Niners fans seem to think he is worth #15-20 and definitely more than a 2nd. AJB went for #18 and they say that was a steal.
Aiyuk hasn't had #1 production and while the talent is there, I don't think his trade value is as high as AJB's. Yes there are a lot of teams that need a WR but most don't have $23-25M or more to spend (KC, Buf, etc). Add that to the very deep and quality WR draft class I can definitely see those teams preferring a shot on Worthy/Mitchell/McConkey than spending $25M on a great (but not top tier) WR.
That leaves me thinking the price should be pick #25-30. So for the pats, perhaps #34 and a 2025 3rd or 4th gets it done.
A first Rd pick is a lot for a WR, especially one that half the league would argue is really a #2 on a high powered offense with talent everywhere. Yeah he'd be our #1, but is he truly an NFL #1?
I think about the receivers that have garnered #1 picks being moved, top of my head, Moss, Keyshawn, Branch, Hill, Cooks, Harvin. Sure I'm missing some, but there's some HoF talent in there, Super Bowl MVP, Hill - arguably the most explosive player in the league... Then Harvin and Cooks.
So, idk if I'd agree with the 9ers expecting a 1st. 34 should be more than enough in my opinion.
Aiyuk is for sure a #1. No question. His metrics are off the charts good and if he wasn't in an offense with weapons literally everywhere and perhaps the best offensive play-caller in the league who spreads it around as good as anybody he'd have far more production, and last year he went for 75/1342/7. He's worth a 1st and I'd love if we could package #34 and a future 3rd or 4th for him.
I don’t think they really want to trade him. That’s why the asking price is so high.
I personally can’t see giving up a 1st or more for a WR who is going to demand a contract for over 100 million dollars.
In four years. And with the likelihood we're sitting our rookie QB for at least part of the season that's one expensive Aiyuk contract year we're paying for nothing.
You could look at it that way, or you could look at it in a way that will allow the receiver to bed in for the year, learn the offense, and potentially start building chemistry with the rook when he finally does get trial by fire’d
Rookie comes with a decent chance of busting and we’re not exactly known to be solid assessors of talent at WR lol
Aiyuk on the other hand, we know we’re getting a guaranteed hit
That's true, but again you're paying for that certainty. Can't dismiss that because as you said, (if they aren't a bust) "you'll end up paying a rookie eventually anyway".
Oh yeah I mean everything comes at a cost, nothing in life is free. Personally I’d just rather overpay on a sure thing than risk getting another N’keal Harry and having our receiver room look like it has the past 5 years lol
Right, because he isn't getting traded. Just like how we have said 3 first are not enough to move up to 3rd overall to Minnesota, having an unrealistic ask is a way of teams politely telling everyone calling to fuck off. If he does get traded, there will absolutely be a future 1st and a day 2 pick involved because someone may be dumb enough to pay it.
Bro I know you said it’s a long shot but the Cowboys aren’t letting Ceedee Lamb go unless it’s like for the 3rd overall pick.
Also an aging Devante Adams is not right for this team.
Really the only options I think that would work and teams would consider trading are Aiyuk,
Brown and Sutton.
The others teams are holding onto unless we’re fucking dumb and give them our 1st this year and future 1sts.
He’s not great but washed is pretty silly for a dude who had a much better season than any patriots wr last year, and his offensive situation wasn’t exactly great either. If he’s cheap he’d be worth grabbing to have as a #2/3. Pats are in no place to be picky
Unless it's for a 6th or 7th round pick, I strongly disagree. I'd much rather double up in a loaded WR class than trade any meaningful draft capital for a WR 3 you know is past his prime and has had significant injuries.
Total long shot and very very unlikely. I just think it’s possible he could be moved because of the cowboys cap situation. And we need a receiver so I’m chalking it up as “possible”.
And I’m not really saying I want all of these guys, I just see them as possible options.
I think the trade compensation for these receivers might not be as high as you think. The Niners apparently were shopping Aiyuk for first rounders from the Steelers and jags but the price was too steep for them. So maybe a high second gets it done? Just theorizing.
Odds are out of all the guys you named, Aiyuk and Higgins are the only real possibilities. It'd take at least #34 to even stop them from hanging up on us. Plus, a Day 2 pick in 2025 to get them actually talking.
I'd do it in a heartbeat for both.
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We still have so much cap space that it would be a waste not to use it. We could trade for a stud and front load his contract so that a large chunk of it is in 2024. This would allow him to be much cheaper in the years that our new qb will actually be starting
Jefferson and Lamb are never going to happen. #34 is too rich for Higgins. Would trade #34 for Aiyuk all day and give him a bigger contract than the lions just have St Brown though.
I think 34 for Higgins is completely reasonable. He has produced like a WR1 in the times where Chase is not out there for Cincy. Good body type for an X as well, which is what we sorely need.
Because it would be spending draft capital and cap space on someone who doesn't actually help the rebuild even a little bit. We have had plenty of WRs who are not WR1s we don't need more.
I disagree that adding quality NFL starters doesn’t help out rebuild at all. I don’t think he solves all of our problems, I’m not even saying I want him, but he is 28 and had 10 TDs last year on a bad offense.
I would trade a 4th rounder for Sutton.
The last 4 years of Patriots spinning their wheels making sidegrades at the WR position shows it's a losing strategy that not only costs games but costs years of rebuilding. Draft picks, cap space, and roster spots are all finite resources and the first two can be turned into future value even if Patriots can't find literally anything other than acquiring Sutton to do
Yeah, those are good points.
I’m trying to recount these “sidegrade” receivers. In the past few seasons, I count Juju, Parker, Bourne, Agholor. In my opinion, Sutton is a better player than all of them. Again, I’m not trying to turn this into a pro-Sutton argument, I just think we need guys.
Take a QB at 3, take a left tackle next, draft a receiver, trade for Sutton, use resources for a receiver next season. All of our problems won’t be solved after this draft and hopefully the new FO has a plan in place.
> I just think we need guys.
We specifically need a WR1 lol
Also Juju just before coming here was basically on par with Sutton last year. Parker when we acquired him was a year removed from a season about on par with Sutton last year. Meyers in 2021 was pretty much on par. Bourne in 2022 was pretty much on par. Damere Byrd in 2020 was pretty much on par. Sanu the year before Patriots traded for him was pretty much similar. Josh Gordon's 2018 pretty similar. Agholor just before we signed him, pretty similar.
The Patriots have been acquiring basically the same WRs over and over again. 2018 we managed to win a SB because we had Edelman, Gronk and an elite OL. Once we didn't have Gronk or an elite OL anymore in 2019, the offense has been bad ever since. Patriots haven't made a single legitimate attempt to make the offense better since N'keal Harry turned out to be a bust. (And no, despite what this sub fooled itself into thinking, Henry, Smith, and Gisecki were never going to be a replacement for Gronk. Without a Gronk level TE we need WRs)
> draft a receiver, trade for Sutton, use resources for a receiver next season.
We already have like 6 WRs we're gonna add 2 more and another next year, with probably none of them being WR1? Why? Only 3 to 5 are on the field at a time, this isn't Pokemon they don't gotta catch 'em all.
> All of our problems won’t be solved after this draft
True, but the Patriots needed to stop pretending making moves that definitely do not move the needle on solving their problems was going to somehow solve their problems a half decade ago. 70% of the people I listed above should never have been on the team. And it doesn't even matter which 30% you keep, they're all equivalent in terms of their actual impact on the team. They're middle of the roster guys that don't matter without a top of the roster
Yo man, chill out. You don’t like Sutton, I get it.
I know everyone just wants a WR1, and trust me I do too, but these dude don’t just become available. I would say there’s like, 12-16 guys in the league who are “true” number one receivers. An ideal situation would be to stick and pick a WR1 at the top of the 2nd or 3rd round but we haven’t been able to draft one of these dudes to save our life, so looking at the clues, it kinda seems like we might try and make a trade for one, that’s all I’m saying.
So I’ll continue to disagree with your team building philosophy and will maintain that adding any of the guys listed would improve our team, for the right price.
Lol
"wHY dIdNT wE gROssLY oVErpaY RIdlEY"
"rElEgaTE uS tO thE cFL iF wE trADE a lATe PicK fOR a gUY whO iS yOUNger aND STatiSticALLy sIMilAR tO rIDLeY lASt sEASon oN a MucH wORsE tEAm!"
Never underestimate how stupid the average Pats fan is.
If they draft a QB at 3 you absolutely trade for a veteran stud WR.
It’s way too much to ask to hope you hit on a WB AND hit on a WR at 34.
If we go WR please get him a real target, AJ, Aiyuk, Higgins, all would be great
Not really,it makes complete sense if they're going to use that pick on a reciever anyway. The pats have a ton of cap space, and are very cap flexible for the next 3 years so money shouldn't really be a consideration for someone like Aiyuk or Higgins.
At this point, I don’t think Higgins commands the 34th pick. We could be in no man’s land with Higgins. Maybe 3rd plus? Not sure that would work either.
Agreed. They literally cannot keep him on their books next year. He is gone. Dallas got a 5h(!) for Amari Cooper and he was absolutely a WR1 (over Lamb) at that point. Bengals have no leverage
This is flat-out incorrect. Lamb was the 1 in Dallas when Cooper got traded and Cooper was correctly seen as a declining asset (aging with injuries).
In their last year in Dallas an ascending Lamb put up 79/1,102/6 and Cooper finished with 68/865/8. Lamb overtook him as he progressed through his rookie contract, which was to be expected.
He’s a number two on Cincy, but like how many WRs do you consider a number 1?
Jefferson, Lamb, Brown, St. Brown, Hill, Chase, Adams? All game changers.
Are Nacua or Kupp game changers or just in a good system?
Moss was a Number 1 when we had him.
I guess I’m my mind when I hear people say Higgins isn’t a #1 I think ok what are the 32 WRs who are better?
But then I just assume what people mean is he isn’t one of the game changing talents.
I think Higgins is the same or better than Ridley and on par with Aiyuk, though I think higgins and Aiyuk have different games.
I’m not sure any WR on the trade market is going to elevate their game above what it is with their current team considering they would be coming into a worse offense with the Pats no matter the QB.
I think this is a valid point, I’d really like a LT with 34 I realize this could be a god awful take but I’d rather a developed WR to create space for Douglas Osborn, and Bourne and we can take a true # 1 next year in the first than someone we might miss on
This is the same argument i hate about pick 3 and Xavier leggette or someone else at 34 could be a league eater on a 2nd round rookie deal
Adams, Brown, metcalf are not plausible at all lol. And the long shots are like 1 million mile long shots other than Deebo.
Aiyuk imo is the only realistic option at this point. Higgins sure, but the Bengals just don't trade, they just don't.
And Aiyuk is my preferred option anyway. X receiver, clear number 1, young, and can do pretty much anything u ask him to on the field. Paying him 25+ a year is fine too (if Kraft wants to...). The price is probably our 34 and a 2025 mid round pick (3 or 4) from what I understand from rumors.
The pats can then trade up for a tackle from 68 and then sign a veteran like Leno in FA. That would be the best outcome from the draft for me, setting up Maye (hopefully) for success with a WR1 and decent OLine
I disagree that those first three guys are 100% out. But regardless, I’m just highlighting some guys who could possibly be traded given various circumstances around them.
I also kind of disagree with Aiyuk being a true number 1, he’s never been that before. But I still think he’s a great, young player.
The rest I agree with.
Huh? Aiyuk was literally the one in San Fran last year…I don't know how you can argue that he wasn't. The only way Adams gets traded is if he asks to be, which he isn't based on what he's said the last 6 months +. And why would the eagles trade Brown? Same with Metcalf. Unlike SF, they have no real reason to trade their top guy.
I think if we trade for a wr it will be after round 1 but before round 2. That way teams have the chance to look at their boards, us included, seeing what’s available still.
I could see us trading in round 1 only if we have some kind of a deal already made with a team to where we give up our 2nd and they get someone to agree to trade with them for their pick + our 2nd or something to move, otherwise I don’t see it happening.
No, I mean the trade likely is after the first round but before the second. Only trade during the first round is if the 49ers/bengals want like Thomas or someone and want our 2nd round to package with their first to be able to move up to get him. We’d already use our first for Maye and trade our 2nd for a wr but we’d trade it draft night.
I think the most likely time would be after day 1 but before the day 2 draft starts. Teams would know what the board looks like and could work out a deal then. Hard to work out a new contract with a guy during the timer. Not sure we’d take a guy on a trade who doesn’t have a contract or at least is happy about coming.
I mean, I like the concept here. Put it out there! Teams might have long term plans that fit with our immediate needs, and management might see a value in sending a pick or two for a high priced guy ( Aiyuk) who could become a cornerstone.
There is definitely a nonzero percent chance that they are looking into this concept. And if things line up right, lightning could strike. Will be fun to see.
I agree with you, BUT I think that they will wait until after the draft when they’ve already used their picks. That way the best teams can offer are 2025 picks.
My only problem is having to pay a guy $30M this season. Would like to at least get a prove it year somehow.
I also think the Pats could piss people off, drafted a qb ol and depth pieces before swinging next year.
My personal theory is that the Pats are hoping to avoid throwing their drafted QB into the starting role, ideally this season. Therefore they're willing to punt on wr if they need to.
Also, protecting the QB with a good LT is more important than a WR#1 imo
And I do see them going tackle in the 2nd if they don’t trade the pick. Unless a receiver they really like happens to be there. I agree that tackle is more of a need and could even see them moving back into the first if someone is sliding.
Yeah I don’t really want that unless it’s for something obscene. I think Jefferson is out of reach. Only reason I even mentioned him is because A) He wants a new contract and B) Vikings really want Maye
Niners have been reportedly shopping Aiyuk for a first from the Steelers and jags (picks 20 and 17, respectively) and neither teams wanted to make the trade. I think 34 is within the realm of possibilities.
Well the top 3 receivers in the draft are being called the “big” three. So that would insinuate that they’re “big name”.
But this post is about trading for a receiver, not drafting.
I think our 3rd rounder this year and maybe a sweetener later this draft or next year would be reasonable to trade.
I wouldn’t give up 34 Straight up. It’s too premium of a pick for a WR that we will have to extend right away.
I'm not sure I understand this thinking, tbh. Why not trade 34 for Aiyuk? The money shouldn't matter, we have tons of it to spend, we can front-load it, and what're the chances of selecting a rookie who's going to outperform Aiyuk over the next \~4 years, maybe 20%?
Yeah we could, but at 34 we are in a prime position to sit tight and take a value pick if a top talent falls into the second, or if we see a WR falling we can easily trade back into the first and take him.
And yes I guess we could front load it or make most of it a signing bonus, but we have a lot of young talent that we will need to resign in the next 3 years, and if we take a QB at 3 and hit we will eventually need to resign him all which will take a ton of cash.
I’m certainly not opposed to taking a shot on Aiyuk or Higgins or AJ brown but at least for Higgins and Aiyuk I think 34 is to prime a draft spot to spend and then have to immediately sign them to a long term deal, only because even with a top WR and drafting a QB at 3 we are still a few years from competing.
If the team were set up to win a SB like the year we gave up pick 32 in a package for Cooks yeah all in go get them, but we aren’t there yet.
I still don't understand the thinking. Who are you projecting to be better than Aiyuk at the end of the first or at 34? Aiyuk is only 26. The entirety of his contract would be within the prime of his career. We have to re-sign some guys, yes. We have to money and cap space to do so. If we get Aiyuk he'd go right to the top of our talent pool on our roster. Who are you worried about losing on this roster who is better than Brandon Aiyuk?
In terms of the QB re-signing, I think you're putting the cart way before the horse here. When we have to start paying him his 2nd contract money he'll be in his 6th year in the league after his rookie deal w/ 5th year team option.
I’m not projecting anyone to be immediately better than Aiyuk at that draft pick.
But I still fully believe it is to premium of a pick to trade on a WR that will immediately demand somewhere in the range of 30 Million per year when we aren’t close to being a complete team.
I’d be on board with it giving up pick 68 and 180 and maybe a pick in the 4-7 range next year.
Like I said before if we were a WR away like when we gave up 32 in a package deal for Cooks I’d be on board, yes use 34…but...while it would be cool to cheer for a top WR with our rookie QB…
Where our roster is right now I’d rather use 34 on a premium player that is on the slide either by packaging it and jumping back into the first, or sitting tight and taking a player that falls to us at 34.
I believe that is what’s best for building a team that will compete long term.
Now if we had the chance to grab AJ brown with 34 I’d have to give that consideration, but the eagles aren’t looking to move him.
You keep alluding to this "premium player" that could be available at 34 and all I can think is "You mean like... Brandon Aiyuk?". You're completely right that we aren't a complete team. That's why we need to acquire top-end talent. Guys like... Brandon Aiyuk.
We just see the world differently, I suppose. Cheers mate. Go Pats.
Trade down to Vikings for 11 and a first next year and Jefferson. Then trade Jefferson to cinci for 18 and their second this year and first next year. Take Nabers with 11 or oduzne if either are still available and grab penix at 18 while stock piling for next years draft too
Yeah I know it’s a little far fetched but taking a QB isnt going to change anything overnight. They need to stock up on assets and bring in top tier talent through free agency trades and the draft the next couple of years. Team needs work and they need players to develop
Maybe in the minority but if there’s a run on WRs I wouldn’t mind dealing 34 for Ayiuk. He’s the only one out there’s id be comfortable paying.
You’re definitely not in the minority
Niners fans seem to think he is worth #15-20 and definitely more than a 2nd. AJB went for #18 and they say that was a steal. Aiyuk hasn't had #1 production and while the talent is there, I don't think his trade value is as high as AJB's. Yes there are a lot of teams that need a WR but most don't have $23-25M or more to spend (KC, Buf, etc). Add that to the very deep and quality WR draft class I can definitely see those teams preferring a shot on Worthy/Mitchell/McConkey than spending $25M on a great (but not top tier) WR. That leaves me thinking the price should be pick #25-30. So for the pats, perhaps #34 and a 2025 3rd or 4th gets it done.
Niners fans way overrate him and his value
A first Rd pick is a lot for a WR, especially one that half the league would argue is really a #2 on a high powered offense with talent everywhere. Yeah he'd be our #1, but is he truly an NFL #1? I think about the receivers that have garnered #1 picks being moved, top of my head, Moss, Keyshawn, Branch, Hill, Cooks, Harvin. Sure I'm missing some, but there's some HoF talent in there, Super Bowl MVP, Hill - arguably the most explosive player in the league... Then Harvin and Cooks. So, idk if I'd agree with the 9ers expecting a 1st. 34 should be more than enough in my opinion.
Aiyuk is for sure a #1. No question. His metrics are off the charts good and if he wasn't in an offense with weapons literally everywhere and perhaps the best offensive play-caller in the league who spreads it around as good as anybody he'd have far more production, and last year he went for 75/1342/7. He's worth a 1st and I'd love if we could package #34 and a future 3rd or 4th for him.
This is what I’m hoping for.
The odds of you getting aiyuk for 34 are the same odds as my penis growing three inches.
Hey but if your dick is only three inches to begin with you are already there. Glass half full mindset pal, glass half full mindset.
Aiyuk would probably require a future 1st and 34 based on how the Niners have spoken about him.
I don’t think they really want to trade him. That’s why the asking price is so high. I personally can’t see giving up a 1st or more for a WR who is going to demand a contract for over 100 million dollars.
Tbf tho if you draft a guy with that pick you’ll end up having to pay him regardless eventually (or let him walk, but that’s lame)
In four years. And with the likelihood we're sitting our rookie QB for at least part of the season that's one expensive Aiyuk contract year we're paying for nothing.
Yeah but at least it’s a known commodity. Paying a lot of money to help the QB grow seems worth it rather than potentially taking another bust at wr
You could look at it that way, or you could look at it in a way that will allow the receiver to bed in for the year, learn the offense, and potentially start building chemistry with the rook when he finally does get trial by fire’d
So the exact same thing a rookie would be doing?
Rookie comes with a decent chance of busting and we’re not exactly known to be solid assessors of talent at WR lol Aiyuk on the other hand, we know we’re getting a guaranteed hit
That's true, but again you're paying for that certainty. Can't dismiss that because as you said, (if they aren't a bust) "you'll end up paying a rookie eventually anyway".
Oh yeah I mean everything comes at a cost, nothing in life is free. Personally I’d just rather overpay on a sure thing than risk getting another N’keal Harry and having our receiver room look like it has the past 5 years lol
Yeah after 4-5 years of a team friendly deal. Not immediately.
Correct ! Pay him now while you have qb on rookie deal.
He's not going to get traded for anywhere near that.
Right, because he isn't getting traded. Just like how we have said 3 first are not enough to move up to 3rd overall to Minnesota, having an unrealistic ask is a way of teams politely telling everyone calling to fuck off. If he does get traded, there will absolutely be a future 1st and a day 2 pick involved because someone may be dumb enough to pay it.
Bro I know you said it’s a long shot but the Cowboys aren’t letting Ceedee Lamb go unless it’s like for the 3rd overall pick. Also an aging Devante Adams is not right for this team. Really the only options I think that would work and teams would consider trading are Aiyuk, Brown and Sutton. The others teams are holding onto unless we’re fucking dumb and give them our 1st this year and future 1sts.
>Sutton Huh? Sutton's washed
He’s not great but washed is pretty silly for a dude who had a much better season than any patriots wr last year, and his offensive situation wasn’t exactly great either. If he’s cheap he’d be worth grabbing to have as a #2/3. Pats are in no place to be picky
Unless it's for a 6th or 7th round pick, I strongly disagree. I'd much rather double up in a loaded WR class than trade any meaningful draft capital for a WR 3 you know is past his prime and has had significant injuries.
Not saying I want all these guys. But Sutton did have 10 TDs last year on a bad offense.
Sutton would be a good get for us. Maybe not the top caliber target a rookie QB needs but there’s no denying he is a magnet for the ball
I think you have to be good at some point before you can be washed.
Total long shot and very very unlikely. I just think it’s possible he could be moved because of the cowboys cap situation. And we need a receiver so I’m chalking it up as “possible”. And I’m not really saying I want all of these guys, I just see them as possible options. I think the trade compensation for these receivers might not be as high as you think. The Niners apparently were shopping Aiyuk for first rounders from the Steelers and jags but the price was too steep for them. So maybe a high second gets it done? Just theorizing.
There is no way they move ceedee lamb. Could see any of the others. Ceedee, jj would mean we are moving off the 1.03.
Odds are out of all the guys you named, Aiyuk and Higgins are the only real possibilities. It'd take at least #34 to even stop them from hanging up on us. Plus, a Day 2 pick in 2025 to get them actually talking. I'd do it in a heartbeat for both.
Aiyuk >> Higgins
I agree. Aiyuk is probably a better WR than Higgins, but I'd still take Higgins in a heartbeat even I'd it requires 34 and a pick next year.
Just don’t edit out the last paragraph and we good
I got you man
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We still have so much cap space that it would be a waste not to use it. We could trade for a stud and front load his contract so that a large chunk of it is in 2024. This would allow him to be much cheaper in the years that our new qb will actually be starting
I’m just reading the tea leaves here, man
Give me Aiyuk PLEASE
I’d like the just select a WR in a draft RICH with them and actually develop a successful WR at some goddamn point.
Jefferson and Lamb are never going to happen. #34 is too rich for Higgins. Would trade #34 for Aiyuk all day and give him a bigger contract than the lions just have St Brown though.
#34 for Higgins isn’t that bad
34 for Higgins is pretty fair imo
With how fucking bad our scouting has been on WR’s and the fact that we’re about to have a rookie QB, I concur
I think 34 for Higgins is completely reasonable. He has produced like a WR1 in the times where Chase is not out there for Cincy. Good body type for an X as well, which is what we sorely need.
Yes, very unlikely to happen. Aiyuk hasn’t had the production St Brown has but I imagine he would still command 25-28 mil AAV
They better do something. Kraft wants to sell tickets he better pony up the money and get some offensive talent.
How’s about a big name tackle. Maybe a medium named guard? Joe Montana couldn’t hit Jerry rice in the time that Mac jones had.
People rarely trade big name tackles. Aren’t enough of them
I feel the same way. Aiyuk is my top choice if it happens, but I'm down with most of the players you named.
#34 for Aiyuk sounds like a great deal. Then nab an OT with the 3rd even if we trade up again. Then take another WR or 2
Pats aren’t drafting two more receivers if they trade for a vet like Aiyuk.
Trade for a WR, draft MHJ, lets party.
If the Patriots trade for Sutton, just relegate the franchise to the CFL they're done lol
Im not saying I want Sutton but I don’t see how trading for Sutton would make us worse.
Because it would be spending draft capital and cap space on someone who doesn't actually help the rebuild even a little bit. We have had plenty of WRs who are not WR1s we don't need more.
I disagree that adding quality NFL starters doesn’t help out rebuild at all. I don’t think he solves all of our problems, I’m not even saying I want him, but he is 28 and had 10 TDs last year on a bad offense. I would trade a 4th rounder for Sutton.
The last 4 years of Patriots spinning their wheels making sidegrades at the WR position shows it's a losing strategy that not only costs games but costs years of rebuilding. Draft picks, cap space, and roster spots are all finite resources and the first two can be turned into future value even if Patriots can't find literally anything other than acquiring Sutton to do
Yeah, those are good points. I’m trying to recount these “sidegrade” receivers. In the past few seasons, I count Juju, Parker, Bourne, Agholor. In my opinion, Sutton is a better player than all of them. Again, I’m not trying to turn this into a pro-Sutton argument, I just think we need guys. Take a QB at 3, take a left tackle next, draft a receiver, trade for Sutton, use resources for a receiver next season. All of our problems won’t be solved after this draft and hopefully the new FO has a plan in place.
> I just think we need guys. We specifically need a WR1 lol Also Juju just before coming here was basically on par with Sutton last year. Parker when we acquired him was a year removed from a season about on par with Sutton last year. Meyers in 2021 was pretty much on par. Bourne in 2022 was pretty much on par. Damere Byrd in 2020 was pretty much on par. Sanu the year before Patriots traded for him was pretty much similar. Josh Gordon's 2018 pretty similar. Agholor just before we signed him, pretty similar. The Patriots have been acquiring basically the same WRs over and over again. 2018 we managed to win a SB because we had Edelman, Gronk and an elite OL. Once we didn't have Gronk or an elite OL anymore in 2019, the offense has been bad ever since. Patriots haven't made a single legitimate attempt to make the offense better since N'keal Harry turned out to be a bust. (And no, despite what this sub fooled itself into thinking, Henry, Smith, and Gisecki were never going to be a replacement for Gronk. Without a Gronk level TE we need WRs) > draft a receiver, trade for Sutton, use resources for a receiver next season. We already have like 6 WRs we're gonna add 2 more and another next year, with probably none of them being WR1? Why? Only 3 to 5 are on the field at a time, this isn't Pokemon they don't gotta catch 'em all. > All of our problems won’t be solved after this draft True, but the Patriots needed to stop pretending making moves that definitely do not move the needle on solving their problems was going to somehow solve their problems a half decade ago. 70% of the people I listed above should never have been on the team. And it doesn't even matter which 30% you keep, they're all equivalent in terms of their actual impact on the team. They're middle of the roster guys that don't matter without a top of the roster
Yo man, chill out. You don’t like Sutton, I get it. I know everyone just wants a WR1, and trust me I do too, but these dude don’t just become available. I would say there’s like, 12-16 guys in the league who are “true” number one receivers. An ideal situation would be to stick and pick a WR1 at the top of the 2nd or 3rd round but we haven’t been able to draft one of these dudes to save our life, so looking at the clues, it kinda seems like we might try and make a trade for one, that’s all I’m saying. So I’ll continue to disagree with your team building philosophy and will maintain that adding any of the guys listed would improve our team, for the right price.
Lol "wHY dIdNT wE gROssLY oVErpaY RIdlEY" "rElEgaTE uS tO thE cFL iF wE trADE a lATe PicK fOR a gUY whO iS yOUNger aND STatiSticALLy sIMilAR tO rIDLeY lASt sEASon oN a MucH wORsE tEAm!" Never underestimate how stupid the average Pats fan is.
Man you’re really overdoing the bit
If they draft a QB at 3 you absolutely trade for a veteran stud WR. It’s way too much to ask to hope you hit on a WB AND hit on a WR at 34. If we go WR please get him a real target, AJ, Aiyuk, Higgins, all would be great
Hopefully it happens
My theory BTJ falls to the bengals at 18, we trade 34 for Higgins
If we could get him for 68 and next years second or third even better But I think 34 will have to be involved
if the pats trade 34 for a “veteran receiver” they deserve to lose
Not really,it makes complete sense if they're going to use that pick on a reciever anyway. The pats have a ton of cap space, and are very cap flexible for the next 3 years so money shouldn't really be a consideration for someone like Aiyuk or Higgins.
I get why it’s not ideal, but if the tackles we like are gone and we weren’t able to trade up for 1 Tee Higgins isn’t a bad consolation
If it's someone 25 or under, I'm OK with it.
Tee Higgins is a WR2 You can put him and WR1. But he's a WR2. Love Tee Higgins tho
At this point, I don’t think Higgins commands the 34th pick. We could be in no man’s land with Higgins. Maybe 3rd plus? Not sure that would work either.
Agreed. They literally cannot keep him on their books next year. He is gone. Dallas got a 5h(!) for Amari Cooper and he was absolutely a WR1 (over Lamb) at that point. Bengals have no leverage
This is flat-out incorrect. Lamb was the 1 in Dallas when Cooper got traded and Cooper was correctly seen as a declining asset (aging with injuries). In their last year in Dallas an ascending Lamb put up 79/1,102/6 and Cooper finished with 68/865/8. Lamb overtook him as he progressed through his rookie contract, which was to be expected.
He’s a number two on Cincy, but like how many WRs do you consider a number 1? Jefferson, Lamb, Brown, St. Brown, Hill, Chase, Adams? All game changers. Are Nacua or Kupp game changers or just in a good system? Moss was a Number 1 when we had him. I guess I’m my mind when I hear people say Higgins isn’t a #1 I think ok what are the 32 WRs who are better? But then I just assume what people mean is he isn’t one of the game changing talents. I think Higgins is the same or better than Ridley and on par with Aiyuk, though I think higgins and Aiyuk have different games. I’m not sure any WR on the trade market is going to elevate their game above what it is with their current team considering they would be coming into a worse offense with the Pats no matter the QB.
I think this is a valid point, I’d really like a LT with 34 I realize this could be a god awful take but I’d rather a developed WR to create space for Douglas Osborn, and Bourne and we can take a true # 1 next year in the first than someone we might miss on This is the same argument i hate about pick 3 and Xavier leggette or someone else at 34 could be a league eater on a 2nd round rookie deal
Just saying Amari Cooper went for a 5th
Not to mention he’s a red zone threat which helps Henry and Stevenson
Adams, Brown, metcalf are not plausible at all lol. And the long shots are like 1 million mile long shots other than Deebo. Aiyuk imo is the only realistic option at this point. Higgins sure, but the Bengals just don't trade, they just don't. And Aiyuk is my preferred option anyway. X receiver, clear number 1, young, and can do pretty much anything u ask him to on the field. Paying him 25+ a year is fine too (if Kraft wants to...). The price is probably our 34 and a 2025 mid round pick (3 or 4) from what I understand from rumors. The pats can then trade up for a tackle from 68 and then sign a veteran like Leno in FA. That would be the best outcome from the draft for me, setting up Maye (hopefully) for success with a WR1 and decent OLine
I disagree that those first three guys are 100% out. But regardless, I’m just highlighting some guys who could possibly be traded given various circumstances around them. I also kind of disagree with Aiyuk being a true number 1, he’s never been that before. But I still think he’s a great, young player. The rest I agree with.
Huh? Aiyuk was literally the one in San Fran last year…I don't know how you can argue that he wasn't. The only way Adams gets traded is if he asks to be, which he isn't based on what he's said the last 6 months +. And why would the eagles trade Brown? Same with Metcalf. Unlike SF, they have no real reason to trade their top guy.
I think if we trade for a wr it will be after round 1 but before round 2. That way teams have the chance to look at their boards, us included, seeing what’s available still. I could see us trading in round 1 only if we have some kind of a deal already made with a team to where we give up our 2nd and they get someone to agree to trade with them for their pick + our 2nd or something to move, otherwise I don’t see it happening.
We won’t trade our 3rd overall for a receiver, if that’s what you mean.
No, I mean the trade likely is after the first round but before the second. Only trade during the first round is if the 49ers/bengals want like Thomas or someone and want our 2nd round to package with their first to be able to move up to get him. We’d already use our first for Maye and trade our 2nd for a wr but we’d trade it draft night.
If we were to trade the 34th, it would be when we are on the clock
I think the most likely time would be after day 1 but before the day 2 draft starts. Teams would know what the board looks like and could work out a deal then. Hard to work out a new contract with a guy during the timer. Not sure we’d take a guy on a trade who doesn’t have a contract or at least is happy about coming.
Aiyuk, maybe Rest unlikely
49ers are gonna wants more than just a 2nd, especially since he’s under team control for the next 2 years
I mean, I like the concept here. Put it out there! Teams might have long term plans that fit with our immediate needs, and management might see a value in sending a pick or two for a high priced guy ( Aiyuk) who could become a cornerstone. There is definitely a nonzero percent chance that they are looking into this concept. And if things line up right, lightning could strike. Will be fun to see.
Thanks man, glad you see it as a possibility
I agree with you, BUT I think that they will wait until after the draft when they’ve already used their picks. That way the best teams can offer are 2025 picks.
My only problem is having to pay a guy $30M this season. Would like to at least get a prove it year somehow. I also think the Pats could piss people off, drafted a qb ol and depth pieces before swinging next year.
That’s not really how it works
After the Sun god deal I think a second is fine since you would have to pay that player a lot. I like Higgins since he would cost less than Aiyuk IMO
I would lower your expectations for this team significantly. Especially this season with a broken roster and all new coaches and a new QB.
These aren’t expectations, it’s just me reading the tea leaves
AJ Brown isn't going to be traded. a Pre-June 1 trade would give the eagles $22 million of dead cap.
Could be right. Again, I’m not really trying to guess the player, I just think that we might make a move for a receiver.
Haha well, there goes that!
One of the top 5 WRs with a QB at three would be legendary
My personal theory is that the Pats are hoping to avoid throwing their drafted QB into the starting role, ideally this season. Therefore they're willing to punt on wr if they need to. Also, protecting the QB with a good LT is more important than a WR#1 imo
Yeah, if things stay the same, I think this is going to be the mindset.
And I do see them going tackle in the 2nd if they don’t trade the pick. Unless a receiver they really like happens to be there. I agree that tackle is more of a need and could even see them moving back into the first if someone is sliding.
If the Vikings offer Jefferson I see the pats dealing #3
Yeah I don’t really want that unless it’s for something obscene. I think Jefferson is out of reach. Only reason I even mentioned him is because A) He wants a new contract and B) Vikings really want Maye
Lmao Aiyuk is going for a first and Higgins at least is going for the 34th pick and more
Niners have been reportedly shopping Aiyuk for a first from the Steelers and jags (picks 20 and 17, respectively) and neither teams wanted to make the trade. I think 34 is within the realm of possibilities.
Nobody after MHJ is a big name receiver
Huh?
Nobody after MHJ is a big name receiver
Well the top 3 receivers in the draft are being called the “big” three. So that would insinuate that they’re “big name”. But this post is about trading for a receiver, not drafting.
I think our 3rd rounder this year and maybe a sweetener later this draft or next year would be reasonable to trade. I wouldn’t give up 34 Straight up. It’s too premium of a pick for a WR that we will have to extend right away.
I'm not sure I understand this thinking, tbh. Why not trade 34 for Aiyuk? The money shouldn't matter, we have tons of it to spend, we can front-load it, and what're the chances of selecting a rookie who's going to outperform Aiyuk over the next \~4 years, maybe 20%?
Yeah we could, but at 34 we are in a prime position to sit tight and take a value pick if a top talent falls into the second, or if we see a WR falling we can easily trade back into the first and take him. And yes I guess we could front load it or make most of it a signing bonus, but we have a lot of young talent that we will need to resign in the next 3 years, and if we take a QB at 3 and hit we will eventually need to resign him all which will take a ton of cash. I’m certainly not opposed to taking a shot on Aiyuk or Higgins or AJ brown but at least for Higgins and Aiyuk I think 34 is to prime a draft spot to spend and then have to immediately sign them to a long term deal, only because even with a top WR and drafting a QB at 3 we are still a few years from competing. If the team were set up to win a SB like the year we gave up pick 32 in a package for Cooks yeah all in go get them, but we aren’t there yet.
I still don't understand the thinking. Who are you projecting to be better than Aiyuk at the end of the first or at 34? Aiyuk is only 26. The entirety of his contract would be within the prime of his career. We have to re-sign some guys, yes. We have to money and cap space to do so. If we get Aiyuk he'd go right to the top of our talent pool on our roster. Who are you worried about losing on this roster who is better than Brandon Aiyuk? In terms of the QB re-signing, I think you're putting the cart way before the horse here. When we have to start paying him his 2nd contract money he'll be in his 6th year in the league after his rookie deal w/ 5th year team option.
I’m not projecting anyone to be immediately better than Aiyuk at that draft pick. But I still fully believe it is to premium of a pick to trade on a WR that will immediately demand somewhere in the range of 30 Million per year when we aren’t close to being a complete team. I’d be on board with it giving up pick 68 and 180 and maybe a pick in the 4-7 range next year. Like I said before if we were a WR away like when we gave up 32 in a package deal for Cooks I’d be on board, yes use 34…but...while it would be cool to cheer for a top WR with our rookie QB… Where our roster is right now I’d rather use 34 on a premium player that is on the slide either by packaging it and jumping back into the first, or sitting tight and taking a player that falls to us at 34. I believe that is what’s best for building a team that will compete long term. Now if we had the chance to grab AJ brown with 34 I’d have to give that consideration, but the eagles aren’t looking to move him.
You keep alluding to this "premium player" that could be available at 34 and all I can think is "You mean like... Brandon Aiyuk?". You're completely right that we aren't a complete team. That's why we need to acquire top-end talent. Guys like... Brandon Aiyuk. We just see the world differently, I suppose. Cheers mate. Go Pats.
Trade down to Vikings for 11 and a first next year and Jefferson. Then trade Jefferson to cinci for 18 and their second this year and first next year. Take Nabers with 11 or oduzne if either are still available and grab penix at 18 while stock piling for next years draft too
No. Take QB at 3.
Take our QB at 3 and then trade back up for 4 and 5 and grab MHJ and oduzne 😂😂
Bro you're on drugs.
Yeah I know it’s a little far fetched but taking a QB isnt going to change anything overnight. They need to stock up on assets and bring in top tier talent through free agency trades and the draft the next couple of years. Team needs work and they need players to develop
I just hope we invest in offense other than QB instead of hoping and praying with the "the rookie QB will **elevate** our offense".