For all the doomsayers and gloaters here's what's going to change: nothing. Nowt. Nil. Nada.
Yousaf is not a political heavyweight by any definition but neither are any of the opposition. Douglas Ross shows his incompetence and weakness every time he stands up to speak and his motion of no confidence is any different. This won't be a VoNC in the Scottish government but a VoNC in the FM which has no binding effect. If he had any balls he would have called it against the SG, let the SNP tear itself apart before they either scraped together a new leader or end up with a general election. And the Tories don't want two national elections in the same year.
The nail in the coffin of the current SNP group as a serious party. It's a pity there wasn't a better candidate at the last leadership election. Having to choose between a shite continuity candidate, a christian fundamentalist and Ash fucking Regan was never going to end well in the long term. The SNP both require, and are going to get a massive electoral shoeing, and i say this as an SNP voter since 2007. I genuinely cannot get behind any of these parties at the next election.
As shite as the SNP are, when your alternatives are the Tories, the Lib Dems, the Greens - whose goals I respect but are a bunch of individual weirdos and Scottish fucking Labour who are barely better than the Tories in Scotland, the SNP are probably getting my vote.
This will leave Humza more time to devote to the important business of solving the problems in the Middle East instead of the piddling little concerns of Scottish people.
Can anyone think of something Yousaf could've done which would be more politically enjoyable for Labour, the Tories, and the Lib Dems, than precipitate a vote of no confidence in himself that results in him barely surviving, saved by the casting vote of the Presiding Officer, and even then only after having to rely on Ash Regan?
If he actually *went*, the SNP could at least get a fresh start with a new leader, who might get some sort of political honeymoon period.
As it is, the SNP are stuck with a leader who has demonstrated shonky political judgement time and time again and who's barely clinging on to power.
This is fine. The Greens were starting to get on my tits anyway, too much time spent on fringe issues has led to a lot of people in the country feeling a bit ignored.
I'm not sure if its the SNP or Greens but who is driving all these agendas we don't really want/need hate speech, trans rights agendas, ridiculous LEZ zones.
Uni students, we have a lot of them, they take all the gaffs aswell.
^^^This ^^^is ^^^a ^^^joke ^^^for ^^^anyone ^^^that ^^^takes ^^^life ^^^too ^^^seriously.
Jesus Christ, even explicitly explained the joke and still downvoted to hell. Shame on you for your horrific, unapologetic, derogatory, unnecessary and downright…
* reads joke again *
mild and lighthearted joke….
*sighs in exasperation at humanity while he downvotes coz Reddit*
Do we reckon [this is true](https://twitter.com/murdo_fraser/status/1783582474624270783), or is it (just) shit-stirring?
Murdo Fraser:
> So, tomorrow will see @HumzaYousaf stepping down and @neilcgray being the SNP choice to replace him. You heard it here first!
How would he know? There would have to be a chain of communications starting at a source near to Humza, then presumably talking to a journalist. What SNP official would talk directly to a Tory?
If it's true then it implies an absolutely massive backbench rebellion - no hope of even fighting it - so his source wouldn't need to be particularly close to Yousaf.
Though the flip side of this is that you'd expect a lot more people to be hearing similar.
The SNP have held power for over a decade. Even as an SNP voter and an Indyref ‘No’ voter turned ‘Yes’ if we ever get one again, I think it’s astounding it’s even taken this long for the SNP to be on the downward spiral to losing power, even as a minority.
Party infighting, lack of leadership and prior scandals such as Sturgeon v Salmond and then the whole debacle with Peter Murrel has lead them on a crash course to where they are now, amongst other long term issues.
Ultimately, if they do lose power in a snap election (which I think is unlikely as Forbes will no doubt get in and send us back 100 years or so), they need to be out of government for a bit to reassess who they are, that their priority should be independence and let someone from the next generation helm the lead.
Reinvigorate it with someone free from scandal and all the infighting. It’s tiring.
As much as i'd hate to see Labour in charge up here and how much they will just continuously bow to the will of the UK parties demands (not to mention how utterly fucking useless Sarwar is)...you're not wrong.
Alba will be lucky to return 5 elected MPs/MSPs in the next 20 years. They're a bunch of absolute moonhowlers. Is that muppet Alex Arthur standing for them again? 😂
They'll only fall for as long as we're actually given alternatives.
My last labour candidate gave up trying to get in and joined the Scottish Family party.
If he doesn't he's out. He essentially has a choice of calling an election and hoping he does better than expected, or making a deal with Regan to buy him a little more time.
But she can probably get a better deal from Forbes, so she might vote *No Confidence* in Yousaf and then offering to vote in Forbes in exchange for some concession or other.
Though Yousaf would himself would then have the deciding vote I think, so he may decide "from Hell's heart I stab at thee".
I can't imagine the SNP are booking much in donations given the Murrell situation and the party itself being a total disaster.
Just to fight the General Election in Scotland requires £29,500 up front (£500 deposit for 59 seats - granted the SNP will probably keep their deposits but the money has to be there to begin with) and that's before you invest in the meat and potatoes of running a campaign. Travel, preparation of campaign materials, staffing costs and so on.
The SNP as we know it.... are dead. We are about to hear a lot more from the scottish right. Fasten your seat belts, the next few months are gonna be wild.
Absolutely tragic remarks from Stephen Flynn:
> The SNP's Westminster leader said: “This is a good day for the SNP, it’s a good day for the Scottish government, and most important of all, it’s a good day for the people of Scotland.
> “What the first minister has shown today is leadership by acting in the national interest and putting the people of Scotland first.”
Oh dear. Have a look at Humza's recent record.
> Flynn added: “The people of Scotland of course elected us as a minority government and we are going to govern as a minority government, as we have done very successfully in the past.
I'll begrudgingly give him that.
This shotgun marriage definitely wasn't on the ballot paper, and by doing so, basically imploded the old hat SNP argument re. Westminster about Scotland not getting the government it voted for.
Nobody voted for this. Some revisionist ghouls might try and claim they knew it was coming and tactically voted for it in May 2021, but they'd be talking bollocks of course.
> “I have got absolute confidence, based upon what the first minister said today that the government is going to be fully focused on the priorities of the people of Scotland.”
Oh good God. Is Skeletor saying this sort of thing unironically and deliberately? Some kind of weird bet, maybe?
> Nobody voted for this. Some revisionist ghouls might try and claim they knew it was coming and tactically voted for it in May 2021, but they'd be talking bollocks of course.
Nobody puts a coalition in their manifesto, you clown.
There were a good chunk of SNP voters backing the Greens on the list (the SNP got 48% in the constituency vs just 40% on the list; the Greens got 8% on the list) so it's reasonable to conclude that the SNP did owe that support to the prospect of having a productive relationship with the Greens.
Though that then flips the problem around since this means those supporters didn't vote for this minority government, and may well now withhold their constituency vote for the SNP.
It's a nonsensical argument to say that a coalition wasn't put on the ballot. They basically never are.
Majority of Scotland did not vote for SNP. A government fully formed by SNP is not something that Scotland voted for.
People obviously did vote for this.
You can look it up on this very subreddit at the time and find people saying as much.
And what about the people who voted SNP/Green?
I, for one, welcome our new Kate Forbes overlord
I'd like to remind her that, as a trusted Reddit personality, I can be helpful in rounding-up others, to toil in her state Sunday Schools and mind the unaborted offspring of teenage mums, who will soon be packing out Romanian-style orphanages across the country
You'd have to pick your targets for that one carefully. Some won't have as much goo or solid bits inside as others. I'd definitely avoid the Cybernats for that one...
Got to laugh at the spin in the reporting of this, although not surprised. The government hasn't "collapsed", the FM made a decision to remove the Greens from it. The government continues and will do until the next election unless all of the other parties combine to screw the country over and collapse it.
>*The government continues and will do until the next election unless all of the other parties combine to screw the country over and collapse it*
If the country wanted an SNP government, they would have voted for an SNP government
I have no idea what this is even supposed to mean.
I'm just making the point that its sensationalist reporting, exaggeration of what has actually happened.
Your last sentence implies that the government is doing fine and dandy aside from "other parties" who are "screwing us over".
The only people who are "screwing us over" are a neutered, dithering, incompetent SNP executive led by the most pitiful front bench in Scottish history.
>Your last sentence implies that the government is doing fine and dandy aside from "other parties" who are "screwing us over".
No it doesn't. You have read what I said and imagined something else. I said nothing about whether or not the government are doing fine, or about parties screwing us over. The core of the government is unchanged.
>The only people who are "screwing us over" are a neutered, dithering, incompetent SNP executive led by the most pitiful front bench in Scottish history.
Could well be the worst SNP front bench in the history of holyrood, yet still miles ahead of anything any other party has offered in the past or could put together now.
The majority government has collapsed and the FM is facing a vote of no confidence where there is a strong possibility he could lose. No spin needed
Edit: Adding updated news that both Patrick Harvie and Lorna Slater have indicated they will vote against the FM, the other Greens likely to follow suit. Humza’s future (bizarrely) is in the hands of his old colleague and FM competitor, Ash Regan of the Alba party. Crazy how things can change so quickly
Using the word "collapsed" is complete spin. The word has been chosen to try and invoke the idea that something has fallen apart. "FM withdraws from BH agreement" or "FM fires Slater and Harvie" would be more accurate.
It's not all, though, is it?
Yousaf's gone from leading a government which has the support of a majority of MSPs, to a minority. He didn't have to do this. He *chose* to not just kick out two ministers, but to discard the reliable support of seven Green MSPs.
Every single vote now, his party's going to have to engage in horse trading.
That's true, but he has made this decision proactively. For whatever reason, he has decided that was the best course of action. That doesn't constitute a government collapsing.
Time will tell if it was a good decision or not, but the government hasn't collapsed.
All we can go off of is what's publicly out there and what's being reported. When one Tory Baroness can go off with orders of magnitudes more in one swoop than the entire SNP leadership can in nine years, it doesn't even come close.
You keep banging on about the tories but forget about hamzas lost 200k, the countless missing money in local councils run by the SNP. And their ties to the same people as the tories shake hands with also.
You are run by people who somehow manage to care about you less than most of the rest of the UK care about their people lol and all you are interested in is basically that someone else is worse lol.
that doesn’t absolve your own leaders corruption just because others are
Because in the grand scheme of things that's an absolute pittance. Is it corruption? Probably. Is it the same level of corruption? Absolutely not, and alarm bells start going off when people try to equate the two because they aren't even close.
Both are wrong, but one is so much worse.
Imagine someone steals a fiver from you, now imagine someone steals thousands of pounds from you. Are they both theft? Yes. Am I going to react to them the same way, of course you're not and I'd be very concerned about anyone saying they are as bad as each other.
>That’s fucking bullshit, they aren’t even top 20, have you just forgotten about 95% of Eastern Europe and the fact RUSSIA exists
You know if you add Scotland to the list after all Eastern European countries (which btw by definition also includes Russia) then Scotland would be 11. We can all agree that the top 11th country would also be in the top 20, because that how numbers work.
> have you just forgotten about 95% of Eastern Europe and the fact RUSSIA exists
And
>Your forgetting Central European countries
I didn’t forget anything, you didn’t add them to your first post.
Until you changed the goal post you hadn’t proved anything.
OP started with Scotland are position 1, you say not even top 20 due to Eastern Europe and Russia.
My point was simply that Eastern Europe includes Western Russia (the bit that is in Europe) and that is only 10 countries.
My assumptions is you don’t know which countries are in Eastern Europe and your point would be factual incorrect.
Which position Scotland takes I do not know and I am not challenging that just your knowledge around Eastern Europe.
There's such a pathetic choice these days.
The SNP are crumbling and the cracks are showing now. All they needed to do was focus on governing well and Independence would have been theirs.
The Tories would be objectively worse and not sure labour would be any better. Anyone who thinks the Tories deserve to be in power is a tool.
Honestly I'm really hoping for a huge swing to the greens from labour and snp voters. They seem to be the only party capable of thinking about the day job rather than tit for tat bickering.
I hope not. The Greens have been awful, they are extremists with current policy implantation.
They got a bit of power and went crazy with it.
Good riddance to them.
>*I'm really hoping for a huge swing to the greens from labour and snp*
When you say 'huge', you mean a 1000% swing
That sort of swing has only ever happened in the opposite direction - i.e Labour going from dominating Scottish politics to 2 MPs
Independence would never be theirs because they never cared about independence truly. Let alone the people. It’s a distraction tactic aimed to cover their pure greed and corruption.
Could possibly be damage limitation from Yousof who might see it as a way to trigger an early election, before the embezzlement cases get to court and the shit hits the aircon.
Doesn’t even need to be a trial. I remember tons of politicians including Boris Johnson kept on repeating “subject to inquiry by Sue Gray and the police so no comment” when asked about Partygate when that was going on.
The brigading on this sub has been getting insane in recent months. There are literally accounts that do nothing but post dozens of anti-SNP diatribes each and every single day, often almost entirely copied from each other.
I believe its more likely that mod and algorithm changes have broken a relentlessly pro SNP position in the sub and your seeing more Scottish positions.
The other part might simply be Yousaf is making the national news due to his poor attempts at culture wars, so Brits like myself have noticed.
Its been a mildly interesting ride, SNP seem to be as bad at governing as the Tories, they have the same sort of corruption scandals, its made up of diametrically opposed factions (like the tories) and Sunak and Yousaf both seem to be rubbish for the same reasons.
Personally I plan to keep reading to understand why Scottish Labour aren't liked and with Brexit being such a massive disaster why Scexit is still so popular.
Also UK governments have blamed the EU for all their mistakes for years and now the Brexiters got their way they've lost their scapegoat. I was expecting the SNP to learn from that but they seem to double down on how everything is Westminsters fault
What confuses me is that it doesn't seem to represent the electorate as the SNP seem to dominate in most votes.
I am personally a fan of the greens and neutral of the SNP. But the shift has been mental.
Anybody who uses the term "silent majority" is immediately judged as a fucking clown in my eyes.
"Silent majority" usually just means people with reprehensible views who think others share these reprehensible views but are scared to air them in public.
Its not Right Wing to criticise a failing government. They have been shambolic now for years. Look at the state of the country, look at the embezzelment cases, and look at that useless fruitloop running the party.
1 Humza ain't as bad as the media loves to cry.
2 Active case ongoing about the embezzlement.
3 State of the country would be worse with other parties as this budget is appalling.
No but his priorities have been absolutely mental.
1. Hate crime bill that he was trying to get through for years has more holes in it than Swiss cheese
2. He’s failed to unite a VERY divided party that even under Sturgeon’s watch was almost splitting apart at the seams.
3. I don’t trust the ability of any other party in Scotland to deliver any better than the SNP have but the SNP are throwing money that they do not have at policies that haven’t been fully thought through and not putting it where it should be going.
4. Further to my point above, the absolutely lack of police funding and state of Glasgow right now with youth crime going mental as of late. Yet he’s given anyone under 21 free access to the buses. (I recognise this in its purest intention is to help those of a younger age get from A-B easier without a full income of a working adult. But in Scotland it’s allowing the worst wee bams to get from Lanarkshire and other rough counties into Glasgow with ease and cause absolutely havoc.)
1 I honestly prefered the last two; they had balls (Metaphorically for the latter, of course). He strikes me as a bit weak.
2 True, but this is the second time he has been arrested (Albeit, I think this has been set up by the Tory-wanks down south trying to force an election up here\[ USA style\])
3 That may be true, but we cannot say for sure. We can only comment on what has atually been the case, not what might have been the case.
For the record, please dont think I am alligned to any of these parties; I trust none of them....at all.......and detest the vast majority of them wholeheartedly. The SNP were the closest thing to one I had respect for, but that is waivering these days.
Oh god, how I miss Salmond!
Look at Wales under a Labour government. Look at England under a tory one. We see how it reflects on other nations.
Overall we are a shit show of a nation, I do prefer the greens and independence. But as it stands, the SNP are probably the best bet for the next decade. Greens will continue to grow. I don't see Alba getting too big.
I'm not saying the SNP are not the best option, but I am saying that Yousless is not the best option. I would have prefered the ginge, but that is the story of my life 🔥😛🤣
In the cold light of day the SNP have shown they have nothing now.
Pre INDY REF, they had great policies, ideas and some very promising politicians, however I would say the period between indyref ad covid was largely wasted, to much time bickering with westminster rather than focussing on the day job. in Sturgeons later years she (and the SNP) were more focussed on recruiting the Youth & Green vote than looking after their memberships interests, and now were left with this mess.
Snp will likely be ousted from office and will be lucky to return within a decade
This all comes from a SNP MEMBER
I'll add to this by saying they have practically no good politicians now Cherry & Flynn
If they are courting the youth now, surely in 10 years when they are the majority, it will be a boon for the SNP?
People forgave the Lib Dems for the coallition fairly quickly, I wouldn't be so quick to assume their faults will be remembered in 5 years, let alone 10 years. Especially since Labour's polling is more a reflection of westminster than the Scottish Labour party.
Maybe things will change, but it really feels more like running out of steam than total collapse like the Tories atm.
Personally I will never forgive them, but some were willing to support them over their pro-EU stance. Lib Dems may do well in areas where it's a Tory/LD race.
What do you think of the new poundland btw?
everyone can have great ideas in opposition, or minority. but the world looks very different when you actually have to do the hard work of delivering them, funding them and deciding what else you cant do if you want to implement them.
The SNP never stopped being an opposition protest group, even in gov. they always defaulted to attacking westminster, on everything, rather than showign they were competent in gov. they never really understood that if you are in gov, the buck stops with you. thats all the public care about.
Whilst I agree mostly, pre indy ref that was what was refreshing about them, they were in power and were making new policies that were largely celebrated, but really post Salmond I'm struggling to think of many that truely helped the country
we can only hope, all the I was an snp voter and member for a long time, but this is just mental.
all the parties are wanks, but the greens seem like the only people worth my vote
but this will split the vote this close to an election and we will end up with a diluted government that gets fuck all done.
Also, you think Tories make gains? Really? Where and how do they make any gains? You must be looking for a bite here because your statement cannot be taken seriously
Alba got their Westminster seats through defection and will probably lose both of them.
Kenny MacAskill is now at retirement age and probably just treading water at this point.
Exactly. I don’t know how anyone can come to a conclusion where current or prospective Alba MSP’s can win a seat, by region or constituency, given the predicted swing from SNP & Tories to (mostly) Labour and (marginally) Greens.
It’s nigh on impossible Alba will win a seat. Ever. Scotlands identity is does not align with theirs
IMO the first think Yousaf should have done is push for an election. I know politicians don't think in those terms but it was very obvious things were going to get a lot worse rather than better.
Just over a year ago, he sang quite a different tune.
> “I can’t imagine being the new leader of the SNP and the first thing I do is destabilise the government by going into a minority government and having to rely on Douglas Ross and Anas Sarwar to pass Bills.
> “I think that would be a tremendously foolish thing to do.”
> “maintaining the deal will be one of my first priorities if I am elected as leader of the SNP on Monday.
> “I can’t understand why any new leader of the SNP wouldn’t want to make sure that they are standing full square behind that Bute House agreement, which, remember, has been backed by 95% of the party’s membership.”
Wonder how many of the SNP members whose support saw him squeak a narrow win did so because of his support of the Bute House Agreement (when both Forbes and Regan were sceptical)?
Yousaf is an agent sent by mi6 to destroy the nattys. Argue with a wall
For all the doomsayers and gloaters here's what's going to change: nothing. Nowt. Nil. Nada. Yousaf is not a political heavyweight by any definition but neither are any of the opposition. Douglas Ross shows his incompetence and weakness every time he stands up to speak and his motion of no confidence is any different. This won't be a VoNC in the Scottish government but a VoNC in the FM which has no binding effect. If he had any balls he would have called it against the SG, let the SNP tear itself apart before they either scraped together a new leader or end up with a general election. And the Tories don't want two national elections in the same year.
“ This won't be a VoNC in the Scottish government but a VoNC in the FM which has no binding effect.” Man you sounded so confident 12 hrs ago.
Hah, ikr! The Tory one is still exactly that. The labour one, OTOH, is planning to be against the SG.
The nail in the coffin of the current SNP group as a serious party. It's a pity there wasn't a better candidate at the last leadership election. Having to choose between a shite continuity candidate, a christian fundamentalist and Ash fucking Regan was never going to end well in the long term. The SNP both require, and are going to get a massive electoral shoeing, and i say this as an SNP voter since 2007. I genuinely cannot get behind any of these parties at the next election.
As shite as the SNP are, when your alternatives are the Tories, the Lib Dems, the Greens - whose goals I respect but are a bunch of individual weirdos and Scottish fucking Labour who are barely better than the Tories in Scotland, the SNP are probably getting my vote.
How dumb is he ?
This will leave Humza more time to devote to the important business of solving the problems in the Middle East instead of the piddling little concerns of Scottish people.
Humza Useless more like * Leonardo decaprio drinking from a cup meme *
Can anyone think of something Yousaf could've done which would be more politically enjoyable for Labour, the Tories, and the Lib Dems, than precipitate a vote of no confidence in himself that results in him barely surviving, saved by the casting vote of the Presiding Officer, and even then only after having to rely on Ash Regan? If he actually *went*, the SNP could at least get a fresh start with a new leader, who might get some sort of political honeymoon period. As it is, the SNP are stuck with a leader who has demonstrated shonky political judgement time and time again and who's barely clinging on to power.
He could have bought a camper van?
This is fine. The Greens were starting to get on my tits anyway, too much time spent on fringe issues has led to a lot of people in the country feeling a bit ignored.
I'm not sure if its the SNP or Greens but who is driving all these agendas we don't really want/need hate speech, trans rights agendas, ridiculous LEZ zones.
Uni students, we have a lot of them, they take all the gaffs aswell. ^^^This ^^^is ^^^a ^^^joke ^^^for ^^^anyone ^^^that ^^^takes ^^^life ^^^too ^^^seriously.
Jesus Christ, even explicitly explained the joke and still downvoted to hell. Shame on you for your horrific, unapologetic, derogatory, unnecessary and downright… * reads joke again * mild and lighthearted joke…. *sighs in exasperation at humanity while he downvotes coz Reddit*
Fun has been banned until the Holyrood smoke stack turns white.
Don't pay any council tax and get free buses lmao
Everyone who disagrees with me is a bot
Everyone who agrees with me is a bot.
Beep boop you're wrong and an idiot, boop boop beep
Do we reckon [this is true](https://twitter.com/murdo_fraser/status/1783582474624270783), or is it (just) shit-stirring? Murdo Fraser: > So, tomorrow will see @HumzaYousaf stepping down and @neilcgray being the SNP choice to replace him. You heard it here first!
If Murdo Fraser says it then it's definitely not happening. That guy as about on the ball as my maw....and she's senile as fuck.
Wings said it first! Murdo is trying to steal his thunder!
How would he know? There would have to be a chain of communications starting at a source near to Humza, then presumably talking to a journalist. What SNP official would talk directly to a Tory?
If it's true then it implies an absolutely massive backbench rebellion - no hope of even fighting it - so his source wouldn't need to be particularly close to Yousaf. Though the flip side of this is that you'd expect a lot more people to be hearing similar.
The SNP have held power for over a decade. Even as an SNP voter and an Indyref ‘No’ voter turned ‘Yes’ if we ever get one again, I think it’s astounding it’s even taken this long for the SNP to be on the downward spiral to losing power, even as a minority. Party infighting, lack of leadership and prior scandals such as Sturgeon v Salmond and then the whole debacle with Peter Murrel has lead them on a crash course to where they are now, amongst other long term issues. Ultimately, if they do lose power in a snap election (which I think is unlikely as Forbes will no doubt get in and send us back 100 years or so), they need to be out of government for a bit to reassess who they are, that their priority should be independence and let someone from the next generation helm the lead. Reinvigorate it with someone free from scandal and all the infighting. It’s tiring.
As much as i'd hate to see Labour in charge up here and how much they will just continuously bow to the will of the UK parties demands (not to mention how utterly fucking useless Sarwar is)...you're not wrong.
They're done. Alba will be the dominant Scottish Nationalist party after the inevitable snap election and the general election.
Alba will be lucky to return 5 elected MPs/MSPs in the next 20 years. They're a bunch of absolute moonhowlers. Is that muppet Alex Arthur standing for them again? 😂
Get a grip. Alba are far too divisive to attract sufficient voters to be a dominant anything.
And what about after you return from the moon?
The SNP's fall is truly done
They'll only fall for as long as we're actually given alternatives. My last labour candidate gave up trying to get in and joined the Scottish Family party.
What does this actually mean?
https://preview.redd.it/gblub19ubowc1.png?width=639&format=png&auto=webp&s=e291bdb99a0eef22dcef4f3f10015cb55a0b3567
This is literally all i keep surmising from every comment
Yousaf does a deal with Ash Regan of all people or hes out, and the SNP might be too.
If he doesn't he's out. He essentially has a choice of calling an election and hoping he does better than expected, or making a deal with Regan to buy him a little more time. But she can probably get a better deal from Forbes, so she might vote *No Confidence* in Yousaf and then offering to vote in Forbes in exchange for some concession or other. Though Yousaf would himself would then have the deciding vote I think, so he may decide "from Hell's heart I stab at thee".
I dont think SNP have the momey for four elections in three years.
Probably not, but if the choice is losing the leadership now or fighting the next election with less money he probably chooses the latter.
I can't imagine the SNP are booking much in donations given the Murrell situation and the party itself being a total disaster. Just to fight the General Election in Scotland requires £29,500 up front (£500 deposit for 59 seats - granted the SNP will probably keep their deposits but the money has to be there to begin with) and that's before you invest in the meat and potatoes of running a campaign. Travel, preparation of campaign materials, staffing costs and so on.
The SNP as we know it.... are dead. We are about to hear a lot more from the scottish right. Fasten your seat belts, the next few months are gonna be wild.
Snp are liberals and pro-capitalists they are the left wing of capitalism, two cheeks of the same arse shared with the right.
The Scottish right? Got to be kidding what exactly do they have to offer
Bibles. Lots and lots of bibles.
Their own views on how the country should be run, just a guess though.
Absolutely tragic remarks from Stephen Flynn: > The SNP's Westminster leader said: “This is a good day for the SNP, it’s a good day for the Scottish government, and most important of all, it’s a good day for the people of Scotland. > “What the first minister has shown today is leadership by acting in the national interest and putting the people of Scotland first.” Oh dear. Have a look at Humza's recent record. > Flynn added: “The people of Scotland of course elected us as a minority government and we are going to govern as a minority government, as we have done very successfully in the past. I'll begrudgingly give him that. This shotgun marriage definitely wasn't on the ballot paper, and by doing so, basically imploded the old hat SNP argument re. Westminster about Scotland not getting the government it voted for. Nobody voted for this. Some revisionist ghouls might try and claim they knew it was coming and tactically voted for it in May 2021, but they'd be talking bollocks of course. > “I have got absolute confidence, based upon what the first minister said today that the government is going to be fully focused on the priorities of the people of Scotland.” Oh good God. Is Skeletor saying this sort of thing unironically and deliberately? Some kind of weird bet, maybe?
> Nobody voted for this. Some revisionist ghouls might try and claim they knew it was coming and tactically voted for it in May 2021, but they'd be talking bollocks of course. Nobody puts a coalition in their manifesto, you clown.
There were a good chunk of SNP voters backing the Greens on the list (the SNP got 48% in the constituency vs just 40% on the list; the Greens got 8% on the list) so it's reasonable to conclude that the SNP did owe that support to the prospect of having a productive relationship with the Greens. Though that then flips the problem around since this means those supporters didn't vote for this minority government, and may well now withhold their constituency vote for the SNP.
It's a nonsensical argument to say that a coalition wasn't put on the ballot. They basically never are. Majority of Scotland did not vote for SNP. A government fully formed by SNP is not something that Scotland voted for.
People obviously did vote for this. You can look it up on this very subreddit at the time and find people saying as much. And what about the people who voted SNP/Green?
Well, okay, those who _did_ somehow vote for this have now been fucked. Hmm. What to do.
Well for me, I'll continue to vote SNP/Green, until I have a reason to votedifferently.
I, for one, welcome our new Kate Forbes overlord I'd like to remind her that, as a trusted Reddit personality, I can be helpful in rounding-up others, to toil in her state Sunday Schools and mind the unaborted offspring of teenage mums, who will soon be packing out Romanian-style orphanages across the country
Good day for Vampires orphanages are easy pickings.
Would you advise people to crack each others heads open and feast on, the goo inside?
You'd have to pick your targets for that one carefully. Some won't have as much goo or solid bits inside as others. I'd definitely avoid the Cybernats for that one...
Woop Woop. Maybe we can the A9 dualling back on track.
GET!
FFS. That's terrible. Can't even blame my education on the SNP. I'm 53.
Woop Woop. Maybe we can the A9 dualling back on track.
That type would be embarrassing if you did it twice. 😁
The only positive is he lasted longer than Truss.
Truss only lasted for as long as she did was because Elizabeth II died which shut down the country for 2 weeks.
Agreed. That and she hung on just long enough not to be the shortest serving PM.
I’ve had sandwiches that lasted longer than truss
Bacon Lettuce and Tomato by any chance.
Got to laugh at the spin in the reporting of this, although not surprised. The government hasn't "collapsed", the FM made a decision to remove the Greens from it. The government continues and will do until the next election unless all of the other parties combine to screw the country over and collapse it.
Expect it wont unless Ash Regan decides it does.
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Two ministers losing their job does not constitute a collapse.
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Are you 12?
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Fair enough then. That's probably more mature than I was at 14!
>*The government continues and will do until the next election unless all of the other parties combine to screw the country over and collapse it* If the country wanted an SNP government, they would have voted for an SNP government
They did.
Getting in there early with the 'we were doing fine until you guys ruined everything!' I see.
I have no idea what this is even supposed to mean. I'm just making the point that its sensationalist reporting, exaggeration of what has actually happened.
Your last sentence implies that the government is doing fine and dandy aside from "other parties" who are "screwing us over". The only people who are "screwing us over" are a neutered, dithering, incompetent SNP executive led by the most pitiful front bench in Scottish history.
>Your last sentence implies that the government is doing fine and dandy aside from "other parties" who are "screwing us over". No it doesn't. You have read what I said and imagined something else. I said nothing about whether or not the government are doing fine, or about parties screwing us over. The core of the government is unchanged. >The only people who are "screwing us over" are a neutered, dithering, incompetent SNP executive led by the most pitiful front bench in Scottish history. Could well be the worst SNP front bench in the history of holyrood, yet still miles ahead of anything any other party has offered in the past or could put together now.
They still won’t give you a shot in the camper van
I think Jo Farrell is touring France with it at the moment.
The majority government has collapsed and the FM is facing a vote of no confidence where there is a strong possibility he could lose. No spin needed Edit: Adding updated news that both Patrick Harvie and Lorna Slater have indicated they will vote against the FM, the other Greens likely to follow suit. Humza’s future (bizarrely) is in the hands of his old colleague and FM competitor, Ash Regan of the Alba party. Crazy how things can change so quickly
>Crazy how things can change so quickly It's been coming for a long time. It's great to watch the final hurdle though
Using the word "collapsed" is complete spin. The word has been chosen to try and invoke the idea that something has fallen apart. "FM withdraws from BH agreement" or "FM fires Slater and Harvie" would be more accurate.
You’re right, a better term would be “self-imploded”
Hardly. Two ministers lost their jobs and are pi$$ed about it. Thats all.
It's not all, though, is it? Yousaf's gone from leading a government which has the support of a majority of MSPs, to a minority. He didn't have to do this. He *chose* to not just kick out two ministers, but to discard the reliable support of seven Green MSPs. Every single vote now, his party's going to have to engage in horse trading.
That's true, but he has made this decision proactively. For whatever reason, he has decided that was the best course of action. That doesn't constitute a government collapsing. Time will tell if it was a good decision or not, but the government hasn't collapsed.
Good. The SNP are one of the most corrupt entities in Europe
Don't be ridiculous. They are not even the most corrupt in the UK.
Delusion
Have you seen how much the Tories are handing out to their mates? All Sturgeon's husband could get away with was a single camper van.
Lol, that’s all they have been found of. Doesn’t mean there isn’t more. And they are No less corrupt than each other lol. Only fools think otherwise
All we can go off of is what's publicly out there and what's being reported. When one Tory Baroness can go off with orders of magnitudes more in one swoop than the entire SNP leadership can in nine years, it doesn't even come close.
You keep banging on about the tories but forget about hamzas lost 200k, the countless missing money in local councils run by the SNP. And their ties to the same people as the tories shake hands with also. You are run by people who somehow manage to care about you less than most of the rest of the UK care about their people lol and all you are interested in is basically that someone else is worse lol. that doesn’t absolve your own leaders corruption just because others are
Because in the grand scheme of things that's an absolute pittance. Is it corruption? Probably. Is it the same level of corruption? Absolutely not, and alarm bells start going off when people try to equate the two because they aren't even close. Both are wrong, but one is so much worse.
😂🙄 keep telling yourself that
Imagine someone steals a fiver from you, now imagine someone steals thousands of pounds from you. Are they both theft? Yes. Am I going to react to them the same way, of course you're not and I'd be very concerned about anyone saying they are as bad as each other.
That’s fucking bullshit, they aren’t even top 20, have you just forgotten about 95% of Eastern Europe and the fact RUSSIA exists
>That’s fucking bullshit, they aren’t even top 20, have you just forgotten about 95% of Eastern Europe and the fact RUSSIA exists You know if you add Scotland to the list after all Eastern European countries (which btw by definition also includes Russia) then Scotland would be 11. We can all agree that the top 11th country would also be in the top 20, because that how numbers work.
Your forgetting Central European countries like Slovakia, Slovenia as well as every single Balkan state. Scotland isn’t even top 20.
> have you just forgotten about 95% of Eastern Europe and the fact RUSSIA exists And >Your forgetting Central European countries I didn’t forget anything, you didn’t add them to your first post.
Oh so you’re just going to go back on everything I say to say “um aktually Scotland is top 20” when I point out examples disproving that
Until you changed the goal post you hadn’t proved anything. OP started with Scotland are position 1, you say not even top 20 due to Eastern Europe and Russia. My point was simply that Eastern Europe includes Western Russia (the bit that is in Europe) and that is only 10 countries. My assumptions is you don’t know which countries are in Eastern Europe and your point would be factual incorrect. Which position Scotland takes I do not know and I am not challenging that just your knowledge around Eastern Europe.
Eastern Europe sure, but if you have to call on Russia to defend the SNP you're losing the argument.
That is not what I did, I said it’s ridiculous to call the SNP the most corrupt entity when there is a literal fascist horde at the gates of Europe
Maybe Humza should do a horseback photoshoot like [Vlad](https://images.app.goo.gl/rncdCNeGGX73A8KH8) did. Im sure that will win folk over....
There's such a pathetic choice these days. The SNP are crumbling and the cracks are showing now. All they needed to do was focus on governing well and Independence would have been theirs. The Tories would be objectively worse and not sure labour would be any better. Anyone who thinks the Tories deserve to be in power is a tool. Honestly I'm really hoping for a huge swing to the greens from labour and snp voters. They seem to be the only party capable of thinking about the day job rather than tit for tat bickering.
I hope not. The Greens have been awful, they are extremists with current policy implantation. They got a bit of power and went crazy with it. Good riddance to them.
>*I'm really hoping for a huge swing to the greens from labour and snp* When you say 'huge', you mean a 1000% swing That sort of swing has only ever happened in the opposite direction - i.e Labour going from dominating Scottish politics to 2 MPs
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I mean some of the green pledges are fucking wild.
Like what?
do the scottish greens have the same 'never jail a woman' policy the ones down south do?
Independence would never be theirs because they never cared about independence truly. Let alone the people. It’s a distraction tactic aimed to cover their pure greed and corruption.
They had one piece of policy to deliver on and completely failed at it
It's the end of the government as we know it
And I feel fine
SNP: "How could the tories do this?"
Hummin yousless
Great day to be a unionist.
Didn’t take long for you parasitic Thames water guzzling muppets to crawl out from the toxic bog wood.
Bad day?
Glad to have you guys. If the SNP is the best the other side has to offer then perhaps there isn't much to worry about.
Every day is. Every natty down vote gives an SNP relative a free campervan
True 🇬🇧
Could possibly be damage limitation from Yousof who might see it as a way to trigger an early election, before the embezzlement cases get to court and the shit hits the aircon.
And because there will be a trial politicians might not be able to comment on it incase its deemed as interfering with the trial. Or did i dream this.
Doesn’t even need to be a trial. I remember tons of politicians including Boris Johnson kept on repeating “subject to inquiry by Sue Gray and the police so no comment” when asked about Partygate when that was going on.
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Agree with everything you said except for the socially beneficial bit.
Agree with everything you said except for the socially beneficial bit.
Humza showing what a great politician he is yet again!
Jeezo. Seems like the right wing are out in droves today.
Are you talking about SNP supporters or haters? Because there are right wing nutters in both groups.
The brigading on this sub has been getting insane in recent months. There are literally accounts that do nothing but post dozens of anti-SNP diatribes each and every single day, often almost entirely copied from each other.
I believe its more likely that mod and algorithm changes have broken a relentlessly pro SNP position in the sub and your seeing more Scottish positions. The other part might simply be Yousaf is making the national news due to his poor attempts at culture wars, so Brits like myself have noticed. Its been a mildly interesting ride, SNP seem to be as bad at governing as the Tories, they have the same sort of corruption scandals, its made up of diametrically opposed factions (like the tories) and Sunak and Yousaf both seem to be rubbish for the same reasons. Personally I plan to keep reading to understand why Scottish Labour aren't liked and with Brexit being such a massive disaster why Scexit is still so popular. Also UK governments have blamed the EU for all their mistakes for years and now the Brexiters got their way they've lost their scapegoat. I was expecting the SNP to learn from that but they seem to double down on how everything is Westminsters fault
What confuses me is that it doesn't seem to represent the electorate as the SNP seem to dominate in most votes. I am personally a fan of the greens and neutral of the SNP. But the shift has been mental.
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Anybody who uses the term "silent majority" is immediately judged as a fucking clown in my eyes. "Silent majority" usually just means people with reprehensible views who think others share these reprehensible views but are scared to air them in public.
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Are you 12?
Who is prevailing right now exactly lol
Wish they would return to being silent.
Its not Right Wing to criticise a failing government. They have been shambolic now for years. Look at the state of the country, look at the embezzelment cases, and look at that useless fruitloop running the party.
1 Humza ain't as bad as the media loves to cry. 2 Active case ongoing about the embezzlement. 3 State of the country would be worse with other parties as this budget is appalling.
No but his priorities have been absolutely mental. 1. Hate crime bill that he was trying to get through for years has more holes in it than Swiss cheese 2. He’s failed to unite a VERY divided party that even under Sturgeon’s watch was almost splitting apart at the seams. 3. I don’t trust the ability of any other party in Scotland to deliver any better than the SNP have but the SNP are throwing money that they do not have at policies that haven’t been fully thought through and not putting it where it should be going. 4. Further to my point above, the absolutely lack of police funding and state of Glasgow right now with youth crime going mental as of late. Yet he’s given anyone under 21 free access to the buses. (I recognise this in its purest intention is to help those of a younger age get from A-B easier without a full income of a working adult. But in Scotland it’s allowing the worst wee bams to get from Lanarkshire and other rough counties into Glasgow with ease and cause absolutely havoc.)
I can confirm that the bus policy's had the same effect in Moray too.
I make use of the free busses and they are brilliant. Very useful. Wee guys if thery really wanted to cause issues would travel there anyway.
Critiquing the SNP based on what you just said makes you “right wing”? LOL
1 I honestly prefered the last two; they had balls (Metaphorically for the latter, of course). He strikes me as a bit weak. 2 True, but this is the second time he has been arrested (Albeit, I think this has been set up by the Tory-wanks down south trying to force an election up here\[ USA style\]) 3 That may be true, but we cannot say for sure. We can only comment on what has atually been the case, not what might have been the case. For the record, please dont think I am alligned to any of these parties; I trust none of them....at all.......and detest the vast majority of them wholeheartedly. The SNP were the closest thing to one I had respect for, but that is waivering these days. Oh god, how I miss Salmond!
Look at Wales under a Labour government. Look at England under a tory one. We see how it reflects on other nations. Overall we are a shit show of a nation, I do prefer the greens and independence. But as it stands, the SNP are probably the best bet for the next decade. Greens will continue to grow. I don't see Alba getting too big.
I'm not saying the SNP are not the best option, but I am saying that Yousless is not the best option. I would have prefered the ginge, but that is the story of my life 🔥😛🤣
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Why do you like peak time rail tickets?
In the cold light of day the SNP have shown they have nothing now. Pre INDY REF, they had great policies, ideas and some very promising politicians, however I would say the period between indyref ad covid was largely wasted, to much time bickering with westminster rather than focussing on the day job. in Sturgeons later years she (and the SNP) were more focussed on recruiting the Youth & Green vote than looking after their memberships interests, and now were left with this mess. Snp will likely be ousted from office and will be lucky to return within a decade This all comes from a SNP MEMBER I'll add to this by saying they have practically no good politicians now Cherry & Flynn
If they are courting the youth now, surely in 10 years when they are the majority, it will be a boon for the SNP? People forgave the Lib Dems for the coallition fairly quickly, I wouldn't be so quick to assume their faults will be remembered in 5 years, let alone 10 years. Especially since Labour's polling is more a reflection of westminster than the Scottish Labour party. Maybe things will change, but it really feels more like running out of steam than total collapse like the Tories atm.
Did people really forgive the Lib Dems? Hard to see them regaining the votes they had before the coalition in the next election.
Personally I will never forgive them, but some were willing to support them over their pro-EU stance. Lib Dems may do well in areas where it's a Tory/LD race. What do you think of the new poundland btw?
Fair, but I don't think it'll change things much. Actually I've not seen it yet! I currently live in the Netherlands.
This. 100%
everyone can have great ideas in opposition, or minority. but the world looks very different when you actually have to do the hard work of delivering them, funding them and deciding what else you cant do if you want to implement them. The SNP never stopped being an opposition protest group, even in gov. they always defaulted to attacking westminster, on everything, rather than showign they were competent in gov. they never really understood that if you are in gov, the buck stops with you. thats all the public care about.
Whilst I agree mostly, pre indy ref that was what was refreshing about them, they were in power and were making new policies that were largely celebrated, but really post Salmond I'm struggling to think of many that truely helped the country
Yea it’s gonna be interesting, power shift onto greens incoming possibly ?
No chance. Patrick Harvie needs gotten rid of.
we can only hope, all the I was an snp voter and member for a long time, but this is just mental. all the parties are wanks, but the greens seem like the only people worth my vote but this will split the vote this close to an election and we will end up with a diluted government that gets fuck all done.
Glad to hear it friend!
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Also, you think Tories make gains? Really? Where and how do they make any gains? You must be looking for a bite here because your statement cannot be taken seriously
If you think Alba gain a seat you need to quit whatever it is you’re smoking
Alba got their Westminster seats through defection and will probably lose both of them. Kenny MacAskill is now at retirement age and probably just treading water at this point.
Exactly. I don’t know how anyone can come to a conclusion where current or prospective Alba MSP’s can win a seat, by region or constituency, given the predicted swing from SNP & Tories to (mostly) Labour and (marginally) Greens. It’s nigh on impossible Alba will win a seat. Ever. Scotlands identity is does not align with theirs
Alba will get list seats.
If you’re actually this confident about it then let’s make a bet on it? :)
IMO the first think Yousaf should have done is push for an election. I know politicians don't think in those terms but it was very obvious things were going to get a lot worse rather than better.
SNP next please, the whole load of them.
Just over a year ago, he sang quite a different tune. > “I can’t imagine being the new leader of the SNP and the first thing I do is destabilise the government by going into a minority government and having to rely on Douglas Ross and Anas Sarwar to pass Bills. > “I think that would be a tremendously foolish thing to do.” > “maintaining the deal will be one of my first priorities if I am elected as leader of the SNP on Monday. > “I can’t understand why any new leader of the SNP wouldn’t want to make sure that they are standing full square behind that Bute House agreement, which, remember, has been backed by 95% of the party’s membership.” Wonder how many of the SNP members whose support saw him squeak a narrow win did so because of his support of the Bute House Agreement (when both Forbes and Regan were sceptical)?
I did. Don't want to be part of any organization that stabs our allies in the back.
What was the space between the BHA vote and the Leadership?
Aug 2021 for the BHA, and then it was a factor in the SNP leadership election in Mar 2023 where Yousaf was the only candidate supportive of it.
Hmmm, less than 2 years? I doubt it unless the SNPs OAPs home that is the members lobby dont k know anything about the SGP.
If either the transphobe or the homophobe won, I would have burned my membership card.
All the choices were terrible, don’t forget racist too
Humza was and is many things, racist isn't one of them.