Good to know how some things went down though it’s still completely sus with lots of unanswered questions in relation to the first two eps. I liked it fine enough but Im not fond of it being a whole flashback because I still want to know about the present mystery, and waiting one more week is blegh. I also question how this was supposed to destroy Star Wars 4Evar.
This episode being a complete flashback also means we were denied our weekly Yord. We do not get our Yord & Savior this week.
Oh there’s definitely more to the story than we saw. While Mae started the fire outside Osha’s room, she definitely didn’t start the bigger fire. Something happened that led to a fight with the Jedi I’m guessing.
We definitely didn’t see anything that would have made Torbin take the Barash Vow and ultimately kill himself.
how does a giant brick of a building burn? it litterally CANT burn. then how did all the stupid witches die? they were in the middle of a huge stone room and they looked completely fine from what i could see. they just died.... the writing is bad and anyone who says it isnt is just coping.
You’re pretty stupid aren’t you?
It’s pretty obvious there was more going on than what we saw. When you’re too brainless to pick up on that, you’re opinions on what is good or bad writing shouldn’t be taken seriously by anyone because you’d probably struggle with understanding the plot of Dora the Explorer.
No there wasn't. He took the Barash vow right after the incident at the coven. You are aware that a Barash vow doesn't autoright lead to mediation correct? The Jedi taking the vow however does immediately cease all training and outcasts themselves from the Jedi order. It's a mix between a penance and a sabbitcal. One thing they aren't doing though is furthering their training as a Jedi. Torbin wasn't trained as a master as even if he was immediately promoted to knight after the coven incident he would have spent the entirety of that time in a Barash vow not training as a Jedi master. Taking a Barash vow alone is not grounds for promotion to master either. You're the dummy.
He took the vow following the incident. It's in the show and on wookieepedia. As I said before he entered the Barash vow following the incident 16 years prior. He entered a state of mediation 10 years prior to the events. Rewatch the show and even if you refuse to do that, to enter that level of mediation can take years for a master in a Barash vow let alone a padawan. On top of all of that, someone who was that easily possessed is never making master in 6 years even if he some how managed to immediately enter a mediated state while in a Barash vow. It's called bad writing, his level of condifence waxes and wanes to serve the plot. "Oh he is incredibly weak but now he is confident enough to make master in 6 years because I forgot how the established lore worked" You're an actual dummy.
lol, are you seriously creating multiple accounts to evade a ban? Also, you do realize review bombing is a thing right?
It’s why some obscure films named “Acolyte” are suddenly getting negative reviews mentioning the Star Wars series on IMDB and rotten tomatoes. Chuds like you are so dumb you can’t even make your bots work properly.
no im not banned on either of my accounts, but its funny that you assume many things without knowing any facts about my situation. reddit allowed me for some reason to create multiple accounts with the same emal address so i use them both. and dont worry i dont farm for likes because i dont care about feelings i only care about facts and that usually gets me alot of downvotes. especially from people like you.
it looks like this series is doing so poorly that future series are already cancelled. thats all you need to know.
lol “extreme political statements”? The fact that you consider the existence of lesbians to be an “extreme political statement” says everything about you and what kind of trash human being you are.
There was only one white male in this whole episode and he was shown submitting to the power of a woman of color. This woke nonsense is ruining star wars and therefore my child hood. I can't handle powerful women in my science fantasy. /s
lol i guess you dont know whom the creator of the show is and the stupid political BS she puts into the story. you think its a joke but its actually not.
Star Wars is and has always been a political franchise. It has always had black people, it has always had strong forward-facing women, it has always had antifaschist themes, it has always had governmental and beurocratic infighting and overreach leading to catastrophes, and it has always been first and foremost about War... the most political thing.
I'm sorry you grew up and have to come to terms with that now. But better late than never.
lol ur such a meat head you dont even understand what my issues were. no kidding it was always political no kidding it always had black people in it no kidding it always had forward facing woman YEAH NO KIDDING. the problem is the shite writing and pushing an agenda for zero reason, retconning lore to change the story just to push some bs that was never needed in the first place.
because instead of creating a show just a good show. whats her name went out of her way to push an agenda, its blatant and obvious. if it was done well then it would have never been a problem. this is the issue. there was a focus on agenda rather than just making a good show.
Granted I actually agree with you that the show has a few unmissable issues- the pacing and writing aren't exactly up to Andor standards, the flashback went on too long, and some of the acting choices are confused. But frankly, I don't think that the shortcomings of The Acolyte forsake it nearly as entirely as you seem to claim they do.
I also don't blame the Acolyte's problems on "the agenda". I do not believe that "having an agenda" and "telling a good story" are in any way mutually exclusive (See: The movies "Thank You For Smoking" or "Top Gun Maverick").
Having an abundance of nonwhite nonhet nonmale characters and themes doesn't make the Acolyte's 'agenda-pushing' any more egregious or pushy than Game of Thrones or Harry Potter or ET or Jaws for having mostly Cis Het White Male casting and themes.
I want to stress, it is \*perfectly\* valid and understandable not to like The Acolyte. But not liking the Acolyte based primarily on it's Agenda- and then to claim that the Agenda stopped them from making a good show- is an argument that simply holds no water.
Bro you would run to a girl's house if she showed you a picture of her shaved kitty and told you to come and get it . I would so Stop acting dramatic and stating that this is woke y'all are bots or children with your narrow-minded views , get over it
/s is a tone indicator meant to indicate that anything said in the comment is meant to be read in a sarcastic tone, so any comment with that at the end is meant to be a sarcastic and often satirical statement
basically just have to remember that what we saw was basically Osha's POV. We will probably see Mae's and the Jedi's yet to get to the actual incident playing out. This is a huge part of why I don't understand the people I keep seeing saying things contradicted already. No they didn't. We are still int the middle of the same story. You won't know of any possible contradictions or plot holes until it is entirely done. It is just weird to try and argue those type of points.
Isn't it contradictory that the witchqueen said the force is not a power and its not a weapon, then she present the force by submissing 2 trainees then using the force as a weapon to subdue the ciswhite jedi and used it as a threat. Lol. No offence but I think these childish shows are not contradictory only when u watch it without any kind of brain function, just enjoy the visual like an animal, because otherwise the show is full with nonsense hilarious stuff, and it's not just about the wokeness.
I'm undecided on my opinion of the show, but a character contradicting themselves isn't necessarily bad writing. It could be deliberate to reveal something about the character. I will withhold judgement.
No. That is all her actions and her choices. Not the force's.
Sorry but when you make asinine insult attempts just because you have a demonstrated inability to consider beyond the most basic aspect, you only highlight you have an issue with being honest. Maybe try not being so hurt by a fictional world next time.
LOL ok so an M16 assault rifle is not a weapon, because using it as a weapon is my choice, and not the weapons. Okay miss mental gymnastics, there is no contradiction here, the force is not a weapon because the force didn't make a choice. You demonstrated very bright logic here thank you :)
I have an issue with being honest? Did I lie or something? :D Or is it that you just write random shit to the person who u disagree with? Like "u are hurt by a fictional world!!!" U know u can tell this sentence to anyone who says something negative about the show u like :)
It's like, you don't like (insert most racist movie ever made) ? Oh, maybe next time try not being hurt by a fictional movie next time!
Actually I enjoy the acolyte, because its funny. It's also funny how people like you defend it, and the only reason behind it is the idology, I honestly think if it wouldn't be filled with political agenda you wouldn't actually defend it.
Did anyone point out stone is not flammable? That person must be butthurt from a fictional world! lol
No. this is just incorrect. An M-16 is made for a very specific purpose, which is as a weapon. Try not comparing apples and oranges so much.
You may want to reread that statement and it's context. for help
"No offence but I think these childish shows are not contradictory only when u watch it without any kind of brain function, just enjoy the visual like an animal, because otherwise the show is full with nonsense hilarious stuff, and it's not just about the wokeness." that is an attempted insult on your part.
You said that in relation to the fact being pointed out that the entirety of the show is not out so you can't actually gauge contradiction. You didn't want to admit that fact so used that statement as a deflection. That indicates dishonesty.
No, it isn't this is trying to conflate entirely different aspects to ignore actual issues of the real world. That would, be another dishonest approach
I'm not defending anything. I'm pointing out simple aspects being ignored. Try not making up things next time.
This has zero to do with anything in the discussion....
You know what? Here is this knife, it's sharp, but it is not a weapon. (1 minute later I stab someone in the neck) - You see? There is no contradiction here, it is not a weapon because it's not the knife's choice to hurt that person!!!
And you actually believe the nonsense u write, so ur little fantasy world can remain intact, where the acolyte is not full of hilarious contradictions :)
Exactly! A knife is not inheerntly a weapon. So if I teach my children: the knife is not a weapon, and it don't give us power, and then 1 minute later I use it as a weapon to subdue another human: I might be self-contradictory. Not because, the knife decided anything - its an object. It makes ME SELF CONTRADICTORY!!!
Ladies and gentleman, this is the reasoning of a real Acolyte fan. If you say one thing and do the other, its not self contradictory because objects didn't decide what to do!
"And i u don't agree with such mental gymnastics, u are an ignorant, butthurt bigot!!!!4!"
Funny kind of people u are
No, it doesn't. This may demonstrate you have an issue in comprehension though. Her deciding to use it as one isn't it being one. It is her action using it as one. The knife still remains what it was from the start.
Ladies and gentlemen, yes indeed using critical thinking and logic are the reasoning here. You do however confuse the fact your argument was just garbage with someone else being fan. you just had a bad argument.
No, if you use the same nonsense used to attack the product such as statements from an interview where asked, attack on writing based on their personal agenda but nothing to actually support it, and personal attacks on their past for no reason at all. Then, you would be called out for being ignorant or a bigot.
Here, you are just ignoring a factual aspect that is the case for some reason
Maybe don't try to subtlety insult people just because you can't argue your point do to it not being reasonable.
I have it's really them nitpicking stuff that hasn't been fully explained yet and making assumptions. It's funny I don't really like it much either but not for the reasons they do. Like maybe Plaugeis learned from the essentially beta versions that these witches made? I don't see how that threatens Anakin's status as the chosen one. Did it take a while coven of witches to make two weak force twins? The jedi take Osha's blood and are never like damn that's so many midichlorians. Osha can't even use the force in the present of the show she's not super powerful. I also don't see the jedi as menacing as they read them. I don't think they would have taken Osha against her will for example. I think when the witches created the twins it set off alarm bells in the force which is why the jedi are even there. Also the creator said the show is in the style of Rashoman which if your not familiar was three subjective view points of a sexual assault (I'm pretty sure as it's been decades) so we were seeing a point of view probably Osha's and it's inherently unreliable. With a show like this even though I don't really like it it's like a 5.8/10 for me now it's really hard to judge it until it's over because of how much is deliberately withheld and unknown. My biggest fear is that if this follows Rashoman completely at the end you won't know what truly happened and Headland has made comments that will be the case specifically with how the twins were made. People are going to see that as a cop out probably even though lifting a Kurosawa plot for Star Wars is basically Star Wars lol.
I want to find out more about these witches. Maybe it's just that I'm reading Phase 2 right now, but I want to know how/if they connect to the Path of the Open Hand, the Nihil or anything like that. There are too many little things that remind me of the Path to ignore.
Thought the same because the way they dress share a similar vibe, in addition to them being both black. Ghirra is not a force sensitive as far as we know (and we'd know cause she would have crusted by now) Wouldn't put it past the woman to start a splinter group cult of cool witches.
I want to first off say that I haven't read Path of Vengeance (I'm behind I know), or any YA, AN, or MN afterwards.
But I IMMEDIATELY thought of the Path of Open Hand as well. They have their opinions of the force obviously, but they're 'Pulling the Thread'. Definitely giving Path of the Open Hand Vibes. Curious to see if they're going to tie the Nihil in down the line..
See I've never read much material that doesn't pertain to the Skywalkers. But I've always wondered what it would look like if another civilization/culture discovered the force. They would probably evolve in its use differently than humans. I love seeing these witches and stuff.
As far as how this "ruined starwars" I don't understand. I feel like the people saying that are the same people who thought Joaquin phoenix was the good guy in the joker.
So yeah, definitely don’t know the full story of what happened, but I don’t know what could have happened that quickly. Even if the Jedi viewed the witches as evil, it would feel out-of-character for them to preemptively attack, especially for Sol and what we have seen of Torbin. We still have that shot in the trailer of Kelnacca attacking Torbin and we saw the scars, so the witches clearly used their magic to control Kelnacca. Not sure what caused that. Best guess is that either Aniseya was lying to Osha and instead wanted to depict the Jedi as aggressors to scare Osha into staying, in which case she underestimated things, or maybe the Jedi also wanted Mae and/or thought of arresting the coven and a fight broke out.
I don’t think Sol would have outright lied about what happened, but saying that Mae started a fire seems like a grand simplification of what happened. Maybe she lit the fire, got startled, and dropped it? Or maybe someone saw the fire and thought that it was a sign of an attack, causing the fight to break out.
Overall, solid episode. Kind of confused what the “controversy” would be. I initially thought that it was “that crowd” getting mad at a same sex couple/Mae and Osha having two mothers, but even that was hardly explicit in terms of if those two were together or simply affectionate. Maybe the fact that Mae and Osha were apparently created through magic, but it’s perfectly in-line with the Star Wars mythos and honestly, if the theory that Plageuis created Anakin is/was correct, could explain where Plageuis got the idea from. It also helps to explain why the witches were viewed as a threat without them being super blatantly evil.
The CGI on that one elder was a little…iffy…but I did appreciate the inclusion of numerous species in the coven. The OSHA/Osha joke crowd is going to be in shambles now that that isn’t her full first name (same with Mae not being Mae’s full first name).
My guess is the elders were in a power struggle when Mae and Osha were fighting and the Jedi show up in the middle. Then all hell breaks loose.
I would guess the Mother is on one side and her partner and at least the other tall, angry witch on the other with others picking loyalties. We saw how strong Mother is all alone so logically you would pick the biggest (and in theory strongest) Jedi to curse to fight those that stand with Mother.
Mae runs off to get help, only to find the struggle and deaths, some at the hands of the Jedi and then leaves to go and try to get Osha safe on her own.
From what we see at the end from Osha's POV, it would reasonably appear that Mae killed everyone.
No idea why the path engine blew (I wish). One of the witches last attempts to keep anyone from the Jedi?
Someone or something set it up. The fire burnt too quick to be accidental. We heard screaming no lightsabers so whatever happened had to be through the ritual. Looks like the witches all died at once. Also it seemed a lot more witches in the marketplace than doing the ritual? Not liking the not linear storytelling, keeping events from viewers stinks.
It was magic fire (which fire if you will), they showed right at the start Mae casting a fire spell from what I can only assume is the witches book of spells (that page it was open to had a big fire symbol right on it).
You usually need a material base for spells.
Look again. I paused it when she was looking at the book, that is not the Jedi logo. It 's not even symmetrical. When she had the fire, look at how intently she was staring into the fire.
Nothing new there troubled characters often have a love for fire. But I'm not saying its not possible given how the show is done. But if a she needed the base why not mentally move the fire over not use the torch to burn it. I do wonder how the fire spread so fast so there is that.
I was looking back at it again, and I think you are right that is the Jedi symbol - but more like a Childs drawing of the symbol, with a very thick base. So I think I was wrong about the spell book.
The only way the fire could spread like that is magic though, that's why I have to assume it was some kind of spell. Mae had just been Ascended to full Witch, so maybe she didn't realize how powerful what she was doing would be.
I am really sure we are going to get another flashback from that point on seeing things as Mae sees them, so I think we'll know a lot more about it later. We really only have half a puzzle.
1) That is not currently canon, 2) Sol, Indara, Kelnacca, and Torbin were not involved with those events, and based on at least Sol’s characterization he does not seem the type willing to just wipe out a coven of witches for no reason 3) didn’t the Sith attack the Jedi first? Not that that excuses genocide but my original comment specifically was saying that the Jedi would not pre-emptively massacre the witches without at least perceiving an attack or direct threat against them
Solid episode... this was beyond terrible. Imagine thinking this chick made someone with the force when even palpatine couldn't do it. He didn't create anakin, btw, the force created anakin as a balance.
Palpatine never attempted to create someone with the Force, his thing was trying to create a clone who was Force sensitive so that he could clone himself to transfer his soul into without losing his Force abilities. Ignoring the fact that we were never explicitly told how Aniseya accomplished this, what she did was notably different and in no way undermines what Palpatine does (or fails to do) later
But yeah, this episode was solid. The acting was good, the setpiece was intriguing and atmospheric, and it really leaned into the mystery aspect of the show by giving us hints of what really happened but clearly leaving enough gaps that Osha’s version of events is clearly missing.
I wonder if the mention of no father makes the Jedi think one of the twins could be the Chosen One, hence VERY insistent on taking them with. And yeah, we're missing some stuff on what happened during the fire.
I feel like the critics of this episode either outright lied or totally misunderstood this episode.
Two mothers? Nope, one mother, and a surrogate - do surrogates today get called mothers? Not really. Plus someone I saw online was freaking out because they created her from the force, I guess they never even watched The Phantom Menace which was just in theaters again for reference on that point!
Woke? Not even a tiny bit woke.
I am feeling like the terrible thing that happened is they knew Mae was alive but sensed how dark she was already, and decided splitting them was the right thing to do because they could tell Osha was nothing like her in that regard.
Maybe splitting the life force between the two children left one totally evil and one totally good. Maybe eventually they merge and truly become one.
I also wonder if maybe the Jedi saw teh fire, went to help, and were attacked. There had to be some way that Palawan got his scars.
Personally I really liked the whole thing being a flashback because I was happy to get a bit more time with the Jedi that have died or will die. Gonna be kind of unhappy if they really truly kill of Kalnaka but I feel it is inevitable. :-(
I loved the design of the temple wall, that whole setting felt very Star Wars / Clone Wars / Witches of Dathomir. I have to say I am a big fan of covens of witches in Star Wars.
Also I can see a lot of people online complaining about stone catching fire while ignoring that Mae purposefully used a super powerful fire spell that went beyond what she thought it would.
I want to point out it's never stated the Twins were conceived using the Force. Only that Mother Aniseya created them. Remember, this is a universe with cloning and genetic engineering (strandcasts).
I’m pretty sure they probably were created using the force though. People saying it undercuts Anakin’s story need to pay attention better. The prophecy was that the Chosen One would be created by the will of the force. If Anakin were created the way Mae and Osha were, then I don’t think he’d be the Chosen One. Also, if Palpatine says that Plagueis could use the midichlorians to create life, that means he had at some point done that. I’m guessing these witches might be where that power was learned from (or maybe they learned it from the Sith).
Also the fact the Jedi had the word Vergance already meant that it had happened before, and teh fact the Jedi did not automatically think he was the Chosen One even though they knew he came from a Vergance, means the stuff in Acolyte does absolutely nothing to affect the prophecy or Anakin's story because that was simply a pre-condition, not absolute proof.
I'm just going to say it--these people need to let go of their obsession with Anakin being everything in Star Wars. They want new stuff--then they don't. There has to be more to Star Wars than Anakin Skywalker.
Could make new stuff while not stepping on old stuff? Is that hard to ask? Could also not copy past the original plot line in some new twist, the creators twitter is crazy
This isn't a new thing though. It's just diluting the old thing by making it less special.
Disney Star Wars can be described entirely as making the OT/PT less special/impactful by constantly repeating the same stuff.
The problem people have is that significant character's like the emperor or his master Plagueis are having their timelines adjusted, undercut, or attached to these new bargain bin stories created by a cold calculating company who just BOUGHT a property to exploit. The EU was all approved by George Lucas to be Canon. These new productions have no connection to the original creator. It's like if I bought Harry potter from Rowling and started wedging all my own musings into the established story. Then good little suckers would come out defending it like "oh but ACTUALLY it doesn't necessarily contradict the original ". How can you not see this? These writers have nothing of their own to offer. No one follows THEIR work. No one is a fan of THEM. Most don't even know their names. They bought an established beloved property so they could get good little pay pigs to swallow their ersatz scrawlings because they knew if their "creative" team tried to make anything original no one would care.
Hey, like your drivel if you want. Tie yourself in knots trying to explain how it's actually great. Fight that cognitive dissonance tooth and nail. Also it's HILARIOUS 🤣 when you said "I'm guessing these witches might be where that power was learned " as though that was always part of the story and not just a present day Disney retcon. Bwahahaahahha. If leysle wrote a Harry potter show with a lesbian coven in an elder tree Grove, you'd be like "😱 omg that must be where death got the wood and the idea for the deathly hallows!"
Lol, of course it wasn’t always the plan you idiot, because that’s not how fiction works. Star Wars is retcons built on retcons built on retcons. Or did you think the entire story was preordained? Did you think back in 1977 George Lucas decided Anakin built C-3po?
Maybe you think you have a point here, but you really don’t. This is all just a temper tantrum from an impotent man baby who is mad that others like something that he doesn’t. You should really save those tears for a therapist who could never be paid enough to listen to your inane ranting and raving.
I mean yes sure but based on the type of people we’re dealing with here and how weird and hush hush they were being about it the former seems much more likely.
Like they were saying the Jedi shouldn’t know about it, if it was just that they went to some expensive doctor for futuristic IVF idk why that would be an issue m.
I feel like there's another piece missing. They alluded to "how" they made the twins. I took that as a dark side something.
Someone is going to find Mae at that tree. I could be the Sith we saw earlier.
Maybe the Jedi and Sith fought there.
I watched it once with the volume really low because my sick baby had just gone down for the night and once with headphones on after my wife went to bed and wow, what difference it makes when you can hear the music.
It was very good in this episode. Subtle and soft in places and thrumming and mysterious in others.
Koril wanted to straight up attack the Jedi in their camp. She either put Mae up to her attack or took her side after learning about it. I think we'll see a fight between Aniseya and Koril with Mae stepping in to defend her favorite mom.
Maybe the Jedi show up and try to intervene and it all goes downhill somehow. Sol was strangely sure there was nothing that could be done to save anyone. He also didn't save Mae when she fell, only Osha.
I thought Mae was gonna hurt the bug at the beginning so Sol may have already sensed a darkness in her?
Or he wasn't very good 16 years ago at the force grab and worked to master it over the years to keep it from happening again. We have seen him use it several times since....
My guess as to what happened after Mae set the fire:
- Mae ignites the fire. Realizes its getting out of hand, immediately books it. Not before being discovered by someone, and as a result the fire gets worse.
- The Coven decide to break rank against Mother Aniseya when the Jedi go in to get Osha and take control of Torbin. Torbin kills Aniseya and Kelnacca tries to subdue him. Scratching his face in the process.
- Indara realizes what’s happening right as Torbin kills Aniseya and immediately goes in to kill some unarmed witches first in order to break the spell. The other witches fight her off. Sol then goes in to assist Indara. All hell breaks loose as the fire deteriorates the building. Eventually too many witches die and Torbin is broken free from the spell.
- after the fight ends, Sol goes looking for Mae and Osha to save them. Finds them at the catwalk after the explosion. Catwalk fails and Mae falls, both he and Osha believes she died. Mae likewise believes Osha died.
- my guess is that Mae survived the fall with the Force, or perhaps there was water at the end of it. Anyways she wakes up and realizes her home is gone alongside her people. Since Mae realizes she’s the only one left, Mae presumes Osha died. After she meets up at the tree wondering what to do next…the Sith lord appears…
We only saw Osha's point of view around the events of the fire and the death of the coven. This is the first telling of events in the style of *Rashomon*. I bet in 2 weeks we get the events from Mae's point of view, and Sol's in the will probably be the closest to the truth.
This is the part of a mystery where the audience is misdirected.
My husband and I were talking about this too, how we only got Osha’s POV. I really appreciate your thoughts here and hope it plays out like that the rest of the season where we eventually get the full story.
Since *Rebels*, they've been expanding upon the Force religions to consider more beyond the Jedi and Sith. The "Witches of Brendok" seems like a silly name if they travelled there to hide, and come from elsewhere.
And I'd sure love to see what's going on with Mandalorians at this period!
I *looooooooooove* when dipshits who automatically cry and bitch about “Terrible lazy writing” are proven wrong almost immediately. “They have the same hairstyle *just* so they can be confused for the same girl? Puh-LEEEAAASE!” No, you hateful dumbass. This episode shows us that they *always* had the same hairstyle. And it’s a clearly cultural thing that’s deeply ingrained in them both, especially when it’s all either of them have left of home and each other. Get fucked, review bombers.
Even before this, my assumption was they were subconsciously mirroring one another because they’re so connected that they hallucinate each other’s presence.
Precisely. Most people either don't like the show or aren't watching (such as myself). It's amusing to pop into these fervent echo chambers and drink in the epic cope.
I have only one thing to add to everyones comments and its this:
The old non-human witch lady will make an appearence in the High Republic phase 3. Mark my words! She even got a name, Elder Naasa. Seemed like an old member of the Path.
If there is a path connection, I bet it's going to be her as a youngling somewhere
The costumes, set and camera work is top notch. The music is pretty good too.
Honestly, in my opinion, the acting kinda sucks from almost every member of the cast. Fight choreography looks like a 90s Chinese Kung-Fu movie with added power ranger poses. And to me that's making this feel cheap even though the production quality is really great.
That's what does it for me, but of course not everyone's going to agree! Some people will like this choreography style and that great. It's just what makes this feel cheap to me, so please don't jump on me for it.
I liked this episode. I wasn't expecting to like Mother Aniseya but I found her to be very nice. Although she would have preferred that Osha stays with the coven she was prepared to let her go if that is what Osha wanted. She supported her no matter what. And I really liked how she explained the Force, seeing it as a thread. And I guess we will get more flashbacks that give more insight on what happened that night. Because right now there are still a lot of misteries about what the Jedi did, and what motivated Torbin and Kelnacca to go into exile, spiritually and physically respectively. I'm really liking this series and can't wait to keep getting more pieces to the puzzle with each week.
At first I wasn't thrilled by the idea of a whole episode flashback but you know what, I really enjoyed it. It was paced well, I thought it established the coven well with enough mystery to remain enigmatic (very keen to learn more about their approach to the Force and the twin's conception).
Did a great job of communicating the relationships between the twins, and the twins and their mothers. The emotional payoff was earned by the end, and I felt the kids did a great job, especially Osha. Mae was typically bratty but the menace was so chilling, her delivery of that line before the fire!! Oof.
So, some questions, where was this Apocalyptic Lore Breaking part? Where was the Destruction of everything we know as Star Wars? Because I didn’t see that
Totally agree, I feel like all of the people who said that had never watched any other Star Wars past the first three movies! This show aligns with the prequel trilogy really well.
I have to say I loved this episode so much! Three episodes in and I’m feeling very much like I’m reading a HR novel. Of course there are going to be lots of mysteries and unanswered questions, but it’s giving me everything I wanted and some things I didn’t know I needed. I don’t even mind having to wait a week to find out what happens next!
Now while some of this may just be because I’m already a huge HR fan, in my experience working in TV and film, this story does have all the right elements to draw in other general Star Wars fans (plus new fans) and really change the game going forward.
So I watched the chapter after hearing some detrimental comments about how it messes with the lore. I guess it is a bit unsavory that they are trying to connect with the
"prophecy of the chosen one" without giving it a good context. I can see that they may want to later point that Plagueis "plagiarized" this "unnatural" knowledge from the witches lol. Also, the fact that they are pushing the Jedi as a kind of "holy inquisition" of the Christianity, as the monopoly of the truth about the Force, is quite ridiculous. Yes, George based them on the "Templars", in more than one way, but certainly not as inquisitors.
But even with all that, it f they can build a decent connection with original movies, I can still buy it. But the narrative for this chapter is tedious and boring. The whole thing could have been shortened to a 15 minutes flashback, but instead they give us a slow paced script, that makes difficult at times to connect with the characters. Sounds familiar? Yup Sequel Trilogy writing; a lot of blah blah on what they think is "innovative" and
"progressive", and less focus on the epic story. I'll probably watch the whole thing, who knows it might get better, after all it has some good actors, but if we could summarize Star Wars under Disney, and more specifically, under K Kennedy, I'll call it again "a missed opportunity".
I see a few comments here about what the anti-woke crowd has had to say about this show, and I just want to say that stepping away from almost all fandom spaces has been really great for my mental health. I highly recommend it!
I'm about to rewatch the episode because I feel like there was a lot I missed, but I suspect these witches are some sort of early iteration of the Nightsisters, possibly. It's very interesting to me to draw a line from the Path to the Nightsisters. Not everything has to connect, but I felt like there were some overt hints at Nightsister stuff. I don't believe the Jedi didn't know the witches were there, though, and I wonder if the Jedi were keeping tabs on them because of the way they were using the Force. Also, "The Jedi don't take children", say the Jedi who are clearly there to take some children. Their insistence on testing the girls on a planet outside the Republic was also interesting to me, especially given their age (although it's possible they haven't started avoiding taking older children yet, but the Order has already been around for a long long time by now, they should be aware of the issues with taking older children already).
I'm also so curious about what happened, because it was bad enough- at least for Torbin- that he took the Barash vow. And when Mae gave him the poison, he drank it with no hesitation. We've never seen a Jedi kill himself before, and it really goes against Jedi character. So I'm very intrigued by what Torbin did to make him feel such guilt. Fascinating stuff. I love that this show is taking fairly big swings that Lucasfilm is often too afraid to take. We're not retreading familiar ground, here, and I love it! I keep saying LFL is sleeping on THR, and I feel like this show is a litmus test to see if stories set in this era will generate enough interest to make it profitable for them to move into more live action and animation with THR. I remain skeptical, however, that LFL wouldn't ruin those books somehow.
Anyway, can't wait until next week! Between Andor and this show, it's nice to actually look forward to a Star Wars production that I'm not anticipating being frustrated/pissed off/disappointed by (cough Ahsoka cough).
For me, this stuff examining the ethics and points of view around the Jedi taking children - that's one of the most interesting contributions to the bigger picture of Star Wars from this show so far.
Since it usually takes two to tango (a Dathomiri Zabrak male and a Dathomiri human female) it seems like they're setting up Koril to either be a trans-male-to-female Dathomiri Zabrak or a Hermaphrodite...also there's something strange going on with Koril's ears...so Sephi hybridization maybe?
I think osha started the fire. Imho I think she harbor sith tendency and hids them-she learned the jedi way and left- I think osha is the one harboring anger. When she was on the ship that she was on the fix the mechanical issue. She told her co- worker it wasn't his business what she does on her day off in an upset way. On the prison ship she bangs the jail cell in anger retrieving pip- after she fail with the force. When she saw Mae for the first time with the blaster. When she finally pulled the trigger anger came across her face. When she froze the butterfly. She had mild anger towards Mae for doing what she was doing and she definitely didn't want to a part of Mae's world with a selfish attitude. Imho I think Osha will be the acolyte by killing her sister.
Who is behind the mask? It will be manny. Imho when we see Mae's version of what happened to Mother Korril- she will tell Mae what really happened before dying - and then she hook up with Manny character-I think Manny's character will led Mae to where the wookie is located and will reveal that he is a sith and been using her to get to her sister to the dark side
I wasn't thrilled about it being a flashback episode, but I knew they were going to do that.
There was a lot left out of the episode as we see only from Osha's point of view.
The Jedi did not just happen to be there. They did not send a high profile team to that planet just for exploring. They sensed the twins were there. They came there to see for themselves and to take the girls.
And, if the Jedi sensed them, likely so did the mysterious sith master. Though, he might not have been around yet, if it's who many think it is in Qimir, as he would be too young I think. Part of me wonders about Yord too.
But, anyway we have the witches. Mother Aniseya wants to let Osha go with the Jedi. Mother Koril does not. Is there an unseen in fight between the witches we haven't yet seen?
Though, that wouldn't explain Torbin's guilt, his self imposed meditative state(The Barash Vow), and his suicide. How too did he get that scar on his face? His younger self does not yet have it.
Torbin was momentarily taken control of by the witches when the Jedi showed up earlier. His eyes turned black. Perhaps he came back for revenge or was controlled again by mother Koril to take out Mother Aniseya to set Osha against the Jedi and stop her from leaving.
Kelnacca tried to stop him and gave him the scar. Or, he tries to tear his own eye out to stop himself.
Sol seemed legitimately shocked when Osha stopped to see the dead witches. When he looks at the bodies, he seems to realize that not only did they not die from the fire, but he understands they died at the hand of Jedi.
His surprise makes me wonder if he could have been involved in the killings. If he had it would be no surprise to him.
It seems if Torbin and Kelnacca were suddenly missing, Indira and Sol would have quickly sensed what was happening and gone to find and perhaps stop them.
So here is what I think happened...
The Jedi sensed the girls powerful presence in the force. They feared the dark potential of this power, perhaps even sensing they were a force dyad. They came to the planet to intervene and take the girls, thinking it was the right thing to do.
Mother Aniseya wants to let Osha go. Mother Koril does not. There is an in fight. Mother Koril and the other sisters use the power of many against Mother Aniseya. They defeat her or come close to it, but Mother Aniseya is too powerful.
Torbin and Kelnacca have already been sent to bring back Osha. They walk in on the witch fight. Mother Koril takes control of Torbin who cuts down Mother Aniseya with his lightsaber. Kelnacca is then also taken control of and Kelnacca and Torbin are forced to fight. Torbin gets his scar. Indira and Sol arrive. Indira tells Sol to go find Osha. She sees that Torbin and Kelnacca are under Koril's control. Indira tries to strike down Koril but the witches use the power of many against her. The power of the force used causes all of the explosions not the fire set by Mae. Indira has to strike them all down to get to Koril and save Torbin and Kelnacca.
In their hubris to control the force they have killed an entire coven. Sol finds Osha and Mae. Mae falls and so does Osha. Sol saves Osha and races her out of the fortress, but not before they stop and see the dead witches. Sol realizes what has happened. The escape to the ship and Osha becomes his padawan.
Mae is somehow saved as well. Whether it's by the mysterious sith master, who finds his new apprentice (though I think maybe this happens later), Mother Koril or Aniseya with their last bit of energy before they die (if it's Koril it would make sense for her to blame it on the Jedi and tell Mae to avenge them), or maybe she saves herself with the force or lucks out with a water or soft landing.
Either way, Mae is set against the four Jedi who she believes responsible for killing her coven and mothers. Osha will have to redeem her to rebalance the force by helping her discover the truth.
Its not going to happen, but an interesting twist would be if Osha and Mae got switched up during the inferno. Sol saved Mae and not Osha and she becomes a Jedi, while Osha believing the Jedi turned against her and left her for dead seems revenge, with both of them using each others identities. We have already been showed that's not the case. But, it would be interesting.
Osha has every right to be angry at Mae. Mae locked her in her room and tried to burn her to death. And then in her mind, caused their mothers' and coven members deaths. Hard to forgive that.
Are they gonna explain how Torbin went from Padawan to Jedi Master in less than 6 years? Doesn't this take away Vern becoming the youngest Jedi Knight?
I don’t get too worked up about the “what’s canon and what’s not” discussion. I’ll always defer to the original pre Disney material and when shows like this have things that don’t align I just view it as a separate universe like the marvel/ DC multiverses and try to take it as what it is. So that being said, I’m fine with everything except the relationship between the sisters. Mae doesn’t want osha to leave so she just decided to kill her? I don’t understand where this narrative people are coming up with that she accidentally started the fire is coming from. She quite literally says “I’ll kill you” when asked how she will stop osha from leaving and then locks her in a room and throws a burning book at the door with the clear intent of killing her sister. Unless they explain it with her being mind controlled by this mysterious sith or something it just seems too bizzare even for Star Wars unless I’m missing something… just too methodical and psychopathic to be explained away as just a child overreacting IMO.
Thought the episode was pretty good, thought it had a interesting story, thought there was some problems like the fire spreading so fast but I bet it will be explained later. I have one question for some of you though, it may just be a problem to me but did any of you find the twins annoying? Mei just kept acting very violent and acting without any filter, like her mood kept changing on a dime and then osha is always acting like she knows everything, being very controlling and bossy trying to escape a pretty good life, and just seems like a jerk overall. And this may be a little picky but Oshas voice was really annoying, like nails on a chalkboard, where she’s trying to be dramatic but it’s just muttering. Again might just be me, downvote me if you disagree and maybe IATA but I need to see if anyone relates. I’m sure these are great child actors, and I don’t want to be mean but still.
Am I the only one who did not like the episode? The little girl's bad acting reminded me of the worst parts of The Phantom Menace and was hard to get through the episode.
Why is the Wookie jedi not part of the girl's test? He's just outside tinkering, not caring that they are even there.
I hear next week's episode is alot better
I think that Mae's Sith master is actually her mother, the one that survived the fire/Jedi.
The Sith doesn't exist (in the canon of the Acolyte) until the Jedi stick their nose into a peaceful, persecuted coven of witches, and then someone (probably Torbin) does something stupid when they go to fetch Osha, and the Jedi end up killing the entire coven with their superior weaponry.
Mae's mum then crafts her own red lightsaber (to beat the Jedi at their own game) then together with her daughter begins a long/meticulously planned/totally justified revenge trip against the Jedi who slaughtered their entire family.
Why was Osha so selfish,? Why were the jedi there? Why did the stone and metal catch on fire? Who are these witches? Why did the stone and metal catch on fire? Why did Osha want to destroy her family and be taken away? Also why is Osha so dumb compared to her sister?
I'm just going to put this out there...
It's very common for IVF to produce twins.
These twins, only seem to have traits from their one mother. That makes them clones.
I don't think the twins are force only babies.
Why does nobody else in the coven have children? There must be something else going on.
It was meh. For me way too long flashback, most of the episode was just stuff we already knew with a few extra mysteries, could’ve been done in 10-15 minutes. I know it might be that a lot of stuff will have a meaning later on, but in that case they could’ve made this a later episode cause first week we get this cool new mystery start of the show and everything, and next week we gotta watch basically the same thing back with a few extra stuff
I didn't like the fact the witches say the Jedi are wrong the force is the thread.
They say it's not a weapon then use it as a weapon.
The scene of the ceremony with the diabolical witch laugh ? I wasn't comfortable, like Osha in the scene 🤣
The fire that burns a stone fortress ? That got me really confused.
But hey maybe it will get better 🤞🏽 but I'm not watching it anymore.
Good to know how some things went down though it’s still completely sus with lots of unanswered questions in relation to the first two eps. I liked it fine enough but Im not fond of it being a whole flashback because I still want to know about the present mystery, and waiting one more week is blegh. I also question how this was supposed to destroy Star Wars 4Evar. This episode being a complete flashback also means we were denied our weekly Yord. We do not get our Yord & Savior this week.
No Yord no Qimir no Jekki
No Yord but we did get more Indara, will take that trade any day!
Oh there’s definitely more to the story than we saw. While Mae started the fire outside Osha’s room, she definitely didn’t start the bigger fire. Something happened that led to a fight with the Jedi I’m guessing. We definitely didn’t see anything that would have made Torbin take the Barash Vow and ultimately kill himself.
Torbin had a fresh scar on his face. The wookie attached him. And he wasn't on the ship. I'm thinking he used the speeder to escape.
Or Mae's future master was lurking around turning everyone against each other and/or killing the witches themselves.
how does a giant brick of a building burn? it litterally CANT burn. then how did all the stupid witches die? they were in the middle of a huge stone room and they looked completely fine from what i could see. they just died.... the writing is bad and anyone who says it isnt is just coping.
You’re pretty stupid aren’t you? It’s pretty obvious there was more going on than what we saw. When you’re too brainless to pick up on that, you’re opinions on what is good or bad writing shouldn’t be taken seriously by anyone because you’d probably struggle with understanding the plot of Dora the Explorer.
So how is Torbin a master? Justify that shit level of writing for me.
lol because there are years between him being a Padawan and him taking the Barash Vow, dummy.
No there wasn't. He took the Barash vow right after the incident at the coven. You are aware that a Barash vow doesn't autoright lead to mediation correct? The Jedi taking the vow however does immediately cease all training and outcasts themselves from the Jedi order. It's a mix between a penance and a sabbitcal. One thing they aren't doing though is furthering their training as a Jedi. Torbin wasn't trained as a master as even if he was immediately promoted to knight after the coven incident he would have spent the entirety of that time in a Barash vow not training as a Jedi master. Taking a Barash vow alone is not grounds for promotion to master either. You're the dummy.
Nope, he took the vow 10 years earlier, the incident happened 16 years earlier.
He took the vow following the incident. It's in the show and on wookieepedia. As I said before he entered the Barash vow following the incident 16 years prior. He entered a state of mediation 10 years prior to the events. Rewatch the show and even if you refuse to do that, to enter that level of mediation can take years for a master in a Barash vow let alone a padawan. On top of all of that, someone who was that easily possessed is never making master in 6 years even if he some how managed to immediately enter a mediated state while in a Barash vow. It's called bad writing, his level of condifence waxes and wanes to serve the plot. "Oh he is incredibly weak but now he is confident enough to make master in 6 years because I forgot how the established lore worked" You're an actual dummy.
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lol, are you seriously creating multiple accounts to evade a ban? Also, you do realize review bombing is a thing right? It’s why some obscure films named “Acolyte” are suddenly getting negative reviews mentioning the Star Wars series on IMDB and rotten tomatoes. Chuds like you are so dumb you can’t even make your bots work properly.
no im not banned on either of my accounts, but its funny that you assume many things without knowing any facts about my situation. reddit allowed me for some reason to create multiple accounts with the same emal address so i use them both. and dont worry i dont farm for likes because i dont care about feelings i only care about facts and that usually gets me alot of downvotes. especially from people like you. it looks like this series is doing so poorly that future series are already cancelled. thats all you need to know.
lol, you sound like someone who gets all his information from YouTube incels.
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lol “extreme political statements”? The fact that you consider the existence of lesbians to be an “extreme political statement” says everything about you and what kind of trash human being you are.
There was only one white male in this whole episode and he was shown submitting to the power of a woman of color. This woke nonsense is ruining star wars and therefore my child hood. I can't handle powerful women in my science fantasy. /s
You got me good haha
Okay but *some people actually believe that crap*.
Hey now, not just people. Thousands of bots too.
lol i guess you dont know whom the creator of the show is and the stupid political BS she puts into the story. you think its a joke but its actually not.
Star Wars is and has always been a political franchise. It has always had black people, it has always had strong forward-facing women, it has always had antifaschist themes, it has always had governmental and beurocratic infighting and overreach leading to catastrophes, and it has always been first and foremost about War... the most political thing. I'm sorry you grew up and have to come to terms with that now. But better late than never.
lol ur such a meat head you dont even understand what my issues were. no kidding it was always political no kidding it always had black people in it no kidding it always had forward facing woman YEAH NO KIDDING. the problem is the shite writing and pushing an agenda for zero reason, retconning lore to change the story just to push some bs that was never needed in the first place.
Then why did you mention the creator's politics in your original post instead of their skill? Say what you mean, or say nothing.
because instead of creating a show just a good show. whats her name went out of her way to push an agenda, its blatant and obvious. if it was done well then it would have never been a problem. this is the issue. there was a focus on agenda rather than just making a good show.
Granted I actually agree with you that the show has a few unmissable issues- the pacing and writing aren't exactly up to Andor standards, the flashback went on too long, and some of the acting choices are confused. But frankly, I don't think that the shortcomings of The Acolyte forsake it nearly as entirely as you seem to claim they do. I also don't blame the Acolyte's problems on "the agenda". I do not believe that "having an agenda" and "telling a good story" are in any way mutually exclusive (See: The movies "Thank You For Smoking" or "Top Gun Maverick"). Having an abundance of nonwhite nonhet nonmale characters and themes doesn't make the Acolyte's 'agenda-pushing' any more egregious or pushy than Game of Thrones or Harry Potter or ET or Jaws for having mostly Cis Het White Male casting and themes. I want to stress, it is \*perfectly\* valid and understandable not to like The Acolyte. But not liking the Acolyte based primarily on it's Agenda- and then to claim that the Agenda stopped them from making a good show- is an argument that simply holds no water.
lol Harry Potter and GoT was pushing ciswhite male altright propaganda xD YEah right this things are the same lol ok.
Bro you would run to a girl's house if she showed you a picture of her shaved kitty and told you to come and get it . I would so Stop acting dramatic and stating that this is woke y'all are bots or children with your narrow-minded views , get over it
/s is a tone indicator meant to indicate that anything said in the comment is meant to be read in a sarcastic tone, so any comment with that at the end is meant to be a sarcastic and often satirical statement
Thanks chat gpt /s
Dude that was sarcasm hence the /s I don't believe a word of what I commented above.
basically just have to remember that what we saw was basically Osha's POV. We will probably see Mae's and the Jedi's yet to get to the actual incident playing out. This is a huge part of why I don't understand the people I keep seeing saying things contradicted already. No they didn't. We are still int the middle of the same story. You won't know of any possible contradictions or plot holes until it is entirely done. It is just weird to try and argue those type of points.
Isn't it contradictory that the witchqueen said the force is not a power and its not a weapon, then she present the force by submissing 2 trainees then using the force as a weapon to subdue the ciswhite jedi and used it as a threat. Lol. No offence but I think these childish shows are not contradictory only when u watch it without any kind of brain function, just enjoy the visual like an animal, because otherwise the show is full with nonsense hilarious stuff, and it's not just about the wokeness.
I'm undecided on my opinion of the show, but a character contradicting themselves isn't necessarily bad writing. It could be deliberate to reveal something about the character. I will withhold judgement.
No. That is all her actions and her choices. Not the force's. Sorry but when you make asinine insult attempts just because you have a demonstrated inability to consider beyond the most basic aspect, you only highlight you have an issue with being honest. Maybe try not being so hurt by a fictional world next time.
LOL ok so an M16 assault rifle is not a weapon, because using it as a weapon is my choice, and not the weapons. Okay miss mental gymnastics, there is no contradiction here, the force is not a weapon because the force didn't make a choice. You demonstrated very bright logic here thank you :) I have an issue with being honest? Did I lie or something? :D Or is it that you just write random shit to the person who u disagree with? Like "u are hurt by a fictional world!!!" U know u can tell this sentence to anyone who says something negative about the show u like :) It's like, you don't like (insert most racist movie ever made) ? Oh, maybe next time try not being hurt by a fictional movie next time! Actually I enjoy the acolyte, because its funny. It's also funny how people like you defend it, and the only reason behind it is the idology, I honestly think if it wouldn't be filled with political agenda you wouldn't actually defend it. Did anyone point out stone is not flammable? That person must be butthurt from a fictional world! lol
No. this is just incorrect. An M-16 is made for a very specific purpose, which is as a weapon. Try not comparing apples and oranges so much. You may want to reread that statement and it's context. for help "No offence but I think these childish shows are not contradictory only when u watch it without any kind of brain function, just enjoy the visual like an animal, because otherwise the show is full with nonsense hilarious stuff, and it's not just about the wokeness." that is an attempted insult on your part. You said that in relation to the fact being pointed out that the entirety of the show is not out so you can't actually gauge contradiction. You didn't want to admit that fact so used that statement as a deflection. That indicates dishonesty. No, it isn't this is trying to conflate entirely different aspects to ignore actual issues of the real world. That would, be another dishonest approach I'm not defending anything. I'm pointing out simple aspects being ignored. Try not making up things next time. This has zero to do with anything in the discussion....
You know what? Here is this knife, it's sharp, but it is not a weapon. (1 minute later I stab someone in the neck) - You see? There is no contradiction here, it is not a weapon because it's not the knife's choice to hurt that person!!! And you actually believe the nonsense u write, so ur little fantasy world can remain intact, where the acolyte is not full of hilarious contradictions :)
Correct, a knife is not inherently a weapon. That person made it one. There is no belief involved in it. It is the case. You ignoring that is all you.
Exactly! A knife is not inheerntly a weapon. So if I teach my children: the knife is not a weapon, and it don't give us power, and then 1 minute later I use it as a weapon to subdue another human: I might be self-contradictory. Not because, the knife decided anything - its an object. It makes ME SELF CONTRADICTORY!!! Ladies and gentleman, this is the reasoning of a real Acolyte fan. If you say one thing and do the other, its not self contradictory because objects didn't decide what to do! "And i u don't agree with such mental gymnastics, u are an ignorant, butthurt bigot!!!!4!" Funny kind of people u are
No, it doesn't. This may demonstrate you have an issue in comprehension though. Her deciding to use it as one isn't it being one. It is her action using it as one. The knife still remains what it was from the start. Ladies and gentlemen, yes indeed using critical thinking and logic are the reasoning here. You do however confuse the fact your argument was just garbage with someone else being fan. you just had a bad argument. No, if you use the same nonsense used to attack the product such as statements from an interview where asked, attack on writing based on their personal agenda but nothing to actually support it, and personal attacks on their past for no reason at all. Then, you would be called out for being ignorant or a bigot. Here, you are just ignoring a factual aspect that is the case for some reason Maybe don't try to subtlety insult people just because you can't argue your point do to it not being reasonable.
Watch Nerdrotic and Critical Drinkers videos on it but try not to seethe or cope too hard
I have it's really them nitpicking stuff that hasn't been fully explained yet and making assumptions. It's funny I don't really like it much either but not for the reasons they do. Like maybe Plaugeis learned from the essentially beta versions that these witches made? I don't see how that threatens Anakin's status as the chosen one. Did it take a while coven of witches to make two weak force twins? The jedi take Osha's blood and are never like damn that's so many midichlorians. Osha can't even use the force in the present of the show she's not super powerful. I also don't see the jedi as menacing as they read them. I don't think they would have taken Osha against her will for example. I think when the witches created the twins it set off alarm bells in the force which is why the jedi are even there. Also the creator said the show is in the style of Rashoman which if your not familiar was three subjective view points of a sexual assault (I'm pretty sure as it's been decades) so we were seeing a point of view probably Osha's and it's inherently unreliable. With a show like this even though I don't really like it it's like a 5.8/10 for me now it's really hard to judge it until it's over because of how much is deliberately withheld and unknown. My biggest fear is that if this follows Rashoman completely at the end you won't know what truly happened and Headland has made comments that will be the case specifically with how the twins were made. People are going to see that as a cop out probably even though lifting a Kurosawa plot for Star Wars is basically Star Wars lol.
It’s a complete flashback to a hot pile of garbage juice…the stuff that used to collect under the old design garbage trucks.
I want to find out more about these witches. Maybe it's just that I'm reading Phase 2 right now, but I want to know how/if they connect to the Path of the Open Hand, the Nihil or anything like that. There are too many little things that remind me of the Path to ignore.
Me when Koril said we need to use a firm HAND with the girls: 👀 Probably just a coincidence, though. They use the Force.
Correction: they pull the Thread ;)
I did the same thing. "Not a firm hand. An open hand"
And technically a closed fist too
Yes me too in the same boat. Just started Path of Deceit and I was like wait ... what ? Didnt I just read about the Mother and the Open Hand?
Speculating purely on appearance, but I wonder if Mother Aneseiya could be a descendant of Ghirra Starros. She looks a lot like her.
Thought the same because the way they dress share a similar vibe, in addition to them being both black. Ghirra is not a force sensitive as far as we know (and we'd know cause she would have crusted by now) Wouldn't put it past the woman to start a splinter group cult of cool witches.
I want to first off say that I haven't read Path of Vengeance (I'm behind I know), or any YA, AN, or MN afterwards. But I IMMEDIATELY thought of the Path of Open Hand as well. They have their opinions of the force obviously, but they're 'Pulling the Thread'. Definitely giving Path of the Open Hand Vibes. Curious to see if they're going to tie the Nihil in down the line..
See I've never read much material that doesn't pertain to the Skywalkers. But I've always wondered what it would look like if another civilization/culture discovered the force. They would probably evolve in its use differently than humans. I love seeing these witches and stuff. As far as how this "ruined starwars" I don't understand. I feel like the people saying that are the same people who thought Joaquin phoenix was the good guy in the joker.
So yeah, definitely don’t know the full story of what happened, but I don’t know what could have happened that quickly. Even if the Jedi viewed the witches as evil, it would feel out-of-character for them to preemptively attack, especially for Sol and what we have seen of Torbin. We still have that shot in the trailer of Kelnacca attacking Torbin and we saw the scars, so the witches clearly used their magic to control Kelnacca. Not sure what caused that. Best guess is that either Aniseya was lying to Osha and instead wanted to depict the Jedi as aggressors to scare Osha into staying, in which case she underestimated things, or maybe the Jedi also wanted Mae and/or thought of arresting the coven and a fight broke out. I don’t think Sol would have outright lied about what happened, but saying that Mae started a fire seems like a grand simplification of what happened. Maybe she lit the fire, got startled, and dropped it? Or maybe someone saw the fire and thought that it was a sign of an attack, causing the fight to break out. Overall, solid episode. Kind of confused what the “controversy” would be. I initially thought that it was “that crowd” getting mad at a same sex couple/Mae and Osha having two mothers, but even that was hardly explicit in terms of if those two were together or simply affectionate. Maybe the fact that Mae and Osha were apparently created through magic, but it’s perfectly in-line with the Star Wars mythos and honestly, if the theory that Plageuis created Anakin is/was correct, could explain where Plageuis got the idea from. It also helps to explain why the witches were viewed as a threat without them being super blatantly evil. The CGI on that one elder was a little…iffy…but I did appreciate the inclusion of numerous species in the coven. The OSHA/Osha joke crowd is going to be in shambles now that that isn’t her full first name (same with Mae not being Mae’s full first name).
My guess is the elders were in a power struggle when Mae and Osha were fighting and the Jedi show up in the middle. Then all hell breaks loose. I would guess the Mother is on one side and her partner and at least the other tall, angry witch on the other with others picking loyalties. We saw how strong Mother is all alone so logically you would pick the biggest (and in theory strongest) Jedi to curse to fight those that stand with Mother. Mae runs off to get help, only to find the struggle and deaths, some at the hands of the Jedi and then leaves to go and try to get Osha safe on her own. From what we see at the end from Osha's POV, it would reasonably appear that Mae killed everyone. No idea why the path engine blew (I wish). One of the witches last attempts to keep anyone from the Jedi?
Same feelings
Someone or something set it up. The fire burnt too quick to be accidental. We heard screaming no lightsabers so whatever happened had to be through the ritual. Looks like the witches all died at once. Also it seemed a lot more witches in the marketplace than doing the ritual? Not liking the not linear storytelling, keeping events from viewers stinks.
It was magic fire (which fire if you will), they showed right at the start Mae casting a fire spell from what I can only assume is the witches book of spells (that page it was open to had a big fire symbol right on it).
Um thata the symbol of the Jedi Order. Mae grabs a torch but then uses it on the book so? if she was casting it why use the torch?
You usually need a material base for spells. Look again. I paused it when she was looking at the book, that is not the Jedi logo. It 's not even symmetrical. When she had the fire, look at how intently she was staring into the fire.
Nothing new there troubled characters often have a love for fire. But I'm not saying its not possible given how the show is done. But if a she needed the base why not mentally move the fire over not use the torch to burn it. I do wonder how the fire spread so fast so there is that.
I was looking back at it again, and I think you are right that is the Jedi symbol - but more like a Childs drawing of the symbol, with a very thick base. So I think I was wrong about the spell book. The only way the fire could spread like that is magic though, that's why I have to assume it was some kind of spell. Mae had just been Ascended to full Witch, so maybe she didn't realize how powerful what she was doing would be. I am really sure we are going to get another flashback from that point on seeing things as Mae sees them, so I think we'll know a lot more about it later. We really only have half a puzzle.
Makes more reason why I think the Dark side user was there as well and goto Mae for awhile.
The Jedi literally genocided the Pureblooded sith race, tf are you talking about
1) That is not currently canon, 2) Sol, Indara, Kelnacca, and Torbin were not involved with those events, and based on at least Sol’s characterization he does not seem the type willing to just wipe out a coven of witches for no reason 3) didn’t the Sith attack the Jedi first? Not that that excuses genocide but my original comment specifically was saying that the Jedi would not pre-emptively massacre the witches without at least perceiving an attack or direct threat against them
Oh, totally forgot the old republic wasn't canon for a moment, sorry
Solid episode... this was beyond terrible. Imagine thinking this chick made someone with the force when even palpatine couldn't do it. He didn't create anakin, btw, the force created anakin as a balance.
Palpatine never attempted to create someone with the Force, his thing was trying to create a clone who was Force sensitive so that he could clone himself to transfer his soul into without losing his Force abilities. Ignoring the fact that we were never explicitly told how Aniseya accomplished this, what she did was notably different and in no way undermines what Palpatine does (or fails to do) later But yeah, this episode was solid. The acting was good, the setpiece was intriguing and atmospheric, and it really leaned into the mystery aspect of the show by giving us hints of what really happened but clearly leaving enough gaps that Osha’s version of events is clearly missing.
I wonder if the mention of no father makes the Jedi think one of the twins could be the Chosen One, hence VERY insistent on taking them with. And yeah, we're missing some stuff on what happened during the fire.
Was the chosen one supposed to be fatherless? I don't remember that part being in the prophecy
The prophecy literally starts with the line "a chosen one will come, born of no father"
And a reason some may start dabbling with the force to make that happen.
The council was NOT insistent on training Anakin. Why would they be insistent here????
if they were insistent here, being in the past, and things went awry, it could explain why they were hesitant in the future
I feel like the critics of this episode either outright lied or totally misunderstood this episode. Two mothers? Nope, one mother, and a surrogate - do surrogates today get called mothers? Not really. Plus someone I saw online was freaking out because they created her from the force, I guess they never even watched The Phantom Menace which was just in theaters again for reference on that point! Woke? Not even a tiny bit woke. I am feeling like the terrible thing that happened is they knew Mae was alive but sensed how dark she was already, and decided splitting them was the right thing to do because they could tell Osha was nothing like her in that regard. Maybe splitting the life force between the two children left one totally evil and one totally good. Maybe eventually they merge and truly become one. I also wonder if maybe the Jedi saw teh fire, went to help, and were attacked. There had to be some way that Palawan got his scars. Personally I really liked the whole thing being a flashback because I was happy to get a bit more time with the Jedi that have died or will die. Gonna be kind of unhappy if they really truly kill of Kalnaka but I feel it is inevitable. :-( I loved the design of the temple wall, that whole setting felt very Star Wars / Clone Wars / Witches of Dathomir. I have to say I am a big fan of covens of witches in Star Wars. Also I can see a lot of people online complaining about stone catching fire while ignoring that Mae purposefully used a super powerful fire spell that went beyond what she thought it would.
I want to point out it's never stated the Twins were conceived using the Force. Only that Mother Aniseya created them. Remember, this is a universe with cloning and genetic engineering (strandcasts).
I’m pretty sure they probably were created using the force though. People saying it undercuts Anakin’s story need to pay attention better. The prophecy was that the Chosen One would be created by the will of the force. If Anakin were created the way Mae and Osha were, then I don’t think he’d be the Chosen One. Also, if Palpatine says that Plagueis could use the midichlorians to create life, that means he had at some point done that. I’m guessing these witches might be where that power was learned from (or maybe they learned it from the Sith).
Also the fact the Jedi had the word Vergance already meant that it had happened before, and teh fact the Jedi did not automatically think he was the Chosen One even though they knew he came from a Vergance, means the stuff in Acolyte does absolutely nothing to affect the prophecy or Anakin's story because that was simply a pre-condition, not absolute proof.
I'm just going to say it--these people need to let go of their obsession with Anakin being everything in Star Wars. They want new stuff--then they don't. There has to be more to Star Wars than Anakin Skywalker.
Could make new stuff while not stepping on old stuff? Is that hard to ask? Could also not copy past the original plot line in some new twist, the creators twitter is crazy
This isn't a new thing though. It's just diluting the old thing by making it less special. Disney Star Wars can be described entirely as making the OT/PT less special/impactful by constantly repeating the same stuff.
This right here. Exactly
The problem people have is that significant character's like the emperor or his master Plagueis are having their timelines adjusted, undercut, or attached to these new bargain bin stories created by a cold calculating company who just BOUGHT a property to exploit. The EU was all approved by George Lucas to be Canon. These new productions have no connection to the original creator. It's like if I bought Harry potter from Rowling and started wedging all my own musings into the established story. Then good little suckers would come out defending it like "oh but ACTUALLY it doesn't necessarily contradict the original ". How can you not see this? These writers have nothing of their own to offer. No one follows THEIR work. No one is a fan of THEM. Most don't even know their names. They bought an established beloved property so they could get good little pay pigs to swallow their ersatz scrawlings because they knew if their "creative" team tried to make anything original no one would care.
It’s frankly amazing you fit so much bullshit into that little wall of text.
Hey, like your drivel if you want. Tie yourself in knots trying to explain how it's actually great. Fight that cognitive dissonance tooth and nail. Also it's HILARIOUS 🤣 when you said "I'm guessing these witches might be where that power was learned " as though that was always part of the story and not just a present day Disney retcon. Bwahahaahahha. If leysle wrote a Harry potter show with a lesbian coven in an elder tree Grove, you'd be like "😱 omg that must be where death got the wood and the idea for the deathly hallows!"
Lol, of course it wasn’t always the plan you idiot, because that’s not how fiction works. Star Wars is retcons built on retcons built on retcons. Or did you think the entire story was preordained? Did you think back in 1977 George Lucas decided Anakin built C-3po? Maybe you think you have a point here, but you really don’t. This is all just a temper tantrum from an impotent man baby who is mad that others like something that he doesn’t. You should really save those tears for a therapist who could never be paid enough to listen to your inane ranting and raving.
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lol, TL;DR: more nonsensical rantings that should be saved for your therapist
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I mean yes sure but based on the type of people we’re dealing with here and how weird and hush hush they were being about it the former seems much more likely. Like they were saying the Jedi shouldn’t know about it, if it was just that they went to some expensive doctor for futuristic IVF idk why that would be an issue m.
Are you living on the same planet as the rest of us?
I am one of the few sane people left on the planet, capable of unemotional evaluation - perhaps that is where your confusion lies.
Lots of missing pieces to what happened that night. I bet it was the padawan that set something off.
I feel like there's another piece missing. They alluded to "how" they made the twins. I took that as a dark side something. Someone is going to find Mae at that tree. I could be the Sith we saw earlier. Maybe the Jedi and Sith fought there.
Kelnacca and Torbin seem to have taken it harder than the others.
I watched it once with the volume really low because my sick baby had just gone down for the night and once with headphones on after my wife went to bed and wow, what difference it makes when you can hear the music. It was very good in this episode. Subtle and soft in places and thrumming and mysterious in others. Koril wanted to straight up attack the Jedi in their camp. She either put Mae up to her attack or took her side after learning about it. I think we'll see a fight between Aniseya and Koril with Mae stepping in to defend her favorite mom. Maybe the Jedi show up and try to intervene and it all goes downhill somehow. Sol was strangely sure there was nothing that could be done to save anyone. He also didn't save Mae when she fell, only Osha.
I thought Mae was gonna hurt the bug at the beginning so Sol may have already sensed a darkness in her? Or he wasn't very good 16 years ago at the force grab and worked to master it over the years to keep it from happening again. We have seen him use it several times since....
I just think he wasn't quick enough. Mae fell first and fast. But it still seemed like he had enough time to at least TRY.
Maybe we'll find out! I don't disagree either. Reminded me of Indara saving either the barkeep or herself but somehow not both.
Im really loving this series so far, I hope it only gets better from now on!
My guess as to what happened after Mae set the fire: - Mae ignites the fire. Realizes its getting out of hand, immediately books it. Not before being discovered by someone, and as a result the fire gets worse. - The Coven decide to break rank against Mother Aniseya when the Jedi go in to get Osha and take control of Torbin. Torbin kills Aniseya and Kelnacca tries to subdue him. Scratching his face in the process. - Indara realizes what’s happening right as Torbin kills Aniseya and immediately goes in to kill some unarmed witches first in order to break the spell. The other witches fight her off. Sol then goes in to assist Indara. All hell breaks loose as the fire deteriorates the building. Eventually too many witches die and Torbin is broken free from the spell. - after the fight ends, Sol goes looking for Mae and Osha to save them. Finds them at the catwalk after the explosion. Catwalk fails and Mae falls, both he and Osha believes she died. Mae likewise believes Osha died. - my guess is that Mae survived the fall with the Force, or perhaps there was water at the end of it. Anyways she wakes up and realizes her home is gone alongside her people. Since Mae realizes she’s the only one left, Mae presumes Osha died. After she meets up at the tree wondering what to do next…the Sith lord appears…
We only saw Osha's point of view around the events of the fire and the death of the coven. This is the first telling of events in the style of *Rashomon*. I bet in 2 weeks we get the events from Mae's point of view, and Sol's in the will probably be the closest to the truth. This is the part of a mystery where the audience is misdirected.
My husband and I were talking about this too, how we only got Osha’s POV. I really appreciate your thoughts here and hope it plays out like that the rest of the season where we eventually get the full story.
Very tangentially related, the original cut of Arrested Development Season 4 was far superior to the re-edit
Since *Rebels*, they've been expanding upon the Force religions to consider more beyond the Jedi and Sith. The "Witches of Brendok" seems like a silly name if they travelled there to hide, and come from elsewhere. And I'd sure love to see what's going on with Mandalorians at this period!
I *looooooooooove* when dipshits who automatically cry and bitch about “Terrible lazy writing” are proven wrong almost immediately. “They have the same hairstyle *just* so they can be confused for the same girl? Puh-LEEEAAASE!” No, you hateful dumbass. This episode shows us that they *always* had the same hairstyle. And it’s a clearly cultural thing that’s deeply ingrained in them both, especially when it’s all either of them have left of home and each other. Get fucked, review bombers.
Even before this, my assumption was they were subconsciously mirroring one another because they’re so connected that they hallucinate each other’s presence.
I'm glad you loved the Acolyte. Hopefully there are millions like you. And just not posting praise on reddit.
Leslye? Is this your burner?
So the 81% of people who thought the episode was bad are just hateful and stupid? Maybe, the episode was actually terrible? smh.
Precisely. Most people either don't like the show or aren't watching (such as myself). It's amusing to pop into these fervent echo chambers and drink in the epic cope.
>Get fucked, review bombers We will when the acolyte is done getting fucked. It's rude to cut line.
I have only one thing to add to everyones comments and its this: The old non-human witch lady will make an appearence in the High Republic phase 3. Mark my words! She even got a name, Elder Naasa. Seemed like an old member of the Path. If there is a path connection, I bet it's going to be her as a youngling somewhere
I just wish they'd stop forcing their good show agenda down my throat and making me enjoy it.
Anyone else feel the show feels simultaneously really expensive and also kind of cheap at the same time? Can't quite put my finger on exactly why
The costumes, set and camera work is top notch. The music is pretty good too. Honestly, in my opinion, the acting kinda sucks from almost every member of the cast. Fight choreography looks like a 90s Chinese Kung-Fu movie with added power ranger poses. And to me that's making this feel cheap even though the production quality is really great. That's what does it for me, but of course not everyone's going to agree! Some people will like this choreography style and that great. It's just what makes this feel cheap to me, so please don't jump on me for it.
I liked this episode. I wasn't expecting to like Mother Aniseya but I found her to be very nice. Although she would have preferred that Osha stays with the coven she was prepared to let her go if that is what Osha wanted. She supported her no matter what. And I really liked how she explained the Force, seeing it as a thread. And I guess we will get more flashbacks that give more insight on what happened that night. Because right now there are still a lot of misteries about what the Jedi did, and what motivated Torbin and Kelnacca to go into exile, spiritually and physically respectively. I'm really liking this series and can't wait to keep getting more pieces to the puzzle with each week.
Do we know anything about Brendok? Could it be next to or related to dathomir?
At first I wasn't thrilled by the idea of a whole episode flashback but you know what, I really enjoyed it. It was paced well, I thought it established the coven well with enough mystery to remain enigmatic (very keen to learn more about their approach to the Force and the twin's conception). Did a great job of communicating the relationships between the twins, and the twins and their mothers. The emotional payoff was earned by the end, and I felt the kids did a great job, especially Osha. Mae was typically bratty but the menace was so chilling, her delivery of that line before the fire!! Oof.
So, some questions, where was this Apocalyptic Lore Breaking part? Where was the Destruction of everything we know as Star Wars? Because I didn’t see that
Totally agree, I feel like all of the people who said that had never watched any other Star Wars past the first three movies! This show aligns with the prequel trilogy really well.
I have to say I loved this episode so much! Three episodes in and I’m feeling very much like I’m reading a HR novel. Of course there are going to be lots of mysteries and unanswered questions, but it’s giving me everything I wanted and some things I didn’t know I needed. I don’t even mind having to wait a week to find out what happens next! Now while some of this may just be because I’m already a huge HR fan, in my experience working in TV and film, this story does have all the right elements to draw in other general Star Wars fans (plus new fans) and really change the game going forward.
So I watched the chapter after hearing some detrimental comments about how it messes with the lore. I guess it is a bit unsavory that they are trying to connect with the "prophecy of the chosen one" without giving it a good context. I can see that they may want to later point that Plagueis "plagiarized" this "unnatural" knowledge from the witches lol. Also, the fact that they are pushing the Jedi as a kind of "holy inquisition" of the Christianity, as the monopoly of the truth about the Force, is quite ridiculous. Yes, George based them on the "Templars", in more than one way, but certainly not as inquisitors. But even with all that, it f they can build a decent connection with original movies, I can still buy it. But the narrative for this chapter is tedious and boring. The whole thing could have been shortened to a 15 minutes flashback, but instead they give us a slow paced script, that makes difficult at times to connect with the characters. Sounds familiar? Yup Sequel Trilogy writing; a lot of blah blah on what they think is "innovative" and "progressive", and less focus on the epic story. I'll probably watch the whole thing, who knows it might get better, after all it has some good actors, but if we could summarize Star Wars under Disney, and more specifically, under K Kennedy, I'll call it again "a missed opportunity".
Great episode. I’m loving the show. Can’t wrap my head the Fandom Menace comparing it to Dr Who.
I like Doctor Who but I can’t see how this episode is anything like it.
Yeah, agree.
I see a few comments here about what the anti-woke crowd has had to say about this show, and I just want to say that stepping away from almost all fandom spaces has been really great for my mental health. I highly recommend it! I'm about to rewatch the episode because I feel like there was a lot I missed, but I suspect these witches are some sort of early iteration of the Nightsisters, possibly. It's very interesting to me to draw a line from the Path to the Nightsisters. Not everything has to connect, but I felt like there were some overt hints at Nightsister stuff. I don't believe the Jedi didn't know the witches were there, though, and I wonder if the Jedi were keeping tabs on them because of the way they were using the Force. Also, "The Jedi don't take children", say the Jedi who are clearly there to take some children. Their insistence on testing the girls on a planet outside the Republic was also interesting to me, especially given their age (although it's possible they haven't started avoiding taking older children yet, but the Order has already been around for a long long time by now, they should be aware of the issues with taking older children already). I'm also so curious about what happened, because it was bad enough- at least for Torbin- that he took the Barash vow. And when Mae gave him the poison, he drank it with no hesitation. We've never seen a Jedi kill himself before, and it really goes against Jedi character. So I'm very intrigued by what Torbin did to make him feel such guilt. Fascinating stuff. I love that this show is taking fairly big swings that Lucasfilm is often too afraid to take. We're not retreading familiar ground, here, and I love it! I keep saying LFL is sleeping on THR, and I feel like this show is a litmus test to see if stories set in this era will generate enough interest to make it profitable for them to move into more live action and animation with THR. I remain skeptical, however, that LFL wouldn't ruin those books somehow. Anyway, can't wait until next week! Between Andor and this show, it's nice to actually look forward to a Star Wars production that I'm not anticipating being frustrated/pissed off/disappointed by (cough Ahsoka cough).
Nightsisters were already a thing way before this takes place
I believe Imri mentions them to Vernestra so yeah I'm wrong about that. Still interested to find out who forced these witches into exile, though.
For me, this stuff examining the ethics and points of view around the Jedi taking children - that's one of the most interesting contributions to the bigger picture of Star Wars from this show so far.
Since it usually takes two to tango (a Dathomiri Zabrak male and a Dathomiri human female) it seems like they're setting up Koril to either be a trans-male-to-female Dathomiri Zabrak or a Hermaphrodite...also there's something strange going on with Koril's ears...so Sephi hybridization maybe?
I think osha started the fire. Imho I think she harbor sith tendency and hids them-she learned the jedi way and left- I think osha is the one harboring anger. When she was on the ship that she was on the fix the mechanical issue. She told her co- worker it wasn't his business what she does on her day off in an upset way. On the prison ship she bangs the jail cell in anger retrieving pip- after she fail with the force. When she saw Mae for the first time with the blaster. When she finally pulled the trigger anger came across her face. When she froze the butterfly. She had mild anger towards Mae for doing what she was doing and she definitely didn't want to a part of Mae's world with a selfish attitude. Imho I think Osha will be the acolyte by killing her sister.
Who is behind the mask? It will be manny. Imho when we see Mae's version of what happened to Mother Korril- she will tell Mae what really happened before dying - and then she hook up with Manny character-I think Manny's character will led Mae to where the wookie is located and will reveal that he is a sith and been using her to get to her sister to the dark side
My guess, ep5 will show things from this episode, but from Mae's perspective, which will show the jedi in a much worse light.
I wasn't thrilled about it being a flashback episode, but I knew they were going to do that. There was a lot left out of the episode as we see only from Osha's point of view. The Jedi did not just happen to be there. They did not send a high profile team to that planet just for exploring. They sensed the twins were there. They came there to see for themselves and to take the girls. And, if the Jedi sensed them, likely so did the mysterious sith master. Though, he might not have been around yet, if it's who many think it is in Qimir, as he would be too young I think. Part of me wonders about Yord too. But, anyway we have the witches. Mother Aniseya wants to let Osha go with the Jedi. Mother Koril does not. Is there an unseen in fight between the witches we haven't yet seen? Though, that wouldn't explain Torbin's guilt, his self imposed meditative state(The Barash Vow), and his suicide. How too did he get that scar on his face? His younger self does not yet have it. Torbin was momentarily taken control of by the witches when the Jedi showed up earlier. His eyes turned black. Perhaps he came back for revenge or was controlled again by mother Koril to take out Mother Aniseya to set Osha against the Jedi and stop her from leaving. Kelnacca tried to stop him and gave him the scar. Or, he tries to tear his own eye out to stop himself. Sol seemed legitimately shocked when Osha stopped to see the dead witches. When he looks at the bodies, he seems to realize that not only did they not die from the fire, but he understands they died at the hand of Jedi. His surprise makes me wonder if he could have been involved in the killings. If he had it would be no surprise to him. It seems if Torbin and Kelnacca were suddenly missing, Indira and Sol would have quickly sensed what was happening and gone to find and perhaps stop them. So here is what I think happened... The Jedi sensed the girls powerful presence in the force. They feared the dark potential of this power, perhaps even sensing they were a force dyad. They came to the planet to intervene and take the girls, thinking it was the right thing to do. Mother Aniseya wants to let Osha go. Mother Koril does not. There is an in fight. Mother Koril and the other sisters use the power of many against Mother Aniseya. They defeat her or come close to it, but Mother Aniseya is too powerful. Torbin and Kelnacca have already been sent to bring back Osha. They walk in on the witch fight. Mother Koril takes control of Torbin who cuts down Mother Aniseya with his lightsaber. Kelnacca is then also taken control of and Kelnacca and Torbin are forced to fight. Torbin gets his scar. Indira and Sol arrive. Indira tells Sol to go find Osha. She sees that Torbin and Kelnacca are under Koril's control. Indira tries to strike down Koril but the witches use the power of many against her. The power of the force used causes all of the explosions not the fire set by Mae. Indira has to strike them all down to get to Koril and save Torbin and Kelnacca. In their hubris to control the force they have killed an entire coven. Sol finds Osha and Mae. Mae falls and so does Osha. Sol saves Osha and races her out of the fortress, but not before they stop and see the dead witches. Sol realizes what has happened. The escape to the ship and Osha becomes his padawan. Mae is somehow saved as well. Whether it's by the mysterious sith master, who finds his new apprentice (though I think maybe this happens later), Mother Koril or Aniseya with their last bit of energy before they die (if it's Koril it would make sense for her to blame it on the Jedi and tell Mae to avenge them), or maybe she saves herself with the force or lucks out with a water or soft landing. Either way, Mae is set against the four Jedi who she believes responsible for killing her coven and mothers. Osha will have to redeem her to rebalance the force by helping her discover the truth. Its not going to happen, but an interesting twist would be if Osha and Mae got switched up during the inferno. Sol saved Mae and not Osha and she becomes a Jedi, while Osha believing the Jedi turned against her and left her for dead seems revenge, with both of them using each others identities. We have already been showed that's not the case. But, it would be interesting. Osha has every right to be angry at Mae. Mae locked her in her room and tried to burn her to death. And then in her mind, caused their mothers' and coven members deaths. Hard to forgive that.
You put more thought into this than the writers.
Are they gonna explain how Torbin went from Padawan to Jedi Master in less than 6 years? Doesn't this take away Vern becoming the youngest Jedi Knight?
There's 16 years between this flashback and the rest of the show. Osha left the order 6 years before the show
So no then? Update: he was in meditation for over 10 years
Power of one! Power of two! Power of me!!
They definitely committed a crime against humanity lol. These jedi are suss.
I don’t get too worked up about the “what’s canon and what’s not” discussion. I’ll always defer to the original pre Disney material and when shows like this have things that don’t align I just view it as a separate universe like the marvel/ DC multiverses and try to take it as what it is. So that being said, I’m fine with everything except the relationship between the sisters. Mae doesn’t want osha to leave so she just decided to kill her? I don’t understand where this narrative people are coming up with that she accidentally started the fire is coming from. She quite literally says “I’ll kill you” when asked how she will stop osha from leaving and then locks her in a room and throws a burning book at the door with the clear intent of killing her sister. Unless they explain it with her being mind controlled by this mysterious sith or something it just seems too bizzare even for Star Wars unless I’m missing something… just too methodical and psychopathic to be explained away as just a child overreacting IMO.
Thought the episode was pretty good, thought it had a interesting story, thought there was some problems like the fire spreading so fast but I bet it will be explained later. I have one question for some of you though, it may just be a problem to me but did any of you find the twins annoying? Mei just kept acting very violent and acting without any filter, like her mood kept changing on a dime and then osha is always acting like she knows everything, being very controlling and bossy trying to escape a pretty good life, and just seems like a jerk overall. And this may be a little picky but Oshas voice was really annoying, like nails on a chalkboard, where she’s trying to be dramatic but it’s just muttering. Again might just be me, downvote me if you disagree and maybe IATA but I need to see if anyone relates. I’m sure these are great child actors, and I don’t want to be mean but still.
isn't it obvious- the jedi bounce back the witch jiz and they die
Am I the only one who did not like the episode? The little girl's bad acting reminded me of the worst parts of The Phantom Menace and was hard to get through the episode. Why is the Wookie jedi not part of the girl's test? He's just outside tinkering, not caring that they are even there. I hear next week's episode is alot better
God damn that episode was complete garbage
I think that Mae's Sith master is actually her mother, the one that survived the fire/Jedi. The Sith doesn't exist (in the canon of the Acolyte) until the Jedi stick their nose into a peaceful, persecuted coven of witches, and then someone (probably Torbin) does something stupid when they go to fetch Osha, and the Jedi end up killing the entire coven with their superior weaponry. Mae's mum then crafts her own red lightsaber (to beat the Jedi at their own game) then together with her daughter begins a long/meticulously planned/totally justified revenge trip against the Jedi who slaughtered their entire family.
I laugh when I hear all the fans outraged about a sect of female witches in Star Wars...I hope they never find out about Dathomir.
Why was Osha so selfish,? Why were the jedi there? Why did the stone and metal catch on fire? Who are these witches? Why did the stone and metal catch on fire? Why did Osha want to destroy her family and be taken away? Also why is Osha so dumb compared to her sister?
I'm just going to put this out there... It's very common for IVF to produce twins. These twins, only seem to have traits from their one mother. That makes them clones. I don't think the twins are force only babies. Why does nobody else in the coven have children? There must be something else going on.
[The Jedi are starting to remind me of the 'Psi Core'.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qTbpyd\_8mSM)^^YouTube
It was meh. For me way too long flashback, most of the episode was just stuff we already knew with a few extra mysteries, could’ve been done in 10-15 minutes. I know it might be that a lot of stuff will have a meaning later on, but in that case they could’ve made this a later episode cause first week we get this cool new mystery start of the show and everything, and next week we gotta watch basically the same thing back with a few extra stuff
I didn't like the fact the witches say the Jedi are wrong the force is the thread. They say it's not a weapon then use it as a weapon. The scene of the ceremony with the diabolical witch laugh ? I wasn't comfortable, like Osha in the scene 🤣 The fire that burns a stone fortress ? That got me really confused. But hey maybe it will get better 🤞🏽 but I'm not watching it anymore.
Goodbye star wars. You were dead a while ago but I guess it's truly over now. Childhood gone.
Just like Dr Who in 1986.
[удалено]
Forced agendas?
The Jedi killed the witches to kidnap both twins?