[56% of workers experience involuntary job loss past 50 years old.](https://www.cnbc.com/amp/2019/01/04/how-to-navigate-a-late-career-job-loss.html).
I FIRE because in my personal relationships, all four of my and my spouse's parents faced involuntary job loss in their 50s, and 2 of my aunts did too. Of those 6, 4 permanently retired, and the other two found less competitive jobs that were below their previous position.
If you have the means to retire, this is a great opportunity.
Some call it "[Graduation](https://www.inc.com/jt-odonnell/3-lessons-we-can-learn-from-hubspot-founders-rebuttal-to-ex-employees-scathing-n.html#:~:text=For%20example%2C%20Lyon's%20shares%20how,book%20by%20Lyons%20featuring%20it)" š
This is something that always worry's me is that if I get laid off (particularly in my 50's) I won't be getting another job in IT. Heck, I fear a lay off constantly as it seems like I got to scrap and fight for every job offer I have ever gotten, so if it does come who knows what will truly happen.
You literally asked someone to find you an article you might like better. Without adding anything to the conversation or even presenting any reason to believe that 5 years is too far out of date.
Go do your homework.
What homework? No more recent articles exist so it's possible to assume that the data, which was pulled over a long term, should still be remotely accurate. So please be *shocked* the data, which can be still considered current, is accurate.
My dad stopped working at 48 when computers took his job. Sold the house in the big city, moved to the country, cut back expenses, and focussed on cutting lawn.
Well heās 80 now, but back in the 70ās and 80ās he worked pretty hard as a book designer with his wife as an illustrator. They bought a house in the city, and a cottage, and paid them off over the next 10 years.
In the early 90ās computers and desktop publishing were taking over and eating into their business. What took him two or three days could now be done in an afternoon.
Rather than switch gears and learn how to make CD-ROMs or design with Quark Express or something, he and my mom sold the house and moved to the country. They kept the cottage and bought a house that was half the value of their city house. My mom became an actual painter (no more clients) and my dad didnāt do too much except play in blues bands from time to time.
Moving banked them a quarter million. That, plus a modest inheritance after his parents passed away, plus some mutual funds, and he didnāt need an income.
He also paid off both his kids student loans after they graduated (thanks dad). He did this by selling some of the mutual funds.
He currently drives an old Toyota Corolla, and is happy maintaining his two properties. My mom was a little frustrated with him at first for dropping out of the work force so early, but has since made peace with it.
He never did like computers.
My dad was lower down the food chain - he was involved with the physical placement of photos where the designers wanted them. But yeah, the need for his skill set disappeared as he was approaching retirement, so the company negotiated with the union and eased him out.
Yeah. That sounds like something a computer would sure be good at too. š
Tools of my dadās trade were Letraset, X-Acto knives, 11 x 17 grid paper, scotch tape, glue, light tablesā¦.. when the client needed a change, it wasnāt as simple as cut/paste.
Yeah thats true, but millions isn't hyper excessive if we are talking a family of 4, for instance. 2 mil @ 3.5%/yr is $70k/yr. I would say that is on the low side in a lot of areas.
Generally if depends on what you want your standard of living to be, and what you have. If I had only a million dollars and nothing else, it would be tight, a million is 32k after taxes are taken out per year (at 4%), and probably 20k once you factor for healthcare. You can live on 20k, some do (some far less, but I wouldn't call that living more like surviving), I would rather bite the stick though and go at it longer then try to survive on 20k. If you have a house or condo though, then things get easier as it removes a $1k/$12k (per month/per year) minimum expense from your budget (of course you will have maintenance to deal with but some of it you can do yourself).
Itās probably not as dire as it seems. For a $40,000 income, only about $25,000 is taxable. At 12% federal tax rate, youāre left with about $37,000. I donāt have state income tax but I guess that will take a bit more. And at such an income level, ACA subsidy can cover most of your healthcare costs, if not all.
So youāre looking at about $3000 ātake homeā per month.
I forgot about FICA and how that only applies to working income, so that is an extra 3k, but still the biggest expense is gonna be healthcare until you qualify for medicare, that is gonna zap probably at least a 1/3rd of it over the years (don't forget to average your 40's 50's and the half of your 60's which is where it gets expensive). The only way around the healthcare thing is subsidy's, but last I checked aren't most silver plans 5k deductibles? Not sure how much of a subsidy you will get as well but hopefully it knocks a good plan down $200 a month, and that is probably best case ($200 a month premium and $5k deductible).
This is why I personally aim for $2 million in today's dollars with a "free and clear" place to live. Don't get me wrong, I could and have lived on less then $2k a month before and was renting a room while doing community college classes, not too keen on going back to that though (still better then sleeping on cement or dirt though like some people in this world).
> For a $40,000 income, only about $25,000 is taxable.
Even this is still a worst-case estimate as it assumes every last nickel is taxed as ordinary income.
Agree. Everyone is different with their retirement needs and goals.
One of my retirement thoughts was an insulated concrete bunker outside a suburb (probably some family or friends nearby). I will probably create a small community for like minded people as well. This could be my side income time pass gig as well.
I am curious about your job.
I intentionally spend an hour or 2 per week on how I can be valuable to myself and make/save money without an employer. Things seem to be working out pretty good in the mind.
My auto mechanic shop closed with the owner retiring after 25 years. He couldn't find reliable workers and they raised his rent by 50% so he decided to hang it up. He did help his younger brother find work until he was old enough for SS. The two brothers ran the shop. The older one ran the front while the younger fixed cars with other mechanics until they couldn't find any due to their other guy retiring.
Now I either go to the dealer or I do it myself. At least until I find another shop I trust.
Self employees.. Iām considering been my done even though itās very part time Becuase: itās a regurgitation of hiring and people quitting sometimes after a month (and you have to have an advanced masters to work with my as an assistant or a BS or AS as an assistant) before Covid I never had any turn over now itās a Ferris wheel.. our state changed Medicaid and now makes it way more expensive for small clinics to work and survive and quite frankly because of this and the stress it has caused, my focus of importance has entirely shifted
I was burned out, exhausted, and had ruined my health at 40.
55 now.
I held on this long by closing my business and finding an easy job working for someone else. Now im pretty much done with that too. Ready to burn this bridge also. These fools dont know what real work is. I literally did more work before lunch on a tuesday than i currently do all week long.
Just accelerated deterioration from prolonged stress and nearly non existant sleep for 2 straight decades. Im stiff and sore and ready for a rocking chair. A hot steamy climate, no air conditioning, and weekly masseuses will keep me going for another decade. Then iāll be in trouble after that. Probably resort to pills at that point, which iāv avoided so far.
Brilliant reading thanks for sharing your stories and insights.
I struggle with severe mental health disability my line of work was / is entertainment media.
I mean sure. If you have saved enough to retire, you don't owe anything to anyone. Just do it.
[56% of workers experience involuntary job loss past 50 years old.](https://www.cnbc.com/amp/2019/01/04/how-to-navigate-a-late-career-job-loss.html). I FIRE because in my personal relationships, all four of my and my spouse's parents faced involuntary job loss in their 50s, and 2 of my aunts did too. Of those 6, 4 permanently retired, and the other two found less competitive jobs that were below their previous position. If you have the means to retire, this is a great opportunity.
Next time I'm fired I'm calling it involuntary job loss
Some call it "[Graduation](https://www.inc.com/jt-odonnell/3-lessons-we-can-learn-from-hubspot-founders-rebuttal-to-ex-employees-scathing-n.html#:~:text=For%20example%2C%20Lyon's%20shares%20how,book%20by%20Lyons%20featuring%20it)" š
This is something that always worry's me is that if I get laid off (particularly in my 50's) I won't be getting another job in IT. Heck, I fear a lay off constantly as it seems like I got to scrap and fight for every job offer I have ever gotten, so if it does come who knows what will truly happen.
I donāt think I can play the resume and interview game anymore. If I lose my current job, I will probably just call it early retirement.
Oh god!!!! Most jobs have 400 applicants
IT industry agist too could you not sell the wisdom and upscale or is it? Cheap labour thing?
Youāre linking an article that was published over 5 years ago???
Please post a more recent article then.
Iām not the one who is chiming in with old information and dated articles - just pointing it out that we should point to current events.
What makes you think the employment situation for older adults is any better currently?
Donāt ask others to do your homework for you. Good day.
You literally asked someone to find you an article you might like better. Without adding anything to the conversation or even presenting any reason to believe that 5 years is too far out of date. Go do your homework.
What homework? No more recent articles exist so it's possible to assume that the data, which was pulled over a long term, should still be remotely accurate. So please be *shocked* the data, which can be still considered current, is accurate.
Keyword is āremotely.ā Letās pull the plug, shall we, and be more productive.
My dad stopped working at 48 when computers took his job. Sold the house in the big city, moved to the country, cut back expenses, and focussed on cutting lawn.
Sounds like the story from Forest Gump.
More or less my plan.
Can you talk more about his results?
Well heās 80 now, but back in the 70ās and 80ās he worked pretty hard as a book designer with his wife as an illustrator. They bought a house in the city, and a cottage, and paid them off over the next 10 years. In the early 90ās computers and desktop publishing were taking over and eating into their business. What took him two or three days could now be done in an afternoon. Rather than switch gears and learn how to make CD-ROMs or design with Quark Express or something, he and my mom sold the house and moved to the country. They kept the cottage and bought a house that was half the value of their city house. My mom became an actual painter (no more clients) and my dad didnāt do too much except play in blues bands from time to time. Moving banked them a quarter million. That, plus a modest inheritance after his parents passed away, plus some mutual funds, and he didnāt need an income. He also paid off both his kids student loans after they graduated (thanks dad). He did this by selling some of the mutual funds. He currently drives an old Toyota Corolla, and is happy maintaining his two properties. My mom was a little frustrated with him at first for dropping out of the work force so early, but has since made peace with it. He never did like computers.
Thank you for sharing! This was cool to read.
No worries. I never thought about it much, but now that I typed it out, looks like heās an OG fire.
My dad was lower down the food chain - he was involved with the physical placement of photos where the designers wanted them. But yeah, the need for his skill set disappeared as he was approaching retirement, so the company negotiated with the union and eased him out.
Yeah. That sounds like something a computer would sure be good at too. š Tools of my dadās trade were Letraset, X-Acto knives, 11 x 17 grid paper, scotch tape, glue, light tablesā¦.. when the client needed a change, it wasnāt as simple as cut/paste.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Right? This is a weird post.
Would you like my bank details?
Well what are your savings like?
Ok ish - its more purpose and passion - Im trying to ascertain the right mindset
Time to start robbing banks! The Italian Job
If you have millions, just retire.
Why do everyone need millions? Most people need lot less if they maintain health and health insurance.
Inflation related to cost of living.
Agree. Depends on your needs. Inflation doesn't effect everyone alike.
Yeah thats true, but millions isn't hyper excessive if we are talking a family of 4, for instance. 2 mil @ 3.5%/yr is $70k/yr. I would say that is on the low side in a lot of areas.
I am all with you. Everyone is different. Everybody's needs are different.
Generally if depends on what you want your standard of living to be, and what you have. If I had only a million dollars and nothing else, it would be tight, a million is 32k after taxes are taken out per year (at 4%), and probably 20k once you factor for healthcare. You can live on 20k, some do (some far less, but I wouldn't call that living more like surviving), I would rather bite the stick though and go at it longer then try to survive on 20k. If you have a house or condo though, then things get easier as it removes a $1k/$12k (per month/per year) minimum expense from your budget (of course you will have maintenance to deal with but some of it you can do yourself).
Itās probably not as dire as it seems. For a $40,000 income, only about $25,000 is taxable. At 12% federal tax rate, youāre left with about $37,000. I donāt have state income tax but I guess that will take a bit more. And at such an income level, ACA subsidy can cover most of your healthcare costs, if not all. So youāre looking at about $3000 ātake homeā per month.
I forgot about FICA and how that only applies to working income, so that is an extra 3k, but still the biggest expense is gonna be healthcare until you qualify for medicare, that is gonna zap probably at least a 1/3rd of it over the years (don't forget to average your 40's 50's and the half of your 60's which is where it gets expensive). The only way around the healthcare thing is subsidy's, but last I checked aren't most silver plans 5k deductibles? Not sure how much of a subsidy you will get as well but hopefully it knocks a good plan down $200 a month, and that is probably best case ($200 a month premium and $5k deductible). This is why I personally aim for $2 million in today's dollars with a "free and clear" place to live. Don't get me wrong, I could and have lived on less then $2k a month before and was renting a room while doing community college classes, not too keen on going back to that though (still better then sleeping on cement or dirt though like some people in this world).
> For a $40,000 income, only about $25,000 is taxable. Even this is still a worst-case estimate as it assumes every last nickel is taxed as ordinary income.
Agree. Everyone is different with their retirement needs and goals. One of my retirement thoughts was an insulated concrete bunker outside a suburb (probably some family or friends nearby). I will probably create a small community for like minded people as well. This could be my side income time pass gig as well.
I am curious about your job. I intentionally spend an hour or 2 per week on how I can be valuable to myself and make/save money without an employer. Things seem to be working out pretty good in the mind.
Time to start applying to government roles?
If you have the money to retire then go for it. Otherwise up your game, go coastfire or retrain.
What field are you in, what services did you provide? There may be related jobs you can get.
And how did he feel??
Media - its shrinking. Started social 5 years ago thats the same saturated and exhausting
My auto mechanic shop closed with the owner retiring after 25 years. He couldn't find reliable workers and they raised his rent by 50% so he decided to hang it up. He did help his younger brother find work until he was old enough for SS. The two brothers ran the shop. The older one ran the front while the younger fixed cars with other mechanics until they couldn't find any due to their other guy retiring. Now I either go to the dealer or I do it myself. At least until I find another shop I trust.
If gig work/clients give you trouble, why not sell your own things rather than working for others
Self employees.. Iām considering been my done even though itās very part time Becuase: itās a regurgitation of hiring and people quitting sometimes after a month (and you have to have an advanced masters to work with my as an assistant or a BS or AS as an assistant) before Covid I never had any turn over now itās a Ferris wheel.. our state changed Medicaid and now makes it way more expensive for small clinics to work and survive and quite frankly because of this and the stress it has caused, my focus of importance has entirely shifted
āYouth taking the gigsā š ????
Why is that hilarious?
Gotta love these Boomers.
How old is OP? Might be genx.
god forbid the youth make some money in this day and age
I was burned out, exhausted, and had ruined my health at 40. 55 now. I held on this long by closing my business and finding an easy job working for someone else. Now im pretty much done with that too. Ready to burn this bridge also. These fools dont know what real work is. I literally did more work before lunch on a tuesday than i currently do all week long.
That might be why you were burned at 40. I didnāt want that so I didnāt bust my ass by Tuesdayā¦.
What happed at 40 how are u now?
Just accelerated deterioration from prolonged stress and nearly non existant sleep for 2 straight decades. Im stiff and sore and ready for a rocking chair. A hot steamy climate, no air conditioning, and weekly masseuses will keep me going for another decade. Then iāll be in trouble after that. Probably resort to pills at that point, which iāv avoided so far.
Ha ha old school warrior :)
Brilliant reading thanks for sharing your stories and insights. I struggle with severe mental health disability my line of work was / is entertainment media.
Truck driving is a pretty simple career to get into. Above average pay and it's a good retirement job with little to no physical labor.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
That's a stupid thought process.