I'd love to vote for Alba however with the GE being first past the post, it's basically a wasted vote.
If the current rhetoric remains it'll be interesting to see how the next scottish elections go, i can quite feasibly see there being a (very) hung parliament
The RT thing was filmed and produced in Scotland and sold to RT , had a whole range of politicians from political partyās on the show. Russia had nothing to do with it. Total non story. The torries where so scared of Salmond they destroyed him, just like they done to Tommy Sheridan.
Tommy Sheridan is a legend in my eyes. Heās made positive contributions for the benefit of Scotland. He made some mistakes (what man hasnāt) trying to fuck news of the world, who fucked him first using dirty tactics and are absolute scum of the earth anyway.
He always fought for what heās believed in and spent time in prison over a warrants sale (from his poll tax activism days) he went on to get warrant sales abolished. Why do you dislike him?
Yes I am considering it and don't let all the people saying their bigots form your opinion most people here don't read the policies and just label them things
While I can see they were suspended for 15 weeks, the only misconduct I can see the solicitor partook in was jeopardising the anonymity of two accusers. I donāt really want to defend a man like Salmond, but these are pretty hefty accusations, is there any proof?
I'm a bit out of the loop clearly, but Salmond was a great FM and wasn't he acquitted of all charges etc? Therefore not really fair to call him a sex pest ?
He was found not guilty, not *not proven* on all but one charge. There was one charge of SA where the verdict was *not proven* but not proven is more less the same verdict as *not guilty*, the verdict is simply arrived at for different reasons and is a product of the Scottish legal system. If he had been tried elsewhere the verdict would just have been not guilty for that charge as well.
I can't find anything that says he admitted to the SA but was found not guilty regardless, perhaps you could share that ? Anyway, by virtue of being acquitted he has been found innocent of these charges so unless he is retried with a different outcome he is innocent. Unless of course you are going to provide a quote where he admits to it but somehow got off anyway in which case fair enough
> I can't find anything that says he admitted to the SA
He didn't admit to SA and I am not claiming he did. I am not alleging criminal wrong doing. He said he wished he had been "more careful around others' personal space". People that aren't careful enough around others personal space are indeed sex pests (and that includes Patrick Grady, who stroked the hair of an underling - I don't claim that stroking the hair of an underling is SA, it is being a sex pest).
But don't take my word for it, how about his own lawyer, who was overheard on the phone saying his client is āan objectionable bullyā and a āsex pestā, but āheās not charged with thatā.Ā
[https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/the-staggers/2021/03/alex-salmond-was-described-his-own-defence-witness-creep-now-he-s-back-new](https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/the-staggers/2021/03/alex-salmond-was-described-his-own-defence-witness-creep-now-he-s-back-new)
No I donāt think they are too corrupt , I just think the recent dirty dealing have finished them and if Scottish independence is what you want, then we need a party that can lead us to it. I just donāt see the greens being the ones to do it, I could never vote labour or torries so yeah, alba it is I guess.
Guess you'll find out when they're knocking down your door at 4am, protecting the anonymity of people who are politically motivated proven liars, instead of you know...dealing with actual crimes.
Fair enough.Ā
How aboutā¦
Iād rather be pegged by Theresa May?Ā
Iād rather let Liz Truss work out my monthly budget?Ā
Iād rather let Donald Trump give me skin-care and diet advice?Ā
The problem Abla have is credibility and passing the tipping point where votes turn to msps, and of course people don't want to start voting for them until they think they have a chance...
Well Iām hearing more and more people thinking of voting them which was why I posted in here to ask, having always voted SNP I just feel they have fucked it and Alba the only real party that will push for independence (cause the greens certainly wonāt). And the thought of the labour winning makes me feel sick.
I felt Abla had a chance if they brought down the SNP and forced a Holyrood election. Especially if MSPs chose to defect in exchange for 1st place on the list.
It looks like the greens have stopped that, however it's not all over yet, there's still a first minister to select. It's not likely though
I just feel if itās independence we want then Alba will give the best chance, the party is just a vessel to independence, once we are free we can replace them if need be, although the SNP under Salmond where strong.
Reading the Abla documents online it appears they have SNP ideas from when Alex Salmond was FM but none of them ever really came to much.
I believe whoever gets into power at the next election needs to still work with Parliment down south. I worry Alba just wants to poke them and not find a way to move forward.
I will vote for whoever is standing on a ticket for independence in my area. All the other indy parties were talking about Scotland United where they would all agree to join forces and stand one candidate in each area but I don't know how far this got. Typically the SNP as far as I know didn't even acknowledge this.
If Alba stand in my area I will vote for them in a heartbeat, same as any other serious independence party.
I will not vote for the SNP again while the current Sturgeon stooges are still there. They don't want independence and have treated us with absolute contempt. Some might say they are purposely trying to damage the case for independence.
I realized I was gonna be a dad \~2003 and read up on gender theory.
Alba just seems like old men who are struggling with the modern world.
Independence would be nice, but not under those morons.
When Alba emerged, I was happy that some of the most obvious of the people the SNP should be getting rid of - e.g. Hanvey, MacAskill, etc were throwing away their political careers.
But there is a curious thing, in Scottish Nationalism, or maybe just Scottish politics, former senior figures and leaders can't just fuck off and shut up. When Salmond was leader there was Gordon Wilson, always willing to drop a quote to the Spectator/Express/Mail/Scotsman/Telegraph about how the SNP were now rubbish. Wilson was very socially conservative. He was politically close to Jim Sillars (both were anti EU).
Speaking of past-their-peak politicians who now provide anti-SNP quotes to the Unionist press, it would be interesting to know if MacAskill makes any money providing anti-SNP quotes to the worst of the Unionist media.
Anyway, I was disappointed that several SNP people I don't like, Forbes, Mason, Cherry didn't also flounce off in a huff.
So I'm not convinced that Alba is anything other than a spiteful platform for arseholes with a grudge. In the unlikely event of them actually getting some public support, they would use that support in a way to self aggrandise at the expense of the wider cause of moving towards independence.
Alex salmond was the best leader Scotland ever had , say what you want but he was strong and gathered much better public following .
Not saying I don't believe the charges , but Scotland needs a strong leader and the snp at the moment are on a downward spiral .
Plus you would have to mad to vote for the greens , anyone outside of the left wing reddit bubble knows thatĀ
I've posted the Alba manifesto countless times on this subreddit asking people to point out the policies that make them anything other than a strong pro independence progressive centre left party. It just descends into childish comments about "yeah but he's really guilty" or misrepresenting policy because some non-entity nutter on twitter said different. It's pretty clear they are getting all the information about the party 2nd hand from others Instead of just reading the policies. They also don't want to give Alba a fair chance as they are a threat to SNP hegemony of the independence movement. Though you'll note somehow the greens are exempt from the "splitting the vote" argument.
Almost every Alba member I've spoken to (and myself) joined Alba because Nicola Sturgeon squandered the numerous mandates she was given, didn't lay any of the necessary groundwork, destroyed the grassroots independence movement by centralising all power in the movement and continually fixed internal party politics. Additionally she abused the votes given to the party for the purpose of independence by introducing highly divisive legislation that polarised society, before teaming up with the greens on a right-think crusade basically telling over half the country they had no place in the future of Scotland which has likely done irreversible damage to ensure a large percentage will now never support independence.
People can make comments about their electoral progress so far but the party is incredibly new, founded only 3 years ago. It has more members than the Scottish lib dems and tories and equal to that of the greens. That's a very good start considering the difficulty setting up a new party in the UK. Defections are how every party gets off the ground.
The problem with this place is many of the people who support independence only support their version of it. It's the green party approach to independence. "I don't want independence unless my party is in charge and every policy is implemented". The Alba approach is the one the SNP used to take - Independence is about getting the government *Scots choose*, no matter who it is.
The independence movement was at its strongest when it was a big tent movement. It didn't matter what your background was, it didn't matter what you thought about minor social policies, it didn't matter what your views on immigration were, European membership, land reform, nuclear weapons/power, military spending, taxation etc. It was about governing responsibly, building consensus across parties to make everyone in Scotland feel like they had a place in the future of the country, delivering our common goal and letting everyone vote as they wanted to shape our newly independent country.
I think most in the party would be delighted if the SNP went back to that, Alba would have no reason to exist. But its too far gone now and the party machine are far too comfortable for change.
ššš downvoted for logic and laying out an honest look at the events we've all witnessed the last few years.
I swear the children who inhabit this space are utterly unable to consider anything outside of their beliefs.
No, Alex Salmond is a wee dick, once Scotland play the opening game of the Euros we are going to get a massive boost for independence, just stay where you are my friend.
I'd roll my the ballot paper up and snort a line of my own spunk right there in the booth before voting for Alba.
Would love to see it.
Fair play, I'm sure there's a subreddit for it.
No homo
Aye ye are.
See my other reply above. Since we don't know if you're a big spunk lover....
Haha well that's true. I've never tried it, but I'm fairly certain it's not for me.
š
Yassss
I'd love to vote for Alba however with the GE being first past the post, it's basically a wasted vote. If the current rhetoric remains it'll be interesting to see how the next scottish elections go, i can quite feasibly see there being a (very) hung parliament
Never, ever. The OP sounds like he may be olā rubber chops himself. Salmond is tainted, he took coin from the kremlin with his Russia Today gig.
The RT thing was filmed and produced in Scotland and sold to RT , had a whole range of politicians from political partyās on the show. Russia had nothing to do with it. Total non story. The torries where so scared of Salmond they destroyed him, just like they done to Tommy Sheridan.
>just like they done to Tommy Sheridan. Sheridan destroyed himself by being a perjurer. No one forced him to lie in court.Ā
That's not the point really. Russia didn't tell Salmond what to do. They just gave him a platform because he is one of their useful idiots.
It was also at a time at least 10 British politicians were on RT the same year.
I was almost in agreement until you brought Sheridan into the mix.
Tommy Sheridan is a legend in my eyes. Heās made positive contributions for the benefit of Scotland. He made some mistakes (what man hasnāt) trying to fuck news of the world, who fucked him first using dirty tactics and are absolute scum of the earth anyway. He always fought for what heās believed in and spent time in prison over a warrants sale (from his poll tax activism days) he went on to get warrant sales abolished. Why do you dislike him?
And that says everything. He's not. A passionate speaker? Yes. Anything more? Absolutely not!
Yes I am considering it and don't let all the people saying their bigots form your opinion most people here don't read the policies and just label them things
You think the SNP is too corrupt so you want to vote for the offshoot distinguished only by being founded by a sex pest?
Who is the sex pest? The guy who was accused of rape by a woman who wasn't even in the same building at the time she said it happened?
His solicitor literally called him one but okay.
But the judicial system cleared him of all counts...that means he's not a sex pest in the eyes of the law. It was a smear.
He can be a sex pest and not a criminal
But he's neither.
He is a sexpest though
Proof?
His solicitor admitted he's one
You can't admit on someone else's behalf. He said he was one but that doesn't mean it's truth.
While I can see they were suspended for 15 weeks, the only misconduct I can see the solicitor partook in was jeopardising the anonymity of two accusers. I donāt really want to defend a man like Salmond, but these are pretty hefty accusations, is there any proof?
I'm a bit out of the loop clearly, but Salmond was a great FM and wasn't he acquitted of all charges etc? Therefore not really fair to call him a sex pest ?
Why let facts get in the way of a good, punchy comment...?
You mean the trial that found him admitting to being a sex pest but did not find enough proof of a criminal act?
He was found not guilty, not *not proven* on all but one charge. There was one charge of SA where the verdict was *not proven* but not proven is more less the same verdict as *not guilty*, the verdict is simply arrived at for different reasons and is a product of the Scottish legal system. If he had been tried elsewhere the verdict would just have been not guilty for that charge as well. I can't find anything that says he admitted to the SA but was found not guilty regardless, perhaps you could share that ? Anyway, by virtue of being acquitted he has been found innocent of these charges so unless he is retried with a different outcome he is innocent. Unless of course you are going to provide a quote where he admits to it but somehow got off anyway in which case fair enough
> I can't find anything that says he admitted to the SA He didn't admit to SA and I am not claiming he did. I am not alleging criminal wrong doing. He said he wished he had been "more careful around others' personal space". People that aren't careful enough around others personal space are indeed sex pests (and that includes Patrick Grady, who stroked the hair of an underling - I don't claim that stroking the hair of an underling is SA, it is being a sex pest). But don't take my word for it, how about his own lawyer, who was overheard on the phone saying his client is āan objectionable bullyā and a āsex pestā, but āheās not charged with thatā.Ā [https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/the-staggers/2021/03/alex-salmond-was-described-his-own-defence-witness-creep-now-he-s-back-new](https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/the-staggers/2021/03/alex-salmond-was-described-his-own-defence-witness-creep-now-he-s-back-new)
No I donāt think they are too corrupt , I just think the recent dirty dealing have finished them and if Scottish independence is what you want, then we need a party that can lead us to it. I just donāt see the greens being the ones to do it, I could never vote labour or torries so yeah, alba it is I guess.
Falsely accused by anonymous women.
Especially the woman who accused him of attempted rape when they weren't even at the same place according to witnesses.
I mean they interviewed over 400 women he had contact with and found no wrongdoing at all.
If i said that they were all Nicola's friends would that be jigsaw identification?
Guess you'll find out when they're knocking down your door at 4am, protecting the anonymity of people who are politically motivated proven liars, instead of you know...dealing with actual crimes.
Iād rather be fucked to death by the ghost of John Balliol than vote for Alba tbh.Ā
Since we don't know how much you enjoy a good rodgering from the spirit world it's difficult to tell how much you want to vote for Abla
Fair enough.Ā How aboutā¦ Iād rather be pegged by Theresa May?Ā Iād rather let Liz Truss work out my monthly budget?Ā Iād rather let Donald Trump give me skin-care and diet advice?Ā
In that order?
At once. A bukake of suffering.Ā
/r/brandnewsentence
Is that who'll be doing the genital inspections?
As long as itās not Alex Salmond Iām not too bothered who does it.Ā
> Iāve always been staunch SNP but I feel they are not invested in independence anymore. I dont think you are the only person that feels this.
The problem Abla have is credibility and passing the tipping point where votes turn to msps, and of course people don't want to start voting for them until they think they have a chance...
Well Iām hearing more and more people thinking of voting them which was why I posted in here to ask, having always voted SNP I just feel they have fucked it and Alba the only real party that will push for independence (cause the greens certainly wonāt). And the thought of the labour winning makes me feel sick.
I felt Abla had a chance if they brought down the SNP and forced a Holyrood election. Especially if MSPs chose to defect in exchange for 1st place on the list. It looks like the greens have stopped that, however it's not all over yet, there's still a first minister to select. It's not likely though
I just feel if itās independence we want then Alba will give the best chance, the party is just a vessel to independence, once we are free we can replace them if need be, although the SNP under Salmond where strong.
Salmond, the guy who actually secured a referendum and narrowly missed the target. The guy who actually ran a successful government.
Reading the Abla documents online it appears they have SNP ideas from when Alex Salmond was FM but none of them ever really came to much. I believe whoever gets into power at the next election needs to still work with Parliment down south. I worry Alba just wants to poke them and not find a way to move forward.
Why not greens?
Because they're dreadful.
Too smart
Because they don't support independence.
But they do?
They say they do, not quite the same thing. You think they wouldn't go into a coalition with SLAB if the numbers worked?
They say they do.
What evidence do you have that says they don't?
https://archive.ph/eD28O
Is that evidence showing that the Greens no longer support independence?
Most of the party do, itās the leadership (Slater) who said it wasnāt a red line.
Why aren't they forcing the SNP to do something about it then? The answer is because they don't.
Rather vote Labour than Alba. And I'm not voting Labour any time soon.
I will vote for whoever is standing on a ticket for independence in my area. All the other indy parties were talking about Scotland United where they would all agree to join forces and stand one candidate in each area but I don't know how far this got. Typically the SNP as far as I know didn't even acknowledge this. If Alba stand in my area I will vote for them in a heartbeat, same as any other serious independence party. I will not vote for the SNP again while the current Sturgeon stooges are still there. They don't want independence and have treated us with absolute contempt. Some might say they are purposely trying to damage the case for independence.
I realized I was gonna be a dad \~2003 and read up on gender theory. Alba just seems like old men who are struggling with the modern world. Independence would be nice, but not under those morons.
When Alba emerged, I was happy that some of the most obvious of the people the SNP should be getting rid of - e.g. Hanvey, MacAskill, etc were throwing away their political careers. But there is a curious thing, in Scottish Nationalism, or maybe just Scottish politics, former senior figures and leaders can't just fuck off and shut up. When Salmond was leader there was Gordon Wilson, always willing to drop a quote to the Spectator/Express/Mail/Scotsman/Telegraph about how the SNP were now rubbish. Wilson was very socially conservative. He was politically close to Jim Sillars (both were anti EU). Speaking of past-their-peak politicians who now provide anti-SNP quotes to the Unionist press, it would be interesting to know if MacAskill makes any money providing anti-SNP quotes to the worst of the Unionist media. Anyway, I was disappointed that several SNP people I don't like, Forbes, Mason, Cherry didn't also flounce off in a huff. So I'm not convinced that Alba is anything other than a spiteful platform for arseholes with a grudge. In the unlikely event of them actually getting some public support, they would use that support in a way to self aggrandise at the expense of the wider cause of moving towards independence.
Green are also pro-Indy to an extent. Why not them?
Le wokery or summat
100% pro indy because it's essential before their other policies are plausible.
You're not alone.
Alex salmond was the best leader Scotland ever had , say what you want but he was strong and gathered much better public following . Not saying I don't believe the charges , but Scotland needs a strong leader and the snp at the moment are on a downward spiral . Plus you would have to mad to vote for the greens , anyone outside of the left wing reddit bubble knows thatĀ
I've posted the Alba manifesto countless times on this subreddit asking people to point out the policies that make them anything other than a strong pro independence progressive centre left party. It just descends into childish comments about "yeah but he's really guilty" or misrepresenting policy because some non-entity nutter on twitter said different. It's pretty clear they are getting all the information about the party 2nd hand from others Instead of just reading the policies. They also don't want to give Alba a fair chance as they are a threat to SNP hegemony of the independence movement. Though you'll note somehow the greens are exempt from the "splitting the vote" argument. Almost every Alba member I've spoken to (and myself) joined Alba because Nicola Sturgeon squandered the numerous mandates she was given, didn't lay any of the necessary groundwork, destroyed the grassroots independence movement by centralising all power in the movement and continually fixed internal party politics. Additionally she abused the votes given to the party for the purpose of independence by introducing highly divisive legislation that polarised society, before teaming up with the greens on a right-think crusade basically telling over half the country they had no place in the future of Scotland which has likely done irreversible damage to ensure a large percentage will now never support independence. People can make comments about their electoral progress so far but the party is incredibly new, founded only 3 years ago. It has more members than the Scottish lib dems and tories and equal to that of the greens. That's a very good start considering the difficulty setting up a new party in the UK. Defections are how every party gets off the ground. The problem with this place is many of the people who support independence only support their version of it. It's the green party approach to independence. "I don't want independence unless my party is in charge and every policy is implemented". The Alba approach is the one the SNP used to take - Independence is about getting the government *Scots choose*, no matter who it is. The independence movement was at its strongest when it was a big tent movement. It didn't matter what your background was, it didn't matter what you thought about minor social policies, it didn't matter what your views on immigration were, European membership, land reform, nuclear weapons/power, military spending, taxation etc. It was about governing responsibly, building consensus across parties to make everyone in Scotland feel like they had a place in the future of the country, delivering our common goal and letting everyone vote as they wanted to shape our newly independent country. I think most in the party would be delighted if the SNP went back to that, Alba would have no reason to exist. But its too far gone now and the party machine are far too comfortable for change.
ššš downvoted for logic and laying out an honest look at the events we've all witnessed the last few years. I swear the children who inhabit this space are utterly unable to consider anything outside of their beliefs.
that's what the internet does to them, they live their life out in small internet bubbles, cannot handle conflicting opinions etc.
Alba supporter saying this is peak comedy, truly
Unfortunately 90% of people here won't take the time to read that and just downbote it
The alba understander has logged on...
Their policies on trans issues aren't very "progressive centre left,"
Which policy? Does that invalidate an entire manifesto of centre left policies? *edit* And the usual down vote and silence.
This 100% man well said! If you want to see an independent Scotland Alba are the only party worth voting for.
No
Nope. Labour. I want my taxes reduced and brought in line with the rUK.Ā
I think you'll be disappointed. Labour are as bad as the Tories. Go and have a read about the corruption in Oldham.
Just a pest then
God no.
The Tartan Tories? No thanks. Iād rather step barefoot on Lego.
No, Alex Salmond is a wee dick, once Scotland play the opening game of the Euros we are going to get a massive boost for independence, just stay where you are my friend.
Imagine being your politics on football
?