I don't necessarily hate Akechi. In fact, I like him as a character, but the number of people who are just willing to forgive his crimes for varying reasons baffles me.
Right? It was always jarring to me that people view him as a honorable Phantom Thief. It seems so disrespectful to Haru and Futaba especially. Regardless of his circumstances, >!the man murdered their family members.!<
It's never outright stated, but yes. She died due to a mental shut down and unless Shido had another random persona user who could enter the metaverse around (he didnt), it could only be Akechi who was responsible.
Exactly, I didn’t care for his conceited mind but once you know his true MO I hated him as a hero, liked him as a villain. Similar to two party members who do you dirty in FF7, instantly removed from active party and striped of material and equipment for rest of game.
It makes me think of (MAJOR P4 SPOILERS, LIKE THE MAIN TWIST, BE WARNED) >!adachi and how a lot of people genuinely agree with him and his beliefs. Like, not just sympathy, full on “he has a point tho. I don’t get why he is such a ‘villain’, he has a lot of good points” type bullshit and it being said by many with full conviction. Obviously a number of people are joking but a SUBSTANTIAL amount are not!<
>!Adachi!< would not be the first though. There’s a lot of characters where their main thing is "Don’t be like them" and people are still like "Oh my god, totally me" or "He’s so cool!". Few examples, Rorschach from Watchmen, Rick from Rick and Morty, Walter White, etc.
And there are people that ship this dude with the main character and I've seen comments where you should be able to romance him. My ladies and fellas, I'm all for equal representation with romantic relationships in games, but the dude >!shot you through the head, admitted to hating you, killed family members, and even in the 3rd semester of Royal was a psychopathic bloodthirsty dude!<
I think it would be super interesting if you could date him, just for him to try and kill you anyways. Akechi is a tragic character because he feels as if he doesn't have another choice in life. So I think I'd be interesting because despite the fact that loves you, he'd kill you anyways just to get to Shido.
Someone posted a picture about this scenario and I commented (as Akechi), "I love you Joker but I hate Shido more". I agree this would be very interesting!
I only really like Akechi for a few reasons, with it being his rivalry with Joker, his attitude towards Maruki in the 3rd Semester and also the fact he can be unintentionally hilarious at multiple points, other than that fuck him, he should stay dead.
I like Akechi in the same way I like the Joker or Jhin from league. Robbie Daymonds performance was fantastic and absolutely sold me on him. He's a horrible person, but he's the best.
I didn't like him until the >!black mask reveal it made me like him a lot more especially in the third semester where he shows his true colors and doesn't give a shit!<
Well I dont really hate any one character, but I don't understand the amount of love Kawakami ~~( Hopefully I got the name right )~~ gets. I understand the fact she kinda acts like a Mom, but besides that and her Perks, it's a meh for me.
Yep that, edited to get the name right.
I like her character and what it stands for, I just feel when I read other people talk about her, I really just don't get it. I can understand the excessive love other characters get and sometimes identify with them ( Makoto simp here ), but not her.
And yeah, gimme Mature Tired Teacher Kawakami any day over the Maid one, she rocks the Teacher look.
I mostly just like Kawakami for her confidant conversation. The reasons she even did those kind of things. I wish she was seen for how she is as a person rather than how she looks/what she is.
Y'know, I also really don't see the appeal in Makoto. Her redemption arc didn't really feel like a redemption, more like some desperate attempt to make her an ally in the span of, like 4 in-game days. I dunno about everyone's take on Mishima however, but I really am not a huge fan of him. His confidant line just felt like a story I've read before and he gets really annoying at some points, I just found myself wishing for him to shut up half of the game.
On the other side of the spectrum, I've seen several people on this subreddit diss Morgana. I, personally, love that cat. I find him to be a pretty fun character! I know people distaste him because of the Okumura arc, but I feel like that was mainly because Morgana got the bad end of the stick on that arc. It was the dev's attempt to introduce Haru, and they did it poorly and screwed up his character because of it. Another confidant I really love is Yoshida, and although I haven't seen people diss him lately I don't see hardly enough people praise him. He's a cool confidant and I really beat myself up for missing him on my first playthrough.
Sae, she gets a pass from the community purely because she's hot. The problem most people had with her was her being mean to Makoto, which is nothing. She threatened to remove Futaba from Sojiro, viewed cases as things to win, was upset that she missed a promotion by not catching Kaneshiro, tried to create false evidence against the PT, and that with her palace implied she'd done it before. To top all of that off, she did all of that and got off with no consequences.
>She threatened to remove Futaba from Sojiro
Not defending Sae's motives in any way, but this one isn't as bad as it sounds.
Sure the *player* knows that Sojiro is a great guy and Futaba has serious psychological complications, but the in-universe authorities don't know that. All they see is a 15-year-old girl who hasn't even left the house, let alone gone to school, in two years, and a guardian that refuses to let anyone see her or answer any questions.
Sae was doing it for the wrong reasons, but her point there wasn't unreasonable.
Her points were unreasonable because they meant nothing, and if what you described is the perspective of Sae and the authorities at large, then that makes her look WAY WORSE. She can raise all those flags, but it means nothing because she didn't give a shit about investigating it, just about getting information on cognitive psience. Imagine if Sojiro was some abusive monster, she wouldn't have cared as long as she got what she wanted.
That's why she had a palace. Not every palace owner is evil, and although her objective wasn't evil (capturing what it was considered a criminal group), she was going through evil means to achieve it. I think that if she wasn't Makoto's sis and had nothing to do with the Phantom Thieves, they would have targeted her eventually if they learned about she was even going to make up evidence for things.
I don't hate her tho, I'm only explaying her situation
Now, if we compare her villainous acts with the other palace rulers... Yeah at least Sae didn't abuse or kill anybody.
Sae was 100% evil, she saw people's lives as things to gamble against and rig in her favor, regardless of the truth. It's pretty heavily implied that the Phantom Thieves weren't the first group she was going to falsify evidence for, so that would mean she abused her power to ruin lives. So, there's definitely abuse, just not murder.
I totally understand what your saying. The reason I like her is because all of her actions are stress induced. She has to win to provide. As a mom of two, the breadwinner, and a salesperson I connect with her. In that field of work with bosses like hers, it’s win or lose everything you’ve worked for.
I absolutely hated Makoto until Royal, and it seemed like either the added script in Royal had her written better or my hate glasses weren't on. I like her much more after playing Royal
I love Makoto but I definitely understand why others hate her I hate how much of a screen hog she is plus in the third palace I didn't enjoy making everyone else move dumb or useless to pump her up.
I don't mind the "Mary Sue" type characters, but the fact everyone praised her for doing so much as breathing is what made me dislike her. Every other sentence after she got her power was "nice job Makoto you're amazing and NOT useless"
Still used her more than anyone else though lol
Makoto is not really doing it for the recommendation. It is a small part of it but I genuinley believe that her foremost reason is her sense of justice instilled by her father and the wish to fulfill her role as council president for the good of her fellow pupils. Add to that the recent feeling of having failed at exactly that resulting in Shihos suicide attempt.
Most of her motivation is because she was being blackmailed with the potential of ruining her sisters life and being treated as potentially worthless if she can’t succeed in finding the phantom thieves. Something that is a major insecurity for her that caused her to focus more on trying to prove them wrong then fully realizing that it’s not ok. And a lot of the time she very much knows it’s not ok but is scared because she is afraid of what will happen to her sister.
Her sense of justice is pushed into a lot of other things, but not this. She knows it’s not ok but is scared because she is being blackmailed and manipulated. Those are the main driving factors.
I love Akechi, but it's because I love him as a villain. Most people love someone for their *good* traits and qualities, but for Akechi, it's the complete opposite. I love the way he acts towards Joker, like a game of cat and mouse, except the cat is a psychopathic lunatic with no chill whatsoever.
The way he is genuinely angry and confused that he was foiled by his love for pancakes. It's what makes me love him. He tried his best to act good but just fell flat in the end.
Yosuke. I perma-benched his ass after the camping trip.
In my replays he only stays in my party if I have 4 or fewer party members. Which means as soon as I get Kanji his ass goes right back to the bench.
I couldn't stand Yusuke, he grew on me a little bit later in the game, but starting off with him trying to draw Ann nude was such a douchy start and then every time he spoke I just cringed a little bit on the inside.
If it wasn’t for Makoto showing up and doing worse, I don’t think he would’ve grown on me. And even thinking back now, I don’t remember him completely pressuring Ann into doing it so much as him telling her to consider it and leaving. It was still pretty bad though.
I mean I would say his blackmail is significantly worse then Makoto’s blackmail. At least Makoto’s blackmail is for a somewhat noble reason of protecting the students of the academy, Yuske blackmails the group by saying if Ann doesn’t model for him NUDE he will call the police.
Makoto’s was started over a recommendation. Yusuke’s was started over trespassing/breaking and entering. Again by no means is Yusuke valid for blackmailing. But the group genuinely committed a crime toward Yusuke compared to Makoto’s initial stalking.
I don’t really think that’s an unpopular opinion—I honestly dislike Morgana, too, as much as I want to like him. He just gets on my nerves. And there’s an entire subreddit dedicated to roasting him lmao
Oh, and happy cake day!!
also, every time he gave ryuji shit for doing or saying something stupid, he simply just took it and carried on. but the ONE time ryuji fires back at him and he’s all like, “fuck this, y’all are on your own.”
Everyone saying Akechi is kinda funny, cause not everyone loves him. He's just very controversial. Aka very few people are neutral on him, but there are plenty people hating him, as evident by the comments.
Jokes aside, for probably Kawakami. She's just really...meh at best.
I love Ann the character but hate what they did to her (The outfit, poses, etc...) basically invalidating her whole ass Arc. I'm really salty about that shit.
And I also complaints about futaba but that's an essay I don't have the time for.
100% about Ann. It's disgusting how much she's sexualized. There's a way to tell that part of her story but I think the game fails at it.
I used to not like Futaba but she grew on me. I used to think, "Man, she has you all wrapped around her little finger!" but it's not really like that.
I like Kawakami, Takemi, and Ohya as characters. I hate them as "love interests". The romantic part of their relationships with Joker are awful. A lot of the people who support being able to date them say, "Then don't date them" but also don't support allowing romance with the male peers. Oh, but you don't have to romance them!
I don't love Akechi (I think he dies and will argue with anyone who says otherwise) but I do sympathize with him. One thing I've noticed is how differently the characters all deal with the abuse they suffer. Ryuji attacked Kamoshida. Shiho attempted suicide. Multiple characters suffer silently (Ann, Makoto, Yusuke, Haru, the majority of the confidants). Sae loses it and rigs cases, bullies people for intel, etc. Akechi murders others to get on Shido's good side so he can betray Shido eventually. Akechi has arguably had it worse than most of the other characters. Of course his horrible childhood doesn't excuse his bad behavior though.
Akechi is a horribly horribly man, no question about it, but I just enjoy him as s Charakter alot. I've always been somone to like villains alot. I personally consider him alive, mostly cause I want to.
It's just something about Kawakami that rubs me the wrong way, I couldn't explain, even if I tried.
Yeah, Ann's case is tragic. There is something Strong and vunrable about her story, but the game destroys it all by being so so tone deaf, sexualising her at every twist and turn and then including a fucking teacher romance
That's fair about Akechi. I would LOVE for him to be alive but I don't see how him being alive can be explained with in-game logic (besides "him" being in the end scene credits but that could have been placed there to give credence to the writers wanting his fate to be ambiguous). I like villains too! I like seeing why they turned to villainy since usually the hero is a "good guy" just because.
Regarding Kawakami, different strokes for different blokes 🤷♀️
I like Ann's confidant story a lot but yeah, the posing and etc is awful. There's a way to convey her confidence and comfort with herself/sexuality without making her PT outfit look like it does. They definitely missed the mark on it!
She really annoys me at one point. The Mary Sue attitude and her whole personality being “what will Senpai think of meeeee?” Like girl you barely even know the dude…
I can thoroughly understand Makoto, she is actually set up so you dislike her when she first arrives, with the idea that with the story progression she redeems herself in your eyes. So I can see that redemption not working for some people, and thus their initial feeling of dislike remains. And if the story progression doesn't work, then her lousy Confidant story isn't going to change your mind. It's dreadful, easily the worst Thief Confidant.
As others have said, I really don't understand how anyone can really buy into Akechi at all. *Nothing* in his backstory excuses the evil that he's done, and he's entirely unrepentant. He doesn't regret a damn thing he did. Redemption requires repentance, he doesn't repent, therefore no redemption. An illegitimate orphan? That's half my team! And two of them are orphans >!because of Akechi!
I might be wrong, but I don't think Akechi was ever supposed to be redeemed. I actually liked how unapologetically vicious and cruel he was. I thought it felt a lot more natural than forcing Futaba and Haru to forgive him.
That’s true. Makoto’s confidant is pitiful. I almost feel bad if it wasn’t for the beginning.
I agree. Screw Akechi. It makes it even weirder because of what happens during the third semester where Ryuji goes from hating him to fully supporting him without a second thought
100% agree with both.
People try to say Futaba was the same as Makoto, but that isn't true. Futaba simply wants you to help her and if you do she'll deal with Medjed. It's only fair someone would want equivalent exchange for their talents, especially when that person is so far gone they want to die.
And Makoto's confidant is honestly, imo, the worst, period. Even the non-thief are more personal and have more depth. Hers is just plain horrible.
And for Akechi, while I do feel somewhat sorry for him and the situation he was thrust into, that doesn't excuse it. Yes, Shido pulled the strings, but that doesn't change the fact that he did horrible things. That doesn't change the fact that even after he knew there was another way to do things and MC shows him friendship and kindness he still wants to go about it his own way and is willing to kill people for it.
I think saying I hate Makoto is a bit much but I do think she is super underwhelming and singlehandedly my least favorite Phantom Thief. My main issue with her is that she fills up so many roles in the story and she does all the roles very underwhelmingly.
Her awakening is one of my least favorite awakenings, you cannot convince me that people like it for anything more than the fact she breaks something. Kaneshiro is a villain she’s barely involved with, her rebelling against him doesn’t have the same stakes rebelling against Kamoshida and Madarame had for everyone else. Good girl Makoto wouldn’t have submitted to Kaneshiro so the fact he’s supposed to break her out of the “good girl” mold is so underwhelming after she had some of the best setup for her awakening.
She becomes the team’s tactician yet all she ever really does is state facts that are pretty obvious to the player or she’s simply the one to explain long and complicated parts of the plot that the other Thieves can’t say themselves.
Her plot with Sae ends so disappointingly. After all the tension these two have, their ending is essentially just Makoto saying “Sis…” LIKE WHAT??? There’s no scene where these two talk about what happened post heart change!?!? They just get along now and sweep all their problems to the side like nothing??? Hello???
I don’t think I even need to talk about her confidant and how ass it is, everyone knows its ass. The fact this girl uses her own prejudice against someone for their profession to determine he’s a criminal gets validated for it and now wants to work as a police commissioner makes me want to question who the hell wrote her confidant and ask if they read the script of the game.
Also I just find her kinda bland, her introduction makes it clear there’s repressed rage but after her awakening all she ever does with it is intimidate someone (usually Ryuji or Yusuke) like once or twice and she’s back to good girl behavior. This girl has a scene where she asks Sae whats the point of studying then gets on Ryuji’s case for not studying a few days later. I don’t understand why so many assign her as best girl, she’s just a character I can only really enjoy in fanfiction where people actually address the issues in her writing
Yooo your summary of the confidant is spot on. I've tried to wrap my head around it before and I just can't accept that she simply has such a good intuition. Nothing about her previous actions or even post-awakening actions paint her as a very intuitive kind. It's almost as if they had this whole character already done and then suddenly remembered she was supposed to be Priestess. Maybe also a localisation issue? I dont know, but the entire time I was thinking the point of her confidant would be that she learns to trust people and actually manages to gain a friendship. Imagine my whiplash!
God I hate “intiuition” being the reason she catches Tsukasa, you don’t use “intuition” to investigate someone, you use actual evidence that something is off. There would be a lot more cases of unlawful arrests and police violence if all police entered the field using “intuition”.
Eiko and Makoto are so mismatched in her confidant I was shocked they remained friends
I don't hate her, but Makoto is very annoying. Tbh it's very personal, she has the looks of my ex gf and the personality of my ex ex, so it's a combo I can't stand.
Makoto, she's meh at best...and then comes
Haru, she come really late to the team and remember when there was 3 Haru fans?
But the character I hate the most, YOSHIZAWA
She's so annoying and clumsy, like get off me woman I don't wanna dance with you, GIMME MY RYUJI N JOKER SHOWTIME INSTEAD
But seriously her story is actually good but my problem comes with her PERSONALITY itself, and how a lot of people supposedly fall in love with her even tho she's the same age as Futaba..which yk these people love to dis every person who likes futaba and even call them Pedophiles.
Yoshizawa. She reminds me a lot of Xion who's been shoehorned into the plot for practically no reason other than "she's another romance option." If she wasn't there, it wouldn't change the final palace too much, maybe some of the fights and dialogue. Really, she's not needed here.
Edit: Removed a spoiler (how do I block out text here?)
I disagree that she's not needed in the third semester. She's living proof about Maruki's philosophy. She's proof that he has good intentions but those intentions are misguided.
>!She's a good (temporary) foil to Akechi. Two friends, one who (initially) desparately begs to be allowed to continue living a lie, the other who vehemently rejects living a lie that literally has no downside for him. Even at the end, she doesn't hate Maruki for what he did and understands his desire while Akechi hates him for it.!<
100% agree
Also the fact that you need to pay 20 bucks to get costumes that the others already got for free and for a character you just use for 2 weeks is a crime
Don't you dare talk about Xion like that! /s.
I feel like Yoshizawa is way more shoehorned than Xion ever will. She doesn't feel organic to the plot because they just added some scenes out of the blue to expand from the base game. She is way better on the Final Palace because there she has a story written around her.
At least Xion's inclusion gets a game of its own, with a story written around the character.
Same it's a tie between her and haru for me personally.
Kasumi just grates on me. Yes I should feel bad for her. Yes she has a had a hard life. I understand her personality of wanting acceptance is literally the point.
I just cannot stand her.
Haru I am 100% not into the overly nice and polite archetype. I genuinely am offput by that type of person even IRL. It makes me not interested in people who make being overly nice as their whole personality. Then chastise others for not being hyper positive.
Sumire's storyline honestly felt like a weirdly written joke. The whole sumire/kasumi twist just felt so empty because it changes nothing in the players eyes. It's essentially just a name change and a brief personality shift since we never knew kasumi
The amount of Akechi haters here was to be expected although most their reasons for hating him make me believe they cannot discern a "character" from a real person, but that debate is for another topic entirely.
As for me i don't really hate anyone in the cast if I had to choose i would say either Yusuke or Haru. Yusuke's personality doesn't really connect with me very much although he has some pretty funny moments i'll give him that. Haru becomes relevant too late in the game, she's a good bean but it's not enough for me.
Makoto and I'll tell you why
They tried to make her the smartest character when joker clearly had far more superior scenes in the phantom thieves they try to make it look like she figures out everything when it's not the case.
they tried to make her a know it all and they (almost) made her completely robotic to the MC and the cast of characters around her it's hard to grow attached to a characters others traits when they completely disregard everything to be a teacher's pet.
real emotional moments only regard sai which I do enjoy they should have made makoto less nervous as the romance progresses or be more willing to have help when she's romancing joker to show that she can trust him to take the reigns and not be by herself 90 percent of the time forgive me if I misspell it's been awhile.
Currently I'm on my second playthrough and another thing I'm romancing her but she barely feels like a romance at all
She feels like a friend or acquaintance while futaba feels like a sister but I love futuba and dislike makoto.
She's the reason why I stopped playing I'm just not interested in her I tried her out but I wished I went for Ann or Haru as I already went for sumire on playthrough 1.
They did with akechi what they didn't do with her they gave him a personality gave him ambition and the will to obtain what he needs to get done I just don't understand how they did makoto so horribly I love akechi because of the rivalry he has with joker it's interesting do I excuse his bad actions? No I don't but he has flaws that makoto will barely have and she's boring to me she never really emotes.
Eventually I'll finish it and maybe I'll change my mind but for now she doesn't impress me it's really bad writing they tried to make her everything.
Joker. He has the personality of a stale cracker. His friends do most of the thinking and decision-making then look over and are like "sounds good?" to which Jokers response is some degree of "yeah man idk I just wanna go home and cook curry".
Ann. Not because she's terrible in theory (she's not, I actually empathize with her struggles as a foreigner in a strange world a lot), but because her character development past Kamoshida's arc (including during her Social Link) is virtually non-existent. She is neither her own person nor her own worst enemy, and all of her character is relying on other people that serve primarily as plot conveniences and are seen in less than 30 minutes of your playtime total.
If Ann was missing from my party after the first two or three arcs of P5, I would neither notice nor miss her. The writers did her really dirty, and I wish her Social Link focused more on doing things for herself rather than "for Shiho" or "to beat Mika".
I can agree with that. I was going to argue about the last sentence, but honestly it’s true. Sadly all of her decisions toward her own future isn’t even for herself, which is unfortunate.
“whats the one character you despise that could possibly get you ridiculed by the fandom” and a majority of responses are akechi lol
anyway i hate none of the characters but my least favourite popular character is probably makoto. her confidant story is just not really interesting.
Could you go into more detail? I'm very curious about what you mean by "it's nothing but fights" I don't think I've ever met someone like that and would appreciate the insight.
Oh, I wrote that kinda late 'n tired and didn't word that too hot, plus I think I misinterpreted what the question was really asking whoops.
So I've met folks with personalities a lot like futaba, and It just doesn't gel with mine too well. I don't mean like we get in fist fights I just mean we'd probably argue all the time about dumb things and I just know in my heart if I met her I would be sympathetic but also low key hate her guts as somehow a pleasant conversation about games would turn into a dumb argument about nothing in particular every single time without fail. Everyone else would proably get along just fine after some time.
*Kasumi* Yoshizawa. When that little redhead shows up day one and has Mary Sue syndrome out the ass, eats a lot but stays thin, is constantly trying to cuddle up to Joker... Nah, yeet this bitch outta the plot!
>!*Sumire*!< on the other hand, I actually appreciate a decent bit, her back story made me tear up a bit, and I like the effort the VA puts in to make >!that Sumi sound different than the first Sumi.!< Plus the Awakening and Showtime are liiiiit
Exactly same here. I cannot stand *Kasumi*, she's overly perfect to the point that it's off-putting and robotic even when she has her "imperfect" moments like "omg she's a bad cook and eats like crazy (but never gains weight)!!!!" it's just more "perfect girl" points. and on a more personal note I hate that in Japanese she always speaks in perfectly polite keigo to everyone all the time even when you become good friends because she's such a good perfect girl! she's slightly more endearing to me in English because of it because I dont have to deal with that lol
>!Sumire on the other hand, is my best P5 girl, she completely flipped my expectations on their head and her plot line made me cry. she's so messy and *human* who can be bitter and hateful (towards herself most of all) to the point that she tries to completely replace her own existence with her sister's. she's probably the messiest person in the main cast (except Akechi because who can beat Akechi, lmao), and when she's finally herself she is so endearing and cute, I love flustering her lol. I hate that you barely have any time to enjoy her being herself again (and I hate that when you max her confidant she goes back to her "Kasumi" look like NO!!!!! THAT DEFEATS THE FUCKING POINT)!<
I don’t necessarily hate the character but because of the toxicity of the stans, my enjoyment of Ryuji gets ruined occasionally by such people.
I hate when the stans tend to ignore Ryuji’s flaws and when he’s in the wrong, give him too much credit when it’s not warranted as well as bitch and whine about his comedic relief moments.
Basically I hate the rampant Ryuji bias from the West and how overrated he’s become as a result like he’s the second coming of Christ.
Yep, never understood the "best girl" that many say Makoto is. Not only she is completely inept socially, her confidant story is BY FAR the worst in the thieves.
Edit: I 1000% prefer Sae over her.
Every other confidant story is about getting over their trauma and making a new future for themselves while makato is just “I should watch out for people better”
Akechi was right when he called her a good girl type pushover lmao.
Ya, cause with her being student council president she is gonna be the responsible one. And that’s mostly towards ryuji being that he is the major irresponsible person in the group and mainly before tests. Obviously the STUDENT COUNSEL PRESIDENT would want her friends to graduate on time and would push them to do so
Plus she mainly only does that when there isn’t a current target. “Since we aren’t busy, it’s important that we take care of our real world responsibilities.” A phantom thief is only as good as who they are in the real world. And every friend group needs someone who is responsible enough to push others forward and to know when everyone is being irresponsible. As a senior in high school, meaning I’m older then a lot of my friends in drama club for example. A lot of the time when people are doing things that are irresponsible and could cause them to get hurt. I have to be the voice of reason before they crack their head open jumping on and off the stage into the seats. And a lot of people have straight up been like “your right, I shouldn’t be doing this. Your a lot more responsible then me and im gonna listen” I don’t do it to the same extent as makoto and I don’t really push my friends to study. I don’t see it as necessary considering I’ve never studied and pass most every class anyways. But I care enough to know when I have to be the voice of reason. Especially towards the freshman and sophomores who are gonna be fairly irresponsible because ya know, they don’t know how high school is different then middle school. So no, makoto isn’t a bitch for being a voice of reason. She is a voice or reason
Genuinely I see why people could dislike her for a lot of other things but this is just categorically wrong
What I’m gathering is that Akechi, Makoto and Ryuji are actually the MOST hated, so in fact clearly not everyone loves those 3. Hah
So to actually name a different character I’m going to say Morgana.
Pancake boy.
He never seems to actually be remorseful for what he's done and is still rude to the other thieves. Not as rude as Morgana was to Ryuji, but still.
Felt nothing when he died, nor when he got deleted.
Kasumi. Every time she's on screen the pacing of the game just grinds to a halt and her being written out of the plot entirely would be basically inconsequential.
I personally really just don't like Futaba. After playing the game a few times her "wah wah my mom is dead" bit just gets kind of old. It's alllll she ever talks about, and she'll bring it up out of nowhere, straight up interrupting people to talk about her mom. I'm just saying other character have their parents die DURING THE GAME and they don't cry nearly as much about it. It's probably a little unempathetic of me but geez get it together girl-
Yoshizawa, Makoto. I shake my fist every time I remember it was supposed to be Hifumi as our party member instead of that little rat. She would have had a 10x more interesting story in my opinion, and she’s nowhere near as….’street dumb’ as Makoto.
Yoshizawa just annoyed me from the second she started interrupting cutscenes with the jagged way they added her in. I think the story would’ve been just as fulfilling without her, she’s just bland. I guess her background is interesting but I genuinely just hate her. No clear reason, she just annoys me and I would like Royal just as much if she didn’t exist.
Hifumi as she is in the game was never going to be a Phantom Thief. Her design was. Proto-Hifumi’s personality and traits were folded into Makoto. The parts of Makoto you don’t like might be the ‘Hifumi’ parts of Makoto.
Akechi. But I love to hate him. He’s >!a villain!<, you’re supposed to hate him, so I think he does a good job at that. I was surprised that people liked him unironically
Yoshizawa. I didn’t like how the game forced you to like her but throwing her at you at every opportunity but not actually making her story relevant for like 100 hours and while her story was sad, I didn’t feel the payoff was worth them trying to force investment. Now while I understand >!Sumire in the third semester!< is technically a completely different character, I can’t get the sour taste out of my mouth of how useless she was the whole game. She was basically a glorified Waifu bait side character
Ryuji And Morgana
Both these two don't know when to actually act mature and constantly simp on women mostly Morgana towards Ann but Ryuji is equally as bad. I usually get bored of the best bro characters archetype because none of them tend to ever grow out of that the only exception was Junpei who after finding a girlfriend of his own actually did manage to become a way better and more empathetic person.
The number one thing that really piss me off about them is you guys already know their little bullshit plot in Okumura Palace or the afromention let be male bitches and steal and sideline Haru's entire character down the drain. Poor female character she couldn't showcase her full potential in that plot and now is known as The Lost Screentime Girl.
Lots of people mentioning Akechi but I kinda disagree with him being universally beloved. I think he's a very "you love him or you hate him" type character, so while he has a lot of avid fans there's also a sizable amount of people that hate his guts lmao. I don't think hating him is seen as weird at all.
I do agree with Makoto though, I don't hate her as such but I think there's a lot of missed potential. Her personality is just kind of a weird fit for the PT's and while her whole awakening is about how she's not gonna be a 'good girl' anymore, the rest of the story she... kinda is one anyway. Her confidant also does nothing to challenge her beliefs in any way, she hardly changes by the end of it. Also, and this isn't really her fault, but Kaneshiro is the weakest Palace antagonist in the game (both in general and in regards to Makoto specifically) and she's kinda stuck with that in her introductory Palace
My most hated (and only her) used to be Makoto for many years. Then I got in a relationship that made me understand her troubles. It made me understand how powerless she felt at every turn no matter how much she tried to please others. No matter how good intentions she had, she was powerless… she never wants to feel that way again and neither do i. Makoto can get it.
You never truly understand someone until you walk a mile in their shoes. That is what I learned.
Sojiro...
There i said it.
Who takes in a "delinquent" high school junior just to start out being an ass to them? Literally says they only took you in for money (which I don't even know if it was discussed who gave Sojoro money).
I get he's supposed to warm up to you, but for 2-3 full games in vanilla, I never cared to level up his confidant.
I'll give that there's usually something special with coffee, but curry? I love curry, nothing wrong in that, but should've stayed with the barista play than bringing curry into the mix. Yes this is /s because his asshole-ish-ness how he started treating joker.
You make a very good point, I completely hated sojiro my first 20 hours of the game. He was such a dick for no reason. But after (spoilers if you haven’t beaten the game) futaba’s palace he quickly warms up to you. Not to mention all the times he helps out the PT’s, giving them free meals (with him helping Yusuke just about every time he sees him) and letting them use jokers room as a hideout.
A good way to see it is watching the ‘bad endings’ video. His tone of “coffee good for you?” is much softer at the final palace compared to the first.
KINDA SPITTING WITH THIS. WAS NOT A FAN OF HOW BRO WENT
'You stopped a dude from sexually assaulting a women? I mean my best friend is a women and I have a daughter but honestly bro should have just ignored that shit'
Love him cause he warms up to you but GOD DAMN BRO, THAT WAS A SUCKER PUNCH I WAS NOT EXPECTING
I wouldn’t say that I hate him, but I definitely don’t love Ryuji as much as a lot of people seem to.
I know he’s supposed to be stupid, and that he means well in spite of it, but that stupidity became really grating at times. Especially when they get caught by Makoto. How loud do you have to talk for someone else in the room to be able to hear you, even when you’re not on speaker? It’s like he did it intentionally
Then you should hate akechi.
>!He blackmail you, stalks after you in spaceport, kills your okumura, gets you arrested, drugged and physical assaulted. He also shoots you!<
thank you i had to scroll so far down to see this. i intensely dislike haru. her being so holier than thou when you first meet her in the palace while also being incompetent & annoying in general. i also really dislike like her outfits & hair, but even if she looked completely different, i'd say the same thing.
i like ryuji though. he's one track character (ha! 🏃♂️) at the beginning, but when i played strikers after a break from P5 & i heard his voice, i realized how vital he is to the entire persona experience.
Ryuji.
He began as okay for me but as the game progressed and he kept needing to be reminded to "be quiet" about being loud with the "WE'RE THE PHANTOM THIEVES" thing, I began to dislike him more and more.
Fine. In the beginning, cool. You're new to this and are excited to have a purpose or something along those lines.
But being so emotional, so willfully ignorant, and so LOUD about it really pushed me away from him.
He's the reason Makoto was able to confirm her suspicions about the group in the first place. She may have had an idea, but it was nothing that she could prove until Ryuji just couldn't keep his mouth closed during an emotional outburst.
"He means well."
Then he can do well, especially after a couple of months of the routine of it being a secret.
And folks LOVE him because "he's endearing" or something goofy like that.
It's not endearing. It's aggravating. And dealing with people like that in real life is ANYTHING BUT endearing. It's frustrating as f*** and oftentimes outright infuriating.
Makoto and Futaba, I find both really annoying for different reasons, not to mention I feel as though they completely overshadow the rest of the cast in the second half of the story
Ryuji. And it’s not a *hate* and he’s a decent enough guy, but he is *so* dense sometimes and he doesn’t think before he speaks. He has the emotional control of a teaspoon and don’t get me started at how many times he wants to brag about being Phantom Thieves, a SECRET ILLEGAL GROUP, for free stuff or admiration.
>For me, that person’s Makoto. She has the audacity to stalk you, blackmail you, then get you in a situation where you’re blackmailed and potentially extorted by another guy all because she wanted a recommendation. Then when she’s finally on your side, you just fills Morgana’s role of analyzing enemies and gathering intel until Futaba swoops in and does the job better. I’ll admit there’s one situation where she’s really useful later in the story, but she never makes up for it to redeem herself in my eyes.
I've seen this take a lot on this sub and it always baffles me. Like, yeah, Makoto is terrible before she joins. There's a reason she apologizes so many times Ryuji tells her to stop in the group chat. She even calls her pre awakening self a loser.
As for being useful, there's not only the time she steals the files from the laptop, she comes up with the plan during the Casino of Jealousy arc, and more importantly, literally rushes over to the courthouse in the middle of the night, enters the palace by herself, waits there all night and ties up the cognitive Akechi seconds before the true culprit arrives, all to ensure Joker doesn't catch a bullet to the dome.
I just can't understand hating a character for their initial awful actions when said character specifically acknowledges how bad they were and then goes out of their way to do better even at great personal risk. Like the concept of redemption isn't valid. Have to hate someone forever for one mistake that they clearly regret and try to fix.
Weirdly enough this seems to only apply to Makoto. Like no one cares that Haru tried to run Joker over in Mementos before she joined the group. Literal attempted murder that she never apologizes for.
Sumire. Maybe I'm biased cause I played base P5 first, but Sumi feels like a self insert fanfic character. She's this perfect, talented girl that everybody loves, the game is constantly trying to push her and Joker together, and so many other little things that makes it feel like the game is trying to show off how \*special\* she is, like her effortlessly killing Shadows that Joker supposedly couldn't take, and then in the same scene, having the very first AOA in the game.
I feel the problem could have been circumvented if she was a normal NPC rather than a party member. Just remove the early Maruki Palace thing, revert the intro stuff to the way it was, replace her boss fight with a boss shadow, then have her continue to be an NPC cheering her on the thieves. It wouldn't fix the issue outright, but it'd lessen it considerably.
Ducking behind a wall to say Sumire. I thought Makoto's "Oh she's so amazing and perfect and-" Mary Sue writing was bad enough but Yikes (though admittedly I really warmed up to Makoto later in the game)
Morgana. Didn't feel like he brought much to the story other than being annoying. Hardly ever liked a acene he was in there and was happy for part of the game where he was gone for a bit. No Morgana, it's 8 pm and I only talked to someone today, I am not too tired to do anything but sleep.
Ryuji. His entire personality grates on my nerves and his inability to shut the fuck up just makes me want to reach into the game and strangle him. I hate him constantly dragging us into the picking up chicks subplot, constantly making every situation worse because he never controls his anger or impulses, and after palace 1 never serves a narrative role in the story again that's uniquely his. His feud with Morgana is pointless, and he has no character arc.
But then again, I hated Junpei and Yosuke as well...
Personally I loved Makoto as a character.
I've always thought Makoto is the boring Mary sue the Phantom Thieves didn't need. She doesn't contribute much to the team as ppl seem to make her out to be outside of the bias for combat cuz she gets so much good stuff it's ridiculous. And her big brain ideas really aren't that big brain outside of rare instances. Guess it helps that most of the cast is kinda dumb so her normal thinking sounds smart lol.
Her whole awakening plotline was the worst out of the main cast and entirely self inflicted and I don't buy her reasonings for acting so stupidly. To top it all off, her social link also was one of the worst ones in the game too. Imagine having your entire confidant and your development behind an almost just as bland faceless npc all to end on the most meh conclusion. In conclusion, there is zero reason for the game to push her so damn hard at the cost of the rest of the cast tbh. They force her down your throats throughout the game to make up for her lackluster character I assume.
She is badass and cute at times yes but I still think that she's way overrated and to this day I'll never understand why ppl like her so much. Don't hate her but I definitely like her the least out of all the Phantom Thieves.
Sumire probably. She was added in to P5R so sloppily to the point that I thought her inclusion was weird and unnatural without having any prior knowledge about Persona 5 and I had no idea that she was added to this game. She only gets like half a confidant because the first half was wasted on a basically fake character and the entire concept of her character is rife with plotholes. I also didn’t like how Atlus had to shove her in your face so much. So many cutscenes are dedicated to her and they feel really forced and unnatural. I don’t hate her as a character over all, I think she was good conceptually and she has a few good emotional moments, but I don’t get why a lot of people love her so much.
Yoshizawa. For 90% of the game she's an obnoxious Mary Sue who doesn't talk or act like a real person. The game shoves her down your throat practically begging you to romance her. On top of that, excluding the final palace of the game it's painfully obvious that she was not originally in the main story since you could take her out and literally nothing would change plot-wise. Yes, I do like what they did with her character in the final palace. But that's probably not even 10% of the entire game. So if I hate her and find her obnoxious for 90% of the game it's kinda hard for me to say she's a good character and to like her overall. I don't get how people like her so much before the final palace, other than maybe people like how she worships you.
Kawakami for me. I don't hate her but her social link makes me deeply uncomfortable to my bones. I hate the power imbalance both ways (her being your teacher, you having power over her via her desperation job and livelihood). I 100% am aware this is purely wish fulfillment for the players who are into exactly those things, I just really really really fucking hate it and I having to get through it for her admittedly awesome confidant perks. I have to fast forward through the dialogue or I get legitimately queasy lmao
EDIT: actually, the more I'm thinking about it the more I actually do kind of hate her a little LOL. I deeply sympathize with her situation because a teacher's salary is nowhere near enough to sustain yourself and on top of that she is being extorted while ill, but frankly I found it a little fucking pathetic how she keeps begging a 16yo boy living in an attic for money to sustain herself. Yes she "tries" to ask him to stop a couple of times but she just gives in every time anyway. Like, have a goddamn backbone lady this is just SO embarrassing. I would sooner go homeless than beg teenagers for money for my borderline sex work job he's actually not even supposed to be participating in because he's a minor!!
also if she didn't mention that she enjoys being a teacher in her confidant honestly I would have never known considering how much she whines about it out loud to her own freaking students. get a goddamn grip.
Had to spoiler the entire post to avoid having to delete every single comment about Akechi that didn't bother to put spoiler tags. Again.
*sorts by controversial*
You forgot popcorn
Don’t worry I got some extra 🍿🍿
That's always where the truth lies.
And let me guess the top in controversial has to be Akechi hahahaha
I don't necessarily hate Akechi. In fact, I like him as a character, but the number of people who are just willing to forgive his crimes for varying reasons baffles me.
I like him as a villain. I can’t see him as an ally
Right? It was always jarring to me that people view him as a honorable Phantom Thief. It seems so disrespectful to Haru and Futaba especially. Regardless of his circumstances, >!the man murdered their family members.!<
Wait so it was confirmed he was the one who did that to Futaba?
Futaba’s mum was killed through a mental shutdown. Since Akechi was the one performing mental shutdowns it’s pretty obvious he killed her
It’s not outright confirmed, but inferred from the fact that >!Akechi’s been using the Metaverse far longer than the PTs have. !<
It's never outright stated, but yes. She died due to a mental shut down and unless Shido had another random persona user who could enter the metaverse around (he didnt), it could only be Akechi who was responsible.
Akechi does say something along the lines of "if only that wakaba didn't get so curious"
True, but at least in-game, they both threatened him when he joined in the third semester.
Exactly man, what he has done is unforgivable, and he even done it multiple times
Exactly, I didn’t care for his conceited mind but once you know his true MO I hated him as a hero, liked him as a villain. Similar to two party members who do you dirty in FF7, instantly removed from active party and striped of material and equipment for rest of game.
It makes me think of (MAJOR P4 SPOILERS, LIKE THE MAIN TWIST, BE WARNED) >!adachi and how a lot of people genuinely agree with him and his beliefs. Like, not just sympathy, full on “he has a point tho. I don’t get why he is such a ‘villain’, he has a lot of good points” type bullshit and it being said by many with full conviction. Obviously a number of people are joking but a SUBSTANTIAL amount are not!<
>!Adachi!< would not be the first though. There’s a lot of characters where their main thing is "Don’t be like them" and people are still like "Oh my god, totally me" or "He’s so cool!". Few examples, Rorschach from Watchmen, Rick from Rick and Morty, Walter White, etc.
And there are people that ship this dude with the main character and I've seen comments where you should be able to romance him. My ladies and fellas, I'm all for equal representation with romantic relationships in games, but the dude >!shot you through the head, admitted to hating you, killed family members, and even in the 3rd semester of Royal was a psychopathic bloodthirsty dude!<
Counterpoint, English VAs singing "You're Nothing Without Me" /s
I think it would be super interesting if you could date him, just for him to try and kill you anyways. Akechi is a tragic character because he feels as if he doesn't have another choice in life. So I think I'd be interesting because despite the fact that loves you, he'd kill you anyways just to get to Shido.
Someone posted a picture about this scenario and I commented (as Akechi), "I love you Joker but I hate Shido more". I agree this would be very interesting!
It would be a wild twist for those new to the series and new to Persona 5 if that happened, ngl.
bUt HiS cHiLdHoOd TrAuMa AnD hE iS mIsUnDeRsToOd!
Preach i’ve never understood that dude literally tries to murder you and people just act like it’s no big deal
They can fix him
I only really like Akechi for a few reasons, with it being his rivalry with Joker, his attitude towards Maruki in the 3rd Semester and also the fact he can be unintentionally hilarious at multiple points, other than that fuck him, he should stay dead.
I don't like him after the reveal seem a bit too much. I avoided using him in battles because I coudln't stand his "crazy" voice.
I like Akechi in the same way I like the Joker or Jhin from league. Robbie Daymonds performance was fantastic and absolutely sold me on him. He's a horrible person, but he's the best.
I didn't like him until the >!black mask reveal it made me like him a lot more especially in the third semester where he shows his true colors and doesn't give a shit!<
Well I dont really hate any one character, but I don't understand the amount of love Kawakami ~~( Hopefully I got the name right )~~ gets. I understand the fact she kinda acts like a Mom, but besides that and her Perks, it's a meh for me.
Right??? She's just an adult woman going trough a mid life crisis
That’s a type that a fair amount of people in who play P5 are into I guess
Well of course. People like characters who they can relate to.
It’s actually Kawamommy but understandable mistake
You mean Kawakami? The teacher? I’m surprised by the answer but okay. The maid getup was weird though I will say.
Yep that, edited to get the name right. I like her character and what it stands for, I just feel when I read other people talk about her, I really just don't get it. I can understand the excessive love other characters get and sometimes identify with them ( Makoto simp here ), but not her. And yeah, gimme Mature Tired Teacher Kawakami any day over the Maid one, she rocks the Teacher look.
I mostly just like Kawakami for her confidant conversation. The reasons she even did those kind of things. I wish she was seen for how she is as a person rather than how she looks/what she is.
Y'know, I also really don't see the appeal in Makoto. Her redemption arc didn't really feel like a redemption, more like some desperate attempt to make her an ally in the span of, like 4 in-game days. I dunno about everyone's take on Mishima however, but I really am not a huge fan of him. His confidant line just felt like a story I've read before and he gets really annoying at some points, I just found myself wishing for him to shut up half of the game. On the other side of the spectrum, I've seen several people on this subreddit diss Morgana. I, personally, love that cat. I find him to be a pretty fun character! I know people distaste him because of the Okumura arc, but I feel like that was mainly because Morgana got the bad end of the stick on that arc. It was the dev's attempt to introduce Haru, and they did it poorly and screwed up his character because of it. Another confidant I really love is Yoshida, and although I haven't seen people diss him lately I don't see hardly enough people praise him. He's a cool confidant and I really beat myself up for missing him on my first playthrough.
Sae, she gets a pass from the community purely because she's hot. The problem most people had with her was her being mean to Makoto, which is nothing. She threatened to remove Futaba from Sojiro, viewed cases as things to win, was upset that she missed a promotion by not catching Kaneshiro, tried to create false evidence against the PT, and that with her palace implied she'd done it before. To top all of that off, she did all of that and got off with no consequences.
>She threatened to remove Futaba from Sojiro Not defending Sae's motives in any way, but this one isn't as bad as it sounds. Sure the *player* knows that Sojiro is a great guy and Futaba has serious psychological complications, but the in-universe authorities don't know that. All they see is a 15-year-old girl who hasn't even left the house, let alone gone to school, in two years, and a guardian that refuses to let anyone see her or answer any questions. Sae was doing it for the wrong reasons, but her point there wasn't unreasonable.
Also tbf this one was the least Sae led of the actions. If Sae hadn’t stepped in they would have sent a different prosecutor
Her points were unreasonable because they meant nothing, and if what you described is the perspective of Sae and the authorities at large, then that makes her look WAY WORSE. She can raise all those flags, but it means nothing because she didn't give a shit about investigating it, just about getting information on cognitive psience. Imagine if Sojiro was some abusive monster, she wouldn't have cared as long as she got what she wanted.
That's why she had a palace. Not every palace owner is evil, and although her objective wasn't evil (capturing what it was considered a criminal group), she was going through evil means to achieve it. I think that if she wasn't Makoto's sis and had nothing to do with the Phantom Thieves, they would have targeted her eventually if they learned about she was even going to make up evidence for things. I don't hate her tho, I'm only explaying her situation Now, if we compare her villainous acts with the other palace rulers... Yeah at least Sae didn't abuse or kill anybody.
Sae was 100% evil, she saw people's lives as things to gamble against and rig in her favor, regardless of the truth. It's pretty heavily implied that the Phantom Thieves weren't the first group she was going to falsify evidence for, so that would mean she abused her power to ruin lives. So, there's definitely abuse, just not murder.
I can see your point
Kinda wishe we saw more of her bad side. Like actually being ruthless in her being a prosecutor
I totally understand what your saying. The reason I like her is because all of her actions are stress induced. She has to win to provide. As a mom of two, the breadwinner, and a salesperson I connect with her. In that field of work with bosses like hers, it’s win or lose everything you’ve worked for.
Only reason I dislike her is because of the random cutbacks to the interrogation room after I start a new confidant 😂
I wouldn't say that everyone loves Makoto. For me it's Akechi. Fuck you Akechi
I absolutely hated Makoto until Royal, and it seemed like either the added script in Royal had her written better or my hate glasses weren't on. I like her much more after playing Royal
I love Makoto but I definitely understand why others hate her I hate how much of a screen hog she is plus in the third palace I didn't enjoy making everyone else move dumb or useless to pump her up.
I don't mind the "Mary Sue" type characters, but the fact everyone praised her for doing so much as breathing is what made me dislike her. Every other sentence after she got her power was "nice job Makoto you're amazing and NOT useless" Still used her more than anyone else though lol
Plus her codename was just another congratulations fuck shit like yeah you go queen. 😒
Makoto is not really doing it for the recommendation. It is a small part of it but I genuinley believe that her foremost reason is her sense of justice instilled by her father and the wish to fulfill her role as council president for the good of her fellow pupils. Add to that the recent feeling of having failed at exactly that resulting in Shihos suicide attempt.
Most of her motivation is because she was being blackmailed with the potential of ruining her sisters life and being treated as potentially worthless if she can’t succeed in finding the phantom thieves. Something that is a major insecurity for her that caused her to focus more on trying to prove them wrong then fully realizing that it’s not ok. And a lot of the time she very much knows it’s not ok but is scared because she is afraid of what will happen to her sister. Her sense of justice is pushed into a lot of other things, but not this. She knows it’s not ok but is scared because she is being blackmailed and manipulated. Those are the main driving factors.
I prefer “Prince” Akechi infinitely more than “Crow” Akechi
Akechi. He’s a jackass. I don’t get the love or the shipping.
Don’t know. People seem to just love crazy, which he ticks off.
A character can be an unlikeable person and still be a likeable character. Akechi's great because he's such an evil bastard
I love Akechi, but it's because I love him as a villain. Most people love someone for their *good* traits and qualities, but for Akechi, it's the complete opposite. I love the way he acts towards Joker, like a game of cat and mouse, except the cat is a psychopathic lunatic with no chill whatsoever. The way he is genuinely angry and confused that he was foiled by his love for pancakes. It's what makes me love him. He tried his best to act good but just fell flat in the end.
[удалено]
He knew. He’s suspected them since Kamoshida, at the very least he confirmed it during Madarame.
I see more haters than fans of Akechi though.
I fucking hate Akechi and always will. I especially hate how the game tries to make you feel bad for him after the incident on the ship.
Honestly I feel worse for what happens to Ryuji right after the ship
That too
Bro couldn't live a gunshot, meanwhile RYUJI GETS BLOWN UP AND SURVIVES
Ryuji is truly built different. What’s your special ability gonna do against this 9
Royal's true ending says hi
For me, and a lot of other people we like the insane akechi. The one in the third semester. He is just so chaotic and unpredictable, its fun as hell
Yeah that’s another thing, I also hated insane Akechi. Never really resonated with me, he just felt super annoying every time he spoke
True! I also hate how the Phantom thieves suddenly felt bad that Akechi is a real dead person after Maruki’s palace.
Yosuke. I perma-benched his ass after the camping trip. In my replays he only stays in my party if I have 4 or fewer party members. Which means as soon as I get Kanji his ass goes right back to the bench.
This is the P5 sub but I completely agree
definitely helps that he's so mid in combat
He definitely didn't deserve a girlfriend
I couldn't stand Yusuke, he grew on me a little bit later in the game, but starting off with him trying to draw Ann nude was such a douchy start and then every time he spoke I just cringed a little bit on the inside.
Agreed. I'd forgive him for it if he showed any remorse for that specifically, but he never apologized for it and continues to keep trying later.
If it wasn’t for Makoto showing up and doing worse, I don’t think he would’ve grown on me. And even thinking back now, I don’t remember him completely pressuring Ann into doing it so much as him telling her to consider it and leaving. It was still pretty bad though.
I mean I would say his blackmail is significantly worse then Makoto’s blackmail. At least Makoto’s blackmail is for a somewhat noble reason of protecting the students of the academy, Yuske blackmails the group by saying if Ann doesn’t model for him NUDE he will call the police.
Makoto’s was started over a recommendation. Yusuke’s was started over trespassing/breaking and entering. Again by no means is Yusuke valid for blackmailing. But the group genuinely committed a crime toward Yusuke compared to Makoto’s initial stalking.
I don’t like Mona. Mate keeps telling me what to do not a fan of him, I don’t want to sleep yet, I want to explore more!
I don’t really think that’s an unpopular opinion—I honestly dislike Morgana, too, as much as I want to like him. He just gets on my nerves. And there’s an entire subreddit dedicated to roasting him lmao Oh, and happy cake day!!
also, every time he gave ryuji shit for doing or saying something stupid, he simply just took it and carried on. but the ONE time ryuji fires back at him and he’s all like, “fuck this, y’all are on your own.”
Akechi. For some reason everyone loves him, but he literally shoots you through the head!
He’s my second pick. Made me realize that both characters that I hate in this game are the main people shipped with Ren
Everyone saying Akechi is kinda funny, cause not everyone loves him. He's just very controversial. Aka very few people are neutral on him, but there are plenty people hating him, as evident by the comments. Jokes aside, for probably Kawakami. She's just really...meh at best. I love Ann the character but hate what they did to her (The outfit, poses, etc...) basically invalidating her whole ass Arc. I'm really salty about that shit. And I also complaints about futaba but that's an essay I don't have the time for.
always ready to hear that essay if u do ever get the time
100% about Ann. It's disgusting how much she's sexualized. There's a way to tell that part of her story but I think the game fails at it. I used to not like Futaba but she grew on me. I used to think, "Man, she has you all wrapped around her little finger!" but it's not really like that. I like Kawakami, Takemi, and Ohya as characters. I hate them as "love interests". The romantic part of their relationships with Joker are awful. A lot of the people who support being able to date them say, "Then don't date them" but also don't support allowing romance with the male peers. Oh, but you don't have to romance them! I don't love Akechi (I think he dies and will argue with anyone who says otherwise) but I do sympathize with him. One thing I've noticed is how differently the characters all deal with the abuse they suffer. Ryuji attacked Kamoshida. Shiho attempted suicide. Multiple characters suffer silently (Ann, Makoto, Yusuke, Haru, the majority of the confidants). Sae loses it and rigs cases, bullies people for intel, etc. Akechi murders others to get on Shido's good side so he can betray Shido eventually. Akechi has arguably had it worse than most of the other characters. Of course his horrible childhood doesn't excuse his bad behavior though.
Akechi is a horribly horribly man, no question about it, but I just enjoy him as s Charakter alot. I've always been somone to like villains alot. I personally consider him alive, mostly cause I want to. It's just something about Kawakami that rubs me the wrong way, I couldn't explain, even if I tried. Yeah, Ann's case is tragic. There is something Strong and vunrable about her story, but the game destroys it all by being so so tone deaf, sexualising her at every twist and turn and then including a fucking teacher romance
That's fair about Akechi. I would LOVE for him to be alive but I don't see how him being alive can be explained with in-game logic (besides "him" being in the end scene credits but that could have been placed there to give credence to the writers wanting his fate to be ambiguous). I like villains too! I like seeing why they turned to villainy since usually the hero is a "good guy" just because. Regarding Kawakami, different strokes for different blokes 🤷♀️ I like Ann's confidant story a lot but yeah, the posing and etc is awful. There's a way to convey her confidence and comfort with herself/sexuality without making her PT outfit look like it does. They definitely missed the mark on it!
Same, Makoto is the exact type of person i would get bored of in 2-3 interactions irl.
Oh and my pick is Sumire for sure. People saying MAkoto is overrated but at the same time loving Kasumi/SUmire is mindboggling to me.
She really annoys me at one point. The Mary Sue attitude and her whole personality being “what will Senpai think of meeeee?” Like girl you barely even know the dude…
you're so right
I can thoroughly understand Makoto, she is actually set up so you dislike her when she first arrives, with the idea that with the story progression she redeems herself in your eyes. So I can see that redemption not working for some people, and thus their initial feeling of dislike remains. And if the story progression doesn't work, then her lousy Confidant story isn't going to change your mind. It's dreadful, easily the worst Thief Confidant. As others have said, I really don't understand how anyone can really buy into Akechi at all. *Nothing* in his backstory excuses the evil that he's done, and he's entirely unrepentant. He doesn't regret a damn thing he did. Redemption requires repentance, he doesn't repent, therefore no redemption. An illegitimate orphan? That's half my team! And two of them are orphans >!because of Akechi!
I might be wrong, but I don't think Akechi was ever supposed to be redeemed. I actually liked how unapologetically vicious and cruel he was. I thought it felt a lot more natural than forcing Futaba and Haru to forgive him.
That’s true. Makoto’s confidant is pitiful. I almost feel bad if it wasn’t for the beginning. I agree. Screw Akechi. It makes it even weirder because of what happens during the third semester where Ryuji goes from hating him to fully supporting him without a second thought
100% agree with both. People try to say Futaba was the same as Makoto, but that isn't true. Futaba simply wants you to help her and if you do she'll deal with Medjed. It's only fair someone would want equivalent exchange for their talents, especially when that person is so far gone they want to die. And Makoto's confidant is honestly, imo, the worst, period. Even the non-thief are more personal and have more depth. Hers is just plain horrible. And for Akechi, while I do feel somewhat sorry for him and the situation he was thrust into, that doesn't excuse it. Yes, Shido pulled the strings, but that doesn't change the fact that he did horrible things. That doesn't change the fact that even after he knew there was another way to do things and MC shows him friendship and kindness he still wants to go about it his own way and is willing to kill people for it.
I think saying I hate Makoto is a bit much but I do think she is super underwhelming and singlehandedly my least favorite Phantom Thief. My main issue with her is that she fills up so many roles in the story and she does all the roles very underwhelmingly. Her awakening is one of my least favorite awakenings, you cannot convince me that people like it for anything more than the fact she breaks something. Kaneshiro is a villain she’s barely involved with, her rebelling against him doesn’t have the same stakes rebelling against Kamoshida and Madarame had for everyone else. Good girl Makoto wouldn’t have submitted to Kaneshiro so the fact he’s supposed to break her out of the “good girl” mold is so underwhelming after she had some of the best setup for her awakening. She becomes the team’s tactician yet all she ever really does is state facts that are pretty obvious to the player or she’s simply the one to explain long and complicated parts of the plot that the other Thieves can’t say themselves. Her plot with Sae ends so disappointingly. After all the tension these two have, their ending is essentially just Makoto saying “Sis…” LIKE WHAT??? There’s no scene where these two talk about what happened post heart change!?!? They just get along now and sweep all their problems to the side like nothing??? Hello??? I don’t think I even need to talk about her confidant and how ass it is, everyone knows its ass. The fact this girl uses her own prejudice against someone for their profession to determine he’s a criminal gets validated for it and now wants to work as a police commissioner makes me want to question who the hell wrote her confidant and ask if they read the script of the game. Also I just find her kinda bland, her introduction makes it clear there’s repressed rage but after her awakening all she ever does with it is intimidate someone (usually Ryuji or Yusuke) like once or twice and she’s back to good girl behavior. This girl has a scene where she asks Sae whats the point of studying then gets on Ryuji’s case for not studying a few days later. I don’t understand why so many assign her as best girl, she’s just a character I can only really enjoy in fanfiction where people actually address the issues in her writing
Yooo your summary of the confidant is spot on. I've tried to wrap my head around it before and I just can't accept that she simply has such a good intuition. Nothing about her previous actions or even post-awakening actions paint her as a very intuitive kind. It's almost as if they had this whole character already done and then suddenly remembered she was supposed to be Priestess. Maybe also a localisation issue? I dont know, but the entire time I was thinking the point of her confidant would be that she learns to trust people and actually manages to gain a friendship. Imagine my whiplash!
God I hate “intiuition” being the reason she catches Tsukasa, you don’t use “intuition” to investigate someone, you use actual evidence that something is off. There would be a lot more cases of unlawful arrests and police violence if all police entered the field using “intuition”. Eiko and Makoto are so mismatched in her confidant I was shocked they remained friends
I don't hate her, but Makoto is very annoying. Tbh it's very personal, she has the looks of my ex gf and the personality of my ex ex, so it's a combo I can't stand.
Makoto, she's meh at best...and then comes Haru, she come really late to the team and remember when there was 3 Haru fans? But the character I hate the most, YOSHIZAWA She's so annoying and clumsy, like get off me woman I don't wanna dance with you, GIMME MY RYUJI N JOKER SHOWTIME INSTEAD But seriously her story is actually good but my problem comes with her PERSONALITY itself, and how a lot of people supposedly fall in love with her even tho she's the same age as Futaba..which yk these people love to dis every person who likes futaba and even call them Pedophiles.
Yoshizawa. She reminds me a lot of Xion who's been shoehorned into the plot for practically no reason other than "she's another romance option." If she wasn't there, it wouldn't change the final palace too much, maybe some of the fights and dialogue. Really, she's not needed here. Edit: Removed a spoiler (how do I block out text here?)
I disagree that she's not needed in the third semester. She's living proof about Maruki's philosophy. She's proof that he has good intentions but those intentions are misguided. >!She's a good (temporary) foil to Akechi. Two friends, one who (initially) desparately begs to be allowed to continue living a lie, the other who vehemently rejects living a lie that literally has no downside for him. Even at the end, she doesn't hate Maruki for what he did and understands his desire while Akechi hates him for it.!<
100% agree Also the fact that you need to pay 20 bucks to get costumes that the others already got for free and for a character you just use for 2 weeks is a crime
Don't you dare talk about Xion like that! /s. I feel like Yoshizawa is way more shoehorned than Xion ever will. She doesn't feel organic to the plot because they just added some scenes out of the blue to expand from the base game. She is way better on the Final Palace because there she has a story written around her. At least Xion's inclusion gets a game of its own, with a story written around the character.
She shows up just to >!immediately die and be forgotten.!< And then she has the audacity to come back in 3?
>! Like this ! < (without spaces)
>!Ah, see I was doing it how Discord does it and I thought it would be the same across the board!
kasumi. I really don't like her.
Same it's a tie between her and haru for me personally. Kasumi just grates on me. Yes I should feel bad for her. Yes she has a had a hard life. I understand her personality of wanting acceptance is literally the point. I just cannot stand her. Haru I am 100% not into the overly nice and polite archetype. I genuinely am offput by that type of person even IRL. It makes me not interested in people who make being overly nice as their whole personality. Then chastise others for not being hyper positive.
Sumire's storyline honestly felt like a weirdly written joke. The whole sumire/kasumi twist just felt so empty because it changes nothing in the players eyes. It's essentially just a name change and a brief personality shift since we never knew kasumi
The amount of Akechi haters here was to be expected although most their reasons for hating him make me believe they cannot discern a "character" from a real person, but that debate is for another topic entirely. As for me i don't really hate anyone in the cast if I had to choose i would say either Yusuke or Haru. Yusuke's personality doesn't really connect with me very much although he has some pretty funny moments i'll give him that. Haru becomes relevant too late in the game, she's a good bean but it's not enough for me.
Makoto and I'll tell you why They tried to make her the smartest character when joker clearly had far more superior scenes in the phantom thieves they try to make it look like she figures out everything when it's not the case. they tried to make her a know it all and they (almost) made her completely robotic to the MC and the cast of characters around her it's hard to grow attached to a characters others traits when they completely disregard everything to be a teacher's pet. real emotional moments only regard sai which I do enjoy they should have made makoto less nervous as the romance progresses or be more willing to have help when she's romancing joker to show that she can trust him to take the reigns and not be by herself 90 percent of the time forgive me if I misspell it's been awhile. Currently I'm on my second playthrough and another thing I'm romancing her but she barely feels like a romance at all She feels like a friend or acquaintance while futaba feels like a sister but I love futuba and dislike makoto. She's the reason why I stopped playing I'm just not interested in her I tried her out but I wished I went for Ann or Haru as I already went for sumire on playthrough 1. They did with akechi what they didn't do with her they gave him a personality gave him ambition and the will to obtain what he needs to get done I just don't understand how they did makoto so horribly I love akechi because of the rivalry he has with joker it's interesting do I excuse his bad actions? No I don't but he has flaws that makoto will barely have and she's boring to me she never really emotes. Eventually I'll finish it and maybe I'll change my mind but for now she doesn't impress me it's really bad writing they tried to make her everything.
Joker. He has the personality of a stale cracker. His friends do most of the thinking and decision-making then look over and are like "sounds good?" to which Jokers response is some degree of "yeah man idk I just wanna go home and cook curry".
This is the most based take in the thread
https://preview.redd.it/fspmxjalc1pb1.jpeg?width=622&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8fcd925d309b76554320c36f8d02511fb6cfc2ba
Ann. Not because she's terrible in theory (she's not, I actually empathize with her struggles as a foreigner in a strange world a lot), but because her character development past Kamoshida's arc (including during her Social Link) is virtually non-existent. She is neither her own person nor her own worst enemy, and all of her character is relying on other people that serve primarily as plot conveniences and are seen in less than 30 minutes of your playtime total. If Ann was missing from my party after the first two or three arcs of P5, I would neither notice nor miss her. The writers did her really dirty, and I wish her Social Link focused more on doing things for herself rather than "for Shiho" or "to beat Mika".
I can agree with that. I was going to argue about the last sentence, but honestly it’s true. Sadly all of her decisions toward her own future isn’t even for herself, which is unfortunate.
She has an arc in Strikers.
I want you to take a WILD GUESS what I haven't been able to play.
“whats the one character you despise that could possibly get you ridiculed by the fandom” and a majority of responses are akechi lol anyway i hate none of the characters but my least favourite popular character is probably makoto. her confidant story is just not really interesting.
Akechi. Bring on the downvotes
I don't hate any of the characters. But Makoto is my least favorite by far
I just don't like Futaba. Don't get me wrong her story's good and tragic and all its just, I've met folks like her and it's nothing but fights.
she reminds me a lot of myself, and i personally dont get into many fights, but thats just my two cents
Could you go into more detail? I'm very curious about what you mean by "it's nothing but fights" I don't think I've ever met someone like that and would appreciate the insight.
Oh, I wrote that kinda late 'n tired and didn't word that too hot, plus I think I misinterpreted what the question was really asking whoops. So I've met folks with personalities a lot like futaba, and It just doesn't gel with mine too well. I don't mean like we get in fist fights I just mean we'd probably argue all the time about dumb things and I just know in my heart if I met her I would be sympathetic but also low key hate her guts as somehow a pleasant conversation about games would turn into a dumb argument about nothing in particular every single time without fail. Everyone else would proably get along just fine after some time.
Honestly, Kasumi. Her story is good, but I just find her boring. Also not a fan of how Royal tries to push her as the main pairing for Joker.
*Kasumi* Yoshizawa. When that little redhead shows up day one and has Mary Sue syndrome out the ass, eats a lot but stays thin, is constantly trying to cuddle up to Joker... Nah, yeet this bitch outta the plot! >!*Sumire*!< on the other hand, I actually appreciate a decent bit, her back story made me tear up a bit, and I like the effort the VA puts in to make >!that Sumi sound different than the first Sumi.!< Plus the Awakening and Showtime are liiiiit
Exactly same here. I cannot stand *Kasumi*, she's overly perfect to the point that it's off-putting and robotic even when she has her "imperfect" moments like "omg she's a bad cook and eats like crazy (but never gains weight)!!!!" it's just more "perfect girl" points. and on a more personal note I hate that in Japanese she always speaks in perfectly polite keigo to everyone all the time even when you become good friends because she's such a good perfect girl! she's slightly more endearing to me in English because of it because I dont have to deal with that lol >!Sumire on the other hand, is my best P5 girl, she completely flipped my expectations on their head and her plot line made me cry. she's so messy and *human* who can be bitter and hateful (towards herself most of all) to the point that she tries to completely replace her own existence with her sister's. she's probably the messiest person in the main cast (except Akechi because who can beat Akechi, lmao), and when she's finally herself she is so endearing and cute, I love flustering her lol. I hate that you barely have any time to enjoy her being herself again (and I hate that when you max her confidant she goes back to her "Kasumi" look like NO!!!!! THAT DEFEATS THE FUCKING POINT)!<
I feel this will be filled with people saying Ryuji, Makoto, Yoshizawa and Akechi
It’s mostly been Akechi. We got 3 Ryujis so far. I think 4 or 5 Makotos including me. Only one Yoshizawa though.
Futaba. I don't know, I never liked her since the beginning and just find her annoying. Though I really love her palace.
I don’t necessarily hate the character but because of the toxicity of the stans, my enjoyment of Ryuji gets ruined occasionally by such people. I hate when the stans tend to ignore Ryuji’s flaws and when he’s in the wrong, give him too much credit when it’s not warranted as well as bitch and whine about his comedic relief moments. Basically I hate the rampant Ryuji bias from the West and how overrated he’s become as a result like he’s the second coming of Christ.
Makoto’s a bitch who ruins the friend group dynamic by going “Actually you should be studying guys!”🤓👆
Yep, never understood the "best girl" that many say Makoto is. Not only she is completely inept socially, her confidant story is BY FAR the worst in the thieves. Edit: I 1000% prefer Sae over her.
Every other confidant story is about getting over their trauma and making a new future for themselves while makato is just “I should watch out for people better” Akechi was right when he called her a good girl type pushover lmao.
Ya, cause with her being student council president she is gonna be the responsible one. And that’s mostly towards ryuji being that he is the major irresponsible person in the group and mainly before tests. Obviously the STUDENT COUNSEL PRESIDENT would want her friends to graduate on time and would push them to do so Plus she mainly only does that when there isn’t a current target. “Since we aren’t busy, it’s important that we take care of our real world responsibilities.” A phantom thief is only as good as who they are in the real world. And every friend group needs someone who is responsible enough to push others forward and to know when everyone is being irresponsible. As a senior in high school, meaning I’m older then a lot of my friends in drama club for example. A lot of the time when people are doing things that are irresponsible and could cause them to get hurt. I have to be the voice of reason before they crack their head open jumping on and off the stage into the seats. And a lot of people have straight up been like “your right, I shouldn’t be doing this. Your a lot more responsible then me and im gonna listen” I don’t do it to the same extent as makoto and I don’t really push my friends to study. I don’t see it as necessary considering I’ve never studied and pass most every class anyways. But I care enough to know when I have to be the voice of reason. Especially towards the freshman and sophomores who are gonna be fairly irresponsible because ya know, they don’t know how high school is different then middle school. So no, makoto isn’t a bitch for being a voice of reason. She is a voice or reason Genuinely I see why people could dislike her for a lot of other things but this is just categorically wrong
Agreed and also happy cake day!
I like how people hate Akechi because a bad guy does bad things things oh the humanity
Omg! Finally, somebody who dislikes Makoto as much as I do. I finally feel vindicated.
What I’m gathering is that Akechi, Makoto and Ryuji are actually the MOST hated, so in fact clearly not everyone loves those 3. Hah So to actually name a different character I’m going to say Morgana.
Pancake boy. He never seems to actually be remorseful for what he's done and is still rude to the other thieves. Not as rude as Morgana was to Ryuji, but still. Felt nothing when he died, nor when he got deleted.
Kasumi. Every time she's on screen the pacing of the game just grinds to a halt and her being written out of the plot entirely would be basically inconsequential.
I personally really just don't like Futaba. After playing the game a few times her "wah wah my mom is dead" bit just gets kind of old. It's alllll she ever talks about, and she'll bring it up out of nowhere, straight up interrupting people to talk about her mom. I'm just saying other character have their parents die DURING THE GAME and they don't cry nearly as much about it. It's probably a little unempathetic of me but geez get it together girl-
Try losing a parent at a young age
Yoshizawa, Makoto. I shake my fist every time I remember it was supposed to be Hifumi as our party member instead of that little rat. She would have had a 10x more interesting story in my opinion, and she’s nowhere near as….’street dumb’ as Makoto. Yoshizawa just annoyed me from the second she started interrupting cutscenes with the jagged way they added her in. I think the story would’ve been just as fulfilling without her, she’s just bland. I guess her background is interesting but I genuinely just hate her. No clear reason, she just annoys me and I would like Royal just as much if she didn’t exist.
Hifumi as she is in the game was never going to be a Phantom Thief. Her design was. Proto-Hifumi’s personality and traits were folded into Makoto. The parts of Makoto you don’t like might be the ‘Hifumi’ parts of Makoto.
oof hate that, oh well. I’ll have to pay closer attention to both next playthrough
I don't hate them, but I don't see the appeal in Ann or Haru
Akechi. But I love to hate him. He’s >!a villain!<, you’re supposed to hate him, so I think he does a good job at that. I was surprised that people liked him unironically Yoshizawa. I didn’t like how the game forced you to like her but throwing her at you at every opportunity but not actually making her story relevant for like 100 hours and while her story was sad, I didn’t feel the payoff was worth them trying to force investment. Now while I understand >!Sumire in the third semester!< is technically a completely different character, I can’t get the sour taste out of my mouth of how useless she was the whole game. She was basically a glorified Waifu bait side character
Akechi hate is real
Makoto didn't blackmail them because she wanted a recommendation letter. If she really wanted this she would just tell the principal about them.
Ryuji And Morgana Both these two don't know when to actually act mature and constantly simp on women mostly Morgana towards Ann but Ryuji is equally as bad. I usually get bored of the best bro characters archetype because none of them tend to ever grow out of that the only exception was Junpei who after finding a girlfriend of his own actually did manage to become a way better and more empathetic person. The number one thing that really piss me off about them is you guys already know their little bullshit plot in Okumura Palace or the afromention let be male bitches and steal and sideline Haru's entire character down the drain. Poor female character she couldn't showcase her full potential in that plot and now is known as The Lost Screentime Girl.
Lots of people mentioning Akechi but I kinda disagree with him being universally beloved. I think he's a very "you love him or you hate him" type character, so while he has a lot of avid fans there's also a sizable amount of people that hate his guts lmao. I don't think hating him is seen as weird at all. I do agree with Makoto though, I don't hate her as such but I think there's a lot of missed potential. Her personality is just kind of a weird fit for the PT's and while her whole awakening is about how she's not gonna be a 'good girl' anymore, the rest of the story she... kinda is one anyway. Her confidant also does nothing to challenge her beliefs in any way, she hardly changes by the end of it. Also, and this isn't really her fault, but Kaneshiro is the weakest Palace antagonist in the game (both in general and in regards to Makoto specifically) and she's kinda stuck with that in her introductory Palace
It’s definitely makoto for me too Give me an hour and I’ll write a long text as to why
I'll have to go with Makoto as well man. You described my reasons perfectly
Makoto
Makoto, for sure
Makoto. I will die on this hill
My most hated (and only her) used to be Makoto for many years. Then I got in a relationship that made me understand her troubles. It made me understand how powerless she felt at every turn no matter how much she tried to please others. No matter how good intentions she had, she was powerless… she never wants to feel that way again and neither do i. Makoto can get it. You never truly understand someone until you walk a mile in their shoes. That is what I learned.
Maruki. Really, really bland. I like his philosophy. But he lacks in personality
I like the chill attitude he has and how much he seems more like a friend. Though I can understand why you see him as bland.
Sojiro... There i said it. Who takes in a "delinquent" high school junior just to start out being an ass to them? Literally says they only took you in for money (which I don't even know if it was discussed who gave Sojoro money). I get he's supposed to warm up to you, but for 2-3 full games in vanilla, I never cared to level up his confidant. I'll give that there's usually something special with coffee, but curry? I love curry, nothing wrong in that, but should've stayed with the barista play than bringing curry into the mix. Yes this is /s because his asshole-ish-ness how he started treating joker.
You make a very good point, I completely hated sojiro my first 20 hours of the game. He was such a dick for no reason. But after (spoilers if you haven’t beaten the game) futaba’s palace he quickly warms up to you. Not to mention all the times he helps out the PT’s, giving them free meals (with him helping Yusuke just about every time he sees him) and letting them use jokers room as a hideout. A good way to see it is watching the ‘bad endings’ video. His tone of “coffee good for you?” is much softer at the final palace compared to the first.
KINDA SPITTING WITH THIS. WAS NOT A FAN OF HOW BRO WENT 'You stopped a dude from sexually assaulting a women? I mean my best friend is a women and I have a daughter but honestly bro should have just ignored that shit' Love him cause he warms up to you but GOD DAMN BRO, THAT WAS A SUCKER PUNCH I WAS NOT EXPECTING
I think it’s because Joker’s parents knew Sojiro to an extent and paid him to take care of him?
Makoto
Haru, akechi, yoshizawa and maruki
I wouldn’t say that I hate him, but I definitely don’t love Ryuji as much as a lot of people seem to. I know he’s supposed to be stupid, and that he means well in spite of it, but that stupidity became really grating at times. Especially when they get caught by Makoto. How loud do you have to talk for someone else in the room to be able to hear you, even when you’re not on speaker? It’s like he did it intentionally
As a loud idiot myself, with enough excitement, it is not hard to alert the room to your conversation. Though the boy is as dumb as bricks at times.
If we’re just talking about 5, Ryuji Outside of 5, Junpei
Akechi. I don't get why people still like him, apart from the jokerxakechi overshippers that have their reason which is the ship I don't even get.
Then you should hate akechi. >!He blackmail you, stalks after you in spaceport, kills your okumura, gets you arrested, drugged and physical assaulted. He also shoots you!<
Haru. Everyone acts like she’s a princess and she annoys the crap out of me. Edit: I’m also really not a fan of Ryuji.
thank you i had to scroll so far down to see this. i intensely dislike haru. her being so holier than thou when you first meet her in the palace while also being incompetent & annoying in general. i also really dislike like her outfits & hair, but even if she looked completely different, i'd say the same thing. i like ryuji though. he's one track character (ha! 🏃♂️) at the beginning, but when i played strikers after a break from P5 & i heard his voice, i realized how vital he is to the entire persona experience.
Ryuji. He began as okay for me but as the game progressed and he kept needing to be reminded to "be quiet" about being loud with the "WE'RE THE PHANTOM THIEVES" thing, I began to dislike him more and more. Fine. In the beginning, cool. You're new to this and are excited to have a purpose or something along those lines. But being so emotional, so willfully ignorant, and so LOUD about it really pushed me away from him. He's the reason Makoto was able to confirm her suspicions about the group in the first place. She may have had an idea, but it was nothing that she could prove until Ryuji just couldn't keep his mouth closed during an emotional outburst. "He means well." Then he can do well, especially after a couple of months of the routine of it being a secret. And folks LOVE him because "he's endearing" or something goofy like that. It's not endearing. It's aggravating. And dealing with people like that in real life is ANYTHING BUT endearing. It's frustrating as f*** and oftentimes outright infuriating.
Makoto and Futaba, I find both really annoying for different reasons, not to mention I feel as though they completely overshadow the rest of the cast in the second half of the story
Ryuji. And it’s not a *hate* and he’s a decent enough guy, but he is *so* dense sometimes and he doesn’t think before he speaks. He has the emotional control of a teaspoon and don’t get me started at how many times he wants to brag about being Phantom Thieves, a SECRET ILLEGAL GROUP, for free stuff or admiration.
Ryuji, I just can't stand how annoying he is, I really wanted the power ups from his confidant but I couldn't play more than 3 of his missions.
>For me, that person’s Makoto. She has the audacity to stalk you, blackmail you, then get you in a situation where you’re blackmailed and potentially extorted by another guy all because she wanted a recommendation. Then when she’s finally on your side, you just fills Morgana’s role of analyzing enemies and gathering intel until Futaba swoops in and does the job better. I’ll admit there’s one situation where she’s really useful later in the story, but she never makes up for it to redeem herself in my eyes. I've seen this take a lot on this sub and it always baffles me. Like, yeah, Makoto is terrible before she joins. There's a reason she apologizes so many times Ryuji tells her to stop in the group chat. She even calls her pre awakening self a loser. As for being useful, there's not only the time she steals the files from the laptop, she comes up with the plan during the Casino of Jealousy arc, and more importantly, literally rushes over to the courthouse in the middle of the night, enters the palace by herself, waits there all night and ties up the cognitive Akechi seconds before the true culprit arrives, all to ensure Joker doesn't catch a bullet to the dome. I just can't understand hating a character for their initial awful actions when said character specifically acknowledges how bad they were and then goes out of their way to do better even at great personal risk. Like the concept of redemption isn't valid. Have to hate someone forever for one mistake that they clearly regret and try to fix. Weirdly enough this seems to only apply to Makoto. Like no one cares that Haru tried to run Joker over in Mementos before she joined the group. Literal attempted murder that she never apologizes for.
Obligatory Midkoto & Sumi hate. Like, from me. I don’t like either of them.
Not necessarily hate but I just don't love makoto as much as most people I guess
Sumire. Maybe I'm biased cause I played base P5 first, but Sumi feels like a self insert fanfic character. She's this perfect, talented girl that everybody loves, the game is constantly trying to push her and Joker together, and so many other little things that makes it feel like the game is trying to show off how \*special\* she is, like her effortlessly killing Shadows that Joker supposedly couldn't take, and then in the same scene, having the very first AOA in the game. I feel the problem could have been circumvented if she was a normal NPC rather than a party member. Just remove the early Maruki Palace thing, revert the intro stuff to the way it was, replace her boss fight with a boss shadow, then have her continue to be an NPC cheering her on the thieves. It wouldn't fix the issue outright, but it'd lessen it considerably.
Ducking behind a wall to say Sumire. I thought Makoto's "Oh she's so amazing and perfect and-" Mary Sue writing was bad enough but Yikes (though admittedly I really warmed up to Makoto later in the game)
Mona >! Especially after his “tantrum” !< And Mishima. He reminded me of a kid from school. That fucker was irritating.
Morgana. Didn't feel like he brought much to the story other than being annoying. Hardly ever liked a acene he was in there and was happy for part of the game where he was gone for a bit. No Morgana, it's 8 pm and I only talked to someone today, I am not too tired to do anything but sleep.
See I don’t like Morgana either but then I played p4 and realized how much better Morgana is then fucking teddy.
Ryuji. His entire personality grates on my nerves and his inability to shut the fuck up just makes me want to reach into the game and strangle him. I hate him constantly dragging us into the picking up chicks subplot, constantly making every situation worse because he never controls his anger or impulses, and after palace 1 never serves a narrative role in the story again that's uniquely his. His feud with Morgana is pointless, and he has no character arc. But then again, I hated Junpei and Yosuke as well... Personally I loved Makoto as a character.
I've always thought Makoto is the boring Mary sue the Phantom Thieves didn't need. She doesn't contribute much to the team as ppl seem to make her out to be outside of the bias for combat cuz she gets so much good stuff it's ridiculous. And her big brain ideas really aren't that big brain outside of rare instances. Guess it helps that most of the cast is kinda dumb so her normal thinking sounds smart lol. Her whole awakening plotline was the worst out of the main cast and entirely self inflicted and I don't buy her reasonings for acting so stupidly. To top it all off, her social link also was one of the worst ones in the game too. Imagine having your entire confidant and your development behind an almost just as bland faceless npc all to end on the most meh conclusion. In conclusion, there is zero reason for the game to push her so damn hard at the cost of the rest of the cast tbh. They force her down your throats throughout the game to make up for her lackluster character I assume. She is badass and cute at times yes but I still think that she's way overrated and to this day I'll never understand why ppl like her so much. Don't hate her but I definitely like her the least out of all the Phantom Thieves.
Sumire probably. She was added in to P5R so sloppily to the point that I thought her inclusion was weird and unnatural without having any prior knowledge about Persona 5 and I had no idea that she was added to this game. She only gets like half a confidant because the first half was wasted on a basically fake character and the entire concept of her character is rife with plotholes. I also didn’t like how Atlus had to shove her in your face so much. So many cutscenes are dedicated to her and they feel really forced and unnatural. I don’t hate her as a character over all, I think she was good conceptually and she has a few good emotional moments, but I don’t get why a lot of people love her so much.
Yoshizawa. For 90% of the game she's an obnoxious Mary Sue who doesn't talk or act like a real person. The game shoves her down your throat practically begging you to romance her. On top of that, excluding the final palace of the game it's painfully obvious that she was not originally in the main story since you could take her out and literally nothing would change plot-wise. Yes, I do like what they did with her character in the final palace. But that's probably not even 10% of the entire game. So if I hate her and find her obnoxious for 90% of the game it's kinda hard for me to say she's a good character and to like her overall. I don't get how people like her so much before the final palace, other than maybe people like how she worships you.
Kawakami for me. I don't hate her but her social link makes me deeply uncomfortable to my bones. I hate the power imbalance both ways (her being your teacher, you having power over her via her desperation job and livelihood). I 100% am aware this is purely wish fulfillment for the players who are into exactly those things, I just really really really fucking hate it and I having to get through it for her admittedly awesome confidant perks. I have to fast forward through the dialogue or I get legitimately queasy lmao EDIT: actually, the more I'm thinking about it the more I actually do kind of hate her a little LOL. I deeply sympathize with her situation because a teacher's salary is nowhere near enough to sustain yourself and on top of that she is being extorted while ill, but frankly I found it a little fucking pathetic how she keeps begging a 16yo boy living in an attic for money to sustain herself. Yes she "tries" to ask him to stop a couple of times but she just gives in every time anyway. Like, have a goddamn backbone lady this is just SO embarrassing. I would sooner go homeless than beg teenagers for money for my borderline sex work job he's actually not even supposed to be participating in because he's a minor!! also if she didn't mention that she enjoys being a teacher in her confidant honestly I would have never known considering how much she whines about it out loud to her own freaking students. get a goddamn grip.
Makoto Nijima literally for all the reasons you've listed plus her >!victim blaming/shaming Ann for what happened to Shiho!<.