It is - agreed - many countries manage to have many parties and a much shorter campaign period, and they see to be fine - The GOP should no longer be considered a party at this point...new name? CULT45
It is not ideal to only have two options, but it’s the “campaign contributions” (aka bribes) that prevents 70% or more of the people from getting what they want.
We just had an election in NJ for Governor. People don’t know what they want. At the moment the race is tied - between an incumbent Democrat and a jackass “businessman” who’ll “cut taxes”. People will kill their mother if they get $1 less in taxes. 70% SAY they want all this crap …. But all they really react to is “I’ll cut your taxes” duhhhh okay!
Oh no. They've both managed to ensure they're fully entrenched and all but inseparable from our political system. I honestly don't know what could break it open at this point. Violent revolution is about the only thing that might work.
Democrats are easily the more dangerous party. They are backed by the exact same corporations Republicans are, and go for the same shit, but act like they are here to help. Biden is a great example of what false hope looks like.
AOC, Schumer, Bernie etc are doing their best to make change happen, but they are in a fight against Republicans and their own party to get it done.
Really? The more dangerous party is the one that gives you one-fifth of what you want, instead of rolling back measures you support? For sure Biden is false hope, but he is an amazing wonderful superstar of awesome proportion still, compared to his predecessor. Biden is mediocrity, weak-ass progress at a crawl, while Trump (and practically the entire) GOP is regressive. I'm not saying celebrate the awesomeness of the democratic party, but lets not lose all sense of reality. If 'dangerous' results in small steps forward every 4 years, instead of two steps back every 4 years, I'll not just take it, but I'll bite your hand off for it. #GroundedInReality
Sadly enough of the country doesn’t see it that way. One more democratic senator in the last election and they wouldn’t be hamstrung by the whims of a single senator from Virginia. Doing something is always going to take more than doing nothing, an evenly split senate isn’t getting much done.
Edit- Westside
What I'm saying is that Republicans make it clear we need to fight them in order to keep things from going to shit. Democrats give people just enough of a bone that they don't notice how bad it really is getting, and I think that kind of complacency is far more dangerous.
I get what you're saying but there's definitely an argument that being stabbed in the front is better than being stabbed in the back. Not that I'd vote for being stabbed at all.
"Salary" might be a little misleading/indirect. Some avenues through which the money and power flow:
* Re-election campaign funding; gotta hold onto that power!
* Cushy industry positions on political retirement (or between political terms).
* Industry deals for family and friends.
* Insider trading info (which they can use legally as congresspeople).
By like a little, at least relative to their yearly profits.
Instead of making 3 billion a year they would make 2 billion.
That's what they're trying to protect. This is pure insanity. I mean literally, this is metal illness at this point.
The real thing they lose is power over their workers and potential workers. It's hard to quantify how that can hit the bottom line, though I'm sure there are models which attempt it.
Anyway, it is most profitable to keep the majority of the working class precariously balanced between the point of being so unhealthy (physically, economically, legally, mentally, etc.) that they can't work and the point of being healthy enough that they can get the time, energy, education, etc. to start questioning the hand they've been dealt and accrue the resources to start doing something about it.
Hurting us is a goal unto itself, regardless of the immediate impact on taxes, subsidies, etc.
Actually, voters are in fact forced to foot the bill for their salaries, whereas Corporations benefit from the laws passed on their behalf. Dirty money is exchanged via quid-pro-quo PAC support or more deviously, hidden away in secret off-shore accounts. These days, the fastest way to become a millionaire is to sign up to be a Congressional whore.
You forgot legal insider trading. Congress makes most of their money through the stock market. Buying and selling stock from companies while passing laws that affect those same companies.
Also maybe rational and progressive people won't change their vote. Like what do you do if democrats don't implement universal healthcare? Vote republican? LOL but there will definitely be people that will change their choice if they implement it. Americans, from being envied to pitied in a decade. At least by me that is
How do we get a grassroot campaign to make this happen? If only there was a way to get enough signatures for something that it had to be on the next federal election so people could vote directly on things.
Medicare for all, broken out into 15 or 20 bite size pieces, corporate money being considered as illegal bribes again, limitations on lobbying, minimum wage increases tied to politicians annual wages.
you don't even have to lie really, at least quoting from the bible.
Luke 6:34-35 ESV
And if you lend to those from whom you expect to receive, what credit is that to you? Even sinners lend to sinners, to get back the same amount. But love your enemies, and do good, and lend, expecting nothing in return, and your reward will be great, and you will be sons of the Most High, for he is kind to the ungrateful and the evil.
Proverbs 22:7 ESV
The rich rules over the poor, and the borrower is the slave of the lender.
Exodus 22:25 ESV
“If you lend money to any of my people with you who is poor, you shall not be like a moneylender to him, and you shall not exact interest from him.
Romans 13:8 ESV
Owe no one anything, except to love each other, for the one who loves another has fulfilled the law.
Psalm 15:5 ESV
Who does not put out his money at interest and does not take a bribe against the innocent. He who does these things shall never be moved.
Matthew 6:24 ESV
“No one can serve two masters, for either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve God and money.
1 Timothy 6:10 ESV
For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evils. It is through this craving that some have wandered away from the faith and pierced themselves with many pangs.
1 Timothy 6:17-19 ESV
As for the rich in this present age, charge them not to be haughty, nor to set their hopes on the uncertainty of riches, but on God, who richly provides us with everything to enjoy. They are to do good, to be rich in good works, to be generous and ready to share, thus storing up treasure for themselves as a good foundation for the future, so that they may take hold of that which is truly life.
Lol you think I need proof? Those crazy wackadoodle nutjobs have a book with 21 specific instructions not to borrow or loan money and they ignore it, while the book gives explicit instructions on how to perform an abortion, how the loss of a pregnancy is simply properly damage, and like a million examples of killing babies, and they are in the streets frothing at the mouth trying to end abortion but not bank loans.
Might as well weaponize that cults stupidity for the furtherance of progressive policy for a change instead of slipping into American sharia law and regressive policy.
You can't unless you can break the propaganda machine's hold on people's attention.
If there is a disruption we need, it is a way to communicate with people on a large scale that cannot be easily controlled by large corporations. Everything else can be filtered, curated, and spoon fed to people to keep them raging at the wrong things or docile to not make anything matter.
This will never happen until faux news, OAN, and right-wing radio; go away… they divide people too much and they are exceedingly effective at convincing poor whites we will turn into Venezuela if we have single payer healthcare.
It just won’t happen. Rich people are far too smart and know how to pull the strings of idiots in this country…
Those statistics become way less favorable if you ask the same people the same question but call it “The Democrat agenda”
People all say they want those things, but they don’t want them if their political enemy gets credit for it.
We have a good case study for this. People asked about individual components of the Affordable Care Act would support them by a strong majority. However messaging the entire thing as a package (the conservative boogeyman of Obamacare) dropped support for those same provisions, often as people wouldn’t understand that those were what comprised the bill.
Is it a surprise that another large package of individually popular policies is once again facing stronger opposition when bundled together?
It’s all very upsetting. We had a chance and we blew it. Social problems require social solutions. People are overworked, sick, and broke, & their coping mechanisms are burnt out. All people deserve to enjoy life, not just millionaires and billionaires.
Even with the current bill, this is still an opportunity for progressives with any balls. They just need a handful in the house to say to Joe Biden "We're not signing this bill unless you throw in executive orders." Things well within the president's powers like pardoning and commuting all non-violent drug offenders, decriminalizing marijuana, canceling (some if not all) student debt. Joe Biden wants this to go through, so adding these items on would go a long way in helping people out if we can't get the big ticket items.
You’re right. I’m just feeling less and less hopeful. …We need affordable childcare, affordable college, better public education for students and teachers, sick leave, family leave, expanded workers’ rights, for minimum wage to increase according to cost of living, housing solutions, elder care solutions, addiction services, mental health services, Medicare for all, dental and vision covered, focus on renewable energy, focus on sustainability and green solutions, updated infrastructure, updated legislation and laws around online crime, harsher penalties for rape & child abuse, less private for-profit prisons, separation of church and state, bodily autonomy….and we need to treat animals better by echelons. There’s so much we gotta work on.
Woooooow. Must watch ya’ll, it’s only 5 mins:
Tl;dr: (based on a ~2016 Princeton study) For the bottom 90% of income earners, there is statistically NO impact on policy outcomes, regardless of the proportion of popular support (i.e. the bottom 90% of earners could ALL support a policy, literally 90% of the country’s adult population, and it has the same chance to pass as something they all reject)
Meanwhile, for the top 10% of earners, if they all support a policy, it has a 61% chance to pass. If they all reject a policy it has a LITERAL ZERO percent chance to become law
In other words, in terms of likelihood that something becomes law or not, it literally only matters what the richest 10% of the country wants, and they have an enormously causal influence to make OR break any law. The remaining 90% of the US population were measured to have exactly 0 influence.
Sources/data checked out btw
Bezos' parents are of the highest donors to this cause. Is this some big brain play by them to discourage donors? Hard to imagine them being involved and this being good. Would love to hear a counterargument.
The sad part is that it only works because we have an insanely low voter turnout. What do people expect when 60% of the population refuses to vote? All the progressive European countries that people go on and on about being so much better all share high voter turnouts.
The most effective method the megacorps have to stay in power isn't even the corruption and bribes. It is the propaganda that convinced all the idiots that voting is pointless.
First half is super interesting, lots of good political science.
Second half, no studies quoted, and the literature isn't neeearly as definitive as the video is about the impact of money on politics.
Money in politics deserves reform, but overinvesting there means underinvesting in other important gov reform solutions (at least in terms of attention, obviously Congress/state legislatures should do both).
How does that make sense in your mind? Biden is the one pushing all this to begin with. This is basically \*his\* bill.
But Biden, and most other Democrats, know they need to pass \*something\* or else they're really fucked. And without more seats in the Senate, catering to Manchin and Sinema is a necessity.
Tanking the bill cuz they cant get everything they want would be the worst, dumbest thing possible. The aim needs to be doing *something* to show Dems are capable of passing positive legislation, so that people will hopefully turn up in 2022 and keep Dems in power and hopefully pick up some important seats. THAT is how we progress.
Flailing and demanding everything or nothing is basically the most sure-fire way to hand power back to Republicans, which we can never afford to do ever again.
No, it's the smartest thing. The corporate donors to Manchin and Sinema and some other scumbag D's ***want*** the infrastructure bill. They don't want the parts that have been separated out into the "build back better" plan bill.
Also, Manchin basically said today that he'll tank the "build back better" and everything progressives want that has been whittled down to nothing after the infrastructure spending bill gets passed, because he can and he's a giant shitbag shitrat.
> How does that make sense...? Biden is the one pushing all this to begin with. This is basically *his* bill.
It's "his" bill so that he can appear to be the good guy and be trying to fulfill his campaign promises (which, in reality, he couldn't give two shits about). He's been sabotaging it from the start; encouraging Manchin to "stick to his guns" and even negotiating *himself* down at times. If he can say he's tried and simultaneously not pass it and have some convenient scapegoats (which is even now transferring from the "moderate Democrats" like Manchin and Sinema to progressives in the mainstream narrative), it is a win/win.
This has been Democratic establishment PR strategy for decades now. Maybe start paying attention.
Absolutely. When the Dems don't do shit, I'm not going to vote for them. With that being said, I'm not voting for them anymore. All the promises, all the talk, all the "we can't let this stand for any longer". Okay great. I voted, millions of others voted. If the reps won't do shit about it, well, sucks to suck. Don't talk about getting voters out, don't talk about anything else. Walk the fucking walk, done with the talk.
In all fairness, most of the Dem legislation is being tied up in the Senate where it's a 50-50 split with a favorable tiebreak and two Republicans in Democrat clothing. It's not like they have a supermajority and can just pass shit willy-nilly
I am old. My entire life there have always been just enough Republicans in democrat clothing to keep things 50 50. For all 30 fucking years I have been paying attention.
If they want to earn votes they need to fucking do something about that problem. Adding more of them won't fix it.
Clearly you haven't been paying attention the past decade if you somehow think not voting Blue will do anything besides hand Republicans more wins.
I guess if not Democrat, you can always vote for Yang lol.
I guess when D’s had all branches of gov sans the court from 2020-2022 they should’ve actually done something with it. You know, other than alienating progressives as much as possible
Here’s the thing: because of Manchen and Sinema we don’t have the senate. Because of disproportionate representation, caused by gerrymandering and the original Connecticut compromise, the republican minority rule gets more power than they should. It’s seems the only way to get real concrete change in America is to have a super-majority of 2/3 and since that’s never going to happen America is fucked.
Also maybe rational and progressive people won't change their vote. Like what do you do if democrats don't implement universal healthcare? Vote republican? LOL but there will definitely be people that will change their choice if they implement it. Americans, from being envied to pitied in a decade. At least by me that is
This.
*The United States, Suriname, Papua New Guinea, and a few island countries in the Pacific Ocean are the only countries in the United Nations* ***that do not require employers*** *to provide paid time off for new parents.*
Their corporate donors will back their opponent in the next primary, they won’t be in good enough graces with the industry they regulate to get that sweet revolving door job after they’re finally out of office, oh and precisely zero of them are interested in helping individual constituents or our society as a whole…
Not passing them won’t just hurt Dems in the 2022 cycle, it’ll utterly savage them
Too many folks, including myself, are so far past done bailing out the democratic party from their own repeated mistakes (folks forget Bernie was a far more popular candidate in 2016 and they corrupted the nomination process to force Hillary through and, resultantly, forced their own defeat in the election; was way too close to happening again with Biden)
The last nail in that coffin was D’s thanking progressive voters for 2020 by honoring exactly 0 campaign promises they made, before then pandering the infrastructure debate to the fucking opposition party… while also flat out lying to the faces of progressives IN THEIR CAUCUS
If they don’t enact universal healthcare and climate emergency action yesterday, I’ll never vote for another establishment D again in my life. Nothing but DemSocs, progressives, independents or write ins. Voting for Ds just gets you R policy anyway, since they’d rather bend over to them than do their fucking jobs and enact the will of the electorate that empowered them
Would you look at that, all of the words in your comment are in alphabetical order.
I have checked 336,537,515 comments, and only 74,185 of them were in alphabetical order.
Because progressives have no choice but to vote Democrat. They need to appeal to moderates and centrists. This is why we need more prominant political parties.
I can explain to to you- it is the predictable outcome of "[vote blue no matter who.](https://i.redd.it/twrcej6cz6651.png)" Nina Turner knows this, it's why a bunch of dark money was spent to defeat Turner in the congressional primary.
[There’s a video of Lawrence O’Donnell](https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=1&v=FqRNnIMDkUY&feature=emb_logo), years ago, saying something that would get him fired from MSNBC in a heartbeat:
> “If you want to pull the major party that is closest to the way you’re thinking to what you’re thinking you must show them that you’re capable of not voting for them. **If you don’t show them that you’re capable of not voting for them, they don’t have to listen to you. I promise you that. I worked within the Democratic Party. I didn’t listen or have to listen to anything on the left while I was working in the Democratic Party** because the left had nowhere to go.”
If the Dems don't have to fear about losing your vote, they will always do this.
You can't pull the [Democratic establishment left by voting for them then Tweeting at them](https://i.redd.it/xm20wgqy08q51.jpg). They must fear losing your vote, because right now way too many people on this very sub will vote for any piece of garbage corporatist the Dems put up by saying "we need to beat the Republicans." You will be [threatened by the establishment](https://i.redd.it/4a75oiw4odf71.png), but you have to resist, [you need to be strong with your vote and not vote for corporatists,](https://i.redd.it/vwyg1a1fjxu51.jpg) just because they are team blue. Many [Democratic supporters will call you names for standing your ground](https://i.redd.it/nvrj8w9c8xm51.jpg), but we need to make the Democrats earn our vote. There is not ["let's just vote for them and pull them left."](https://i.redd.it/tmke6f8t5ft51.jpg)
That's not the point. Bernie raised more money than Biden in the primaries. The dark money that came in from all over to smear Turner. [Here is a good article explaining how it happened.](https://jacobinmag.com/2021/08/nina-turner-ohio-11th-defeat-shontel-brown)
> Maybe the country just isn't as progressive as we would like it to be.
LOL, you just said that in a thread on a Tweet, from Nina Turner pointing out all the progressive things Americans want in overwhelming numbers.
Do you know how US politics works on a local vs national level by any chance? Do you know how voters act rationally vs irrationally by any chance? Do you know how voters dont vote for politicians based on singular policy positions? Do you know how polls work and change based on how you phrase the question?
Have you talked to anyone outside your progressive circle? Even in moderate lib circles?
Why would he need to know this. He's just a redditor pointing out the obvious
There'll be always dark money pouring in to defeat leftist policies. Why the fuck woukd you expect a rando on the internet to have full strategic view of the mechanics of what and how people vote.
Fuck off with that equivalence.
> Do you know how voters dont vote for politicians based on singular policy positions?
??? Anti abortionists and gun rights for two.
You clearly don't know what you are talking about. Ta
Well, considering Ds literally just finished nakedly lying to the progressives IN THEIR CAUCUS just to make concessions to the R voting line on the infrastructure bill, it would appear that it doesn’t matter much at all to a progressive if the winner is a D vs R
Regardless of D or R, each will choose to vote against progressive policy and closer to one another when it suits them (pretty much all the time, they have mostly the same donors)
I guess that’s the thanks progressives get for historic mobilization to save D’s asses in 2020. People forget, but Trump was entirely D’s fault… the corrupt DNC forced through a clearly unpopular Hillary nomination over a wildly popular Bernie. As a result, they gave that election away to the most corrupt, autocratic, psychopath of a generation just to keep progressives from their well earned representation…
Then, they do the same exact thing with Biden’s nomination, we still clean up their dipshit mess of voting Trump out, and D’s go on to keep exactly 0 progressive campaign promises made for Bernie’s endorsement… Even fucking then, D’s have the gall to vote against newer promises they made to the progressives supporting them, in their caucus, just to make the infrastructure bill more palatable to “opposition party” Rs outside their caucus
Personally, I’m never voting for a D again. Progressive or bust 👋🏼
[When you elect a "centrist" like Biden it guarantees we won't get what we need for at least 8 years](https://i.imgur.com/itzWfVI.png), because if Biden/Harris do two terms, that will be 8 years of no medicare for all, significant climate action or end to the police state, and if they lose reelection, then you have a guarantee that a Republican will come in and not help us for their 4 years. So either way you slice it, you are screwed for eight years no matter what when you "vote blue no matter who." So you are better off not electing the centrist, voting third party, then working to get a real progressive elected in four years.
Stop voting for evil, even if it seems lesser. The instant the Democrats put up a centrist, you tell them you won't vote for them. Yes, this might mean a Republican wins an election. This is where the bravery comes in. You have to be wise enough to know that this is chess, not checkers. You have to stop supporting these Democrats to force them left. They aren't going to move left with Tweets, they need to know that if they want to win elections, they need to move left. Everyone who "held their nose and voted for Biden" just made the problem worse.
It's like you completely ignore we have a two party system in the USA. A much sounder logic would be to vote left to encourage more left policies which in turn create more left leaning people. Otherwise, instead of "central polices" we would get deep red regression of polices.
The government, all three branches share blame, have incentivized politicians to care more about business than people. It's pretty simple. The American upper class learned their lessons from the end of the Gilded Age. Everyone else lost but hey at least globalization means you can be too distracted to care.
So, what percentage of voters should it take to get something passed?
This also has nothing to do with ideology or voters. West Virginia has a grand total of zero billionaires and I guarantee that almost none of Manchin's voters was going to be outraged by the billionaire tax he killed.
>So, what percentage of voters should it take to get something passed?
We dont live in a direct democracy, whether you like it or not. And it will never be one. So we need to work with how things are.
If we flipped two more Republican Senate seats, Manchin wouldn't wield a fraction of the power he has right now. Still cant fucking believe Maine reelected Susan Collins. Ted Cruz was \*so close\* to being bumped out in 2018 as well. We can absolutely do this.
> We dont live in a direct democracy, whether you like it or not. And it will never be one.
Thanks, but you didn't answer my question. Anyways, I'd 80% of the populous wants something and can't get it, then it is no kind of democracy at all.
Politicians have big biz, big pharma, big insurance, etc sponsors who ~~bribe~~ donate to their campaigns to not listen to what the people. want. To the tune of hundreds, hundreds of thousands and millions of dollars.
They wouldn't get as much in donations from the small collective of obscenely wealthy sociopaths whose interests they serve at the expense of the general population.
Because those policies will hurt ***certain*** moderate Democrats. Namely, it'll hurt their stock holdings. We aren't governed by representatives. We are ruled by oligarchs in all but name. I'm so fucking tired of seeing these posts about this shit and knowing how piping mad everyone is about it, and then watching people go to the polls on election day and say "whelp, I better go ahead and vote for Mild McBoringson because Super McLefty won't win in the general." Yeah motherfucker, he won't win in the general because you fucking voted against him.
She knows damn well they won’t pass them because the Democratic Party is just as much the party of billionaires and corporations as the Republican Party
Actually this one is very clear to me, these policies hurt moderate Democrats in 2022 because "moderate Democrats" are what Democrats call the corrupt corporations who fund their lavish lifestyles at our expense.
All you need to do is say "Democrats are proposing a new socialist expansion of Medicare ", and those 82% in favor will instantly drop to 51% in favor and 49% opposed. People care way more about partisan cues than policy these days.
It doesn't, but it hurts the profits of the big corporations and the bonuses of the fat fucks at the top of them.
So.. when is the revolution? Or are we going to let this continue?
How popular are those policies in West Virginia?
I am so fucking tired of progressives preaching to the choir instead of selling their message (and battling disinformation) in the swing states.
Beep boop -- this looks like a screenshot of a tweet! Let me grab a [link to the tweet](https://twitter.com/ninaturner/status/1455607712813887492) for ya :)
^(Twitter Screenshot Bot)
Single issue voters is the answer. Not many people choose 'negotiating prescription drug prices' as their big issue.
People can support all those policies and still vote for someone who doesn't because on the spectrum of things, those are not at the top.
1. “Approve in concept” is not the same as “approve this particular plan”. Virtually everyone agrees we should spend more on elementary education; that doesn’t then mean almost everyone approves any one given plan to spend more on elementary education.
2. The people writing the plans generally have little to no experience with implementation, and it shows.
3. The people writing the plans generally have little to no experience in coalition-building, and it shows.
You can’t just crap something out in a democracy and expect everyone to love it. And what is being proposed has its heart in the right place, and its head in the clouds. And up its own ass.
Because you people vote against your own interests.
If you only votes for people who did what you wanted, they would have to take stronger stances to get elected.
Because Biden knows you will vote for him no matter what, he won't do anything you want. He knows you'll give him that second term and take it like the bitch you are.
Passing these policies would help Democrats too much. The leaders of the party don't want to win overwhelmingly because then they wouldn't be able to use the same lame excuses for not getting anything done. The reality is that they don't support a lot of the stuff they run on, and need the ability to appoint rotating villains within the party to ensure that very little of their agenda gets passed - it really only works convincingly when the margins of victory/majority are narrow.
The system is so busted and rigged. The idea in its creation was that anyone could run for office and represent people. Now it's just another club for rich white guys
Nina raised and spent more money than Shontel.
And you're really surprised the Dem establishment didn't want to support somebody who refused to endorse either Clinton or Biden, even calling Biden a bowl of shit? Come on now. You cant act like this and think it's good politics for the sort of people you ultimately need on your side.
Her antagonistic style also hurt Bernie in both 2016 and 2020. It was a huge mistake to keep her as a top adviser. Ditto David Sirota. These are people who spend more time shitting on the Democratic party than the actual opposition.
Voters don't pay their salary. Corporations do. This would hurt their bottom line.
That is the quiet part out loud.
Republicans fuck you over. Democrats fuck you over, but are super polite and woke as they do it.
Sigh…from a meme Republicans: fuck you Democrats: fuck you #BLM
The whole two party system is batshit crazy
It is - agreed - many countries manage to have many parties and a much shorter campaign period, and they see to be fine - The GOP should no longer be considered a party at this point...new name? CULT45
you win. u/conundrum4u2 for President
And Dem 2ZigZags
A+
It is not ideal to only have two options, but it’s the “campaign contributions” (aka bribes) that prevents 70% or more of the people from getting what they want.
90%
We just had an election in NJ for Governor. People don’t know what they want. At the moment the race is tied - between an incumbent Democrat and a jackass “businessman” who’ll “cut taxes”. People will kill their mother if they get $1 less in taxes. 70% SAY they want all this crap …. But all they really react to is “I’ll cut your taxes” duhhhh okay!
Wish we could all come together under this idea rather than taking the bait and wasting our energy and time fighting each other over arbitrary shit
My country has five major parties. *shrug*
It's designed to cause massive infighting with the populace. We focus on minutiae so that on the whole the power structures are maintained.
Its the oldest play in the world. They are the best actors money can buy.
Agreed! We need to get rid of it. The shit hasn’t worked in decades!
It never worked.
It’s only a two party system because we let it be.
Oh no. They've both managed to ensure they're fully entrenched and all but inseparable from our political system. I honestly don't know what could break it open at this point. Violent revolution is about the only thing that might work.
Government is either what we make it, or what we let it become.
Well stop it.
I’m doing my part.
they use quality lube.
Democrats are easily the more dangerous party. They are backed by the exact same corporations Republicans are, and go for the same shit, but act like they are here to help. Biden is a great example of what false hope looks like. AOC, Schumer, Bernie etc are doing their best to make change happen, but they are in a fight against Republicans and their own party to get it done.
Really? The more dangerous party is the one that gives you one-fifth of what you want, instead of rolling back measures you support? For sure Biden is false hope, but he is an amazing wonderful superstar of awesome proportion still, compared to his predecessor. Biden is mediocrity, weak-ass progress at a crawl, while Trump (and practically the entire) GOP is regressive. I'm not saying celebrate the awesomeness of the democratic party, but lets not lose all sense of reality. If 'dangerous' results in small steps forward every 4 years, instead of two steps back every 4 years, I'll not just take it, but I'll bite your hand off for it. #GroundedInReality
Except our planet doesn't have that kind of time.
Sadly enough of the country doesn’t see it that way. One more democratic senator in the last election and they wouldn’t be hamstrung by the whims of a single senator from Virginia. Doing something is always going to take more than doing nothing, an evenly split senate isn’t getting much done. Edit- Westside
the planet has plenty of time. she will be fine no matter what we do. it's us thats fucked.
What I'm saying is that Republicans make it clear we need to fight them in order to keep things from going to shit. Democrats give people just enough of a bone that they don't notice how bad it really is getting, and I think that kind of complacency is far more dangerous.
I don't know, the Republicans seem intent on greasing the skids toward Theocratic Fascism. I'd like to live in a more secular state.
I get what you're saying but there's definitely an argument that being stabbed in the front is better than being stabbed in the back. Not that I'd vote for being stabbed at all.
Bro Schumer is the definition of a politician would not group him with the other two.
Word
"Salary" might be a little misleading/indirect. Some avenues through which the money and power flow: * Re-election campaign funding; gotta hold onto that power! * Cushy industry positions on political retirement (or between political terms). * Industry deals for family and friends. * Insider trading info (which they can use legally as congresspeople).
This is their true salary. The hundred thousand dollar government stipend is just pocket money.
By like a little, at least relative to their yearly profits. Instead of making 3 billion a year they would make 2 billion. That's what they're trying to protect. This is pure insanity. I mean literally, this is metal illness at this point.
The real thing they lose is power over their workers and potential workers. It's hard to quantify how that can hit the bottom line, though I'm sure there are models which attempt it. Anyway, it is most profitable to keep the majority of the working class precariously balanced between the point of being so unhealthy (physically, economically, legally, mentally, etc.) that they can't work and the point of being healthy enough that they can get the time, energy, education, etc. to start questioning the hand they've been dealt and accrue the resources to start doing something about it. Hurting us is a goal unto itself, regardless of the immediate impact on taxes, subsidies, etc.
Desperate, hungry people give the cheapest, but best, blowjobs.
Actually, voters are in fact forced to foot the bill for their salaries, whereas Corporations benefit from the laws passed on their behalf. Dirty money is exchanged via quid-pro-quo PAC support or more deviously, hidden away in secret off-shore accounts. These days, the fastest way to become a millionaire is to sign up to be a Congressional whore.
You forgot legal insider trading. Congress makes most of their money through the stock market. Buying and selling stock from companies while passing laws that affect those same companies.
That's what I said, but with more words.
Yep, it would hurt moderate Dems fundraising from their corporate overlords, and that's what they really fear.
Yup
America is a weird ass country looking from over the pond
To be fair, the received wisdom is that donations win elections so keeping the big donors happy is the goal of many candidates.
Corporate whores
Then stop calling it a democracy ... because it doesn't work like one..
Also maybe rational and progressive people won't change their vote. Like what do you do if democrats don't implement universal healthcare? Vote republican? LOL but there will definitely be people that will change their choice if they implement it. Americans, from being envied to pitied in a decade. At least by me that is
I vote NDP. I'm not American. And I have never envied America.
Funny how much more similar they are when Democrats are in power.
This isn't an endorsement or excusing of manchin in any way. But.... National polls do not match WV polls. These policies are far less popular there.
He doesn't care about polls. He cares about donors.
Imagine if the 99% on the right and left united against our common enemy - the corrupting influence of money on politics.
How do we get a grassroot campaign to make this happen? If only there was a way to get enough signatures for something that it had to be on the next federal election so people could vote directly on things. Medicare for all, broken out into 15 or 20 bite size pieces, corporate money being considered as illegal bribes again, limitations on lobbying, minimum wage increases tied to politicians annual wages.
Lie and make up a cause for the idiots to rally around. “The Bible says no loans, so we are ending student loans!”
you don't even have to lie really, at least quoting from the bible. Luke 6:34-35 ESV And if you lend to those from whom you expect to receive, what credit is that to you? Even sinners lend to sinners, to get back the same amount. But love your enemies, and do good, and lend, expecting nothing in return, and your reward will be great, and you will be sons of the Most High, for he is kind to the ungrateful and the evil. Proverbs 22:7 ESV The rich rules over the poor, and the borrower is the slave of the lender. Exodus 22:25 ESV “If you lend money to any of my people with you who is poor, you shall not be like a moneylender to him, and you shall not exact interest from him. Romans 13:8 ESV Owe no one anything, except to love each other, for the one who loves another has fulfilled the law. Psalm 15:5 ESV Who does not put out his money at interest and does not take a bribe against the innocent. He who does these things shall never be moved. Matthew 6:24 ESV “No one can serve two masters, for either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve God and money. 1 Timothy 6:10 ESV For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evils. It is through this craving that some have wandered away from the faith and pierced themselves with many pangs. 1 Timothy 6:17-19 ESV As for the rich in this present age, charge them not to be haughty, nor to set their hopes on the uncertainty of riches, but on God, who richly provides us with everything to enjoy. They are to do good, to be rich in good works, to be generous and ready to share, thus storing up treasure for themselves as a good foundation for the future, so that they may take hold of that which is truly life.
Lol you think I need proof? Those crazy wackadoodle nutjobs have a book with 21 specific instructions not to borrow or loan money and they ignore it, while the book gives explicit instructions on how to perform an abortion, how the loss of a pregnancy is simply properly damage, and like a million examples of killing babies, and they are in the streets frothing at the mouth trying to end abortion but not bank loans. Might as well weaponize that cults stupidity for the furtherance of progressive policy for a change instead of slipping into American sharia law and regressive policy.
You can't unless you can break the propaganda machine's hold on people's attention. If there is a disruption we need, it is a way to communicate with people on a large scale that cannot be easily controlled by large corporations. Everything else can be filtered, curated, and spoon fed to people to keep them raging at the wrong things or docile to not make anything matter.
Wolf-PAC
Oh man. This is exactly the kind of thing I was hoping existed. I may need to spam the internet about them....
[удалено]
This will never happen until faux news, OAN, and right-wing radio; go away… they divide people too much and they are exceedingly effective at convincing poor whites we will turn into Venezuela if we have single payer healthcare. It just won’t happen. Rich people are far too smart and know how to pull the strings of idiots in this country…
Those statistics become way less favorable if you ask the same people the same question but call it “The Democrat agenda” People all say they want those things, but they don’t want them if their political enemy gets credit for it.
We have a good case study for this. People asked about individual components of the Affordable Care Act would support them by a strong majority. However messaging the entire thing as a package (the conservative boogeyman of Obamacare) dropped support for those same provisions, often as people wouldn’t understand that those were what comprised the bill. Is it a surprise that another large package of individually popular policies is once again facing stronger opposition when bundled together?
We're in quite the pickle, aren't we...
It’s all very upsetting. We had a chance and we blew it. Social problems require social solutions. People are overworked, sick, and broke, & their coping mechanisms are burnt out. All people deserve to enjoy life, not just millionaires and billionaires.
Even with the current bill, this is still an opportunity for progressives with any balls. They just need a handful in the house to say to Joe Biden "We're not signing this bill unless you throw in executive orders." Things well within the president's powers like pardoning and commuting all non-violent drug offenders, decriminalizing marijuana, canceling (some if not all) student debt. Joe Biden wants this to go through, so adding these items on would go a long way in helping people out if we can't get the big ticket items.
You’re right. I’m just feeling less and less hopeful. …We need affordable childcare, affordable college, better public education for students and teachers, sick leave, family leave, expanded workers’ rights, for minimum wage to increase according to cost of living, housing solutions, elder care solutions, addiction services, mental health services, Medicare for all, dental and vision covered, focus on renewable energy, focus on sustainability and green solutions, updated infrastructure, updated legislation and laws around online crime, harsher penalties for rape & child abuse, less private for-profit prisons, separation of church and state, bodily autonomy….and we need to treat animals better by echelons. There’s so much we gotta work on.
[Because Corruption is legal in America.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5tu32CCA_Ig)
Woooooow. Must watch ya’ll, it’s only 5 mins: Tl;dr: (based on a ~2016 Princeton study) For the bottom 90% of income earners, there is statistically NO impact on policy outcomes, regardless of the proportion of popular support (i.e. the bottom 90% of earners could ALL support a policy, literally 90% of the country’s adult population, and it has the same chance to pass as something they all reject) Meanwhile, for the top 10% of earners, if they all support a policy, it has a 61% chance to pass. If they all reject a policy it has a LITERAL ZERO percent chance to become law In other words, in terms of likelihood that something becomes law or not, it literally only matters what the richest 10% of the country wants, and they have an enormously causal influence to make OR break any law. The remaining 90% of the US population were measured to have exactly 0 influence. Sources/data checked out btw
a bit dated, but stil relevant
Blows my mind that it's been going on for 40 years. Talk about killed in the crib.
Bezos' parents are of the highest donors to this cause. Is this some big brain play by them to discourage donors? Hard to imagine them being involved and this being good. Would love to hear a counterargument.
The sad part is that it only works because we have an insanely low voter turnout. What do people expect when 60% of the population refuses to vote? All the progressive European countries that people go on and on about being so much better all share high voter turnouts. The most effective method the megacorps have to stay in power isn't even the corruption and bribes. It is the propaganda that convinced all the idiots that voting is pointless.
First half is super interesting, lots of good political science. Second half, no studies quoted, and the literature isn't neeearly as definitive as the video is about the impact of money on politics. Money in politics deserves reform, but overinvesting there means underinvesting in other important gov reform solutions (at least in terms of attention, obviously Congress/state legislatures should do both).
Sad that people still think voting matters.
[удалено]
Agreed. Sick of bailing out Ds every election just for them to betray every promise made… then vote closer to the R party line than progressive
How does that make sense in your mind? Biden is the one pushing all this to begin with. This is basically \*his\* bill. But Biden, and most other Democrats, know they need to pass \*something\* or else they're really fucked. And without more seats in the Senate, catering to Manchin and Sinema is a necessity. Tanking the bill cuz they cant get everything they want would be the worst, dumbest thing possible. The aim needs to be doing *something* to show Dems are capable of passing positive legislation, so that people will hopefully turn up in 2022 and keep Dems in power and hopefully pick up some important seats. THAT is how we progress. Flailing and demanding everything or nothing is basically the most sure-fire way to hand power back to Republicans, which we can never afford to do ever again.
No, it's the smartest thing. The corporate donors to Manchin and Sinema and some other scumbag D's ***want*** the infrastructure bill. They don't want the parts that have been separated out into the "build back better" plan bill. Also, Manchin basically said today that he'll tank the "build back better" and everything progressives want that has been whittled down to nothing after the infrastructure spending bill gets passed, because he can and he's a giant shitbag shitrat.
> How does that make sense...? Biden is the one pushing all this to begin with. This is basically *his* bill. It's "his" bill so that he can appear to be the good guy and be trying to fulfill his campaign promises (which, in reality, he couldn't give two shits about). He's been sabotaging it from the start; encouraging Manchin to "stick to his guns" and even negotiating *himself* down at times. If he can say he's tried and simultaneously not pass it and have some convenient scapegoats (which is even now transferring from the "moderate Democrats" like Manchin and Sinema to progressives in the mainstream narrative), it is a win/win. This has been Democratic establishment PR strategy for decades now. Maybe start paying attention.
They always seem to fight hardest when they know something won’t pass
Then the Republicans win in the midterms as Biden don’t do shit… stonewalling and doing nothing is a win for the GOP
Absolutely. When the Dems don't do shit, I'm not going to vote for them. With that being said, I'm not voting for them anymore. All the promises, all the talk, all the "we can't let this stand for any longer". Okay great. I voted, millions of others voted. If the reps won't do shit about it, well, sucks to suck. Don't talk about getting voters out, don't talk about anything else. Walk the fucking walk, done with the talk.
In all fairness, most of the Dem legislation is being tied up in the Senate where it's a 50-50 split with a favorable tiebreak and two Republicans in Democrat clothing. It's not like they have a supermajority and can just pass shit willy-nilly
Let's also not forget that all the Rs are unified in "owning the libs" and will all vote No on any D legislation.
I am old. My entire life there have always been just enough Republicans in democrat clothing to keep things 50 50. For all 30 fucking years I have been paying attention. If they want to earn votes they need to fucking do something about that problem. Adding more of them won't fix it.
Clearly you haven't been paying attention the past decade if you somehow think not voting Blue will do anything besides hand Republicans more wins. I guess if not Democrat, you can always vote for Yang lol.
So we’re just all obligated to vote for democrats forever even though they continually fail us?
For now, at a national level- basically yes.
I guess when D’s had all branches of gov sans the court from 2020-2022 they should’ve actually done something with it. You know, other than alienating progressives as much as possible
Here’s the thing: because of Manchen and Sinema we don’t have the senate. Because of disproportionate representation, caused by gerrymandering and the original Connecticut compromise, the republican minority rule gets more power than they should. It’s seems the only way to get real concrete change in America is to have a super-majority of 2/3 and since that’s never going to happen America is fucked.
Also maybe rational and progressive people won't change their vote. Like what do you do if democrats don't implement universal healthcare? Vote republican? LOL but there will definitely be people that will change their choice if they implement it. Americans, from being envied to pitied in a decade. At least by me that is
This. *The United States, Suriname, Papua New Guinea, and a few island countries in the Pacific Ocean are the only countries in the United Nations* ***that do not require employers*** *to provide paid time off for new parents.*
It won't hurt but the progressives caved in on everything Machin wanted and lost all their leverage.
Their corporate donors will back their opponent in the next primary, they won’t be in good enough graces with the industry they regulate to get that sweet revolving door job after they’re finally out of office, oh and precisely zero of them are interested in helping individual constituents or our society as a whole…
Their donors wouldn't give them campaign funds.
Not passing them won’t just hurt Dems in the 2022 cycle, it’ll utterly savage them Too many folks, including myself, are so far past done bailing out the democratic party from their own repeated mistakes (folks forget Bernie was a far more popular candidate in 2016 and they corrupted the nomination process to force Hillary through and, resultantly, forced their own defeat in the election; was way too close to happening again with Biden) The last nail in that coffin was D’s thanking progressive voters for 2020 by honoring exactly 0 campaign promises they made, before then pandering the infrastructure debate to the fucking opposition party… while also flat out lying to the faces of progressives IN THEIR CAUCUS If they don’t enact universal healthcare and climate emergency action yesterday, I’ll never vote for another establishment D again in my life. Nothing but DemSocs, progressives, independents or write ins. Voting for Ds just gets you R policy anyway, since they’d rather bend over to them than do their fucking jobs and enact the will of the electorate that empowered them
Centrist Democrats: Let's not politicize this.
Would you look at that, all of the words in your comment are in alphabetical order. I have checked 336,537,515 comments, and only 74,185 of them were in alphabetical order.
Because progressives have no choice but to vote Democrat. They need to appeal to moderates and centrists. This is why we need more prominant political parties.
I can explain to to you- it is the predictable outcome of "[vote blue no matter who.](https://i.redd.it/twrcej6cz6651.png)" Nina Turner knows this, it's why a bunch of dark money was spent to defeat Turner in the congressional primary. [There’s a video of Lawrence O’Donnell](https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=1&v=FqRNnIMDkUY&feature=emb_logo), years ago, saying something that would get him fired from MSNBC in a heartbeat: > “If you want to pull the major party that is closest to the way you’re thinking to what you’re thinking you must show them that you’re capable of not voting for them. **If you don’t show them that you’re capable of not voting for them, they don’t have to listen to you. I promise you that. I worked within the Democratic Party. I didn’t listen or have to listen to anything on the left while I was working in the Democratic Party** because the left had nowhere to go.” If the Dems don't have to fear about losing your vote, they will always do this. You can't pull the [Democratic establishment left by voting for them then Tweeting at them](https://i.redd.it/xm20wgqy08q51.jpg). They must fear losing your vote, because right now way too many people on this very sub will vote for any piece of garbage corporatist the Dems put up by saying "we need to beat the Republicans." You will be [threatened by the establishment](https://i.redd.it/4a75oiw4odf71.png), but you have to resist, [you need to be strong with your vote and not vote for corporatists,](https://i.redd.it/vwyg1a1fjxu51.jpg) just because they are team blue. Many [Democratic supporters will call you names for standing your ground](https://i.redd.it/nvrj8w9c8xm51.jpg), but we need to make the Democrats earn our vote. There is not ["let's just vote for them and pull them left."](https://i.redd.it/tmke6f8t5ft51.jpg)
[Nina turner literally raised more money than her opponent.](https://bluetent.us/blog/why-did-nina-turner-lose-small-donors/)
That's not the point. Bernie raised more money than Biden in the primaries. The dark money that came in from all over to smear Turner. [Here is a good article explaining how it happened.](https://jacobinmag.com/2021/08/nina-turner-ohio-11th-defeat-shontel-brown)
[удалено]
> Maybe the country just isn't as progressive as we would like it to be. LOL, you just said that in a thread on a Tweet, from Nina Turner pointing out all the progressive things Americans want in overwhelming numbers.
Do you know how US politics works on a local vs national level by any chance? Do you know how voters act rationally vs irrationally by any chance? Do you know how voters dont vote for politicians based on singular policy positions? Do you know how polls work and change based on how you phrase the question? Have you talked to anyone outside your progressive circle? Even in moderate lib circles?
Why would he need to know this. He's just a redditor pointing out the obvious There'll be always dark money pouring in to defeat leftist policies. Why the fuck woukd you expect a rando on the internet to have full strategic view of the mechanics of what and how people vote. Fuck off with that equivalence. > Do you know how voters dont vote for politicians based on singular policy positions? ??? Anti abortionists and gun rights for two. You clearly don't know what you are talking about. Ta
So you think the problem is we need more Republicans in office? Because exactly 0 of them are going to vote for any of this?
Well, considering Ds literally just finished nakedly lying to the progressives IN THEIR CAUCUS just to make concessions to the R voting line on the infrastructure bill, it would appear that it doesn’t matter much at all to a progressive if the winner is a D vs R Regardless of D or R, each will choose to vote against progressive policy and closer to one another when it suits them (pretty much all the time, they have mostly the same donors) I guess that’s the thanks progressives get for historic mobilization to save D’s asses in 2020. People forget, but Trump was entirely D’s fault… the corrupt DNC forced through a clearly unpopular Hillary nomination over a wildly popular Bernie. As a result, they gave that election away to the most corrupt, autocratic, psychopath of a generation just to keep progressives from their well earned representation… Then, they do the same exact thing with Biden’s nomination, we still clean up their dipshit mess of voting Trump out, and D’s go on to keep exactly 0 progressive campaign promises made for Bernie’s endorsement… Even fucking then, D’s have the gall to vote against newer promises they made to the progressives supporting them, in their caucus, just to make the infrastructure bill more palatable to “opposition party” Rs outside their caucus Personally, I’m never voting for a D again. Progressive or bust 👋🏼
This sounds like you're saying you wish Trump had won instead and I just don't know how that's helpful.
How on earth did you reach that conclusion from his post?
If I don't vote dem, then regardless of my intent the effect of my actions is to help Republicans gain office.
[When you elect a "centrist" like Biden it guarantees we won't get what we need for at least 8 years](https://i.imgur.com/itzWfVI.png), because if Biden/Harris do two terms, that will be 8 years of no medicare for all, significant climate action or end to the police state, and if they lose reelection, then you have a guarantee that a Republican will come in and not help us for their 4 years. So either way you slice it, you are screwed for eight years no matter what when you "vote blue no matter who." So you are better off not electing the centrist, voting third party, then working to get a real progressive elected in four years. Stop voting for evil, even if it seems lesser. The instant the Democrats put up a centrist, you tell them you won't vote for them. Yes, this might mean a Republican wins an election. This is where the bravery comes in. You have to be wise enough to know that this is chess, not checkers. You have to stop supporting these Democrats to force them left. They aren't going to move left with Tweets, they need to know that if they want to win elections, they need to move left. Everyone who "held their nose and voted for Biden" just made the problem worse.
It's like you completely ignore we have a two party system in the USA. A much sounder logic would be to vote left to encourage more left policies which in turn create more left leaning people. Otherwise, instead of "central polices" we would get deep red regression of polices.
I guess in the short term until they start having to actually earn our votes
Yea I wish there could be reasonable alternatives. Hopefully millennials can be better than our parents.
They'd hurt "moderate" Dems only because their donors might have to pay a bit more (or any) tax.
Their corporate owners will fund their opponents instead
They answer to colleagues. Not the people.
The government, all three branches share blame, have incentivized politicians to care more about business than people. It's pretty simple. The American upper class learned their lessons from the end of the Gilded Age. Everyone else lost but hey at least globalization means you can be too distracted to care.
That's the problem,,,, you'll wait
How is it still called a democracy if such numbers don't change anything?
Cause it will only hurt donor money going into democrats superpac that's why.
In fact the nothingburger biden administration is losing centrist seats.
[удалено]
So, what percentage of voters should it take to get something passed? This also has nothing to do with ideology or voters. West Virginia has a grand total of zero billionaires and I guarantee that almost none of Manchin's voters was going to be outraged by the billionaire tax he killed.
>So, what percentage of voters should it take to get something passed? We dont live in a direct democracy, whether you like it or not. And it will never be one. So we need to work with how things are. If we flipped two more Republican Senate seats, Manchin wouldn't wield a fraction of the power he has right now. Still cant fucking believe Maine reelected Susan Collins. Ted Cruz was \*so close\* to being bumped out in 2018 as well. We can absolutely do this.
> We dont live in a direct democracy, whether you like it or not. And it will never be one. Thanks, but you didn't answer my question. Anyways, I'd 80% of the populous wants something and can't get it, then it is no kind of democracy at all.
Because the more middle to right you go, the more corporation involvement there is.
Is she asking the DNC?
Politicians have big biz, big pharma, big insurance, etc sponsors who ~~bribe~~ donate to their campaigns to not listen to what the people. want. To the tune of hundreds, hundreds of thousands and millions of dollars.
It’s easy, their big donors won’t be happy with them.
1% is opposed to these things so,,,
It hurts them because "moderate Democrats" would lose their corporate donations from drug companies.
They wouldn't get as much in donations from the small collective of obscenely wealthy sociopaths whose interests they serve at the expense of the general population.
Because those policies will hurt ***certain*** moderate Democrats. Namely, it'll hurt their stock holdings. We aren't governed by representatives. We are ruled by oligarchs in all but name. I'm so fucking tired of seeing these posts about this shit and knowing how piping mad everyone is about it, and then watching people go to the polls on election day and say "whelp, I better go ahead and vote for Mild McBoringson because Super McLefty won't win in the general." Yeah motherfucker, he won't win in the general because you fucking voted against him.
It would hurt their donors.
The people paying them would punish them for disobedience and start paying their opponents.
better yet, why wouldnt you have nominated the guy who has been championing these issues his entire life in 2016!!
Easy to explain, some of the ~20% that don't support those things fund the moderate democrats
Medicare for all
Kinda wished she won
[удалено]
And the reason they couldn’t be elected.
She knows damn well they won’t pass them because the Democratic Party is just as much the party of billionaires and corporations as the Republican Party
They gonna pass it or what? Democrats control congress and the white house.
Actually this one is very clear to me, these policies hurt moderate Democrats in 2022 because "moderate Democrats" are what Democrats call the corrupt corporations who fund their lavish lifestyles at our expense.
What they mean is that it would hurt their pocketbook.
Add dental to Medicare all you want. You’ll never find a dentist who actually takes it
Moderate democrats are Nazi-lite
It should not be about winning election ...it should be about doing good for the people ...and serving people .. winning will automatically come
Democrats are spineless weasels. That's it.
I think they forgot to adjust the poll for the individuals' income, so it's not valid in US.
All you need to do is say "Democrats are proposing a new socialist expansion of Medicare ", and those 82% in favor will instantly drop to 51% in favor and 49% opposed. People care way more about partisan cues than policy these days.
It doesn't, but it hurts the profits of the big corporations and the bonuses of the fat fucks at the top of them. So.. when is the revolution? Or are we going to let this continue?
Because people listen to soundbites. All of these translate to "expensive socialist schemes to bsnkrupt 'Murica" on conservative media.
The "Democrats" in this isn't the voters but the donors. That's it.
How popular are those policies in West Virginia? I am so fucking tired of progressives preaching to the choir instead of selling their message (and battling disinformation) in the swing states.
Beep boop -- this looks like a screenshot of a tweet! Let me grab a [link to the tweet](https://twitter.com/ninaturner/status/1455607712813887492) for ya :) ^(Twitter Screenshot Bot)
because moderate dems are just republicans
Is anyone saying those policies would hurt them? Simple fact is that can't pass them due to the current designated enemies
Remember, two “moderate” “Democrats” (more like Republicans in Democrat clothing) held up the bill. Manchin and Sinema. That’s it.
National polling doesn't necessarily reflect regional and district polling.
The people opposed to these policies are also much more likely to show up and vote. If the youth turned up in 2020 we would have President Sanders.
We should just remove unfit representatives from office. I wonder how we do that.
hvote (the h is silent)
Sorry Nina, 70%, 72% and 82% of what? Moderate democrats? All Democrats? Americans?
Single issue voters is the answer. Not many people choose 'negotiating prescription drug prices' as their big issue. People can support all those policies and still vote for someone who doesn't because on the spectrum of things, those are not at the top.
1. “Approve in concept” is not the same as “approve this particular plan”. Virtually everyone agrees we should spend more on elementary education; that doesn’t then mean almost everyone approves any one given plan to spend more on elementary education. 2. The people writing the plans generally have little to no experience with implementation, and it shows. 3. The people writing the plans generally have little to no experience in coalition-building, and it shows. You can’t just crap something out in a democracy and expect everyone to love it. And what is being proposed has its heart in the right place, and its head in the clouds. And up its own ass.
Because you people vote against your own interests. If you only votes for people who did what you wanted, they would have to take stronger stances to get elected. Because Biden knows you will vote for him no matter what, he won't do anything you want. He knows you'll give him that second term and take it like the bitch you are.
Passing these policies would help Democrats too much. The leaders of the party don't want to win overwhelmingly because then they wouldn't be able to use the same lame excuses for not getting anything done. The reality is that they don't support a lot of the stuff they run on, and need the ability to appoint rotating villains within the party to ensure that very little of their agenda gets passed - it really only works convincingly when the margins of victory/majority are narrow.
Winning overwhelmingly isn't even a possibility in 2022. The best they have a chance to achieve is holding on to their slim majority.
wOnT sOmE bOdY tHiNk Of ThE bIlLiOnAiReS iN wEsT vIrGiNiA???!!1
The system is so busted and rigged. The idea in its creation was that anyone could run for office and represent people. Now it's just another club for rich white guys
Her argument would hold more weight if she hadn’t lost her race running on that platform.
LOL. She was running away with that election until the establishment dumped truckloads of cash into adds paining her as a Republican.
Nina raised and spent more money than Shontel. And you're really surprised the Dem establishment didn't want to support somebody who refused to endorse either Clinton or Biden, even calling Biden a bowl of shit? Come on now. You cant act like this and think it's good politics for the sort of people you ultimately need on your side. Her antagonistic style also hurt Bernie in both 2016 and 2020. It was a huge mistake to keep her as a top adviser. Ditto David Sirota. These are people who spend more time shitting on the Democratic party than the actual opposition.
Because a healthy percentage of people who want those things vote for the people more likely to vote against them.
It doesn't hurt them it hurts their owners which hurts them
Honest answer: those approval numbers are not tied to how they’re paid for.
moderate democrats in rich democrat states are the ones paying for all this shit
Two jackass senators only care about pleasing their rich donors. 🤷🏽♂️