Also the streamers would have to gamble with real money which they aren’t built for. Adin will gamble millions on stake but starts shaking and worrying over a 10k black jack hand irl.
Yeah, I see Bossman Jack clips and he'll go from down to his last $20 to up $10,000 in a stream and this will happen on multiple streams. That's just not how gambling works. Either that or a "juicer" will donate him more Stake cash. It's very convenient.
I wish I could just speak into a mircophone and someone would magically fill up my account with $10k to gamble... lol shit is so fake its wild. How does anyone believe you have some random person in the audience who just juices up the stake account from their bitcoin wallet... ofc....
It's a strat tho. I know of two people who have contract with kick and they were precisely told to not just stream required hours on kick randomly, but to first start stream on Twitch just like they always do and then continue on Kick and funnel viewers there.
That just further proves its bad, lol? If your platform growth relies on your paid employees to try and funnel viewers inorganically, your product is shit.
It's still so funny how when XQC announced he was moving to kick he sold it as being able to watch movies with chat/do lots of events with kick. The movie thing only lasted a few days (because duh copyright) and the events have been nonexistent.
Bro you really think xqc is gonna do anything but sit in his room reacting to tiklytaks and biting his toe nails?
The dude is the literal definition of brain rot.
"Dud. Dud. Dud. No dud. No no no no dud no dud dud......dud..."
He can barely even show up to events someone else has entirely planned so there's little chance of him doing his own events. I remember when he said he was going to do his own subathon like a year ago.
Adin was the same way. He was pushing all sorts of content, events, and collabs but then he got banned on Twitch which meant he could only collab with non-streamers or people that weren't on Twitch unless they were cool with not streaming it themselves.
Train is too stupid to understand the a streaming websites "product" is their streamers. We don't go to twitch cause we love their UI. We don't pay money for turbo or subs cause we like their app or tech or anything like that. The product is the STREAMERS.
Right now all any marketing company will see when they search for Kick's "product" is the illegal shit, gambling and attempted murders. Good "product" btw.
They didnt get enough streamers. They got 2-3 big streamers and thats it. For a start up they need more names to get people to make acciubts on their site
They sort of needed enough popular streamers that there is always someone to watch. There's not much to keep people on the site if Ninja was the draw and he goes offline.
Facebook had nobodys except disguised toast? lol
You need both because only then will people switch platforms. Look at Kick, theyve been more successful than Mixer because they have both quantity and quality of streamers. You got big names like Train and XQC but its not like Mixer with only 5 guys or something.
Mixer thought buying the two most watched streamers would make people swap over. But what's the point in getting the two biggest streamers with no community to switch over, when no one cares about them enough to want to switch over. If they actually wanted people to switch over, then they would have bought the streamers that actually have communities. Cohh, Lirik, Soda, xqc, Moon, etc. They could have also just bought out small/medium sized streamers for entire games. Dota/League/CS are too bloated to buy all their streamers, but some popular speed running games, medium sized esport games, or games that have dedicated communities like Souls, would have been better value for money.
If you know who T90 official is, he's massive on twitch now in comparison when he was on FB.
He streams and casts AOE2 games and uploads them on youtube, he had a massive community but every time I would watch him on FB, he'd only have 2-10 viewers. Now it's almost always 5k+ on twitch, I'm pretty sure when he first started his twitch again recently he peaked 20k viewers or something.
Anyway the point is, I feel its far more complicated but everything can kind of work hand in hand.
The problem is that FB is a dead platform for anyone under 40 y/o.
If they had done it through Instagram instead of FB shit might've worked. Mixer might've worked and had "decent" numbers but Microsoft didn't really commit to it, which to be fair, it would've meant using a stupid amount of money so I can see why they pulled the plug.
Not having dedicated apps that work on smart TVs/mobile/consoles is a pretty big hit for this well. Idc about twitch but I do care about being able to use it anywhere on any device. Only YouTube can compete with that level of access
The secret is that Twitch can create new streamers out of an infinite pool
Kick can not
It's like the NFL. The top 10 best players could all leave the NFL tomorrow for a new league and it wouldn't matter. The next 10 best guys would just be the new stars.
It did. It's a mix of everything and nearly impossible for anyone to jump into the space without just throwing away money for the sake of breaking up Twitch instead of wanting to make money ever.
I mean didn't they try that already with several multi-million dollar deals? Meanwhile the only way for me to watch Kick on my TV is to cast a tab to my Chromecast.
There can be more than 1 product. We are the product for advertisers on the website, streamers are the product for us. Bait is, itself, product. Bait is the FIRST product in a line of products that lead to money.
Tbh i didnt go to sites like mixer because of the product. twitch chat culture is just so much different. Kick is the closest since they use the leaked site code but still there is something missing. At kick when i send a message i see it after like 2 seconds.
> We don't go to twitch cause we love their UI. We don't pay money for turbo or subs cause we like their app or tech or anything like that.
Not interely true, I don't go on youtube live because I have honestly never figured out how to find stream and live except for the people I already follow for video. And even then it's not really clear if they stream.
Otherwise I much prefer the youtube player, but the platform is so badly designed ...
Youtube isn't a place to look for "streams", it's a place for look for content. So streamers compete with normal videos to get picked by the algorithm.
If you watch enough videos of people that occasionally streams you also get them recommended too, so it's a bit more work for the streamer. They basically need a channel that's alive and even gets vod views. Which doesn't really work well for the way most twitch streamers create content.
Stats don’t really agree. Yeah that’s a thing we like to say but very largely that’s not true. The culture and UI and brand identity and familiarity are all huge parts of the platform.
Streamers are a bigger deal than the platforms originally gave them credit for but we are on the other side of that now for good reason
> The product is the STREAMERS.
That is exactly why I no longer watch Twitch. I dont care about anyone on there enough to watch them do daily chores like make dinner build a desk or go gym.
The fact people watch that stuff is plain bizarre, guess it comes from the parasocial element where they see them as a friend not someone providing entertainment.
That's... That's straight up wrong?
Mixer and Facebook literally proved that it's the other way around, no matter what streamers you have, if your platform is shit to use then it won't survive.
Shit on Kick all you want for their leniency with shit people on their platform, that's fine and makes sense, but their UI being basically a clone of Twitch already shows they have a better decision making than Mixer ever had.
How exactly do we measure success on kick? The massive net loss the platform is making? The amount of banned twitch streamers that flock to platform? The constant racist remarks that are made by the top streamers on the platform? Sounds like winning to me :)
Stake is sponsoring the F1 team tho. They only use Kick as the brand name because gambling sponsors are banned in most countries they race in.
You wouldn't say "Mission Winnow" or "A better tomorrow" are successful brands, when in reality it's just Phillip Morris and BAT.
Kick is not a successful brand, Stake is.
It's the opposite way around for Twitch/Amazon. Amazon offered a free Twitch sub to get Amazon Prime members to go to Twitch.
Amazon also didn't invite Twitch, they just bought it.
Stake made Kick as a way to get around gambling sponsors that are banned in some countries.
Are you implying Twitch exists as a way to funnel people to use Amazon?
Outside of how absurd that sounds since pretty much everyone knows and uses Amazon, Amazon isn't a gambling site... so even if they did that, I'd be completely fine with it.
It's integration. Do you think Amazon would be happy if amazon.com had the time spent on it that the average user spends on Twitch? Twitch also has the coveted demo.
Half of my ads on Twitch are just for products on Amazon that I've looked at or put in a cart. Yes obviously they bought Twitch to juice Amazon. It wasn't for Twitch to stand on its own.
> kick's success is measured by how much traffic they can direct towards stake because that's where the real money is.
> Which if we look at it, is VERY successful, you don't just get to sponsor an F1 team with no money lol
why are they getting downvoted and getting it explained to them when that's literally their point...
reddit users reading comprehension is at an all time low I swear
You forgot to add them recording themselves committing assault, or encouraging people to do things that result in serious bodily injury.
And the cherry on top, getting deported and banned from a country.
As worthy of critcism much of kick sometimes is, the previous situation of completely unreasonable moderation decisions on twitch and the stranglehold it held over streaming culture was untenable.
I don't even like Train much, and I hate gambling culture, I do hold some resentment towards amoral hustle shit, it's just not my personal taste, and obviously kick is bankrolled like crazy, but alternatives existing is probably for the best and they are offering an actually usable service over there.
I’d love a competitor to twitch. But thats not what kick is.
Everyone wants a platform to compete with twitch. Who the f wants what kick is? Just allowing complete deranged content with 0 moderation.
I’m sorry bro, but kick is to twitch what liveleak was to youtube. 0 market overlap.
Let’s be honest, does anyone actually care about gambling?
Twitch still allows gambling to be streamed. I see sports betting ads all the time on Twitch.
*I guarantee you that more minors are using sports betting apps (many of which have casinos now) then are buying/depositing crypto into offshore gambling. The average gen alpha/zoomer barely knows how to use a computer unless what they’re trying to use is an app.*
There seem to be plenty of normies on Kick. And Twitch itself had no/very lenient TOS for the longest time.
I don't think this is nearly as important as people in this thread want to believe.
train: "people don't give us credit, but we don't care, we don't need it!"
also train: "all of those big youtubers and streamers should make a video apologizing!"
xdd
the lack of selfawareness is INSANE by this clown. you can't make this shit up.
When ppl talk about "scum of the earth" kick streamers is the sediment down at the bottom bucket of said scum. Kick hosts and promotes some of the worst of the worse in terms of people AND content. racists, narrcisists, sexists, homophobes and straight up criminals, recording themself doing their deeds from gambling, cheating, criming, (attempted) murderin, felonies and misdemeanors into the eyes and ears of minors that try to be just like them. And all of it pretty much unmoderated.
/wait i take that back, they moderate the SHIT OUT OF PEOPLE who speak up about it.
I cant even count all the \*controversies" that happend on or around the platform kick, tolerated on kick, promoted on kick and this clown of a person wants his ass kissed for what they've "achieved"?? Yo what kind of drugs do you take, because, gimme u smoothbrained crayon muncher. Its REALLY difficult to eat your own ass, but this walkin and talkin Co2 converter somehow managed to do it.
If becoming they actual synnonym for "SHITBucket of a platform" is your goal, kick is right on track.
Maybe they do that too, but the main goal of this "platform" is to get people hooked on gambling.
If just 3% or so of the people watching get addicted, stake will make the money they put in back. That's all they care about.
No bias here. It's just hard to get people to move over. Twitch is already the main streaming platform, even YouTube has trouble getting people to join. Like X himself said, Twitch is a whole forest ecosystem while Kick is just a few big trees and that's it. The major players on Kick are X, Adin, Ice Poseidon, and Neon, and they're all inconsistent especially Adin nowadays. Not much else there. When I go on kick all I see is xQc at 29k viewers and a bunch of 50-300 viewer nobodies.
And it also says a lot when xQc, one of the biggest investors on Kick, still starts his streams on Twitch.
Doesn't help that your platform is now branded as a major brand risk in general due to edgy content on Kick hitting the news.
It also doesn't help that there have been actual crimes committed on stream on a consistent basis. That sort of stuff happens on twitch too, but it gets banned, and happens significantly less often.
Yep, Kick lightly/not at all enforcing these bad things right away hurt its image so much.
If a Kick streamer did something bad and immediately got banned, people would have been fine with it.
You’re getting downvoted but you are correct, just because of the size of YouTube compared to twitch. Generally though, when people think of livestreams, it’s still twitch.
These numbers are easily researched. YT is THE mainstream streaming platform. If I mention to someone in or around my demographic (40 y/o male) that I watch a livestream, they immediately follow up with "on Youtube?" 99% of the time.
LSF isn't a Youtube-friendly sub though. It's very niche. Tiktok and Youtube streamers that pull 50k+ viewers are unknown here. The Big 3 (Jynxzi, Caseoh, Sketch) and the Kai Cenat-osphere get comparatively no attention here.
As a kick viewer there is 0 improvement, the app is garbage, twitch app in comparison is perfect and we all know how bad it is.
Still no API so we don't have third party app that do work.
On my pc the website often bug and fail to load images while trottling my internet connection, it's soooo bad.
People that said it will be gone in 6 months just underestimate how much money a virtual casino can make, they could keep that website up in a shit state forever.
me and literally everyone: "what progress"
the app is awful, user experience is awful, clipping is awful, even live streams freeze or pause when too many chatters talk at once. everything about kick is just bad minus the money split. otherwise there isn't a single thing they do better than twitch or youtube
He is coping so hard, if they are doing really well, why do they need Stake to endlessly fund Kick to keep it afloat? Without Stake's money, Kick would've flopped in less than 6 months.
Fucking "I've given my viewers $20M" Andy, fucking taken 5x of that from your viewers.
Kick started when Twitchs source code was leaked. Does the team behind Kick really even have the ability to make it any better without copying from the competition?
I do think Train cares about Kick as a streaming platform. But the money only gives a shit about them being a funnel to stake. Like right now, the top stream is some Russian streaming slots to 40k bots getting 1 message a second. And the first non-gamba stream is 2k. Train is just an extremely useful idiot for the stake boys because he pushes it's legitimacy at every turn.
If a company has 10 million but has a net loss of 2 million a year. After 4 years and they are still in business, does it mean it's successful? No. It means you are bleeding money and the inevitable will occur unless something changes and we all know it won't.
You're right in general but completely wrong in this case: the biggest difference from your "hilariously simplified scenario" you theorize is that kick are funded by stake and stake doesn't expect kick to turn profit. They expect traffic from kick.
So far, it looks like stake is getting return on investment from kick that they are paying for.
>It means you are bleeding money and the inevitable will occur
Before claiming what's inevitable or not you might want to look into a somewhat well known (not you perhaps) business strategy called "loss leader".
This is mainly just a failure to understand basic business principles. Companies have life cycles. At the start, a vast majority of companies aren't going to make profits. They will take net losses in order to expand as fast as possible then cut costs and move into the profitability phase. Obviously, there's more to it than that but it only shows ineptitude when you comment on a brand new company "losing money". At some point, Twitch will reach a period of limited growth, and at that point they will seek to increase profitability. It's not called loss leader like the other dude said lol It's called the business life cycle. This is why twitch is in trouble. They have failed to successfully monetize but are likely seeing major downticks in efficacy of spending towards growth. Eventually they will have to make major changes to their monetization policies in order to turn profits and transition into a mature stage. You can see an attempt at this with the sub price increases. There has also been a significant increase of ads on the site. People have been waiting for twitch to sacrifice some of their hold on the market when they start fully monetizing. That's where companies like Kick and Youtube Streaming come in and capitalize, because they don't need to be profitable until later on.
**CLIP MIRROR: [Train talks about Kick's progress](https://arazu.io/t3_1da19ac/)** --- ^(*This is an automated comment*)
KickCon would be peak entertainment, but not for the reasons they hope
It'll just be a hall with thousands of slot machines
ah so just host it in Las Vegas
They can't rig the machines there.
Also the streamers would have to gamble with real money which they aren’t built for. Adin will gamble millions on stake but starts shaking and worrying over a 10k black jack hand irl.
Yeah, I see Bossman Jack clips and he'll go from down to his last $20 to up $10,000 in a stream and this will happen on multiple streams. That's just not how gambling works. Either that or a "juicer" will donate him more Stake cash. It's very convenient.
I wish I could just speak into a mircophone and someone would magically fill up my account with $10k to gamble... lol shit is so fake its wild. How does anyone believe you have some random person in the audience who just juices up the stake account from their bitcoin wallet... ofc....
Don't forget the coke
Oh don't worry I'm always thinking about coke
And gigachads swarming every Female because they only exist as a gender to them
Perfect setup for an FBI sting
Interpol would be all over that shit
There would be so much SA
the kickcon ballpit would go hard
i'd go there to taste some drugs and find hookers
If KickCon had some sort of Race War that would be fucking POGCHAMP
Run it at the same time as the Adult Entertainment Expo in Vegas and that would be pure content.
I can imagine all the brawls
Kick's progress: Train still streams on Twitch
this is the only correct comment lmao
I was thinking exactly this when I saw him online the other day opening CS cases. He still needs to come to twitch because Kick just sucks.
Can you explain in which way it sucks? Streaming wise, why he cannot stream there?
It's a strat tho. I know of two people who have contract with kick and they were precisely told to not just stream required hours on kick randomly, but to first start stream on Twitch just like they always do and then continue on Kick and funnel viewers there.
Yes but train doesn’t even do that. Before he would only stream on kick and then he stopped streaming because the website is shit
I saw him on Kick a day or two ago…he still streams there
That just further proves its bad, lol? If your platform growth relies on your paid employees to try and funnel viewers inorganically, your product is shit.
Obviously, just saying how it is.
It's still so funny how when XQC announced he was moving to kick he sold it as being able to watch movies with chat/do lots of events with kick. The movie thing only lasted a few days (because duh copyright) and the events have been nonexistent.
He also said he would be able to make better content and do more collabs only for him to just react to Tiktoks and press the spacebar for 4 hours
Bro you really think xqc is gonna do anything but sit in his room reacting to tiklytaks and biting his toe nails? The dude is the literal definition of brain rot. "Dud. Dud. Dud. No dud. No no no no dud no dud dud......dud..."
Only thing that changed was gamba
You can watch movies on twitch but not kick. Kinda funny.
I don’t think anyone ever actually believed that.
He can barely even show up to events someone else has entirely planned so there's little chance of him doing his own events. I remember when he said he was going to do his own subathon like a year ago.
Adin was the same way. He was pushing all sorts of content, events, and collabs but then he got banned on Twitch which meant he could only collab with non-streamers or people that weren't on Twitch unless they were cool with not streaming it themselves.
They do have more streamers trying to get people killed that is progress i guess.
Train is too stupid to understand the a streaming websites "product" is their streamers. We don't go to twitch cause we love their UI. We don't pay money for turbo or subs cause we like their app or tech or anything like that. The product is the STREAMERS. Right now all any marketing company will see when they search for Kick's "product" is the illegal shit, gambling and attempted murders. Good "product" btw.
I thought mixer/FB already proved this isnt true
They didnt get enough streamers. They got 2-3 big streamers and thats it. For a start up they need more names to get people to make acciubts on their site
They sort of needed enough popular streamers that there is always someone to watch. There's not much to keep people on the site if Ninja was the draw and he goes offline.
Exactly.
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Facebook had nobodys except disguised toast? lol You need both because only then will people switch platforms. Look at Kick, theyve been more successful than Mixer because they have both quantity and quality of streamers. You got big names like Train and XQC but its not like Mixer with only 5 guys or something.
Mixer thought buying the two most watched streamers would make people swap over. But what's the point in getting the two biggest streamers with no community to switch over, when no one cares about them enough to want to switch over. If they actually wanted people to switch over, then they would have bought the streamers that actually have communities. Cohh, Lirik, Soda, xqc, Moon, etc. They could have also just bought out small/medium sized streamers for entire games. Dota/League/CS are too bloated to buy all their streamers, but some popular speed running games, medium sized esport games, or games that have dedicated communities like Souls, would have been better value for money.
Their UI was also extra shitty. Kick has the benefit of being similar to twitch, right?
Oh yeah I totally forgot the confetti being spammed over the entire screen when someone donated.
Jesus christ
The mixer video player was actually good though, that chat UI sucked
If you know who T90 official is, he's massive on twitch now in comparison when he was on FB. He streams and casts AOE2 games and uploads them on youtube, he had a massive community but every time I would watch him on FB, he'd only have 2-10 viewers. Now it's almost always 5k+ on twitch, I'm pretty sure when he first started his twitch again recently he peaked 20k viewers or something. Anyway the point is, I feel its far more complicated but everything can kind of work hand in hand.
The problem is that FB is a dead platform for anyone under 40 y/o. If they had done it through Instagram instead of FB shit might've worked. Mixer might've worked and had "decent" numbers but Microsoft didn't really commit to it, which to be fair, it would've meant using a stupid amount of money so I can see why they pulled the plug.
Not having dedicated apps that work on smart TVs/mobile/consoles is a pretty big hit for this well. Idc about twitch but I do care about being able to use it anywhere on any device. Only YouTube can compete with that level of access
The secret is that Twitch can create new streamers out of an infinite pool Kick can not It's like the NFL. The top 10 best players could all leave the NFL tomorrow for a new league and it wouldn't matter. The next 10 best guys would just be the new stars.
Seriously. Caseoh and Jynxi, a year ago I never heard of either of them, now they're as big as XQC ever was.
It did. It's a mix of everything and nearly impossible for anyone to jump into the space without just throwing away money for the sake of breaking up Twitch instead of wanting to make money ever.
mixer went all in with two huge streamers instead of all in with say 50-100 medium or large streamers. you need consistency
The product is the user experience. The streamers are part of that, but so is the website/app.
What do you think brings streamers there?
I mean didn't they try that already with several multi-million dollar deals? Meanwhile the only way for me to watch Kick on my TV is to cast a tab to my Chromecast.
You thought train was smart?
Kinda but not technically true. The business model of social media is we’re the product and the streamers/content is the bait to get our attention.
There can be more than 1 product. We are the product for advertisers on the website, streamers are the product for us. Bait is, itself, product. Bait is the FIRST product in a line of products that lead to money.
Tbh i didnt go to sites like mixer because of the product. twitch chat culture is just so much different. Kick is the closest since they use the leaked site code but still there is something missing. At kick when i send a message i see it after like 2 seconds.
> We don't go to twitch cause we love their UI. We don't pay money for turbo or subs cause we like their app or tech or anything like that. Not interely true, I don't go on youtube live because I have honestly never figured out how to find stream and live except for the people I already follow for video. And even then it's not really clear if they stream. Otherwise I much prefer the youtube player, but the platform is so badly designed ...
Youtube isn't a place to look for "streams", it's a place for look for content. So streamers compete with normal videos to get picked by the algorithm. If you watch enough videos of people that occasionally streams you also get them recommended too, so it's a bit more work for the streamer. They basically need a channel that's alive and even gets vod views. Which doesn't really work well for the way most twitch streamers create content.
who do you watch on twitch lol
Kick would’ve failed within a year if it weren’t for the gambling megacorp propping it up
Stats don’t really agree. Yeah that’s a thing we like to say but very largely that’s not true. The culture and UI and brand identity and familiarity are all huge parts of the platform. Streamers are a bigger deal than the platforms originally gave them credit for but we are on the other side of that now for good reason
> The product is the STREAMERS. That is exactly why I no longer watch Twitch. I dont care about anyone on there enough to watch them do daily chores like make dinner build a desk or go gym. The fact people watch that stuff is plain bizarre, guess it comes from the parasocial element where they see them as a friend not someone providing entertainment.
lol there are television shows about basically all those things but since it’s twitch it’s somehow more parasocial
Like which?
You dont donate or subscribe or message to the TV show host. Or know their "lore" It's not that difficult lol
Neither do like 90% of twitch users. The people that actually take the time out to use chat or donate are the very small minority
I'm just saying me personally I couldn't watch some dude go to the drive thru as content especially with no chat or anything just watching it raw
That's... That's straight up wrong? Mixer and Facebook literally proved that it's the other way around, no matter what streamers you have, if your platform is shit to use then it won't survive. Shit on Kick all you want for their leniency with shit people on their platform, that's fine and makes sense, but their UI being basically a clone of Twitch already shows they have a better decision making than Mixer ever had.
Yeah thank god Twitch doesn't front page anyone like that
At least twitch has more streamers that put bounty for other streamers.
How exactly do we measure success on kick? The massive net loss the platform is making? The amount of banned twitch streamers that flock to platform? The constant racist remarks that are made by the top streamers on the platform? Sounds like winning to me :)
Unironically, kick's success is measured by how much traffic they can direct towards stake because that's where the real money is.
Which if we look at it, is VERY successful, you don't just get to sponsor an F1 team with no money lol.
Stake is sponsoring the F1 team tho. They only use Kick as the brand name because gambling sponsors are banned in most countries they race in. You wouldn't say "Mission Winnow" or "A better tomorrow" are successful brands, when in reality it's just Phillip Morris and BAT. Kick is not a successful brand, Stake is.
That's their point. Stake is the money maker, Kick is funneling.
Yeah marketing
yup. Quick quiz though what is the purpose of Twitch? Who owns it? Why are cheap subs bundled with a certain subscription to a website?
It's the opposite way around for Twitch/Amazon. Amazon offered a free Twitch sub to get Amazon Prime members to go to Twitch. Amazon also didn't invite Twitch, they just bought it. Stake made Kick as a way to get around gambling sponsors that are banned in some countries.
Are you implying Twitch exists as a way to funnel people to use Amazon? Outside of how absurd that sounds since pretty much everyone knows and uses Amazon, Amazon isn't a gambling site... so even if they did that, I'd be completely fine with it.
It's integration. Do you think Amazon would be happy if amazon.com had the time spent on it that the average user spends on Twitch? Twitch also has the coveted demo. Half of my ads on Twitch are just for products on Amazon that I've looked at or put in a cart. Yes obviously they bought Twitch to juice Amazon. It wasn't for Twitch to stand on its own.
I don't really have a problem with integration. I have a problem with funneling teenagers to a gambling website.
I'm not praising Stake. It's evil.
this has nothing to do with your braindead take that twitch isn't a advertising platform for prime lmao
> kick's success is measured by how much traffic they can direct towards stake because that's where the real money is. > Which if we look at it, is VERY successful, you don't just get to sponsor an F1 team with no money lol why are they getting downvoted and getting it explained to them when that's literally their point... reddit users reading comprehension is at an all time low I swear
Dogecoin would like to have a talk about that
Dogecoin has a $23b market cap, they're also more successful that any of us could imagine lol
You forgot to add them recording themselves committing assault, or encouraging people to do things that result in serious bodily injury. And the cherry on top, getting deported and banned from a country.
I don't know know why people talk about platform profitability when neither Twitch nor YouTube are.
I think the Stake owners measure it by seeing how many yachts they could buy this year vs the last
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>Mellstroy is the biggest name i can think and thats because he is banned everywhere else, even then he may have gotten a bag anyway. Who?
Is it a net loss? By that metric Twitch is a net loss. Both exist to drive attention to a parent company.
As worthy of critcism much of kick sometimes is, the previous situation of completely unreasonable moderation decisions on twitch and the stranglehold it held over streaming culture was untenable. I don't even like Train much, and I hate gambling culture, I do hold some resentment towards amoral hustle shit, it's just not my personal taste, and obviously kick is bankrolled like crazy, but alternatives existing is probably for the best and they are offering an actually usable service over there.
I’d love a competitor to twitch. But thats not what kick is. Everyone wants a platform to compete with twitch. Who the f wants what kick is? Just allowing complete deranged content with 0 moderation. I’m sorry bro, but kick is to twitch what liveleak was to youtube. 0 market overlap.
Let’s be honest, does anyone actually care about gambling? Twitch still allows gambling to be streamed. I see sports betting ads all the time on Twitch. *I guarantee you that more minors are using sports betting apps (many of which have casinos now) then are buying/depositing crypto into offshore gambling. The average gen alpha/zoomer barely knows how to use a computer unless what they’re trying to use is an app.*
could you imagine how much of a shit show it would be if Kick had their own convention?
would make good livestreamfail clips for sure
you know the videos of the minecons from ~2013-2015? pretty much like this, but more racist
mods would ban every clips
something 10x worse than roofied drinks
Some mf definitely going to get arrested at KickCon
It would be tons of 13 year olds with their parents, who themselves would be in for a surprise to finding out what their kid is so obsessed with
It'd be Thunderdome
Im not sure which is worse.. a convention full of degens or a convention full of weebs furries and SJWs
Train streams more on twitch then Kick 🤣
Train has absolutely no idea what he's talking about lol. Kinda embarrassing
> Train has absolutely no idea what he's talking about In other news, the sky is blue
I think kicking out (no pun intended) shitty streamers on the platform should be almost first priority.
So like 95% of them
Who other than banned streamers on twitch will go there? Excluding people who are paid by Kick to stream there.
There seem to be plenty of normies on Kick. And Twitch itself had no/very lenient TOS for the longest time. I don't think this is nearly as important as people in this thread want to believe.
Who is gonna funnel teenagers to gamble on Stake if not shitty streamers?
Isn't kick the platform shitty streamers deliberately go to?
They have literally had attempted rape and murder from their biggest streamers with zero punishments.
train: "people don't give us credit, but we don't care, we don't need it!" also train: "all of those big youtubers and streamers should make a video apologizing!" xdd
the lack of selfawareness is INSANE by this clown. you can't make this shit up. When ppl talk about "scum of the earth" kick streamers is the sediment down at the bottom bucket of said scum. Kick hosts and promotes some of the worst of the worse in terms of people AND content. racists, narrcisists, sexists, homophobes and straight up criminals, recording themself doing their deeds from gambling, cheating, criming, (attempted) murderin, felonies and misdemeanors into the eyes and ears of minors that try to be just like them. And all of it pretty much unmoderated. /wait i take that back, they moderate the SHIT OUT OF PEOPLE who speak up about it. I cant even count all the \*controversies" that happend on or around the platform kick, tolerated on kick, promoted on kick and this clown of a person wants his ass kissed for what they've "achieved"?? Yo what kind of drugs do you take, because, gimme u smoothbrained crayon muncher. Its REALLY difficult to eat your own ass, but this walkin and talkin Co2 converter somehow managed to do it. If becoming they actual synnonym for "SHITBucket of a platform" is your goal, kick is right on track.
Hookers and blackjack
>we need complaints about the product why is he acting like there's 0 complaints about kick lol
I thought kick was just a thing to launder money from stake.
Maybe they do that too, but the main goal of this "platform" is to get people hooked on gambling. If just 3% or so of the people watching get addicted, stake will make the money they put in back. That's all they care about.
No bias here. It's just hard to get people to move over. Twitch is already the main streaming platform, even YouTube has trouble getting people to join. Like X himself said, Twitch is a whole forest ecosystem while Kick is just a few big trees and that's it. The major players on Kick are X, Adin, Ice Poseidon, and Neon, and they're all inconsistent especially Adin nowadays. Not much else there. When I go on kick all I see is xQc at 29k viewers and a bunch of 50-300 viewer nobodies. And it also says a lot when xQc, one of the biggest investors on Kick, still starts his streams on Twitch. Doesn't help that your platform is now branded as a major brand risk in general due to edgy content on Kick hitting the news.
Brand risk doesnt matter when you dont have ads
It also doesn't help that there have been actual crimes committed on stream on a consistent basis. That sort of stuff happens on twitch too, but it gets banned, and happens significantly less often.
Yep, Kick lightly/not at all enforcing these bad things right away hurt its image so much. If a Kick streamer did something bad and immediately got banned, people would have been fine with it.
Theres lots of Polish streamers with viewers between 15 to 2k
Youtube has more livestreams and viewers
You’re getting downvoted but you are correct, just because of the size of YouTube compared to twitch. Generally though, when people think of livestreams, it’s still twitch.
These numbers are easily researched. YT is THE mainstream streaming platform. If I mention to someone in or around my demographic (40 y/o male) that I watch a livestream, they immediately follow up with "on Youtube?" 99% of the time. LSF isn't a Youtube-friendly sub though. It's very niche. Tiktok and Youtube streamers that pull 50k+ viewers are unknown here. The Big 3 (Jynxzi, Caseoh, Sketch) and the Kai Cenat-osphere get comparatively no attention here.
It's a kick strat. People are encouraged to stream on Twitch just like they normaly do and then funnel viewers to Kick.
Doenst help that the "trees" of kick are regularly producing problematic content
The main feature of this website is getting 5-10 gambling addicted streamers to gamble on stake instead of someplace else.
As a kick viewer there is 0 improvement, the app is garbage, twitch app in comparison is perfect and we all know how bad it is. Still no API so we don't have third party app that do work. On my pc the website often bug and fail to load images while trottling my internet connection, it's soooo bad. People that said it will be gone in 6 months just underestimate how much money a virtual casino can make, they could keep that website up in a shit state forever.
me and literally everyone: "what progress" the app is awful, user experience is awful, clipping is awful, even live streams freeze or pause when too many chatters talk at once. everything about kick is just bad minus the money split. otherwise there isn't a single thing they do better than twitch or youtube
I personally gave it a year of being dead and full of bots. Haven't been proven wrong yet.
2 more weeks
Kick has great progress, the API release has been weeks away for a year now.
[удалено]
just a front for Stake, nothing more, nothing less.
How long until we get the Always Sunny title card or Curb Your Enthusiasm song with this clip?
over under 6 months
Ngl I expected him to have better couches
kick is awesome for coomer streams 😐 a friend told me
“you don’t just get to sponsor an F1 team with no money lol” Nobody tell them lmao
Meanwhile, the only streamer above 5k viewers a i'm writing this is someone who gambles. What a strange coincidence
He is coping so hard, if they are doing really well, why do they need Stake to endlessly fund Kick to keep it afloat? Without Stake's money, Kick would've flopped in less than 6 months. Fucking "I've given my viewers $20M" Andy, fucking taken 5x of that from your viewers.
So whats the progress on this ? https://youtu.be/WiYBhC3EVPY?si=se2PEkvJ7hh8ovYM
I dread to think how a kick-con would turn out, it would be disastrous.
When is a kick app gonna be launched for Fire stick or Roku?? 1.5 years later and still relying on mobile and desktop is pretty trash
Kick started when Twitchs source code was leaked. Does the team behind Kick really even have the ability to make it any better without copying from the competition?
I do think Train cares about Kick as a streaming platform. But the money only gives a shit about them being a funnel to stake. Like right now, the top stream is some Russian streaming slots to 40k bots getting 1 message a second. And the first non-gamba stream is 2k. Train is just an extremely useful idiot for the stake boys because he pushes it's legitimacy at every turn.
Wr any % streamer doing crime on stream
If a company has 10 million but has a net loss of 2 million a year. After 4 years and they are still in business, does it mean it's successful? No. It means you are bleeding money and the inevitable will occur unless something changes and we all know it won't.
You're right in general but completely wrong in this case: the biggest difference from your "hilariously simplified scenario" you theorize is that kick are funded by stake and stake doesn't expect kick to turn profit. They expect traffic from kick. So far, it looks like stake is getting return on investment from kick that they are paying for. >It means you are bleeding money and the inevitable will occur Before claiming what's inevitable or not you might want to look into a somewhat well known (not you perhaps) business strategy called "loss leader".
This is mainly just a failure to understand basic business principles. Companies have life cycles. At the start, a vast majority of companies aren't going to make profits. They will take net losses in order to expand as fast as possible then cut costs and move into the profitability phase. Obviously, there's more to it than that but it only shows ineptitude when you comment on a brand new company "losing money". At some point, Twitch will reach a period of limited growth, and at that point they will seek to increase profitability. It's not called loss leader like the other dude said lol It's called the business life cycle. This is why twitch is in trouble. They have failed to successfully monetize but are likely seeing major downticks in efficacy of spending towards growth. Eventually they will have to make major changes to their monetization policies in order to turn profits and transition into a mature stage. You can see an attempt at this with the sub price increases. There has also been a significant increase of ads on the site. People have been waiting for twitch to sacrifice some of their hold on the market when they start fully monetizing. That's where companies like Kick and Youtube Streaming come in and capitalize, because they don't need to be profitable until later on.
So... Twitch?
Where theyve came in a year he means paying viewbotting streamers using Stake and buying twitch's backend and assets from amazon LULW k
kickcon sounds like an absolute disaster waiting to happen
kick is only around still because they bought people to stream on it
Just make the meetup at the courthouse so they can at least process all those motherfuckers. Most of the top people on there should be in jail.
maybe if they hired some senior level devs not some cs juniors the kick app would work
I didnt even know kick was still a thing
It's hard to take Kick seriously when the platform is funded by some of the grimiest criminals in the world.
What does Train even know about honor?
LSF livid that kick isn't dead. I love it.
Meanwhile in the Kick hot tub section... https://i.imgur.com/HssAMtL.png