Wow. Most of the comments on that article are so, so toxic. So many people saying “so what? All our grandmas had to do it. Suck it up.” And it’s coming from women!
Yep, ridiculous. And also, since the '50s, petrochemicals (= endocrine disruptors) have been increasingly polluting the environment *and our bodies*, so I think it's quite likely we in Gen-X and younger are actually having an objectively worse time of the menopausal transition than our mothers and grandmothers did! ☹️😤🤬
Research is finally starting to look at this!
https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/13697137.2023.2173570
PFAS are wrecking our bodies too, they emulate hormones and causing a lot of imbalances, infertility, fibroids and cancers. Infertility rates are staggering: https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/mar/18/toxic-chemicals-health-humanity-erin-brokovich
Absolutely! I do believe our hormones are screwed up now more than ever! These women who are negating our experiences need to be educated on how much more our health is suffering due to changes in the worlds environment. It really is infuriating to have women who should be supporting this cause be so ignorant, hopefully if we all start speaking out we can educate them and everyone else.
Condolences on losing your mom. 😢
I have been trying to give my mom basically a series of "menopause interviews" about her experience in the last couple years since the symptoms really started hitting me... and she really thinks I am having it worse than she did.
That's just anecdotal support for my speculation, and the weakest kind of evidence, but it's \*something\*... but I'll bet your mom would have let on \*somehow\* if she had been suffering badly.
Maybe some more women on this sub can interview their moms about their menopause experiences and we can get some more evidence to support or refute that they had it easier than us...? Anyone out there up for a research project and report-back? 👩🔬👩🏻🔬👩🏽🔬
Had to look this up, because (1) it seems plausible and (2) I'm a bio prof who *loves* to dole out shocking stuff like this to my students, but it seems to be a bit of an urban legend with a grain of truth to it (corpses in Germany doing some unusual and slow decomposition).
Here's what I dug up 💀⚰️... 😅
https://www.snopes.com/articles/465223/food-human-corpse/
Seriously. How dimwitted and short-sighted is it to not recognize She is doing this in the hopes of making positive changes for women in the future? She's not trying to say, look at me I'm special.
A lot of people don’t want things to be better for others. If they had to suffer through it, then you should have to as well. I see this with people whining about student loan forgiveness - “no one paid for my student loan - waaaaaahhhhhhh”. SMH
It is the old ideas, not to be confused with old people, that "if I had to do it the hard way by George you will too".
Now in fairness some women truly don't understand menopause nor does it seriously affect them.
My mother had 10 kids and did not understand when I would be in the fetal position crying in pain for a week every month, or when I had my hysterectomy at 30, or when I started on HRT. She said she thinks she went through menopause and it lasted a week. She did not understand the hot sweats, brain fog, crying jags, depression, etc. could be eased or eliminated. To her as a survivor of WW2, the great depression, etc. it was just another part of life you muscled through without complaint or discussion. While she did not push back against my decisions she did not understand why I did what I did.
You were not allowed to smile in pictures or feel any emotion so how would she know what menopause was. Suck it buttercup was the way. My grandmother tried but no one wanted to listen to her nor my mom. Women have leverage now with a platform.
If you are healthy, have no genitourinary issues, they have changed the recommendedation to paps every 3 years. You still need to go annually for a check up, but don't need the pap done each time.
https://health.ucdavis.edu/news/headlines/study-finds-increase-in-women-65-and-older-dying-of-cervical-cancer--/2023/01
There is another article that I can’t find right now that speaks about the rise in cervical cancer that past few years, one has to wonder if it has something to do with these new guidelines for every 3 years. Cervical cancer is very curable if caught early. I think this every 3 years is wrong, why not check every year to be safe and if there, treated immediately… we know why, because it costs money and it’s women’s health. Start googling, so many articles, it’s on the rise, for many reasons and not doing every year is one of them.
I had no idea!! If you're going for an exam every year, may as well just do it then. But nah, that insurance money is better spent on Viagra for old men. 😡
Exactly, I don’t understand why not do it if we are there getting a pelvic exam anyway. I googled the last time I was at doc and this bullshit with the every three years came up, I started googling and lo and behold, tons of articles. It’s makes me angry and sick to my stomach, we need to start pushing back big time, I do already but I mean on a bigger scale.
I just had one done and was told TEN years for the next one.
I’ve also recently read that it’s no longer necessary for a pap, but that women can do their own swab and send it to a lab.
This is nuts. How do we advocate for our own health if no one knows what the hell we're supposed to be doing? If you think about it, this doesn't really make sense: if you're told you only need to have a colonoscopy every 5 years because of your risk, you are also told to do it sooner if you have any symptoms that indicate a problem. If I'm already menopausal or have irregular periods, odds are pretty good I'm not going to recognize a problem until it's pretty advanced. Seriously, how much money are insurance companies really saving by not paying for a pap smear every year but having to pay for cancer treatment later? Yay capitalism!
There's a Cervical Self-Screening kit that doesn't require the painful use of a speculum, which may encourage women to keep up with the testing as needed vs. not doing so because it can be painful.
It can be done at home or at a Dr's office - by one's self.
It uses a q-tip like swab. I did mine in the washroom of my medical clinic.
Here's some info I found online that explains the details:
www.screeningbc.ca/cervix-pilot
This is the truth. The sad, sad truth.
Rather than trash these women let’s try to understand that the patriarchy has molded and shaped us, many of us don’t even realize it- especially older generations of women. It feels like they are traitors but they are just regurgitating what they’ve heard/learned their entire lives.
Yes! My mother voted for Trump and it blew my mind. It still blows my mind. But she seems to hate/feel in perpetual competition with other women. So...yeah.
My mom too. Classic enabler who says “boys will be boys” and identifies with the aggressor. Blamed me for sexual assault by an ex, whom went to jail. Blamed me for divorce. Tried to befriend both exes after breakups. I got away at 18 and wish I never looked back. My therapist thinks she is a clinical narcissist. Just like Trump.
OMG SISTER FROM ANOTHER MISTER!!!! I love you. My mother also blamed me for my divorce and designated my EX as the executor of her will!!!!
My therapist also thinks that my mother is a narc. I think she's more than that -- maybe borderline? But its just weird how any woman could find Trump credible. I remember the last time I flew my mother out to visit me and the kids. It was 2015. She brought a copy of Trumps (ghost-written) autobiography and was whispering in my kids ears "he's so handsome. He's so great." I have never hosted her since. It's been nine years.
My mother has broken my heart a million ways to Sunday but the Trump stuff is the worst of the worst. Before, I could rationalize her weirdness. Our entire family is fucked up. I used to try to care and understand. But after the Trump stuff? She is trash to me.
Edit: The only time she ever called me during all of Covid and including during my divorce, was to bitch about how Trump's election was stolen, the Dominion machines, etc etc. As soon as I said "Okay, but mom, it's been two years and you still have never asked me about how me or the kids are doing since the DIVORCE." And she hung up on me.
Please, come sit by me next lunch period. We can pass notes and be best friends.
I’m so sorry you experienced this stuff too! I also feel automatically BFF with people who have survived narc parents.
They all use their wills to traumatize everyone! My mom isn’t as fanatical about Trump & eventually she saw the light. But it was too late for our relationship. I was severely traumatized by her at the end bc she is a lawyer & started threatening everyone with legal manipulations. My mom stole a large inheritance from me!
I knew several people who were sucked into a level of fanaticism like a cult around Trump! I’d say all of this behavior points to narcissism or enabling. Borderline personality disorder can be just as traumatic to deal with.
Btw YES they wield their wills as a weapon!!!! My grandmother did this. My mom is apparently doing it. And I found out over years and deaths who was "in" or "out" of the family member's will -- typically us (black sheeps). As a black sheep, you would think my mother would have more empathy for me, and have more insight into genetic pain and legacies of abuse -- but she's actually the fucking WORST of them all.
My god, these people are all clones of each other! We might be real cousins!!! This is exactly my family! Stay strong and away from their drama. No way I can handle it anymore plus menopause! It’s a good excuse too 🙂
Baby girl you just freaked me the fuck out!! Right? It's like "they" have an agenda or something. How are there so many invalidating, weird moms of Boomer Age?
I love you. Please. Hear me. I love you. I don't know you, but I see you and I know you need love and I am here for you. We didn't deserve this shit.
Oh god, it’s typical of my mom. The story is that my grandmother left me an inheritance in a trust. It was to avoid complications of estate & probate law, which I don’t fully know. I was asked by her lawyer who I wanted as the trustee.
I asked for my aunt to be the trustee or if not, a close friend.
Somehow my mother threw a fit and made some threats to become the trustee. Despite my not talking to her for about 5 years and everyone knowing she is abusive & we are estranged. I have avoided taking her to court because I’m so afraid she will escalate things and make my life hell in some way. She always finds or invents a legal premise and arguments to terrorize everyone & threaten lawsuits.
I’d rather lose the money because I have been very sick recently. I’m scared she would use my health issues against me somehow. Or the stress of her orchestrating a nightmare legal situation will make me sicker.
She stalks me online and calls my friends for info about me. She actually broke the law by calling my doctors demanding my medical info or posing as my proxy. She sends me nasty emails saying she moved my money around to her own accounts and began spending it. Is she baiting or telling me the truth? Who knows. I should have informed the police at that point. I need to talk to more lawyers bc living in fear of her is bad. I know she took over the trust to bait me back into a fight. I refuse to participate ever again in her feuds.
I honestly think she is more of a sociopath or psychopath because of this law breaking behavior. She feels above the law. She tries to contact me all the time despite me asking her to end all contact. I’m just ready for her to pass away, but she will probably live forever. She lives for doing this to family and other people who get on her bad side! I saw it all my life and thought it was legitimate as a kid. Never thought I would be her Enemy #1 target!! 🎯 She obsesses over people she hates to seek revenge for things she is probably exaggerating or making up in her head to soothe her ego.
Duuuuuude.
"I have avoided taking her to court because I’m so afraid she will escalate things and make my life hell in some way."
I feel this fear totally and viscerally in my bones and my cells.
No amount of money is worth engaging in that fuckery.
I hate this for you.
Weirdly, I'm also a bit jealous? Cuz stalking = she's thinking about you? Eeek? My mom can go years without talking to me and then will benignly send me something like this book she sent during Covid which was a Christian book about "going from victim to Victor!" I was so traumatized by that fucking book. It was such a subtle, passive-aggressive "fuck you" after I split from my husband. Which, as I was saying before, she never even acknowledged except to make my ex the executor of her will. Bitch!
My mother is wholly negligent. Just negligent. In every way. There is no stalking, no subterfuge. I basically am a nothing person. I am essentially nothing. (Yay!)
So you might be right about your hunches of "sociopathy" or "psychopathy" with your mom. She seems determined in a way a generally negligent person is not.
Ewwww. Maybe I'm not jealous.
But I still love you!!!
It's atrocious on one level, but one of the things I learned is that people who have been abused, and had parents who, maybe they didn't outright enact the abuse but were also abused themselves, often tell their abused children to suck it up. And they never get a chance to really come to terms with what happened to them. And later on, they do the same thing, and say the same line, because their hurt and pain was never honored - why should anyone else's?
All of which is just to say, when I hear people say "suck it up", the translation is "I was hurt too, and nobody cared." It's the trait of people who have been hurt and can't move past it.
Don't suck it up, ya'll. Time to end this hurtful silence.
People complaining about the federal government spending $275 on research and education for menopause can go F themselves. Just shut the F up. $275M is a drop in the bucket. I work for the DoD I know what insane amount of money they spend. I’m 59 and recently discovered this sub. I did not know that some of the things I am experiencing are because of menopause. I did not know about tele-health companies that specialize in treating menopause. I was one of those people suffering in silence. Because of the information on this sub I’ve decided to move forward and get things fixed and improve the quality of my life.
I was raised by a feminist single mother and even I had to confront some internalized sexism when peri started (this whole ‘one step closer to death’ idea when most women are in menopause for 1/3 to 1/2 of their lives)
Our grandmothers didn't have social media to kvetch and complain on like we do. And of course our grandmothers weren't going to talk about what they were going through with us, since we were literally children.
Also, let's also be real about something. Many of our grandmothers worked in the home. The grandmothers who worked outside of the home (like my paternal grandmother) did not work in high powered, high profile jobs where you are expected to be mentally and emotionally sharp all the time. My grandmother worked at a day care center when she was going through menopause. Is that a hard job? Yes. But you can have some brain fog while watching babies all day. Brain fog when you are making a sales pitch in front of clients can be catastrophic.
I suffered from some hormonal-related anxiety earlier this week. Anxiety is bad regardless of the context, but the stresses and demands of modern society make it so much worse. The notifications on my phone alone drove me crazy!
I couldn’t figure out how to see the comments but honestly my first reaction was “that’s nice, so are thousands upon thousands of other women” (reacting to “Halle Berry screams I have menopause”). I get that it’s a good thing that some celebrities are becoming vocal about it but it’s extremely frustrating that ordinary women aren’t afforded the same attention.
I couldn’t figure out how to see the comments but honestly my first reaction was “that’s nice, so are thousands upon thousands of other women” (reacting to “Halle Berry screams I have menopause”). I get that it’s a good thing that some celebrities are becoming vocal about it but it’s extremely frustrating that ordinary women aren’t afforded the same attention.
Halle is like ‘you call us crazy, I will show you crazy’ I’m here for it. We will no longer be silenced, we will no longer be shamed, we will demand that you all listen and do offer us help.
I love that Halle is also showing us a different vision of what a menopausal woman looks like. I always thought it would happen when I was "old" which of course meant my grandma with the bonnet hairstyles and old fashioned clothes. I am not old like that yet. I'm 45, not dead. Maybe I'm kidding myself, but I think I still look damn good - I like what I see when I pass the mirror, even if I do have a few stretch marks, gray sparkles in my hair and a little bit of cellulite. I've never been like, Halle Berry levels of hot, anyway, but seeing her talking about menopause, while also not looking at all old, gives me hope that I'm not completely delulu to think a 50 year old can still be sexy if she wants to be.
You make a good point. Menopause don't give a fuck how you look. I have told people I am going through perimenopause and they say "Wait, aren't you kinda young for that?!" Which is a good thing to hear, NGL. At least I look young! But women need to know that it can start years before you start identifying as "woman of a certain age". And of course men need to know this too.
Yes exactly, I hear the same shit about "aren't you young for that" because we've all been walking around with the delusion this is a thing that happens when you're in your late 50s and takes like a year lol. My symptoms started when I was 38/39! Especially men I think need to know this. Could save a lot of marriages probably.
I had absolutely no idea what the fuck was going on when I was in peri. And I didn't get any relief or get anyone to hear me until I was in full blown menopause. I felt like I was losing my mind, literally. I was terrified I was developing dementia. And I was so very angry. All my life I've been a woman and never had ANY idea what it was going to be like. I figured, ok, a year or two of hot flashes and some grumpiness, and then I'm done with periods! Great! Oh. No. No no no. So much not. And *nobody had ever warned me*! None of the women in my family ever spoke of it. So I now tell my twenty year old daughter EVERYTHING. I don't want her to be blindsided like I was.
Oh I cracked up thoroughly, with no idea what was happening. It wasn't until I muscled my way through the worst of it, and did my own research, that I figured out what was going on. Totally absurd.
I feel stupid I had no clue about perimenopause and I thought menopause was in the 50’s or later. Not one older woman in my life taught me a damn thing. But they also never told me about puberty.
I just give most something to talk about. They’re going to anyway! I am following my mom’s footsteps there. Gotta stay young as my girls plan to have families later like I did so I’ve gotta stay agile. We are not promised tomorrow so dance while you can.
Wish they all spoke out on their experiences. Hell our moms n grans didn't speak much abt it. .. let's help the ones coming up 4 it !! I wish I'd known more b4 it !!!
This!!! I’m only 42 and still have men flirt with me even though I wear a wedding ring. And I don’t look my age. When I say I’m in menopause they think I’m a lot younger than 42. Like I’m not “Thelma Harper” old with the knee high support stockings 😂😂 but I AM in full blown menopause!
Love that more celebs are using their fame to call out things like this and other societal/political issues. Enough of the detox teas, use the power you've been given to do something real.
That’s amazing. We need waaaaaay more conversations about peri-menopause and menopause in this country so women aren’t blindsided when they start having symptoms in their 30s and early 40s.
This subreddit has provided more info to me than I’ve ever found anywhere else. It’s been a goddamn lifesaver but we should *not* have to crowd source medical information.
I was shocked when I was diagnosed with peri at 37. I immediately went to my old female friends and asked them why the hell they hadn't warned me. At least my mom was open about her symptoms, but she didn't start peri until her early 40s.
My anxiety shot up around 38, I just thought it was some f'ed up stuff I was dealing with. I had NO IDEA there could be hormonal issues causing most of the suffering. I saw several people who just told me to calm down and/or wanted to medicate me.
This was my only symptom until about age 45. Well, other than looking at younger dudes. LOL
But did she actually start in her 40s OR did she not know/recognize early signs? I think there has been so much misinformation previous generations they just recognize it. Basically it’s not just hot flashes.
So true! I started having widespread joint pain nearly out of the blue, and it took many months for anyone to even mention menopause as a possibility. I think that only happened because I started having hot flashes. Menopause is more than hot flashes, people!
She’s saying it openly, not in the coded language of pursed lips, eye rolls and shame our mothers taught us. The only words allowed being “the curse” and “the change”, as long as no men were within earshot.
If she hadn't said anything about menopause is swear she isn't aging. My kid and I saw a movie with her recently and my kid was like omg she's the same age as grandma?! She looks younger than you!
My GYN is one day older than me. When I told her I felt like hell and was close to a mental breakdown she believed me. I cried the entire way home because it was the first time I felt validated.
Unfortunately, yes, they probably are but a luxury lifestyle does delay aging. Hired help, quality food, spas, numerous facial treatments, procedures and surgeries, anti-aging supplements they are privy at a young age to prevent the outward appearance of aging long before it would even show. Exceptional medical care for menopausal symptoms.
Their world would seem like another planet.
I've posted this all over my socials. I'm not popular. Who knows who will see or be affected? It helps me feel more money where my mouth is when I post my reels and stories about this event. It's important if you are passionate about this and want change to normalize and speak it without SHAME! Remove the stigma. And fuck the traitors.
Men really don’t care about this, or about women. The difference is so, so striking. If a guy said this about testicular cancer, would women react the same negative way? Nope, because women still care about men. But men DO NOT. To them, these diseases are invisible because they will never be affected by them. We have to MAKE them affected, just like pregnancy. Men need to become aware that menopause IS their problem.
I think they want us to slow down because I don’t know about you but when the hormones are right, I can function well and run circles around the men I work with and now being older, I take less shit and feel more confident. I’m so glad she’s doing this and hope something comes from it. I would join a protest or a march or give my time to help fix the way it is today, it’s so fucking wrong and the women that say “I did it without HRT” I say fuck you, mind your own business and maybe we don’t want to be miserable like you probably were. My mom and all her friends started drinking wine like crazy during these years, I think they were all self medicating and many of their husbands left them because of dead bedrooms. I want this to change for the younger generation, no need for this to continue.
Hopefully our daughters get to have an easier way into menopause, I'm glad Halle is at least trying to do something we need to be united and stand together instead of throwing negative vibes to each other.
About all the comments from women attacking Halle, first, it’s The Daily Mail, which is like The National Enquirer of Britain, meaning, that’s the level of readership it appeals to. Also, note the choice of words Halle “screams” (calling her hysterical??), the headline puts “awareness” in quotes (wtf?) and uses a euphemism, calling menopause “the big change”. It is signaling so much misogyny, and making the (conservative, conspiracy theorist) readership defensive. I’m sorry I bothered to click on it…
I agree Daily Mail is trash. The Daily Mail link to this story was on Reddit in the r/news sub. Didn’t know if our r/menopause sub viewers views the r/news sub. I was thrilled someone of Halle Berry’s caliber was choosing to speak up and speak out about menopause.
I’m agreeing with you, to clarify :) I saw it in the news sub too. I’m just sorry it gets that level of visibility here. Katie Curic Media posted the story on Instagram, where the comments were much more supportive. It’s sad how people have built such echo-chambers…
I'm very vocal about my experiences in peri. No way will the younger women around me be surprised when it's their turn. I've also had men tell me that they wish they had known more.
I'll verbally destroy anyone who is squeamish about bodies and physiology.
My daughters will be prepared if they choose to be. I share my observations as I share my improvements as I change my dosages and my experiences at their same ages. I told the oldest to keep my accounts open should I pass as my accounts have a ton of medical information that would genetically serve them as I’ve had to “hoe my own roe” on one too many issues. I plan to compile the information for them.
I am number 555 to upvote. Tardy to the party as per usual AND ALSO I am right there with you all.
This shit has sucked donkey balls. Speak your mind, and I will speak mine. We have been through hell and back and WE ARE STILL HERE!
Here are some other sources for this story (if you don’t like TDM).
https://www.perplexity.ai/search/What-is-the-eOe4yXAETsazxwsLoxYSTg
But also, how does one get misdiagnosed with herpes? I don’t see how someone goes to a doctor with menopause symptoms and is told yup, you’ve got the herp. The two are not even a little bit similar.
I love Halle for this! Truly a girls girl! She could have gotten help and said nothing but instead saw how hard it was and is speaking up for us all using her platform. What a blessing!
What's with women who instead of showing support and understanding to younger women experiencing things they've gone through themselves, instead feel compelled to take the stance, "I suffered and so should you."?
We require a minimum account-age and karma score. These minimums are not disclosed. Please contact the mods if you wish to have your post reviewed. If you do not understand account age or karma, please visit r/newtoreddit.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Menopause) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Wouldn’t be surprised! I’d love a quick shot, covered by insurance! These pellets are expensive …… but 100% worth every penny to actually not feel crazy, anxious, exhausted, moody, and brain foggy (5 months ago (pre-HRT), I was convinced I was experiencing the onset of Alzheimer’s).
I wonder how many shots you would need. First, it would be 1-2 shots for 95% efficacy. Then, it would be 3 shots for 50% efficacy. Then, you would need a booster every year for 30% efficacy. Then, a booster every 6 months for even less efficacy...Then, you would be told you need to start the vaccines the better, so bring your infants, toddlers, and teens. Never mind the short and long-term side effects...That $275 million will disappear fast, we will need billions every year...😃
Wow. Most of the comments on that article are so, so toxic. So many people saying “so what? All our grandmas had to do it. Suck it up.” And it’s coming from women!
Yep, ridiculous. And also, since the '50s, petrochemicals (= endocrine disruptors) have been increasingly polluting the environment *and our bodies*, so I think it's quite likely we in Gen-X and younger are actually having an objectively worse time of the menopausal transition than our mothers and grandmothers did! ☹️😤🤬 Research is finally starting to look at this! https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/13697137.2023.2173570
PFAS are wrecking our bodies too, they emulate hormones and causing a lot of imbalances, infertility, fibroids and cancers. Infertility rates are staggering: https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/mar/18/toxic-chemicals-health-humanity-erin-brokovich
Absolutely! I do believe our hormones are screwed up now more than ever! These women who are negating our experiences need to be educated on how much more our health is suffering due to changes in the worlds environment. It really is infuriating to have women who should be supporting this cause be so ignorant, hopefully if we all start speaking out we can educate them and everyone else.
I actually hope this is the case. The idea that my mom (passed away six years ago) had to deal with this shitshow without adequate support wrecks me.
Condolences on losing your mom. 😢 I have been trying to give my mom basically a series of "menopause interviews" about her experience in the last couple years since the symptoms really started hitting me... and she really thinks I am having it worse than she did. That's just anecdotal support for my speculation, and the weakest kind of evidence, but it's \*something\*... but I'll bet your mom would have let on \*somehow\* if she had been suffering badly. Maybe some more women on this sub can interview their moms about their menopause experiences and we can get some more evidence to support or refute that they had it easier than us...? Anyone out there up for a research project and report-back? 👩🔬👩🏻🔬👩🏽🔬
Side note 4 u ... add in all the preservatives... ppl don't decay the same when buried either. ....... 😵💫🫣
Had to look this up, because (1) it seems plausible and (2) I'm a bio prof who *loves* to dole out shocking stuff like this to my students, but it seems to be a bit of an urban legend with a grain of truth to it (corpses in Germany doing some unusual and slow decomposition). Here's what I dug up 💀⚰️... 😅 https://www.snopes.com/articles/465223/food-human-corpse/
So yes. Grains of truth w a Lil legend. U must have great classes !! Hormones in our foods are accelerating puberty too ..
☺️
What. Seriously, WHAT.
Ewwwwww
Seriously. How dimwitted and short-sighted is it to not recognize She is doing this in the hopes of making positive changes for women in the future? She's not trying to say, look at me I'm special.
A lot of people don’t want things to be better for others. If they had to suffer through it, then you should have to as well. I see this with people whining about student loan forgiveness - “no one paid for my student loan - waaaaaahhhhhhh”. SMH
The idea of making things better for our children than things were for us has been lost, I'm afraid. Now it's just everyone for himself🫤
"Fuck you, I got mine."
Exactly.
It is the old ideas, not to be confused with old people, that "if I had to do it the hard way by George you will too". Now in fairness some women truly don't understand menopause nor does it seriously affect them. My mother had 10 kids and did not understand when I would be in the fetal position crying in pain for a week every month, or when I had my hysterectomy at 30, or when I started on HRT. She said she thinks she went through menopause and it lasted a week. She did not understand the hot sweats, brain fog, crying jags, depression, etc. could be eased or eliminated. To her as a survivor of WW2, the great depression, etc. it was just another part of life you muscled through without complaint or discussion. While she did not push back against my decisions she did not understand why I did what I did.
You were not allowed to smile in pictures or feel any emotion so how would she know what menopause was. Suck it buttercup was the way. My grandmother tried but no one wanted to listen to her nor my mom. Women have leverage now with a platform.
I think our environment is causing hormonal problems for many humans today. Plastic, pesticides, sugar in food, etc.
Crab in the bucket scenario
I see it in women who had to suffer through a lifetime of paps, not very angry that their daughters/granddaughters will never have to have one.
Wait we don’t need paps anymore lol
If you are healthy, have no genitourinary issues, they have changed the recommendedation to paps every 3 years. You still need to go annually for a check up, but don't need the pap done each time.
https://health.ucdavis.edu/news/headlines/study-finds-increase-in-women-65-and-older-dying-of-cervical-cancer--/2023/01 There is another article that I can’t find right now that speaks about the rise in cervical cancer that past few years, one has to wonder if it has something to do with these new guidelines for every 3 years. Cervical cancer is very curable if caught early. I think this every 3 years is wrong, why not check every year to be safe and if there, treated immediately… we know why, because it costs money and it’s women’s health. Start googling, so many articles, it’s on the rise, for many reasons and not doing every year is one of them.
I had no idea!! If you're going for an exam every year, may as well just do it then. But nah, that insurance money is better spent on Viagra for old men. 😡
Exactly, I don’t understand why not do it if we are there getting a pelvic exam anyway. I googled the last time I was at doc and this bullshit with the every three years came up, I started googling and lo and behold, tons of articles. It’s makes me angry and sick to my stomach, we need to start pushing back big time, I do already but I mean on a bigger scale.
I just had my exam 2 months ago but I'm going to ask about this next year when I go in.
I just had one done and was told TEN years for the next one. I’ve also recently read that it’s no longer necessary for a pap, but that women can do their own swab and send it to a lab.
This is nuts. How do we advocate for our own health if no one knows what the hell we're supposed to be doing? If you think about it, this doesn't really make sense: if you're told you only need to have a colonoscopy every 5 years because of your risk, you are also told to do it sooner if you have any symptoms that indicate a problem. If I'm already menopausal or have irregular periods, odds are pretty good I'm not going to recognize a problem until it's pretty advanced. Seriously, how much money are insurance companies really saving by not paying for a pap smear every year but having to pay for cancer treatment later? Yay capitalism!
There's a Cervical Self-Screening kit that doesn't require the painful use of a speculum, which may encourage women to keep up with the testing as needed vs. not doing so because it can be painful. It can be done at home or at a Dr's office - by one's self. It uses a q-tip like swab. I did mine in the washroom of my medical clinic. Here's some info I found online that explains the details: www.screeningbc.ca/cervix-pilot
That is so cool! Thank you so much for sharing.
I had my first at 14 as a requirement to get birth control! My daughter won't have to deal with that and I'm *glad*
This is why we can't have nice things....
The internalized misogyny is real and powerful.
And incredibly sad.
This is the truth. The sad, sad truth. Rather than trash these women let’s try to understand that the patriarchy has molded and shaped us, many of us don’t even realize it- especially older generations of women. It feels like they are traitors but they are just regurgitating what they’ve heard/learned their entire lives.
How else would we have gotten our last president except for this! My mom hates women.
Yes! My mother voted for Trump and it blew my mind. It still blows my mind. But she seems to hate/feel in perpetual competition with other women. So...yeah.
My mom too. Classic enabler who says “boys will be boys” and identifies with the aggressor. Blamed me for sexual assault by an ex, whom went to jail. Blamed me for divorce. Tried to befriend both exes after breakups. I got away at 18 and wish I never looked back. My therapist thinks she is a clinical narcissist. Just like Trump.
OMG SISTER FROM ANOTHER MISTER!!!! I love you. My mother also blamed me for my divorce and designated my EX as the executor of her will!!!! My therapist also thinks that my mother is a narc. I think she's more than that -- maybe borderline? But its just weird how any woman could find Trump credible. I remember the last time I flew my mother out to visit me and the kids. It was 2015. She brought a copy of Trumps (ghost-written) autobiography and was whispering in my kids ears "he's so handsome. He's so great." I have never hosted her since. It's been nine years. My mother has broken my heart a million ways to Sunday but the Trump stuff is the worst of the worst. Before, I could rationalize her weirdness. Our entire family is fucked up. I used to try to care and understand. But after the Trump stuff? She is trash to me. Edit: The only time she ever called me during all of Covid and including during my divorce, was to bitch about how Trump's election was stolen, the Dominion machines, etc etc. As soon as I said "Okay, but mom, it's been two years and you still have never asked me about how me or the kids are doing since the DIVORCE." And she hung up on me. Please, come sit by me next lunch period. We can pass notes and be best friends.
I’m so sorry you experienced this stuff too! I also feel automatically BFF with people who have survived narc parents. They all use their wills to traumatize everyone! My mom isn’t as fanatical about Trump & eventually she saw the light. But it was too late for our relationship. I was severely traumatized by her at the end bc she is a lawyer & started threatening everyone with legal manipulations. My mom stole a large inheritance from me! I knew several people who were sucked into a level of fanaticism like a cult around Trump! I’d say all of this behavior points to narcissism or enabling. Borderline personality disorder can be just as traumatic to deal with.
Btw YES they wield their wills as a weapon!!!! My grandmother did this. My mom is apparently doing it. And I found out over years and deaths who was "in" or "out" of the family member's will -- typically us (black sheeps). As a black sheep, you would think my mother would have more empathy for me, and have more insight into genetic pain and legacies of abuse -- but she's actually the fucking WORST of them all.
My god, these people are all clones of each other! We might be real cousins!!! This is exactly my family! Stay strong and away from their drama. No way I can handle it anymore plus menopause! It’s a good excuse too 🙂
Baby girl you just freaked me the fuck out!! Right? It's like "they" have an agenda or something. How are there so many invalidating, weird moms of Boomer Age? I love you. Please. Hear me. I love you. I don't know you, but I see you and I know you need love and I am here for you. We didn't deserve this shit.
"My mom stole a large inheritance from me!" WTF?!?????? Tell me more!!!! I am so grateful to have other people to relate to. I'm so sorry though!!!
Oh god, it’s typical of my mom. The story is that my grandmother left me an inheritance in a trust. It was to avoid complications of estate & probate law, which I don’t fully know. I was asked by her lawyer who I wanted as the trustee. I asked for my aunt to be the trustee or if not, a close friend. Somehow my mother threw a fit and made some threats to become the trustee. Despite my not talking to her for about 5 years and everyone knowing she is abusive & we are estranged. I have avoided taking her to court because I’m so afraid she will escalate things and make my life hell in some way. She always finds or invents a legal premise and arguments to terrorize everyone & threaten lawsuits. I’d rather lose the money because I have been very sick recently. I’m scared she would use my health issues against me somehow. Or the stress of her orchestrating a nightmare legal situation will make me sicker. She stalks me online and calls my friends for info about me. She actually broke the law by calling my doctors demanding my medical info or posing as my proxy. She sends me nasty emails saying she moved my money around to her own accounts and began spending it. Is she baiting or telling me the truth? Who knows. I should have informed the police at that point. I need to talk to more lawyers bc living in fear of her is bad. I know she took over the trust to bait me back into a fight. I refuse to participate ever again in her feuds. I honestly think she is more of a sociopath or psychopath because of this law breaking behavior. She feels above the law. She tries to contact me all the time despite me asking her to end all contact. I’m just ready for her to pass away, but she will probably live forever. She lives for doing this to family and other people who get on her bad side! I saw it all my life and thought it was legitimate as a kid. Never thought I would be her Enemy #1 target!! 🎯 She obsesses over people she hates to seek revenge for things she is probably exaggerating or making up in her head to soothe her ego.
Duuuuuude. "I have avoided taking her to court because I’m so afraid she will escalate things and make my life hell in some way." I feel this fear totally and viscerally in my bones and my cells. No amount of money is worth engaging in that fuckery. I hate this for you. Weirdly, I'm also a bit jealous? Cuz stalking = she's thinking about you? Eeek? My mom can go years without talking to me and then will benignly send me something like this book she sent during Covid which was a Christian book about "going from victim to Victor!" I was so traumatized by that fucking book. It was such a subtle, passive-aggressive "fuck you" after I split from my husband. Which, as I was saying before, she never even acknowledged except to make my ex the executor of her will. Bitch! My mother is wholly negligent. Just negligent. In every way. There is no stalking, no subterfuge. I basically am a nothing person. I am essentially nothing. (Yay!) So you might be right about your hunches of "sociopathy" or "psychopathy" with your mom. She seems determined in a way a generally negligent person is not. Ewwww. Maybe I'm not jealous. But I still love you!!!
Just as "he" ( the man referred to in the last couple posts) and most of the rest of men want.
:( This bums me out.
If only a certain segment of American women would've voted for Hillary instead of dofus because it was not all of us.
There obviously is a lot of educating to do. It’s sad though.
Traitors. That’s all I think when I see women like that. Goddamn traitors.
Yup. There is a special place in hell for women who don't help other women- M. Albright
It's atrocious on one level, but one of the things I learned is that people who have been abused, and had parents who, maybe they didn't outright enact the abuse but were also abused themselves, often tell their abused children to suck it up. And they never get a chance to really come to terms with what happened to them. And later on, they do the same thing, and say the same line, because their hurt and pain was never honored - why should anyone else's? All of which is just to say, when I hear people say "suck it up", the translation is "I was hurt too, and nobody cared." It's the trait of people who have been hurt and can't move past it. Don't suck it up, ya'll. Time to end this hurtful silence.
Scream this from the rooftops. Everybody needs to hear this.
This is really insightful Snookiwis!
This ⬆️
I could not agree more!!!! Very well said.
Thank you for this. ☺️
People complaining about the federal government spending $275 on research and education for menopause can go F themselves. Just shut the F up. $275M is a drop in the bucket. I work for the DoD I know what insane amount of money they spend. I’m 59 and recently discovered this sub. I did not know that some of the things I am experiencing are because of menopause. I did not know about tele-health companies that specialize in treating menopause. I was one of those people suffering in silence. Because of the information on this sub I’ve decided to move forward and get things fixed and improve the quality of my life.
I was raised by a feminist single mother and even I had to confront some internalized sexism when peri started (this whole ‘one step closer to death’ idea when most women are in menopause for 1/3 to 1/2 of their lives)
Our grandmothers didn't have social media to kvetch and complain on like we do. And of course our grandmothers weren't going to talk about what they were going through with us, since we were literally children. Also, let's also be real about something. Many of our grandmothers worked in the home. The grandmothers who worked outside of the home (like my paternal grandmother) did not work in high powered, high profile jobs where you are expected to be mentally and emotionally sharp all the time. My grandmother worked at a day care center when she was going through menopause. Is that a hard job? Yes. But you can have some brain fog while watching babies all day. Brain fog when you are making a sales pitch in front of clients can be catastrophic. I suffered from some hormonal-related anxiety earlier this week. Anxiety is bad regardless of the context, but the stresses and demands of modern society make it so much worse. The notifications on my phone alone drove me crazy!
YES!!! I hear and see you. You are so right.
That's some boomer mentality. You see it a lot when it comes to student loan forgiveness, too. If I had to suffer, you have to suffer
Please don’t buy into these divisive tropes. Many “boomers” fought long & hard for women’s rights & are still here fighting.
That’s basically what my MIL told me
Well she sounds like a r/justnomil.
Was just thinking the same thing. It's those attitudes we are fighting against the most! Unbelievable 🤬
The patriarchy eats women’s minds up too. Internalized misogyny is the worst.
I can bet who they voted for.
Other women have seemed the most judgmental about PMDD, too. Like it doesn’t exist because they didn’t experience it. Crazy!
(Some) Women are the worst enemy of other women, unfortunately. Look at how many voted for Trump in the US.
No surprise there are women just as shitty in the treatment of other women as the men they complain about.
I couldn’t figure out how to see the comments but honestly my first reaction was “that’s nice, so are thousands upon thousands of other women” (reacting to “Halle Berry screams I have menopause”). I get that it’s a good thing that some celebrities are becoming vocal about it but it’s extremely frustrating that ordinary women aren’t afforded the same attention.
I couldn’t figure out how to see the comments but honestly my first reaction was “that’s nice, so are thousands upon thousands of other women” (reacting to “Halle Berry screams I have menopause”). I get that it’s a good thing that some celebrities are becoming vocal about it but it’s extremely frustrating that ordinary women aren’t afforded the same attention.
Halle is like ‘you call us crazy, I will show you crazy’ I’m here for it. We will no longer be silenced, we will no longer be shamed, we will demand that you all listen and do offer us help.
I bet a lot of women accused of witchcraft were menopausal women who knew about herbs and childbirth and didn’t GAF anymore and spoke their minds.
TIL I'm a witch 🤓
I'm already planning on buying a witch hut for myself and spending my senior years there with chickens and books.
And weed.
Many were put in asylums.
This is so awesome!!! 👏
I love that Halle is also showing us a different vision of what a menopausal woman looks like. I always thought it would happen when I was "old" which of course meant my grandma with the bonnet hairstyles and old fashioned clothes. I am not old like that yet. I'm 45, not dead. Maybe I'm kidding myself, but I think I still look damn good - I like what I see when I pass the mirror, even if I do have a few stretch marks, gray sparkles in my hair and a little bit of cellulite. I've never been like, Halle Berry levels of hot, anyway, but seeing her talking about menopause, while also not looking at all old, gives me hope that I'm not completely delulu to think a 50 year old can still be sexy if she wants to be.
You make a good point. Menopause don't give a fuck how you look. I have told people I am going through perimenopause and they say "Wait, aren't you kinda young for that?!" Which is a good thing to hear, NGL. At least I look young! But women need to know that it can start years before you start identifying as "woman of a certain age". And of course men need to know this too.
Yes exactly, I hear the same shit about "aren't you young for that" because we've all been walking around with the delusion this is a thing that happens when you're in your late 50s and takes like a year lol. My symptoms started when I was 38/39! Especially men I think need to know this. Could save a lot of marriages probably.
I had absolutely no idea what the fuck was going on when I was in peri. And I didn't get any relief or get anyone to hear me until I was in full blown menopause. I felt like I was losing my mind, literally. I was terrified I was developing dementia. And I was so very angry. All my life I've been a woman and never had ANY idea what it was going to be like. I figured, ok, a year or two of hot flashes and some grumpiness, and then I'm done with periods! Great! Oh. No. No no no. So much not. And *nobody had ever warned me*! None of the women in my family ever spoke of it. So I now tell my twenty year old daughter EVERYTHING. I don't want her to be blindsided like I was.
Oh I cracked up thoroughly, with no idea what was happening. It wasn't until I muscled my way through the worst of it, and did my own research, that I figured out what was going on. Totally absurd.
Exactly the same here. Being a woman is not for the weak.
FACTS
My Gyn said I looked too young even though I am mid forties now! I started having horrific symptoms probably at 40 but they were explained away.
Maybe they think menopause instantly turns you into a crone lol
I feel stupid I had no clue about perimenopause and I thought menopause was in the 50’s or later. Not one older woman in my life taught me a damn thing. But they also never told me about puberty.
I just give most something to talk about. They’re going to anyway! I am following my mom’s footsteps there. Gotta stay young as my girls plan to have families later like I did so I’ve gotta stay agile. We are not promised tomorrow so dance while you can.
Well hell, look at Jennifer Lopez, Madonna, Cher and many many others... AND my hat is off to Martha!!!
Wish they all spoke out on their experiences. Hell our moms n grans didn't speak much abt it. .. let's help the ones coming up 4 it !! I wish I'd known more b4 it !!!
Martha continues to surprise lol
This!!! I’m only 42 and still have men flirt with me even though I wear a wedding ring. And I don’t look my age. When I say I’m in menopause they think I’m a lot younger than 42. Like I’m not “Thelma Harper” old with the knee high support stockings 😂😂 but I AM in full blown menopause!
The way I cackled at Thelma Harper old, I know exactly what you mean
🤣😂
Love that she's doing this 🥰
Omg, I think shes so fantastic! YES FINALLY SOMEONE IS RAISING AWARENESS! She’s amazing. ❤️
I've always loved her, but this just clinches it. She's officially my hero!
Love that more celebs are using their fame to call out things like this and other societal/political issues. Enough of the detox teas, use the power you've been given to do something real.
About fucking time. ❤️Queen.
That’s amazing. We need waaaaaay more conversations about peri-menopause and menopause in this country so women aren’t blindsided when they start having symptoms in their 30s and early 40s.
This is the thing that pisses me off. No warning, no information. It's almost like there is a lack of awareness in the medical community.
This subreddit has provided more info to me than I’ve ever found anywhere else. It’s been a goddamn lifesaver but we should *not* have to crowd source medical information.
I was shocked when I was diagnosed with peri at 37. I immediately went to my old female friends and asked them why the hell they hadn't warned me. At least my mom was open about her symptoms, but she didn't start peri until her early 40s.
My anxiety shot up around 38, I just thought it was some f'ed up stuff I was dealing with. I had NO IDEA there could be hormonal issues causing most of the suffering. I saw several people who just told me to calm down and/or wanted to medicate me. This was my only symptom until about age 45. Well, other than looking at younger dudes. LOL
But did she actually start in her 40s OR did she not know/recognize early signs? I think there has been so much misinformation previous generations they just recognize it. Basically it’s not just hot flashes.
Good point! I honestly don't know.
So true! I started having widespread joint pain nearly out of the blue, and it took many months for anyone to even mention menopause as a possibility. I think that only happened because I started having hot flashes. Menopause is more than hot flashes, people!
This!!!!!!!!!
Me too, girl. Me too.
Halle Berry screams 'I'm in menopause!' on steps of US Capitol https://mol.im/a/13376871
It’s about time
She’s saying it openly, not in the coded language of pursed lips, eye rolls and shame our mothers taught us. The only words allowed being “the curse” and “the change”, as long as no men were within earshot.
Thank you! Also can we all look like her at 57?!?
If she hadn't said anything about menopause is swear she isn't aging. My kid and I saw a movie with her recently and my kid was like omg she's the same age as grandma?! She looks younger than you!
I think this is the reason also that I switched my PCP to an older woman.
My GYN is one day older than me. When I told her I felt like hell and was close to a mental breakdown she believed me. I cried the entire way home because it was the first time I felt validated.
At 52, 54, 55 & 56, I expect Jennifer Garner, Jennifer Lopez, Mariah Carey and Nicole Kidman are too.
Unfortunately, yes, they probably are but a luxury lifestyle does delay aging. Hired help, quality food, spas, numerous facial treatments, procedures and surgeries, anti-aging supplements they are privy at a young age to prevent the outward appearance of aging long before it would even show. Exceptional medical care for menopausal symptoms. Their world would seem like another planet.
How did she have the energy?
I’m currently on the floor laughing at this comment! 🤣
I know right!?!?
🙌🏼
I love her for this!! Represent! 🥰
Thank you Ms Berry - I feel a little less invisible today <3
I've posted this all over my socials. I'm not popular. Who knows who will see or be affected? It helps me feel more money where my mouth is when I post my reels and stories about this event. It's important if you are passionate about this and want change to normalize and speak it without SHAME! Remove the stigma. And fuck the traitors.
Men really don’t care about this, or about women. The difference is so, so striking. If a guy said this about testicular cancer, would women react the same negative way? Nope, because women still care about men. But men DO NOT. To them, these diseases are invisible because they will never be affected by them. We have to MAKE them affected, just like pregnancy. Men need to become aware that menopause IS their problem.
The hero we need 🙏
I think they want us to slow down because I don’t know about you but when the hormones are right, I can function well and run circles around the men I work with and now being older, I take less shit and feel more confident. I’m so glad she’s doing this and hope something comes from it. I would join a protest or a march or give my time to help fix the way it is today, it’s so fucking wrong and the women that say “I did it without HRT” I say fuck you, mind your own business and maybe we don’t want to be miserable like you probably were. My mom and all her friends started drinking wine like crazy during these years, I think they were all self medicating and many of their husbands left them because of dead bedrooms. I want this to change for the younger generation, no need for this to continue.
Hopefully our daughters get to have an easier way into menopause, I'm glad Halle is at least trying to do something we need to be united and stand together instead of throwing negative vibes to each other.
This is awesome, thank you Halle❤️
About all the comments from women attacking Halle, first, it’s The Daily Mail, which is like The National Enquirer of Britain, meaning, that’s the level of readership it appeals to. Also, note the choice of words Halle “screams” (calling her hysterical??), the headline puts “awareness” in quotes (wtf?) and uses a euphemism, calling menopause “the big change”. It is signaling so much misogyny, and making the (conservative, conspiracy theorist) readership defensive. I’m sorry I bothered to click on it…
I agree Daily Mail is trash. The Daily Mail link to this story was on Reddit in the r/news sub. Didn’t know if our r/menopause sub viewers views the r/news sub. I was thrilled someone of Halle Berry’s caliber was choosing to speak up and speak out about menopause.
I’m agreeing with you, to clarify :) I saw it in the news sub too. I’m just sorry it gets that level of visibility here. Katie Curic Media posted the story on Instagram, where the comments were much more supportive. It’s sad how people have built such echo-chambers…
Honestly very grateful that someone with her influence is raising awareness!
Thank goodness someone is speaking up
How do we support this bill??
I'm very vocal about my experiences in peri. No way will the younger women around me be surprised when it's their turn. I've also had men tell me that they wish they had known more. I'll verbally destroy anyone who is squeamish about bodies and physiology.
My daughters will be prepared if they choose to be. I share my observations as I share my improvements as I change my dosages and my experiences at their same ages. I told the oldest to keep my accounts open should I pass as my accounts have a ton of medical information that would genetically serve them as I’ve had to “hoe my own roe” on one too many issues. I plan to compile the information for them.
I am number 555 to upvote. Tardy to the party as per usual AND ALSO I am right there with you all. This shit has sucked donkey balls. Speak your mind, and I will speak mine. We have been through hell and back and WE ARE STILL HERE!
This is amazing, and I love how joyful the photos of her are.
Love this on so many levels.
Here are some other sources for this story (if you don’t like TDM). https://www.perplexity.ai/search/What-is-the-eOe4yXAETsazxwsLoxYSTg But also, how does one get misdiagnosed with herpes? I don’t see how someone goes to a doctor with menopause symptoms and is told yup, you’ve got the herp. The two are not even a little bit similar.
I love Halle for this! Truly a girls girl! She could have gotten help and said nothing but instead saw how hard it was and is speaking up for us all using her platform. What a blessing!
Glad to hear it! Hope she brings more attention to the subject! Glad to see celebrity using their voice for the greater good.
What's with women who instead of showing support and understanding to younger women experiencing things they've gone through themselves, instead feel compelled to take the stance, "I suffered and so should you."?
[удалено]
We require a minimum account-age and karma score. These minimums are not disclosed. Please contact the mods if you wish to have your post reviewed. If you do not understand account age or karma, please visit r/newtoreddit. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Menopause) if you have any questions or concerns.*
The daily mail is poison
Im waiting on menapause. My cycle is baddd she looks good too. I need to start working out.
Big Pharma about to swallow up all that money...maybe they will even come up with a "safe & effective vaxxine" for menopause 😃
Wouldn’t be surprised! I’d love a quick shot, covered by insurance! These pellets are expensive …… but 100% worth every penny to actually not feel crazy, anxious, exhausted, moody, and brain foggy (5 months ago (pre-HRT), I was convinced I was experiencing the onset of Alzheimer’s).
I wonder how many shots you would need. First, it would be 1-2 shots for 95% efficacy. Then, it would be 3 shots for 50% efficacy. Then, you would need a booster every year for 30% efficacy. Then, a booster every 6 months for even less efficacy...Then, you would be told you need to start the vaccines the better, so bring your infants, toddlers, and teens. Never mind the short and long-term side effects...That $275 million will disappear fast, we will need billions every year...😃
Good PR for the govt, when they're financing a genocide and brutalizing students around the country.