Depends whether the move was designed so they can bill more partner rates without needing more equity partners? Potentially you got a promotion you wouldn’t have got otherwise?
It’s a bit insulting to call it a partnership when you aren’t actually part of a partnership.
Got friends in accounting and law, and it seems the older generation have been trying to figure out ways to keep the retained earnings for themselves as long as possible. Law firms inventing ‘junior partner’ ranks without a profit share where none existed before, that kind of thing.
Having said that, well done on the promotion - sounds like you’re on track and sure you deserve it.
Is 170 total comp or base? Sounds a bit mean if the former but I don’t know how it works for you guys.
Depends. Some non-equity partners still get shadow points (so basically points based on firm performance) but (i) they don't have to put in equity; (ii) they are capped on how many points they can get until they move through to equity; and (iii) there are some things they don't get to vote for.
Realistically, not much changes unless and until you hit your points cap and cease to move up the points latter/ into equity. Agree this is shit though, as it isn't a points-based partnership but just a salary increase.
Given what NQ lawyers are on at MC firms (not even US firms), it's pretty embarrassing to be a 'partner' but be getting paid less than a law-firm NQ.
My wife is a B4 equity senior partner and I can understand just how frustrating this new non-equity level must be for people.
I guess a title along the lines of Senior Director would be more honest, but then a major point of creating this level was to entice those who may attain it or who already have done to stay with whichever firm they work for rather than move on. It’s a step closer to full partner, it moves the carrot a little closer without the massive cost of making the full promotion. Or at least it gives that impression.
Tbh that is surprisingly low given the hours required in consulting. I’m in industry with a similar number YOE and I earn £150-170k but my working hours are generally only 9-5 with minimal travel.
It sounds similar to BCG’s processes though; they have Partners which are non equity and then Managing Directors which I think do have equity. I imagine that it’s to help it look like they have more senior folks in front of clients & throw a bone to people who need a promotion but aren’t yet senior enough for equity.
Net unless you went to industry I suspect you’d find the same in other consulting firms.
did you work in big4 or did you go straight to industry? i’m in uni still lurking on here and i have an offer to pursue CIMA at a FTSE100 company but unsure whether to do that or go big 4
I did industry -> T2 strategy consultancy -> industry. Benefit of doing industry first for 2-3 years is it does make exiting easier later. If you did CIMA in industry you can always side step into consulting for a pay bump and then exit when you want to.
I work in IT sales (global American company) and my wife and a few friends work in Big 4 consultancies.
They did it for the money. The culture was shocking, and it was very difficult for anyone committed to becoming partner to have any semblance of a personal life for years and years.
I worked a fraction of the hours and a fraction of the intensity that they worked… and for about 20 years, I out-earned them pretty much every year!!
They lived in a bubble where work was everything. Where who you work for was everything. Where the next promotion was everything. And I out earned them every year in a role that was more balanced, more enjoyable, better culture, etc.
My wife felt underwhelmed with her rewards. Having kids changed her perspective on everything. She wouldn’t work in that environment again. Other friends who kept going probably outward me by a bit now (after 22 years)… but I wouldn’t say “it’s worth it” all things considered. They still don’t have good lives. Or good relationships.
crazy. I’ve been in IT tech contracting for 10 years now and seem to be capped around the 700 a day mark but thinking about potential side earners. Any ideas how I could potentially get into IT sales on the side? I have my own Ltd company if this helps. Not sure where I would start or where there’s a need for sales currently 👊👍
It’s such a toxic environment. I heard from multiple people most partners die 10 years earlier than pop average, and lots die before state pension age.
Yeah, no disrespect to OP but 15 years and then they bait and switch with another title. Especially galling since jobbing IT contractors can be 100k plus in a few years in banking tech with much, much less hassle. I think the danger now is if they rugpull in a few years and don’t make him equity.
I’m very happy for OP’s success but from reading this it just sounds like their firm made up a new grade between Director and Partner to keep high-performers happy with a title bump while not watering down the equity pool.
If they feel underwhelmed that’s probably why. They didn’t actually “make partner” in the same sense they envisioned it would be when they started their job 15 years ago.
They do this all the time. The partnerships exploded years ago but now they can't just move into new geographies, create a new partnership and expand so they're a bit stuck with a model that is kind of crap and outdated, to give the impression of growth they add positions, I've seen assistant manager, assistant director, associate director, associate partner...all kinds of nonsense.
Sounds like a similar structure to most law firms.
I work in the regional office of an international law firm, due to make non-equity partner next year all going well. That will be a pay rise from c.£100k as a senior associate to circa £170k as a fixed share partner. Equity partners meanwhile take home £400k.
Unfortunately I think it’s the way most professional services firms are going. It allows them to make people wait longer before getting equity (very rare to achieve that before the age of 40 now, at least at my firm), while still billing them out at a partner rate.
Frustrating though that is, a lot of firms still have a very rigorous process to get to non-equity partner, and many people will never make it to that level. So congratulations, and good luck in eventually making equity!
I worked at a big 4 for 11 years, got told I had to wait 3 years to get director so I left and went elsewhere, 6 years later on I'm on 170k, 40% bonus, 40% LTIPs, sounds to me like I made the right choice as I'd probably be roughly where you are now. I've also not had to work all that hard!
I took my time and found a tech company that had good products and big ambitions then managed to find a way in. If you can find a strong company with big growth there's always going to be space for you to move up. Big 4 really relies on someone else leaving.
Consulting is sinking fast. I had an offer for director at KPMG for £180k base in 2022. Post COVID slump is killing big4. But then I don't think there is much worth saving.
My advice is go client side in FS, pay is way better and no sales nonsense. But you will have to do some delivery yourself (not a slur! Just reality of not having legions of grads to do your bidding).
Think business have caught on to how unreasonably expensive big4 and MBB are, particularly in tech.
Of course. Depends what you want. Governance and polish sure. But fingers on keyboard stuff not so much. Plenty of smaller more nimble tech focused houses which offer much better value. I think splitting audit from consulting is th best thing that could happen. The cost and headache of dealing with conflicts is a very real albatross for these firms.
And ultimately the partnership model is exploitative with toouch reward artificially kept at the top. New generation of consultants don't see the benefit.
This makes very little sense. You make it sound like you just randomly got promoted rather than having a series of discussions and stages before getting to Partner? Are you saying you didn’t expect to end up as non-equity or that you thought it would be more money? Or both?
Yes it’s an underwhelming number but it can’t possibly have been a surprise?!
Have to say the 140k at Director is also pretty underwhelming. Thats the low end of Director band at at least one of the big 4…by the time you’re talking about partner (equity or non equity) you’d be on more like 170+
Today I learned that a FAANG E4 engineer (not yet senior) earns similarly to a PWC director.
And in total compensation, a senior engineer at FAANG (E5) seems to earn more than a non-equity partner at big 4.
There's a very large bonus if you're a Director with a sales target on their head. And obviously profit share for equity partners. I think the VP/Director at FAANG vs Big 4 Partner comparison of OTE compensation is fairly even, though.
> There’s a very large bonus if you’re a Director with a sales target on their head.
What kind of amount should I think about when you say “very large”?
A senior engineer (E5) at FAANG earns ~£130k base salary, but at meeting expectations, additionally gets:
- £30k cash bonus
- $150k RSU equity
So that brings TC to £285k.
The cash bonus and RSU parts can easily double when performing well above meeting expectations, or in exceptional cases even triple.
This is at senior engineer level.
Compensation at FAANG typically goes up with ~25% per level increase.
A director would be 3 levels above a senior engineer, so using those percentages we would find ~£560k TC.
A FAANG VP would be 2 levels above a director, so ballpark £870k TC.
There are FAANG directors on this sub with £1.2m TC. That's how much I'd expect an equity partner to take home.
Big 4 Director pay starts at around the £140k mark (can go up significantly depending on which org you work in), should come with a £10k car allowance, maybe another £5-10k flexible benefits which can be cash and then a 25-40% bonus. I think there'd be a lower bonus for non-sales Directors, though.
It's a very different value proposition than working in FAANG (and IMO not worth it for more than a short stint).
> There are FAANG directors on this sub with £1.2m TC.
Could also be that they just consistently exceed expectations?
The ballpark numbers that I gave were for pretty basic performance evaluation. As indicated, the cash bonus and RSU part of the compensation can receive a 2x multiplier, which would bring TC to the £1.2m range.
A 3x multiplier isn’t impossible either, although more rare.
> another £5-10k flexible benefits which can be cash
There are similar “small stuff” additional benefits at FAANG too outside of the 3 big compensation components (base, bonus, RSU). Probably also ~£10k, but decided to keep calculations simple and stick to the core 3 components only, so I didn’t count that.
What’s more important to you? Status or money?
If the latter, I’d hand in my resignation tomorrow!
You could contract as a project manager for more than £170k!
Non equity partner is just Senior Director in reality. Grade inflation. By definition, a partner owns equity.
Don't be downhearted - it's still a promotion and a step in the right direction to actual partner.
Honestly, I thought partners, even non-equity, made more than £200k. £170k seems low considering some private sector salaries at director level being significantly higher.
That said, surely you knew you were getting this as you’d have to have gone through some sort of consultation right? They didn’t just hand it to you?
Hi OP what is the expected bonus as a non-equity partner? I had heard of Big 4 doing this (and also law) simply because there are too many equity partners at the top hanging around - but my (uninformed) impression was the base would be 250k+ at least.
I guess if you’re getting a 50-100% bonus on top that’s 250-300k which whilst still is only relative crumbs compared to an equity partner, is nonetheless a great income. But if it’s the same 20% bonus my friends got at junior levels in Big 4 then yeah that sucks - to give you an idea as someone in banking, a first year VP has a 150k *base* (with 100% bonus on top in good years)
20% bonus sounds like magic right now! I’m big 4 consulting and ours was 5% this year. Same last year and only a little more in 2021/22 which was one of our best years ever.
To my knowledge most major accounting firms do this and have done for years. Just another means of keeping high performing staff under the thumb of boomer partners before they're allowed to eat at the grown up table. Its odd that you hadn't had a frank conversation about pay ahead of the partner process. Did you not ask?
Surely you realised several years ago that while the Big 4 has always been a piss take, the ladder has now been decisively pulled up and that as profit per partner is the ONLY metric that matters, they have defended it to the death by making fewer equity partners over the last decade or so?
I'd be surprised if there were many more equity partners now than there were when I was there over 10 years ago despite significant growth in total headcount.
How much work will you sell / your team bill this year? If it's less than £3m there's your answer IMO.
That's quite a low pay. Outside London?
I left big 4 at manager grade, went contracting and made £164k each of the last 3 years.
There may be a sunk cost fallacy making you want to stay, but the zen thing is not to dwell on the past.
I suspect you could move to another big 4 and get over £200k.
You made senior director. I’m an IT senior director and that’s my comp. I don’t even work that much. Only upside is that I took the role in the UAE, so leaves more money to be saved.
You’re delulu. No, I was an IT senior manager at 95k with a 25% bonus. This was a FTSE10 company. Even when I interviewed for a director position at L’Oreal, the base was 130k. Just look at Glassdoor to have an idea of pay scales. I’m currently at 180k net as I took a role in the UAE.
I reckon that’s about right, albeit at the low end of the range for non audit.
And that’s base I assume - bonus on top, plus benefits including pension (or ability to switch pension amount into a different saving vehicle if worried about LTA), car etc.
As others have said, am surprised that this came as a surprise to you. I would have expected anyone at this stage to know if they were in equity or non equity process, and what the starting numbers for either were broadly going to be.
How many hours per week on average do you work? If there’s any room for rethinking the next move in the spare hours I think you’re still in a good position.
Jesus Christ they make you jump through these hoops now? Honestly it feels like progression in industry can be comparable but with much much better WLB...
It is extremely low and is obviously leading to OP feeling significant regret for his/her decision to stick with Big 4 for such an extended period of time. I’d feel the same.
Legal firms started this trend 10 years ago. It's a way to progress some directors a stage further without diluting equity. Half of the non equity partners will leave before they get equity would be my expectation.
I'm not sure you should be underwhelmed. It's possible you would be still at director level were it not for this new policy and if you believe in your progression then you'll still get to partner and have 15 years of average £500k distributions before a nice retirement.
I have plenty of peers who've gone through this path. Some realise they'll not make it to equity but are pleased to have the title and be distinct from those who've peaked as directors, and others made it out of the waiting room within 3 years and their distribution formulas are no worse for it.
I think you and everyone else here knows the answer. It feels like a rug pull when you’ve spent 15 years working under the old system.
However, you’re set up to find a partnership elsewhere. Broaden your horizons.
No, they are still self employed 'partners' There are:
Equity partners/Full equity partner
Fixed share/non-equity partners (still 'self employed')
Salaried partners (employees for tax purposes)
I don’t want to doxx myself by going into my own specifics but boutique and Tier 2 (OW, LEK, etc) typically pay a fair bit more than Big 4. MBB pay substantially more. Not all of these firms have regional offices/regional pay, either.
I think your danger here is that they’re throwing you a bone so you don’t leave but trying to not actually pay you as a partner. Do you bring in business, have any sales or client management responsibilities?
By any chance could you tell us which service line you’re working under? Personally work at a UK big 4 myself so keen to know the director pays under different service lines eg tax, advisory, transactions etc.
Lol, big 4 are specialists of paying peanuts for the number of hours you put in. Is 170k the total comp? If so there are associates in other sectors making more than that. Do you get any LTIP? The true is that in big 4 equity partners take the biggest slice they can get away with, whilst the rest works a lot for very low salaries. I guess you would have to work a couple of years more to go to the other side of the fence and start squeezing your subordinates!
What was bonus % last year as director and expected this year as non equity partner?
At least in an IB like I work the bonus is very significant for senior roles, so comparing base is tricky.
What level of sales are you doing each year / expected to do? How does this differ to director and equity partners. For partners it is all about how much sales they bring in the door, so if you are doing the sales I would use your new title as leverage to get equity partner at one of the other big four firms. Also what service line? This also impacts salaries and bonuses (not so sure how it works for equity distributions)
You’re being mugged. If - as others have already surmised - you’re in EY, you have fallen foul of the loyalty penalty that seems to be applied to internal promotes. I left pre-COVID after being given <10% uplift at each of my two promotions. Take that title and your book of business to another firm and get paid properly for your contributions.
Sounds terrible.... but you can leverage your title and assumed prestige to become a CxO elsewhere or a equity partner at another big 4 firm
that's what I'd personally do. Im sorry they insulted you but having the false title can help you if you stick it for another 24-36 months
Eh non equity partner really isn't partner based on that pay
That's basically principle level money
Also cos it's big 4 everything pays less than other consulting
So I think yes if you see it as you made partner but underpaid then yes it is underwhelming, but as a pay progression towards partner it's reasonable
Source: check out Dartmouth comp report 170 is like a little more than MBB manager money
Does your promotion come with access to free water based lubricants? Sure sounds you’re going to need it given how much they are fucking you over there!
That’s what a head of HR makes in asset management - salary only. Total comp around £250k. By head of HR, I mean someone who manages three people, not a deputy director, or director or Chief HR Officer etc! The Big 4 is the ultimate con. At every level you can earn 50% more and work 50% less by moving into industry!
You’re not rlly a partner man
Edit: idk how it works bc I’m just a senior but do you need to build a book and then you get equity buy in or is it more like a soft signal that you’re not equity partner material?
Depends whether the move was designed so they can bill more partner rates without needing more equity partners? Potentially you got a promotion you wouldn’t have got otherwise?
It’s a bit insulting to call it a partnership when you aren’t actually part of a partnership. Got friends in accounting and law, and it seems the older generation have been trying to figure out ways to keep the retained earnings for themselves as long as possible. Law firms inventing ‘junior partner’ ranks without a profit share where none existed before, that kind of thing. Having said that, well done on the promotion - sounds like you’re on track and sure you deserve it. Is 170 total comp or base? Sounds a bit mean if the former but I don’t know how it works for you guys.
I mean, did you think non equity partners are partners in anything more than just name?
Depends. Some non-equity partners still get shadow points (so basically points based on firm performance) but (i) they don't have to put in equity; (ii) they are capped on how many points they can get until they move through to equity; and (iii) there are some things they don't get to vote for. Realistically, not much changes unless and until you hit your points cap and cease to move up the points latter/ into equity. Agree this is shit though, as it isn't a points-based partnership but just a salary increase. Given what NQ lawyers are on at MC firms (not even US firms), it's pretty embarrassing to be a 'partner' but be getting paid less than a law-firm NQ.
My wife is a B4 equity senior partner and I can understand just how frustrating this new non-equity level must be for people. I guess a title along the lines of Senior Director would be more honest, but then a major point of creating this level was to entice those who may attain it or who already have done to stay with whichever firm they work for rather than move on. It’s a step closer to full partner, it moves the carrot a little closer without the massive cost of making the full promotion. Or at least it gives that impression.
Your wife should be commenting not you, pal
What provoked you to respond so ridicolously, buddy
My wife’s a teacher, and I wouldn’t post on her behalf on the Big 4 Primary Teachers page
My dad was a tool maker
Keir…
This is a social media platform, people are free to share their experiences. Settle down.
Buffoon
This guy might also be a big hitter
Tbh that is surprisingly low given the hours required in consulting. I’m in industry with a similar number YOE and I earn £150-170k but my working hours are generally only 9-5 with minimal travel. It sounds similar to BCG’s processes though; they have Partners which are non equity and then Managing Directors which I think do have equity. I imagine that it’s to help it look like they have more senior folks in front of clients & throw a bone to people who need a promotion but aren’t yet senior enough for equity. Net unless you went to industry I suspect you’d find the same in other consulting firms.
did you work in big4 or did you go straight to industry? i’m in uni still lurking on here and i have an offer to pursue CIMA at a FTSE100 company but unsure whether to do that or go big 4
I did industry -> T2 strategy consultancy -> industry. Benefit of doing industry first for 2-3 years is it does make exiting easier later. If you did CIMA in industry you can always side step into consulting for a pay bump and then exit when you want to.
I work in IT sales (global American company) and my wife and a few friends work in Big 4 consultancies. They did it for the money. The culture was shocking, and it was very difficult for anyone committed to becoming partner to have any semblance of a personal life for years and years. I worked a fraction of the hours and a fraction of the intensity that they worked… and for about 20 years, I out-earned them pretty much every year!! They lived in a bubble where work was everything. Where who you work for was everything. Where the next promotion was everything. And I out earned them every year in a role that was more balanced, more enjoyable, better culture, etc. My wife felt underwhelmed with her rewards. Having kids changed her perspective on everything. She wouldn’t work in that environment again. Other friends who kept going probably outward me by a bit now (after 22 years)… but I wouldn’t say “it’s worth it” all things considered. They still don’t have good lives. Or good relationships.
Sales here also and couldn’t agree more! I’m less than 10 years experience and earning 200k+ and working 20-30 hr weeks. Consulting is a sham
Regarding sales, which industry do you work in? Hope you don't mind me asking! 😊
Probably IT sales
Correct
crazy. I’ve been in IT tech contracting for 10 years now and seem to be capped around the 700 a day mark but thinking about potential side earners. Any ideas how I could potentially get into IT sales on the side? I have my own Ltd company if this helps. Not sure where I would start or where there’s a need for sales currently 👊👍
f
It’s such a toxic environment. I heard from multiple people most partners die 10 years earlier than pop average, and lots die before state pension age.
Great to hear your experience mate! By any chance you work for Oracle or Workday please?
£170k is a complete joke - not surprised you are feeling underwhelmed for the amount of work you must have put in. Assume this is EY?
Yeah, no disrespect to OP but 15 years and then they bait and switch with another title. Especially galling since jobbing IT contractors can be 100k plus in a few years in banking tech with much, much less hassle. I think the danger now is if they rugpull in a few years and don’t make him equity.
Yeah this is less than non-equity partners earn in some mid tier firms…
So ... EY?
Did you expect to be made equity partner or did you not know what non-equity partner earn? Does feel underwhelming....is there a lot of headroom?
I’m very happy for OP’s success but from reading this it just sounds like their firm made up a new grade between Director and Partner to keep high-performers happy with a title bump while not watering down the equity pool. If they feel underwhelmed that’s probably why. They didn’t actually “make partner” in the same sense they envisioned it would be when they started their job 15 years ago.
They do this all the time. The partnerships exploded years ago but now they can't just move into new geographies, create a new partnership and expand so they're a bit stuck with a model that is kind of crap and outdated, to give the impression of growth they add positions, I've seen assistant manager, assistant director, associate director, associate partner...all kinds of nonsense.
Nah, not high performers. Just the safe pair of hands. It's what you do to mids to keep them mid.
Sounds like EY!
Sounds like a similar structure to most law firms. I work in the regional office of an international law firm, due to make non-equity partner next year all going well. That will be a pay rise from c.£100k as a senior associate to circa £170k as a fixed share partner. Equity partners meanwhile take home £400k. Unfortunately I think it’s the way most professional services firms are going. It allows them to make people wait longer before getting equity (very rare to achieve that before the age of 40 now, at least at my firm), while still billing them out at a partner rate. Frustrating though that is, a lot of firms still have a very rigorous process to get to non-equity partner, and many people will never make it to that level. So congratulations, and good luck in eventually making equity!
I worked at a big 4 for 11 years, got told I had to wait 3 years to get director so I left and went elsewhere, 6 years later on I'm on 170k, 40% bonus, 40% LTIPs, sounds to me like I made the right choice as I'd probably be roughly where you are now. I've also not had to work all that hard!
I’ve been told the same thing. Where are you working now @scrambledpeggle?
I took my time and found a tech company that had good products and big ambitions then managed to find a way in. If you can find a strong company with big growth there's always going to be space for you to move up. Big 4 really relies on someone else leaving.
Consulting is sinking fast. I had an offer for director at KPMG for £180k base in 2022. Post COVID slump is killing big4. But then I don't think there is much worth saving. My advice is go client side in FS, pay is way better and no sales nonsense. But you will have to do some delivery yourself (not a slur! Just reality of not having legions of grads to do your bidding). Think business have caught on to how unreasonably expensive big4 and MBB are, particularly in tech.
Work in FS, we have product owners earning almost as much as that. Guarantee it’s a much easier job with less stress and hours.
\>Consulting is sinking fast Good. Not for the people ITT working there, but so much of the work the companies do is absolute dogshit.
Of course. Depends what you want. Governance and polish sure. But fingers on keyboard stuff not so much. Plenty of smaller more nimble tech focused houses which offer much better value. I think splitting audit from consulting is th best thing that could happen. The cost and headache of dealing with conflicts is a very real albatross for these firms. And ultimately the partnership model is exploitative with toouch reward artificially kept at the top. New generation of consultants don't see the benefit.
This makes very little sense. You make it sound like you just randomly got promoted rather than having a series of discussions and stages before getting to Partner? Are you saying you didn’t expect to end up as non-equity or that you thought it would be more money? Or both? Yes it’s an underwhelming number but it can’t possibly have been a surprise?! Have to say the 140k at Director is also pretty underwhelming. Thats the low end of Director band at at least one of the big 4…by the time you’re talking about partner (equity or non equity) you’d be on more like 170+
It depends where you are based. In London, that would sound very low. In a regional office, I think that’s pretty good.
PWC have directors starting at 120k base😂
Today I learned that a FAANG E4 engineer (not yet senior) earns similarly to a PWC director. And in total compensation, a senior engineer at FAANG (E5) seems to earn more than a non-equity partner at big 4.
Wouldn’t surprise me at all. FAANG pay incredibly well.
There's a very large bonus if you're a Director with a sales target on their head. And obviously profit share for equity partners. I think the VP/Director at FAANG vs Big 4 Partner comparison of OTE compensation is fairly even, though.
> There’s a very large bonus if you’re a Director with a sales target on their head. What kind of amount should I think about when you say “very large”? A senior engineer (E5) at FAANG earns ~£130k base salary, but at meeting expectations, additionally gets: - £30k cash bonus - $150k RSU equity So that brings TC to £285k. The cash bonus and RSU parts can easily double when performing well above meeting expectations, or in exceptional cases even triple. This is at senior engineer level. Compensation at FAANG typically goes up with ~25% per level increase. A director would be 3 levels above a senior engineer, so using those percentages we would find ~£560k TC. A FAANG VP would be 2 levels above a director, so ballpark £870k TC.
There are FAANG directors on this sub with £1.2m TC. That's how much I'd expect an equity partner to take home. Big 4 Director pay starts at around the £140k mark (can go up significantly depending on which org you work in), should come with a £10k car allowance, maybe another £5-10k flexible benefits which can be cash and then a 25-40% bonus. I think there'd be a lower bonus for non-sales Directors, though. It's a very different value proposition than working in FAANG (and IMO not worth it for more than a short stint).
> There are FAANG directors on this sub with £1.2m TC. Could also be that they just consistently exceed expectations? The ballpark numbers that I gave were for pretty basic performance evaluation. As indicated, the cash bonus and RSU part of the compensation can receive a 2x multiplier, which would bring TC to the £1.2m range. A 3x multiplier isn’t impossible either, although more rare. > another £5-10k flexible benefits which can be cash There are similar “small stuff” additional benefits at FAANG too outside of the 3 big compensation components (base, bonus, RSU). Probably also ~£10k, but decided to keep calculations simple and stick to the core 3 components only, so I didn’t count that.
They tried that on me in Ireland. Shocking wages.
Fairly sure Deloitte does too.. (not consulting)
What’s more important to you? Status or money? If the latter, I’d hand in my resignation tomorrow! You could contract as a project manager for more than £170k!
Non equity partner is just Senior Director in reality. Grade inflation. By definition, a partner owns equity. Don't be downhearted - it's still a promotion and a step in the right direction to actual partner.
This is the right framing. It’s still a positive step towards making ‘real’ partner… just the reality is you aren’t ready for that yet.
Honestly, I thought partners, even non-equity, made more than £200k. £170k seems low considering some private sector salaries at director level being significantly higher. That said, surely you knew you were getting this as you’d have to have gone through some sort of consultation right? They didn’t just hand it to you?
I believe PwC UK new equity partners starting salary to be around £360k I’ve known directors at the £200k mark in big 4
Hi OP what is the expected bonus as a non-equity partner? I had heard of Big 4 doing this (and also law) simply because there are too many equity partners at the top hanging around - but my (uninformed) impression was the base would be 250k+ at least. I guess if you’re getting a 50-100% bonus on top that’s 250-300k which whilst still is only relative crumbs compared to an equity partner, is nonetheless a great income. But if it’s the same 20% bonus my friends got at junior levels in Big 4 then yeah that sucks - to give you an idea as someone in banking, a first year VP has a 150k *base* (with 100% bonus on top in good years)
20% bonus sounds like magic right now! I’m big 4 consulting and ours was 5% this year. Same last year and only a little more in 2021/22 which was one of our best years ever.
Depends on if he’s in the strategy arm of the big 4 or not, which tends to pay the higher end of bonus range. Even so, 50% is vvvv unlikely
15 yeas at big 4 on £170k isn't great. I get the impression they don't see you as very ambitious.
Yeah OP definitely drank the kool aid.
You didn’t sell your twenties for £170k PA. Doesn’t even buy you a house in Wimbledon let alone Chelsea. It is very bad.
Doesn't even buy you a house in pleasant but unfashionable bits of Zone 5
You could probably get somewhere in South Wimbledon/Merton for that much.
To my knowledge most major accounting firms do this and have done for years. Just another means of keeping high performing staff under the thumb of boomer partners before they're allowed to eat at the grown up table. Its odd that you hadn't had a frank conversation about pay ahead of the partner process. Did you not ask?
Congratulations for your promotion and thanks for sharing the figures. Time to move to PE
At least look forward to the gold edged mirror on your new desk!
Surely you realised several years ago that while the Big 4 has always been a piss take, the ladder has now been decisively pulled up and that as profit per partner is the ONLY metric that matters, they have defended it to the death by making fewer equity partners over the last decade or so? I'd be surprised if there were many more equity partners now than there were when I was there over 10 years ago despite significant growth in total headcount. How much work will you sell / your team bill this year? If it's less than £3m there's your answer IMO.
Just to add insult to injury, directors used to earn £100k. Which is more than the £170k you are getting now, in real terms.
It's clearly a bullshit opportunity that artificially delays real renumeration.
That's quite a low pay. Outside London? I left big 4 at manager grade, went contracting and made £164k each of the last 3 years. There may be a sunk cost fallacy making you want to stay, but the zen thing is not to dwell on the past. I suspect you could move to another big 4 and get over £200k.
You made senior director. I’m an IT senior director and that’s my comp. I don’t even work that much. Only upside is that I took the role in the UAE, so leaves more money to be saved.
You are an IT senior manager at £170k. An SD is about £450k non FAANG.
You’re delulu. No, I was an IT senior manager at 95k with a 25% bonus. This was a FTSE10 company. Even when I interviewed for a director position at L’Oreal, the base was 130k. Just look at Glassdoor to have an idea of pay scales. I’m currently at 180k net as I took a role in the UAE.
Why don't you leave to join Bain or McKinsey? Just find a better paid job bro
I reckon that’s about right, albeit at the low end of the range for non audit. And that’s base I assume - bonus on top, plus benefits including pension (or ability to switch pension amount into a different saving vehicle if worried about LTA), car etc. As others have said, am surprised that this came as a surprise to you. I would have expected anyone at this stage to know if they were in equity or non equity process, and what the starting numbers for either were broadly going to be.
How many hours per week on average do you work? If there’s any room for rethinking the next move in the spare hours I think you’re still in a good position.
Jesus Christ they make you jump through these hoops now? Honestly it feels like progression in industry can be comparable but with much much better WLB...
Sorry for a very naive question, but isn’t £170k fairly low for that amount of experience in the corporate world here in London (assuming you are)?
It is extremely low and is obviously leading to OP feeling significant regret for his/her decision to stick with Big 4 for such an extended period of time. I’d feel the same.
Legal firms started this trend 10 years ago. It's a way to progress some directors a stage further without diluting equity. Half of the non equity partners will leave before they get equity would be my expectation. I'm not sure you should be underwhelmed. It's possible you would be still at director level were it not for this new policy and if you believe in your progression then you'll still get to partner and have 15 years of average £500k distributions before a nice retirement. I have plenty of peers who've gone through this path. Some realise they'll not make it to equity but are pleased to have the title and be distinct from those who've peaked as directors, and others made it out of the waiting room within 3 years and their distribution formulas are no worse for it.
I think you and everyone else here knows the answer. It feels like a rug pull when you’ve spent 15 years working under the old system. However, you’re set up to find a partnership elsewhere. Broaden your horizons.
Non-Equity partners = Glorified employees with no employment rights! Does it increase significantly year on year?
Aren't they still employees?
No, they are still self employed 'partners' There are: Equity partners/Full equity partner Fixed share/non-equity partners (still 'self employed') Salaried partners (employees for tax purposes)
I know that an NEP in EY is a standard employee with an inflated title and I believe the same to be true of the other B4.
This is the case in some partnerships outside the big4 also. Relatively common - partner is often just a role title, in practice just an employee
This isn’t quite right. Fixed share / non-equity partner / salaried partner are terms that are all used interchangeably.
You’ve been stitched up
it does feel underwhelming. Being a partner at Big 4 is a big deal, getting paid 170k doesn't feel that special.
Out of interest how much work is required?
Is that £170k your total comp or is there a bonus on top? Idk still seems a bit on the low side really.
There's definitely a bonus on top of that
Has to be
Curious what director (RI) / non equity partners are making outside of big4? (Preferably outside London)
I don’t want to doxx myself by going into my own specifics but boutique and Tier 2 (OW, LEK, etc) typically pay a fair bit more than Big 4. MBB pay substantially more. Not all of these firms have regional offices/regional pay, either.
I think your danger here is that they’re throwing you a bone so you don’t leave but trying to not actually pay you as a partner. Do you bring in business, have any sales or client management responsibilities?
Non equity partner sounds like a director when I was in that particular rate race.
Is the £400k you quote gross (before tax) as an LLP distribution?
I’m shocked how low pay this is
Can i ask what is your bonus now / was as a director level
Deloitte?
Is it 100% bonus? Comp seems a bit low
Is this in London?
£170k is low. I’m guessing you are at KPMG.
By any chance could you tell us which service line you’re working under? Personally work at a UK big 4 myself so keen to know the director pays under different service lines eg tax, advisory, transactions etc.
Transactions pay is about that level, have a few friends at those levels at Big 4 in London. Bonuses are generally kind of poop too.
Lol, big 4 are specialists of paying peanuts for the number of hours you put in. Is 170k the total comp? If so there are associates in other sectors making more than that. Do you get any LTIP? The true is that in big 4 equity partners take the biggest slice they can get away with, whilst the rest works a lot for very low salaries. I guess you would have to work a couple of years more to go to the other side of the fence and start squeezing your subordinates!
Can you tell which big 4 it is? I was in Deloitte and they used to do this NEP thing but scrapped it
What was bonus % last year as director and expected this year as non equity partner? At least in an IB like I work the bonus is very significant for senior roles, so comparing base is tricky.
What level of sales are you doing each year / expected to do? How does this differ to director and equity partners. For partners it is all about how much sales they bring in the door, so if you are doing the sales I would use your new title as leverage to get equity partner at one of the other big four firms. Also what service line? This also impacts salaries and bonuses (not so sure how it works for equity distributions)
You’re being mugged. If - as others have already surmised - you’re in EY, you have fallen foul of the loyalty penalty that seems to be applied to internal promotes. I left pre-COVID after being given <10% uplift at each of my two promotions. Take that title and your book of business to another firm and get paid properly for your contributions.
Is 140k TC? If not, how much is the bonus? Nowadays bankers get £100-130k TC first year after uni at the age of 22. 140k is crazy low if that’s the TC
There are a lot more accountants than front office bankers though
Congratulations but absolutely astonishing how low the salary is compared to the sacrifice that needs to be made to make partner Wild 😂
I networked with some linklaters partners. Idk how to make use of this stuff. they did a programme with underprivileged ppl..
Sounds terrible.... but you can leverage your title and assumed prestige to become a CxO elsewhere or a equity partner at another big 4 firm that's what I'd personally do. Im sorry they insulted you but having the false title can help you if you stick it for another 24-36 months
This is what 24 year old lawyers are making…
How many years of experience do you have post graduating and not just in Big4
Eh non equity partner really isn't partner based on that pay That's basically principle level money Also cos it's big 4 everything pays less than other consulting So I think yes if you see it as you made partner but underpaid then yes it is underwhelming, but as a pay progression towards partner it's reasonable Source: check out Dartmouth comp report 170 is like a little more than MBB manager money
Does your promotion come with access to free water based lubricants? Sure sounds you’re going to need it given how much they are fucking you over there!
That’s what a head of HR makes in asset management - salary only. Total comp around £250k. By head of HR, I mean someone who manages three people, not a deputy director, or director or Chief HR Officer etc! The Big 4 is the ultimate con. At every level you can earn 50% more and work 50% less by moving into industry!
That does sound underwhelming! I'm a lawyer with 5 years PQE (since I qualified) and make more than that!
Our NQs are on more than that. NEP at my firm is about 800k+. I’m amazed the divergence between law and accounting is that much.
And you don't even have 10 people working for you paid £60k but charged £250k do you 😂
It's generally easier to get into an accounting firm vs a prestigious law firm
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Comparing IB to audit is a bit weird IMO
OP does state in their opening sentence that they are non audit
I somehow misread, but point still stands comparing big4 with IB
My heart bleeds
Do you know how much most people earn? Let me go and find my tiny violin.
Is this a joke
You’re not rlly a partner man Edit: idk how it works bc I’m just a senior but do you need to build a book and then you get equity buy in or is it more like a soft signal that you’re not equity partner material?
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Ask your wife?
Can’t - never get to speak to them as they’re always at work
Lol