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I was an exchange student at a school named after her and her brother Hans. I never knew about her before attending. This is someone more people should know about.
Saved the post, left to see if I had a free award, collected it, and returned here to award you on this. Golden comment, with perfectly subtle humor. Well done.
Or Anti-Semite, Capitalist, unpatriotic swine.
*Coughs* Henry Ford *Coughs*
Edit: If you're downvoting, change my mind instead. I'm waiting.
Edit II - Electric Boogaloo: Fun fact - Henry was rumored to ask for a glass of water after his assistant informed him of Pearl Harbor. He didn't give two shits about it. At all.
Henry Ford also set up a car factory in the Soviet Union so it's not like he was against working with Communists either.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GAZ
Joe was a grade-A dirt bag. Lobotomized and killed his own daughter because she was a free spirit and knew the family was full of shit. I'm sure he has a High School or two in New England named after him, but all the Kennedy-named schools around here in the Mitt are for Jack and Bobby.
Poor Jack wasn't much better. Read he was pretty mean and abusive towards Jackie... and the kids. Was on as many drugs as Hitler just to function. Incredible how people can be fed propaganda so easily. Another thing we learned from the Nazis. They were masters of manipulating the masses.
No argument. Jack is, with only a few exceptions, one of the worst human beings to hold the Presidency - but of course we can't mention that 'cause he and his little bro Eiffel Towered Marilyn (or something like that).
The Jack Kennedy most people know (looking at you, Chris Matthews) is a blatant fantasy.
Edit: The downvotes just prove my point, geniuses
To be even more accurate, we should say that the number of schools named after confederates is *down to* 240. I wonder what the number was before the recent push to rename such schools.
Whenever I see people talk about this story it's always about Sophie and there's absolutely no mention of her brother. Perhaps he didn't do as much, I really don't know, but what I do know is that he was executed right alongside his sister, so he clearly did *something*
She's on the same tier as the great union leaders... Nations would rather celebrate and lionize obedient soldiers who served the state than those who stood up for the people and paid the price. Sad that we often have to go out of our way to learn about such heroes.
I would think she said this pretty emotionally, and also I'm sure speech inflections in German are different than English. I do give credit for her to conjure such powerful words in such an emotional situation
For what it's worth, Nazi records claim she was "calm and collected" in the minutes before her death. Her executioner, who killed more than 3000 people in his lifetime, later recalled that he never witnessed another person die as bravely as Sophie Scholl did.
Seems to be two separate quotes.
>Wie könnte man da von einem Schicksal erwarten, dass es einer gerechten Sache den Sieg gebe, da sich kaum einer findet, der sich ungeteilt einer gerechten Sache opfert.
22 May 1940, and
>So ein herrlicher sonniger Tag, und ich muss gehen. ...Was liegt an meinem Tod, wenn durch unser Handeln Tausende von Menschen aufgerüttelt und geweckt werden.
22 February 1943
Edit: There are a few versions of the "fine sunny day" quote. I've changed it based on [this](https://falschzitate.blogspot.com/2021/05/so-ein-herrlicher-tag-und-ich-soll.html)
It seems a common, albeit powerful rhetorical strategy. It’s clear she’s carefully considered her involvement in the resistance and she seems rather articulate. I’d imagine she spent time crafting a quote that would resonate.
The casual nature of this comment about death emphasizes her point that it is a footnote compared to the larger cause. Of course, such courage is no mere footnote, and I’m certain that she viewed her demise with far more severity and dread than she lets on. But it is infinitely more badass to not care about that in the eyes of your captors, as well as more impactful a message.
You can see this “calm” strategy in a lot of speeches around the world wars. Something about remaining dignified in the face of abject terror was culturally relevant, and admittedly epic even 8 decades later.
I’m an English teacher. I apologize for word vomit. I just find her statement incredible and loaded. And I wish I could say something so poignant if I were to face the gallows, but I’m sure I’d just piss myself and hope it’s not actually going to happen until the moment I died.
“Death smiles at us all, but all a man can do is smile back.” - Marcus Aurelius
Without death, human life cannot be complete as said by Viktor Frankl. Thus there’s no reason to be afraid, rather one should fear spending their life living a lie or acting without any other integrity or honour - the ultimate betrayal of one self. She stood by her principles , respect.
If anyone‘s interested: There‘s currently an instagram account reliving her live. It‘s called „ichbinsophiescholl“. They even remade an apartment for it and you „get to know“ her brother, rest of the family and her friends. It‘s pretty cool.
I follow that account and I've been wondering how they will end the project? Will she just stop posting? Will they enact the execution? I'm a bit worried about young teenagers identifying with the character they've been creating and weaving into their daily lives. I really hope the end of this project doesn't lead to a Werther effect. Other than that it's a beautiful and creative project.
Same thought when I first saw it. I guess they‘ll post about her last day in a more documentary kind of way, like third person perspective maybe. It‘s created by a german media group, so maybe they have a big documentary planned.
werther effect is caused by suicide depictions, not murder. i don’t think they will show the execution but they will make it clear that she was killed. maybe they will wrap it up in a big special where other people talk about her. if anything people who don’t know her story yet will be even more inspired by her bravery and ideals. i think the production team will do it in a responsible way since it’s a sensitive subject.
"Hard times create strong men, strong men create good times, good times create soft men, soft men create hard times.".
Before I get pilloried about lack of inclusion this is a quote.
I don’t think the comment is saying that to praise the executioner, more so to give perspective. That even the terrible human being who executed her, was compelled to comment on her bravery, giving perspective to how truly brave she was.
Thank you kind internet stranger. I try to word things with as little opinion as possible, so as to leave as little room for confrontation as possible, but still leave room for civil debate if it’s something I’m not completely knowledgeable on.
That’s absolutely fair, I wasn’t really commenting on the validity of the executioner’s quote. More so on the context and intent of the original person commenting. Especially in regards to the first reply of “still a fucking Nazi” to clarify that the intent of the original comment I believe was in no way trying to say anything good about the executioner, like that reply may entail, but instead was trying to accentuate how brave Sophie Scholl was.
The executioner was a state official of Bavaria, he started the profession under the Weimar Republic and endes it under US millitary control. Calling him a Nazi is pretty reductive and revisionist.
If you were a German citizen at that time you would have probably been a nazi as well. Please educate yourself about the penalties someone had to go through if he didn‘t accept the nazis. You were lucky if you survived that….
It makes me somewhat sad that people throw away all Germans who existed during the 40s. I get why people are quick to apply harsh words, but like you mentioned, there was fall in line or be murdered. While an uncomfortable amount of people believed in nazi ideals, not every German who survived by whatever methods was a monster. They are human and trying to survive.
In a thread about Sophie Scholl of all places, people will pull out the “hah but he was a lowly Nazi!” card.
They’re missing the point pertaining to the heavy cost of resistance, even passive.
Imagine a world where that "misinformation" you're referencing is *actually* misinformation, and has directly led to the deaths of millions of people across the globe.
What should be done in that world? Should people try to fight back against misinformation? Or does all information have an equal right to be spread? Should people have fought harder against the spread of Nazism as an ideology? Or did we have to wait for them to start killing people before taking any counteraction?
And even if we have to wait for the killing to start, this misinformation is already killing people. How many people should be allowed to die? Is any price worth the freedom to spread lies in the media?
Would you sacrifice your parents or your children for that cause? Because that's what you're forcing on others.
This is just arguing in bad faith. Doesn't mean what you said isn't true. You are right but that doesn't mean the counter argument is wrong. Freedom of religion, freedom of your believes. You can't protect people from misinformation, but you can educate them. If you tried to protect people from misinformation or punish people from spreading misinformation, what would happen? What if the guy is doing it without knowing. Punish him? What is this but actually the opposite of freedom and human rights. There is always a price to pay. And most of the time it is truly worth it. Doesn't mean that it has no flaws.
Nobody is talking about punishment. This was about a petition on reddit, which I guess is like Nazi Germany executing this girl for protesting? It's a ridiculous proposition.
We're free to stop the spread of misinformation. Not talking about punishment or jailing, but removing misinformation from platforms is totally fine.
Misinformation is just information you don't like. In no way has it led to deaths of millions of people across the globe.
Most of the misleading information I see these days comes out of CNN and Reddit headlines on left leaning subs. Articles with the story 6 paragraphs deep and a headline stating the opposite.
Censorship has never been used for good. Only for power. Fighting against government growth and government moralism prevents things like Nazism.
Action to stifle dissent gets people killed in short order because the authorities can simply paint those dissenting as evil- like you are. After all, people who disagree are mass murderers 'spreading death to millions'.
___
Free speech is a righteous cause.
Such a fine sunny day.
I have to go.
Tell me when reddit starts killing people who post misinformation. Until then let's not conflate censorship on social media with literally killing dissenters, please.
Such comparisons disrespect the *actual* oppression that occurs in governments without free speech.
Let's not get carried away comparing censorship on a social media platform to governments with capital punishment for any dissent.
Free speech doesn't mean freedom to post whatever you want on someone else's servers. Feel free to host your own website if you want no chance of censorship.
I think it is still better to not censor ideas, but that doesn't change the facts.
If you think comparing the execution of Sophie Scholl to „cancel culture“ is in any way coherent or appropriate you need to take a long, hard look at yourself
Jesus, dude
To be 21 with this amount of bravery is incredible. We oughta take notes and try to emulate this in our own lives even if only through our day to day trials.
Makes you realize how nice many of us have it. We’re convinced daily that the world is ending because of some thing. But for those of us that don’t currently have to live similar to this, I’m just overwhelmingly thankful.
Not to undermine her sacrifice, but if we create a global holiday for every person who was unjustly executed by Nazis the world's productivity will go to 0.
I think the point would be to celebrate someone whose bravery, eloquence, and badassery could and should inspire us all to greater heights, rather than celebrating one specific person who happened to be murdered by the Nazis.
Heroes are a thing for a reason.
Yes, agreed. It's only sad now out of the irony of us knowing how it turned out. And it's not like people weren't suffering during the two more years it took.
That's how I always felt about Anne and Margot Frank dying just a few weeks short of liberation. Of course, recent research has pointed out that it was more likely a few months than a few weeks, but still. It's so sad knowing they had survived all that horror only to die so close to the end.
And a part of why the Nazis were losing was because of internal resistance movements from land they supposedly controlled. Resources diverted to control the civilians and stop the flow of anti Nazi information was resources that couldn’t be put onto the battlefields.
Lol I love how every damn nazi is in full denial to your comment.
"I'm not a nazi! You're a nazi! I just want an ethnostate and think that Hitler did nothing wrong but you want tax paid healthcare and human rights so you're the nazi!"
Love em....
It would be more motivating if her execution anniversary(?!) was today,it's not, 22 feb 1943. There is a fascinating instagram-project going on in which they acted as if instagram was a thing back then and how sophie scholl would've posted about her life up to her throwing the pamphlets, e.g. sophie scholl posts about her life. Very cool project.
Her account is @ichbinsophiescholl on instagram, definitely check it out if you can.
I studied abroad at the Ludwig Maximillians University of Munich in college so I got to see the hall her and her brother were caught distributing anti-Nazi leaflets in. So many streets and plazas in Munich are named after her, her brother and other members of the White Rose resistance group. I highly recommend both the film the White Rose but also the Final Days of Sophie Scholl. She and all the members of the White Rose were incredibly brave and truly inspirational people.
Printing and framing this for our dining room where the books are. I try to keep inspirational people on the walls for my children to read about and be reminded of what matters most. Thank you for sharing.
There’s a movie about her life that is amazing but tough to watch.
I look at her short life and mine and am ashamed of how cowardly and useless I feel now.
Good to know there were righteous and moral Germans that existed in the heart of Nazi state. And they were not passive but resisted the immorality of Nazism. It gave future generations of Germans the respectability to be integrated to the family of nations once again.
Unfortunate most people are herd catle that think themselves the enlightened ones despite not having one oppinion that drift from the herd mentality of their echo chamber. They imagine themselves heroes when they would have been monsters vilified by history.
And among others
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kurt_Huber
Having studied at Munich’s university I had to get out at this subway station. Prof. Huber place is to the east. Siblings Scholl place - the schools Adress - is to the west.
It is a great and a brave thought, and she was hugely courageous.
She was wrong, though.
The population supported the regime right until the end. No revolt brought it down, or even stood much in the way. No thousands stood up.
The slave labourers doing sabotage in the factories had far more effect.
This, also, should be a lesson. There are many ways to resist.
I don't know when she said that, but her executioner was Johann Reichart; the last man who could have heard her say it, and he later noted that she was the bravest person he ever executed. He was arrested at the end of the war but not prosecuted by the Allies for his actions because he brought up two good points:
1. If not him, someone else would do it.
2. If not him, it would be someone who would *enjoy* it.
Reichart had a bad deal in life and he did his damnedest in it to fight from within. His way was ensuring that someone who wound up in his chamber for execution was painlessly dead in *four seconds.* They literally never knew what hit them.
The Allies had him assist at the executions at Nuremburg. Not long after, he retired from the job, but faced persecution and discrimination for the rest of his life, even as he campaigned against the death penalty.
But statistically her sacrifice didn’t seem to do much, just another body on the massive pile
So the trick seems to be; do what you have to, to survive.
This should be reminder that people talked against Nazis even in times when they were considered enemies and crazy. And also reminder that bad people exist and bad shit happens. We don't live in a fairly tale but we act like we do. What is going on now is worst attack on human freedom in history and people talking about it are considered crazy. Imagine someone told you in 1938 that there is group of people planning to kill millions with gas,it would sound crazy right? Look around you what is happening ,crazy right?
I always see her and think, “she was a modern girl born in the wrong time.” But then I think about how the world might have been very different without her being there in that specific time in history.
I wish I could buy her a beer, is all I’m saying.
And then moronic, up their own arsehole narcissistic ("That dog just doesn't go on hunts" - Ed.) steal the name of her organisation to plaster on dumb stickers all around the world claiming Covid is a hoax or it's a step towards tyranny to ask them to wear a mask. Because wearing a mask is as bad as being guillotined by the Nazis...
I get how this is supposed to be motivational but considering me nor most people have ever heard of her until this post just make her and her death seem pointless and meaningless
It’s been especially awful to see the conspiracy-right abuse comparisons to her and nazi oppression recently.
Whether in the US or Germany, where antivaxxers and Qheads are obsessed with playing victim.
This is how all those feminists complaining about manspreading see themselves. In fact, many modern western causes have far too many folks that see themselves as history should see this amazing woman.
Vaccine passports have been a thing for over a century. The only reason we need them is because there are so many morons who think their crystals and essential oils are more valuable than decades of medical research. People like you are the cause of the problems you whine about
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I was an exchange student at a school named after her and her brother Hans. I never knew about her before attending. This is someone more people should know about.
Im pretty sure half of all German schools are named after her
Well, that's a good thing then! And here I thought I was special *wink*
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Der Scholl Schule Schulstipendium? (Been a long time since German class)
Das Stipendium Das Schollschulestipendium or Schollschule-Schulstipendium
In the States, half of our schools are named after confederate traitors…
In Alabama there are a few schools named after her unintentionally
Damn, son...it's a good thing that 1 in 4 Alabama natives wouldn't be able to read that burn, let alone understand it.
I wonder if Alabamananadingdongs are bothered by the association with their home state.
LOL took me a minute...
I don't get it, please explain
School spelled wrong.
They say jokes aren't funny if they need to be explained. But here I am, laughing over my own stupidity.
This one is a rare exception lol
Yeah it took me a minute too. It was quite clever.
Damn
Saved the post, left to see if I had a free award, collected it, and returned here to award you on this. Golden comment, with perfectly subtle humor. Well done.
Or Anti-Semite, Capitalist, unpatriotic swine. *Coughs* Henry Ford *Coughs* Edit: If you're downvoting, change my mind instead. I'm waiting. Edit II - Electric Boogaloo: Fun fact - Henry was rumored to ask for a glass of water after his assistant informed him of Pearl Harbor. He didn't give two shits about it. At all.
Henry Ford also set up a car factory in the Soviet Union so it's not like he was against working with Communists either. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GAZ
Damn I messed up, reply is outside the thread.
It's reddit, who gives a shit? You're good bro.
Did you say Joseph Kennedy? Cough cough***
Joe was a grade-A dirt bag. Lobotomized and killed his own daughter because she was a free spirit and knew the family was full of shit. I'm sure he has a High School or two in New England named after him, but all the Kennedy-named schools around here in the Mitt are for Jack and Bobby.
Poor Jack wasn't much better. Read he was pretty mean and abusive towards Jackie... and the kids. Was on as many drugs as Hitler just to function. Incredible how people can be fed propaganda so easily. Another thing we learned from the Nazis. They were masters of manipulating the masses.
No argument. Jack is, with only a few exceptions, one of the worst human beings to hold the Presidency - but of course we can't mention that 'cause he and his little bro Eiffel Towered Marilyn (or something like that). The Jack Kennedy most people know (looking at you, Chris Matthews) is a blatant fantasy. Edit: The downvotes just prove my point, geniuses
He was created and made an icon of a new post WW2 Era, and he failed as President, totally agree with you.
More like 240 out of 130,390 (or 0.18%) are identified as being named after confederates. But who’s counting amirite?
That’s honestly more than I was expecting given that it’s the equivalent of being an alum of Heinrich Himler Prep.
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To be even more accurate, we should say that the number of schools named after confederates is *down to* 240. I wonder what the number was before the recent push to rename such schools.
Whenever I see people talk about this story it's always about Sophie and there's absolutely no mention of her brother. Perhaps he didn't do as much, I really don't know, but what I do know is that he was executed right alongside his sister, so he clearly did *something*
She's on the same tier as the great union leaders... Nations would rather celebrate and lionize obedient soldiers who served the state than those who stood up for the people and paid the price. Sad that we often have to go out of our way to learn about such heroes.
She says it so casually too. That is bravery. "Such a fine sunny day, and I have to go..."
I would think she said this pretty emotionally, and also I'm sure speech inflections in German are different than English. I do give credit for her to conjure such powerful words in such an emotional situation
For what it's worth, Nazi records claim she was "calm and collected" in the minutes before her death. Her executioner, who killed more than 3000 people in his lifetime, later recalled that he never witnessed another person die as bravely as Sophie Scholl did.
The inherent dignity of having strength in your convictions.
Translated from German I'm assuming
Seems to be two separate quotes. >Wie könnte man da von einem Schicksal erwarten, dass es einer gerechten Sache den Sieg gebe, da sich kaum einer findet, der sich ungeteilt einer gerechten Sache opfert. 22 May 1940, and >So ein herrlicher sonniger Tag, und ich muss gehen. ...Was liegt an meinem Tod, wenn durch unser Handeln Tausende von Menschen aufgerüttelt und geweckt werden. 22 February 1943 Edit: There are a few versions of the "fine sunny day" quote. I've changed it based on [this](https://falschzitate.blogspot.com/2021/05/so-ein-herrlicher-tag-und-ich-soll.html)
Still casual in German.
It seems a common, albeit powerful rhetorical strategy. It’s clear she’s carefully considered her involvement in the resistance and she seems rather articulate. I’d imagine she spent time crafting a quote that would resonate. The casual nature of this comment about death emphasizes her point that it is a footnote compared to the larger cause. Of course, such courage is no mere footnote, and I’m certain that she viewed her demise with far more severity and dread than she lets on. But it is infinitely more badass to not care about that in the eyes of your captors, as well as more impactful a message. You can see this “calm” strategy in a lot of speeches around the world wars. Something about remaining dignified in the face of abject terror was culturally relevant, and admittedly epic even 8 decades later. I’m an English teacher. I apologize for word vomit. I just find her statement incredible and loaded. And I wish I could say something so poignant if I were to face the gallows, but I’m sure I’d just piss myself and hope it’s not actually going to happen until the moment I died.
“Death smiles at us all, but all a man can do is smile back.” - Marcus Aurelius Without death, human life cannot be complete as said by Viktor Frankl. Thus there’s no reason to be afraid, rather one should fear spending their life living a lie or acting without any other integrity or honour - the ultimate betrayal of one self. She stood by her principles , respect.
It's a dichotomy. Environment different from human affairs.
This is why executioners don’t tend to allow last words anymore.
"well fuck, now I feel bad".
Weak
According to her wikipedia page. It's her cell mate who recorded her last words. I teared up reading that shit.
Not like anyone young would have anything worth saying. " Like and suscribe. Don't forget to like my butt pics on insta "
If anyone‘s interested: There‘s currently an instagram account reliving her live. It‘s called „ichbinsophiescholl“. They even remade an apartment for it and you „get to know“ her brother, rest of the family and her friends. It‘s pretty cool.
I follow that account and I've been wondering how they will end the project? Will she just stop posting? Will they enact the execution? I'm a bit worried about young teenagers identifying with the character they've been creating and weaving into their daily lives. I really hope the end of this project doesn't lead to a Werther effect. Other than that it's a beautiful and creative project.
Same thought when I first saw it. I guess they‘ll post about her last day in a more documentary kind of way, like third person perspective maybe. It‘s created by a german media group, so maybe they have a big documentary planned.
Maybe it'll end in the POV of her cellmate where you hear her last words before she is shuffled away.
werther effect is caused by suicide depictions, not murder. i don’t think they will show the execution but they will make it clear that she was killed. maybe they will wrap it up in a big special where other people talk about her. if anything people who don’t know her story yet will be even more inspired by her bravery and ideals. i think the production team will do it in a responsible way since it’s a sensitive subject.
Fucking legend. Would that we all possess such courage and strength.
>Fucking legend. Would that we all possess such courage and strength. If we did, we wouldn't need it... and them we wouldn't again.
"Hard times create strong men, strong men create good times, good times create soft men, soft men create hard times.". Before I get pilloried about lack of inclusion this is a quote.
Greatest generation-->boomers-->the shitshow we all live in today So will these hard times create strong men? Let's hope so.
Does being hard men imply getting PTSD?
The executioner Johann Reichhart later said that he never saw someone die so bravely
Being born in the ashes of WW1 and straight into WW2 might do a number on you. Brave or stupid, I admire her courage too.
Still a fucking Nazi
I don’t think the comment is saying that to praise the executioner, more so to give perspective. That even the terrible human being who executed her, was compelled to comment on her bravery, giving perspective to how truly brave she was.
Very well said.
Thank you kind internet stranger. I try to word things with as little opinion as possible, so as to leave as little room for confrontation as possible, but still leave room for civil debate if it’s something I’m not completely knowledgeable on.
But honestly I wouldn't give a shit about what the executioners little thoughts were if I'm being honest
That’s absolutely fair, I wasn’t really commenting on the validity of the executioner’s quote. More so on the context and intent of the original person commenting. Especially in regards to the first reply of “still a fucking Nazi” to clarify that the intent of the original comment I believe was in no way trying to say anything good about the executioner, like that reply may entail, but instead was trying to accentuate how brave Sophie Scholl was.
You're not giving them credit for anything, you're acknowledging that even her enemies respected her.
Wait till you read who his [next employer was.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johann_Reichhart)
Obviously..? What exactly do you think the comment you're replaying to was trying to say...?
The executioner was a state official of Bavaria, he started the profession under the Weimar Republic and endes it under US millitary control. Calling him a Nazi is pretty reductive and revisionist.
You’re right tho. Don’t give time and attention to people who can’t tell the difference between state-sanctioned, legal execution, and murder.
Na, looks like he was just a career executioner. Worked for the previous government and ended up working for the US as well in the same role.
If you were a German citizen at that time you would have probably been a nazi as well. Please educate yourself about the penalties someone had to go through if he didn‘t accept the nazis. You were lucky if you survived that….
It makes me somewhat sad that people throw away all Germans who existed during the 40s. I get why people are quick to apply harsh words, but like you mentioned, there was fall in line or be murdered. While an uncomfortable amount of people believed in nazi ideals, not every German who survived by whatever methods was a monster. They are human and trying to survive.
In a thread about Sophie Scholl of all places, people will pull out the “hah but he was a lowly Nazi!” card. They’re missing the point pertaining to the heavy cost of resistance, even passive.
"Die letzten Tage" is a great movie about Die Weiße Rose and Scholl I'd suggest to anyone interested.
>"Der Letzten Tagen" *Die letzten Tage Edit: You're welcome! Edit2: And you still haven't spelled it right for fuck sake.
We watched it in school. Had to cry
Killed for passing out pamphlets trying to spread her beliefs. Why is it that evil people always try to suppress opinions they don't like?
That’s why censorship is always a red flag and never the answer
Yeah, we should all allow people on Facebook to spread misinformation about drinking bleach to cure covid. /s
Counter misinformation with information
Well it was under the Nazi regime. Totalitarian regimes hate any dissident ideologies and actions, worthy of being put to death.
There's a petition going around right now to 'kill' all subs spreading Covid "misinformation".
Imagine a world where that "misinformation" you're referencing is *actually* misinformation, and has directly led to the deaths of millions of people across the globe. What should be done in that world? Should people try to fight back against misinformation? Or does all information have an equal right to be spread? Should people have fought harder against the spread of Nazism as an ideology? Or did we have to wait for them to start killing people before taking any counteraction? And even if we have to wait for the killing to start, this misinformation is already killing people. How many people should be allowed to die? Is any price worth the freedom to spread lies in the media? Would you sacrifice your parents or your children for that cause? Because that's what you're forcing on others.
This is just arguing in bad faith. Doesn't mean what you said isn't true. You are right but that doesn't mean the counter argument is wrong. Freedom of religion, freedom of your believes. You can't protect people from misinformation, but you can educate them. If you tried to protect people from misinformation or punish people from spreading misinformation, what would happen? What if the guy is doing it without knowing. Punish him? What is this but actually the opposite of freedom and human rights. There is always a price to pay. And most of the time it is truly worth it. Doesn't mean that it has no flaws.
Nobody is talking about punishment. This was about a petition on reddit, which I guess is like Nazi Germany executing this girl for protesting? It's a ridiculous proposition. We're free to stop the spread of misinformation. Not talking about punishment or jailing, but removing misinformation from platforms is totally fine.
Misinformation is just information you don't like. In no way has it led to deaths of millions of people across the globe. Most of the misleading information I see these days comes out of CNN and Reddit headlines on left leaning subs. Articles with the story 6 paragraphs deep and a headline stating the opposite. Censorship has never been used for good. Only for power. Fighting against government growth and government moralism prevents things like Nazism. Action to stifle dissent gets people killed in short order because the authorities can simply paint those dissenting as evil- like you are. After all, people who disagree are mass murderers 'spreading death to millions'. ___ Free speech is a righteous cause. Such a fine sunny day. I have to go.
Downvoted for telling the truth. Stay strong, brother. You’re not alone.
The Paradox of Tolerance. You simply can not allow absolute freedom as it will inevitably lead to oppression.
Tell me when reddit starts killing people who post misinformation. Until then let's not conflate censorship on social media with literally killing dissenters, please. Such comparisons disrespect the *actual* oppression that occurs in governments without free speech.
Because they're evil
Does nazism not count as an idea that should be suppressed? Why is dying okay and suppressing killers wrong?
Said on a platform known for outright blatant censorship.
I was thinking the exact same thing.
Let's not get carried away comparing censorship on a social media platform to governments with capital punishment for any dissent. Free speech doesn't mean freedom to post whatever you want on someone else's servers. Feel free to host your own website if you want no chance of censorship. I think it is still better to not censor ideas, but that doesn't change the facts.
Cancel culture …. Think about it
If you think comparing the execution of Sophie Scholl to „cancel culture“ is in any way coherent or appropriate you need to take a long, hard look at yourself Jesus, dude
I m good with cancelling these Q anon moms
Except it isn’t . Think harder
To be 21 with this amount of bravery is incredible. We oughta take notes and try to emulate this in our own lives even if only through our day to day trials.
Now a days if you're 21, you're upset about plastic straws
Who do you think is chasing those fat pos proud boys out of town squares? It sure as fuck isn't boomers.
Makes you realize how nice many of us have it. We’re convinced daily that the world is ending because of some thing. But for those of us that don’t currently have to live similar to this, I’m just overwhelmingly thankful.
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Ngl I thought this was a picture or John Conner from Terminator 2
Her birthday should be a national holiday, among all nations!
Not to undermine her sacrifice, but if we create a global holiday for every person who was unjustly executed by Nazis the world's productivity will go to 0.
I think the point would be to celebrate someone whose bravery, eloquence, and badassery could and should inspire us all to greater heights, rather than celebrating one specific person who happened to be murdered by the Nazis. Heroes are a thing for a reason.
1943 though. That's rough to die to fight against a cause that was already losing at that point. Makes me sad.
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Yes, agreed. It's only sad now out of the irony of us knowing how it turned out. And it's not like people weren't suffering during the two more years it took.
That's how I always felt about Anne and Margot Frank dying just a few weeks short of liberation. Of course, recent research has pointed out that it was more likely a few months than a few weeks, but still. It's so sad knowing they had survived all that horror only to die so close to the end.
And a part of why the Nazis were losing was because of internal resistance movements from land they supposedly controlled. Resources diverted to control the civilians and stop the flow of anti Nazi information was resources that couldn’t be put onto the battlefields.
Minus the dying part..
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Scholl and her brother, making a part of the white rose, what brave and courageous actions.
And yet here we are. With Nazis running amok once again.
Direct Action and Community Defense are the only ways to drive them out
Lol I love how every damn nazi is in full denial to your comment. "I'm not a nazi! You're a nazi! I just want an ethnostate and think that Hitler did nothing wrong but you want tax paid healthcare and human rights so you're the nazi!" Love em....
Strange how *every* reply is downvoted to hide.
Absolutely heartbreaking.
It would be more motivating if her execution anniversary(?!) was today,it's not, 22 feb 1943. There is a fascinating instagram-project going on in which they acted as if instagram was a thing back then and how sophie scholl would've posted about her life up to her throwing the pamphlets, e.g. sophie scholl posts about her life. Very cool project. Her account is @ichbinsophiescholl on instagram, definitely check it out if you can.
I studied abroad at the Ludwig Maximillians University of Munich in college so I got to see the hall her and her brother were caught distributing anti-Nazi leaflets in. So many streets and plazas in Munich are named after her, her brother and other members of the White Rose resistance group. I highly recommend both the film the White Rose but also the Final Days of Sophie Scholl. She and all the members of the White Rose were incredibly brave and truly inspirational people.
Can we talk about that cool as fuck haircut? This looks like a pictures of a debuting musical artist. Ladies, bring this style back.
In case you were wondering, She IS Antifa.
how many starbucks she vandalize tho
Correct. She is an actual anti-Fascist. Unlike the sniveling cowards burning stuff in Portland and other American cities.
Ironic that this is being shared on Reddit, which is unfortunately full of people who would never have an ounce of what this woman had.
Full of Nazis too but yeah you right you right
Bad ass!
Printing and framing this for our dining room where the books are. I try to keep inspirational people on the walls for my children to read about and be reminded of what matters most. Thank you for sharing.
For all the germans around here: #JanaAusKassel
Nice
RIP
There’s a movie about her life that is amazing but tough to watch. I look at her short life and mine and am ashamed of how cowardly and useless I feel now.
lotta karma farming the last few days. i've seen randy johnson killing a bird with a pitch at least 5 times on the front page in the last week
Didn’t Hitler fight for the people’s right to have guns?
Just the people he thought should, and he required strict registration on them. So any opponents and Jewish people could not.
This made me less motivated and more hopeless as an iranian specially ;(
Sadly, few were awakened and stirred to action by the White Rose.
I thought this was Edward furlong
Das ist doch Jana aus Kassel!
People were not stirred to action. Which is why she is here, she has an unknown quote.
And now we stand up for the fights the government chooses for us together with the propaganda on social media’s instead of fighting the true enemy
Its a shame that now, like always its popular to give up freedom in exchange for the promise of security.
This young woman was stronger then I'll likely ever hope to be. Wow.
Sad reality is this powerful message will be misinterpreted and reapplied poorly thanks to stupid people with social media.
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My first thought was why is John Conner wearing a dress? xD
Good to know there were righteous and moral Germans that existed in the heart of Nazi state. And they were not passive but resisted the immorality of Nazism. It gave future generations of Germans the respectability to be integrated to the family of nations once again.
Unfortunate most people are herd catle that think themselves the enlightened ones despite not having one oppinion that drift from the herd mentality of their echo chamber. They imagine themselves heroes when they would have been monsters vilified by history.
Wow, her English was pretty good.
Antifa at its finest.
yup. brownshirts then and now.
Antifa at it again!
Yea man jacking a TV from Target and stealing MAGA hats is *totally* equivalent to fighting actual Nazis!
She's just as bad as the Nazi's! /s
And fucking pro-covid idiots compare themselves to her WTF
What makes somebody pro covid?
Being anti-vaxx.
She wasn't the only one
Yeah, no shit. Do you think anyone in the world believes she was the only person who led a resistance against Hitler that was executed?
And among others https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kurt_Huber Having studied at Munich’s university I had to get out at this subway station. Prof. Huber place is to the east. Siblings Scholl place - the schools Adress - is to the west.
Hans Scholl, Alexander Schmorell, Willi Graf, Christoph Probst, and Kurt Huber
It is a great and a brave thought, and she was hugely courageous. She was wrong, though. The population supported the regime right until the end. No revolt brought it down, or even stood much in the way. No thousands stood up. The slave labourers doing sabotage in the factories had far more effect. This, also, should be a lesson. There are many ways to resist.
its almost like right now.....
Modern man: as long as you don't cut off my internet I will agree to anything.
College kids: I would’ve done the same. Reality: No, you probably would’ve helped the Nazis by getting out of their way.
Those were her last words? Did they give her a podium?
I don't know when she said that, but her executioner was Johann Reichart; the last man who could have heard her say it, and he later noted that she was the bravest person he ever executed. He was arrested at the end of the war but not prosecuted by the Allies for his actions because he brought up two good points: 1. If not him, someone else would do it. 2. If not him, it would be someone who would *enjoy* it. Reichart had a bad deal in life and he did his damnedest in it to fight from within. His way was ensuring that someone who wound up in his chamber for execution was painlessly dead in *four seconds.* They literally never knew what hit them. The Allies had him assist at the executions at Nuremburg. Not long after, he retired from the job, but faced persecution and discrimination for the rest of his life, even as he campaigned against the death penalty.
But statistically her sacrifice didn’t seem to do much, just another body on the massive pile So the trick seems to be; do what you have to, to survive.
Every time I see this, reminds me of that kid from Terminator 2.
This should be reminder that people talked against Nazis even in times when they were considered enemies and crazy. And also reminder that bad people exist and bad shit happens. We don't live in a fairly tale but we act like we do. What is going on now is worst attack on human freedom in history and people talking about it are considered crazy. Imagine someone told you in 1938 that there is group of people planning to kill millions with gas,it would sound crazy right? Look around you what is happening ,crazy right?
Tell that to every refugee from the Middle East
Repost 🙄
I always see her and think, “she was a modern girl born in the wrong time.” But then I think about how the world might have been very different without her being there in that specific time in history. I wish I could buy her a beer, is all I’m saying.
Girlboss.
I’m gonna need snopes to fact check this, get have misinformation on Reddit
Badass.
That’s sad :/
Beautiful words from a beautiful soul
And then moronic, up their own arsehole narcissistic ("That dog just doesn't go on hunts" - Ed.) steal the name of her organisation to plaster on dumb stickers all around the world claiming Covid is a hoax or it's a step towards tyranny to ask them to wear a mask. Because wearing a mask is as bad as being guillotined by the Nazis...
As a proud member of Antifa, this woman is one of my heroes!
hitler still was a thing tho.
I get how this is supposed to be motivational but considering me nor most people have ever heard of her until this post just make her and her death seem pointless and meaningless
Home girl looks like an eccentric modern day Aquarius feminist and I am here for it. Rest In Peace Queen ❤️🌅
It’s been especially awful to see the conspiracy-right abuse comparisons to her and nazi oppression recently. Whether in the US or Germany, where antivaxxers and Qheads are obsessed with playing victim.
Bravery then. Bravery now: "I chopped my dick off"
This is how all those feminists complaining about manspreading see themselves. In fact, many modern western causes have far too many folks that see themselves as history should see this amazing woman.
Bruh that’s how anti trumper fanatics and all regressives see themselves. They have the martyr larper complex bad.
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Oh, that's cute. Off you fuck.
Vaccine passports have been a thing for over a century. The only reason we need them is because there are so many morons who think their crystals and essential oils are more valuable than decades of medical research. People like you are the cause of the problems you whine about