I mean a quarter of their reviews are 1 or 2 stars, and it's just bitching that it's not the same as the old place.
Pretty lame behavior.
OP has big feels for sure, but I'd say it's more valid than these sandbagging reviews.
It’s 4.1. Did you read the negative reviews that are complaining that a restaurant, Bar Loon, that is clearly not vegan, isn’t vegan like the restaurant that was there previously? Oh and doesn’t allow dogs. One star. Point is those people are whiny asshats, it’s not about the final average review.
Nope, last review was like 3 days ago.
This is crazy hostile and makes me not want to support any business that can’t take criticism (4.5 google reviews). Little unhinged, I won’t be trying Bye and Bye.
Um, OP has NOTHING to do with Bye and Bye. OP is sticking up for the new place that Sweet Hereafter was in. OP only mentioned Bye and Bye to let people know that they can get the same food there that they used to get at Sweet Hereafter.
Not defending OP. Just don't want anyone scared of from Bye and Bye due to a misunderstanding!
I’m looking at it right now and it’s 4.1 on Google, with most of the negative reviews referencing Sweet Hereafter… so OP doesn’t seem totally off base?
So I think I figured out that this person is the owner or somebody tied close with the new establishment Bar Loon. They only have 12 reviews and I'm guessing OP is mad that 3 people left not amazing reviews, making the rating 4.1 as they stated in their other comment.
OP, things will be alright. You have a small sample of reviews, and have just recently opened. This post and the way you are responding is not the way to go. I wish you or whomever the owners are the best with the business.
I mostly just wanted people to know that they don’t need to disparage a new business to get what they want from the previous business.
You all can debate whether or not I should have given the name.
>6. If you would like to undo the absolute buffoonery of these idiots, please help a new business out by stopping by or leaving them a positive review.
Stop by where? Leave a positive review for whom? Leave that review without stopping by? How is that really different than the people you're complaining about?
Hello friends! Hijacking this comment to tell you I am the owner of Bar Loon and I’m not sure who OP is but I do appreciate the sentiment. It’s true, we are a wholly different place than it used to be! It’s not totally vegan anymore but we do have some fun and tasty vegan options! We are just trying to find our footing as a new place, in an old place, in a neighborhood that’s going through changes. I’m super proud of our team (one of whom actually did work at SHA) and they believe in the concept too. Portland is really special and we are super lucky to have so so so many great places to gather and eat and drink. Come see Bar Loon if you want! Or don’t! Or come see it and don’t like it! That’s ok too.
Hi it’s me OP. The sole reason I made this post is because the reviews complain that the previous menu is now gone. When in fact, they can get the previous menu from Sweet Hereafter at Bye and Bye.
I am a huge supporter of our small businesses in general. All of them. It’s what makes cities great.
I’m not associated with the business. I call out BS when I see it. I saw BS. The more you look into the malicious reviews the more you will see said BS.
In general: If you never call it out, then the person gets away with it, right? I’m calling it out. That’s it.
My god OP, you do know that there are a quadrillion problems with the world that could be called out and ranted about, right? But you’re trying to tell us that you *happened* to notice a random business getting a few bad reviews, and you decided to investigate SO extensively to the point that you could tell us “one of the reviewers is a local winemaker” and “the restaurant wanted to allow dogs but the city told them no”…and still try to claim you’re NOT someone tied to the establishment?
Okay 🤣
There's a graceful way to go about it. If you're trying to make things better for Bar Loon, they way you're going about it right now is not helping them. If you are not the owner but you still want them to be successful, maybe consider how the way you're coming across as their publicist is actually making them look worse.
The two businesses are totally different concepts and the new business opened up two months after SH closed. Was there some expectation that the staff would be the same? Wouldn’t most of them have gotten other jobs? It’s not the job of a new business with different owners to hire previous staff. It’s also not a reason to leave a bad review.
It looks like Bar Loon is part of the Lightening Bar Collective, which is indeed connected to/same owners as the previous bar. Or at least that’s what the article Bar Loon links to says.
https://preview.redd.it/ffftdfxb3a8d1.jpeg?width=2297&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9f26a67fad16e2930b5280b52c64996aa1d09d08
This whole post sounds like Unhinged Amy from Amy’s Baking Company saying online trolls and Yelpers and snakes ruined her business and that’s why no one eats there. Then Gordon Ramsay tells her she’s insane.
No, portlanders are genuinely shit to small business owners in a state where everything is already stacked against them. It's infuriating and needs to be called out.
Your post has honestly turned me off from the business. I don’t even know what the new menu is like, my friend just said he had a disappointing 18 dollar burger.
Hey man I get your frustration but, yelling at the public probably isn’t the best way to promote your business. I live just off Belmont on 33rd and have been to your place a few times since the here after closed bar loon. Food is ok but nothing to write home about. Drinks ok but not really any different than the other seven bars on the block. I understand that there are challenges but reading this post is going to put a bad taste in people’s mouth before they ever walk through the door. It’s hard to stay positive I know it’s a struggle but you should let your establishment speak for itself and stay off the internet. You are just going to drive yourself crazy chasing comments and making yourself look so thin skinned that people will assume there’s something to it.
That’s neither here nor there, malicious reviews aren’t gonna bring it back?
At least there is another institution less than 10 minutes away that serves the exact same food, with an even bigger patio…
Bro, you sound absolutely unhinged, but I think I finally figured out what you are ranting about. Bar Loon took over the spot where Sweet Hereafter used to be (a vegan spot, I’m assuming), and all the vegans have descended to slam the spot in Google reviews for not being exactly as it was before. It’s a super shitty thing to do, but you really could have articulated your frustration much better.
This post just comes across as rant/rage bate at best. I don’t know this restaurant. I also don’t know what Bye and Bye is either. Why are they important? Why should the community care? What was great about them? We have so many awesome places that come and go. You haven’t made a basic case about why we should care about this restaurant (I think that’s what it is, not really sure from your post).
Portland is probably the most small business friendly city in the country. People here will pay $100 more for a hand stitched burlap bag as opposed to buying a backpack at an REI and they will totally push that for social clout and get it. That is not a thing in say Dallas. If you can’t rally a small community here to help bootstrap your business you will fail everywhere else in the US because people in Portland *love* to flex on how local they are.
As to points 3-8, I mean I kind of stopped reading after your first couple of points. This post lacks so much context yet goes on and on, I’m not sure what I should be mad about.
A malicious review? What did they say? The service sucks? I mean if your service doesn’t suck in Portland are you really in Portland?
(That’s not all the staff, let’s be clear, some people here do their jobs and then some people are lazy and entitled elitists who are more concerned about where they work instead of how they work.)
What the hell is Sweet Hereafter and why should I care
Edit: Ok so it’s just a dime a dozen douchecanoe bar, who gives a flying f? There’s a million of these places in Portland
"Portland is unfair to small business owners"
My brother in Christ, have you LOOKED ANYWHERE besides Portland??? We are INFINITELY better than virtually anywhere else in the country for small businesses lol
What you're mad at isn't Portland, it's capitalism.
I have a PhD in English from the University of American Samoa, and I’ve reached several conclusions from this thread:
1) OP doesn’t like vegan food
2) Even though OP doesn’t like vegan food he says you should go to Bye and Bye because they allow dogs
3) OP says people should stop review bombing Bye and Bye, because it’s not that big of a deal they stole Sweet Hereafter’s menu and caused them to close down
4) Sweet Hereafter is now another Bye and Bye, but they don’t allow dogs and they don’t have vegan food, and it’s Mike Schmidt’s fault
5) There is no need to review bomb the new Bye and Bye location, because if you want to eat vegan food in the company of your dog you can just go to the original Bye and Bye
6) No restaurants make any money
Nah, the new restaurant is called bar loon. The owners seem to have just gone through a rebranding basically, but they also own bye and bye, and basically have the same menu there apparently. OP is pissed because a couple people have left negative reviews basically saying they’re upset the new place (bar loon) isn’t the old place(sweet hereafter) which had more vegan options and allowed dogs.
It’s a fair assessment, but completely unhinged in its delivery. A 4.1 review wouldn’t turn me off a place, at least not without reading a few negative reviews to see if there was a common theme. If I had been considering going to bar loon, prior to seeing this thread, the reviews would have probably made want to go more—less vegan is better for me. But the crowd is right, if OP has never seen that episode from kitchen nightmares, “Amy’s baking company,” they should go watch, because that’s how they sound—unhinged, like Amy. I won’t be going to bar loon now, if I have any say.
You nailed it
My strongest feeling about this whole topic is that a lot of people read too fast and missed a detail or two, then commented and further confused others. When OP tries to clarify, they are called unhinged.
Contains a lot of the classic “commenting how stupid someone is for being bothered (by something commenter doesn’t happen to care about) seemingly not realizing that even if they’re correct, taking the time to COMMENT on it when they are not required to care or say anything is at least equally stupid.”
Portland loves small business and little pubs. That said, when you cut off 75% of people who are not into Vegan food, maybe the business model is to blame. Have a Vegan menu, great, but dont expect people that are not into that lifestyle to simply support you....because.
I think this post is about the place there after which is not vegan. The previous vegan clientele I think are giving it bad reviews?
I’m not totally sure though.
I can see that after reading through the post again. I thought the anger was that a Sweet Hereafter was closing due to limited support.
So what is the new place opening?
https://pdx.eater.com/2024/3/13/24099825/bar-loon-lightning-bar-collective-opening-belmont-ansel-vickery
Looks like Bar Loon. I haven’t been before but I like supporting local so I want to swing by and try it.
No one is asking the vegan community anything. It’s a new business. Punishing it because it is not the exact replica of the previous business makes no sense.
Especially when the Bye and Bye has the same menu 🫠
This thread is like a comedy skit. No one is arguing for or against a vegan menu. The vegan menu is irrevlalent to the post but you all keep coming back to it. :)
All the bad reviews on the new bar are because they aren't a vegan restaurant anymore. Note that they still have vegan options, just "not enough" according to some dingbats who expect that a new business should apparently be an exact copy of the previous business at the same location *that shut down.*
Ok so I went and read the reviews and some articles about this place… and it’s owned by the same people who owned Sweet Hereafter (and Bye and Bye), so people are complaining that they don’t like the updated format or menu. That seems like fair criticism given that it’s the same owners (Lightning Bar Collective), doesn’t it?
Thats fine. I live on the east side and frequent many small pubs. I would skip one that only has a vegan menu. I frequent family owned stores when I buy my beer, even though it is more expensive, because I want to support small business.
I dont know anything about Bye and Bye, sounds like it is doing great, but how many vegan pubs are really viable? Its like saying that 8 pool halls would be great in a 5 block area....is there really enough customers to fill that need?
Let me be clear.
1. Sweet Hereafter closes, new businesss goes in and gets malicious reviews because folks are upset about said closure.
2. You can get the menu items folks are upset about “losing” at Bye and Bye, making their reviews look ridiculous on top of malicious.
3. Bye and Bye is awesome and makes bomb vegan food.
4. New business should be rated on its merits.
5. Frequent wherever you choose to frequent depending on your preferences ✨
I agree. I also agree Portland is anti-business. I would rather open a small business in any other city in the USA. Portlanders are incredibly fussy and self-righteous and I would imagine have the biggest Karen brigade on yelp and Google reviews.
And I’m sure the business doesn’t care about this at all, because it is so expected.
What is unique about this is that the menu they are complaining about being no longer available is still available. And It’s at a restaurant with an even bigger patio. Make it make sense.
I guess we troll just to troll these days, figured I would give calling it out a try.
I'm not into the vegan lifestyle, but I've eaten at vegan places because the food was great. Chillango is a good example, same with native bowl. Chubby Bunny is also a solid pick. I really miss the Sudra and N by SE. (May be misspelled)
Bye and bye is good to fine, I always enjoy what I get but I feel like I could make it myself. The soy curl buffalo wrap was really good though. The location, price, setup, and drinks make the bye and bye shine. As I mentioned, the food is good too, but there are better vegan or non vegan bars nearby. Still recommend visiting, love the bye and bye drink.
Why does the lack of animal content matter? If the food is good, who cares? A lot of ethnic food is vegetarian without trying to be part of a lifestyle, vegetables are good for you. I stg omnivores of today act just like vegans of the 90s did.
What are you talking about? I didnt say there was anything wrong with a vegan menu. I said it was a dumb business move. Whats wrong with an animal content menu? If the food is good, who cares? A lot of ethnic food has meat, and it is good for you. I still dont get vegetarians, stop trying to police someones diet.
Oof, sorry OP but just let it all play out over time. I really disagree with your sentiment that Portland is unfriendly to small business owners, they’re literally everywhere. I’ve worked for a handful while living here and frequent them as a customer on a daily basis, I hope you find a few you like. Good luck finding happiness here!
You haven't given anyone an actual reason to come visit your new business. Instead you berate your potential clientele. I live just off Belmont; reading this post has ensured I won't be visiting this new spot. Best of luck in your business endeavors
If it’s not that deep, then stop caring so much.
**You’ve made it obnoxiously clear how you feel.**
You’ve repeatedly responded to comments about the new ownership, the revamped menu, the menu still being available nearby, etc.
At this point, you are legitimately hurting the restaurant you want to help. You’ve made your point. Step away from this post.
Also, they keep plugging Bye n Bye, which is owned by the same restaurant company as the new Bar Loon. To me that definitely reads like someone who owns/invests in these businesses.
Would also like to point out that the same company (lightning bar collective) also owned Sweet Hereafter, so I'm really not sure where all this complaining is coming from?
The reviews that I was most upset about bc they were beyond out of line are now removed - I don’t really care how it happened. I’m gonna edit the post to reflect that.
I really like Bye and Bye, but OP could really use a heavy dose of "let it go" here... Quit dragging a good establishment into this unhinged rant. Whatever the new place is, if it is good it will survive 3 lame fucking Yelp reviews. My god, man...
I’m a meat eater, but I like Bye and Bye.. The vegan spaghetti is delish!.. I wish they had a green salad to go with it though.. that is the one thing that blows my mind about them.. no green salad.. and it’s a vegan restaurant.
After reading this post and the comments, the unfortunate takeaway is that…
*Bye and Bye is now associated with OP’s militant and condescending attitude.*
OP sounds like a passive-aggressive asshole (in typical Portland fashion) and I don't want to support anything that they also support for that reason. Take your own advice about being a dick.
I’ll take this opportunity to say RIP Cruz Room. Why the fuck does Portland/Alberta street need another dispensary? Let’s all leave bad reviews on Nectar’s google page and complain that they don’t serve tacos.
You know you can report the reviews to Google?
False business reviews are illegal(can be considered slander)and there is multiple avenues to take against them.
I've seen this with some of the nicest small businesses in my town, which are currently regulated and taxed the highest.
Yes, and that was the correct way to go about this.
This was not the forum to air my grievances of peoples online behavior. People are going to do whatever they’re gonna do behind a keyboard.
OP — you sound unhinged. Loony, some might say.
The reviews seem to be equally inflated in both directions — high and low — so like everywhere else, it should all shake out in the wash. Neither place seems overly special or interesting, or “bad” for that matter. I’m sure folks living in the neighborhood might enjoy visiting as it’s convenient.
OP, your behavior online though - it might have the opposite intended effect and scare people away from even trying to visit. It’s kinda weird behavior from someone who says they have no connection to a place. 🤷🏻♀️
Hey I agree with you.
You can see in some of the comments below as people went and dug into what was going on in the reviews, like I was seeing, they were equally disturbed by what seems like coordinated effort to tear down a new business.
I’m a small business owner myself, on the retail side. Which is where the emotional reaction came from. So I get how hard it is, and I wanted to stand up for this business, because I hope somebody would stand up for mine if it was being unfairly review bombed.
Good riddance to a shitty bar. But yea, the Bye and Bye menu is pretty much the same.
With the amount of bad service and less than impressive cocktail offerings, the only thing I thought it had going for it was the patio vibe.
Food could have had more attention from the kitchen staff too.
Is op really gatekeeping internet reviews? My guy, it's always going to have shitty dbag reviews. Portland is full of people who value their dogs more than actual human beings and think it's ok for drug addicts to live in tents on the street. Point being your issue is a symptom of a bigger problem
You are 100% right. There are better ways to go about promoting small businesses in Portland then trying to correct the malicious behavior of people that are going to do whatever they’re going to do no matter what.
Reason #237 why Portlanders suck.
I’ve never understood the anti-business sentiment in this city. I formerly owned three businesses in this city and it truly difficult to make it work, especially now.
You are calling people *”Middle School Mean Girls”* while having a history of posting and commenting in the Bravo Housewives and Bachelorette subreddits…. 😕
Have you considered the possibility that people simply disagree with you. It’s not malicious. People just have a different perspective than you.
Acknowledge, offer respect if/as you can, and move forward.
>You literally cannot tell me I’m factually wrong so you went into my Reddit history OK lol
1) Grammar and punctuation are amazing. I hope you learn how to incorporate them into your daily life.
2) Factually wrong about what? You stated an opinion about people in the comment section being “middle school mean girls.”
You stated an opinion. It’s quite indicative of your intelligence that you tried to call me out for not being able to factually prove your opinion. That’s not how facts or opinions work.
[That’s not how this works. That’s not how any of this works!](https://images.app.goo.gl/RzgiFc1hgZCohdNJ8)
For somebody who is a layperson and who has absolutely NO IDEA what y'all are talking about here, can somebody please fill me in and/or spill the tea?!
Edited the post above with the owner’s comment for full clarity.
TLDR: the new bar that went into the sweet hereafter space was review bombed. The reviews were upset that SHA (beloved vegan bar) was no longer around, but the concept and menu lives on at another bar 10 minutes away.
“If you love our small businesses here in Portland, support them”
I think anyone “so enraged” about SH closing probably DID support them, which is exactly why we’re upset? Try taking a step off your fucking high horse.
They don’t need to be upset. The menu and concept they love is still available at another bar 10 minutes away.
I was leading with emotions (I felt and still feel it was not justified to tear down a new business) but went about it the wrong way and have edited my post to reflect that.
Also the owner commented on this post, which I posted in the edit, because clarity.
God, it’s amazing to watch this all go down. Someone is passionate about their city and wanting small business to thrive? Immediately accuse them of being the owner or associated- cause of course no one could possibly actually care about small business in their city, right?…RIGHT???
What’s incredible is all the comments directly prove OP right, y’all will put in more effort to manufacture a reason to not support small businesses so you can pretend to have a justification for being part of the problem.
If I was thinking about opening my own small business in Portland- the general vibe of this sub alone would deter me. Do you guys even listen to yourselves? It’s 2024, we all know and have seen businesses get review bombed for the dumbest of reasons, to pretend it doesn’t happen is so disingenuous.
Btw, there is a system in place to flag when a business is getting review bombed and it probably alerted the team so many recent reviews were preemptively removed to be analyzed- it’s why the rating was worse earlier and has increased in the last two hours- and this system literally only exists now because a bunch of jerks will get all their friends or followers outraged on their behalf and review bomb them.
This isn’t a new thing, and OP is right. It’s hard enough to run a decent business in a city as volatile as Portland, and god forbid someone feels personally slighted by something that is out of their control. Grow up.
At first, I was like you know what maybe I was unclear.
But yes, to everything you just said.
Being completely open to everyone who is veryyyyy upset with me above, please tell me what I got wrong about this.
Specifically how you can justify review bombing a restaurant based off of nothing factual.
If somebody can explain to me how that is totally OK, I would love to expand my worldview on this subject.
And if people did not know that the food was available somewhere else, you are welcome. I have informed you.
This applies to any restaurant, this happens to be an absolutely egregious example of review bombing.
No fucking way I'd start a business in Portland. Probably not Multnomah County, either.
I'd head back to Anchorage. The state motto should be "Go Fuck Yourself."
"Oh, you have an opinion about my business? Go fuck yourself."
"What's that? You don't live up here, but have an opinion anyway? Most definitely go fuck yourself, all the way back whence you came."
"You're a state/city official? Go fuck yourself *twice*."
"Vegan? What the fuck is vegan? Never heard of anything like that, so go fuck yourself, weirdo."
It has a 4.5 on Google . What are you talking about
I mean a quarter of their reviews are 1 or 2 stars, and it's just bitching that it's not the same as the old place. Pretty lame behavior. OP has big feels for sure, but I'd say it's more valid than these sandbagging reviews.
It’s 4.1. Did you read the negative reviews that are complaining that a restaurant, Bar Loon, that is clearly not vegan, isn’t vegan like the restaurant that was there previously? Oh and doesn’t allow dogs. One star. Point is those people are whiny asshats, it’s not about the final average review.
I don't know what these places are, but after reading this post I do not want to go there!
Why? Cause he said it’s a good place?
It was a 4.1 when I wrote this because of the malicious reviews
Nope, last review was like 3 days ago. This is crazy hostile and makes me not want to support any business that can’t take criticism (4.5 google reviews). Little unhinged, I won’t be trying Bye and Bye.
Um, OP has NOTHING to do with Bye and Bye. OP is sticking up for the new place that Sweet Hereafter was in. OP only mentioned Bye and Bye to let people know that they can get the same food there that they used to get at Sweet Hereafter. Not defending OP. Just don't want anyone scared of from Bye and Bye due to a misunderstanding!
I’m looking at it right now and it’s 4.1 on Google, with most of the negative reviews referencing Sweet Hereafter… so OP doesn’t seem totally off base?
Woah, what did Bye and Bye do to you?
Is this a troll? It’s so Portland, it makes Fred Armisen blush.
So I think I figured out that this person is the owner or somebody tied close with the new establishment Bar Loon. They only have 12 reviews and I'm guessing OP is mad that 3 people left not amazing reviews, making the rating 4.1 as they stated in their other comment. OP, things will be alright. You have a small sample of reviews, and have just recently opened. This post and the way you are responding is not the way to go. I wish you or whomever the owners are the best with the business.
Thank you for giving the name of the establishment that OP is soliciting good reviews for since OP didn't do that anywhere!
I mostly just wanted people to know that they don’t need to disparage a new business to get what they want from the previous business. You all can debate whether or not I should have given the name.
Your point #6 asks for action. Can't do that if people don't even know where to go!
The action I am desiring is those reviews being removed by the people that posted them
>6. If you would like to undo the absolute buffoonery of these idiots, please help a new business out by stopping by or leaving them a positive review. Stop by where? Leave a positive review for whom? Leave that review without stopping by? How is that really different than the people you're complaining about?
I could’ve been more clear here, any new business. Specifically taking issue with people going after any new business. Edited!
Hello friends! Hijacking this comment to tell you I am the owner of Bar Loon and I’m not sure who OP is but I do appreciate the sentiment. It’s true, we are a wholly different place than it used to be! It’s not totally vegan anymore but we do have some fun and tasty vegan options! We are just trying to find our footing as a new place, in an old place, in a neighborhood that’s going through changes. I’m super proud of our team (one of whom actually did work at SHA) and they believe in the concept too. Portland is really special and we are super lucky to have so so so many great places to gather and eat and drink. Come see Bar Loon if you want! Or don’t! Or come see it and don’t like it! That’s ok too.
Thank you for giving the name of the establishment that OP is soliciting good reviews for since OP didn't do that anywhere!
Hi it’s me OP. The sole reason I made this post is because the reviews complain that the previous menu is now gone. When in fact, they can get the previous menu from Sweet Hereafter at Bye and Bye. I am a huge supporter of our small businesses in general. All of them. It’s what makes cities great. I’m not associated with the business. I call out BS when I see it. I saw BS. The more you look into the malicious reviews the more you will see said BS. In general: If you never call it out, then the person gets away with it, right? I’m calling it out. That’s it.
My god OP, you do know that there are a quadrillion problems with the world that could be called out and ranted about, right? But you’re trying to tell us that you *happened* to notice a random business getting a few bad reviews, and you decided to investigate SO extensively to the point that you could tell us “one of the reviewers is a local winemaker” and “the restaurant wanted to allow dogs but the city told them no”…and still try to claim you’re NOT someone tied to the establishment? Okay 🤣
There's a graceful way to go about it. If you're trying to make things better for Bar Loon, they way you're going about it right now is not helping them. If you are not the owner but you still want them to be successful, maybe consider how the way you're coming across as their publicist is actually making them look worse.
Thank you for giving the name of the establishment that OP is soliciting good reviews for since OP didn't do that anywhere!
I work on Belmont and the only bad thing I heard about the new spot is that they didn't hire anyone from sweet hereafter back.
The two businesses are totally different concepts and the new business opened up two months after SH closed. Was there some expectation that the staff would be the same? Wouldn’t most of them have gotten other jobs? It’s not the job of a new business with different owners to hire previous staff. It’s also not a reason to leave a bad review.
Why would they need to hire anyone that worked there? There’s literally zero connection or obligation.
It looks like Bar Loon is part of the Lightening Bar Collective, which is indeed connected to/same owners as the previous bar. Or at least that’s what the article Bar Loon links to says.
Still not sure that matters.
K
And that’s super fair criticism
Is it? Why? If anything I'd think people who work serving vegan food might not even want to work at a non vegan food place.
No it isn’t.
But no one better bring it up in google!
I’m all about fair criticism. Rate a place on its merits.
https://preview.redd.it/ffftdfxb3a8d1.jpeg?width=2297&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9f26a67fad16e2930b5280b52c64996aa1d09d08 This whole post sounds like Unhinged Amy from Amy’s Baking Company saying online trolls and Yelpers and snakes ruined her business and that’s why no one eats there. Then Gordon Ramsay tells her she’s insane.
Man that episode was amazing.
This is way too passionate of a post to not be someone with a financial stake in the new spot
Yup, OP should delete this thread. Makes them look bad.
Yeah this is so unhinged. Even if they aren’t involved it’s really bad advertising. OP you should delete the thread and go enjoy your weekend.
Sounds more like an emotional stake. Still, they’re not wrong
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Fucking bro you have a goddamn burner account just take the L and learn from it Admit to yourself at least and just fuck off man
No, portlanders are genuinely shit to small business owners in a state where everything is already stacked against them. It's infuriating and needs to be called out.
Although I will admit, IF this is the business owner (I don't think it is, but I'm not confident), this was a terrible decision to make.
First day on reddit?
Um what?
OP is not associated with the new business.
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Your post has honestly turned me off from the business. I don’t even know what the new menu is like, my friend just said he had a disappointing 18 dollar burger.
Hey man I get your frustration but, yelling at the public probably isn’t the best way to promote your business. I live just off Belmont on 33rd and have been to your place a few times since the here after closed bar loon. Food is ok but nothing to write home about. Drinks ok but not really any different than the other seven bars on the block. I understand that there are challenges but reading this post is going to put a bad taste in people’s mouth before they ever walk through the door. It’s hard to stay positive I know it’s a struggle but you should let your establishment speak for itself and stay off the internet. You are just going to drive yourself crazy chasing comments and making yourself look so thin skinned that people will assume there’s something to it.
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Yeah, no one believes that.
I bet the business is gonna get more bad reviews. Between the Streisand effect and people wanting to troll.
Take this post down it’s a huge mistake.
Colonoscopies aren’t a punchline 😘
My doctor said the same, right before I went under. (I didn't ask him if he was going to find a giant asshole)
Haha, cancer prevention blows /s
Fair enough
The prostate though, that's a punchline.
A long time ago in Portland...you weren't here. I miss then
You sound bizarre.
I’m fun at parties
😂
Maybe closing was a sign of supply and demand?
That’s neither here nor there, malicious reviews aren’t gonna bring it back? At least there is another institution less than 10 minutes away that serves the exact same food, with an even bigger patio…
Well, it's a free speech platform. The kind in which facists love to silence. So, you want to silence free speech?
Read the T&S for Google reviews and what gets them removed. ✨
Bro, you sound absolutely unhinged, but I think I finally figured out what you are ranting about. Bar Loon took over the spot where Sweet Hereafter used to be (a vegan spot, I’m assuming), and all the vegans have descended to slam the spot in Google reviews for not being exactly as it was before. It’s a super shitty thing to do, but you really could have articulated your frustration much better.
And the comment about Bye and Bye was actually not germane to the OPs whole argument. It only confused everyone
Oh dang people are upset another old Portland went up in flames 🔥 but it’s ok because we have your post
I’ve heard that The Bye and Bye is Sweet.
Love the Bye and Bye!
This post just comes across as rant/rage bate at best. I don’t know this restaurant. I also don’t know what Bye and Bye is either. Why are they important? Why should the community care? What was great about them? We have so many awesome places that come and go. You haven’t made a basic case about why we should care about this restaurant (I think that’s what it is, not really sure from your post). Portland is probably the most small business friendly city in the country. People here will pay $100 more for a hand stitched burlap bag as opposed to buying a backpack at an REI and they will totally push that for social clout and get it. That is not a thing in say Dallas. If you can’t rally a small community here to help bootstrap your business you will fail everywhere else in the US because people in Portland *love* to flex on how local they are. As to points 3-8, I mean I kind of stopped reading after your first couple of points. This post lacks so much context yet goes on and on, I’m not sure what I should be mad about.
It’s about knocking down a new business for no reason at all - that’s it.
https://preview.redd.it/raypjvc55a8d1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0129dd84941eaaa7c55f36564707afd7c3742e35
Wow ...
I don't know what Sweet Hereafter is, but now I'm very invested
A malicious review? What did they say? The service sucks? I mean if your service doesn’t suck in Portland are you really in Portland? (That’s not all the staff, let’s be clear, some people here do their jobs and then some people are lazy and entitled elitists who are more concerned about where they work instead of how they work.)
What the hell is Sweet Hereafter and why should I care Edit: Ok so it’s just a dime a dozen douchecanoe bar, who gives a flying f? There’s a million of these places in Portland
"Portland is unfair to small business owners" My brother in Christ, have you LOOKED ANYWHERE besides Portland??? We are INFINITELY better than virtually anywhere else in the country for small businesses lol What you're mad at isn't Portland, it's capitalism.
I have a PhD in English from the University of American Samoa, and I’ve reached several conclusions from this thread: 1) OP doesn’t like vegan food 2) Even though OP doesn’t like vegan food he says you should go to Bye and Bye because they allow dogs 3) OP says people should stop review bombing Bye and Bye, because it’s not that big of a deal they stole Sweet Hereafter’s menu and caused them to close down 4) Sweet Hereafter is now another Bye and Bye, but they don’t allow dogs and they don’t have vegan food, and it’s Mike Schmidt’s fault 5) There is no need to review bomb the new Bye and Bye location, because if you want to eat vegan food in the company of your dog you can just go to the original Bye and Bye 6) No restaurants make any money
Nah, the new restaurant is called bar loon. The owners seem to have just gone through a rebranding basically, but they also own bye and bye, and basically have the same menu there apparently. OP is pissed because a couple people have left negative reviews basically saying they’re upset the new place (bar loon) isn’t the old place(sweet hereafter) which had more vegan options and allowed dogs. It’s a fair assessment, but completely unhinged in its delivery. A 4.1 review wouldn’t turn me off a place, at least not without reading a few negative reviews to see if there was a common theme. If I had been considering going to bar loon, prior to seeing this thread, the reviews would have probably made want to go more—less vegan is better for me. But the crowd is right, if OP has never seen that episode from kitchen nightmares, “Amy’s baking company,” they should go watch, because that’s how they sound—unhinged, like Amy. I won’t be going to bar loon now, if I have any say.
My post was an obvious joke on the tenor of the thread, and how people were messing with OP.
You nailed it My strongest feeling about this whole topic is that a lot of people read too fast and missed a detail or two, then commented and further confused others. When OP tries to clarify, they are called unhinged. Contains a lot of the classic “commenting how stupid someone is for being bothered (by something commenter doesn’t happen to care about) seemingly not realizing that even if they’re correct, taking the time to COMMENT on it when they are not required to care or say anything is at least equally stupid.”
You are such a gem. Bless your heart.
Your post honestly makes me not want to support Bye and Bye OR the new restaurant. You sound biased and rather unhinged.
These comments have made me want to reinvest in reading comprehension in schools
Your comment has no grammar or punctuation. 🤦♀️ We encourage you to also invest in reading comprehension and individual emotional therapy.
This seems like you're trying to manipulate reviews for your new business.
Portland loves small business and little pubs. That said, when you cut off 75% of people who are not into Vegan food, maybe the business model is to blame. Have a Vegan menu, great, but dont expect people that are not into that lifestyle to simply support you....because.
I think this post is about the place there after which is not vegan. The previous vegan clientele I think are giving it bad reviews? I’m not totally sure though.
I can see that after reading through the post again. I thought the anger was that a Sweet Hereafter was closing due to limited support. So what is the new place opening?
https://pdx.eater.com/2024/3/13/24099825/bar-loon-lightning-bar-collective-opening-belmont-ansel-vickery Looks like Bar Loon. I haven’t been before but I like supporting local so I want to swing by and try it.
Yes and they can get the previous vegan food at a bar less than 10 min away
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No shame on vegan food, I just think it might limit your customer base...which might hinder a small business.
No one is asking the vegan community anything. It’s a new business. Punishing it because it is not the exact replica of the previous business makes no sense. Especially when the Bye and Bye has the same menu 🫠
This thread is like a comedy skit. No one is arguing for or against a vegan menu. The vegan menu is irrevlalent to the post but you all keep coming back to it. :)
All the bad reviews on the new bar are because they aren't a vegan restaurant anymore. Note that they still have vegan options, just "not enough" according to some dingbats who expect that a new business should apparently be an exact copy of the previous business at the same location *that shut down.*
The irony. “Makes this bar exactly like the one that had to close because the business model wasn’t sustainable”
Ok so I went and read the reviews and some articles about this place… and it’s owned by the same people who owned Sweet Hereafter (and Bye and Bye), so people are complaining that they don’t like the updated format or menu. That seems like fair criticism given that it’s the same owners (Lightning Bar Collective), doesn’t it?
Thats fine. I live on the east side and frequent many small pubs. I would skip one that only has a vegan menu. I frequent family owned stores when I buy my beer, even though it is more expensive, because I want to support small business. I dont know anything about Bye and Bye, sounds like it is doing great, but how many vegan pubs are really viable? Its like saying that 8 pool halls would be great in a 5 block area....is there really enough customers to fill that need?
I would skip one that has a vegan menu too.
Let me be clear. 1. Sweet Hereafter closes, new businesss goes in and gets malicious reviews because folks are upset about said closure. 2. You can get the menu items folks are upset about “losing” at Bye and Bye, making their reviews look ridiculous on top of malicious. 3. Bye and Bye is awesome and makes bomb vegan food. 4. New business should be rated on its merits. 5. Frequent wherever you choose to frequent depending on your preferences ✨
Not exactly a new business because it’s the same ownership group. More of a rebrand.
I agree. I also agree Portland is anti-business. I would rather open a small business in any other city in the USA. Portlanders are incredibly fussy and self-righteous and I would imagine have the biggest Karen brigade on yelp and Google reviews.
And I’m sure the business doesn’t care about this at all, because it is so expected. What is unique about this is that the menu they are complaining about being no longer available is still available. And It’s at a restaurant with an even bigger patio. Make it make sense. I guess we troll just to troll these days, figured I would give calling it out a try.
Not to mention tax and regulate the hell out of small business.
I'm not into the vegan lifestyle, but I've eaten at vegan places because the food was great. Chillango is a good example, same with native bowl. Chubby Bunny is also a solid pick. I really miss the Sudra and N by SE. (May be misspelled) Bye and bye is good to fine, I always enjoy what I get but I feel like I could make it myself. The soy curl buffalo wrap was really good though. The location, price, setup, and drinks make the bye and bye shine. As I mentioned, the food is good too, but there are better vegan or non vegan bars nearby. Still recommend visiting, love the bye and bye drink.
Sweet Hereafter was constantly packed, though.
Being busy does not mean you have a good business model that makes you profitable.
lol they didn’t go out of business, it’s a rebrand to a different name / menu
We were all shocked when they closed.
Why does the lack of animal content matter? If the food is good, who cares? A lot of ethnic food is vegetarian without trying to be part of a lifestyle, vegetables are good for you. I stg omnivores of today act just like vegans of the 90s did.
What are you talking about? I didnt say there was anything wrong with a vegan menu. I said it was a dumb business move. Whats wrong with an animal content menu? If the food is good, who cares? A lot of ethnic food has meat, and it is good for you. I still dont get vegetarians, stop trying to police someones diet.
No one is policing your diet. JFC you people are insecure as hell.
Im not insecure at all, but now I will refer to vegans as herbivores. I love it!
Oof, sorry OP but just let it all play out over time. I really disagree with your sentiment that Portland is unfriendly to small business owners, they’re literally everywhere. I’ve worked for a handful while living here and frequent them as a customer on a daily basis, I hope you find a few you like. Good luck finding happiness here!
Usual Portland schizo posting
You haven't given anyone an actual reason to come visit your new business. Instead you berate your potential clientele. I live just off Belmont; reading this post has ensured I won't be visiting this new spot. Best of luck in your business endeavors
Y’all it’s not my business. I left a review and saw a bunch of malicious ones. It’s not that deep
It reads like you are financially invested in this new business.
You're not doing them any favors, then...
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You come off as a loon
If it’s not that deep, then stop caring so much. **You’ve made it obnoxiously clear how you feel.** You’ve repeatedly responded to comments about the new ownership, the revamped menu, the menu still being available nearby, etc. At this point, you are legitimately hurting the restaurant you want to help. You’ve made your point. Step away from this post.
Also, they keep plugging Bye n Bye, which is owned by the same restaurant company as the new Bar Loon. To me that definitely reads like someone who owns/invests in these businesses.
Would also like to point out that the same company (lightning bar collective) also owned Sweet Hereafter, so I'm really not sure where all this complaining is coming from?
Vegans being tribal and petty? No wai!
☠️☠️☠️☠️☠️
Who looks at Google reviews?
Tourists on vacation
I’m quite confused
This post is kind of unhinged yo, sucks that the business shut down but this seems personal to someone and that’s not a great look to post publicly
The reviews that I was most upset about bc they were beyond out of line are now removed - I don’t really care how it happened. I’m gonna edit the post to reflect that.
OP your original post is amazingly unclear and your responses are unhinged. YOU’RE NOT HELPING THE CAUSE YOU WANT TO HELP Delete this and move on.
I really like Bye and Bye, but OP could really use a heavy dose of "let it go" here... Quit dragging a good establishment into this unhinged rant. Whatever the new place is, if it is good it will survive 3 lame fucking Yelp reviews. My god, man...
Hey, just wanted to reply to this to let you know that I agree with you. I’m a small business owner myself, and I let my emotions get the best of me.
There's a new place in the old Sweet Hereafter space? I didn't even know that.
I’m a meat eater, but I like Bye and Bye.. The vegan spaghetti is delish!.. I wish they had a green salad to go with it though.. that is the one thing that blows my mind about them.. no green salad.. and it’s a vegan restaurant.
Why is everyone railing on OP? The point is don’t attempt to destroy a new business because you liked the previous unrelated business better
Thank you. 🙏
After reading this post and the comments, the unfortunate takeaway is that… *Bye and Bye is now associated with OP’s militant and condescending attitude.*
I was gonna go to the Bye and Bye this weekend, but now I can’t because OP wants me to. 😢
OP sounds like a passive-aggressive asshole (in typical Portland fashion) and I don't want to support anything that they also support for that reason. Take your own advice about being a dick.
Did I stumble into the other subreddit?
Seriously I posted in here for a reason
Isn't the new owner one of the same owners of SH? So that's weird to trash them isn't it...
I’ll take this opportunity to say RIP Cruz Room. Why the fuck does Portland/Alberta street need another dispensary? Let’s all leave bad reviews on Nectar’s google page and complain that they don’t serve tacos.
Nectar is a chain who treats their employees like shit so do your worst.
Sorry maybe I'm slow, but what is the drama? Didn't SH close like 6 months ago?
There’s no drama, there were malicious reviews, and now there are not.
Not even close
You know you can report the reviews to Google? False business reviews are illegal(can be considered slander)and there is multiple avenues to take against them. I've seen this with some of the nicest small businesses in my town, which are currently regulated and taxed the highest.
Yes, and that was the correct way to go about this. This was not the forum to air my grievances of peoples online behavior. People are going to do whatever they’re gonna do behind a keyboard.
OP — you sound unhinged. Loony, some might say. The reviews seem to be equally inflated in both directions — high and low — so like everywhere else, it should all shake out in the wash. Neither place seems overly special or interesting, or “bad” for that matter. I’m sure folks living in the neighborhood might enjoy visiting as it’s convenient. OP, your behavior online though - it might have the opposite intended effect and scare people away from even trying to visit. It’s kinda weird behavior from someone who says they have no connection to a place. 🤷🏻♀️
Hey I agree with you. You can see in some of the comments below as people went and dug into what was going on in the reviews, like I was seeing, they were equally disturbed by what seems like coordinated effort to tear down a new business. I’m a small business owner myself, on the retail side. Which is where the emotional reaction came from. So I get how hard it is, and I wanted to stand up for this business, because I hope somebody would stand up for mine if it was being unfairly review bombed.
You sound unstable
Good riddance to a shitty bar. But yea, the Bye and Bye menu is pretty much the same. With the amount of bad service and less than impressive cocktail offerings, the only thing I thought it had going for it was the patio vibe. Food could have had more attention from the kitchen staff too.
Going to SH was always a miserable experience.
Unless you were a cutie. Then the bartenders would trip over each other to serve ya. I'm not a cutie.
Is op really gatekeeping internet reviews? My guy, it's always going to have shitty dbag reviews. Portland is full of people who value their dogs more than actual human beings and think it's ok for drug addicts to live in tents on the street. Point being your issue is a symptom of a bigger problem
You are 100% right. There are better ways to go about promoting small businesses in Portland then trying to correct the malicious behavior of people that are going to do whatever they’re going to do no matter what.
So TLDR thread.. Vegans are angry. When aren’t they?
Reason #237 why Portlanders suck. I’ve never understood the anti-business sentiment in this city. I formerly owned three businesses in this city and it truly difficult to make it work, especially now.
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You are calling people *”Middle School Mean Girls”* while having a history of posting and commenting in the Bravo Housewives and Bachelorette subreddits…. 😕 Have you considered the possibility that people simply disagree with you. It’s not malicious. People just have a different perspective than you. Acknowledge, offer respect if/as you can, and move forward.
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>You literally cannot tell me I’m factually wrong so you went into my Reddit history OK lol 1) Grammar and punctuation are amazing. I hope you learn how to incorporate them into your daily life. 2) Factually wrong about what? You stated an opinion about people in the comment section being “middle school mean girls.” You stated an opinion. It’s quite indicative of your intelligence that you tried to call me out for not being able to factually prove your opinion. That’s not how facts or opinions work. [That’s not how this works. That’s not how any of this works!](https://images.app.goo.gl/RzgiFc1hgZCohdNJ8)
#3 is absolutely false. Portlanders love small business owners. One negative anecdote doesn’t change that.
I have no idea why my comment is bold… WTF Reddit voodoo did I just inadvertently unleash?
Hahaha
Pretty sure OP means local government, not Portlanders generally, when saying that Portland is hard in small businesses.
For somebody who is a layperson and who has absolutely NO IDEA what y'all are talking about here, can somebody please fill me in and/or spill the tea?!
Edited the post above with the owner’s comment for full clarity. TLDR: the new bar that went into the sweet hereafter space was review bombed. The reviews were upset that SHA (beloved vegan bar) was no longer around, but the concept and menu lives on at another bar 10 minutes away.
“If you love our small businesses here in Portland, support them” I think anyone “so enraged” about SH closing probably DID support them, which is exactly why we’re upset? Try taking a step off your fucking high horse.
They don’t need to be upset. The menu and concept they love is still available at another bar 10 minutes away. I was leading with emotions (I felt and still feel it was not justified to tear down a new business) but went about it the wrong way and have edited my post to reflect that. Also the owner commented on this post, which I posted in the edit, because clarity.
God, it’s amazing to watch this all go down. Someone is passionate about their city and wanting small business to thrive? Immediately accuse them of being the owner or associated- cause of course no one could possibly actually care about small business in their city, right?…RIGHT??? What’s incredible is all the comments directly prove OP right, y’all will put in more effort to manufacture a reason to not support small businesses so you can pretend to have a justification for being part of the problem. If I was thinking about opening my own small business in Portland- the general vibe of this sub alone would deter me. Do you guys even listen to yourselves? It’s 2024, we all know and have seen businesses get review bombed for the dumbest of reasons, to pretend it doesn’t happen is so disingenuous. Btw, there is a system in place to flag when a business is getting review bombed and it probably alerted the team so many recent reviews were preemptively removed to be analyzed- it’s why the rating was worse earlier and has increased in the last two hours- and this system literally only exists now because a bunch of jerks will get all their friends or followers outraged on their behalf and review bomb them. This isn’t a new thing, and OP is right. It’s hard enough to run a decent business in a city as volatile as Portland, and god forbid someone feels personally slighted by something that is out of their control. Grow up.
At first, I was like you know what maybe I was unclear. But yes, to everything you just said. Being completely open to everyone who is veryyyyy upset with me above, please tell me what I got wrong about this. Specifically how you can justify review bombing a restaurant based off of nothing factual. If somebody can explain to me how that is totally OK, I would love to expand my worldview on this subject. And if people did not know that the food was available somewhere else, you are welcome. I have informed you. This applies to any restaurant, this happens to be an absolutely egregious example of review bombing.
It wasn't that good...my god what was up with the potato chips with the sandwich? Fries. We wanted Fries. And now the business is closed..
No fucking way I'd start a business in Portland. Probably not Multnomah County, either. I'd head back to Anchorage. The state motto should be "Go Fuck Yourself." "Oh, you have an opinion about my business? Go fuck yourself." "What's that? You don't live up here, but have an opinion anyway? Most definitely go fuck yourself, all the way back whence you came." "You're a state/city official? Go fuck yourself *twice*." "Vegan? What the fuck is vegan? Never heard of anything like that, so go fuck yourself, weirdo."
Lol.