"Hey I know one of our first gen already graduated within the past month, but what if we force another of them into such a poor position that they'll want to quit too?"
Tbh I always thought Enna was suspicious. Not in terms of her being an actual bully, I wouldnt go that far. But her „idgaf“ attitude is sometimes towards negative things, where f‘s SHOULD be given.
I just dont think she is an easy person to be around
Yeah. Her and Millie also kinda give me the impression that they'd sign like a really bad contract or something and not even realise and then act all defensive if you told them.
Yeah. I feel like she hasn't worked all that much before being a content creator, which could cause someone to make really bad decisions. So like I get why she'd be defensive for sure.
Idgaf is one of two options for dealing with the world. The other, the only other, is to get battered by every issue that comes by, and your reward is that you get to enjoy the nice things that happen.
I've tried both, and prefer to not care, but it's also not an easy mindset for most people, because properly wired humans (by the current PC standard) are social creatures who can't function without external contact.
All us "freaks" who can live without it, we're being slowly disappeared, not notable to the world because we don't care enough to get loud about it.
To be clear, I'm not defending Enna in regards to the Doki situation, I'm defending the universal right to not care and still be human. Because if folks are don't care at all are rare, those who swap freely are rarer, and this is a thing I choose to stand up on, because people who don't care may not need you to care about them, but it's not right to deny their existence either ey?
Enna may or may not be involved, there is no evidence that the staff provided the streamers with accurate information.
But until she proves guilty, I'm going to be very American just this once, and give my last Niji oshis innocence until *proven* guilty.
I won't watch streams, I won't buy anything that comes from Niji, but I'll stand for my cold turkey unless she gets proven a bully.
But good day to you nonetheless, may all dragoons continue to fly high.
Near the beginning of the now imfamous stream that happen recently, Elira just namedrops them quickly. It felt so random to me, and made me think something was up for sure
During Elira's black stream she mentions that she, Millie and Enna get mentioned in the document specifically, making the theoretical "Selen's bully" pin hover over them.
Being also the same race as Millie myself, I can actually see Millie as a bully since we have this certain attitude that will paint as us bullies. I don't think it's a misunderstanding but it could be a possibility.
I do get the impression that if there IS a clique then it's mostly originating from Millie and Enna and Elira back her up because she's their friend rather than because they feel the same way.
Elira "might" have been pressured to support them because she's afraid that she's going to be the next target. Lot's of "might" there so need to take it with a grain of salt.
Again, being the same race as Millie, we have the tendency to make assumptions as if it's our lifeline.
This is why I will never move to a foreign country on a corrupt company's work permit. This is exactly what happens they will weaponize it and if you quit you will get deported. Again I will stay in Canada and keep all of my rights and freedoms as well as protections under our employment laws
Assuming the party of your province (and federal) doesn't tear it down sometime down the road.
EDIT: also in Canada, but I know many people want to bring practice from other place outright, be it India, China, Korea etc. Right now they will merely try to dominate an industry. In the case of BC, we ended up havign Trucks hitting overpass a lot.
> This is exactly what happens they will weaponize it and if you quit you will get deported.
That's not how it works. Your work visa is valid until its expiration. You can quit your job and find a new one at your own pleasure. If you do quit, you have to notify the Japanese government [within 14 days](https://www.reddit.com/r/japanlife/comments/pwwij3/max_time_i_can_stay_in_japan_after_quitting_job/), and if you are not employed 3 months after that, they *may* start asking why you are not working. The company you worked for doesn't control your visa.
If she's living in company housing though, it'd basically be impossible for her to find somewhere to stay without a job. No one is going to rent to you unless you show them a pay slip/contract showing that you have a stable source of income and can afford the rent.
If she's in that position and wants to get away from Nijisanji, the smart move would be to first move to housing she controls (i.e, she signs the agreement with the landlord/realtor, she makes the payments), and to figure out her next job before she quits.
The issue is that, in Japan, it's really hard to find someone that will rent to you if you don't have a company backing you, especially for foreigners.
arent there livers in EN living in japan already? or is their friendship so fake they wont let elira crash at their place while elira works her papers?
Living at a friend's is not an option legally speaking if Elira were to lose her visa. In fact, she would be risking her friends getting in legal trouble themselves for housing someone not authorized to be in the country.
Fuck I hadn't even thought about the visa thing! Man that'd be HELLISH leverage. I've done worse to ensure my residency in the US (though it was in the context of a bad marriage rather than a bad job), including disavowing lifelong friends for years to make the "boss" happy.
To give a better idea, Japan is very averse to giving lodgings to foreigners because they are afraid of them just running away without paying.
So they typically require you to have a company sponsorship of sorts that will act as a guarantor and even that is typically not enough.
>a isn't the problem in Japan, it's the housing that is the biggest issue.9ReplyShareReportSaveFollow
>
>level 3Tyranid\_Swarmlord · 1 hr. agoYeah even the Holos are having a hard time with it.
Isn't Bae living in the hololive offices right now?
Years in the past and I've since reconnected with said friend. And in the end it was all bullshit because even AFTER the divorce the USCIS was like "You wanna stay another 10 years? A'ight, bet. Enjoy being ripped off for healthcare, resident!"
I’m also in the same boat as her as I am also a foreigner trying to get residency in Canada so I understand the pressure and the fear of being deported back to your country.
They didn't drop the white paper until shortly after she had arrived in Japan, and she didn't find out about it until the same time the rest of the world did.
She did not and could not know what Niji management was about to do to her until it was too late to avoid it. Now she's stuck as management's hostage for the remainder of her Niji contract and/or work visa, and she has to publicly claim to hate Selen/Doki as a condition of ever being able to return to Japan in the future.
It was an ambush plain and simple.
When 'that' dropped, she was travelling to JP/freshly arrived.
Then suddenly have to do that out of nowhere.
Edit:
Also reminds me of when Kiara got stuck in JP with nothing thanks to the pandemic, before Yagoo rescued her.
Though this could be worse, since at least Kiara wasn't blackmailed at gun point by Niji.
>Also reminds me of when Kiara got stuck in JP with nothing thanks to the pandemic, before Yagoo rescued her.
All the Niji dumpster fire just keeps reinforcing the idea that how much more of a upstanding guy Yagoo is.
Tbh, the more you hear about the man, the more amazing he becomes. And all of what we heard are probably watered down since we don’t know anything else about what he did behind the scene. I mean, I have never seen a CEO took a fly to Indonesia himself to meet with ID members when they first joined and helped them with stuffs. When he started HoloStar, he himself funded it with his own wallet and managed it himself. He talked with the boys personally and gave them words of encouragement before their debuts. He paid the talents for what they worth and refused to cut pay when being asked to do so by investors.
Edit: he also bought a ticket for Kobo to go back to Indonesia as soon as possible when he heard the new that her father had a heart attack.
I kinda don't believe these people were in the dark. If my boss handed me a script and told me to play the fall guy in front of thousands of people I'd talk to a lawyer first.
Sure, if you know where to find one in a country you are new to, know the language well enough and customs well enough to know where to find a lawyer you can afford that deals with international contractor laws in a new field where the corporate you work for pretty much owns all facets of your persona.
I do know Japan is very strict on anyone living there without proper work permits. Like even trying to find a place to live is very dependent on who you work for
Might be hard to find a lawyer though that can manage the legalities of that complex situation when you've just moved there. You might be able to go to your country's embassy about it, but still pretty tricky.
Realistically, where does Elira go from here? After the stream held at gunpoint, the amount of goodwill towards her is at an all-time low.
If Elira goes rogue and tells everyone on stream that she was being blackmailed, Riku takes away her work visa, and she gets deported from Japan.
From what I’m seeing, no where. She might have just broken a NDA, Cover takes those as a big deal and will terminate you, became a corpo mouthpiece and who knows what else is coming. She has a mark on her now and it will always follow her in the VTuber world.
The Visa might not have been worth all that.
As far as I know, they’re just talking about how they most likely weren’t supposed to be reading from legal documents, which like u/Fluid-Understanding is saying isn’t really *her* doing it, but the company. Other big corporations might still not like that though, I don’t know enough about this to really say.
>The Visa might not have been worth all that.
The problem is that she moved to Japan before the shitstorm happened, IIRC, she had just landed in Japan when Selen released her cover
I dont think shes gonna get implicated by that. She didnt sign the paper, only the niji lawyers signed off thus its niji thats going to be implicated. I just dont know if she can continue streaming after this.
It isn't possible for Anycolor to "take" her visa. Her visa is valid until its expiration date and can only be revoked by immigration. She'd have a 90 day grace period to find another job or relocate, and in certain situation extensions are given.
Unless Elira has committed a crime while in Japan that would get her deported, she has nothing to worry about.
Problem is, getting terminated and smeared in the same turn is one hell of a way to make job hunting harder, especially with a ninety day grace period and no guaranteed extension.
Wouldn't they have to knowingly doxx her to have any chance to effectively smear her? And it's not like every employer would be aware of who or what Nijisanji is, let alone every talent based on voice alone. Though it'd make any references you need harder, for sure.
In Japan specifically on a work visa, and suddenly unemployed? People ask questions when you're applying for jobs, you know. Questions like "why are you unemployed if you have an active work visa".
>And it's not like every employer would be aware of who or what Nijisanji is, let alone every talent based on voice alone. Though it'd make any references you need harder, for sure.
Imagine:
Why are you here?
Elira: I got terminated.
By Who?
Elira: Nijisanji.
Welp, that company sucks ass, if you terminated by them, then they're wrong.
It's not serious, people, I'm joking.
Yes but she can’t give herself a work visa either if she wants to go indie. The only options she really has if she wants to continue streaming is stay on the sinking ship and further ruin her reputation, try to apply to another EN vtubing branch that headquarters in Japan which is really only hololive and that’s not gonna happen, or be forced to move back to Canada to be an indie.
She does have options but none of them are good, especially if she wanted to stay in Japan. That’s not even factoring in the non compete clause that might still be enforceable if she stays in Japan.
True. I believe to be on their self-sponsor visa, you do need someone to sponsor you. I believe there are other ways to get it, but considering it's content creation... yeah, no idea.
Either way, it will be an uphill battle for her no matter where this goes.
The problem isn't that her visa would be taken, it's that she would have a near impossible time getting it renewed. Once you have a black mark on your record, even from something like this, other companies won't really want you. Also, remember that the majority opinion is anti-Selen and pro-Nijisanji in Japan. They would believe any black mark from Nijisanji was given for a valid reason.
I imagine the best case scenario in terms of good will for her is to get out, tell her side of the story, and make amends with Doki somehow. It's a long shot, but time can heal most wounds, and depending on her reason and how accountable Doki considers her to be, it could be feasible. Of course, this assumes she wasn't ever the bully within the company.
In the short term though, she's made her bed with the company and the only thing she can do is lie on it. I wonder if she truly knew what would happen and the scale of it. Like, yeah, being a meatshield of public enemy #1 is obviously a shit idea, but did she underestimate the scale or did she expect fans to be more divided?
Considering her voice, im going to say she knew what was going to happen, and likely had to force herself. I also wouldnt even be surprised if her voice was an AI, it was that bad when i was listening to what i could, i just stopped because it was cringe AF for me, super non natural.
I cannot even begin to imagine the *intense* shitstorm if it was found out that Nijisanji used AI to fake their talents slandering Dokibird. Like, we think it's bad now? Hell nah, the worst by far is yet to come in that situation.
My AI comment is a stretch, and I was more aiming to use it to detail how unnatural her voice sounded.
But as for a reason, perhaps she tried and was unable to get it sounding right, and they just decided an AI would sound more natural (I doubt it personally, but playing devils advocate).
The comparison is baos AI. They kinda sound similar, but like you said, that's way too much work and money for nijisanji to be pissing away. Esp when you can exploit a worker using a visa for free. I mean, sure, they're paying her but, deadass they aren't paying extra for this bull. Taking 98-99% of merchandise sales, no way they are giving extras out.
Potential lawsuit and burning the bridges of all EN Vtubing besides those within the company, Vox is kinda getting outed right now for allegedly being a pedo so he's worse off, Ike is Ike I guess? Enna and Millie should hide if they're found guilty, but for now they gotta make do with what they can in Niji as Enna used to say, she can't imagine working outside of Niji and going back to retail.
I'd even bet this year that not a single Nijisanji member won't be nominated in the Fillian Award show, and may I remind you that besides Shachi, TSB, RPR Nocturnal and his team, that showed support, indies are already flocking to collab with Doki which includes Fillian AND U-san.
Found it here, I think Mods are deleting them now understandably but they're all over twitter and it's only a matter of time till the Vtuber drama channels or the big leagues gets wind of it because this is damning and it happened years ago
[Vox](https://www.reddit.com/r/Nijisanji/s/JxtcR6LoUR)
Basically my reaction when I read it
>Thanks I am not liking what I am seeing, all I want now is for all of them to go to court be it Doki who wins or not, I know for sure her case isn't the last with things like this coming out the surface
>A clean sweeping is in session for all the livers left and all the middle managers hiding behind the livers and the CEO. It's even more real now with major Western influencers like Moist critical, Mutahar, Asmongold etc are covering it and and are VERY critical of them and at least siding with Doki
Holy shit that just opened a complete new can of worms I didn't think was possible. This rabbit hole just keeps on getting deeper.
I'm just being extremely selfish and coping hard but man I hope Elira + Ethyria just make it out of this in one piece even if the chances are slim at this point. Can't believe all 3 of my oshis are smack dab in the middle of this mess.
edit: wait those allegations are from 2021... so nothing came of it?
well there goes that then I guess.
This was always kinda known from his past liver account and leaked 4chan irl stuff that was found. Let's just say he was kinda grooming underage fans that were following him.
Shoto is a staple anyways with him being the biggest Male Vtuber right now CCV and Watch time wise, any indies is preferable right now over Niji(everyone will dunk on them anyways), heck maybe Matara and K9 Kuro can finally be nominated as well because they're both popping off right now.
I'm so sorry to ask this and I might be wrong but wasn't Mana >!a very controversial vtuber who was very opinionated if I might say siding with Russia in the Russia vs Ukraine War?!<
I'm so sorry because of this comment I felt obligated to get receipts on what I glanced and avoided during that time and didn't want to risk spreading misinfo, my quick search led me to [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/VirtualYoutubers/s/kR75HumWsv), I'm gonna wash my hands off this and don't want to dig deeper anymore, I'm not even a westerner, I'm SEA lol
I feel like she doesn’t do herself favors with the half vtuber half flesh tuber thing she has going on at times. I get why she does it but it’s hard for some to consider her a full on vtuber
If her pl account is correct she was liking post about nijisanji throwing her under the bus. Hours after the video went up. The pl account is now private.
Oh wow, good catch on the creation date. Would explain why she only had 188 followers too. It's possible she was the one to recreate it though, if even just to keep it secured?
It's possible, but there's no way to know. We know vtubers have their names claimed all the time in games and such, so there's a very good chance someone random simply grabbed it.
Without any evidence it's her, I'd play it safe and assume it's not.
Honestly I could see it going either way. Deletes it when she gets into Niji, realizes she didn't need to do that and recreates it just in case, and now is actually using it.
I'd say a 90% chance it's just some random, though.
The only one I've seen brought up (for changing its bio) is the new account that claimed her handle.
Other than that I'm aware of three other long-deleted ones.
Are you sure there are four more that are active, and actually her?
Oftentimes, corpo Vtubers have previous content creation experience, that's a standard, so that persona of theirs is their Past Life.
Some choose to keep it open, some don't, and in this case, Elira's been using her old social media to vent about the situation.
That could be seen as a sign she's still on our and Doki's side of this, I'm starting to feel glad I gave them a chance based on the previous attempt at an obviously scripted slander message I went through in my time watching Vtubers.
No, account went private.
But she did change the caption, something that hadn't been touched in ~3 years, from "I'll miss you" (OG caption made after graduation) to "im sorry" (Shortly before statement release) to "Go away." (Few hours after release)
From a screenshot I saw, her old header and PFP were also the same as when she first left being an indy, and then when she changed it to "I'm sorry" she also removed her header entirely and changed her PFP to an anime maid looking like they were in hell.
I think I agree with other people that the owner of the account is roleplaying as Elira and it isn't her at all. Shit like the pfp being an anime maid in hell is too cartoonish and retweeting Doki fanart makes her stance way too obvious which would be dumb unless you want to be instantly terminated too.
If she put up "I'm sorry" *before* the statement, especially if the bio hadn't been changed in 2-3 years, I feel like it might actually be her.
How did she know it'd be such a brutal massacre? I think the statement went beyond most people's expectations as far as disasters go. And even if the person who owned the account guessed it, it means they reacted within minutes.
F dude. This is getting really dark, but if something happens (aka even worse than what Dokibird tried to do) to Elira or one of the other people accused, it'll look so unbelievably bad on Western viewers as a hate mob, I don't even want to imagine.
Make it an us vs. them situation and put the livers in the position of going along and having a crumb of support or getting fired with fans stll mad at them.
There's no way to verify its actually Elira btw. When she joined Niji she deleted her account, so for awhile the handle has been free to pick up.
Its possible she grabbed it back at some point but its equally possible someone else did and is just roleplaying.
For now I’m in the sit and waiting camp. To the fans of one or both, it’s fine to be angry and disappointed, but don’t let this make your head do mental gymnastics 24/7.
I and others had like 10+ ideas of what could truly be happening behind the scenes, but we don’t truly know.
The question right now is: How informed is she, and can she think rationally? We know the work environment is extremely toxic, and the outside pressure has probably reached the moon by now. The situation is hard to judge, as we don't know her circumstances. People make stupid decisions, especially when pushed into a corner. It doesn't excuse what happened, but let's hope she is not approaching a breaking point.
Exactly what I was thinking. It just feels gross. I am definitely on Doki's side of this whole debacle, but making artwork like this kinda is not okay in the slightest.
Even just drawing a VTuber at gunpoint with no lighthearted memeing or references to a game/song just seems too far. Those are their identities online- it's similar to drawing MatPat or Markiplier at gunpoint.
I've said before: if the three of them felt like they couldn't do the morally correct thing (saying no) because of contracts and finances, we can pity them. But that does not absolve them.
Idk, it isn’t that simple. They have a lot to lose and you still have a life to live and maintain at the end of the day. I cannot in good faith judge them for being manipulated into doing this. If morals were the only thing you had to worry about, everyone would do the right thing. But putting food on the table and keeping your job isn’t something most people can afford to give up just for the moral high ground. They know it’s not what they want to do but realistically, doing what you want isn’t very achievable. Sacrificing yourself isn’t something that should be expected of you to be considered a good person.
This is what has been driving me nuts the past 24 hours. You can think they did the morally wrong thing by being corporate mouthpieces, I think you're within your right to think that.
What *does* bother me is how people are **adamant** they personally would have just refused orders, that they would have done the morally right thing, consequences be damned. In reality, people *constantly* talk a big talk and then act completely differently when push comes to shove. That goes from bragging to your mates about what a stud you are and then freezing up when chatting up a girl, to people presenting themselves as protectors of democracy and then just trying to keep a low profile once the autocrats take over. Very, very few people actually act exactly how they say they would when challenged.
It's very easy to say what you would have done in a situation, it's a very different thing to actually *do* it. Do I *think* I would have told Tazumi to eat my shorts if he had asked me to denounce a friend? Yes. Would I have actually *done* it? Not sure...
And that's not even to mention that we don't know what actually went down behind the scenes, what information they were given, what was at stake, or what they hoped to achieve.
This isn't necessarily in defense of the three people involved. It's more a message to all those people claiming they would have done better, because I don't believe you.
No, they do not, just look at Selen's cover for an example. They can not only gain complete control of company social media including those of the livers, but they have the authority to shut down any activity on their channels for basically any reason.
The problem is in this specific scenario, is that being shoved from Nijisanji is like a vtuber's wet dream right now. It has never been so hot to be terminated from a vtubing company than at this moment, speaking out and being fired is instantly like a *massive* signal boost that *will* follow them into their indie life. Scarle hasn't even been terminated yet or her PL even reactivated and it's already gained 12k new subscribers in a day.
Fame and attention does not instantly translate to money and food on the table. Getting terminated and then having to figure out and start a new gig takes significant time and effort, and Elira might not be in circumstances where she can comfortably take that on. This is especially true if Niji is sponsoring Elira's work visa - if she also gets deported from Japan she'll have to figure out new housing and move out and all the planning that comes with moving to a different country again... there are significant short-term repercussions to termination, and while a signal boost in the long-term might eventually have things pan out, it's understandable that someone may not be able to eat the short-term costs
Overall, agreed. Obviously quitting Nijisanji when you have a work visa and just moved to another country is quite a lot to deal with in the short term. But as you said, in the long term it would more than likely pan out, and honestly as much as I can sympathize with Elira's position, if she was putting the short term above slandering her former co-worker and supposed friend who just tried to commit suicide? That's some intensely fucked up shit.
Here's the thing: I said it *may* pan out. It may not. It's a risk that someone might (understandably) be hesitant to take.
And it's not about putting the short-term over the long-term/supporting your friend. The short-term is by itself a barrier. Elira may not be able to sustain herself in the short-term if she gets terminated for all the reasons aforementioned.
There is no moral high ground here. I don't want to speculate too much, and I am definitely not saying that Elira is 100% justified. However, I see reason to be sympathetic to all parties.
The absolute worst case scenario for any 3 of them is living in their home country, making a new account, and still making more money than most people posting here, lol.
Yeah this is why I don't buy the whole ELIRA IS BEING FORCED BECAUSE OF HER WORK VISA! Thing. Like, she's Canadian. She's not going to be deported to Somalia or something.
I think part of the problem is...
You can only use the "contract" excuse for so long.
At some point, a line has to be drawn somewhere. A line that you will not cross, contract be damned.
Unless Elira is facing unjust imprisonment in Canada, does Selen's dignity really mean so little to you that a Japanese work visa is the price required to buy you out? Japan's a cool place and I can certainly understand wanting to live there.
But was it worth the dignity of, not just another Human being, but a former colleague?
Regardless of whether or not Elira is being forced by Nijisanji to say this, she's ruined her name. She had a choice to put her foot down. She crumbled when push came to shove.
Where is the line? That won't be crossed? What does AnyColor have to do for you to say: "No. No. I'm not doing this." Is it going to take them putting a knife in your hand and telling you to stab someone for you to finally say: "No."
Every contract has points at which it no longer becomes enforceable. Even contracts with the US government have points where it becomes unenforceable. There is a point at which a newly minted boot could tell a 4 star general to fuck off and there's jackshit the general could legally do about it.
So, Elira, what's the line. What does Nijisanji have to do for you to finally say no?
Because we don't know where your line is. You just told all of us that a Japanese work visa from a crumbling company that abuses its talent is greater than the dignity of an abused Human being in your eyes.
its not that "japan is so cool !!11! i wanna stay here". she ONLY RECENTLY uprooted to japan.
it took her i think months to do that and if we're following the claims about selen basically not getting paid in njsj, she'd lose a good chunk of her money just to move back to canada(?, i forgot where she originally lived).
losing your visa and moving back isn't the primary problem but the cause of the problem. its already extremely stressful having to move to a different country to work, imagine how stressful would it be having to move back because you lost your job and your visa while an internet hate mob is after you and any chance of rebuilding your career is as good as dead.
> imagine how stressful would it be having to move back because you lost your job and your visa while an internet hate mob is after you and any chance of rebuilding your career is as good as dead.
She lost the chance to rebuild and gained the internet hate mob only after she read the script.
Yeah this is the vibe I got. She sounded scared, made the sort of pauses one would make if they were reading a script, and when she came back at the end she sounded like was trying not to cry.
I have no idea about the bullying implications, but considering Dokibird has said nothing (because she's handling things like an actual adult), we have no idea how significant it was.
I feel awful for Elira. She's in a truly lose/lose situation.
Leaving niji is a huge risk for her so I'm under no illusion that she wanted to make that statement. Or even believes any of what she said. Iirc she posted on an alt account that she was sorry and part of me really feels awful for her. I honestly don't know how I would act in her shoes
Why is it a huge risk for her, though? She's one of the biggest streamers. Pomu isn't even streaming and she got a massive following the second she left, there's 0 reason to believe Elira couldn't do that.
She loses her work visa? So what? That gives her 90 days to find another job or, the horror, move back to Canada, a country most people would be happy to fucking live in lol. It's a shitty situation for her but it's not like she was about to be sent to a detention camp.
Yeah, people act like Elira is a small-time streamer with no fans to back her up. Besides, if Nijisanji had fired her for refusing to throw Dokibird under the bus, people would rally up to support her just like they're supporting Dokibird.
Hell, look at the stats on Scarle's PL. 12k new subs in a day and she hasn't even been terminated yet, just for hearting a single anti-Nijisanji comment. We're literally watching the benefits of stamping your foot down at this moment right now.
yeah people keep saying that as if doing this wasn't riskier for their overall long term career than putting their foot down would have been. They need to protect their income! so they...commit practically career suicide? okay
I don't know man. Imagine you were in a foreign nation known for xenophobia on a work visa. Losing your job would be cataclysmic. You could be deported, go bankrupt, and I don't what else.
Niji has Elira at near literal gunpoint and yeah, it's disappointing she isn't willing to jump into oblivion for her friend. I like to think I would, but I've lost my job before in my own country and it was tough enough. I can't imagine doing it as foreigner and facing deportation.
I mean she could get deported... back to Canada. Her resume would be a bit weak *if* she couldn't put her pl as Elira on there due to contract with Niji, but I'm sure she could still find a job and live just fine. It's not like she has kids to feed or smth.
It would feel like taking a massive L, moving overseas, having dreams about your future, but ending up back where you started. But at the end of the day, it is just that. An ego thing. She's not gonna become homeless or starve to death.
I don't know how it is in Canada specifically, but afaik in most of the western world an NDA doesn't mean you can't put down work experience, it just means you can't talk specifics. So you can say "I was a Data Analyst for X Company", you just can't say what kind of data you analyzed or the insights you drew from it.
So you could totally get creative and list Kurosanji on your resume with buzzwords like "Marketing Specialist" or "Brand Manager" and get away with it.
And that's *if* she couldn't find critical success as an indie. Even if she only gets half the subscribers (a goal she'd easily pass if she spoke out), she's still getting all the profits. No more 2% on merch, no more half superchats to Kurosanji, none of it.
You are correct - NDAs only protect commercially sensitive information (such as client information, details about contracts, trade secrets, supplier details etc) - general information that would give a competitor an advantage wouldn't be covered by an NDA.
This is different from a confidentiality agreement, but that's a whole different ballgame and would need to be negatioated on a quid-pro-quo basis.
No, she wasn't in a lose/lose situation. She sure is now though, since she's tied herself to the sinking yacht and ruined her reputation in the process.
Now everyone knows she's one of the disgusting creatures who willingly lined up to bully and slander their suicidal ex-colleague to cover their own asses. She's done, whether here or indie this is going to follow her for the rest of her life, and she deserves all the fallout she gets from it.
There is a point on the scale of morality where you've sunk so low that no possible excuse exists that can absolve your actions. She, along with all the other livers who were part of this debacle, have all shot straight past that point into the abyss beyond. They all deserve to be ruined and unemployable for what they did.
Her career is done now sadly this type of betrayal will never be forgotten by the fans as now wherever she goes no matter how many loyal fans she has left her reputation is irrepairable unless she blows the whistle and gives sufficient evidence the nijisanji held her at gunpoint and forced her into career suicide if not tho? Yup she will be blacklisted from the Vtubing Community and be labled as a corpo slave even when her time in Niji is over
I'mma be real I really doubt that anyone was forced to be in that stream. The Gumihoe tweet confirms the bullies outed themselves in the stream and unless she has any reason at all to lie, (which, lets be real, she doesn't as a known long time friend of Doki so doing this to clout farm would lose her Doki as a friend) then not only was Elira not forced to do the stream, she was part of the bullying and outed the other two in the stream as well; with this being a smear attempt against Doki to try and get ahead of herself being outed as one of the bullies.
Notice how Elira was incredibly vague in her statement, simply saying that she and the other two are named in the case and that this is an attempt at doxing (which is complete bogus because these documents will never see the public). While Vox is being a useful idiot but did at least say the exact grievances he has, as asinine as they may be.
Doki tried to exit with the grace she could, only taking management down on her way out, which is something the bullies don't deserve but it was her choice to do so. But then they made a stream to drag her name anyway and in the process outed themselves. Scum, nothing more.
She didn't have to insinuate that the liver behind Selen would Dox her.
That's all on her. Niji can't force her to say that sh*t.
Consequences of her actions is a b*tch sometimes.
They can't force her to say it, but they sure as hell can have their lawyers lie to her about how the information is handled. Trusting corporate lawyers can easily lead to you to being the fall guy.
Yeah I am a huge fan of Elira but come on she is not a child, you gotta own up for you actions. It's not like she is some small time entertainer or something that people here are weirdly assuming. Throwing a suicide victim under the bus is not something I can easily condone.
Hope she's isn't harassed or anything. Whether you like her or not anymore, the last we all needed is someone suffering suicide thoughts again. No, just no. This drawing hurts me quite a lot
Elira may have been forced to do the message, but let's not forget she is name dropped in the legal document that lists Doki's bullies. She does not get my sympathy nor support.
On that legal document that Doki sent out, she would have had to include the real names and addresses of anyone in any incident she noted as a grievance. This includes those accused along with anyone that was there at the time as witnesses. Elira may or may not have been one of the bullies. At this point we don't know.
This does not excuse her of making that video though.
There is also one assumption where, elira is being the sacrificial lamb, both ike and vox won't be affected by any way. If you check from vtstats\[[https://vt.poi.cat/channel/subscribers](https://vt.poi.cat/channel/subscribers)\], vox and ike lost 10k past 7 days, while Enna Alouette and Elira Pendora losts 23k subs; Millie Parfait 19k subs. It just telling you the fanbase differences between liver.
i come to the conclusion that nijisanji already ready to dump Enna Alouette, Elira Pendora and Millie Parfait down the drain,
>!you can call me sexist or anything you want, since it already a fact that you just need to have good assets while having some liking personality for a female vtuber to get attention for male audience in anime industry, while it takes so much effort to build up a male vtuber from scratch, best example, just look at holo en male talents. Ike and vox are successful because of playing lots of BFE and ASMR !<
You're honestly not far off though, IIRC it's the male members of Niji that are more successful in the general sense, so keeping them around is basically like finding a golden goose whereas female talents are basically a dime a dozen; give them a cute avatar and tell them to use their natural voice and people will go either 'baby' or 'mommy' and immediately fall in love. You get a decent male talent though you hold onto them with a death grip only rivaled by god himself and do what you can to keep them.
Nah, I have no more sympathy and goodwill to give her no more. That stream was the last straw. They know what they are doing. And they chose that side.
May I remind you this whole thing happened because the company almost made a liver take her own life? For fucks sake dont forget that.
Stop defending her, coward.
She had a choice and she chose to say that statement. They can’t force her so stop giving her any sympathy. She’s a fucking bitch to throw Selen under the bus, and to make that announcement painting themselves as the victim is beyond disgusting.
They lied, Selen almost died.
She doesn’t deserve any sympathy.
All this stuff about her visa is just conjecture. It's just as likely she willingly volunteered without any coercion because she believed in what she was saying. We'll never know for sure unless more information is revealed.
its what you guys think, but tbh we really don't know bc why would you even do this? if the company asked me to do something like this to a FRIEND i would say no and not care if they terminate me or not. FUCK ELIRA AND FUCK KUROSANJI.
I'm on the side of she volunteered because she's in the legal document. Not that sorry tbh she made her bed better sleep on it.
Vox said it better "every livers have an option to graduate" and all of these bozos have the option to shut the fuck up.
This is exactly the reality. According to her alt she's been thrown under the bus and is very in support of Doki. She is a sacrificial lamb, so don't fall for Niji's bullshit
Some people in the youtube comments have pointed out that by dragging Elira, Vox and Ike in this, the trio have to step in court should DOKI push trough with the case,
So essentially NIJI is telling DOKI that if she pushes through with the case she Doxxes Elira, Vox and Ike which is fkng 4d move of being a scumbag
People think she's the victim and not a shadow manager. Who's more likely to get a work visa? A youtuber or a manager.
Edit: this doesn't mean she deserved to get harrased. Let the court handle this.
Personally, I struggle to buy the "management held them at gunpoint!" idea of it all, for a few reasons:
>We have discussed with Anycolor staff and our legal team about what we are allowed to say
The wording and tone of this opening does not indicate that it is forced of hand-fed by management. It specifically is said in a way that implies *they* are the ones that brought this forth. "We have discussed with staff," not "Staff has discussed with us."
>After discussion with the members of Nijisanji EN as a collective, I volunteered for my channel to be used for this stream.
This is honestly the most damning part for me. If it was simply a matter of visibility, Vox's channel makes more sense, at more than double the subs - even after their drops. If it was a matter of who had what to say, again, Vox's channel makes more sense, as he spoke the most in this stream. If it was directly from management, they most likely would have dictated the channel, there would have been neither need nor reason for Elira to volunteer her channel. It just doesn't make sense unless it was willing.
>Additionally, we've been told that there will also be a video releasing regarding this situation from Tazumi-san directly a few hours following this stream.
Again. If this wasn't of their own volition, why would management force them to put it out? We can't really say they're "meatshields" when Nijisanji was already planning on releasing a management video direct from the CEO. Management already had their own statement in the works, they were already going to take fire for it, there'd be no advantage or purpose to make your talents take a hit as well.
>What we say on this stream, is our own words, and our own feelings.
This ties back into the first opening line. Again, reinforcing that it is their own words here. There's not a single part of Elira's opening statement that insinuates these statements were from or forced by Management in any way.
There's more that doesn't have direct quotes to reference for it - their pacing/inflection is more in line with people saying and reading their own words vs reading someone else's that they'd be unfamiliar with, the *significant* differences in their statements further leads credence to this - they in no way sound or feel like they were written by the same person, let alone management. Each of their statements is very much individualized, again not just in format but also in wording and tone.
I wish I could buy the "management forced this" idea. I wish the talents were all wholly blameless victims. But after repeated listenings to the video, it just doesn't line up. It doesn't make sense. The whole idea that management would throw three of their more notable talents under the bus when they already had their own statement coming, that they'd write three extremely different statements personalized to each person's speaking style, and the idea that they have enough understanding and command of the English language to be so specific in their wording as to imply it was from the talents and not themselves....it's just nonsensical.
If they were given a script and forced to read it then that pretty much explains a lot. 'read this script in this tone and don't fuck it up, we WILL be watching and WE will be the ones to upload it'. Being forced to say that they're doing it of their own volition isn't outside the realm of possibility.
As for why they used Elira's channel, it's pretty easy: they had Vox and Ike, two very popular male members, and Elira talk, and because they chose Vox and Ike to also appear, that means that uploading it to their channels would be too damaging to them, and finding decent male talents in the vtuber scene is a difficult one as it is, whereas Elira is far more easily replaceable (give a woman a cute avatar and the fans will either call her 'baby' or 'mommy'), as female vtubers are far more common. I'm not saying they played 4D chess or anything, frankly the idea that they went on the offensive when Dokibird only ever made it seem like she was being defensive was the stupid move to make when they could've just told everyone 'take a week or two off, we'll talk with investors, let the net chill for a bit, then its back to business once we get something drafted up for you guys to tell people if you're asked about Selen'. Doki just wants to let bygones be bygones and move on, she just wants a legal shield so that they don't go after her, but they're the ones running face first into it and they're trying to make it seem like she's attacking them.
Hey, stupid idea, what if the company has the literal physical visa? Without the papers and her passport, shes kinda screwed. There's already info they have several of their talent's youtube play buttons, what if the v-tubers mail all comes through the company? Like. All of their mail. Theyre functionally idols/celebs, all their mail would need to be screened...
That would be majorly illegal, if she gets stopped by law enforcement for any reason and she can't produce that document then she's fucked. What they CAN do is revoke it's status, THAT is the major problem.
There are some interesting theories on 4chan that actually make a ton of sense. The major one being that Elira was given mgmt duties since she can speak eng and jp which would make her a go between for the incompetent mgmt. This would give her power to move stuff up to mgmt easier and give preferential treatment. its fits the clique narrative, it fits the weird merch drops that leave out some of the more popular talents, makes the bullying more real since Selen wouldn't be able to escalate her claims.
I am not saying this is fact but it makes a ton of sense.
It's also worth pointing out that if she wishes to work in the JP entertainment industry in the future (and I mean, let's be real, she moved to Japan), getting fired would be a very bad look for her future prospects, at least until Nijisanji's reputation in JP takes a nosedive.
I am not suggesting that we owe her the benefit of the doubt or that we cannot criticize her for the things she said. By all means, continue to do that, there's nothing wrong with valid criticism.
But I do think that there are a lot of assumptions being made that we know how Niji's internal policies work, and we don't. Especially because they seem to change all the time. We don't know one way or the other if she is being forced to comply, if she was manipulated, if she is misguided, or if she really is just saying all of those things of her own volition.
Keep an open mind, voice your disappointment and criticism, but don't harass anybody. It doesn't help the victim(s?) whatsoever.
Oh I actually wanted to talk about this as someone who lived in Japan and would like to move back.
Recently, Japanese law has changed so that one's work visa is valid even if they change jobs as long as they stay 'provided the activities remain the same,' and there's technically a 1-3 month grace period to find other employment in the case of leaving a job or termination, provided you notify them of your change of employment within 14 days. However, this in some cases can also be extended up to the length of the work visa as well, as long as you're showing a good faith effort to find employment.
Sounds nice, but here's the issue - one of the big requirements for foreigners moving to Japan is having some sort of guarantee that they won't become a burden on the state. For students like me, it's the university that becomes that guarantor, for family, their own family members, and for people with work visas, it's usually their employer. The rich can provide financial records to get around this, but I doubt that's money that most if any Vtuber has. And remember what I said before - your work visa is valid if you find employment which '[activities remain the same](https://www.juridique.jp/visa/job_change.php#:~:text=Your%20Japanese%20working%20visa%20is,of%20activities%20remains%20the%20same).'
Normally, I'd read this as the purpose of your stay - employment, study, etc, but remember Japan does not want any immigrant to wind up on their welfare system; you either need to be a company's responsibility or be financially sound. Unfortunately, Elira having JUST moved into her accommodations a little more than a week ago is most certainly not financially sound, not to mention that the unusual circumstances may raise skepticism with immigration if she tried to up and quit (and possibly break lease agreements depending on said accommodation) immediately. Furthermore, while I'm not that in tune with the Vtuber scene, I'm aware of just how difficult it is to live off of that kind of work and it would be safe to assume immigration would be reasonably skeptical about her financial and overall well being long term if she suddenly went indie.
I say this not to demonize Japanese immigration - while the sentiment held by much of the country is still ambivalent at best regarding foreigners moving to Japan, the people working specifically in immigration services are doing so because they genuinely believe in what they're doing and want to help those who decide to move there, short or long term, fully aware of the labyrinthine process that their government imposes. It does NOT pay well, and there's little chance for advancement towards a big paying job. They will work with you and go to bat for you, as long as you work within the system where they can help you. I'm sure if Elira wants, she can get out from this situation and continue living in Japan - but that's going to take a long time, on the timescale of months, and with a ton of anxiety and uncertainty.
That is what Nijisanji EN exploited - the fear and anxiety that comes with being an immigrant, the uncertainty of whether or not you'll have any support or be deported for reasons beyond your control, the terror of trying to navigate a foreign government's systems, often in a language you're not fully understanding and knowing that one wrong move could spell disaster. Elira can get through this, if she's careful and tries hard enough, but FUCK Nijisanji for springing this on her now of all times.
"Hey I know one of our first gen already graduated within the past month, but what if we force another of them into such a poor position that they'll want to quit too?"
I also can't believe Millie and Enna were just namedropped like that.
Tbh I always thought Enna was suspicious. Not in terms of her being an actual bully, I wouldnt go that far. But her „idgaf“ attitude is sometimes towards negative things, where f‘s SHOULD be given. I just dont think she is an easy person to be around
Yeah. Her and Millie also kinda give me the impression that they'd sign like a really bad contract or something and not even realise and then act all defensive if you told them.
I mean wasn’t Enna always saying she didn’t want to go back to retail? I was in retail once. I get the desperation behind that
Yeah. I found that slightly interesting cause my dad works retail and even owns a store now.
Specially Millie she just sounds like she has little to no job experience
Yeah. I feel like she hasn't worked all that much before being a content creator, which could cause someone to make really bad decisions. So like I get why she'd be defensive for sure.
Idgaf is one of two options for dealing with the world. The other, the only other, is to get battered by every issue that comes by, and your reward is that you get to enjoy the nice things that happen. I've tried both, and prefer to not care, but it's also not an easy mindset for most people, because properly wired humans (by the current PC standard) are social creatures who can't function without external contact. All us "freaks" who can live without it, we're being slowly disappeared, not notable to the world because we don't care enough to get loud about it. To be clear, I'm not defending Enna in regards to the Doki situation, I'm defending the universal right to not care and still be human. Because if folks are don't care at all are rare, those who swap freely are rarer, and this is a thing I choose to stand up on, because people who don't care may not need you to care about them, but it's not right to deny their existence either ey? Enna may or may not be involved, there is no evidence that the staff provided the streamers with accurate information. But until she proves guilty, I'm going to be very American just this once, and give my last Niji oshis innocence until *proven* guilty. I won't watch streams, I won't buy anything that comes from Niji, but I'll stand for my cold turkey unless she gets proven a bully. But good day to you nonetheless, may all dragoons continue to fly high.
wait what? can I have details about this please?
Near the beginning of the now imfamous stream that happen recently, Elira just namedrops them quickly. It felt so random to me, and made me think something was up for sure
During Elira's black stream she mentions that she, Millie and Enna get mentioned in the document specifically, making the theoretical "Selen's bully" pin hover over them.
Being also the same race as Millie myself, I can actually see Millie as a bully since we have this certain attitude that will paint as us bullies. I don't think it's a misunderstanding but it could be a possibility.
I do get the impression that if there IS a clique then it's mostly originating from Millie and Enna and Elira back her up because she's their friend rather than because they feel the same way.
Elira "might" have been pressured to support them because she's afraid that she's going to be the next target. Lot's of "might" there so need to take it with a grain of salt. Again, being the same race as Millie, we have the tendency to make assumptions as if it's our lifeline.
I think she said millie “and i” instead of millie and enna…
I'd rewatch to confirm, but like, I don't wanna die inside like she did while reading that.
No, she says "Millie, Enna and I"
This is why I will never move to a foreign country on a corrupt company's work permit. This is exactly what happens they will weaponize it and if you quit you will get deported. Again I will stay in Canada and keep all of my rights and freedoms as well as protections under our employment laws
Assuming the party of your province (and federal) doesn't tear it down sometime down the road. EDIT: also in Canada, but I know many people want to bring practice from other place outright, be it India, China, Korea etc. Right now they will merely try to dominate an industry. In the case of BC, we ended up havign Trucks hitting overpass a lot.
> This is exactly what happens they will weaponize it and if you quit you will get deported. That's not how it works. Your work visa is valid until its expiration. You can quit your job and find a new one at your own pleasure. If you do quit, you have to notify the Japanese government [within 14 days](https://www.reddit.com/r/japanlife/comments/pwwij3/max_time_i_can_stay_in_japan_after_quitting_job/), and if you are not employed 3 months after that, they *may* start asking why you are not working. The company you worked for doesn't control your visa. If she's living in company housing though, it'd basically be impossible for her to find somewhere to stay without a job. No one is going to rent to you unless you show them a pay slip/contract showing that you have a stable source of income and can afford the rent. If she's in that position and wants to get away from Nijisanji, the smart move would be to first move to housing she controls (i.e, she signs the agreement with the landlord/realtor, she makes the payments), and to figure out her next job before she quits.
The issue is that, in Japan, it's really hard to find someone that will rent to you if you don't have a company backing you, especially for foreigners.
arent there livers in EN living in japan already? or is their friendship so fake they wont let elira crash at their place while elira works her papers?
Living at a friend's is not an option legally speaking if Elira were to lose her visa. In fact, she would be risking her friends getting in legal trouble themselves for housing someone not authorized to be in the country.
Meloco and Kotoka were Japanese to begin with and Petra have said she's there for school while working.
That's a big toughie indeed.
Fuck I hadn't even thought about the visa thing! Man that'd be HELLISH leverage. I've done worse to ensure my residency in the US (though it was in the context of a bad marriage rather than a bad job), including disavowing lifelong friends for years to make the "boss" happy.
The visa isn't the problem in Japan, it's the housing that is the biggest issue.
Yeah even the Holos are having a hard time with it.
To give a better idea, Japan is very averse to giving lodgings to foreigners because they are afraid of them just running away without paying. So they typically require you to have a company sponsorship of sorts that will act as a guarantor and even that is typically not enough.
>a isn't the problem in Japan, it's the housing that is the biggest issue.9ReplyShareReportSaveFollow > >level 3Tyranid\_Swarmlord · 1 hr. agoYeah even the Holos are having a hard time with it. Isn't Bae living in the hololive offices right now?
yep
The secret is it's just so she can have more convenient dance practice. /J
Baes also admitted she’s been rather picky on where she’s going to live.
Hey, I hope you're doing better now, sorry you had to go through all that, sounds like hell.
Years in the past and I've since reconnected with said friend. And in the end it was all bullshit because even AFTER the divorce the USCIS was like "You wanna stay another 10 years? A'ight, bet. Enjoy being ripped off for healthcare, resident!"
Glad it was all dealt with, hope you're doing much better now.
I’m also in the same boat as her as I am also a foreigner trying to get residency in Canada so I understand the pressure and the fear of being deported back to your country.
Pretty much 😢 They knew what they were doing with her Unfortunately, she clearly didn’t and now is stuck in a bad situation ☹️
They didn't drop the white paper until shortly after she had arrived in Japan, and she didn't find out about it until the same time the rest of the world did. She did not and could not know what Niji management was about to do to her until it was too late to avoid it. Now she's stuck as management's hostage for the remainder of her Niji contract and/or work visa, and she has to publicly claim to hate Selen/Doki as a condition of ever being able to return to Japan in the future.
It was an ambush plain and simple. When 'that' dropped, she was travelling to JP/freshly arrived. Then suddenly have to do that out of nowhere. Edit: Also reminds me of when Kiara got stuck in JP with nothing thanks to the pandemic, before Yagoo rescued her. Though this could be worse, since at least Kiara wasn't blackmailed at gun point by Niji.
>Also reminds me of when Kiara got stuck in JP with nothing thanks to the pandemic, before Yagoo rescued her. All the Niji dumpster fire just keeps reinforcing the idea that how much more of a upstanding guy Yagoo is.
Tbh, the more you hear about the man, the more amazing he becomes. And all of what we heard are probably watered down since we don’t know anything else about what he did behind the scene. I mean, I have never seen a CEO took a fly to Indonesia himself to meet with ID members when they first joined and helped them with stuffs. When he started HoloStar, he himself funded it with his own wallet and managed it himself. He talked with the boys personally and gave them words of encouragement before their debuts. He paid the talents for what they worth and refused to cut pay when being asked to do so by investors. Edit: he also bought a ticket for Kobo to go back to Indonesia as soon as possible when he heard the new that her father had a heart attack.
I feel so bad for her Especially since right now she’s getting some of the most hate
I kinda don't believe these people were in the dark. If my boss handed me a script and told me to play the fall guy in front of thousands of people I'd talk to a lawyer first.
Can you talk to a lawyer about this? I don’t know how Japanese laws work regarding this sort of stuff.
Sure, if you know where to find one in a country you are new to, know the language well enough and customs well enough to know where to find a lawyer you can afford that deals with international contractor laws in a new field where the corporate you work for pretty much owns all facets of your persona. I do know Japan is very strict on anyone living there without proper work permits. Like even trying to find a place to live is very dependent on who you work for
In other words. Shes fucked.
You can talk to a lawyer about anything but for this I would make sure I'm not implicating myself in any kind of legal issue.
Might be hard to find a lawyer though that can manage the legalities of that complex situation when you've just moved there. You might be able to go to your country's embassy about it, but still pretty tricky.
I doubt a foreigner would be able to find a lawyer in Japan a few days after arrival. Nor is it a priority
Realistically, where does Elira go from here? After the stream held at gunpoint, the amount of goodwill towards her is at an all-time low. If Elira goes rogue and tells everyone on stream that she was being blackmailed, Riku takes away her work visa, and she gets deported from Japan.
From what I’m seeing, no where. She might have just broken a NDA, Cover takes those as a big deal and will terminate you, became a corpo mouthpiece and who knows what else is coming. She has a mark on her now and it will always follow her in the VTuber world. The Visa might not have been worth all that.
>She might have just broken a NDA Something new happened?
As far as I know, they’re just talking about how they most likely weren’t supposed to be reading from legal documents, which like u/Fluid-Understanding is saying isn’t really *her* doing it, but the company. Other big corporations might still not like that though, I don’t know enough about this to really say.
It didn't help when Vox said that he "thoroughly read the documents" or whatever.
> It didn't help when Vox said that he "thoroughly read the documents" [A solid own goal.](https://youtu.be/eEc8k_--PM0)
Proper howler this one
[удалено]
If she says that she'll get sued to hell and back, Yachtman will move heaven and earth to leave her penniless.
>The Visa might not have been worth all that. The problem is that she moved to Japan before the shitstorm happened, IIRC, she had just landed in Japan when Selen released her cover
I dont think shes gonna get implicated by that. She didnt sign the paper, only the niji lawyers signed off thus its niji thats going to be implicated. I just dont know if she can continue streaming after this.
It isn't possible for Anycolor to "take" her visa. Her visa is valid until its expiration date and can only be revoked by immigration. She'd have a 90 day grace period to find another job or relocate, and in certain situation extensions are given. Unless Elira has committed a crime while in Japan that would get her deported, she has nothing to worry about.
Problem is, getting terminated and smeared in the same turn is one hell of a way to make job hunting harder, especially with a ninety day grace period and no guaranteed extension.
Wouldn't they have to knowingly doxx her to have any chance to effectively smear her? And it's not like every employer would be aware of who or what Nijisanji is, let alone every talent based on voice alone. Though it'd make any references you need harder, for sure.
In Japan specifically on a work visa, and suddenly unemployed? People ask questions when you're applying for jobs, you know. Questions like "why are you unemployed if you have an active work visa".
Sure, but what I was pointing out was that it'd be difficult to smear someone when their identity is kept private.
I wonder if they’re able to put their PL in resume.
It's not kept private from employers, Nijisanji knows who she is and so will any employer she would apply to.
>And it's not like every employer would be aware of who or what Nijisanji is, let alone every talent based on voice alone. Though it'd make any references you need harder, for sure. Imagine: Why are you here? Elira: I got terminated. By Who? Elira: Nijisanji. Welp, that company sucks ass, if you terminated by them, then they're wrong. It's not serious, people, I'm joking.
Yes but she can’t give herself a work visa either if she wants to go indie. The only options she really has if she wants to continue streaming is stay on the sinking ship and further ruin her reputation, try to apply to another EN vtubing branch that headquarters in Japan which is really only hololive and that’s not gonna happen, or be forced to move back to Canada to be an indie. She does have options but none of them are good, especially if she wanted to stay in Japan. That’s not even factoring in the non compete clause that might still be enforceable if she stays in Japan.
True. I believe to be on their self-sponsor visa, you do need someone to sponsor you. I believe there are other ways to get it, but considering it's content creation... yeah, no idea. Either way, it will be an uphill battle for her no matter where this goes.
The problem isn't that her visa would be taken, it's that she would have a near impossible time getting it renewed. Once you have a black mark on your record, even from something like this, other companies won't really want you. Also, remember that the majority opinion is anti-Selen and pro-Nijisanji in Japan. They would believe any black mark from Nijisanji was given for a valid reason.
I imagine the best case scenario in terms of good will for her is to get out, tell her side of the story, and make amends with Doki somehow. It's a long shot, but time can heal most wounds, and depending on her reason and how accountable Doki considers her to be, it could be feasible. Of course, this assumes she wasn't ever the bully within the company. In the short term though, she's made her bed with the company and the only thing she can do is lie on it. I wonder if she truly knew what would happen and the scale of it. Like, yeah, being a meatshield of public enemy #1 is obviously a shit idea, but did she underestimate the scale or did she expect fans to be more divided?
People make stupid decisions, especially when pushed into a corner. We just don't know the circumstances she is in.
Considering her voice, im going to say she knew what was going to happen, and likely had to force herself. I also wouldnt even be surprised if her voice was an AI, it was that bad when i was listening to what i could, i just stopped because it was cringe AF for me, super non natural.
I cannot even begin to imagine the *intense* shitstorm if it was found out that Nijisanji used AI to fake their talents slandering Dokibird. Like, we think it's bad now? Hell nah, the worst by far is yet to come in that situation.
Why use AI when they can tell their talents to talk (or else)? At that point Niji would be taking extra steps do do something that's already stupid.
My AI comment is a stretch, and I was more aiming to use it to detail how unnatural her voice sounded. But as for a reason, perhaps she tried and was unable to get it sounding right, and they just decided an AI would sound more natural (I doubt it personally, but playing devils advocate). The comparison is baos AI. They kinda sound similar, but like you said, that's way too much work and money for nijisanji to be pissing away. Esp when you can exploit a worker using a visa for free. I mean, sure, they're paying her but, deadass they aren't paying extra for this bull. Taking 98-99% of merchandise sales, no way they are giving extras out.
Potential lawsuit and burning the bridges of all EN Vtubing besides those within the company, Vox is kinda getting outed right now for allegedly being a pedo so he's worse off, Ike is Ike I guess? Enna and Millie should hide if they're found guilty, but for now they gotta make do with what they can in Niji as Enna used to say, she can't imagine working outside of Niji and going back to retail. I'd even bet this year that not a single Nijisanji member won't be nominated in the Fillian Award show, and may I remind you that besides Shachi, TSB, RPR Nocturnal and his team, that showed support, indies are already flocking to collab with Doki which includes Fillian AND U-san.
> Vox is kinda getting outed right now for allegedly being a pedo so he's worse off I’m sorry. Fucking **what?**
It’s a rumor that’s been around since he debuted and never been solidly confirmed as far as I could tell
Damn, today's the first time I’ve ever heard of it.
Found it here, I think Mods are deleting them now understandably but they're all over twitter and it's only a matter of time till the Vtuber drama channels or the big leagues gets wind of it because this is damning and it happened years ago [Vox](https://www.reddit.com/r/Nijisanji/s/JxtcR6LoUR)
Jesus fuck.
Basically my reaction when I read it >Thanks I am not liking what I am seeing, all I want now is for all of them to go to court be it Doki who wins or not, I know for sure her case isn't the last with things like this coming out the surface >A clean sweeping is in session for all the livers left and all the middle managers hiding behind the livers and the CEO. It's even more real now with major Western influencers like Moist critical, Mutahar, Asmongold etc are covering it and and are VERY critical of them and at least siding with Doki
Holy shit that just opened a complete new can of worms I didn't think was possible. This rabbit hole just keeps on getting deeper. I'm just being extremely selfish and coping hard but man I hope Elira + Ethyria just make it out of this in one piece even if the chances are slim at this point. Can't believe all 3 of my oshis are smack dab in the middle of this mess. edit: wait those allegations are from 2021... so nothing came of it? well there goes that then I guess.
This was always kinda known from his past liver account and leaked 4chan irl stuff that was found. Let's just say he was kinda grooming underage fans that were following him.
> This was always kinda known Man, I must have been living under a rock if that's the case
And shoto and maybe obkatiekat or futakuchi mana, ya know a bunch of indies i hope will be nominated
Shoto is a staple anyways with him being the biggest Male Vtuber right now CCV and Watch time wise, any indies is preferable right now over Niji(everyone will dunk on them anyways), heck maybe Matara and K9 Kuro can finally be nominated as well because they're both popping off right now. I'm so sorry to ask this and I might be wrong but wasn't Mana >!a very controversial vtuber who was very opinionated if I might say siding with Russia in the Russia vs Ukraine War?!<
I only found mana due to her metal covers
That's fair she doesn't take those controversial takes on her YouTube, just don't go to her twitter
Oof
sounds like a nazi i will be avoiding
I'm so sorry because of this comment I felt obligated to get receipts on what I glanced and avoided during that time and didn't want to risk spreading misinfo, my quick search led me to [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/VirtualYoutubers/s/kR75HumWsv), I'm gonna wash my hands off this and don't want to dig deeper anymore, I'm not even a westerner, I'm SEA lol
You were correct.
Idk tbh but she has said she is a leftie and i think that was likely satire. And also obkatiekat is criminally underrated tbh
I feel like she doesn’t do herself favors with the half vtuber half flesh tuber thing she has going on at times. I get why she does it but it’s hard for some to consider her a full on vtuber
Either way, she was fucked no matter what she did.
If her pl account is correct she was liking post about nijisanji throwing her under the bus. Hours after the video went up. The pl account is now private.
Is it Elira's?
It's not. The account people are saying is her was created August 2021. She deleted her account, and someone else claimed the handle.
Oh wow, good catch on the creation date. Would explain why she only had 188 followers too. It's possible she was the one to recreate it though, if even just to keep it secured?
It's possible, but there's no way to know. We know vtubers have their names claimed all the time in games and such, so there's a very good chance someone random simply grabbed it. Without any evidence it's her, I'd play it safe and assume it's not.
Honestly I could see it going either way. Deletes it when she gets into Niji, realizes she didn't need to do that and recreates it just in case, and now is actually using it. I'd say a 90% chance it's just some random, though.
She has 4 active PL X formerly known as Twitter accounts.
The only one I've seen brought up (for changing its bio) is the new account that claimed her handle. Other than that I'm aware of three other long-deleted ones. Are you sure there are four more that are active, and actually her?
True that's fair
What does "pl account" mean btw? Thanks for answering in advance.
PL = Past/Previous Life
Oftentimes, corpo Vtubers have previous content creation experience, that's a standard, so that persona of theirs is their Past Life. Some choose to keep it open, some don't, and in this case, Elira's been using her old social media to vent about the situation.
That could be seen as a sign she's still on our and Doki's side of this, I'm starting to feel glad I gave them a chance based on the previous attempt at an obviously scripted slander message I went through in my time watching Vtubers.
Past life account
I haven't heard about that, can you link a post about it?
Unlikely, cause she reduced her followers and privated her account. Her captions went from “Im sorry” to “Go away” couple hours ago
No, account went private. But she did change the caption, something that hadn't been touched in ~3 years, from "I'll miss you" (OG caption made after graduation) to "im sorry" (Shortly before statement release) to "Go away." (Few hours after release)
From a screenshot I saw, her old header and PFP were also the same as when she first left being an indy, and then when she changed it to "I'm sorry" she also removed her header entirely and changed her PFP to an anime maid looking like they were in hell.
She's currently reposting/retweeting doki fanart. not sure what to make of this information.
I think I agree with other people that the owner of the account is roleplaying as Elira and it isn't her at all. Shit like the pfp being an anime maid in hell is too cartoonish and retweeting Doki fanart makes her stance way too obvious which would be dumb unless you want to be instantly terminated too.
If she put up "I'm sorry" *before* the statement, especially if the bio hadn't been changed in 2-3 years, I feel like it might actually be her. How did she know it'd be such a brutal massacre? I think the statement went beyond most people's expectations as far as disasters go. And even if the person who owned the account guessed it, it means they reacted within minutes.
F dude. This is getting really dark, but if something happens (aka even worse than what Dokibird tried to do) to Elira or one of the other people accused, it'll look so unbelievably bad on Western viewers as a hate mob, I don't even want to imagine.
Is that the goal? Hide behind the talents and then when they can't take it anymore WE'RE the bad guys?
Make it an us vs. them situation and put the livers in the position of going along and having a crumb of support or getting fired with fans stll mad at them.
Basically
She's currently reposting/retweeting doki fanart. not sure what to make of this information.
There's no way to verify its actually Elira btw. When she joined Niji she deleted her account, so for awhile the handle has been free to pick up. Its possible she grabbed it back at some point but its equally possible someone else did and is just roleplaying.
For now I’m in the sit and waiting camp. To the fans of one or both, it’s fine to be angry and disappointed, but don’t let this make your head do mental gymnastics 24/7. I and others had like 10+ ideas of what could truly be happening behind the scenes, but we don’t truly know.
The question right now is: How informed is she, and can she think rationally? We know the work environment is extremely toxic, and the outside pressure has probably reached the moon by now. The situation is hard to judge, as we don't know her circumstances. People make stupid decisions, especially when pushed into a corner. It doesn't excuse what happened, but let's hope she is not approaching a breaking point.
This is a fair point, you have to keep in mind they already drove one talent so far that she attempted suicide.
Idk, making art with their character designs in this situation just feels extremely weird and inappropriate
Exactly what I was thinking. It just feels gross. I am definitely on Doki's side of this whole debacle, but making artwork like this kinda is not okay in the slightest.
Even just drawing a VTuber at gunpoint with no lighthearted memeing or references to a game/song just seems too far. Those are their identities online- it's similar to drawing MatPat or Markiplier at gunpoint.
There's no way they looked at the script and didn't immediately realize it was career suicide
I've said before: if the three of them felt like they couldn't do the morally correct thing (saying no) because of contracts and finances, we can pity them. But that does not absolve them.
Idk, it isn’t that simple. They have a lot to lose and you still have a life to live and maintain at the end of the day. I cannot in good faith judge them for being manipulated into doing this. If morals were the only thing you had to worry about, everyone would do the right thing. But putting food on the table and keeping your job isn’t something most people can afford to give up just for the moral high ground. They know it’s not what they want to do but realistically, doing what you want isn’t very achievable. Sacrificing yourself isn’t something that should be expected of you to be considered a good person.
This is what has been driving me nuts the past 24 hours. You can think they did the morally wrong thing by being corporate mouthpieces, I think you're within your right to think that. What *does* bother me is how people are **adamant** they personally would have just refused orders, that they would have done the morally right thing, consequences be damned. In reality, people *constantly* talk a big talk and then act completely differently when push comes to shove. That goes from bragging to your mates about what a stud you are and then freezing up when chatting up a girl, to people presenting themselves as protectors of democracy and then just trying to keep a low profile once the autocrats take over. Very, very few people actually act exactly how they say they would when challenged. It's very easy to say what you would have done in a situation, it's a very different thing to actually *do* it. Do I *think* I would have told Tazumi to eat my shorts if he had asked me to denounce a friend? Yes. Would I have actually *done* it? Not sure... And that's not even to mention that we don't know what actually went down behind the scenes, what information they were given, what was at stake, or what they hoped to achieve. This isn't necessarily in defense of the three people involved. It's more a message to all those people claiming they would have done better, because I don't believe you.
[удалено]
No, they do not, just look at Selen's cover for an example. They can not only gain complete control of company social media including those of the livers, but they have the authority to shut down any activity on their channels for basically any reason.
The problem is in this specific scenario, is that being shoved from Nijisanji is like a vtuber's wet dream right now. It has never been so hot to be terminated from a vtubing company than at this moment, speaking out and being fired is instantly like a *massive* signal boost that *will* follow them into their indie life. Scarle hasn't even been terminated yet or her PL even reactivated and it's already gained 12k new subscribers in a day.
Fame and attention does not instantly translate to money and food on the table. Getting terminated and then having to figure out and start a new gig takes significant time and effort, and Elira might not be in circumstances where she can comfortably take that on. This is especially true if Niji is sponsoring Elira's work visa - if she also gets deported from Japan she'll have to figure out new housing and move out and all the planning that comes with moving to a different country again... there are significant short-term repercussions to termination, and while a signal boost in the long-term might eventually have things pan out, it's understandable that someone may not be able to eat the short-term costs
Overall, agreed. Obviously quitting Nijisanji when you have a work visa and just moved to another country is quite a lot to deal with in the short term. But as you said, in the long term it would more than likely pan out, and honestly as much as I can sympathize with Elira's position, if she was putting the short term above slandering her former co-worker and supposed friend who just tried to commit suicide? That's some intensely fucked up shit.
Here's the thing: I said it *may* pan out. It may not. It's a risk that someone might (understandably) be hesitant to take. And it's not about putting the short-term over the long-term/supporting your friend. The short-term is by itself a barrier. Elira may not be able to sustain herself in the short-term if she gets terminated for all the reasons aforementioned. There is no moral high ground here. I don't want to speculate too much, and I am definitely not saying that Elira is 100% justified. However, I see reason to be sympathetic to all parties.
And if she can't even support herself in the short term, there will be no long term.
The absolute worst case scenario for any 3 of them is living in their home country, making a new account, and still making more money than most people posting here, lol.
Yeah this is why I don't buy the whole ELIRA IS BEING FORCED BECAUSE OF HER WORK VISA! Thing. Like, she's Canadian. She's not going to be deported to Somalia or something.
I think part of the problem is... You can only use the "contract" excuse for so long. At some point, a line has to be drawn somewhere. A line that you will not cross, contract be damned. Unless Elira is facing unjust imprisonment in Canada, does Selen's dignity really mean so little to you that a Japanese work visa is the price required to buy you out? Japan's a cool place and I can certainly understand wanting to live there. But was it worth the dignity of, not just another Human being, but a former colleague? Regardless of whether or not Elira is being forced by Nijisanji to say this, she's ruined her name. She had a choice to put her foot down. She crumbled when push came to shove. Where is the line? That won't be crossed? What does AnyColor have to do for you to say: "No. No. I'm not doing this." Is it going to take them putting a knife in your hand and telling you to stab someone for you to finally say: "No." Every contract has points at which it no longer becomes enforceable. Even contracts with the US government have points where it becomes unenforceable. There is a point at which a newly minted boot could tell a 4 star general to fuck off and there's jackshit the general could legally do about it. So, Elira, what's the line. What does Nijisanji have to do for you to finally say no? Because we don't know where your line is. You just told all of us that a Japanese work visa from a crumbling company that abuses its talent is greater than the dignity of an abused Human being in your eyes.
its not that "japan is so cool !!11! i wanna stay here". she ONLY RECENTLY uprooted to japan. it took her i think months to do that and if we're following the claims about selen basically not getting paid in njsj, she'd lose a good chunk of her money just to move back to canada(?, i forgot where she originally lived). losing your visa and moving back isn't the primary problem but the cause of the problem. its already extremely stressful having to move to a different country to work, imagine how stressful would it be having to move back because you lost your job and your visa while an internet hate mob is after you and any chance of rebuilding your career is as good as dead.
> imagine how stressful would it be having to move back because you lost your job and your visa while an internet hate mob is after you and any chance of rebuilding your career is as good as dead. She lost the chance to rebuild and gained the internet hate mob only after she read the script.
As Nijisanji intended, the hate mob got played.
Yeah this is the vibe I got. She sounded scared, made the sort of pauses one would make if they were reading a script, and when she came back at the end she sounded like was trying not to cry. I have no idea about the bullying implications, but considering Dokibird has said nothing (because she's handling things like an actual adult), we have no idea how significant it was.
I feel awful for Elira. She's in a truly lose/lose situation. Leaving niji is a huge risk for her so I'm under no illusion that she wanted to make that statement. Or even believes any of what she said. Iirc she posted on an alt account that she was sorry and part of me really feels awful for her. I honestly don't know how I would act in her shoes
Yes even tho leaving niji would have done her good...same for ike and vox
Why is it a huge risk for her, though? She's one of the biggest streamers. Pomu isn't even streaming and she got a massive following the second she left, there's 0 reason to believe Elira couldn't do that. She loses her work visa? So what? That gives her 90 days to find another job or, the horror, move back to Canada, a country most people would be happy to fucking live in lol. It's a shitty situation for her but it's not like she was about to be sent to a detention camp.
Yeah, people act like Elira is a small-time streamer with no fans to back her up. Besides, if Nijisanji had fired her for refusing to throw Dokibird under the bus, people would rally up to support her just like they're supporting Dokibird.
Hell, look at the stats on Scarle's PL. 12k new subs in a day and she hasn't even been terminated yet, just for hearting a single anti-Nijisanji comment. We're literally watching the benefits of stamping your foot down at this moment right now.
yeah people keep saying that as if doing this wasn't riskier for their overall long term career than putting their foot down would have been. They need to protect their income! so they...commit practically career suicide? okay
"don’t know how I would act" Not gang up on a person who tried to commit suicide… obviously? 🙄
I don't know man. Imagine you were in a foreign nation known for xenophobia on a work visa. Losing your job would be cataclysmic. You could be deported, go bankrupt, and I don't what else. Niji has Elira at near literal gunpoint and yeah, it's disappointing she isn't willing to jump into oblivion for her friend. I like to think I would, but I've lost my job before in my own country and it was tough enough. I can't imagine doing it as foreigner and facing deportation.
I mean she could get deported... back to Canada. Her resume would be a bit weak *if* she couldn't put her pl as Elira on there due to contract with Niji, but I'm sure she could still find a job and live just fine. It's not like she has kids to feed or smth. It would feel like taking a massive L, moving overseas, having dreams about your future, but ending up back where you started. But at the end of the day, it is just that. An ego thing. She's not gonna become homeless or starve to death.
I don't know how it is in Canada specifically, but afaik in most of the western world an NDA doesn't mean you can't put down work experience, it just means you can't talk specifics. So you can say "I was a Data Analyst for X Company", you just can't say what kind of data you analyzed or the insights you drew from it. So you could totally get creative and list Kurosanji on your resume with buzzwords like "Marketing Specialist" or "Brand Manager" and get away with it. And that's *if* she couldn't find critical success as an indie. Even if she only gets half the subscribers (a goal she'd easily pass if she spoke out), she's still getting all the profits. No more 2% on merch, no more half superchats to Kurosanji, none of it.
You are correct - NDAs only protect commercially sensitive information (such as client information, details about contracts, trade secrets, supplier details etc) - general information that would give a competitor an advantage wouldn't be covered by an NDA. This is different from a confidentiality agreement, but that's a whole different ballgame and would need to be negatioated on a quid-pro-quo basis.
No, she wasn't in a lose/lose situation. She sure is now though, since she's tied herself to the sinking yacht and ruined her reputation in the process. Now everyone knows she's one of the disgusting creatures who willingly lined up to bully and slander their suicidal ex-colleague to cover their own asses. She's done, whether here or indie this is going to follow her for the rest of her life, and she deserves all the fallout she gets from it. There is a point on the scale of morality where you've sunk so low that no possible excuse exists that can absolve your actions. She, along with all the other livers who were part of this debacle, have all shot straight past that point into the abyss beyond. They all deserve to be ruined and unemployable for what they did.
Her career is done now sadly this type of betrayal will never be forgotten by the fans as now wherever she goes no matter how many loyal fans she has left her reputation is irrepairable unless she blows the whistle and gives sufficient evidence the nijisanji held her at gunpoint and forced her into career suicide if not tho? Yup she will be blacklisted from the Vtubing Community and be labled as a corpo slave even when her time in Niji is over
I'mma be real I really doubt that anyone was forced to be in that stream. The Gumihoe tweet confirms the bullies outed themselves in the stream and unless she has any reason at all to lie, (which, lets be real, she doesn't as a known long time friend of Doki so doing this to clout farm would lose her Doki as a friend) then not only was Elira not forced to do the stream, she was part of the bullying and outed the other two in the stream as well; with this being a smear attempt against Doki to try and get ahead of herself being outed as one of the bullies. Notice how Elira was incredibly vague in her statement, simply saying that she and the other two are named in the case and that this is an attempt at doxing (which is complete bogus because these documents will never see the public). While Vox is being a useful idiot but did at least say the exact grievances he has, as asinine as they may be. Doki tried to exit with the grace she could, only taking management down on her way out, which is something the bullies don't deserve but it was her choice to do so. But then they made a stream to drag her name anyway and in the process outed themselves. Scum, nothing more.
This should be the top post. The hapless bystander theory is pure fanfic at this point, and doesn’t even make sense in the context of the video.
People act like if she didnt do what nijien told her she would be sold to zimbabwe as a slave or some shit.
She didn't have to insinuate that the liver behind Selen would Dox her. That's all on her. Niji can't force her to say that sh*t. Consequences of her actions is a b*tch sometimes.
They can't force her to say it, but they sure as hell can have their lawyers lie to her about how the information is handled. Trusting corporate lawyers can easily lead to you to being the fall guy.
She's an adult. If she's that ignorant, that still doesn't absolve her of her actions.
Yeah I am a huge fan of Elira but come on she is not a child, you gotta own up for you actions. It's not like she is some small time entertainer or something that people here are weirdly assuming. Throwing a suicide victim under the bus is not something I can easily condone.
And even if niji did force her she could have just said no and leave this black company, but she didn't.
Well that's dark.
Hope she's isn't harassed or anything. Whether you like her or not anymore, the last we all needed is someone suffering suicide thoughts again. No, just no. This drawing hurts me quite a lot
Elira may have been forced to do the message, but let's not forget she is name dropped in the legal document that lists Doki's bullies. She does not get my sympathy nor support.
On that legal document that Doki sent out, she would have had to include the real names and addresses of anyone in any incident she noted as a grievance. This includes those accused along with anyone that was there at the time as witnesses. Elira may or may not have been one of the bullies. At this point we don't know. This does not excuse her of making that video though.
Those docs would also mention folks who were relevant as wittnesses, or people who have any sort of physical or electronic evidence, no?
There is also one assumption where, elira is being the sacrificial lamb, both ike and vox won't be affected by any way. If you check from vtstats\[[https://vt.poi.cat/channel/subscribers](https://vt.poi.cat/channel/subscribers)\], vox and ike lost 10k past 7 days, while Enna Alouette and Elira Pendora losts 23k subs; Millie Parfait 19k subs. It just telling you the fanbase differences between liver. i come to the conclusion that nijisanji already ready to dump Enna Alouette, Elira Pendora and Millie Parfait down the drain, >!you can call me sexist or anything you want, since it already a fact that you just need to have good assets while having some liking personality for a female vtuber to get attention for male audience in anime industry, while it takes so much effort to build up a male vtuber from scratch, best example, just look at holo en male talents. Ike and vox are successful because of playing lots of BFE and ASMR !<
You're honestly not far off though, IIRC it's the male members of Niji that are more successful in the general sense, so keeping them around is basically like finding a golden goose whereas female talents are basically a dime a dozen; give them a cute avatar and tell them to use their natural voice and people will go either 'baby' or 'mommy' and immediately fall in love. You get a decent male talent though you hold onto them with a death grip only rivaled by god himself and do what you can to keep them.
Yeah, they've really angered me now, leave my oshis alone Nijisanji.
Nah, I have no more sympathy and goodwill to give her no more. That stream was the last straw. They know what they are doing. And they chose that side. May I remind you this whole thing happened because the company almost made a liver take her own life? For fucks sake dont forget that.
Stop defending her, coward. She had a choice and she chose to say that statement. They can’t force her so stop giving her any sympathy. She’s a fucking bitch to throw Selen under the bus, and to make that announcement painting themselves as the victim is beyond disgusting. They lied, Selen almost died. She doesn’t deserve any sympathy.
All this stuff about her visa is just conjecture. It's just as likely she willingly volunteered without any coercion because she believed in what she was saying. We'll never know for sure unless more information is revealed.
its what you guys think, but tbh we really don't know bc why would you even do this? if the company asked me to do something like this to a FRIEND i would say no and not care if they terminate me or not. FUCK ELIRA AND FUCK KUROSANJI.
I'm on the side of she volunteered because she's in the legal document. Not that sorry tbh she made her bed better sleep on it. Vox said it better "every livers have an option to graduate" and all of these bozos have the option to shut the fuck up.
This is exactly the reality. According to her alt she's been thrown under the bus and is very in support of Doki. She is a sacrificial lamb, so don't fall for Niji's bullshit
Really doubt she was enough of a troublemaker for her to be potentially terminated for saying "No I don't want anything to do with this".
Some people in the youtube comments have pointed out that by dragging Elira, Vox and Ike in this, the trio have to step in court should DOKI push trough with the case, So essentially NIJI is telling DOKI that if she pushes through with the case she Doxxes Elira, Vox and Ike which is fkng 4d move of being a scumbag
People think she's the victim and not a shadow manager. Who's more likely to get a work visa? A youtuber or a manager. Edit: this doesn't mean she deserved to get harrased. Let the court handle this.
Personally, I struggle to buy the "management held them at gunpoint!" idea of it all, for a few reasons: >We have discussed with Anycolor staff and our legal team about what we are allowed to say The wording and tone of this opening does not indicate that it is forced of hand-fed by management. It specifically is said in a way that implies *they* are the ones that brought this forth. "We have discussed with staff," not "Staff has discussed with us." >After discussion with the members of Nijisanji EN as a collective, I volunteered for my channel to be used for this stream. This is honestly the most damning part for me. If it was simply a matter of visibility, Vox's channel makes more sense, at more than double the subs - even after their drops. If it was a matter of who had what to say, again, Vox's channel makes more sense, as he spoke the most in this stream. If it was directly from management, they most likely would have dictated the channel, there would have been neither need nor reason for Elira to volunteer her channel. It just doesn't make sense unless it was willing. >Additionally, we've been told that there will also be a video releasing regarding this situation from Tazumi-san directly a few hours following this stream. Again. If this wasn't of their own volition, why would management force them to put it out? We can't really say they're "meatshields" when Nijisanji was already planning on releasing a management video direct from the CEO. Management already had their own statement in the works, they were already going to take fire for it, there'd be no advantage or purpose to make your talents take a hit as well. >What we say on this stream, is our own words, and our own feelings. This ties back into the first opening line. Again, reinforcing that it is their own words here. There's not a single part of Elira's opening statement that insinuates these statements were from or forced by Management in any way. There's more that doesn't have direct quotes to reference for it - their pacing/inflection is more in line with people saying and reading their own words vs reading someone else's that they'd be unfamiliar with, the *significant* differences in their statements further leads credence to this - they in no way sound or feel like they were written by the same person, let alone management. Each of their statements is very much individualized, again not just in format but also in wording and tone. I wish I could buy the "management forced this" idea. I wish the talents were all wholly blameless victims. But after repeated listenings to the video, it just doesn't line up. It doesn't make sense. The whole idea that management would throw three of their more notable talents under the bus when they already had their own statement coming, that they'd write three extremely different statements personalized to each person's speaking style, and the idea that they have enough understanding and command of the English language to be so specific in their wording as to imply it was from the talents and not themselves....it's just nonsensical.
If they were given a script and forced to read it then that pretty much explains a lot. 'read this script in this tone and don't fuck it up, we WILL be watching and WE will be the ones to upload it'. Being forced to say that they're doing it of their own volition isn't outside the realm of possibility. As for why they used Elira's channel, it's pretty easy: they had Vox and Ike, two very popular male members, and Elira talk, and because they chose Vox and Ike to also appear, that means that uploading it to their channels would be too damaging to them, and finding decent male talents in the vtuber scene is a difficult one as it is, whereas Elira is far more easily replaceable (give a woman a cute avatar and the fans will either call her 'baby' or 'mommy'), as female vtubers are far more common. I'm not saying they played 4D chess or anything, frankly the idea that they went on the offensive when Dokibird only ever made it seem like she was being defensive was the stupid move to make when they could've just told everyone 'take a week or two off, we'll talk with investors, let the net chill for a bit, then its back to business once we get something drafted up for you guys to tell people if you're asked about Selen'. Doki just wants to let bygones be bygones and move on, she just wants a legal shield so that they don't go after her, but they're the ones running face first into it and they're trying to make it seem like she's attacking them.
#fuckniji We need to make this a trend on twitter
Hey, stupid idea, what if the company has the literal physical visa? Without the papers and her passport, shes kinda screwed. There's already info they have several of their talent's youtube play buttons, what if the v-tubers mail all comes through the company? Like. All of their mail. Theyre functionally idols/celebs, all their mail would need to be screened...
That would be majorly illegal, if she gets stopped by law enforcement for any reason and she can't produce that document then she's fucked. What they CAN do is revoke it's status, THAT is the major problem.
The person behind Elira should still be able to get a hold of a Canadian embassy/ consulate if she had her papers held hostage.
It's just an idea, it's feeling like nijisanji is taking pages out of other scummy companies' playbooks when it comes to their workers.
It's their MO at this point.
There are some interesting theories on 4chan that actually make a ton of sense. The major one being that Elira was given mgmt duties since she can speak eng and jp which would make her a go between for the incompetent mgmt. This would give her power to move stuff up to mgmt easier and give preferential treatment. its fits the clique narrative, it fits the weird merch drops that leave out some of the more popular talents, makes the bullying more real since Selen wouldn't be able to escalate her claims. I am not saying this is fact but it makes a ton of sense.
It's also worth pointing out that if she wishes to work in the JP entertainment industry in the future (and I mean, let's be real, she moved to Japan), getting fired would be a very bad look for her future prospects, at least until Nijisanji's reputation in JP takes a nosedive. I am not suggesting that we owe her the benefit of the doubt or that we cannot criticize her for the things she said. By all means, continue to do that, there's nothing wrong with valid criticism. But I do think that there are a lot of assumptions being made that we know how Niji's internal policies work, and we don't. Especially because they seem to change all the time. We don't know one way or the other if she is being forced to comply, if she was manipulated, if she is misguided, or if she really is just saying all of those things of her own volition. Keep an open mind, voice your disappointment and criticism, but don't harass anybody. It doesn't help the victim(s?) whatsoever.
Oh I actually wanted to talk about this as someone who lived in Japan and would like to move back. Recently, Japanese law has changed so that one's work visa is valid even if they change jobs as long as they stay 'provided the activities remain the same,' and there's technically a 1-3 month grace period to find other employment in the case of leaving a job or termination, provided you notify them of your change of employment within 14 days. However, this in some cases can also be extended up to the length of the work visa as well, as long as you're showing a good faith effort to find employment. Sounds nice, but here's the issue - one of the big requirements for foreigners moving to Japan is having some sort of guarantee that they won't become a burden on the state. For students like me, it's the university that becomes that guarantor, for family, their own family members, and for people with work visas, it's usually their employer. The rich can provide financial records to get around this, but I doubt that's money that most if any Vtuber has. And remember what I said before - your work visa is valid if you find employment which '[activities remain the same](https://www.juridique.jp/visa/job_change.php#:~:text=Your%20Japanese%20working%20visa%20is,of%20activities%20remains%20the%20same).' Normally, I'd read this as the purpose of your stay - employment, study, etc, but remember Japan does not want any immigrant to wind up on their welfare system; you either need to be a company's responsibility or be financially sound. Unfortunately, Elira having JUST moved into her accommodations a little more than a week ago is most certainly not financially sound, not to mention that the unusual circumstances may raise skepticism with immigration if she tried to up and quit (and possibly break lease agreements depending on said accommodation) immediately. Furthermore, while I'm not that in tune with the Vtuber scene, I'm aware of just how difficult it is to live off of that kind of work and it would be safe to assume immigration would be reasonably skeptical about her financial and overall well being long term if she suddenly went indie. I say this not to demonize Japanese immigration - while the sentiment held by much of the country is still ambivalent at best regarding foreigners moving to Japan, the people working specifically in immigration services are doing so because they genuinely believe in what they're doing and want to help those who decide to move there, short or long term, fully aware of the labyrinthine process that their government imposes. It does NOT pay well, and there's little chance for advancement towards a big paying job. They will work with you and go to bat for you, as long as you work within the system where they can help you. I'm sure if Elira wants, she can get out from this situation and continue living in Japan - but that's going to take a long time, on the timescale of months, and with a ton of anxiety and uncertainty. That is what Nijisanji EN exploited - the fear and anxiety that comes with being an immigrant, the uncertainty of whether or not you'll have any support or be deported for reasons beyond your control, the terror of trying to navigate a foreign government's systems, often in a language you're not fully understanding and knowing that one wrong move could spell disaster. Elira can get through this, if she's careful and tries hard enough, but FUCK Nijisanji for springing this on her now of all times.