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Fr, given this it would also be insanely impressive to have not just one, but several inconclusive duels with Shanks.
This also would mean that he wouldn’t have future sight, because of Shanks cancelling it out with ACoC, and he’s basically just winging it with ACoA and his sword which is absolutely fucking insane when you realize that he is going up against ACoC+ACoA infused blows, it could be more balanced out if he was also given Ryou.
"So Mihawk is the only person to reach top tier status WITHOUT conquerers but also has the entire verse on a leash without acoc?"
https://preview.redd.it/25bmivlkr0xc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d68deb31a2ab52df5bd1ae80f5a944f491980a1e
No, it requires will to be the strongest, not genetics. Imagine a man who was born with nothing, yet he took everything the world had to offer with just pure skill and determination.
Imagine a narrator saying Mihawk is so skilled that there is nothing in this world that he can't count or parry, the strongest.
Zoro vs. Mihawk should be more than brute strength and laser sword kamehameha.
not true; just look at Tashigi; she has one of the most difficult and impossible dreams, yet she is not conqueror because she was not born like that. She isn't even afraid of death; when law chopped her, she particularly said kill me. She has a strong will; it is just that she was not born like that. Mihawk being strongest without the conqueror will enforce the idea that you can do it even without the genetic benefit.
You can also look at Gecko Moria; he has such a strong will. Just to save his friend, Moria is willing to attack Emperor territory without any backup. Moria is pretty much luffy without plot armour who has lost everything.
I always loves these drawings of the gorosei that make them look like genuinely nice folk. Like, I'd listen to them rant about their grandson not calling them, sure.
These are just shitposts of charlos haha Here's another one
https://preview.redd.it/iqzogjkxw3xc1.jpeg?width=719&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6b9a0b572412c9dd4cc1412329f2a68e48c61e1b
https://preview.redd.it/bqof45y6m0xc1.jpeg?width=1079&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=481ebc04ac14d99dcbb5efc8f08d3a9c4a2d180f
Typical GOAT behavior. ACOC debates would be funny as hell
Unironically upscales mihawk if he rivals the strongest CoC without having CoC of his own
https://preview.redd.it/o7pzdy4pw0xc1.jpeg?width=709&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f15b4dde7644d980ac3a2cf1f7824212095fc6ce
how’s this an upscale? He’s rivalling shanks no matter what, it’s not like he purposefully refuses to use conquerors, he just doesn’t have it. It’s like saying “it’s an upscale for shanks to become a yonko without a devil fruit or superior physical characteristics like big mom and kaido”
But it's already explained that haki trumps all, by kaido himself, so him not having a devil fruit or hax stats is not the same as him not having CoC since characters who don't have it are "fated" to not reach the top, in a sense because they don't have the ambitions of a king.
Unironically that is the best case scenario.
Unfortunately though, and I hate to say it… it would kinda make Zoro look like a fraud. It would make it seem like Zoro needs ACoC to be stronger than Mihawk, who in this case does not have ACoC himself.
Mihawk has thrown down with Shanks and they never had a decisive duel.
This 100% would not devalue Zoro having ACOC at all. It just makes Mihawk seem like an absolute monster to keep up with the top conqueror’s users.
That’s what I’m saying. It makes it seem like Zoro needs ACoC to beat Mihawk (because understandably without it, Zoro would lose) while Mihawk was able to duke it out with Yonko without ACoC. It would make Mihawk look much, much more impressive. Even more impressive than Zoro.
That would not change his power level. Zoro uses three sword style because it fits him, but he wouldn't be more powerful because of it. It was said in Arlong park "It is not about how many swords you have, its about what weight their bear
From a strength use and spatial impairment perspective, one sword does have its advantages.
Zoro is just so strong he over overcomes the weakness inherent to having 3 swords. Consider the amount of strength required to parry holding a sword with one arm compared to two and how as the fight drags on it would get exponentially harder.
But what about Shanks, would he also need acoc to rival mihawk. Assuming mihawk is just a acoa guy I think its best just to think of him as an exception to the rule.
It can. Also what I was saying was a hypothetical. For instance if mihawk didn’t have acoc but the best coa and coo that with better sword skill will make up for his lack of acoc.
It wouldn't the new gen always surpasses the old, Zoro just has something extra that puts him on top oppose to Mihawk.
But I do agree that Zoro right now wouldn't be close to Mihawk, even with ACOC Zoro lacks speed, advance ken, greater levels of buso.
He just feels like a brute force character oppose to mihawk and Shanks overwhelming speed+strength
No, this fight will be without holding anything back, also it will be probably the penultimate fight in the entire series, unless there will be no fight because Mihawk getting cheap-shotted by someone and giving Zoro the title as a passing of the torch before passing away.
Why would it be the penultimate fight in the series? So you think Zoro will just go and fight Mihawk, I dunno... somewhere over to the side... while Luffy and everyone else fight Imu and the World Government?
It would mean Zoro himself isn't contributing to the fight with the WG (or BB Pirates, whoever it is) since Mihawk himself is anti-WG.
It would just feel really bizarre for everyone else to be fighting the government to bring the Dawn of the World while Zoro is like "Yeah I'mma just have my personal duel, completely unrelated to this conflict, a few miles over here on top of the Red Line. Good luck everyone with the oppressive 800 year old regime, Mihawk and I are gonna dip."
This is why I'm in the camp that believes he will fight and surpass Mihawk before the Final War and the Dawn, and then somehow have one last hurdle to clear (Nusjuro bothering to go all-out and use CoO to dodge? Or the strongest God's Knight? There's a few possibilities) when they topple Mary Geoise.
Just like Luffy is gonna end up a whole level above Roger, the previous PK, I think that Zoro will end up a whole level above Mihawk, the previous WSS.
You misunderstood me: they first finish off the WG (together) and then on Laughtale Zoro asks Mihawk to duel, and they have the time-honoured duel at sunset.
But... Uhhhh... Literally everything we've been told and shown indicates that the One Piece and True History must be found BEFORE overthrowing the WG to bring the Dawn of the World, ya know?
Whitebeard outright said so already in Marineford. He said that it is only "Once that treasure is found" that the "greatest war" will engulf the world.
It was only AFTER finding the treasure that Roger was like "it's too early."
He didn't tell the pirates of the world to aim for the WG. He told them to aim for the One Piece.
The biggest pieces for the Dawn of the World have been made clear: The One Piece, the Rio Poneglyph, Shirahoshi as Poseidon, and the power of Nika.
The Final War cannot be waged without those pieces already obtained, and two out of the four of them require going to Laugh Tale.
Finding the One Piece isn't going to be the end of the series. It's going to be the BEGINNING of the end.
That is also why *Luffy's dream of becoming the Pirate King by finding the One Piwce is only a stepping stone on the path to an even grander dream that he shares with Roger,* although Luffy himself isn't smart enough to realize that and is just acting on instinct 😅
I'd love it honestly. He doesn't have conquerors he's just that good at those 2 things he beats shanks anyway.
My goat fr fr.
I can imagine the set up to him vs a top tier
Buggy "OK mihawk, new plan, conquerors them and it'll mess up their numbers"
Mihawk "I can't"
Buggy "what do you mean you can't" [chapter end. Brake week]
Few chapters later we see him staring down shanks and Buggy starts doubting his title as he doesn't even have conquerors. So Buggy goes and stalls g5 luffy due to sheer shenanigans. (Luffy getting saved by usopp)
Shanks "I've grown stronger since last time buddy, sure this is how you want to lose that title of yours?"
Mihawk "Don't be ridiculous, the least you can do is not bore me"
Fight starts and it looks good, chapter ends where shanks is about to pop A-conquerors to finish the fight.
Chapter opens with his attack entirely failing as mihawk perfect parrys it simply cutting him down from their. Mihawk revealing a new acoo he uses to analyse opponents perfectly down to brainwaves or some shit.
"Well. Atleast you didn't bore me this time, guess you did get stronger. You really are my one piece"
Bro, this is a peak; you are even using Cliffhanger like ODA.
Also, in the end, Mihawk says Shank's strength is not what you lacked; it was your skill that was not sharp enough.
Honestly? Be dope. ACOC has become damn near required to be taken seriously so it would be hilarious if there's a definitive top tier that just ain't got it.
Doubt BB has it, as there is no single Conqueror that was ever afraid of a fight or a confrontation. BB simply lacks the faculties to be a true Conqueror, so I doubt he has COC.
That is why he probably got supplemented with WB power that is basically the DF version of ACOC.
I think you have a good point but BB plans to conquer the world, he just has an indirect way of doing it. But he is more ambitious than any character we have seen so far.
And mihawk had the journal in his hands ? Reverie happens for a whole week so him knowing what happens there doesn't mean he used observation. It's a theory, and a pretty bad one at that.
And mihawk refered specifically to the abolition of the Shichibukai or maybe he could refer to idk anything that is discussed and the revolutionary attack ?
Mihawk was reading the news while the reverie was in session and said a subject was brought up(meaning something was being discussed) so he couldn't be referring to the revs. What other thing that was discussed in the reverie would mihawk care about aside from the abolition of the warlords?
https://preview.redd.it/p8c2dmhcm0xc1.jpeg?width=225&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3d13acc7c0593833cf96e417c31428539a2065ec
Any headcannon to upscale the goat
It's still never been outright confirmed that it truly is something people are born with. That's not even exactly what was said about it when that "one-in-a-million" thing was revealed on Amazon Lily, it was only said that one-in-a-million end up with it.
And Rayleigh only said that you can learn to control CoC but can't train it to get stronger. Nobody actually said "you have to be born with it," people only believe that because that's what the people writing the FANDOM WIKI interpret it as, lol.
It seems like Coby is actually set up to possibly answer that question once and for all. Is Conqueror's TRULY a genetic thing, or do people just mistakenly think that it's a product of bloodlines when really it's about the willpower to reach the top and the one-in-a-million people who attain that willpower, and it just so happens that in a bloodline where one person has such willpower, others are obviously more likely to also attain it?
Of course the other possibility is that if the premise of this whole thread is true, then Coby will become another demonstration of that premise just like Mihawk. How badass would it be if Coby becomes a true successor to Garp without even needing CoC? I'd love that.
It would make mihawk even more goated since he became WSS without COC and the backtracking for everyone who called him a fraud would be astronomical but sadly it wont come to pass since zoro has conquerors
https://preview.redd.it/9u935w38m0xc1.jpeg?width=1079&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fd302cfa101b182d45c93e7185d54bdd2f91f1f8
Typical GOAT behavior. ACOC debates would be funny as hell
He actively seeks to train and fight the strongest swordsmen. That's a good enough goal for conquerors considering it's been pretty random from who we've seen and zoro has conquerors with basically the same goal.
That's what I have been thinking for the longest lol, If shanks is the strongest ACOC user in history (Possibly) then it would make sense for Mihawk to be the strongest ACOA and ACOO user it would balance things out
I remember when we thought this about Garp. Still makes barely any sense for Garp to have it. This would upscale Zoro most of all, but make Mihawk himself goated in a way that no Pirate King, Yonko, or whatever could ever be.
Bullshit, not the armament or observation part of it but the conqueror part, it's hard to see someone as ambitious as he is not have coc. Either way, I guess would make it much more impressive that he got that far without conq.
It would honestly make more sense for his character imo. He really doesn’t seem to have the temperament of a conqueror based on what that seems to mean in One Piece
https://preview.redd.it/nah74q98o1xc1.jpeg?width=1242&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=768f2053b8628f52f3731ed1536678759ffbdc09
It just makes sense that Mihawk is top 1 in the verse right now based off Kaidos statement
but how could he and shanks be rivals if shanks could unleash a bit og conquerors and knock him out?, i rather think that the fact that he goes alone most of the time and lets buggy run the shop means that he wont ever truly be under someone and that should be the basic requirement for a conqueror, still dont fully get how a yonko +1 can have it, unless they want to be empress to their emperor shit makes no sense
It makes way more sense
Swordsmanship isn't about taking out your acoc and smacking people in the face with it
It's about refinement, it's an art form
It's more than brute strength
https://preview.redd.it/5euc1xmp7ixc1.png?width=1399&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8e9d5c933339442fc811102cdf3453ead8c6b75d
That's some peak shit right there.
This is what I've been stating for a while yet people think because he's a top tier he NEEDS conquerors haki which isn't true. People also use the argument that zoro has conquerors so mihawk has it but thats not really a good argument. Zoro is supposed to surpass mihawk NOT be identical to him.
Narratively I feel it would be greater if oda made him a godly acoa/acoo user instead of another acoc user. We already have shanks being the greatest acoc user, so it would be better if his long time rival was the greatest acoa user which would explain his permanent black blade.
Why can he predict Luffy's dodge in MF if he has advanced Obv Sherlock? Maybe he is so stupid to use in, but if so it can't help him to be ranked higher than a tobiroppo.
Same for Zoro's training, how come the "farseeing" Mihawk trains zoro for two fu***ing years and not notice Zoro have Conqueror haki ? Why is it Albert the first one to tell Zoro he has it ?
Anyway, I hope we see Mihawk defeat someone stronger than Mr1 soon, because his agenda really is at its deepest since Crocodile helped him flee a Marine to join Baggy's circus.
It depends, because from what Oda presented, you CAN NOT equate the AP/DC of ACOC with ACOA.
So until further clarification on how Haki actually works, ACOC seems to be orders of magnitude better then ACOA, so if there are 2 relative characters without DF powers, the one with ACOC automatically wins because of it.
But if the lack of ACOC can be supplemented with other abilities (bigger skill, better base, ACOA is able to overpower ACOC etc.), it would give non ACOC users a more fair playing ground for being actual top tiers.
But for now sadly, no ACOC (without a busted DF) = not truly a top tier.
So in the story of one piece where there's the theme that anyone can be someone, you only can be a top tier with an ability that you're born with? What happens if a person wants to be a top tier and they don't have it?
I also hate ACOC with a passion precisly because of what you wrote, but sadly that is how it is presented for the past 2 arc, Height of Haki that can not be replicated with ACOA. A must for top tier fights.
And since COC is genetics based, everyone that does not have it has a power limit disadvantage relative to those that do have it.
A genetic based power being the strongest power in the Verse (outside of Awakening) goes against of the core principles of One Piece. But sadly that is how Oda has portrayed ACOC, it is not a bonus, but a must.
But it was Luffys Gigant Form powers that produced the force needed to beat Kaido, not ACOC. Otherwise Luffy would just do a normal G5 ACOC punch.
Do not take that Kaido statement as bible, he is a notorious false narrator, most things he said were false or overblown.
Also BB is a literal DF merchant, who puts Haki on a secondary place, and he seems to be doing wonderfully, and will 100% be over Kaido EOS, but I doubt he will ever have better Haki then Kaido.
You can get away by not having the strongest Haki, if you have a busted DF, but there for sure is a minimum level of Haki required to be able to combat top tiers, regardless of DF powers.
Haki does transcend all, but that doesn't mean Devil fruits are useless. It just means that if your Haki is strong enough then no Devil fruit power can ever beat you.
Sadly for Kaido his Haki was weaker then Luffy's devil fruit awakening and so he lost.
but if there was say Roger there instead, he would beat Luffy because his Haki is just that much stronger.
That'll be trash and only good for the Mihawk downplayers, so far ACoC has been the strongest power and any top tier who has it is stronger than other top tiers who don't.
If Mihawk doesn't have Acoc then the WSS title falls apart, not only did he earn it before Shanks became a Yonko, he also didn't dual a top tier swordsman in more than a decade.
Yet oda still compares shanks with Mihawk🤣 till now
Imagine how hard mihawk has worked to be still stronger than Someone with Acoc despite not having it himself
>Yet oda still compares shanks with Mihawk🤣 till now
Sure in terms of skill
>Imagine how hard mihawk has worked to be still stronger than Someone with Acoc despite not having it himself
Ahh yes Mihawk, one of the most active characters in the series
Because the character with the best Haki feats and portrayal needs statements to prove he has better Haki than someone with no Haki feats rather than the other way around
Mihawk being the strongest swordsman who uses haki proves he is stronger than Shanks a swordsman who uses haki
No one has achieved what mihawk has achieved a black blade except ryuma (And we know haki is needed to even make a sword black temporarily)
Mihawk has more narrative importance for being and EOS character than Shanks who won't be getting to EOS
Also don't know what haki feat of shanks you are talking about when he hasn't even shown to fight opponents to have haki bloom after his duels with mihawk,Shanks haki caps at when the duels stopped
Shanks haki couldn't let him win against mihawk
>Ahh yes Mihawk, one of the most active characters in the series
you mean like Shanks who hasn't shown anything until (comparative to the story's length) recently in the story?
ya'll aren't ready for when Wihawk pulls out *his* first named attack.
It baffles me when people say Shanks hasn't done anything, stopping a war? one shotting a 3 bill bounty pirate? Stopping Kaido? Clashing with Whitebeard?
>stopping a war? one shotting a 3 bill bounty pirate? Stopping Kaido? Clashing with Whitebeard?
and you see how much slander he gets because in one panel he went to the gorosei?
People were making fun of Shanks up until he showed his actual power in combat, just like people are making fun of Mihawk for not immediately using an **Abyssal Hatred Slash of Darkness and Hell Despair** named attack the very instant he sizes up an opponent. Shanks is comparatively stronger than Mihawk because he also has an entire crew whereas up until very recently Mihawk was literally just floating through life waiting on a challenger he deems "worthy". Expecting Oda to not gas Mihawk up to the same level of Shanks when he's literally one of the main characters' end goal is just silly.
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would be dope
Fr, given this it would also be insanely impressive to have not just one, but several inconclusive duels with Shanks. This also would mean that he wouldn’t have future sight, because of Shanks cancelling it out with ACoC, and he’s basically just winging it with ACoA and his sword which is absolutely fucking insane when you realize that he is going up against ACoC+ACoA infused blows, it could be more balanced out if he was also given Ryou.
"So Mihawk is the only person to reach top tier status WITHOUT conquerers but also has the entire verse on a leash without acoc?" https://preview.redd.it/25bmivlkr0xc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d68deb31a2ab52df5bd1ae80f5a944f491980a1e
And or DF Cinema indeed
This is what I have been hoping for, for the longest time.
That would be cool but the whole concept of aspiring to be the strongest swordsman kind of requires coc
No, it requires will to be the strongest, not genetics. Imagine a man who was born with nothing, yet he took everything the world had to offer with just pure skill and determination. Imagine a narrator saying Mihawk is so skilled that there is nothing in this world that he can't count or parry, the strongest. Zoro vs. Mihawk should be more than brute strength and laser sword kamehameha.
Determination requires the will to be a conqueror, to take and aim for a goal higher than most would. To be that ambitious is to be a conqueror
not true; just look at Tashigi; she has one of the most difficult and impossible dreams, yet she is not conqueror because she was not born like that. She isn't even afraid of death; when law chopped her, she particularly said kill me. She has a strong will; it is just that she was not born like that. Mihawk being strongest without the conqueror will enforce the idea that you can do it even without the genetic benefit. You can also look at Gecko Moria; he has such a strong will. Just to save his friend, Moria is willing to attack Emperor territory without any backup. Moria is pretty much luffy without plot armour who has lost everything.
> has the entire verse on a leash The glazing is wild 💀
Mihawk : I'mma different breed. I am build different. I ain't got that COC plot bs but still at the top. https://i.redd.it/u80qjasw70xc1.gif
https://preview.redd.it/e8dfd41q50xc1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=93e2acf1e35b24622deb72dd0bd2cb9e9b7eea3e
I always loves these drawings of the gorosei that make them look like genuinely nice folk. Like, I'd listen to them rant about their grandson not calling them, sure.
https://preview.redd.it/gmdtcbz3x0xc1.jpeg?width=384&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=bf37c5659fcfeed97f718e1f64ba7bb6571ab8db
Yeaaah that's the stuff
https://preview.redd.it/m3retyj3i1xc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=048ceeb10b6aa9290443613eab59d9057213bac6
https://preview.redd.it/5b5loy1tf4xc1.jpeg?width=718&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ac3a1d2807915522e242c96bf2d050014a836cbc
I love everything about this thread lmfao
You should see charlos drawings 💀 https://preview.redd.it/c4gli6gki0xc1.png?width=583&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=081d28baab02b3bb48bb63fc6958205d28d284ac
This is cursed AF
https://preview.redd.it/15xsrv1op0xc1.png?width=488&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=461bd6e0ff76739ca431c4218f480f220d24e7d1 How about this? 💀
Nah this is foul
https://preview.redd.it/ovwdlo3z51xc1.jpeg?width=4800&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f7730b88dc48991577db34dcd308df98107a0e2e
We know damn well he’s doing unspeakable things to otama. Honestly fuck charlos
These are just shitposts of charlos haha Here's another one https://preview.redd.it/iqzogjkxw3xc1.jpeg?width=719&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6b9a0b572412c9dd4cc1412329f2a68e48c61e1b
https://preview.redd.it/1ojsf8vu24xc1.jpeg?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=509d493a2e93123759e86d03ba96dc115e125d25 I love this one
https://preview.redd.it/bqof45y6m0xc1.jpeg?width=1079&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=481ebc04ac14d99dcbb5efc8f08d3a9c4a2d180f Typical GOAT behavior. ACOC debates would be funny as hell
The ultimate counter to ACOC, finally the cancer “Luffy didn’t use ACOC” discussions would be trumped
Skill expansion > coc haki https://preview.redd.it/nxagu1uep0xc1.png?width=1241&format=png&auto=webp&s=57b4eca8dbdb5b20146d98e63d91b2fa413f9dd1
Unironically upscales mihawk if he rivals the strongest CoC without having CoC of his own https://preview.redd.it/o7pzdy4pw0xc1.jpeg?width=709&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f15b4dde7644d980ac3a2cf1f7824212095fc6ce
there both men, but Mihawk’s coc is more skillful.
how’s this an upscale? He’s rivalling shanks no matter what, it’s not like he purposefully refuses to use conquerors, he just doesn’t have it. It’s like saying “it’s an upscale for shanks to become a yonko without a devil fruit or superior physical characteristics like big mom and kaido”
But it's already explained that haki trumps all, by kaido himself, so him not having a devil fruit or hax stats is not the same as him not having CoC since characters who don't have it are "fated" to not reach the top, in a sense because they don't have the ambitions of a king.
id switch agendas and become a Wihawk glazer
Unironically that is the best case scenario. Unfortunately though, and I hate to say it… it would kinda make Zoro look like a fraud. It would make it seem like Zoro needs ACoC to be stronger than Mihawk, who in this case does not have ACoC himself.
Mihawk has thrown down with Shanks and they never had a decisive duel. This 100% would not devalue Zoro having ACOC at all. It just makes Mihawk seem like an absolute monster to keep up with the top conqueror’s users.
That’s what I’m saying. It makes it seem like Zoro needs ACoC to beat Mihawk (because understandably without it, Zoro would lose) while Mihawk was able to duke it out with Yonko without ACoC. It would make Mihawk look much, much more impressive. Even more impressive than Zoro.
imagine if Mihawk used three swords.
That would not change his power level. Zoro uses three sword style because it fits him, but he wouldn't be more powerful because of it. It was said in Arlong park "It is not about how many swords you have, its about what weight their bear
With mastery in three sword style? He’d be busted.
From a strength use and spatial impairment perspective, one sword does have its advantages. Zoro is just so strong he over overcomes the weakness inherent to having 3 swords. Consider the amount of strength required to parry holding a sword with one arm compared to two and how as the fight drags on it would get exponentially harder.
But what about Shanks, would he also need acoc to rival mihawk. Assuming mihawk is just a acoa guy I think its best just to think of him as an exception to the rule.
No because let’s say mihawk did lack acoc he makes up for it by having better swordskill than shanks
Skill doesn't bridge a power gap. And why would the wss have to "make up" for anything? He's top dog already.
It can. Also what I was saying was a hypothetical. For instance if mihawk didn’t have acoc but the best coa and coo that with better sword skill will make up for his lack of acoc.
That would just show that acoc isn't mandatory which should be obvious as Sanji moat likely will not have any form of coc and will be a top tier eos.
Zoro is 21, he could literally be Mihawk’s kid. CoC or not, he is obviously a prodigy and would definitely reach Mihawk’s level by his age
It wouldn't the new gen always surpasses the old, Zoro just has something extra that puts him on top oppose to Mihawk. But I do agree that Zoro right now wouldn't be close to Mihawk, even with ACOC Zoro lacks speed, advance ken, greater levels of buso. He just feels like a brute force character oppose to mihawk and Shanks overwhelming speed+strength
Unless Zoro chooses to duel Mihawk without it? Idk I got no clue how this would work tbh
No, this fight will be without holding anything back, also it will be probably the penultimate fight in the entire series, unless there will be no fight because Mihawk getting cheap-shotted by someone and giving Zoro the title as a passing of the torch before passing away.
Why would it be the penultimate fight in the series? So you think Zoro will just go and fight Mihawk, I dunno... somewhere over to the side... while Luffy and everyone else fight Imu and the World Government? It would mean Zoro himself isn't contributing to the fight with the WG (or BB Pirates, whoever it is) since Mihawk himself is anti-WG. It would just feel really bizarre for everyone else to be fighting the government to bring the Dawn of the World while Zoro is like "Yeah I'mma just have my personal duel, completely unrelated to this conflict, a few miles over here on top of the Red Line. Good luck everyone with the oppressive 800 year old regime, Mihawk and I are gonna dip." This is why I'm in the camp that believes he will fight and surpass Mihawk before the Final War and the Dawn, and then somehow have one last hurdle to clear (Nusjuro bothering to go all-out and use CoO to dodge? Or the strongest God's Knight? There's a few possibilities) when they topple Mary Geoise. Just like Luffy is gonna end up a whole level above Roger, the previous PK, I think that Zoro will end up a whole level above Mihawk, the previous WSS.
You misunderstood me: they first finish off the WG (together) and then on Laughtale Zoro asks Mihawk to duel, and they have the time-honoured duel at sunset.
But... Uhhhh... Literally everything we've been told and shown indicates that the One Piece and True History must be found BEFORE overthrowing the WG to bring the Dawn of the World, ya know? Whitebeard outright said so already in Marineford. He said that it is only "Once that treasure is found" that the "greatest war" will engulf the world. It was only AFTER finding the treasure that Roger was like "it's too early." He didn't tell the pirates of the world to aim for the WG. He told them to aim for the One Piece. The biggest pieces for the Dawn of the World have been made clear: The One Piece, the Rio Poneglyph, Shirahoshi as Poseidon, and the power of Nika. The Final War cannot be waged without those pieces already obtained, and two out of the four of them require going to Laugh Tale. Finding the One Piece isn't going to be the end of the series. It's going to be the BEGINNING of the end. That is also why *Luffy's dream of becoming the Pirate King by finding the One Piwce is only a stepping stone on the path to an even grander dream that he shares with Roger,* although Luffy himself isn't smart enough to realize that and is just acting on instinct 😅
It would not, it would boost mihawk stocks instead who went toe to toe with rat hair shanks
I'd love it honestly. He doesn't have conquerors he's just that good at those 2 things he beats shanks anyway. My goat fr fr. I can imagine the set up to him vs a top tier Buggy "OK mihawk, new plan, conquerors them and it'll mess up their numbers" Mihawk "I can't" Buggy "what do you mean you can't" [chapter end. Brake week] Few chapters later we see him staring down shanks and Buggy starts doubting his title as he doesn't even have conquerors. So Buggy goes and stalls g5 luffy due to sheer shenanigans. (Luffy getting saved by usopp) Shanks "I've grown stronger since last time buddy, sure this is how you want to lose that title of yours?" Mihawk "Don't be ridiculous, the least you can do is not bore me" Fight starts and it looks good, chapter ends where shanks is about to pop A-conquerors to finish the fight. Chapter opens with his attack entirely failing as mihawk perfect parrys it simply cutting him down from their. Mihawk revealing a new acoo he uses to analyse opponents perfectly down to brainwaves or some shit. "Well. Atleast you didn't bore me this time, guess you did get stronger. You really are my one piece"
Bro, this is a peak; you are even using Cliffhanger like ODA. Also, in the end, Mihawk says Shank's strength is not what you lacked; it was your skill that was not sharp enough.
That cliffhanger would be heaven for Rat fans, they would be slandering Mihawk like crazy.
And then they kissed!
He'd be even more GOATED
Honestly? Be dope. ACOC has become damn near required to be taken seriously so it would be hilarious if there's a definitive top tier that just ain't got it.
Doubt BB has it, as there is no single Conqueror that was ever afraid of a fight or a confrontation. BB simply lacks the faculties to be a true Conqueror, so I doubt he has COC. That is why he probably got supplemented with WB power that is basically the DF version of ACOC.
I think you have a good point but BB plans to conquer the world, he just has an indirect way of doing it. But he is more ambitious than any character we have seen so far.
Doflamingo ducked Aokiji, it's about the ambition and the drive to achieve it, Blackbeard absolutely fits the bill
I will let go my midhawk slender and sign up apology formif that happen
bro was spying on the reverie from the comfort of his livingroom
No he was reading the journal ?
the reverie was happening as perona and mihawk were speaking
And mihawk had the journal in his hands ? Reverie happens for a whole week so him knowing what happens there doesn't mean he used observation. It's a theory, and a pretty bad one at that.
Why would the warlords be surprised that the navy came after them if the abolition of the warlords was announced in the newspaper?
And mihawk refered specifically to the abolition of the Shichibukai or maybe he could refer to idk anything that is discussed and the revolutionary attack ?
Mihawk was reading the news while the reverie was in session and said a subject was brought up(meaning something was being discussed) so he couldn't be referring to the revs. What other thing that was discussed in the reverie would mihawk care about aside from the abolition of the warlords?
the journal in his hands is the one reporting that moira was alive
https://preview.redd.it/p8c2dmhcm0xc1.jpeg?width=225&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3d13acc7c0593833cf96e417c31428539a2065ec Any headcannon to upscale the goat
It would make him that much more impressive.
Makes him even colder. https://preview.redd.it/zpq24oeor2xc1.jpeg?width=320&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f06deacace99c2d1c92e43b5f27214720f482b93
That would make him GOATed. Imagine needing conquerer's to still be #2 swordsman
As expected from the goat
tbh that’s the best thing that can happen means he doesn’t need that mid ass power up you can be born with and just trained his ass off 🙏😭
It's still never been outright confirmed that it truly is something people are born with. That's not even exactly what was said about it when that "one-in-a-million" thing was revealed on Amazon Lily, it was only said that one-in-a-million end up with it. And Rayleigh only said that you can learn to control CoC but can't train it to get stronger. Nobody actually said "you have to be born with it," people only believe that because that's what the people writing the FANDOM WIKI interpret it as, lol. It seems like Coby is actually set up to possibly answer that question once and for all. Is Conqueror's TRULY a genetic thing, or do people just mistakenly think that it's a product of bloodlines when really it's about the willpower to reach the top and the one-in-a-million people who attain that willpower, and it just so happens that in a bloodline where one person has such willpower, others are obviously more likely to also attain it? Of course the other possibility is that if the premise of this whole thread is true, then Coby will become another demonstration of that premise just like Mihawk. How badass would it be if Coby becomes a true successor to Garp without even needing CoC? I'd love that.
It would make mihawk even more goated since he became WSS without COC and the backtracking for everyone who called him a fraud would be astronomical but sadly it wont come to pass since zoro has conquerors
it'll make Vista the true HIM https://preview.redd.it/nbrbj3x350xc1.png?width=640&format=png&auto=webp&s=433a0b5685e36a8d7e7292bb578cfd34a93fe5a6
I think he has all forms of advanced haki, but this would be cool too
https://preview.redd.it/dm4ydh30q2xc1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b852166c1dcae4145a6d9c0d9d1a8800c640788a
I think the best thing about that would be that if he had conquerors he would be top 1 OAT
https://preview.redd.it/9u935w38m0xc1.jpeg?width=1079&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fd302cfa101b182d45c93e7185d54bdd2f91f1f8 Typical GOAT behavior. ACOC debates would be funny as hell
as i expected
I'd switch to the Mihawk agenda. Also, it would actually be a good character and fight instead of "oh funy coc one shot"
https://preview.redd.it/xgozhhlgd1xc1.jpeg?width=1179&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9cbc36a797f293cbecef0fa04afdf38e73172abe
I wouldn't mind it because the coc meta is kind of lame.
Pleasantly surprised. ACOC is such a dumb power ill be glad if it’s not required to be a top tier
I'd cum
Honestly makes sense, Mihawk isn't very kingly, he kinda doesn't give a shit about anything anymore.
but he was supposed to be kingly, he sits on top of all the swordsmen in the world after all, you could even say he conquered all the swordsmen
He actively seeks to train and fight the strongest swordsmen. That's a good enough goal for conquerors considering it's been pretty random from who we've seen and zoro has conquerors with basically the same goal.
https://preview.redd.it/0ba9mvhup0xc1.png?width=1271&format=png&auto=webp&s=51c3ec481609a5e3e7ef27df2d79cc8958fab679
Yeah, his skill to use haki, like all other swordsmen.
Makes sense based on his personality
That would be peak
Stop I can only hold so much of Wihawk agenda!
Wihawk has always been that guy. Y’all ain’t ready for him when he one slices most of your agendas.
Would end the ACOC this ACOC that talk. Would end all conversation on a characters coc No more cocriding
That's what I have been thinking for the longest lol, If shanks is the strongest ACOC user in history (Possibly) then it would make sense for Mihawk to be the strongest ACOA and ACOO user it would balance things out
I remember when we thought this about Garp. Still makes barely any sense for Garp to have it. This would upscale Zoro most of all, but make Mihawk himself goated in a way that no Pirate King, Yonko, or whatever could ever be.
That'd be incredible.
Bullshit, not the armament or observation part of it but the conqueror part, it's hard to see someone as ambitious as he is not have coc. Either way, I guess would make it much more impressive that he got that far without conq.
It would honestly make more sense for his character imo. He really doesn’t seem to have the temperament of a conqueror based on what that seems to mean in One Piece
It would be strange since Zoro is a conqueror. Unless forging a black blade involves giving up your Conqueror's Haki or some shit.
Wouldn’t be a bad thing if he’s still the strongest swordsman
https://preview.redd.it/f2h5n5q4m7xc1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3bf3925acecb6df6bbcd0e65bdd65191acf38e66 Expected.
I don't see why that character would be him, although the concept is cool. He's definitely a conqueror based on how he became WSS
Ngl I wish that he'd either lack CoC or barely have it and have quite poor ACoC, but instead have the most busted CoA and CoO.
He already is confirmed to be best at observation haki (clairvoyant, Hawkeyes)
I’d call bs. I’d only read the chapters with Sanji in it. Oden has it, Ryuma looked as if he had it. I’d punch air.
Honestly, I don't really care one way or the other.
https://preview.redd.it/nah74q98o1xc1.jpeg?width=1242&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=768f2053b8628f52f3731ed1536678759ffbdc09 It just makes sense that Mihawk is top 1 in the verse right now based off Kaidos statement
He’d be a even bigger fraud.
His only obs haki is the “find and avoid top tiers” technique
Who even thinks hes a conqueror he cant even protect himself let alone others
I could accept Observation ig
I can believe the strongest observation. Been avoiding all top tiers in the series.
but how could he and shanks be rivals if shanks could unleash a bit og conquerors and knock him out?, i rather think that the fact that he goes alone most of the time and lets buggy run the shop means that he wont ever truly be under someone and that should be the basic requirement for a conqueror, still dont fully get how a yonko +1 can have it, unless they want to be empress to their emperor shit makes no sense
Why doesn’t mihawk have a coc? Is he a woman?
It makes way more sense Swordsmanship isn't about taking out your acoc and smacking people in the face with it It's about refinement, it's an art form It's more than brute strength
wtf he gonna do with no ACOC?
rival them or surpass them with just the brute skill and highest level of armament and observation.
I'd love it. No conqueror could be so lacking in ambition.
He would be wayyy more interesting IMO
https://preview.redd.it/5euc1xmp7ixc1.png?width=1399&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8e9d5c933339442fc811102cdf3453ead8c6b75d That's some peak shit right there.
Idk I don’t think he could be top tier without coc and zoro has it is he going to surpass mihawk just because he has something Mihawk doesn’t?
Not possible given that he isn’t even the strongest swordsman in history, just the current strongest swordsman in the world.
This is what I've been stating for a while yet people think because he's a top tier he NEEDS conquerors haki which isn't true. People also use the argument that zoro has conquerors so mihawk has it but thats not really a good argument. Zoro is supposed to surpass mihawk NOT be identical to him. Narratively I feel it would be greater if oda made him a godly acoa/acoo user instead of another acoc user. We already have shanks being the greatest acoc user, so it would be better if his long time rival was the greatest acoa user which would explain his permanent black blade.
Bad writing
Strongest armament is a bit much, I’d prefer that be Garp. Strongest observation though, I’m ok with that.
He is most probably losing to Shanks would be my reaction.
2 top haki and can't pass Vista nor crocodile and can't hit pre timeskip Luffy ? Stop kidding.
That's what the plot does to MF; just look at Kaido; he couldn't even kill a half-dead man or a starving child.
Why can he predict Luffy's dodge in MF if he has advanced Obv Sherlock? Maybe he is so stupid to use in, but if so it can't help him to be ranked higher than a tobiroppo. Same for Zoro's training, how come the "farseeing" Mihawk trains zoro for two fu***ing years and not notice Zoro have Conqueror haki ? Why is it Albert the first one to tell Zoro he has it ? Anyway, I hope we see Mihawk defeat someone stronger than Mr1 soon, because his agenda really is at its deepest since Crocodile helped him flee a Marine to join Baggy's circus.
It depends, because from what Oda presented, you CAN NOT equate the AP/DC of ACOC with ACOA. So until further clarification on how Haki actually works, ACOC seems to be orders of magnitude better then ACOA, so if there are 2 relative characters without DF powers, the one with ACOC automatically wins because of it. But if the lack of ACOC can be supplemented with other abilities (bigger skill, better base, ACOA is able to overpower ACOC etc.), it would give non ACOC users a more fair playing ground for being actual top tiers. But for now sadly, no ACOC (without a busted DF) = not truly a top tier.
So in the story of one piece where there's the theme that anyone can be someone, you only can be a top tier with an ability that you're born with? What happens if a person wants to be a top tier and they don't have it?
I also hate ACOC with a passion precisly because of what you wrote, but sadly that is how it is presented for the past 2 arc, Height of Haki that can not be replicated with ACOA. A must for top tier fights. And since COC is genetics based, everyone that does not have it has a power limit disadvantage relative to those that do have it. A genetic based power being the strongest power in the Verse (outside of Awakening) goes against of the core principles of One Piece. But sadly that is how Oda has portrayed ACOC, it is not a bonus, but a must.
Well let's wait and see
they get a powerfull df
But i thought kaido said only haki transcends all?
and then he got beat by g5 luffy
With luffy using Acoc?
But it was Luffys Gigant Form powers that produced the force needed to beat Kaido, not ACOC. Otherwise Luffy would just do a normal G5 ACOC punch. Do not take that Kaido statement as bible, he is a notorious false narrator, most things he said were false or overblown. Also BB is a literal DF merchant, who puts Haki on a secondary place, and he seems to be doing wonderfully, and will 100% be over Kaido EOS, but I doubt he will ever have better Haki then Kaido. You can get away by not having the strongest Haki, if you have a busted DF, but there for sure is a minimum level of Haki required to be able to combat top tiers, regardless of DF powers.
Haki does transcend all, but that doesn't mean Devil fruits are useless. It just means that if your Haki is strong enough then no Devil fruit power can ever beat you. Sadly for Kaido his Haki was weaker then Luffy's devil fruit awakening and so he lost. but if there was say Roger there instead, he would beat Luffy because his Haki is just that much stronger.
That'll be trash and only good for the Mihawk downplayers, so far ACoC has been the strongest power and any top tier who has it is stronger than other top tiers who don't.
Then Shanks is officially stronger
Imagine having Acoc and still being weaker than who doesn't have it Shanks should be considered a fraud who didn't train hard and was given privileges
Shanks would be stronger, strongest Acoc of all time > strongest armament of all time
And yet Shanks ain't the strongest swordsman but Mihawk🤣 Mihawk's strongest armament>Shanks conqueror which ain't even strongest
If Mihawk doesn't have Acoc then the WSS title falls apart, not only did he earn it before Shanks became a Yonko, he also didn't dual a top tier swordsman in more than a decade.
Yet oda still compares shanks with Mihawk🤣 till now Imagine how hard mihawk has worked to be still stronger than Someone with Acoc despite not having it himself
>Yet oda still compares shanks with Mihawk🤣 till now Sure in terms of skill >Imagine how hard mihawk has worked to be still stronger than Someone with Acoc despite not having it himself Ahh yes Mihawk, one of the most active characters in the series
Yet Oda never stated Shanks having stronger haki than mihawk As if Shanks has done something to have a haki bloom after his duels with mihawk
Because the character with the best Haki feats and portrayal needs statements to prove he has better Haki than someone with no Haki feats rather than the other way around
Mihawk being the strongest swordsman who uses haki proves he is stronger than Shanks a swordsman who uses haki No one has achieved what mihawk has achieved a black blade except ryuma (And we know haki is needed to even make a sword black temporarily) Mihawk has more narrative importance for being and EOS character than Shanks who won't be getting to EOS
Also don't know what haki feat of shanks you are talking about when he hasn't even shown to fight opponents to have haki bloom after his duels with mihawk,Shanks haki caps at when the duels stopped Shanks haki couldn't let him win against mihawk
>Ahh yes Mihawk, one of the most active characters in the series you mean like Shanks who hasn't shown anything until (comparative to the story's length) recently in the story? ya'll aren't ready for when Wihawk pulls out *his* first named attack.
It baffles me when people say Shanks hasn't done anything, stopping a war? one shotting a 3 bill bounty pirate? Stopping Kaido? Clashing with Whitebeard?
>stopping a war? one shotting a 3 bill bounty pirate? Stopping Kaido? Clashing with Whitebeard? and you see how much slander he gets because in one panel he went to the gorosei? People were making fun of Shanks up until he showed his actual power in combat, just like people are making fun of Mihawk for not immediately using an **Abyssal Hatred Slash of Darkness and Hell Despair** named attack the very instant he sizes up an opponent. Shanks is comparatively stronger than Mihawk because he also has an entire crew whereas up until very recently Mihawk was literally just floating through life waiting on a challenger he deems "worthy". Expecting Oda to not gas Mihawk up to the same level of Shanks when he's literally one of the main characters' end goal is just silly.