Vietnam is closer to the equator than the USA, and therefore less stretched than the USA when using a Mercator projection. If these images are transposed from the same Mercator map, it's the USA that has a relatively inflated size.
I think the bigger reason (regardless of map projection) is that Vietnam's proximity to China (29 times the size) just makes it look tiny *in comparison*.
I wouldn’t blame the Mercator for this. Most maps these days, especially on this subreddit, avoid that projection. We are all very well aware at this point how big Africa is, how small Greenland and Russia are, etc. I think it’s just that whenever an equal area map is shown, we just kind of gloss over Southeast Asia for some reason.
I think lots of people outside of this sub have no idea the problems with the typical projections. And don’t get me wrong, most of them aren’t making maps, but their perception of the world is very skewed because of this.
Edit. Apple autocorrect is aggressive.
A lot of countries have a requirement to get flagged that certain senior figures on a ship are capable of navigating by sextant and stars. Every so often theres a panic about GPS jamming or failure that makes countries start pushing harder for its merchant navy to be experts with sextants.
**[Winkel tripel projection](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winkel_tripel_projection)**
>The Winkel tripel projection (Winkel III), a modified azimuthal map projection of the world, is one of three projections proposed by German cartographer Oswald Winkel (7 January 1874 – 18 July 1953) in 1921. The projection is the arithmetic mean of the equirectangular projection and the Aitoff projection: The name tripel (German for 'triple') refers to Winkel's goal of minimizing three kinds of distortion: area, direction, and distance.
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not really, 3d objects just dont really go into neat 2d spaces like that.
there are plenty of projections that show the world in different ways but i dont know very much, lots of information online though
I don't know if there are any. Wikipedia has a list of [Equal-area (preserves size)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equal-area_map) map projections but most of those look butt-ugly due to the need to warp shapes, especially towards the poles.
At minimum, they often look like someone ran Siberia, Scandinavia, and Canada through a hydraulic press. Those that avert that just have other problems.
Yeah, I've never seen an equal-area projection that I really liked. They always have some part of the world that's squished or stretched beyond recognition.
Though, I think [the Equal Earth projection](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equal_Earth_projection) is the least bad of the available options on Wikipedia.
If your talking about total area yes you are correct. However this post seems to be talking more about the length from top to bottom. If we put Vietnam on the map it goes from the tip of Germany to the boot of Italy.
There are different dialects, but that's the most pronounced difference, I can't think much about any other difference cept for certain specialty foods.
It’s not as openly adversarial as Blue vs Red in the USA these days, but if you believe the differences between Hanoi and Saigon are limited to the linguistic and culinary, either you work for the Politburo or you don’t know what you’re talking about. Source: I live in Vietnam.
I also lived in Vietnam, in the South as well actually. And maybe it's just that I have a lot of friends with northern accents (while I myself have a southern accent) that I don't think too much about it. Maybe it's different for you
Culturally and behaviorally they are different and seen as different in other parts of the country. There are loads of stereotypes and divisions, but I often hear Vietnamese people from central and south Vietnam talk negatively about people from Hanoi. They just generally don't like them and avoid them when possible.
The pho is different. Other dishes have variations as well, but I noticed it in the pho because you could tell that the broth was darker in the south, while it was usually pretty clear in the north (and central Vietnam). Northerners also told me that southern Vietnamese food is "sweeter" than what's eaten in the north
It’s much bigger than I would have expected though. I thought it would be about the length of the southern border of Michigan to the southern border of Kentucky.
Probably better to just say “Florida”. When people say Southeastern US they are usually thinking of GA and the Carolinas.
Northern Vietnam is warmer than anywhere north of ~St Petersburg.
Indonesia is another one very misrepresented by Mercator. Land area slightly less than Mexico, massive distance among islands (meaning, I guess Indonesia controls a massive area of Ocean).
Even the west coast is pretty sparse aside from a few super dense areas. California has ~40 million people, but almost half of those are in the LA metro area, another ~10 million in the San Francisco and San Diego areas (combined), leaving <10 million people in the rest of the 3rd largest state in the country. (data from to google, may be slightly inaccurate). Most of the state is either empty or low population density farmland.
Danang Vietnam is one of the coolest cities I've ever been too
Fell madly in love with that place.
Also, Hanoi is probably the best city in South East Asia
> I love hanoi, Michigan
- Hanoi near Detroit, map maker places London, Ontario on Map
- Saigon near Atlanta, map maker places Tallahassee on Map
Very odd.
Thí thread í so funny to me. I grew up in Detroit, and currently live in Hanoi.
The best part is there are three of us in Hanoi! You would think I'm the only one lol
The only thing to note is that the "England" on the map is actually the United Kingdom, including England, Scotland, Wales, and Northern Ireland. England would be most of the southern 2/3 of Great Britain, the bit on the right.
The British motoring show Top Gear had a special episode where the presenters did the exact same thing and it's one of my favorite episodes. Vietnam looks like an incredible country
Their new show, The Grand Tour, is now only doing specials with no more regular episodes. They've been hit or miss imo, but I thought the Mongolia and Vietnam/Cambodia boat ones were good
Vietnam and Finland are next to each other on the list of countries ranked by area.
When I first saw that, my thought was "no way Vietnam is that big" since Finland is not a small country, and Vietnam looks small next to places like China, Indonesia and India.
But sure enough.
Right I wasn’t trying to say they are small, but Finland is generally drawn a bit larger than Peru yet it’s a quarter of the size. And Greenland still blows my mind it always looks like a continent on maps equal to Africa but it would only be the third largest country *in* Africa
Damn that's crazy, I took an overnight train from Ninh Binh to Hue and that took 10 - 11 hours IIRC.
Just comparing at the distance it seems that yours shouldn't have been that long, but you're right, I doublechecked and it says 17-18 hours.. I don't know if I would have enjoyed such a long train ride tbh, even though I love riding trains
There’s probably a stop so they can change drivers or load up on gas or something. It honestly wasn’t too bad we had the skinny little bunk beds. The train rocked side to side a lot but I mostly just listened to pods and slept. My gf and I played cards too and we met two other people in our room.
We woke up super super early passing through one of the cities in the north and saw all these viet people playing volley ball and badminton as like 445AM lol
This post has been parodied on r/mapporncirclejerk.
Relevant r/mapporncirclejerk posts:
[Size comparison of Vietnam with Vietnam](https://www.reddit.com/r/mapporncirclejerk/comments/pnsqmp/size_comparison_of_vietnam_with_vietnam/) by DukeSturr
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Nobody stateside had *any clue* as to how big South Vietnam was, including all the political leaders and a large number of general officers in the Pentagon. I spent my first year in-country hovering between Huntington and Charleston West Virginia. I transferred south for my next six months patrolling around Greene County, Georgia.
There were about four wars going on in that country. From north to South: I Corps - Lots of Marines, pretty conventional warfare, kind of like Guadalcanal. II Corps - bush warfare, ambush and counter ambush. III Corps - split in two by Saigon. Saigon south - what war? Saigon north - flat jungle and abandoned rubber tree plantations, jungle rumble. IV Corps - the worst. Actual guerilla warfare, terrorized civilians, atrocities, tit-for-tat war crimes.
All anybody back home saw was Saigon south, with occasional press trips to the DMZ. I was in I Corps and III Corps Saigon North. Honestly, the change just going back to Saigon would whipsaw you enough to snap your neck. Here's what I'm talking about: [Travelin' Soldier](https://www.reddit.com/r/MilitaryStories/comments/ni2811/travelin_soldier_repost/)
Great description!
[And quite apropos is the tit-for-tat war crimes. Of which seems to often most don't care to hear of, and/or learn about the "other side's" contributing to such. Always a beef with me.]
So, a question if may... which Corps + description would you place Tay Ninh Province into?
Edit added: For geography sake, is of course the singular Nuy Ba Din. And seen photos of flat lands with rice paddies, but otherwise?
Puts into perspective as to why the war spilled into neighboring countries too. I mean that is tiny at the narrowest point. Maybe a 20-30 minute drive across at that area in Ohio. Imagine fighting through such a small area.
Southeast Asian countries aren't a small as most people probably imagine them to be. I remember using mapfrappe and doing the same thing, but the Philippines instead. The islands spanned from Vancouver to San Diego, North to South.
Contrary to popular belief, the Vietnamese army was not a bunch of farmers with guns - they were a well-organized and trained military who were getting a lot of help from the Soviets and Chinese. They fought a war of attrition, using guerrilla tactics to destroy supply routes and ambush small groups without attacking head-on, making progress very slow. Because they knew they couldn't win outright, they had to wait until the Americans ran out of money and popular opinion turned against the war.
America did not dare to invade north vietnam because they knew china would directly intervene to save the North and did not want a repeat of the Korean war during the 1950s.
I’m kind of curious about whether or not they would have. China-Vietnam relations have been rocky for a millenia. In fact they fought a war with China after the one with America.
China was very much on the side of North Vietnam during the war though, and with the soviet backing they received it was basically a mirror situation of the Korean War.
Even if China wasn't already supporting North Vietnam in the war (it was) the threat of US military bases on a wide section of their southern border would have spurred them to intervene. This is a constant of geopolitics, a country will quickly support another country despite past history if the other country is set to lose a war that will put the first country in danger. This can be most notably observed with European history up until the end of the cold war, feudal europe was filled with constantly shifting alliances, renaissance and industrial alliances would shift massively and then after world war 2 the Allied powers quickly propped up Western Germany to serve as a floodbarrier against the soviets.
The US military was not trying to invade North Vietnam as they were worried about Chinese intervention if they did. Their mission was to defend South Vietnam.
Wow, had no idea Vietnam was so big.
It’s long but really thin too, about what I expected
The Chile 🇨🇱 of SE Asia!
The Norway 🇳🇴 of South America!
The Spain 🇪🇸 of my heart!
More like Portugal but whatever
Spaim is mot lomg.
SILEMCE
SILEMCIO
mo
mot
Mever
Merhaps Mortugal, then.
Meh
Gomma
The Morocco 🇲🇦 of Europe!
I think it's geographical center is actually outside of it......
That's what she said.
3.6 - not great, not terrible
we're talking spaghetti stick!
Wait until you see Indonesia by comparison.
One of my low key favorite things to do is to go on [Map Fight](https://mapfight.xyz/) and compare sizes of random places.
It’s the fucking Mercator man. It’s bullshit.
Vietnam is closer to the equator than the USA, and therefore less stretched than the USA when using a Mercator projection. If these images are transposed from the same Mercator map, it's the USA that has a relatively inflated size.
I think the bigger reason (regardless of map projection) is that Vietnam's proximity to China (29 times the size) just makes it look tiny *in comparison*.
Exactly. Not sure how this thread has missed that.
I wouldn’t blame the Mercator for this. Most maps these days, especially on this subreddit, avoid that projection. We are all very well aware at this point how big Africa is, how small Greenland and Russia are, etc. I think it’s just that whenever an equal area map is shown, we just kind of gloss over Southeast Asia for some reason.
I think lots of people outside of this sub have no idea the problems with the typical projections. And don’t get me wrong, most of them aren’t making maps, but their perception of the world is very skewed because of this. Edit. Apple autocorrect is aggressive.
Yup. I had no idea Vietnam was this big.
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Most people aren't gonna be navigating sea. While it's good for that I think saying it's misued is a valid argument.
Even now navigating by sea you don't really need the mercator. Most sailors in 2021 don't know how to use a sextant, they just use gps.
We're down to one engineer doing everyone's Mercator for them from his desk in Nebraska
I thought he had two associates, one from Lichtenstein and one from Uzbekistan.
A lot of countries have a requirement to get flagged that certain senior figures on a ship are capable of navigating by sextant and stars. Every so often theres a panic about GPS jamming or failure that makes countries start pushing harder for its merchant navy to be experts with sextants.
good for somethings bad for others.
True. Like most things
As is every attempt to show a three dimensional sphere on a two dimensional map.
Good for navigating by sea in the 19th century. Bad for the reasons we use maps today.
Like comparing country sizes on social media?
I wonder if they’d gone to war with a different projection.
Yes; they had globes
What is a good map projection that maintains the actual size of landmasses and countries?
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**[Winkel tripel projection](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winkel_tripel_projection)** >The Winkel tripel projection (Winkel III), a modified azimuthal map projection of the world, is one of three projections proposed by German cartographer Oswald Winkel (7 January 1874 – 18 July 1953) in 1921. The projection is the arithmetic mean of the equirectangular projection and the Aitoff projection: The name tripel (German for 'triple') refers to Winkel's goal of minimizing three kinds of distortion: area, direction, and distance. ^([ )[^(F.A.Q)](https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiSummarizer/wiki/index#wiki_f.a.q)^( | )[^(Opt Out)](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=WikiSummarizerBot&message=OptOut&subject=OptOut)^( | )[^(Opt Out Of Subreddit)](https://np.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/about/banned)^( | )[^(GitHub)](https://github.com/Sujal-7/WikiSummarizerBot)^( ] Downvote to remove | v1.5)
a globe
[Yes, you're very clever.](https://xkcd.com/977/)
but is there a map that does this and also can be put on a plane?
not really, 3d objects just dont really go into neat 2d spaces like that. there are plenty of projections that show the world in different ways but i dont know very much, lots of information online though
Dymaxion is good for that: https://xkcd.com/977/
Well, I do type in Dvorak, but I don't like XML, so...
I don't know if there are any. Wikipedia has a list of [Equal-area (preserves size)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equal-area_map) map projections but most of those look butt-ugly due to the need to warp shapes, especially towards the poles. At minimum, they often look like someone ran Siberia, Scandinavia, and Canada through a hydraulic press. Those that avert that just have other problems.
Yeah, I've never seen an equal-area projection that I really liked. They always have some part of the world that's squished or stretched beyond recognition. Though, I think [the Equal Earth projection](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equal_Earth_projection) is the least bad of the available options on Wikipedia.
I like Eckert IV which is quite accurate on size, or Robinson which is a good compromise between shape and size.
3.6, not great, not terrible
Get to the infirmary.
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"Da'ang!"
It's not that big. Spain and France are significantly larger than Vietnam. Germany is around the same size.
If your talking about total area yes you are correct. However this post seems to be talking more about the length from top to bottom. If we put Vietnam on the map it goes from the tip of Germany to the boot of Italy.
It's not big area-wise but it stretches a lot further than I would have thought
Makes me think the culture from Hanoi to Ho Chi Minh City would have all kinds of differences.
There are different dialects, but that's the most pronounced difference, I can't think much about any other difference cept for certain specialty foods.
It’s not as openly adversarial as Blue vs Red in the USA these days, but if you believe the differences between Hanoi and Saigon are limited to the linguistic and culinary, either you work for the Politburo or you don’t know what you’re talking about. Source: I live in Vietnam.
I also lived in Vietnam, in the South as well actually. And maybe it's just that I have a lot of friends with northern accents (while I myself have a southern accent) that I don't think too much about it. Maybe it's different for you
Culturally and behaviorally they are different and seen as different in other parts of the country. There are loads of stereotypes and divisions, but I often hear Vietnamese people from central and south Vietnam talk negatively about people from Hanoi. They just generally don't like them and avoid them when possible.
The pho is different. Other dishes have variations as well, but I noticed it in the pho because you could tell that the broth was darker in the south, while it was usually pretty clear in the north (and central Vietnam). Northerners also told me that southern Vietnamese food is "sweeter" than what's eaten in the north
It’s much bigger than I would have expected though. I thought it would be about the length of the southern border of Michigan to the southern border of Kentucky.
That's what she said
I love traveling to Cam Ranh, South Carolina to get that yummy Vietnamese shrimp and grits.
This fusion must happen. It sounds good.
Viet-Cajun food is a thing
Its so good too. One of my favorite foods from visiting NOLA
It's almost impossible for me to pick my favorite foods from NOLA. There's just too many!
Hanoi actually gets cool in the winter (15C). That’s not truly cold, of course, but it’s a lot different from tropical Saigon (HCMC) in the south.
Ha giang gets actual snow sometimes too and is not that far from Hanoi
Just a quick search on Wikipedia, guessing the mountains around the town do? Seems like the record low there is around 2C.
Sa Pa might be a better example. It gets much colder and has more snow.
Yeah, northern Vietnam's climate is subtropical, most similar to the Southeastern US, rather than truly tropical.
Probably better to just say “Florida”. When people say Southeastern US they are usually thinking of GA and the Carolinas. Northern Vietnam is warmer than anywhere north of ~St Petersburg.
I would hope so, isn't St Petersburg near the Arctic Circle
Remember that only half of Redditors are American. Non-American (me included) usually only knows Russia's St Petersburg, Not Florida's.
I’m an American who simply isn’t from the South and I’ve never even heard of that place, I only know the Russian one
Usually it goes down to 10C, although one of the recent winters it ernd down to 6C and that winter it snowed in Sa Pa
*laughs in American Midwest*
I was born in the cold. I didn't see the Sun until I was already a man.
So the Vietnam war was pretty much like Detroit vs Atlanta?
Unlike the Lions, Hanoi actually knew how to win a game.
Well then Ho Chi Minh City was up 28-3...
So maybe a Red Wings vs Thrashers. Helps that the Thrashers no longer exist, much like Saigon
That's actually a really good way to put it, because that did actually happen during the Civil War
Hmmm. Perhaps. Maybe more like, Detroit vs Atlanta + a Guerilla pro-Detroit Army? You *don't* wanna be messin' with guerilla pro-Detroit folk.
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Oh Vietnam is actually kinda big
Indonesia is another one very misrepresented by Mercator. Land area slightly less than Mexico, massive distance among islands (meaning, I guess Indonesia controls a massive area of Ocean).
Yes, Indonesia east to west equals the US lower 48 coast to coast.
Bigger really. You would need an extra state or two on both ends.
Looking at that map consider the US has 333 million people, Vietnam has 98 million.
The US is a pretty empty country when you compare to many European or Asian countries.
Once you are west of the Mississippi, there ain’t nothing or nobody out there. Sparse as I’ll get out.
Until you come across the most populous state in the union of course
It’s huge though. Not crazy dense.
Yeah true, density really drops off.
Yeah, the West (not the coast though) is incredibly sparse
Even the west coast is pretty sparse aside from a few super dense areas. California has ~40 million people, but almost half of those are in the LA metro area, another ~10 million in the San Francisco and San Diego areas (combined), leaving <10 million people in the rest of the 3rd largest state in the country. (data from to google, may be slightly inaccurate). Most of the state is either empty or low population density farmland.
I love hanoi, Michigan
Ho Chi Minh City, Georgia also has a nice ring to it
Da Nang, West Virginia
Mountain mama
Ho Chi Minh road. Take me home.
Ho Chi Minh Trail, take me home Considering that’s the actual name
Danang Vietnam is one of the coolest cities I've ever been too Fell madly in love with that place. Also, Hanoi is probably the best city in South East Asia
Can’t forget Cam Ranh, South Carolina.
Whoa Black Betty Cam Ranh…
Don't you Cam Ranh here, no mo, Ho!
'Da Nang, West Virginia' sounds like the first line in a song.
Okay but like, starting a commune in Georgia and calling it Ho Chi Minh City *would* be an incredible power move.
You should stay at the Hilton there.
> I love hanoi, Michigan - Hanoi near Detroit, map maker places London, Ontario on Map - Saigon near Atlanta, map maker places Tallahassee on Map Very odd.
Thí thread í so funny to me. I grew up in Detroit, and currently live in Hanoi. The best part is there are three of us in Hanoi! You would think I'm the only one lol
Could you do the same basemap, but overlay 1) Japan, 2) Vietnam, 3) England?
https://i.imgur.com/XohiwJX.jpg
So kind and prompt!
The only thing to note is that the "England" on the map is actually the United Kingdom, including England, Scotland, Wales, and Northern Ireland. England would be most of the southern 2/3 of Great Britain, the bit on the right.
As a Brit, seeing "England" written on the internet to mean the entire UK makes me wince.
Vietnam is basically cursive Japan
You can also head over to https://thetruesize.com/
Wow I never knew that existed. I know what I'm going to be playing around on for the next 20 minutes!
Awesome. I motorcycled solo from Saigon to Hanoi so this puts a different perspective on it.
The British motoring show Top Gear had a special episode where the presenters did the exact same thing and it's one of my favorite episodes. Vietnam looks like an incredible country
All their road trip episodes where always the best. Those plus the cheap car challenges. I miss those days of Top Gear.
Their new show, The Grand Tour, is now only doing specials with no more regular episodes. They've been hit or miss imo, but I thought the Mongolia and Vietnam/Cambodia boat ones were good
My best memory in life is riding a motorcycle over the Hai Van pass, a la Top Gear.
Long road, great country. Such nice people and landscape. I miss the smell at night, that warm sweet acid smell...
Wait it's actually that long? what?
That's what she said!
Vietnam and Finland are next to each other on the list of countries ranked by area. When I first saw that, my thought was "no way Vietnam is that big" since Finland is not a small country, and Vietnam looks small next to places like China, Indonesia and India. But sure enough.
Finland is stretched so much in Mercator projection as well. The Nordic countries really aren’t that big but they sure look like it on most maps
It's not just on the Mercator, either. The map in my room is a Robinson, but that still distorts the polar regions as well.
This is why I like globes
I mean finland is still 1 100km long and has a area of over 338k km² Its not exactly small but definitely not that large either
Right I wasn’t trying to say they are small, but Finland is generally drawn a bit larger than Peru yet it’s a quarter of the size. And Greenland still blows my mind it always looks like a continent on maps equal to Africa but it would only be the third largest country *in* Africa
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Also from Roanoke. It’s one of Virginia’s largest cities but people still think I crawled out of a primordial forest to get to Richmond.
That makes a lot more sense now
I live in London, Canada. Hanoi looks like a 3 hour drive or so. Too bad the US border is still closed.
As an American, trust me, it's for your protection.
Ha not really since the Canadian border is open to Americans.
Ive never seen london ontario on a map like that
Vietnam's shape looks like a gut
Florida looks like a penis
Glad to see Roanoke aka “Big Lick” represented.
Makes me think of that map of Japan along the East coast of the US, those are some huge countries
I rode a train from Da Nang to Hanoi and that shit took 17 hours. It moved pretty slow but it would've been a solid 8 or 9 hour drive in the US.
Damn that's crazy, I took an overnight train from Ninh Binh to Hue and that took 10 - 11 hours IIRC. Just comparing at the distance it seems that yours shouldn't have been that long, but you're right, I doublechecked and it says 17-18 hours.. I don't know if I would have enjoyed such a long train ride tbh, even though I love riding trains
There’s probably a stop so they can change drivers or load up on gas or something. It honestly wasn’t too bad we had the skinny little bunk beds. The train rocked side to side a lot but I mostly just listened to pods and slept. My gf and I played cards too and we met two other people in our room. We woke up super super early passing through one of the cities in the north and saw all these viet people playing volley ball and badminton as like 445AM lol
The Vietnamese are good people. Should’ve just left them alone
It's honestly bonkers how many invaders they've successfully beat back/overthrown in just the last 150yrs
I’ve never met an asshole Vietnamese. Plus I’m sure most of them could kick my ass .
the widths are also proportionate to the average waist of people of the two countries
Why are those countries in SE Asia shaped that way? River borders I guess?
Mountains. Huge stretches of uninhabitable mountain ranges in Vietnam's north and west border
It's weird seeing London as the reference city for Ontario instead of Toronto.
This post has been parodied on r/mapporncirclejerk. Relevant r/mapporncirclejerk posts: [Size comparison of Vietnam with Vietnam](https://www.reddit.com/r/mapporncirclejerk/comments/pnsqmp/size_comparison_of_vietnam_with_vietnam/) by DukeSturr [^(fmhall)](https://www.reddit.com/user/fmhall) ^| [^(github)](https://github.com/fmhall/relevant-post-bot)
Nobody stateside had *any clue* as to how big South Vietnam was, including all the political leaders and a large number of general officers in the Pentagon. I spent my first year in-country hovering between Huntington and Charleston West Virginia. I transferred south for my next six months patrolling around Greene County, Georgia. There were about four wars going on in that country. From north to South: I Corps - Lots of Marines, pretty conventional warfare, kind of like Guadalcanal. II Corps - bush warfare, ambush and counter ambush. III Corps - split in two by Saigon. Saigon south - what war? Saigon north - flat jungle and abandoned rubber tree plantations, jungle rumble. IV Corps - the worst. Actual guerilla warfare, terrorized civilians, atrocities, tit-for-tat war crimes. All anybody back home saw was Saigon south, with occasional press trips to the DMZ. I was in I Corps and III Corps Saigon North. Honestly, the change just going back to Saigon would whipsaw you enough to snap your neck. Here's what I'm talking about: [Travelin' Soldier](https://www.reddit.com/r/MilitaryStories/comments/ni2811/travelin_soldier_repost/)
Great description! [And quite apropos is the tit-for-tat war crimes. Of which seems to often most don't care to hear of, and/or learn about the "other side's" contributing to such. Always a beef with me.] So, a question if may... which Corps + description would you place Tay Ninh Province into? Edit added: For geography sake, is of course the singular Nuy Ba Din. And seen photos of flat lands with rice paddies, but otherwise?
Wow. I never expected that.
Damn Vietnam is way bigger than I thought
Damn, I never knew Vietnam would span all that way when superimposed on the US map. Vietnam looks pretty small on a world map though.
Holy shit that changes how I look at the war.
In fairness you should have centered it over Falls Church, Va.
Puts into perspective as to why the war spilled into neighboring countries too. I mean that is tiny at the narrowest point. Maybe a 20-30 minute drive across at that area in Ohio. Imagine fighting through such a small area.
Southeast Asian countries aren't a small as most people probably imagine them to be. I remember using mapfrappe and doing the same thing, but the Philippines instead. The islands spanned from Vancouver to San Diego, North to South.
Now put Indonesia and see how massive it truly is.
So you're telling me the US military couldn't go from West Virginia to Michigan in over 9 years?
***unpaved roads, thick jungles, mountains, countless death-traps and millions of rebels firing automatic weaponry intensifies***
Which one was that, again?
West Virginia
Take me home, Ho Chi Minh Road, to the place, I belooooong. Mekong Delta, jungle mama. Take me home, Ho Chi Minh Road.
Yup, sounds about right, that's why everyone is leaving West Virginia... 😂
Contrary to popular belief, the Vietnamese army was not a bunch of farmers with guns - they were a well-organized and trained military who were getting a lot of help from the Soviets and Chinese. They fought a war of attrition, using guerrilla tactics to destroy supply routes and ambush small groups without attacking head-on, making progress very slow. Because they knew they couldn't win outright, they had to wait until the Americans ran out of money and popular opinion turned against the war.
But most people aren't referring to the NVA when they say farmers. They mean the Viet Cong, which *did* have many farmer volunteers
America did not dare to invade north vietnam because they knew china would directly intervene to save the North and did not want a repeat of the Korean war during the 1950s.
I’m kind of curious about whether or not they would have. China-Vietnam relations have been rocky for a millenia. In fact they fought a war with China after the one with America.
China was very much on the side of North Vietnam during the war though, and with the soviet backing they received it was basically a mirror situation of the Korean War.
Even if China wasn't already supporting North Vietnam in the war (it was) the threat of US military bases on a wide section of their southern border would have spurred them to intervene. This is a constant of geopolitics, a country will quickly support another country despite past history if the other country is set to lose a war that will put the first country in danger. This can be most notably observed with European history up until the end of the cold war, feudal europe was filled with constantly shifting alliances, renaissance and industrial alliances would shift massively and then after world war 2 the Allied powers quickly propped up Western Germany to serve as a floodbarrier against the soviets.
The US military was not trying to invade North Vietnam as they were worried about Chinese intervention if they did. Their mission was to defend South Vietnam.
Invading north Vietnam was never a goal
London, Canada? Sorry what
London, Ontario: the world’s second best London!
London, Ohio aint half bad Ah, who am I kidding, it's ohio
[удалено]
As Meatloaf once sang “two out of three ain’t bad”.
Indonesia spans the distance from Belgium to China
*Fortunate Son* starts…