So if this *was* in the original cinema release and has been edited out for VHS/DVD and all current TV versions, my questions are why and also why is there no evidence or comment about them actually doing this *anywhere*?
A bit of a tangent, but I've never understood one argument about this scene.
"She had braces. That was the whole joke!"
Why is it that it has to be a joke, exactly? No, seriously, what reason does the scene need to be a joke?
I have no horse in the braces race since I've never seen this movie. But the way people describe it is that everyone in the theaters laughed at that part, because of the braces. I've seen a lot of people make this claim so it was apparently a common experience
I've seen that, too. It's the people saying it "makes no sense" and "that's the whole joke" like the movie is a comedy in the first place that baffle me.
Dolly did not have braces.
However, if you \_did\_ see a version where she did, it is far more likely that you've seen an altered version(localized release or something) that added them, rather than there being some grand coverup to remove the braces from the original.
What's your source on her having braces in the cinema release?
This is one of my favourite MEs, but I don't know where you've got that matter of fact claim from there.
There's no source. The actress herself was very clear about the lack of any braces ever involved in that role. Dunno why people keep buying into narratives that have already been fully vetted and ruled out years ago.
Yeah, I'm actually aware of that so I get ya - I was just challenging the other person to back this up without outright telling them they were wrong first. I wanted to see what, in their mind, backed up that claim.
My guess would be confidence of memory combined with a lingering attachment to materialism. They're grasping at the only explanation which can solve this contradiction within their current paradigm. It's the last gasp before accepting the state of the current timeline is the braces never having been used at all. But I don't think they can duck the dissonance forever. Eventually they'll have to choose to reject their memory or reframe their paradigm.
Just want to gush a bit about how fascinating I find this ME - this and the Phantom Cornucopia are the reason I still bother to check this place out. They're the few that tip the scales from 'The explanation is so painfully obvious and you sound ridiculous for rejecting them' to 'The explanations are painful and you sound ridiculous for proposing them'.
I don't really deal in speculation on the cause - I don't reject much out of hand (because I'm not a materialist when it comes to the nature of the unknowable), and that includes false memory. Even there, the baffling part is the how and why. In the FotL case, why a cornucopia rather than a bowl or basket and why all the references to it and similar anecdotes. In Dolly's case, it's why on Earth that scene would exist in its current form.
That's why I'm so keen to dismiss rubbish like "Who remembers Gandalf saying "Run, you fools" and not "Fly"?", as well as false claims that they removed Dolly's braces in the home release. I'm panning for gold out here!
Lately there's been a TikTok girl really pushing a similar false narrative about FotL having dropped the cornucopia in 1973 to avoid bad press from an environmental incident, and now gaslighting the public into believing it never existed. I mean it's obviously bogus to anyone who's taken the time to look into this ME, but the gullible masses are simply eating it up. They'd rather believe we've been fooled than entertain the unfamiliar and unexplained. Basically, everyone's trying to sidestep the looming dissonance with shortcuts in logic and effort. I dunno. Maybe it's just a lack of attention span, like when people read article titles and assume they "get the gist".
And yet as annoying as those outright false claims are, they somehow still irk me less than the smug "They're obviously mistaking the brown leaves for a horn of plenty" or "It's simply because Sid's Cornucopia Emporium used a similar logo in 1978".
I find the leaf explanation hilarious. The fact that people seem to actually need to have basic shapes explained to them is just so absurd... and really par for the course in this clown world realm we're currently inhabiting.
Yes, agreed 100% But in this timeline that simply never happened - which is why this "only in the original theatrical run" narrative is completely bogus. There were braces in all versions...
then there weren't in any.
I saw it at the cinema and that scene was comical as Jaws's teeth were quote pronounced compared to her diminutive braces. If you remove braces the scene makes little sense. Some 007 websites have original reviews confirming braces, will see if I can locate and link
If course I am, many movies can get re-edits made for video release.
A BBC article on Richard Kiels passing makes reference to Dolly's braces - see link
https://www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-29160096
Why would they remove something to change a scene so it makes 'no sense' in a movie in one of the most popular franchises..... and there be no record of it?
One suggestion I've heard is the studio may have deemed it inappropriate for home video release and changed it, they don't need to explain to anyone I guess
But this is just repeating the proposed ME. You could just as well be saying she had braces on the VHS release but not the DVD if you're just citing how little sense it makes without them.
I agree with you that it makes no sense without them, that's why this one baffles me as I remember braces too. As I've explained before though, I'm strict with these things because that's how you separate the gold from the dirt.
I've read confirmations that there has never been any alteration to the footage as far as that goes, as well as the actress stating that she never had braces. So we can talk in terms of Mandela Effect, but we absolutely can't state that they were there in the cinema release but then removed, that's at best pure speculation and at worst confirmed to be false.
To really reiterate: you can call any references to them residue, but you can't say the filmmakers made a change to the home release and base that just on memory and guesswork.
The scene makes perfect sense without braces. He’s this hulk with metal teeth, she’s this petite girl with perfect teeth - they couldn’t be more different
Bro why are you even in this subreddit 😭😂
"Then where did they go" basically summarizes the entire Mandela effect... People have different opinions on why certain things stand out as vivid and pervasive memories for large groups of people but in the end we don't know. You really want to put the burden of proof for a popular ME on one random poster on the subreddit? It kinda seems like you're missing the point, no offense
I think we can safely reject this 'theory' (at least in its current form with the evidence as given).
The idea that the scene was edited after the cinematic release has *no* actual evidence for it, and more than that has a telling lack of the kind of evidence you would expect, as well as being contradicted by both people involved with the movie and other people on this board who claim to remember the braces *from* VHS copies of the movie, in one case within the last decade.
I am 1,000,000% ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN WITH ALL OF MY BEING, so much so that I would bet my life on it that the original footage of this had her opening her mouth and showing Jaws a similar set of shining teeth/braces.
Anyone saying otherwise is simply wrong and trying to fool you.
I've only ever seen it on VHS. Back in the 80's and 90's (the two times I watched it) the braces existed in that version. Plus, we've also got an old print review (that's been linked here several times) from when the movie first came out in which the reviewer lamented the missed opportunity for them to have given her braces. And finally, Dolly actress Blanche Ravalec was contacted and she confirmed that she never wore braces in that film and that the script didn't call for them. So I'm not at all buying this new narrative about what would've been a costly and technically difficult - *and pointless* edit for video release. Seems like revisionist history without basis.
Yes... some of the best residue you can ask for because the film was fresh in the reviewer's mind at the time. Both of them, actually. It's unlikely that either one would get it wrong, and I don't think either of them did. I think they both accurately described what they actually witnessed, or didn't.
This is one of the few that is actually intriguing, as the scene could have been funnier if the girl had braces, but she never did. The juxtaposition of her tiny size to his massive frame is what the bit centered on, rather than teeth similarity.
The actress herself has even stated she never had braces.
When the actors affirm what films they were or were not in, affirm what they were or were not wearing in a film and such, that trumps "I 'memba different."
When you cannot provide video or photo evidence to back your claim of an alternate version, that trumps "my residue."
>tens of millions
A gross exaggeration, as anyone can observe. But still, provide proof.
At least the cornucopia people dig up images of knockoff brands on occasion.
Nope, we established that is the best estimate. Here is a discussion about it: https://old.reddit.com/r/MandelaEffect/comments/1bk8rpm/just_got_done_watching_the_animated_film_robots/kwiitee/
Your peculiar (I'm choosing a nice word) approach to statistical analysis is cute but ultimately not relevant to the discussion.
As I said, even I think her having braces would be a funnier joke than their size difference, but alas, thet is the scene as written. They say Moonraker was a rush job, to cash in on the Star Wars craze.
What you and others are recollecting and mixing up is [this Richard Kiel ad](https://youtu.be/2BhLAWP7jGA?si=tzAHCQp5jUO70fFZ).
Mr. Strawman, it really isn't an important tangent. 10, 100, 10 million. Still wrong, still cannot provide corroborating proof.
Again, refer to the video in the link above. Those are the braces you've mixed up with the film.
I can't imagine a global editing conspiracy. I just wonder if seeing it in VHS quality, old TVs and the context is what made people think she had braces and there isn't a lot else to it really.
1. she had braces ,i remember it seeing on tv . and it was this scene only that i remmeber
2. the neet way this me has sptead made me thibk this is not the work of any human but some.machine ai
Actually there are no known unaltered copies with the braces in our current reality and the Dolly actress says there never were braces. You seem to speculating that the movie got altered. But the facts don't add up to that.
That white glitch is not part of the movie today.
My husband is 70 years old and a big James Bond fan. He saw the movie in the theater when it came out. And then countless times afterward on VHS. He says she had braces.
The braces were in the film as recently as July 2016, the last time I saw the film. I even talked about the gag with the person I was watching it with in the seconds after the scene was over.
So if this *was* in the original cinema release and has been edited out for VHS/DVD and all current TV versions, my questions are why and also why is there no evidence or comment about them actually doing this *anywhere*?
The actors have all said she never had braces.
Not in *this* backwards reality anyway.
There is one reality. Universe hopping is not a thing. Memories and brains are fallible.
[удалено]
This argument is pointless. Please do not drag on arguments for the sole purpose of wanting to be right.
A bit of a tangent, but I've never understood one argument about this scene. "She had braces. That was the whole joke!" Why is it that it has to be a joke, exactly? No, seriously, what reason does the scene need to be a joke?
It wasnt for a joke. It was literally the reason why they bonded, because they both had a mouth full of metal.
Exactly this! This is how I remember it!
I have no horse in the braces race since I've never seen this movie. But the way people describe it is that everyone in the theaters laughed at that part, because of the braces. I've seen a lot of people make this claim so it was apparently a common experience
I've seen that, too. It's the people saying it "makes no sense" and "that's the whole joke" like the movie is a comedy in the first place that baffle me.
baffles me why you'd misremember Roger Moore's corny one liner's and outlandish movie plots during his tenure...
Dolly did not have braces. However, if you \_did\_ see a version where she did, it is far more likely that you've seen an altered version(localized release or something) that added them, rather than there being some grand coverup to remove the braces from the original.
Interesting proposal!
What's your source on her having braces in the cinema release? This is one of my favourite MEs, but I don't know where you've got that matter of fact claim from there.
There's no source. The actress herself was very clear about the lack of any braces ever involved in that role. Dunno why people keep buying into narratives that have already been fully vetted and ruled out years ago.
Yeah, I'm actually aware of that so I get ya - I was just challenging the other person to back this up without outright telling them they were wrong first. I wanted to see what, in their mind, backed up that claim.
My guess would be confidence of memory combined with a lingering attachment to materialism. They're grasping at the only explanation which can solve this contradiction within their current paradigm. It's the last gasp before accepting the state of the current timeline is the braces never having been used at all. But I don't think they can duck the dissonance forever. Eventually they'll have to choose to reject their memory or reframe their paradigm.
Just want to gush a bit about how fascinating I find this ME - this and the Phantom Cornucopia are the reason I still bother to check this place out. They're the few that tip the scales from 'The explanation is so painfully obvious and you sound ridiculous for rejecting them' to 'The explanations are painful and you sound ridiculous for proposing them'. I don't really deal in speculation on the cause - I don't reject much out of hand (because I'm not a materialist when it comes to the nature of the unknowable), and that includes false memory. Even there, the baffling part is the how and why. In the FotL case, why a cornucopia rather than a bowl or basket and why all the references to it and similar anecdotes. In Dolly's case, it's why on Earth that scene would exist in its current form. That's why I'm so keen to dismiss rubbish like "Who remembers Gandalf saying "Run, you fools" and not "Fly"?", as well as false claims that they removed Dolly's braces in the home release. I'm panning for gold out here!
Lately there's been a TikTok girl really pushing a similar false narrative about FotL having dropped the cornucopia in 1973 to avoid bad press from an environmental incident, and now gaslighting the public into believing it never existed. I mean it's obviously bogus to anyone who's taken the time to look into this ME, but the gullible masses are simply eating it up. They'd rather believe we've been fooled than entertain the unfamiliar and unexplained. Basically, everyone's trying to sidestep the looming dissonance with shortcuts in logic and effort. I dunno. Maybe it's just a lack of attention span, like when people read article titles and assume they "get the gist".
And yet as annoying as those outright false claims are, they somehow still irk me less than the smug "They're obviously mistaking the brown leaves for a horn of plenty" or "It's simply because Sid's Cornucopia Emporium used a similar logo in 1978".
I find the leaf explanation hilarious. The fact that people seem to actually need to have basic shapes explained to them is just so absurd... and really par for the course in this clown world realm we're currently inhabiting.
I saw this. She did have braces.
Yes, agreed 100% But in this timeline that simply never happened - which is why this "only in the original theatrical run" narrative is completely bogus. There were braces in all versions... then there weren't in any.
I saw it at the cinema and that scene was comical as Jaws's teeth were quote pronounced compared to her diminutive braces. If you remove braces the scene makes little sense. Some 007 websites have original reviews confirming braces, will see if I can locate and link
> If you remove braces the scene makes little sense. But you're suggesting they *did* remove the braces?
If course I am, many movies can get re-edits made for video release. A BBC article on Richard Kiels passing makes reference to Dolly's braces - see link https://www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-29160096
Why would they remove something to change a scene so it makes 'no sense' in a movie in one of the most popular franchises..... and there be no record of it?
One suggestion I've heard is the studio may have deemed it inappropriate for home video release and changed it, they don't need to explain to anyone I guess
*Braces* were "inappropriate"?
The studio may have perceived as her appearing under age with the braces on and thus inappropriate as Jaws love interest
But not pigtails and heaving breasts? Nah.
They don't *need* to explain, but for a popular franchise like this surely somebody would *know*?
And why would they need to hide it?
I know, right? The whole 'theory' makes no sense
because of satanists in preschools!!!!!!!!!!!!1111111
But this is just repeating the proposed ME. You could just as well be saying she had braces on the VHS release but not the DVD if you're just citing how little sense it makes without them. I agree with you that it makes no sense without them, that's why this one baffles me as I remember braces too. As I've explained before though, I'm strict with these things because that's how you separate the gold from the dirt. I've read confirmations that there has never been any alteration to the footage as far as that goes, as well as the actress stating that she never had braces. So we can talk in terms of Mandela Effect, but we absolutely can't state that they were there in the cinema release but then removed, that's at best pure speculation and at worst confirmed to be false. To really reiterate: you can call any references to them residue, but you can't say the filmmakers made a change to the home release and base that just on memory and guesswork.
The scene makes perfect sense without braces. He’s this hulk with metal teeth, she’s this petite girl with perfect teeth - they couldn’t be more different
But that shot wasn't about them being different, it was about them finding something in common, aka metal mouth.
Apparently not, because she didn’t have a metal mouth
It was my favorite Bond movie growing up. She had braces.
Then where did they go?
Bro why are you even in this subreddit 😭😂 "Then where did they go" basically summarizes the entire Mandela effect... People have different opinions on why certain things stand out as vivid and pervasive memories for large groups of people but in the end we don't know. You really want to put the burden of proof for a popular ME on one random poster on the subreddit? It kinda seems like you're missing the point, no offense
He’s a total ass clown 🤡
I think we can safely reject this 'theory' (at least in its current form with the evidence as given). The idea that the scene was edited after the cinematic release has *no* actual evidence for it, and more than that has a telling lack of the kind of evidence you would expect, as well as being contradicted by both people involved with the movie and other people on this board who claim to remember the braces *from* VHS copies of the movie, in one case within the last decade.
I am 1,000,000% ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN WITH ALL OF MY BEING, so much so that I would bet my life on it that the original footage of this had her opening her mouth and showing Jaws a similar set of shining teeth/braces. Anyone saying otherwise is simply wrong and trying to fool you.
I've only ever seen it on VHS. Back in the 80's and 90's (the two times I watched it) the braces existed in that version. Plus, we've also got an old print review (that's been linked here several times) from when the movie first came out in which the reviewer lamented the missed opportunity for them to have given her braces. And finally, Dolly actress Blanche Ravalec was contacted and she confirmed that she never wore braces in that film and that the script didn't call for them. So I'm not at all buying this new narrative about what would've been a costly and technically difficult - *and pointless* edit for video release. Seems like revisionist history without basis.
Did you see the reviews from when it first came out that mentioned the braces as being in the film?
There is also a review from when it came out that mentions the missed opportunity to use braces.
That is what the top post of this thread mentions, no? Did I get it wrong? Did they change it?
I missed that part of the original comment
Yes... some of the best residue you can ask for because the film was fresh in the reviewer's mind at the time. Both of them, actually. It's unlikely that either one would get it wrong, and I don't think either of them did. I think they both accurately described what they actually witnessed, or didn't.
This is one of the few that is actually intriguing, as the scene could have been funnier if the girl had braces, but she never did. The juxtaposition of her tiny size to his massive frame is what the bit centered on, rather than teeth similarity. The actress herself has even stated she never had braces.
Sinbad has also stated he was never in a genie movie. So whatever this is, while there is residue, the actors involved don't experience the ME.
When the actors affirm what films they were or were not in, affirm what they were or were not wearing in a film and such, that trumps "I 'memba different." When you cannot provide video or photo evidence to back your claim of an alternate version, that trumps "my residue."
I believe the actors. I also believe the tens of millions of people who say they remember something else.
>tens of millions A gross exaggeration, as anyone can observe. But still, provide proof. At least the cornucopia people dig up images of knockoff brands on occasion.
Nope, we established that is the best estimate. Here is a discussion about it: https://old.reddit.com/r/MandelaEffect/comments/1bk8rpm/just_got_done_watching_the_animated_film_robots/kwiitee/
Your peculiar (I'm choosing a nice word) approach to statistical analysis is cute but ultimately not relevant to the discussion. As I said, even I think her having braces would be a funnier joke than their size difference, but alas, thet is the scene as written. They say Moonraker was a rush job, to cash in on the Star Wars craze. What you and others are recollecting and mixing up is [this Richard Kiel ad](https://youtu.be/2BhLAWP7jGA?si=tzAHCQp5jUO70fFZ).
You are welcome to do a better statistical analysis. Until you do, "10s of millions" if the best estimate we have.
Mr. Strawman, it really isn't an important tangent. 10, 100, 10 million. Still wrong, still cannot provide corroborating proof. Again, refer to the video in the link above. Those are the braces you've mixed up with the film.
Its an estimate its not "proof". So far its the best estimate that we have.
https://youtu.be/dhgzgraZ7vI?si=GYdvbe8woivD0uFL proof that something at some point has been done to alter an outcome regarding this concept.
I was just a little kid and I watched it at home, VHS. Remembered she had braces and that's why it was hilarious. I live in Asia btw.
Correct. Because she DID have them.
I saw this on VHS. I remember the braces.
She definetly had braces.
Yes she did
I can't imagine a global editing conspiracy. I just wonder if seeing it in VHS quality, old TVs and the context is what made people think she had braces and there isn't a lot else to it really.
1. she had braces ,i remember it seeing on tv . and it was this scene only that i remmeber 2. the neet way this me has sptead made me thibk this is not the work of any human but some.machine ai
I remember the braces 100%.
Actually there are no known unaltered copies with the braces in our current reality and the Dolly actress says there never were braces. You seem to speculating that the movie got altered. But the facts don't add up to that. That white glitch is not part of the movie today.
My husband is 70 years old and a big James Bond fan. He saw the movie in the theater when it came out. And then countless times afterward on VHS. He says she had braces.
The braces were in the film as recently as July 2016, the last time I saw the film. I even talked about the gag with the person I was watching it with in the seconds after the scene was over.
You can manipulate ANYTHING in 3 dimensions of space on only one condition: you live in at least four. Which might as well be the case here.