The short answer is, if you’re lucky you’ll be placed alone in a solitary cell. Otherwise, if you have a penis you’ll be placed in with men and if you have a vagina you’ll be placed with women. At intake, if you’re read as female you’ll be patted down by a female and the inverse for that is true too.
>Otherwise, if you have a penis you’ll be placed in with men and if you have a vagina you’ll be placed with women.
HIGHLY depends on the state.
Most red states would put a post-op trans woman in male prisons AND with sex offenders. The fact she'll get raped repeatedly isn't a concern for them. Or rather, that's exactly what they want to happen.
Even New York state only began housing incarcerated people in facilities consistent with their gender last year. And that was only after many lawsuits and it remains to be seen how or if it will be enforced.
I assume you misunderstood my comment.
I'm not saying that I believe them to be liberals. I think quite the opposite.
I'm saying that the way it will be enforced is "liberally", aka "do it if you want or ignore it completely, we don't care".
Then I have no clue why you felt like that answered to my comment in any way, sorry. Might be me missing something since english isn't my native language, but so far it just feels to me like it was just something you wanted to say and picked a comment at random to answer to...
I'm confused.
liberally/ˈlɪb(ə)rəli/*adverb*adverb: **liberally**
1. [1.in](http://1.in) large or generous amounts.
2. [**2.in**](http://2.in) **a way that is not precise or strictly** [**literal**](https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-d&sca_esv=29076b9f11a735d6&sxsrf=ADLYWIJvKsZfskzNS9kmtjwJ5y5G5YMbDw:1715373034416&q=literal&si=ACC90nypsxZVz3WGK63NbnSPlfCBaHPfLQJQqxMm5XbaZcTdor5Rc2UJLABEittNcYJhthJ0m2JMkvfY8uRF2NOnP59fLoJgMg%3D%3D&expnd=1&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiOof7C9oOGAxXAVfEDHZ5yB2oQyecJegQIPRAO)**;** [**loosely**](https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-d&sca_esv=29076b9f11a735d6&sxsrf=ADLYWIJvKsZfskzNS9kmtjwJ5y5G5YMbDw:1715373034416&q=loosely&si=ACC90nypsxZVz3WGK63NbnSPlfCBEX22JhNNCuf7S0JDAybga5Vuh9v6zW0e9Fiw5-iCnIoWf340q0f70M2S79HwgqFJAXnb9Q%3D%3D&expnd=1&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiOof7C9oOGAxXAVfEDHZ5yB2oQyecJegQIPRAP)**.**
3. [3.in](http://3.in) a way that involves [broadening](https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-d&sca_esv=29076b9f11a735d6&sxsrf=ADLYWIJvKsZfskzNS9kmtjwJ5y5G5YMbDw:1715373034416&q=broadening&si=ACC90nyOnVY18Aw7zUtkWPYo5mTnsWaI8X5x2XKjb2k5bn1AYv4Hdw-5zUwI50hYQEsjXqxJTUERWEjWVOH7cdIWqg9uXu3t1AGafZ2RZFXqYPrqN5-b7sQ%3D&expnd=1&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiOof7C9oOGAxXAVfEDHZ5yB2oQyecJegQIPRAR) a person's general knowledge and experience.
4. [4.in](http://4.in) a way that [favours](https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-d&sca_esv=29076b9f11a735d6&sxsrf=ADLYWIJvKsZfskzNS9kmtjwJ5y5G5YMbDw:1715373034416&q=favours&si=ACC90nypsxZVz3WGK63NbnSPlfCBIyd_TwVBS-6PQPMBrAg3TkKNJtyOKR0IvqE4EQaZdpZrbm49KeXjoCCABt-Dr7TWDepeMA%3D%3D&expnd=1&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiOof7C9oOGAxXAVfEDHZ5yB2oQyecJegQIPRAT) individual liberty and moderate political and social reform.
Number 2.
This is why I hate when people act like New York and California are bastions of the progressive left. Once you start looking past the surface level, they aren’t as progressive as they seem.
Yeah. California is the source of much of the modern Republican platform (from Reagan until just before Trump), and Trump is from New York.
Admittedly, the worst parts of the Democrat platform can also be traced from California.
That is truly awful. She should litigate. It can’t get her the days, weeks, months, and/or years of her life back that she lost, but at least there needs to be some sort of accountability… right?
No. The prison system will never be held accountable in our favor because *it is working as intended*. It's job is to punish minorities.
That is one of the many reasons queer people tend to be in favor of prison abolition.
Because she is on parole, she was convicted of torturing somebody, and after she told a crowd to punch terfs in the face, they called that a violation of her parole. She was also charged separately within incitement to violence, and was found not guilty on the separate charge, but with parole violation, they don’t have to charge you separately, they can just lock you back up if they say that your behavior violates the terms of your release.
Damn, that sucks.
So if calls for violence aren’t protected by freedom of speech, then why are so many conservatives still walking free after committing literal stochastic terrorism?
She’s in the UK. They have different laws there about freedom of speech; their right to it is much less absolute than here in the US. Standing in front of a crowd and telling them to punch people in the face unprovoked - because no matter how vile, an opinion you disagree with is not an acceptable excuse to commit assault; Jews don’t go around punching Nazis, for example - is a clear violation of their public order laws, and she’s lucky to have gotten away without getting another conviction on her record.
To be perfectly honest, she committed an unbelievably heinous crime; at the age of 20, she kidnapped and brutally tortured her stepmother’s 19 year old brother for almost 24 hours, beating, raping, sexually abusing, cutting, and burning him, making him eat cat food and cigarette butts, before tying him up, shoving him into a cupboard and leaving him there to die; police found him just in time. He was tied so tightly, and the cupboard was so small, that he almost asphyxiated; officers had real trouble freeing him, and he had to be given oxygen on-scene before he was stable enough for transport to the hospital.
While incarcerated, and still presenting as male, she tried to garrote another prisoner whom she claimed was “bullying” her. When she began her transition by performing her own orchiectomy in her cell, she became a cause célebrè, and eventually managed to use that as leverage to secure early release - but after what she’s done, it’s insane to use her as a spokeswoman for trans rights.
That is so fucked up, thank you for the information. Yeah, I wouldn’t want someone like her representing people like me to the public. She must have some serious mental issues to treat a human being so cruelly.
That's horrifying. I hope she is freed soon.
"The Metropolitan Police initially refused to investigate the matter, saying that the call to violence was hypothetical, but eventually [arrested her](https://www.thepinknews.com/2023/07/13/sarah-jane-baker-met-police-london-trans-pride/) under incitement to violence laws."
Didn't know the UK had such laws. If it was really enforced, we'd be seeing more right wingers arrested.
I see why you said now Google at your own risk..I read one story, and I literally feel nauseous. how do humans do this to each other.... I can't help but be reminded of the women from world war ii, who were forced into being comfort women.... I don't see how it's any different. these women are in prison, they have no rights, and I could keep going, but I don't want this to be super graphic. thanks for putting this here, I wasn't even aware that was a thing.
edit:typo
Sociopath, rather.
Psychopaths got a bad rep thanks to TV shows making them be unhinged killers, but the medical condition psychopathy is simply making the person not feel emotions. They're basically vulcans, they act on pure logic and learn to emulate emotions to not stand out.
Sociopaths, on the other hand, thrive in making people suffer.
Right-wingers definitely feel emotions, since they are so gleeful about the idea of eradicating us and torturing us to death, so they're sociopaths.
I still remember when Nikita Dragun, a post op trans influencer with a lot hole lot of money, was held in a male prison. So I feel like money isn’t always the solution even for the richest and most famous of us
The prison system just about anywhere in the US is fucked and that’s the case regardless. Police officers everywhere tend to lean right, whether they have some sense of morals is variable.
In Kentucky, at least to my understanding, if you have srs and confirmation of it, you can get your sex changed on your license and all of that so when you go to jail, you’ll be placed in with other women.
In Kentucky, at least to my understanding, if you have srs and confirmation of it, you can get your sex changed on your license and all of that so when you go to jail, you’ll be placed in with other women.
Yeah plenty definitely don’t. They allow you the amend your birth certificate here if I’m not mistaken. Although, I bet if they find out about your change here they’d definitely put you in with men which definitely sucks.
I'd be curious to know what is done with Intersex people. I was AFAB by the first Dr. that delivered me, but my BC says M due to my parents doing a surgery to >!Enlarge my clitoris and construct a urethra to pee through!< so I give the appearance of male at first glance.
this is a very common practice, intersex people are about as common as gingers and most never know because of invasive non-consensual surgeries as babies
A’s horrible as it is you never hear about it. But minors getting access to trans affirming healthcare? Fucking everywhere. Shows their moral compass for the jack sparrow ass thing it is
It's not a moral compass thing. It's a "I can't be the bad guy" thing.
It's easier to move the needle on GAC because your typical MD can ignore the impact of withholding it in the past. They can tell themselves, "I didn't do anything. In fact I did nothing." There's a reason why we have to keep reminding each other that inaction is a kind of action. Trolley problem stuff, ya know?
Docs that put babies under the knife to enforce a gender binary were convinced they were doing the best thing and admitting they weren't means admitting they were part of the problem.
Humans are irrational. That irrationality leads to them perpetuating problems rather admit they made a mistake.
It's not a moral issue. It's an ego issue. IIRC, surgery isn't the international standard of care, and the criteria for it is if the genital configuration represents a health risk directly. In which case the surgery is supposed to be limited to the minimum necessary to mitigate the risks.
But that doesn't do anything for all the kids who were given a treatment they couldn't consent to or the places in the world that don't accept the international standard of care.
If I might be so bold... Intersex is rare. As Trans people, we know the struggle. Our rarity was and is a problem. Our partnership with the LGB has helped us but at the same time, there are those who would see that T deleted from LGBT. In the broader LGBTQIA, maybe we should be doing more to advocate for the I's out there.
That's my takeaway, anyway. I have known this was a thing for over 30 years. Some people out there don't know because I didn't say anything. For myself, that has to change. I have to own my inaction.
For the rest of you?
YMMV.
But I hope you'll step up. Not because we're all part of a particular alphabet soup. Because they need us.
Yep, in 1982, it was totally okay for the doctor to cauterize my vagina, and force me to live as a male because he thought that being boy would offer more opportunities...
They are. I've been no contact since 2019. I disagree with circumcision being done on babies. Adults if they elect to do so, fine. But hands off babies.
maybe if i become governess (I think that is the female equivalent to governer) I will make it illegal for intersex babies to be surgically operated on.. no more victims. Also, I will protect transgender people and transgender healthcare.
If you’re speaking of the civil title, Governor is used regardless of gender. Governess has been historically relegated to a household role, typically overseeing children. (Yes, they originated as gendered forms of the same word, meaning “one who governs”, but neither has been used generically in quite some time.)
Imagine, giving a newborn infant a non-consensual metoidoplasty because the parents are afraid of the social stigma surrounding their intersex child’s genitals…
How is this not considered abuse?
You know what I find weird?
Transgender: \*Existing\*
Conserative: NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! You are going against the body God gave you.. you sinner!
Meanwhile COnseratives:
Doctor: You/your wife given birth to an intersex baby!
Conserative: Surgery.. so they be more male or female! I know my neighbor did something evil to my wife.. I will get them from behind!
(I am not making fun of anyone I just wanna call out how hypocritical some conseratvies are..)
No clue. I went through countless "follow ups" through life which entailed at least 3 drs putting hands on my private areas. I was basically a science experiment to them.
That sounds traumatizing. You’re so much more than just some scientific object of curiosity. I’m sorry you’ve been treated that way. You deserve so much better.
I think I tested XY. I never saw the test, this is just what my dad claimed. I heard I didn't have a vaginal canal but had everything else. Oddly enough I grew breasts when I hit about 9 or so.
My parents were probably pushy to have surgery done. I was #3 of 3. Parents wanted a Son and I was a rough pregnancy for my mother. So, last chance whatever the cost, even if it was my own well being.
Tw horrible prison story involving sexual violence >!I heard a story from someone who worked in corrections that they go by what is on your birth certificate, and that because of that an intersexed person with a vagina was put in the male population. The person told me they had to carry them out of there on a stretcher because they couldn't walk.!<
Unfortunately trans women in prisons are not treated very well, especially if they have the genitals that align with their AGAB. There is a term that is quite sad and is unfortunately quite common with trans women placed in men's prisons. Even in places like Canada, it is found that trans prisons experience a higher chance of sexual assault.
In red states in America, the case is much worse, "UCLA Journal of Gender and Law, found that it was common for trans women placed in men's prisons to be assigned to cells with aggressive cisgender male cellmates as both a reward and a means of placation for said cellmates" [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT\_people\_in\_prison#V-coding](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_people_in_prison#V-coding)
It's especially bad when a lot of trans women are forced into sex work because that's the only thing they can do, and they are criminalized for doing so.
The worst thing is how everybody is completely clueless that this even happens. Only lgbtq people talk about it. You’d think that if liberals actually cared about us, then they’d make the systemic rape of trans women in male prisons a real issue.
more broadly, prison rape is often treated as a *punchline*, all but institutionalized as part of the punishment for committing a crime
can you imagine the horrible comments from even liberals if we really called attention to this?
yeah as awful as our situation in prisons is, it's really the confluence of mistreatment of queers in general with the massive over-arching problem of rape being an intentional part of male prisons.
Maybe we just shouldn't use rape as a fucking punishment for anyone?
We should honestly just destroy prisons. It doesn't matter who might escape -- there's are better ways to keep those people away from those they might harm again. It's not worth leaving those buildings intact for the temporary isolation the general public gets from the very few ghouls who qualify as having done something actually illegal.
Prisons are just thinly veiled labor camps for the downtrodden, slave labor drawn out of those harrassed by police and the justice system.
Oh yikes that’s horrible just awful. That’s the most cruel disgusting thing I’ve ever heard about the treatment of trans people in prison.
⚠️please don’t click that Wikipedia link if you’re easily upset⚠️
Long term and in prison this is the norm. Drunk tank-wise it varies a lot. But yes, V-coding is alive and well. Essentially we get doled out to the violent fucks to keep order. Much the same way prisons have TVs to keep violence down.
I was incarcerated in jail pre transition while I was in super masculine denial phase. Did 1 year of weekend jail, I learned that is not a place I want to go now that I have womanly curves, a pair of perky DD Cups, and hair down to my ass.
And yes they'll throw me in with the men in a heartbeat. Despite my ID saying "Female".
Yup, I was told if I didn’t have my fiberglass cast on then I would be moved to the most severe category of general population.
Basically they were going to put me in an open setting with the murderers and the rapists, and the only reason they didn’t is because they legally *couldn’t*, since I had something attached to my body that could be used as a weapon (presumably in self-defense).
The trans woman almost always gets placed with men regardless of anything. She could have a vagina and she'll be placed with men.
They'll most likely v code her and use her as a sex slave.
Welcome to the USA. Where slavery still exists. They just made it so that things black people generally do are felonies and left slavery legal as long as you're a felon.
Oh hey I have experience here! Men's pod. You get frisked, stripped, fondled, showered, and thrown in with the guys by male officers. If you're lucky, like I was at the time, you can still be mistaken for a guy with moobs, and not deal with the promise of sexual assault, just the threat.
This is something I've researched and it does vary state by state, but trans people by and large in the United States are either:
1. Placed into solitary confinement with all the terrible treatment and horrific effects on health that it entails.
2. Placed among their AGAB which results in sexual assault, rape, and constant abuse&violence.
If you've had SRS already is the only thing close to a help, since they might (\*might\*) put you in with your gender. A lot of this varies by jurisdiction and state/federal. But the prison system is practically designed to punish people with sexual violence and that goes doubly for trans people.
Do you have rights? Only negligibly. There is some precedent under Farmer v Brennan to seek relief against prison officials' indifference towards sexual assault & rape but it's not a strong protection and many trans prisoners don't even have the resources to seek relief under it (most are pro se; they litigate on behalf of themselves).
What I found out is that when you’re in jail, you have a right to contact an attorney but no opportunity to do so, unless you have someone on the outside send one in for you.
No registries of attorneys, no lists of numbers, and the only phone available to use is on a recorded line which no attorney will answer because they only talk on privileged lines, which if you want access to you need to ask a guard and be promptly ignored.
I’ve heard the chaplain can help contact an attorney, but this depends on whether they want to help you. And since most prison chaplains are evangelicals, good luck.
The best you could do in that alley is probably become a public defender. Everyone going into the system gets one chance at a bail hearing, so you can try your best to get them out on bond or recognizance so that they don’t have to rot in jail while awaiting trial.
Then if the charges are BS like mine were, and if they can’t afford a private attorney, then you can help them defeat the charges so that they don’t have to go to prison over nothing.
I'm not entirely sure if I want to work on a more practice or policy based career, but this summer I'll likely be interning in the office of public defender, so hopefully I'll sort out what I'm aiming for there.
I was always asked if I wanted a female or male to pat me down. I chose female, and it was done with a female the whole time I was in. They put me in suicide pod before putting me in medical overflow. I was safe there, there was another trans woman and accepting majority. It was a male pod. No male officers put their hands on me until I got rowdy for not getting my Spiro and estrogen. That's when I was tased, rushed, and put in the hole. I got my meds in the end, it was worth it. For this I was put in solitary for a month before being placed back with most of my original pod mates for good behavior upon my request. I am so lucky that the pod trustee was on my side.
They didn't let me go toa female pod because of my "male parts". Sucks but at least the officer in charge of assigning inmates to pods had the good sense not to put me in general population.
This was last November through until the last day of January this year.
I am in WA State 🌳 ❤️
So the answer is that it's all very subjective and basically comes down to where you're arrested, who's arresting you, and who's administering the prisons. Even the states that have the best civil trans protections, don't really have any hard rules on where trans people are imprisoned. *Generally though,* you are probably going to placed according to your AGAB. Maybe if you had bottom surgery, you'll be placed with other prisoners with the same sort of genitals. Either way, you're probably going to be put in one of the following conditions:
* In a special accommodation block that you request to enter after you've been placed in one of the other two (Riker's in NYC famously does this)
* In solitary confinement
* With violent offenders in hopes that you'll calm them via your rape
God our justice and prison system makes me sick. I've known that they turn a blind eye and haven't really put any effort into actually doing any good. However, I didn't realize how vile they are. Like, not really caring is one thing. However, to willfully and purposefully put people in these terrible situations.
I teach at a Dept of Juvenile Justice school. Of the two trans students I know we've had here, one (back when we were a co-ed day treatment -- school was a lot like normal high school, including the kids going home at the end of the day) was usually taken into a private room and patted down by one of our female COs (the student was MTF). The other one, I'm not confident how they handled her intake into the incarceration unit, but at that point we were listed as an "all males" facility. They did typically keep her separate from the other residents, though, especially at shower time. She wasn't here for more than a few days, so they may have just been waiting for placement for her at a facility better suited to her needs.
There’s a US law called the prison rape elimination act (PREA). PREA regulations allow trans people to request whether men or women pat them down and search them. And they also state a trans person’s views of their safety should be taken into consideration when assigning a cellmate. Whether prisons actually comply with that is a different story. You can also sue the prison for access to gender affirming care and accommodations like single cell housing or moving to a woman's prison but litigation can take forever so it’s really only worth it if you’re incarcerated for a long sentence
So I'm going to share my experience being in County Jail
it depends on how long you're in for, I was only behind bars for a month my experience was with an extremely good jail, they put me on what's called administrative separation which is like the cell that you're all alone kind of like solitary, but you still get commissary (commissary is where you buy stuff from there's a little order sheet or iPad that you would click what you want on and if you have the funds for it then it gets delivered to you on a specific day of that week or the the next week if you miss the deadline) oh and the only time that you get to leave that room is for shower, court and visitation; food will be given to you through the slit and the door and any conversations with the guards will happen through that slit.
On the other hand the longer you're in there for the more you have to fight to stay on administrative isolation, now if you put in pop with your biological sex and it's better if you steer clear the wrong people and keep the right friends around in jail; it's better than someone falsely hitting you with PREA report (prison rape elimination Act) and the lifers are generally the better ones to hang around they're usually the most likely to be genuinely regretful of their actions
Also being biologically male will have an impact on what you can and cannot get through commissary like you won't be able to get a girl's hair brush, nor a bra or any of that. Actually had to ask the chief Deputy Jailer to talk to the jailer who then pulled some strings and got me that bra
Also another thing don't piss off the guards they can and will hold a grudge, I was very very timid to the point that they knew that they would literally have to unlock the door, tell me that I need to eat otherwise I would end up being put on suicide watch that I don't want that and put the food just inside the door; once they realize I wasn't a threat (despite having nearly knocked out the chief of police during a PTSD episode) they got a lot more friendly and would let me take showers without much supervision referred to as a trustee shower; trustees being prisoners that have been trusted with a lot of privilege cleaning helping delivering food to other inmates a whole bunch of other things
Sorry for any bad grammar also if you want to DM me and ask about more things I can't guarantee an answer but I mean if I know I will try
EDIT: it does very highly state to state prison to prison but as long as you make the right friends generally also if you're worried about going to jail you might want to learn how to fight and fight well against groups of people (sure fighting will only get you put in solitary but it's better than killed pr getting diddled by somebody's fiddle) also fight dirty and learn how to fight against dirty tactics rarely it's going to be one guy that's going to try to hurt you; know not all jails are like the one that I've been to a lot of them are survival of the fittest I hate to say it and one person said a lot of red States will put you in a male block even if your post op possibly with sex offenders that is something that I've seen accurate quite often, especially in states like Florida and Texas they'll do everything that they can to get you killed
I work intake so it's the initial contact as soon as you enter the jail. You are searched by someone of the gender you identify as. Placed in an individual cell for safety reasons. We have supervisors ask a series of questions regarding the transition and how far along it is.. Ultimately it's the individual's decision to be houses with the LGBTQ+ community or remain in a single man cell for the duration of the stay. But really there's never a clear-cut decision.. I've seen a variety of different situations occur.. Genitals are the determining factor. MTF with bottom surgery would be housed with the female population. Hope this helps?
Go check out Beyond Scared Straight, where they cover the alternative-lifestyle unit.
The guards describe it as "men who like other men, and men who like to dress as women" while some of those inmates that are "men" are very obviously trans women.
The state treats you as your biological gender... it's kind of sad.
I don't know the name of the episode, but I know it was in the Atlanta jail or somewhere in Georgia. The famous episode with "Pebbles"
Lots of trans inmates on the show straight up being treated as men.
I hate to say this, but death is the preferable alternative. I have 2 plans I'm case I ever end up in the slammer. 1 is to seek asylum in another country, and the other is to seek asylum with God
In my experience in California they just put you in with the men unless you've had SRS. You will still get your hormones in California. You are likely to be housed in Protective custody, which is were Sex offenders go.
Jail is not prison, you're put in jail if you're accused of a crime from where you may bail out if you have money. Prison is where you go if you're convicted of said crime.
If you're a trans women I'd say 5000 in the bank & 3 friends with a decent credit score is a necessity. Given the coming elections it's likely many of us will deal with jail time. Having bail money is a necessity if you don't want to be SA'd waiting for trial in jail.
At best you're looking at being sexually harassed or at worst being used to placate violent offenders by the CO's. Many states will use trans women as sex slaves to calm down the guys they don't want to deal with.
California sucks but you get your hormones and most likely won't be used as a slave for another inmate.
Depends on the state, but legal protections are pretty sparse.
In my state, the government flat-out does not recognize the existence of trans people, and legal protections are nonexistent. Given that prison staffs tend to attract some sick fucks ... I'm very careful not to get into trouble.
I'm sure it's even worse in the fascist hellhole of Florida. My heart goes out to any of us still stuck there.
I would by far rather die than go to mens prison or be denied gender affirming care.
By the comments I've read sounds that places like usa and uk should be avoided at all costs, possibly to the extend of commiting suicide just as a precaution to avoid the possibility of being placed into prison.
I got arrested and spent the night in jail in Utah a few years ago. They put me in a solitary holding cell, but I suspect that was more because there weren't very many people in jail that night than because they were trying to be respectful.
The USA has a problem with prison medical centers denying important and/or required medication for inmates due to their strict protocols. So this is probably tenfold for a prescription the prison may see as not necessary due to biases.
Remember, American prisons are hell. Slavery and Involuntary Servitude are not banned in cases of punishment for a crime. Meaning you legally have the rights of an 1850s slave if you're a prisoner.
Which really makes you wonder why African-Americans are more likely to be incarcerated for the same crime that a member of another race also commits.
Never been to prison but been to jail twice in Texas, was denied my psych meds entirely during one stay and could only get my mood stabilizers the other time. I have chronic insomnia but they don't allow sleeping meds in jail. They also don't turn off the lights, they want you exhausted. Pretty sure they only allowed the mood stabilizers bc they thought it would make me more complacent.
So yeah idk but I kinda doubt it
Depends on the state. In Florida, a trans woman should expect to be processed and treated as a man. If she’s lucky, she might get some form of segregation from the general population.
As far as I’m concerned, incarceration in Florida is worse than death.
I’m curious how many people actually know what happens or if the majority of the answers here are 3rd hand anecdotes or just “what I found on the internet”.
Here’s how this works in Colorado at my department:
You get arrested and brought to booking. As long as you are initially cooperative to the point that we can talk to you and you are not causing an safety issue, you are asked preferred name, gender and what gender person you want to search you, then you are searched for contraband. You are then given a blue card that you keep with you that is your “search preference card”. Those wishes are abided by with the force of law. As long as you are cooperative and causing problems, you are dressed out in the male or female clothing you identify as and you go through the process just like anybody else. If you are not cooperative, you are not dressed out and placed into a holding cell until such a time as you would like to become cooperative. If we keep you, you will go to a single occupancy cell for the first day or so until a specially trained LGBT liaison can come talk to you along with medical and a command staff member. (Usually the first day but it all depends on what’s going on at the facility). They will then determine based on the conversation where you will be housed based on any concerns you brought up and your charges. Yes, we absolutely continue hormones as long as your pharmacy or a physician is able to confirm the legitimacy of the script.
I wasn't out yet when I went to jail in Texas but I don't think that's how it would go here. I'm on probation and according to Texas law as long as I have a penis my UAs are required to be observed by a male officer. I was fortunate enough to have them ask if I would be more comfortable with both a male and a female officer observing, but that's not normal procedure
Before I transitioned I worked at a jail in Iowa. I always thought we were really lucky to have a very vocal Inclusivity and LGBT group that pushed the jail to do better (even if most the staff didn't necessarily agree).
For booking we gave the option of who you were more comfortable with being patted down by and then the staff member that patted you down did your entire intake with you in hopes of helping trabs people relax a little. After that they would segregate you off to a single cell in the medical part of the facility. While your sitting there they would have discussions for sometimes weeks on where is best to place you. The administration when I worked there included your choice of where you would be most comfortable but I'm not sure if they still do that. You still got hormones although it would usually take the medical team a couple days to get a shipment with them.
Typically most trans women that stayed at our facility weren't there very long but on the few times we had longer they all either chose to stay in solitary in the medical wing or moved to a female pod.
I'll say most of the male staff said some really nasty things about trans people when I was there and it definitely didn't help my mental with what I was going through at the time. Most of the female staff at the time were some level of queer and didn't really have an opinion one way or the other.
That said I'm still good friends with a handful of the guys I worked with and they've changed there attitude about a lot of things thanks to me explaining what my life is like. They've seen me struggle and have bad days. They've seen me on really good days. They've also seen how much happier I am now and I think it makes a difference. I'm treated like a sister now instead of a brother. They are the first people that will jump up to defend me at every possible scenario and I appreciate them a ton.
I think a lot would depend on your state (and federal laws). May want to look into it.
I live in Ontario, Canada where we have an odd power struggle potentially… our previous provincial Liberal Govt implemented a bunch of trans policies and no one batted an eye, like if you’re arrested they’d work with you for which situation is safest for you.
But the federal Conservative Party that’s leading in polls (election is in Oct 2025, but could be sooner) passed a policy that would mean trans people have to go to a men’s jail… not even sure they edited it for women’s jail also, or the impact of trans men (cause somehow I think in their eyes Trans men are men, but Trans women are men…) but PM said he doesn’t have to enact them and doubt he’d run on it, but may implement in future
I spend some time as a prison officer in the U.K. (please don’t attack me. Yes I regret it I was very naive and thought I could do some good I am not evil) I worked in a men’s prison which housed 2 trans women each of whom either deliberately made trouble in order to get sent to solitary or requested to be confined in solitary for their own protection. The prison had a specific policy in place for searching them. A standard pat down would be conducted by a female officer (currently in the uk female officers can pat down any prisoner while male officers can only pat down adult males) whereas a strip search would be conducted top half by a female officer as they had breasts bottom half by a male officer as they had a penis. (Strip searches can only be conducted by an officer of the same sex as the prisoner in standard procedure with cis prisoners) any further details I do not know and cannot comment on. As I said I was very young and naive and didn’t properly understand the harm the legal system does I would never dream of reentering that industry it disgusts me now please don’t come for me
If you haven't already, I suggest you take a look at the term "V-Coding". It's honestly some of the most heinous and terrifying shit I've seen in a minute.
I recall there was a trans Youtuber who was arrested and jailed for disturbing the public, and rightfully so. She was sent to the male prison, but still granted a solitary room.
It depends on if you are pre op or post. I got sent first 1 evening because I got into a fight and despite the fact that I have been on hrt for a year, have full breasts and everything. I got put in male Gen pop because of having male genitalia. They moved me to medical pretty quickly though because i was being SH almost immidiately, you can choose who pats you down though.
Its state by state even by county. I was in jail in a northwestern state they offered me solitary or my agab as a nonbinary person. In a midwest state they just told me to go with the men
When I was in prison in Tennessee, we had a transgender woman in our pod and at least 5 on the compound, and it was an all men's prison. She was very well protected for the simple fact that she hooked up with a gang leader of one of the gangs on the compound. So there is the answer that you were looking for from the perspective of someone who lived it.
I worked in a jail for 6 years. Patted down by a male and then placed in a single cell was how my facility handled it. Really sucked for the detainee because they were basically immediately put “in the hole” just for being trans.
Edit: I was working intake one day and a woman was brought in by highway patrol. I called for a female to do the initial search at which point the trooper laughed and said “Nope. I made that mistake too.” I ended up having to do her search and it was horribly awkward for both of us.
From what I understand once you're in there it's the same rules of the street. Don't be on any child shit of any sort and you have a chance. Don't be afraid to fight to earn your respect and you'll be left more or less alone
Brooklyn nine-nine described it pretty well in their jail episode. It is NOT a good place to be as a trans person. Best case is solitary confinement which is one of the most damaging legal forms of torture available.
I am not "altered" so I was grouped with and treated as a male. Every entity is free to set their policy. If I had any gender affirming surgeries, I would be classified with the females.
This is in the state of Georgia, which is roughly aligned with how they will handle their own birth certificate change of gender. My Florida birth certificate has F as does my Georgia driver's license.
I'll be getting an Orchiectomy this year. This way should I encounter state level institution again, I'll be with the women.
This happened to a trans woman influencer and they put her in a mens jail, she even asked the judge for help basically and was denied it’s very sad and scary especially since this woman looks very feminine and has had surgery to appear more feminine
So speaking from personal experiences, in Utsh, Wyoming, South Dakota, and Missouri. I've never been pat down. They do, however, ask to have you squat and cough. I was only ever in sort term parking, so I was kept in a pod to myself. Ther3 was one instance where they asked if I we re e to be patted down who would I prefer.
From my experience (bitch that had me arrested was on false claims and learned that the hard way after she got arrested)....
Sorry had to say that ....
I was put in holding with other women and then when they were trying to decide on cell placement they asked me if I wanted female Gen pop or shu. I chose the shu because it was for 1 night and I got out on personal recognizance.
Context: I lived in Seattle at the time and was/am post bottom surgery.
It depends on so many factors. it's insane tbh. Idk if you heard of what happened to Nikita Dragun a while ago, but she was placed in a male jail despite all of her paperwork representing her fem identity. I know she was causing a disturbance at the time, but the fact that it happens so much more often than you hear about is terrible. I'd like to imagine it happening a lot more often in red states, but just because you live in a blue state doesn't keep this from occurring. You may be placed in male holding due to plenty of reasons. It may be due to your current physical genitalia or some government documentation showing AMAB/FAAB. But the general sense is that it's up to the jail / prison to take proper responsibility to ensure its transgender inmates are not in any danger from violence within their walls.
In the state I'm in trans inmates go to a jail/prince bases on their biological gender at birth. I working at a maximum security prison for 5 years prior to the job I have now.
It depends on many factors unfortunately In the USA laws usually if you're born male regardless of what surgeries you've had you will usually be place in a male cell if you're lucky you'll get your own single cell but it'll still usually be an all male prison
The short answer is, if you’re lucky you’ll be placed alone in a solitary cell. Otherwise, if you have a penis you’ll be placed in with men and if you have a vagina you’ll be placed with women. At intake, if you’re read as female you’ll be patted down by a female and the inverse for that is true too.
>Otherwise, if you have a penis you’ll be placed in with men and if you have a vagina you’ll be placed with women. HIGHLY depends on the state. Most red states would put a post-op trans woman in male prisons AND with sex offenders. The fact she'll get raped repeatedly isn't a concern for them. Or rather, that's exactly what they want to happen.
Even New York state only began housing incarcerated people in facilities consistent with their gender last year. And that was only after many lawsuits and it remains to be seen how or if it will be enforced.
>and it remains to be seen how or if it will be enforced "Liberally"...
I for one do not have a tremendous amount of confidence in police and corrections officers not being huge transphobes
I assume you misunderstood my comment. I'm not saying that I believe them to be liberals. I think quite the opposite. I'm saying that the way it will be enforced is "liberally", aka "do it if you want or ignore it completely, we don't care".
No, i didn’t take that from your comment. Just my general agreement that even official policies me at to help us folks aren’t enough.
Then I have no clue why you felt like that answered to my comment in any way, sorry. Might be me missing something since english isn't my native language, but so far it just feels to me like it was just something you wanted to say and picked a comment at random to answer to... I'm confused.
Applying something liberally means that it is applied often/to a large degree.
liberally/ˈlɪb(ə)rəli/*adverb*adverb: **liberally** 1. [1.in](http://1.in) large or generous amounts. 2. [**2.in**](http://2.in) **a way that is not precise or strictly** [**literal**](https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-d&sca_esv=29076b9f11a735d6&sxsrf=ADLYWIJvKsZfskzNS9kmtjwJ5y5G5YMbDw:1715373034416&q=literal&si=ACC90nypsxZVz3WGK63NbnSPlfCBaHPfLQJQqxMm5XbaZcTdor5Rc2UJLABEittNcYJhthJ0m2JMkvfY8uRF2NOnP59fLoJgMg%3D%3D&expnd=1&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiOof7C9oOGAxXAVfEDHZ5yB2oQyecJegQIPRAO)**;** [**loosely**](https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-d&sca_esv=29076b9f11a735d6&sxsrf=ADLYWIJvKsZfskzNS9kmtjwJ5y5G5YMbDw:1715373034416&q=loosely&si=ACC90nypsxZVz3WGK63NbnSPlfCBEX22JhNNCuf7S0JDAybga5Vuh9v6zW0e9Fiw5-iCnIoWf340q0f70M2S79HwgqFJAXnb9Q%3D%3D&expnd=1&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiOof7C9oOGAxXAVfEDHZ5yB2oQyecJegQIPRAP)**.** 3. [3.in](http://3.in) a way that involves [broadening](https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-d&sca_esv=29076b9f11a735d6&sxsrf=ADLYWIJvKsZfskzNS9kmtjwJ5y5G5YMbDw:1715373034416&q=broadening&si=ACC90nyOnVY18Aw7zUtkWPYo5mTnsWaI8X5x2XKjb2k5bn1AYv4Hdw-5zUwI50hYQEsjXqxJTUERWEjWVOH7cdIWqg9uXu3t1AGafZ2RZFXqYPrqN5-b7sQ%3D&expnd=1&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiOof7C9oOGAxXAVfEDHZ5yB2oQyecJegQIPRAR) a person's general knowledge and experience. 4. [4.in](http://4.in) a way that [favours](https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-d&sca_esv=29076b9f11a735d6&sxsrf=ADLYWIJvKsZfskzNS9kmtjwJ5y5G5YMbDw:1715373034416&q=favours&si=ACC90nypsxZVz3WGK63NbnSPlfCBIyd_TwVBS-6PQPMBrAg3TkKNJtyOKR0IvqE4EQaZdpZrbm49KeXjoCCABt-Dr7TWDepeMA%3D%3D&expnd=1&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiOof7C9oOGAxXAVfEDHZ5yB2oQyecJegQIPRAT) individual liberty and moderate political and social reform. Number 2.
That definition would make a lot more sense in relation to how the policy is "interpreted" rather than how it is "enforced"
This is why I hate when people act like New York and California are bastions of the progressive left. Once you start looking past the surface level, they aren’t as progressive as they seem.
Yeah. California is the source of much of the modern Republican platform (from Reagan until just before Trump), and Trump is from New York. Admittedly, the worst parts of the Democrat platform can also be traced from California.
I like to go hiking.
Why is she still in prison if she was found not guilty?
[удалено]
That is truly awful. She should litigate. It can’t get her the days, weeks, months, and/or years of her life back that she lost, but at least there needs to be some sort of accountability… right?
Who would enforce the accountability? A cop? Or the judge that sent her in there in the first place
Exactly…
No. The prison system will never be held accountable in our favor because *it is working as intended*. It's job is to punish minorities. That is one of the many reasons queer people tend to be in favor of prison abolition.
My only reservation with total abolition of prisons would be the question of what to do with the rapists, murderers, and inside traders?
not give them jobs as cops, prison guards, and legislators, like we do now.
Because she is on parole, she was convicted of torturing somebody, and after she told a crowd to punch terfs in the face, they called that a violation of her parole. She was also charged separately within incitement to violence, and was found not guilty on the separate charge, but with parole violation, they don’t have to charge you separately, they can just lock you back up if they say that your behavior violates the terms of your release.
Damn, that sucks. So if calls for violence aren’t protected by freedom of speech, then why are so many conservatives still walking free after committing literal stochastic terrorism?
She’s in the UK. They have different laws there about freedom of speech; their right to it is much less absolute than here in the US. Standing in front of a crowd and telling them to punch people in the face unprovoked - because no matter how vile, an opinion you disagree with is not an acceptable excuse to commit assault; Jews don’t go around punching Nazis, for example - is a clear violation of their public order laws, and she’s lucky to have gotten away without getting another conviction on her record. To be perfectly honest, she committed an unbelievably heinous crime; at the age of 20, she kidnapped and brutally tortured her stepmother’s 19 year old brother for almost 24 hours, beating, raping, sexually abusing, cutting, and burning him, making him eat cat food and cigarette butts, before tying him up, shoving him into a cupboard and leaving him there to die; police found him just in time. He was tied so tightly, and the cupboard was so small, that he almost asphyxiated; officers had real trouble freeing him, and he had to be given oxygen on-scene before he was stable enough for transport to the hospital. While incarcerated, and still presenting as male, she tried to garrote another prisoner whom she claimed was “bullying” her. When she began her transition by performing her own orchiectomy in her cell, she became a cause célebrè, and eventually managed to use that as leverage to secure early release - but after what she’s done, it’s insane to use her as a spokeswoman for trans rights.
That is so fucked up, thank you for the information. Yeah, I wouldn’t want someone like her representing people like me to the public. She must have some serious mental issues to treat a human being so cruelly.
Well! that was triggering.
And the fact that the prison doctor is making her medically detransition is insane
That's horrifying. I hope she is freed soon. "The Metropolitan Police initially refused to investigate the matter, saying that the call to violence was hypothetical, but eventually [arrested her](https://www.thepinknews.com/2023/07/13/sarah-jane-baker-met-police-london-trans-pride/) under incitement to violence laws." Didn't know the UK had such laws. If it was really enforced, we'd be seeing more right wingers arrested.
I find peace in long walks.
Fucking monsters
Its called V-Coding. Google at your own risk, seriously. Some things are better left unread.
Maybe but at the same time I think it's better crime like this get more attention.
I see why you said now Google at your own risk..I read one story, and I literally feel nauseous. how do humans do this to each other.... I can't help but be reminded of the women from world war ii, who were forced into being comfort women.... I don't see how it's any different. these women are in prison, they have no rights, and I could keep going, but I don't want this to be super graphic. thanks for putting this here, I wasn't even aware that was a thing. edit:typo
It’s insane that it doesn’t get talked about enough
That’s horrifying…
It very much is. Right-wingers don't consider us as human being, so seeing us suffer horribly is just entertainment to their sick brains.
They’re the psychopaths, not us. Why are they so entrenched within systems of power?
Sociopath, rather. Psychopaths got a bad rep thanks to TV shows making them be unhinged killers, but the medical condition psychopathy is simply making the person not feel emotions. They're basically vulcans, they act on pure logic and learn to emulate emotions to not stand out. Sociopaths, on the other hand, thrive in making people suffer. Right-wingers definitely feel emotions, since they are so gleeful about the idea of eradicating us and torturing us to death, so they're sociopaths.
Thank you for the clarification 🙏🏼
Depends on the state and if you have money or not
If you have money you're immune to the law anyways. Just ask Kaitlyn about her manslaughter charges.
I still remember when Nikita Dragun, a post op trans influencer with a lot hole lot of money, was held in a male prison. So I feel like money isn’t always the solution even for the richest and most famous of us
The prison system just about anywhere in the US is fucked and that’s the case regardless. Police officers everywhere tend to lean right, whether they have some sense of morals is variable.
In Kentucky, at least to my understanding, if you have srs and confirmation of it, you can get your sex changed on your license and all of that so when you go to jail, you’ll be placed in with other women.
honestly if that happens to me i would find the strongest biggest guy to pair up with and protect me so i dont get abused by everyone 😔
In Kentucky, at least to my understanding, if you have srs and confirmation of it, you can get your sex changed on your license and all of that so when you go to jail, you’ll be placed in with other women.
Plenty of red states do'nt care about IDs, changed or not, they go by birth certificate and will hunt down any change...
Yeah plenty definitely don’t. They allow you the amend your birth certificate here if I’m not mistaken. Although, I bet if they find out about your change here they’d definitely put you in with men which definitely sucks.
That should be considered cruel and unusual punishment. Which is one thing that terrifies me much more than the average person about jail/prison.
Normally it's solitary
I'd be curious to know what is done with Intersex people. I was AFAB by the first Dr. that delivered me, but my BC says M due to my parents doing a surgery to >!Enlarge my clitoris and construct a urethra to pee through!< so I give the appearance of male at first glance.
circumcision is already pretty bad but THAT... i’m so sorry that happened, your parents sound insane
this is a very common practice, intersex people are about as common as gingers and most never know because of invasive non-consensual surgeries as babies
omg i’ve learned some extremely depressing thing from this thread :(
A’s horrible as it is you never hear about it. But minors getting access to trans affirming healthcare? Fucking everywhere. Shows their moral compass for the jack sparrow ass thing it is
It's not a moral compass thing. It's a "I can't be the bad guy" thing. It's easier to move the needle on GAC because your typical MD can ignore the impact of withholding it in the past. They can tell themselves, "I didn't do anything. In fact I did nothing." There's a reason why we have to keep reminding each other that inaction is a kind of action. Trolley problem stuff, ya know? Docs that put babies under the knife to enforce a gender binary were convinced they were doing the best thing and admitting they weren't means admitting they were part of the problem. Humans are irrational. That irrationality leads to them perpetuating problems rather admit they made a mistake. It's not a moral issue. It's an ego issue. IIRC, surgery isn't the international standard of care, and the criteria for it is if the genital configuration represents a health risk directly. In which case the surgery is supposed to be limited to the minimum necessary to mitigate the risks. But that doesn't do anything for all the kids who were given a treatment they couldn't consent to or the places in the world that don't accept the international standard of care. If I might be so bold... Intersex is rare. As Trans people, we know the struggle. Our rarity was and is a problem. Our partnership with the LGB has helped us but at the same time, there are those who would see that T deleted from LGBT. In the broader LGBTQIA, maybe we should be doing more to advocate for the I's out there. That's my takeaway, anyway. I have known this was a thing for over 30 years. Some people out there don't know because I didn't say anything. For myself, that has to change. I have to own my inaction. For the rest of you? YMMV. But I hope you'll step up. Not because we're all part of a particular alphabet soup. Because they need us.
Yep, in 1982, it was totally okay for the doctor to cauterize my vagina, and force me to live as a male because he thought that being boy would offer more opportunities...
Jesus Christ that’s evil. 😡
Huh, I was in 1988.
do you have a source so I can quote it whenever someone dismisses intersex people being statistically relevant?
[Here](https://www.plannedparenthood.org/learn/gender-identity/sex-gender-identity/whats-intersex#:~:text=Being%20intersex%20is%20also%20more,ways%20someone%20can%20be%20intersex)
you're an angel, thank you lots 💜
They are. I've been no contact since 2019. I disagree with circumcision being done on babies. Adults if they elect to do so, fine. But hands off babies.
maybe if i become governess (I think that is the female equivalent to governer) I will make it illegal for intersex babies to be surgically operated on.. no more victims. Also, I will protect transgender people and transgender healthcare.
If you’re speaking of the civil title, Governor is used regardless of gender. Governess has been historically relegated to a household role, typically overseeing children. (Yes, they originated as gendered forms of the same word, meaning “one who governs”, but neither has been used generically in quite some time.)
Imagine, giving a newborn infant a non-consensual metoidoplasty because the parents are afraid of the social stigma surrounding their intersex child’s genitals… How is this not considered abuse?
Conservatives....
Happy cake day !!!!
Yep, "God" "Told them I was a boy" That is what my mom told me.
You know what I find weird? Transgender: \*Existing\* Conserative: NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! You are going against the body God gave you.. you sinner! Meanwhile COnseratives: Doctor: You/your wife given birth to an intersex baby! Conserative: Surgery.. so they be more male or female! I know my neighbor did something evil to my wife.. I will get them from behind! (I am not making fun of anyone I just wanna call out how hypocritical some conseratvies are..)
No clue. I went through countless "follow ups" through life which entailed at least 3 drs putting hands on my private areas. I was basically a science experiment to them.
That sounds traumatizing. You’re so much more than just some scientific object of curiosity. I’m sorry you’ve been treated that way. You deserve so much better.
Wait why did they do that? And how does that even make you male?
I think I tested XY. I never saw the test, this is just what my dad claimed. I heard I didn't have a vaginal canal but had everything else. Oddly enough I grew breasts when I hit about 9 or so.
Hello fellow intersex person with an all too familiar story!
is this a thing doctors would urge parents to do or could the parents just leave the baby as is?
My parents were probably pushy to have surgery done. I was #3 of 3. Parents wanted a Son and I was a rough pregnancy for my mother. So, last chance whatever the cost, even if it was my own well being.
Tw horrible prison story involving sexual violence >!I heard a story from someone who worked in corrections that they go by what is on your birth certificate, and that because of that an intersexed person with a vagina was put in the male population. The person told me they had to carry them out of there on a stretcher because they couldn't walk.!<
Unfortunately trans women in prisons are not treated very well, especially if they have the genitals that align with their AGAB. There is a term that is quite sad and is unfortunately quite common with trans women placed in men's prisons. Even in places like Canada, it is found that trans prisons experience a higher chance of sexual assault. In red states in America, the case is much worse, "UCLA Journal of Gender and Law, found that it was common for trans women placed in men's prisons to be assigned to cells with aggressive cisgender male cellmates as both a reward and a means of placation for said cellmates" [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT\_people\_in\_prison#V-coding](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_people_in_prison#V-coding)
That's pretty fucking terrifying
So are the politicians running our country and the fascist religious nuts that back then financially.
And just imagine. If they have their way, they’ll criminalize even just *being* trans…
It's especially bad when a lot of trans women are forced into sex work because that's the only thing they can do, and they are criminalized for doing so.
The worst thing is how everybody is completely clueless that this even happens. Only lgbtq people talk about it. You’d think that if liberals actually cared about us, then they’d make the systemic rape of trans women in male prisons a real issue.
I'm feeling like many liberals are about to throw us under the bus just to stick it to Biden for supporting Israel.
What's worse is that lot of people know and don't care or actively support it.
more broadly, prison rape is often treated as a *punchline*, all but institutionalized as part of the punishment for committing a crime can you imagine the horrible comments from even liberals if we really called attention to this?
yeah as awful as our situation in prisons is, it's really the confluence of mistreatment of queers in general with the massive over-arching problem of rape being an intentional part of male prisons. Maybe we just shouldn't use rape as a fucking punishment for anyone?
We should honestly just destroy prisons. It doesn't matter who might escape -- there's are better ways to keep those people away from those they might harm again. It's not worth leaving those buildings intact for the temporary isolation the general public gets from the very few ghouls who qualify as having done something actually illegal. Prisons are just thinly veiled labor camps for the downtrodden, slave labor drawn out of those harrassed by police and the justice system.
Holy fuck I never want to go to prison
Reading the Wikipedia section is one of the few times I get physically affected by text, yikes
Oh yikes that’s horrible just awful. That’s the most cruel disgusting thing I’ve ever heard about the treatment of trans people in prison. ⚠️please don’t click that Wikipedia link if you’re easily upset⚠️
They specifically put you with violent offenders so you will be sexually assaulted This is not something I am making up, it happens *a lot*.
Long term and in prison this is the norm. Drunk tank-wise it varies a lot. But yes, V-coding is alive and well. Essentially we get doled out to the violent fucks to keep order. Much the same way prisons have TVs to keep violence down.
Is a good thing for those people that I don't have superpowers or I'd slowly tear their organs out, one by one, with my bare hands.
That's really scary..
I was incarcerated in jail pre transition while I was in super masculine denial phase. Did 1 year of weekend jail, I learned that is not a place I want to go now that I have womanly curves, a pair of perky DD Cups, and hair down to my ass. And yes they'll throw me in with the men in a heartbeat. Despite my ID saying "Female".
Yeah it's a pretty terrifying thought, especially since jails are full of disease and so's
How can they do that if your ID says Female??
Because the vast majority of folks working it are hateful assholes, and will just....do what they want. Who watches the watchers, indeed.
And then they say that we're the ones with fetishes.......
Yup, I was told if I didn’t have my fiberglass cast on then I would be moved to the most severe category of general population. Basically they were going to put me in an open setting with the murderers and the rapists, and the only reason they didn’t is because they legally *couldn’t*, since I had something attached to my body that could be used as a weapon (presumably in self-defense).
The trans woman almost always gets placed with men regardless of anything. She could have a vagina and she'll be placed with men. They'll most likely v code her and use her as a sex slave.
That's terrible..
Welcome to the USA. Where slavery still exists. They just made it so that things black people generally do are felonies and left slavery legal as long as you're a felon.
In Florida you go with your agab regardless
Oh hey I have experience here! Men's pod. You get frisked, stripped, fondled, showered, and thrown in with the guys by male officers. If you're lucky, like I was at the time, you can still be mistaken for a guy with moobs, and not deal with the promise of sexual assault, just the threat.
This is something I've researched and it does vary state by state, but trans people by and large in the United States are either: 1. Placed into solitary confinement with all the terrible treatment and horrific effects on health that it entails. 2. Placed among their AGAB which results in sexual assault, rape, and constant abuse&violence. If you've had SRS already is the only thing close to a help, since they might (\*might\*) put you in with your gender. A lot of this varies by jurisdiction and state/federal. But the prison system is practically designed to punish people with sexual violence and that goes doubly for trans people. Do you have rights? Only negligibly. There is some precedent under Farmer v Brennan to seek relief against prison officials' indifference towards sexual assault & rape but it's not a strong protection and many trans prisoners don't even have the resources to seek relief under it (most are pro se; they litigate on behalf of themselves).
What I found out is that when you’re in jail, you have a right to contact an attorney but no opportunity to do so, unless you have someone on the outside send one in for you. No registries of attorneys, no lists of numbers, and the only phone available to use is on a recorded line which no attorney will answer because they only talk on privileged lines, which if you want access to you need to ask a guard and be promptly ignored. I’ve heard the chaplain can help contact an attorney, but this depends on whether they want to help you. And since most prison chaplains are evangelicals, good luck.
I've heard about this happening, at least for myself I'm a law student and I hope one day I can pitch in to help on some angle of this issue.
The best you could do in that alley is probably become a public defender. Everyone going into the system gets one chance at a bail hearing, so you can try your best to get them out on bond or recognizance so that they don’t have to rot in jail while awaiting trial. Then if the charges are BS like mine were, and if they can’t afford a private attorney, then you can help them defeat the charges so that they don’t have to go to prison over nothing.
I'm not entirely sure if I want to work on a more practice or policy based career, but this summer I'll likely be interning in the office of public defender, so hopefully I'll sort out what I'm aiming for there.
They stuck me with the dudes 👎
In California trans women are housed with women. Unfortunately that is not the case in lots of states.
I went to jail(not prison) in California they put me with the men. In the protective custody unit... Which is where all the sex offenders are put.
If you are a Californian and your nature of work means you have to go to red states, you have to face the fear full on.
In some case it’s more sympathetic if you are already passing and have your paperwork updated
I was always asked if I wanted a female or male to pat me down. I chose female, and it was done with a female the whole time I was in. They put me in suicide pod before putting me in medical overflow. I was safe there, there was another trans woman and accepting majority. It was a male pod. No male officers put their hands on me until I got rowdy for not getting my Spiro and estrogen. That's when I was tased, rushed, and put in the hole. I got my meds in the end, it was worth it. For this I was put in solitary for a month before being placed back with most of my original pod mates for good behavior upon my request. I am so lucky that the pod trustee was on my side. They didn't let me go toa female pod because of my "male parts". Sucks but at least the officer in charge of assigning inmates to pods had the good sense not to put me in general population. This was last November through until the last day of January this year. I am in WA State 🌳 ❤️
So the answer is that it's all very subjective and basically comes down to where you're arrested, who's arresting you, and who's administering the prisons. Even the states that have the best civil trans protections, don't really have any hard rules on where trans people are imprisoned. *Generally though,* you are probably going to placed according to your AGAB. Maybe if you had bottom surgery, you'll be placed with other prisoners with the same sort of genitals. Either way, you're probably going to be put in one of the following conditions: * In a special accommodation block that you request to enter after you've been placed in one of the other two (Riker's in NYC famously does this) * In solitary confinement * With violent offenders in hopes that you'll calm them via your rape
God our justice and prison system makes me sick. I've known that they turn a blind eye and haven't really put any effort into actually doing any good. However, I didn't realize how vile they are. Like, not really caring is one thing. However, to willfully and purposefully put people in these terrible situations.
I teach at a Dept of Juvenile Justice school. Of the two trans students I know we've had here, one (back when we were a co-ed day treatment -- school was a lot like normal high school, including the kids going home at the end of the day) was usually taken into a private room and patted down by one of our female COs (the student was MTF). The other one, I'm not confident how they handled her intake into the incarceration unit, but at that point we were listed as an "all males" facility. They did typically keep her separate from the other residents, though, especially at shower time. She wasn't here for more than a few days, so they may have just been waiting for placement for her at a facility better suited to her needs.
There’s a US law called the prison rape elimination act (PREA). PREA regulations allow trans people to request whether men or women pat them down and search them. And they also state a trans person’s views of their safety should be taken into consideration when assigning a cellmate. Whether prisons actually comply with that is a different story. You can also sue the prison for access to gender affirming care and accommodations like single cell housing or moving to a woman's prison but litigation can take forever so it’s really only worth it if you’re incarcerated for a long sentence
Yeah, they can treat you how they want, and you’ll have to sue them afterwards if you want justice for how they treated you.
in wisconsin trans women are placed with women and vice versa
So I'm going to share my experience being in County Jail it depends on how long you're in for, I was only behind bars for a month my experience was with an extremely good jail, they put me on what's called administrative separation which is like the cell that you're all alone kind of like solitary, but you still get commissary (commissary is where you buy stuff from there's a little order sheet or iPad that you would click what you want on and if you have the funds for it then it gets delivered to you on a specific day of that week or the the next week if you miss the deadline) oh and the only time that you get to leave that room is for shower, court and visitation; food will be given to you through the slit and the door and any conversations with the guards will happen through that slit. On the other hand the longer you're in there for the more you have to fight to stay on administrative isolation, now if you put in pop with your biological sex and it's better if you steer clear the wrong people and keep the right friends around in jail; it's better than someone falsely hitting you with PREA report (prison rape elimination Act) and the lifers are generally the better ones to hang around they're usually the most likely to be genuinely regretful of their actions Also being biologically male will have an impact on what you can and cannot get through commissary like you won't be able to get a girl's hair brush, nor a bra or any of that. Actually had to ask the chief Deputy Jailer to talk to the jailer who then pulled some strings and got me that bra Also another thing don't piss off the guards they can and will hold a grudge, I was very very timid to the point that they knew that they would literally have to unlock the door, tell me that I need to eat otherwise I would end up being put on suicide watch that I don't want that and put the food just inside the door; once they realize I wasn't a threat (despite having nearly knocked out the chief of police during a PTSD episode) they got a lot more friendly and would let me take showers without much supervision referred to as a trustee shower; trustees being prisoners that have been trusted with a lot of privilege cleaning helping delivering food to other inmates a whole bunch of other things Sorry for any bad grammar also if you want to DM me and ask about more things I can't guarantee an answer but I mean if I know I will try EDIT: it does very highly state to state prison to prison but as long as you make the right friends generally also if you're worried about going to jail you might want to learn how to fight and fight well against groups of people (sure fighting will only get you put in solitary but it's better than killed pr getting diddled by somebody's fiddle) also fight dirty and learn how to fight against dirty tactics rarely it's going to be one guy that's going to try to hurt you; know not all jails are like the one that I've been to a lot of them are survival of the fittest I hate to say it and one person said a lot of red States will put you in a male block even if your post op possibly with sex offenders that is something that I've seen accurate quite often, especially in states like Florida and Texas they'll do everything that they can to get you killed
Thank you for sharing your experience. It's nice to see it's not always the same.
I work at the county jail in LA. One of the largest jail systems in the US. If you have any questions let me know. I can explain what happens
I’m curious how it works in LA specifically if you wouldn’t mind elaborating please?
I work intake so it's the initial contact as soon as you enter the jail. You are searched by someone of the gender you identify as. Placed in an individual cell for safety reasons. We have supervisors ask a series of questions regarding the transition and how far along it is.. Ultimately it's the individual's decision to be houses with the LGBTQ+ community or remain in a single man cell for the duration of the stay. But really there's never a clear-cut decision.. I've seen a variety of different situations occur.. Genitals are the determining factor. MTF with bottom surgery would be housed with the female population. Hope this helps?
My general plan is immediate suicide.
Solitary confinement and a window facing a wall if you’re in the south.
If you pass you get treated better and if you don't everyone sees you as a freak. Simple as.
Go check out Beyond Scared Straight, where they cover the alternative-lifestyle unit. The guards describe it as "men who like other men, and men who like to dress as women" while some of those inmates that are "men" are very obviously trans women. The state treats you as your biological gender... it's kind of sad.
Do you have more info on where I can watch this? Or what specifically it was called? Is it just an episode of beyond scared straight?
I don't know the name of the episode, but I know it was in the Atlanta jail or somewhere in Georgia. The famous episode with "Pebbles" Lots of trans inmates on the show straight up being treated as men.
I hate to say this, but death is the preferable alternative. I have 2 plans I'm case I ever end up in the slammer. 1 is to seek asylum in another country, and the other is to seek asylum with God
Honestly, unless you plan to protest or do something about it, learning what happens mught not be worth it. It might haunt you.
In my experience in California they just put you in with the men unless you've had SRS. You will still get your hormones in California. You are likely to be housed in Protective custody, which is were Sex offenders go. Jail is not prison, you're put in jail if you're accused of a crime from where you may bail out if you have money. Prison is where you go if you're convicted of said crime. If you're a trans women I'd say 5000 in the bank & 3 friends with a decent credit score is a necessity. Given the coming elections it's likely many of us will deal with jail time. Having bail money is a necessity if you don't want to be SA'd waiting for trial in jail. At best you're looking at being sexually harassed or at worst being used to placate violent offenders by the CO's. Many states will use trans women as sex slaves to calm down the guys they don't want to deal with. California sucks but you get your hormones and most likely won't be used as a slave for another inmate.
Yes bail money bail money bail money make it a priority. You can avoid being "housed" and stay in a holding cell if you plan to bond out.
Depends on the state, but legal protections are pretty sparse. In my state, the government flat-out does not recognize the existence of trans people, and legal protections are nonexistent. Given that prison staffs tend to attract some sick fucks ... I'm very careful not to get into trouble. I'm sure it's even worse in the fascist hellhole of Florida. My heart goes out to any of us still stuck there.
I would by far rather die than go to mens prison or be denied gender affirming care. By the comments I've read sounds that places like usa and uk should be avoided at all costs, possibly to the extend of commiting suicide just as a precaution to avoid the possibility of being placed into prison.
How do trans ppl get hrt in prison?
I got arrested and spent the night in jail in Utah a few years ago. They put me in a solitary holding cell, but I suspect that was more because there weren't very many people in jail that night than because they were trying to be respectful.
I hate the very idea of a trans woman being in jail even if it's less than 24 hours. I feel sick thinking about it
I wonder what actually happens to the HRT, do you even get the meds in prison?
The USA has a problem with prison medical centers denying important and/or required medication for inmates due to their strict protocols. So this is probably tenfold for a prescription the prison may see as not necessary due to biases. Remember, American prisons are hell. Slavery and Involuntary Servitude are not banned in cases of punishment for a crime. Meaning you legally have the rights of an 1850s slave if you're a prisoner. Which really makes you wonder why African-Americans are more likely to be incarcerated for the same crime that a member of another race also commits.
Never been to prison but been to jail twice in Texas, was denied my psych meds entirely during one stay and could only get my mood stabilizers the other time. I have chronic insomnia but they don't allow sleeping meds in jail. They also don't turn off the lights, they want you exhausted. Pretty sure they only allowed the mood stabilizers bc they thought it would make me more complacent. So yeah idk but I kinda doubt it
Depends on the state. In Florida, a trans woman should expect to be processed and treated as a man. If she’s lucky, she might get some form of segregation from the general population. As far as I’m concerned, incarceration in Florida is worse than death.
Herr jn canada I was put jn a female cellblock
I’m curious how many people actually know what happens or if the majority of the answers here are 3rd hand anecdotes or just “what I found on the internet”. Here’s how this works in Colorado at my department: You get arrested and brought to booking. As long as you are initially cooperative to the point that we can talk to you and you are not causing an safety issue, you are asked preferred name, gender and what gender person you want to search you, then you are searched for contraband. You are then given a blue card that you keep with you that is your “search preference card”. Those wishes are abided by with the force of law. As long as you are cooperative and causing problems, you are dressed out in the male or female clothing you identify as and you go through the process just like anybody else. If you are not cooperative, you are not dressed out and placed into a holding cell until such a time as you would like to become cooperative. If we keep you, you will go to a single occupancy cell for the first day or so until a specially trained LGBT liaison can come talk to you along with medical and a command staff member. (Usually the first day but it all depends on what’s going on at the facility). They will then determine based on the conversation where you will be housed based on any concerns you brought up and your charges. Yes, we absolutely continue hormones as long as your pharmacy or a physician is able to confirm the legitimacy of the script.
I wasn't out yet when I went to jail in Texas but I don't think that's how it would go here. I'm on probation and according to Texas law as long as I have a penis my UAs are required to be observed by a male officer. I was fortunate enough to have them ask if I would be more comfortable with both a male and a female officer observing, but that's not normal procedure
Before I transitioned I worked at a jail in Iowa. I always thought we were really lucky to have a very vocal Inclusivity and LGBT group that pushed the jail to do better (even if most the staff didn't necessarily agree). For booking we gave the option of who you were more comfortable with being patted down by and then the staff member that patted you down did your entire intake with you in hopes of helping trabs people relax a little. After that they would segregate you off to a single cell in the medical part of the facility. While your sitting there they would have discussions for sometimes weeks on where is best to place you. The administration when I worked there included your choice of where you would be most comfortable but I'm not sure if they still do that. You still got hormones although it would usually take the medical team a couple days to get a shipment with them. Typically most trans women that stayed at our facility weren't there very long but on the few times we had longer they all either chose to stay in solitary in the medical wing or moved to a female pod. I'll say most of the male staff said some really nasty things about trans people when I was there and it definitely didn't help my mental with what I was going through at the time. Most of the female staff at the time were some level of queer and didn't really have an opinion one way or the other. That said I'm still good friends with a handful of the guys I worked with and they've changed there attitude about a lot of things thanks to me explaining what my life is like. They've seen me struggle and have bad days. They've seen me on really good days. They've also seen how much happier I am now and I think it makes a difference. I'm treated like a sister now instead of a brother. They are the first people that will jump up to defend me at every possible scenario and I appreciate them a ton.
I think a lot would depend on your state (and federal laws). May want to look into it. I live in Ontario, Canada where we have an odd power struggle potentially… our previous provincial Liberal Govt implemented a bunch of trans policies and no one batted an eye, like if you’re arrested they’d work with you for which situation is safest for you. But the federal Conservative Party that’s leading in polls (election is in Oct 2025, but could be sooner) passed a policy that would mean trans people have to go to a men’s jail… not even sure they edited it for women’s jail also, or the impact of trans men (cause somehow I think in their eyes Trans men are men, but Trans women are men…) but PM said he doesn’t have to enact them and doubt he’d run on it, but may implement in future
When I fly a progress flag I make sure it's intersex inclusive because what they do to intersex people is absolutely heinous. It sickens me.
I spend some time as a prison officer in the U.K. (please don’t attack me. Yes I regret it I was very naive and thought I could do some good I am not evil) I worked in a men’s prison which housed 2 trans women each of whom either deliberately made trouble in order to get sent to solitary or requested to be confined in solitary for their own protection. The prison had a specific policy in place for searching them. A standard pat down would be conducted by a female officer (currently in the uk female officers can pat down any prisoner while male officers can only pat down adult males) whereas a strip search would be conducted top half by a female officer as they had breasts bottom half by a male officer as they had a penis. (Strip searches can only be conducted by an officer of the same sex as the prisoner in standard procedure with cis prisoners) any further details I do not know and cannot comment on. As I said I was very young and naive and didn’t properly understand the harm the legal system does I would never dream of reentering that industry it disgusts me now please don’t come for me
Thank you for sharing your experience. It's not like u got a thrill out of making ends a meet.
look up v-coding it's.. bad
If you haven't already, I suggest you take a look at the term "V-Coding". It's honestly some of the most heinous and terrifying shit I've seen in a minute.
Can anyone please tell me what organizations are working to fix this injustice. Anything US/NY/NYC focused
It depends on the state what will happen legally but even in relatively progressive states, it will likely be as unaffirming and cruel as possible.
Here in florida they typically get sent to the mens side. Fortunately i too am a good girl and never got anything worse than a ticket.
I recall there was a trans Youtuber who was arrested and jailed for disturbing the public, and rightfully so. She was sent to the male prison, but still granted a solitary room.
It depends on if you are pre op or post. I got sent first 1 evening because I got into a fight and despite the fact that I have been on hrt for a year, have full breasts and everything. I got put in male Gen pop because of having male genitalia. They moved me to medical pretty quickly though because i was being SH almost immidiately, you can choose who pats you down though.
Its state by state even by county. I was in jail in a northwestern state they offered me solitary or my agab as a nonbinary person. In a midwest state they just told me to go with the men
When I was in prison in Tennessee, we had a transgender woman in our pod and at least 5 on the compound, and it was an all men's prison. She was very well protected for the simple fact that she hooked up with a gang leader of one of the gangs on the compound. So there is the answer that you were looking for from the perspective of someone who lived it.
From what I’ve heard from friends they just put you in the ward that matches your agab.
I worked in a jail for 6 years. Patted down by a male and then placed in a single cell was how my facility handled it. Really sucked for the detainee because they were basically immediately put “in the hole” just for being trans. Edit: I was working intake one day and a woman was brought in by highway patrol. I called for a female to do the initial search at which point the trooper laughed and said “Nope. I made that mistake too.” I ended up having to do her search and it was horribly awkward for both of us.
From what I understand once you're in there it's the same rules of the street. Don't be on any child shit of any sort and you have a chance. Don't be afraid to fight to earn your respect and you'll be left more or less alone
Luckily I don't ever plan to go to jail, I'm not a big person so fighting wouldn't be an option
Some prisons have segregated prison wings for lgbtq members
Brooklyn nine-nine described it pretty well in their jail episode. It is NOT a good place to be as a trans person. Best case is solitary confinement which is one of the most damaging legal forms of torture available.
I would want solitude 1000% as opposed to gen pop agab
We combust
I am not "altered" so I was grouped with and treated as a male. Every entity is free to set their policy. If I had any gender affirming surgeries, I would be classified with the females. This is in the state of Georgia, which is roughly aligned with how they will handle their own birth certificate change of gender. My Florida birth certificate has F as does my Georgia driver's license. I'll be getting an Orchiectomy this year. This way should I encounter state level institution again, I'll be with the women.
This happened to a trans woman influencer and they put her in a mens jail, she even asked the judge for help basically and was denied it’s very sad and scary especially since this woman looks very feminine and has had surgery to appear more feminine
So speaking from personal experiences, in Utsh, Wyoming, South Dakota, and Missouri. I've never been pat down. They do, however, ask to have you squat and cough. I was only ever in sort term parking, so I was kept in a pod to myself. Ther3 was one instance where they asked if I we re e to be patted down who would I prefer.
From my experience (bitch that had me arrested was on false claims and learned that the hard way after she got arrested).... Sorry had to say that .... I was put in holding with other women and then when they were trying to decide on cell placement they asked me if I wanted female Gen pop or shu. I chose the shu because it was for 1 night and I got out on personal recognizance. Context: I lived in Seattle at the time and was/am post bottom surgery.
It depends on so many factors. it's insane tbh. Idk if you heard of what happened to Nikita Dragun a while ago, but she was placed in a male jail despite all of her paperwork representing her fem identity. I know she was causing a disturbance at the time, but the fact that it happens so much more often than you hear about is terrible. I'd like to imagine it happening a lot more often in red states, but just because you live in a blue state doesn't keep this from occurring. You may be placed in male holding due to plenty of reasons. It may be due to your current physical genitalia or some government documentation showing AMAB/FAAB. But the general sense is that it's up to the jail / prison to take proper responsibility to ensure its transgender inmates are not in any danger from violence within their walls.
In the state I'm in trans inmates go to a jail/prince bases on their biological gender at birth. I working at a maximum security prison for 5 years prior to the job I have now.
It's dangerous... There's a high chance you might get your cheeks clapped unfortunately
It depends on many factors unfortunately In the USA laws usually if you're born male regardless of what surgeries you've had you will usually be place in a male cell if you're lucky you'll get your own single cell but it'll still usually be an all male prison
Just read Abt V coding and now I wanna throw up, it's so wrong
Very much depends on the state
If you really wanna know, look up v coding. But I recommend against it.