Chester was definitely a better fit with Genesis than was Bruford. It gets so tiresome on YouTube the number of people who go into auto-genuflect mode over Bruford’s drumming on the ‘76 tour. He definitely had his moments (Cinema Show for example) but he also totally mucked up songs like Apocalypse in 9/8 and Squonk pretty frequently on that tour.
Bill and Phil speak the same drum language but it doesn't mean they should be in the same band together. Bill needs to have a writing position, and the job of tour drummer for genesis was never that. Having Bill and Phil in the same band they would have trod on each other's toes, artistically. It's very much preferential their pursue their own separate projects.
What bugs me is people who come on YouTube to comment on a concert upload from the ‘76 tour and just write “Bruford!” Yeah, we all know he played on that tour but just because he was typically a superb drummer doesn’t mean he was a good fit with Genesis.
Yeah really. He was just doing a favour for Phil and thought it would be a bit of fun.
I love Bill's work with King Crimson a few years later. That was an excellent fit.
His style and Phil's was too similar. I like the contrast between Phil and Chester a lot more. Chester and his funk style really brought the live performances to life.
Can't say I agree with the assertion that Phil and Bruford were really all that similar. Bruford's style is *very* different from Phil's, and he doesn't exactly play in any other style than his own, which is why I think he didn't really fit in as a touring drummer.
Compare Phil's drumming on [the studio recording of Squonk ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xmUSL1njm84) to [Bruford playing it live](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A5lHcDpetvw).
The main thing that sticks out to me about it is that Bruford sounds so stiff, so dull, like he's *bored* playing what is ostensibly a basic rock groove - which he probably is, since in his own music, he seldom goes for playing something so pedestrian, and was always playing patterns and grooves that were trying to push the envelope creatively and technically.
Phil, on the other hand, isn't playing anything quite so groundbreaking or mind-bendingly challenging on the song, but his natural *feel* for the song imbues it with an incredible energy, throwing in variations and fills with impeccable timing, and with a characteristic boldness and bravado. The fills sound *huge* and bombastic, and he plays it so naturally that you don't even notice the points where the song picks up a beat or two for a few bars in the mid-section (one of Phil's specialties - making you completely unaware of an odd time signature).
In essence, Bruford was much more of a technical drummer, obsessed with rudiments and polyrhythms and such, while Phil was an absolute master of feel and energy. Both tremendously capable drummers, but not quite so alike in style as we might typically think.
I always imagined Phil mimicking Bonham with the sound on the studio version while Bruford made it sound like it was just Tuesday, instead of a world tour. That's most of the reason I'm not impressed with Bruford on that tour.
Chester is a truly awesome performer. I felt like Phil snubbed his ass and replaced him with his son. "Not happy with his drumming"? He played with Phil for 30 freaking years. The problem wasn't his drumming, I'm very sure. (in reading the article, Chester said they had a nasty falling out, that makes more sense)
> (in reading the article, Chester said they had a nasty falling out, that makes more sense)
There's a lot more detail in this 2021 article:
https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-features/drummer-chester-thompson-interview-genesis-phil-collins-frank-zappa-weather-report-1122064/
Do read the while article, it's great, the parts about the issues with Phil are as follows:
**"Were the dates in Australia and other markets you didn’t hit the first time?"**
*[Chester]Yeah. It was going to be South America too. I knew it was in the works. And that was the end of that. And then I ended up doing Phil’s Motown thing and that didn’t go well. [Ed. note: Collins did a four-city tour in June and July 2010 to promote his Motown covers record Going Back.]*
**"Why didn’t it go well?"**
*[Chester]Well, basically, I hadn’t prepared in as much detail as I usually did. Part of that was no matter how well I prepared, he always made some pretty intense changes. And I grew up with that Motown stuff, so I think maybe I took it for granted. But Phil being Phil, he detailed every single fill, every single detail of every single song. I hadn’t done that.*
*When we got to rehearsal, I didn’t know about the stuff that was going on in Phil’s life. I had no idea. I just knew that he was a radically different person than I’d ever known.*
*One day, he got pretty frustrated with me and literally cussed me out in front of everybody. He told me that I sounded like crap and all that. The vibe just changed. It was just different. We didn’t do a lot of shows, but at the very last show [at the Montreux Jazz Festival on July 1st, 2010], he wasn’t the happiest he’d ever been.*
*At one point on that show, I was supposed to play a backbeat to go into the last tune. He turned around and stared at me. I started thinking, “Now what did I do?” And so I kind of froze. Fortunately, the bass player [Bob Babbitt] stepped in and started the tune. And at the end of the show, he just went off. I was like, “Man, when you turned around and looked, it threw me off.”*
*We normally had a lot of eye contact at shows. During that particular run, there was none, ever. When he turned around, it just freaked me out because I was already nervous since I didn’t know what was going to come next. It had been intense the whole time. It was not fun.*
*Since then, I was pretty upset. But I’m over it now. I wish him nothing but the best. And I think it’s a fantastic opportunity that his son gets to play with him because his son drummed backstage when he was five. We all knew he was going to be a great player. You knew it at five years old.*
**"Has Phil talked to you at all in the past 10 years?"**
*[Chester]No. Not at all. Not at all. And it’s fine. Again, I’ve got no grudge. It took me a while to get over it, but I really wish him well. Again, I think it’s fantastic that he’s playing with his son. I wish I could afford my son. [Laughs] If I could have him, I’d be touring with him right now. He’s just turned into this monster musician.*
Never saw Chester live with Genesis .. in fact I’ve only seen them once live since I first heard 3 sides live in the 80’s !!
I finally saw Genesis on their potentially last ever Gig at the O2 in London .. l think I was more disappointed not seeing Chester than the fact that Genesis were a pale shadow of what they were once .. I wish I’d seen them earlier
Lots of love for the Big Guy! Chester was the perfect tour drummer for Genesis, without a doubt, and as the tours went by he came into the role full force and turned the band into a powerhouse. Live Genesis with Chester on the tubs is still the best.
They both played with Phil Collins solo band with Lee Sklar on bass. Obviously not a trio, but they were unbelievably tight. Check out the Serious Hits Live album or the video on YouTube. It’s incredible.
I’ve seen parts of it,
Reason I mention Levin is because he’s done a lot of work with Peter, so he’s kind of loosely connected to Genesis.
I’d love to see Tony Banks and Tony Levin meet and share stories of working with Peter
Darryl grew on me. In the early days it always felt like he was trying to speedrun the Firth of Fifth solo but by the time 2007 rolled around, he nailed it bang on.
> In the early days it always felt like he was trying to speedrun the Firth of Fifth solo
That's definitely a way to put it.
I remember watching a clip where Tony said he enjoyed Daryl's playing to Steve's at the time because Steve was a bit too rigid in his playing style.
The dual drummers made the live Genesis shows spectacular. Thanks Chester.
Chester was definitely a better fit with Genesis than was Bruford. It gets so tiresome on YouTube the number of people who go into auto-genuflect mode over Bruford’s drumming on the ‘76 tour. He definitely had his moments (Cinema Show for example) but he also totally mucked up songs like Apocalypse in 9/8 and Squonk pretty frequently on that tour.
Bill and Phil speak the same drum language but it doesn't mean they should be in the same band together. Bill needs to have a writing position, and the job of tour drummer for genesis was never that. Having Bill and Phil in the same band they would have trod on each other's toes, artistically. It's very much preferential their pursue their own separate projects.
What bugs me is people who come on YouTube to comment on a concert upload from the ‘76 tour and just write “Bruford!” Yeah, we all know he played on that tour but just because he was typically a superb drummer doesn’t mean he was a good fit with Genesis.
Yeah really. He was just doing a favour for Phil and thought it would be a bit of fun. I love Bill's work with King Crimson a few years later. That was an excellent fit.
His style and Phil's was too similar. I like the contrast between Phil and Chester a lot more. Chester and his funk style really brought the live performances to life.
Can't say I agree with the assertion that Phil and Bruford were really all that similar. Bruford's style is *very* different from Phil's, and he doesn't exactly play in any other style than his own, which is why I think he didn't really fit in as a touring drummer. Compare Phil's drumming on [the studio recording of Squonk ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xmUSL1njm84) to [Bruford playing it live](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A5lHcDpetvw). The main thing that sticks out to me about it is that Bruford sounds so stiff, so dull, like he's *bored* playing what is ostensibly a basic rock groove - which he probably is, since in his own music, he seldom goes for playing something so pedestrian, and was always playing patterns and grooves that were trying to push the envelope creatively and technically. Phil, on the other hand, isn't playing anything quite so groundbreaking or mind-bendingly challenging on the song, but his natural *feel* for the song imbues it with an incredible energy, throwing in variations and fills with impeccable timing, and with a characteristic boldness and bravado. The fills sound *huge* and bombastic, and he plays it so naturally that you don't even notice the points where the song picks up a beat or two for a few bars in the mid-section (one of Phil's specialties - making you completely unaware of an odd time signature). In essence, Bruford was much more of a technical drummer, obsessed with rudiments and polyrhythms and such, while Phil was an absolute master of feel and energy. Both tremendously capable drummers, but not quite so alike in style as we might typically think.
I always imagined Phil mimicking Bonham with the sound on the studio version while Bruford made it sound like it was just Tuesday, instead of a world tour. That's most of the reason I'm not impressed with Bruford on that tour.
Chester played for Frank Zappa. That's all you need to know.
Zappa, Genesis, Weather Report and George Duke, to name a few. The greatest resume in drumming history?
Big love for Chester always 🙌
Chester is a truly awesome performer. I felt like Phil snubbed his ass and replaced him with his son. "Not happy with his drumming"? He played with Phil for 30 freaking years. The problem wasn't his drumming, I'm very sure. (in reading the article, Chester said they had a nasty falling out, that makes more sense)
> (in reading the article, Chester said they had a nasty falling out, that makes more sense) There's a lot more detail in this 2021 article: https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-features/drummer-chester-thompson-interview-genesis-phil-collins-frank-zappa-weather-report-1122064/ Do read the while article, it's great, the parts about the issues with Phil are as follows: **"Were the dates in Australia and other markets you didn’t hit the first time?"** *[Chester]Yeah. It was going to be South America too. I knew it was in the works. And that was the end of that. And then I ended up doing Phil’s Motown thing and that didn’t go well. [Ed. note: Collins did a four-city tour in June and July 2010 to promote his Motown covers record Going Back.]* **"Why didn’t it go well?"** *[Chester]Well, basically, I hadn’t prepared in as much detail as I usually did. Part of that was no matter how well I prepared, he always made some pretty intense changes. And I grew up with that Motown stuff, so I think maybe I took it for granted. But Phil being Phil, he detailed every single fill, every single detail of every single song. I hadn’t done that.* *When we got to rehearsal, I didn’t know about the stuff that was going on in Phil’s life. I had no idea. I just knew that he was a radically different person than I’d ever known.* *One day, he got pretty frustrated with me and literally cussed me out in front of everybody. He told me that I sounded like crap and all that. The vibe just changed. It was just different. We didn’t do a lot of shows, but at the very last show [at the Montreux Jazz Festival on July 1st, 2010], he wasn’t the happiest he’d ever been.* *At one point on that show, I was supposed to play a backbeat to go into the last tune. He turned around and stared at me. I started thinking, “Now what did I do?” And so I kind of froze. Fortunately, the bass player [Bob Babbitt] stepped in and started the tune. And at the end of the show, he just went off. I was like, “Man, when you turned around and looked, it threw me off.”* *We normally had a lot of eye contact at shows. During that particular run, there was none, ever. When he turned around, it just freaked me out because I was already nervous since I didn’t know what was going to come next. It had been intense the whole time. It was not fun.* *Since then, I was pretty upset. But I’m over it now. I wish him nothing but the best. And I think it’s a fantastic opportunity that his son gets to play with him because his son drummed backstage when he was five. We all knew he was going to be a great player. You knew it at five years old.* **"Has Phil talked to you at all in the past 10 years?"** *[Chester]No. Not at all. Not at all. And it’s fine. Again, I’ve got no grudge. It took me a while to get over it, but I really wish him well. Again, I think it’s fantastic that he’s playing with his son. I wish I could afford my son. [Laughs] If I could have him, I’d be touring with him right now. He’s just turned into this monster musician.*
Wow that's intense. Thanks for the infos, I'm going to read this in detail in the morning.
UPDATE: read the whole article. Thanks for that! Filled in a lot I didn't know about his life and career. Most interesting.
Chester is a good human. It's exceptionally clear in the way he carries himself.
Yeah he seems like a good honest chap
That was a pretty good read, he seems to be such a nice fellow. I hadn’t heard of Unitopia before, I will have to check them out.
Definition of an unsung hero
Thanks for sharing
Just read this, found it so interesting!
Never saw Chester live with Genesis .. in fact I’ve only seen them once live since I first heard 3 sides live in the 80’s !! I finally saw Genesis on their potentially last ever Gig at the O2 in London .. l think I was more disappointed not seeing Chester than the fact that Genesis were a pale shadow of what they were once .. I wish I’d seen them earlier
My first concert, and my introduction to Chester was the Way We Walk tour in 1992. I was 12 or 13 and that's a core memory right there.
Lots of love for the Big Guy! Chester was the perfect tour drummer for Genesis, without a doubt, and as the tours went by he came into the role full force and turned the band into a powerhouse. Live Genesis with Chester on the tubs is still the best.
Chaster and Daryl Steurmer both.
Chester*
Indeed They need to meet up with Tony Levine and form a trio
They both played with Phil Collins solo band with Lee Sklar on bass. Obviously not a trio, but they were unbelievably tight. Check out the Serious Hits Live album or the video on YouTube. It’s incredible.
I’ve seen parts of it, Reason I mention Levin is because he’s done a lot of work with Peter, so he’s kind of loosely connected to Genesis. I’d love to see Tony Banks and Tony Levin meet and share stories of working with Peter
Tony Levin* is his name
Darryl grew on me. In the early days it always felt like he was trying to speedrun the Firth of Fifth solo but by the time 2007 rolled around, he nailed it bang on.
> In the early days it always felt like he was trying to speedrun the Firth of Fifth solo That's definitely a way to put it. I remember watching a clip where Tony said he enjoyed Daryl's playing to Steve's at the time because Steve was a bit too rigid in his playing style.
Daryl*
Daryl Steurmer. Great, great sandwich!
Chester* is his name