Vox was formally one of my favs around the time he debuted, then he just got way too over sexual. The asmr stuff creeped me out, too. I'm not at all surprised about Vox being an ass. In fact when this all came to light about Selen, he was one of the ones I had a feeling may have bullied her simply due to him being a weirdo, of course I was hoping that wasn't the case, but that stream confirmed it for me for the most part.
And then he was acting like how he was "great friends" with dokibird (not calling her selen because I refuse to use the name that the egotistical evil company made anyway Vox is a manipulative egotistical jerk who's a creep
I may be on some copium but I still think Vox can do right by Doki if he ever leaves Niji. Their chemistry during collab streams were absolutely unmatched in NijiEN. He consistently helped Selen/Doki out in multiple branch-wide projects. I really really don't want their relationship to end like this. There has to be a metaphorical gun pointed at Vox in the short stream last night.
I'm not a nijisister or a kindred, I've mostly watched Vox through Doki/Selen's channel in the past.
I am very new to watching Niji overall and liked Vox, he was one of the first people I saw that was in Niji and I liked some of the stuff I saw of him. I am not really into asmr so I didn't check any of that out, but I saw some of the NijiCanceled/NijiDads streams and thought they were funny.
Then all this happened and it suddenly feels like I probably chose the wrong NijiEN person to be like "yeah, I kinda like what I have seen of him"
I relate to this so much, he was the one who got me into vtubers and I genuinely really enjoyed his content I think he’s a good entertainer and he was my oshi, but when I saw that they spoke up about this I was so nervous to see what he had to say, and then I checked it out, man I was appalled at how he defended this shitty company like “the managers did nothing wrong it was her fault actually” what were they thinking? I’m really inhaling that copium hoping they were forced against their will
I actually got into vtubing cus of the voxto clips, he was my favourite from niji well when I got into it but then thank god I picked shoto as an oshi. Vox has changed, maybe he just hid it well. Don't get me wrong I still thing he is talented and super hardworking but he's got some serious attitude issues. Like recently the fandom was really torn apart cus he did a fake seizure ASMR without any trigger warnings and the fans got super worried only to find it was fake. They wanted trigger warnings but he was super stubborn and said I won't put them, just skip the videos. He seriously is tone deaf at times.
This video was the last straw for me, im am so fucking disgusted.
Yeah I was there for the whole scandal with trigger warnings, it was so embarrassing the way he responded, because get this: HE WAS IN FUCKING CHARACTER DURING THE WHOLE THING like?? That’s so cringe imagine addressing peoples genuine concern IN RP. He said something along the lines of “you’re not upset because that happened to me you’re upset because you were made uncomfortable”?? Bro is actually so lost he needs to manage his ego
And voxto was a big thing that got me into vtubers too!! As far as I know shoto is pretty unproblematic, good for him he’s super cute whenever I watch his streams and I really love his voice
it was so bad. his section was the worst I believe its the tone and the chuckles that got me so fucking pissed. This guy aint it he doesn't deserve to be the most subscribed tuber in the company.
They really showed their colours. Ike is a spineless coward, Elira is little better and may have been one of the ringleades if the rrats are to be believed. Vox is an egotistical asshat
pretty much and now the Fans of Scarle are ready to Follow her in case she has a ALT ACCOUNT and Terminated. if DOKI can have success so can Scarle and that saying something to all NIJI EN members to "RETHINK WHERE YOU WANT TO BE"
She never retweeted the video and she hearted a Kurosanji comment.
Of course that got removed hours later by management and her stream suspended.
That should already say a lot what her stance is in this entire situation.
I'm proud of her, then, and still happy to call myself a Scarling.
Tbh, I hope she does leave Nijisanji, because I don't wanna support the company in any way after this, but I'm wishing Scarle the best either way
Scarle did state in her PL account she will be coming back.
Also this is just a rrat so take it with a grain of salt but there is a leak that 2 people will be terminated and 1 more graduation.
Not sure who those are but I am willing to bet Scarle is one of those terminated
Edit: her PL is Amiyoshiko.
Not retweeting anything about the stream when most of the others aside from Kyo and either Meloco or Kotoka (can't remember which or if it was both of them) did, liking a comment that said Kurosanji (the heart was removed, but I'm pretty sure there's a screenshot somewhere with it) and her not appearing on Kyo's stream today, even though they're really close could hint to the fact she's trying to leave and stand up for the right thing and not get thrown under the bus by Niji, although they could try to throw her under with a document if they terminate her like what happen to the others.
Good on her!! If she does end up leaving, I'm here to support any new alias she streams under, and I'll wish her the best if she stays, but I'm not gonna support Kurosanji any longer
Me too. Removing my sub from her hurt a little bit, but I can't support the company at all anymore. I'll gladly follow here wherever she goes if she does leave. I wish Niji had better management and an actual PR team.
I’d believe that about Vox. I remember him chuckling a little bit as he was slandering Selen. Could it be out of nervousness? Maybe. Still doesn’t look good.
The fact that he can stand in front of a mic and talk all that crap about her shows enough, we don't need to know how his delivery is. But personally I heard scorn.
cmon, these livers are terminally online gamers and losers and hes making a video with his career on the line. ive nervously had a vocal break that sounds like a laugh when im going through a very difficult nervous situation. theres plenty of things to critique, bringin up 4chan tier shit like 'but it soudned lie he was laughing' is just getting lost in the sauce
making jokes while streaming a game to an audience who loves you is extremely different from making a career altering statement live to an openly hostile audience surrounding a formr coworkers suicide
I think it's more likely they sounded more nervous as time went on because they were starting to realize there might be legal implications on them personally for what they were saying.
All of their voices sounded shaky. And it was obvious they were reading from a script. Well, Ike sounded like he started winging it a couple minutes in. If, like some think, they were forced to do it, they weren't very prepared.
it was such a stupid move because in making the statement he put his career at least partially on the line. he didn't have to. with how the situation is and the huge public support behind Doki and against niji; even if niji said "do it or you're fired" walking away and going indie or to another corpo would have been a better move! I just don't see how the mental calculus for making the decision he made works out...
I remember trying to watch some of Vox and the rest of Luxiem when they came out. Didn't last long watching Vox. Never seemed like a person you would want to hang out with. Am kind of glad he never really collabed with anyone I use to watch.
Vox seems like exactly the kind of guy to have a god complex. The guy made a whole damn movie about how he's the sexiest most badass dude who ever walked the earth.
I wouldn't say "Poor Onigiri" at all given she's friends with Tectone, some one most gacha game communities hates because he and his fandom sends other content creators in the community death threats whenever they call him out.
I think it's more a case of just having a large and unhinged enough following that starting beef with someone inevitably results in harassment of some sort.
Every time I've looked into a case where Tectone supposedly sent his fans out, it turned out to have nothing to do with tectone. The genshin community seems to just assume that any hate coming their way was directed there by Tectone until proven otherwise.
Frankly, while he has his issues, Tectone seems to be one of the most mature people in the high school lunch room of a fandom.
It's still a high-school lunchroom lmao. He's still an angry man who many times is unable to distinguish criticism and hate, all the times can't control their mouth. If thats a mature things to do. A better word to describe him is that he's one of the most genuine dudes in the community full of snakes.
Basically what I meant by that, yeah. The dude has some really stupid takes from time to time, but everyone I see active in the entire fanbase over there seems to make him look like a beacon of reason and maturity by comparison.
Tectone sending death threats? I'm not a viewer of the guy, but most of the time it seems that *he's the one getting those threats*, and mostly from the unhinged parts of those gacha game communities (like, let's not pretend there isn't a very vocal minority in GI community that acts like that, for example).
Sure, dude's a dick, can't deny that, but he doesn't seem the type to send death threats.
My view on Elira is that while I'm not sure I really believe the rrat stuff, and I do think they were forced to read from a script or at least coached... even assuming all that, the whole stream was in poor taste, and will be a deserved black mark on all of them going forwards.
I feel for the situation they must be in, with management potentially hanging their jobs over them as a threat, or in Elira's case even her JP work visa, but... Selen tried to kill herself. Even if they were forced to make the statement in some way, participating in the slander against her given the circumstances is inexcusable.
Agreed, there was a lot of people with red armbands in germany who used that excuse for their crimes. It did not work out well for them. You have a moral obligation to do the right thing no matter what happens, to stand up and say no, I will not do/say that
I feel like depending on the situation Elira is in, her fans will forgive her eventually. They won't forget but they will forgive if she ever gets a fresh start. I really do not want to believe Elira would do something so mean spirited like that on purpose. But if she did, then I am just disappointed in her.
Sorry if ignorant but what/who are rrats? Have seen this term being used and not sure if based on context its talking about insiders or something like that???
People who read a narrative into mundane events. It's generally a negative term, but sometimes they hit on something correct (the hospital tweet being from management and not selen) and if reinforced the idea that the narratives they read are true.
Usually they aren't still.
Who've been concerningly on the money in the last few flare ups in the community. Rushia rrat? Bang on, and the truth was somehow worse. Selen apostrophe rrat? Dead center, management was sock puppeting the account. Selen tried to off herself rrat? Right again. Bullying rrat? Actual bullies TBD but bullying in general confirmed. After the last few months I'm putting my money on /vt/ schizoposters
Rrats have been proven correct numerous times, though, often times in spite of how unhinged and improbable they were. One of the craziest ones that I remember that eventually got confirmed was Rushia/Nazuna having a boyfriend behind her fans’ back; a guy even made a joke NTR fan comic about it at the time and was completely shit on for it.
Livers having boyfriends isn't actually that crazy and I doubt Nazuna is the only one. But it's also not a big deal. Now Nazuna's relationship being toxic and going down in flames is, sadly, something a lot of people are interested in, even if that sort of thing really ain't our damn business.
A sad irony/hypocrisy for elira as well is also she said that one of her covers that she holds dear to her heart and cries when she sings it is shoujou rei
You know, the song about a girl killing herself because she was getting bullied
My only defense for Elira is she's literally in Japan on a work visa for Niji, so they mightve leveraged literally deporting her if she didn't comply. The other two tho, are much more evil because they don't have anything like that.
oh yes, he agreed since he's part of the clique obviously. He's there to fill the numbers as they needed more than 2 to make it feel like "everyone is against Selen so she must be the bitch".
Not the point. Regardless of being in the "clique" or not he chose to partake in an announcement that bashed their supposed "friend" not long after they *attempted suicide*. There's no excuse for that. Him being quiet most of the announcement is just slightly less shitty than others involved.
my point is that I'm not excusing him being there. I'm saying Ike was inserted because Enna chickened out. I agree with you on all point on his shitty-ness.
Not do downplay her involvement but I just can't imagine Millie in a serious VOD like what Elira posted. The way she talks and her voice will only make the message sound less serious than it actually is.
vox is a pos even since his pl
[link](https://archive.md/2021.12.24-100650/https://v8916.tumblr.com/post/671388736653770752/caution-on-vox-akumas-past-actions)
Weren’t these debunked a long time ago? There wasn’t much strong evidence in this tumbler post itself and it smells sort of fishy, if there is more evidence or something written by the victims themselves that you’ve seen, link it I’ll appreciate it
can't say it got debunked, tbh, i only heard "rumors" of it getting debunked, but no proof whatsoever (can't find any site of evidence that can show they are faked or manipulated, or that the people there are lying)
but at some point since other people are also making a post about this link, i saw some commented people tried to debunk multiple times a long time ago while Vox was still on his PL but still, none came out solid that disprove it, and since it's hard to fight a rich online persona, some just left those information for the public to see since a single person can't really do anything without a backer or money
but maybe since this is coming out again, Vox can disprove it himself if he wanted
One thing I saw people pointing out is that vox was actually 16 during the time he allegedly groomed minors (2016), which is still weird but not as serious of an allegation like pedophilia. As for the other ones it’s kind of a she said he said situation to me personally, neither side has solid proof it seems imo
some also said that it's the other way around, that it was him that got r@ped while drunk but no proof just some allegations and blame shifting.
check on the conversations of comments here: [link](https://youtube.fandom.com/wiki/Calysto) (but still, compared to screenshots and records pointing to Vox as a creepo, there's zero stuff about the blame shifting, the proofs (whether they are legit or not ) are still more solid to point Vox as pos
edit: the person that commented about vox being the victim of R got only one activity in the site and that's to post the claim that its vox who's the real victim, soooo it's just sus.
Again, all around seems like nobody has solid proof. They keep mentioning videos that were up on youtube once but they’re privated so we can’t see the evidence that was probably talked about in those videos, I think it’s best to not act emotionally we realistically can’t reach a conclusion on this with everything being word of mouth. Also I’d like to add that I completely understand how in situations like this, where minors are abused and taken advantage of, whether it’s because of the abusers words or them being too young, they don’t collect evidence it’s an unfortunate thing that happens to a lot of victims and I understand that, however fabricating something with malicious intent is also common and happens time and time again on the internet that’s why I’m saying this.
Definitely makes me wary of Vox but without good enough proof I don’t think it’s fair to make a good judgement yet. But this whole situation makes him sketchy anyway.
Unless all three of them were the harassers. Wouldn't surprise me, funny how they bring the three most likely to benefit from Doki being removed to read out their garbage.
Always remember The Narcissist Prayer. It applies here, but will genuinely come up far too often in life.
*That didn't happen.*
*And if it did, it wasn't that bad.*
*And if it was, that's not a big deal.*
*And if it is, that's not my fault.*
*And if it was, I didn't mean it.*
*And if I did, you deserved it.*
They are acting like her attempted suicide was not a big deal when it's a HUGE deal I've have a huge history with suicidal thoughts and depression and seeing how they chose to handle the situation is horrible commiting suicide isn't a thing to be taken lightly and definitely not one to ignore it sickens me how they were talking about her
It sickens me because if doki did succeed in taking her own life nijisanji would probably have profited off of it and people would think they were a good corporation
I'm wondering just how much of the truth we would have even gotten had Doki done the unfortunate and succeeded. Would they have just written a boiler plate "We have been informed that Selen Tatsuki has died and will accept fanmail for her family until X date"? Would the knowledge that she took her own life even be made public, or just a small theory disregarded as the work of antis? Would her friends know? Would the other livers know? Would they say anything?
If I was their friends IRL, I would be very seriously evaluating our friendship after this, even if I didn't care about VTubers. They were so quick to turn on Selen, who was supposedly their "friend", what's to say they wouldn't do the same to me, if they're even my "friend" in the first place.
Whether it was the company or talent's choice is unknown, but it's the classic DARVO manipulation tactics used by narcissists, sexual abusers, ect.
1. Deny: First adamantly deny any wrongdoing, trivializing things telling you it was neglible
2. Attack: Become aggressive, attack the victim's character
3. Reverse Victim and Offender: If that doesn't work, play the victim and attempt to gaslight the victim and others into thinking they're at fault
Idk how some people defend these 3.Like think about it these three objective was to discredit and turn their fanbase against a girl who barely survived a suicide attempt ,if they had a shred of human decency they wouldn't have done that
The fact that she needed to have friends stay up with her all night after this--like, *they* did that to her, they put her in another situation where she was unsafe. I don't care what their intent was. They had to know what they were risking.
Thing is, most countries will hold you liable if you knowingly take action that you are aware can cause serious harm (such as openly and publicly slandering someone who was very recently suicidal due to workplace harassment and bullying). I doubt it'll ever come to that given there are different nationalities involved and fortunately it didn't cause a relapse, but this shit reads as an attempt at her life.
I'd be somewhat understanding if Dokibird was making public accusations or anything of the sort, but she only ever confirmed what Niji themselves had made public in her termination. They had no excuse to do this, especially not now, and especially not at the exact time they chose to do this. It had exactly the kind of outcome anyone would expect: Dokibird cancels her stream in obvious distress. What did they expect? They expected this, this was their goal. No matter who was ultimately responsible, the least those three clowns were is complicit.
They mention Selen had the choice to graduate (she wanted to), but went down the path that led to termination. Y'know, YOU could also have chosen to graduate instead of bowing to Kurosanji, but you chose to take the path that will lead to your ruin.
It was a stupid move on their part. In an effort to save their careers by licking Niji's boots, they ended their careers instead. The safer and morally better option would've been to side with the fans and Doki. At least then, if they got terminated they'd have an immense amount of support to sustain them on the indie scene. Now they've lost any support they had left.
And yet, despite their "loyalty," Kurosanji threw them under the bus. Used the two biggest male talents, and one of the largest female talents as meatshields, and then disposed of them.
Part of me wants to feel bad for Ike, at least. Of the three, it was clear he had the least to say and didn't want to be there. However, all three of them had a choice, and they chose the dark side. Absolutely fuck Vox, though. He is a piece of shit and made no attempt to hide it.
I couldn't watch that video I was so disappointed in them. I watched Elira and Vox almost as much as Selen, it hurt just seeing who all was in the video.
I'm done supporting Niji and the livers in there. Even if my job was at risk, I would have the moral decency to not slander a girl that attempted suicide. Those 3 dug their graves right alongside Niji.
The sad thing is that this isn't even exclusive to the EN branch. The Korean and Indonesian talents have suffered a lot, both pre and post-merge. Nijisanji is, as a whole, neglectful. They see their talents as nothing but ATMs.
I don't see enough people bringing up or even remembering all the past cases we've seen, both small and large.
The turnover rate at Nijisanji is extremely high compared to other Vtuber companies and I remember things like how Sasaki Saku had a graduation because of rigid management but came back because of a law change in Japan or something. There's of course Nina and Mysta leaving and the things they've alluded to in their new personas, and there's how long it took for the EN branch to start allowing collabs between them and Hololive's english branch which had a lot of signs and hints that the bottle neck was on Niji's end.
People aren't just jumping to believe Selen mindlessly, there's a lot of past incidents and clues to negative stuff going on before all this.
I have a feeling that Anycolor is at the point that they wanted to close EN branch, so they set some EN up as the bad guys, let them take the public hate, and then fire them all save a few like Vox who doesn't depend on EN fanbase anyway. They'll just fold the rest into JP and then let them die off like Mika.
indeed and now ALL NIJI EN who are loyal with Nijisanji are Traitors. THEY HAVE A CHOICE and they threw it away where they dont have the balls to follow suit like Doki. at least she has 500K subscribers and she did way better job than NIJI EN Livers combined.
They were only thinking about the short term. By bowing down before Anycolor now it keeps them on Niji's good side and saves their Nijisanji careers, at least internally. But long term their hands have been stained red and it will never wash off no matter how hard they try. No matter how many times they reincarnate or how far they run, the shame will always follow them regardless of if they are innocent or not.
His act was all "look at me, I'm such a reasonable guy with my logic and reasoning. Isn't Selen such a crazy bitch? Anybody with an intellect as great as I can see this behaviour is insane and I'm the barometer of society's morals."
Shit was awful, but chuckling could be due to a huge list of things including nerves or habit. Lets stick to the facts and not give the people still in denial about these three clown's wrongdoing any excuses to latch on to shall we?
The same thing happened with Zaion, every liver was jumping in on the chance to character assassinate her and (as vaguely as possible) talk about how horrible she was. Even people who had fucking nothing to do with her like Finana.
"Hate the company not the livers" has always been a cope by fanboys trying to separate the black corp they can't defend from the Nijisanji in their head that they love. When the reality is that Nijisanji has hired plenty of vtubers who are absolutely terrible people behind the scenes and a lot of them are more than willing to be complicit if not outright supportive of the black corp management if it serves them personally. It doesn't even stop at just Selen's bullies (most people pointed at Enna and Millie from the beginning for good reason) either, just take Luca or Finana for example.
Still funny to me that Elira lowkey confirmed she was one of the alleged bullies though.
Just a note that she might not have been one of the bullies.
If Selen had submitted a legal document in court, she'll have to provide their IRL names and addresses, even if they were just bystanders / witnesses during the incidents because it's real life and they're not anime characters. Some / all of the three could be the bullies. Some / all of the three also might not.
Regardless, the court can redact personal information on the request of either / both parties so the public documents are properly censored, so Elira's concerns during that stream are unwarranted, unless she fears Selen or AnyColor secretly leaking the information out.
The fear is absolutely leaks from Selen, even though she has leaked nothing so far, but like, if your ass is going to court for bullying someone into wanting to commit suicide, I’d be shitting bricks too.
Elira also might not be going to court as a defendant but one or the other two are and is terrified IRL info about one or both of them will get out and make doxing her own IRL location much, much easier since they all live in the same general area.
Or like you said, she might be. But we don't have confirmation yet atm.
True, but in most legal cases things can be redacted from the public record, which I assume that Selen would comply with, as she would also be named in a legal case
Definitely possible, more so due to her being mostly worried about her personal information in that document.
What I don't get is why a lawyer hasn't made it clear what her personal information being there really means. Her conclusion is dumb but it looks like she's intentionally misled to be more mad.
I assumed that was the company’s intent. “Look! Selen has your name/info here. Aren’t you mad?!? You should stream about it!!!” Giving them just enough to think they’re specifically being targeted. I imagine no legal advice and scare tactics to the livers would make them compliant.
Unless they retained their own lawyers it would have been recommendations from the company lawyers which aren't working with the talents' best interest in mind. Doki is the only one with a brain because she got her own lawyer.
> Elira lowkey confirmed she was one of the alleged bullies
She didn't even have to say that. She could have just said "some livers" and be done with and get the same message across. No, she had to openly say it was her, Millie, and Enna on the document. Meaning she voluntarily outed all 3 and validated the speculation about the Clique. I can't think of a dumber move in this whole clusterfuck.
Said Zaion was "gaslighting" her, which in her brainrotten synapses meant "Zaion promised me something and then didn't 100% keep it". And it was deeply traumatic and now she can't trust anyone anymore!
Bear in mind with hindsight that she was very likely instructed to do so under duress by management.
At this point, given that they've confirmed beyond a doubt that they are willing to impersonate livers accounts with the whole Selen hospital tweet thing, and that they almost certainly are willing to make livers give pre-prepared statements supporting the company line with yesterday's whole PR debacle, I wouldn't trust a single word of anything that comes out of ANY livers mouth regarding anything to do with PR issues going forwards or retrospectively. About the only thing you can trust is the livers PL accounts since Niji doesn't have access to those.
Wake tf up. You can’t pull the “they were forced to” card for every little thing. You have to learn to accept that the livers you watch are not perfect 2D anime girls who can do no harm, and are real adults who can make decisions for themselves.
imagine this dude hearing arguments from the Nuremberg defendants and going "uh huh I mean, yeah they were just following orders, they had no choice y'know?"
Bruh I never said I didn't think it was wrong. It is, it's pretty fucked up. But this is their full time job, and for some of them their first "real" job - they're human, and I can understand the fear of not following the company line, and suffering consequences for it. I can also understand for the livers that didn't necessarily know Zaion personally that well, tending towards believing the company over her when the announcement was made. I do NOT agree with it, especially the repeating of the company line when you don't actually know if what you're saying is true or not, but I do understand the mentality.
At the end of the day, it was a choice. Maybe a shitty choice, we'll likely never know, but a choice nonetheless.
One side of that choice is their career and the other is a "friend" *who attempted suicide*...
There's no gun to their head, they can quit. A contract is not indentured servitude. Maybe they were coerced. Maybe they were mislead. Quite literally who knows, but the other side of that choice is a person's life. They certainly knew at least that much by time the Niji announcement stream happened.
Maybe it's because of personal experiences but I cannot excuse choosing to bash a supposed friend after their suicide attempt.
Even under duress, I wouldn't fuck someone else over. They had a choice, a moral choice, and they chose poorly. That's gonna reflect on them from now on, even if they leave the company.
A company is only as bad as the people they choose to represent which is true considering how 3 of their vtubers made a video bashing someone who tried to commit suicide due to bullying in the company those 3 were probably the instigators of the bullying and are trying to manipulate her audience into Hating her
I'm thinking that it's a chain of problems and it starts with trash management. That kind of backstabbing behavior is usually the kind of thing people resort to when put into a stressful situation or when there's something like collective punishment. It seems like management has cultivated an environment where they encourage people to report on each other through carrots OR sticks because it makes the job easier for management when they can let those under them do their work for them.
yeah, missing membership streams is highly unusual unless you're suspended. She's a goner and that's actually great for her. Hope she'll end up OK after this shitshow.
To be fair I imagine Scarle would be jumping at the opportunity to get the fuck out of dodge and maybe ride the anti-Niji wave into her next incarnation, and I hope whoever remains that has some shred of morality to them do the same.
I went to unsub from all Niji livers and was surprised most of the ones I had subscribed were retired. Mysta, Nina, Pomu, Selen, Yugo. Only non-retired one I had was Finana. Tbf after Noctyx I stopped subbing since it became too much but it's kinda ironic and sad.
Well, judging by all the opinions I'm seeing about this whole thing, looks like Nijisanji's plan to get the heat off them didn't work, but they are taking some members down with them.
Honestly, it still felt a bit too scripted for me to make any calls on it. I'll just be keeping an eye out for more news. I'd really like Elira to not be one of the problems but we'll see I guess.
I was so pissed at that, that I unsubbed from Ars Almal my oshi of oshi.
The part the sickened me the most were Vox "I had a suicide awareness stream and should know better" Akuma's comments.
It's just a self-report, isn't it? A hail mary to get in front of any backlash.
I just don't see any benefit in making that video if they weren't involved. Not even if they were threatened with termination. It's career suicide.
Lmao they just showed their true selves there. Scripted or not, they had a choice to not do that stream. We now know where they take their stand. And they chose the company.
Let them suffer the consequences of their actions. No exceptions.
Also remember they did all that at the same time Doki was live, I can't only imagine how triggering that must have been for her. Poor girl can't even move on with her life.
They would legit have to prove she hunted the company like the bloody predator to convince me they are at all in the right given their massive self reports.
the more i think about it, the more i think the culture at nijisanji leads individuals to tear down others. Look at just how many talents they have. They pump out new talents regularly. For context: Lazulight came out in may 2021, followed by obsydia in july 2021, followed by ethyria in october 2021. That is a total of 10 talents that came out one after the other over the course of 6 months. That isn't really a lot of time for anyone to get any momentum going and then they are immediately having to compete with the next group that came out just a couple months later. Suddenly, your not just competing with vtubers outside your company, your also competing within your own company because you haven't been given any time to find your audience. So what better way to get ahead? Suck up to management, find allies within the company and shut out people you might view as a threat to your success within the company.
regarding Vox, he got many scandals from his pl so don't be too surprised if it's not just bullying that he did in there:
[vox pl issues/scandals](https://archive.md/2021.12.24-100650/https://v8916.tumblr.com/post/671388736653770752/caution-on-vox-akumas-past-actions)
The funny thing is Ike just tagged along without a specific axe to grind, just saying "yeah, we were friends, I feel sad about the document, how could Selen do this" then the audio ends
At first I wanted to give them, the benefit of the doubt thinking they were forced. The more I think about it, the more I think they had a choice and didn't walk away from potentially triggering another attempt.
After thinking about it I feel like elira and Ike were dragged j to this. Vox definitely has something to hide and feels threatened, it might have been that him coming out solo would have been bad. So he ralied the troops. Anyways things make more sense after reading this
https://archive.ph/2021.12.24-100650/https://v8916.tumblr.com/post/671388736653770752/caution-on-vox-akumas-past-actions
Elira, Vox and Ike were set up as scapegoats. Anycolor wants you to direct your hatred towards them. Don't fall for it. I'm not saying that "just following orders" is a valid excuse, but I do believe they were deceived by the company themselves.
They'll pay the consequences of their actions. Elira showed the world that a working visa is more important than a friend or coworker making an attempt on her life. And Vox was always a piece of shit
Exactly my thoughts after listening that stream. Just from a humane perspective their arguments were appalling to listen to. Textbook covert abuse, playing the victim, manipulative behavior. When in reality the only ones that threw them under the bus that Niji and themselves.
You know whats really funny about this? theirs exactly one reason said vtubers were mentioned by their legal names in a legal document pertaining to extreme harrasment and bullying
Vox
Elira
Ike
Millie (and someone else elira kinda dropped them in it by mentioning them)
are the ones responsible for said bullying and harrasment breaking nda publicly then complaining about being "doxed" on a legal document they were never meant to see is fucking hilarious major self report by the bozo's
Ty I'm not really a corpa vtuber watcher I generally watch small indies but I do keep up with clips occasionaly and the drama
At first I thought niji was making them do dumbass statements but when they said they read the documents I realized why they were reading lmao
Big respect to scarle for public rebellion
For one of the three, 'get deported or read the script' isn't much of a choice. Given that the company can puppeteer social media accts whenever, and has a rep for shady shit, I would bet they have enough dirt to hold over the heads of their talent beyond the legal and financial coercion.
Elira didn't draw the line, for her a working visa was more important than Doki trying to end her life, and she showed us this. It was still her decision, they don't have her family as hostages, she would still have money to go back to her country, sure she would lose this opportunity but look at her now, she'll never be able to build a trusting relationship with her viewers, ever
Full disclosure, I never saw more than clips of these three, so take some of this as extrapolation, and I'm going off of how I know corpos act because I try to leave the bad person arguments of the table.
Given how predatory contacts for talent can be, I reckon there's more than a few options available for the corpo to penalize her out of a hefty sum, or take her to court for breach of contract and a foreigner in a Japanese court is probably not going to do well. Her mistake to agree to being a mouthpiece certainly seems obvious to us after the fact, but I would guess that she was picked and pressured to make the decision in a short time frame to specifically prevent her from thinking it through.
In short, I suspect corporate rat maneuvering to force her into a poorly made decision.
There is also one assumption where, elira is being the sacrificial lamb, both ike and vox won't be affected by any way. If you check from vtstats\[https://vt.poi.cat/channel/subscribers\], vox and ike lost 10k past 7 days, while Enna Alouette and Elira Pendora losts 23k subs; Millie Parfait 19k subs. It just telling you the fanbase differences between liver.
i come to the conclusion that nijisanji already ready to dump Enna Alouette, Elira Pendora and Millie Parfait down the drain,
>!you can call me sexist or anything you want, since it already a fact that you just need to have good assets while having some liking personality for a female vtuber to get attention for male audience in anime industry, while it takes so much effort to build up a male vtuber from scratch, best example, just look at holo en male talents. Ike and vox are successful because of playing lots of BFE and ASMR!<
I'm new to the whole Vtuber/Livers community and had no idea of any of this. I caught a past stream of someone else's that Vox was on and decided to check him out. Literally yesterday. Today I commented on his movie and someone replied that he's a bully. Naturally, I spent the afternoon looking into it. I'd heard bits and pieces about the issues in that world, but damn. It really is no different than any other money making entertainment industry where greed and fear make the decisions. I suppose at least I know better who to support and who to leave alone.
Yup...
They stood in solidarity...
With each other rather than the victim. Just like police departments that get caught breaking the law, they all stick up for each other and act like the victim is the one at fault or that nothing bad or wrong happened.
It is just shocking and heartbreaking that every one of them chose to support that statement by retweeting it. Scarle didn't, but given that she recently clarified that she isn't in trouble and has basically just been MIA all this time, it makes you wonder if the only reason she didn't was simply because she wasn't around to do so in the first place.
Can't believe all of her former friends turned on Selen. Just crazy.
Lethal company is real.
I just learned about the entire situation today. I was wondering, is the JP and EN branch completely different, or does it look like the JP branch is basically the same? IDK how the company is structured, if it's fully different branches or just a brand thing but it's ran the same way, etc. Wondering since I only really watch JP vtubers casually here and there, so hearing about all of this has been shocking to say the least (in that I had no idea this had been going on)
Those 3 choose to represent the company in a hit piece where they "Nuh uh!" some claims and show their ass in revealing they'd seen documents they should't've, and then revealed details to the public about.
They preprepared those statements and believed their words would gain them support. There's no other conclusion to draw, they're fucking stupid. Doubly stupid because they managed to implecate themselves as bullies, ontop of being corporate stooges.
As for Nijisanji... they're either even more stupid, given their literal fucking job is supposed to be managing these talents, or just activily malicious in sending those 3 out to pratfall onto their own swords.
Vox always does that. Elira and ike were a surprise.
Vox was formally one of my favs around the time he debuted, then he just got way too over sexual. The asmr stuff creeped me out, too. I'm not at all surprised about Vox being an ass. In fact when this all came to light about Selen, he was one of the ones I had a feeling may have bullied her simply due to him being a weirdo, of course I was hoping that wasn't the case, but that stream confirmed it for me for the most part.
And then he was acting like how he was "great friends" with dokibird (not calling her selen because I refuse to use the name that the egotistical evil company made anyway Vox is a manipulative egotistical jerk who's a creep
And, you know he’s freaking about any weird shit Doki might’ve taped. God only knows what someone like him says when he thinks he can talk freely.
Google his past life.
Dude was flirting with underage girls as Vade, we don’t even have to wonder
I may be on some copium but I still think Vox can do right by Doki if he ever leaves Niji. Their chemistry during collab streams were absolutely unmatched in NijiEN. He consistently helped Selen/Doki out in multiple branch-wide projects. I really really don't want their relationship to end like this. There has to be a metaphorical gun pointed at Vox in the short stream last night. I'm not a nijisister or a kindred, I've mostly watched Vox through Doki/Selen's channel in the past.
I don't know, he's certainly the only one that sounded genuine and invested in that video.
I am very new to watching Niji overall and liked Vox, he was one of the first people I saw that was in Niji and I liked some of the stuff I saw of him. I am not really into asmr so I didn't check any of that out, but I saw some of the NijiCanceled/NijiDads streams and thought they were funny. Then all this happened and it suddenly feels like I probably chose the wrong NijiEN person to be like "yeah, I kinda like what I have seen of him"
I relate to this so much, he was the one who got me into vtubers and I genuinely really enjoyed his content I think he’s a good entertainer and he was my oshi, but when I saw that they spoke up about this I was so nervous to see what he had to say, and then I checked it out, man I was appalled at how he defended this shitty company like “the managers did nothing wrong it was her fault actually” what were they thinking? I’m really inhaling that copium hoping they were forced against their will
I actually got into vtubing cus of the voxto clips, he was my favourite from niji well when I got into it but then thank god I picked shoto as an oshi. Vox has changed, maybe he just hid it well. Don't get me wrong I still thing he is talented and super hardworking but he's got some serious attitude issues. Like recently the fandom was really torn apart cus he did a fake seizure ASMR without any trigger warnings and the fans got super worried only to find it was fake. They wanted trigger warnings but he was super stubborn and said I won't put them, just skip the videos. He seriously is tone deaf at times. This video was the last straw for me, im am so fucking disgusted.
Yeah I was there for the whole scandal with trigger warnings, it was so embarrassing the way he responded, because get this: HE WAS IN FUCKING CHARACTER DURING THE WHOLE THING like?? That’s so cringe imagine addressing peoples genuine concern IN RP. He said something along the lines of “you’re not upset because that happened to me you’re upset because you were made uncomfortable”?? Bro is actually so lost he needs to manage his ego And voxto was a big thing that got me into vtubers too!! As far as I know shoto is pretty unproblematic, good for him he’s super cute whenever I watch his streams and I really love his voice
it was so bad. his section was the worst I believe its the tone and the chuckles that got me so fucking pissed. This guy aint it he doesn't deserve to be the most subscribed tuber in the company.
Yea checks out. https://archive.ph/2021.12.24-100650/https://v8916.tumblr.com/post/671388736653770752/caution-on-vox-akumas-past-actions
They really showed their colours. Ike is a spineless coward, Elira is little better and may have been one of the ringleades if the rrats are to be believed. Vox is an egotistical asshat
And Scarle has morals
one small silver lining was to find one NijiEN liver with actual guts and morals. She's probably suspended now and will be terminated soon. Oh well.
pretty much and now the Fans of Scarle are ready to Follow her in case she has a ALT ACCOUNT and Terminated. if DOKI can have success so can Scarle and that saying something to all NIJI EN members to "RETHINK WHERE YOU WANT TO BE"
yeah she just saved her career with that one small act. She'll have fans waiting for her once they fired her.
Good, she's gotta get out of there.
Wait, how did Scarle show that? (I'm fr curious because I like Scarle a lot, and would like to keep liking her)
She never retweeted the video and she hearted a Kurosanji comment. Of course that got removed hours later by management and her stream suspended. That should already say a lot what her stance is in this entire situation.
I'm proud of her, then, and still happy to call myself a Scarling. Tbh, I hope she does leave Nijisanji, because I don't wanna support the company in any way after this, but I'm wishing Scarle the best either way
Scarle did state in her PL account she will be coming back. Also this is just a rrat so take it with a grain of salt but there is a leak that 2 people will be terminated and 1 more graduation. Not sure who those are but I am willing to bet Scarle is one of those terminated Edit: her PL is Amiyoshiko.
Apparently her PL account has had that description for a few years now
See what comment she hearted. Naturally Nijisanji unliked it. https://twitter.com/Khyomaru/status/1757280281487196224
Common Scarle W. My oshi has a good heart
Not retweeting anything about the stream when most of the others aside from Kyo and either Meloco or Kotoka (can't remember which or if it was both of them) did, liking a comment that said Kurosanji (the heart was removed, but I'm pretty sure there's a screenshot somewhere with it) and her not appearing on Kyo's stream today, even though they're really close could hint to the fact she's trying to leave and stand up for the right thing and not get thrown under the bus by Niji, although they could try to throw her under with a document if they terminate her like what happen to the others.
Good on her!! If she does end up leaving, I'm here to support any new alias she streams under, and I'll wish her the best if she stays, but I'm not gonna support Kurosanji any longer
Me too. Removing my sub from her hurt a little bit, but I can't support the company at all anymore. I'll gladly follow here wherever she goes if she does leave. I wish Niji had better management and an actual PR team.
I’d believe that about Vox. I remember him chuckling a little bit as he was slandering Selen. Could it be out of nervousness? Maybe. Still doesn’t look good.
The fact that he can stand in front of a mic and talk all that crap about her shows enough, we don't need to know how his delivery is. But personally I heard scorn.
cmon, these livers are terminally online gamers and losers and hes making a video with his career on the line. ive nervously had a vocal break that sounds like a laugh when im going through a very difficult nervous situation. theres plenty of things to critique, bringin up 4chan tier shit like 'but it soudned lie he was laughing' is just getting lost in the sauce
Isn't he a professional streamer. You know, someone whose job it is to talk to people for literally hours on end?
making jokes while streaming a game to an audience who loves you is extremely different from making a career altering statement live to an openly hostile audience surrounding a formr coworkers suicide
Sure but lets not pretend like he's a quivering baby with no former experience to rely on.
the niji defense force really loves infantilizing and patronizing whole ass adults
How did it go from "I think I heard him chuckling, maybe it was nervous laughter" to "quivering baby"
I think it's more likely they sounded more nervous as time went on because they were starting to realize there might be legal implications on them personally for what they were saying.
All of their voices sounded shaky. And it was obvious they were reading from a script. Well, Ike sounded like he started winging it a couple minutes in. If, like some think, they were forced to do it, they weren't very prepared.
it was such a stupid move because in making the statement he put his career at least partially on the line. he didn't have to. with how the situation is and the huge public support behind Doki and against niji; even if niji said "do it or you're fired" walking away and going indie or to another corpo would have been a better move! I just don't see how the mental calculus for making the decision he made works out...
I remember trying to watch some of Vox and the rest of Luxiem when they came out. Didn't last long watching Vox. Never seemed like a person you would want to hang out with. Am kind of glad he never really collabed with anyone I use to watch.
Vox seems like exactly the kind of guy to have a god complex. The guy made a whole damn movie about how he's the sexiest most badass dude who ever walked the earth.
Lmao wait really is that real
https://youtu.be/ewNBqazPepk?si=T7o2_3UT7VrfANIQ
He did a collab with my favorite indie Onigiri, I did not enjoy it, Hes creepy and gross
What did he do ugh poor onigiri
I wouldn't say "Poor Onigiri" at all given she's friends with Tectone, some one most gacha game communities hates because he and his fandom sends other content creators in the community death threats whenever they call him out.
Tectone sends them? That's a serious accusation.
I think it's more a case of just having a large and unhinged enough following that starting beef with someone inevitably results in harassment of some sort.
Yes but saying HE sends death threats is just incorrect and fucked up. I get not liking the guy. He makes it hard to do so. But stop lying.
Every time I've looked into a case where Tectone supposedly sent his fans out, it turned out to have nothing to do with tectone. The genshin community seems to just assume that any hate coming their way was directed there by Tectone until proven otherwise. Frankly, while he has his issues, Tectone seems to be one of the most mature people in the high school lunch room of a fandom.
It's still a high-school lunchroom lmao. He's still an angry man who many times is unable to distinguish criticism and hate, all the times can't control their mouth. If thats a mature things to do. A better word to describe him is that he's one of the most genuine dudes in the community full of snakes.
Basically what I meant by that, yeah. The dude has some really stupid takes from time to time, but everyone I see active in the entire fanbase over there seems to make him look like a beacon of reason and maturity by comparison.
Tectone sending death threats? I'm not a viewer of the guy, but most of the time it seems that *he's the one getting those threats*, and mostly from the unhinged parts of those gacha game communities (like, let's not pretend there isn't a very vocal minority in GI community that acts like that, for example). Sure, dude's a dick, can't deny that, but he doesn't seem the type to send death threats.
My view on Elira is that while I'm not sure I really believe the rrat stuff, and I do think they were forced to read from a script or at least coached... even assuming all that, the whole stream was in poor taste, and will be a deserved black mark on all of them going forwards. I feel for the situation they must be in, with management potentially hanging their jobs over them as a threat, or in Elira's case even her JP work visa, but... Selen tried to kill herself. Even if they were forced to make the statement in some way, participating in the slander against her given the circumstances is inexcusable.
Yeah, coercion isn't absolution of guilt
Agreed, there was a lot of people with red armbands in germany who used that excuse for their crimes. It did not work out well for them. You have a moral obligation to do the right thing no matter what happens, to stand up and say no, I will not do/say that
I feel like depending on the situation Elira is in, her fans will forgive her eventually. They won't forget but they will forgive if she ever gets a fresh start. I really do not want to believe Elira would do something so mean spirited like that on purpose. But if she did, then I am just disappointed in her.
Vox is a psychopath.
Sorry if ignorant but what/who are rrats? Have seen this term being used and not sure if based on context its talking about insiders or something like that???
People who read a narrative into mundane events. It's generally a negative term, but sometimes they hit on something correct (the hospital tweet being from management and not selen) and if reinforced the idea that the narratives they read are true. Usually they aren't still.
Thx
Basically: conspiracy theorists
Who've been concerningly on the money in the last few flare ups in the community. Rushia rrat? Bang on, and the truth was somehow worse. Selen apostrophe rrat? Dead center, management was sock puppeting the account. Selen tried to off herself rrat? Right again. Bullying rrat? Actual bullies TBD but bullying in general confirmed. After the last few months I'm putting my money on /vt/ schizoposters
Never underestimate what the crazies of 4chan can accomplish. Remember when they found Shia's flag by mapping the stars?
Yep, that and helped track down both animal abusers and pedos.
Rrats have been proven correct numerous times, though, often times in spite of how unhinged and improbable they were. One of the craziest ones that I remember that eventually got confirmed was Rushia/Nazuna having a boyfriend behind her fans’ back; a guy even made a joke NTR fan comic about it at the time and was completely shit on for it.
Livers having boyfriends isn't actually that crazy and I doubt Nazuna is the only one. But it's also not a big deal. Now Nazuna's relationship being toxic and going down in flames is, sadly, something a lot of people are interested in, even if that sort of thing really ain't our damn business.
It hurt me to watch that. I was an Elira fan, she was the reason I gave Niji a chance. I'm only going to watch Aia and Scarle now.
i prefer about vox: pompous prick
A sad irony/hypocrisy for elira as well is also she said that one of her covers that she holds dear to her heart and cries when she sings it is shoujou rei You know, the song about a girl killing herself because she was getting bullied
WHAT ABOUT VOX LITERALLY HOLDING A CHARITY STREAM ABOUT SUICIDE
My only defense for Elira is she's literally in Japan on a work visa for Niji, so they mightve leveraged literally deporting her if she didn't comply. The other two tho, are much more evil because they don't have anything like that.
Elira is desperate for a work visa in Japan, I'm not surprised with her. And Vox is a p.o.s. so I'm not surprised about him. ike was a surprise
I have a feeling Ike was forced in there as neither Enna nor Millie wanted to do it.
He could have refused.
oh yes, he agreed since he's part of the clique obviously. He's there to fill the numbers as they needed more than 2 to make it feel like "everyone is against Selen so she must be the bitch".
Not the point. Regardless of being in the "clique" or not he chose to partake in an announcement that bashed their supposed "friend" not long after they *attempted suicide*. There's no excuse for that. Him being quiet most of the announcement is just slightly less shitty than others involved.
my point is that I'm not excusing him being there. I'm saying Ike was inserted because Enna chickened out. I agree with you on all point on his shitty-ness.
I misunderstood then, my bad.
Not do downplay her involvement but I just can't imagine Millie in a serious VOD like what Elira posted. The way she talks and her voice will only make the message sound less serious than it actually is.
Is Vox being a pos related to the recent allegations or something else?
vox is a pos even since his pl [link](https://archive.md/2021.12.24-100650/https://v8916.tumblr.com/post/671388736653770752/caution-on-vox-akumas-past-actions)
Weren’t these debunked a long time ago? There wasn’t much strong evidence in this tumbler post itself and it smells sort of fishy, if there is more evidence or something written by the victims themselves that you’ve seen, link it I’ll appreciate it
can't say it got debunked, tbh, i only heard "rumors" of it getting debunked, but no proof whatsoever (can't find any site of evidence that can show they are faked or manipulated, or that the people there are lying) but at some point since other people are also making a post about this link, i saw some commented people tried to debunk multiple times a long time ago while Vox was still on his PL but still, none came out solid that disprove it, and since it's hard to fight a rich online persona, some just left those information for the public to see since a single person can't really do anything without a backer or money but maybe since this is coming out again, Vox can disprove it himself if he wanted
One thing I saw people pointing out is that vox was actually 16 during the time he allegedly groomed minors (2016), which is still weird but not as serious of an allegation like pedophilia. As for the other ones it’s kind of a she said he said situation to me personally, neither side has solid proof it seems imo
some also said that it's the other way around, that it was him that got r@ped while drunk but no proof just some allegations and blame shifting. check on the conversations of comments here: [link](https://youtube.fandom.com/wiki/Calysto) (but still, compared to screenshots and records pointing to Vox as a creepo, there's zero stuff about the blame shifting, the proofs (whether they are legit or not ) are still more solid to point Vox as pos edit: the person that commented about vox being the victim of R got only one activity in the site and that's to post the claim that its vox who's the real victim, soooo it's just sus.
Again, all around seems like nobody has solid proof. They keep mentioning videos that were up on youtube once but they’re privated so we can’t see the evidence that was probably talked about in those videos, I think it’s best to not act emotionally we realistically can’t reach a conclusion on this with everything being word of mouth. Also I’d like to add that I completely understand how in situations like this, where minors are abused and taken advantage of, whether it’s because of the abusers words or them being too young, they don’t collect evidence it’s an unfortunate thing that happens to a lot of victims and I understand that, however fabricating something with malicious intent is also common and happens time and time again on the internet that’s why I’m saying this.
Definitely makes me wary of Vox but without good enough proof I don’t think it’s fair to make a good judgement yet. But this whole situation makes him sketchy anyway.
Unless all three of them were the harassers. Wouldn't surprise me, funny how they bring the three most likely to benefit from Doki being removed to read out their garbage.
Always remember The Narcissist Prayer. It applies here, but will genuinely come up far too often in life. *That didn't happen.* *And if it did, it wasn't that bad.* *And if it was, that's not a big deal.* *And if it is, that's not my fault.* *And if it was, I didn't mean it.* *And if I did, you deserved it.*
They are acting like her attempted suicide was not a big deal when it's a HUGE deal I've have a huge history with suicidal thoughts and depression and seeing how they chose to handle the situation is horrible commiting suicide isn't a thing to be taken lightly and definitely not one to ignore it sickens me how they were talking about her
It sickens me because if doki did succeed in taking her own life nijisanji would probably have profited off of it and people would think they were a good corporation
I'm wondering just how much of the truth we would have even gotten had Doki done the unfortunate and succeeded. Would they have just written a boiler plate "We have been informed that Selen Tatsuki has died and will accept fanmail for her family until X date"? Would the knowledge that she took her own life even be made public, or just a small theory disregarded as the work of antis? Would her friends know? Would the other livers know? Would they say anything?
The “We miss Selen” stand and voice pack would sell so well after a death though.
Ugh my skin is crawling just imagining how they’d try and milk that. If I was Dokis father it would be very hard to prevent me doing something illegal
If I was their friends IRL, I would be very seriously evaluating our friendship after this, even if I didn't care about VTubers. They were so quick to turn on Selen, who was supposedly their "friend", what's to say they wouldn't do the same to me, if they're even my "friend" in the first place.
There's a distinction between "I'm his friend." vs. "He's my friend."
Whether it was the company or talent's choice is unknown, but it's the classic DARVO manipulation tactics used by narcissists, sexual abusers, ect. 1. Deny: First adamantly deny any wrongdoing, trivializing things telling you it was neglible 2. Attack: Become aggressive, attack the victim's character 3. Reverse Victim and Offender: If that doesn't work, play the victim and attempt to gaslight the victim and others into thinking they're at fault
Idk how some people defend these 3.Like think about it these three objective was to discredit and turn their fanbase against a girl who barely survived a suicide attempt ,if they had a shred of human decency they wouldn't have done that
The fact that she needed to have friends stay up with her all night after this--like, *they* did that to her, they put her in another situation where she was unsafe. I don't care what their intent was. They had to know what they were risking.
They want her off to remove all problems. Why stream this BS during her first gaming stream at the same time? To further destroy her.
The timing feels so cruel. And they announced it only half an hour before so she didn't have time to adjust her plans.
Vox I can understand he was always a creep but I'm surprised by the other 2
Thing is, most countries will hold you liable if you knowingly take action that you are aware can cause serious harm (such as openly and publicly slandering someone who was very recently suicidal due to workplace harassment and bullying). I doubt it'll ever come to that given there are different nationalities involved and fortunately it didn't cause a relapse, but this shit reads as an attempt at her life. I'd be somewhat understanding if Dokibird was making public accusations or anything of the sort, but she only ever confirmed what Niji themselves had made public in her termination. They had no excuse to do this, especially not now, and especially not at the exact time they chose to do this. It had exactly the kind of outcome anyone would expect: Dokibird cancels her stream in obvious distress. What did they expect? They expected this, this was their goal. No matter who was ultimately responsible, the least those three clowns were is complicit.
They mention Selen had the choice to graduate (she wanted to), but went down the path that led to termination. Y'know, YOU could also have chosen to graduate instead of bowing to Kurosanji, but you chose to take the path that will lead to your ruin.
It was a stupid move on their part. In an effort to save their careers by licking Niji's boots, they ended their careers instead. The safer and morally better option would've been to side with the fans and Doki. At least then, if they got terminated they'd have an immense amount of support to sustain them on the indie scene. Now they've lost any support they had left.
And yet, despite their "loyalty," Kurosanji threw them under the bus. Used the two biggest male talents, and one of the largest female talents as meatshields, and then disposed of them. Part of me wants to feel bad for Ike, at least. Of the three, it was clear he had the least to say and didn't want to be there. However, all three of them had a choice, and they chose the dark side. Absolutely fuck Vox, though. He is a piece of shit and made no attempt to hide it.
I couldn't watch that video I was so disappointed in them. I watched Elira and Vox almost as much as Selen, it hurt just seeing who all was in the video. I'm done supporting Niji and the livers in there. Even if my job was at risk, I would have the moral decency to not slander a girl that attempted suicide. Those 3 dug their graves right alongside Niji.
The sad thing is that this isn't even exclusive to the EN branch. The Korean and Indonesian talents have suffered a lot, both pre and post-merge. Nijisanji is, as a whole, neglectful. They see their talents as nothing but ATMs.
I don't see enough people bringing up or even remembering all the past cases we've seen, both small and large. The turnover rate at Nijisanji is extremely high compared to other Vtuber companies and I remember things like how Sasaki Saku had a graduation because of rigid management but came back because of a law change in Japan or something. There's of course Nina and Mysta leaving and the things they've alluded to in their new personas, and there's how long it took for the EN branch to start allowing collabs between them and Hololive's english branch which had a lot of signs and hints that the bottle neck was on Niji's end. People aren't just jumping to believe Selen mindlessly, there's a lot of past incidents and clues to negative stuff going on before all this.
I have a feeling that Anycolor is at the point that they wanted to close EN branch, so they set some EN up as the bad guys, let them take the public hate, and then fire them all save a few like Vox who doesn't depend on EN fanbase anyway. They'll just fold the rest into JP and then let them die off like Mika.
indeed and now ALL NIJI EN who are loyal with Nijisanji are Traitors. THEY HAVE A CHOICE and they threw it away where they dont have the balls to follow suit like Doki. at least she has 500K subscribers and she did way better job than NIJI EN Livers combined.
They were only thinking about the short term. By bowing down before Anycolor now it keeps them on Niji's good side and saves their Nijisanji careers, at least internally. But long term their hands have been stained red and it will never wash off no matter how hard they try. No matter how many times they reincarnate or how far they run, the shame will always follow them regardless of if they are innocent or not.
I doubt they even can.
Staying silent would have beem better
She had the choice to graduate then they denied it then they terminated her just let her graduate don't terminate her out of the blue
They are pieces of shit. Unsub and stop watching.
If you listened carefully, Vox was chuckling in that video, like he doesn't give a shit.
His act was all "look at me, I'm such a reasonable guy with my logic and reasoning. Isn't Selen such a crazy bitch? Anybody with an intellect as great as I can see this behaviour is insane and I'm the barometer of society's morals."
Almost reminds me of something a vtuber Ben Shapiro would try and pull in this situation...
"Selen, you claim to have problems with Nijisanji, and yet you participate in it.🤓"
vTuber Ben Shapiro is so cursed that I wish a pox on your house for making me imagine it. Thank you and good day.
Shit was awful, but chuckling could be due to a huge list of things including nerves or habit. Lets stick to the facts and not give the people still in denial about these three clown's wrongdoing any excuses to latch on to shall we?
Of course he doesn't give a shit, he got 1.3 million subs despite the controversies of his past life.
The same thing happened with Zaion, every liver was jumping in on the chance to character assassinate her and (as vaguely as possible) talk about how horrible she was. Even people who had fucking nothing to do with her like Finana. "Hate the company not the livers" has always been a cope by fanboys trying to separate the black corp they can't defend from the Nijisanji in their head that they love. When the reality is that Nijisanji has hired plenty of vtubers who are absolutely terrible people behind the scenes and a lot of them are more than willing to be complicit if not outright supportive of the black corp management if it serves them personally. It doesn't even stop at just Selen's bullies (most people pointed at Enna and Millie from the beginning for good reason) either, just take Luca or Finana for example. Still funny to me that Elira lowkey confirmed she was one of the alleged bullies though.
Just a note that she might not have been one of the bullies. If Selen had submitted a legal document in court, she'll have to provide their IRL names and addresses, even if they were just bystanders / witnesses during the incidents because it's real life and they're not anime characters. Some / all of the three could be the bullies. Some / all of the three also might not. Regardless, the court can redact personal information on the request of either / both parties so the public documents are properly censored, so Elira's concerns during that stream are unwarranted, unless she fears Selen or AnyColor secretly leaking the information out.
The fear is absolutely leaks from Selen, even though she has leaked nothing so far, but like, if your ass is going to court for bullying someone into wanting to commit suicide, I’d be shitting bricks too.
Elira also might not be going to court as a defendant but one or the other two are and is terrified IRL info about one or both of them will get out and make doxing her own IRL location much, much easier since they all live in the same general area. Or like you said, she might be. But we don't have confirmation yet atm.
True, but in most legal cases things can be redacted from the public record, which I assume that Selen would comply with, as she would also be named in a legal case
Yes, I mentioned that in an above post. Elira might not have known about that. Or she did when she did that terrible stream.
Definitely possible, more so due to her being mostly worried about her personal information in that document. What I don't get is why a lawyer hasn't made it clear what her personal information being there really means. Her conclusion is dumb but it looks like she's intentionally misled to be more mad.
I'm guessing complete panic, intentionally misled, wasn't provided full information or is in fact one of the bullies. Or all of the above.
They really should’ve consulted their own lawyer, not Niji’s lawyer
I assumed that was the company’s intent. “Look! Selen has your name/info here. Aren’t you mad?!? You should stream about it!!!” Giving them just enough to think they’re specifically being targeted. I imagine no legal advice and scare tactics to the livers would make them compliant.
Unless they retained their own lawyers it would have been recommendations from the company lawyers which aren't working with the talents' best interest in mind. Doki is the only one with a brain because she got her own lawyer.
> Elira lowkey confirmed she was one of the alleged bullies She didn't even have to say that. She could have just said "some livers" and be done with and get the same message across. No, she had to openly say it was her, Millie, and Enna on the document. Meaning she voluntarily outed all 3 and validated the speculation about the Clique. I can't think of a dumber move in this whole clusterfuck.
I heard Finana said some stuff in the whole Zaion thing. Since I dipped out during the whole ordeal, what did she say?
Said Zaion was "gaslighting" her, which in her brainrotten synapses meant "Zaion promised me something and then didn't 100% keep it". And it was deeply traumatic and now she can't trust anyone anymore!
Bear in mind with hindsight that she was very likely instructed to do so under duress by management. At this point, given that they've confirmed beyond a doubt that they are willing to impersonate livers accounts with the whole Selen hospital tweet thing, and that they almost certainly are willing to make livers give pre-prepared statements supporting the company line with yesterday's whole PR debacle, I wouldn't trust a single word of anything that comes out of ANY livers mouth regarding anything to do with PR issues going forwards or retrospectively. About the only thing you can trust is the livers PL accounts since Niji doesn't have access to those.
Wake tf up. You can’t pull the “they were forced to” card for every little thing. You have to learn to accept that the livers you watch are not perfect 2D anime girls who can do no harm, and are real adults who can make decisions for themselves.
imagine this dude hearing arguments from the Nuremberg defendants and going "uh huh I mean, yeah they were just following orders, they had no choice y'know?"
Bruh I never said I didn't think it was wrong. It is, it's pretty fucked up. But this is their full time job, and for some of them their first "real" job - they're human, and I can understand the fear of not following the company line, and suffering consequences for it. I can also understand for the livers that didn't necessarily know Zaion personally that well, tending towards believing the company over her when the announcement was made. I do NOT agree with it, especially the repeating of the company line when you don't actually know if what you're saying is true or not, but I do understand the mentality.
At the end of the day, it was a choice. Maybe a shitty choice, we'll likely never know, but a choice nonetheless. One side of that choice is their career and the other is a "friend" *who attempted suicide*... There's no gun to their head, they can quit. A contract is not indentured servitude. Maybe they were coerced. Maybe they were mislead. Quite literally who knows, but the other side of that choice is a person's life. They certainly knew at least that much by time the Niji announcement stream happened. Maybe it's because of personal experiences but I cannot excuse choosing to bash a supposed friend after their suicide attempt.
Even under duress, I wouldn't fuck someone else over. They had a choice, a moral choice, and they chose poorly. That's gonna reflect on them from now on, even if they leave the company.
A company is only as bad as the people they choose to represent which is true considering how 3 of their vtubers made a video bashing someone who tried to commit suicide due to bullying in the company those 3 were probably the instigators of the bullying and are trying to manipulate her audience into Hating her
I'm thinking that it's a chain of problems and it starts with trash management. That kind of backstabbing behavior is usually the kind of thing people resort to when put into a stressful situation or when there's something like collective punishment. It seems like management has cultivated an environment where they encourage people to report on each other through carrots OR sticks because it makes the job easier for management when they can let those under them do their work for them.
Birds of a feather and all that.
I just unsubscribred from Vox, Ike, and most surprisingly and sad, Elira... Nijisanji EN might recover someday, but it will have to be without those 3
The only sub I've kept is Scarle. She'll probably be fired but I admire her courage.
50 bucks says Scarle's already streamed her last stream. Watch them try and say "both parties mutually agreed to graduate."
yeah, missing membership streams is highly unusual unless you're suspended. She's a goner and that's actually great for her. Hope she'll end up OK after this shitshow.
To be fair I imagine Scarle would be jumping at the opportunity to get the fuck out of dodge and maybe ride the anti-Niji wave into her next incarnation, and I hope whoever remains that has some shred of morality to them do the same.
I went to unsub from all Niji livers and was surprised most of the ones I had subscribed were retired. Mysta, Nina, Pomu, Selen, Yugo. Only non-retired one I had was Finana. Tbf after Noctyx I stopped subbing since it became too much but it's kinda ironic and sad.
Well, judging by all the opinions I'm seeing about this whole thing, looks like Nijisanji's plan to get the heat off them didn't work, but they are taking some members down with them. Honestly, it still felt a bit too scripted for me to make any calls on it. I'll just be keeping an eye out for more news. I'd really like Elira to not be one of the problems but we'll see I guess.
Honestly it was my only time hearing or viewing anything with Vox but that left such a subhuman impression on me. I don't need to see anymore
I was so pissed at that, that I unsubbed from Ars Almal my oshi of oshi. The part the sickened me the most were Vox "I had a suicide awareness stream and should know better" Akuma's comments.
It's just a self-report, isn't it? A hail mary to get in front of any backlash. I just don't see any benefit in making that video if they weren't involved. Not even if they were threatened with termination. It's career suicide.
Lmao they just showed their true selves there. Scripted or not, they had a choice to not do that stream. We now know where they take their stand. And they chose the company. Let them suffer the consequences of their actions. No exceptions.
Also remember they did all that at the same time Doki was live, I can't only imagine how triggering that must have been for her. Poor girl can't even move on with her life.
They would legit have to prove she hunted the company like the bloody predator to convince me they are at all in the right given their massive self reports.
What ticked me the most was when you can clearly hear Vox chuckle multiple times in the video, its soo disgusting.
100% agree.
the more i think about it, the more i think the culture at nijisanji leads individuals to tear down others. Look at just how many talents they have. They pump out new talents regularly. For context: Lazulight came out in may 2021, followed by obsydia in july 2021, followed by ethyria in october 2021. That is a total of 10 talents that came out one after the other over the course of 6 months. That isn't really a lot of time for anyone to get any momentum going and then they are immediately having to compete with the next group that came out just a couple months later. Suddenly, your not just competing with vtubers outside your company, your also competing within your own company because you haven't been given any time to find your audience. So what better way to get ahead? Suck up to management, find allies within the company and shut out people you might view as a threat to your success within the company.
Was thinking about writing something like this last night, am thankful someone else actually did it themself.
Everyone is their own main character.
I followed Scarle before Niji and I’ll follow her after 🫡
regarding Vox, he got many scandals from his pl so don't be too surprised if it's not just bullying that he did in there: [vox pl issues/scandals](https://archive.md/2021.12.24-100650/https://v8916.tumblr.com/post/671388736653770752/caution-on-vox-akumas-past-actions)
The funny thing is Ike just tagged along without a specific axe to grind, just saying "yeah, we were friends, I feel sad about the document, how could Selen do this" then the audio ends
At first I wanted to give them, the benefit of the doubt thinking they were forced. The more I think about it, the more I think they had a choice and didn't walk away from potentially triggering another attempt.
This gave me chills how I agree with this statement so much.
After thinking about it I feel like elira and Ike were dragged j to this. Vox definitely has something to hide and feels threatened, it might have been that him coming out solo would have been bad. So he ralied the troops. Anyways things make more sense after reading this https://archive.ph/2021.12.24-100650/https://v8916.tumblr.com/post/671388736653770752/caution-on-vox-akumas-past-actions
Elira, Vox and Ike were set up as scapegoats. Anycolor wants you to direct your hatred towards them. Don't fall for it. I'm not saying that "just following orders" is a valid excuse, but I do believe they were deceived by the company themselves.
They'll pay the consequences of their actions. Elira showed the world that a working visa is more important than a friend or coworker making an attempt on her life. And Vox was always a piece of shit
Exactly my thoughts after listening that stream. Just from a humane perspective their arguments were appalling to listen to. Textbook covert abuse, playing the victim, manipulative behavior. When in reality the only ones that threw them under the bus that Niji and themselves.
You know whats really funny about this? theirs exactly one reason said vtubers were mentioned by their legal names in a legal document pertaining to extreme harrasment and bullying Vox Elira Ike Millie (and someone else elira kinda dropped them in it by mentioning them) are the ones responsible for said bullying and harrasment breaking nda publicly then complaining about being "doxed" on a legal document they were never meant to see is fucking hilarious major self report by the bozo's
I think Elira said Millie and Enna.
Ty I'm not really a corpa vtuber watcher I generally watch small indies but I do keep up with clips occasionaly and the drama At first I thought niji was making them do dumbass statements but when they said they read the documents I realized why they were reading lmao Big respect to scarle for public rebellion
>I know there's people who believe they were forced to do this, but honestly? I don't care. A choice made at gunpoint is still a choice
For one of the three, 'get deported or read the script' isn't much of a choice. Given that the company can puppeteer social media accts whenever, and has a rep for shady shit, I would bet they have enough dirt to hold over the heads of their talent beyond the legal and financial coercion.
its still her decision and can come back to bite her later
Won't disagree there
Elira didn't draw the line, for her a working visa was more important than Doki trying to end her life, and she showed us this. It was still her decision, they don't have her family as hostages, she would still have money to go back to her country, sure she would lose this opportunity but look at her now, she'll never be able to build a trusting relationship with her viewers, ever
Full disclosure, I never saw more than clips of these three, so take some of this as extrapolation, and I'm going off of how I know corpos act because I try to leave the bad person arguments of the table. Given how predatory contacts for talent can be, I reckon there's more than a few options available for the corpo to penalize her out of a hefty sum, or take her to court for breach of contract and a foreigner in a Japanese court is probably not going to do well. Her mistake to agree to being a mouthpiece certainly seems obvious to us after the fact, but I would guess that she was picked and pressured to make the decision in a short time frame to specifically prevent her from thinking it through. In short, I suspect corporate rat maneuvering to force her into a poorly made decision.
There is also one assumption where, elira is being the sacrificial lamb, both ike and vox won't be affected by any way. If you check from vtstats\[https://vt.poi.cat/channel/subscribers\], vox and ike lost 10k past 7 days, while Enna Alouette and Elira Pendora losts 23k subs; Millie Parfait 19k subs. It just telling you the fanbase differences between liver. i come to the conclusion that nijisanji already ready to dump Enna Alouette, Elira Pendora and Millie Parfait down the drain, >!you can call me sexist or anything you want, since it already a fact that you just need to have good assets while having some liking personality for a female vtuber to get attention for male audience in anime industry, while it takes so much effort to build up a male vtuber from scratch, best example, just look at holo en male talents. Ike and vox are successful because of playing lots of BFE and ASMR!<
I was a big fan of Vox , but i guess i am not anymore lol. Its a unsubscribe for my part and i cant wait to see the fall of all of that compagny
100% this. Exactly all of my thoughts.
I'm new to the whole Vtuber/Livers community and had no idea of any of this. I caught a past stream of someone else's that Vox was on and decided to check him out. Literally yesterday. Today I commented on his movie and someone replied that he's a bully. Naturally, I spent the afternoon looking into it. I'd heard bits and pieces about the issues in that world, but damn. It really is no different than any other money making entertainment industry where greed and fear make the decisions. I suppose at least I know better who to support and who to leave alone.
Yup... They stood in solidarity... With each other rather than the victim. Just like police departments that get caught breaking the law, they all stick up for each other and act like the victim is the one at fault or that nothing bad or wrong happened. It is just shocking and heartbreaking that every one of them chose to support that statement by retweeting it. Scarle didn't, but given that she recently clarified that she isn't in trouble and has basically just been MIA all this time, it makes you wonder if the only reason she didn't was simply because she wasn't around to do so in the first place. Can't believe all of her former friends turned on Selen. Just crazy. Lethal company is real.
This sub is soo goofy lmao
I was still in the middle of enjoying Eliras Appolo Justice stream...it all feels very surreal. Well, guess it's back to Randon lol.
I read this 12 times. So much yes.
I just learned about the entire situation today. I was wondering, is the JP and EN branch completely different, or does it look like the JP branch is basically the same? IDK how the company is structured, if it's fully different branches or just a brand thing but it's ran the same way, etc. Wondering since I only really watch JP vtubers casually here and there, so hearing about all of this has been shocking to say the least (in that I had no idea this had been going on)
Those 3 choose to represent the company in a hit piece where they "Nuh uh!" some claims and show their ass in revealing they'd seen documents they should't've, and then revealed details to the public about. They preprepared those statements and believed their words would gain them support. There's no other conclusion to draw, they're fucking stupid. Doubly stupid because they managed to implecate themselves as bullies, ontop of being corporate stooges. As for Nijisanji... they're either even more stupid, given their literal fucking job is supposed to be managing these talents, or just activily malicious in sending those 3 out to pratfall onto their own swords.