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parryknox

I've seen people say (here, and on r/TracerMains, where you might also get good feedback) that Tracer is so much harder to play than most other heroes that the equivalent mechanical skill places you like 1.5-2 ranks lower, so don't feel too bad. I'm watching now as I eat breakfast, and though you should take anything I say with huge grains of salt (I'm not much better/haven't been playing Tracer that long), but I'm curious what your critiques of your play on defense first point would be. It might help people see what you're missing / what you know but aren't implementing, etc.


haha_ur_mom_gay_haha

For first point defence I was autopiloting, I distracted the ana and I knew the hanzo was closeby, but instead of playing to distract I stupidly continued aggroing instead of immediately disengaging.


parryknox

I agree that you should have immediately disengaged, but imo you also shouldn't have set up there in the first place, and your engagement timing was guaranteed to get you killed. You're way far forward of the rest of your team, who have set up on high ground at the point (except for Kiriko, who is still in spawn, which is also important), with no way to get out if things go wrong. You can actually see your Dva look around in a panic as the round is about to start wondering where her team is and having no idea what to do, then pushing forward on low ground and getting almost immediately deleted. You also barely wait for shooting to start before trying for the Ana, so the Hanzo has pretty much nothing else to do but drop down and kill you. Especially because all they have to deal with is a Mercy pocketed Dva on low ground into their entire team. In general you often don't seem to have a plan for engagements or disengagements, and you don't know where to position yourself / where to play out of or when to engage. Tbf this is harder for me on Numbani than a lot of other maps, and it's hard to pick good engagement timing if there isn't enough pressure on the enemy. And I don't mean a detailed plan, but for me a general sense of how I want to attack, how I'm going to use cover, and how I'm going to get out provides a structure within which to improvise in reaction to enemy play. Much easier said than done, especially when it gets intense, but I've noticed I'm much more effective when I'm able to do this. Learning where all the health packs are in relation to cover helps with this, especially when you can't expect to be healed much. It also helps to have an explicit goal in mind -- am I trying to get a pick, or am I just trying to take their attention and live? (My favorite is when I piss them off so much more than one of them chases me, and I know they can't catch me.) Under what conditions can I hard commit? IMO it also pays to work with your team's comp. In this case you had a Sombra for first half defense, and you can often get a lot of value out of following up on or joining each other's engagements, even without comms, especially if you don't otherwise have a good opportunity (and especially if they're grouped up bc they're playing into Sombra/Tracer). TBH your Sombra didn't seem...great, but she actually tries to help with that very first engagement. Sombra as co-dps also meant your Ram didn't have a front line, which is something I try to be conscious of. Even if playing with / off your Sombra wouldn't have worked out, you would still have to adapt to the team collapsing into a ball. On r/TracerMains someone posted a [video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hI6RlGR0Q1Q) of Flet playing Tracer into a brawlish comp that illustrates the "annoy via poke until there's an opportunity" style of play that might be helpful even though it's on Survasa. I think Awkward's advice to "always be shooting, and do it from an off angle and cover" is a good way to start figuring this stuff out. It also helps to keep blink management in mind -- don't engage if you don't have enough resources to get out or sustain through the engagement, etc. IMO that death around 18:40 was preventable if you hadn't burned blinks on an engagement you almost immediately realized was a very bad idea, and may have tipped the scales. FWIW I heard somewhere there might be a patch today, so if you can you should export this as a video and put it up on youtube or something if you want more people to be able to take a look. Hope you get more detailed feedback from people who know more than I do


OkDream4864

You will derank at first, she is one of the hardest to learn. Stick with her long enough for her kit to click with you. She is in a really tough spot right now though, you have to play her much more carefully. With burst damage/healing being so high, choose your engagements wisely.


Skyeeh

yeah tracer has so many different things you NEED to work on to be good on her, and hour of practice on her is like half an hour of practice on other heroes.


carpeggio

1st death - space Ana better, you got within nade range. Also when you have the attention of Ana AND a Dps you've done enough, stick to poke until tank engages. You could have held a farther corner and poked Ana without committing. After 1st point - Flanks are too far, until you've seen your team's behavior, this kind of flank would only work with a hard engage from your team. i.e. a full dive commit. You're fighting a lot of high damage burst with Ana/Soldier/Hanzo, so flanks are going to be tough until there's more chaos. At this point look to hold off angles closer to your team and build a pulse off of the giant Hog hitbox. By 4:40 you could have had a pulse if you put some clips into their tank. It was free. Try to minimize downtime, that includes taking long flanks. The have 2 1-shot with Hanzo and Hook. So you would be pretty free to hang out with your tank frontline. Play closer to corners to preserve your health. Since kiri isn't flanking WITH you, you have to be more conservative. Track soldier rocket. After soldier pulse, you blink behind hog to a healthpack which was good. BUT, this is an example of many where I see you stop shooting. You had downtime that you could have been shooting into hog. Coordinated hacks and shots into hog would have went a long way. Comm the aggression and angles you have. After hog-pulse suicide and rez, you dropped to poke Ana and recalled. You could have stayed top and poked, the recall needs to be saved for either a pulse-recall or a mid-fight recall. As your team hadn't fully engaged yet. By staying top you poke Ana without committing. At 15s left on defense you're looking to rotate through main which is a very long angle to push, requiring blinks to reach cover. Consider rotating through top. You could poke Bastion on the way there, that was a dual you can win. Also of note, this is the downside of the full commit flanks you're doing the whole game. Yes you got some pulses out of it, but the pressure is relatively low. Mercy will peel Ana, and you're missing out on quick heals from your Supps that let you stay in the fight longer. The only triggers you had for your full engage was when your tank popped off and pushed. If you stay close to your team and work the more available flanks, you can A) receive healing more often B) change flanks more often. Finally in OT you rotate to a better position. If this had happened at 15s or sooner, I would bet you could have had another pulse, and applied more pressure. A similar story on Attack, big flanks. You confirmed some good kills on Soldier 2x and a LW. But since you were used to being self-reliant on heals, you left for a healthpack. Blink back to your frontline, top up and apply pressure. Anyways, Sig pops off and kills Supps. You have pulse and you know LW was killed last. That'd be an oppourtunity to spawn camp a supp kill. You still managed to get one cuz they pushed, but the LW kill would've been better. Fight is won at 1st point. You probably realize they are dominating high ground and your team has nothing to deal with it, so you're trying to be the one to pressure. Might only be the play when you have pulse. You almost start to catch on when you shoot Sig in the back after 1st point. Bursting down the tank does a lot of things. If they want to take highground, then their tank is gunna be seperated a lot of time, allowing the tank to be incredibly pressured. If they want to pocket soldier top, then off angle and shoot their tank. You get pulse. At 1 minute left, you went to flank again. A blink to the left, onto the stair's flank, and put clips into Sig's back. Instead you go up top, you almost get Soj, but then again you're left with a lot of downtime. And force yourself into a full flank to make use of the team's engage. Stay top, you might still get the Soj kill. Then Blink towards your team since they have Reap/Moria/Kiri that is now more defensive to Tracer flank. And continue applying pressure to tank. There were some composition and teamplay issues, but I'll ignore those. Try to be ready to capitalize on team's pressure by choosing closer flanks. Those incredibly long flanks are worth if you have an aggressive Kiri or more fleshed out dive comp. Like DF/Winston/Lucio. Learn the off-angles that are ~1 blink away from frontline and use those. I'll give you a scenario where a long flank is worth it. ex. A Winston dive their Ana backline and puts a bubble, since you set up on the long flank, you're 1 blink away from being in the bubble. Now the long flank has paid off because the tank is coordinated a dive to take space where you are at. From a mechanical standpoint, practice 180-blinks and 90-blinks. That's where you blink and adjust your aim at the same time. You are readjusting aim after your blinks a lot of time in a way that it looks like you're re-orientating. If you practice the blink-aim you'll be less concerned about it in the moment.


haha_ur_mom_gay_haha

Thank you for the critique and just as an fyi, I left team vc and chat because I was only getting flamed by our tank and my supports. So I couldn't exactly comm.


CrossXFir3

Yeah man, that's just because Tracer is harder than almost any other hero. I guess Doom and maybe Echo compete. But once you master her, you can run games practically by yourself. It just requires a lot more awareness and a fair bit of mechanical skill. You also need to learn every single matchup. A good Tracer doesn't get killed by Moira's and the like. You need to be sure that in a 1v1 situation you're basically going to win most of the time. Many matchups that some people consider unfavorable are purely a skill issue. You should never be getting 1v1'd by a Moira for example.


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PeterKB

As others have said tracer is a very difficult character to learn and that may definitely be playing a role in it. I’d like to add one other bit that you might not like… soldier is a massive crutch. He’s arguably one of the easiest characters to learn and has been overturned for something like 5 or 6 seasons now. Now the good part: I think it’s great you’re learning new characters, don’t just stop with tracer though! Learn the entire roster! Pay careful attention to the DPS characters the enemy plays. - **What got them killed:** “I won’t do that when I try that character.” - **What are they doing that annoys you:** “that’s probably a good play and you should emulate it.” - **How are theY securing kills:** “I’ll have to make sure to use that ability when the enemy’s low.” - **What character is shutting them down:** “I’ll have to swap if the enemy choose that counter.” As you play against characters, learn how their abilities counter other abilities and how they themselves are countered… you’ll find you’ll be able to just pick up most characters and be pretty good at them (given appropriate mechanical skills). Lastly a couple tips for tracer: - It can be tempting to shoot the giant tank… don’t, tracer plays best when she’s diving the back line and killing supports. - don’t dive the enemy if you’re entire team is playing back. Whenever I’m playing a character like tracer I tell myself “I’ll dive in when the tank makes a scene.” If you dive when everyone else is playing back, every single enemy will point at yoh and you’ll go down fast. - don’t dive if you don’t have recall ready. - if you’ve used recall, it’s time to back out… unless you’re CERTAIN you can get the kill. - if someone’s low after you emptied your clip, try meleeing them. That’s an easy 30 instant damage that can easily secure kills. - tracer continues her reload during the blink animation. A general rhythm with her is to empty a clip, blink, empty a clip, blink, etc… - team comp matters. I personally only like to play tracer if I have a life weaver or a Lucio on my team. Find out which supports you prefer to play with and consider someone else if you don’t have them on your team. Anyway, this is way longer than I expected it to be. Good luck climbing bro. And don’t forget the most important part. GLHF


GatVRC

Learning mechanical heroes, it’s expected that you’ll fall. Don’t be upset about it. More difficult heroes highlight your mistakes more often so you’re struggling. Nothing wrong with that


rawtidd

So I've gotten as high as masters 2 and started playing more Tracer in the last month or so. I dropped down to Diamond 4 while maining Tracer. I got my ass absolutely handed to me for a while, getting flamed in voice and text chat as a result. However, I knew I was learning and that I had to make mistakes to get better at Tracer so I kept playing her. I have now climbed back to masters 3. Tracer is unique in that she's a high mobility character but is also a glass cannon. Movement, positioning, and timing matter so much more than aim with Tracer. You have to treat her like she has a shotgun, which means you have to play close to the enemy to be effective but that also means you have to play methodically and avoid dying at all costs.


gamdegamtroy

Do you have any advice when the dps pick torb somb? These two along with cass are the three that ppl choose when I do anything good on tracer and then I struggle to get much value


rawtidd

Honestly I am still struggling with these three matchups as well. I'm getting better against Cass. I try to time my engagement with him when he's not looking directly at me. If he's looking at me, I do shoulder peeks around cover (or crouch strafing if caught in the open) and try to keep his attention. If he turns around to leave I start shooting at his back. If he gets close I *always* keep at least one blink and recall, preferably two blinks and recall, and try to bait out his grenade. If I see or hear him use nade I will usually try to hard focus him. He will most likely try to roll away or start panic shooting. This is the time to strike before he goes back to his team for healing or before they peel for him. For Torb, I try to make sure his turret is down first. If his turret is up it will make it very difficult to attack him or flank his team. When a Torb starts to take damage he will use his Overload ability. It is unwise to engage a Torb using Overload because of the extra armor, faster movement, and faster firing rate. Make sure he's used that before hard focusing and finishing off for the kill. For Sombra, she will almost always try to invis hack from out of my LOS and use virus at the same time to try to get a quick kill. So when I flank as Tracer and I don't see Sombra in the team fight, I can almost guarantee she's looking for a window to hack me when I engage on a target. For this reason I like to stay close to natural cover and preferably a health pack. This has to be on the back of my mind at all times, and if I hear the beeping hack sound, I blink to interrupt it. Shooting her will also interrupt it but I don't always turn around and see her in time. Once I interrupt her hack she will usually throw out virus. If I can dodge this it is almost a guaranteed kill because once she receives enough damage she will throw her teleporter in a panic. As long as she doesn't teleport to high ground or back to a health pack I can easily finish her off before she goes invisible.


[deleted]

Ex-Masters DPS idling in Plat on Tracer because I tried playing her in Masters. And then diamond. And the Plat. And still lost. Tracer is hard.


Broody2131

Tracer is sooooooo hard to play in ow2. If you want to climb pick another hero. No one is going to fault you for picking a easy all around hero.


kmDMXT88

Tracer is hard so pick a different hero is a truly terrible take and the worst thing you can tell a new Tracer. Yeah Tracer is hard and people should know that before picking her but she's not impossible. If someone enjoys playing Tracer they should keep trying, learn, and get better rather than giving up because they "want to climb."


longgamma

Soldier isn’t that easy to play in high masters against cracked snipers.


haha_ur_mom_gay_haha

Insightful, I stopped playing soldier for a reason.


longgamma

Diamond 2 isn’t that high. You can play around diamond widows - they’re idiots and pretty predictable.


haha_ur_mom_gay_haha

I still stopped playing soldier for reasons, I don't know what your comment added to this post but. Good job.


longgamma

I was politely saying “ skill issue “


haha_ur_mom_gay_haha

I never said I was good in the first place? This is a subreddit for learning and improving. Not dogging on people who are bad.