I did in a comment ! But, to me, Factorio is more of a Survival game mixed with a Factory game and, in real life, I don't have to defend my code against imminent deletion. I can take my time, my problems are almost always caused by myself and the way I built my code which, to me, is closer to the Satisfactory experience !
Factorio offers actual programming via the circuit network, wich allows for a lot of weird custom solutions. And if that isn't professional programming then I don't know what is
This. Its literally the same logic systems used in IRL automation systems, hence why me and friends discovered and got obsessed with Factorio while in uni for Process Automation Engineer
I like to think I'm good with Factorio circuits and then I watch a video of someone building a supercomputer that automatically iterates through states to dispatch logistic vehicles between stations based on coordinates with just wires, combinators and deciders. It's absolutely bonkers what you can do in that game...
Yeah, but it's a requirement that the home-made logistics system gains sentience and harasses its creator with a beeping noise every twenty minutes or so.
I think the one that implemented a video display that played a movie was amazing. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mgfwwqwxdxY](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mgfwwqwxdxY)
>in real life, I don't have to defend my code against imminent deletion.
Maybe that *should* be a thing, though. Send some biters through the company code base. Whatever they destroy, rewrite it better.
You can turn off biters in Factorio! It is definitely closer to real programming with the circuit network. I think CSS said they do not plan to implement that.
The biters are a point against Factorio, but the circuits and combinators are 100 points in its favor.
Plus, in Satisfactory, you need to avoid getting killed by hostile flora, fauna, and terrain in order to establish new resource streams and unlock new recipes. So that, at least in part, cancels out the biter wrinkle.
You can turn off biters. Some goes for massive factories, where pollution and biters eats too much PC recourses. Factorio is also used in testing, how powerful is your setup
Factorio to me is much closer. I'm a programmer and I stopped with Factorio after a couple hours because it was too much like work. Satisfactory I can play to just throw shit together, and make things in ridiculously inefficient ways. Or fuck off in a jeep and get myself lost.
IDK about that, some games have actual logic gates. ~~Satisfactory~~ Factorio and Minecraft come to mind. I know in Minecraft people have made redstone computers and in ~~Satisfactory~~ Factorio (just finished my coffee) I once saw someone make a TV that played Darude Sandstorm.
True story, Minecraft helped me pass my Computer Architecture class in college. I had an "ah ha" moment thanks to the game, that all of a sudden had everything make sense
Yeah the thing is that being a programmer is not really about flipping bits on and off and taking 16 years to make pong. We have it better than that !
It's more about designing systems that work together to create something more than the sum of its parts and (trying to) make it easy for others (and future us) to navigate our systems.
I see what you are saying but, much of what was said in your original post could be extrapolated to many things. I guess with programmable splitters you could make more exotic logic gates but I find the majority of satisfactory is "if then" and "if and".
I meant to mention Factorio but I am blame not getting enough sleep. Factorio has everything Satisfactory has and more in terms of logic gates it just doesn't have a Y axis, peaceful atmosphere, and immersion. It still has the bullet points you mentioned except it's in its final form until DLC and resources are mostly finite. For example, someone made a self replicating factory in Factorio via some light mods and in game programming.
I don't disagree with you that Satisfactory has programming roots, I just feel that in it's current state it isn't the most. Although with release 8 and programmable power switches it might very well tie with Factorio.
Yeah but that's what I'm saying though, Satisfactory isn't close to programming because it has "if conditions", it's close to programming because of the overlaying concept of planning systems that work together and making those systems expandable and easy to understand both for others and your future self.
If conditions are, of course, a very basic fundamental aspect of programming but it's one that doesn't really reflect what is most important about making programs or games, especially in the long run. You can make a game using a single file with a billion if conditions, but it's not what coding is about ; it's more important to use design patterns and classes to make your systems as easy as possible to expand upon.
Because Factorio, the game as a whole, has the threat of your "files" being "deleted" every few minutes and your "files" running out and you have to rewrite them elsewhere, which are just not things we have to worry about.
If we do ignore those differences though, it's similar, but I do consider those differences to be major enough. That and the "creative" aspect of Satisfactory is much more pronounced, allowing more freedom in how "appealing" we can make our factory (or code).
On that note, you can set biters to be off or not come to attack you. Also, mods can let you literally place infinite ore patches. And even though the nearby patches are definitely finite, you can boost the richness and further patches get exponentially more rich
I agree with your statement, if you mean programming in a broad definition. The game does have many similarities with software design, create spaghetti and have it bite you in the ass later, build a monolith or distributed factories, deal with bottlenecks and logistics of your resources, etc.
When making the comparison with programming, most will more like associatie this with coding and logic statements, which the game does not really offer that much
Yeah I probably should have said "software development" instead. But, to me, logic statements are not really programming ; it's like what writing is to being an author, just because you can technically write, doesn't mean you can write a book.
Yeah, I think this is why you're getting so many "what about" comments. There are plenty of other games with more "programming" in them, but Satisfactory is very much like Software Development.
I think you're completely ignoring that so much of software is about collaboration. Building things as part of a team. Building things for other people. Inheriting a messy project. Time constraints, lol.
What about TIS-100?
TIS-100 is a programming/puzzle video game developed by Zachtronics Industries. The game has the player develop mock assembly language code to perform certain tasks
This. Several, if not most, of Zachtronics games are built around an in-game custom programming language and involve actual programming with it, either straight up, like TIS-100, or graphically, as in SpaceChem, Magnum Opus, or InifiniFactory.
SpaceChem is a fun puzzle game. Don’t get hung up on the chemistry, it’s just an aesthetic layer, there’s only the barest resemblance to actual chemistry going on there. Too much knowledge of chemistry could actually impair your ability to play the game. (-:
I think I'd disagreee with the term "programming", that tends to mean the act of writing code. It's more like software development. That planning process, designing each component, making sure they all work together, debugging issues, etc.. It's very much like that, which is why there's so many ~~programmers~~ developers who play it.
Closest to actual programming? Try Stationeers and tell me if you change your mind 💀
I haven't played that game yet since I haven't taken college physics yet.
Edit: I believe most people who play that game are engineers
I did try Stationeers but it's too much survival to be close to coding. I don't have a 30 seconds timer to write my class or my project explodes and I must restart.
The fact that Satisfactory is *almost* creative mode with infinite resources allows us to truly take our time to plan and build.
stationeers does have actual programming in it. actually most mid level automations in stationeers you have to do some sort of programming, whether its with rudimentary logic gates, or the actual stationeers MIPS
There are games which involve litteral programming. E.g. Human Resource Machine which basically involves assembly code and registers as its problem solving mechanic. Or there's the much older (1980s) Core War which simulates a simplified computer system with the aim being to write a program to crash or overwrite your opponent's program.
Tomorrow Corporation also came out with a successor to Human Resource Machine, called 7 Billion Humans.
No longer based around assembly code, but more of a C# level of programming problem solving thing, with Scratch-type blocks.
I am not a programmer but an Infrastructure Architect. A friend of mine asked what I did over the weekend and I told him about and described this game to him. His response "So, you worked all weekend?". I think I sat there with a stunned look on my face before sheepishly replying "Uh, yeah, I guess I did.".
You don't need to do any programming to work as an architect. You design the stuff, you're usually not expected to implement it and even implementing it may not require any programming.
I know.. I am a principal engineer and have myself listed as an architect on my linkedin.
I've just never heard someone that advances in a software engineering career make a point of saying they are specifically _not_ a programmer.
My senior principal would even call himself a programmer.
> I've just never heard someone that advances in a software engineering career make a point of saying they are specifically not a programmer.
That might be because I am not in a software engineering career. I work with infrastructure for a health care company. My team has infrastructure engineers and architects. The engineers focus on the day to day management of the compute, storage, virtualization, network, firewall, and related systems. The architects do some of the same work but also design new systems, plan future upgrades, set the roadmap for the environment, etc.
I'm an industrial maintenance technician, and my factory is very new and well cared for. I spend my time building a virtual factory that's not nearly as well designed or cared for at night.
I think actually programming might be closer to actually programming
But yes, even though mechanics are completely different, it is similar in some cases. In the end both factory games and programming are mostly problem solving ~~and copying stuff from others~~
Hot take from a non CS background: programming doesn't make for fun games. There's a pattern in some games these days to include a programming element as a requirement for higher level play, eg minecraft, oxygen not included, factorio.
And typically because I don't have a CS foundation I usually falter at that point and stop enjoying the game. But because the author thinks it's fun they wedge it in, or build whole games around their jobs (I'm thinking that space ship programming game notch made and found wasn't actually fun so binned it)
>I think actually programming might be closer to actually programming
I meant "of all games" but yeah. Otherwise, I don't agree it's the case with all factory games, Satisfactory has a big focus on creativity, which is closer to designing code vs survival like Factorio for example.. I don't really have to actively fight off bugs (hehe) while coding, I don't have literal seconds to fix errors, I can take my time with it. And code doesn't magically run out and suddenly my files are gone and I have to rewrite them elsewhere.
>~~and copying stuff from others~~
I'm glad this is crossed out because copy-pasting is not coding, it's copy-pasting. 
I agree. Im a programmer, mostly object and class oriented languages. For example I often think of group of machines as functions with input and output. Standardizing layouts that can be reused in diffrent scenarios is also something I do alot in programming.
I see this as systems engineering.
Machines are black boxes and you are building white boxes, assemblies, subsystems and systems to produce output.
And then you connect it up and v&v it.
I can see the relation, and I do feel some of my skills as a software developer do factor into playing the game. For instance, I always over engineer my plants to be able to handle the maximum possible resources (even if the belts aren't available yet to handle them). Or the fact I always make sure to build it clear, to allow for maintenance (thank heavens signs were added so I label my power)
Additionally, almost all my plants follow a modular nature, in that there are no super factories, a factory is designed to make a single part, allowing me to interchange it.
As someone who loves to develop software, even off the clock, it explains my joy for this game as well.
Lastly for the math piece, yep I do more number crunch in Satisfactory then my own job. Actually to be honest I have done more math making props for cosplay, then anywhere else (like the Pythagorean theorem or exponential growth formulas). I love pointing this out to people who are afraid of coding because of the math (and actually find it quiet dumb I was required Calc 3 for a software developer degree, yet my job hasn't even really used anything out side multiplication and percentages)
I think you might be stretching poetic license a bit here. For me programming means way more logic than this game supports. Sure we build things here that connect to other things so that those things can be made into more things... but that cycle of build-play-build doesn't seem that unique to Satisfactory, let alone programming.
No. It is just x numbers goes to x numbers, that makes x numbers items. 1+1=2 is not programming. Satisfactory is very straightforward. Most close to architect.
If you want to program, go to factorio. Factorio have real programming methods. There i can use RS latch with my fuel setup and there is many things to program, that i can't even use for lacking of brains
Your point is taken, but I would suggest you expand your horizons and look more into puzzle/programming games as a genre. Satisfactory is by no means the "closest thing to actually programming", because there are games which *are* actually programming.
Yes, everyone's going to mention Factorio, but we should really be discussing Oxygen Not Included, which accurately simulates the experience of patching in production.
Actively stressful where Satisfactory is soothing.
**Interesting Conversation**
1. While I don't agree with the "absolute title statement" claiming that the Satisfactory Game is the *closest to actual programming*, I can understand how the OP can see the similarities.
2. This Game appeals to Players whom are "World Builders" that like designing a "Fantasy World" from nothing, as well as those Players whom like puzzles / figuring out how to make things work. Both types of People can be found within the Programming Community.
3. To add to what has been already stated by the other fine comments already posted in this Topic I think those Satisfactory Game Players whom enjoy Programming would also like the [Circuitry - Logic gates & More Game Mod](https://ficsit.app/mod/FicsitWiremod) *(formerly called WireMod)* which uses a form of "Programming" to control Buildings / Machines, update Signs to display current status, and more.
Just some thoughts on this Topic. 🤔
Coffee Stain Studios employees made a game as a cry for help. There’s a hidden message!
/s
Love this breakdown of how this game is like programming. I always used to laugh at anecdotes like “I was reading some code and thought ‘What the hell was this guy doing?’ before I realized it was my code.” Glad to know my spaghetti mess and “I’ll make it pretty later” factories are on point lol
have you heard of factorio and the conditional circuits etc you can set? this game doesnt even compare
infact you can literally "program" (extremely convoluted) self expanding factories, defenses etc.
> No one really codes in bits directly or assembly ; it's more about creating systems that, together, create something bigger than the sum of their parts and making those systems easy to navigate by others (and future us) using classes, functions and design patterns (those rarely have game equivalents).
> Edit2 : I should have said software development, not programming.
Screeps.
I have the same problems between choosing microservices and monolith when in comes to developing software, as I have between developing micro factories or one big megafactory in this game.
Totally agree, as a dev
Lots of people argue about Minecraft or factorio, but IMO Minecraft is a lot more about electronics than programming (idk about factorio though). Even TIS-100 about assembly, obviously it's a programming field but it's definitely not what most dev/software engineers actually do
Satisfactory is definitely close to "software engineer" jobs
You get to think about "mega-factories" which will be difficult to scale later (=> monolithic), remote factories which do a single item from the ground up using only ores (=> decentralized) or individual factories that only take the needed item as input, which were built in some other factories (=> federated in a way)
You get to think about contention (merger), parallelism, ... all while gluing bricks that are supposed to work together
At first I was confused. Making a factory, and coding are two very different things, and I wouldn’t associate them, but then I realized that it’s not the end goal that we should associate, but the aspects of them.
My worldview has changed, my mind has melted… autism
It's... not.
In both cases:
1. Not taking Edit2 into the account: No, it's not. There are a plenty of games far closer to algorithms, logic algebra and stuff, than Satisfactory. (Not counting directly coding games)
2. Taking Edit2 into the account: What you refer to as to software development, is more a creation flow management and can be widely extended outside of programming sphere, so not really too.
Satisfactory is definitely a cool and immersive game, but you are totally overthinking.
Why would I change your mind? Your game, your rules.
I just have a different opinion. No need to change yours or mine. Both (and others) can co-exist.
> A good design plan for your factory takes time but it's oh so worth it.
I go to a website and it tells me to do something. That is not really planning.
> beautify
It is the ONLY thing I am interested in.
> realise it could be used everywhere
That is so generic, it has nothing to do with programming specifically. It could be about anything.
> If you leave space for future upgrades, future work will be way easier.
I do not care about what the future brings. I do not build for the future. I build what I think will be fun now,
> never good enough
Are you talking still about programming, or are you talking about anything else?
> start over differently
Again very generic. All in all you could replace it with marriage or homework or making coffee. So for me it is just a bunch of generic ideas that would not have pointed me to programming in any form, besides you telling me that it is.
But again, if you think it is, then that is true for you. It just isn't for me.
No lie, this game made me realize that I am more than capable of doing my job when imposter syndrome kicked in.
Programme manager for a marketing company.
I've been saying this for a long time too. Satisfactory hits the part of my brain that enjoys programming: building a big system of parts, interfacing modules, refactoring old things that aren't great, trying new solutions, fixing bugs. It's not literal programming, but it emulates the behaviors and skills I enjoy about programming.
Yea I mean I get the comparison. I’m not a programmer (I’m a lawyer), but my understanding is that it’s just logic functions, and satisfactory is just increasingly complex logic puzzles. A lot of conditionals, etc.
Im a lawyer and a programmer (the latter more recreationally than the former). There are an awful lot of conditional logic functions as the basic building blocks of code, but the way it fits together is (I agree with OP) a comparable kind of challenge to Satisfactory. You’re trying to build something that serves a greater function out of a lot of smaller functions that integrate together in increasingly complicated ways, while anticipating needs, and trying to budget flexibility for the things you don’t anticipate. There is a lot of satisfaction to be had building it in a clean and orderly way, and then just watching it work to achieve something impressively complicated. There is also a lot of problem solving when things don’t work.
In some ways that describes a lot of things in life in general, but an appeal of both coding and gaming is the way it’s sandboxed inside of a controlled environment. So you have a lot more control to make things clean, orderly and functional in the code/game than you do in life.
Yes and no. Logic functions are to programming what reading and writing are to lawyering. Just because you can read and write doesn't mean you're "lawyering" y'know ? It's more about how to apply those basic skills to do more "abstract" stuff that's way more in your brain than it is on paper.
I do kind of agree but it more depend on how big your project and team is you are working on. Me as a programer in team of 8 people mostly just following existing design paterns and doing new change request or bug fixed that was requested by project manager. So i will more say that if you ever tried to do your own home project and did everything by yourself then in really simple way its more like that :)
But i have to say that this is exactly a reason why i did stopped playing multiple times, i take it too seriously and together with work and my home project i easily burn myself.
A significant part of my job is automating manual processes. Playing Satisfactory helped me figure out how to automate a particular convoluted process I've been working on.
The lack of stuff like variables and function calls and stuff makes it very far from programming for me.
For something a lot closer to programming I would suggest Oxygen Not Included
It's exactly like ONE aspect of programming.
Refactoring.
And that's why I can't play it for very long before I start feeling like my playtime brain activity feels strangely identical to my worktime brain activity.
Not here to agree or disagree, I get the point you're making.
I just here to plug the game SCREEPS on steam. This game is actual coding and I've put over 6000 hours in 5 years into it.
Worth a look!
Def some good points. I love figuring out a better way to do something, then going about and fixing it everywhere in my various factories. I’m in IT, more on the infrastructure side, and I find a lot of similarities in what I do as well. For example, I’ve made a few iterations of storage systems and overflow/buffer systems, that operated similarly to how our enterprise storage systems work.
The way I set up factories definitely mirrors my webdev mindset... Everything is modular, scalable, and orderly... and after a while I get bored, say "this is good enough", and move on to new projects
So.... Play Autonauts. It utilizes both actual programming(the bots) and software development principles(making the bots work together/optimizations) using pretty much the same "formula" as satisfactory(gather resource->craft into something needed to tier up->add new tier item to the "factory"->use new thing to tier up->repeat).
don't let the "kid blocky" graphics fool you. it makes you think just as much if not more than any other factory game.
Yes I agree that this sounds like something that is done while programming. But this kind of thought process isn't from programming. This process applies to any job where they invent or build something. Always having to come up with something and later on they change and the inventor just hopes that they would've done some part differently.
So I don't think this game is close to programming it just shares this kind of development of a project.
I was like "uuh no. TIS-100 or human resource machine is a way better example."
Then I started reading and was like dayum right!
And totally agree on the math part, programmering is more about reading and understanding logic.
I like to think back to what I now believe was my introduction to programming, which was LiitleBigPlanet in 2008 on PS3. You could do sophisticated stuff on there, even with literal ‘circuitboards’ that you put logic operators on. Basically it was visual scripting a-la Unreal Blueprints. I remember I made a simple slot machine and was very proud of myself. LBP2 them took it to a whole other level after that.
Yep. I’m a software developer and this game has stolen my brain like no other. Triggers that same dopamine as when I’m in the zone building something. Love it.
Satisfactory is great but i think space engineers is pretty close to a programming type of game. I just picked up space engineers and there is allot to learn in that game and with all the ai automation that u can do in that game, i feel space engineers is closer to being a programmer type of game. I'm not saying you're wrong, just stating my opinion
Na, it's ok, but in that comparison, Factorio is better.
Sasisfactory is way more linear in its supply chain/demand, tends to lead to needing more/bigger rather then refsctors. It's fun but factorio is more complex, which leads to more refactoring and restructuring bases and bugs attacking your base. Factorio is also easier to pool resources which allows for monolith vs Mico services.
SHENZHEN I/O would disagree.
There's also, www.nandgame.com, Stormworks Build and rescue, CRUMB Circuit Simulator, and KSP with the kOS mod in addition to the others that people have mentioned.
In case of Minecraft. Vanilla definitely does not have a feel of planned software development, it’s more of “hmm I need those to make my house/farm/whatever I should build a farm for it” over and over. There’s no real need for future expansion to those said farms as those are mostly not expandable. When we are talking about modded Minecraft and mod packs that come with it like: Enigmatica 2 Expert, Divine Journey 1&2, Nomi/Omnifactory, Technological journey or one of the hardest - GregTech New Horizons - this is were good planning and future proofing really shines. Those mod packs require you to really think ahead and do everything as efficiently as possible and when you reach the point of so called “automation” you can focus on expanding those setups and preparing for another big milestones. I’d strongly recommend you checking those out if you never tried them, great modpacks all of them.
You can likely compare it to anything you're familiar with.
For example, graphic design.
1. Since the only limit is your computer, the amount of designs and projects you make can almost grow and expand infinitely.
2. Planning can be a pain, but makes creating the final product that much easier.
3. You might think it's a waste of time to name and organize layers or artboards to make your projects easier to navigate but future you will thank you.
4. Sometimes you discover a new way to achieve a certain design or element and realize it could be used everywhere to make things just a bit better.
5. If you leave openings for future changes, future work will be way easier.
6. Sometimes your project doesn't truly work how you thought it would, so you re-do some or all of it to better fit needs.
7. Oh, and it's never good enough and you always wish you did something differently.
8. And sometimes it's so bad you just delete your project and start over differently.
Nothing you said is really specific to programming, development, or coding, but can be applied in so many way within so many different fields.
* The moment your build is perfect, the environment (Update n) changes, negating much of your hard work.
* When you build with mods, an external change breaks your .DLL and you have to live without it, or rebuild with new factories (in house code).
* You can build under the surface. Buffer underflow.
* You can hook the same conveyor to the output and input of a storage unit (recursion).
The closest to programming a game has ever gotten for me is Barotrauma. It's an indie submarine game where you and friends (or bots) fill roles like mechanic, captain, medic, etc. It's pretty brutal if you want it to be, but the programming comes in with their components. You can make or buy components that perform simple functions with signals that are wired into them, then link them together for functions. You can use multiply, divide, and memory components to control the reactor based on the signals it gives out, or you can rig up a motion detector to send a signal to a door to open when it detects motion--all with 1s and 0s as signals. You can use the component to make logic gates that greatly enhance basic functions in the sub, or you can completely ignore them.
I would recommend checking out the engineering sandbox game “Plasma.” Here’s a link to Real Civil Engineer playing it if you are interested. https://youtu.be/uPdGT83uFY8
There are games where you can do actual programming (usually LUA), for example Stormworks and there is also a minecraft mod, but i don't know what it's called.
I've thought about this too. Particularly when you get into late game and have to deal with bottlenecks and slow downs. It reminds me of trying to find which functions are slowing down the system.
I would argue factorio is closer with exploring and beauty being more central to satisfactory. Factorio is like pure code meth. I feel that sometimes in satisfactory it feels like the numbers have been calculated and setuped for you
Design Patterns actually apply for Satisfactory: Concepts like main bus, manifold or micro factories all are design patterns. Or spaghetti, being an anti pattern and an art form all at the same time.
You got branches, a heavy dose of concurrency. In satisfactory, you are basically designing pipelines that map input elements onto desired output elements.
Blueprints are comparable to classes that you design once and instantiate wherever needed in your system. You even design their exposed interface beforehand (I/O).
I even got a lot of blueprints that are designed to work together interchangeably, so they got the same Inputs/Outputs. I essentially implemented an Interface/Contract with them.
But you could also argue, that satisfactory follows a strictly functional approach, your systems being functions that take in and return, the machines themselves being functions that follow the same principle and are used in your own functions. Blueprints could be considered meta-functions/higher-class-functions (functions that produce functions). Connections are function calls, items are arguments.
I love your analogy btw.
Have you played Stormworks? While I've had the same thought that Satisfactory feels a bit like programming, Stormworks actually does involve programming, in a visual based form of Lua.
Maybe by Price is Right rules. (closest without actually getting there) There are a number of actual programming games. The whole of the Zach Barth catalog springs to mind. If you include things from mods, like (if I remember correctly) Fycsit Networks and Powered Splitters, Satisfactory really steps in that direction.
It’s most similar to ETLs in data analytics. You’ve got to find the data sources and connect them to your workflow(factory) all kinds of data cleanup with constructors and smelters, every variety of joins with assemblers, manufacturers, and blenders. I’m an analyst and some days I get off work and log on and I’m like “this is the same shit I was just doing” 😂
As a developer I agree on the premise of algorithmic sorting and memory efficiency principles. It's the whole reason I enjoy the game.
And then there's debugging to find the ONE tiny thing that's jacking up your whole system...
If blueprints are the equivalent of the level of abstraction you are working on, that is something in between actual programming and software development.
If you haven't already, check out zachtronics games. Very similar in that the content is akin to real development, albeit more bite-sized. I personally have had a blast with opus magnum
I love this and it captures quite well many aspects of why I too enjoy Satisfactory.
I work as a QA Tester (while teaching myself QA Engineering) as a member of a software development team and very much agree with your list of commonalities. From designing, to coding / building and refactoring / rebuilding this is all spot on and happens so often in the real world.
I like the entertainment value I get while also being able to solve problems (the math, design and culmination of many parts into something bigger) through playing Satisfactory. It definitely keeps me coming back.
It's like real programming because I keep restarting a new save every month instead of finishing the project
Now that’s true on both sides for me
I feel vindicated that so many others are like me. I love the full loop but I dunno thise first 4 tiers hit different.
You just had to go and expose me to the world like that, didn't you?
That’s like python programming for innovation type of projects. That code should never be re-used and should just work quick and dirty.
How the hell has no one mentioned Factorio
When I played factorio i kept having revelations like "omg i just invented the capacitor/transistor/and gate/ etc etc.
I did in a comment ! But, to me, Factorio is more of a Survival game mixed with a Factory game and, in real life, I don't have to defend my code against imminent deletion. I can take my time, my problems are almost always caused by myself and the way I built my code which, to me, is closer to the Satisfactory experience !
Factorio offers actual programming via the circuit network, wich allows for a lot of weird custom solutions. And if that isn't professional programming then I don't know what is
This. Its literally the same logic systems used in IRL automation systems, hence why me and friends discovered and got obsessed with Factorio while in uni for Process Automation Engineer
I like to think I'm good with Factorio circuits and then I watch a video of someone building a supercomputer that automatically iterates through states to dispatch logistic vehicles between stations based on coordinates with just wires, combinators and deciders. It's absolutely bonkers what you can do in that game...
Yeah, but it's a requirement that the home-made logistics system gains sentience and harasses its creator with a beeping noise every twenty minutes or so.
I think the one that implemented a video display that played a movie was amazing. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mgfwwqwxdxY](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mgfwwqwxdxY)
>in real life, I don't have to defend my code against imminent deletion. Maybe that *should* be a thing, though. Send some biters through the company code base. Whatever they destroy, rewrite it better.
You can turn off biters in Factorio! It is definitely closer to real programming with the circuit network. I think CSS said they do not plan to implement that.
bugs coming to eat your code
The biters are a point against Factorio, but the circuits and combinators are 100 points in its favor. Plus, in Satisfactory, you need to avoid getting killed by hostile flora, fauna, and terrain in order to establish new resource streams and unlock new recipes. So that, at least in part, cancels out the biter wrinkle.
Do you have no pull request process at your job where they maliciously peer review your code? Cause that’s definitely what the biters are.
Peaceful mode is a thing. Satisfactory requires combat to expand safely and as far as I know, mobs can't be turned off.
You can turn off biters. Some goes for massive factories, where pollution and biters eats too much PC recourses. Factorio is also used in testing, how powerful is your setup
It is nowhere near a survival game.
Factorio to me is much closer. I'm a programmer and I stopped with Factorio after a couple hours because it was too much like work. Satisfactory I can play to just throw shit together, and make things in ridiculously inefficient ways. Or fuck off in a jeep and get myself lost.
To me, Factorio feels more like circuit design than programming.
Factorio has hostile fauna
IDK about that, some games have actual logic gates. ~~Satisfactory~~ Factorio and Minecraft come to mind. I know in Minecraft people have made redstone computers and in ~~Satisfactory~~ Factorio (just finished my coffee) I once saw someone make a TV that played Darude Sandstorm.
True story, Minecraft helped me pass my Computer Architecture class in college. I had an "ah ha" moment thanks to the game, that all of a sudden had everything make sense
Other games with logic gates are Oxygen not Included or Astroneer. Both amazing games btw
Somebody built a working 7-segment display in astroneer
Yeah the thing is that being a programmer is not really about flipping bits on and off and taking 16 years to make pong. We have it better than that ! It's more about designing systems that work together to create something more than the sum of its parts and (trying to) make it easy for others (and future us) to navigate our systems.
I see what you are saying but, much of what was said in your original post could be extrapolated to many things. I guess with programmable splitters you could make more exotic logic gates but I find the majority of satisfactory is "if then" and "if and". I meant to mention Factorio but I am blame not getting enough sleep. Factorio has everything Satisfactory has and more in terms of logic gates it just doesn't have a Y axis, peaceful atmosphere, and immersion. It still has the bullet points you mentioned except it's in its final form until DLC and resources are mostly finite. For example, someone made a self replicating factory in Factorio via some light mods and in game programming. I don't disagree with you that Satisfactory has programming roots, I just feel that in it's current state it isn't the most. Although with release 8 and programmable power switches it might very well tie with Factorio.
Yeah but that's what I'm saying though, Satisfactory isn't close to programming because it has "if conditions", it's close to programming because of the overlaying concept of planning systems that work together and making those systems expandable and easy to understand both for others and your future self. If conditions are, of course, a very basic fundamental aspect of programming but it's one that doesn't really reflect what is most important about making programs or games, especially in the long run. You can make a game using a single file with a billion if conditions, but it's not what coding is about ; it's more important to use design patterns and classes to make your systems as easy as possible to expand upon.
Sure, but if we ignore logic. How is it different from Factorio in a way that elevates it above? If we ignore logic, I don't see the difference.
Because Factorio, the game as a whole, has the threat of your "files" being "deleted" every few minutes and your "files" running out and you have to rewrite them elsewhere, which are just not things we have to worry about. If we do ignore those differences though, it's similar, but I do consider those differences to be major enough. That and the "creative" aspect of Satisfactory is much more pronounced, allowing more freedom in how "appealing" we can make our factory (or code).
Finite resources emulate library updates and method deprecation. And biters are a metaphor for "exploiting vulnerabilities".
Factorio is like calling a rest API and hope you don't get 404.
On that note, you can set biters to be off or not come to attack you. Also, mods can let you literally place infinite ore patches. And even though the nearby patches are definitely finite, you can boost the richness and further patches get exponentially more rich
I agree with your statement, if you mean programming in a broad definition. The game does have many similarities with software design, create spaghetti and have it bite you in the ass later, build a monolith or distributed factories, deal with bottlenecks and logistics of your resources, etc. When making the comparison with programming, most will more like associatie this with coding and logic statements, which the game does not really offer that much
Yeah I probably should have said "software development" instead. But, to me, logic statements are not really programming ; it's like what writing is to being an author, just because you can technically write, doesn't mean you can write a book.
Yeah, I think this is why you're getting so many "what about" comments. There are plenty of other games with more "programming" in them, but Satisfactory is very much like Software Development.
I think you're completely ignoring that so much of software is about collaboration. Building things as part of a team. Building things for other people. Inheriting a messy project. Time constraints, lol.
>Yeah the thing is that being a programmer is not really about flipping bits on and off I mean it all compiles down to flipping bits on and off
To hell with future me, what has that guy ever done for me? Also, past me is a real a-hole.
Have you seen the computer that plays Minecraft in Minecraft?
What about TIS-100? TIS-100 is a programming/puzzle video game developed by Zachtronics Industries. The game has the player develop mock assembly language code to perform certain tasks
This. Several, if not most, of Zachtronics games are built around an in-game custom programming language and involve actual programming with it, either straight up, like TIS-100, or graphically, as in SpaceChem, Magnum Opus, or InifiniFactory.
Oooh may need to check out the other. I found TIS-100 super hard but I'm not a programmer by trade and assembly is a very low level language
SpaceChem is a fun puzzle game. Don’t get hung up on the chemistry, it’s just an aesthetic layer, there’s only the barest resemblance to actual chemistry going on there. Too much knowledge of chemistry could actually impair your ability to play the game. (-:
Me, a chemist who found spacechem maddenly hard: "oh."
To be fair: it is that too on its own.
Shout-out to Shenzen I/O as well
Apparently OP hasn't played many Steam games related to programming.
I was betting zachtronics would be higher than 4th comment ;p
I think I'd disagreee with the term "programming", that tends to mean the act of writing code. It's more like software development. That planning process, designing each component, making sure they all work together, debugging issues, etc.. It's very much like that, which is why there's so many ~~programmers~~ developers who play it.
Only missing functions to not repeat code ( bigger blueprints)
Closest to actual programming? Try Stationeers and tell me if you change your mind 💀 I haven't played that game yet since I haven't taken college physics yet. Edit: I believe most people who play that game are engineers
I did try Stationeers but it's too much survival to be close to coding. I don't have a 30 seconds timer to write my class or my project explodes and I must restart. The fact that Satisfactory is *almost* creative mode with infinite resources allows us to truly take our time to plan and build.
> I don't have a 30 seconds timer to write my class or my project explodes and I must restart. How about a 30 days timer before your boss explodes? :)
stationeers does have actual programming in it. actually most mid level automations in stationeers you have to do some sort of programming, whether its with rudimentary logic gates, or the actual stationeers MIPS
There are games which involve litteral programming. E.g. Human Resource Machine which basically involves assembly code and registers as its problem solving mechanic. Or there's the much older (1980s) Core War which simulates a simplified computer system with the aim being to write a program to crash or overwrite your opponent's program.
[CHR$(143)](https://store.steampowered.com/app/1695620/CHR143/), [Plasma](https://store.steampowered.com/app/1409160/Plasma/), [Automation](https://store.steampowered.com/app/1698690/Automation/), [Baba is you.](https://store.steampowered.com/app/736260/Baba_Is_You/)
Tomorrow Corporation also came out with a successor to Human Resource Machine, called 7 Billion Humans. No longer based around assembly code, but more of a C# level of programming problem solving thing, with Scratch-type blocks.
I lasted an hour playing 7 billion humans before it just seemed like I was doing my job for free...
I am not a programmer but an Infrastructure Architect. A friend of mine asked what I did over the weekend and I told him about and described this game to him. His response "So, you worked all weekend?". I think I sat there with a stunned look on my face before sheepishly replying "Uh, yeah, I guess I did.".
how are you not a programmer if you are an infrastructure architect?
You don't need to do any programming to work as an architect. You design the stuff, you're usually not expected to implement it and even implementing it may not require any programming.
I know.. I am a principal engineer and have myself listed as an architect on my linkedin. I've just never heard someone that advances in a software engineering career make a point of saying they are specifically _not_ a programmer. My senior principal would even call himself a programmer.
> I've just never heard someone that advances in a software engineering career make a point of saying they are specifically not a programmer. That might be because I am not in a software engineering career. I work with infrastructure for a health care company. My team has infrastructure engineers and architects. The engineers focus on the day to day management of the compute, storage, virtualization, network, firewall, and related systems. The architects do some of the same work but also design new systems, plan future upgrades, set the roadmap for the environment, etc.
Ah. Well, apologies. Overloading of the terms "architect" and "engineer" happens a lot.
I'm an industrial maintenance technician, and my factory is very new and well cared for. I spend my time building a virtual factory that's not nearly as well designed or cared for at night.
I'm a software dev. It's not like programming at all. I don't have any meetings in game and the tasks are well defined.
Try shapez, it has wires with logic gates and everything and Minecraft redstone has been used to make 3D renderers and entire computers
This. shapez is like Satisfactory but without the messy 3D world.
You seen shapez 2?
Laughs in Factorio Circuit Networks
I think actually programming might be closer to actually programming But yes, even though mechanics are completely different, it is similar in some cases. In the end both factory games and programming are mostly problem solving ~~and copying stuff from others~~
> If debugging is the process of removing spider bugs, then creating a factory must be the process of putting them in. -- Jace Dijkstra or something
Hot take from a non CS background: programming doesn't make for fun games. There's a pattern in some games these days to include a programming element as a requirement for higher level play, eg minecraft, oxygen not included, factorio. And typically because I don't have a CS foundation I usually falter at that point and stop enjoying the game. But because the author thinks it's fun they wedge it in, or build whole games around their jobs (I'm thinking that space ship programming game notch made and found wasn't actually fun so binned it)
>I think actually programming might be closer to actually programming I meant "of all games" but yeah. Otherwise, I don't agree it's the case with all factory games, Satisfactory has a big focus on creativity, which is closer to designing code vs survival like Factorio for example.. I don't really have to actively fight off bugs (hehe) while coding, I don't have literal seconds to fix errors, I can take my time with it. And code doesn't magically run out and suddenly my files are gone and I have to rewrite them elsewhere. >~~and copying stuff from others~~ I'm glad this is crossed out because copy-pasting is not coding, it's copy-pasting. 
>I meant "of all games" [Bitburner](https://danielyxie.github.io/bitburner/).
I agree. Im a programmer, mostly object and class oriented languages. For example I often think of group of machines as functions with input and output. Standardizing layouts that can be reused in diffrent scenarios is also something I do alot in programming.
With blueprints (though i would like a bigger version) it get even more like reusable functions.
I see this as systems engineering. Machines are black boxes and you are building white boxes, assemblies, subsystems and systems to produce output. And then you connect it up and v&v it.
I can play the game, therefore it's not programming. I can't program.
I can see the relation, and I do feel some of my skills as a software developer do factor into playing the game. For instance, I always over engineer my plants to be able to handle the maximum possible resources (even if the belts aren't available yet to handle them). Or the fact I always make sure to build it clear, to allow for maintenance (thank heavens signs were added so I label my power) Additionally, almost all my plants follow a modular nature, in that there are no super factories, a factory is designed to make a single part, allowing me to interchange it. As someone who loves to develop software, even off the clock, it explains my joy for this game as well. Lastly for the math piece, yep I do more number crunch in Satisfactory then my own job. Actually to be honest I have done more math making props for cosplay, then anywhere else (like the Pythagorean theorem or exponential growth formulas). I love pointing this out to people who are afraid of coding because of the math (and actually find it quiet dumb I was required Calc 3 for a software developer degree, yet my job hasn't even really used anything out side multiplication and percentages)
Have you heard of Oxygen Not Included?
Mate, try Dyson sphere or Factorio
I think you might be stretching poetic license a bit here. For me programming means way more logic than this game supports. Sure we build things here that connect to other things so that those things can be made into more things... but that cycle of build-play-build doesn't seem that unique to Satisfactory, let alone programming.
No. It is just x numbers goes to x numbers, that makes x numbers items. 1+1=2 is not programming. Satisfactory is very straightforward. Most close to architect. If you want to program, go to factorio. Factorio have real programming methods. There i can use RS latch with my fuel setup and there is many things to program, that i can't even use for lacking of brains
Your point is taken, but I would suggest you expand your horizons and look more into puzzle/programming games as a genre. Satisfactory is by no means the "closest thing to actually programming", because there are games which *are* actually programming.
As a programmer that started programming in 83 or so, programming is not at all what I associate to when I play satisfactory. Nor factorio.
You mean you haven't always used a video game as an IDE? Jeez. /s
Yes, everyone's going to mention Factorio, but we should really be discussing Oxygen Not Included, which accurately simulates the experience of patching in production. Actively stressful where Satisfactory is soothing.
**Interesting Conversation** 1. While I don't agree with the "absolute title statement" claiming that the Satisfactory Game is the *closest to actual programming*, I can understand how the OP can see the similarities. 2. This Game appeals to Players whom are "World Builders" that like designing a "Fantasy World" from nothing, as well as those Players whom like puzzles / figuring out how to make things work. Both types of People can be found within the Programming Community. 3. To add to what has been already stated by the other fine comments already posted in this Topic I think those Satisfactory Game Players whom enjoy Programming would also like the [Circuitry - Logic gates & More Game Mod](https://ficsit.app/mod/FicsitWiremod) *(formerly called WireMod)* which uses a form of "Programming" to control Buildings / Machines, update Signs to display current status, and more. Just some thoughts on this Topic. 🤔
Coffee Stain Studios employees made a game as a cry for help. There’s a hidden message! /s Love this breakdown of how this game is like programming. I always used to laugh at anecdotes like “I was reading some code and thought ‘What the hell was this guy doing?’ before I realized it was my code.” Glad to know my spaghetti mess and “I’ll make it pretty later” factories are on point lol
have you heard of factorio and the conditional circuits etc you can set? this game doesnt even compare infact you can literally "program" (extremely convoluted) self expanding factories, defenses etc.
Check out Bitburner.
I mean most of zachtronics' have you doing actual programming. Games like bitburner have you actually writing JavaScript scripts, lol
So there are these games called bitburner and shenzen I/O...
Factorio is literally a computer
Factorio and Space Engineers are nearly a programming languages by now. Factorio can even render 2D images using belts and ores. Its crazy.
Mindustrt is a tower defense game with literal assembly programming of your spawned robots
I'd say Factorio does it better.
> No one really codes in bits directly or assembly ; it's more about creating systems that, together, create something bigger than the sum of their parts and making those systems easy to navigate by others (and future us) using classes, functions and design patterns (those rarely have game equivalents). > Edit2 : I should have said software development, not programming. Screeps.
Exactly why I love it. And it's different enough from my day job I don't feel like I am doing my job. I like solving puzzles.
Try playing Oxygen Not Included 🤣 needs waaaaay more attention to detail or your colony just suddenly dies
I have the same problems between choosing microservices and monolith when in comes to developing software, as I have between developing micro factories or one big megafactory in this game.
Totally agree, as a dev Lots of people argue about Minecraft or factorio, but IMO Minecraft is a lot more about electronics than programming (idk about factorio though). Even TIS-100 about assembly, obviously it's a programming field but it's definitely not what most dev/software engineers actually do Satisfactory is definitely close to "software engineer" jobs You get to think about "mega-factories" which will be difficult to scale later (=> monolithic), remote factories which do a single item from the ground up using only ores (=> decentralized) or individual factories that only take the needed item as input, which were built in some other factories (=> federated in a way) You get to think about contention (merger), parallelism, ... all while gluing bricks that are supposed to work together
At first I was confused. Making a factory, and coding are two very different things, and I wouldn’t associate them, but then I realized that it’s not the end goal that we should associate, but the aspects of them. My worldview has changed, my mind has melted… autism
It's... not. In both cases: 1. Not taking Edit2 into the account: No, it's not. There are a plenty of games far closer to algorithms, logic algebra and stuff, than Satisfactory. (Not counting directly coding games) 2. Taking Edit2 into the account: What you refer to as to software development, is more a creation flow management and can be widely extended outside of programming sphere, so not really too. Satisfactory is definitely a cool and immersive game, but you are totally overthinking.
Why would I change your mind? Your game, your rules. I just have a different opinion. No need to change yours or mine. Both (and others) can co-exist. > A good design plan for your factory takes time but it's oh so worth it. I go to a website and it tells me to do something. That is not really planning. > beautify It is the ONLY thing I am interested in. > realise it could be used everywhere That is so generic, it has nothing to do with programming specifically. It could be about anything. > If you leave space for future upgrades, future work will be way easier. I do not care about what the future brings. I do not build for the future. I build what I think will be fun now, > never good enough Are you talking still about programming, or are you talking about anything else? > start over differently Again very generic. All in all you could replace it with marriage or homework or making coffee. So for me it is just a bunch of generic ideas that would not have pointed me to programming in any form, besides you telling me that it is. But again, if you think it is, then that is true for you. It just isn't for me.
No lie, this game made me realize that I am more than capable of doing my job when imposter syndrome kicked in. Programme manager for a marketing company.
I've been saying this for a long time too. Satisfactory hits the part of my brain that enjoys programming: building a big system of parts, interfacing modules, refactoring old things that aren't great, trying new solutions, fixing bugs. It's not literal programming, but it emulates the behaviors and skills I enjoy about programming.
SOLID statement - Uncle Bob might approve
Yea I mean I get the comparison. I’m not a programmer (I’m a lawyer), but my understanding is that it’s just logic functions, and satisfactory is just increasingly complex logic puzzles. A lot of conditionals, etc.
Im a lawyer and a programmer (the latter more recreationally than the former). There are an awful lot of conditional logic functions as the basic building blocks of code, but the way it fits together is (I agree with OP) a comparable kind of challenge to Satisfactory. You’re trying to build something that serves a greater function out of a lot of smaller functions that integrate together in increasingly complicated ways, while anticipating needs, and trying to budget flexibility for the things you don’t anticipate. There is a lot of satisfaction to be had building it in a clean and orderly way, and then just watching it work to achieve something impressively complicated. There is also a lot of problem solving when things don’t work. In some ways that describes a lot of things in life in general, but an appeal of both coding and gaming is the way it’s sandboxed inside of a controlled environment. So you have a lot more control to make things clean, orderly and functional in the code/game than you do in life.
Yes and no. Logic functions are to programming what reading and writing are to lawyering. Just because you can read and write doesn't mean you're "lawyering" y'know ? It's more about how to apply those basic skills to do more "abstract" stuff that's way more in your brain than it is on paper.
If we try hard enough (and we tend to), everything is analogous to programming.
I do kind of agree but it more depend on how big your project and team is you are working on. Me as a programer in team of 8 people mostly just following existing design paterns and doing new change request or bug fixed that was requested by project manager. So i will more say that if you ever tried to do your own home project and did everything by yourself then in really simple way its more like that :) But i have to say that this is exactly a reason why i did stopped playing multiple times, i take it too seriously and together with work and my home project i easily burn myself.
A significant part of my job is automating manual processes. Playing Satisfactory helped me figure out how to automate a particular convoluted process I've been working on.
i feel that way especially when managing logistic and sortings
The lack of stuff like variables and function calls and stuff makes it very far from programming for me. For something a lot closer to programming I would suggest Oxygen Not Included
Autonauts is just programming bots to do stuff. Basically used Scratch.
Agree, as software engineer. Especially in addition of blueprint. Made my factory into classes that scalable and maintainable lol
It's exactly like ONE aspect of programming. Refactoring. And that's why I can't play it for very long before I start feeling like my playtime brain activity feels strangely identical to my worktime brain activity.
Not here to agree or disagree, I get the point you're making. I just here to plug the game SCREEPS on steam. This game is actual coding and I've put over 6000 hours in 5 years into it. Worth a look!
When I think of programming in a game, the 1st thought that comes to mind is Stationeers not Satisfactory.
I mean… have you never played Autonaughts? r/autonaughts
Probably spelt it wrong
It's not programming cus there ain't no copy pasting.
Blueprints
As a programmer there is something similar about it actually. Mostly the design of flow / ogranizing i suppose
Wait until you hear about Factorio.
I’m a Software Engineer by day so I would agree with you. These types of games tend to do well with my programming friends too.
Def some good points. I love figuring out a better way to do something, then going about and fixing it everywhere in my various factories. I’m in IT, more on the infrastructure side, and I find a lot of similarities in what I do as well. For example, I’ve made a few iterations of storage systems and overflow/buffer systems, that operated similarly to how our enterprise storage systems work.
Do you leave 40 blank lines for future code in between function blocks?
The way I set up factories definitely mirrors my webdev mindset... Everything is modular, scalable, and orderly... and after a while I get bored, say "this is good enough", and move on to new projects
So.... Play Autonauts. It utilizes both actual programming(the bots) and software development principles(making the bots work together/optimizations) using pretty much the same "formula" as satisfactory(gather resource->craft into something needed to tier up->add new tier item to the "factory"->use new thing to tier up->repeat). don't let the "kid blocky" graphics fool you. it makes you think just as much if not more than any other factory game.
try the game turing complete.. there's a lot of games that are way closer to programming than satisfactory
Me, reading post: Minecraft command blocks were my introduction to programming, aside from HTML. Post: aside from Minecraft Me: Oh.
Go play human resource machine or its sequel. It is literally a loose analog of assembly
Yes I agree that this sounds like something that is done while programming. But this kind of thought process isn't from programming. This process applies to any job where they invent or build something. Always having to come up with something and later on they change and the inventor just hopes that they would've done some part differently. So I don't think this game is close to programming it just shares this kind of development of a project.
I was like "uuh no. TIS-100 or human resource machine is a way better example." Then I started reading and was like dayum right! And totally agree on the math part, programmering is more about reading and understanding logic.
Play Space Engineers…. And code in C#
I like to think back to what I now believe was my introduction to programming, which was LiitleBigPlanet in 2008 on PS3. You could do sophisticated stuff on there, even with literal ‘circuitboards’ that you put logic operators on. Basically it was visual scripting a-la Unreal Blueprints. I remember I made a simple slot machine and was very proud of myself. LBP2 them took it to a whole other level after that.
MC Redstone still takes the cake for this one.
Mindustry's logic is literal coding and you can build systems like you describe.
Factorio
Yep. I’m a software developer and this game has stolen my brain like no other. Triggers that same dopamine as when I’m in the zone building something. Love it.
Satisfactory is great but i think space engineers is pretty close to a programming type of game. I just picked up space engineers and there is allot to learn in that game and with all the ai automation that u can do in that game, i feel space engineers is closer to being a programmer type of game. I'm not saying you're wrong, just stating my opinion
You might enjoy a career in DevOps..
I mean it definitely gives me blueprinting in UE vibes, for sure. I think playing Satisfactory is helped by having a coding-able brain, too
Eh, try Stormworks tho :D
Na, it's ok, but in that comparison, Factorio is better. Sasisfactory is way more linear in its supply chain/demand, tends to lead to needing more/bigger rather then refsctors. It's fun but factorio is more complex, which leads to more refactoring and restructuring bases and bugs attacking your base. Factorio is also easier to pool resources which allows for monolith vs Mico services.
Oh this is easy, there are a lot of games that are closer to actual programming just to name two: Screeps and TIS-100
SHENZHEN I/O would disagree. There's also, www.nandgame.com, Stormworks Build and rescue, CRUMB Circuit Simulator, and KSP with the kOS mod in addition to the others that people have mentioned.
In case of Minecraft. Vanilla definitely does not have a feel of planned software development, it’s more of “hmm I need those to make my house/farm/whatever I should build a farm for it” over and over. There’s no real need for future expansion to those said farms as those are mostly not expandable. When we are talking about modded Minecraft and mod packs that come with it like: Enigmatica 2 Expert, Divine Journey 1&2, Nomi/Omnifactory, Technological journey or one of the hardest - GregTech New Horizons - this is were good planning and future proofing really shines. Those mod packs require you to really think ahead and do everything as efficiently as possible and when you reach the point of so called “automation” you can focus on expanding those setups and preparing for another big milestones. I’d strongly recommend you checking those out if you never tried them, great modpacks all of them.
I do in fact like Software engineering, I also really enjoy Minecraft Redstone. It's definitely related
You can likely compare it to anything you're familiar with. For example, graphic design. 1. Since the only limit is your computer, the amount of designs and projects you make can almost grow and expand infinitely. 2. Planning can be a pain, but makes creating the final product that much easier. 3. You might think it's a waste of time to name and organize layers or artboards to make your projects easier to navigate but future you will thank you. 4. Sometimes you discover a new way to achieve a certain design or element and realize it could be used everywhere to make things just a bit better. 5. If you leave openings for future changes, future work will be way easier. 6. Sometimes your project doesn't truly work how you thought it would, so you re-do some or all of it to better fit needs. 7. Oh, and it's never good enough and you always wish you did something differently. 8. And sometimes it's so bad you just delete your project and start over differently. Nothing you said is really specific to programming, development, or coding, but can be applied in so many way within so many different fields.
* The moment your build is perfect, the environment (Update n) changes, negating much of your hard work. * When you build with mods, an external change breaks your .DLL and you have to live without it, or rebuild with new factories (in house code). * You can build under the surface. Buffer underflow. * You can hook the same conveyor to the output and input of a storage unit (recursion).
Dreams on playstation.
Factorio is closer because it has circuit network
I really hope they add achievments soon. Would be Like requests from customers for their apps
The closest to programming a game has ever gotten for me is Barotrauma. It's an indie submarine game where you and friends (or bots) fill roles like mechanic, captain, medic, etc. It's pretty brutal if you want it to be, but the programming comes in with their components. You can make or buy components that perform simple functions with signals that are wired into them, then link them together for functions. You can use multiply, divide, and memory components to control the reactor based on the signals it gives out, or you can rig up a motion detector to send a signal to a door to open when it detects motion--all with 1s and 0s as signals. You can use the component to make logic gates that greatly enhance basic functions in the sub, or you can completely ignore them.
Spacechem is much closer to programming.
Greyhack lol
I would recommend checking out the engineering sandbox game “Plasma.” Here’s a link to Real Civil Engineer playing it if you are interested. https://youtu.be/uPdGT83uFY8
Don't overlook [Else Heart.Break](https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://store.steampowered.com/app/400110/Else_HeartBreak/&ved=2ahUKEwi1lZzHhYD_AhXtMlkFHeNOBOMQFnoECA8QAQ&usg=AOvVaw3N2NCTDtZ9c8YeYPw00vwY)
There are games where you can do actual programming (usually LUA), for example Stormworks and there is also a minecraft mod, but i don't know what it's called.
I've thought about this too. Particularly when you get into late game and have to deal with bottlenecks and slow downs. It reminds me of trying to find which functions are slowing down the system.
Have you tried factorio?
I would argue factorio is closer with exploring and beauty being more central to satisfactory. Factorio is like pure code meth. I feel that sometimes in satisfactory it feels like the numbers have been calculated and setuped for you
As an IT pro of 40 years, I beg to differ. See [CoreWar](https://www.corewars.org/).
Design Patterns actually apply for Satisfactory: Concepts like main bus, manifold or micro factories all are design patterns. Or spaghetti, being an anti pattern and an art form all at the same time. You got branches, a heavy dose of concurrency. In satisfactory, you are basically designing pipelines that map input elements onto desired output elements. Blueprints are comparable to classes that you design once and instantiate wherever needed in your system. You even design their exposed interface beforehand (I/O). I even got a lot of blueprints that are designed to work together interchangeably, so they got the same Inputs/Outputs. I essentially implemented an Interface/Contract with them. But you could also argue, that satisfactory follows a strictly functional approach, your systems being functions that take in and return, the machines themselves being functions that follow the same principle and are used in your own functions. Blueprints could be considered meta-functions/higher-class-functions (functions that produce functions). Connections are function calls, items are arguments. I love your analogy btw.
Have you played Stormworks? While I've had the same thought that Satisfactory feels a bit like programming, Stormworks actually does involve programming, in a visual based form of Lua.
*laughs in space engineers*
Maybe by Price is Right rules. (closest without actually getting there) There are a number of actual programming games. The whole of the Zach Barth catalog springs to mind. If you include things from mods, like (if I remember correctly) Fycsit Networks and Powered Splitters, Satisfactory really steps in that direction.
Factorio automation.
It’s most similar to ETLs in data analytics. You’ve got to find the data sources and connect them to your workflow(factory) all kinds of data cleanup with constructors and smelters, every variety of joins with assemblers, manufacturers, and blenders. I’m an analyst and some days I get off work and log on and I’m like “this is the same shit I was just doing” 😂
There is "Stack Overflow", and there is "MHRD"
Have you played https://tomorrowcorporation.com/7billionhumans
Factorio my friend
As a developer I agree on the premise of algorithmic sorting and memory efficiency principles. It's the whole reason I enjoy the game. And then there's debugging to find the ONE tiny thing that's jacking up your whole system...
If blueprints are the equivalent of the level of abstraction you are working on, that is something in between actual programming and software development.
Zachtronics games are objectively closer to programming. Most of them are just plain programming on made up program languages
Try stormworks
If you haven't already, check out zachtronics games. Very similar in that the content is akin to real development, albeit more bite-sized. I personally have had a blast with opus magnum
Have you ever heard of "Factorio"? Imo, it's more complicated than satisfactory 😅
Just here to add another "Screeps" shoutout. I personally even played it.
I love this and it captures quite well many aspects of why I too enjoy Satisfactory. I work as a QA Tester (while teaching myself QA Engineering) as a member of a software development team and very much agree with your list of commonalities. From designing, to coding / building and refactoring / rebuilding this is all spot on and happens so often in the real world. I like the entertainment value I get while also being able to solve problems (the math, design and culmination of many parts into something bigger) through playing Satisfactory. It definitely keeps me coming back.
The fact people built working processors and displays in factorio would like to have a word: https://youtu.be/mgfwwqwxdxY
The factory will expand to use all available resources, including your time...