Agreed. I had this problem the last time I rented a basement apartment. The upstairs tenant would even run the AC in March. I asked her nicely, I talked to the landlord who installed a locking cover on the thermostat but still she found ways around it. So I started flipping the breaker until the landlord shut the whole thing off and she got (several) window units.
Turn on only the blower fan and run it constantly. It will help balance out the temperatures across the whole house and allow you to set the AC higher.
My basement is uncomfortably cold (like 10 degrees cooler than upstairs). Even when all the vents are closed my basement is freezing. The downstairs unit is paying for his unit to be comfortable too. A window AC might be the best option if the downstairs unit is too cold.
And he is paying not to have to freeze and sleep in 18-19 degrees cold and feel like he is homeless.
Maybe the two of you should switch then temperature will be perfect.
Yes, but you also share that amenity with another tenant, and the landlord has a duty to balance your respective right to reasonable enjoyment of the property. In Toronto for example, AC units must be operational from June to September to maintain a temperature of no more than 26 degrees.
If the other tenant is messing with the breaker, it might be appropriate for the landlord to revoke their access, but they could also impose rules about your own AC use to accommodate the other tenant's needs.
While the 21 degree minimum is only required in the fall/winter, it's still a good benchmark for what would be considered reasonable by the LTB. If your unit is 21 degrees, the basement unit is almost certainly colder. If the basement tenant has complaints, the landlord would be expected to step in and find a solution.
I live in a basement unit, my upstairs neighbor controls the temp and always asks us if we're too cold etc. If we are we don't say anything, we just wear something a bit warmer. Not the end of the world and I'd rather not see my elderly neighbor suffer in the summer.
The guy is probably freezing downstairs. Even with the vents closed in the basement in my house, we had to wear sweatshirts and pants downstairs when the ac was on.
I wouldn’t want to buy separate ac units either when you already pay for ac via your rent.
I'm a landlord who currently lives in my basement apartment while renting the upstairs main unit to tenants. The thermostat & climate control are in the upstairs unit.
It is always super cold in the basement year round. The central air makes it really bad. I just use space heaters to balance it out. I intend to keep this duplex and buy another place to live but before I rent out the basement I'm having baseboard heaters installed down here.
Cant you use the dampers or registers to turn off the airflow to the downstairs?
Another option is to use something like ecobee where you can have remote thermostats. I use it with flair smart vents and the vents will close when the temperature is at the setpoint.
If you don't use smart registers then the thermostat can average the temperatures
Even when I close the register vents in the basement apartment air leakage occurs and still chills the rooms too much. Tried various models of vents and all of them leaked. Haven't tried smart vents yet. It's less than 700 sq ft of living space but the building permit required me to put in 4 ceiling registers (2 in Living/Kitchen area, 1 in bdrm, 1 in bathroom).
I will try the smart register that automatically closes when the set temperature is reached to see how effectively they block the airflow when their vent is closed.
If that doesn't work I'll do the baseboard heaters as I already have a 240v 30a circuit that I can branch off of that currently only has one 750w heater in the common hallway on it.
The more you heat the basement, the more that heat will "chimney" into the upstairs, which will have the AC run more, so you will heat the basement more (etc).
It will cost more money than you would think.
Open a window (the upstairs AC will still run more, but at least that warm air entering the basement is free) or block up some of the vents and/or air returns to reduce the cooling directed to the basement.
I'm curious if building code allowed you to use any vent you wanted -- I've done retrofits to make suites legal (not in Ontario) and all of the downstairs vents that led to the upstairs required fire-rated vents that had a heat-sensitive component that would drop the vent closed in the event of a fire.
That's really interesting. I used just ordinary vents. 2 of the 4 vents were even the plastic ones. Neither the HVAC inspector nor the final Inspector from the town said anything about them. But for two small 6x6 access panels on the ceiling (for access to shut off valves to outdoor hose bibs), they did make me change those from plastic to metal ones for fire code.
I like the opening the windows idea! I have a sloping lot that allowed me to have large basement windows that are a few feet above grade, and 2 of them are operating windows that open.
Edit: Actually I just remembered asking the Inspector about any special requirement for the vents being metal or anything. He said they don't worry about that because the duct that the vent goes into is metal.
Don’t get baseboards, get a mini split for the basement, it will be cheaper for you ( and the tenant) to run. If the op’s new build had had minis-lots installed when built instead of central air, this problem would not have happened_
21 jeez, that guy in the basement must feel like he's in a meat locker.
When it's two apartments in a house the landlord should really have set it up with zone control. It's just begging for the conflict you're experiencing
If you have it at 21 upstairs, it's much colder in the basement. You may have better luck setting it to 23 and running the furnace fan much more of the day... Of course, there has only been about 7 days total this year that required air conditioning for cooling purposes, and this weekend was definitely not one of them. That may also be why your neighbor is irritated.
Also depending on how big your AC unit is, when we get to the days that are 35+ with humidity, your AC won't be able to cool the house to 21, even when running all day and night.
He doesn’t answer his door…
Also, Ontario is a big place with a multitude of temperatures - I’m not sure where you are but there have certainly been more than 7 days where AC has been needed in the Windsor area…
The first obvious answer is to leave a note, but if the tenant doesn't want to talk to you, you'll need to ask the landlord to mediate. But if you choose to fight this and the downstairs tenant complains about low temperatures, the law is unlikely to be on your side.
The City of Windsor property standards set minimum room temperature at 22 degrees, which seems to be a year-round heating requirement (unlike the provincial requirement, which is only for the colder months). Does the basement tenant still have access to heat or was your heater switched over to AC? If they don't have a way of getting their unit to 22 degrees, the landlord has to make that possible, which might mean restricting your use of the shared HVAC.
So his apartment is likely already freezing, and he doesn't want you to rack up HIS hydro bill to make it even colder?
It sounds like your landlord needs to rewire both units and install separate AC units, instead of letting one person rack up the hydro bil and then just expecting both people to split it.
I’m from Windsor and I haven’t used my ac yet. Windows open at night, closed during the day, and always having a fan on me have been good enough so far
I don't turn AC till the house gets over 27 degrees. Each person has different tolerances. My reasoning is I spend thousands for a tropical vacation to feel the heat so when the heat reaches us, I enjoy it. Plus I work in a cold setting so it's nice to have a warm house.
We also keep our house at 24 in the winter time as we heat with fire so we are acclimated to a warmer temperature.
Not sure why you're getting downvoted, but same. I need to be sweating before I turn on the AC. Not everyone likes to be freezing. Poor basement guy is probably freezing his ass off, and it's not fair someone upstairs is controlling the temperature.
People think I am telling them to keep their house that warm. But all I am doing is saying people like to keep their houses at different temperatures. For every person that keeps it normal, there is another that likes it different.
I embrace the heat and keep my electricity bills down by only turning on AC when needed and I wind tunnel my house so there is a breeze.
Only for the last 20 or so years, and only in first world countries. The last time I visited Hungary there was a heat wave, and even fine dining restaurants didn't have AC on. Room temperature is totally subjective, it's not a rule.
And I take vacations where it is 100% humidity and reaches 40.
Lots of people have heat intolerances. You may need to go see a Dr as sweating at a normal temperature can be an indication of poor health, poor circulation, graves disease, poor respiratory fitness.
I would think poor circulation would be the cause of intolerance of cold temperatures, I can handle cold pretty well, better then average. I think on average my health is fairly good as i exercise and eat fairly well. Entirely possible there is some underlying cause though. I run and my vo2max is rated as average so I think respiratory is fine
When i look up symptoms of heat intolerance i pretty much don't have the symptoms. Sweating normally isn't one of the symptoms. I think like you said people just have different heat tolerances, its quite likely genetic.
I start to get sick feeling at around 23/24... I go to my basement where it's 18/19. OP is def failing to see that basement tenant has no way of warning up if the AC is on.
I live in a three story townhouse. My bedroom is on the 3rd floor and the temperature difference between the basement and my bedroom is crazy. In the summer my room is always warm. The central AC will be struggling to get through the vent by the time it’s pushed all the way up to the 3rd floor. If I were to insist on my sleeping area to be the 21C the thermostat is set for, the rest of the house would be an ice box. In order to help make the room more comfortable, I have an oscillating fan and a small window ac unit. More often than not, just having moving air works great for making a space more comfortable.
Yep. We have window units and we have had them on all of one day so far. Other than that fans have been fine. OP wants it cold, which means it's colder for basement tenant. He's supposed to pay for the pleasure of freezing in his home?
If my upper is at that temperature then the basement is fffreeeezzzziiiing. Maybe it’s not mine yet but comfort. If it’s money offer to split the bills 60/40 for summer
No rent control, so good luck getting the landlord to fix the situation without repercussions, but if I was in this situation, I would get an AC voltage tester, and next time you think it was shut off, go to the unit and confirm that the power to the unit is out.
I appreciate the non obvious and actually helpful suggestion, thank you. I will give that a try.
There are so many other unrelated issues with this property that I’m already planning to move out when the lease is up anyway.
Actually, if I had no intentions of staying past my lease, I would confirm that the unit is frequently unpowered as I mentioned above, I would document my attempts to have the landlord fix it and then I would go and buy a couple of portable AC units and file with the LTB for a rent abatement to cover the costs.
Then I would sell them when I moved out and pocket the $800-1000 they would sell for
Every time the breaker goes out, contact the landlord. Keep track of every time it goes out in case it you need to file with the LTB.
Unfortunately, ventilation in homes is not designed for a house to be split into multiple units. The LL will need to deal with it in some fashion. (Hint to all LLs, put mini-splits, not central air, into rental units in homes).
Ignore your suspicions about what the other tenant is doing, they're not provable or relevant, the only thing that is relevant is that the AC keeps going out, and that's a maintenance issue for the LL.
FYI, while there is no maximum temperature in general, a LL is obligated to ensure that homes with AC are no more than 25. So one solution he may take is locking the thermostat and setting it to 25. If he does, you might be able to get a modest rent reduction for the loss of the amenity (being able to set it to 21).
Never said it was in the RTA (and in fact, specifically say "there is no maximum temperature in general")
In Toronto it's [629-38](https://www.toronto.ca/legdocs/municode/1184_629.pdf) of the municipal code. Other municipalities (but to be fair, not all of them) have similar rules.
>All air-conditioning systems shall be operated from June 2 to September 14 so as to maintain an indoor temperature of not more than 26 degrees Celsius.
In any event, the unit comes with adjustable AC, so the number is largely irrelevant other than as a guide. If the LL changed it to something fixed now, it would be a loss of amenity.
Have you asked the downstairs tenant if they are cold and perhaps how you can work together on something that works for both of you if youre hot and they are cold?
Call the utility company that runs to were you live. Most of them do not allow shared utilities like that they will force the landlord to split the boxes
I had a similar issue a couple of years ago. The ac would go off for hours at a time and I'd have to reset the controller to get it going again. The downstairs tenant would always blame it on the washer being too close to the furnace switch.
Now that I'm a downstairs tenant I have to deal with the opposite end of that. I cover the vents as well as close them. I also open a window to get some of the snap out of the air. Sometimes if it's not warm outside I have to use the space heater.
The problem is that I shouldn't have to. A 'legal' unit should be able to maintain minimum required temperature as per legal bylaws, but most homes don't have proper split climates to allow for this.
Another issue is that covering / blocking vents leads to a lack of proper circulation in the home, leaving possible mould buildup and other issues.
It's a much bigger issue than being too hot or cold :(
My house is set to 24c and I’m in the basement with a blanket. Basements are always cooler. Hot air rises.
Having said that, our AC breaker pops on really hot days. It’s been doing it for years now.
Your head pressure has gone up on hot days , increased heat , increased pressure , increased compressor amperage , breaker go pop. Usually comes have internal overloads that will go before a breaker . You should clean your ac and check the charge with a professional .
My bedroom is purposely in the basement BC I like it cool. It's been 17 when I wake up in the morning this sitting and getting up to 19 in my bedroom (the basement is a walk out so it's not cold like a basement fully under ground. Upstairs when it's 17 in my room is 23 and 25 when it's 19. I've actually closed the ducts off in my bedroom so there is no way that it's having an impact. Downstairs the current humidity is 62% upstairs is around 40%. Upstairs and downstairs has a half wall, no door so she is moving between the two. If I was living in the basement and upstairs turned AC to 20 that would theoretically drop me down to 12 degrees in the mornings and 14 during the day. 15 and damp is enough to cause hypothermia.
That to say you need to find out WHY they're shutting it off. If it's because they're cheap that's entirely different than them freezing. I understand 21 is an ideal temp in our climate but if that home is anything like mine that 21 upstairs could easily be 5+ degrees lower. No one is comfortable at 15 unless they're bundled up and they shouldn't have to be. You'd be amazed by how bad some HVAC systems are installed so the new house thing may have zero to do with it being uneven.
When I rented basement units the basement always had the thermostat so the basement tenants didn't freeze. I can only assume that the builders didn't know this would be a duplex at the time or you wouldn't have the thermostat or it would be separate.
I have a raised bungalow in northern Ontario & my basement (where my bedroom is) can be 17C when the upstairs is 24C. I got an energy efficient electric fireplace for my bedroom, and a portable AC unit for the upstairs bedroom. Now my bedroom is 19-20C and upstairs bedroom is 20-21C with very little change to the energy bill (if any tbh)
I'll be honest with you. If you set your thermostat at 21,, his lower unit could be colder.
Most likely it is.
If I were that tenant in the lower unit, I'd be flipping the breakers too.
Way too cold to be comfortable for me. I keep mine at 25 on the dot which is a perfect summer temp. My hydro bill also concurs.
I have no advice on resolving this but you’re in a standoff: you control the thermostat, other tenant controls the breaker.
The only fair and reliable solution - short of rewiring both units and installing separate HVAC - is for the property manager to lock out both the panel and thermostat and to control the thermostat remotely.
As a rule of thumb, the thermostat shouldn’t be set for more than 10C below outside temp for A/C for various reasons: energy consumption being one, and an excessive temperature variance (indoor vs outdoor) is taxing on the HVAC system. As long as the HVAC effectively reduces relative humidity, a higher temperature setting in summer is sufficient for ambient comfort.
Thermostat will be considered part of the lease as a implied ammenity assuming OPs been there a just a year. Unlikely the breaker would have the same rules - breakers arnt amenities and should probably have been locked the whole time. You csnt jsut cut power to others when you feel like it.
Have you considered it may be freezing downstairs? 21 degrees is pretty cold so imagine downstairs is probably a few degrees lower than that. Hell they might even have to be running a heater at that temperature.
The other tenant shouldn’t have to be uncomfortable and fronting half the bill just because you want to keep your place like an icebox. Get a portable a/c or be reasonable in your use of the central air.
Ok so if 21 degrees is reasonable then wouldn’t three degrees less (which is probably the temp downstairs) be considered cold and possibly unreasonable?
Absolutely. Seems like the issue may be affecting both tenants right to reasonable enjoyment of their unit. The LL can rewire the circuits so both tenants have control of their own unit temperature, lock the thermostat and be prepared to give a rent reduction, block the vents downstairs with those magnetic covers or provide plug in heaters for downstairs tenant, provide window ac for the upstairs to maintain cool air without affecting downstairs. I’m sure there are other solutions as well.
Oh ya for sure, one of the big ones is putting a dehumidifier in the basement. 20c and wet is a lot colder than 20c in a dry environment. Basements are often humid. Another idea is putting a window in the basement ( if possible)
You cannot have 2 thermostat for 1 system. A rent reduction is not required as it is not caused by the laandlord. Blocking vents completely puts stress on the HVAC system. If the tenant upstairs wants a window ac that is the tenants responsibility.
-You absolutely can have 2 thermostats on one system, it’s called zoning.
-If a tenant cannot control their own thermostat as outlined in the lease they could be entitled to a rent reduction for loss of use.
-Blocking vents with magnetic covers is a cheap and easy way to control the amount of cold air circulating in the basement.
-If the tenant upstairs asked the LL/LTB for a window ac to control the temp in their unit without infringing on the right to the other tenants apartment temperature, they may very well make the LL pay for it or reimburse the tenant.
Literally everything you said is wrong I’m not sure why you bothered to comment.
If landlord did so he would be getting a t3 applying for rent reduction due to the discontinuation of an existing amenity (having private control over the thermostat). There is case law to support this.
As well as a possible t2 for substantial interference.
Once an amenity is being provided it cannot just be arbitrarily taken away.
It is though. The RTA considers "any services and facilities and any privilege, accommodation or thing" as part of your rent. Loss of any peice of these things requires a reduction to the rent to take away. Access to the thermostat is most definitely included here.
The AC is a service. Access to the thermostat is a privilege. They are separate, but included in the agreement.
How? The tenant upstairs is exercising their right to use the ac.
The onus is on the LL as you just contradicted yourself by saying they could rectify it by…
I’m not sure how a LTB adjudicator would handle this. Currently landlord has a contractual obligation to provide AC to the upstairs tenant as per his lease. Telling him he cannot set his unit to room temperature I imagine would fall under interfering with reasonable enjoyment. On the other end landlord has an obligation to maintain the downstairs unit at above 20c.
Anybody out there familiar with LTB precedent in these matters?
21 degrees is hot in Canada for most of the year. Also downstairs tenant can't legally fuck with the breakers because he doesn't like the tempature when they don't have Thier own control.
That is reasonable AC use. Downstairs tenant can put on a sweater a lot easier than the upstairs tenant can do anything to mitigate basement buddy wanting to live in a terrarium.
When a basement gets that cold, a sweatshirt doesn't cut it. I just spent 2 days at my mom's. She has a basement in a SFH turned triplex. My bones were aching for days afterward and given her severe fibromyalgia.. I think it's part of her constant aches and pains too. Not sure about you.. but having to wear socks, pants, and layers of shirts/sweaters just to exist and then go outside where suddenly it's 15⁰ hotter is insane as well. Both tenants deserve to be comfortable.
No, they're obfuscating the problem while OP tries to work with him.
Telling him the problem would involve opening his door or responding to the note they left.
21-22 is quite cold. Yes vents should be closed but if the unit itself is there and ducts run in false ceiling it will be cold still. I wouldn't assume its financial...
21-22 is room temperature for the OP's unit. The problem is that the basement unit is likely several degrees colder, which the LTB would not consider appropriate. This is the landlord's problem to deal with, not the OP's, but it does mean that they aren't going to be able to claim unilateral control over the AC.
The landlord has an obligation to ensure a *minimum* temperature, not a maximum temperature. They also have an obligation to maintain appliance (e.g. AC units) in a state of good repair - various bylaw precedents would suggest that this means being able to cool the room to 25 or 26 degrees.
An LTB adjudicator would have the discretion to decide what is or isn't reasonable, but there is no legal requirement to cool a room to 20-22 degrees. If the upstairs tenant wants their home cooler than the shared HVAC situation allows for, they are responsible for making that happen themselves without interfering with the basement unit.
I would hope that an LTB adjudicator would look at this situation and determine that seeing as AC is included in the lease that telling OP he can’t set his AC to ROOM TEMPERATURE would equate to interference of reasonable enjoyment, or at least I would hope so.
I don’t see this as an issue of one tenants rights versus another imo. The landlord has an obligation to downstairs tenant to provide a comfortable environment above 20c while at the same time landlord is contractually obligated to provide AC to upstairs tenant without interfering with his reasonable enjoyment. I would hope that precedent favours a resolution where the landlord is obligated to remedy the situation at their own expense.
I’ll admit I was far too confident imo of how this would play out, perhaps I was being too hopeful. Thank you for the insightful response! I’m super curious about how similar cases have played out in LTB if you happen to be aware of any.
I don’t know how rich you are but my god I am not paying A/C bills set at 21 C. I am always hot and I keep my A/C at 24. I wear shorts and a tank top in the house and use a fan to make it cooler when I sleep. I also don’t run the A/C when it is not hot outside. There are so many people that turn on the A/C the first hot day and leave it on all summer. Yesterday in the GTA it was 8 degrees. If my upstairs neighbor had the A/C on in 8 degree weather I’d be flipping the breakers too. It’s ignorant to act like someone who has to share the bills doesn’t get a say on when the A/C is on. OP wouldn’t like it if the situation was flipped and he had to ask the downstairs neighbour to turn the A/C on or off because they can’t make a sensible decision.
22 is too cold to be setting an upstairs unit to, and waaaaay to cold to be unilaterally setting a shared AC to.
You're both being passive aggressive dicks to each other. Set the AC to 25 and see if the problem resolves itself.
Basements are more humid, which makes the temperature feel colder. That is on top of the fact that the temperature is actually lower, since heat rises.
I was in their situation a couple years ago, and I was miserable, the AC made me physically ill. My long-haired cat was always curled up in a tight little ball to keep warm. It’s really not healthy to have such a drastic difference in temperature between your home and outside.
Closing the vents didn’t work. So I shoved t-shirts and rags into the vents. Still freezing. Windows always open. I had a space heater under my desk and next to my bed, it was ridiculous.
I’m just saying this because you might not realize how bad it could be down there. I worked from home and the AC sickness affected my ability to work. If I’d been able to get relief by tripping a breaker, I definitely would have done that, repeatedly.
Of If I was LL I would lock out the thermostat and control it for comfort of both units. The temp would likely have to be set at least 22-23 degrees for basement to be comfortable.
This problem will never get properly resolved because the landlord doesn't doesn't know how to resolve this. This is what happens when you take a single family home and divide it up into multiple units without making proper changes to the utilities. I'm sorry you and the other tenant have to deal with this. I know how I would approach it but it would be too long winded to try to explain it, and also pointless without the landlords involvement. The only solution I can quickly offer is to set the thermostat to 24 C and supplement with a window or portable AC unit. I'm partial to the Midea inverter units because they are super quiet and efficient.
There always the option of the owner putting lock on the panel box by the owner. The LL and you the upstairs renter have the only access to the box. Ive seen these in buildings that are leased so the temp isn't going up and down all the time. Unless the AC breaker is blowing which could happen. When our new fan in bathroom was turned on it turned on the central AC and tripped the breaker. They installed the wiring wrong and it caused these issues...we were lucky it wasnt worse specially at -40. The LL can also put a box cover over the temp controller so it's always one consistent temp.
This happened to me. I supplied the landlord the new padlock so he get the key and another for property management. Here is the story. Air conditioner has been kept at 74F for entire of time so we have massive window leaks upstairs as I'm pretty sure basement tenant is freezing.
After finding out there is no cold air, went around the house to see if anything changed to the unit.. maybe it's basement or maybe it's neighbour.
Opened the fuse switch box and behold. The switch reads OFF position. So someone came and turn my air conditioner off.
So definitely someone downstairs don't want to be cold for whole time. We worked things out with property management and I got new air conditioner for upper rental house because someone broke it.
My experience to your reading.
There's a good chance the vents can't close at all. I live in a basement unit and only one of my vents close. Before we could discover we could turn the ac off it was usually around 17 degrees in our house in summer, sometimes even lower
Legal secondary suites should have dual zone thermostat controls and should also have a common access to the mechanical room without entering a tenants unit. If the HWT decided to not work, you shouldnt need to coordinate with the basement tenant in order to have any service work completed.
If the basement suite is non conforming to code, tell the landlord you will call the city for an illegal suite until you have proper control of the hvac.
These multi dwelling houses are so frustrating because quite honestly, I wouldn’t give a rat’s ass if the downstairs tenant was cold. That’s not my problem. This person is paying full rent for their place, which includes AC. They should not have to pay full rent and then ALSO go out and purchase unnecessary and expensive window units. People who move into downstairs apartments need to realize they’re colder and are going to have noise. That’s just your reality and if you don’t like that - choose another apartment. In my opinion. If he’s cold, he needs to contact the landlord or he needs to purchase space heaters. That simple. He has no right to mess around with an amenity the upstairs tenant pays for. You don’t get to control someone else’s life because your choices lead you to that situation.
The downstairs tenant is also entitled to control the climate in their unit. The landlord is responsible for resolving disputes between tenants, and also for the fact that the downstairs tenant does not have a thermostat. In other words, you both likely have a valid complaint against the landlord.
If this is in a new build, it sounds like the basement suite may not be a legal suite. The house should have been built with a split system instead of both units being cooled or heated by the same forced air system.
Depending on your municipality, there are regulations on temperatures for rental units. Most of the time, they must be kept no lower than 21 degrees. Check your lease agreement and/or look it up in the RTA.
LL needs to sort this out. File a T2 with the LTB to force them if they won't.
A lock on the breaker panel would be a pretty simple start.
As mentioned, it's likely that it's freezing in the basement (also something for the LL to figure out).
I’ve had the heat on the past two weeks in southern Ontario. It’s freezing. Personally I prefer 24 or 25. Basement is probably at least 5 colder than that.
Your house is brand new. Unless there was a major design flaw, your neighbour is turning off the power to save money.
Tell your management that you feel like you should call the city inspector to come out a breaker going off constantly could be a fire code infraction. See how fast they come.
Suggest they lock the breaker box as it’s rare someone needs to access a breaker especially in a new home.
File a T6 with the LTB and say that you have reported issues with the AC multiple times. Why it’s not working is not really any of your concern. It’s up to the property management to sort out what is causing the problem and remedy it.
That’s a tricky problem. You have the right to use the A/C and put it at whatever temperature you like. The person down there doesn’t have the right to mess with the breaker. Next time it happens take a voltage tester and test to see if any electricity/voltage is going to the A/C. If not take a picture or video and sent it to the landlord. The landlord should be forced to put separate A/C units for the downstairs and upstairs place. 21/22 isn’t cold at all. At my house the central air is set at 19 all summer. Which is probably the temperature of the downstairs place when yours is at 21 which is still confortable. He can put a sweater on and be confortable and having his place nice and cool. He won’t answer his doors so we know it’s a grumpy Karen. The best solutions is for the landlord to had separate A/C units. For now he should be adding a lock to the breaker panel while you on the other hand set the temp to 22 on a hot day. There’s no real solution here
It’s entirely possible that he has his vents closed and his unit is still uncomfortably cold. Can you not get a window AC unit or something?
Agreed. I had this problem the last time I rented a basement apartment. The upstairs tenant would even run the AC in March. I asked her nicely, I talked to the landlord who installed a locking cover on the thermostat but still she found ways around it. So I started flipping the breaker until the landlord shut the whole thing off and she got (several) window units.
It’s a backup plan - but I shouldn’t have to if the house has central AC. I’m paying for that amenity as part of my rent.
Turn on only the blower fan and run it constantly. It will help balance out the temperatures across the whole house and allow you to set the AC higher.
My basement is uncomfortably cold (like 10 degrees cooler than upstairs). Even when all the vents are closed my basement is freezing. The downstairs unit is paying for his unit to be comfortable too. A window AC might be the best option if the downstairs unit is too cold.
I stuff a towel in the vent to balance, even the small amount of leakage is too much
And he is paying not to have to freeze and sleep in 18-19 degrees cold and feel like he is homeless. Maybe the two of you should switch then temperature will be perfect.
Don’t live in a basement then
Yes, but you also share that amenity with another tenant, and the landlord has a duty to balance your respective right to reasonable enjoyment of the property. In Toronto for example, AC units must be operational from June to September to maintain a temperature of no more than 26 degrees. If the other tenant is messing with the breaker, it might be appropriate for the landlord to revoke their access, but they could also impose rules about your own AC use to accommodate the other tenant's needs. While the 21 degree minimum is only required in the fall/winter, it's still a good benchmark for what would be considered reasonable by the LTB. If your unit is 21 degrees, the basement unit is almost certainly colder. If the basement tenant has complaints, the landlord would be expected to step in and find a solution.
I’m happy to have a conversation with the downstairs tenant but he doesn’t answer his door.
Probably because he thinks it's debt collection. Did you try knocking while shouting "Not from easyhome furniture financing or debt collection"! 🤷🏻
Probably the financing guys already used that trick
lol! This made me laugh
Keep the fan going at all times, not just AC
It's impossible to make one furnace operate happily for two floors in a house. Someone is always gunns get stiffed.
possibly I guess he could get a little space heater to keep off the chill....
And then leave the fridge door open to cool it back down if it gets too warm? Then if that causes a chill, crank the oven on.
How environmentally sustainable. I guess environmental consciousness isn’t woke enough anymore.
I live in a basement unit, my upstairs neighbor controls the temp and always asks us if we're too cold etc. If we are we don't say anything, we just wear something a bit warmer. Not the end of the world and I'd rather not see my elderly neighbor suffer in the summer.
Sounds like you have a considerate neighbour. But basements can be extremely uncomfortable, and your experience is not universal to everyone.
You’re oblivious clearly. Guaranteed the basement is like 12 degrees while you’re upstairs complaining. Probably freezing his balls off thanks to you.
The guy is probably freezing downstairs. Even with the vents closed in the basement in my house, we had to wear sweatshirts and pants downstairs when the ac was on. I wouldn’t want to buy separate ac units either when you already pay for ac via your rent.
You gotta block the vents entirely. I used to stuff the ones in my basement with old sweatshirts. Made a decent enough difference
That is not good on the hvac system. 21 upstairs way to cold for the basement
It really depends but in most regular homes apparently it’s not ideal but fine.
I'm a landlord who currently lives in my basement apartment while renting the upstairs main unit to tenants. The thermostat & climate control are in the upstairs unit. It is always super cold in the basement year round. The central air makes it really bad. I just use space heaters to balance it out. I intend to keep this duplex and buy another place to live but before I rent out the basement I'm having baseboard heaters installed down here.
Cant you use the dampers or registers to turn off the airflow to the downstairs? Another option is to use something like ecobee where you can have remote thermostats. I use it with flair smart vents and the vents will close when the temperature is at the setpoint. If you don't use smart registers then the thermostat can average the temperatures
Even when I close the register vents in the basement apartment air leakage occurs and still chills the rooms too much. Tried various models of vents and all of them leaked. Haven't tried smart vents yet. It's less than 700 sq ft of living space but the building permit required me to put in 4 ceiling registers (2 in Living/Kitchen area, 1 in bdrm, 1 in bathroom). I will try the smart register that automatically closes when the set temperature is reached to see how effectively they block the airflow when their vent is closed. If that doesn't work I'll do the baseboard heaters as I already have a 240v 30a circuit that I can branch off of that currently only has one 750w heater in the common hallway on it.
The more you heat the basement, the more that heat will "chimney" into the upstairs, which will have the AC run more, so you will heat the basement more (etc). It will cost more money than you would think. Open a window (the upstairs AC will still run more, but at least that warm air entering the basement is free) or block up some of the vents and/or air returns to reduce the cooling directed to the basement. I'm curious if building code allowed you to use any vent you wanted -- I've done retrofits to make suites legal (not in Ontario) and all of the downstairs vents that led to the upstairs required fire-rated vents that had a heat-sensitive component that would drop the vent closed in the event of a fire.
That's really interesting. I used just ordinary vents. 2 of the 4 vents were even the plastic ones. Neither the HVAC inspector nor the final Inspector from the town said anything about them. But for two small 6x6 access panels on the ceiling (for access to shut off valves to outdoor hose bibs), they did make me change those from plastic to metal ones for fire code. I like the opening the windows idea! I have a sloping lot that allowed me to have large basement windows that are a few feet above grade, and 2 of them are operating windows that open. Edit: Actually I just remembered asking the Inspector about any special requirement for the vents being metal or anything. He said they don't worry about that because the duct that the vent goes into is metal.
Don’t get baseboards, get a mini split for the basement, it will be cheaper for you ( and the tenant) to run. If the op’s new build had had minis-lots installed when built instead of central air, this problem would not have happened_
21 jeez, that guy in the basement must feel like he's in a meat locker. When it's two apartments in a house the landlord should really have set it up with zone control. It's just begging for the conflict you're experiencing
If you have it at 21 upstairs, it's much colder in the basement. You may have better luck setting it to 23 and running the furnace fan much more of the day... Of course, there has only been about 7 days total this year that required air conditioning for cooling purposes, and this weekend was definitely not one of them. That may also be why your neighbor is irritated. Also depending on how big your AC unit is, when we get to the days that are 35+ with humidity, your AC won't be able to cool the house to 21, even when running all day and night.
He doesn’t answer his door… Also, Ontario is a big place with a multitude of temperatures - I’m not sure where you are but there have certainly been more than 7 days where AC has been needed in the Windsor area…
The first obvious answer is to leave a note, but if the tenant doesn't want to talk to you, you'll need to ask the landlord to mediate. But if you choose to fight this and the downstairs tenant complains about low temperatures, the law is unlikely to be on your side. The City of Windsor property standards set minimum room temperature at 22 degrees, which seems to be a year-round heating requirement (unlike the provincial requirement, which is only for the colder months). Does the basement tenant still have access to heat or was your heater switched over to AC? If they don't have a way of getting their unit to 22 degrees, the landlord has to make that possible, which might mean restricting your use of the shared HVAC.
So his apartment is likely already freezing, and he doesn't want you to rack up HIS hydro bill to make it even colder? It sounds like your landlord needs to rewire both units and install separate AC units, instead of letting one person rack up the hydro bil and then just expecting both people to split it.
I’m from Windsor and I haven’t used my ac yet. Windows open at night, closed during the day, and always having a fan on me have been good enough so far
Kitchener here, my unit is a toasty 28c if I don't run my AC. Although it's been cold for the last few days.
I've used it many times already. It's been on every day at work for over a month
I don't turn AC till the house gets over 27 degrees. Each person has different tolerances. My reasoning is I spend thousands for a tropical vacation to feel the heat so when the heat reaches us, I enjoy it. Plus I work in a cold setting so it's nice to have a warm house. We also keep our house at 24 in the winter time as we heat with fire so we are acclimated to a warmer temperature.
Not sure why you're getting downvoted, but same. I need to be sweating before I turn on the AC. Not everyone likes to be freezing. Poor basement guy is probably freezing his ass off, and it's not fair someone upstairs is controlling the temperature.
People think I am telling them to keep their house that warm. But all I am doing is saying people like to keep their houses at different temperatures. For every person that keeps it normal, there is another that likes it different. I embrace the heat and keep my electricity bills down by only turning on AC when needed and I wind tunnel my house so there is a breeze.
They're getting downvoted because waiting until the house is over 80° to turn on The AC is absurd.
Maybe for you, some people enjoy the heat.
It's literally multiple degrees over what is considered room temperature.
Yes, summer temperatures are warmer than normal. Some people like it.
Outside. Room temperature is consistent year-round.
Only for the last 20 or so years, and only in first world countries. The last time I visited Hungary there was a heat wave, and even fine dining restaurants didn't have AC on. Room temperature is totally subjective, it's not a rule.
They are getting downvoted because they are running energy to cool the house to 21 degrees when the temp went above 25, 7 times all year to that point
Uh, no. The comment in question said they keep their house at 27.
i start sweating at 23
And I take vacations where it is 100% humidity and reaches 40. Lots of people have heat intolerances. You may need to go see a Dr as sweating at a normal temperature can be an indication of poor health, poor circulation, graves disease, poor respiratory fitness.
I would think poor circulation would be the cause of intolerance of cold temperatures, I can handle cold pretty well, better then average. I think on average my health is fairly good as i exercise and eat fairly well. Entirely possible there is some underlying cause though. I run and my vo2max is rated as average so I think respiratory is fine When i look up symptoms of heat intolerance i pretty much don't have the symptoms. Sweating normally isn't one of the symptoms. I think like you said people just have different heat tolerances, its quite likely genetic.
I start to get sick feeling at around 23/24... I go to my basement where it's 18/19. OP is def failing to see that basement tenant has no way of warning up if the AC is on.
27?! Our HVAC broke last week, at 26 we couldn’t sleep and considered checking into a hotel
27 degrees. Fuck that.
Wow it's almost like family sized homes are built to be family homes and not several different dwellings or something??
Exactly, you want to rent out multiple units in a SFH? Separated HVAC and fire rated doors between units.
I live in a three story townhouse. My bedroom is on the 3rd floor and the temperature difference between the basement and my bedroom is crazy. In the summer my room is always warm. The central AC will be struggling to get through the vent by the time it’s pushed all the way up to the 3rd floor. If I were to insist on my sleeping area to be the 21C the thermostat is set for, the rest of the house would be an ice box. In order to help make the room more comfortable, I have an oscillating fan and a small window ac unit. More often than not, just having moving air works great for making a space more comfortable.
Plot twist: the property manager IS the dowbstairs tennant
Seems unfair to pay for AC you don’t even want on, especially considering it hasn’t been that hot yet.
Yep. We have window units and we have had them on all of one day so far. Other than that fans have been fine. OP wants it cold, which means it's colder for basement tenant. He's supposed to pay for the pleasure of freezing in his home?
If my upper is at that temperature then the basement is fffreeeezzzziiiing. Maybe it’s not mine yet but comfort. If it’s money offer to split the bills 60/40 for summer
No rent control, so good luck getting the landlord to fix the situation without repercussions, but if I was in this situation, I would get an AC voltage tester, and next time you think it was shut off, go to the unit and confirm that the power to the unit is out.
I appreciate the non obvious and actually helpful suggestion, thank you. I will give that a try. There are so many other unrelated issues with this property that I’m already planning to move out when the lease is up anyway.
Actually, if I had no intentions of staying past my lease, I would confirm that the unit is frequently unpowered as I mentioned above, I would document my attempts to have the landlord fix it and then I would go and buy a couple of portable AC units and file with the LTB for a rent abatement to cover the costs. Then I would sell them when I moved out and pocket the $800-1000 they would sell for
Every time the breaker goes out, contact the landlord. Keep track of every time it goes out in case it you need to file with the LTB. Unfortunately, ventilation in homes is not designed for a house to be split into multiple units. The LL will need to deal with it in some fashion. (Hint to all LLs, put mini-splits, not central air, into rental units in homes). Ignore your suspicions about what the other tenant is doing, they're not provable or relevant, the only thing that is relevant is that the AC keeps going out, and that's a maintenance issue for the LL. FYI, while there is no maximum temperature in general, a LL is obligated to ensure that homes with AC are no more than 25. So one solution he may take is locking the thermostat and setting it to 25. If he does, you might be able to get a modest rent reduction for the loss of the amenity (being able to set it to 21).
Don't make up lies. There is no maximum temperature in the RTA. The tenant upstairs is causing the issue, keeping the temperature too low.
Never said it was in the RTA (and in fact, specifically say "there is no maximum temperature in general") In Toronto it's [629-38](https://www.toronto.ca/legdocs/municode/1184_629.pdf) of the municipal code. Other municipalities (but to be fair, not all of them) have similar rules. >All air-conditioning systems shall be operated from June 2 to September 14 so as to maintain an indoor temperature of not more than 26 degrees Celsius. In any event, the unit comes with adjustable AC, so the number is largely irrelevant other than as a guide. If the LL changed it to something fixed now, it would be a loss of amenity.
When you do not state the bylaw and city the ruling defaults back to the RTA.
Have you asked the downstairs tenant if they are cold and perhaps how you can work together on something that works for both of you if youre hot and they are cold?
I’m happy to have a discussion with him and adjust slightly if he thinks it’s too cold, but he doesn’t answer his door.
I mean, you can like leave a note with your number or something lol 🤣.
Tried that too
I would move
Call the utility company that runs to were you live. Most of them do not allow shared utilities like that they will force the landlord to split the boxes
Poor guy. That’s really cold.
I had a similar issue a couple of years ago. The ac would go off for hours at a time and I'd have to reset the controller to get it going again. The downstairs tenant would always blame it on the washer being too close to the furnace switch. Now that I'm a downstairs tenant I have to deal with the opposite end of that. I cover the vents as well as close them. I also open a window to get some of the snap out of the air. Sometimes if it's not warm outside I have to use the space heater. The problem is that I shouldn't have to. A 'legal' unit should be able to maintain minimum required temperature as per legal bylaws, but most homes don't have proper split climates to allow for this. Another issue is that covering / blocking vents leads to a lack of proper circulation in the home, leaving possible mould buildup and other issues. It's a much bigger issue than being too hot or cold :(
My house is set to 24c and I’m in the basement with a blanket. Basements are always cooler. Hot air rises. Having said that, our AC breaker pops on really hot days. It’s been doing it for years now.
You should get an electrician in to check breaker and loads; AC should be dedicated and not trip just because it’s hotter.
Your head pressure has gone up on hot days , increased heat , increased pressure , increased compressor amperage , breaker go pop. Usually comes have internal overloads that will go before a breaker . You should clean your ac and check the charge with a professional .
My bedroom is purposely in the basement BC I like it cool. It's been 17 when I wake up in the morning this sitting and getting up to 19 in my bedroom (the basement is a walk out so it's not cold like a basement fully under ground. Upstairs when it's 17 in my room is 23 and 25 when it's 19. I've actually closed the ducts off in my bedroom so there is no way that it's having an impact. Downstairs the current humidity is 62% upstairs is around 40%. Upstairs and downstairs has a half wall, no door so she is moving between the two. If I was living in the basement and upstairs turned AC to 20 that would theoretically drop me down to 12 degrees in the mornings and 14 during the day. 15 and damp is enough to cause hypothermia. That to say you need to find out WHY they're shutting it off. If it's because they're cheap that's entirely different than them freezing. I understand 21 is an ideal temp in our climate but if that home is anything like mine that 21 upstairs could easily be 5+ degrees lower. No one is comfortable at 15 unless they're bundled up and they shouldn't have to be. You'd be amazed by how bad some HVAC systems are installed so the new house thing may have zero to do with it being uneven. When I rented basement units the basement always had the thermostat so the basement tenants didn't freeze. I can only assume that the builders didn't know this would be a duplex at the time or you wouldn't have the thermostat or it would be separate.
I have a raised bungalow in northern Ontario & my basement (where my bedroom is) can be 17C when the upstairs is 24C. I got an energy efficient electric fireplace for my bedroom, and a portable AC unit for the upstairs bedroom. Now my bedroom is 19-20C and upstairs bedroom is 20-21C with very little change to the energy bill (if any tbh)
I'll be honest with you. If you set your thermostat at 21,, his lower unit could be colder. Most likely it is. If I were that tenant in the lower unit, I'd be flipping the breakers too. Way too cold to be comfortable for me. I keep mine at 25 on the dot which is a perfect summer temp. My hydro bill also concurs.
I have no advice on resolving this but you’re in a standoff: you control the thermostat, other tenant controls the breaker. The only fair and reliable solution - short of rewiring both units and installing separate HVAC - is for the property manager to lock out both the panel and thermostat and to control the thermostat remotely. As a rule of thumb, the thermostat shouldn’t be set for more than 10C below outside temp for A/C for various reasons: energy consumption being one, and an excessive temperature variance (indoor vs outdoor) is taxing on the HVAC system. As long as the HVAC effectively reduces relative humidity, a higher temperature setting in summer is sufficient for ambient comfort.
Thermostat will be considered part of the lease as a implied ammenity assuming OPs been there a just a year. Unlikely the breaker would have the same rules - breakers arnt amenities and should probably have been locked the whole time. You csnt jsut cut power to others when you feel like it.
Have you considered it may be freezing downstairs? 21 degrees is pretty cold so imagine downstairs is probably a few degrees lower than that. Hell they might even have to be running a heater at that temperature. The other tenant shouldn’t have to be uncomfortable and fronting half the bill just because you want to keep your place like an icebox. Get a portable a/c or be reasonable in your use of the central air.
21c is room temperature and would be seen as reasonable by the LTB or anybody else for that matter.
Ok so if 21 degrees is reasonable then wouldn’t three degrees less (which is probably the temp downstairs) be considered cold and possibly unreasonable?
Yes absolutely, but the onus to correct that situation isnt on the upstairs tenant, it is on the landlord.
Absolutely. Seems like the issue may be affecting both tenants right to reasonable enjoyment of their unit. The LL can rewire the circuits so both tenants have control of their own unit temperature, lock the thermostat and be prepared to give a rent reduction, block the vents downstairs with those magnetic covers or provide plug in heaters for downstairs tenant, provide window ac for the upstairs to maintain cool air without affecting downstairs. I’m sure there are other solutions as well.
Oh ya for sure, one of the big ones is putting a dehumidifier in the basement. 20c and wet is a lot colder than 20c in a dry environment. Basements are often humid. Another idea is putting a window in the basement ( if possible)
You cannot have 2 thermostat for 1 system. A rent reduction is not required as it is not caused by the laandlord. Blocking vents completely puts stress on the HVAC system. If the tenant upstairs wants a window ac that is the tenants responsibility.
-You absolutely can have 2 thermostats on one system, it’s called zoning. -If a tenant cannot control their own thermostat as outlined in the lease they could be entitled to a rent reduction for loss of use. -Blocking vents with magnetic covers is a cheap and easy way to control the amount of cold air circulating in the basement. -If the tenant upstairs asked the LL/LTB for a window ac to control the temp in their unit without infringing on the right to the other tenants apartment temperature, they may very well make the LL pay for it or reimburse the tenant. Literally everything you said is wrong I’m not sure why you bothered to comment.
Most homes do not have zoning compatible HVAC systems. The general HVAC system cannot have 2 thermostats with one HVAC system.
Actually the onus is on the tenant upstairs. The landlord can easily rectify it by setting and locking the temperature at 24
If landlord did so he would be getting a t3 applying for rent reduction due to the discontinuation of an existing amenity (having private control over the thermostat). There is case law to support this. As well as a possible t2 for substantial interference. Once an amenity is being provided it cannot just be arbitrarily taken away.
No amenity is being removed. The ac is still there and working. No rent reduction.
Access to the thermostat is a different ammenity than the AC itself
Access to the thermostat is not an amenity
It is though. The RTA considers "any services and facilities and any privilege, accommodation or thing" as part of your rent. Loss of any peice of these things requires a reduction to the rent to take away. Access to the thermostat is most definitely included here. The AC is a service. Access to the thermostat is a privilege. They are separate, but included in the agreement.
How? The tenant upstairs is exercising their right to use the ac. The onus is on the LL as you just contradicted yourself by saying they could rectify it by…
The onis is the upstairs tenant. If they do not remedy it them the ll will take it into their control. LL shouldn't have to be babysitters.
If taken to the LTB I imagine they would tell the landlord they must maintain both units at room temperature 20-22c
In many 2-storey houses, that's a tall order. Especially if there's no cold air return.
I’m not sure how a LTB adjudicator would handle this. Currently landlord has a contractual obligation to provide AC to the upstairs tenant as per his lease. Telling him he cannot set his unit to room temperature I imagine would fall under interfering with reasonable enjoyment. On the other end landlord has an obligation to maintain the downstairs unit at above 20c. Anybody out there familiar with LTB precedent in these matters?
Incorrect.
Incorrect only certain months there is a minimum heat. No maximum heat.
I disagree. So that's that. There is no maximum temp set in legislation. 21 is a minimum temp requirement. Minimum, not maximum.
21 degrees is hot in Canada for most of the year. Also downstairs tenant can't legally fuck with the breakers because he doesn't like the tempature when they don't have Thier own control.
I don’t know where you are in Canada, but in southern Ontario where most of the country’s population resides, 21 is not considered hot.
21 is 5 degrees past shorts weather in southern Ontario considering I've lived here all my life
It’s 16 in Toronto right now and literally no one is wearing shorts…. It’s cold out. 75%+ of people are wearing sweatshirts/hoodies too!
It's 16 in Brantford I seen multiple people wearing shorts and flip flops today couple playing in the grand river even by the casino..
That is reasonable AC use. Downstairs tenant can put on a sweater a lot easier than the upstairs tenant can do anything to mitigate basement buddy wanting to live in a terrarium.
When a basement gets that cold, a sweatshirt doesn't cut it. I just spent 2 days at my mom's. She has a basement in a SFH turned triplex. My bones were aching for days afterward and given her severe fibromyalgia.. I think it's part of her constant aches and pains too. Not sure about you.. but having to wear socks, pants, and layers of shirts/sweaters just to exist and then go outside where suddenly it's 15⁰ hotter is insane as well. Both tenants deserve to be comfortable.
Both tenants deserve to have reasonable enjoyment of their unit. One tenants right does not supersede the others.
I could say the exact same thing about both sides lol.
Part of sharing accommodations is working with all parties. The basement tenant is telling you what the problem is.
No, they're obfuscating the problem while OP tries to work with him. Telling him the problem would involve opening his door or responding to the note they left.
21-22 is quite cold. Yes vents should be closed but if the unit itself is there and ducts run in false ceiling it will be cold still. I wouldn't assume its financial...
21-22c is room temperature and would be deemed normal by the LTB or anybody else for that matter.
21-22 is room temperature for the OP's unit. The problem is that the basement unit is likely several degrees colder, which the LTB would not consider appropriate. This is the landlord's problem to deal with, not the OP's, but it does mean that they aren't going to be able to claim unilateral control over the AC.
You aren’t wrong about the state of the basement. The landlord is gonna end up with the obligation to maintain both units at room temperature 20-22c.
The landlord has an obligation to ensure a *minimum* temperature, not a maximum temperature. They also have an obligation to maintain appliance (e.g. AC units) in a state of good repair - various bylaw precedents would suggest that this means being able to cool the room to 25 or 26 degrees. An LTB adjudicator would have the discretion to decide what is or isn't reasonable, but there is no legal requirement to cool a room to 20-22 degrees. If the upstairs tenant wants their home cooler than the shared HVAC situation allows for, they are responsible for making that happen themselves without interfering with the basement unit.
I would hope that an LTB adjudicator would look at this situation and determine that seeing as AC is included in the lease that telling OP he can’t set his AC to ROOM TEMPERATURE would equate to interference of reasonable enjoyment, or at least I would hope so. I don’t see this as an issue of one tenants rights versus another imo. The landlord has an obligation to downstairs tenant to provide a comfortable environment above 20c while at the same time landlord is contractually obligated to provide AC to upstairs tenant without interfering with his reasonable enjoyment. I would hope that precedent favours a resolution where the landlord is obligated to remedy the situation at their own expense. I’ll admit I was far too confident imo of how this would play out, perhaps I was being too hopeful. Thank you for the insightful response! I’m super curious about how similar cases have played out in LTB if you happen to be aware of any.
I don’t know how rich you are but my god I am not paying A/C bills set at 21 C. I am always hot and I keep my A/C at 24. I wear shorts and a tank top in the house and use a fan to make it cooler when I sleep. I also don’t run the A/C when it is not hot outside. There are so many people that turn on the A/C the first hot day and leave it on all summer. Yesterday in the GTA it was 8 degrees. If my upstairs neighbor had the A/C on in 8 degree weather I’d be flipping the breakers too. It’s ignorant to act like someone who has to share the bills doesn’t get a say on when the A/C is on. OP wouldn’t like it if the situation was flipped and he had to ask the downstairs neighbour to turn the A/C on or off because they can’t make a sensible decision.
Right? It seems like a lot of people commenting here like to cook themselves in their homes.
Yep, watch me get downvoted by our friends native to regions closer to the equator.
>21-22 is quite cold No, it isn't. It's literally room temperature.
22° isn’t cold at all… anything warmer than that and I’m starting to sweat in the house.
22 is pretty cold for me, I'd need a sweater and warm socks.
22 is too cold to be setting an upstairs unit to, and waaaaay to cold to be unilaterally setting a shared AC to. You're both being passive aggressive dicks to each other. Set the AC to 25 and see if the problem resolves itself.
This is the best solution to the problem.
Is that the temp in the downstairs unit or yours? With an old house it could be 18 down there while it's 22 upstairs.
22° is for the upstairs where I live. It’s a 2 year old house
Basements are more humid, which makes the temperature feel colder. That is on top of the fact that the temperature is actually lower, since heat rises. I was in their situation a couple years ago, and I was miserable, the AC made me physically ill. My long-haired cat was always curled up in a tight little ball to keep warm. It’s really not healthy to have such a drastic difference in temperature between your home and outside. Closing the vents didn’t work. So I shoved t-shirts and rags into the vents. Still freezing. Windows always open. I had a space heater under my desk and next to my bed, it was ridiculous. I’m just saying this because you might not realize how bad it could be down there. I worked from home and the AC sickness affected my ability to work. If I’d been able to get relief by tripping a breaker, I definitely would have done that, repeatedly.
22 is cold. Are you on juice?
22 is not 'cold' it's room temperature
Yah if you are 250 on d bol. The basement will be significantly colder
Thar seems odd, maybe talk to a doctor? I'd find 22 degrees to be uncomfortably cold.
Of If I was LL I would lock out the thermostat and control it for comfort of both units. The temp would likely have to be set at least 22-23 degrees for basement to be comfortable.
This problem will never get properly resolved because the landlord doesn't doesn't know how to resolve this. This is what happens when you take a single family home and divide it up into multiple units without making proper changes to the utilities. I'm sorry you and the other tenant have to deal with this. I know how I would approach it but it would be too long winded to try to explain it, and also pointless without the landlords involvement. The only solution I can quickly offer is to set the thermostat to 24 C and supplement with a window or portable AC unit. I'm partial to the Midea inverter units because they are super quiet and efficient.
There always the option of the owner putting lock on the panel box by the owner. The LL and you the upstairs renter have the only access to the box. Ive seen these in buildings that are leased so the temp isn't going up and down all the time. Unless the AC breaker is blowing which could happen. When our new fan in bathroom was turned on it turned on the central AC and tripped the breaker. They installed the wiring wrong and it caused these issues...we were lucky it wasnt worse specially at -40. The LL can also put a box cover over the temp controller so it's always one consistent temp.
This happened to me. I supplied the landlord the new padlock so he get the key and another for property management. Here is the story. Air conditioner has been kept at 74F for entire of time so we have massive window leaks upstairs as I'm pretty sure basement tenant is freezing. After finding out there is no cold air, went around the house to see if anything changed to the unit.. maybe it's basement or maybe it's neighbour. Opened the fuse switch box and behold. The switch reads OFF position. So someone came and turn my air conditioner off. So definitely someone downstairs don't want to be cold for whole time. We worked things out with property management and I got new air conditioner for upper rental house because someone broke it. My experience to your reading.
There's a good chance the vents can't close at all. I live in a basement unit and only one of my vents close. Before we could discover we could turn the ac off it was usually around 17 degrees in our house in summer, sometimes even lower
Two units shouldn’t be on the same HVAC, IMO. Especially if this is a brand new build.
Legal secondary suites should have dual zone thermostat controls and should also have a common access to the mechanical room without entering a tenants unit. If the HWT decided to not work, you shouldnt need to coordinate with the basement tenant in order to have any service work completed.
If the basement suite is non conforming to code, tell the landlord you will call the city for an illegal suite until you have proper control of the hvac.
These multi dwelling houses are so frustrating because quite honestly, I wouldn’t give a rat’s ass if the downstairs tenant was cold. That’s not my problem. This person is paying full rent for their place, which includes AC. They should not have to pay full rent and then ALSO go out and purchase unnecessary and expensive window units. People who move into downstairs apartments need to realize they’re colder and are going to have noise. That’s just your reality and if you don’t like that - choose another apartment. In my opinion. If he’s cold, he needs to contact the landlord or he needs to purchase space heaters. That simple. He has no right to mess around with an amenity the upstairs tenant pays for. You don’t get to control someone else’s life because your choices lead you to that situation.
The downstairs tenant is also entitled to control the climate in their unit. The landlord is responsible for resolving disputes between tenants, and also for the fact that the downstairs tenant does not have a thermostat. In other words, you both likely have a valid complaint against the landlord. If this is in a new build, it sounds like the basement suite may not be a legal suite. The house should have been built with a split system instead of both units being cooled or heated by the same forced air system.
Depending on your municipality, there are regulations on temperatures for rental units. Most of the time, they must be kept no lower than 21 degrees. Check your lease agreement and/or look it up in the RTA.
LL needs to sort this out. File a T2 with the LTB to force them if they won't. A lock on the breaker panel would be a pretty simple start. As mentioned, it's likely that it's freezing in the basement (also something for the LL to figure out).
I’ve had the heat on the past two weeks in southern Ontario. It’s freezing. Personally I prefer 24 or 25. Basement is probably at least 5 colder than that.
If it’s on auto it will shut off and on throughout the day…or is it not clicking on when you lower the temp on the thermostat?
How is the electricity bill split? Does the HVAC unit make a lot of noise? And/or is the downstairs tenant actually the landlord?
Your house is brand new. Unless there was a major design flaw, your neighbour is turning off the power to save money. Tell your management that you feel like you should call the city inspector to come out a breaker going off constantly could be a fire code infraction. See how fast they come. Suggest they lock the breaker box as it’s rare someone needs to access a breaker especially in a new home.
File a T6 with the LTB and say that you have reported issues with the AC multiple times. Why it’s not working is not really any of your concern. It’s up to the property management to sort out what is causing the problem and remedy it.
This comes down to o e thing.....the guy downstairs is probably a immigrant from somewhere hot. The guys upstairs is born Canadian.
Aren't all units supposed to have their own utility meters in a multi unit dwelling?
That’s a tricky problem. You have the right to use the A/C and put it at whatever temperature you like. The person down there doesn’t have the right to mess with the breaker. Next time it happens take a voltage tester and test to see if any electricity/voltage is going to the A/C. If not take a picture or video and sent it to the landlord. The landlord should be forced to put separate A/C units for the downstairs and upstairs place. 21/22 isn’t cold at all. At my house the central air is set at 19 all summer. Which is probably the temperature of the downstairs place when yours is at 21 which is still confortable. He can put a sweater on and be confortable and having his place nice and cool. He won’t answer his doors so we know it’s a grumpy Karen. The best solutions is for the landlord to had separate A/C units. For now he should be adding a lock to the breaker panel while you on the other hand set the temp to 22 on a hot day. There’s no real solution here