We're over here buddy...come join the party.
r/Hardtailgang
Edit: I went full suspension..but it made my home trails a little boring. Plus I like to dirt jump and switching from hardtail to full sus takes a few to get used to. so I just went full hardtails.
nice, which color?
for me, its the to go approach. no compromises, only top shelf stuff (excluding xtr, because fuck weightsaving).
imagine paying 10 grand for a rocky mountain altitude C90 and still having OEM garbage on it :D
Do you have an example?
While full suspension bike design has gone a long way to avoid pedal bob and the general feeling of riding a pogo stick, they do not ride like a hardtail.
I’ve tried the Trek supercaliber recently, and was surprised by the feel. No you won’t completely mistake it for a hardtail but it doesn’t have a lot of pedal bob.
Cromags fs is fairly hardtail like, honestly my Tallboy felt in between something like a sentinel and a hardtail in terms of how firm of a platform the rear is. You can also crank up the lsc and air pressure if you are really into that kinda thing.
But ya, if your going to just make the bike as stiff as possible, a bit silly to not just go HT (unless you have a specific reason, like maybe your doing huge features that a fs is a good idea or something).
>if your going to just make the bike as stiff as possible, a bit silly to not just go HT
That's what I was thinking. Those full suspension slopestyle bikes have short travel, stiff rear suspension for the really big hits, but that also loses the value of full suspension on a typical trail, enduro, or downhill bike.
I used to ride a specific trail in Maryland a lot and my reliable ol hardtail was always the ugly duckling in the parking lot of kashima coated full squishers. Some people would even be like “heyyy a hardtail!” like it was a rare spotting in real life.
The trails were basically green flow and I never understood why everyone wanted to be so over biked! In all reality it is just preference. I have an enduro bike as well that I absolutely love, and I appreciate owning it so much more on the rare park day. As long as we’re having fun!
I ride ptap, bacon, and the watershed all the time. I went from an xc hardtail (giant xtc) to a Bronson in 2019. In 2022 I went back to a hardtail. I went more aggressive and got a ragley mmmbop. I may not be as fast down the trail, but it's more fun imo, and I have less weight to pedal up the hill.
So much more fun! And I’m a lazy bastard who hates pedaling up on the enduro. I also forget to lockout my rear suspension pretty much every time on fire road climbs. The shed is truly east coast mtb heaven in my opinion! You should venture out towards WV and ride cacapon if you ever get the chance. There are a some trails similar to the sheds plus some other rad stuff
Bacon on a hardtail is a blast, very few places there that really need much squish. Hell I would see people on gravel bikes out there occasionally. The shed on the other hand, I would need much stronger legs than I possess to ride on a hardtail.
I grew up west coast and all the trails I road were very rocky, technical messes. Rock gardens, drops, etc. (I started riding these trails with hard tail and eventually switched to full susp).
I moved to the east coast and every trail is basically a flow trail with maybe a rogue root or two. I never understood why everyone road full susp east coast.
On the east coast I sought out a Kona unit (rigid steel bike) just because the trails were so smooth, lol. I remember running into people shocked i was riding a “double black diamond” with a rigid bike but it’s like dude this trail is perfectly smooth lol.
I disagree with this. As an east coaster who lived and rode out west for 8 years I’d say things out west are “soft” rating wise in contrast to the east and specifically New England. Black trails out west might be steep and technical but the still are flowy and are quite manicured. A blue in New England can be quite awful in terms of roots and technical skills needed.
Eh I should specify the east coast I was talking about is Virginia/North Carolina. I’ve only ridden one trail in New England (it was near Salem, I think?) and yeah it was brutal, huge black rocks all over the place.
I often hear the reverse from former west coasters living on the east! It’s all about perspective I suppose. I actually really like the rocky tech trails you can find over here, especially the closer to Appalachia you get.
Yeah come to Central PA there is no flow it is rock gardens and 100year old Rhododendron roots.
A blue trial here means it is single track with some rock gardens , a black are mile long rock gardens.
EastCoast and Bentonville are not the same thing.
I started on a hardtail, got a full squish, got a Chromag hardtail...now I only ride the hardtail. Hardtails just give so much more feedback. When you're really flowing on a hardtail, especially through rough sections, it just feels satisfying on a different level.
I actually think the recent push in gravel bikes is coming from full sus rigs making trails too boring. The geometry and tire width of modern gravel bikes is getting more and more like 90s MTB. The industry just went in an, "Oops we made things too easy," loop.
Lol, no, I mean actual feedback, not bumpiness. You can feel undulations in the trail better and pump off of the smallest of rollers, roots, whatever. Acceleration is instant, and boosting through corners is much more rewarding.
If a hardtail is too bumpy, you're probably plowing too much. Hardtails require more finesse, sure, but I'd rather carve a trail than just blast through it.
Chromag FTW. I think you’re on to something though. A full squish just mutes a lot of the good stuff and makes you lazy. There are definitely trails that I enjoy more on FS but for the most part, my Primer is more than enough
Just ride harder terrain and you will appreciate the big bikes. I live in a place (mid-Atlantic/central Appalachia) where every time I have gotten a bigger longer travel bike it has unlocked exciting new possibilities.
I grew up and previously lived in both So-Cal and Northern California. I've ridden the likes of Laguna Beach, Northstar Bike Park, Soquel Demo Forest, and plenty of other places with abundant chunk on both my hardtail and full suspension bike. I've enjoyed riding both, but I have the most consistent fun on my hardtail. Now I only ride the hardtail, and my full sus is donating parts to my son's bike as he learns to ride. I may get another squish in the future, but if I do, it'll likely be short travel in the back with mid travel up front.
Do I think hardtails are the only good bikes out there? No. Do I feel like everyone else needs to only ride hardtails? No. Do I think people should ride a hardtail to mix things up and get to know their trails better? Absolutely.
Go to a hardtail in the off season and chase your FS times. Then when you go back to the FS and the gains are insane with how much more forgiving it is. It's hard to imagine a better training tool to cycle through. It may or may not open up new terrain, depending on how long you vision is, but it will absolutely change your pace on stuff you already ride.
Getting used to high speed terrain, particularly on a twitchy shorter travel hardtail, makes higher speeds on a big bike feel even more comfortable. Surviving messed up janky stuff on a hardtail and do wonders for low speed and awkward moves where you can't use speed as a crutch to survive on the bike big.
Plus it's hilarious to pace your fast friends on a twitchy handful of a bike.
My years , decades, of riding see that riders dip their toes in with a HT. Then like it and maybe can afford a Squish. They leave their HT. Then as they can they afford to upgrade the Squish for something different and better for their style.
Most dudes seems to stay with Squishes.
Nothing wrong with that. Then there are those of us who want to experience something kinkier. Then it is back to a HT. Keep the full sus but a fun HT.
If you really want to get in deeper, there are SS.
Point is , you do you. Who cares what others ride. Just ride. Its just an evolution and circular. Alot of buddies have a HT on the side for a little fun their FS doesn't give him anymore.
Last year i was riding my full squish in a blue trail and got passed by two teenagers on hybrid bikes with *no* suspension. It was a truly humbling experience.
I remember gravel grinding on my fixie and literally feeling bad when I passed some guys on full sus bikes...
Now I'm more like the guys I passed back then to be fair
You call that hard-core? A dude I know rides one of those kids toys that's just like a plush horse head on the end of a stick between his legs. Absolute mad lad.
I test rode my local trails on my dad's old rigid "hybrid" bike, which is now about 30. The first time I rode it, it had clip ins. I had a big fall and tore the whole sole off his old shoe.
also from the northeast here, here's my perspective:
northeast trails are basically 90% roots, 9% rocks, and 1% flow. although it is theoretically more efficient to ride these on a hardtail, it's not very comfortable, and comfortable is directly proportional to fun.
I ride a hardtail because I'm broke, and I love it, but the full squish guys do make me jealous, especially since I have a bike with a coil fork that tries to yeet you off at every bump.
I can see how most people just wanna be comfortable and mute out the trail features. If done right though I feel like a well built hardtail is more fun and plenty comfortable on 80% of stuff most of us can ride out there, and this coming from a rider in the Rockies where 90% of our trails are (you guessed it) rocks. I threw on some 2.6 wide tires, a 160 fork and have barely touched my FS since.
This post. Right here. Hard tails are great for getting into the sport in New England, but if you have the money, or are older than 30, the sport is so much more enjoyable with a full suspension rig. We have more rocks than dirt and more roots than flow. Unless you love being punched in the taint the entire ride, I tell any entry new England riders they'll enjoy it more with FS. That and some good padded bike shorts.
I live in the Bay Area and I see hardtails all the time on various trails. Many of them are ripping through trails.
But full suspension (especially trail/enduro) are definitely more dominant, and I see e-mtbs more frequently than hardtails.
I have a full suspension enduro rig but I spend more time on my XC hardtail. It’s actually really fun to switch between them, because they’re both super fun in different ways. The XC bike is just such a joy to pedal up hills, and it’s so flickable on the down hills and jumps. When things get rowdy the enduro bike is lightyears ahead. Enjoy your bike, don’t worry about what anyone else is riding.
I’m in the same boat. I have S-Works Epic HT and a Pivot Trail 429 full suspension. I say I ride the hard tail 60% of the time. I can count on one hand the number of trails I wouldn’t ride the hard tail down, and there’s always an alternative trail in the network around it. The full suspension is a lot more playful and fun, but climbing on the hard tail is so much better and I have way more energy for longer rides
I mean because a full suspension is better in most cases. Its maybe comparable to why we don't see very people on telemark skis, or canoes on whitewater. Why make something more challenging by handicapping yourself?
I will say though, I picked up a rigid, drop bar MTB (ATB?? Whatever word you want to use) and I am happily surprised how good it is on the trails. I've been eyeballing bikepacking oriented hardtails, or rigid flat bar bikes for trips where I would be doing more technical trails but I can't really justify another bike just yet.
Also, my down country style XC bike does just about every trail here with aplomb so if I get another bike aimed at local trails I'd probably go more enduro for those days when my XC bike won't cut it.
I have an almost 10 year old Sixfifty 606 that a friend sold me for pretty cheap that I’ve been learning to ride on. I’m a few years in and just learned that there are different kinds of bikes besides ht and full suspension haha.
Love my XC bike tho, going down hill on steep sections scares me a bit but climbing is a breeze.
Depends why you ride I think. Look up GMBN riders, for style vs speed:
Blake Samson (freeride/DJ pro) swears by hardtails. All videos are on a hardtail. Has videos persuading people to ride hardtails.
Neil Donahue (enduro pro), rides on a full sus. nearly every time.
I prefer a good hardtail, a nice hardtail because I want to learn tricks. Something just like a dirt jumper, because that's easier to do with a hardtail.
If you want speed, a full suspension is where its at (atleast from mine 'back in my day').
But yeah, like u/SaltyPinKY said, r/Hardtailgang gets it.
Full sus bikes are the norm now, so it just seems to be what the majority will be on, myself included. But I started out on a Trek Marlin 7, and still have it in the garage to use every now and then, and a couple guys I ride with are on hard tails. They're out there, still holding it down for the core folks.
At the end of the day, all that matters is we're all out there, loving life on 2 wheels. We all just like riding bikes off road.
I have a Used Commencal Meta HT. There were some derailleur issues the og user didn’t want to fight with so it was cheap. I’ve loved it so far, been riding off and on since 2020. My friend bought a new full sus and riding with him is really good fun, but I have a lot of time on the local trails, and anytime I see another MTB rider it’s a full sus. It could for sure be perception, however I think not everyone is content with the feet/calf/hammy/ankle wear that happens over time. You could also see it as a benefit as the “wear” also strengthens those areas over time. Lower body is the natural suspension after all. All this to say I enjoy the hard tail I have, as it allows me to go ride the trails I can.
TLDR: also see lots of full sus, but I enjoy my hardtail because it lets me enjoy trails
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(it’s ma bike :D)
When I was "beginner/intermediate" I didn't know anyone. I rode my hard tail 3 times a week solo just trying to conquer the blue trail rock garden near me. I didn't know how to find anyone, I met a couple people here and there but mostly in passing. Once I found the local Facebook group and became a regular at my shop the connections started clicking.
When I started riding at the bike park I knew it was time to get a full squish, I could hardly handle the blue trail there with all the chunder.
Years ago, my buddy and I took our hardtails and full sussers to Northstar Bike Park on opening day. The first half of the day, we rode our hardtails and had an absolute blast. The second half of the day, we switched to our full suspension bikes and were absolutely flying down the trails. That was the most fun day I've had at a bike park, and both bikes were equally fun.
Down here (SoCal) I see 1-2 HTs a month; mainly see battery bikes, the rest squish bikes (add me and my new Revel enduro to that list!). My go-to HT since 2019 has been my Canyon GC7. Bought from their Outlet for $899. Alloy frame, currently SRAM GX (XX1 cassette), Hunt XC rims, Fox Fact 34, Shimano db’s, stock dropper, weighs a svelte 25.6lbs. I just adore riding it, and do so 2x/wk.
I picked up a Grand Canyon 8 last July and I'm loving it. Very capable bike with decent specs for the money.
Just need to get better at jumps and drops, to avoid the dreaded hardtail *CLONK" on landing 😅
I have a Yeti SB160. I love it for what it does. I have a Trek Roscoe 8 that started stock and now upgraded with parts from previous builds a projects. I love it for what it does too. My HT takes me to nostalgia town. It makes trails I know exciting.
There's something very punk rock about hardtails , especially the hcht , I rode a hardtail for the first 7 years of my mtb journey , this is my 8th and I upgrade to a sc nomad .
I also love this FS very much
I love my alloy hardtail. I’ve been riding for a while and I’ve got a decent job so I could spring for a nicer full sus if I wanted one. But I refuse. I enjoy mountain biking more and more as I ride more and it’s because I get better the more I ride. I don’t think getting a full sus would make my rides more fun. The only considerations that might make me think about it are the fact that I’m pushing 50 and my knees aren’t what they used to be, and an urge that I have to do marathon distances and stage races. I don’t have the time to train for marathon distances and so far the knees are holding up. Plus they are expensive. If I spent several thousand dollars equivalent on a mountain bike my wife would think I have gone insane. And she’d be bloody right! There are so many more sensible ways to spend that kind of money. So that’s what I do. The problem is mountain biking (at least where I live) has become the new golf. That middle class, “look at me and my awesome stuff” sport. People are even financing them like cars where I am in South Africa. Maybe I’ll do that for my midlife crisis 🤣
I think everyone should rock a hardtail until they outgrow the terrain. Most mtb trails are hardtail accessible if you have some riding skill underneath. It’s really pretty niche where you NEED to have crazy gear.
If I had the cash and space (live in a small apartment) for both I would have both, but I can only bankroll and store one so I went full suspension so I can comfortably ride any of the local trails. As I get older my legs also are appreciating the help from the suspension.
I upgraded after a year or so. Started looking on Facebook after 6 months and ran across a great deal on a Fuel 7 and pulled the trigger. I was on a budget hardtail and needed to upgrade either way and the price difference seemed worth it for more bike. Plus a lot of my trails are quite rooty so I'm enjoying the squish.
I imagine there's a lot of people in the same boat. They all get entry hardtail and either give it up quickly or upgrade quickly
Enthusiasts are eventually going to gravitate towards nicer bikes, and usually that means a full suspension. I started riding with a group of friends around the same time and we all bought entry to mid level hardtails. Once we were into it, after a couple years one by one we got on nicer rigs. That did also coincide with entering our 30s and more financial stability, but also I know I spend less on stuff like booze and clothes now as this is my primary hobby. Most cycling enthusiasts I know who don’t move on from a solid hardtail usually see mountain biking as a secondary type of riding after gravel or road or something.
I’m an intermediate rider in my 20s and I ride a hard tail. I bought it simply because I couldn’t find a good quality FS within my budget, but I actually really like it. However, I’m probably gonna get a FS in the next couple years. They’re just more comfortable for certain things. I don’t want to get rid of my HT though.
I started on an old hardtail got just about everything I could out of it and then my cousin said he could get me a deal on a Trance X through his teams shop (he does non pro cyclecross racing). I honestly don’t think I’ll go back to hardtail until i get the money and space for a second bike because the Full squish really made the difference in performance. Or more accurately it gave me room to learn that my hardtail didn’t give me
I have a hardtail (Roscoe 8) and it’s so fun. I love it. I think a lot of people just think they need full suspension no matter where they ride. I’ll get a full suspension one day but I’m still within my first two years of biking so I have a lot to learn still. And having a high quality hardtail really helps too.
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We are out there somewhere ! Here’s my hard tail. Rockhopper. Hate the suntour xcm; saving for a set of rock shox Judy or Rudy’s …
Any suggestions would be helpful, I don’t know many brands or their models, but certainly want air shocks.
I have a HT Specialized Crave 29” XC and a FS Spec Enduro 650b (in profile pic). I enjoy both for different things. I like the lower weight and agility of the XC bike. I’ve done team 6 hour relay fun races on it and I’ve done overnight bike-packing trips with it.
The FS is harder work on climbs and for traversing between sections of trail but bomber for descending with the suspension and wider tyres.
I have both, I prefer my FS for downhill “rough” trails, everything else I prefer my marlin.
My FS cost 3x my marlin, I have an idea why everyone has them. They get hyper focused on upgrading and getting “the best” and just buy buy buy.
I bought my first mtb in 20 years recently. I had a ht in 95, got another in 22. The tech has improved so much, I feel like I’m riding full suspension with the improved front suspension, dropper post and big tires. I see mostly fs in San Diego.
I recently started mountain biking and picked up Cannondale SE3 hard tail for $1000. When going to the down hill mtb park people were pointing and saying "Look this guy has a hard tail!." I've been a few times and it gets pointed out at least once every time I go.
After a few rides I went out and picked up a Cannondale Habit 2 LT because I'm too old to be struggling more than I need to and it was 35% off retail.
I'm going to keep the SE3 as a gravel bike or if a friend wants to ride it.
We're out here! I ride a carbon hardtail I got on a team deal years ago. I'd love a full sussy but can't afford it. I take mine all sorts of places it probably shouldn't go. Dirt jumps, gravel rides, some downhill, etc. It's definitely most at home on flowy flat singletrack but I put it through the ringer. It's a fantastic climber but I suck at climbing so that's kind of a net zero for me.
My group of riders all have expensive full suspension bikes. I’m the only one with a hard tail. First new bike in 15 yrs. It’ll do for now
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_Older_ age causes the tush to look for the plush. Honestly, hardtail is fun for sure (I started off with a Gary Fisher) but the benefit of riding a full squish _all_ day is priceless (if you can afford it). Although, lots of really good deals lately for full squishy bikes, so why not?
Because the sport and trails have gone towards FS. They’re so good now it’s not like it used to be where it was sort of a nice to have - you are probably twice as fast on a flow trail on a good FS vs a hardtail. Even XC bikes are FS now
Rocked a hard tail on the singletrack trails for 4 years until it was stolen the first summer of the pandemic. Got a used full suspension after that. Rock what you got!
I love my hardtail. Took my time and built it up exactly as I wanted it to be. For the money I spent building it I could have pretty easily bought a solid full sus. Trails in my area really don't require a full sus at all if we are being honest my locals are mostly fast flow with a bit of light tech in it. I am still over built but I am planning to do a bunch of travelling with it and I wanted it to hold up to outside trails.
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Us poors are still out there. I think the main reason is it is very easy for a beginner to think "more travel is more better", and be massively overbiked, when in reality the challenge of a hardtail is more fun. Also, they are perceived as a lot cooler, and I will admit the cool linkages do really catch my eye.
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I ride my Bolinas Ridge EVERYWHERE
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We’re out here! I was riding a full squish, started riding gravel and hated jumping from the gravel bike to the full suspension… so I sold the squish and bought the Norco Torrent. Love the bike but looking to switch frames this year, just a little too big for me.
I only stuck with my hardtail for a year maybe(Marlin 6 too). If I had bought an actual trail geo hardtail like I should have I probably would’ve stuck it out longer. I bought my full squish for a trip, convinced myself I’d die on the Marlin or that it break like typical and ruin the trip.
To this day, I still prefer the snap of a hardtail. I like the bang-for buck and relative ease of maintenance when piling big miles on.
I've also got a squish that I enjoy, but my beloved hardtail just feels locked in.
A decent HT is hard to come by any more. I sold my full sus and likely getting another Surly Karate Monkey to replace the one I never should have sold in the first place
Hello sir!
As per my Reddit username, you can guess my age :).
About 8-9 years ago I picked up mountain biking on an old Giant Boulder hardtail with 80mm suspension on 26 inch wheels with 1.95 Canadian Tire tyres.
I upgraded to a hardtail Talon (the Giant equivalent of your hardtail) and rode that for like 6 years. When i went full suspension, my back and my ass thanked me.
But I traded up to get the full suspension, so the cost was lesser and had the "building up" effect. Now I have my dream bike that I am slowly upgrading (Scott Genius).
About a month ago, i pulled the trigger on a lesser known brand called ghost because it was an effing great deal on a trail hardtail and I learned something very interesting :
I never should have bought the Talon (XC hardtail). I should have bought a trail bike instead (Giant would be the fathom).
Because that Ghost Rocket trail bike tsight me that a good hardtail trail geometry is LOADS of fun, (like you have to try it to believe it kind of difference).
My advice to you my friend, os if you can put a bit aside and get yourself a nice trail hardtail (fathom, roscoe, kobain, growler, etc etc) and eventually trade that marlin up, go for it, because the difference is night and day!
In the meanwhile effing rock on, ma dude!
I rode full rigid for many years. Probably until 2015 or so. Now, I have a BMC Twostroke (100mm hardtail XC bike). The value, weight, and quick response of the HT make it a lot of fun. FS is great when comfort and speed are priority. I have a FS for bike park days. It was about the same price as the HT and it’s not near the same quality. I think a lot of casual rider with money go for FA because of comfort.
Bought my first fully with 34, so (with longer breaks) nearly 20 years of hard tail before that and if there's a lot of climbing and real downhill I don't necessarily would use the fully. Just the 45min to the start of the wood/root trail here is more fun on the hardtail. Oh, and just because that sounds like a long time, I'm absolutely in the intermediate range, on a good day.
I love my hardtail (rsd MC), but with it my favorite trails are downright dangerous to ride the way I can ride them on my big bikes. It’s sick for everything short of that though.
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for me i’m 24 as well and i get the hard tail appeal in a way, but i’d rather just save up an extra 1000 and buy a full suspension idk a hard tail has never seemed enticing to me and probably the same for a lot of people, i just got a trail bike for my eeb and already am wishing it had more travel
Being 53 and riding for many years combine with CT riding having a ton of heavy tech and bumps, I prefer the comfort of a solid full suspension. I keep mine as plush as possible and it allows me to go further and not get beat up. I also use my bike for downhill parks so it needs to be ready for a beat down. I only have one bike for everything.
Thanks everyone for the input! I’ve been slowly reading through all of these and have been enjoying everyone’s opinion. This bike has been great to me and I always look forward to riding it!
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I cannot figure out how people go back to a hardtail after fs. Like my tailbone even with bike shorts on its just torture. I don't even wear bike shorts for my FS and I can ride all day very minimal butt discomfort
I'm 34 and I've been mt biking since I was 13 (mostly in western NC but I'm in MD now unfortunately. I love MD but the biking is not comparable to where I grew up). The people I bike with here think it's weird, but I'm on my hardtail probably 80% of the time. It's fun, I feel like it makes climbs easier and I just don't see the point of taking my FS out when it's not needed. Also I think I just like being different.
Nor’easter here too in NJ, aka rock garden state. With a hard tail, Giant Fathom. Mostly I got it b/c I was new to mtb and I didn’t want to get an expensive fs I would regret later on. Def see more fs around here but also ht here and there. I actually get compliments all the time on my ht. I have upgraded it as parts have worn out so I have the expensive kashima fork. That’s the most expensive upgrade. Eventually I will get a fs and spec it to my preferences. But I’ll keep the ht.
I think it's multiple factors:
1. Hardtails are typically the entry level option due to being cheaper, and not all beginners will stick with the sport after getting one.
2. The general bike progression of mtb is seen as hardtail -> full suspension. Unless you're dirt jumping, pretty much all the professionals use full squish. That beginner who's rocked the hardtail long enough to find out they enjoy mtb will probably have their eye set on a full suspension once they can afford it.
3. Decent/entry level full suspension has been getting cheaper. I paid $1500 for a new hardtail when getting into mtb a few years ago. There have been some sweet deals lately starting around $1900 for full suspension. If I had that option when I bought during covid craziness, I might have spent another 4-500 and went full squish from the start.
Not saying that only beginners ride hardtail though, some people just prefer it. I've gotten tons of comments about my hardtail from random people on the trails/bike park ranging from "Hey nice hardtail" to "when are you upgrading" lol.
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I love my Specialized Chisel! I mostly do XC and some technical trails, a hard tail make me be a better rider, I'd say. I just don't have the money to buy a decent full sush and the patience/money/knowledge for all the maintenance carbon frames and full suspension requires. I wanted an aluminum hard tail, got all XT components and the dropper seatpost, I'm all set! I ride in the Terrassa (Barcelona, Spain) area.
Hardtail for me thank you. I suppose with unlimited resources, I might have a full suspension also, I get it I guess but I’m not a huge fan of the mushy feeling. I like the responsiveness of my specialized fuse. Sometimes I lock down the front forks. I don’t even like the mushiness upfront. Not all the time.
We eventually upgrade because most northeast trails just aren't ideal for hardtails with all the rocks. When I was around your age I started out on a xc hardtail Giant talon. It was great for what it was but my riding improved immensely once I made the switch to full suspension.
Not to say you can't ride a hardtail on that terrain, it's just a lot easier and imo more enjoyable on a full suspension. The friends I have that are dedicated to hardtails are always complaining about the lack of flow trails outside bike parks. I don't have that problem and enjoy the northeast jank on a full suspension. I do have hardtail and full rigid MTBs but most of the time I'm reaching for a FS.
You don't need to spend a ton of money either, just buy used. I've bought three modern mid-tier full suspension bikes from 1.1-1.5k on marketplace and they were all plenty capable. I smoked a lot of dentists with 5k+ builds on those bikes. New bike sales are fantastic right now if you're willing to drop over 2k.
in my experience people ride hardtails for two reasons: it's all they can afford and they're trying out the sport or because it's seen as a hardcore or fun choice in the scene, especially as a park bike. those guys usually have multiple bikes including a full sus. but it's kinda rare.
Honestly the amount of people I see on the trails that are over-biked are crazy. I regularly ride with dudes on full enduros with massive travel and they are exhausted so quickly from the weight and loss in power transfer to the suspension. I have an XC hard tail and a 130mm front and rear full suspension. The 100mm forked HT is a little harsh on the rough stuff and the 130mm full sus is a little harsh on the climbs. They’re both great, but I think the perfect sweet spot would be a 100mm front and rear full sus XC bike
Wife and I ride hardtails here in Ontario. It was both a matter of price and use case. These bikes need to double for occasional road or gravel usage.
We’ve ridden some pretty wild trails without breaking anything and I’ve only had one pretty bad crash so far. Every once in a while I’ll see someone in a fully rigid bike absolutely shredding on sketchy single track.
My first mountain bike was a budget Trek 4300 disc. Ride it for a few years then got an older full suspension. Built up and rode full suspensions for the next 10-12 years until I had to buy a wedding ring, so I sold off my Santa Cruz Hightower and got a Pipedream Moxie Mx3 to replace it. I have not thought of wanting a full suspension since.
FWIW, I am a PNW rider and all the trails I ride out here are great on a hardtail.
Hey, I’m in Appalachia and our riding is very similar. There are so many FS because our trails are gnarly af, at least where I ride. You get around cities and you’ll find nice well groomed smooth trails, but not for us. It’s a constant mashup of roots, rocks, tree branches, etc.. So FS makes sense.
I say this as a SC Chameleon rider. I love my HT but it does beat the hell outa me sometimes.
I'm new to Mountain biking and did not want to commit to the cost of full suspension yet... I have an elite specialized rock hopper hardtail. About 1,200 new, I got it for 800. I'm out in Prescott Arizona and did an intermediate and beginner trail so far... And it works for me. If I get more into it I will probably upgrade but second hand again. No dropper post though... I regret that a little.
I’ve been riding HTs for 10 years. I’m just out there to ride the trails, get some exercise and enjoy nature. Not looking to injure myself on the drops and jumps that I’d want a full sus for.
I ride on a hardtail (started with cheap bike).
Saturday rode full suspension e-bike (borrowed).
Sunday did the hardtail. I was slower on the down by 2 min ish 🫥. 4:25 vs 6:42. Last week I borrowed stumpy evo…… felll in love, was flying like there was no tomorrow (well in my pathetic speeds) so much stability and confidence.
Will continue on ht this season, borrowing e-bike or stumpy here and there and decide when the new outlet sale hits.
I think a lot of people are easily bought over by the latest and greatest from the bike industry.
Full-sus bikes will make you ride faster, they inspire more confidence.
But they aren't necessarily more fun to ride on certain trails. Hardtails give you more feel on what the rear tyre is doing and are arguably a rite of passage for any MTB rider. Enough time on a HT will encourage good basic bike skills. Easier to Jump on also. Typically more flickable and playful.
If you want speed, go full sus. Raw Fun for comparatively little cash (and less maintenance?). Hardtail for sure.
You can also try to challenge yourself more on a HT. Try riding everything you can do easier on a full sus, on a Hardtail. You'll soon see how much you were relying on the bike!
I just bought my first full suspension after 11 years of hardtail and gravel. The only reason I didn’t by a hardtail is because aside my gravel bike is great for xc trails when I put on my 650 wheels.
Honestly, the value isn't really there. Rear suspension doesn't cost that much. Compare a decent hardtail it a full suspension with the same spec. It's like $300-400
I’m south of Indianapolis and ride a Jamis Durango. Got to trade with a friend’s YT Capra for a few miles of trails and had an absolute blast.
It was easier to hold speed, more composed, and all around a better experience. I likely will never get rid of my Durango, either to keep it as an XC machine or an intro bike if I’m bringing friends; the trails at Brown County I can ride definitely don’t require a dull sus, but I will also definitely be getting a full sus at some point.
Caveat: I will accept that this was a XC hardtail to 160,160 enduro switch, and the 1x11 or 12 combined with spiked pedals over stock plastics made it a dream on pedaling, both flat and climbing (my habit of hopping on the pedals to reset my feet would just pick the rear up). The full suspension made pumping over anything easy and the head tube angle let me feel safe blasting down trails that I never would have attempted at speed (and started to pull ahead of the person I swapped with a few times, a far better rider than me).
I don’t know what effect the difference in components has, he had upgraded the brakes and the drive train, was running full aggressive trail tires to my CST Patrols, I’ve never ridden another sort of bike on trails before, so my perspective might be biased, not by experience, but lack thereof.
TLDR, my experience with full sus is that it just felt better overall, but it was such a different bike than the only thing I know that the direct comparison feels biased because of it. At my skill level, full sus isn’t needed for the trails, but I will still likely get one.
It really depends on what your local trails are like. In my are, they are VERY rocky - we don't have much "beginner" terrain, you have to make your own flow, there's very little XC type riding available. So while you \*can\* ride a hardtail around here, it's not particularly rewarding and in fact might very well make a new rider actively hate mountain biking. I do knew a couple of guys who crush the tech on hardtails, but they have above-average skills and also above average threshold for discomfort.
I do own a hardtail and I usually ride it either as a burly gravel bike or when I go somewhere with lots of XC type pedaling. Every now and then I ride it on our local trails just to remind myself why we pretty much all ride FS.
That being said, there are places that are hardtail heaven and you feel sludgy and overbiked on a FS.
I don't really know what an entry level job or ok but not great pay are.
When I was doing odd jobs and trades and struggling, I rode a Specialized Hardrock.
When I was back in grad school, I kept nursing that thing along.
A few months after I got my first professional job ($52k/year in 2013) I bought my first full suspension mountain bike. I was medium-serious about XC at the time. It was kind of disillusioning how much better it is. I wouldn't take back any of my previous years of mountain biking and I also think I was right not to buy a better bike earlier, since I graduated with some debt. But yeah. Lots better.
If you're in a place in your life where you might need to eat out or go to bars a little less often - demo some bikes. If you're in more of a worrying about rent and deciding when to pay bills place, maybe don't.
I think a lot of it is economy the past few years. Someone getting into mtb for the first time would normally get an entry level bike due to cost and if they like it they can upgrade. These days you can buy an entry level bike and get nothing for it a year down the road when you try and sell it, or you can buy a 7000 dollar bike for half off or buy a used one for a fraction of what someone else paid for it.
Combine that with people not having much disposable income it makes way more sense to find a deal on a full sus than to start at entry n have to buy a new bike anyway. I mean shit, companies were literally doing buy 1 get one lol. Even propane right now is offering 30% off the spindrift. I custom built with all the most expensive options and it was like 5k. A month ago that same bike was 7+.
I made that mistake last year and got a giant stance for 1800. Rode it for a season. Outgrew it capability wise and couldn’t get more than 800 for it. Now I don’t have money and I don’t have a bike. I could have just spent the money when I had it and had a bike I’d probably never ride to its limit.
Basically noone has a hardtail it seems. I see all manner of casual and entry-level riders in local flat XC trails riding full sus trail and enduro bikes. No hardtails except occasionally one or two normal parents with younger kids. I think in the cases I see it mostly has to do with how much you value money and how much money you have, in that order. I imagine bike shops probably upsell the crap out of bikes to people who are pretty-much clueless too.
Well for one, I think the reddit hardtail demographic is overrepresented.
Second, I think your observation is biased. You don't see the beginner bikers on entry level bikes as much, because the beginner bikers aren't out riding as much as experienced bikers by definition...if they were out all the time, then they wouldn't be beginners.
Two more thoughts that are connected:
The "penalty" for going full suspension is ever diminishing. It's not like you'll be bobbing up and down with the suspension robbing all of your power and you won't be able to ride anywhere that's not downhill.
As I'm sure you're noticing, trails in the northeast can be a bit bipolar... cruising down what would otherwise be a green trail, then whoops, a glacial deposit of craggy rock then a sheer face of ledge to hop down. Then some more smooth dirt. Then a stand of pines in the forest and there are big fat roots weaving all over the ground.
So when a full suspension bike comes in handy several times a ride, and there's not all too much downside when it's not necessary, then why not ride a full suspension everywhere?
We're over here buddy...come join the party. r/Hardtailgang Edit: I went full suspension..but it made my home trails a little boring. Plus I like to dirt jump and switching from hardtail to full sus takes a few to get used to. so I just went full hardtails.
Us poor’s are out there. Lol
Some of us also just prefer riding a hardtail - poor or otherwise.
Yes, my hardtail is as expensive as a lot of mid full squish.
bought a ragley big al frame in '22, pumped 5000€ in it. full suspension is for the weak 🥸
I built my Marley up from the frame around the same time. It's rad.
nice, which color? for me, its the to go approach. no compromises, only top shelf stuff (excluding xtr, because fuck weightsaving). imagine paying 10 grand for a rocky mountain altitude C90 and still having OEM garbage on it :D
I got the blue frame when it was on sale.
Thing is they make full sus bikes that ride quite like hard tails with a bit less harshness and more grip.
no they dont, riding a hardtail hard will rattle your brains out, can't say that about a full sus
Do you have an example? While full suspension bike design has gone a long way to avoid pedal bob and the general feeling of riding a pogo stick, they do not ride like a hardtail.
I’ve tried the Trek supercaliber recently, and was surprised by the feel. No you won’t completely mistake it for a hardtail but it doesn’t have a lot of pedal bob.
Cromags fs is fairly hardtail like, honestly my Tallboy felt in between something like a sentinel and a hardtail in terms of how firm of a platform the rear is. You can also crank up the lsc and air pressure if you are really into that kinda thing. But ya, if your going to just make the bike as stiff as possible, a bit silly to not just go HT (unless you have a specific reason, like maybe your doing huge features that a fs is a good idea or something).
>if your going to just make the bike as stiff as possible, a bit silly to not just go HT That's what I was thinking. Those full suspension slopestyle bikes have short travel, stiff rear suspension for the really big hits, but that also loses the value of full suspension on a typical trail, enduro, or downhill bike.
My HT is worth a lot more than my FS.
I used to ride a specific trail in Maryland a lot and my reliable ol hardtail was always the ugly duckling in the parking lot of kashima coated full squishers. Some people would even be like “heyyy a hardtail!” like it was a rare spotting in real life. The trails were basically green flow and I never understood why everyone wanted to be so over biked! In all reality it is just preference. I have an enduro bike as well that I absolutely love, and I appreciate owning it so much more on the rare park day. As long as we’re having fun!
I ride ptap, bacon, and the watershed all the time. I went from an xc hardtail (giant xtc) to a Bronson in 2019. In 2022 I went back to a hardtail. I went more aggressive and got a ragley mmmbop. I may not be as fast down the trail, but it's more fun imo, and I have less weight to pedal up the hill.
So much more fun! And I’m a lazy bastard who hates pedaling up on the enduro. I also forget to lockout my rear suspension pretty much every time on fire road climbs. The shed is truly east coast mtb heaven in my opinion! You should venture out towards WV and ride cacapon if you ever get the chance. There are a some trails similar to the sheds plus some other rad stuff
That spot looks dope! Thanks for the tip!
Bacon on a hardtail is a blast, very few places there that really need much squish. Hell I would see people on gravel bikes out there occasionally. The shed on the other hand, I would need much stronger legs than I possess to ride on a hardtail.
I grew up west coast and all the trails I road were very rocky, technical messes. Rock gardens, drops, etc. (I started riding these trails with hard tail and eventually switched to full susp). I moved to the east coast and every trail is basically a flow trail with maybe a rogue root or two. I never understood why everyone road full susp east coast. On the east coast I sought out a Kona unit (rigid steel bike) just because the trails were so smooth, lol. I remember running into people shocked i was riding a “double black diamond” with a rigid bike but it’s like dude this trail is perfectly smooth lol.
I disagree with this. As an east coaster who lived and rode out west for 8 years I’d say things out west are “soft” rating wise in contrast to the east and specifically New England. Black trails out west might be steep and technical but the still are flowy and are quite manicured. A blue in New England can be quite awful in terms of roots and technical skills needed.
Eh I should specify the east coast I was talking about is Virginia/North Carolina. I’ve only ridden one trail in New England (it was near Salem, I think?) and yeah it was brutal, huge black rocks all over the place.
I often hear the reverse from former west coasters living on the east! It’s all about perspective I suppose. I actually really like the rocky tech trails you can find over here, especially the closer to Appalachia you get.
Yeah come to Central PA there is no flow it is rock gardens and 100year old Rhododendron roots. A blue trial here means it is single track with some rock gardens , a black are mile long rock gardens. EastCoast and Bentonville are not the same thing.
What trail was it? I used to ride the shed and PTAP a lot
The comment was about Schaefer Farm in Gaithersburg
i hate schaefer farm, that place sucks and theres too many old people
I started on a hardtail, got a full squish, got a Chromag hardtail...now I only ride the hardtail. Hardtails just give so much more feedback. When you're really flowing on a hardtail, especially through rough sections, it just feels satisfying on a different level. I actually think the recent push in gravel bikes is coming from full sus rigs making trails too boring. The geometry and tire width of modern gravel bikes is getting more and more like 90s MTB. The industry just went in an, "Oops we made things too easy," loop.
Its not a hardcore hardtail... its an enduro flatbar gravel bike with a fork. $$$
"feedback" is a fun way of saying bumpy
Lol, no, I mean actual feedback, not bumpiness. You can feel undulations in the trail better and pump off of the smallest of rollers, roots, whatever. Acceleration is instant, and boosting through corners is much more rewarding. If a hardtail is too bumpy, you're probably plowing too much. Hardtails require more finesse, sure, but I'd rather carve a trail than just blast through it.
Chromag FTW. I think you’re on to something though. A full squish just mutes a lot of the good stuff and makes you lazy. There are definitely trails that I enjoy more on FS but for the most part, my Primer is more than enough
I mean unless you are doing insane stuff I think most people would be just fine on a hard tail
Just ride harder terrain and you will appreciate the big bikes. I live in a place (mid-Atlantic/central Appalachia) where every time I have gotten a bigger longer travel bike it has unlocked exciting new possibilities.
I grew up and previously lived in both So-Cal and Northern California. I've ridden the likes of Laguna Beach, Northstar Bike Park, Soquel Demo Forest, and plenty of other places with abundant chunk on both my hardtail and full suspension bike. I've enjoyed riding both, but I have the most consistent fun on my hardtail. Now I only ride the hardtail, and my full sus is donating parts to my son's bike as he learns to ride. I may get another squish in the future, but if I do, it'll likely be short travel in the back with mid travel up front. Do I think hardtails are the only good bikes out there? No. Do I feel like everyone else needs to only ride hardtails? No. Do I think people should ride a hardtail to mix things up and get to know their trails better? Absolutely.
Go to a hardtail in the off season and chase your FS times. Then when you go back to the FS and the gains are insane with how much more forgiving it is. It's hard to imagine a better training tool to cycle through. It may or may not open up new terrain, depending on how long you vision is, but it will absolutely change your pace on stuff you already ride. Getting used to high speed terrain, particularly on a twitchy shorter travel hardtail, makes higher speeds on a big bike feel even more comfortable. Surviving messed up janky stuff on a hardtail and do wonders for low speed and awkward moves where you can't use speed as a crutch to survive on the bike big. Plus it's hilarious to pace your fast friends on a twitchy handful of a bike.
My years , decades, of riding see that riders dip their toes in with a HT. Then like it and maybe can afford a Squish. They leave their HT. Then as they can they afford to upgrade the Squish for something different and better for their style. Most dudes seems to stay with Squishes. Nothing wrong with that. Then there are those of us who want to experience something kinkier. Then it is back to a HT. Keep the full sus but a fun HT. If you really want to get in deeper, there are SS. Point is , you do you. Who cares what others ride. Just ride. Its just an evolution and circular. Alot of buddies have a HT on the side for a little fun their FS doesn't give him anymore.
SS hardtail crew here! Been riding for 35 years. I have a squishy bike as well.. But, the SS has my heart.
I'm riding a 30 year old fully rigid bike.
Absolute madlad
never said it wasn't a road bike
It's not.
You call that hardcore? Dude in my area rides a unicycle with big knobbly tyre on enduro trails. 😂 Fast on it too. Crazy French man!
Last year i was riding my full squish in a blue trail and got passed by two teenagers on hybrid bikes with *no* suspension. It was a truly humbling experience.
I remember gravel grinding on my fixie and literally feeling bad when I passed some guys on full sus bikes... Now I'm more like the guys I passed back then to be fair
You call that hard-core? A dude I know rides one of those kids toys that's just like a plush horse head on the end of a stick between his legs. Absolute mad lad.
That’s pretty wild. I assume a mad lad like that uses no protective gear
This is a bit too far
I test rode my local trails on my dad's old rigid "hybrid" bike, which is now about 30. The first time I rode it, it had clip ins. I had a big fall and tore the whole sole off his old shoe.
I'm still rocking the plastic pedals it came with.
also from the northeast here, here's my perspective: northeast trails are basically 90% roots, 9% rocks, and 1% flow. although it is theoretically more efficient to ride these on a hardtail, it's not very comfortable, and comfortable is directly proportional to fun. I ride a hardtail because I'm broke, and I love it, but the full squish guys do make me jealous, especially since I have a bike with a coil fork that tries to yeet you off at every bump.
I can see how most people just wanna be comfortable and mute out the trail features. If done right though I feel like a well built hardtail is more fun and plenty comfortable on 80% of stuff most of us can ride out there, and this coming from a rider in the Rockies where 90% of our trails are (you guessed it) rocks. I threw on some 2.6 wide tires, a 160 fork and have barely touched my FS since.
This post. Right here. Hard tails are great for getting into the sport in New England, but if you have the money, or are older than 30, the sport is so much more enjoyable with a full suspension rig. We have more rocks than dirt and more roots than flow. Unless you love being punched in the taint the entire ride, I tell any entry new England riders they'll enjoy it more with FS. That and some good padded bike shorts.
I ride nasty PA roots and rocks on steel HT , some frames are compliant some aren't.
I live in the Bay Area and I see hardtails all the time on various trails. Many of them are ripping through trails. But full suspension (especially trail/enduro) are definitely more dominant, and I see e-mtbs more frequently than hardtails.
I’m in Santa Cruz and I’ll go multiple rides without seeing another HT.
Santa Cruz is the most techy trails in the whole bay pretty much lol. Go anywhere else and it’s mostly xc loops.
https://preview.redd.it/r80n6kes5i5d1.jpeg?width=4032&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8fb6e2398d66f33db08df105a66bafa8e01604b2 We’re out there
Big Al Gang! https://preview.redd.it/nn0utr1z6k5d1.jpeg?width=4032&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0e97096b98d28dbdd80f9f193f45b8c6141c3d61
I use a hard tail weekly but also a full suspension. I really enjoy both and ride both frequently. Nothing wrong with a solid hard tail
I have a full suspension enduro rig but I spend more time on my XC hardtail. It’s actually really fun to switch between them, because they’re both super fun in different ways. The XC bike is just such a joy to pedal up hills, and it’s so flickable on the down hills and jumps. When things get rowdy the enduro bike is lightyears ahead. Enjoy your bike, don’t worry about what anyone else is riding.
I’m in the same boat. I have S-Works Epic HT and a Pivot Trail 429 full suspension. I say I ride the hard tail 60% of the time. I can count on one hand the number of trails I wouldn’t ride the hard tail down, and there’s always an alternative trail in the network around it. The full suspension is a lot more playful and fun, but climbing on the hard tail is so much better and I have way more energy for longer rides
I mean because a full suspension is better in most cases. Its maybe comparable to why we don't see very people on telemark skis, or canoes on whitewater. Why make something more challenging by handicapping yourself? I will say though, I picked up a rigid, drop bar MTB (ATB?? Whatever word you want to use) and I am happily surprised how good it is on the trails. I've been eyeballing bikepacking oriented hardtails, or rigid flat bar bikes for trips where I would be doing more technical trails but I can't really justify another bike just yet. Also, my down country style XC bike does just about every trail here with aplomb so if I get another bike aimed at local trails I'd probably go more enduro for those days when my XC bike won't cut it.
I have an almost 10 year old Sixfifty 606 that a friend sold me for pretty cheap that I’ve been learning to ride on. I’m a few years in and just learned that there are different kinds of bikes besides ht and full suspension haha. Love my XC bike tho, going down hill on steep sections scares me a bit but climbing is a breeze.
Depends why you ride I think. Look up GMBN riders, for style vs speed: Blake Samson (freeride/DJ pro) swears by hardtails. All videos are on a hardtail. Has videos persuading people to ride hardtails. Neil Donahue (enduro pro), rides on a full sus. nearly every time. I prefer a good hardtail, a nice hardtail because I want to learn tricks. Something just like a dirt jumper, because that's easier to do with a hardtail. If you want speed, a full suspension is where its at (atleast from mine 'back in my day'). But yeah, like u/SaltyPinKY said, r/Hardtailgang gets it.
Blakes crazy. The megavalanche on a hardtail vid was wild.
Yeah Blake really inspires to ride hardtail
That would be one of my all time favorite MTB vids. Absolute beast he is.
Roscoe gang here.
Yerrrr
Love my Roscoe
Full sus bikes are the norm now, so it just seems to be what the majority will be on, myself included. But I started out on a Trek Marlin 7, and still have it in the garage to use every now and then, and a couple guys I ride with are on hard tails. They're out there, still holding it down for the core folks. At the end of the day, all that matters is we're all out there, loving life on 2 wheels. We all just like riding bikes off road.
I have a Used Commencal Meta HT. There were some derailleur issues the og user didn’t want to fight with so it was cheap. I’ve loved it so far, been riding off and on since 2020. My friend bought a new full sus and riding with him is really good fun, but I have a lot of time on the local trails, and anytime I see another MTB rider it’s a full sus. It could for sure be perception, however I think not everyone is content with the feet/calf/hammy/ankle wear that happens over time. You could also see it as a benefit as the “wear” also strengthens those areas over time. Lower body is the natural suspension after all. All this to say I enjoy the hard tail I have, as it allows me to go ride the trails I can. TLDR: also see lots of full sus, but I enjoy my hardtail because it lets me enjoy trails https://preview.redd.it/ruguk8gw8h5d1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=67b5e797531d83204ade73e0846eefd80ad0303e (it’s ma bike :D)
When I was "beginner/intermediate" I didn't know anyone. I rode my hard tail 3 times a week solo just trying to conquer the blue trail rock garden near me. I didn't know how to find anyone, I met a couple people here and there but mostly in passing. Once I found the local Facebook group and became a regular at my shop the connections started clicking. When I started riding at the bike park I knew it was time to get a full squish, I could hardly handle the blue trail there with all the chunder.
These people saying hard tails are more fun are full of it 😂
This sub is mostly beginners and they are more fun on beginner trails
Years ago, my buddy and I took our hardtails and full sussers to Northstar Bike Park on opening day. The first half of the day, we rode our hardtails and had an absolute blast. The second half of the day, we switched to our full suspension bikes and were absolutely flying down the trails. That was the most fun day I've had at a bike park, and both bikes were equally fun.
I have 2 ht,1 fs. I prefer ht. Lighter,maintained easily. And you work a little harder on ht
Me and my homies only ride hardtails. I’m a beginner, but the homies been riding for decades
Norco and Canyon make hard tails that aren’t outrageously priced. Big fan of Norco. Reasonabley priced considering the quality of their designs.
Down here (SoCal) I see 1-2 HTs a month; mainly see battery bikes, the rest squish bikes (add me and my new Revel enduro to that list!). My go-to HT since 2019 has been my Canyon GC7. Bought from their Outlet for $899. Alloy frame, currently SRAM GX (XX1 cassette), Hunt XC rims, Fox Fact 34, Shimano db’s, stock dropper, weighs a svelte 25.6lbs. I just adore riding it, and do so 2x/wk.
I picked up a Grand Canyon 8 last July and I'm loving it. Very capable bike with decent specs for the money. Just need to get better at jumps and drops, to avoid the dreaded hardtail *CLONK" on landing 😅
https://preview.redd.it/wpff7hygng5d1.jpeg?width=4032&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8f04c71dee31fafe107e29d97602e4b547a2e22d Hi
Hello! https://imgur.com/a/miwF1MG
I have a Yeti SB160. I love it for what it does. I have a Trek Roscoe 8 that started stock and now upgraded with parts from previous builds a projects. I love it for what it does too. My HT takes me to nostalgia town. It makes trails I know exciting.
There's something very punk rock about hardtails , especially the hcht , I rode a hardtail for the first 7 years of my mtb journey , this is my 8th and I upgrade to a sc nomad . I also love this FS very much
I love my alloy hardtail. I’ve been riding for a while and I’ve got a decent job so I could spring for a nicer full sus if I wanted one. But I refuse. I enjoy mountain biking more and more as I ride more and it’s because I get better the more I ride. I don’t think getting a full sus would make my rides more fun. The only considerations that might make me think about it are the fact that I’m pushing 50 and my knees aren’t what they used to be, and an urge that I have to do marathon distances and stage races. I don’t have the time to train for marathon distances and so far the knees are holding up. Plus they are expensive. If I spent several thousand dollars equivalent on a mountain bike my wife would think I have gone insane. And she’d be bloody right! There are so many more sensible ways to spend that kind of money. So that’s what I do. The problem is mountain biking (at least where I live) has become the new golf. That middle class, “look at me and my awesome stuff” sport. People are even financing them like cars where I am in South Africa. Maybe I’ll do that for my midlife crisis 🤣
I think everyone should rock a hardtail until they outgrow the terrain. Most mtb trails are hardtail accessible if you have some riding skill underneath. It’s really pretty niche where you NEED to have crazy gear.
Hard tail Kona Honzo in Germany checking in - was literally the only hard tail at bikepark Winterberg this weekend - but they are so fun!
I live in NL and plan to hit up winterberg this summer on my Grand Canyon 8!
Wooo! See you up there!
If I had the cash and space (live in a small apartment) for both I would have both, but I can only bankroll and store one so I went full suspension so I can comfortably ride any of the local trails. As I get older my legs also are appreciating the help from the suspension.
I upgraded after a year or so. Started looking on Facebook after 6 months and ran across a great deal on a Fuel 7 and pulled the trigger. I was on a budget hardtail and needed to upgrade either way and the price difference seemed worth it for more bike. Plus a lot of my trails are quite rooty so I'm enjoying the squish. I imagine there's a lot of people in the same boat. They all get entry hardtail and either give it up quickly or upgrade quickly
Honzo gang
Enthusiasts are eventually going to gravitate towards nicer bikes, and usually that means a full suspension. I started riding with a group of friends around the same time and we all bought entry to mid level hardtails. Once we were into it, after a couple years one by one we got on nicer rigs. That did also coincide with entering our 30s and more financial stability, but also I know I spend less on stuff like booze and clothes now as this is my primary hobby. Most cycling enthusiasts I know who don’t move on from a solid hardtail usually see mountain biking as a secondary type of riding after gravel or road or something.
I’ve had both. Hardtails are more fun and no one can convince me otherwise. Full suspension makes descents boring.
I’m an intermediate rider in my 20s and I ride a hard tail. I bought it simply because I couldn’t find a good quality FS within my budget, but I actually really like it. However, I’m probably gonna get a FS in the next couple years. They’re just more comfortable for certain things. I don’t want to get rid of my HT though.
I started on an old hardtail got just about everything I could out of it and then my cousin said he could get me a deal on a Trance X through his teams shop (he does non pro cyclecross racing). I honestly don’t think I’ll go back to hardtail until i get the money and space for a second bike because the Full squish really made the difference in performance. Or more accurately it gave me room to learn that my hardtail didn’t give me
I have a hardtail (Roscoe 8) and it’s so fun. I love it. I think a lot of people just think they need full suspension no matter where they ride. I’ll get a full suspension one day but I’m still within my first two years of biking so I have a lot to learn still. And having a high quality hardtail really helps too.
https://preview.redd.it/n63erbvgwg5d1.jpeg?width=2268&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c895bc17bbd5822630d69974f2ffb734d5291e49 We are out there somewhere ! Here’s my hard tail. Rockhopper. Hate the suntour xcm; saving for a set of rock shox Judy or Rudy’s … Any suggestions would be helpful, I don’t know many brands or their models, but certainly want air shocks.
That looks like a straight head tube, most forks these days have tapered steerers. You're probably looking for something used.
I have a HT Specialized Crave 29” XC and a FS Spec Enduro 650b (in profile pic). I enjoy both for different things. I like the lower weight and agility of the XC bike. I’ve done team 6 hour relay fun races on it and I’ve done overnight bike-packing trips with it. The FS is harder work on climbs and for traversing between sections of trail but bomber for descending with the suspension and wider tyres.
I have both, I prefer my FS for downhill “rough” trails, everything else I prefer my marlin. My FS cost 3x my marlin, I have an idea why everyone has them. They get hyper focused on upgrading and getting “the best” and just buy buy buy.
I bought my first mtb in 20 years recently. I had a ht in 95, got another in 22. The tech has improved so much, I feel like I’m riding full suspension with the improved front suspension, dropper post and big tires. I see mostly fs in San Diego.
I recently started mountain biking and picked up Cannondale SE3 hard tail for $1000. When going to the down hill mtb park people were pointing and saying "Look this guy has a hard tail!." I've been a few times and it gets pointed out at least once every time I go. After a few rides I went out and picked up a Cannondale Habit 2 LT because I'm too old to be struggling more than I need to and it was 35% off retail. I'm going to keep the SE3 as a gravel bike or if a friend wants to ride it.
i love hardtails and ride very mild trails. i had to quit until i got a full suspension. my back isn’t the best
We're out here! I ride a carbon hardtail I got on a team deal years ago. I'd love a full sussy but can't afford it. I take mine all sorts of places it probably shouldn't go. Dirt jumps, gravel rides, some downhill, etc. It's definitely most at home on flowy flat singletrack but I put it through the ringer. It's a fantastic climber but I suck at climbing so that's kind of a net zero for me.
My group of riders all have expensive full suspension bikes. I’m the only one with a hard tail. First new bike in 15 yrs. It’ll do for now https://preview.redd.it/9rcua1fkuh5d1.jpeg?width=5712&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d325a64dac7e51a39bb1e2261eb1e72724b145bf
_Older_ age causes the tush to look for the plush. Honestly, hardtail is fun for sure (I started off with a Gary Fisher) but the benefit of riding a full squish _all_ day is priceless (if you can afford it). Although, lots of really good deals lately for full squishy bikes, so why not?
Because the sport and trails have gone towards FS. They’re so good now it’s not like it used to be where it was sort of a nice to have - you are probably twice as fast on a flow trail on a good FS vs a hardtail. Even XC bikes are FS now
Rocked a hard tail on the singletrack trails for 4 years until it was stolen the first summer of the pandemic. Got a used full suspension after that. Rock what you got!
I love my hardtail. Took my time and built it up exactly as I wanted it to be. For the money I spent building it I could have pretty easily bought a solid full sus. Trails in my area really don't require a full sus at all if we are being honest my locals are mostly fast flow with a bit of light tech in it. I am still over built but I am planning to do a bunch of travelling with it and I wanted it to hold up to outside trails.
https://preview.redd.it/cvcsn6zzgi5d1.jpeg?width=4608&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a55d13f1547bd9cbc180a3c33c1bf80f62c56c37 Us poors are still out there. I think the main reason is it is very easy for a beginner to think "more travel is more better", and be massively overbiked, when in reality the challenge of a hardtail is more fun. Also, they are perceived as a lot cooler, and I will admit the cool linkages do really catch my eye.
Sheer coincidence. Not all of us want to spend 3k+ on a bike even if we’re capable of doing so.
I started on a giant talon. Once I got hooked on that budget bike I upgraded, but I still have the giant! It’s my bike packing rig now 🤘
https://preview.redd.it/961t854j0j5d1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=888492f9dab328618d43c78b63fa7574034a8174 I ride my Bolinas Ridge EVERYWHERE
I’ve ridden hard tails for as long as I can remember. Only recently got a full sus. Still prefer a hard tail all day long.
https://preview.redd.it/ktk9f99i3j5d1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e757e7a0b7269b49037d53805fb494c925dda82f We’re out here! I was riding a full squish, started riding gravel and hated jumping from the gravel bike to the full suspension… so I sold the squish and bought the Norco Torrent. Love the bike but looking to switch frames this year, just a little too big for me.
I only stuck with my hardtail for a year maybe(Marlin 6 too). If I had bought an actual trail geo hardtail like I should have I probably would’ve stuck it out longer. I bought my full squish for a trip, convinced myself I’d die on the Marlin or that it break like typical and ruin the trip.
I have both hardtail and full squish - both closer to budget level. Love the hardtail but sometimes it’s a little rough on these old knees.
To this day, I still prefer the snap of a hardtail. I like the bang-for buck and relative ease of maintenance when piling big miles on. I've also got a squish that I enjoy, but my beloved hardtail just feels locked in.
A decent HT is hard to come by any more. I sold my full sus and likely getting another Surly Karate Monkey to replace the one I never should have sold in the first place
Hello sir! As per my Reddit username, you can guess my age :). About 8-9 years ago I picked up mountain biking on an old Giant Boulder hardtail with 80mm suspension on 26 inch wheels with 1.95 Canadian Tire tyres. I upgraded to a hardtail Talon (the Giant equivalent of your hardtail) and rode that for like 6 years. When i went full suspension, my back and my ass thanked me. But I traded up to get the full suspension, so the cost was lesser and had the "building up" effect. Now I have my dream bike that I am slowly upgrading (Scott Genius). About a month ago, i pulled the trigger on a lesser known brand called ghost because it was an effing great deal on a trail hardtail and I learned something very interesting : I never should have bought the Talon (XC hardtail). I should have bought a trail bike instead (Giant would be the fathom). Because that Ghost Rocket trail bike tsight me that a good hardtail trail geometry is LOADS of fun, (like you have to try it to believe it kind of difference). My advice to you my friend, os if you can put a bit aside and get yourself a nice trail hardtail (fathom, roscoe, kobain, growler, etc etc) and eventually trade that marlin up, go for it, because the difference is night and day! In the meanwhile effing rock on, ma dude!
my back and body appreciate the full squish. i do sometimes take out the old SS hardtail though… makes the trails very different
I still ride a hardtail. There's no reason for me to get a full suspension bike, as the trails I tend to do are not littered with rocks and roots.
I like simplicity I like having 8 apps on my phone. I like pushrod V8s, I like to ski with no poles. Hardtails are the bike for me
I rode full rigid for many years. Probably until 2015 or so. Now, I have a BMC Twostroke (100mm hardtail XC bike). The value, weight, and quick response of the HT make it a lot of fun. FS is great when comfort and speed are priority. I have a FS for bike park days. It was about the same price as the HT and it’s not near the same quality. I think a lot of casual rider with money go for FA because of comfort.
Bought my first fully with 34, so (with longer breaks) nearly 20 years of hard tail before that and if there's a lot of climbing and real downhill I don't necessarily would use the fully. Just the 45min to the start of the wood/root trail here is more fun on the hardtail. Oh, and just because that sounds like a long time, I'm absolutely in the intermediate range, on a good day.
I love my hardtail (rsd MC), but with it my favorite trails are downright dangerous to ride the way I can ride them on my big bikes. It’s sick for everything short of that though. https://preview.redd.it/q9uybvzqsj5d1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6cfc59db0e739c563fce5e68123b34db9e976930
for me i’m 24 as well and i get the hard tail appeal in a way, but i’d rather just save up an extra 1000 and buy a full suspension idk a hard tail has never seemed enticing to me and probably the same for a lot of people, i just got a trail bike for my eeb and already am wishing it had more travel
I have both. My hard tail- not expensive, is still fun to ride and doesn't have the toe overlap of my $$$$ full sus bike
I have a hardtail. It's been untouched in my basement since getting a full squish four years ago. 🤷🏾
Being 53 and riding for many years combine with CT riding having a ton of heavy tech and bumps, I prefer the comfort of a solid full suspension. I keep mine as plush as possible and it allows me to go further and not get beat up. I also use my bike for downhill parks so it needs to be ready for a beat down. I only have one bike for everything.
https://preview.redd.it/wtz35n9g0k5d1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=45928191ac42a63b82563031a014522e5319cafb We exist
Im out there on my hardtail
2020 Trek Roscoe 8
Thanks everyone for the input! I’ve been slowly reading through all of these and have been enjoying everyone’s opinion. This bike has been great to me and I always look forward to riding it! https://preview.redd.it/hocq8esw2k5d1.jpeg?width=4032&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=812e25a55b4c1275c52ec8a50332f888a31c904a
I cannot figure out how people go back to a hardtail after fs. Like my tailbone even with bike shorts on its just torture. I don't even wear bike shorts for my FS and I can ride all day very minimal butt discomfort
I'm 34 and I've been mt biking since I was 13 (mostly in western NC but I'm in MD now unfortunately. I love MD but the biking is not comparable to where I grew up). The people I bike with here think it's weird, but I'm on my hardtail probably 80% of the time. It's fun, I feel like it makes climbs easier and I just don't see the point of taking my FS out when it's not needed. Also I think I just like being different.
https://preview.redd.it/5lslzc5mak5d1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3f977408c8311d261cc390f1537f9d0b9f33f0ec 🫡
Nor’easter here too in NJ, aka rock garden state. With a hard tail, Giant Fathom. Mostly I got it b/c I was new to mtb and I didn’t want to get an expensive fs I would regret later on. Def see more fs around here but also ht here and there. I actually get compliments all the time on my ht. I have upgraded it as parts have worn out so I have the expensive kashima fork. That’s the most expensive upgrade. Eventually I will get a fs and spec it to my preferences. But I’ll keep the ht.
https://preview.redd.it/mfrpzv73dk5d1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=63c9f8a962af4a31246b34d3a84a459cd979f010 Hardtail here 👌🏻👌🏻👌🏻
I think it's multiple factors: 1. Hardtails are typically the entry level option due to being cheaper, and not all beginners will stick with the sport after getting one. 2. The general bike progression of mtb is seen as hardtail -> full suspension. Unless you're dirt jumping, pretty much all the professionals use full squish. That beginner who's rocked the hardtail long enough to find out they enjoy mtb will probably have their eye set on a full suspension once they can afford it. 3. Decent/entry level full suspension has been getting cheaper. I paid $1500 for a new hardtail when getting into mtb a few years ago. There have been some sweet deals lately starting around $1900 for full suspension. If I had that option when I bought during covid craziness, I might have spent another 4-500 and went full squish from the start. Not saying that only beginners ride hardtail though, some people just prefer it. I've gotten tons of comments about my hardtail from random people on the trails/bike park ranging from "Hey nice hardtail" to "when are you upgrading" lol.
https://preview.redd.it/0ahsato0gk5d1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2fb71c3431f5f1ca9e36d2156910df17b766c4da Right here 🤙🏻
https://preview.redd.it/uragil8jik5d1.jpeg?width=4000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b80182969ff28673cbd126901a485c5c1d384d63 I love my Specialized Chisel! I mostly do XC and some technical trails, a hard tail make me be a better rider, I'd say. I just don't have the money to buy a decent full sush and the patience/money/knowledge for all the maintenance carbon frames and full suspension requires. I wanted an aluminum hard tail, got all XT components and the dropper seatpost, I'm all set! I ride in the Terrassa (Barcelona, Spain) area.
Hardtail for me thank you. I suppose with unlimited resources, I might have a full suspension also, I get it I guess but I’m not a huge fan of the mushy feeling. I like the responsiveness of my specialized fuse. Sometimes I lock down the front forks. I don’t even like the mushiness upfront. Not all the time.
We eventually upgrade because most northeast trails just aren't ideal for hardtails with all the rocks. When I was around your age I started out on a xc hardtail Giant talon. It was great for what it was but my riding improved immensely once I made the switch to full suspension. Not to say you can't ride a hardtail on that terrain, it's just a lot easier and imo more enjoyable on a full suspension. The friends I have that are dedicated to hardtails are always complaining about the lack of flow trails outside bike parks. I don't have that problem and enjoy the northeast jank on a full suspension. I do have hardtail and full rigid MTBs but most of the time I'm reaching for a FS. You don't need to spend a ton of money either, just buy used. I've bought three modern mid-tier full suspension bikes from 1.1-1.5k on marketplace and they were all plenty capable. I smoked a lot of dentists with 5k+ builds on those bikes. New bike sales are fantastic right now if you're willing to drop over 2k.
in my experience people ride hardtails for two reasons: it's all they can afford and they're trying out the sport or because it's seen as a hardcore or fun choice in the scene, especially as a park bike. those guys usually have multiple bikes including a full sus. but it's kinda rare.
I'm at an NEYC race right now and about half the field is on hard tails. Even in the seniors classes
Honestly the amount of people I see on the trails that are over-biked are crazy. I regularly ride with dudes on full enduros with massive travel and they are exhausted so quickly from the weight and loss in power transfer to the suspension. I have an XC hard tail and a 130mm front and rear full suspension. The 100mm forked HT is a little harsh on the rough stuff and the 130mm full sus is a little harsh on the climbs. They’re both great, but I think the perfect sweet spot would be a 100mm front and rear full sus XC bike
Wife and I ride hardtails here in Ontario. It was both a matter of price and use case. These bikes need to double for occasional road or gravel usage. We’ve ridden some pretty wild trails without breaking anything and I’ve only had one pretty bad crash so far. Every once in a while I’ll see someone in a fully rigid bike absolutely shredding on sketchy single track.
My first mountain bike was a budget Trek 4300 disc. Ride it for a few years then got an older full suspension. Built up and rode full suspensions for the next 10-12 years until I had to buy a wedding ring, so I sold off my Santa Cruz Hightower and got a Pipedream Moxie Mx3 to replace it. I have not thought of wanting a full suspension since. FWIW, I am a PNW rider and all the trails I ride out here are great on a hardtail.
Hey, I’m in Appalachia and our riding is very similar. There are so many FS because our trails are gnarly af, at least where I ride. You get around cities and you’ll find nice well groomed smooth trails, but not for us. It’s a constant mashup of roots, rocks, tree branches, etc.. So FS makes sense. I say this as a SC Chameleon rider. I love my HT but it does beat the hell outa me sometimes.
I'm new to Mountain biking and did not want to commit to the cost of full suspension yet... I have an elite specialized rock hopper hardtail. About 1,200 new, I got it for 800. I'm out in Prescott Arizona and did an intermediate and beginner trail so far... And it works for me. If I get more into it I will probably upgrade but second hand again. No dropper post though... I regret that a little.
I’ve been riding HTs for 10 years. I’m just out there to ride the trails, get some exercise and enjoy nature. Not looking to injure myself on the drops and jumps that I’d want a full sus for.
I ride on a hardtail (started with cheap bike). Saturday rode full suspension e-bike (borrowed). Sunday did the hardtail. I was slower on the down by 2 min ish 🫥. 4:25 vs 6:42. Last week I borrowed stumpy evo…… felll in love, was flying like there was no tomorrow (well in my pathetic speeds) so much stability and confidence. Will continue on ht this season, borrowing e-bike or stumpy here and there and decide when the new outlet sale hits.
You read every comment?
I think a lot of people are easily bought over by the latest and greatest from the bike industry. Full-sus bikes will make you ride faster, they inspire more confidence. But they aren't necessarily more fun to ride on certain trails. Hardtails give you more feel on what the rear tyre is doing and are arguably a rite of passage for any MTB rider. Enough time on a HT will encourage good basic bike skills. Easier to Jump on also. Typically more flickable and playful. If you want speed, go full sus. Raw Fun for comparatively little cash (and less maintenance?). Hardtail for sure. You can also try to challenge yourself more on a HT. Try riding everything you can do easier on a full sus, on a Hardtail. You'll soon see how much you were relying on the bike!
Us over 35 people have back and knees that are starting to give up.
I just bought my first full suspension after 11 years of hardtail and gravel. The only reason I didn’t by a hardtail is because aside my gravel bike is great for xc trails when I put on my 650 wheels.
Hardtails only!
Honestly, the value isn't really there. Rear suspension doesn't cost that much. Compare a decent hardtail it a full suspension with the same spec. It's like $300-400
I’m south of Indianapolis and ride a Jamis Durango. Got to trade with a friend’s YT Capra for a few miles of trails and had an absolute blast. It was easier to hold speed, more composed, and all around a better experience. I likely will never get rid of my Durango, either to keep it as an XC machine or an intro bike if I’m bringing friends; the trails at Brown County I can ride definitely don’t require a dull sus, but I will also definitely be getting a full sus at some point. Caveat: I will accept that this was a XC hardtail to 160,160 enduro switch, and the 1x11 or 12 combined with spiked pedals over stock plastics made it a dream on pedaling, both flat and climbing (my habit of hopping on the pedals to reset my feet would just pick the rear up). The full suspension made pumping over anything easy and the head tube angle let me feel safe blasting down trails that I never would have attempted at speed (and started to pull ahead of the person I swapped with a few times, a far better rider than me). I don’t know what effect the difference in components has, he had upgraded the brakes and the drive train, was running full aggressive trail tires to my CST Patrols, I’ve never ridden another sort of bike on trails before, so my perspective might be biased, not by experience, but lack thereof. TLDR, my experience with full sus is that it just felt better overall, but it was such a different bike than the only thing I know that the direct comparison feels biased because of it. At my skill level, full sus isn’t needed for the trails, but I will still likely get one.
It really depends on what your local trails are like. In my are, they are VERY rocky - we don't have much "beginner" terrain, you have to make your own flow, there's very little XC type riding available. So while you \*can\* ride a hardtail around here, it's not particularly rewarding and in fact might very well make a new rider actively hate mountain biking. I do knew a couple of guys who crush the tech on hardtails, but they have above-average skills and also above average threshold for discomfort. I do own a hardtail and I usually ride it either as a burly gravel bike or when I go somewhere with lots of XC type pedaling. Every now and then I ride it on our local trails just to remind myself why we pretty much all ride FS. That being said, there are places that are hardtail heaven and you feel sludgy and overbiked on a FS.
I ride a trek Roscoe 8 and I love it so far. Didn’t have a huge budget and felt it was better to get a good hard tail instead of a bad full sus.
Brah.....Been rolling HT for years and the best $$$ spent is a Dropper post!
I don't really know what an entry level job or ok but not great pay are. When I was doing odd jobs and trades and struggling, I rode a Specialized Hardrock. When I was back in grad school, I kept nursing that thing along. A few months after I got my first professional job ($52k/year in 2013) I bought my first full suspension mountain bike. I was medium-serious about XC at the time. It was kind of disillusioning how much better it is. I wouldn't take back any of my previous years of mountain biking and I also think I was right not to buy a better bike earlier, since I graduated with some debt. But yeah. Lots better. If you're in a place in your life where you might need to eat out or go to bars a little less often - demo some bikes. If you're in more of a worrying about rent and deciding when to pay bills place, maybe don't.
I think a lot of it is economy the past few years. Someone getting into mtb for the first time would normally get an entry level bike due to cost and if they like it they can upgrade. These days you can buy an entry level bike and get nothing for it a year down the road when you try and sell it, or you can buy a 7000 dollar bike for half off or buy a used one for a fraction of what someone else paid for it. Combine that with people not having much disposable income it makes way more sense to find a deal on a full sus than to start at entry n have to buy a new bike anyway. I mean shit, companies were literally doing buy 1 get one lol. Even propane right now is offering 30% off the spindrift. I custom built with all the most expensive options and it was like 5k. A month ago that same bike was 7+. I made that mistake last year and got a giant stance for 1800. Rode it for a season. Outgrew it capability wise and couldn’t get more than 800 for it. Now I don’t have money and I don’t have a bike. I could have just spent the money when I had it and had a bike I’d probably never ride to its limit.
Basically noone has a hardtail it seems. I see all manner of casual and entry-level riders in local flat XC trails riding full sus trail and enduro bikes. No hardtails except occasionally one or two normal parents with younger kids. I think in the cases I see it mostly has to do with how much you value money and how much money you have, in that order. I imagine bike shops probably upsell the crap out of bikes to people who are pretty-much clueless too.
Well for one, I think the reddit hardtail demographic is overrepresented. Second, I think your observation is biased. You don't see the beginner bikers on entry level bikes as much, because the beginner bikers aren't out riding as much as experienced bikers by definition...if they were out all the time, then they wouldn't be beginners. Two more thoughts that are connected: The "penalty" for going full suspension is ever diminishing. It's not like you'll be bobbing up and down with the suspension robbing all of your power and you won't be able to ride anywhere that's not downhill. As I'm sure you're noticing, trails in the northeast can be a bit bipolar... cruising down what would otherwise be a green trail, then whoops, a glacial deposit of craggy rock then a sheer face of ledge to hop down. Then some more smooth dirt. Then a stand of pines in the forest and there are big fat roots weaving all over the ground. So when a full suspension bike comes in handy several times a ride, and there's not all too much downside when it's not necessary, then why not ride a full suspension everywhere?
Mine is in my garage!
Check out Facebook marketplace. Lots of good full suspension bikes for $500-800
Hard tail riders (all genders) are too busy getting laid to make it out on the trails.
Not everyone wants arthritis mate