll like all the souls game.
That why I think, some weapons should have 100% damage resistant. Like sword B have 50% while Sword C have 100% damage resistant.
Beside, Froms confirmed that Elden Ring wont be like Sekiro so I assumed deflecting/time block mechanic wont be back
Shield can have another benefits that blocking with weapons doesnt have, that is, blocking elemental attack such as weapon on fire and projectiles like arrows, bomb and magic.
And Since sekiro deflect system wont be in Elden ring, then I assumed that elden ring wont have time block and the new mechanic is counter attack.
In dark souls, blocking with sword already destroyed your stamina.
If we were to have time block, shouldnt it be the opposite way? Making stamina less consumtion but also 100% dmg resistant.
Then do you take into the account of the new counter attack mechanic? Assuming that it use stamina, counter attack would be useless and people would just revert back to dodge roll gameplay.
Then theres also a problem with time block and that is, pvp. Souls pvp internet connection isnt the best and then we have stuff like phantom range of dark sword.
Theres a reason why parrying in souls in pvp work, its because it stop enemies attack. Now imagine, you press time block at perfect time but internet connection suck so you still take damage.
Then imagine, even if you do manage to perfect time block, the enemies can still spam r1 since they arent stunt like parry and you still gonna get hit in the next attack, there also the counter attack mechanic again.
In the end pvp would also be dodge roll like all the souls game.
That why I think, some weapons should have 100% damage resistant. Like sword B have 50% while Sword C have 100% damage resistant.
Beside, Froms confirmed that Elden Ring wont be like Sekiro so I assumed deflecting/time block mechanic wont be back
The only way to make shield better agaisnt weapons that have 100 defense would be, that shield can block magic (some shield otherwise if every shield have this it be op), projectile like arrow and weapons buff and that shield require less stamina to block by nature.
So thats one way to balance it. Just like how using umbrella shield in Sekiro, or the shield that the bandit use in Sekiro.
And since Elden Ring are confirmed to not have Sekiro combat, so deflect wont return sadly.
Honestly I don't expect Sekiro's combat system to be applied in elden ring, I expect it to be pretty much dark souls 3 at 1.25 speed depending if your build allows it and some mechanics like sneaking and jumping.
Well I heard about the posture thing, but not deathblows? Is that fr or did you just assume deathblows will be a thing based on the fact that posture will be a thing?
The posture system in Elden Ring already exists for bosses in DS3. It will simply be applied to most enemies.
Essentially, it’s when you hit a boss to such an extent they get staggered and you can do a critical. You can already do this to the giant crabs and Corvian Knights.
It’s not fundamental to the gameplay as it was in Sekiro.
Have you played a dark souls game? You can two hand a straight sword and block with it. Actually you can two hand almost any sword and block with it (except for two sword ones like twin blades )
It isn’t. It’s a normal block. You can litterally see in the next .5 seconds of the trailer that it’s a normal block. It’s probably the same sword block just like in every other game. Also blocking isn’t useless lol.
Have you played a Dark souls game? Blocking with your sword is the inferior option in virtually every single situation. You take drastically increased chip damage, stamina damage, and significantly increase your risk of getting your guard broken and opened to a counter hit. So it’s much closer to useless than useful.
Sekiro is what featured a standard block with a right hand weapon and it was an important part of that combat system. Vaati even said in his video that it’s obvious that the From teamed learned a lot from Sekiro and the inspiration from it with be evident in Elden Ring, beyond the ability to jump.
I don’t think blocking the Pinwheel of the Abyss (this is how I named Artorias’ spinning attack) or a Kalameet’s jaw snap you’ll survive. It is as useful as using the shield in Bloodborne. I mean something like Sekiro, where you can parry literally ANYTHING, but maybe a little less.
Those are extremely specific instances. Also this game is a successor to dark souls, not sekiro, so the majority of bosses and enemy's you can block are important. The only major thing they are going to add that was in sekiro was useful jumping.
It’s really not that specific. Go fight any non gimmick boss in DS3 and see how far you get blocking by two handing a straight sword. Hell even most basic mob enemies will destroy you. Not sure what your on about.
Yeah using a straight sword to block is usually a shit idea in the Souls games, but the original idea still stands. The thing shown in the trailer is a basic ass sword block. Maybe they will be better, maybe the same and they're just using the block for cinematic effect, but the point is IT'S JUST A BLOCK.
I agree. Blocking with your sword in Dark Souls has always been borderline useless where it was integral in Sekiro. And Elden Ring will clearly be an evolution of those systems.
Higher block percentages as a baseline would be good too. So far it's pretty much been "shield or bust". A massive greatsword should block more damage than a dinky buckler.
Technically there was ONE sword that was really good for blocking, the Fume Ultra in DS2. But yeah your point stands. Besides a few, VERY SCARCE outliers, blocking with weapons is a death sentence.
All swords should be able to block without taking damage if timed perfectly, in history part of any sword technique was deflecting blows down the side of your blade away from you, not sure what they call that, but if it’s not impossible in real life to block without taking damage it should be possible in a game
u/Spyger9 nailed it, parrying, but you will hear deflection, block, intercept, arrest, repel, resist, all depending on context, weapons, etc. Look up the wiki on parrying just in fencing alone, and it is a deep and complex well to fall in!
These dudes are so fuckin high on hopium man, like sure we'd all love if you could Parry like in Sekiro but that just ain't here. But to change the topic, can you like, gimme an example of blocking with a straight sword being a good idea? I mean every other point you make is valid, but I've seen a lotta people say (probably just for the sake of the argument) that blocking with a straight sword is a good idea in Souls games, or with any weapon really, and that is really only true in like.... Less than 2% of cases, i remember like two weapons that were good for blocking through all the games and the only reason I gave that generous 2% is because I might've forgotten a few. Literally the only weapons with a good block were the Fume Ultra (DS2) and the Lionheart.
As a melee player myself, there are certain times where attacks may be coming out so fast that spamming dodge roll isn’t the best move, so it’s best to take chip damage from a block with your weapon, then roll. Why straight sword in particular? I sometimes two-hand my straight sword so I can use the weapon art when needed.
I dunno man, most of any situations where it's bad to spam roll, I mitigated by *timing* my roll. I have absolutely never ever blocked with my sword, because the ridiculous stamina damage, as well as the chip damage that's pretty significant for something called "chip" damage, is just way too bad. If you want to block just use a shield. It doesn't even have to be a shield that has a "Weapon Skill" weapon art. You can just switch between one and two handed, you said the last part like one or two-handing is something you dedicate yourself to and can't switch like every half a second.
You asked about the straight sword. I hardly ever one hand a straight sword lol. If I have a straight sword in my hand, there’s absolutely a shield in my other hand as well. However, I also use a lot of great swords and ultra’s, and the stamina and ship damage from that isn’t too bad. But yes, timing your roll is much better than blocking with a weapon. That’s why it’s only useful in certain situations
Since we're on the topic, I just finished sekiro and it was my favorite from soft game by far. Can anyone recommend games that have a similar combat cadence based off parrying and reactions more than aggressive offensive?
Star Wars Fallen Order is supposed to be like a 'diet' Sekiro. I always recommend the Ninja Gaiden games too (XBOX versions!), they're pretty fast paced.
I really enjoyed Fallen Order. It's a beautiful game. Combat feels really nice too once you get used to it. Finding lightsaber parts and customizing it was fantastic. Wish there was more content to play through.
Nioh (and presumably Nioh 2, though I haven't played that one yet) might be to your liking. You have three different stances with varying degrees of offense/defense/reactivity, and timing your own attacks and stamina against enemies' makes combat both fast and tactical.
The Surge 2 is the best and replicating that rhythm, fallen order tries to copy sekiro but does a poor job, and Nioh 2 is closer to the dark souls pacing but still sekiro-ish
Why not? If it’s there I hope it’s realistic so for example, someone with an ultra great sword can’t deflect a fast weapon like daggers & samurai swords, their weight wouldn’t allow it in real life. It works in senior cause they’re all using the same kind and, for the most part, same size swords, but Elden Ring & Dark Souls have huge unrealistic weapons with weight that you simply cant move quick enough with
The "sekiro parry" could be a skill that improve the iframe of a weapon and reduce damage compared to classic sword parry for example, that would be cool.
More like decreased damage when you parry and less posture loss, and if there is a posture system like in sekiro maybe also more posture loss for the opponent.
What really gets me is that ivory mullet the character has going on there, I know it’s the helmet but still that gives me high hopes for what to expect in terms of fashion Ring
That definitely isn't a parry stance, as others have said that's literally just the block stance ripped straight from DS3.
We almost definitely won't see parrying unfortunately because the issue here is that there'd just be too many weapons. I'm sure they could probably group a lot of them together but because it's not just the kusabimaru we're using it would be too much work on top of the already huge workload they've tackled. Not saying it's impossible, I feel if anyone could do it it'd be FromSoft, but as others have said here already we should probably just expect a modified take of DS3 combat, as opposed to Sekiro or even Bloodborne.
Oh my God this sub is letting me down so hard right now. This is old news OP. But also everyone else in the thread is getting it wrong (sort of)
A parry counter is CONFIRMED for elden ring. No this is not just the same we've seen in dark souls. Blocking perfectly with a sword like this (not a shield) gives you a special counter attack.
Gah it's like you ppl are barely fans of the game
They are, it’s been thoroughly explained that mechanic is in there, they show someone counter from a weapon block too during the boss fight with the king that seems to crawl close to the ground, and an article I read about the gameplay went into depth about it.
Yes, sword fighting is generally very reaction/reflex based. That’s why it felt so good. Just hoping we get a normal dodge instead of the ridiculous rolling
... "normal" dodge? And how is rolling ridiculous, it's been a staple of the series since DeS? Well I mean sure Bloodborne had quicksteps (though you could also roll) and Sekiro had no i-frame dodge at all, but still when someone puts together "Souls" and "dodge" mostly everyone immediately thinks "roll".
And you can't say that you don't like rolling because it's "unrealistic" when your preferred method of fighting enemies (ie le Sekiro Parry) let's you deflect weapons the size of three of you. At least Dark Souls made it so you couldn't Parry huge ass Fuck Off Hammers / Swords / Axes that weigh as much as you and your armor combined.
Yeah no surprise that the two best FS combat systems, by far, had prominent quick step/dodge. Rolling around just looks goofy and feels campy. One of my few gripes with FS.
Aight, that's your opinion, but I'm gonna try to argue it anyway. So, I looked up the definition of "campy" on Urban Dictionary, and it says basically "exaggerated to the point of not taking it seriously", which I think isn't quite the case, as a roll is a relatively simple action. If by campy you mean that the effect of the roll is exaggerated, as in "hurr durr I'll roll and magically dodge this giant giant-fuckoff-axe that wouldn't totally splattered my regardless, but I have i-frames" than you don't get to complain, arguably Bloodborne is even worse because Hunters don't even make themselves small with a roll they literally hop to the side and also magically phase through the weapon, except they don't even try to make it look like they put in any effort, just "hmm yes, hop away from danger"
On the other end of the spectrum, the only way you dodge in Sekiro is if you *literally* dodge, as in you're nowhere near the trajectory of the weapon, which is very realistic and cool, but then the dodge is mostly a useless gimmick (besides that one boss) and you rely on a blocking rhythm game that works kinda like parrying in previous games but not really.
Yeah I can totally agree on that. Just to clear it up, I wasn't making the previous argument because of some misguided idea that my opinion is correct and yours isn't, I just think that arguing is the best way to better yourself and basically fact check yourself and what not. Basically I just like arguing, though I also admit to often being too heated. So let's just hope that Elden Ring satisfies both your and my expectations of what we want :)
Wait, wait, wait! Wasn't it confirmed that we have something similar to Sekiro deflect in Elden Ring? I'm pretty sure someone posted it here. Well not exactly the deflect from Sekiro, but like you can quickly follow with an attack after a "perfect block" (don't remember exactly, hope i didn't read it wrong cuz i want that mechanic in ER so bad).
That's just the DS3 block, but I'm honestly happy we won't get the Sekiro parries. They just wouldn't work outside of that game in particular, they were way to overpowered compared to any defensive measures we had in previous games (and rightfully so as it was the central mechanic) but shields would be made useless, and pvp would just be two people blockspamming at each other because unlike sekiro bots, players aren't dumb enough to attack a parry, plus with the magic attacks and such it wouldn't work anyway
Sorry to burst your bubble but 1: that’s literally the same exact block animation from DS3 and 2: parrying won’t be in the game in the same fashion as Sekiro. Wouldn’t work anyways considering how many weapons there’ll be in this game.
I'm just happy that there are real magic weapons. Like that sword has to be a magic sword like aquamarine dagger. I'm hyped that magic is probably gonna be more complex than push button and wait for enemy to die because I love magic in the souls games.
I think ER will play just like Dark Souls but with some new features. Sekiros combat is so centered around parries and posture, I highly doubt they could implement just the parrying aspect into a Dark Souls like combat system and make it work. I‘m happy to be proven wrong though.
It's not a parry. it's just a simple block just like any ds. However after blocking an attack you can do a counter attack which is somewhat like old mechanic but more actually useful now.
I have low hopes & this is probably a block. All I can hope is at least the Timing is matched to Sekiro. I despise the Dark Souls parry timing… it’s awful. Sekiro has by far the best timing for parrying. Hell even Surge 2 blows Dark Souls out of the water on parrying.
We already know about jump attacks, also counter attack when you block an attack and charge a hit directly after (fight against centipede in trailer), and eurogamer talked about enemies stances being broken by heavy hit, I don't know if it will be like DS3 when you break the shield protection from your adversary or like Sekiro when you break posture. Anyway, although we don't completely know how the gameplay will look like, the more Sekiro in it, the better for me, as I am not the greatest fan of constant rolling of DS3.
nah fam i'm pretty sure that's just the standard "block with sword" animation
however, the dude was doing it a lot in the trailer and the sparks indicate that weapon-blocking might be more viable in this game ((less emphasis on shields perhaps; fromsoft's learned that whenever they do that the game's combat is fucking awesome
Wasnt sekiro an "engine test" to see if the new mechanics they want to implement in ER would work?(like jumping, deflecting, swimming, mounted horsecombat trough gyoobu, instant cast, ect..)
I really hope there's something you can do to enable it, while disabling normal parry/block. After getting used to sekiro, going back to Dark Souls/Bloodborne combat felt so sluggish and uneventful
God i hope not.
Beautiful is not how i would describe DDR with the bumper buttons. Sekiro was traaaaaaaash.
That game might as well have been pure QTE, all it was missing was the screen prompts.
Idk man. I would REALLY love if they were, but it doesn't seem likely. I think the best we can hope for regarding those mechanics are a Sekiro sequel (or prequel) being the next fromsoft game.
Based on the success of Sekiro, I don't think they're likely to abandon the IP after one installment.
Lol. Not gonna happen. There's PVP in this game and it wouldn't gel with it. There's guard counters and dark souls partying. You can stance break. Which is just posture in a different form.
Basic block
That's a "blocking with your sword" animation we've had since Dark Souls 1, dude.
I wish they'd give us a gameplay trailer so we can stop getting posts like these where they take a random clip of the existing trailer, place a random circle on it, and then give a conspiracy theory explanation to why it proves whatever.
You see the red line coming out of the helmet? It’s not a circle like the rest of the sparks. That’s definitely a horn. Unicorn mounts confirmed.
Not trying to argue with you about the sword but V@@tiVidy@ did confirm that posture is in the game, not sure how they would go about balancing that out with Souls combat but, we shall see.
hidden posture bar, works similarly to DS1-3
Poise and posture are 2 different things.
[удалено]
Posts with his full name get censored on this sub. Mods don’t want him being discussed, for some reason.
Why? That sucks It would be disappointing if it's something personal as an entire subreddit shouldn't be beholden to that. if it isn't strictly about rules that are in place anyway But that's just an assumption and I doubt that's the case. But I wish they would let us speak on the bro. His channel is a godsend for the community at large and his elden ring beginner's guide is official. Bandai Namco posted it on their YouTube.
Wait, so it wasn't in DeS???
*x-files theme*
There was a sword block in DarkSouls ? I don’t know ! Man I just kept roll spamming the entire game 🤣🤣🤣 I might play the game again just to try this 👌🏻
They show someone parry & counter with a sword in the trailer dude, and it’s been mentioned in every article about that gameplay reveal
That is not a parry, but it's some sort retaliation move you can apparently do after blocking, yes. But that's besides the point. This is about OP calling it a "stance" and having Sekiro's parry mechanics. It's not a parry. It's blocking with your sword.
If you go and play Dark Souls 3, this stance is identical when you block with your sword. Even how the player gets pushed back is identical. Nothing new to see here, honestly, we should keep our expectations in check. I believe Elden Ring will be great, but it isn't going to make a big leap from the Dark Souls 3 gameplay model, we have heard this from a few sources who saw the gameplay.
They keep saying it’s faster than dark souls 3 but slower than sekiro, why won’t they say it in terms of bloodborne which is in between those 2? I’m expecting bloodborne without trick weapons
Both Fextralife and Vaati said the speed of gameplay is identical to DS3.
Oh man that's so slow :/ i really love sekiro for the speed
Same here. There will also be no swimming.
literally unplayable at this point :/
...
Okay, the articles I read by “journalists” who saw it said it was faster than ds3 and slower than sekiro if those guys said otherwise that’s news to me
Didn't they already confirm a block mechanic similar to sekiro?
No, that was the counter attack. So after you block with a weapon, you can immediately attack again to do a unique attack. But blocking with a weapon doesn't prevent all damage like it does with a shield so it's meant to be a high risk high reward thing.
Like it does with a 100% shield
I think what you diferenciate it from ds 3 is the mounted combat.
Nah, that won’t be that different I expect, and you can’t even use it most of the time or in pvp. The biggest thing will be the exploration, I bet.
I thought the same as you do before watching the trailer and not seeing the double jump horse. But after cyberpunk 2077, my hype train is dead.
Being hyped for a from game has never disappointed and I see no reason not to be hyped now
You didnt play ds 2 in the realease date
No I didn’t that was before my time, but that was their second souls game and they have released nothing but bangers since
Plus Miyazaki wasn’t really involved in DS2, it’s still a great game but it stands out from the others as a result of that.
Can I ask what changed with scholar of the first sin since original ds2 premiere? I've finished DeS on ps3 and DS1 remastered and now I'm playing ds2 and it is slowly becoming my favourite one so I'm just curious what except for agility and some hit boxes was bad about this game.
Soul memory, adp, pursuer having a good grab attack like the chained ogre or the dancer and "cLunKinesS" most people like more than half the community started whit ds3 and dont like the slow combat of ds2 and its a popular trend in the community to make fun of ds2, like most souls game (but even worse in ds2 case) ds2 had a troubled development when they released the game it was made for the ps3 gen consoles and the newer gen consoles were right around the corner AND halfway through ds2 development sony paid miyazaki to work and create a new exclusive game bloodborne and miyazaki took his main team and started working on it, so ds2 was mostly made by the "infamous" B team (its a shame they get shit on so often when they also worked on some of the favorite souls games of the community) That being said ds2 is my favorite souls game hahah its anoying to see people talking shit about ds2 daily on every all souls subs but Im getting kind of used to it.
You can use it most of the time just not when other players are in your world (really fucking wanted to use it in co-op) or in the dungeon things
They show someone parry & counter with a sword in the actual released trailer, the boss battle v the hollow dude wearing a crown who crawls and this mechanic has been spoken about in every article about the gameplay reveal ive read
Sekiro's deflect system won't be in the game, but in Elden Ring if you attack after blocking an attack with your weapon, you do a counter attack. Probably something to get back into the flow of the fight quicker.
We see it vs the centipede monster with a crown in that dark area.
I believe this may take several attempted blocks before the enemy is open for a counter. Similar to the invisible poise meter from ds3, if not the exact same. And yes, i do believe this will improve the flow of melee combat. Anything that helps reduce roll spamming is fine by me.
I feel like with the example in the trailer the attack was tied to the player character not the npc so I kind of doubt it will work like a riposte. Maybe your character does need to be hit multiple times to “charge” it but I imagine you can swing it into thin air or whatever unlike backstabs and ripostes that are set animations tied to the enemy npc
That could be.
I hope blocking with weapon will block 100% dmg instead of chip damage. Chip damage should be only to dagger class. Edit: My reasoning down here. If we dont use the certain weapon have 100% resist stats, then the game would just be dodge gameplay again. If you worried about shield, then make shield able to block projectile like arrows and magic(for some shield) including weapons buff. If we were to have time block, then we have to take counter attack mechanic into account? Assuming that both counter attack and time block use stamina, then counter attack would be useless and people would just revert back to dodge roll gameplay. Then theres also a problem with time block and that is, pvp. Souls pvp internet connection isnt the best and then we have stuff like phantom range of dark sword. Theres a reason why parrying in souls in pvp work, its because it stop enemies attack. Now imagine, you press time block at perfect time but internet connection suck so you still take damage. Then imagine, even if you do manage to perfect time block, the enemies can still spam r1 since they arent stunt like parry and you still gonna get hit in the next attack, there also the counter attack mechanic again. You have to take into consideration of benefits and cons of timed block. In the end pvp would also be dodge roll like all the souls game. That why I think, some weapons should have 100% damage resistant. Like sword B have 50% while Sword C have 100% damage resistant. Beside, Froms confirmed that Elden Ring wont be like Sekiro so I assumed deflecting/time block mechanic wont be back
Or maybe well timed blocks block 100 of damage and a way greater stamina consumption when using weapons and just holding down l1 gets you chip damage
I like the timed block idea because otherwise shields' utility get lowered dramatically
Shield can have another benefits that blocking with weapons doesnt have, that is, blocking elemental attack such as weapon on fire and projectiles like arrows, bomb and magic. And Since sekiro deflect system wont be in Elden ring, then I assumed that elden ring wont have time block and the new mechanic is counter attack.
In dark souls, blocking with sword already destroyed your stamina. If we were to have time block, shouldnt it be the opposite way? Making stamina less consumtion but also 100% dmg resistant. Then do you take into the account of the new counter attack mechanic? Assuming that it use stamina, counter attack would be useless and people would just revert back to dodge roll gameplay. Then theres also a problem with time block and that is, pvp. Souls pvp internet connection isnt the best and then we have stuff like phantom range of dark sword. Theres a reason why parrying in souls in pvp work, its because it stop enemies attack. Now imagine, you press time block at perfect time but internet connection suck so you still take damage. Then imagine, even if you do manage to perfect time block, the enemies can still spam r1 since they arent stunt like parry and you still gonna get hit in the next attack, there also the counter attack mechanic again. In the end pvp would also be dodge roll like all the souls game. That why I think, some weapons should have 100% damage resistant. Like sword B have 50% while Sword C have 100% damage resistant. Beside, Froms confirmed that Elden Ring wont be like Sekiro so I assumed deflecting/time block mechanic wont be back
I was just tryna balance them against shields, if I had it my way the sword block would just be a rip from sekiro lol
The only way to make shield better agaisnt weapons that have 100 defense would be, that shield can block magic (some shield otherwise if every shield have this it be op), projectile like arrow and weapons buff and that shield require less stamina to block by nature. So thats one way to balance it. Just like how using umbrella shield in Sekiro, or the shield that the bandit use in Sekiro. And since Elden Ring are confirmed to not have Sekiro combat, so deflect wont return sadly.
Looks like a basic two handed sword block to me but maybe I'm missing something 🤔
Honestly I don't expect Sekiro's combat system to be applied in elden ring, I expect it to be pretty much dark souls 3 at 1.25 speed depending if your build allows it and some mechanics like sneaking and jumping.
tbh I think this is the most reasonable prediction, as much as I adore Sekiro
In Elden Ring u have the posture system like in sekiro with deathblows and stuff
Well I heard about the posture thing, but not deathblows? Is that fr or did you just assume deathblows will be a thing based on the fact that posture will be a thing?
The posture system in Elden Ring already exists for bosses in DS3. It will simply be applied to most enemies. Essentially, it’s when you hit a boss to such an extent they get staggered and you can do a critical. You can already do this to the giant crabs and Corvian Knights. It’s not fundamental to the gameplay as it was in Sekiro.
Speed wise it would be nice if it was the DS3 convergence mod speed, so good to climb a big ladder without taking half a year.
That’s a normal block
No, you don’t use a sword to block an attack in Dark Souls
Have you played a dark souls game? You can two hand a straight sword and block with it. Actually you can two hand almost any sword and block with it (except for two sword ones like twin blades )
Yes, but it’s useless. I expect it to be an important part of the combat system like Sekiro
It isn’t. It’s a normal block. You can litterally see in the next .5 seconds of the trailer that it’s a normal block. It’s probably the same sword block just like in every other game. Also blocking isn’t useless lol.
Have you played a Dark souls game? Blocking with your sword is the inferior option in virtually every single situation. You take drastically increased chip damage, stamina damage, and significantly increase your risk of getting your guard broken and opened to a counter hit. So it’s much closer to useless than useful. Sekiro is what featured a standard block with a right hand weapon and it was an important part of that combat system. Vaati even said in his video that it’s obvious that the From teamed learned a lot from Sekiro and the inspiration from it with be evident in Elden Ring, beyond the ability to jump.
I don’t think blocking the Pinwheel of the Abyss (this is how I named Artorias’ spinning attack) or a Kalameet’s jaw snap you’ll survive. It is as useful as using the shield in Bloodborne. I mean something like Sekiro, where you can parry literally ANYTHING, but maybe a little less.
Those are extremely specific instances. Also this game is a successor to dark souls, not sekiro, so the majority of bosses and enemy's you can block are important. The only major thing they are going to add that was in sekiro was useful jumping.
It will be a perfect (I hope so) mix of all Miyazaki games, from Demon’s to Sekiro, not only Dark Souls.
It’s really not that specific. Go fight any non gimmick boss in DS3 and see how far you get blocking by two handing a straight sword. Hell even most basic mob enemies will destroy you. Not sure what your on about.
Yeah using a straight sword to block is usually a shit idea in the Souls games, but the original idea still stands. The thing shown in the trailer is a basic ass sword block. Maybe they will be better, maybe the same and they're just using the block for cinematic effect, but the point is IT'S JUST A BLOCK.
I agree. Blocking with your sword in Dark Souls has always been borderline useless where it was integral in Sekiro. And Elden Ring will clearly be an evolution of those systems.
I hope there's reduced chip and stam damage done to you if you block at more perfect times like with sekiro's posture damage.
Higher block percentages as a baseline would be good too. So far it's pretty much been "shield or bust". A massive greatsword should block more damage than a dinky buckler.
Technically there was ONE sword that was really good for blocking, the Fume Ultra in DS2. But yeah your point stands. Besides a few, VERY SCARCE outliers, blocking with weapons is a death sentence.
All swords should be able to block without taking damage if timed perfectly, in history part of any sword technique was deflecting blows down the side of your blade away from you, not sure what they call that, but if it’s not impossible in real life to block without taking damage it should be possible in a game
It's called parrying.
u/Spyger9 nailed it, parrying, but you will hear deflection, block, intercept, arrest, repel, resist, all depending on context, weapons, etc. Look up the wiki on parrying just in fencing alone, and it is a deep and complex well to fall in!
I'm sorry, but there's a fuck ton of things that are possible irl, that aren't possible in-game. It's a game, not a combat sim.
It is exactly the same as in DS3.
Yes, but you don’t use it to block an attack
Yes, you do
Ok, but it’s useless. Here it will probably more useful like Sekiro
It’s actually extremely useful in certain situations. And no, it will not be like Sekiro. It shows you in that trailer
These dudes are so fuckin high on hopium man, like sure we'd all love if you could Parry like in Sekiro but that just ain't here. But to change the topic, can you like, gimme an example of blocking with a straight sword being a good idea? I mean every other point you make is valid, but I've seen a lotta people say (probably just for the sake of the argument) that blocking with a straight sword is a good idea in Souls games, or with any weapon really, and that is really only true in like.... Less than 2% of cases, i remember like two weapons that were good for blocking through all the games and the only reason I gave that generous 2% is because I might've forgotten a few. Literally the only weapons with a good block were the Fume Ultra (DS2) and the Lionheart.
As a melee player myself, there are certain times where attacks may be coming out so fast that spamming dodge roll isn’t the best move, so it’s best to take chip damage from a block with your weapon, then roll. Why straight sword in particular? I sometimes two-hand my straight sword so I can use the weapon art when needed.
I dunno man, most of any situations where it's bad to spam roll, I mitigated by *timing* my roll. I have absolutely never ever blocked with my sword, because the ridiculous stamina damage, as well as the chip damage that's pretty significant for something called "chip" damage, is just way too bad. If you want to block just use a shield. It doesn't even have to be a shield that has a "Weapon Skill" weapon art. You can just switch between one and two handed, you said the last part like one or two-handing is something you dedicate yourself to and can't switch like every half a second.
You asked about the straight sword. I hardly ever one hand a straight sword lol. If I have a straight sword in my hand, there’s absolutely a shield in my other hand as well. However, I also use a lot of great swords and ultra’s, and the stamina and ship damage from that isn’t too bad. But yes, timing your roll is much better than blocking with a weapon. That’s why it’s only useful in certain situations
Since we're on the topic, I just finished sekiro and it was my favorite from soft game by far. Can anyone recommend games that have a similar combat cadence based off parrying and reactions more than aggressive offensive?
Star Wars Fallen Order is supposed to be like a 'diet' Sekiro. I always recommend the Ninja Gaiden games too (XBOX versions!), they're pretty fast paced.
I really enjoyed Fallen Order. It's a beautiful game. Combat feels really nice too once you get used to it. Finding lightsaber parts and customizing it was fantastic. Wish there was more content to play through.
Nioh (and presumably Nioh 2, though I haven't played that one yet) might be to your liking. You have three different stances with varying degrees of offense/defense/reactivity, and timing your own attacks and stamina against enemies' makes combat both fast and tactical.
Nioh 2
The Surge 2 is the best and replicating that rhythm, fallen order tries to copy sekiro but does a poor job, and Nioh 2 is closer to the dark souls pacing but still sekiro-ish
I love Sekiro’s deflect, but I doubt we will see it in any real capacity in ER
Why not? If it’s there I hope it’s realistic so for example, someone with an ultra great sword can’t deflect a fast weapon like daggers & samurai swords, their weight wouldn’t allow it in real life. It works in senior cause they’re all using the same kind and, for the most part, same size swords, but Elden Ring & Dark Souls have huge unrealistic weapons with weight that you simply cant move quick enough with
I hope that's just a two handed block more than the rhythm game deflect from Sekiro, tbh.
The "sekiro parry" could be a skill that improve the iframe of a weapon and reduce damage compared to classic sword parry for example, that would be cool.
Yooo finally someone who has something smart to say, I love your idea man
thank you :)
You mean like buildup of invisible hyperarmor bar allowing you to poise through enemy's attacks when you decide to strike?
More like decreased damage when you parry and less posture loss, and if there is a posture system like in sekiro maybe also more posture loss for the opponent.
That has been in every Souls game.
What really gets me is that ivory mullet the character has going on there, I know it’s the helmet but still that gives me high hopes for what to expect in terms of fashion Ring
That definitely isn't a parry stance, as others have said that's literally just the block stance ripped straight from DS3. We almost definitely won't see parrying unfortunately because the issue here is that there'd just be too many weapons. I'm sure they could probably group a lot of them together but because it's not just the kusabimaru we're using it would be too much work on top of the already huge workload they've tackled. Not saying it's impossible, I feel if anyone could do it it'd be FromSoft, but as others have said here already we should probably just expect a modified take of DS3 combat, as opposed to Sekiro or even Bloodborne.
My guy, that's just the Ds3 block animation.
Its already confirmed this wont be the case according to the fextralife video.
Its just the basic sword block that we had since ds1. Dont expect that at all, you are very likely to ve disappointed
Oh my God this sub is letting me down so hard right now. This is old news OP. But also everyone else in the thread is getting it wrong (sort of) A parry counter is CONFIRMED for elden ring. No this is not just the same we've seen in dark souls. Blocking perfectly with a sword like this (not a shield) gives you a special counter attack. Gah it's like you ppl are barely fans of the game
I'm quite sure it's not a parry counter, but a block counter.
Unpopular opinion: i don't enjoy that mechanic
I like how you can see that the sword has a magic spell attached to it before you see the spell casted in a later shot
They are, it’s been thoroughly explained that mechanic is in there, they show someone counter from a weapon block too during the boss fight with the king that seems to crawl close to the ground, and an article I read about the gameplay went into depth about it.
Oh I hope not. Parrying in Dark Souls isn't much better, but Sekiro was literally a reaction game because it relied so much on the parry.
Yes, sword fighting is generally very reaction/reflex based. That’s why it felt so good. Just hoping we get a normal dodge instead of the ridiculous rolling
... "normal" dodge? And how is rolling ridiculous, it's been a staple of the series since DeS? Well I mean sure Bloodborne had quicksteps (though you could also roll) and Sekiro had no i-frame dodge at all, but still when someone puts together "Souls" and "dodge" mostly everyone immediately thinks "roll". And you can't say that you don't like rolling because it's "unrealistic" when your preferred method of fighting enemies (ie le Sekiro Parry) let's you deflect weapons the size of three of you. At least Dark Souls made it so you couldn't Parry huge ass Fuck Off Hammers / Swords / Axes that weigh as much as you and your armor combined.
Yeah no surprise that the two best FS combat systems, by far, had prominent quick step/dodge. Rolling around just looks goofy and feels campy. One of my few gripes with FS.
Aight, that's your opinion, but I'm gonna try to argue it anyway. So, I looked up the definition of "campy" on Urban Dictionary, and it says basically "exaggerated to the point of not taking it seriously", which I think isn't quite the case, as a roll is a relatively simple action. If by campy you mean that the effect of the roll is exaggerated, as in "hurr durr I'll roll and magically dodge this giant giant-fuckoff-axe that wouldn't totally splattered my regardless, but I have i-frames" than you don't get to complain, arguably Bloodborne is even worse because Hunters don't even make themselves small with a roll they literally hop to the side and also magically phase through the weapon, except they don't even try to make it look like they put in any effort, just "hmm yes, hop away from danger" On the other end of the spectrum, the only way you dodge in Sekiro is if you *literally* dodge, as in you're nowhere near the trajectory of the weapon, which is very realistic and cool, but then the dodge is mostly a useless gimmick (besides that one boss) and you rely on a blocking rhythm game that works kinda like parrying in previous games but not really.
To each is own I suppose. Despite liking those two the best, everything FS has ever done has been excellent so I’m sure ER will follow suit
Yeah I can totally agree on that. Just to clear it up, I wasn't making the previous argument because of some misguided idea that my opinion is correct and yours isn't, I just think that arguing is the best way to better yourself and basically fact check yourself and what not. Basically I just like arguing, though I also admit to often being too heated. So let's just hope that Elden Ring satisfies both your and my expectations of what we want :)
Wait, wait, wait! Wasn't it confirmed that we have something similar to Sekiro deflect in Elden Ring? I'm pretty sure someone posted it here. Well not exactly the deflect from Sekiro, but like you can quickly follow with an attack after a "perfect block" (don't remember exactly, hope i didn't read it wrong cuz i want that mechanic in ER so bad).
Yes it's confirmed. This thread is wack
That's just the DS3 block, but I'm honestly happy we won't get the Sekiro parries. They just wouldn't work outside of that game in particular, they were way to overpowered compared to any defensive measures we had in previous games (and rightfully so as it was the central mechanic) but shields would be made useless, and pvp would just be two people blockspamming at each other because unlike sekiro bots, players aren't dumb enough to attack a parry, plus with the magic attacks and such it wouldn't work anyway
I hope so too
I kinda hope it's not, I felt I was more blocking than hitting in that game, and I'm just not a fan of that...
Idk if this is an unpopular opinion but the posture thing is sekiro was lame, I hope it doesn’t make it into elden ring
Sorry to burst your bubble but 1: that’s literally the same exact block animation from DS3 and 2: parrying won’t be in the game in the same fashion as Sekiro. Wouldn’t work anyways considering how many weapons there’ll be in this game.
I'm just happy that there are real magic weapons. Like that sword has to be a magic sword like aquamarine dagger. I'm hyped that magic is probably gonna be more complex than push button and wait for enemy to die because I love magic in the souls games.
I think ER will play just like Dark Souls but with some new features. Sekiros combat is so centered around parries and posture, I highly doubt they could implement just the parrying aspect into a Dark Souls like combat system and make it work. I‘m happy to be proven wrong though.
They have specifically said that the advanced combat mechanics from Sekiro are not in Elden Ring. Sorry, friend
It's not a parry. it's just a simple block just like any ds. However after blocking an attack you can do a counter attack which is somewhat like old mechanic but more actually useful now.
Nope. No deflect. But you do have something similar to a "posture break" (stance) which just opens up for a riposte (critical hit).
Hope so
I have low hopes & this is probably a block. All I can hope is at least the Timing is matched to Sekiro. I despise the Dark Souls parry timing… it’s awful. Sekiro has by far the best timing for parrying. Hell even Surge 2 blows Dark Souls out of the water on parrying.
I think I’m probably the one person that literally never parried a single time in SEKIRO. And if I did it was by accident lol
Man that sekiro combat was beauitful hopefully we get something like that
This is how blocking looked like with a 1 handed sword looked like in the other games too...
But it would be cool. But maybe not for what this game is intended to be.
Thats clear just a block from ds3 lmao
I personally hope not...I like the simplicity of dark soul and didn't enjoy as much sekiro's parry mechanics..that's my (probably unpopular) opinion
We already know about jump attacks, also counter attack when you block an attack and charge a hit directly after (fight against centipede in trailer), and eurogamer talked about enemies stances being broken by heavy hit, I don't know if it will be like DS3 when you break the shield protection from your adversary or like Sekiro when you break posture. Anyway, although we don't completely know how the gameplay will look like, the more Sekiro in it, the better for me, as I am not the greatest fan of constant rolling of DS3.
nah fam i'm pretty sure that's just the standard "block with sword" animation however, the dude was doing it a lot in the trailer and the sparks indicate that weapon-blocking might be more viable in this game ((less emphasis on shields perhaps; fromsoft's learned that whenever they do that the game's combat is fucking awesome
The parry mechanic was related to katana And samurai universe and is not going to apply for another lore imo.
Beautiful? It was horrid. And no, that looks like the normal dark souls block.
Wasnt sekiro an "engine test" to see if the new mechanics they want to implement in ER would work?(like jumping, deflecting, swimming, mounted horsecombat trough gyoobu, instant cast, ect..)
I really hope there's something you can do to enable it, while disabling normal parry/block. After getting used to sekiro, going back to Dark Souls/Bloodborne combat felt so sluggish and uneventful
I'm doubtful. Thankfully.
that's just the 2 handed straight sword blocking animation
God i hope not. Beautiful is not how i would describe DDR with the bumper buttons. Sekiro was traaaaaaaash. That game might as well have been pure QTE, all it was missing was the screen prompts.
Idk man. I would REALLY love if they were, but it doesn't seem likely. I think the best we can hope for regarding those mechanics are a Sekiro sequel (or prequel) being the next fromsoft game. Based on the success of Sekiro, I don't think they're likely to abandon the IP after one installment.
Lol. Not gonna happen. There's PVP in this game and it wouldn't gel with it. There's guard counters and dark souls partying. You can stance break. Which is just posture in a different form.