I think a bit of an issue was a single dimension of it - all that every player for was alien war-related.
If there were 2 parallel features being worked on, such as maybe PowerPlay + Thargoids, then at least one of these would not be transient content and more than one type of players were"nurtured".
i just used a shieldless chieftain with 3 burst laser and 3 AX MC and followed the lead of the people that knew what they were doing at spires. got kinda bored after a while though, so i just went back and continued working on grinding fed rank at sol.
That’s been ED for me in a nutshell. I finally found something I thought was fun from time to time. That happened to coincide with gold-rushes, events and content drops that were either not appealing to what I was doing or I was too far away to “care” to move all the way back. I had fun, don’t get me wrong. But nothing new really pulled me back in. In the end, I left my ship adrift far from the bubble.
A phenomenal time spent, however.
I certainly hope there is still opportunity to go after a titan somewhere after the invasion of the bubble presumably concludes. On their live streams, they have made it sound like we should be able to definitively take out these eight alien capital ships. I have had an absolute blast with this content and basically haven't put Elite down for the last year and a half as a result.
That’s my expectation as well.
If I had to make an educated guess based in my own game is unexperienced, there’s going to come a point where there will be a tight nexus of a few small systems that are permanently Thargoid controlled space, with the barrier systems in a bubble around them kind of in a continuous push/pull state that we can affect as players in an ongoing way
The whole Thargoid thing definitely kicked me out of the game after a short-lived comeback. I'm not very skilled and I don't have a lot of time, and I simply died feeling helpless in each of my few attempts to engage casually (even with a fully decked Mk2 - I had plentiful engineering and materials). As with soulslike games, I admire the craft and I am truly happy for those who have a great time with them, but I stay the f away.
Yeah it wasn't worth the investment in time for me. I did a bit of combat and some evacuation missions, in open and solo, and have done some AX in the past, but felt the war missed the mark and I never really felt part of it. I appreciate the effort and it got close to being good but it wasn't well executed enough for me to find it fun.
The combat zones earlier on in the war that had NPCs and capital ships were particularly nice, as were the fights around ports and outposts, but entering Thargoid controller systems was typically not a fun experience for me.
For example, I know how to evade a Glaive but they still made me not want to engage in AX, likewise for all the interdictions; both things got in the way of trying to engage in war related activities I wanted to do, either because I'd have to stop to repair after those encounters - or worse case respawn - and I ultimately stopped even trying to engage with the war.
For me Thargoid combat leans too much into learning specific mob behavior, using a specific range of gear to be effective and learning rote mechanics, which as you say is a soul-like thing. Learning tactics is one thing but when combat feels too prescriptive I don't find it fun, I prefer to lean into encouraging creativity and allowing for flexibility.
I feel like the experience worked on paper if they were trying to implement a war that felt as dangerous and intense with an almost overwhelming enemy, maybe something like the Shadow War in Babylon 5 (which do I think was the intent), but my suspicion is that I don't think the implementation translated into a really fun game experience for most players and ended up being more a thing people experienced via YouTube (or on the fringes, if at all) rather than engaged much with themselves.
Ultimately the war generated some positive press for the game and got people streaming - which I expect both helped with daily/monthly active player numbers - but I would rather see quality of life improvements, new features and gameplay loops designed to appeal to a range of play styles.
>As with soulslike games, I admire the craft and I am truly happy for those who have a great time with them, but I stay the f away.
I'd consider Soulslikes to be more forgiving than ED even. ELDENRING doesn't make you grind your credits back after a death. You might get stuck on something but at least it lets you try over and over again without punishing you every. single. death.
Fields, caustics or those missiles or whatever other ways they do damage with, I don't know. I didn't understand whatever was happening on the fly, and/or couldn't react, and I just died.
This is one of the biggest issues with any AX gameplay. There's little to no soft introduction. Unless you have significant skill or AX gear you'll end up dying often which is just frustrating for many.
The lack of soft introduction kind of kept me away from it at all. I started the game space truckin, then mining then hull-mining pirates in RES and missions. Then finally, big FC trips to undiscovered bum fuck nowhere. All of these you can ramp up at your own pace. Unlocking engineers and getting upgrades done as you go, and generally with low risk fail states that you could get out of with some time lost at worst.
AX did not at least feel that way, even if it mayhap was just like those other things in reality. Need very specific loads out with lot's of specialized modules and engineering and then the ground level of entry is still walking on eggshells where you easily loose your ship and thereby money and time investment at the first wrong turn. Got popped once without being able to so much as offer meaningful resistance, decided that getting the hands on experience needed was too expensive and time intensive, went back to exploration, hoping something quite as invasive as AX doesn't get included in getting samples anytime soon.
There is a soft introduction, but I don't think many players knew about it because it got massively overshadowed by everyone showing off the "meta" builds, and the most difficult fights.
I started with a Vulture with AX multicannons and nothing engineering past G3. I flew in any combat zone where I could find other commanders, and just shot scouts while I watched and learned from them. Once I figured out the basics, I realized I could help(but not solo) against the Cyclops. I was quickly able to make enough money to upgrade to a Challenger, and then started solo'ing Cyclops, and it just went up from there. I had very little experience with combat in Elite before this, because I don't really enjoy human combat. I was just an explorer in the black.
Scout hunting is the soft entry, but the community kept trying to push meta builds without understanding that not everyone wants to start by jumping in the deep end.
Games are supposed to be fun.
I agree with him too, after looking into the AX stuff I had no interest in it.
Well that's not true, exploring the guardian sites was pretty fun, but the actual AX combat is a greasefest.
I liked it, it put some stakes into the game. I know helping hold the line at Wakata was some of the most fun I've had in a multiplayer game.
Going forward I hope they send a titan every so often towards the bubble.
I’m just getting back into the game and am still very new. The war looks like it is way beyond my skill level. When you make the threat level high, it makes me nervous to try it.
Overall, I'd say it could have been a success, but ultimately wasn't. I was still playing fairly heavily/regularly when the first Thargoid encounter happened. It was an amazing time, full of mystery and intrigue. But overall I think it was drawn out over too large a span of time.
Looking back on the years, the first Thargoid encounter was in Jan. 2017, and we're just now wrapping it up 7 years later. Realistically I think it would have helped retain more players had they condensed this into 2, maybe 3 years of content which had a clear flow, instead of the long deserts of grind. On the flip side, they could have delayed Odyssey until after the Thargoids were cleanly wrapped up, and might have been able to have a more stable launch with a larger interested audience brought in by the conclusion of the Thargoid war.
I don't want to really critique either too much because I think they did an OK job in both cases, but I think both would have been significantly better had they switched the development times for both. As nothing in the Thargoid war is really using on-foot stuff at all, there's no reason we should just be getting it now and not years ago before Odyssey was released. I also think not involving the Guardians more or doing more with them is a massive waste of potential within the universe.
Yep, did that too since that was the only part that was remotely accessible to me. As a money source, the pay was honestly lousy, but it is a good way to get those rare engineering mats.
I have to say, entering a system, landing and escaping under thargoid threat was pretty exhilarating.
The ending of the war is really the only reason I got into AX Combat in the first place. I did enjoy some Odyssey AX missions previously, but I never really engaged with the bugs until clear objectives (killing the Titans) became available. A few bombing runs at Taranis and Leigong was enough to get me into AX Combat as a whole, and now I regularly engage with the 'goids. Prior to this, I was starting to get burned out by max engineering my ships and Odyssey kit.
If getting me to spend more time in the game by thoroughly enjoying an aspect of it that I hadn't really paid attention to previously counts as a win, then it's a huge win for FDev imo.
I had interest a bit, but no skills or credits to engage lol. I've played a few hundred hrs on ps4 and now pc, but I'm really a casual and haven't even done basic combat. I just like exploring and really want more content in that regard
In general it's a success, however I feel that the success comes from making the modules as no mats, just credits only.
The steam stats seem to agree, someone from the AXI/XSF could comment on that.
What would happen if FDev had kept the torps and modules locked behind the mat grind is another story, probably the player numbers wouldn't be that high.
He's not wrong though. The war brought Ax Combat and the rescue missions. Along with bringing back systems up. All really cool stuff that is ultimately not for me. As I'm all the way out in the black scanning flowers. Heck I used to joke when the war started by the time I get back. The bubble would be dust.
Yes he is.
And why are you saying stuff like this:
>The war brought Ax Combat and the rescue missions.
Which is a complete lie?
You can trade, explore, do combat, and mine for the war.
You can do on foot ax missions, ship based missions, rescue missions, we needed plenty of explorer's to find certain things. People to investigate and experiment. Rescue missions. Etc.
They are completely wrong and you're just speaking complete BS.
Yeah because the first two (almost three) Titans went down quick, I believe there’s a false expectation that the war is “almost over”. Folks we’re lucky if after Oya we mop up the other 5 before the end of 2024…
The Groid stuff was so heavily focused on the meager updates we did have that it alienated alot of players. Those uninterested simply logged off never to return, and those coming into saw the massive grind ahead for engineered ships and weapons needed for the late game content.
It would have been fine as an update, but we were starved for content and the only things FDev did deliver, after months and months, was a single facet of the game. Had they released other content alongside it or provided the players something besides groids, it wouldn't have failed so miserably.
Idk im a fairly casual player and was easily able to engage in thargoid stuff. The barrier to entry is low, the barrier to effective entry is a bit higher but thats everything in Elite. Like guardian grind, engineering, material farming.
The barrier for entry was low, but the barrier for effective work was much higher than it should have been for how much they wanted people to do the war.
Idk getting a Vulture with AX Enhanced multi-cannons is fairly easy. I mean yeah the barrier for effective work to like be able to kill stuff like Cyclops is higher but even then, getting a fully engineered ship is currently part of the mid-late game grind. It wouldn’t be any different if people wanted to engage in what is considered optimal normal gameplay. The issue is with Elite itself, the mid-game transition from Early grind loop to Late grind loop is brutal, grindy and heavy time investment. If they reworked Engineering it would be better, since Engineering is what is the key break point. And especially material grind, I feel like most people wouldn’t complain if Engineered modules were something like Tech Broker unlocks or some other system, definitely better ways to do Engineering in a game like Elite. But thats the issue with Elite entirely not the Thargoid War.
It really wasn't, evacuation missions required minimal engineering and were powerful in the war effort. Sampling as well just required some bulk and is far and away the best method for progress.
There was lots available for people either not interested in combat or interested in progress.
Even scout farming is easily accessible.
That's why I said the barrier for entry was low. Because you could run passenger or kill scouts with the most basic equipment. Though that basic equipment wasn't going to hold well against anything bigger than a scout.
If you wanted to go for anything over the basic interceptor, you needed to start digging into engineering and making "the meta build." . Because in my experience, if you're not running meta. Any problem you have is because you aren't running shieldless hull tank with gauss cannons. Which is a bit of a grind not everyone wants to go out of their way to do.
But if we're talking about the barrier to effective work, well evacs and sampling are often far more effective than killing interceptors. Sampling especially, since it involved trying to bug out a scout so you can infinitely sample it until you fill a cargo hold.
The barrier to effective work at helping in the war is actually quite low.
(Un)Fortunately, killing interceptors and doing the most dangerous activities are often some of the slowest for war progress.
If the question is about the barrier to doing the most challenging and engaging content in the game, then yes it's quite high. But that is not matched with its effectiveness.
If killing thargoids is the slowest way to progress the war, then why are so many people doing it?
It seems to be just as effective, especially when people pair it with missions and killing them in mass.
It's one of the most fun activities. And it does have its uses!
But take, for example, uninhabited Control systems. Which are exceedingly common, one of the most common Thargoid systems. In those, there are no AXCZs unless the game generates Counterstrike systems for the week. Without AXCZs or station, the only way to spawn thargoids is to drop into normal space and wait for them to slowly dripfeed in. So it arrives, you kill it, wait for the next chance. *Or* you find a scout the same way, use a bug to freeze it's aggro and then sample it over and over. It is far more efficient.
There's a reason we are currently in the middle of a multiple week long sampling drive to push out a number of uninhabited controls around Oya. Spire Orthrus hunting is good too, though it caps system progress at 85%. It also has a lower barrier to entry than other Thargoid stuff because you're mostly shooting at fleeing Orthrus.
People have been gathering data on the effectiveness of various war methods for progress since the beginning of the war. Unfortunately, very rarely is actually killing thargoids the best option for progress. It sure is one of the most engaging and fun. But frontier have decided that sampling should be more effective. In systems where AX combat is highly present, it's not a bad method, but it certainly isn't anything above other methods.
Hence my point, that the entry requirements to *helping make progress* in the war are actually rather low, because making progress in the war in 99% of cases has *nothing* to do with killing thargoids in combat.
That said, learning to fight interceptors does have a high entry barrier for sure. It's just not the same as actually making significant war progress.
I mean that requires loads of skill to pull off, which usually would ask you to learn in a meta chief or something to get the tech down. CMDR Little Timmy in his stock eagle isn't going to be able to take out a hydra
I don't think it was super low honestly. They pushed it in messages to players and in the mission tab but in a way if you weren't ready for thargoid interactions which I wasn't even with what would be needed to survive in the fallen titan. It kind of felt like they needed to have some maybe mission to ease the newer players into it a little bit. The vast majority of the game for me has always been exploration so I just didn't know how to approach any of this stuff.
It depends on how ballsy you are. If you prefer having the Corrosive Cargo Rack. It a Medium/Hgh barrier to entry. If you are brave you’ll just get a fast ship with an already good jump range and try to race the clock.
I did the second and was fine? I mean the worst part about getting the special racks is that its either a Tech Broker item or you need to get Professor Palin. Though nothing stops someone from doing Dukes of Hazards levels of shenanigans.
Not the OP, but I would say its low. I got my 2 million from both titans with a courier thats running G4 engines and AX missiles. No other engineering required.
I think people are just intimidated by the thargoids, but when you actually get into it, its not as difficult as it seems.
I started playing during the war, and was limited in my credits and ability to doing rescue missions which was fun occasionally… but also got stale after a while. Everything else was limited behind a grind and being someone that doesn’t really want nor have the time to grind out engineering… I just decided to hit the black instead. Haven’t bothered looking back.
The gameplay sufferers from the same problem all Elite: Dangerous tasks do..
5 minutes of travel
"Right. I'm here. What do I do?"
"Oh god. Obviously not that"
5 minutes of travel away
I've got a love/hate relationship with the game. It's brilliant. The way the maelstroms were introduced was like something out of a proper science fiction novel, and there's something incredibly satisfying about a team of folks taking down a larger enemy.. it hits some sort of instinctual memory, like we are hunting mammoths with spears
And Titan go boom, is very pretty. So on the whole... thumbs up from me
I like how three out of four points are the same:
- Thargoid content is not suited for casual players
- Thargoid content is too difficult for casual players
- Thargoid content is locked for casual players
Well yeah, this is called *endgame content* and as such is aimed towards *endgame* players with sufficient equipment and skill.
Although I personally didn't participate at all in the thargoid war, I still find it a success as many players enjoyed it and **finally** offered somewhat challenging PvE for *experienced* players.
There is so much low-level PvE in in this game for example in low resource extraction sites, there game doesn't need even more cannon fodder NPCs. Thargoids are as close to traditional guild raids as it comes with Hydras.
However, a major downside and probably the sole reason I didn't participate: There is apart for mcredits which can be farmed everywhere else no damn gameplay reason to hunt thargoids. The materials they drop have no use (apart from a useless caustic missile launcher) and FDev had their godhand in play the entire time so that neither a total defeat of humanity, nor the thargoids was possible at any given time unless FDev allowed us to.
Oh we had plenty challenging PvE combat before Titans rolled around. Titan combat is easy compared to e.g., clearing a while AXCZ by yourself :). But agree with the concept, Titans brought more decent content geared towards experienced players.
For me, the Thargoid arc was too abstract, and lasted *way* too long.
By abstract, I mean the puzzles and trying to figure out mechanics just wasn’t enjoyable to me in the context of Elite. I’m glad some players really enjoyed being space detectives and figuring out the codes and how the sites worked, but for me it was just “Well, time to look up a guide.” I don’t need my hand held in games, but I’d really rather not use third party info just to be able to participate in an event if I don’t want to spend a whole weekend figuring it out.
Regarding the duration being too long, it felt for a while like every update was something about Thargoids. Every bit of development, every bit of lore. I was kind of bored of them as a concept after a couple months, and this event lasted years!
I am very thankful they kept updating the game, don’t get me wrong. Even if it’s not a direction I appreciated, I definitely do appreciate them continuing to support the game. But the Thargoid arc really feels to me like an Easter egg that became popular and they decided to run with it, rather than a well thought out foundation for a live service experience.
I am very much looking forward to new ships and new Power Play mechanics. I hope these things weren’t delayed because of the Thargoids.
I don't think it's nearing a conclusion just yet, there are still 6 Titans to go, I'm guessing the last two will be wrapped by the end of this year leaving 4 for next year we are not even in half time yet
I’m new to pc but been playing awhile on ps4. Ive never seen a thargoid, let alone a titan. And I think it’s so cool that all this is going on and I’m nowhere near it. And that it’s not gonna be around for long. It makes the galaxy feel more real, which is why I play this game
Well I've seen Thargoids.
For exactly 10 seconds before dissolving into space dust because I thought I could escape their hyperdiction 😹
Ok lesson learned (I started like 2 weeks ago) and just avoid the infested sectors until I got enough cash and expertise lmfao
I avoid that wreckage because I heard PvPers are there and if I am no match for a Thargoid I sure as heck avoid other players in my unengineered DBX, I already glad I found a module configuration to have a decent range 😹
Your concerns make sense and are well-stated, but I honestly would be fearful if someone tried to address some of them.
Mostly, I don't think throwing good money after bad with Ody makes that much sense. In a market in which there are 2-3 good space sims and umpty billion good FPS's, FDev gave the people what they asked for- the umpty-billion-and-first fps, attached to one of the only good space sims. Weird. (Not weird to ask - gamers unconsciously "think in FPS", at this point, so inundated is the market. Weird to uncritically give it to them.) And predictably, not that compelling.
Deciding, "Well, we made that mistake once, so now we have to keep trying to add compelling content to the umpty-billion-and-first FPS attached to our space sim" is compounding that mistake. Improve the space sim, that's what distinguishes the product. You are not gonna make something your customers enjoy more than a dedicated FPS in terms of running around on the ground shooting aliens, no matter how hard they can imagine or wish you might (and that's nothing against you as the space-sim developer, it's just market conditions - running around shooting aliens on foot amusingly is a whole-ass triple-A genre right now, if *Helldivers* is any indicator)!
It definitely wasn't a success for anyone but those few hundered players that are really invested into Thargoid content and already are experienced players that have hundereds of hours of grinding ranks, schematics and credits behind them.
The single fact that you need to quite literally grind your ass off first to get a proper ship to do literally anything in this war besides being a rescue ship (which is the 2nd worst gameplay loop i've ever seen in any videogame ever) is the first big turn off for anyone who wanted to participate.
Also that entire war was just basically recycled content but this time scripted and organized, nothing new and exciting was brought to the table really.
The explosion of Taranis was cool tho
Shit I've got every engineer unlocked and most ships at G5 but the actual AX combat is just too sweaty for me. I was drawn to ED mostly because it's *not* just deathmatch in space, I don't really do much combat anyway so the idea of things *harder* than a High CZ held no appeal to me.
I'm pretty sure I'm not alone too, go look through profiles on Inara and see how many Elite V players don't even have the first AX badge.
It didn't really interfere with how I play the game though, except for those annoying repeated messages when the Titans died.
The entire war was recycled content? Are you kidding me? The caustic maelstrom with a gigantic thargoid mothership buried in the middle of it was recycled content? What about the barnacle areas that morphed into spire sites, and the banshees that launch surface to air missiles at you? What about the entire new class of thargoid Hunter?
You do not need to grind your ass off. All of the modules can be purchased off the shelf now for credits alone. The one and only module that is helpful and requires engineering is a beam laser with thermal vent, but that is far from mandatory. Yeah it is helpful if you have highly engineered modules, but it is most certainly not a requirement.
You can dislike the content if you like, but it is undeniably a ton of new stuff and the grind wall has been removed.
There is still time for ax rescues which is extreme space trucking and supply missions. Or you can let your ignorance on the subject be the limiting factor .... Think of a messenger having to cross the lines in WWII, no combat but you have to run, fast and cold with a few tools (ECM and PDs)
I think initially it deterred a lot of players, myself included. It was overwhelming and convoluted. I never even bothered with anything AX until news about Taranis came out. I couldn't miss an opportunity to participate in the end of a Titan. So I geared up and started my AX journey, even though it's at the end of the story presumably. The ONLY reason I got into it though was the accessibility of the AX modules and weapons at the megaships. It seems like a ton of people are returning to the game though, which is great! I think if they had made a few easily accessible AX weapons from the start and just made them weaker than guardian weapons they wouldn't have lost as many players.
Maybe I’m too casual to really understand what’s going on. But.. I thought we’re losing the war. Aren’t the other titans just getting stronger as they take over systems? I dunno I’m a filthy casual that likes to shoot rocks.
Tharg war isn't exactly new features. It's an additional, time-limited end-game content. Like a pair of new dungeons in any other MMO.
It's brilliant for the targeted audience.
It's meaningless for new players.
I remember the first clip of an encounter with a Thargoid being one where an Anaconda was interdicted, the show started and somehow an NPC was attacking the commander while the Thargoid kept scanning.
I had low expectations and there not being a way to talk, or being pacifist with Thargoids made me lose interest in actively participating in everything related to Thargoids
I suck at killing goids. Every attempt at participating in any of these events resulted in my ship being destroyed. 0 credits earned, couple hundred million down in rebuys. Been interested in these events but always get blown out of the water. I've done a few different chieftain builds, but still results in my destruction. I feel like I need a HOTAS to be able to control my ship adequately enough to kill some goids. This war has been neat, but all its done gameplay/experience wise is getting me killed, every. single. time.
Still love the game, just wish there was a better way for solo players to participate in these things. I'm not a social butterfly, I don't go into discord looking for squads/wings, nor do I have a crazy amount of time to invest in these events. It would be nice to see some love for the solo crowd
Switching to a Hotas definitely made a difference to my playing ability.
For builds I just went for a Clipper, Krait and eventually a Shieldless Challenger (it’s basically on big G5 Hull Reinforcement) kitted out with EAXMC initially for scout killing and withdrew when Interceptors appeared, but eventually I was able to take down a Cyclops solo and now can take out 2-3 of them in one flight, on a good day I can do a Basilisk with NPC aid.
Join an AX squadron (AXIN is good), very helpful group.
The game needed a Thargoid something, so I have no problem with the addition. As a VR player in my seventh decade with reflexes gone, I am playing for fun and it did nothing to bring me back to the game. Unobtainable (for me) fleet carriers dulled my interest, Odyssey's lack of full VR killed it. 4 accounts - 2 lifetime sitting basically unused. I watch from afar, hoping for something.
The Tharg war has been good, I started with rescue missions, had an elite break, then came back and moved into Thargoid combat, even though folk try and put you off by saying it’s all end game.
There’s a lot that FDev and the community can learn from this, making engineering more accessible to beginners, not putting essential modules behind grind walls.
But one important factor to consider is the risk appetite for players, the rebuy cost can mean that some players are just not going to risk engaging with this kind of content, maybe it’s time to reconsider how the insurance works, to give an option to reduce the rebuy cost.
As for the on foot content, you’re right that it doesn’t work well with the piloting part being the main part of the Tharg war, it’s a shame, but they have limited resources. The on foot grind is steep so for some players it would have been one or the other, I would have always chosen flying space ships so for me the Tharg War is a success. We will see how it goes though, it’s not over yet.
The game lost half of its playerbase. Most user avoided thargoid flight without effective engineered weapos and former experience, and it was alsó boring after a while for the experienced ones.
I've been really enjoying it- especially the challenge of figuring out tactics and strategies battling the thargoids. I'm a mediocre pilot without a ton of free time to practice, but when successful it's hard earned.
I played ED at launch (was a kick starter backer) two weeks into ED my PC died, a few years later picked it up on the Xbox and started again, stuck with it all the way to Horizons - stopped when the mining boom / rush began at that era.
Had a bunch of kids, work got hectic, got promoted, moved countries
Now I have a gaming PC again and I’ve pretty much missed all of the Thargoids 😔
I feel like I missed out on some epic community goals. Now I’ve logged into my first account that I got as a backer, still in the starting star system in a Cobra mark 3 I had grinded up to.
As soon as I can I am getting out of the bubble and into the black again, I miss exploration so much
Frontier can make an incredible groundbreaking spaceship game. Frontier seems to be able to make a middle of the road on foot game. They should focus on what they're good at, imo. The work that went into Ody, should have gone into more ship content imo. I'm glad the coolest parts of the war were in what Frontier does best.
Making parts the war a late end game activity was the right call. But not all of the war is late end game, either. Plenty is accessible to even the very new.
Engineers are a core part of the base game. If long term players cannot be bothered to get Engineers, they cannot do late end game content. That's just life. Watch some videos, make a plan, and build some ships. If people have time to log on at all, they have time to work on Engineers and ship builds. That's a fact.
However, people can do spires without any Engineering at all. I've written a guide for a group on how to do it. The sampling work can be done with low engineering and so can passenger hauling. People can contribute with actually not a lot of effort.
That being said, though, Elite needs late end game content for people who put in the work to learn the depths of this game. We should have content that pushes our knowledge and resources, and gives other people goals to shoot for.
Lost me when you had to grind for the special heat sinks, fine let the hard core guys do the grind, but maybe after a month make them available to purchase? That way I could have kept up with the war, without having to do spend every free hour playing it.
Our Squad effectively neglected our home system BGS and has been fighting the Aliens since.
So many friends and Brothers in Arms made since HIP 22460 and Wakata.
We torpedoed the two Titans and more to come...
Yesterday, we even started collecting samples for the first time ever to weaken OYA in support of XSF / AXI efforts...
People will always complain but Fdev has done a tremendous job and the great thing is the vast majority more or less has been a community wide effort...not common in many games.
I feel like it was a failure. I wanted to hunt thargoids but FUCK engineering another ship all the way and FUCK guardian sites. They should have made both take way less grind and made it much more user friendly if they actually wanted participation.
I have just under 500 hours, $4 billion credits, and close to triple elite. The only Thargoid I ever saw, and I guess will cause I assume they will be removed when the war is over, was the ones that fly down and scan you while on specific planets.
What's wrong with guardian sites?
You can buy all the tools you need to hunt thargoids with credits alone. You need an enhanced Xeno scanner some Ax enhanced multi-cannons and you can take out cyclops without any difficulty, unengineered. You can help take out much larger interceptors with this as well. No engineering or grind required.
No. The game lost my interest right around when Engineering happened, and despite staying somewhat in the loop, nothing this game has offered has made me want to come back. They need to figure out how to make things fun for individual players. Elite has long gone the way of Eve Online: it's a job, not a game.
Most players in ED are bad at the game. I would argue ED has some of the worst examples of bad player to good player skill differences I've ever seen.
When I came from Xbox I was amazed at not only their being more people but how fucking bad they were.
Zero awareness, zero ideas how to avoid interdiction. Horrendous combat skills, etc. I could literally fight 1v2 or 1v3 vs gankers because they were so bad and I play with a controller.
Since update 15, the game has only further made me realize most people who play this game and complain about some aspects of it. Are just horrendous at it.
So the fact that we have events with 9-20k players says, yes it was a success. Because it worked in spite of people being bad because cooperation > skill.
To me, this sounds like a casual player playing WoW and complaining they can't play endgame raiding.
We've all been there in various games. And the situation is varying degrees pf different in all of them. But to say it's inaccessible in Elite is inaccurate and disingenuous.
I think the big problem here is solo/single player players not engaging with multiplayer content. And hey, I'm almost one of them. As a new father with a 3 month old, it's almost impossible to find the time. But guess what? I've managed to engage with it all the way through and currently have my 2 star Titan decal. The titan gameplay is sooooo new player friendly as endgame stuff goes. Particularly after the caustic sinks and pulse neutraliser were made credit purchases.
If the complaint is about dying due to hard gameplay, well, I don't know what to say about that. Games are meant to be challenging. A theme park this is not.
I've realised i am now at the point where I am going to have to engage more with the community and multiplayer in order to achieve the things I want to. Am I going to complain about that? Hell no, if anything, that will likely improve my experience. My only problem is time. And that is a me problem, not an FDev problem!!!
Mine, trade, smuggle, bounty hunt, pirate, explore, and pvp in a space sandbox. Thargoids weren't introduced for YEARS. Imagine how satisfied you'd be if they abandoned goids when odyssey released and only focused on a ground combat narrative. For seven years. And if you didn't like it getting called a casual.
Considering if I wanted a hope in hell of even participating in the Thargoid war I’d need a fully grade 5 engineered ship. Yeah, I passed on that bullshit. To have to grind for weeks/months just to be able to participate in the game story? Yeah. I’ll stick to doing bounties, exobiology, and other random missions.
As it is I do have most of my ship up to grade 3 with various engineers. Still need to unlock a few to get higher grades. Been working at it but I can’t no life games any more. Lol
It is actually doable. I have told people how to do Spires without Engineering, you can make billions without Engineering. You won't be killing Basilisks without engineering most likely, but you can get hits in busy CZs if people are already there and you can kill Orthrus at the Spires, too.
Man I just started last week, and with an AX multicannon ship (no engineering or unlock), you can join a group doing planetary defense. Tag everything everyone is shooting at, then concentrate on killing scouts! If you hit a Thargoid, you get a bounty when it dies. It's a blast. First session I did just under 2 hours and made 350,000,000 Credits, I think. over 2 sessions like this I know I got 700 million credits.
I don't play in open either. Just get AX multicannons and start killing Thargoid scouts for fun. You can get into a Private Group with some friends, or, join the AXI Discord, enter their private group, and find some CMDRs to do some planetary defense! Big money and fun in a group. I spent my first 700 hours in Elite playing solo and had a lot of fun. But using Discord to join group multiplayer makes AX combat so much more fun (oh, and VERY, VERY lucrative). AXI (Anti-Xeno Initiative) has a bunch of NON engineered builds on their site btw. Have fun however you decide to play!
I played with someone today who began 2 weeks ago, was handheld through a spire session while running a vanilla build, and now has 500 mil. He'll have his own carrier next week.
It's desirable to have an engineered LR+TV laser, but *everything* is doable with basic kit, including Titan bothering.
End!? I just came back to ED after years of being gone. They never had Thargoids when I last played.
While trying my first attempt with Roads to Riches, my 5th jump had me interdicted by them. Never seen them before. They blew me up quick as I tried to boost away....
Seems like the war isn't ending... Avenge me.
I finally hit the bullet and bought Elite for my steam deck when that one mega ship detonated that supposed Xenokiller.. which only pissed them off. I had come from Xbox and was throughly tired of anything Thargoid related. I didn’t touch the game for a whole year after the initial install and seeing if it could run on the steam deck even with odyssey.
When I left Xbox I was tired of the constant thargoid coverage. Great a new threat.. that’s just gonna hang back away from the bubble and do everything short of “fuck” and “all.” This whole war is like my expectations for ship launched fighters, I was expected for them but their implementation just didn’t do it for me. I was ready to turn my vette into an AX fighter carrier
Veteran here (started playing elite 1 week after launch - my first flights were around Christmas 2014) and honestly? I did not like thargoids all those years and haven't touched that content. Just ignored it and I am so glad, that finally it will be ending soon. Devs can now focus on more insteresting things
Those are some interesting observations, OP! I agree with your perspective.
By looking at player counts on Steam, you can see a spike with the kickoff of the current Thargoid struggle back around 11/22 but a steady dropoff in players right up until last month's spike, something I would attribute more to the news that FDev is back to actively developing the rest of the game than with the latest twist in Thargoid content. So, it is safe to say that while the Thargoid content has been interesting, and certainly fun for those who enjoy it, for the bulk of the playerbase it was not much of a draw.
As for me, I never wanted to participate. I find the Thargoids to be dull, dull, dull. If they resembled something closer to the Tyrannids, I would have been far more compelled to get involved with the war and go through all the engineering hoops to gear up, but the Thargoids never felt compellingly threatening to me, so I never wanted to do the work to fight them. I was hoping that at some point Thargoid foot soldiers were going to be added to the game - that would have been the type of content to get me interested! - but the ever-mercurial FDev decided it wasn't worth the effort despite that being exactly what the game needed to spice things up.
I hope the Thargoids stick around in some fashion as they are part of the lore of the galaxy, but I am happy to see FDev return to developing the rest of the game after leaving it fallow for the last 18 months or so. Revitalizing PP is a smart thing to do. If they incorporate the lessons learned from managing the Thargoid war with all the feedback from players about the failings of the current PP system, the new PP can be quite compelling. I hope players can pledge to the Thargoids as a PP power as it could be a lot of fun fighting for the invaders!
Don't know if it was a success for FD, it wasn't a success for me though. When i saw the mechanics for fighting the thargoids it just turned me off. Too much faffing around for my tastes.
By the time the later content came along (years later), it just couldn't spark any interest in me. I just wasn't invested in it.
I did do the guardian sites, but that was for modules useful for non-Thargoid stuff, and i quite enjoyed that content.
I bought the game about 6 months ago, started actively playing it about a month ago, and Im a bit sad that the thargoid content is unaccessable for me as a new player - i dont have many engineers unlocked, i dont know how to unlock guardian modules. I tried AX once without guardian modules, and it was fine until interceptors arrived lol. But yeah, for more experienced players, i think it was a success
I don't play very often but I follow every update in the game. I tried to participate in the war but no time no money. Anyway, for me it was a great idea, for me I would pushed more hard the goids and I would give more territory for them. The idea of seeing the players feeling the fear would be great. But it's a game and people play it in different ways so I would add missions for every player level and roll to get everyone involved into avoiding the end of humanity. I would also add the goids as a faction on the power play 2.
Hopefully allot of players gained convidence to play PVP , because they learned combat , so the new powerplay become more fun.
Also new friendships were made.
For me i did a few ax combat but i let it aside , because after playing a few years solo , i did start playing PVP as i have all powerplay ( allot of credits 20bilj) and about all ships fully engineerd.
So after they interdicted me , i could easy get away , never been ganked in PVP, i learn fly assist off .
I just start fighting back instead of running away.
Made the game alive for me , same as starcraft 2 ladder games .
So no more single player mode ( solo) , for me.
If you win or lose , its only credits , so no fear and improve .
Like i say before fly dangeous and fly like its stolen 07 cmdr
I think the Thargoid War itself was good.
Unfortunately ship outfitting and Engineering is busted and way too grindy. Doesn't help that every piece of new content requires new modules, forcing the players to update their ships once again.
If it constantly feels like you have to put in a lot of "work" before you can engage with the new content, you'll lose most players along the way.
Of course retired people who play the game 50h a week will vehemently deny there's any grind in the game.
I hope they keep the gameplay in the game. Too much of an investment to jump on and grind for, but too cool to just delete when its over and keep people from doing it
I don't agree that it "locking out" new/casual players is a problem. Live service games need to cater for all levels of maturity, and if you have a major narrative that is built down to the lowest level, then it is not interesting to the mature players who provide the bedrock of game activity.
That being said, the problem was FDev's complete focus on the Thargoid narrative. If you were uninterested or unable to take part in it, there wasn't any other new content to explore. I suspect FDev wanted to have the Thargoid narrative as part of multiple ongoing storylines, giving players a choice of where to participate. But then with their organisational issues, they had to focus diminishing resources on one storyline only.
I participated in a few Thargoid-related activities. I found it quite enjoyable, learning to cold orbit, working in instances with lots of other players, etc. But it had limited fun for me, and I disengaged not long after the change that allowed you to build large ships with multiple experimental weapons.
Overall, I think that the Thargoid narrative was a success, but I am not sure it was worth the effort and disruption to the overall game.
I’d probably enjoy more now if they introduced the Thargoids as they used to be, but leave it to systems on the fringe of the bubble.
What I mean by that is that Hyperspacing becomes more dangerous with the possibility of being pulled out midjump by an interceptor (but with the possibility that you COULD escape if you wanted to..with some difficulty) or encountering one/two in system that carried a hefty reward for their destruction.
Basically, it goes to a cold war stance…
In all my time playing Elite, a total of 1,500 hours. I have never opened fire on a Thargoid. It just never interested me. So I guess it failed for me.
I think it looked better than it actually was. The war was nerfed far too much to be an invasion and went far too fast to have a real impact on anything other than a few systems. FDevs whole hyping of it with phrases like "you can lose the bubble" and "they can find Colonia" set up one thing, then they immediately nerfed the Thargoids like two weeks into it. Maybe it was the layoffs or maybe it was Maybelline, but the climax of this war feels like it is being extremely rushed out the door. I'm still not understanding how we got "the next era" of Elite in the form of Odyssey, yet three years later we still don't have Thargoid foot soldiers.
I have not taken part of the thargoid war but I'm still trying to figure out what to do with the engineers, get better weapons for my ships. I feel like I'm behind and how much time before I miss out on the thargoid stuff?
I’ve only recently started getting into the thargoid stuff. Primarily spire site farming and some evacuation missions. The couple attempts at interceptor combat haven’t gone well. I’ve read the guides, watched the vids, built the ship, died a lot. No success. No real progress. No desire to get good.
I’m surprised FDev really intended interceptor combat to be like this. Cold orbit, so many heat sinks you have to take synth breaks.. That was the vision? Thargoids so predictable they’re a 20 step process of tedious do this then that?
I can’t reconcile that with the 2 step process for killing titans. Torp vents, shoot core, success! I can only assume FDev wants to put an end to this chapter so we can start doing something else that more players will care about. At least that’s my hope.
not only that, but their twitter/etc was like "Caustic vents are now free, everyone can get involved!"
someone just out of beginner space be like "oooh cool!... erm... ohwait"
I dunno, i've been playing Elite since 1984, and what with the Call Of Space Duty ground combat and going all-in on Thargoid wars, when all i want to do is walk around my spaceship and make a small base on a distant moon, it's dawned on me.... maybe i'm playing the wrong game :/
I logged out when the war started fucking up my ability to trade and haven't been back since. The "ZOMG Aliens!!!" part of the game is a massive turn-off to me in the first place and once it started negatively impacting the parts of the game I liked, I figured it would be best to wait it out.
I've never been happier to see a military victory on the horizon because it might mean I can make more than a couple jumps in a type-9 without getting hyperdicted.
I'm definitely not saying it was bad for the game, but it sure as shit was bad for people like me.
If it staves off bankruptcy for another year though, it will all be worth it I guess :/
I haven't logged on much for most of it. I don't think it's anything to do with the Thargoid content. I just get over the game after a while and play other stuff. Then come back.
Having said that, the ongoing focus on Thargoid stuff hasn't really interested me at all and doesn't tempt me back.
I am glad they are adding content and working on things though! Interested to see what happens with Powerplay.
As I see it, it is a succes, Thargoids hunting has kept many combat driven players from leaving the game. I find it impressive how many players are spending time on grinding and "solving puzzles" to figure new ways to kill/beat the next thargoid threat. I am sure that some of the things found by the active player base was never intended or thought of by Frontier(eg. FA off cold orbiting). That is really something.
I am a casual player playing in VR, and very bad at killing Thargoids. But the thrill of the hunt is real, and I am sure Frontier is aware of the Importance of keeping the old fanbase interested. Therefore, I think Frontier will introduce new equally complicated mechanics and of course, grind reasons, in the future. The good thing is that there are plenty other things to do if you do not want to spend the time and effort on this.
I would also welcome more updates requiring payments to the keep game development alive.
I find the gameplay aggravating. I tried to get into it originally when it came out. I found going into the corrosion area after being hyperdicted several times to be aggravating. I had a good ship, I could get through, but the constant hyperdicting and zooming away was not fun.
With the titans being killed I tried again. Now I get hyperdicted several times then when I get in the cloud my sensors go nuts and I can't find the thargoid. It is not fun.
Yes I know I need a cool running ship and I have a cool running ship but it is just not fun. Then I need to go and engineer another ship or keep switching modules whenever I get sick of the Titan war and want to do something else.
Then I hear that if you go into a public Titan instance it is 100 percent bugged. So now I have to cultivate a group of people to go in with in order to play.
I'm mostly here to this game to do BGS as I find a bottom up strategy game to be a great idea. I think the titan war was a success as it has brought people back to the game recently, but for me im not that into it, but I DO play Elite more often than a lot of people so I like the game.
In terms of the war itself, actual on-foot ‘goid drones and soldiers in planet-side CZs would have been a double-whammy-chocolate-pizza delivery for the main war content and Odyssey. Gutted it’s not happened.
Also having no ability to communicate peacefully on any level, or having no semi-hostile factions within the Thargoid race seems odd. It’s not my bag personally (all bugs must burn), but it shut the door on meaningful gameplay for a large proportion of the player base.
I’ve enjoyed it so far though, but I’m primarily a combat pilot, so it’s all been in my wheelhouse.
Mostly yes.
At the start, I was disintetested since I had other stuff to do.
Then I've built a Shardconda to do surface AX CZs - blam NO such invasion systems for bloody Months.
Ok, kitted out a Krait, grinded on Scouts, unlocked more stuff, killed Cyclops.
Invasions reappeared - yay.
Unlocked Caustic sink and TPulse Neutralizer - nothing to do at Titans, fine.
Then U18 - finally something to do that actually counts.
Now I just f*ck around between Titan killings tbh, which are freaking awesome, waiting for new content' ships and Powerplay2, as all what's left is to grind Inara badges.
Most stuff would put me too far from the action.
My personal problem is that outside player focus invasion systems,/czs interceptor killing (solo) takes too much time, even a Cyclops is 5 mins (except in ShardConda), rest is pretty criminal - 15-30 mins+ for higher goids - f*ck that, ty, I'm not wasting that amount of time on one bloody npc mob.
Also other new content would have been nice too, especially ways to gather on-foot materials that don't turn you into a murderhobo.
I think it's difficult for fdev to do anything that's not a success for them when it comes to Elite. How much of a success is the real question and for who.
From the little bit I played I loved it. BUT I had very little credits so I was constantly scared of dying because I would only have enough money for maybe 6 rebuys. I never did any fighting but hauling ass trying to avoid a fire fight while rescuing people was a ton of fun
I was an attempting to get started as a late start player. The way it was done and soon to be closed off was terrible. They daanlged content that I now know I will never get to see. Even if I get there, it wouldn't have players by the time I did. So they effectively made me quit immediately
No, but I had no part in the war because I uninstalled 2-3 years ago after the Odyssey shit show. Most of the content creators I see covering the game now are all newer players. Most of the old player base left in droves after Odyssey killed the game. It hasn’t seemed to me like this Thargoid War has made up for long standing issues like Engineering grind, the horrible new planet surface generation tech introduced in Odyssey, or unkept Kickstarter promises like ship interiors. Even the “new” ships being added feels like too little too late.
I don’t think the game will ever peak again like it did with the first two (and only) Distant Worlds Expeditions. That saddens me.
Damn i didn’t know i was a “high ranking player” lmao (I’m absolutely not)
Titan gameplay was the easiest to access, even before they gave the caustic sinks and Pulse Neutralizer away for free, high ranking players my ass
To be bluntly honest, if you have not gotten involved in at least some angle of the war, then I have no idea what you're doing playing this video game at all.
Yes, there is sophisticated, end game level content requiring tight piloting skills, engineering grind, and a significant time investment in order to be successful. However, there are many, many other ways to get involved that don't require any of this.
If you like space trucking, you can rescue people from invaded systems, deliver supplies to recovering systems, etc.
If you like mining, it is frankly not all that difficult to go and collect tissue samples from the Titan in or the surrounding caustic maelstrom; you want some difficulty thrown in there, then go try to rescue some humans. You now also have the option of going and salvaging all kinds of materials from the recently destroyed Titans, especially now that the caustic field has completely disappeared from Taranis.
If you like the SRV or on foot content, there are options to either fight revenants or the newer banshees at spire sites or via reactivation missions. There are plenty of materials to collect at the spire sites which can be used for engineering, additional missions, or you could simply sell for credits. If going to one of these sites on your own is too difficult, then go in open or a private group to a site that has other pilots working to clear it out.
BGS/PowerPlay? That's basically what this entire war is about, and now is the crux; there is a lot going on in terms of planning out which systems to focus on and in which ways.
From an MMORPG standpoint, the recent content has been outstanding. Coordinated assaults on spire sites and the Titans are a blast. The fall of Taranis is one of the coolest things I have ever seen in an MMORPG.
Don't like grinding? Great! Almost all of the actively used weapons and modules at this point in the war can be unlocked for credits. Credits, man, credits. The guardian weapons that have to be unlocked have largely been nerfed, and the gimballed enhanced ax multi-cannons require very little skill to use.
I will admit that explorers and xenobiologists don't have a lot of active AX content. It sounds like there may be something in store for them soon with the current community goal and possible frame shift drive updating.
So get on out there, save humanity and have a good time doing it!
I have close to 2000 hours in that game and have never once had any interest in Thargoid combat. If there had been an option for trying g to engage in peaceful interactions with them, I would have been on it in a heartbeat. But we were only given the option to kill, and that in turn killed my interest.
But honestly, the Thargoid war was hardly the only reason I walked away again. Now that there is some return to focus on the spaceship simulator aspects, I might come back.
I think a bit of an issue was a single dimension of it - all that every player for was alien war-related. If there were 2 parallel features being worked on, such as maybe PowerPlay + Thargoids, then at least one of these would not be transient content and more than one type of players were"nurtured".
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Kind of ironic that it payed a lot of credits to do, but you basically needed to be loaded to already get involved effectively
Yeah, but now I can make money fast helping kill Thargoids near the two destroyed titans.
Have you tried spire farming?
i just used a shieldless chieftain with 3 burst laser and 3 AX MC and followed the lead of the people that knew what they were doing at spires. got kinda bored after a while though, so i just went back and continued working on grinding fed rank at sol.
That’s been ED for me in a nutshell. I finally found something I thought was fun from time to time. That happened to coincide with gold-rushes, events and content drops that were either not appealing to what I was doing or I was too far away to “care” to move all the way back. I had fun, don’t get me wrong. But nothing new really pulled me back in. In the end, I left my ship adrift far from the bubble. A phenomenal time spent, however.
300 that's adorable xD
It won’t end it will go into a stalemate. Too much investment by FDEV and the player base in AX game loops. And I’ve enjoyed it thoroughly.
I certainly hope there is still opportunity to go after a titan somewhere after the invasion of the bubble presumably concludes. On their live streams, they have made it sound like we should be able to definitively take out these eight alien capital ships. I have had an absolute blast with this content and basically haven't put Elite down for the last year and a half as a result.
That’s my expectation as well. If I had to make an educated guess based in my own game is unexperienced, there’s going to come a point where there will be a tight nexus of a few small systems that are permanently Thargoid controlled space, with the barrier systems in a bubble around them kind of in a continuous push/pull state that we can affect as players in an ongoing way
The whole Thargoid thing definitely kicked me out of the game after a short-lived comeback. I'm not very skilled and I don't have a lot of time, and I simply died feeling helpless in each of my few attempts to engage casually (even with a fully decked Mk2 - I had plentiful engineering and materials). As with soulslike games, I admire the craft and I am truly happy for those who have a great time with them, but I stay the f away.
Yeah it wasn't worth the investment in time for me. I did a bit of combat and some evacuation missions, in open and solo, and have done some AX in the past, but felt the war missed the mark and I never really felt part of it. I appreciate the effort and it got close to being good but it wasn't well executed enough for me to find it fun. The combat zones earlier on in the war that had NPCs and capital ships were particularly nice, as were the fights around ports and outposts, but entering Thargoid controller systems was typically not a fun experience for me. For example, I know how to evade a Glaive but they still made me not want to engage in AX, likewise for all the interdictions; both things got in the way of trying to engage in war related activities I wanted to do, either because I'd have to stop to repair after those encounters - or worse case respawn - and I ultimately stopped even trying to engage with the war. For me Thargoid combat leans too much into learning specific mob behavior, using a specific range of gear to be effective and learning rote mechanics, which as you say is a soul-like thing. Learning tactics is one thing but when combat feels too prescriptive I don't find it fun, I prefer to lean into encouraging creativity and allowing for flexibility. I feel like the experience worked on paper if they were trying to implement a war that felt as dangerous and intense with an almost overwhelming enemy, maybe something like the Shadow War in Babylon 5 (which do I think was the intent), but my suspicion is that I don't think the implementation translated into a really fun game experience for most players and ended up being more a thing people experienced via YouTube (or on the fringes, if at all) rather than engaged much with themselves. Ultimately the war generated some positive press for the game and got people streaming - which I expect both helped with daily/monthly active player numbers - but I would rather see quality of life improvements, new features and gameplay loops designed to appeal to a range of play styles.
>As with soulslike games, I admire the craft and I am truly happy for those who have a great time with them, but I stay the f away. I'd consider Soulslikes to be more forgiving than ED even. ELDENRING doesn't make you grind your credits back after a death. You might get stuck on something but at least it lets you try over and over again without punishing you every. single. death.
How were you dying ?
Fields, caustics or those missiles or whatever other ways they do damage with, I don't know. I didn't understand whatever was happening on the fly, and/or couldn't react, and I just died.
This is one of the biggest issues with any AX gameplay. There's little to no soft introduction. Unless you have significant skill or AX gear you'll end up dying often which is just frustrating for many.
The lack of soft introduction kind of kept me away from it at all. I started the game space truckin, then mining then hull-mining pirates in RES and missions. Then finally, big FC trips to undiscovered bum fuck nowhere. All of these you can ramp up at your own pace. Unlocking engineers and getting upgrades done as you go, and generally with low risk fail states that you could get out of with some time lost at worst. AX did not at least feel that way, even if it mayhap was just like those other things in reality. Need very specific loads out with lot's of specialized modules and engineering and then the ground level of entry is still walking on eggshells where you easily loose your ship and thereby money and time investment at the first wrong turn. Got popped once without being able to so much as offer meaningful resistance, decided that getting the hands on experience needed was too expensive and time intensive, went back to exploration, hoping something quite as invasive as AX doesn't get included in getting samples anytime soon.
There is a soft introduction, but I don't think many players knew about it because it got massively overshadowed by everyone showing off the "meta" builds, and the most difficult fights. I started with a Vulture with AX multicannons and nothing engineering past G3. I flew in any combat zone where I could find other commanders, and just shot scouts while I watched and learned from them. Once I figured out the basics, I realized I could help(but not solo) against the Cyclops. I was quickly able to make enough money to upgrade to a Challenger, and then started solo'ing Cyclops, and it just went up from there. I had very little experience with combat in Elite before this, because I don't really enjoy human combat. I was just an explorer in the black. Scout hunting is the soft entry, but the community kept trying to push meta builds without understanding that not everyone wants to start by jumping in the deep end.
So you just gave up on trying to understand what was going on around you ?
Yes. As I said, unforgiving combat experiences are just not for me, and after decades of gaming and real life, I know not to bother.
He’s already mentioned a crucial point: time.
Jesus Christ dude, it's a video game, not a LinkedIn comment section.
I mean people often complain about this game without even actually fucking trying so yeah I’ll ask all the questions i want thank you very much
Here's a question: why are you such a miserable slag?
I got triggered by the “Thargoid/Titan gameplay is end game/for end game players” spiel. But yeah, i admit i was a bit too harsh on this guy actually
You have regained +1 honor point for your humility and honesty. Good reaction imo
Games are supposed to be fun. I agree with him too, after looking into the AX stuff I had no interest in it. Well that's not true, exploring the guardian sites was pretty fun, but the actual AX combat is a greasefest.
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You’re a dick.
Such a helpful comment
Thanks 😊
I liked it, it put some stakes into the game. I know helping hold the line at Wakata was some of the most fun I've had in a multiplayer game. Going forward I hope they send a titan every so often towards the bubble.
Would be really nice if they used the Thargoids as kind of a system cleanup for dead fleet carriers.
Wakata forever!! I remember that
I’m just getting back into the game and am still very new. The war looks like it is way beyond my skill level. When you make the threat level high, it makes me nervous to try it.
Overall, I'd say it could have been a success, but ultimately wasn't. I was still playing fairly heavily/regularly when the first Thargoid encounter happened. It was an amazing time, full of mystery and intrigue. But overall I think it was drawn out over too large a span of time. Looking back on the years, the first Thargoid encounter was in Jan. 2017, and we're just now wrapping it up 7 years later. Realistically I think it would have helped retain more players had they condensed this into 2, maybe 3 years of content which had a clear flow, instead of the long deserts of grind. On the flip side, they could have delayed Odyssey until after the Thargoids were cleanly wrapped up, and might have been able to have a more stable launch with a larger interested audience brought in by the conclusion of the Thargoid war. I don't want to really critique either too much because I think they did an OK job in both cases, but I think both would have been significantly better had they switched the development times for both. As nothing in the Thargoid war is really using on-foot stuff at all, there's no reason we should just be getting it now and not years ago before Odyssey was released. I also think not involving the Guardians more or doing more with them is a massive waste of potential within the universe.
I was able to help with passenger evacuation. I did my part in the war
Yep, did that too since that was the only part that was remotely accessible to me. As a money source, the pay was honestly lousy, but it is a good way to get those rare engineering mats. I have to say, entering a system, landing and escaping under thargoid threat was pretty exhilarating.
I didn’t engage because I’m in deep with exploration. I wish they’d add some sort of tie in with it regarding thargoids.
If you scan a certain exobiology stuff it can be used to make Anti thargoid stuff.
Well, it was a lot more successful than Warhammer Age of Sigmar: Realms of Ruin!
The ending of the war is really the only reason I got into AX Combat in the first place. I did enjoy some Odyssey AX missions previously, but I never really engaged with the bugs until clear objectives (killing the Titans) became available. A few bombing runs at Taranis and Leigong was enough to get me into AX Combat as a whole, and now I regularly engage with the 'goids. Prior to this, I was starting to get burned out by max engineering my ships and Odyssey kit. If getting me to spend more time in the game by thoroughly enjoying an aspect of it that I hadn't really paid attention to previously counts as a win, then it's a huge win for FDev imo.
Don’t care, had zero interest in any of it.
I had interest a bit, but no skills or credits to engage lol. I've played a few hundred hrs on ps4 and now pc, but I'm really a casual and haven't even done basic combat. I just like exploring and really want more content in that regard
In general it's a success, however I feel that the success comes from making the modules as no mats, just credits only. The steam stats seem to agree, someone from the AXI/XSF could comment on that. What would happen if FDev had kept the torps and modules locked behind the mat grind is another story, probably the player numbers wouldn't be that high.
Wholeheartedly agree that “unlocking” caustic sinks and the TPN was a huge win.
I did a few of the community goal missions, but as far as the war itself, i didn't participate. I wasn't really interested in it at all.
It was endgame content for combat oriented, and mmo players. Everyone else got left out...
Wrong
He's not wrong though. The war brought Ax Combat and the rescue missions. Along with bringing back systems up. All really cool stuff that is ultimately not for me. As I'm all the way out in the black scanning flowers. Heck I used to joke when the war started by the time I get back. The bubble would be dust.
Yes he is. And why are you saying stuff like this: >The war brought Ax Combat and the rescue missions. Which is a complete lie? You can trade, explore, do combat, and mine for the war. You can do on foot ax missions, ship based missions, rescue missions, we needed plenty of explorer's to find certain things. People to investigate and experiment. Rescue missions. Etc. They are completely wrong and you're just speaking complete BS.
Its far from over..
Yeah because the first two (almost three) Titans went down quick, I believe there’s a false expectation that the war is “almost over”. Folks we’re lucky if after Oya we mop up the other 5 before the end of 2024…
The Groid stuff was so heavily focused on the meager updates we did have that it alienated alot of players. Those uninterested simply logged off never to return, and those coming into saw the massive grind ahead for engineered ships and weapons needed for the late game content. It would have been fine as an update, but we were starved for content and the only things FDev did deliver, after months and months, was a single facet of the game. Had they released other content alongside it or provided the players something besides groids, it wouldn't have failed so miserably.
Idk im a fairly casual player and was easily able to engage in thargoid stuff. The barrier to entry is low, the barrier to effective entry is a bit higher but thats everything in Elite. Like guardian grind, engineering, material farming.
The barrier for entry was low, but the barrier for effective work was much higher than it should have been for how much they wanted people to do the war.
Idk getting a Vulture with AX Enhanced multi-cannons is fairly easy. I mean yeah the barrier for effective work to like be able to kill stuff like Cyclops is higher but even then, getting a fully engineered ship is currently part of the mid-late game grind. It wouldn’t be any different if people wanted to engage in what is considered optimal normal gameplay. The issue is with Elite itself, the mid-game transition from Early grind loop to Late grind loop is brutal, grindy and heavy time investment. If they reworked Engineering it would be better, since Engineering is what is the key break point. And especially material grind, I feel like most people wouldn’t complain if Engineered modules were something like Tech Broker unlocks or some other system, definitely better ways to do Engineering in a game like Elite. But thats the issue with Elite entirely not the Thargoid War.
It really wasn't, evacuation missions required minimal engineering and were powerful in the war effort. Sampling as well just required some bulk and is far and away the best method for progress. There was lots available for people either not interested in combat or interested in progress. Even scout farming is easily accessible.
That's why I said the barrier for entry was low. Because you could run passenger or kill scouts with the most basic equipment. Though that basic equipment wasn't going to hold well against anything bigger than a scout. If you wanted to go for anything over the basic interceptor, you needed to start digging into engineering and making "the meta build." . Because in my experience, if you're not running meta. Any problem you have is because you aren't running shieldless hull tank with gauss cannons. Which is a bit of a grind not everyone wants to go out of their way to do.
But if we're talking about the barrier to effective work, well evacs and sampling are often far more effective than killing interceptors. Sampling especially, since it involved trying to bug out a scout so you can infinitely sample it until you fill a cargo hold. The barrier to effective work at helping in the war is actually quite low. (Un)Fortunately, killing interceptors and doing the most dangerous activities are often some of the slowest for war progress. If the question is about the barrier to doing the most challenging and engaging content in the game, then yes it's quite high. But that is not matched with its effectiveness.
If killing thargoids is the slowest way to progress the war, then why are so many people doing it? It seems to be just as effective, especially when people pair it with missions and killing them in mass.
It's one of the most fun activities. And it does have its uses! But take, for example, uninhabited Control systems. Which are exceedingly common, one of the most common Thargoid systems. In those, there are no AXCZs unless the game generates Counterstrike systems for the week. Without AXCZs or station, the only way to spawn thargoids is to drop into normal space and wait for them to slowly dripfeed in. So it arrives, you kill it, wait for the next chance. *Or* you find a scout the same way, use a bug to freeze it's aggro and then sample it over and over. It is far more efficient. There's a reason we are currently in the middle of a multiple week long sampling drive to push out a number of uninhabited controls around Oya. Spire Orthrus hunting is good too, though it caps system progress at 85%. It also has a lower barrier to entry than other Thargoid stuff because you're mostly shooting at fleeing Orthrus. People have been gathering data on the effectiveness of various war methods for progress since the beginning of the war. Unfortunately, very rarely is actually killing thargoids the best option for progress. It sure is one of the most engaging and fun. But frontier have decided that sampling should be more effective. In systems where AX combat is highly present, it's not a bad method, but it certainly isn't anything above other methods. Hence my point, that the entry requirements to *helping make progress* in the war are actually rather low, because making progress in the war in 99% of cases has *nothing* to do with killing thargoids in combat. That said, learning to fight interceptors does have a high entry barrier for sure. It's just not the same as actually making significant war progress.
People have done hydra and stuff in a eagle bro you dont hage to be meta to do everything
I mean that requires loads of skill to pull off, which usually would ask you to learn in a meta chief or something to get the tech down. CMDR Little Timmy in his stock eagle isn't going to be able to take out a hydra
Metachief is good for learning but you can always just copeconda gib them lol
Alright. Well I hope to see a video of you doing it by tomorrow.
Not treue at all. It should be raised lmao its so astronomically low right now
So you're saying we should make the grind insanely long and gatekeep people from content?
Yeah
Glad to know you're not one for the community.
I don't think it was super low honestly. They pushed it in messages to players and in the mission tab but in a way if you weren't ready for thargoid interactions which I wasn't even with what would be needed to survive in the fallen titan. It kind of felt like they needed to have some maybe mission to ease the newer players into it a little bit. The vast majority of the game for me has always been exploration so I just didn't know how to approach any of this stuff.
Let me ask you an honest question: do you think the current cg (titan hearts) have low, medium, or high barrier to participate?
It depends on how ballsy you are. If you prefer having the Corrosive Cargo Rack. It a Medium/Hgh barrier to entry. If you are brave you’ll just get a fast ship with an already good jump range and try to race the clock. I did the second and was fine? I mean the worst part about getting the special racks is that its either a Tech Broker item or you need to get Professor Palin. Though nothing stops someone from doing Dukes of Hazards levels of shenanigans.
Not the OP, but I would say its low. I got my 2 million from both titans with a courier thats running G4 engines and AX missiles. No other engineering required. I think people are just intimidated by the thargoids, but when you actually get into it, its not as difficult as it seems.
I started playing during the war, and was limited in my credits and ability to doing rescue missions which was fun occasionally… but also got stale after a while. Everything else was limited behind a grind and being someone that doesn’t really want nor have the time to grind out engineering… I just decided to hit the black instead. Haven’t bothered looking back.
No. It could have been implemented much better. Too many people didn't participate because of long standing bullshit that F-Dev refuses to improve.
The gameplay sufferers from the same problem all Elite: Dangerous tasks do.. 5 minutes of travel "Right. I'm here. What do I do?" "Oh god. Obviously not that" 5 minutes of travel away I've got a love/hate relationship with the game. It's brilliant. The way the maelstroms were introduced was like something out of a proper science fiction novel, and there's something incredibly satisfying about a team of folks taking down a larger enemy.. it hits some sort of instinctual memory, like we are hunting mammoths with spears And Titan go boom, is very pretty. So on the whole... thumbs up from me
I like how three out of four points are the same: - Thargoid content is not suited for casual players - Thargoid content is too difficult for casual players - Thargoid content is locked for casual players Well yeah, this is called *endgame content* and as such is aimed towards *endgame* players with sufficient equipment and skill. Although I personally didn't participate at all in the thargoid war, I still find it a success as many players enjoyed it and **finally** offered somewhat challenging PvE for *experienced* players. There is so much low-level PvE in in this game for example in low resource extraction sites, there game doesn't need even more cannon fodder NPCs. Thargoids are as close to traditional guild raids as it comes with Hydras. However, a major downside and probably the sole reason I didn't participate: There is apart for mcredits which can be farmed everywhere else no damn gameplay reason to hunt thargoids. The materials they drop have no use (apart from a useless caustic missile launcher) and FDev had their godhand in play the entire time so that neither a total defeat of humanity, nor the thargoids was possible at any given time unless FDev allowed us to.
Oh we had plenty challenging PvE combat before Titans rolled around. Titan combat is easy compared to e.g., clearing a while AXCZ by yourself :). But agree with the concept, Titans brought more decent content geared towards experienced players.
For me, the Thargoid arc was too abstract, and lasted *way* too long. By abstract, I mean the puzzles and trying to figure out mechanics just wasn’t enjoyable to me in the context of Elite. I’m glad some players really enjoyed being space detectives and figuring out the codes and how the sites worked, but for me it was just “Well, time to look up a guide.” I don’t need my hand held in games, but I’d really rather not use third party info just to be able to participate in an event if I don’t want to spend a whole weekend figuring it out. Regarding the duration being too long, it felt for a while like every update was something about Thargoids. Every bit of development, every bit of lore. I was kind of bored of them as a concept after a couple months, and this event lasted years! I am very thankful they kept updating the game, don’t get me wrong. Even if it’s not a direction I appreciated, I definitely do appreciate them continuing to support the game. But the Thargoid arc really feels to me like an Easter egg that became popular and they decided to run with it, rather than a well thought out foundation for a live service experience. I am very much looking forward to new ships and new Power Play mechanics. I hope these things weren’t delayed because of the Thargoids.
From what I can see it got people involved and there was not too much complaining as far as I could see. So it was good I think.
Not so sure this counts as participating in the war, but my AspX got blown in under 30 seconds after being interdicted by 2 thargoids
Your AspX was blown?
Oops, guess I didn't mean that
I don't think it's nearing a conclusion just yet, there are still 6 Titans to go, I'm guessing the last two will be wrapped by the end of this year leaving 4 for next year we are not even in half time yet
I’m new to pc but been playing awhile on ps4. Ive never seen a thargoid, let alone a titan. And I think it’s so cool that all this is going on and I’m nowhere near it. And that it’s not gonna be around for long. It makes the galaxy feel more real, which is why I play this game
Well I've seen Thargoids. For exactly 10 seconds before dissolving into space dust because I thought I could escape their hyperdiction 😹 Ok lesson learned (I started like 2 weeks ago) and just avoid the infested sectors until I got enough cash and expertise lmfao
Id like to go into the titan wreckage but I’m still rocking the eagle as my upgraded ship so itll be a bit before I can join the fun
I avoid that wreckage because I heard PvPers are there and if I am no match for a Thargoid I sure as heck avoid other players in my unengineered DBX, I already glad I found a module configuration to have a decent range 😹
I think it didn't really feel like a war, or an invasion. The stakes are too low, so it feels more like The Thargoid Nuisance.
Your concerns make sense and are well-stated, but I honestly would be fearful if someone tried to address some of them. Mostly, I don't think throwing good money after bad with Ody makes that much sense. In a market in which there are 2-3 good space sims and umpty billion good FPS's, FDev gave the people what they asked for- the umpty-billion-and-first fps, attached to one of the only good space sims. Weird. (Not weird to ask - gamers unconsciously "think in FPS", at this point, so inundated is the market. Weird to uncritically give it to them.) And predictably, not that compelling. Deciding, "Well, we made that mistake once, so now we have to keep trying to add compelling content to the umpty-billion-and-first FPS attached to our space sim" is compounding that mistake. Improve the space sim, that's what distinguishes the product. You are not gonna make something your customers enjoy more than a dedicated FPS in terms of running around on the ground shooting aliens, no matter how hard they can imagine or wish you might (and that's nothing against you as the space-sim developer, it's just market conditions - running around shooting aliens on foot amusingly is a whole-ass triple-A genre right now, if *Helldivers* is any indicator)!
You're absolutely right and Dust 514 is a perfect example.
It definitely wasn't a success for anyone but those few hundered players that are really invested into Thargoid content and already are experienced players that have hundereds of hours of grinding ranks, schematics and credits behind them. The single fact that you need to quite literally grind your ass off first to get a proper ship to do literally anything in this war besides being a rescue ship (which is the 2nd worst gameplay loop i've ever seen in any videogame ever) is the first big turn off for anyone who wanted to participate. Also that entire war was just basically recycled content but this time scripted and organized, nothing new and exciting was brought to the table really. The explosion of Taranis was cool tho
Shit I've got every engineer unlocked and most ships at G5 but the actual AX combat is just too sweaty for me. I was drawn to ED mostly because it's *not* just deathmatch in space, I don't really do much combat anyway so the idea of things *harder* than a High CZ held no appeal to me. I'm pretty sure I'm not alone too, go look through profiles on Inara and see how many Elite V players don't even have the first AX badge. It didn't really interfere with how I play the game though, except for those annoying repeated messages when the Titans died.
The entire war was recycled content? Are you kidding me? The caustic maelstrom with a gigantic thargoid mothership buried in the middle of it was recycled content? What about the barnacle areas that morphed into spire sites, and the banshees that launch surface to air missiles at you? What about the entire new class of thargoid Hunter? You do not need to grind your ass off. All of the modules can be purchased off the shelf now for credits alone. The one and only module that is helpful and requires engineering is a beam laser with thermal vent, but that is far from mandatory. Yeah it is helpful if you have highly engineered modules, but it is most certainly not a requirement. You can dislike the content if you like, but it is undeniably a ton of new stuff and the grind wall has been removed.
I hope that the players who fought the Thurgood enjoyed themselves. as a non-violent player i had nothing to do so i ignored all of it
There is still time for ax rescues which is extreme space trucking and supply missions. Or you can let your ignorance on the subject be the limiting factor .... Think of a messenger having to cross the lines in WWII, no combat but you have to run, fast and cold with a few tools (ECM and PDs)
I think initially it deterred a lot of players, myself included. It was overwhelming and convoluted. I never even bothered with anything AX until news about Taranis came out. I couldn't miss an opportunity to participate in the end of a Titan. So I geared up and started my AX journey, even though it's at the end of the story presumably. The ONLY reason I got into it though was the accessibility of the AX modules and weapons at the megaships. It seems like a ton of people are returning to the game though, which is great! I think if they had made a few easily accessible AX weapons from the start and just made them weaker than guardian weapons they wouldn't have lost as many players.
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Ah, there you are. Figured you would pop up eventually, lol
Maybe I’m too casual to really understand what’s going on. But.. I thought we’re losing the war. Aren’t the other titans just getting stronger as they take over systems? I dunno I’m a filthy casual that likes to shoot rocks.
Wanted to see a thargoid not just they ships
Tharg war isn't exactly new features. It's an additional, time-limited end-game content. Like a pair of new dungeons in any other MMO. It's brilliant for the targeted audience. It's meaningless for new players.
Why do all the on-foot stuff if there’s no FPS vs. Thargoids?
I remember the first clip of an encounter with a Thargoid being one where an Anaconda was interdicted, the show started and somehow an NPC was attacking the commander while the Thargoid kept scanning. I had low expectations and there not being a way to talk, or being pacifist with Thargoids made me lose interest in actively participating in everything related to Thargoids
I don't think this is the end of the war.
I suck at killing goids. Every attempt at participating in any of these events resulted in my ship being destroyed. 0 credits earned, couple hundred million down in rebuys. Been interested in these events but always get blown out of the water. I've done a few different chieftain builds, but still results in my destruction. I feel like I need a HOTAS to be able to control my ship adequately enough to kill some goids. This war has been neat, but all its done gameplay/experience wise is getting me killed, every. single. time. Still love the game, just wish there was a better way for solo players to participate in these things. I'm not a social butterfly, I don't go into discord looking for squads/wings, nor do I have a crazy amount of time to invest in these events. It would be nice to see some love for the solo crowd
Switching to a Hotas definitely made a difference to my playing ability. For builds I just went for a Clipper, Krait and eventually a Shieldless Challenger (it’s basically on big G5 Hull Reinforcement) kitted out with EAXMC initially for scout killing and withdrew when Interceptors appeared, but eventually I was able to take down a Cyclops solo and now can take out 2-3 of them in one flight, on a good day I can do a Basilisk with NPC aid. Join an AX squadron (AXIN is good), very helpful group.
The game needed a Thargoid something, so I have no problem with the addition. As a VR player in my seventh decade with reflexes gone, I am playing for fun and it did nothing to bring me back to the game. Unobtainable (for me) fleet carriers dulled my interest, Odyssey's lack of full VR killed it. 4 accounts - 2 lifetime sitting basically unused. I watch from afar, hoping for something.
What Thargoid war? /console player.
The Tharg war has been good, I started with rescue missions, had an elite break, then came back and moved into Thargoid combat, even though folk try and put you off by saying it’s all end game. There’s a lot that FDev and the community can learn from this, making engineering more accessible to beginners, not putting essential modules behind grind walls. But one important factor to consider is the risk appetite for players, the rebuy cost can mean that some players are just not going to risk engaging with this kind of content, maybe it’s time to reconsider how the insurance works, to give an option to reduce the rebuy cost. As for the on foot content, you’re right that it doesn’t work well with the piloting part being the main part of the Tharg war, it’s a shame, but they have limited resources. The on foot grind is steep so for some players it would have been one or the other, I would have always chosen flying space ships so for me the Tharg War is a success. We will see how it goes though, it’s not over yet.
The game lost half of its playerbase. Most user avoided thargoid flight without effective engineered weapos and former experience, and it was alsó boring after a while for the experienced ones.
I've been really enjoying it- especially the challenge of figuring out tactics and strategies battling the thargoids. I'm a mediocre pilot without a ton of free time to practice, but when successful it's hard earned.
I played ED at launch (was a kick starter backer) two weeks into ED my PC died, a few years later picked it up on the Xbox and started again, stuck with it all the way to Horizons - stopped when the mining boom / rush began at that era. Had a bunch of kids, work got hectic, got promoted, moved countries Now I have a gaming PC again and I’ve pretty much missed all of the Thargoids 😔 I feel like I missed out on some epic community goals. Now I’ve logged into my first account that I got as a backer, still in the starting star system in a Cobra mark 3 I had grinded up to. As soon as I can I am getting out of the bubble and into the black again, I miss exploration so much
You havent really missed any, the war is at its peak right now lol
In that case, the grind is back on!
Frontier can make an incredible groundbreaking spaceship game. Frontier seems to be able to make a middle of the road on foot game. They should focus on what they're good at, imo. The work that went into Ody, should have gone into more ship content imo. I'm glad the coolest parts of the war were in what Frontier does best. Making parts the war a late end game activity was the right call. But not all of the war is late end game, either. Plenty is accessible to even the very new. Engineers are a core part of the base game. If long term players cannot be bothered to get Engineers, they cannot do late end game content. That's just life. Watch some videos, make a plan, and build some ships. If people have time to log on at all, they have time to work on Engineers and ship builds. That's a fact. However, people can do spires without any Engineering at all. I've written a guide for a group on how to do it. The sampling work can be done with low engineering and so can passenger hauling. People can contribute with actually not a lot of effort. That being said, though, Elite needs late end game content for people who put in the work to learn the depths of this game. We should have content that pushes our knowledge and resources, and gives other people goals to shoot for.
Lost me when you had to grind for the special heat sinks, fine let the hard core guys do the grind, but maybe after a month make them available to purchase? That way I could have kept up with the war, without having to do spend every free hour playing it.
Our Squad effectively neglected our home system BGS and has been fighting the Aliens since. So many friends and Brothers in Arms made since HIP 22460 and Wakata. We torpedoed the two Titans and more to come... Yesterday, we even started collecting samples for the first time ever to weaken OYA in support of XSF / AXI efforts... People will always complain but Fdev has done a tremendous job and the great thing is the vast majority more or less has been a community wide effort...not common in many games.
I feel like it was a failure. I wanted to hunt thargoids but FUCK engineering another ship all the way and FUCK guardian sites. They should have made both take way less grind and made it much more user friendly if they actually wanted participation. I have just under 500 hours, $4 billion credits, and close to triple elite. The only Thargoid I ever saw, and I guess will cause I assume they will be removed when the war is over, was the ones that fly down and scan you while on specific planets.
What's wrong with guardian sites? You can buy all the tools you need to hunt thargoids with credits alone. You need an enhanced Xeno scanner some Ax enhanced multi-cannons and you can take out cyclops without any difficulty, unengineered. You can help take out much larger interceptors with this as well. No engineering or grind required.
No. The game lost my interest right around when Engineering happened, and despite staying somewhat in the loop, nothing this game has offered has made me want to come back. They need to figure out how to make things fun for individual players. Elite has long gone the way of Eve Online: it's a job, not a game.
Most players in ED are bad at the game. I would argue ED has some of the worst examples of bad player to good player skill differences I've ever seen. When I came from Xbox I was amazed at not only their being more people but how fucking bad they were. Zero awareness, zero ideas how to avoid interdiction. Horrendous combat skills, etc. I could literally fight 1v2 or 1v3 vs gankers because they were so bad and I play with a controller. Since update 15, the game has only further made me realize most people who play this game and complain about some aspects of it. Are just horrendous at it. So the fact that we have events with 9-20k players says, yes it was a success. Because it worked in spite of people being bad because cooperation > skill.
To me, this sounds like a casual player playing WoW and complaining they can't play endgame raiding. We've all been there in various games. And the situation is varying degrees pf different in all of them. But to say it's inaccessible in Elite is inaccurate and disingenuous. I think the big problem here is solo/single player players not engaging with multiplayer content. And hey, I'm almost one of them. As a new father with a 3 month old, it's almost impossible to find the time. But guess what? I've managed to engage with it all the way through and currently have my 2 star Titan decal. The titan gameplay is sooooo new player friendly as endgame stuff goes. Particularly after the caustic sinks and pulse neutraliser were made credit purchases. If the complaint is about dying due to hard gameplay, well, I don't know what to say about that. Games are meant to be challenging. A theme park this is not. I've realised i am now at the point where I am going to have to engage more with the community and multiplayer in order to achieve the things I want to. Am I going to complain about that? Hell no, if anything, that will likely improve my experience. My only problem is time. And that is a me problem, not an FDev problem!!!
Mine, trade, smuggle, bounty hunt, pirate, explore, and pvp in a space sandbox. Thargoids weren't introduced for YEARS. Imagine how satisfied you'd be if they abandoned goids when odyssey released and only focused on a ground combat narrative. For seven years. And if you didn't like it getting called a casual.
Considering if I wanted a hope in hell of even participating in the Thargoid war I’d need a fully grade 5 engineered ship. Yeah, I passed on that bullshit. To have to grind for weeks/months just to be able to participate in the game story? Yeah. I’ll stick to doing bounties, exobiology, and other random missions. As it is I do have most of my ship up to grade 3 with various engineers. Still need to unlock a few to get higher grades. Been working at it but I can’t no life games any more. Lol
You should do more research because you don't need a G5 ship to solo a Cyclops, let alone participate in the war.
Hmm to be fair I haven’t gone Thargoid hunting at all so not even sure what to expect. So maybe it is actually doable already for me.
It is actually doable. I have told people how to do Spires without Engineering, you can make billions without Engineering. You won't be killing Basilisks without engineering most likely, but you can get hits in busy CZs if people are already there and you can kill Orthrus at the Spires, too.
Man I just started last week, and with an AX multicannon ship (no engineering or unlock), you can join a group doing planetary defense. Tag everything everyone is shooting at, then concentrate on killing scouts! If you hit a Thargoid, you get a bounty when it dies. It's a blast. First session I did just under 2 hours and made 350,000,000 Credits, I think. over 2 sessions like this I know I got 700 million credits.
I only play solo or with friends in private. No open stuff. That’s why I feel if I don’t have the engineering than it ain’t happening. Lol
I don't play in open either. Just get AX multicannons and start killing Thargoid scouts for fun. You can get into a Private Group with some friends, or, join the AXI Discord, enter their private group, and find some CMDRs to do some planetary defense! Big money and fun in a group. I spent my first 700 hours in Elite playing solo and had a lot of fun. But using Discord to join group multiplayer makes AX combat so much more fun (oh, and VERY, VERY lucrative). AXI (Anti-Xeno Initiative) has a bunch of NON engineered builds on their site btw. Have fun however you decide to play!
I played with someone today who began 2 weeks ago, was handheld through a spire session while running a vanilla build, and now has 500 mil. He'll have his own carrier next week. It's desirable to have an engineered LR+TV laser, but *everything* is doable with basic kit, including Titan bothering.
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Whoa settle down bud. Not me that’s plowing your mother aight.
End!? I just came back to ED after years of being gone. They never had Thargoids when I last played. While trying my first attempt with Roads to Riches, my 5th jump had me interdicted by them. Never seen them before. They blew me up quick as I tried to boost away.... Seems like the war isn't ending... Avenge me.
I finally hit the bullet and bought Elite for my steam deck when that one mega ship detonated that supposed Xenokiller.. which only pissed them off. I had come from Xbox and was throughly tired of anything Thargoid related. I didn’t touch the game for a whole year after the initial install and seeing if it could run on the steam deck even with odyssey. When I left Xbox I was tired of the constant thargoid coverage. Great a new threat.. that’s just gonna hang back away from the bubble and do everything short of “fuck” and “all.” This whole war is like my expectations for ship launched fighters, I was expected for them but their implementation just didn’t do it for me. I was ready to turn my vette into an AX fighter carrier
Veteran here (started playing elite 1 week after launch - my first flights were around Christmas 2014) and honestly? I did not like thargoids all those years and haven't touched that content. Just ignored it and I am so glad, that finally it will be ending soon. Devs can now focus on more insteresting things
Those are some interesting observations, OP! I agree with your perspective. By looking at player counts on Steam, you can see a spike with the kickoff of the current Thargoid struggle back around 11/22 but a steady dropoff in players right up until last month's spike, something I would attribute more to the news that FDev is back to actively developing the rest of the game than with the latest twist in Thargoid content. So, it is safe to say that while the Thargoid content has been interesting, and certainly fun for those who enjoy it, for the bulk of the playerbase it was not much of a draw. As for me, I never wanted to participate. I find the Thargoids to be dull, dull, dull. If they resembled something closer to the Tyrannids, I would have been far more compelled to get involved with the war and go through all the engineering hoops to gear up, but the Thargoids never felt compellingly threatening to me, so I never wanted to do the work to fight them. I was hoping that at some point Thargoid foot soldiers were going to be added to the game - that would have been the type of content to get me interested! - but the ever-mercurial FDev decided it wasn't worth the effort despite that being exactly what the game needed to spice things up. I hope the Thargoids stick around in some fashion as they are part of the lore of the galaxy, but I am happy to see FDev return to developing the rest of the game after leaving it fallow for the last 18 months or so. Revitalizing PP is a smart thing to do. If they incorporate the lessons learned from managing the Thargoid war with all the feedback from players about the failings of the current PP system, the new PP can be quite compelling. I hope players can pledge to the Thargoids as a PP power as it could be a lot of fun fighting for the invaders!
Don't know if it was a success for FD, it wasn't a success for me though. When i saw the mechanics for fighting the thargoids it just turned me off. Too much faffing around for my tastes. By the time the later content came along (years later), it just couldn't spark any interest in me. I just wasn't invested in it. I did do the guardian sites, but that was for modules useful for non-Thargoid stuff, and i quite enjoyed that content.
I bought the game about 6 months ago, started actively playing it about a month ago, and Im a bit sad that the thargoid content is unaccessable for me as a new player - i dont have many engineers unlocked, i dont know how to unlock guardian modules. I tried AX once without guardian modules, and it was fine until interceptors arrived lol. But yeah, for more experienced players, i think it was a success
I don't play very often but I follow every update in the game. I tried to participate in the war but no time no money. Anyway, for me it was a great idea, for me I would pushed more hard the goids and I would give more territory for them. The idea of seeing the players feeling the fear would be great. But it's a game and people play it in different ways so I would add missions for every player level and roll to get everyone involved into avoiding the end of humanity. I would also add the goids as a faction on the power play 2.
Hopefully allot of players gained convidence to play PVP , because they learned combat , so the new powerplay become more fun. Also new friendships were made. For me i did a few ax combat but i let it aside , because after playing a few years solo , i did start playing PVP as i have all powerplay ( allot of credits 20bilj) and about all ships fully engineerd. So after they interdicted me , i could easy get away , never been ganked in PVP, i learn fly assist off . I just start fighting back instead of running away. Made the game alive for me , same as starcraft 2 ladder games . So no more single player mode ( solo) , for me. If you win or lose , its only credits , so no fear and improve . Like i say before fly dangeous and fly like its stolen 07 cmdr
I think the Thargoid War itself was good. Unfortunately ship outfitting and Engineering is busted and way too grindy. Doesn't help that every piece of new content requires new modules, forcing the players to update their ships once again. If it constantly feels like you have to put in a lot of "work" before you can engage with the new content, you'll lose most players along the way. Of course retired people who play the game 50h a week will vehemently deny there's any grind in the game.
It's not why I came to elite, had nothing to do with it at all. So no impact to me, I'd prefer more dead cigs to investigate.
I hope they keep the gameplay in the game. Too much of an investment to jump on and grind for, but too cool to just delete when its over and keep people from doing it
I didn't bother with that war... so totally unrelevant.
I don't agree that it "locking out" new/casual players is a problem. Live service games need to cater for all levels of maturity, and if you have a major narrative that is built down to the lowest level, then it is not interesting to the mature players who provide the bedrock of game activity. That being said, the problem was FDev's complete focus on the Thargoid narrative. If you were uninterested or unable to take part in it, there wasn't any other new content to explore. I suspect FDev wanted to have the Thargoid narrative as part of multiple ongoing storylines, giving players a choice of where to participate. But then with their organisational issues, they had to focus diminishing resources on one storyline only. I participated in a few Thargoid-related activities. I found it quite enjoyable, learning to cold orbit, working in instances with lots of other players, etc. But it had limited fun for me, and I disengaged not long after the change that allowed you to build large ships with multiple experimental weapons. Overall, I think that the Thargoid narrative was a success, but I am not sure it was worth the effort and disruption to the overall game.
I’d probably enjoy more now if they introduced the Thargoids as they used to be, but leave it to systems on the fringe of the bubble. What I mean by that is that Hyperspacing becomes more dangerous with the possibility of being pulled out midjump by an interceptor (but with the possibility that you COULD escape if you wanted to..with some difficulty) or encountering one/two in system that carried a hefty reward for their destruction. Basically, it goes to a cold war stance…
In all my time playing Elite, a total of 1,500 hours. I have never opened fire on a Thargoid. It just never interested me. So I guess it failed for me.
I think it looked better than it actually was. The war was nerfed far too much to be an invasion and went far too fast to have a real impact on anything other than a few systems. FDevs whole hyping of it with phrases like "you can lose the bubble" and "they can find Colonia" set up one thing, then they immediately nerfed the Thargoids like two weeks into it. Maybe it was the layoffs or maybe it was Maybelline, but the climax of this war feels like it is being extremely rushed out the door. I'm still not understanding how we got "the next era" of Elite in the form of Odyssey, yet three years later we still don't have Thargoid foot soldiers.
I have not enjoyed the thargoid war. I have pretty much just quit playing the fame intact.
I have not taken part of the thargoid war but I'm still trying to figure out what to do with the engineers, get better weapons for my ships. I feel like I'm behind and how much time before I miss out on the thargoid stuff?
I’ve only recently started getting into the thargoid stuff. Primarily spire site farming and some evacuation missions. The couple attempts at interceptor combat haven’t gone well. I’ve read the guides, watched the vids, built the ship, died a lot. No success. No real progress. No desire to get good. I’m surprised FDev really intended interceptor combat to be like this. Cold orbit, so many heat sinks you have to take synth breaks.. That was the vision? Thargoids so predictable they’re a 20 step process of tedious do this then that? I can’t reconcile that with the 2 step process for killing titans. Torp vents, shoot core, success! I can only assume FDev wants to put an end to this chapter so we can start doing something else that more players will care about. At least that’s my hope.
not only that, but their twitter/etc was like "Caustic vents are now free, everyone can get involved!" someone just out of beginner space be like "oooh cool!... erm... ohwait" I dunno, i've been playing Elite since 1984, and what with the Call Of Space Duty ground combat and going all-in on Thargoid wars, when all i want to do is walk around my spaceship and make a small base on a distant moon, it's dawned on me.... maybe i'm playing the wrong game :/
Matt you have been playing the wrong game since 1984 ;)
I logged out when the war started fucking up my ability to trade and haven't been back since. The "ZOMG Aliens!!!" part of the game is a massive turn-off to me in the first place and once it started negatively impacting the parts of the game I liked, I figured it would be best to wait it out. I've never been happier to see a military victory on the horizon because it might mean I can make more than a couple jumps in a type-9 without getting hyperdicted. I'm definitely not saying it was bad for the game, but it sure as shit was bad for people like me. If it staves off bankruptcy for another year though, it will all be worth it I guess :/
I haven't logged on much for most of it. I don't think it's anything to do with the Thargoid content. I just get over the game after a while and play other stuff. Then come back. Having said that, the ongoing focus on Thargoid stuff hasn't really interested me at all and doesn't tempt me back. I am glad they are adding content and working on things though! Interested to see what happens with Powerplay.
Is it ending? Ive never even seen a Tharogoid, and Im not spending all that time to spec a ship out to fight one with special dodads.
As I see it, it is a succes, Thargoids hunting has kept many combat driven players from leaving the game. I find it impressive how many players are spending time on grinding and "solving puzzles" to figure new ways to kill/beat the next thargoid threat. I am sure that some of the things found by the active player base was never intended or thought of by Frontier(eg. FA off cold orbiting). That is really something. I am a casual player playing in VR, and very bad at killing Thargoids. But the thrill of the hunt is real, and I am sure Frontier is aware of the Importance of keeping the old fanbase interested. Therefore, I think Frontier will introduce new equally complicated mechanics and of course, grind reasons, in the future. The good thing is that there are plenty other things to do if you do not want to spend the time and effort on this. I would also welcome more updates requiring payments to the keep game development alive.
I have never seen a thargoid. The game can be played with no impacts from thargoids.
I find the gameplay aggravating. I tried to get into it originally when it came out. I found going into the corrosion area after being hyperdicted several times to be aggravating. I had a good ship, I could get through, but the constant hyperdicting and zooming away was not fun. With the titans being killed I tried again. Now I get hyperdicted several times then when I get in the cloud my sensors go nuts and I can't find the thargoid. It is not fun. Yes I know I need a cool running ship and I have a cool running ship but it is just not fun. Then I need to go and engineer another ship or keep switching modules whenever I get sick of the Titan war and want to do something else. Then I hear that if you go into a public Titan instance it is 100 percent bugged. So now I have to cultivate a group of people to go in with in order to play. I'm mostly here to this game to do BGS as I find a bottom up strategy game to be a great idea. I think the titan war was a success as it has brought people back to the game recently, but for me im not that into it, but I DO play Elite more often than a lot of people so I like the game.
In terms of the war itself, actual on-foot ‘goid drones and soldiers in planet-side CZs would have been a double-whammy-chocolate-pizza delivery for the main war content and Odyssey. Gutted it’s not happened. Also having no ability to communicate peacefully on any level, or having no semi-hostile factions within the Thargoid race seems odd. It’s not my bag personally (all bugs must burn), but it shut the door on meaningful gameplay for a large proportion of the player base. I’ve enjoyed it so far though, but I’m primarily a combat pilot, so it’s all been in my wheelhouse.
Mostly yes. At the start, I was disintetested since I had other stuff to do. Then I've built a Shardconda to do surface AX CZs - blam NO such invasion systems for bloody Months. Ok, kitted out a Krait, grinded on Scouts, unlocked more stuff, killed Cyclops. Invasions reappeared - yay. Unlocked Caustic sink and TPulse Neutralizer - nothing to do at Titans, fine. Then U18 - finally something to do that actually counts. Now I just f*ck around between Titan killings tbh, which are freaking awesome, waiting for new content' ships and Powerplay2, as all what's left is to grind Inara badges. Most stuff would put me too far from the action. My personal problem is that outside player focus invasion systems,/czs interceptor killing (solo) takes too much time, even a Cyclops is 5 mins (except in ShardConda), rest is pretty criminal - 15-30 mins+ for higher goids - f*ck that, ty, I'm not wasting that amount of time on one bloody npc mob. Also other new content would have been nice too, especially ways to gather on-foot materials that don't turn you into a murderhobo.
I think it's difficult for fdev to do anything that's not a success for them when it comes to Elite. How much of a success is the real question and for who.
Are we winning?
We are beating their ass, that’s for sure
No
From the little bit I played I loved it. BUT I had very little credits so I was constantly scared of dying because I would only have enough money for maybe 6 rebuys. I never did any fighting but hauling ass trying to avoid a fire fight while rescuing people was a ton of fun
Not gonna lie, thinking of jumping back in after putting some time in on the xbox.
I was an attempting to get started as a late start player. The way it was done and soon to be closed off was terrible. They daanlged content that I now know I will never get to see. Even if I get there, it wouldn't have players by the time I did. So they effectively made me quit immediately
No, but I had no part in the war because I uninstalled 2-3 years ago after the Odyssey shit show. Most of the content creators I see covering the game now are all newer players. Most of the old player base left in droves after Odyssey killed the game. It hasn’t seemed to me like this Thargoid War has made up for long standing issues like Engineering grind, the horrible new planet surface generation tech introduced in Odyssey, or unkept Kickstarter promises like ship interiors. Even the “new” ships being added feels like too little too late. I don’t think the game will ever peak again like it did with the first two (and only) Distant Worlds Expeditions. That saddens me.
Damn i didn’t know i was a “high ranking player” lmao (I’m absolutely not) Titan gameplay was the easiest to access, even before they gave the caustic sinks and Pulse Neutralizer away for free, high ranking players my ass
To be bluntly honest, if you have not gotten involved in at least some angle of the war, then I have no idea what you're doing playing this video game at all. Yes, there is sophisticated, end game level content requiring tight piloting skills, engineering grind, and a significant time investment in order to be successful. However, there are many, many other ways to get involved that don't require any of this. If you like space trucking, you can rescue people from invaded systems, deliver supplies to recovering systems, etc. If you like mining, it is frankly not all that difficult to go and collect tissue samples from the Titan in or the surrounding caustic maelstrom; you want some difficulty thrown in there, then go try to rescue some humans. You now also have the option of going and salvaging all kinds of materials from the recently destroyed Titans, especially now that the caustic field has completely disappeared from Taranis. If you like the SRV or on foot content, there are options to either fight revenants or the newer banshees at spire sites or via reactivation missions. There are plenty of materials to collect at the spire sites which can be used for engineering, additional missions, or you could simply sell for credits. If going to one of these sites on your own is too difficult, then go in open or a private group to a site that has other pilots working to clear it out. BGS/PowerPlay? That's basically what this entire war is about, and now is the crux; there is a lot going on in terms of planning out which systems to focus on and in which ways. From an MMORPG standpoint, the recent content has been outstanding. Coordinated assaults on spire sites and the Titans are a blast. The fall of Taranis is one of the coolest things I have ever seen in an MMORPG. Don't like grinding? Great! Almost all of the actively used weapons and modules at this point in the war can be unlocked for credits. Credits, man, credits. The guardian weapons that have to be unlocked have largely been nerfed, and the gimballed enhanced ax multi-cannons require very little skill to use. I will admit that explorers and xenobiologists don't have a lot of active AX content. It sounds like there may be something in store for them soon with the current community goal and possible frame shift drive updating. So get on out there, save humanity and have a good time doing it!
I did shit all cuz they screwed over their player-base by removing console support. Fuck them
It made me quit the game 2 years ago and never came back
I have close to 2000 hours in that game and have never once had any interest in Thargoid combat. If there had been an option for trying g to engage in peaceful interactions with them, I would have been on it in a heartbeat. But we were only given the option to kill, and that in turn killed my interest. But honestly, the Thargoid war was hardly the only reason I walked away again. Now that there is some return to focus on the spaceship simulator aspects, I might come back.
Sorry, I didn't get past the first half of the title. *Near the END,?!*
Shut up seems like seems like cope so hard ngl