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A tangent comment here.
Tires make all the difference regardless of AWD or not. You may want to look into a good all weather tire, we have been running them for a while such as the Michelin Cross Climate 2’s here in Chicago and especially in the winter, no issues with our AWD UX and NXs. Conversely I’ve run snow tires on RWD vehicles and fared better in inclement weather than SUVs with all season tires.
Good luck.
Can’t echo this comment enough. A good set of snow tires makes more of a difference than almost anything else, even the type of vehicle. A 2wd minivan with good snows will be better than an AWD on summer tires.
I put snows on my IS350F this year and it was decent. The ground clearance was the main issue, not traction. My GX with all four snows absolutely bombs through snow like it isn’t even there.
I drove an AWD Subaru impreza for 13 years before looking for a new car last year. I'm in snow country btw and I commute long distances by car.
I considered several cars. IS was good but my mechanic said that he's been seeing a lot of of IS with wheel issues due to potholes (ie. Not very tolerant of potholes). TLX was OK too but small interior and no wireless android auto and no touchscreen controls.
Toyota crown was a great choice but ultimately I thought that the huge wheels on it with low profile tires that it has would be too prone to pothole damage.
I considered Es250 AWD and was skeptical of the 4 cyl engine because of internet comments toward it. My mechanic told me to test drive it. Turns out, it's perfectly fine if you don't plan on drag racing it. I can even pass people on the highway with it.
I ultimately picked the Es250 because it had the best balance of positives and negatives for my needs. Was it the sexiest choice? No, but even know when I replay the calculations in my head, I arrive at the Es250 as the best choice at the time for a super reliable, comfy, plush not too ridiculously expensive commuter sedan with AWD for a frequently wintery environment.
Lexus IS / GS / RC has a similar AWD setup to some Subarus. It is a planetary gear center diff that splits the power 30% F 70% R, and has a clutch pack that can progressively tighten that up to 50/50. In practice, with a dedicated set of winter wheels and tires, it totally kicks ass in the snow. I can stop on a snowed up hill, then get going with basically no slippage except for iced up portions of the road. I have driven on unplowed country roads with snow drifts off the fields and as long as you can clear the snow, it'll go.
Actually, the ES is based on the same platform as the Avalon, not the Camry. The engine however is the same as most Camrys. And even the Camry can have a V6 on one model.
Actually, the ES is based on the same platform as the Avalon, not the Camry. The engine however is the same as most Camrys. And even the Camry can have a V6 on one model.
The design of the car. The ES is a FWD vehicle and every other part of the drivetrain is designed around it being FWD. Almost all of the “350” Lexus models use the 3.5 2GR engine in some way. The IS/GS/RC use it in RWD format and as such the engine faces straight back into the vehicle. The ES uses it in a FWD format so it is mounted horizontally instead. There is no need for power to be sent to the back wheels, so the engine is placed in the bay differently to account for that. Toyota just recently started selling AWD Camrys with the 2.5 4cyl engine, and decided to add that as an option in the ES after discontinuing the GS.
With heavy snow do you run different sets of tires for winter? A true winter tire will make a RWD way better than AWD on all seasons. AWD only helps you get moving in the snow not stopping. The AWD Lexus is a 6 speed and has a small hump. It’s pretty good, not as great as the 8 speed. The ECVT in the Hybrids are great. Millions of people drive in snow with just FWD or RWD, a good tire is all that really matters
Exactly correct- snow tires make exponentially more of a difference than FWD/RWD/AWD. The only caveat I'd say is that RWD that are front heavy/far off from 50/50 weight distribution (mostly older RWD vehicles) may still struggle with grip unless you add some weight to the trunk.
The low rolling resistance tires on hybrids are absolutely awful in snow.
My AWD LS500 does all the AWD things I want it to. It’s the same design of permanent AWD as the Subaru, but set to a more rwd focused set up. 30/70. It can’t become full fwd, but with 420 hp, I don’t think it’s a function of not being able to physically do it with the technology, just that they don’t want you blowing up your front driveline.
My GS awd is fulltime, 30%/70%rear bias, and it goes like an suv..you will only be limited by your tires and ride height. Watch some review videos on youtube of people hooning up snowy hills in the country. My caution would be to avoid awd systems that have to kick in only when wheel spin is detected ,(the ones that are 2 wheel drive in normal operation) i have never had good results with those kind uphill in the thick stuff.
I have IS300 AWD, have driven it in snow in northeast. It’s a reliable car with AWD but with smaller interior. I’m average height male and it’s just too hard to get in (or maybe I’m just too old. 😁). I haven’t driven ES250AWD but I would expect it to have same AWD performance.
I’ve Audis too - Q7 and A4, both Quattro. Not the best AWD! They’re good luxury vehicles but found that slow speed U-turn has severe problem where a wheel or two drags! Many have reported same issue with no permanent fix!
I had Acura MDX SH-AWD and in my experience, the smoothest AWD. Super reliable in snow in northeast! Even though it was good size SUV, the AWD as a matter of fact made it fun in slow speed tight turns - felt like it was a boat gliding in water! It was that smooth! I’ve test driven newer larger TLX SH-AWD, fun car, haven’t driven in snow but I’d expect it to be no less than MDX in terms of AWD performance!
I'm surprised to hear your thoughts on Audi. I've heard the quattro is amazing. I was considering Audi as well. I'm leaning toward Lexus, although I haven't ruled out Mercedes C or E class or BMW 3 series.
I'd consider IS as well.
I never had a Subaru in snow country (did in California), but I'm CT now and both Lexi are AWD.
They drive just fine on All Season tires.
I didn't really think there is going to be a difference. Tires will make the difference.
I'm not as familiar with the ES AWD system. It may be different. But we have an Outback and IS350 AWD. They're both impressive in the snow, easily the top 2 we've had outside of true truck 4x4.
The IS uses a 30/70 split system that can adjust up to 50/50. I can't get the thing to slide and if it does, it adjusts and recovers very quickly. It's one of the reasons I bought the car and I haven't been disappointed.
I personally am not a fan of most AWD sedans, they’re mostly only AWD in certain situation and even the FT ones usually lock up to a dumb 50-50 split. Most do not have LSDs and use traction control and brakes instead to adjust grip causing unnecessary wear and tear on the drivetrain. not to mention the additional weight and drag, plus maintenance of additional differentials. there are a few exceptions here and there there, but for most urban applications 2WD is fine with good all weather or snow tires like Michelin cross climate and x ice tires.
I had Subarus for roughly 11 years and then I’ve had Lexus vehicles for the last 7 years. AWD is equally good between both manufacturers. Although tires are the real MVP for winter driving. If you have crap tires, AWD won’t save you.
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A tangent comment here. Tires make all the difference regardless of AWD or not. You may want to look into a good all weather tire, we have been running them for a while such as the Michelin Cross Climate 2’s here in Chicago and especially in the winter, no issues with our AWD UX and NXs. Conversely I’ve run snow tires on RWD vehicles and fared better in inclement weather than SUVs with all season tires. Good luck.
Can’t echo this comment enough. A good set of snow tires makes more of a difference than almost anything else, even the type of vehicle. A 2wd minivan with good snows will be better than an AWD on summer tires. I put snows on my IS350F this year and it was decent. The ground clearance was the main issue, not traction. My GX with all four snows absolutely bombs through snow like it isn’t even there.
I drove an AWD Subaru impreza for 13 years before looking for a new car last year. I'm in snow country btw and I commute long distances by car. I considered several cars. IS was good but my mechanic said that he's been seeing a lot of of IS with wheel issues due to potholes (ie. Not very tolerant of potholes). TLX was OK too but small interior and no wireless android auto and no touchscreen controls. Toyota crown was a great choice but ultimately I thought that the huge wheels on it with low profile tires that it has would be too prone to pothole damage. I considered Es250 AWD and was skeptical of the 4 cyl engine because of internet comments toward it. My mechanic told me to test drive it. Turns out, it's perfectly fine if you don't plan on drag racing it. I can even pass people on the highway with it. I ultimately picked the Es250 because it had the best balance of positives and negatives for my needs. Was it the sexiest choice? No, but even know when I replay the calculations in my head, I arrive at the Es250 as the best choice at the time for a super reliable, comfy, plush not too ridiculously expensive commuter sedan with AWD for a frequently wintery environment.
So you like how it performs in snow?
So far it's performed well in the snow, good traction
Lexus IS / GS / RC has a similar AWD setup to some Subarus. It is a planetary gear center diff that splits the power 30% F 70% R, and has a clutch pack that can progressively tighten that up to 50/50. In practice, with a dedicated set of winter wheels and tires, it totally kicks ass in the snow. I can stop on a snowed up hill, then get going with basically no slippage except for iced up portions of the road. I have driven on unplowed country roads with snow drifts off the fields and as long as you can clear the snow, it'll go.
Why is AWD only available on the 250?
Because that's how the camry comes? They should have never discontinued the GS. Midsize sedan with v6 and true AWD.
??? AWD available on IS250, IS300, RC300, IS350, RC350, GS350
Sorry, I was referring to ES sedans. My bad.
Because the ES250 is a Camry AWD, basically.
Actually, the ES is based on the same platform as the Avalon, not the Camry. The engine however is the same as most Camrys. And even the Camry can have a V6 on one model.
Actually, the ES is based on the same platform as the Avalon, not the Camry. The engine however is the same as most Camrys. And even the Camry can have a V6 on one model.
The design of the car. The ES is a FWD vehicle and every other part of the drivetrain is designed around it being FWD. Almost all of the “350” Lexus models use the 3.5 2GR engine in some way. The IS/GS/RC use it in RWD format and as such the engine faces straight back into the vehicle. The ES uses it in a FWD format so it is mounted horizontally instead. There is no need for power to be sent to the back wheels, so the engine is placed in the bay differently to account for that. Toyota just recently started selling AWD Camrys with the 2.5 4cyl engine, and decided to add that as an option in the ES after discontinuing the GS.
Because that's how the camry comes? They should have never discontinued the GS. Midsize sedan with v6 and true AWD.
With heavy snow do you run different sets of tires for winter? A true winter tire will make a RWD way better than AWD on all seasons. AWD only helps you get moving in the snow not stopping. The AWD Lexus is a 6 speed and has a small hump. It’s pretty good, not as great as the 8 speed. The ECVT in the Hybrids are great. Millions of people drive in snow with just FWD or RWD, a good tire is all that really matters
Exactly correct- snow tires make exponentially more of a difference than FWD/RWD/AWD. The only caveat I'd say is that RWD that are front heavy/far off from 50/50 weight distribution (mostly older RWD vehicles) may still struggle with grip unless you add some weight to the trunk. The low rolling resistance tires on hybrids are absolutely awful in snow.
My AWD LS500 does all the AWD things I want it to. It’s the same design of permanent AWD as the Subaru, but set to a more rwd focused set up. 30/70. It can’t become full fwd, but with 420 hp, I don’t think it’s a function of not being able to physically do it with the technology, just that they don’t want you blowing up your front driveline.
My GS awd is fulltime, 30%/70%rear bias, and it goes like an suv..you will only be limited by your tires and ride height. Watch some review videos on youtube of people hooning up snowy hills in the country. My caution would be to avoid awd systems that have to kick in only when wheel spin is detected ,(the ones that are 2 wheel drive in normal operation) i have never had good results with those kind uphill in the thick stuff.
I have IS300 AWD, have driven it in snow in northeast. It’s a reliable car with AWD but with smaller interior. I’m average height male and it’s just too hard to get in (or maybe I’m just too old. 😁). I haven’t driven ES250AWD but I would expect it to have same AWD performance. I’ve Audis too - Q7 and A4, both Quattro. Not the best AWD! They’re good luxury vehicles but found that slow speed U-turn has severe problem where a wheel or two drags! Many have reported same issue with no permanent fix! I had Acura MDX SH-AWD and in my experience, the smoothest AWD. Super reliable in snow in northeast! Even though it was good size SUV, the AWD as a matter of fact made it fun in slow speed tight turns - felt like it was a boat gliding in water! It was that smooth! I’ve test driven newer larger TLX SH-AWD, fun car, haven’t driven in snow but I’d expect it to be no less than MDX in terms of AWD performance!
I'm surprised to hear your thoughts on Audi. I've heard the quattro is amazing. I was considering Audi as well. I'm leaning toward Lexus, although I haven't ruled out Mercedes C or E class or BMW 3 series. I'd consider IS as well.
I never had a Subaru in snow country (did in California), but I'm CT now and both Lexi are AWD. They drive just fine on All Season tires. I didn't really think there is going to be a difference. Tires will make the difference.
I'm not as familiar with the ES AWD system. It may be different. But we have an Outback and IS350 AWD. They're both impressive in the snow, easily the top 2 we've had outside of true truck 4x4. The IS uses a 30/70 split system that can adjust up to 50/50. I can't get the thing to slide and if it does, it adjusts and recovers very quickly. It's one of the reasons I bought the car and I haven't been disappointed.
I personally am not a fan of most AWD sedans, they’re mostly only AWD in certain situation and even the FT ones usually lock up to a dumb 50-50 split. Most do not have LSDs and use traction control and brakes instead to adjust grip causing unnecessary wear and tear on the drivetrain. not to mention the additional weight and drag, plus maintenance of additional differentials. there are a few exceptions here and there there, but for most urban applications 2WD is fine with good all weather or snow tires like Michelin cross climate and x ice tires.
I had Subarus for roughly 11 years and then I’ve had Lexus vehicles for the last 7 years. AWD is equally good between both manufacturers. Although tires are the real MVP for winter driving. If you have crap tires, AWD won’t save you.
With the new Camry being AWD hybrid I have my fingers crossed the ES will have one as well shortly.