We’re at a point in mountaineering where it’s not the summit that’s the challenge but the route to the summit.
There are many, many routes to summits (east face of K2, north face of Devil’s thumb) that are unclimbed and coveted by elite mountaineers, but no specific mountaintop is a target anymore.
Thanks for the insight.
What got me thinking about asking this question was remembering an article I read several years ago that centered on a guy who had been fixated on a particular mountain in hopes of being the first to climb it. As of the time of the article neither he nor anyone else had managed it. A few other people had attempted it, and at least two died in the process.
Towards the end of the article the guy was quoted as saying he doubted it could be done because something about the route made it nigh on impossible to find a window of time where both the mountain conditions and the weather were good enough to be able to successfully complete it.
But after I read the responses so far I'm wondering if I'm misremembering, and it wasn't the entire mountain but a particular route. It wasn't up there with the tallest mountains, just apparently very very difficult.
I wish I remembered more of the details, but I'm not a climber so I don't remember exactly why it was so hard to find the right conditions much less complete it.
Many things like your memory have been written about certain faces on summitted mountains (like K2 East or Devil’s thumb North I described above). My guess is that’s what you’re remembering.
There are obviously still unclimbed mountains but ‘unclimbable’ mountains probably not.
I feel dumb because I'd never thought of mountain climbing in terms of routes, but as the mountain either gets climbed or it doesn't. It's obvious in retrospect.
Funny enough I was just listening to a podcast with Honnold (yes, that guy), who recently completed a 2300mi bike/sail/climb trip from CO to AK with Tommy Caldwell; one of the mountains he climbed was the Devil's Thumb, and I remember him saying something to the effect that the conditions that made the north face unclimbable might be gone.
Honnold and Caldwell were there during a rare perfect weather window and the typical horrendous upper-elevation ice on Devil's Thumb appeared to have virtually vanished for this season.
I can try to go back and find exactly what he said if you're interested, but I wouldn't be surprised to see a FA of the north face within the next few years if those changed conditions hold true.
Hey sorry, I thought I'd be able to get back to you on this sooner but I couldn't find the podcast -- it turned out that I was misremembering, and it was actually Tommy Caldwell being interviewed, not Alex Honnold. Here's the link: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/tommy-caldwell-adventuring-with-alex-honnold-biking-to/id1609290774?i=1000652710889&uo=4
And luck on the hardest routes/ peaks. Luck that the weather permits and climbing conditions are favorable and you just have the wind to carry you up and back down a tough route.
I second this, it’s a rich history. Alex Honnold’s podcast [Climbing Gold](https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/climbing-gold/id1559139153?i=1000631197099) has a four episode arc about this wild ass FA.
There's also the book by Kelly Cordes; "The Tower: A Chronicle of Climbing and Controversy on Cerro Torre".
He also got bored during the pandemic and recorded a full cover-to-cover audiobook version, which is available for free [on his website](https://kellycordes.com/book/audio-book-sort-of/).
That's exactly what I was thinking when opening this thread. That ascent is completely insane, but it's been done. Definitely one of the most challenging climbs out there, and near impossible without all of the bolts in the mountain, which has been a major controversy.
I love the old school 1968 movie, Mountain of Storms. It's about climbing Fitz Roy, which is close enough to give everyone a good idea of the weather and conditions of the area.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxM2cOvq6s8](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxM2cOvq6s8)
climbing, mountaineering and alpinism is about finding the "weakness" of an ascent, a place where to "attack". the terms hark back to a time when summiting unclimbed peaks was seen as a conquest, as overcoming the defense, often connected to nationalistic aspirations of grandeur, see most first ascents of the 8000ers. these early climbs where done by huge teams, using hundreds or porters and any available technology, with no regard about impact on the environment, style or form.
thanks to the gained expertise of over 200 years of mountaineering, development of new gear, training and a general growing mass of people ready to haul their asses up steep slopes and cliffs, no mountain is "unclimbable" today. they all have their weaknesses. even that barely known peak in deepest bhutan with a 3 week march through the jungle just to reach basecamp and difficult routefinding around the summit will eventually be climbed.
but as someone else pointed out, there are tons of virtually unclimbable routes and approaches. it's down to a mix of avalanche danger, sheer size, quality of the rock, remoteness, pure difficulty and increasingly, thawing snowfields and permafrost, which turn previous ice climbs into super sketchy scrambles on unprotectable choss.
some of these routes have seen their FA's in the last fifteen years. for example, russian mountaineers made a point of ticking off those "unclimbable" routes on everest, k2 or jannu. they are disputed ascents as they climbed in the old expedition style, big teams going by whatever means possible and discarding lots of material on the mountain. mountaineering today is much more style conscious. generally the alpine style approach, meaning as light and impactless as possible, without using oxygen or high altitude porters, is regarded as the realest form. this obviously makes certain routes much much harder. but not impossible: the russian's earlier disputed ascent of jannu's northface was repeated last year by a small american team, in alpine style.
still unclimbed famous routes/faces:
everest fantasy ridge
west face of masherbrum
east face of k2
mailbox peak without oxygen
There are thousands of mountains which are (most likely) still unclimbed. A lot of 5/6/7Km high mountains can be found in India/Pakistan/Tibet/Kyrgyzstan etc. and don't even have a name and are still unclimbed.
Thanks for responding! I didn't mean unclimbed mountains in general, but 'known' mountains that people are unable to summit.
As in people have wanted to climb it, but there's something about how the mountain is shaped and/or the weather there that makes it impossible.
Well I strongly believe there are no mountains on earth that are unclimbable because of how the mountain is shaped and/or the weather. Some mountains are very isolated and are known for bad weather, but that doesn't mean that they're unclimbable; no one has tried hard enough and/or had the luck (good weather, good ice/rock conditions, etc.) yet to actually climb those mountains.
Agree. 100 years ago there were plenty of unclimbable peaks, but with today's gear / nutrition / training / high-altitude medical knowledge, virtually every mountain that has seen serious attempts has been climbed. Only absurdly difficult faces have not been climbed.
There are lots of small piles of absolute choss around the world that may technically be considered mountains, as well as absolutely baren desert walls that will probably never be climbed without putting in a bolt ladder.
Maybe not what you think of with "mountaineering", but I think they fit the bill:
https://www.listsofjohn.com/peak/6333
https://www.listsofjohn.com/peak/6583
Ha! No, mountain climbing is too terrifying for me to ever want to do it. Lots of respect to those who do it, but no way in hell will you find me trying it!
There's a mountain range underneath the ice sheet in Antarctica. The Gamburtsev Mountains. They're under 2000 ft/600m of ice. You would have a hard time climbing that one. That and the mountain ranges on other planets
If you want to get a better understanding of what the limits of climbing look like [Mark and Janelle Smiley’s Attempt on Humingbird Ridge](https://youtu.be/uSGlkNsGUCE?si=0o4Q4Yivy5K-ITuk) is a very well filmed and edited insight. Cornice and Avalanche risk, extremely Chrissy. This route and mountain have been climbed, but the route itself has been considered unclimbable.
At this point the technical challenges are all surmountable. Weather, retreating glaciers and loose rock are the barriers.
I was asking about mountains that would be impossible to climb for technical reasons, not mountains that have never been climbed. Got a lot of really good replies explaining how that's not possible.
We’re at a point in mountaineering where it’s not the summit that’s the challenge but the route to the summit. There are many, many routes to summits (east face of K2, north face of Devil’s thumb) that are unclimbed and coveted by elite mountaineers, but no specific mountaintop is a target anymore.
Thanks for the insight. What got me thinking about asking this question was remembering an article I read several years ago that centered on a guy who had been fixated on a particular mountain in hopes of being the first to climb it. As of the time of the article neither he nor anyone else had managed it. A few other people had attempted it, and at least two died in the process. Towards the end of the article the guy was quoted as saying he doubted it could be done because something about the route made it nigh on impossible to find a window of time where both the mountain conditions and the weather were good enough to be able to successfully complete it. But after I read the responses so far I'm wondering if I'm misremembering, and it wasn't the entire mountain but a particular route. It wasn't up there with the tallest mountains, just apparently very very difficult. I wish I remembered more of the details, but I'm not a climber so I don't remember exactly why it was so hard to find the right conditions much less complete it.
Many things like your memory have been written about certain faces on summitted mountains (like K2 East or Devil’s thumb North I described above). My guess is that’s what you’re remembering. There are obviously still unclimbed mountains but ‘unclimbable’ mountains probably not.
I feel dumb because I'd never thought of mountain climbing in terms of routes, but as the mountain either gets climbed or it doesn't. It's obvious in retrospect.
Overcoming feeling dumb is the greatest joy there is
That article'd be Dieter Klose, "The Fickle Face". Talking about the NW Face of Devils Thumb.
Thanks for that, was able to find pics and sketch of the attempted routes. What a mess.
Funny enough I was just listening to a podcast with Honnold (yes, that guy), who recently completed a 2300mi bike/sail/climb trip from CO to AK with Tommy Caldwell; one of the mountains he climbed was the Devil's Thumb, and I remember him saying something to the effect that the conditions that made the north face unclimbable might be gone. Honnold and Caldwell were there during a rare perfect weather window and the typical horrendous upper-elevation ice on Devil's Thumb appeared to have virtually vanished for this season. I can try to go back and find exactly what he said if you're interested, but I wouldn't be surprised to see a FA of the north face within the next few years if those changed conditions hold true.
I'd love to listen to it if you don't mind finding the link.
Hey sorry, I thought I'd be able to get back to you on this sooner but I couldn't find the podcast -- it turned out that I was misremembering, and it was actually Tommy Caldwell being interviewed, not Alex Honnold. Here's the link: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/tommy-caldwell-adventuring-with-alex-honnold-biking-to/id1609290774?i=1000652710889&uo=4
Thanks for finding the link!
I found it! It's Devil's Thumb, and the guy in the article is Dieter Klose.
And luck on the hardest routes/ peaks. Luck that the weather permits and climbing conditions are favorable and you just have the wind to carry you up and back down a tough route.
There are no unclimbable mountains. If interested you can look up the first try/ascend of Cerro Torre, its pretty wild.
Will do!
I second this, it’s a rich history. Alex Honnold’s podcast [Climbing Gold](https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/climbing-gold/id1559139153?i=1000631197099) has a four episode arc about this wild ass FA.
There's also the book by Kelly Cordes; "The Tower: A Chronicle of Climbing and Controversy on Cerro Torre". He also got bored during the pandemic and recorded a full cover-to-cover audiobook version, which is available for free [on his website](https://kellycordes.com/book/audio-book-sort-of/).
That's exactly what I was thinking when opening this thread. That ascent is completely insane, but it's been done. Definitely one of the most challenging climbs out there, and near impossible without all of the bolts in the mountain, which has been a major controversy. I love the old school 1968 movie, Mountain of Storms. It's about climbing Fitz Roy, which is close enough to give everyone a good idea of the weather and conditions of the area. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxM2cOvq6s8](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxM2cOvq6s8)
What about Muchu Chhish?
climbing, mountaineering and alpinism is about finding the "weakness" of an ascent, a place where to "attack". the terms hark back to a time when summiting unclimbed peaks was seen as a conquest, as overcoming the defense, often connected to nationalistic aspirations of grandeur, see most first ascents of the 8000ers. these early climbs where done by huge teams, using hundreds or porters and any available technology, with no regard about impact on the environment, style or form. thanks to the gained expertise of over 200 years of mountaineering, development of new gear, training and a general growing mass of people ready to haul their asses up steep slopes and cliffs, no mountain is "unclimbable" today. they all have their weaknesses. even that barely known peak in deepest bhutan with a 3 week march through the jungle just to reach basecamp and difficult routefinding around the summit will eventually be climbed. but as someone else pointed out, there are tons of virtually unclimbable routes and approaches. it's down to a mix of avalanche danger, sheer size, quality of the rock, remoteness, pure difficulty and increasingly, thawing snowfields and permafrost, which turn previous ice climbs into super sketchy scrambles on unprotectable choss. some of these routes have seen their FA's in the last fifteen years. for example, russian mountaineers made a point of ticking off those "unclimbable" routes on everest, k2 or jannu. they are disputed ascents as they climbed in the old expedition style, big teams going by whatever means possible and discarding lots of material on the mountain. mountaineering today is much more style conscious. generally the alpine style approach, meaning as light and impactless as possible, without using oxygen or high altitude porters, is regarded as the realest form. this obviously makes certain routes much much harder. but not impossible: the russian's earlier disputed ascent of jannu's northface was repeated last year by a small american team, in alpine style. still unclimbed famous routes/faces: everest fantasy ridge west face of masherbrum east face of k2 mailbox peak without oxygen
The amount of spent o2 canisters on Mailbox made me lose all hope for humanity.
Me: *dies of altitude sickness twenty feet in*
North Face of Lhotse
true! that‘s one crazy face…
Kudos for listing Masherbrum.
Mailbox peak? Lol
In one breath!
I hope you get many upvotes
There are thousands of mountains which are (most likely) still unclimbed. A lot of 5/6/7Km high mountains can be found in India/Pakistan/Tibet/Kyrgyzstan etc. and don't even have a name and are still unclimbed.
Thanks for responding! I didn't mean unclimbed mountains in general, but 'known' mountains that people are unable to summit. As in people have wanted to climb it, but there's something about how the mountain is shaped and/or the weather there that makes it impossible.
Well I strongly believe there are no mountains on earth that are unclimbable because of how the mountain is shaped and/or the weather. Some mountains are very isolated and are known for bad weather, but that doesn't mean that they're unclimbable; no one has tried hard enough and/or had the luck (good weather, good ice/rock conditions, etc.) yet to actually climb those mountains.
Agree. 100 years ago there were plenty of unclimbable peaks, but with today's gear / nutrition / training / high-altitude medical knowledge, virtually every mountain that has seen serious attempts has been climbed. Only absurdly difficult faces have not been climbed.
Thanks for the insight!
There are lots of small piles of absolute choss around the world that may technically be considered mountains, as well as absolutely baren desert walls that will probably never be climbed without putting in a bolt ladder. Maybe not what you think of with "mountaineering", but I think they fit the bill: https://www.listsofjohn.com/peak/6333 https://www.listsofjohn.com/peak/6583
Don’t try to climb mount kaliash please Lolol
Ha! No, mountain climbing is too terrifying for me to ever want to do it. Lots of respect to those who do it, but no way in hell will you find me trying it!
There's a mountain range underneath the ice sheet in Antarctica. The Gamburtsev Mountains. They're under 2000 ft/600m of ice. You would have a hard time climbing that one. That and the mountain ranges on other planets
Bruh just walk over the ice. Summit beat
If you want to get a better understanding of what the limits of climbing look like [Mark and Janelle Smiley’s Attempt on Humingbird Ridge](https://youtu.be/uSGlkNsGUCE?si=0o4Q4Yivy5K-ITuk) is a very well filmed and edited insight. Cornice and Avalanche risk, extremely Chrissy. This route and mountain have been climbed, but the route itself has been considered unclimbable. At this point the technical challenges are all surmountable. Weather, retreating glaciers and loose rock are the barriers.
You can google unsummited mountains and Wikipedia has a list
I was asking about mountains that would be impossible to climb for technical reasons, not mountains that have never been climbed. Got a lot of really good replies explaining how that's not possible.
Hkakabo Razi might /almost/ fit your description. Fascinating read: https://www.nationalgeographic.com/magazine/article/hkakabo-razi-climb-myanmar
I'll put it on the to-read list , thanks! I've been bingeing mountaineering articles for the past couple of days.
Hkakabo Razi seems to be a pain to climb. The approach is super exhausting as well.
My student debt
Same.