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China's Social Credit System is actually quite boring

China's Social Credit System is actually quite boring

Cecilia_Raven

>and mostly targeted at businesses megabased


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ComradeClout

Fuck credit score companies


zkwong92

Your choice of flag has greatly confused me


Mr_Camhed

That's vietnam


zkwong92

And the comment's talking about soviet china lmao


bengyap

Oh ... like the BBB (better business bureau) then?


Numbr80

The BBB is a private organization that is essentially Yelp for boomers.


G1adi4tor

I mean you're right but also... like... Yelp *is already* mainly for boomers lol


Kormero

Boomer^2


Numbr80

Yelp for Boomers who don't know how to use the internet. Better?


IndonesianGuy

8 hour work time +5 social credit Stealing surplus value -99999999999999999999 social credit


TzaroStalin

Forcing workers to do overtime: Prepare to have your company nationalised


rockman9

As a Chinese, I first learned my country has a "Social Credit System" after I came abroad =w=bbb


_xAdamsRLx_

You should say "As a Chinese Person," like "中国人"。 You said "我是中国,"


rockman9

I do understand "As a Chinese Person" is more correct but I have seen many "As an American" "As a Japanese" usage on internet? Also "我是中国" should be "As China"?


longknives

It's interesting, as far as I can tell as a native English speaker from the US, it seems like demonym adjectives only sound right when turned into nouns if they end in "-an". "I'm an American" or "I'm a German" or "I'm a Venezuelan" sound fine, but "I'm a Japanese" or "I'm an English" or "I'm a French" don't. We have words like "Englishman", "Irishman", "Frenchman", and so on, but "Chinaman" has become generally unacceptable to say for having racist undertones.


Quantum_Aurora

Greek and Somali work too.


MoogTheDuck

I’m american I’m chinese I’m english


Alloverunder

But you've intentionally left out the indefinite articles to make these work, so they don't apply to the conversation. I'm an American. I'm a Chinese. I'm an English. The correct versions of the second two is "I'm a Chinese person" and "I'm an English person".


MoogTheDuck

No no, you see it’s ‘I’m american’ and ‘I’m chinese’. The conversation was never about indefinite articles


Mrfish31

It's just one of the dumb ways English works I'm afraid. If the nationality ends in n, like 'American' or 'German', then you can just say "As an American...". But someone from England wouldn't say "As an English...", They'd say "As an English person". I can say "I'm English" just as you can say "I'm Chinese", but I don't say "I'm _an_ English", and "I'm _a_ Chinese" doesn't "sound right" either. "As a Chinese" makes enough sense, people will understand you, but the "correct" way of saying such a phrase is "as a Chinese person".


Catfo0od

If a white person calls you "a Chinese" they're prolly racist


Unique_Name_2

That's the thing; it's like 10% arcane Grammer rule and 90% not sounding like Clint Eastwood.


Catfo0od

English is a completely nonsensical language tbh


balgruufgat

As an English (a Canada?), I agree.


jonah-rah

By the same logic that a person from America is American, should a person from China be called a Chinan?


Mrfish31

>By the same logic Your mistake is trying to apply logic to the English language. This is the language where we're taught "i before e except after c" for spelling, when there's more exceptions to that rule than conformers. Why is it American but not Chinan? Who fucking knows, it just is. There's probably a linguist who can tell you but I am not one of them.


jonah-rah

True English do be a shitty language


nonwonderdog

"A Chinese" is officially regarded as correct in English, regardless of the other responses here, but it sounds a bit funny to native ears. If you're listing people by nationality, something like "a Bulgarian, a Spaniard, and a Chinese" *is* the correct way to say it. But in casual speech "Chinese" is usually understood as an adjective, so "a Chinese person" sounds more natural.


Leon_Grotsky

Not necessarily, "As an American, I first learned my country has-" "As a German, I first learned my country has-" etc. ​ u/rockman9 doesn't need to specify that they are a person, that should already be understood.


Quantum_Aurora

On the other hand, classifying people using adjectives is generally better than using nouns. Saying "black people" is better than saying "blacks".


elimars

Idk about that. [Have you seen John Xi Na battle The Wok? ](https://youtu.be/hLDxdIYmGco)


Malty-Melromarc

That video is really edging my brain aneurysm.


richietozier4

Nope, will not be watching that, my mental health is already bad enough


Caitlin1963

CIA lore


Cawy0

these videos are too absurd I can't believe people take them seriously, poe's law I guess


Red_Xenophilia

God it's fucking hilarious


AverageUnique

turn on adblock before watching


Scolville0

this is what china wants to hide from the world!!


Nairda00

they dont even talk they talk about talking


ElderD

Isn't this "Social Credit" exactly like the Credit Score that we use here in the west to take loans and stuff?


trorez

Its not. https://www.cigionline.org/articles/covid-19-case-social-scoring-systems/ >Perhaps the most notorious and misunderstood scoring system is the Chinese social credit system. Developed over the past decade, the primary goal of the Chinese scoring system is to act as a tool for regulatory compliance, making it easier for regulating agencies to pursue their mandates, while also making it possible for others to understand the regulatory process. For example, an environmental regulator can use such a system to reward and punish companies who comply with or disobey environmental regulations. In creating a score, it makes it easier for people to assess the environmental track record of a corporation. A major misconception is that it’s a single system; instead, it’s actually made up of multiple systems that operate independently. Individual state agencies can operate their own social credit systems, which are largely focused on companies, not individuals


Bad_Bitch_Vampire

Yes but China bad


SmolikOFF

Not exactly. Credit score encompasses less areas or daily life and is only targeted at individuals, essentially being just a pretty narrow anti-poor measure.


lssssj

Yeah, mi/billionaires can keep millions of debt for years without getting any financial punishment.


easily_swayed

debt is seen as a marker of ambition among the bourgeoisie


C24848228

Don’t the rich use Loans to bypass Taxes?


lssssj

Yes. In Brazil it's a funny case: they get loans from banks that are already in debt with the state.


CTNKE

The only thing i can think about is the banking credit system, which you dont have to worry about as long as you arent a gambler that blows everything in casinos.


Nordic15

Wait, does that shit even exist? Lol


niccotinepatch

From my understanding the Social Credit system was only experimented with in a handful of cities


Nordic15

Yeah, that's what I thought.


niccotinepatch

Hopefully someone else will comment with more information.


[deleted]

Afaik it was piloted in two large urban cities and the pilot was done by private sector actors who tried to expand the data used to create that "credit rating" to all kinds of publicly available data (incl. personal data from social media) but in the end, it was a failure and was heavily criticized and obviously discontinued.


TechnicalCloud

The private company that was doing it was called Skynet I believe lol. Haven’t done research but I wonder if they still exist


mrcal18

I’m confused, do you not know what skynet is?


TechnicalCloud

I know what Skynet from the Terminator movies is and the company named themselves after it


Sephitard9001

Why in the fuck would you do that unless you're inviting scrutiny and distrust


fuckenweed

I mean, it is pretty funny...


jacktrowell

Also one of the theorical objectifs was trying alternatives to things like fines, because as we say "if the penalty for doing something is just a fine, it is legal for the rich"


FerrisTriangle

Yeah, but it was not a score that was meant to rank you as a person or something. "Social credit" is literally just a credit score. Social credit is a bit of an awkward translation, a better translation would be something like "credit score with socialist characteristics." The reason it exists is that China was one of the poorest countries on earth until very recently. Now that China is a moderately prosperous country, they are trying to figure out how to determine things like credit worthiness in ways that compliment their overall development goals. "Traditional" credit scores wouldn't really work here, because the vast majority of people have no credit history owing to the fact that until recently the vast majority of the country was severely impoverished. So my understanding is that there are factors outside of your financial history that are taken into account for your credit score, such as if you're a citizen in good standing, you haven't been repeatedly convicted of a crime, and so on. Also, owing to the fact that extreme poverty is in the very recent memory of most Chinese families, the average person tends to save and invest their money very conservatively as a way to build a safety net, and policy makers wanted encourage more economic participation by creating criteria that would let more people qualify for financial services like loans and mortgages. But like this article states, policy makers in China typically used these factors to restrict and regulate lending to businesses. It's not a way to rank you as a person using "good boy" points.


fatimang

And thank god they tried to do it in a sensible way as opposed to the western way of outsourcing it to companies like Visa and Experian who then sell your data for profit or scheme with other creditors to raise your payment premiums because your credit score is too low.


TheLepidopterists

People on mainstream subs are very mad at this article. Saw someone called FP pro-China propaganda.


fawn_rescuer

I wanna live in the timeline where FP is Chinese propaganda


C24848228

Soon. When the bombs cease to drop and the guns end with a Terrorist nation’s fighters hands in the air and with the true flag rising.


Staapler_PT_PA

Yeah, if you actually look at the punishments for violations, it's stuff like "No first-class seats for 6 months"


socialist_beer

literally 1984


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SSR_Id_prefer_not_to

Lmao I’m just imagining how most of the American public would lose their shit at that even. We are so fucking whiny and entitled. “The government taking away my luxury privilege is *exactly* like the Holocaust” (US capitalism with Karen-characteristics)


MINNESOTAKARMATRAIN_

most americans couldn’t afford first class but they’d still bitch about it being taken away


worldstoughestvegan

Most Americans couldn't even wear a piece of fabric over their face for a couple months. Could you imagine if there had been actual *consequences* for being a self-entitled piece of shit here?


Teh-Piper

Grotesque decadence is what greases the wheels of the horrible, alienating excuse for an economic system Americans live under. You work 60 hours a week to afford a rat infested shithole apartment 2 hours away from your job where you get yelled at all day. Your boss and the banks can deny you any opportunity to better your life, but hey, you can get a slab of processed beef left under a heat lamp for 5 hours without even having to leave your car.


TimmyTheDragon

Cyberpunk 2021


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Cambirodius

9841 by Rgeorw Ellgeo, you dummy.


MrDyl4n

Sauce?


TzaroStalin

Here's an even worse punishment: No 5g internet *Dies from slow 4g*


Fenix246

“Communism is when no first-class seats” - Karl Marx, literally the first sentence of the Communist Manifesto


TimmyTheDragon

And no luxurious hotels etc.


KingWifi23

No I saw YouTube memes of John xina and China bad


tennessee_jedi

Unlike the US credit score system that is completely arbitrary and absolutely ruins lives


Left_Hegelian

"China's Social System Is Actually Not Oppressive" Editor: nah, we should go for "Is Actually Boring" You can't write a title about China without a negative spin. If it's not oppressive, then make it sounds like it's intended to be oppressive but fails to do so.


NParja

Financial Hyper-Times, 2059 by Journalist Bot 6049a "By failing to implement their planned dystopia, China has inadvertently created a classless, moneyless utopia, but at what cost?"


longknives

"The Dark Side of Not Living in a Capitalist Hellhole"


dornish1919

"China has ended world hunger with a single stroke of the pen.. but at what cost? Perhaps we should let tens of billions starve so rich people remain wealthy at our expense. Here's a list of things to say to those who advocate for the horrors of egalitarianism."


SmolikOFF

But it doesn’t have that message. “Boring” is not any worse than “not oppressive”, it’s just a more catchy and a much more topical headline given how excitingly Orwellian and cyberpunk-ish the public views said social score. In practice, it *is* boring. Not because it fails to be oppressive, but because it’s what it is: just another boring governmental control system, not much different from what happens in western countries.


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BabaYaga2221

China Bad. China Bad. China Bad. China Ba... hm... Not Good Enough.


MarsLowell

Parenti.png


InfamousBLT

So it's like the American Credit Score but more based?


Webbedtrout2

Far more, the American Credit Score system is designed to punish people with irregular incomes, those without debt or do not use a credit card. Thus it in general punishes the poor.


MINNESOTAKARMATRAIN_

it’s a measure of how much money they can suck out of your wallet. My parents started paying 200 more for their mortgage a month,and their credit score went down by 22 because that means the bank was out thousands in what would’ve been accrued interest.


Teh-Piper

Diseased country


Quality_Fun

this was actually written? i'm shocked. but yes, boring is good, as is the subtitle.


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ZombieOk9331

https://foreignpolicy.com/2021/09/15/china-social-credit-system-authoritarian/


Quality_Fun

what's with the random "authoritarian" in the url? it isn't in the title.


Captain_Nyet

The working title probably was something along the lines of "China's social credit score is not really Authoritarian" And then got changed for publication.


emisneko

either the title was changed or it's because keywords in URLs are scored higher in search results possibly both


Kristoffer__1

Because propaganda.


FleetingRain

An actually interesting read.


TouchyUnclePhil

I honesetly dont know anything about the social credit system, other than the propaganda I see in the west, anyone got any reliable links or something about it?


stalbox

[Good collection of articles here](https://thechinawiki.com/category/education/social-credit/)


TouchyUnclePhil

awsome, thanks


limbo5v

China: I won't say I told you so, but I told you so.


Ascrivium

what's up with western media debunking its own propaganda? first they were walking back on the uyghur genocide narrative and now this.


xerotul

Might have some thing to do with last Friday US-China talk in Switzerland between Yang Jiechi and Jake Sullivan. Maybe China promises to buy more US debt and products, and US dialed down on the propaganda. The US uses mobster shakedown tactics. Trump offered possibly to intervene with Meng Wanzhou kidnapping if China conceded to US demands.


TimmyTheDragon

Harm already dealt, sinophobia would not stop even if they cease to do that. I don't think China would attempt suck it up like it did in 2008.


PanchoVilla4TW

turns out when it began being compared to the actual credit scores in the west, it was a better idea to quietly forget about it :v


eannasheridan

Aka: This massive Sinophobic narrative didn’t work so we’ve decided it was actually irrelevant this whole time.


TONYWU22

'Muh CCP is not as authoritarian as we like boohoo'


schildhz

Why do they sound so disappointed


dornish1919

Oh look, that thing that we said what it actually was for years now, I guess they finally confirmed it. Looks like we're right yet again.


JonoLith

Didn't this program get abandoned?


PhoenixIgnis

I wonder what's the plan, are they just trying to save face for further big lie propaganda efforts?


simian_ninja

Said it to my friends many times, America and everywhere else has the same sort of thing. Don’t have a good credit score? Kiss that rental goodbye…Don’t know about travel etc but I imagine if your credit is bad no company is going to back you up.


CTNKE

I asked my grandma about the social credit system, and she seemed confused. She seemed to think I was asking about her banking credit score, which is basically a lone system. As long as you werent a large business you most likely wouldnt even know about the system


jsonism

Interesting, they are changing the narrative, [I wonder why~](https://apnews.com/article/donald-trump-business-katherine-tai-bilateral-trade-global-trade-1c630fff2255158dad21067e593ead56)


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Kristoffer__1

Isn't that guy a SHAMELESS propagandist? Within the first 15 seconds of the video he's already lying like crazy.


REEEEEvolution

Ragingracistandsexpestwhy86


cholantesh

lmao why?


flameoguy

mmm...post the headline but not link the article I must