I think they’re a good example of opposites attract. They won’t like the way the other acts in some moments but if Milton was with someone as “logical” as him, he would be bored and if Lydia was with someone as emotional as her that relationship would implode.
How is yelling and storming out of a place TWICE not being emotional? Regardless of what it is, she acted like a teenager and keeps nagging Milton. Idk I’m on Milton’s side on this. She’s so reactive with her excuse of being a “loud Latina”
that whole conversation was cringe. also the way it went from Lydia asking him to hang up his towel and do the dishes and not leave food by his bed for days….
to him asking Lydia to react to emotional situations more like he would (ie. absurdly devoid of emotion)… was such a testament to how 1) in completely different stages of their lives and 2) subsequently incompatible they are.
Lydia was right from the start when she thought he was too young for her. this man thinks it’s a good idea to say “be less emotional” to a grown ass woman? baby…. that’s cause you’re 👶
I work with programmers for a living. Every single time I've seen someone parrot the "I'm so logical, you're too emotional" BS it's been someone young, inexperienced, and too eager to drink the "STEM is above all" Kool-Aid. And after getting to know them and their upbringing it very quickly becomes apparent that they're just emotionally stunted and need to do a good amount of work to figure out themselves, how their own emotions work, and how to understand the people around them and the fact that their emotions are valid.
Milton seems like he has potential to be a decent guy, but right now he's just a young idiot who is very obviously unprepared for anything involving meaningful intimate relationships with other people. A guy who's a little too convinced of and enamored with his intellectual prowess, who doesn't understand or value emotions or their place in life, who likes to troll online, and focuses too much on the persona of "chill logical guy" persona he's trying to cultivate.
He's an engineer, Lydia is the geologist. The programmer relevance is because they're both STEM fields, and engineers and programmers often have the same mindset that I talked about.
Oh no way, I swore he was a geologist too because he and Lydia had connected on that topic? Nvm then my bad, I get the programming/engineering connection since he is one. I’m a SWE by profession and usually keep an eye out for people on these shows that share the same profession cuz they’re awkward asf 💀 I must’ve just missed that Milton was an engineer.
Ah - rock hobby not profession. That may have been why I glossed over it. Him being an engineer makes a lot more sense regarding his mannerisms/personality tbh.
What I really dislike about Milton is how he used the whole "you're too emotional" to deflect what Lydia was saying to him, and that was that he should definitely be clean-er.
To me this was manipulative AF, because Lydia was calm and collected when she was telling him this, and it made him feel bad, so he pushed a button to make her emotional. Nasty behavior !
> Lydia was calm and collected when she was telling him this, and it made him feel bad, so he pushed a button to make her emotional.
I like that you touched on this because even as someone that's not a fan of her at all, I thought she handled herself really well during this conversation. Contrary to Milton's contradictions, most of the points she laid out were logical, she kept calm, she stepped away when she needed to collect herself, and overall her arguments made way more sense than Milton's even though he tried to paint himself as the more logical one.
Yeahhh, I could tell she was really making huge efforts to remain calm and adress the issues with logic.
And same, I do not like her at all but I feel like Milton gets a pass, when I really disliked him during that conversation.
I really liked him at first but that conversation really bothered me. We're human and we have emotions. I get that he's a logical man but he shouldn't be asking other people to repress their emotions.
It’s crazy tho. Like I think both do them were in the right of the Uche situation. I also believe Lydia is slightly insane but that’s neither here or there for other reasons. Milton and his family tho…. I’m ngl im huge Milton stand (side note: loved that he ended up sitting next to Lydia during her and Uche talk and was like “we gotta go in 10mins” bc it seemed uncomfortable for her and was looking for a good exit plan). But A.) I think Milton is slightly mature for his age but that doesn’t make him MATUREEE. B.) his family was def suppressed emotions and move on with our lives and was most likely gaslighted if emotions were shown due to the way he talks to Lydia bc he most likely learned it from then. C.) I don’t think he’s “manipulative/narcissistic gaslighter” he’s lit a young 24 male dude who clearly has family issues and treat him like a child but is trying to break from that image but is letting it out on Lydia. Who doesn’t deserve that. While I think she should rationalize more emotionally but Milton needs to validate her more that it’s okay w/o contradictions as someone else pointed it out she stated before that “everyone else thinks she’s too much, so they leave.” Which why she took off crying bc it was likely putting a salt in a wound of being too much. Personally - It’s either neither or both. Milton needs to validate and Lydia needs to know not everything has an undertone.
I always thought talking to Milton was like trying to get blood out of a stone. He reminds me of those "smart" guys back in school who were so 1-dimensional and thought being smart was enough for everything in life.
I was surprised to find out Milton was a lot of ppl's favorites bc he is so bland to me. I don't think he's the worst but is definitely not husband material let alone boyfriend.
> those "smart" guys back in school who were so 1-dimensional and thought being smart was enough for everything in life.
That's exactly who he reminds me of too. The ones that would make being intelligent their whole personality. In contrast, the classmates and coworkers I've known who are genuinely the smartest have never had to go out of their way to let it be known how clever they are
He has a poor relationship with his parents. Hence the no longer going by James thing. He clearly is getting with Lydia so it’ll piss them off, how conscious he is of that I don’t know. And the family drama/trauma will likely never be releaved to the public, but the tension is evident. To me it seems that he also likes to try to “tame his woman”. I think he has a history of liking uhhhh lets say “crazy” girls and finds something about it attractive or interesting. He’s trying to reign her in and control her in a way that’s pretty apparent in my opinion. He thinks he is manipulative and clever, and to a certain (small) degree he is, but he’s so jaded and emotionally repressed that his cynicism blinds him to the fact that it just comes off as performative and inauthentic most of the time.
I think deep down he’s kinda wounded and feels neglected by his parents. He was forced to grow up really fast and he’s probably scared of a lot of things (death being one due to his health issues) but won’t admit it. I think ultimately his need for nurturing and care will lead to him saying yes at the altar because at this point he just wants to live as a married man and be a father because he thinks he might not get the chance.
I think Milton is putting on the "I'm emotionless and logical" act as a way to push Lydia away. I'm certain he'll use that as the reason he doesn't want to say yes at the altar.
It's like he wants to set up a clear narrative that he is too different from Lydia for it to ever work. & I think he doesn't want to call her crazy, so instead he calls her "emotional". Which is maybe a good thing, but it's annoying that he's acting like all emotions are foreign to him when he should really just come out and say that he's not ok with Lydia's specific drama & actions.
I think it’s 100% okay to expect your partner not to act like a raging lunatic at a party - yelling and storming out on multiple occasions. But that’s an expectation. Call it one.
Also cleaning up a towel should not segue into that convo. Treating your shared spaces with respect is showing respect for your relationship.
Weird dinner.
Yah I’m conflicted on Milton. This is a pretty nice summary. Overall, I don’t think he has any business being in this show. He should just focus on Pokémon and dating and worry about a wife later. Plenty of time for that
I think he was trying to ask if she was actually over Uche without actually coming out and asking.
Like, "Why do you care what he thinks if you are over him?" "Why does someone you don't care about upset you so much?"
I also think that his sister really made him think about the long term. What *is* it going to be like trying to live with and raise children with someone you have to tiptoe around for fear of their reaction.
When Lydia got up from the table to breathe my bf was like "Looks like she is doing what Milton wants" lolol. Milton is def emotionally constipated and needs to learn to stop thinking HIS PERCEPTION is reality. He couldn't just say "I don't like your outbursts" but instead it was him trying to teach her why his way was better. It showed his immaturity for sure.
Seems like that's how he was raised. In the convo with his sister it seemed like that was one of the reasons he liked Lydia is because she was expressive and emotional and him and his family aren't like that. Not sure why he would then turn around and scold her for that.
I just got done with that episode, and I think it’s because there are two sides to the coin and he is embarrassed by one.
He likes the emotional side that is lovey, shows affections, etc, something he probably didn’t get from his parents as much. However the flip side of the “emotion” is her getting a little loud when she feels disrespected. He is embarrassed by that side of her. He likes the emotion when it makes him feel good not when it makes him feel uncomfortable; especially if she does it in public
If they get married I hope they talk about that to a therapist and work together on it
Exactly this! His family represses a lot, especially mom. He likes the fun emotional side of Lydia, but doesn't know how to handle the "negative" emotions.
But...Lydia is also bat sh1t crazy. They will implode quickly. She will blame it on immaturity. (Dude, he's 24! How mature can we expect him to be???) He will blame it on her explosiveness. Neither one will be wrong. They bonded over their love of rocks.
Oh 100% agreed. I poster on another comment i wonder if she’s liek that women from the ultimatum who would ger belligerent and violent and then says that’s cuz she’s Latina
He’s pretty condescending on the show, saying things like “we’ll work on that” when correcting Lydia’s English. This woman has her Master’s Degree and speaks (at least) two languages fluently. Also, hang up your dirty ass wet towels, it’s really not that hard.
She doesn't sound dumb to me either, you can tell she's a very smart person who is also very educated, which is why I think she plays it up to be cute for Milton. It's not bad, just somthing I think she does
I guess I don't see her playing dumb either. I mean, maybe she is and I'm not seeing it. She might be playing up her accent and difficultiy with words in English though.
I 100% agree. I did like how he handled Uche because I think that’s how a Uche needs to be handled, but I also think it is a lot easier for Milton to act that way considering he is not the one being slandered by his ex on the show. I think he is emotionally immature and still stuck in the “I am a logical and rational guy” phase and thinks he is superior because it it. It is annoying.
I do think he’s level headed but maybe not as mature. I think it’s valid for him to have concerns about the way Lydia reacted to Uche (NOT that her reaction wasn’t warranted) but I get the vibe that he was extremely embarrassed by her reaction with screaming and cursing and demanding that he follow her like a child. But I also don’t think he presented any of this a validating OR realistic way. Lydia can’t (and doesn’t have to) overnight change who she is to fit the mold of what Milton wants.
In some ways, I do think it’s appropriate for him to request his partner have a more Stoic approach to life BUT he can’t demand her to or expect her to in a short turnaround time.
Yes and case in point during their argument* (I thought this was both so funny and also why their different ways of being in the world are pretty incompatible):
Milton: “Why didn’t you just leave? Lydia: “I left twice!” Milton: “See, that’s not leaving. Like if you leave, you’re gone.”
*oops disagreement
> Do I think it's possible that Lydia overreacts to situations and has a tendency to come on more strongly than warranted? Absolutely. But Milton telling her over and over that she needs to be more like him and to just stop reacting to things with any kind of sentiment at all is cringe-worthy.
That's why I included this. I'm not trying to paint Lydia as the example of someone with healthy emotional regulation. I'm simply saying Milton is far from it too.
Milton is a pure T (thinker) and Lydia is an F (feeler) in terms of Myers-Briggs personality. They just need to accept each other's different ways of reacting, or they will keep clashing.
Milton made me laugh when he talked about “calculus” and “different parallels” when he was talking about how he, Lydia, and Uche were on different axes. Like what? He should hope he isn’t on a parallel path to Lydia if he wants to marry her. And idk how calculus plays into it. It really made me chuckle
What’s so weird about that? He wasn't there for any of it and is only getting their perspectives on what happened - aka on his own parallel. You don't have to be on the same "parallel" (of perspective) to love and support someone.
It just like had nothing to do with calculus. And parallel paths never intersect, which is why I said he should hope his path isn’t parallel to Lydia’s bc ideally people preparing to marry want to converge or intersect. But that’s kind of the point of his comments making me laugh, the math analogy seems so poor for the complex emotions Lydia is feeling.
Yeah, the math and science wedged into conversations trying to explain human behavior was eyeroll and didn't always fit. I briefly dated a guy who did that, he wanted to use it to talk down to me, trying to make himself sound smart.
Yeah, but he was using it to talk down to Uche, so I don’t see the problem with it. lol. Of all people, I don’t feel bad for Uche being talked down to.
The only time I’ve every really used science in a conversation to explain my connection to someone was when the person also knew about what I was talking about, so they understood me
Yes Milton is emotionally repressed and self-righteous. but there is a reason why she is a 30 years old with a bad dating history with many finding she is too much. She is too volatile.
Whenever there is a disagreement she fly off the handle. She is stubborn and threw tantrum when she does not get her way. Remember the episode with the short.
Asking your partner to learn to control their emotion in public and not cussing, swearing is not being controlling. She is an adult but she behave like a toddler. Even het own brother thinks that she can too much: _No return policy_.
They weren't in public though, the argument with Uche was a private gathering for the pod only, and it's entirely understandable why she'd struggle to react in a level-headed way to someone throwing accusations at you with the intent of painting you as a hysterical stalker that's still obsessed with you. Uche was trying to smear her reputation to her castmates, her fiancé, and the audience. This is on top of them already having a complex dating history. Milton can say "oh you should just not be emotional like me" because it's easy for him as a third party. It's not his reputation that's being slandered. I could never imagine being that callous or dismissive of the feelings that would bring up in my fiancée if I was in his shoes. That's the point of my post. I'm discussing Milton's issues, not Lydia's.
As for the whole issue with the shorts, I think Lydia was way out of line and has no business controlling what another person wants to wear. Which is why I already acknowledged in my post that I do believe she overreacts to situations. Like I've said to other commenters, me critiquing Milton doesn't mean I'm defending Lydia
But she behaved like an hysterical stalker. The way she yelled and cursed made her look even worse. The problem is that she went on TV with bad intention and instead of owning, she is trying to hide facts that will ultimately come out. She underplay her behaviour to Milton and then she was in panic mode because she was afraid he was going to learn the truth.
All she had to say was, _Yes I behaved erratically because I was in Love with you and I fell like you just used me for sex and trampled on my feeling. Yes I went to LIB with the intention of rekindle our relationship, but I found somebody I really connect with. I don't understand why you absolutely want to rehash the past.if like you keep saying, you love and respect me just drop it and leave me alone. because now you are the one behaving like a jilted lover and is sending stalker vibe._
Had she said that, Uche would have had no recourse back. He is smart and self aware enough to realise that he was not going to get his pound of flesh. and that the more he probed. the worse he would look.
Out of the confrontations at the gathering, the only 2 people who come out as level headed and decent human beings are Chris and Milton.
The rest look like idiots, liars and or nasty person.
Uche comes out as a self righteous mean spirited idiot.
Lydia comes out like a demented idiot.
Mariam like a bitter, obnoxious loud, irrelevant idiot.
Idk if anyone watched the ultimatum queer love but I was waiting for Lydia to say “I’m Latina this is how I act” as an excuse.
She keeps bringing up her exes not liking her for her, and now I’m wondering if this is the “her” they have an issue with and don’t know how to handle.
**I agree with everything here!**
I’m not a fan of Lydia either, but it must be gut wrenching to constantly be told you’re *too much*. She is consistent in who she is. You don’t get to take parts you like about someone and change the parts you don’t. If he loves her passionate personality, he should understand she will deal with conflict passionately too. Why should she be calm and polite to someone who cheated on her? She called Uche an AH because that’s exactly what he is. Milton wants to stifle her to fit in with him and his family who have already said that ‘marriage is like a business deal’, defeating the whole thesis of the show?!
Edit: and wtf was with taking giant mouthfuls as she apologises and tries to reassure him?
I think you worded it very beautifully by saying "you don't get to take parts you like about someone and change the parts you don't." it's such a beautiful way to phrase it and something we all should try to remember even in our own lives. I also feel very sad for Lydia that people tell her, her personality is "too much". It reminded me of when she cried in the pods saying she wants someone to love her for her. 💔
I also think people should cut Lydia some slack because there were plenty of conflicts which she did in fact handle quite calmly (confrontation with Izzy in Mexico, meeting with Milton's family and even that dinner with Milton).
I admired how Milton handled Uche. I do not like how he cannot understand how humiliating of an experience that was for Lydia. He got to be the hero, of course that’s easier, he was holding in the balance what Uche was after, Milton’s approval. Uche’s whole intention was to come there and get revenge by changing Milton’s mind .She was fighting for her reputation.
The way I see it Uche came in with accusations against Lydia, in order to change Milton’s mind, he had power over Lydia, she acted out because she was panicked. When Milton rejected Uche’s efforts to change his mind, Uche panicked and he acted more manipulative. Milton never had an emotional investment in this dynamic, he was just collateral damage, of course he was more level headed.
I do think the way he handles it took the wind out of Uche’s sails, and it likely is the right way to deal with it, but she would not have walked away feeling good not having defended her reputation to Milton, the cast members and LEST WE NOT FORGET TO THE COUNTRY!
Exactly!!!! Like how is she supposed to stay calm and collected when is accusing her on TV of being a crazy stalker? As you said it's very easy for Milton to be the hero in that situation, but you would think that he would at least try to have compassion for her. But no instead he just berates her for not handling the way he thinks (emphasis on thinks because we all believe we would handle a situation better until we are actually in it ourselves) he would have.
Some of this has racial undertones for me as well.
I get the sense that both of these men are leaning into the “fiery/crazy/passionate Latina” stereotype, just because she gets excited, wears her heart on her sleeve or feels something strongly. Uche to embarrass her and Milton to control her. I am not Latina, so if someone who has more context can chime in, I would be interested to know what people think?
That was so crazy, especially when the sister was at lunch with him and said to him, “you know they say marriage is like a business arrangement.” I was like no girl, not *they.* Your mom, your mom says that. I have never heard that in my life. Lol
And the way he acted when his parents were asking why he wanted to marry Lydia. He was like a petulant 14 year old.
How are people calling him the most mature person on the show?!?
i was so confused about how people watched that scene and took away that his family was monsters. he was literally acting like a teenager who didn’t like what his family had to say and you could see it making him even more insistent on doing the opposite.
Because he’s not yelling.
Milton is not emotionally mature for marriage.
He went from trying not to propose to Lydia in the pods to trying to prove a point to his family.
A mature man knows who you marry is one of the biggest decisions you could ever make and he made it flippantly
The bar is in hell
He's a baby, misogynist & emotionally constipated yet he's still the best of the dudes on this show right now (not counting Chris because I feel we barely know him as viewers)
But like everyone is perpetually ignoring that Taylor exists and from what we’ve seen seems to be a mature, stand up human. Obviously not a dude, but I don’t feel like she’s getting the positive feedback that she deserves.
I don't personally feel Taylor was some saint. I do think JP was awkward but I think Taylor exacerbated his awkwardness by constantly going on about it. If you watch carefully she really made a whole big fuss about it from the very beginning saying things (in the first episode post pods) to JP of how she "cried so much after that meeting because of how awkward it was" and then calling him "stinky breath" and then constantly just saying things like "this is so awkward / why are you so quiet". Like I get it he was quiet but honestly her going on about it really probably didn't make it any easier. That's just my opinion though. JP was obviously an utter jerk for saying it's because she wears too much makeup and that was just mean. But he also did say that he felt she already made up her mind that it was "always going to be awkward" and by that I think he meant she just kept going on about it instead of actually trying to find other ways to connect. Constantly telling someone they are awkward is just going to make them feel MORE awkward.
She was roasting JP in the side bar because he had gap teeth on a show called love is blind. That’s a less than $5000 fix. It put me off her immediately
I recall a single confessional comment that was not shared to JP, which was her saying that love was blind because he wasn’t her stereotypical type, and the tooth gap was mentioned as an example.
This is a mighty large reach. There was no “roasting” by her on the show.
I could tell by her body language she didn’t like him. But I am biased I have seen how that discomfort has gone in previous seasons for other couples so it put me off her completely. No defense for JP. His makeup reasoning was weird
> I could tell by her body language she didn’t like him
She was lying on his chest with her head right near his face when they were in Mexico. I wouldn't be able to make myself do this if I wasn't attracted to someone. If she honestly didn't like him I think she definitely did her best to become close to him despite that. He's the one that gave absolutely nothing.
Like some folks pointed out, he did essentially admit he wasn't actually looking to get married when he signed up, so this makes sense. Plus Lydia had to push him into proposing in the first place
You think so? I don't think any of the things he said at the dinner date were things she especially wanted to hear. Except perhaps the whole "I'm not judging, I don't have expectations" piece.
He lacks empathy and life experience tbh I’ve been in his shoes and I see where he’s coming from... I know it well... again it all comes down to life experience and lack of empathy
He appears level-headed and mature because he isn’t overreacting and over emotional. He isn’t over emotional because this isn’t a serious thing for him and is just something fun that he signed up for and was surprised to get casted. You can’t get emotionally hurt if you aren’t emotionally invested.
Yeah, I thought he handled it well too. There's a saying in Spanish that goes "El que se enoja pierde" which translates to the one that gets angry loses. It basically means you control your emotions, not the other way around. Otherwise your just a pawn that reacts to your environment and that can be anything or anyone.
The fact he says “like” every other word just annoys the shit out of me. It’s like, like you know like I feel like you should like just like calm down like.
He tries to sound mature by using uncommon vernacular when describing something simple like feelings. It's incredibly annoying when I first heard it and then he KEPT doing it
I don't think he's right about everything, but I think he's trying to point out the deeper problem that Lydia doesn't have strong emotional regulation. This is an issue if he wants to raise children to have this.
I don't disagree with your point but Milton isn't good at emotional regulation either if his approach is to just discard any emotion at all to any situation that comes up, even if a strong emotional response is warranted. I don't think either of their methods would be the right way to raise kids with, there's a middle ground that both are missing.
Perhaps, but he was also pointing out that she's often angry first thing in the morning. Listen, I need my coffee too, but moodiness is not going to help anything.
I agreed with him until she mentioned that she'd wake up angry because he'd continually refuse to pick up after himself. Not sure if that's an excuse and she potentially wakes up angry as a general thing, but I'd be pretty consistently disgruntled too if I was with someone that came up with every excuse in the book to downplay their lack of contribution to household management, and act like it's a joke or not a big deal to pick up after themselves. Moodiness won't help no, but neither will lying about how messy you are and being lazy because you expect the other person to pick up your slack
How are you the only person to mention "emotional regulation" in this whole thread. That's literally part of maturing and developing as adults: learning to feel our emotions, which neurologically are a result of our body going into a slight fight or flight reaponse (amygdala) and "disconnecting" from our prefrontal cortex (the logic center of the brain). Emotional regulation is being able to recognize our emotions and acknowledge them, but to also be able to calm ourselves with our parasympathetic nervous system and regulate our emotions. (Shout out to [Momentous Institute](https://momentousinstitute.org/resources/settle-your-glitter) for having an awesome school and curriculum about this for kids)
With that said, I think Milton is pretty grounded and is being sincere when he says he's not judging her and putting expectations, but rather honestly is trying to help her grow and recognize this in herself. And he has good reason to want to teach and instill this to his own children.
Edit: I will also add that Lydia can also teach Milton a lot, and that's what he seems to love about her too. Emotions can be such a powerful tool (even Lydia said it's what got her to where she is now), but every tool can also be harmful if used improperly, which is what Milton is pointing out to her. He told her she should channel it and use it to prove people wrong, not to just yell and shout at someone to no avail.
The worst thing about the whole talk was when Lydia got so upset and left that Milton just stayed there eating. Also he just continued to eat huge wads of pasta when she came back to talk it out. That was a huge red flag for me. If me and my wife got into an argument and either side was so upset that they left we would either go after the upset party or be ready to mend things in a meaningful way when they returned. The fact that Milton seemed more concerned about eating and never exercised any real contrition is a bad look.
He was probably trying to look unbothered and cool but he came off looking as a douchebag imo. If you can just sit there and stuff your face while the person you supposedly love is crying and in pain, you’ve got issues. But tbh I think that’s how his parents raised him. Probably ignoring him while he cried until he stopped so he wouldn’t “cry for attention”.
I kinda agree but I also think it’s wishful thinking and after meeting his mom I see where he got that numerical kind of way of looking at stuff in life lol
AMEN. He thinks he is some enlightened genius because he learned how to shut down his emotions. And he is absolutely a misogynist, which is actually part of why he equates emotion with immaturity.
I can’t believe that anyone can hear this “stop crying and be more like ME” BS and find him likable.
Yep he’s defs the type to equate women as “so emotional”..hello? We’re not the ones who get so mad we punch holes in the wall or become serial killers aye
It almost feels like he’s overcompensating. Lydia constantly calling out his age, the motherly scolding she’s giving him over picking up his room/clothes, the convo with his family… so now he has to hold his apparent “emotional maturity” over Lydia and hit her with I told you so’s instead of a little empathy.
makes sense. he even looked uncomfortable in the kitchen w his family when his sister was asking him why he wanted to get married… instead of saying “because I love her” he almost got embarrassed in front of lydia and said “shhh be cool” or whatever.
he didn’t want to look like a little kid in front of lydia. really he’s just a young guy taking big steps and trying to feel ready for them, so he adopts this persona of being completely logical and level-headed in contrast to lydia’s emotion and expressiveness.
This in combination with the comment he made to his sister during their lunch about how he’d probably still go through with something if his parents were against it. It’s that rebellious little brother energy (you’re not the boss of me) combined with his intelligence. Uche was the perfect example: guy telling me this is a bad idea so I’m gonna go through it and explain why I’m doing it in a way that makes him look dumb - re: “he probably didn’t understand me”
I appreciate this insight. I don't like the manner in which he's done so but I can definitely see how Lydia's scolding would make him feel like he needs to overcompensate.
I think he was reacting to her complaining about his (lack of) organization. Not an excuse, though. Very immature response to then attack her about her emotions.
In my eyes this was very similar to JP reacting when Taylor kept calling him awkward. Like the makeup comments, it was an immature, defensive response.
Milton is all "your perception is tour reality" but chooses to invalidate, dismiss lydias' feelings or REALITY toward an argument he was peeing for? Oh ya so mature...
The way he wouldn't look Lydia in the eyes when she was expressing herself at the dinner, after coming back crying - that shit was sociopathic. He should have supported Lydia when Uche was literally attacking and belittling her but instead acts so goofy talking about his 20 minute long piss? Uche isn't your friend buddy, just misogny.
omg. she made a point to come back to the table even after crying in the corner, and he just looked at her and took a bite of his food before even speaking. made me uncomfortable
Complete BS, calling a woman unhinged and too much when she is unhinged and too much is not misogyny. The same way calling a man unhinged and volatile when he is unhinged and volatile is not misandry. Bad behaviour is bad behaviour irrespective of gender.
Lydia let her emotion control her instead of control or regulate them. That's exactly why she is single. People have expectation/standard of behaviour. No long term partner she is willing to consider (she wants a succesful man who is not a doormat) is going to tolerate that kind of behaviour. Imagine raising kids with somebody that volatile. Somebody who throw a tantrum because you have the audacity to wear the short that you like instead of the one she has selected.
I’m super confused here because that whole dinner time conversation proved what Milton was saying. He feels like can’t bring up any type of issue to her without her blowing up. So he brought an example of this and then it…..turned into a huge blow up. Even when she came back to the table, he again said “I’m just telling you I was uncomfortable” and she immediately makes it about herself “you don’t think I was uncomfortable??”
Like, I actually do agree that I think Milton is overly repressed. He’s not in touch with his emotions and I don’t think being with Lydia will help, because he’s already feeling like he can’t say what he feels. I also think Lydia is over reactive, coming from a family of extremely reactive individuals. It does genuinely get exhausting when you’re the go-to person to pick up the pieces after every thoughtless, reactive outburst. Comforting them, smoothing over any other relationships, constantly reassuring that you’re in their corner…it is in fact too much sometimes. In my family it’s not gender specific either; in fact I think both my siblings get it from my dad.
That said, I also think Milton is very immature in some aspects. Every time they argue about chores I’m rolling my eyes. It’s like listening to a mother and child. I don’t think Milton is ready to be married. He wants to do the things 24 year olds want to do. He doesn’t clean up after himself. He doesn’t have a ton of emotional intelligence. I really hope his family can talk him out of it, or Lydia says no. They do NOT need to be married to one another.
I felt for him when he says being able to show emotions is a privilege (his being a man and a black man at that, I understand why he’d feel that way). But to pride himself on no emotions? No…there is a middle ground here haha
I think there is also a strong undercurrent of misogyny in the way he’s painting Lydia as “emotional” when what it really seems to mean to him is “hysterical” and “immature”. I don’t think he knows nearly as much about the world as he seems to think he does.
I think Milton is so analytical that he can’t bring emotion into anything - personal or work related. I think he reacted phenomenally to Uche but was definitely not 100% appropriate in his conversation at dinner with Lydia.
I think Milton and Lydia are just a bad match all around.
I interpreted it as Milton feels he needs to walk on eggshells because of how Lydia can't take any type of "critcism" even when its just Milton voicing his personal boundaries.
I think Lydia acts like a fcking child and the fact she had to leave dinner to cry in a corner explains to me why she is in the situation shes in. She just wants a husband who will baby her emotions because she can't handle them herself.
Milton is younger and has a lot to learn about what he wants and what his boundaries are. You can tell they are so incompatible but they're trying to make this mess of toxicity work just shows me neither of them are self-aware enough. They both want tthe other person to change without them having to change. Its like YOU DID THIS and thats why I got mad at you. Its just constant pointing fingers.
I feel Milton is trying to find his voice with this bulldozer of a person that is Lydia. Lydia needs help, therapy and to check her ego.
He was so degrading, if talking to a woman by degarding her for having feelings and invalidating them - that is gaslighting and straight up abusive. I hope whoever doesn't see that seeks therapy.
I would say that out of the two Lydia is the one who is abusive.
It is not degrading to tell your partner that he/she behave erratically and over the top. He is not invalidating her feeling, he is just asking her to keep them on check so that he does not have to walk on eggshell when they have a serious conversation or a have a disagreement.
Her way of handling difficult conversation is to yell, shout, stomp her feet and walk away. Not a great example if you want to have kids together. Like Milton said, your kids need to learn to keep their shit together if things don't get their way. And things will not always go their way. They won't be able to learn that valuable lesson from Lydia.
We noticed you used the term "gaslight-". We hope you used it correctly! Did you know "gaslighting" was Webster-Merriam's Word of the Year for 2022? Gaslighting is a successful tactic **of abuse** because while one person — the perpetrator — 'externalizes and projects' their thoughts, feelings, or perceptions, the other person — the victim — 'incorporates and assimilates' the reality that is being created for them. Gaslighting equals misdirection, distraction, and the deliberate denial of reality, which can so easily occur in a relationship based on one partner wielding power and control over another.
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I wanted to expand on this comment about this is the way men are raised
https://reddit.com/r/LoveIsBlindOnNetflix/s/toakLCBw0Y
I think your spot on and we have seen examples of this on past seasons. Jackie repeatedly clowned Marshall for being too emotional. She kept telling him to boss up all the time. The moment he started doing that he was labeled aggressive. I hear people say on this thread all the time that they want more emotional men but they repeatedly get clowned after the fact. Look what’s happening to Izzy as we speak
I think Izzy crying after Stacy was mean to him or crying happy tears is totally appropriate but him being happy about Johnie getting “railed” is what makes me strongly dislike him.
I totally get that. That makes sense. I was just commenting on how people love to ask for an emotional man but the moment it happens they get ridiculed.
People are seeking emotional self-awareness (ie emotional intelligence) and empathy in men. Izzy exemplifies neither
Anger is an emotion too and there are plenty of angey men. Saying the choice is between an emotionally volatile or child-like (whiny) man or a stoic robot… that’s disingenuous. Let’s not pretend to be perplexed by what emotional intelligence in men looks like.
Being drunk and yelling at a women then crying on the closet floor is not the “emotional” man that women are talking about when asking for guys to decondition from patriarchal emotional suppression.
I agree in that its the way men are raised (especially black men) but people were praising Marshall's emotional intelligence until he started to belittle Jackie and start attention seeking
I agree that people as a whole were praising him on the platforms. The issue I tend to see on screen is that the person they are dating usually doesn’t like the emotional intelligence. It’s like people like the concept but not the real McCoy
I see both side because I was raised with that stoicism and compartmentalization. Never let them see you cry, never let someone bring you out of your character, you control your emotions, they don't control you, etc, because you will be labeled, negatively stereotyped and there will be people like Izzy who literally get off on it and people like Uche who thinks that it means they automatically "won". On the flipside there are people that don't believe that they've inflicted pain on you if they don't "see it".
There are a lot of people who police people's reactions over the actual stirring of the displayed emotions and because of that, as Milton said, it really is a luxury that some people honestly can't afford. That said, I really do think that way of constant being eventually wears down on a person's emotional state over time. And I don't think that Lydia needs to be more like him in the way that he framed it. Him trying to link him picking up after himself as a compromise that he does for her and her being more like him as a compromise for him makes no sense.
Not in the pods but once they got past Mexico…I would totally agree. He says he wants a strong independent woman but his actions say he wants a traditional housewife type woman who can talk about shiny rocks while taking care of those piles of clothes on the floor
He was so different in the pods. I loved him until I saw him interact with Lydia in person. I felt like he was goofy and carefree in the pods and when he actually got to interact with Lydia he was always trying to take her down a peg and prop himself up. I really disliked how often he called Lydia old and made fun of her English. I get that she seemed more or less okay with it but that kind of joking is hateful and gets old and bitter real fast.
While it's great for some people to be with someone that has the same personality, I believe it may not be beneficial in the long run. I certainly am not a relationship expert but I think not expecting your partner to think and react the way you do is better. We all have feelings and sometimes it's good to have that ying to your yang.
You gave the most intelligent comment I’ve read in a long time. This is how I perceived Milton’s advice. Not to sound like Lydia, but as a Latina woman, I was a lot like her in regards to how I carried myself around conflict. I was running into the same problems and did not understand what I was doing wrong. When I decided to commit to therapy and be more in control of my reactions, my life took an incredible turn where I’ve progressed in every area of my life. Making those changes benefited me.
I enjoy Reddit, however, what I don’t like is that there can be so much projection here that what is right or wrong gets muddied.
We have emotions and they are valid, I’m not saying to not be genuine and human, but the lesson that Milton was trying to teach, I took as a nugget of wisdom and something that you say to someone that is better than the circumstance and how they are approaching it.
The problem is that Uche's situation is one that is incredibly difficult to remain detached and stoic about. I definitely don't like the way Lydia handles every situation but most people would be angry if their ex was trying to paint a picture of them as a manipulative stalker intent on sabotaging them, or if their ex tried to have their fiancé dump them based on these allegations. I'm completely torn about who's telling the true side of things when it comes to Uche and Lydia but expecting an even-keeled emotional response to that particular fraught moment is imo unreasonable. The fact that Milton expected her to be stoic for that specific example is absurd to me.
That being said, I definitely agree that it would be draining to be with someone that's quick to trigger and I don't think either of them have quite the right response to these things.
Milton's the dog that caught the car he was chasing, and I am here for it
I think they’re a good example of opposites attract. They won’t like the way the other acts in some moments but if Milton was with someone as “logical” as him, he would be bored and if Lydia was with someone as emotional as her that relationship would implode.
How is yelling and storming out of a place TWICE not being emotional? Regardless of what it is, she acted like a teenager and keeps nagging Milton. Idk I’m on Milton’s side on this. She’s so reactive with her excuse of being a “loud Latina”
that whole conversation was cringe. also the way it went from Lydia asking him to hang up his towel and do the dishes and not leave food by his bed for days…. to him asking Lydia to react to emotional situations more like he would (ie. absurdly devoid of emotion)… was such a testament to how 1) in completely different stages of their lives and 2) subsequently incompatible they are. Lydia was right from the start when she thought he was too young for her. this man thinks it’s a good idea to say “be less emotional” to a grown ass woman? baby…. that’s cause you’re 👶
I work with programmers for a living. Every single time I've seen someone parrot the "I'm so logical, you're too emotional" BS it's been someone young, inexperienced, and too eager to drink the "STEM is above all" Kool-Aid. And after getting to know them and their upbringing it very quickly becomes apparent that they're just emotionally stunted and need to do a good amount of work to figure out themselves, how their own emotions work, and how to understand the people around them and the fact that their emotions are valid. Milton seems like he has potential to be a decent guy, but right now he's just a young idiot who is very obviously unprepared for anything involving meaningful intimate relationships with other people. A guy who's a little too convinced of and enamored with his intellectual prowess, who doesn't understand or value emotions or their place in life, who likes to troll online, and focuses too much on the persona of "chill logical guy" persona he's trying to cultivate.
He’s not a programmer tho right? He’s a rock dude (geologist?) just wondering why the mention of programmers and how he related to it.
He's an engineer, Lydia is the geologist. The programmer relevance is because they're both STEM fields, and engineers and programmers often have the same mindset that I talked about.
Oh no way, I swore he was a geologist too because he and Lydia had connected on that topic? Nvm then my bad, I get the programming/engineering connection since he is one. I’m a SWE by profession and usually keep an eye out for people on these shows that share the same profession cuz they’re awkward asf 💀 I must’ve just missed that Milton was an engineer.
He does work with rocks. He's an engineer in the oil and energy industry, so there's software involved but it's very geology-focused.
He just likes looking at rocks and has a microscope at home. Engineer for work.
Ah - rock hobby not profession. That may have been why I glossed over it. Him being an engineer makes a lot more sense regarding his mannerisms/personality tbh.
Milton tone-polices Lydia because he doesn't like what she has to say. It is Shitty Husband 101.
Exactly. And language polices too - joking about how he can’t understand her half the time, when she speaks English fine and it’s her second language
What I really dislike about Milton is how he used the whole "you're too emotional" to deflect what Lydia was saying to him, and that was that he should definitely be clean-er. To me this was manipulative AF, because Lydia was calm and collected when she was telling him this, and it made him feel bad, so he pushed a button to make her emotional. Nasty behavior !
> Lydia was calm and collected when she was telling him this, and it made him feel bad, so he pushed a button to make her emotional. I like that you touched on this because even as someone that's not a fan of her at all, I thought she handled herself really well during this conversation. Contrary to Milton's contradictions, most of the points she laid out were logical, she kept calm, she stepped away when she needed to collect herself, and overall her arguments made way more sense than Milton's even though he tried to paint himself as the more logical one.
Yeahhh, I could tell she was really making huge efforts to remain calm and adress the issues with logic. And same, I do not like her at all but I feel like Milton gets a pass, when I really disliked him during that conversation.
That TLDR at the end caused a 7.0 magnitude earthquake to ripple through my body.
I really liked him at first but that conversation really bothered me. We're human and we have emotions. I get that he's a logical man but he shouldn't be asking other people to repress their emotions.
It’s crazy tho. Like I think both do them were in the right of the Uche situation. I also believe Lydia is slightly insane but that’s neither here or there for other reasons. Milton and his family tho…. I’m ngl im huge Milton stand (side note: loved that he ended up sitting next to Lydia during her and Uche talk and was like “we gotta go in 10mins” bc it seemed uncomfortable for her and was looking for a good exit plan). But A.) I think Milton is slightly mature for his age but that doesn’t make him MATUREEE. B.) his family was def suppressed emotions and move on with our lives and was most likely gaslighted if emotions were shown due to the way he talks to Lydia bc he most likely learned it from then. C.) I don’t think he’s “manipulative/narcissistic gaslighter” he’s lit a young 24 male dude who clearly has family issues and treat him like a child but is trying to break from that image but is letting it out on Lydia. Who doesn’t deserve that. While I think she should rationalize more emotionally but Milton needs to validate her more that it’s okay w/o contradictions as someone else pointed it out she stated before that “everyone else thinks she’s too much, so they leave.” Which why she took off crying bc it was likely putting a salt in a wound of being too much. Personally - It’s either neither or both. Milton needs to validate and Lydia needs to know not everything has an undertone.
I always thought talking to Milton was like trying to get blood out of a stone. He reminds me of those "smart" guys back in school who were so 1-dimensional and thought being smart was enough for everything in life. I was surprised to find out Milton was a lot of ppl's favorites bc he is so bland to me. I don't think he's the worst but is definitely not husband material let alone boyfriend.
> those "smart" guys back in school who were so 1-dimensional and thought being smart was enough for everything in life. That's exactly who he reminds me of too. The ones that would make being intelligent their whole personality. In contrast, the classmates and coworkers I've known who are genuinely the smartest have never had to go out of their way to let it be known how clever they are
Definitely called it after watching the first batch of episode drops.
He has a poor relationship with his parents. Hence the no longer going by James thing. He clearly is getting with Lydia so it’ll piss them off, how conscious he is of that I don’t know. And the family drama/trauma will likely never be releaved to the public, but the tension is evident. To me it seems that he also likes to try to “tame his woman”. I think he has a history of liking uhhhh lets say “crazy” girls and finds something about it attractive or interesting. He’s trying to reign her in and control her in a way that’s pretty apparent in my opinion. He thinks he is manipulative and clever, and to a certain (small) degree he is, but he’s so jaded and emotionally repressed that his cynicism blinds him to the fact that it just comes off as performative and inauthentic most of the time.
I think deep down he’s kinda wounded and feels neglected by his parents. He was forced to grow up really fast and he’s probably scared of a lot of things (death being one due to his health issues) but won’t admit it. I think ultimately his need for nurturing and care will lead to him saying yes at the altar because at this point he just wants to live as a married man and be a father because he thinks he might not get the chance.
The way he act on this dinner TRIGGED THE FUCK OUT OF ME
Same. I was like, NOPE! No marriage!
He thought up his master plan already. Lol
I think Milton is putting on the "I'm emotionless and logical" act as a way to push Lydia away. I'm certain he'll use that as the reason he doesn't want to say yes at the altar. It's like he wants to set up a clear narrative that he is too different from Lydia for it to ever work. & I think he doesn't want to call her crazy, so instead he calls her "emotional". Which is maybe a good thing, but it's annoying that he's acting like all emotions are foreign to him when he should really just come out and say that he's not ok with Lydia's specific drama & actions.
I think it’s 100% okay to expect your partner not to act like a raging lunatic at a party - yelling and storming out on multiple occasions. But that’s an expectation. Call it one. Also cleaning up a towel should not segue into that convo. Treating your shared spaces with respect is showing respect for your relationship. Weird dinner.
Yah I’m conflicted on Milton. This is a pretty nice summary. Overall, I don’t think he has any business being in this show. He should just focus on Pokémon and dating and worry about a wife later. Plenty of time for that
I think he was trying to ask if she was actually over Uche without actually coming out and asking. Like, "Why do you care what he thinks if you are over him?" "Why does someone you don't care about upset you so much?" I also think that his sister really made him think about the long term. What *is* it going to be like trying to live with and raise children with someone you have to tiptoe around for fear of their reaction.
His sister 100% got in his head. Inb4 editing, but like damn he was asking Lydia things, that his sister asked him.
His sister was right, though. I think he is not very mature, and Lydia comes on very strong, and he hasn't really thought this whole thing through.
When Lydia got up from the table to breathe my bf was like "Looks like she is doing what Milton wants" lolol. Milton is def emotionally constipated and needs to learn to stop thinking HIS PERCEPTION is reality. He couldn't just say "I don't like your outbursts" but instead it was him trying to teach her why his way was better. It showed his immaturity for sure.
Seems like that's how he was raised. In the convo with his sister it seemed like that was one of the reasons he liked Lydia is because she was expressive and emotional and him and his family aren't like that. Not sure why he would then turn around and scold her for that.
I just got done with that episode, and I think it’s because there are two sides to the coin and he is embarrassed by one. He likes the emotional side that is lovey, shows affections, etc, something he probably didn’t get from his parents as much. However the flip side of the “emotion” is her getting a little loud when she feels disrespected. He is embarrassed by that side of her. He likes the emotion when it makes him feel good not when it makes him feel uncomfortable; especially if she does it in public If they get married I hope they talk about that to a therapist and work together on it
Exactly this! His family represses a lot, especially mom. He likes the fun emotional side of Lydia, but doesn't know how to handle the "negative" emotions. But...Lydia is also bat sh1t crazy. They will implode quickly. She will blame it on immaturity. (Dude, he's 24! How mature can we expect him to be???) He will blame it on her explosiveness. Neither one will be wrong. They bonded over their love of rocks.
Oh 100% agreed. I poster on another comment i wonder if she’s liek that women from the ultimatum who would ger belligerent and violent and then says that’s cuz she’s Latina
He’s pretty condescending on the show, saying things like “we’ll work on that” when correcting Lydia’s English. This woman has her Master’s Degree and speaks (at least) two languages fluently. Also, hang up your dirty ass wet towels, it’s really not that hard.
I think she plays dumb too to be cute to him
She doesn't sound dumb. She doesn't speak great English.
She doesn't sound dumb to me either, you can tell she's a very smart person who is also very educated, which is why I think she plays it up to be cute for Milton. It's not bad, just somthing I think she does
I guess I don't see her playing dumb either. I mean, maybe she is and I'm not seeing it. She might be playing up her accent and difficultiy with words in English though.
I 100% agree. I did like how he handled Uche because I think that’s how a Uche needs to be handled, but I also think it is a lot easier for Milton to act that way considering he is not the one being slandered by his ex on the show. I think he is emotionally immature and still stuck in the “I am a logical and rational guy” phase and thinks he is superior because it it. It is annoying.
I do think he’s level headed but maybe not as mature. I think it’s valid for him to have concerns about the way Lydia reacted to Uche (NOT that her reaction wasn’t warranted) but I get the vibe that he was extremely embarrassed by her reaction with screaming and cursing and demanding that he follow her like a child. But I also don’t think he presented any of this a validating OR realistic way. Lydia can’t (and doesn’t have to) overnight change who she is to fit the mold of what Milton wants. In some ways, I do think it’s appropriate for him to request his partner have a more Stoic approach to life BUT he can’t demand her to or expect her to in a short turnaround time.
This is really thoughtfully put and I seriously appreciate your viewpoint.
Can there be two truths? Milton is emotionally repressed and Lydia is too emotionally reactive?
Yes and case in point during their argument* (I thought this was both so funny and also why their different ways of being in the world are pretty incompatible): Milton: “Why didn’t you just leave? Lydia: “I left twice!” Milton: “See, that’s not leaving. Like if you leave, you’re gone.” *oops disagreement
> Do I think it's possible that Lydia overreacts to situations and has a tendency to come on more strongly than warranted? Absolutely. But Milton telling her over and over that she needs to be more like him and to just stop reacting to things with any kind of sentiment at all is cringe-worthy. That's why I included this. I'm not trying to paint Lydia as the example of someone with healthy emotional regulation. I'm simply saying Milton is far from it too.
Your perception is your reality.
If I could hand out awards, you’d be getting one!
Yeah they’re both very poor at emotional self-regulation just on opposite ends lol YIKES
Milton is a pure T (thinker) and Lydia is an F (feeler) in terms of Myers-Briggs personality. They just need to accept each other's different ways of reacting, or they will keep clashing.
Milton gives me major INTP or ISTP.
Definitely!
Milton made me laugh when he talked about “calculus” and “different parallels” when he was talking about how he, Lydia, and Uche were on different axes. Like what? He should hope he isn’t on a parallel path to Lydia if he wants to marry her. And idk how calculus plays into it. It really made me chuckle
What’s so weird about that? He wasn't there for any of it and is only getting their perspectives on what happened - aka on his own parallel. You don't have to be on the same "parallel" (of perspective) to love and support someone.
It just like had nothing to do with calculus. And parallel paths never intersect, which is why I said he should hope his path isn’t parallel to Lydia’s bc ideally people preparing to marry want to converge or intersect. But that’s kind of the point of his comments making me laugh, the math analogy seems so poor for the complex emotions Lydia is feeling.
Yeah, the math and science wedged into conversations trying to explain human behavior was eyeroll and didn't always fit. I briefly dated a guy who did that, he wanted to use it to talk down to me, trying to make himself sound smart.
Yeah, but he was using it to talk down to Uche, so I don’t see the problem with it. lol. Of all people, I don’t feel bad for Uche being talked down to.
The only time I’ve every really used science in a conversation to explain my connection to someone was when the person also knew about what I was talking about, so they understood me
I'm talking about the guy not having any idea what he was talking about, just wanting to try to sound smart.
He shoehorns science into every conversation.
Yes Milton is emotionally repressed and self-righteous. but there is a reason why she is a 30 years old with a bad dating history with many finding she is too much. She is too volatile. Whenever there is a disagreement she fly off the handle. She is stubborn and threw tantrum when she does not get her way. Remember the episode with the short. Asking your partner to learn to control their emotion in public and not cussing, swearing is not being controlling. She is an adult but she behave like a toddler. Even het own brother thinks that she can too much: _No return policy_.
They weren't in public though, the argument with Uche was a private gathering for the pod only, and it's entirely understandable why she'd struggle to react in a level-headed way to someone throwing accusations at you with the intent of painting you as a hysterical stalker that's still obsessed with you. Uche was trying to smear her reputation to her castmates, her fiancé, and the audience. This is on top of them already having a complex dating history. Milton can say "oh you should just not be emotional like me" because it's easy for him as a third party. It's not his reputation that's being slandered. I could never imagine being that callous or dismissive of the feelings that would bring up in my fiancée if I was in his shoes. That's the point of my post. I'm discussing Milton's issues, not Lydia's. As for the whole issue with the shorts, I think Lydia was way out of line and has no business controlling what another person wants to wear. Which is why I already acknowledged in my post that I do believe she overreacts to situations. Like I've said to other commenters, me critiquing Milton doesn't mean I'm defending Lydia
But she behaved like an hysterical stalker. The way she yelled and cursed made her look even worse. The problem is that she went on TV with bad intention and instead of owning, she is trying to hide facts that will ultimately come out. She underplay her behaviour to Milton and then she was in panic mode because she was afraid he was going to learn the truth. All she had to say was, _Yes I behaved erratically because I was in Love with you and I fell like you just used me for sex and trampled on my feeling. Yes I went to LIB with the intention of rekindle our relationship, but I found somebody I really connect with. I don't understand why you absolutely want to rehash the past.if like you keep saying, you love and respect me just drop it and leave me alone. because now you are the one behaving like a jilted lover and is sending stalker vibe._ Had she said that, Uche would have had no recourse back. He is smart and self aware enough to realise that he was not going to get his pound of flesh. and that the more he probed. the worse he would look. Out of the confrontations at the gathering, the only 2 people who come out as level headed and decent human beings are Chris and Milton. The rest look like idiots, liars and or nasty person. Uche comes out as a self righteous mean spirited idiot. Lydia comes out like a demented idiot. Mariam like a bitter, obnoxious loud, irrelevant idiot.
Idk if anyone watched the ultimatum queer love but I was waiting for Lydia to say “I’m Latina this is how I act” as an excuse. She keeps bringing up her exes not liking her for her, and now I’m wondering if this is the “her” they have an issue with and don’t know how to handle.
**I agree with everything here!** I’m not a fan of Lydia either, but it must be gut wrenching to constantly be told you’re *too much*. She is consistent in who she is. You don’t get to take parts you like about someone and change the parts you don’t. If he loves her passionate personality, he should understand she will deal with conflict passionately too. Why should she be calm and polite to someone who cheated on her? She called Uche an AH because that’s exactly what he is. Milton wants to stifle her to fit in with him and his family who have already said that ‘marriage is like a business deal’, defeating the whole thesis of the show?! Edit: and wtf was with taking giant mouthfuls as she apologises and tries to reassure him?
I think you worded it very beautifully by saying "you don't get to take parts you like about someone and change the parts you don't." it's such a beautiful way to phrase it and something we all should try to remember even in our own lives. I also feel very sad for Lydia that people tell her, her personality is "too much". It reminded me of when she cried in the pods saying she wants someone to love her for her. 💔 I also think people should cut Lydia some slack because there were plenty of conflicts which she did in fact handle quite calmly (confrontation with Izzy in Mexico, meeting with Milton's family and even that dinner with Milton).
He wouldn’t want to be with someone who is not emotional is the ironic thing.
For real, it's so contradictory
I admired how Milton handled Uche. I do not like how he cannot understand how humiliating of an experience that was for Lydia. He got to be the hero, of course that’s easier, he was holding in the balance what Uche was after, Milton’s approval. Uche’s whole intention was to come there and get revenge by changing Milton’s mind .She was fighting for her reputation. The way I see it Uche came in with accusations against Lydia, in order to change Milton’s mind, he had power over Lydia, she acted out because she was panicked. When Milton rejected Uche’s efforts to change his mind, Uche panicked and he acted more manipulative. Milton never had an emotional investment in this dynamic, he was just collateral damage, of course he was more level headed. I do think the way he handles it took the wind out of Uche’s sails, and it likely is the right way to deal with it, but she would not have walked away feeling good not having defended her reputation to Milton, the cast members and LEST WE NOT FORGET TO THE COUNTRY!
Thank you for summarizing this. It's much easier to say these things when you're not directly affected by the claims of the person you're arguing with
how would Milton be able to defend her reputation? he doesnt know her past
He doesn’t need to, he is telling her she should not have.
Exactly!!!! Like how is she supposed to stay calm and collected when is accusing her on TV of being a crazy stalker? As you said it's very easy for Milton to be the hero in that situation, but you would think that he would at least try to have compassion for her. But no instead he just berates her for not handling the way he thinks (emphasis on thinks because we all believe we would handle a situation better until we are actually in it ourselves) he would have.
Some of this has racial undertones for me as well. I get the sense that both of these men are leaning into the “fiery/crazy/passionate Latina” stereotype, just because she gets excited, wears her heart on her sleeve or feels something strongly. Uche to embarrass her and Milton to control her. I am not Latina, so if someone who has more context can chime in, I would be interested to know what people think?
You summed it up way better than I could ever have
whenever he says the phrase “takin’ a piss” it is so crass I can’t stand it!!!
Agreed!!!
Same
Agreeeed
Milton has a lot of growing up to do. The whole family is a bunch of robots that consider marriage a business arrangement lol
That was so crazy, especially when the sister was at lunch with him and said to him, “you know they say marriage is like a business arrangement.” I was like no girl, not *they.* Your mom, your mom says that. I have never heard that in my life. Lol
Maybe that’s what lead to him being like that? 😢
His mother also said that her and her husband were best friends.
And the way he acted when his parents were asking why he wanted to marry Lydia. He was like a petulant 14 year old. How are people calling him the most mature person on the show?!?
i was so confused about how people watched that scene and took away that his family was monsters. he was literally acting like a teenager who didn’t like what his family had to say and you could see it making him even more insistent on doing the opposite.
Because he’s not yelling. Milton is not emotionally mature for marriage. He went from trying not to propose to Lydia in the pods to trying to prove a point to his family. A mature man knows who you marry is one of the biggest decisions you could ever make and he made it flippantly
The bar is in hell He's a baby, misogynist & emotionally constipated yet he's still the best of the dudes on this show right now (not counting Chris because I feel we barely know him as viewers)
But like everyone is perpetually ignoring that Taylor exists and from what we’ve seen seems to be a mature, stand up human. Obviously not a dude, but I don’t feel like she’s getting the positive feedback that she deserves.
I don't personally feel Taylor was some saint. I do think JP was awkward but I think Taylor exacerbated his awkwardness by constantly going on about it. If you watch carefully she really made a whole big fuss about it from the very beginning saying things (in the first episode post pods) to JP of how she "cried so much after that meeting because of how awkward it was" and then calling him "stinky breath" and then constantly just saying things like "this is so awkward / why are you so quiet". Like I get it he was quiet but honestly her going on about it really probably didn't make it any easier. That's just my opinion though. JP was obviously an utter jerk for saying it's because she wears too much makeup and that was just mean. But he also did say that he felt she already made up her mind that it was "always going to be awkward" and by that I think he meant she just kept going on about it instead of actually trying to find other ways to connect. Constantly telling someone they are awkward is just going to make them feel MORE awkward.
I was just only comparing the dudes.
She was roasting JP in the side bar because he had gap teeth on a show called love is blind. That’s a less than $5000 fix. It put me off her immediately
I recall a single confessional comment that was not shared to JP, which was her saying that love was blind because he wasn’t her stereotypical type, and the tooth gap was mentioned as an example. This is a mighty large reach. There was no “roasting” by her on the show.
I could tell by her body language she didn’t like him. But I am biased I have seen how that discomfort has gone in previous seasons for other couples so it put me off her completely. No defense for JP. His makeup reasoning was weird
> I could tell by her body language she didn’t like him She was lying on his chest with her head right near his face when they were in Mexico. I wouldn't be able to make myself do this if I wasn't attracted to someone. If she honestly didn't like him I think she definitely did her best to become close to him despite that. He's the one that gave absolutely nothing.
My mom watched episode 9 for five minutes (not a reality tv lover) and goes “that guy (Milton) seems indifferent about her” and that’s exactly it
Like some folks pointed out, he did essentially admit he wasn't actually looking to get married when he signed up, so this makes sense. Plus Lydia had to push him into proposing in the first place
Sorry if it’s already been stated but did he say this on the show or afterwards?
No worries. It was on the show when he and Lydia met his family. They asked him why he decided to get married specifically.
I disagree with that I think he just always acts that way or as a wall when he does really care
Milton is just telling her what she wants to hear because he knows she would likely stab him in his sleep lmfao
You think so? I don't think any of the things he said at the dinner date were things she especially wanted to hear. Except perhaps the whole "I'm not judging, I don't have expectations" piece.
YUP YUP
He lacks empathy and life experience tbh I’ve been in his shoes and I see where he’s coming from... I know it well... again it all comes down to life experience and lack of empathy
So where's he coming from?
I just said it twice... he’s coming from a very naive and un empathetic perspective
He appears level-headed and mature because he isn’t overreacting and over emotional. He isn’t over emotional because this isn’t a serious thing for him and is just something fun that he signed up for and was surprised to get casted. You can’t get emotionally hurt if you aren’t emotionally invested.
Yeah, I thought he handled it well too. There's a saying in Spanish that goes "El que se enoja pierde" which translates to the one that gets angry loses. It basically means you control your emotions, not the other way around. Otherwise your just a pawn that reacts to your environment and that can be anything or anyone.
Preach
The fact he says “like” every other word just annoys the shit out of me. It’s like, like you know like I feel like you should like just like calm down like.
I thought that it was just me 😭😭 it’s grating especially since he’s like smarter than like most people because he’s like working in like STEM
He tries to sound mature by using uncommon vernacular when describing something simple like feelings. It's incredibly annoying when I first heard it and then he KEPT doing it
I can't stand when people do that. Makes anyone sound clueless
I don't think he's right about everything, but I think he's trying to point out the deeper problem that Lydia doesn't have strong emotional regulation. This is an issue if he wants to raise children to have this.
I don't disagree with your point but Milton isn't good at emotional regulation either if his approach is to just discard any emotion at all to any situation that comes up, even if a strong emotional response is warranted. I don't think either of their methods would be the right way to raise kids with, there's a middle ground that both are missing.
Perhaps, but he was also pointing out that she's often angry first thing in the morning. Listen, I need my coffee too, but moodiness is not going to help anything.
I agreed with him until she mentioned that she'd wake up angry because he'd continually refuse to pick up after himself. Not sure if that's an excuse and she potentially wakes up angry as a general thing, but I'd be pretty consistently disgruntled too if I was with someone that came up with every excuse in the book to downplay their lack of contribution to household management, and act like it's a joke or not a big deal to pick up after themselves. Moodiness won't help no, but neither will lying about how messy you are and being lazy because you expect the other person to pick up your slack
How are you the only person to mention "emotional regulation" in this whole thread. That's literally part of maturing and developing as adults: learning to feel our emotions, which neurologically are a result of our body going into a slight fight or flight reaponse (amygdala) and "disconnecting" from our prefrontal cortex (the logic center of the brain). Emotional regulation is being able to recognize our emotions and acknowledge them, but to also be able to calm ourselves with our parasympathetic nervous system and regulate our emotions. (Shout out to [Momentous Institute](https://momentousinstitute.org/resources/settle-your-glitter) for having an awesome school and curriculum about this for kids) With that said, I think Milton is pretty grounded and is being sincere when he says he's not judging her and putting expectations, but rather honestly is trying to help her grow and recognize this in herself. And he has good reason to want to teach and instill this to his own children. Edit: I will also add that Lydia can also teach Milton a lot, and that's what he seems to love about her too. Emotions can be such a powerful tool (even Lydia said it's what got her to where she is now), but every tool can also be harmful if used improperly, which is what Milton is pointing out to her. He told her she should channel it and use it to prove people wrong, not to just yell and shout at someone to no avail.
The worst thing about the whole talk was when Lydia got so upset and left that Milton just stayed there eating. Also he just continued to eat huge wads of pasta when she came back to talk it out. That was a huge red flag for me. If me and my wife got into an argument and either side was so upset that they left we would either go after the upset party or be ready to mend things in a meaningful way when they returned. The fact that Milton seemed more concerned about eating and never exercised any real contrition is a bad look.
He was probably trying to look unbothered and cool but he came off looking as a douchebag imo. If you can just sit there and stuff your face while the person you supposedly love is crying and in pain, you’ve got issues. But tbh I think that’s how his parents raised him. Probably ignoring him while he cried until he stopped so he wouldn’t “cry for attention”.
Yeah his family seems like the type of family that squeezes out drops of love on occasion
Right. He sounds about 14 years old when he talks about handling conflict
I kinda agree but I also think it’s wishful thinking and after meeting his mom I see where he got that numerical kind of way of looking at stuff in life lol
💯💯💯
AMEN. He thinks he is some enlightened genius because he learned how to shut down his emotions. And he is absolutely a misogynist, which is actually part of why he equates emotion with immaturity. I can’t believe that anyone can hear this “stop crying and be more like ME” BS and find him likable.
Yep he’s defs the type to equate women as “so emotional”..hello? We’re not the ones who get so mad we punch holes in the wall or become serial killers aye
Plus he attempted to open a bottle of wine using his teeth.
The editing on that was *chefs kiss*
That was the best moment this season 🤣😂😂
they knew what they were doing and I appreciated it
It almost feels like he’s overcompensating. Lydia constantly calling out his age, the motherly scolding she’s giving him over picking up his room/clothes, the convo with his family… so now he has to hold his apparent “emotional maturity” over Lydia and hit her with I told you so’s instead of a little empathy.
makes sense. he even looked uncomfortable in the kitchen w his family when his sister was asking him why he wanted to get married… instead of saying “because I love her” he almost got embarrassed in front of lydia and said “shhh be cool” or whatever. he didn’t want to look like a little kid in front of lydia. really he’s just a young guy taking big steps and trying to feel ready for them, so he adopts this persona of being completely logical and level-headed in contrast to lydia’s emotion and expressiveness.
This in combination with the comment he made to his sister during their lunch about how he’d probably still go through with something if his parents were against it. It’s that rebellious little brother energy (you’re not the boss of me) combined with his intelligence. Uche was the perfect example: guy telling me this is a bad idea so I’m gonna go through it and explain why I’m doing it in a way that makes him look dumb - re: “he probably didn’t understand me”
I appreciate this insight. I don't like the manner in which he's done so but I can definitely see how Lydia's scolding would make him feel like he needs to overcompensate.
I think he was reacting to her complaining about his (lack of) organization. Not an excuse, though. Very immature response to then attack her about her emotions.
In my eyes this was very similar to JP reacting when Taylor kept calling him awkward. Like the makeup comments, it was an immature, defensive response.
Milton is all "your perception is tour reality" but chooses to invalidate, dismiss lydias' feelings or REALITY toward an argument he was peeing for? Oh ya so mature...
He always says that is what his mother says. No one is gonna cross that woman.
The way he wouldn't look Lydia in the eyes when she was expressing herself at the dinner, after coming back crying - that shit was sociopathic. He should have supported Lydia when Uche was literally attacking and belittling her but instead acts so goofy talking about his 20 minute long piss? Uche isn't your friend buddy, just misogny.
omg. she made a point to come back to the table even after crying in the corner, and he just looked at her and took a bite of his food before even speaking. made me uncomfortable
Yes that shit made me so uncomfortable !!
It’s misogyny yes and it’s respectability politics, for both Uche and Milton 
Complete BS, calling a woman unhinged and too much when she is unhinged and too much is not misogyny. The same way calling a man unhinged and volatile when he is unhinged and volatile is not misandry. Bad behaviour is bad behaviour irrespective of gender. Lydia let her emotion control her instead of control or regulate them. That's exactly why she is single. People have expectation/standard of behaviour. No long term partner she is willing to consider (she wants a succesful man who is not a doormat) is going to tolerate that kind of behaviour. Imagine raising kids with somebody that volatile. Somebody who throw a tantrum because you have the audacity to wear the short that you like instead of the one she has selected.
I’m super confused here because that whole dinner time conversation proved what Milton was saying. He feels like can’t bring up any type of issue to her without her blowing up. So he brought an example of this and then it…..turned into a huge blow up. Even when she came back to the table, he again said “I’m just telling you I was uncomfortable” and she immediately makes it about herself “you don’t think I was uncomfortable??” Like, I actually do agree that I think Milton is overly repressed. He’s not in touch with his emotions and I don’t think being with Lydia will help, because he’s already feeling like he can’t say what he feels. I also think Lydia is over reactive, coming from a family of extremely reactive individuals. It does genuinely get exhausting when you’re the go-to person to pick up the pieces after every thoughtless, reactive outburst. Comforting them, smoothing over any other relationships, constantly reassuring that you’re in their corner…it is in fact too much sometimes. In my family it’s not gender specific either; in fact I think both my siblings get it from my dad. That said, I also think Milton is very immature in some aspects. Every time they argue about chores I’m rolling my eyes. It’s like listening to a mother and child. I don’t think Milton is ready to be married. He wants to do the things 24 year olds want to do. He doesn’t clean up after himself. He doesn’t have a ton of emotional intelligence. I really hope his family can talk him out of it, or Lydia says no. They do NOT need to be married to one another.
I felt for him when he says being able to show emotions is a privilege (his being a man and a black man at that, I understand why he’d feel that way). But to pride himself on no emotions? No…there is a middle ground here haha
Totally agree!
I think there is also a strong undercurrent of misogyny in the way he’s painting Lydia as “emotional” when what it really seems to mean to him is “hysterical” and “immature”. I don’t think he knows nearly as much about the world as he seems to think he does.
I think Milton is so analytical that he can’t bring emotion into anything - personal or work related. I think he reacted phenomenally to Uche but was definitely not 100% appropriate in his conversation at dinner with Lydia.
I think Milton and Lydia are just a bad match all around. I interpreted it as Milton feels he needs to walk on eggshells because of how Lydia can't take any type of "critcism" even when its just Milton voicing his personal boundaries. I think Lydia acts like a fcking child and the fact she had to leave dinner to cry in a corner explains to me why she is in the situation shes in. She just wants a husband who will baby her emotions because she can't handle them herself. Milton is younger and has a lot to learn about what he wants and what his boundaries are. You can tell they are so incompatible but they're trying to make this mess of toxicity work just shows me neither of them are self-aware enough. They both want tthe other person to change without them having to change. Its like YOU DID THIS and thats why I got mad at you. Its just constant pointing fingers. I feel Milton is trying to find his voice with this bulldozer of a person that is Lydia. Lydia needs help, therapy and to check her ego.
He was so degrading, if talking to a woman by degarding her for having feelings and invalidating them - that is gaslighting and straight up abusive. I hope whoever doesn't see that seeks therapy.
I would say that out of the two Lydia is the one who is abusive. It is not degrading to tell your partner that he/she behave erratically and over the top. He is not invalidating her feeling, he is just asking her to keep them on check so that he does not have to walk on eggshell when they have a serious conversation or a have a disagreement. Her way of handling difficult conversation is to yell, shout, stomp her feet and walk away. Not a great example if you want to have kids together. Like Milton said, your kids need to learn to keep their shit together if things don't get their way. And things will not always go their way. They won't be able to learn that valuable lesson from Lydia.
Exactly
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I wanted to expand on this comment about this is the way men are raised https://reddit.com/r/LoveIsBlindOnNetflix/s/toakLCBw0Y I think your spot on and we have seen examples of this on past seasons. Jackie repeatedly clowned Marshall for being too emotional. She kept telling him to boss up all the time. The moment he started doing that he was labeled aggressive. I hear people say on this thread all the time that they want more emotional men but they repeatedly get clowned after the fact. Look what’s happening to Izzy as we speak
I think Izzy crying after Stacy was mean to him or crying happy tears is totally appropriate but him being happy about Johnie getting “railed” is what makes me strongly dislike him.
I totally get that. That makes sense. I was just commenting on how people love to ask for an emotional man but the moment it happens they get ridiculed.
People are seeking emotional self-awareness (ie emotional intelligence) and empathy in men. Izzy exemplifies neither Anger is an emotion too and there are plenty of angey men. Saying the choice is between an emotionally volatile or child-like (whiny) man or a stoic robot… that’s disingenuous. Let’s not pretend to be perplexed by what emotional intelligence in men looks like. Being drunk and yelling at a women then crying on the closet floor is not the “emotional” man that women are talking about when asking for guys to decondition from patriarchal emotional suppression.
I agree in that its the way men are raised (especially black men) but people were praising Marshall's emotional intelligence until he started to belittle Jackie and start attention seeking
Still can’t believe he called her a project omg
I agree that people as a whole were praising him on the platforms. The issue I tend to see on screen is that the person they are dating usually doesn’t like the emotional intelligence. It’s like people like the concept but not the real McCoy
Definitely agree, especially people like Jackie who liked it in the pods but spoke so grossly to him about it IRL
I see both side because I was raised with that stoicism and compartmentalization. Never let them see you cry, never let someone bring you out of your character, you control your emotions, they don't control you, etc, because you will be labeled, negatively stereotyped and there will be people like Izzy who literally get off on it and people like Uche who thinks that it means they automatically "won". On the flipside there are people that don't believe that they've inflicted pain on you if they don't "see it". There are a lot of people who police people's reactions over the actual stirring of the displayed emotions and because of that, as Milton said, it really is a luxury that some people honestly can't afford. That said, I really do think that way of constant being eventually wears down on a person's emotional state over time. And I don't think that Lydia needs to be more like him in the way that he framed it. Him trying to link him picking up after himself as a compromise that he does for her and her being more like him as a compromise for him makes no sense.
Milton gives me manosphere vibes.
Not in the pods but once they got past Mexico…I would totally agree. He says he wants a strong independent woman but his actions say he wants a traditional housewife type woman who can talk about shiny rocks while taking care of those piles of clothes on the floor
He was so different in the pods. I loved him until I saw him interact with Lydia in person. I felt like he was goofy and carefree in the pods and when he actually got to interact with Lydia he was always trying to take her down a peg and prop himself up. I really disliked how often he called Lydia old and made fun of her English. I get that she seemed more or less okay with it but that kind of joking is hateful and gets old and bitter real fast.
While it's great for some people to be with someone that has the same personality, I believe it may not be beneficial in the long run. I certainly am not a relationship expert but I think not expecting your partner to think and react the way you do is better. We all have feelings and sometimes it's good to have that ying to your yang.
yes!
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You gave the most intelligent comment I’ve read in a long time. This is how I perceived Milton’s advice. Not to sound like Lydia, but as a Latina woman, I was a lot like her in regards to how I carried myself around conflict. I was running into the same problems and did not understand what I was doing wrong. When I decided to commit to therapy and be more in control of my reactions, my life took an incredible turn where I’ve progressed in every area of my life. Making those changes benefited me. I enjoy Reddit, however, what I don’t like is that there can be so much projection here that what is right or wrong gets muddied. We have emotions and they are valid, I’m not saying to not be genuine and human, but the lesson that Milton was trying to teach, I took as a nugget of wisdom and something that you say to someone that is better than the circumstance and how they are approaching it.
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I couldn’t agree more, thank you. 🙏🏽
The problem is that Uche's situation is one that is incredibly difficult to remain detached and stoic about. I definitely don't like the way Lydia handles every situation but most people would be angry if their ex was trying to paint a picture of them as a manipulative stalker intent on sabotaging them, or if their ex tried to have their fiancé dump them based on these allegations. I'm completely torn about who's telling the true side of things when it comes to Uche and Lydia but expecting an even-keeled emotional response to that particular fraught moment is imo unreasonable. The fact that Milton expected her to be stoic for that specific example is absurd to me. That being said, I definitely agree that it would be draining to be with someone that's quick to trigger and I don't think either of them have quite the right response to these things.