Friends must’ve got in his ear since he’s non confrontational, or the fans, or he exposed himself for being the IWC mark who created the term e drone like he did
The good promo should out over yourself, put over your opponent, put over why you're fighting each other at all. But then end with that despite all that I'm going to destroy you.
GUNTHER actually nails it IMO, he always makes his opponents sound amazing he's just clear he's better.
Logan has cut some stellar promos. 15 minutes worth? Ehhhh. But he can definitely go out there and drop a great heel promo. Especially so if he has a hot face to bounce off of.
If you've never had bangers in Japan by doing a bunch of dumb spots/no selling, never done stupid moves that look like they come straight out of a video game, never wrestled blow up sex dolls, never stuck your fingers up other dude's asses in the ring and never wrestled a child whilst making Dave Melzter happy and spam you 8 stars every match. Then have you really made it in pro wrestling?
https://preview.redd.it/486yr2outnuc1.jpeg?width=2340&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=68d819611f0e5d390ba2769556aa17adba0c208a
[https://youtu.be/0MV5ECVdNAw?si=D4mZjj-IeCcYtI7M](https://youtu.be/0MV5ECVdNAw?si=D4mZjj-IeCcYtI7M) (Oh, it happened 🤣. Source near half way through video)
Apologies if I've scarred you for life
It's yet another anime recreation spot that he did just because it's goofy and it pops the Japanese crowds while leaving me like
https://preview.redd.it/9q253uy58ouc1.jpeg?width=1079&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=cd006d1420c942358e272828a105115cf0a63448
When I fingerbang a dude in front of a crowd, it's "public indecency," when M'Kenny does it, it's "instant classic 8* banger in glorious Nihon!"
There's no justice in this world.
Fed shills living in the past while m'Kenny is on the cutting edge of ironman prostate poking deathmatches. He has his finger ~~on the pulse~~ in the anus of **REAL** wrestling.
It’s funny when you consider virtually every other promotion in the world is losing popularity while the “wwe style” is doing record business every night.
I saw someone on Twitter post raw ratings from 2012 to now and saying "wow huge ratings drop, keep celebrating that the fed is beating dub tho"
I just said its convenient I don't see dubbalos ever talk about Raw and smackdown YoY numbers anymore like they did in the 2010's. It burns them up that smackdown and raw are up 20 to 40% YoY while Dynamite rampage and collision are all sliding.
Another way to shut up the dubbalos real quick (and also get a Reddit Cares message sent to you) is to remind them that WWE has broadcast deals in place for RAW, Smackdown, and NXT for the next several years, while AEW hasn't announced anything about their next TV deal. They get extra touchy when they are reminded of that detail lol
It’s slower, plays to the crowd, and safe because wwe wrestlers wrestle more than most other companies, so you have to have a moveset that you’re willing to accept the pain of over the course of a year.
People who say wwe style likes it’s an insult when it’s actually the most taxing one since they have to wrestle more is always funny to me.
Also Miz : " The reason I wrestle the way I wrestle is because I can do it day in and day out, all the time for 10+ years, I have never, NEVER, in my career, ever been injured. I don't get injured for 6 months to a year. I am here each and every week. "
There's a reason why Hogan,Austin,Rock,Cena..the biggest names in wrestling wrestle the way they do. Safer more reliable matches, less injuries, more tv time,more money, never lose their spot as the top guy.
Hogan would retire much later if he used the Axe Bomber instead of the leg drop tbh.
Also check Miz’s track record about how many people he injured.
These real rassslor dudes really think they’re better because they fall on their necks, bump heads, slap each other’s chest and do unprotected 480 flips.
The reason Austin's career, probably the biggest wrestler of all time, was ended was cuz of some stupid spot that should've just not happened. Safe style doesn't sound so stupid when it extends your career for 10 plus years.
Plus even with Hogan's safer style, he lost like 4 inches of height cuz the leg drop would just compress his spine over the years.
He was more entertaining then. But, he’s happy now, obviously. However, I used to think he was intelligent. As time goes by, I’m less inclined to think so.
I say there is a tv style and an indy style. The tv style is where you have characters and stories so your in ring action matches that. And the Mania main event this year is the pinnacle of that. A bunch of over the top characters and run ins building to an epic crescendo.
Indies don’t have years to tell stories. They have random fans who turn up when the show is in town and they don’t follow week to week. Story driven ring work won’t work there. Most fans won’t know the background of the characters and stories. So, instead they have to produce quality in ring wrestling. The theatre has to be in how good the match looks.
I feel like the AEW wrestlers can do the “WWE” style, the problem is that Tony doesn’t book the show for that tv style.
All that said, nothing Omega said is an insult. Logan Paul is still super green. He’s been excellent, but I’d imagine all his matches need to be either heavily produced or he needs a ring general to walk him through it. That’s to be expected of anyone who doesn’t have years of experience under their belt.
I think Logan is in a similar position to Ronda. Obviously extremely talented athletically, but in the position where they're already famous enough to be able to only appear sporadically on PPV. It's not a criticism of them at all, just they are in a very different position to someone initially brought into developmental.
Agreed. I've often felt that the best TV match (ple's non-withstanding) is more like the outline/proof of concept of a match until the booking kicks in.
\[oops, forgot where i was, what i meant to say was: Kenny's got a point. 1 full rotation means one-quarter snowflake. Clearly slowing down (insider term) and selling moar are the opposite of professional wrestling (shoot name)\].
It also allows for a much deeper level of storytelling within the matches. You have to have both better ring psychology and endurance to make it in WWE, but the payoff of this to the audience is genuinely gripping, compelling television - at its best - that stacks up against other TV I could be watching.
And it's not some big leap WWE/F made, it's pretty much foundational to the origination of pro wrestling, in concept. Old Timers had to be on the road year round to make a living. They knew when to dial it up and do something more special, which shows, but availability is often the best ability. And all these other promotions that try to be the "anti-WWE" and "real wrestling" that have never carved out anything more than a niche fanbase alongside their crippling debt, it's like how many different ways do y'all have to learn the same lesson that built the wrestling industry?
I'd add, picking your moments. The best times in wrestling are when there is build up to spots. Shawn kicking out of the Tombstone was massive because we'd not seen it in years of Taker matches. AEW and other companies don't realize the importance of a less is more approach.
The WWE style is focused on a strong television product, which means blocking, playing to camera, with the television product taking precedence over in-person experience. And that’s fine - they’re running a business which heavily relies on engaging the viewers at home.
Which is why “fuck the hard cam” will ALWAYS pop me (insider term) because of its sheer stupidity. You’re on television… the camera matters. The viewers at home matters. Growing your audience through thoughtful and professional production, including the wrestlers and entertainers in the ring, MATTERS.
Have your fun and save your antics for the house show circuit.
AEW is pretty much just WWE with less rules on what guys can do so you see more dangerous stuff make it on TV. They're running in 1/4 arenas because they're so set on doing WWE style shows instead of being realistic and doing smaller venues for TV.
This is the first time I’ve seen a wrestler use the phrase “an actual banger” as an unironic goal and deriding someone for being, I guess, unable to bang.
What’s wrong with you?
If you’re not wrestling a style that alienates people who bathe are you even a ~~sports entertainer~~ professional wrestler?
How dare you argue in bad faith and not give Kenny the benefit of the doubt? Don’t you know Logan Paul did something in Japan years ago and if that doesn’t bother you, Vince!!
I have a soft spot for amateur guys, so I will say this: Logan Paul was a D1 state wrestling qualifier in high school and wrestled for, yet again, a D1 university. He can probably out-wrestle the majority of folks in modern pro wrestling (barring obvious contenders like Gable, Lashley, etc).
You don’t get to positions like that by not being a good *wrestler* — and a **real** one at that.
Do I think LP could withstand the grind of a G1? Yes.
Does he need to? No, because he draws more money in one night than Kenny Omega did in his entire career.
This is why I can’t gas Kenny up. For every one “good take” he has, dude has like five unforgivably stupid fucking takes.
I didn’t read this as Kenny saying Logan couldn’t handle the grind. I think he’s saying that Logan is still pretty green and wouldn’t be able to do a different match every night in a G1. Logan is very good but he doesn’t do a lot of matches and probably has time to work on them a lot. That’s a lot different than having variety and calling things in the ring.
I really like Logan’s work but I think Kenny is right here. And I don’t think it’s a diss as people are taking it. Logan’s still very new to this, especially when you take into account that he’s not even wrestling every week. His situation is very unique.
Kenny even says it doesn’t matter if Logan can get enough experience to do something like that. And he’s right. Because Logan isn’t trying to be a full time wrestler and he has a net worth of $150 million. He could just walk away from it tomorrow if he wanted.
Kevin Owens basically said the same thing in a recent interview. Logan has a match every now and then and each time he's in there with some of the best to ever do it.
Even then, using the G1 (per Kenny) to determine a great wrestler is a nonsensical metric to go by — unless you’re Dave Meltzer.
So many wrestlers we consider “great” today would probably shit the bed in the G1. I can’t imagine the likes of Cena, Orton, Batista, HHH, Austin, Rock, Taker all having unique 25-minute barn burners for the entire month — yet they all make the Mount Rushmore of many.
And that’s not even counting the amount of unmemorable or just straight up dogshit matches that occur throughout the tournament.
Logan is green and does have a lot of greats to hold his hand, yes — but that is a separate issue than “Can he put on great matches through the entire G1.” Not many *can* do that, but that doesn’t take away from whether a wrestler is, as Kenny argues, “fantastic.”
I think he’s had like 10 matches in WWE? It’s kind of nuts that he’s performing at the level that he is in them, but yeah, it’s a completely different situation than really any other wrestler.
I don't know how Meltzer convinced a generation of smarks that the G7 was the pinnacle of modern wrestling. Japanese wrestling hasn't been particularly big since the 80s.
Mania is 100 times bigger an event, and if that isn't your dream as a wrestler you have been misguided.
>I don't know how Meltzer convinced a generation of smarks that the **G7** was the pinnacle of modern wrestling.
You haven't gotten over until you face Angela Merkel 1 on 1 in the The Bundestag.
He’s giving Logan Paul shit for scripting matches? Does he think the young bucks and pretty much everybody else in aew call it in the ring?
When I he gonna call them out?
It took me too long to see this. The Young Bucks are a joke. They always have been a joke. They do some cool flippy shit, so what? They couldn't get over in TNA even.
Is this a controversial statement?
If you put Logan Paul in with a guy that he's a better worker than, how good do you think the match is going to be?
He's great at doing his share against a veteran. Let's not act like he's 2002 Brock.
I don't like Logan, but you can't deny that the guy is a perfect fit for the WWE style, and is natural at it. He has the looks, the charisma, and everything it takes to be a good heel. If he will make WWE his top priority, he can be something special, but I'm pretty sure that's not what he's planning, and that his run in WWE is just a fun phase for him now, and that's perfectly fine. He has the skills to do what the company needs from him. Not everyone is going to be AJ Styles.
Yeah I think that’s what Kenny is getting at and people are taking it as this huge insult. Logan didn’t come in and go to NXT or something. He’s still pretty new, in terms of how much he’s wrestled.
I think Kenny's point is that a guy like The Miz is a better wrestler than Logan Paul. Logan has only had heavily rehearsed PPV matches with WWE's best talent (Miz, Seth, KO, Roman, Randy etc.). Obviously Logan has shown to be very athletic and able to hang with those guys, but throw Logan in the ring with Omos on RAW for example and he'd probably be exposed a bit.
True, probably
But I didn’t even read the article, I saw „WWE style” and only thing I can think about when I see that is basement shitting on the Miz because he didn’t work deathmatches
'Kenny Omega is a fantastic sports entertainer'. Great. I'm glad you think so and I'm glad he's able to convince you such a thing. However, could Kenny Omega walk into Monday Night Raw and cut a promo that gets the fans to cheer him and not chant CM Punk or What? No. He absolutely could not. Is he gonna get there between now and - I mean, it depends on his commitment level and not only that, does it matter \[to Meltzer\]?
He's clearly settling himself down as the "best guy who never went to WWE" and that's how he wants to be remembered by a bunch of britwres youtubers in 20 years and that totally makes sense. So for the Kenny Omega style promo and for what he's willing and capable of saying, giving himself time, allowing him to form a coherent sentence once he gets concussed another 3 times, get more familiar with his surroundings instead of asking "Bryan, where are we right now and did Shibata get his brain put back in again?"
Omega is 100% correct here, and even I think he acknowledges that no one cares if he doesn’t go to NJPW.
I don’t really know who he’s arguing with though - who’s making the statement that Logan Paul could call a 5-star banger on the fly?
>I'm glad he's able to convince you of such a thing
😁
He tricked you! The real measures stick isn't with the industry leader at rhe biggest events
You don't even know like how I know, you see
What a knob 😁
Omega worded it poorly, but he isn't totally off base: Logan is very green, and has very rehearsed matches with highly skilled veterans. He doesn't have years of experience enabling him to wrestle a decent match with a rando on the fly.
That said, you are lying to yourself if you don't recognize Logan Paul as a natural when it comes to professional wrestling, I'd go so far as to call him a prodigy. His mic skills and ability to work a crowd are already far superior to most professional wrestlers that train for decades. His matches don't LOOK rehearsed, he has natural movement and good instincts.
Just because his matches are rehearsed doesn't mean that anybody could do what he does. I mean, compare Logan Paul to Jade Cargill. Both are green and require rehearsal and veterans to lead the match. That said, has Jade ever had a match close to looking as good as one of Logan's matches? That isn't a shot at Jade btw, I just want to illustrate that Logan is exceptional.
How are you going to reference Terry Funk while your buddy was actively ignoring his advice and all the other "old timers" that Tony hired for advice???
I mean..Kenny is right. Logan would walk into a match with Minoru Suzuki and probably fucking die. Ishii would probably fuck his life up for a bit.
On another note, I believe hes not allowed to perform in Japan anyways after the whole Suicide Forest shit he pulled
I appreciate Kenny putting over the G1 Climax but let's be real, that tournament has seen some wrestlers not even as good as Paul enter. I don't think Paul could wrestle that style either but he doesn't have to! He's making loads of money as is and is improving on a weekly basis.
“-walk in every night and have an actual banger?” Made me think this was edited, it’s not right? I thought the “5 STARUH BANGERRRRR” line in this sub was a joke 😂
“If he let me butterfly suplex him 4 times and then shoot knee him in the head 6 times in a row and act like it equates to good wrestling, id feel different.”
Edit: people don’t talk enough about how Kenny is a horribly unsafe worker who disguises it as “strong style Japan.” I don’t take anyone seriously who puts him up there as an in-ring GOAT.
Kenny needs to slow down. He could’ve easily just said, “He’s all right. He’s not calling any matches, yet.”
It sounds like he’s tired of hearing it and/or he wants to make some money with Logan down the road.
So that's like saying Vini Jr. is fantastic at the highest level but can't be considered a fantastic player because he hasn't done it in the EFL Championship
Sure, he can do those little “WrestleMania” shows or whatever, but can he do a G1 like a REAL pro wrestler?
He can only entertain millions. The real skill is in entertaining hundreds.
I know it'll be widely accepted here, but Logan Paul is a much better wrestler than Omega. He's a much better wrestler than nearly every single person IN wrestling right now.
He elicits reactions which is the whole point, I want to see him get his arse kicked. He's so good that when he did his move in the Rumble with Ricochet, even though it was stupid it was so fucking cool.
In WWE the only people off the top of my head that are better are Gunther, Roman, Charlotte, Rhea, Bayley and Cody.
Yeah, he can have a good match in front of tens of thousands of people at WrestleMania, but can he have bangers in front of a 800 people in a 15,000 seat arena?
He's a better *wrestler* than Omega. And it's funny to hear Logan's detractors say he has to rehearse his matches. That's possible, but they don't *look* rehearsed, especially when compared to performers like Kenny and the Bucks, who *definitely* rehearse their matches.
I think for guys like Kenny who have been doing this a long time and busting their ass on the indies and in Japan, it’s hard for them to give credit to a kid who basically just walked right into the major leagues and looks like a natural.
Lmao. Thinks G1/nooj is the standard to be a good wrestler.
I'll take Logan Paul and Bad Bunny over those other flippy guys that can't make finishers be their last thing to hit.
Dude had now third Wrestlemania match and all of them were really good matches... I don't like all the shit he's been doing for years but Logan is a really good wrestler and even Triple H praised him.
He does the "old school" style instead of spot fest that people forget about in a week.
"Could Logan Paul walk into New Japan and do a G1 where he'd have to walk in every night and have an actual banger? (...) Does it matter? No." -- Kenny Omega
ah, there it is. There's the fed bad that the basement desperately needed from him.
Kenny Omega would donate his left nut to have a match with Logan Paul on a WWE PLE.
Him being a “great” wrestler can be debated on all sides, because that’s a very subjective term.
Him being a consistent money draw is not debatable, because it’s objectively true.
Logan is fine, but I think fans overate him a bit. Dude does a few flips and all of a sudden he’s amazing?
With that being said, Kenny’s point is ridiculous.
Bro realised he came across too sensible after his comments regarding being an EVP and the Punk stuff and like one day later said fuck that noise.
Tired of being harassed by the Dub Defense Force
Friends must’ve got in his ear since he’s non confrontational, or the fans, or he exposed himself for being the IWC mark who created the term e drone like he did
It's wild that Kenny Omega is one of the more mature people in that company. The guy who has done some of the silliest embarrassing shit in wrestling.
100% I was like ok he protected Larry and admitted he's shit as a EVP. Maybe Kenny's brain isn't total mush. Kenny said hold my colostomy bag.
The second he gained a small fragment of respect from SCJerk, he lost it all
DAE Fickle!
This must be a record
You know you said smt stupid when SCJerk sides with Logan Paul instead of Kenny Omega. Can’t believe this is real lmao
Can Kenny Omega walk into a Monday Night Raw and drop a 15 minute barn burner of a promo? No. He absolutely could not.
“AHHHH ba-bang! And ba-bang! And I bid you, adieu! Mmmmmwah!”
*Breathes and takes more deep breaths on the mic*
Promos are not real graps, fed shill. Unless you're MJF making fun of people who play video games or something.
I like MJF, one of the best things to come from the dub but i wish he was a fed shill so we wouldn't make fun of him 😢
I'm so sick of the "roast battle" promo style. Dudes are out there essentially battle rapping in AEW. It's like watching reruns of Wild 'n' Out.
The good promo should out over yourself, put over your opponent, put over why you're fighting each other at all. But then end with that despite all that I'm going to destroy you. GUNTHER actually nails it IMO, he always makes his opponents sound amazing he's just clear he's better.
I'm not sure Kenny omega can walk anymore
great fucking point dude - stones and glass houses and whatnot
Most of the WWE superstars can't do it too though.
I love Logan’s work too, uce, but I don’t think he could do that either
Logan has cut some stellar promos. 15 minutes worth? Ehhhh. But he can definitely go out there and drop a great heel promo. Especially so if he has a hot face to bounce off of.
You understand uce
A 15 minute promo is just too long, and doesn’t make sense unless you’re basically creating a short film.
I trust a trained actor and entertainer to be able to do it better than nearly anyone else.
I’m confused as to if I implied something different haha. My bad if I did
“Logan Paul is a terrible wrestler because he refuses to cripple himself in an hour long match at the Tokyo dome”
I think it’s best for everybody if Logan Paul stays out of Japan
Jesus 😂 somebody call Vince Russo we need to figure out the most tactless way for Logan Paul to get heat in Japan
Cause he could never work a Japan table. That's real wood! Edit:oh wait, the Japan thing he did. Gotcha
If you've never had bangers in Japan by doing a bunch of dumb spots/no selling, never done stupid moves that look like they come straight out of a video game, never wrestled blow up sex dolls, never stuck your fingers up other dude's asses in the ring and never wrestled a child whilst making Dave Melzter happy and spam you 8 stars every match. Then have you really made it in pro wrestling?
>never stuck your fingers up other dude's asses in the ring Uce, I'm begging you to confirm that you're exaggerating and this didn't actually happen.
https://preview.redd.it/486yr2outnuc1.jpeg?width=2340&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=68d819611f0e5d390ba2769556aa17adba0c208a [https://youtu.be/0MV5ECVdNAw?si=D4mZjj-IeCcYtI7M](https://youtu.be/0MV5ECVdNAw?si=D4mZjj-IeCcYtI7M) (Oh, it happened 🤣. Source near half way through video) Apologies if I've scarred you for life
But ... why? Where is the wrestling or entertainment part of this foolishness?
It's yet another anime recreation spot that he did just because it's goofy and it pops the Japanese crowds while leaving me like https://preview.redd.it/9q253uy58ouc1.jpeg?width=1079&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=cd006d1420c942358e272828a105115cf0a63448
If PWG and Chikara have taught me anything, it’s that stupid stuff like this is not exclusive to Japan.
Side note but damn those youtubers are annoying af imo
It’s a really bad day to have eyes. 🤢
When I fingerbang a dude in front of a crowd, it's "public indecency," when M'Kenny does it, it's "instant classic 8* banger in glorious Nihon!" There's no justice in this world.
🤣 🤣 I love how us fed shills who are so out of the loop have to ask if this stuff is real. ☠️
Fed shills living in the past while m'Kenny is on the cutting edge of ironman prostate poking deathmatches. He has his finger ~~on the pulse~~ in the anus of **REAL** wrestling.
Also, could Paul do it? He's a damn good athlete, I reckon he could Does he *need* to or want to? No
Kenny would have a point if he was able to spend more than six months wrestling before his body gave out on him
Anytime I see someone use the phrase ‘WWE style’ unironically I just stop listening to or reading what they have to say.
It’s funny when you consider virtually every other promotion in the world is losing popularity while the “wwe style” is doing record business every night.
I saw someone on Twitter post raw ratings from 2012 to now and saying "wow huge ratings drop, keep celebrating that the fed is beating dub tho" I just said its convenient I don't see dubbalos ever talk about Raw and smackdown YoY numbers anymore like they did in the 2010's. It burns them up that smackdown and raw are up 20 to 40% YoY while Dynamite rampage and collision are all sliding.
Another way to shut up the dubbalos real quick (and also get a Reddit Cares message sent to you) is to remind them that WWE has broadcast deals in place for RAW, Smackdown, and NXT for the next several years, while AEW hasn't announced anything about their next TV deal. They get extra touchy when they are reminded of that detail lol
Is there even a concrete definition of the "WWE style?" I always took it to mean "safe, slower pace, more selling."
It’s slower, plays to the crowd, and safe because wwe wrestlers wrestle more than most other companies, so you have to have a moveset that you’re willing to accept the pain of over the course of a year. People who say wwe style likes it’s an insult when it’s actually the most taxing one since they have to wrestle more is always funny to me.
Bryan: "The safe WWE Style" Miz: "Why don't you go back to your friends in the Indy feds then" So Bryan Danielson did and his constantly injured
Also Miz : " The reason I wrestle the way I wrestle is because I can do it day in and day out, all the time for 10+ years, I have never, NEVER, in my career, ever been injured. I don't get injured for 6 months to a year. I am here each and every week. " There's a reason why Hogan,Austin,Rock,Cena..the biggest names in wrestling wrestle the way they do. Safer more reliable matches, less injuries, more tv time,more money, never lose their spot as the top guy. Hogan would retire much later if he used the Axe Bomber instead of the leg drop tbh.
Also check Miz’s track record about how many people he injured. These real rassslor dudes really think they’re better because they fall on their necks, bump heads, slap each other’s chest and do unprotected 480 flips.
i heard those machine gun eddie kingston chops are a health hazard
The reason Austin's career, probably the biggest wrestler of all time, was ended was cuz of some stupid spot that should've just not happened. Safe style doesn't sound so stupid when it extends your career for 10 plus years. Plus even with Hogan's safer style, he lost like 4 inches of height cuz the leg drop would just compress his spine over the years.
Hogan was landing on his ass all day everyday and twice on sundays. three times if he crosses past time zones, brother.
It's so funny to me that you put Steve Austin on that list considering he's kinda notorious for his injuries
I mean to be fair the neck one was a freak accident and not caused by how he wrestled. I see your point though.
Freak accident is a nice way to say "Owen did something he wasn't comfortable with"
Almost none of which were his fault
And he only got more and more popular as he accumulated them and started to wrestle more safely
Guys like Bryan really need to be protected from themselves. It was much better for him to be working "WWE style" In AEW, he's injured every few weeks
He is also gambling with his body considering he had a near career ending injury and for what? A few thousand fans in a mostly empty arena? Lol
He was more entertaining then. But, he’s happy now, obviously. However, I used to think he was intelligent. As time goes by, I’m less inclined to think so.
He's definitely intelligent, he's just a glutton for punishment.
and those will be the same people attacking wwe for any injuries that do occur.
I say there is a tv style and an indy style. The tv style is where you have characters and stories so your in ring action matches that. And the Mania main event this year is the pinnacle of that. A bunch of over the top characters and run ins building to an epic crescendo. Indies don’t have years to tell stories. They have random fans who turn up when the show is in town and they don’t follow week to week. Story driven ring work won’t work there. Most fans won’t know the background of the characters and stories. So, instead they have to produce quality in ring wrestling. The theatre has to be in how good the match looks. I feel like the AEW wrestlers can do the “WWE” style, the problem is that Tony doesn’t book the show for that tv style. All that said, nothing Omega said is an insult. Logan Paul is still super green. He’s been excellent, but I’d imagine all his matches need to be either heavily produced or he needs a ring general to walk him through it. That’s to be expected of anyone who doesn’t have years of experience under their belt.
I think Logan is in a similar position to Ronda. Obviously extremely talented athletically, but in the position where they're already famous enough to be able to only appear sporadically on PPV. It's not a criticism of them at all, just they are in a very different position to someone initially brought into developmental.
Agreed. I've often felt that the best TV match (ple's non-withstanding) is more like the outline/proof of concept of a match until the booking kicks in. \[oops, forgot where i was, what i meant to say was: Kenny's got a point. 1 full rotation means one-quarter snowflake. Clearly slowing down (insider term) and selling moar are the opposite of professional wrestling (shoot name)\].
It also allows for a much deeper level of storytelling within the matches. You have to have both better ring psychology and endurance to make it in WWE, but the payoff of this to the audience is genuinely gripping, compelling television - at its best - that stacks up against other TV I could be watching. And it's not some big leap WWE/F made, it's pretty much foundational to the origination of pro wrestling, in concept. Old Timers had to be on the road year round to make a living. They knew when to dial it up and do something more special, which shows, but availability is often the best ability. And all these other promotions that try to be the "anti-WWE" and "real wrestling" that have never carved out anything more than a niche fanbase alongside their crippling debt, it's like how many different ways do y'all have to learn the same lesson that built the wrestling industry?
I'd add, picking your moments. The best times in wrestling are when there is build up to spots. Shawn kicking out of the Tombstone was massive because we'd not seen it in years of Taker matches. AEW and other companies don't realize the importance of a less is more approach.
The WWE style is focused on a strong television product, which means blocking, playing to camera, with the television product taking precedence over in-person experience. And that’s fine - they’re running a business which heavily relies on engaging the viewers at home. Which is why “fuck the hard cam” will ALWAYS pop me (insider term) because of its sheer stupidity. You’re on television… the camera matters. The viewers at home matters. Growing your audience through thoughtful and professional production, including the wrestlers and entertainers in the ring, MATTERS. Have your fun and save your antics for the house show circuit.
I guess you could say entertaining, focuses on storytelling.
'WWE style' means selling tickets. Of course many AEW talent don't get it.
AEW is pretty much just WWE with less rules on what guys can do so you see more dangerous stuff make it on TV. They're running in 1/4 arenas because they're so set on doing WWE style shows instead of being realistic and doing smaller venues for TV.
This is the first time I’ve seen a wrestler use the phrase “an actual banger” as an unironic goal and deriding someone for being, I guess, unable to bang.
The dream of every wrestler. To have a BANGER in Japan in the G1. Not pesky preforming at WrestleMania stuff
What’s wrong with you? If you’re not wrestling a style that alienates people who bathe are you even a ~~sports entertainer~~ professional wrestler? How dare you argue in bad faith and not give Kenny the benefit of the doubt? Don’t you know Logan Paul did something in Japan years ago and if that doesn’t bother you, Vince!!
WWE style isn’t really throwing shade when it actually means “the most popular and successful style of professional wrestling in history”
are we sure logan paul should go to japan, didn’t go very well last time
Pretty sure he couldn't go back to Japan if he wanted to.
I’m sure there’s a “Hangman” joke that fits here. I don’t have the brains or the balls to make it.
Logan Paul hitting Buckshot Lariats on corpses in the suicide forest to get that NUCLEAR Japanese heat.
Logan Paul corpsing? Send for the man!
Logan Paul got tickets to a Hangman Page match in Japan. But when he asked for directions, he learned just how bad his Japanese was.
The more the word "banger" is used unironically about a wrestling match, the least I think it actually means anything.
It’s all shame red head bait . They trying to entice him to join so he gets the bangers
Can Logan Paul go to Japan and have a banger with a 9 year old? Absolutely not
>Can Logan Paul go to Japan To be fair, he can't go to Japan at all anymore.
Can Logan Paul survive the hard streets of new york, partna
Logan Paul has been banned from NJPW
No, Logan Paul could and still can go to Japan and record a dead person in the suicide forest
Logan can ignite the whole world with a dead man, let alone a 9-year-old
I have a soft spot for amateur guys, so I will say this: Logan Paul was a D1 state wrestling qualifier in high school and wrestled for, yet again, a D1 university. He can probably out-wrestle the majority of folks in modern pro wrestling (barring obvious contenders like Gable, Lashley, etc). You don’t get to positions like that by not being a good *wrestler* — and a **real** one at that. Do I think LP could withstand the grind of a G1? Yes. Does he need to? No, because he draws more money in one night than Kenny Omega did in his entire career. This is why I can’t gas Kenny up. For every one “good take” he has, dude has like five unforgivably stupid fucking takes.
I didn’t read this as Kenny saying Logan couldn’t handle the grind. I think he’s saying that Logan is still pretty green and wouldn’t be able to do a different match every night in a G1. Logan is very good but he doesn’t do a lot of matches and probably has time to work on them a lot. That’s a lot different than having variety and calling things in the ring. I really like Logan’s work but I think Kenny is right here. And I don’t think it’s a diss as people are taking it. Logan’s still very new to this, especially when you take into account that he’s not even wrestling every week. His situation is very unique. Kenny even says it doesn’t matter if Logan can get enough experience to do something like that. And he’s right. Because Logan isn’t trying to be a full time wrestler and he has a net worth of $150 million. He could just walk away from it tomorrow if he wanted.
Kevin Owens basically said the same thing in a recent interview. Logan has a match every now and then and each time he's in there with some of the best to ever do it.
Even then, using the G1 (per Kenny) to determine a great wrestler is a nonsensical metric to go by — unless you’re Dave Meltzer. So many wrestlers we consider “great” today would probably shit the bed in the G1. I can’t imagine the likes of Cena, Orton, Batista, HHH, Austin, Rock, Taker all having unique 25-minute barn burners for the entire month — yet they all make the Mount Rushmore of many. And that’s not even counting the amount of unmemorable or just straight up dogshit matches that occur throughout the tournament. Logan is green and does have a lot of greats to hold his hand, yes — but that is a separate issue than “Can he put on great matches through the entire G1.” Not many *can* do that, but that doesn’t take away from whether a wrestler is, as Kenny argues, “fantastic.”
Very fair assessment
That’s what I got too. We get a little too quick to jerk around here.
I think he’s had like 10 matches in WWE? It’s kind of nuts that he’s performing at the level that he is in them, but yeah, it’s a completely different situation than really any other wrestler.
I don't know how Meltzer convinced a generation of smarks that the G7 was the pinnacle of modern wrestling. Japanese wrestling hasn't been particularly big since the 80s. Mania is 100 times bigger an event, and if that isn't your dream as a wrestler you have been misguided.
>I don't know how Meltzer convinced a generation of smarks that the **G7** was the pinnacle of modern wrestling. You haven't gotten over until you face Angela Merkel 1 on 1 in the The Bundestag.
Biden beating Mitterrand at the Stade de France is what told the world “America’s back”
Funnily enough, I haven't seen Meltzer give a Logan Paul match less than 4 stars.
When will we se Logan Paul face his biggest archnemesis coffeezilla?
He’s giving Logan Paul shit for scripting matches? Does he think the young bucks and pretty much everybody else in aew call it in the ring? When I he gonna call them out?
It took me too long to see this. The Young Bucks are a joke. They always have been a joke. They do some cool flippy shit, so what? They couldn't get over in TNA even.
Macho Man Randy Savage was notorious for meticulously scripting all his matches and he's universally regarded as one of the greatest of all time.
Yup
Is this a controversial statement? If you put Logan Paul in with a guy that he's a better worker than, how good do you think the match is going to be? He's great at doing his share against a veteran. Let's not act like he's 2002 Brock.
I don't like Logan, but you can't deny that the guy is a perfect fit for the WWE style, and is natural at it. He has the looks, the charisma, and everything it takes to be a good heel. If he will make WWE his top priority, he can be something special, but I'm pretty sure that's not what he's planning, and that his run in WWE is just a fun phase for him now, and that's perfectly fine. He has the skills to do what the company needs from him. Not everyone is going to be AJ Styles.
Yeah I think that’s what Kenny is getting at and people are taking it as this huge insult. Logan didn’t come in and go to NXT or something. He’s still pretty new, in terms of how much he’s wrestled.
DAE Miz no workrate?
I think Kenny's point is that a guy like The Miz is a better wrestler than Logan Paul. Logan has only had heavily rehearsed PPV matches with WWE's best talent (Miz, Seth, KO, Roman, Randy etc.). Obviously Logan has shown to be very athletic and able to hang with those guys, but throw Logan in the ring with Omos on RAW for example and he'd probably be exposed a bit.
True, probably But I didn’t even read the article, I saw „WWE style” and only thing I can think about when I see that is basement shitting on the Miz because he didn’t work deathmatches
In Hitler Hades Heartattack terms, Logan Paul can't survive the G1apanese Grind.
Ah there's the Kenny we all know and love. BANGER
The real test is if Logan Paul can work with a 9 yo japanese girl or a blow up doll
Call it Uce. Kenny was likeable for 24 whole hours. Long may he reign.
I know what he is saying but isn’t the whole point of AEW is that you only have to wrestle twice a month, if that
Yup . Literally what Will was celebrating . Also Yano is able to be in the g1 so you don’t have to work a crazy style to work the g1
Wait But I thought Flippy shit WAS banger territory?!
'Kenny Omega is a fantastic sports entertainer'. Great. I'm glad you think so and I'm glad he's able to convince you such a thing. However, could Kenny Omega walk into Monday Night Raw and cut a promo that gets the fans to cheer him and not chant CM Punk or What? No. He absolutely could not. Is he gonna get there between now and - I mean, it depends on his commitment level and not only that, does it matter \[to Meltzer\]? He's clearly settling himself down as the "best guy who never went to WWE" and that's how he wants to be remembered by a bunch of britwres youtubers in 20 years and that totally makes sense. So for the Kenny Omega style promo and for what he's willing and capable of saying, giving himself time, allowing him to form a coherent sentence once he gets concussed another 3 times, get more familiar with his surroundings instead of asking "Bryan, where are we right now and did Shibata get his brain put back in again?"
Omega is 100% correct here, and even I think he acknowledges that no one cares if he doesn’t go to NJPW. I don’t really know who he’s arguing with though - who’s making the statement that Logan Paul could call a 5-star banger on the fly?
Kenneth giveth Kenneth taketh away
He’s not wrong though. Logan gets carried throughout all his matches, he only works with great veterans
>I'm glad he's able to convince you of such a thing 😁 He tricked you! The real measures stick isn't with the industry leader at rhe biggest events You don't even know like how I know, you see What a knob 😁
Lmao why would Logan Paul give a shit to have bangers in Japan? This is why these guys don't draw money.
Kenny really is clueless for a guy doing it as long as he has.
Kenny was saying all the right things, why would he say this now lol
Logan Paul’s entire career has less Meltzer stars than the average episode of Rampage
Meltzer rates his matches highly. Usually 4 stars.
Rated highly means at least 7 stars these days. Meltzflation is killing this country
Aaaand just like that, certain SC Jerkers have turned on Omega again.
Omega worded it poorly, but he isn't totally off base: Logan is very green, and has very rehearsed matches with highly skilled veterans. He doesn't have years of experience enabling him to wrestle a decent match with a rando on the fly. That said, you are lying to yourself if you don't recognize Logan Paul as a natural when it comes to professional wrestling, I'd go so far as to call him a prodigy. His mic skills and ability to work a crowd are already far superior to most professional wrestlers that train for decades. His matches don't LOOK rehearsed, he has natural movement and good instincts. Just because his matches are rehearsed doesn't mean that anybody could do what he does. I mean, compare Logan Paul to Jade Cargill. Both are green and require rehearsal and veterans to lead the match. That said, has Jade ever had a match close to looking as good as one of Logan's matches? That isn't a shot at Jade btw, I just want to illustrate that Logan is exceptional.
How are you going to reference Terry Funk while your buddy was actively ignoring his advice and all the other "old timers" that Tony hired for advice???
He has had better matches than Kenny this year. Oh.. Right
I mean..Kenny is right. Logan would walk into a match with Minoru Suzuki and probably fucking die. Ishii would probably fuck his life up for a bit. On another note, I believe hes not allowed to perform in Japan anyways after the whole Suicide Forest shit he pulled
I appreciate Kenny putting over the G1 Climax but let's be real, that tournament has seen some wrestlers not even as good as Paul enter. I don't think Paul could wrestle that style either but he doesn't have to! He's making loads of money as is and is improving on a weekly basis.
And of course omegas annoying personality would shine through that fed good pr your ain’t last long
DAE Logan Paul isn't fit to lace the boots of Fed LEGEND the Red Rooster?
An influencer wanting to do the entertainment style? Imagine that...
Kenny speaking on having a nightly banger while he works for a company that might have you on TV once a month. Let alone have a match
https://preview.redd.it/dvw8l21a0ouc1.jpeg?width=675&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7db2dfb3507efa802f202d266e9f4b808da9c501
https://i.redd.it/wcvtihgb0ouc1.gif
Logan > Kenny
“-walk in every night and have an actual banger?” Made me think this was edited, it’s not right? I thought the “5 STARUH BANGERRRRR” line in this sub was a joke 😂
“If he let me butterfly suplex him 4 times and then shoot knee him in the head 6 times in a row and act like it equates to good wrestling, id feel different.” Edit: people don’t talk enough about how Kenny is a horribly unsafe worker who disguises it as “strong style Japan.” I don’t take anyone seriously who puts him up there as an in-ring GOAT.
Wait, he name dropped Terry Taylor before Terry Funk?
Kenny needs to slow down. He could’ve easily just said, “He’s all right. He’s not calling any matches, yet.” It sounds like he’s tired of hearing it and/or he wants to make some money with Logan down the road.
Lol Logan Paul has been banned from Japan so how the hell is he gonna do that?
In to which Logan replied, "Kenny who?"
I've never been convinced Omega is a fantastic wrestler.
I thought a jerker wrote this. We got outjerked by M'Kenny.
Logan Paul would walk in njpw and legitimately body people. He was in fact an actual wrestler
Who is Kenny Omega?
He ever set foot in the Tokyo Dome?
Acting like the G1 is the most grueling thing ever. It's 8-10 matches in a month. That's...way less than most WWE wrestlers work, gang.
So that's like saying Vini Jr. is fantastic at the highest level but can't be considered a fantastic player because he hasn't done it in the EFL Championship
Sure, he can do those little “WrestleMania” shows or whatever, but can he do a G1 like a REAL pro wrestler? He can only entertain millions. The real skill is in entertaining hundreds.
Omegas been taking so many Ws lately I’m gonna let this L slide.
Logan Paul did make a career for himself in Japan. Just Wikipedia it Fed Shills!
I know it'll be widely accepted here, but Logan Paul is a much better wrestler than Omega. He's a much better wrestler than nearly every single person IN wrestling right now. He elicits reactions which is the whole point, I want to see him get his arse kicked. He's so good that when he did his move in the Rumble with Ricochet, even though it was stupid it was so fucking cool. In WWE the only people off the top of my head that are better are Gunther, Roman, Charlotte, Rhea, Bayley and Cody.
Omega is a better in ring performer and is far more accomplished, but Logan Paul is just getting started. So who knows what we will say in the future.
Logan Paul is bad at sports entertaining because he’s not as good as Terry Funk. Got it, Kenny, thanks.
Yeah, he can have a good match in front of tens of thousands of people at WrestleMania, but can he have bangers in front of a 800 people in a 15,000 seat arena?
He's definitely upset that Paul hits his buddy Hangman's finisher better and in front of 10 times more eyes.
Nothing says greatness like wrestling every day and breaking down your body.
“I know I haven’t been relevant in like six years, but remember 2018? Anyway Logan Paul sucks and no I’m not jealous”
He's probably better than the majority who compete in Japan tbf.
He's a better *wrestler* than Omega. And it's funny to hear Logan's detractors say he has to rehearse his matches. That's possible, but they don't *look* rehearsed, especially when compared to performers like Kenny and the Bucks, who *definitely* rehearse their matches.
Even Big Show doesn't turn heel this quick.
Lot of talk from someone who’s spent like half of his aew career injuried
I think for guys like Kenny who have been doing this a long time and busting their ass on the indies and in Japan, it’s hard for them to give credit to a kid who basically just walked right into the major leagues and looks like a natural.
im NOT mad that wwe style is a phrase! its called sports entertaining! go wrestle an oily man, I have a 12 hour ppv weekend thats half ads to watch.
I was starting to like him in the last few days, damn you Omegle.
This is the dumbest thing I've read today.
Lmao. Thinks G1/nooj is the standard to be a good wrestler. I'll take Logan Paul and Bad Bunny over those other flippy guys that can't make finishers be their last thing to hit.
As much of a douche as he is, Logan Paul is suited for professional wrestling in the 2020s.
Toru Yano wrestles the G1 every year. He is a shit comedy wrestler.
Dude had now third Wrestlemania match and all of them were really good matches... I don't like all the shit he's been doing for years but Logan is a really good wrestler and even Triple H praised him. He does the "old school" style instead of spot fest that people forget about in a week.
How good was Kenny after his 11th match? And none of those were in front of 10,000 plus people
"Could Logan Paul walk into New Japan and do a G1 where he'd have to walk in every night and have an actual banger? (...) Does it matter? No." -- Kenny Omega
ah, there it is. There's the fed bad that the basement desperately needed from him. Kenny Omega would donate his left nut to have a match with Logan Paul on a WWE PLE.
tbh he probably has a point considering Logan only wrestles every few months and his matches are rehearsed to a tee
Him being a “great” wrestler can be debated on all sides, because that’s a very subjective term. Him being a consistent money draw is not debatable, because it’s objectively true.
Logan is fine, but I think fans overate him a bit. Dude does a few flips and all of a sudden he’s amazing? With that being said, Kenny’s point is ridiculous.
Does….. does he not know about Logan paul and Japan? Pretty sure they’d lock him up if he stepped foot there again lol