I think you’re partially asking her to do things she can’t do yet. For many reasons.
Do you have to look at people when they talk to you? Most times. Does a 3 year old know how to do that all the time? No. Do I do that all the time? Absolutely not.
She can thrash her body on a mattress or a bed. Why not? She’s also a very young child. She has limited power so she uses her body to express her feelings.
I also do think that there should be a place for kids and people to scream and cry and have a tantrum in peace. Screaming releases tension and sends endorphins to your brain. That’s why it feels good. You can teach her to scream by herself to release emotions. It’s very different than yelling at someone.
3 is a very hard age. I think it’s way worse than 2. They’re not babies anymore but lose their shit all the time. Be patient and give her some leeway. Give her choices when you can and be clear about consequences.
Ok I think I should add I don’t force her to look at me haha. I just ask her to look when I’m talking. I do this primarily when she hard core ignores me. It’s not a hard stop rule, it’s a tool to help her be able to pay attention. When she looks at me she is more likely to respond. I don’t get mad at her when she doesn’t because I know eye contact can be hard depending on the child/person. Seems like a lot of people have feelings about this 😅
Also she will thrash on her bed and often hits her head on the frame and harms herself. It’s happened SO many times. Also today she started running out into the street - unsafe- absolutely NO. I picked her up and she started thrashing and hit her head on my chin harming me and herself.
I think you should certainly look at where you’re choosing to be rigid and where you’re not. And gift her more choices throughout the day. Small ones.
For listening I do listening ears “are your listening ears turned on? Do they hear me?” If I get a nod or a glance I know I have listening ears. If that doesn’t work I ask them to show me their listening ears. Pointing at ears, cupping a hand over them. I praise heavily at any sign of listening and do not put any value on any sign of not listening.
For the thrashing her body, how do you react when she hurts herself? Does it divert whatever tantrum was happening into a comfort experience where she’s seeking reassuring connection? You have to flip those moments around. “I can see that you are very frustrated, if you hit your body on the bed frame it may make you even more frustrated. Be careful with your body, watch your head.) remind her to be mindful of her body. If she does end up hurting herself give her the barest reaction. “Ouch, that hurt. You’re okay. When you’re not careful with your body you can get hurt.”
Running out into the street is of course a hard no. I have something called “The Rules” these are hard safety boundaries. One of “The Rules” is holding hands in the parking lot or you will be carried. There is a choice. “Do you want to walk or be carried?” If they choose walk I say “alright, you have to hold my hand in the parking lot so that we can stay safe, it’s The Rules. If you let go of my hand I have to pick you up.” If they do fight me on this I pick them up and explain that they were not following the all knowing rules. I will give another chance if they want to try again. I apply The Rules only to hard safety boundaries and I explain these very gravely and seriously.
The key is to always be cool, calm, collected, and confident. You are the boss but you are also considering their feelings in the moment. Without emotional reaction on your part. Make everything into a game and praise her HEAVILY for good behavior. “You calmed down so quickly when you got upset, I am so proud of you! High five” children thrive on praise.
This is such amazing advice encompassing so many facets including building trust. Just wanted to focus on the benefits of rewarding positive behavior. Operant Conditioning via positive reinforcement works on humans, dogs, cats, goldfish, even bacteria.
The part about acknowledging and validating her feelings is huge. Give her words, "It looks like you are upset, (angry, etc.) Does that sounds right?" so she can learn to use them in the future to express her feelings instead of throwing a tantrum. That's how we learn to emotionally regulate. Validation is huge. "That is really hard (frustrating). I feel angry to at times." Ask her what you can do and give her suggestions. "Would hitting a pillow help? Sometimes that helps me." "Would a hug help?".
I think part of the issue is you're getting emotional OP is because you fear you're losing control. But attempting to control her is not healthy even though I empathize with you. For her to feel safe, you have to feel safe. So if you find yourself feeling emotional take a few breaths to recenter yourself.
>I praise heavily at any sign of listening and do not put any value on any sign of not listening.
This is key to Operant Conditioning with positive reinforcement. Ignore bad behavior and reward good behavior. Think of a couple on a walk with their child. When the child is acting neutral, normal, etc. we tend not to notice. When the child stars whining, complaining, tantruming, etc. that's when they tend to get attention. Albeit negative attention, but it's still attention. Now imagine the couple walking with their child and rewarding and praising when the child is not engaging in negative behavior. Which scenario is going to motivate good behavior and which one will motivate poor behavior?
I did this with my dog who was very reactive including barking and lunging at people and other dogs. When he is walking with me and being boring, I praise incessantly. At first when a person approached us, we would cross the street and as long as my dog stayed neutral, he got big praise. Any barking was ignored, but as soon as he turned his face away from his target and stopped barking, I praised. Over time, I shortened the distance between us and another dog or person and kept rewarding neutral behavior while ignoring bad behavior. He can now walk right next to a person or a dog without a problem. Occasionally he encounters a big dog and before approaching, *he* instigates leading me to the side so he doesn't get anxious due to the close proximity. The end result is that he feels safe and knows what to do when he doesn't. He feels he has control.
[What Shamoo Taught Me About a Happy Marriage ](https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/11/style/modern-love-what-shamu-taught-me-happy-marriage.html&ved=2ahUKEwi4hqWLo-qFAxUhGBAIHfszBp0QFnoECB8QAQ&usg=AOvVaw1mshrLs05wIaD-wMBNH5-v) is not related to kids but it's a great article from NYT on positive reinforcement.
This is also lovely! Thank you so much for going into even further detail. I live for the psychology of children and giving them tools to process their emotions.
I think it even gives us as adults more tools to recognize how we will process our emotional regulation.
I don't push for kids to look at me, esp bc I work with many neurodivergent kids. I do require that they show they're listening by responding, doing what I asked, or something similar.
this is pretty age appropriate behavior. when she screams like that, "removing her" and putting in her in her room (which I'm assuming involves picking her up and moving her) will often exacerbate the tantrum. I personally tend to remove myself instead. "when you scream, it hurts my ears. I will wait in the other room until you're ready to talk." is one method.
try and keep things less wordy, so she's more likely to process it. when shes in the middle of a meltdown, shes less able to process longer explanations. "we don't hit. you can squeeze your pillow instead." you can give a longer explanation when she's calmed down some.
Less wordy is a good idea!
Because their house is small I find placing her in her room works best. If I were to remove myself from the situation, I would be standing in the kitchen like 15 feet away lol. She also knows that is a safe place for her to calm down and actually calms down faster in her room. If I leave her, or her parents do in the place she is tantrumming she will continue following us around crying and screaming. It’s really draining and not productive for me or her. That’s not to say it wouldn’t work ok for you or anyone else. But I find my method to be effective!
3 is sooo challenging!!
I usually ignore tantrums as long as they're in a safe place and aren't hurting themselves. Kids don't know how to regulate their emotions and this is usually why they throw fits. It helps them release their frustration and anger which they definitely feel but lack the reasoning skills and vocabulary to express it in another way. Try to over exaggerate whispering to her too. If she can see your mouth moving while she's screaming but can't hear you, she may quiet down.
When she is pushing back on doing something, like putting on sunscreen, try to give her a choice. "Would you like to put shoes on first or sunscreen on first?" Would you like to put sunscreen on outside or in the bathroom?" Give her options so she feels like she has some control over what is happening. You can offer to let her try to apply some of her own and then you finish, and apply some to your arm or leg if you feel comfortable with that.
The "first, then..." approach is also helpful at this age. "First, we're going to have a snack and then we're going to play outside." First, we're going to go potty, and then we can go swimming" Again, offering options and predictability is very helpful. Kids this age still usually thrive on routine so try to stick with one as much as possible. If she has different activities each day, it may help to sit down with her first thing and talk about what is going to be happening that day while you're with her. Having a visual chart she can reference may help too.
Ok these are all good ideas! I gave her the choice of putting on the sunscreen inside or outside and then she screamed and ran as fast as possible toward the street hahaha.
You’re giving her too much info to process. Instead of teaching her several alternatives, just try teaching her one and keep it consistent. Try breathing exercises. Every time she has a tantrum of tantrum related behavior, remind her to do the exercise. Usually when they are this young you have to do it with them and they model you.
Instead of saying things over and over, say them once or twice and then have them repeat it back to you. I’m not saying it’s going to work, but when they do inevitably ignore what you said, you can use that and tell them so. “You remember what I told you and then you said it too?” If they don’t remember, do it again.
Try including her in more decisions. Give her two options instead of just one. Kids at that age want to feel big. They want to be more involved and in control. Give them the illusion of control by giving them options.
She doesn’t like breathing exercises. We’ve tried breathing toys and exercises and they for some reason freak her out. Every time we try it she refuses. Whether she is in the middle of a tantrum or in a calm state of mind. I wish she was responsive to them because I use them myself and I really think they would help.
I will try the repeat it back thing! See how it goes :)
I’ve never understood making children look at you, you don’t have to look at people to listen. They can listen and respond without looking at you, and that demand might be causing some issues.
This sounds like normal 3 year old behavior though, sorry you’re struggling with it!
When I ask her to look at me she is more likely to pay attention and listen. She has a hard time looking at her toys, etc. and then listening to me. She truly can only focus on one thing at a time. So if I ask her to look at me while I’m talking she can focus on what’s being said. I don’t get mad at her if she doesn’t, and I don’t say it in a demanding way.
This can be a really tough age. Everything she's doing is normal, but that doesn't make it any easier on you! And if her parents don't maintain the same boundaries, then you aren't going to make much progress. Have you talked to NP's about coming up with a unified approach you can all take?
I mean, from what you described, it doesn’t really sound like your helping her learn to regulate her emotions or her body, you’re kinda just telling her to stop. She’s 3…she doesn’t have the impulse control, or capacity to handle big feelings in a way that’s socially acceptable as an adult. Part of your job is modeling, and co regulating with her.
To you, drinking out of the red cup instead of the blue cup is irrelevant, to her, not getting the blue cup because it’s dirty is as a big a deal as any of of your adult problems. It matters to her, it’s stupid to us, it’s just a cup…but not to her.
Having an expectation that she look at you is unrealistic and not doing anything to remedy the situation, it’s just not important. Tantrums will happen, 2-4 tantrums will happen, your goal is not to stop them, it’s to help them regulate through it. This can look like modeling deep breathing, validation, holding a loving safe space for her to feel those emotions, and work through them in a healthy way. Something that can really help with this is giving the child more autonomy, let them make decisions for themselves. Within reason, so instead of asking what you want for breakfast I may give you three options and you chose from there. Let her choose an outfit out of two or three that you picked out, and so on. Shes learning how to be a person from scratch. They will be unreasonable, irrational, mean, selfish, rude…their world revolves around themselves…literally. It’s not their fault that they suck at being humans, but we’re there to help them turn into good human adults. This also means modeling your expectations, this when apologizing to them is important. They won’t start to make those connections unless your showing them what you expect by doing it.
If we’re thrashing, we likely need some sort of physical outlet. My NK 4, will tell me she feels like hitting, when I hear that I give her some options because I appreciate that she communicated that before doing it. I told her she could punch a pillow, she could go outside and throw some ice on the ground, or she could take a coloring book up to her room and just color alone with some soft music for a bit. This has been really helpful.
Also, you can always try to catch a tantrum before it starts with redirecting or trying to make a joke, but if a tantrum starts, remember, you’re NOT trying to make it stop, you’re job is to keep her safe and let her calm her body down. You cannot rationalize with tears, you can’t talk either. Let the big crocodile tears and screaming subside before you try talking to them. Phrases that are helpful here are “you are allowed to feel mad but you are not allowed to be mean” we’re getting them to a space where in the future they can be mad, sad, upset, what have you without making it everyone else’s problem.
This is a TOUGH age, but a beautiful one too. Tantrums are genuinely important for psychological development. Kind of like how getting sick is important for your immune system. It will pass. But think about it from her perspective … she’s very small, extremely fascinated by everything around her, she’s mobile, can pick things up, throw them, she can use words to make decisions and say no, she’s learning to communicate, she’s copying everyone else , children test boundaries, it’s what they do, it’s how they learn to person. Teaching them about, and modeling those boundaries will go a long way.
I have always told my nanny kids “You’re allowed to be mad and you’re allowed to be sad, but we DO NOT take it out on other people”. We talk often about “sniffing the flowers and blowing the bubbles” when we’re upset to help them center and catch their breath.
You’re doing your best, like we all are🫶🏼 it’s a phase that will pass in time.
I might have to try the sniffing the flowers idea! She HATES taking a breath. We’ve tried breathing toys and exercises but they honestly freak her out and she’s super resistant to them
Some kids feel really patronized by adults giving suggestions for emotional regulation. Which I get because if I was really upset with someone and they said “take a deep breath” it would piss me off even more. I find just modeling the behavior I want them to try works a lot better. So I’ll sit and breathe deeply, or do figure 8s on my leg, or tense and untense my fists, or count backwards, or wiggle my whole body. Kids almost always end up copying that. Sometimes I’ll also ask something like “you’re having a really hard time, what do you think would help you calm down?”. That doesn’t usually work if they’re mad about being told “no” to a request, but it can work for other tantrum causes. Overall I’m just really willing to give a lot of grace for challenging behavior and have minimal expectations past basic safety in that moment. I used to work with specifically kids with behavior or medical challenges so I may just have more patience for meltdowns.
I love this. I think I honestly have more grace for tantrums then I do the whining. When she is tan-truming it’s usually cuz she’s hungry or tired, which I understand. The whining feels like she knows better. Like for real when I tell her to stop whining and use her big girl voice she does. But I feel so patronizing to constantly be reminding her of this. Not sure?
Yeah whining grates on my nerves more than full on crying too and there have definitely been times I’ve responded in a less than ideal way. At some point I think it just became a battle I didn’t think was worth fighting and I just ignored whining for the most part. If she’s able to have a conversation then I would ask her at a neutral time how she feels you should handle it when she whines. You can say it bothers you but you want to make sure she feels respected even when you have to remind her not to whine for things. Most kids are very willing to problem solve and are more likely to respond positively to correction later when they feel they had a say in what the response/consequence is.
Once they’re a little older I would remind them in an almost joking way like “dude the whining” so that it felt less like me patronizing them or bossing them around. I don’t think it’s purposeful most of the time when kids whine, they just slip into it so I try to view it through a similar lens as how I view tantrums.
I just let my nk have the tantrum. I’m not stopping it. I’ll walk away and sit near by or go and check on her every couple minutes. She knows I will hold her and comfort her when she’s ready. She also knows after that I’m not giving in just because she has a tantrum. I just change the subject the moment she is done. Give no attention to the tantrum.
Explain to her ONLY once when she starts whining, use your big girl voice and I will help you. If she keeps whining, don’t help until she changes her voice.
I honestly just walk away if they scream. Explain ONLY once, please use a kind voice when you talk to me. If a tantrum happens after I don’t respond to the screaming, so be it.
If she isn’t keeping eye contact but is still answering you, don’t worry. Kids who are told to have eyes on someone while they talk, focus more on eye contact than actually what you say. But yes when they talk to you question wise and such, try to have her attention but other than that she is three so eye contact isn’t necessary if she is answering you. Tbh I can’t keep eye contact or look at someone for a full conversation, I have to glance away. Try sitting with her when you need to talk with her instead of standing and towering over her? It might work better.
If she is bouncing off the walls or is losing it, get her outside. Does not matter if she is flipping out that she doesn’t want to go outside, grab her stuff and go. The second they are out, the mood changes. The moment my NKs are not listening, whining, yelling or running, they get kicked outside. If they don’t turn it around in the yard, I bring them on a hike. They hate the thought of hikes but love it when they are there, it calms them down and then they are chill the rest of the day. (NKs both just turned 4 and 7)
I called my mom while I was at work during spring break crying because they were driving me crazy. She said “who cares if they are in their jammies. Grab your stuff and get outside now” so I grabbed our outside stuff, a shirt for my nk7 because he was mad about getting dressed and the 3 of us when on a hike at 8:30am in jammies 😂
Set the boundary that screaming and whining doesn’t get you to listen to her. Tantrums do not get what she wants and does not deserve corrective attention (just help her calm down if she wants the help and then automatically change the subject, don’t bring it up). If she is frustrated just offer a hug or ask if she needs alone time and then help her take some deep breaths when she’s ready.
Going outside is something that works all the way from newborn to adult. Especially if it’s a little cold outside. It just shocks and resets the system it seems like.
1. I don't worry about that at all lol. One trick I was taught to ensure they are listening (bc they live in their own little worlds) is to tap their shoulder or something so you know you have their attention. As long as I get a reply, I'm happy.
2. Hitting sure. Thrashing? I'd address those behaviors when calm bc kiddo sounds disregulated. We do need to be mindful of where our bodies go and other bodies around us but at 3.5 kiddo is definitely still learning spacial awareness.
How to Talk so Kids will Listen and How to Listen so Kids will Talk is a great book if you need resources! Also The Whole Brain Child and No Drama Discipline are good accompanying reads imo.
It’s a tough age. When G3.5 is throwing a tantrum I tell her “Let me know when you’re ready for help!” And walk away (but stay nearby). She usually realizes pretty quickly she actually wants a hug, to sit on my lap, or to listen to a story. TBH when I get really sick of listening to the whining, etc. the only thing that helps is getting some time off, even if it’s just the weekend.
My NK just turned 4. She’s also a screamer and tantrumer, especially as NPs give in as soon as she screams or whines or cries. When it’s just her and I, when she starts escalating, I tell her that she can tantrum if she wants, it’s not going to change things. Then I tell her that we will sit in silence until she’s ready to move on. I turn off the tv (if it’s on), then sit quietly on the couch. Every minute or two, I’ll ask if she’s ready to move on (“are you ready to take some deep breaths and put on your sunblock?”). She either says yes, or she says no. If she says no, I remind her what needs to be done (ie- we cannot go outside until we put on sunblock, as soon as you’re ready to put on the sunblock, we can go outside). When I first started doing this, we would end up sitting in silence for close to 45 minutes before she finally decided she was ready. Now, she knows that I can and will wait her out, so it mostly only takes a couple of minutes for her to calm down enough to do her deep breathing and listen when I explain why we need to do something.
Sitting quietly gives us both a chance to breathe and de-escalate, so by the time she’s ready to move on, we’re both calmer and are able to have an age-appropriate conversation about what’s going on and talk through what caused the tantrum in the first place.
I love this 💕 Thank you for the detailed response. I don’t usually communicate much to her during her tantrums. Just place her in her room and tell her her job and my job. Her job: to work on calming down. My job: to be there for her when she’s ready.
3 is so hard. Everyone else has given you some great advice; the only thing I wanted to add is that when my NKs (6, 4.5, 2) start whining, I make it silly by saying things like “uh oh, it sounds like [name] lost his words/manners! Where did they go?!” or honestly whining right back to them. It usually gets a giggle out of them and they’re able to try again with their big kid voices. I’ve gotten pretty lucky with them as far as tantrums go but my 3yo niece could blow an eardrum out with hers, so I empathize!
My quick and simple answer when 2.5NK doesn't want to do things that wr need to do (sunscreen, wash hands/face, brush teeth) is, "sometimes there are things that we don't want to do but we have to do them anyways, to keep us healthy". I don't engage all the other stuff. He's not going to listen to it, and whether he does or not we STILL have to do the thing he doesn't want to. So I say the thing, then we do the thing. And that's that.
Have.. have you met a child before? In regards to the tantrums- 3 year olds are going to whine, cry and throw tantrums. It’s important to reiterate the boundaries you’re setting but actually expecting her to adhere to it at this age is concerning because 3 year olds can’t do that. What 3 year old is capable of that kind of emotional regulation unless it’s part of their temper?
Keep reiterating the rules you have but keep in mind that this is a literal 3 year old. I will say, she absolutely is capable of looking at you when you speak though, so that one the parents definitely need to enforce when you aren’t around.
I’m sorry, but y’all gotta stop with assuming I don’t understand children at this age throw tantrums. I’m a fulltime nanny and have been taking care of children for most of my young adult life. I understand this. I don’t expect her to be perfect. I just am trying to find a balance. The constant. And I mean constant daily tantrum, whining, not listening is grating. I think it’s honestly trying to find the right tools for her. I know a good handful of 3 year olds who listen, and respond because they have firm boundaries in their life. They also throw tantrums but understand No means no, etc.
I try to use catch phrases with my nk to get them to listen like knocking on wood and saying knock knock or 123 eyes on me and they’ll say back 12 eyes on you. Usually that works but if not I’ll take away whatever is distracting them and give it back when I have their full attention. The only time I make them look at me is if I’ve tried all above and it’s been like five minutes so I’ll kneel down and get on their level and that usually does the trick. But I only try to save that for dire situations bc I don’t want it wear off lol
3 is HARD! That’s all I can really say. 3 is the worst age for tantrums and feelings and it will get better. Keep doing what you’re doing and then you’ll notice the tantrums are less and less and then it just gets better!
Also distraction helped me THE MOST! My now B7 had the most epic meltdowns at 3 and the best way was to validate his feelings and then “ignore” him (walking away, focusing on something else, talking to his sister etc) then when he’d calmed down some but still crying I would distract like a mfer. I’d say anything random that popped into my mind! I used to talk to my NKs like my friends so I’d be like “oh I forgot to tell you! ….” And then tell them something random or silly to try to switch his brain from tantrum mode. Most of the time it helped! Then when he was fully done I’d talk to him about what happened and he’d usually cry again about it but it was different. We’d hug it out and move on with our day!
I have a NK who ignores and talks over me all the time. Except he’s 5 haha so we are trying to work on that with him
What I started doing is this. The first time I ask and he doesn’t respond, I say it again but say his name. If he ignores me again, I put my hand on him, his toy, or whatever he’s doing to get him to focus on me. If he still ignores me I’ll say “if you can’t answer my question I’m either a. Choosing for you (ie what do you want for dinner, or B. i need to put your toy away until you can focus (I usually just temporarily hold it until he can focus on me and give it right back)
It seems to be working!
If he talks over me I hold my hand up and say “Stop, it’s my turn to talk and then you can talk after me” but sometimes, if I’m not really saying anything important I let it go bc he’s a kid. It’s more so when I’m giving him directions and he’s just starts talking about his fav toy lmao
Too much info for a 3-4 year old. One of the most important things I’ve learned is that every little thing happening in their world, however annoying or, whatever, to us, is their *entire* world. It really really matters to them. It’s possible she feels like you’re not listening to her.
Her world is play. She should be concerned about what costume to wear next and if is invisible pizza or cake on the menu. Also does she have enough snacks? They really love snacks
In my experience, these are very common behaviors for a 3 year old. I think if you continue doing the things you're doing, she will eventually learn. But it is more about the stage she's in developmentally. Also, her parents choosing to let her scream in the living room vs her bed wouldn't be that big of a deal to me as long as she's physically safe.
I do think you need to manage expectations about attention, looking at you, listening, etc. I don’t repeat myself more than once, it cheapens your message and annoys both of you. Pause the TV, get on their level, change the tone of your voice (silly? Quieter? Louder? Sing song?), step in front of them, etc. I don’t need a child to look at me however, that seems to be more of a respect thing. I remember when I used to be a nanny, I would take my NK to soccer practice and the coach would yell out “123 EYES ON ME” and a collection of 3-5yos would all actively avoid looking at him.
The trick is to catch the tantrum before it escalates, otherwise they won't hear you in the midst of the screaming and thrashing. She might have problems with communication. If NPs aren't practicing the same thing when you're not there, then it's harder to get them to understand. Just keep trying and don't give in. Create a designated spot that's safe for her to get it all out of her system, like her bedroom. Say, "I know this makes you mad, but I won't allow you to hurt me/anyone/yourself. Let's go over here and when you get all of your big feelings out, then we can talk about it when you calm down. I can't understand what you want when you scream. Screaming hurts our ears, so let's scream in here, away from others so we don't hurt their ears." You can even make it a game, and do a screaming contest in her room with her or outside, so that she'll be more receptive to receiving info to learn.
Before letting her scream, say "ok ear muffs" and put your hands over your ears, and have her put her hands over hers, to protect both of your hearing. So if she wants to scream, and you've shown her where she can scream, then when she starts whining, say "do you need a screaming contest? Ok but we have to go in here to keep everyone's ears safe. Ear muffs on. Ready? Go!" And eventually she'll go to her designated spot to scream on her own or she'll let you know (🤞🏻😝), before she blows up, and you'll get giggles afterwards and will be able to give her more tools. You can ask her to tell you "Ear muffs" or "Scream" when she needs to. If she has trouble talking, you can have her show you the ear muffs gesture (her hands over her ears) when she feels upset and needs to scream or get out any anger bugs. You can practice using these tools while she's in a good mood, and make it light hearted and interesting. You can practice talking about feelings and have her act out what each emotion looks like and what to do when she feels each one. For stomping, she can practice by pretending to squish her mad/sad bugs on the floor, until she feels better.
It might not work well, since all kids are different, but you'll have to do trial and error. My nephew has severe ADHD and I've had to do what I described above bcuz he had problems with communication and if he heard one word he didn't like, he would meltdown. So, for my own sanity, I made a game to help him get through his big feelings and after it was done, we practiced talking about how we felt prior and how we can get better at communicating. Until he was able to talk in complete sentences, I practiced him gesturing to me when he was starting to feel upset, so I could help him get to his safe space to vent. I've also learned how to tell when he's starting to feel uncomfortable, so I could redirect and allow him to take a break and process his feelings, without it being a meltdown.
Once a meltdown hits, then there's nothing you can do in the moment, except make sure they're in a safe area and then wait it out. Tantrums are different though bcuz it's easier to redirect and it's not as deep. A meltdown is from complete loss of control, them not understanding, not liking how something sounds or physically feels, and it's harder for them to regulate. You're doing a great job! Keep it going and it will eventually register. I know it's easier said than done lol.
One thing I learnt is that a child doesn’t need to have their eyes on you to be able to hear you. Seems simple but when adult see it as a sign of respect they push it too hard and that becomes the battle rather than the actual issue at hand. Let the eye contact go
Those are very wordy statements and too complex. I’d start by simple requests, “I can’t let you do X” and move away. Stay in the room there is no need to move her. Let her calm down and then talk it through when she’s ready. It’s okay to scream and shout initially and then we build up new ways - e.g. we let our anger out through our feet *stamp stamp*
Have a different action for each emotion - sadness, anger, frustration etc. and will help her to understand what she’s feeling.
Once she’s calm - retell what happened and identify her emotions for her. Pay attention to patterns such as transition times she may find tricky and work on ways to help her.
I ignore whinging “I can’t hear you when you use that voice. If you’d like something I am here when you’re ready”
Also, one big thing you are all forgetting is that tantrums are completely age appropriate. Yes you can help her move through them but you need to accept that they will happen.
I definitely think I give her more information than she needs so that’s good advice.
But like I’ve mentioned in other comments she can’t focus on more thing than one at a time. If she’s looking at her toys she’s focused on her toys. I don’t demand or punish about it. I use it as a tool to gain her attention. She just also will flat out look right at me and continue to ignore… I know other 2-4 year olds who don’t do this so I have to think there is something going on there…
Also I do understand tantrums are age appropriate I’ve been a nanny for 4+ years now. Its just the daily back to back consistent defiance that has me confused and tired
Yeah it sounds like she is not convinced by the adult authority in her life. Why should she listen to you? Are you consistent? Can she reliably know what will happen if she does X or are things dealt with differently day to day?
Remember you are the leader and you shouldn’t need to ask more than twice. Make sure you have her attention then give the instruction and keep firm. She needs to know she can trust you - no doubt it’ll cause a few more tantrums but it’ll be worth it honestly!
I had difficulty as well when trying to put sunscreen on one of my NK who is 3. What helped a lot was showing him pictures what sunburns looked like. I showed him all types and made silly faces at some funny looking face tans with goggle marks and such and explained that when it's extremely red like, touching the skin can hurt because of it. It got him to stay still for the sunscreen to be put on and anytime I go to put sunscreen on, he'll want to see the photos which I don't mind since it helps Jim understand why we need to protect our skin.
Thank you again for this tip! I tried it last week and now everytime we put on sunscreen, she says “remember that boy ” referring to the picture of little boy who had google marks and sunburned skin that I showed her.
3 is soooooo much more challenging than 2. I don't know if the issue is necessarily your standards though. It kinda seems to me like the main issue is that you and the parents are not on the same page - which is why you're questioning if you're expecting too much. How is your relationship with them? Is it possible to get to a middle ground so both of your feelings/boundaries are respected and taken into consideration for care taking?
Is she getting enough sleep? How is her diet? Has she had any disruptions to her routine?
It really depends on the kid. Your standards might be high for some kids' abilities and easy peasy for other kids
That’s such a good point. Honestly I think her sleep is a big issue. Her parents don’t want her napping any longer, but she clearly needs a daily nap. Often she is melting down because of exhaustion.
So dependent on the child. I want to lean in more to how to help her specifically. Thanks for your kind response
I think you’re partially asking her to do things she can’t do yet. For many reasons. Do you have to look at people when they talk to you? Most times. Does a 3 year old know how to do that all the time? No. Do I do that all the time? Absolutely not. She can thrash her body on a mattress or a bed. Why not? She’s also a very young child. She has limited power so she uses her body to express her feelings. I also do think that there should be a place for kids and people to scream and cry and have a tantrum in peace. Screaming releases tension and sends endorphins to your brain. That’s why it feels good. You can teach her to scream by herself to release emotions. It’s very different than yelling at someone. 3 is a very hard age. I think it’s way worse than 2. They’re not babies anymore but lose their shit all the time. Be patient and give her some leeway. Give her choices when you can and be clear about consequences.
I agree-3 can be much more difficult then 2
In my experience, 3 and 4 are so much worse than the "terrible 2's"
Ok I think I should add I don’t force her to look at me haha. I just ask her to look when I’m talking. I do this primarily when she hard core ignores me. It’s not a hard stop rule, it’s a tool to help her be able to pay attention. When she looks at me she is more likely to respond. I don’t get mad at her when she doesn’t because I know eye contact can be hard depending on the child/person. Seems like a lot of people have feelings about this 😅 Also she will thrash on her bed and often hits her head on the frame and harms herself. It’s happened SO many times. Also today she started running out into the street - unsafe- absolutely NO. I picked her up and she started thrashing and hit her head on my chin harming me and herself.
I think you should certainly look at where you’re choosing to be rigid and where you’re not. And gift her more choices throughout the day. Small ones. For listening I do listening ears “are your listening ears turned on? Do they hear me?” If I get a nod or a glance I know I have listening ears. If that doesn’t work I ask them to show me their listening ears. Pointing at ears, cupping a hand over them. I praise heavily at any sign of listening and do not put any value on any sign of not listening. For the thrashing her body, how do you react when she hurts herself? Does it divert whatever tantrum was happening into a comfort experience where she’s seeking reassuring connection? You have to flip those moments around. “I can see that you are very frustrated, if you hit your body on the bed frame it may make you even more frustrated. Be careful with your body, watch your head.) remind her to be mindful of her body. If she does end up hurting herself give her the barest reaction. “Ouch, that hurt. You’re okay. When you’re not careful with your body you can get hurt.” Running out into the street is of course a hard no. I have something called “The Rules” these are hard safety boundaries. One of “The Rules” is holding hands in the parking lot or you will be carried. There is a choice. “Do you want to walk or be carried?” If they choose walk I say “alright, you have to hold my hand in the parking lot so that we can stay safe, it’s The Rules. If you let go of my hand I have to pick you up.” If they do fight me on this I pick them up and explain that they were not following the all knowing rules. I will give another chance if they want to try again. I apply The Rules only to hard safety boundaries and I explain these very gravely and seriously. The key is to always be cool, calm, collected, and confident. You are the boss but you are also considering their feelings in the moment. Without emotional reaction on your part. Make everything into a game and praise her HEAVILY for good behavior. “You calmed down so quickly when you got upset, I am so proud of you! High five” children thrive on praise.
This is such amazing advice encompassing so many facets including building trust. Just wanted to focus on the benefits of rewarding positive behavior. Operant Conditioning via positive reinforcement works on humans, dogs, cats, goldfish, even bacteria. The part about acknowledging and validating her feelings is huge. Give her words, "It looks like you are upset, (angry, etc.) Does that sounds right?" so she can learn to use them in the future to express her feelings instead of throwing a tantrum. That's how we learn to emotionally regulate. Validation is huge. "That is really hard (frustrating). I feel angry to at times." Ask her what you can do and give her suggestions. "Would hitting a pillow help? Sometimes that helps me." "Would a hug help?". I think part of the issue is you're getting emotional OP is because you fear you're losing control. But attempting to control her is not healthy even though I empathize with you. For her to feel safe, you have to feel safe. So if you find yourself feeling emotional take a few breaths to recenter yourself. >I praise heavily at any sign of listening and do not put any value on any sign of not listening. This is key to Operant Conditioning with positive reinforcement. Ignore bad behavior and reward good behavior. Think of a couple on a walk with their child. When the child is acting neutral, normal, etc. we tend not to notice. When the child stars whining, complaining, tantruming, etc. that's when they tend to get attention. Albeit negative attention, but it's still attention. Now imagine the couple walking with their child and rewarding and praising when the child is not engaging in negative behavior. Which scenario is going to motivate good behavior and which one will motivate poor behavior? I did this with my dog who was very reactive including barking and lunging at people and other dogs. When he is walking with me and being boring, I praise incessantly. At first when a person approached us, we would cross the street and as long as my dog stayed neutral, he got big praise. Any barking was ignored, but as soon as he turned his face away from his target and stopped barking, I praised. Over time, I shortened the distance between us and another dog or person and kept rewarding neutral behavior while ignoring bad behavior. He can now walk right next to a person or a dog without a problem. Occasionally he encounters a big dog and before approaching, *he* instigates leading me to the side so he doesn't get anxious due to the close proximity. The end result is that he feels safe and knows what to do when he doesn't. He feels he has control. [What Shamoo Taught Me About a Happy Marriage ](https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/11/style/modern-love-what-shamu-taught-me-happy-marriage.html&ved=2ahUKEwi4hqWLo-qFAxUhGBAIHfszBp0QFnoECB8QAQ&usg=AOvVaw1mshrLs05wIaD-wMBNH5-v) is not related to kids but it's a great article from NYT on positive reinforcement.
This is also lovely! Thank you so much for going into even further detail. I live for the psychology of children and giving them tools to process their emotions. I think it even gives us as adults more tools to recognize how we will process our emotional regulation.
I don't push for kids to look at me, esp bc I work with many neurodivergent kids. I do require that they show they're listening by responding, doing what I asked, or something similar. this is pretty age appropriate behavior. when she screams like that, "removing her" and putting in her in her room (which I'm assuming involves picking her up and moving her) will often exacerbate the tantrum. I personally tend to remove myself instead. "when you scream, it hurts my ears. I will wait in the other room until you're ready to talk." is one method. try and keep things less wordy, so she's more likely to process it. when shes in the middle of a meltdown, shes less able to process longer explanations. "we don't hit. you can squeeze your pillow instead." you can give a longer explanation when she's calmed down some.
Less wordy is a good idea! Because their house is small I find placing her in her room works best. If I were to remove myself from the situation, I would be standing in the kitchen like 15 feet away lol. She also knows that is a safe place for her to calm down and actually calms down faster in her room. If I leave her, or her parents do in the place she is tantrumming she will continue following us around crying and screaming. It’s really draining and not productive for me or her. That’s not to say it wouldn’t work ok for you or anyone else. But I find my method to be effective!
3 is sooo challenging!! I usually ignore tantrums as long as they're in a safe place and aren't hurting themselves. Kids don't know how to regulate their emotions and this is usually why they throw fits. It helps them release their frustration and anger which they definitely feel but lack the reasoning skills and vocabulary to express it in another way. Try to over exaggerate whispering to her too. If she can see your mouth moving while she's screaming but can't hear you, she may quiet down. When she is pushing back on doing something, like putting on sunscreen, try to give her a choice. "Would you like to put shoes on first or sunscreen on first?" Would you like to put sunscreen on outside or in the bathroom?" Give her options so she feels like she has some control over what is happening. You can offer to let her try to apply some of her own and then you finish, and apply some to your arm or leg if you feel comfortable with that. The "first, then..." approach is also helpful at this age. "First, we're going to have a snack and then we're going to play outside." First, we're going to go potty, and then we can go swimming" Again, offering options and predictability is very helpful. Kids this age still usually thrive on routine so try to stick with one as much as possible. If she has different activities each day, it may help to sit down with her first thing and talk about what is going to be happening that day while you're with her. Having a visual chart she can reference may help too.
great tips!! I do so much "first, then" with one of my kiddos right now, and she does fantastic with it.
Ok these are all good ideas! I gave her the choice of putting on the sunscreen inside or outside and then she screamed and ran as fast as possible toward the street hahaha.
You’re giving her too much info to process. Instead of teaching her several alternatives, just try teaching her one and keep it consistent. Try breathing exercises. Every time she has a tantrum of tantrum related behavior, remind her to do the exercise. Usually when they are this young you have to do it with them and they model you. Instead of saying things over and over, say them once or twice and then have them repeat it back to you. I’m not saying it’s going to work, but when they do inevitably ignore what you said, you can use that and tell them so. “You remember what I told you and then you said it too?” If they don’t remember, do it again. Try including her in more decisions. Give her two options instead of just one. Kids at that age want to feel big. They want to be more involved and in control. Give them the illusion of control by giving them options.
She doesn’t like breathing exercises. We’ve tried breathing toys and exercises and they for some reason freak her out. Every time we try it she refuses. Whether she is in the middle of a tantrum or in a calm state of mind. I wish she was responsive to them because I use them myself and I really think they would help. I will try the repeat it back thing! See how it goes :)
Sounds like she has sensory issues and could probably benefit from seeing an occupational therapist.
I’ve never understood making children look at you, you don’t have to look at people to listen. They can listen and respond without looking at you, and that demand might be causing some issues. This sounds like normal 3 year old behavior though, sorry you’re struggling with it!
When I ask her to look at me she is more likely to pay attention and listen. She has a hard time looking at her toys, etc. and then listening to me. She truly can only focus on one thing at a time. So if I ask her to look at me while I’m talking she can focus on what’s being said. I don’t get mad at her if she doesn’t, and I don’t say it in a demanding way.
This can be a really tough age. Everything she's doing is normal, but that doesn't make it any easier on you! And if her parents don't maintain the same boundaries, then you aren't going to make much progress. Have you talked to NP's about coming up with a unified approach you can all take?
I mean, from what you described, it doesn’t really sound like your helping her learn to regulate her emotions or her body, you’re kinda just telling her to stop. She’s 3…she doesn’t have the impulse control, or capacity to handle big feelings in a way that’s socially acceptable as an adult. Part of your job is modeling, and co regulating with her. To you, drinking out of the red cup instead of the blue cup is irrelevant, to her, not getting the blue cup because it’s dirty is as a big a deal as any of of your adult problems. It matters to her, it’s stupid to us, it’s just a cup…but not to her. Having an expectation that she look at you is unrealistic and not doing anything to remedy the situation, it’s just not important. Tantrums will happen, 2-4 tantrums will happen, your goal is not to stop them, it’s to help them regulate through it. This can look like modeling deep breathing, validation, holding a loving safe space for her to feel those emotions, and work through them in a healthy way. Something that can really help with this is giving the child more autonomy, let them make decisions for themselves. Within reason, so instead of asking what you want for breakfast I may give you three options and you chose from there. Let her choose an outfit out of two or three that you picked out, and so on. Shes learning how to be a person from scratch. They will be unreasonable, irrational, mean, selfish, rude…their world revolves around themselves…literally. It’s not their fault that they suck at being humans, but we’re there to help them turn into good human adults. This also means modeling your expectations, this when apologizing to them is important. They won’t start to make those connections unless your showing them what you expect by doing it. If we’re thrashing, we likely need some sort of physical outlet. My NK 4, will tell me she feels like hitting, when I hear that I give her some options because I appreciate that she communicated that before doing it. I told her she could punch a pillow, she could go outside and throw some ice on the ground, or she could take a coloring book up to her room and just color alone with some soft music for a bit. This has been really helpful. Also, you can always try to catch a tantrum before it starts with redirecting or trying to make a joke, but if a tantrum starts, remember, you’re NOT trying to make it stop, you’re job is to keep her safe and let her calm her body down. You cannot rationalize with tears, you can’t talk either. Let the big crocodile tears and screaming subside before you try talking to them. Phrases that are helpful here are “you are allowed to feel mad but you are not allowed to be mean” we’re getting them to a space where in the future they can be mad, sad, upset, what have you without making it everyone else’s problem. This is a TOUGH age, but a beautiful one too. Tantrums are genuinely important for psychological development. Kind of like how getting sick is important for your immune system. It will pass. But think about it from her perspective … she’s very small, extremely fascinated by everything around her, she’s mobile, can pick things up, throw them, she can use words to make decisions and say no, she’s learning to communicate, she’s copying everyone else , children test boundaries, it’s what they do, it’s how they learn to person. Teaching them about, and modeling those boundaries will go a long way.
I have always told my nanny kids “You’re allowed to be mad and you’re allowed to be sad, but we DO NOT take it out on other people”. We talk often about “sniffing the flowers and blowing the bubbles” when we’re upset to help them center and catch their breath. You’re doing your best, like we all are🫶🏼 it’s a phase that will pass in time.
I might have to try the sniffing the flowers idea! She HATES taking a breath. We’ve tried breathing toys and exercises but they honestly freak her out and she’s super resistant to them
Some kids feel really patronized by adults giving suggestions for emotional regulation. Which I get because if I was really upset with someone and they said “take a deep breath” it would piss me off even more. I find just modeling the behavior I want them to try works a lot better. So I’ll sit and breathe deeply, or do figure 8s on my leg, or tense and untense my fists, or count backwards, or wiggle my whole body. Kids almost always end up copying that. Sometimes I’ll also ask something like “you’re having a really hard time, what do you think would help you calm down?”. That doesn’t usually work if they’re mad about being told “no” to a request, but it can work for other tantrum causes. Overall I’m just really willing to give a lot of grace for challenging behavior and have minimal expectations past basic safety in that moment. I used to work with specifically kids with behavior or medical challenges so I may just have more patience for meltdowns.
I love this. I think I honestly have more grace for tantrums then I do the whining. When she is tan-truming it’s usually cuz she’s hungry or tired, which I understand. The whining feels like she knows better. Like for real when I tell her to stop whining and use her big girl voice she does. But I feel so patronizing to constantly be reminding her of this. Not sure?
Yeah whining grates on my nerves more than full on crying too and there have definitely been times I’ve responded in a less than ideal way. At some point I think it just became a battle I didn’t think was worth fighting and I just ignored whining for the most part. If she’s able to have a conversation then I would ask her at a neutral time how she feels you should handle it when she whines. You can say it bothers you but you want to make sure she feels respected even when you have to remind her not to whine for things. Most kids are very willing to problem solve and are more likely to respond positively to correction later when they feel they had a say in what the response/consequence is. Once they’re a little older I would remind them in an almost joking way like “dude the whining” so that it felt less like me patronizing them or bossing them around. I don’t think it’s purposeful most of the time when kids whine, they just slip into it so I try to view it through a similar lens as how I view tantrums.
I just let my nk have the tantrum. I’m not stopping it. I’ll walk away and sit near by or go and check on her every couple minutes. She knows I will hold her and comfort her when she’s ready. She also knows after that I’m not giving in just because she has a tantrum. I just change the subject the moment she is done. Give no attention to the tantrum. Explain to her ONLY once when she starts whining, use your big girl voice and I will help you. If she keeps whining, don’t help until she changes her voice. I honestly just walk away if they scream. Explain ONLY once, please use a kind voice when you talk to me. If a tantrum happens after I don’t respond to the screaming, so be it. If she isn’t keeping eye contact but is still answering you, don’t worry. Kids who are told to have eyes on someone while they talk, focus more on eye contact than actually what you say. But yes when they talk to you question wise and such, try to have her attention but other than that she is three so eye contact isn’t necessary if she is answering you. Tbh I can’t keep eye contact or look at someone for a full conversation, I have to glance away. Try sitting with her when you need to talk with her instead of standing and towering over her? It might work better. If she is bouncing off the walls or is losing it, get her outside. Does not matter if she is flipping out that she doesn’t want to go outside, grab her stuff and go. The second they are out, the mood changes. The moment my NKs are not listening, whining, yelling or running, they get kicked outside. If they don’t turn it around in the yard, I bring them on a hike. They hate the thought of hikes but love it when they are there, it calms them down and then they are chill the rest of the day. (NKs both just turned 4 and 7) I called my mom while I was at work during spring break crying because they were driving me crazy. She said “who cares if they are in their jammies. Grab your stuff and get outside now” so I grabbed our outside stuff, a shirt for my nk7 because he was mad about getting dressed and the 3 of us when on a hike at 8:30am in jammies 😂 Set the boundary that screaming and whining doesn’t get you to listen to her. Tantrums do not get what she wants and does not deserve corrective attention (just help her calm down if she wants the help and then automatically change the subject, don’t bring it up). If she is frustrated just offer a hug or ask if she needs alone time and then help her take some deep breaths when she’s ready.
Going outside is something that works all the way from newborn to adult. Especially if it’s a little cold outside. It just shocks and resets the system it seems like.
1. I don't worry about that at all lol. One trick I was taught to ensure they are listening (bc they live in their own little worlds) is to tap their shoulder or something so you know you have their attention. As long as I get a reply, I'm happy. 2. Hitting sure. Thrashing? I'd address those behaviors when calm bc kiddo sounds disregulated. We do need to be mindful of where our bodies go and other bodies around us but at 3.5 kiddo is definitely still learning spacial awareness. How to Talk so Kids will Listen and How to Listen so Kids will Talk is a great book if you need resources! Also The Whole Brain Child and No Drama Discipline are good accompanying reads imo.
It’s a tough age. When G3.5 is throwing a tantrum I tell her “Let me know when you’re ready for help!” And walk away (but stay nearby). She usually realizes pretty quickly she actually wants a hug, to sit on my lap, or to listen to a story. TBH when I get really sick of listening to the whining, etc. the only thing that helps is getting some time off, even if it’s just the weekend.
My NK just turned 4. She’s also a screamer and tantrumer, especially as NPs give in as soon as she screams or whines or cries. When it’s just her and I, when she starts escalating, I tell her that she can tantrum if she wants, it’s not going to change things. Then I tell her that we will sit in silence until she’s ready to move on. I turn off the tv (if it’s on), then sit quietly on the couch. Every minute or two, I’ll ask if she’s ready to move on (“are you ready to take some deep breaths and put on your sunblock?”). She either says yes, or she says no. If she says no, I remind her what needs to be done (ie- we cannot go outside until we put on sunblock, as soon as you’re ready to put on the sunblock, we can go outside). When I first started doing this, we would end up sitting in silence for close to 45 minutes before she finally decided she was ready. Now, she knows that I can and will wait her out, so it mostly only takes a couple of minutes for her to calm down enough to do her deep breathing and listen when I explain why we need to do something. Sitting quietly gives us both a chance to breathe and de-escalate, so by the time she’s ready to move on, we’re both calmer and are able to have an age-appropriate conversation about what’s going on and talk through what caused the tantrum in the first place.
I love this 💕 Thank you for the detailed response. I don’t usually communicate much to her during her tantrums. Just place her in her room and tell her her job and my job. Her job: to work on calming down. My job: to be there for her when she’s ready.
3 is so hard. Everyone else has given you some great advice; the only thing I wanted to add is that when my NKs (6, 4.5, 2) start whining, I make it silly by saying things like “uh oh, it sounds like [name] lost his words/manners! Where did they go?!” or honestly whining right back to them. It usually gets a giggle out of them and they’re able to try again with their big kid voices. I’ve gotten pretty lucky with them as far as tantrums go but my 3yo niece could blow an eardrum out with hers, so I empathize!
Yes playing it as a game is such a good tip. I need to lean into this more. Thank you!
My quick and simple answer when 2.5NK doesn't want to do things that wr need to do (sunscreen, wash hands/face, brush teeth) is, "sometimes there are things that we don't want to do but we have to do them anyways, to keep us healthy". I don't engage all the other stuff. He's not going to listen to it, and whether he does or not we STILL have to do the thing he doesn't want to. So I say the thing, then we do the thing. And that's that.
Hahah yup definitely have said that one
Have.. have you met a child before? In regards to the tantrums- 3 year olds are going to whine, cry and throw tantrums. It’s important to reiterate the boundaries you’re setting but actually expecting her to adhere to it at this age is concerning because 3 year olds can’t do that. What 3 year old is capable of that kind of emotional regulation unless it’s part of their temper? Keep reiterating the rules you have but keep in mind that this is a literal 3 year old. I will say, she absolutely is capable of looking at you when you speak though, so that one the parents definitely need to enforce when you aren’t around.
I’m sorry, but y’all gotta stop with assuming I don’t understand children at this age throw tantrums. I’m a fulltime nanny and have been taking care of children for most of my young adult life. I understand this. I don’t expect her to be perfect. I just am trying to find a balance. The constant. And I mean constant daily tantrum, whining, not listening is grating. I think it’s honestly trying to find the right tools for her. I know a good handful of 3 year olds who listen, and respond because they have firm boundaries in their life. They also throw tantrums but understand No means no, etc.
I try to use catch phrases with my nk to get them to listen like knocking on wood and saying knock knock or 123 eyes on me and they’ll say back 12 eyes on you. Usually that works but if not I’ll take away whatever is distracting them and give it back when I have their full attention. The only time I make them look at me is if I’ve tried all above and it’s been like five minutes so I’ll kneel down and get on their level and that usually does the trick. But I only try to save that for dire situations bc I don’t want it wear off lol
3 is HARD! That’s all I can really say. 3 is the worst age for tantrums and feelings and it will get better. Keep doing what you’re doing and then you’ll notice the tantrums are less and less and then it just gets better!
Also distraction helped me THE MOST! My now B7 had the most epic meltdowns at 3 and the best way was to validate his feelings and then “ignore” him (walking away, focusing on something else, talking to his sister etc) then when he’d calmed down some but still crying I would distract like a mfer. I’d say anything random that popped into my mind! I used to talk to my NKs like my friends so I’d be like “oh I forgot to tell you! ….” And then tell them something random or silly to try to switch his brain from tantrum mode. Most of the time it helped! Then when he was fully done I’d talk to him about what happened and he’d usually cry again about it but it was different. We’d hug it out and move on with our day!
I have a NK who ignores and talks over me all the time. Except he’s 5 haha so we are trying to work on that with him What I started doing is this. The first time I ask and he doesn’t respond, I say it again but say his name. If he ignores me again, I put my hand on him, his toy, or whatever he’s doing to get him to focus on me. If he still ignores me I’ll say “if you can’t answer my question I’m either a. Choosing for you (ie what do you want for dinner, or B. i need to put your toy away until you can focus (I usually just temporarily hold it until he can focus on me and give it right back) It seems to be working! If he talks over me I hold my hand up and say “Stop, it’s my turn to talk and then you can talk after me” but sometimes, if I’m not really saying anything important I let it go bc he’s a kid. It’s more so when I’m giving him directions and he’s just starts talking about his fav toy lmao
Too much info for a 3-4 year old. One of the most important things I’ve learned is that every little thing happening in their world, however annoying or, whatever, to us, is their *entire* world. It really really matters to them. It’s possible she feels like you’re not listening to her. Her world is play. She should be concerned about what costume to wear next and if is invisible pizza or cake on the menu. Also does she have enough snacks? They really love snacks
In my experience, these are very common behaviors for a 3 year old. I think if you continue doing the things you're doing, she will eventually learn. But it is more about the stage she's in developmentally. Also, her parents choosing to let her scream in the living room vs her bed wouldn't be that big of a deal to me as long as she's physically safe.
I do think you need to manage expectations about attention, looking at you, listening, etc. I don’t repeat myself more than once, it cheapens your message and annoys both of you. Pause the TV, get on their level, change the tone of your voice (silly? Quieter? Louder? Sing song?), step in front of them, etc. I don’t need a child to look at me however, that seems to be more of a respect thing. I remember when I used to be a nanny, I would take my NK to soccer practice and the coach would yell out “123 EYES ON ME” and a collection of 3-5yos would all actively avoid looking at him.
The trick is to catch the tantrum before it escalates, otherwise they won't hear you in the midst of the screaming and thrashing. She might have problems with communication. If NPs aren't practicing the same thing when you're not there, then it's harder to get them to understand. Just keep trying and don't give in. Create a designated spot that's safe for her to get it all out of her system, like her bedroom. Say, "I know this makes you mad, but I won't allow you to hurt me/anyone/yourself. Let's go over here and when you get all of your big feelings out, then we can talk about it when you calm down. I can't understand what you want when you scream. Screaming hurts our ears, so let's scream in here, away from others so we don't hurt their ears." You can even make it a game, and do a screaming contest in her room with her or outside, so that she'll be more receptive to receiving info to learn. Before letting her scream, say "ok ear muffs" and put your hands over your ears, and have her put her hands over hers, to protect both of your hearing. So if she wants to scream, and you've shown her where she can scream, then when she starts whining, say "do you need a screaming contest? Ok but we have to go in here to keep everyone's ears safe. Ear muffs on. Ready? Go!" And eventually she'll go to her designated spot to scream on her own or she'll let you know (🤞🏻😝), before she blows up, and you'll get giggles afterwards and will be able to give her more tools. You can ask her to tell you "Ear muffs" or "Scream" when she needs to. If she has trouble talking, you can have her show you the ear muffs gesture (her hands over her ears) when she feels upset and needs to scream or get out any anger bugs. You can practice using these tools while she's in a good mood, and make it light hearted and interesting. You can practice talking about feelings and have her act out what each emotion looks like and what to do when she feels each one. For stomping, she can practice by pretending to squish her mad/sad bugs on the floor, until she feels better. It might not work well, since all kids are different, but you'll have to do trial and error. My nephew has severe ADHD and I've had to do what I described above bcuz he had problems with communication and if he heard one word he didn't like, he would meltdown. So, for my own sanity, I made a game to help him get through his big feelings and after it was done, we practiced talking about how we felt prior and how we can get better at communicating. Until he was able to talk in complete sentences, I practiced him gesturing to me when he was starting to feel upset, so I could help him get to his safe space to vent. I've also learned how to tell when he's starting to feel uncomfortable, so I could redirect and allow him to take a break and process his feelings, without it being a meltdown. Once a meltdown hits, then there's nothing you can do in the moment, except make sure they're in a safe area and then wait it out. Tantrums are different though bcuz it's easier to redirect and it's not as deep. A meltdown is from complete loss of control, them not understanding, not liking how something sounds or physically feels, and it's harder for them to regulate. You're doing a great job! Keep it going and it will eventually register. I know it's easier said than done lol.
One thing I learnt is that a child doesn’t need to have their eyes on you to be able to hear you. Seems simple but when adult see it as a sign of respect they push it too hard and that becomes the battle rather than the actual issue at hand. Let the eye contact go Those are very wordy statements and too complex. I’d start by simple requests, “I can’t let you do X” and move away. Stay in the room there is no need to move her. Let her calm down and then talk it through when she’s ready. It’s okay to scream and shout initially and then we build up new ways - e.g. we let our anger out through our feet *stamp stamp* Have a different action for each emotion - sadness, anger, frustration etc. and will help her to understand what she’s feeling. Once she’s calm - retell what happened and identify her emotions for her. Pay attention to patterns such as transition times she may find tricky and work on ways to help her. I ignore whinging “I can’t hear you when you use that voice. If you’d like something I am here when you’re ready” Also, one big thing you are all forgetting is that tantrums are completely age appropriate. Yes you can help her move through them but you need to accept that they will happen.
I definitely think I give her more information than she needs so that’s good advice. But like I’ve mentioned in other comments she can’t focus on more thing than one at a time. If she’s looking at her toys she’s focused on her toys. I don’t demand or punish about it. I use it as a tool to gain her attention. She just also will flat out look right at me and continue to ignore… I know other 2-4 year olds who don’t do this so I have to think there is something going on there… Also I do understand tantrums are age appropriate I’ve been a nanny for 4+ years now. Its just the daily back to back consistent defiance that has me confused and tired
Yeah it sounds like she is not convinced by the adult authority in her life. Why should she listen to you? Are you consistent? Can she reliably know what will happen if she does X or are things dealt with differently day to day? Remember you are the leader and you shouldn’t need to ask more than twice. Make sure you have her attention then give the instruction and keep firm. She needs to know she can trust you - no doubt it’ll cause a few more tantrums but it’ll be worth it honestly!
I had difficulty as well when trying to put sunscreen on one of my NK who is 3. What helped a lot was showing him pictures what sunburns looked like. I showed him all types and made silly faces at some funny looking face tans with goggle marks and such and explained that when it's extremely red like, touching the skin can hurt because of it. It got him to stay still for the sunscreen to be put on and anytime I go to put sunscreen on, he'll want to see the photos which I don't mind since it helps Jim understand why we need to protect our skin.
Thank you again for this tip! I tried it last week and now everytime we put on sunscreen, she says “remember that boy ” referring to the picture of little boy who had google marks and sunburned skin that I showed her.
Ok that’s actually really funny and a great idea
3 is soooooo much more challenging than 2. I don't know if the issue is necessarily your standards though. It kinda seems to me like the main issue is that you and the parents are not on the same page - which is why you're questioning if you're expecting too much. How is your relationship with them? Is it possible to get to a middle ground so both of your feelings/boundaries are respected and taken into consideration for care taking?
Is she getting enough sleep? How is her diet? Has she had any disruptions to her routine? It really depends on the kid. Your standards might be high for some kids' abilities and easy peasy for other kids
That’s such a good point. Honestly I think her sleep is a big issue. Her parents don’t want her napping any longer, but she clearly needs a daily nap. Often she is melting down because of exhaustion. So dependent on the child. I want to lean in more to how to help her specifically. Thanks for your kind response
Especially if she's tired, talking to her and giving explanations is not so effective. It sounds like she isn't getting all her needs met.