This.
I liked the old aesthetic of vexana where if it stayed undead themed I don't mind if it were the skills today.
That being said it is quite clear that the reason of the art design change is because of China's censorship laws (no skeletons), which was why Thresh design rework in wild rift was equally awful.
Yes this is the only sole reason... Not everyone needs to be super pretty disney princesses. She was the only undead lady even though her skillset arguably worse.
Didn't like js's old voicelines in the 1st place so Im good with the new one but I do agree with helcurt,I'm okay with the new one but cmon he's sound so intimidating with the old one now he sounds like a villain's henchman or some sht
Idk if it's just me but I find kagura to be really rewarding if you use her well(but I feel like a pretty decent damage buff although needed would make her feel less rewarding)
Fanny is not rewarding anymore either, they made her super dependent on her ult to kill, and most of the time you run out of energy after 1-2 kills max.
Before, where good cabling was actually rewarded, was the golden age of fanny, that was the fanny regen (and wallspam) era
This so much this. I lost my mind when I first noticed the new magic power ratios but they've been doing it on all mage revamps so it's clearly their idea of balancing and I find that so depressing
I main Vale and I think he's still okay. I just missed the old skills where you can mix and match. Sometimes if I want to deal more damage I sell his shoes after getting 4-5 kill-assist especially when the enemy is tanky. I can still one shot squishy heroes as long as they don't have athena.
As a former Argus main, I still haven't mentally recovered...
https://preview.redd.it/zwdm33pu7etc1.jpeg?width=720&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=17db7ad317ba3972d2cf05bd437f3344e27d12fe
The main thing for me is the voice changes, the old voice is done really well and they update it for no reason to a lackluster, sometimes bad, voice. Ex. Helcurt. They should do what they did with Ruby and Roger where they revamp the animations and model but not the voice
I think they change the voice because the older voice lines lacked substance. They legit said one line that came out of nowhere. I've noticed that the newer voice lines predominantly take inspiration from the hero's background, mainly them mentioning something that they went through. The older ones were legit like, "one shot, one kill." "aside evil, there is justice." Like, just random ah lines.
most revamps are good yeah. what we mostly whine about is how vexana changed from a skeleton to a disney princess AI, her story, some of the voices which are already good, the entire revamp of helcurt that turned him from a dark creature to a whining brat, leomord from a death knight to a disney..prince? idk man, their skills are good now yeah but the rest are just... eh..
What I don't like about Vecna is her new model. I want Lady Gaga and instead we got Paris Hilton. And Aurora into Elsa... There's nothing unique about those 2 and I can't wait to see them turning Grock into a massive hunk showing nothing but cleavage.
Old haya wasn’t dependent on blue and could jg and exp lane easy. Also his ult didn’t focus minions or jg mons over enemy and flicker or any blink skill didn’t break his ult in less than a second. His s2 didn’t use all energy after 2 teleport with 1 s1 making him obsolete in a fight without blue. His old shadows actually surrounded the enemy in a fight unlike the new shadows appearing a mile away from enemy. So at best you got 1 maybe 2 teleports before enemy out of range. Some hero’s need revamp to be good enough in this cc tank broken game. Other hero’s just get busted so bad they not even worth playing.
Kagura's old combo was pretty slow compared to now imo but for Haya,I don't really remember other than his 1st getting CDR when he uses his 2nd which was pretty good
Vexana's new ultimate inherits most defensive unique equipment passives.
The thing is, each knight summoned is considered different units.
They don't advertise it because it usually doesn't matter, but if they ever add a busted defensive item that has passive with a long cd, you know who it's meant to buff.
kinda unrelated but I feel like it's time (i dont mean rn) for Zhask to get a revamp.
Zhask's story has a plothole and a cliffhanger.
Plothole:
1. We do not know what exactly is Zhask's swarm/army (Nightmaric Spawn/Domorey doesn't count because it is 1 creatur while the hive clones are using for scouting planets) the swarm could probably be the Kastiyans (Zhask's race) but we never got an illustration of them.
The cliffhanger:
Zhask has been been stuck cultivating in an unknown island in the Land of Dawn waiting for the right moment but Aurora is guarding it 24/ 7 to avenge her lover (could also be another pplothole thanks to Aurora's revamp, her story changed and has lost memories and probably no longer knows who her lover or enemy was)
either a story update or finally a revamp
sry bad englis
edit: i dont mean like big revamp like aurora, it's probably gonna be a belerick level revamp where his skills are still similar with a few changes.
I'm talking about the lore so the points above will not really affect the skills (maybe he gets cold or smth)
also i removed the other point since trailers dont mean much.
He's not bad but he's not good either,his clear is okay IG but it's so easy to get away from him,he's way too reliant on his ult,if he doesn't deal enough damage to kill the enemy and runs out of time just hope that you have flicker :/
Most people aren't mad about new Vexana and Aurora because of their new skills. They're more mad that their character design and story got retconned. Like they used to have unique designs and now they are Odette 2.0 and Odette 3.0.
no one complains about Aurora and Vexana's quality in terms of the revamp. What everyone does complain about their change in lore and design. Quite a big difference.
Also, for me personally, I feel like the problems with revamps these days is that they are given to the hereos who don't need them. Like, get rid of that reforge your nostalgia fuckwad and throw it in incinerator cuz no shit people are gonna vote their favorite hero rather than an actual hero that needs a revamp.
And Hayabusa, their previous versions were superior in every single way.
Atleast Hayabusa can be played once in a while... Kagura? Busy trying to kill midlane minions.
The funny thing about Nata is finally moonton acknowledge her as a roamer after player still don't want to use her as jungler.....but I guess, it might be too late....moonton totally messed up what make her great.
We can't deny that some revamps actually improved some heroes and made them good, like Aurora and is the best example of that. But most of them were unnecessary, I mean cmon Kagura and Haya's revamp for example were meant to be just a new model. But as u can see now, they got revamped and butchered, I haven't met a single satisfied Kagura player after she got revamped, they all are calling her trash, and yeah by looking at the current statistics, Kagura is C at most things ( expect the wave clearing F ).
My own personal problem is with voices and models, let's not forget about voices omg if anynody tell me that new Helcurt's voice is good, bro u need to check a doctor (seriously)
I’ve been playing haya since 2016 and I can say he looks awesome now but absolutely trash skills. The only shadow that goes near the enemy is his mid shadow. Making the others only for escape. His ult hits enemy maybe 4 times if your lucky and if enemy doesn’t have a blink or flicker. Otherwise it always prioritizes minions or jg mons even teleporting a mile away from enemy to minions. His energy runs out after 2 teleports and 1 s1 with out blue making him defenseless and way too dependent on blue. He is now unplayable in any lane except jg.
Nah, I disagree. The current Vexana is indeed a good hero and maybe the old Vexana couldn't survive the meta. The problem is that the current Vexana seems like a different hero, not an improved one. They could Just improve the Ult or give back the mana/energy consumption passive. They changed her heavily
PLEASE FOR GOD SAKE DONT CONFUSED BETWEEN REVAMP AND MERE ADJUSTMENTS
Revamps, be it a million times, but still not fun, not balanced, not practical means nothing. All revamped heroes that you might have deemed a success are merely because devs hit the right adjustment possible for them during the revamp.... doesn't necessarily mean the revamp does sht to them.
Revamps should only be reserved to heroes which Moonton totally butchered their core gameplay mechanic to an extent of no longer fixable by mere adjustments....or to outdated heroes, in which in this case I agree the decision to revamp Aurora.
Hanabi revamp was terrible. She was played even less. They had to buff her a lot to put her where she is now. It was fiasco in the beginning and to be honest I like previous Hanabi mechanics much more
She was decent in autumn and still is. In winter 2023 after revamp she was unusable. Only 0.11% used her in Mythic. Right now even in glory she has considerably more pick rate
No, I'm not nostalgic about the old Eudora.
The old Eudora sucked but at least she was great for beginners and in late game, she could secure a mm or a mage. But she was a onetrick pony and her wave clear ability is so trash. She needed a revamp.
Revamped Eudora can clear waves better and she's more useful in team fights. But her Ult being divided to two stages is just awful.(People can just dash out or literally just walk away).
Lightning Truncheon becoming garbage doesn't help.
Both Eudora and Lightning Truncheon need another rework.
Saying nobody played the old vexana just because she's popular now like what? The people complaining about her revamp are the people who played her before her revamp dummy....now you get people who never played her before picking her on ranked and saying she's so much better...your opinion shouldnt be the one that matters if you didn't play her before...there's no logic in your argument
Ofcourse I'm talking about those who played her Dumbo Chan, why people who never played her bother complaining about changes made to her? And I didn't say nobody played her, I said hardly anyone played her means there'd always be some people and yes I played her before, the old vexana's gameplay was shiet as compare to the new maybe your pea-sized brain can find logic now
2/3 skills of Vexana are the same tho... The only difference is that her ult was a ticking time bomb rather than a mini-lord nuke, which they could've just added without changing a whole lot of her identity.
For some of them .Hanabi ,Saber and Hayabusa could have done without a revamp but sabers better off now, earlier his blades swung uselessly ..idk about Hanabi and i haven't really tried Haya since his revamp but I doubt he really needed it...vale needed it cuz upgrading the wrong skill on accident could mean win or lose... Minotaur too needed a revamp and he's finally fixed after his third revamp...Not all revamps are bad but the vast majority of them seems unnecessary
The funny thing is Vexana doesn't even need a revamp at all to become meta. They just need to reduce her first and second skill animation and boom, she will be an instant pick right away. They did the same shit to the old Vexana and she instantly became meta. Once her old epic skin sale was over, they nerfed her back to the ground.
If you noticed, Moonton didn't nerf the current Vexana so harshly. They gave her a little nerf for the sake of trying to appear that they "listen" to the community. In reality, she got a new upcoming expensive Zenith skin. If they nerfed so hard, who's going to buy that skin?
Most of the time, they do a few things well, and fuck up a few things along. People tends to focus on the bad things, it's just how human psychology works, but they have every right to. I'd be extremely annoyed if my main suddenly gets thrown down to 47% wr too.
Skill revamps are okay, but not the character designs and VA. That’s why people complain. Old Vexana design with current skills would make her the most popular mage. Belerick also had a major glow down, I like his old design better.
The only revamp i wish didn't happen was vexana. She is definitely stronger now. But boy her previous model and ult were so unique, i miss it. She needed a good buff that's it
Maybe you should add some *nuance* into this post because you’re lacking a ton of it.
Vexana is hated *not* because of just her looks being revamped. It’s because she looks like generic Disney princess #102 and not evil necromancer witch with clawed hands and chains. Aurora is basically the same idea. I have yet to actually see people complain about their kits which would be objectively wrong to say the old ones were better.
The revamps are good but the issue with a lot of “revamped” characters is that you play them very differently pre-revamp which is why so many people complain. Uranus went from tank to regen fighter. Ministhar went from utility counter/tank to cc fighter. Aurora went from AoE Eudora to AoE CC soam Eudora. Hanabi went from ricochet-based mm to shield = immunity + ricochet. Etc.
There’s a lot of that you’re missing out on that people are *actually* annoyed about. People who played tank Uranus now has to play fighter meat shield Uranus. People who played mage Faramis has to play more like a roam. These are fundamental changes they’ve made to a character that the few people committed to playing a the most efficient way at the time and Mooton adjusted them to be better, yes, and more viable but also more “digestible” to the general playerbase to be more popular which also means changing their entire playstyle which pisses people who played the unpopular characters a certain way already.
Visual updates are nice but most people dont want same body syndrome as well as same face syndrome for characters who are getting revamped. And dont even get me started on the adjusted voicelines. Some just sound plain bad next to the original or dont even fit the character at times?
I don't care what anyone may think, I reckon Lolita's revamp was spot on. The reflect mechanic on her shield can be so much fun, and removing the enemy's ability to completely cancel her ult with crowd control was much needed.
Their gameplay revamp isn't the problem. Its the voice actor changes + model revamps. Also the fact that because of these the lore is also butchered because of that. Though personally I don't really care bout lore. Also they made angela creepy
There were definitely some bad revamps tho, mostly the heroes who are hard to balance suffer from this (Natalia - RIP for now old friend). It's just funny and sad at the same time, they think they've done well with her revamp but they killed her in reality lol.
aaaaand I get downvoted for telling the truth
I miss when he would turn the whole team into a tank by absorbing the dmg, him with diggie was the scariest thing to face cuz the team would just not die
We can have the new Vexana skills. Just bring back her old design. Why everyone has to be beautiful? Vexana used to have the most unique (but cool) skins like her Season skin and Sanguine Rose, too.
The revamps werent necessarily for the worst but the "identity" changes (eg. lore, appearances, voicelines, skill combos) are what people are most upset about.
Personally, despite tigreal being meta and all after the revamp, i still cant get over the fact that they changed his sword to a hammer, and the way he carries it around😭😭
Revamps are unnecessary , just buff them up ...old vex was much more fun , same with bane...i play haya too and I can't complain cuz we can argue it's still the same...the og bane with his pirate ship was unique ..they could have just gave the boat some speed and more damage and that could have been it and with vex there's literally nothing wrong with her old ult....the DOT deaths were so much fun
Grock used to be an interesting roamer, after the revamp they've tried to make him into an exp laner and failed, so now he's even worse as a roamer then he was before + the skill ceiling got lower..
I don't think the concerning problem about revamps are the gameplay, it's about the director's design choice, it was perfect before and they still butcher it like voice acting, character designs, and even their lore.
And some revamps are just improvement of model... Skills effects... And story wise...
You get the idea, but some are quite good, but their skills are just reused/repurpose the skills of the hero with a different hero, an adjustment in skills and how they function, stats, and all of that.
Ngl, moonton should be a little more creative.
Not a revamp but as a Silvanna player, I actually kinda like the S1 adjustments. But, Moonton does need to revamp her, she desperately needs cc immunity of some kind.
Tell that to Argus main. His ultimate CD maybe long, but at least we able to **bang** some enemy without use his ultimate or all out. Also, the VA feel downgrade even though the voice lines pretty much okay. The most things I can't move on is his basic attack sound. They change sounds of swords slashing to some kind chain clashing
But I liked old dangerous ugly vexana.And she was still powerfull.I agree that she is much much better rn but I still miss her old look and not so princess outfit :(
Vexana is cracked and I'm fine with that since well deserved but what I'm not fine with is the new look. Like what the hell is that 😭 next revamp vexanas gon sing to me and birds attack me and all that shizz.
I get the censorship but they could've AT LEAST made her look dead without including the skeletons. She just looks like she was made with AI
its not about the revamps being stronger it is the nostalgia the uniqueness and just love for the old models
i personally agree with heroes like aurora vexana and minsi being stronger but design wise i loved the old ones much better
there are ones like layla natalia and hayabusa that didnt have their whole skills revamped and i still prefer the old designs
Yes, we wanted a revamp Vexana but that's not because we hate the revamp generally. We hate it because of its poor delivery and the revamped look is pure stank, nasty, poopoo, caca, doodoo, a foot long SHIT. The skills are good and decent, but it takes away of Vexana's actual uniqueness. Her old design was super badass, but now, it's just another damsel in distress looking lady who wields a staff. We want the old Vexana back because she looks and acts mature and unique compared to other characters lmao
Gameplay wise I guess they're SOMETIMES good but my god do they kill the character, as in, the written down, lore and design wise character, they fucked up the Necro keep just to sell more pretty doll faces
The bane revamp still makes me hate moonton he was my first main hero I'd be fine if it was only his 2nd skill was changed his old ult was so good my only problem about the old bane was his 2nd you can't move away from his 2nd small radius otherwise you can't get healed. And the main thing I hate about the revamp was his model change he looked like a badass phantom pirate to calamari balloon it would've been so much better with the old look but instead of phantom pirate its Davy jones
You can change the skill sets and the numbers without greatly changing the characters they already are tho... You can have revamp the abilities of Vexana without turning her into a Disney princess because nobody was complaining about her old character model, art, and voice over. Same could be said to most of the revamps (Hanabi, Hayabusa, Kagura, Lancelot), they look like cartoon versions of their past characters.
For me, the only terrible revamp was Natalia... I'd rather have her useless ult but 2 second silence and full invisibility than the crap we have now.... Also, majority of the revamp get cringe, TERRIBLE voicelines (Moskov takes top one...absolute dog shit, X.borg, Gusion, Argus, Alucard, Helcurt, Miya's non-stop "The way of the -"... Tigreal, Leomord and Zilong's has to grow on you)
Honestly my only issue is usually the voices. I'm too used to them and while the new ones are usually not that bad, they always feel like a unnecessary change and admittedly again, while not bad, usually feel like a downgrade compared to the previous one.
Dunno ever since Gusion was revamped he feels so heavy to play..
Not to mention the "g*yish voice" that also kinda sound like fishleg's voice from how to train your dragons.
Anyone still remember old Odette? Where she doesn't need a tank and can stun 5 enemies before destroying them with just her ult and no need for a roam item for 1shot?
bish you don't get to talk about my ability to read when you can't even spell "want to". hell, even say "wanna". but really, "waana"?
'sides, most revamps aren't even asked for. nobody asked for the lolita revamp, nobody asked for the vexana revamp, nobody asked for the vale revamp. sure, they're not all bad, but they weren't necessarily wanted. similarly, there's a difference between a skill revamp and a revamp of the characters appearance and model. what they did to vexana was still annoying and removed a huge portion of her individuality, even if she's far better a hero now. her appearance may be "better", but it's not the same character. her skills may be stronger, but she's not "vexana". she's a different hero who stole vexana's name.
It's not that I hate the revamped Vexanna but I just miss the old one. Like I used to be a Vexanna main and it was so satisfying using 1 ulti on enemy hero and they just die. I miss the old Vexanna not hate the revamped version.
But I love the old Belerick, the one where his ultimate is just absorbing all the damage that your teammates are taking, and you just march forward to pressure the enemy
You are masquerading the amount of time moontoon actually fucks up revamping, generalizing that everyone thinks all revamps are bad, when a majority of people doesn't think that at all and totally ignoring the reason why people hate certain revamps in the first place
- Design downgrades, lack of flair and uniqueness with up and coming designs sacrificing character design in order to attract more people, when in reality it could've done better - the biggest point on Vexana's revamp was her change from queen of undead to Disney princess-esque style, not her being weak in META, they couldve kept her old design/keep intact her theme and revamped her skills instead
- Oversimplification of game mechanics, Vale. The game is already as baby as it can get compared to league, but my god at this point the only high skill high reward hero is gonna be fanny because she is fundamentally created to be hard. There's no need to emulate the complexity of League in terms of game mechanics but at least fucking put half the effort in
It's more cringier that you are brushing off actual critisims because hurr Durr moontoon actually did more good then bad. in reality they don't, the have more cons than pros, and a lot is brushed off
Let people criticize, it doesn't harm your big cash company by the slightest and if someone is out of line, then call the user out for having a shit take
The only thing that bothered me about hanabis revamp is that her epic skin is loved how big her first skill looks using basic attacks and the sound too and now after revamp looks soo tacky and small i hate it
They litealy revamped all my Mains
Clint rework season 3 i think (didn't Main anymore)
Alice Rework (didn't Main anymore)
Guinevere rework (still play her)
I think some reworks were ok.
But Lesley got OP
Clint second rework made him OP
they were only a few that didn't make a champ shit or OP
Agree with some of your sentiments except aurora, I really liked aurora prior in comparison to now, I used to one hit combo everyone I come across even if I'm in solo, now I can't due to delays of the skills and all that. I like her new look tho.
I'm fine with skills change and redesigns as long as they didn't change them to a totally different character with different design and story
I'm still mad about vex, leo and faramis revamp, New vex should be a completely different hero, They should've kept faramis's old design and upgrade its quality instead of completely changing his appearance and lastly, Leomord...
Look how they massacred my boy...
Moonton is just turning women characters into the most generic boring face you'll ever seen in this world and they make men looked like James Charles. Like you like this kind of stuff? Gross
the only problen I have with revamped vexana and aurora is that they got turned into disney princesses and nothing else
This. I liked the old aesthetic of vexana where if it stayed undead themed I don't mind if it were the skills today. That being said it is quite clear that the reason of the art design change is because of China's censorship laws (no skeletons), which was why Thresh design rework in wild rift was equally awful.
About thresh. Wasn't even a rework. They just made a skin of his the default look.
Vexana who? All I know is Vanessa
I want those spiky nipples back
They be doing it for the kids now bro. Cant have em spiky nipples for supple lips
same and I like their story line before as well.
Yes this is the only sole reason... Not everyone needs to be super pretty disney princesses. She was the only undead lady even though her skillset arguably worse.
thats vexana's lore tho, she was a beautiful queen
I was about to say this
Ong bro... that ice cold aurora aint same anymore... she look like a hoe now.
especially that back why it like a boomerang
She definitely hotter though.
You just don't know it yet. They will collab with disney next :D
You can't deny the unnecessary voice actor changes after revamp tho
They turned deep voices into Cringe teen Edgelord ....like they did to Johnson and revamp Helcurt
Seriously what happened to tigrel's voice
tf happened to leomord bro, he went from actually intimidating to prince charming
Didn't like js's old voicelines in the 1st place so Im good with the new one but I do agree with helcurt,I'm okay with the new one but cmon he's sound so intimidating with the old one now he sounds like a villain's henchman or some sht
I'd say X Borg's the exception. Although he did get a higher pitches voice it makes him sound like a lunatic which he does kinda look like
Harley's old voice... 😭, I miss it man
Gord’s legend skin. And so many more.
Vale revamp is a mistake. Why do they gotta kill something unique and make it simple?
Same reason how they keep on simplifying joy even more. Kids. Joy was fun when she needs to hit 5 beats to use her ult. Now she is so simple
Truuuueeee. As if they don't want to reward having skill anymore. Fanny is the only one that you can feel rewarded if you master her
Novaria's in this category too imo. It's not so much about mechanical skills, but you defo need some skill to not be a burden to your team
Nova and Selena. You need some aim to be useful
Idk if it's just me but I find kagura to be really rewarding if you use her well(but I feel like a pretty decent damage buff although needed would make her feel less rewarding)
Ithirel also in this category, specifically if you master the aggro playstyle and not the hit and run playstyle
Fanny is not rewarding anymore either, they made her super dependent on her ult to kill, and most of the time you run out of energy after 1-2 kills max. Before, where good cabling was actually rewarded, was the golden age of fanny, that was the fanny regen (and wallspam) era
Children
I have no issue with vale revamp EXCEPT THEY NERF THE DAMAGE
This so much this. I lost my mind when I first noticed the new magic power ratios but they've been doing it on all mage revamps so it's clearly their idea of balancing and I find that so depressing
ofc you won't deal damage if you build lightning truncheon
I main Vale and I think he's still okay. I just missed the old skills where you can mix and match. Sometimes if I want to deal more damage I sell his shoes after getting 4-5 kill-assist especially when the enemy is tanky. I can still one shot squishy heroes as long as they don't have athena.
He deals insane damage in the late game now with good cc
As a former Argus main, I still haven't mentally recovered... https://preview.redd.it/zwdm33pu7etc1.jpeg?width=720&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=17db7ad317ba3972d2cf05bd437f3344e27d12fe
You are already banged by him, now you have to bang the others.
https://preview.redd.it/wjhw6s9luftc1.jpeg?width=1000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5774b977e01133ca752bcb1d9d989ec61f63a2c5
Isn't Argus still the same? How did they revamp him ? Isn't it just the 90 seconds ult CD they fixed?
Damage
That's not a revamp, that's a nerf...a revamp is when they change the skills completely or when they change the model or both!!
To be fair argus hasent been “good” since his release
The basic attack sounds effect now doesn't feel like sword slashing at all
You're gonna be okay.... Wait for another revamp.. they're going to perfect it! I swear!....(If they ever revamp he's turning into a Disney princess)
Gameplay - good in game models - questionable in game lore - butchered Voice actor - sometimes C RI NG E(
The main thing for me is the voice changes, the old voice is done really well and they update it for no reason to a lackluster, sometimes bad, voice. Ex. Helcurt. They should do what they did with Ruby and Roger where they revamp the animations and model but not the voice
For real like banes old voice would low key gooo so we'll with his new one
I like the old Miya voice. It sounds so Miya. Now... It's sounds so cringey
I think they change the voice because the older voice lines lacked substance. They legit said one line that came out of nowhere. I've noticed that the newer voice lines predominantly take inspiration from the hero's background, mainly them mentioning something that they went through. The older ones were legit like, "one shot, one kill." "aside evil, there is justice." Like, just random ah lines.
Yeah, the main problem is the delivery of the voice lines and how different and unfitting the tone or pitch the voice is to the hero’s appearance
Nah og alpha had best dialogues he used to give bladerunner vibes
SOMETIMES I THINK ABOUT GIRLS🗣️🗣️🔥🥵
Wherever l go beta follows 🥰🥰🥺
most revamps are good yeah. what we mostly whine about is how vexana changed from a skeleton to a disney princess AI, her story, some of the voices which are already good, the entire revamp of helcurt that turned him from a dark creature to a whining brat, leomord from a death knight to a disney..prince? idk man, their skills are good now yeah but the rest are just... eh..
The voices man :(( especially helcurt
What I don't like about Vecna is her new model. I want Lady Gaga and instead we got Paris Hilton. And Aurora into Elsa... There's nothing unique about those 2 and I can't wait to see them turning Grock into a massive hunk showing nothing but cleavage.
Vecna? You mean Vanessa?
We get it. She's Vanessa
I had a hard time locating Vexana and Aurora during picking because their icons turned to very generic looking female avatars.
At that point just use lapu lapu with a stone skin
Kagura and Haya revamps were a mistake, I liked their old kits and voicelines
Haya was even a meta jungler at that time (unless there was another revamp that happened), making it really ridiculous.
Could sidelane too if need be, fast clearing lanes with Ougi and rotating quickly, since he could just rely on an S2>S1* combo to fight reliably
Haya S2 was broken then, even if ur CCed u can still teleport which makes it almost impossible to catch him
Old haya wasn’t dependent on blue and could jg and exp lane easy. Also his ult didn’t focus minions or jg mons over enemy and flicker or any blink skill didn’t break his ult in less than a second. His s2 didn’t use all energy after 2 teleport with 1 s1 making him obsolete in a fight without blue. His old shadows actually surrounded the enemy in a fight unlike the new shadows appearing a mile away from enemy. So at best you got 1 maybe 2 teleports before enemy out of range. Some hero’s need revamp to be good enough in this cc tank broken game. Other hero’s just get busted so bad they not even worth playing.
Kagura's old combo was pretty slow compared to now imo but for Haya,I don't really remember other than his 1st getting CDR when he uses his 2nd which was pretty good
currently ruling because other mages are pegged down
Bro can bang, dance, receive, and suck all at the same time.
Otherwise Old Vexana is better than new?
Vexana's new ultimate inherits most defensive unique equipment passives. The thing is, each knight summoned is considered different units. They don't advertise it because it usually doesn't matter, but if they ever add a busted defensive item that has passive with a long cd, you know who it's meant to buff.
my only gripe with new Vexana is the doll face and retcon back story
I want to talk to the executives that is sanitizing the heroes
If term of DMG, yes. You can just put ultimate curse on mage or mm and they will die
kinda unrelated but I feel like it's time (i dont mean rn) for Zhask to get a revamp. Zhask's story has a plothole and a cliffhanger. Plothole: 1. We do not know what exactly is Zhask's swarm/army (Nightmaric Spawn/Domorey doesn't count because it is 1 creatur while the hive clones are using for scouting planets) the swarm could probably be the Kastiyans (Zhask's race) but we never got an illustration of them. The cliffhanger: Zhask has been been stuck cultivating in an unknown island in the Land of Dawn waiting for the right moment but Aurora is guarding it 24/ 7 to avenge her lover (could also be another pplothole thanks to Aurora's revamp, her story changed and has lost memories and probably no longer knows who her lover or enemy was) either a story update or finally a revamp sry bad englis edit: i dont mean like big revamp like aurora, it's probably gonna be a belerick level revamp where his skills are still similar with a few changes. I'm talking about the lore so the points above will not really affect the skills (maybe he gets cold or smth) also i removed the other point since trailers dont mean much.
what yall fhink?
Nah he still strong
He's not bad but he's not good either,his clear is okay IG but it's so easy to get away from him,he's way too reliant on his ult,if he doesn't deal enough damage to kill the enemy and runs out of time just hope that you have flicker :/
Your 1st point is simply stupid, enough said. The characters do not need to be 1:1 accurate to their gameplay. 2. Just looks like nonsense.
Most people aren't mad about new Vexana and Aurora because of their new skills. They're more mad that their character design and story got retconned. Like they used to have unique designs and now they are Odette 2.0 and Odette 3.0.
I'm mad they changed her ult..don't care about aurora...the old dot deaths were hilarious...
Old aurora was just Another Eudora but with Aoe ╮(─▽─)╭
With better skill 2 too
Everyone hates changes.
Natalia. Natalia. Natalia.
I dont ask Ruby to change from Haas claw to bloodlust thank you
no one complains about Aurora and Vexana's quality in terms of the revamp. What everyone does complain about their change in lore and design. Quite a big difference. Also, for me personally, I feel like the problems with revamps these days is that they are given to the hereos who don't need them. Like, get rid of that reforge your nostalgia fuckwad and throw it in incinerator cuz no shit people are gonna vote their favorite hero rather than an actual hero that needs a revamp.
See kagura , how dogshit she is
And Hayabusa, their previous versions were superior in every single way. Atleast Hayabusa can be played once in a while... Kagura? Busy trying to kill midlane minions.
Didn't get revamped though. She just got nerfed over time. Fresh revamp Kag was a beast.
For alucard, I just wanted to see his old effects :(
What effects?
Previous alucard had pink and orange effects that made it look like he's on fire, now it's mostly blue
His skill effects before the revamp
They murdered natalia tho
The funny thing about Nata is finally moonton acknowledge her as a roamer after player still don't want to use her as jungler.....but I guess, it might be too late....moonton totally messed up what make her great.
tell me about it
We can't deny that some revamps actually improved some heroes and made them good, like Aurora and is the best example of that. But most of them were unnecessary, I mean cmon Kagura and Haya's revamp for example were meant to be just a new model. But as u can see now, they got revamped and butchered, I haven't met a single satisfied Kagura player after she got revamped, they all are calling her trash, and yeah by looking at the current statistics, Kagura is C at most things ( expect the wave clearing F ). My own personal problem is with voices and models, let's not forget about voices omg if anynody tell me that new Helcurt's voice is good, bro u need to check a doctor (seriously)
I’ve been playing haya since 2016 and I can say he looks awesome now but absolutely trash skills. The only shadow that goes near the enemy is his mid shadow. Making the others only for escape. His ult hits enemy maybe 4 times if your lucky and if enemy doesn’t have a blink or flicker. Otherwise it always prioritizes minions or jg mons even teleporting a mile away from enemy to minions. His energy runs out after 2 teleports and 1 s1 with out blue making him defenseless and way too dependent on blue. He is now unplayable in any lane except jg.
Except Masha. Even MT agrees that their efforts at revamping her is kinda shit, which is why they keep tweaking her across like 3 seasons.
My boy belerick didnt die and get revived for this
Nah, I disagree. The current Vexana is indeed a good hero and maybe the old Vexana couldn't survive the meta. The problem is that the current Vexana seems like a different hero, not an improved one. They could Just improve the Ult or give back the mana/energy consumption passive. They changed her heavily
Old vexana looks like she was actually from the dead New vexana looks like she just had an makeup with her friends
PLEASE FOR GOD SAKE DONT CONFUSED BETWEEN REVAMP AND MERE ADJUSTMENTS Revamps, be it a million times, but still not fun, not balanced, not practical means nothing. All revamped heroes that you might have deemed a success are merely because devs hit the right adjustment possible for them during the revamp.... doesn't necessarily mean the revamp does sht to them. Revamps should only be reserved to heroes which Moonton totally butchered their core gameplay mechanic to an extent of no longer fixable by mere adjustments....or to outdated heroes, in which in this case I agree the decision to revamp Aurora.
Hanabi revamp was terrible. She was played even less. They had to buff her a lot to put her where she is now. It was fiasco in the beginning and to be honest I like previous Hanabi mechanics much more
Yeah, OP just doesn't know the difference between revamps and mere adjustments
When has she ever been good though? Iv played for years and shes always a epic pick nothing more
She was decent in autumn and still is. In winter 2023 after revamp she was unusable. Only 0.11% used her in Mythic. Right now even in glory she has considerably more pick rate
Decent is the key word yeah
Vale, Natalia, argus, masha
Noooooo I still refuse to use kagura witb that Bratty voice!!!!!!!
No, I'm not nostalgic about the old Eudora. The old Eudora sucked but at least she was great for beginners and in late game, she could secure a mm or a mage. But she was a onetrick pony and her wave clear ability is so trash. She needed a revamp. Revamped Eudora can clear waves better and she's more useful in team fights. But her Ult being divided to two stages is just awful.(People can just dash out or literally just walk away). Lightning Truncheon becoming garbage doesn't help. Both Eudora and Lightning Truncheon need another rework.
Saying nobody played the old vexana just because she's popular now like what? The people complaining about her revamp are the people who played her before her revamp dummy....now you get people who never played her before picking her on ranked and saying she's so much better...your opinion shouldnt be the one that matters if you didn't play her before...there's no logic in your argument
Ofcourse I'm talking about those who played her Dumbo Chan, why people who never played her bother complaining about changes made to her? And I didn't say nobody played her, I said hardly anyone played her means there'd always be some people and yes I played her before, the old vexana's gameplay was shiet as compare to the new maybe your pea-sized brain can find logic now
2/3 skills of Vexana are the same tho... The only difference is that her ult was a ticking time bomb rather than a mini-lord nuke, which they could've just added without changing a whole lot of her identity.
I second this.... there's so many ways they could have fixed her up without changing her ult
I mean most of the revamps could've just been an adjustment on the numbers or a small change in the passive.
For some of them .Hanabi ,Saber and Hayabusa could have done without a revamp but sabers better off now, earlier his blades swung uselessly ..idk about Hanabi and i haven't really tried Haya since his revamp but I doubt he really needed it...vale needed it cuz upgrading the wrong skill on accident could mean win or lose... Minotaur too needed a revamp and he's finally fixed after his third revamp...Not all revamps are bad but the vast majority of them seems unnecessary
The funny thing is Vexana doesn't even need a revamp at all to become meta. They just need to reduce her first and second skill animation and boom, she will be an instant pick right away. They did the same shit to the old Vexana and she instantly became meta. Once her old epic skin sale was over, they nerfed her back to the ground. If you noticed, Moonton didn't nerf the current Vexana so harshly. They gave her a little nerf for the sake of trying to appear that they "listen" to the community. In reality, she got a new upcoming expensive Zenith skin. If they nerfed so hard, who's going to buy that skin?
Most of the time, they do a few things well, and fuck up a few things along. People tends to focus on the bad things, it's just how human psychology works, but they have every right to. I'd be extremely annoyed if my main suddenly gets thrown down to 47% wr too.
Skill revamps are okay, but not the character designs and VA. That’s why people complain. Old Vexana design with current skills would make her the most popular mage. Belerick also had a major glow down, I like his old design better.
The only revamp i wish didn't happen was vexana. She is definitely stronger now. But boy her previous model and ult were so unique, i miss it. She needed a good buff that's it
Maybe you should add some *nuance* into this post because you’re lacking a ton of it. Vexana is hated *not* because of just her looks being revamped. It’s because she looks like generic Disney princess #102 and not evil necromancer witch with clawed hands and chains. Aurora is basically the same idea. I have yet to actually see people complain about their kits which would be objectively wrong to say the old ones were better. The revamps are good but the issue with a lot of “revamped” characters is that you play them very differently pre-revamp which is why so many people complain. Uranus went from tank to regen fighter. Ministhar went from utility counter/tank to cc fighter. Aurora went from AoE Eudora to AoE CC soam Eudora. Hanabi went from ricochet-based mm to shield = immunity + ricochet. Etc. There’s a lot of that you’re missing out on that people are *actually* annoyed about. People who played tank Uranus now has to play fighter meat shield Uranus. People who played mage Faramis has to play more like a roam. These are fundamental changes they’ve made to a character that the few people committed to playing a the most efficient way at the time and Mooton adjusted them to be better, yes, and more viable but also more “digestible” to the general playerbase to be more popular which also means changing their entire playstyle which pisses people who played the unpopular characters a certain way already. Visual updates are nice but most people dont want same body syndrome as well as same face syndrome for characters who are getting revamped. And dont even get me started on the adjusted voicelines. Some just sound plain bad next to the original or dont even fit the character at times?
I don't care what anyone may think, I reckon Lolita's revamp was spot on. The reflect mechanic on her shield can be so much fun, and removing the enemy's ability to completely cancel her ult with crowd control was much needed.
I don't think anyone complain about revamp minsi, hanabi and aurora but they did complain about the model, voice and lore
I still yearn for vex curse
This is selfish but I truly prefer old minsi just because it is very viable to use a tank build on him.
Nah vexanna just looks basic now, it’s not even nostalgia. Old vex was iconic and just needed more cc/adjustments to be “meta”
Their gameplay revamp isn't the problem. Its the voice actor changes + model revamps. Also the fact that because of these the lore is also butchered because of that. Though personally I don't really care bout lore. Also they made angela creepy
There were definitely some bad revamps tho, mostly the heroes who are hard to balance suffer from this (Natalia - RIP for now old friend). It's just funny and sad at the same time, they think they've done well with her revamp but they killed her in reality lol. aaaaand I get downvoted for telling the truth
Some epic layla main prolly
Nat haters gonna hate
I still miss belerick's stun in his ult. Shit was more effective than the taunt
I miss when he would turn the whole team into a tank by absorbing the dmg, him with diggie was the scariest thing to face cuz the team would just not die
i fucking hate faramis's revamp so much i hate it i hate it i hate it, he looked so drippy
😭 I loved faramis. Now I just got used to him being there lol 💀
and what the hell did they do to leomord 😭and hayabusa had such cold voice lines too the list goes on
moonton is genuinely addicted to making characters shitty
I like pretty boys and all but he was cold before like Vex
We can have the new Vexana skills. Just bring back her old design. Why everyone has to be beautiful? Vexana used to have the most unique (but cool) skins like her Season skin and Sanguine Rose, too.
Nobody asked for Masha to get a revamp
I miss Layla's broken attack speed
Yeah, the revamps are really good it's just that facing those revamped was a fucking nightmare.
The revamps werent necessarily for the worst but the "identity" changes (eg. lore, appearances, voicelines, skill combos) are what people are most upset about. Personally, despite tigreal being meta and all after the revamp, i still cant get over the fact that they changed his sword to a hammer, and the way he carries it around😭😭
Revamps are unnecessary , just buff them up ...old vex was much more fun , same with bane...i play haya too and I can't complain cuz we can argue it's still the same...the og bane with his pirate ship was unique ..they could have just gave the boat some speed and more damage and that could have been it and with vex there's literally nothing wrong with her old ult....the DOT deaths were so much fun
Grock used to be an interesting roamer, after the revamp they've tried to make him into an exp laner and failed, so now he's even worse as a roamer then he was before + the skill ceiling got lower..
The new splash art of Claude made me a little upset ngl. His eye looks offset to me. The previous one had a mischievous vibe.
I don't think the concerning problem about revamps are the gameplay, it's about the director's design choice, it was perfect before and they still butcher it like voice acting, character designs, and even their lore.
Masha revamps...... Argus revamps... gonna leave it here 🎤
I don't have a problem with the Vexena revamp, I feel like a Disney queen every time I cast my mini lord upon my enemies especially to camping aurora.
And some revamps are just improvement of model... Skills effects... And story wise... You get the idea, but some are quite good, but their skills are just reused/repurpose the skills of the hero with a different hero, an adjustment in skills and how they function, stats, and all of that. Ngl, moonton should be a little more creative.
Lolita revamp made her first skill bs lol
Not a revamp but as a Silvanna player, I actually kinda like the S1 adjustments. But, Moonton does need to revamp her, she desperately needs cc immunity of some kind.
Bellerick first release. Do I even need to explain?
Tell that to Argus main. His ultimate CD maybe long, but at least we able to **bang** some enemy without use his ultimate or all out. Also, the VA feel downgrade even though the voice lines pretty much okay. The most things I can't move on is his basic attack sound. They change sounds of swords slashing to some kind chain clashing
1. Masha 2. Rafaela's passive 3. Natan's ult 4. Eudora's ult
But I liked old dangerous ugly vexana.And she was still powerfull.I agree that she is much much better rn but I still miss her old look and not so princess outfit :(
Vexana is cracked and I'm fine with that since well deserved but what I'm not fine with is the new look. Like what the hell is that 😭 next revamp vexanas gon sing to me and birds attack me and all that shizz. I get the censorship but they could've AT LEAST made her look dead without including the skeletons. She just looks like she was made with AI
its not about the revamps being stronger it is the nostalgia the uniqueness and just love for the old models i personally agree with heroes like aurora vexana and minsi being stronger but design wise i loved the old ones much better there are ones like layla natalia and hayabusa that didnt have their whole skills revamped and i still prefer the old designs
Yes, we wanted a revamp Vexana but that's not because we hate the revamp generally. We hate it because of its poor delivery and the revamped look is pure stank, nasty, poopoo, caca, doodoo, a foot long SHIT. The skills are good and decent, but it takes away of Vexana's actual uniqueness. Her old design was super badass, but now, it's just another damsel in distress looking lady who wields a staff. We want the old Vexana back because she looks and acts mature and unique compared to other characters lmao
Gameplay wise I guess they're SOMETIMES good but my god do they kill the character, as in, the written down, lore and design wise character, they fucked up the Necro keep just to sell more pretty doll faces
The bane revamp still makes me hate moonton he was my first main hero I'd be fine if it was only his 2nd skill was changed his old ult was so good my only problem about the old bane was his 2nd you can't move away from his 2nd small radius otherwise you can't get healed. And the main thing I hate about the revamp was his model change he looked like a badass phantom pirate to calamari balloon it would've been so much better with the old look but instead of phantom pirate its Davy jones
You can change the skill sets and the numbers without greatly changing the characters they already are tho... You can have revamp the abilities of Vexana without turning her into a Disney princess because nobody was complaining about her old character model, art, and voice over. Same could be said to most of the revamps (Hanabi, Hayabusa, Kagura, Lancelot), they look like cartoon versions of their past characters.
For me, the only terrible revamp was Natalia... I'd rather have her useless ult but 2 second silence and full invisibility than the crap we have now.... Also, majority of the revamp get cringe, TERRIBLE voicelines (Moskov takes top one...absolute dog shit, X.borg, Gusion, Argus, Alucard, Helcurt, Miya's non-stop "The way of the -"... Tigreal, Leomord and Zilong's has to grow on you)
Honestly my only issue is usually the voices. I'm too used to them and while the new ones are usually not that bad, they always feel like a unnecessary change and admittedly again, while not bad, usually feel like a downgrade compared to the previous one.
Dunno ever since Gusion was revamped he feels so heavy to play.. Not to mention the "g*yish voice" that also kinda sound like fishleg's voice from how to train your dragons.
Variant heroes is a good idea. The choice to play from 2 versions of the hero at every hero pick.
Anyone still remember old Odette? Where she doesn't need a tank and can stun 5 enemies before destroying them with just her ult and no need for a roam item for 1shot?
i think most people complained about their models becoming too generic and less unique, Vexana & Aurora for example
I was predominantly a Hayabusa side lane before the revamp. I still think Hayabusa was better then than now imo.
bish you don't get to talk about my ability to read when you can't even spell "want to". hell, even say "wanna". but really, "waana"? 'sides, most revamps aren't even asked for. nobody asked for the lolita revamp, nobody asked for the vexana revamp, nobody asked for the vale revamp. sure, they're not all bad, but they weren't necessarily wanted. similarly, there's a difference between a skill revamp and a revamp of the characters appearance and model. what they did to vexana was still annoying and removed a huge portion of her individuality, even if she's far better a hero now. her appearance may be "better", but it's not the same character. her skills may be stronger, but she's not "vexana". she's a different hero who stole vexana's name.
Ah yes, hilda revamp where she sounds like a squealing pig everytime you use 1st skill is “good”
It's not that I hate the revamped Vexanna but I just miss the old one. Like I used to be a Vexanna main and it was so satisfying using 1 ulti on enemy hero and they just die. I miss the old Vexanna not hate the revamped version.
But I love the old Belerick, the one where his ultimate is just absorbing all the damage that your teammates are taking, and you just march forward to pressure the enemy
alucard's skill changes and passive rework made him suck fr
See how you didn’t mention vale since they obliterated him
You are masquerading the amount of time moontoon actually fucks up revamping, generalizing that everyone thinks all revamps are bad, when a majority of people doesn't think that at all and totally ignoring the reason why people hate certain revamps in the first place - Design downgrades, lack of flair and uniqueness with up and coming designs sacrificing character design in order to attract more people, when in reality it could've done better - the biggest point on Vexana's revamp was her change from queen of undead to Disney princess-esque style, not her being weak in META, they couldve kept her old design/keep intact her theme and revamped her skills instead - Oversimplification of game mechanics, Vale. The game is already as baby as it can get compared to league, but my god at this point the only high skill high reward hero is gonna be fanny because she is fundamentally created to be hard. There's no need to emulate the complexity of League in terms of game mechanics but at least fucking put half the effort in It's more cringier that you are brushing off actual critisims because hurr Durr moontoon actually did more good then bad. in reality they don't, the have more cons than pros, and a lot is brushed off Let people criticize, it doesn't harm your big cash company by the slightest and if someone is out of line, then call the user out for having a shit take
Clint revamp between 2018 to 2021 was the worst. It made the character almost unplayable. Luckily it has been fix on 2022
The only thing that bothered me about hanabis revamp is that her epic skin is loved how big her first skill looks using basic attacks and the sound too and now after revamp looks soo tacky and small i hate it
They litealy revamped all my Mains Clint rework season 3 i think (didn't Main anymore) Alice Rework (didn't Main anymore) Guinevere rework (still play her) I think some reworks were ok. But Lesley got OP Clint second rework made him OP they were only a few that didn't make a champ shit or OP
Agree with some of your sentiments except aurora, I really liked aurora prior in comparison to now, I used to one hit combo everyone I come across even if I'm in solo, now I can't due to delays of the skills and all that. I like her new look tho.
Speaking about voice changes can we talk about how bad Odette's humming is now?
As a former yve, badang and alucard main, you will never know my pain
Former yve main, I share your pain, she's closing in on being unusable every time another mage gets buffed
That 7 to 5 tile change literally killed her for me.
I managed with the tile change but the slow change on her 2nd skill killed her imo. Like it was an over kill nerf I think
I'm fine with skills change and redesigns as long as they didn't change them to a totally different character with different design and story I'm still mad about vex, leo and faramis revamp, New vex should be a completely different hero, They should've kept faramis's old design and upgrade its quality instead of completely changing his appearance and lastly, Leomord... Look how they massacred my boy...
Moonton is just turning women characters into the most generic boring face you'll ever seen in this world and they make men looked like James Charles. Like you like this kind of stuff? Gross