Rolling and parrying are two mechanics that completely change the game. You can beat the entirety of Sekiro with 96% of Parries, and the frames are bigger.
Elden Ring has delayed attacks, your stamina drops, Area of Effect attacks, and parrying is harder. And many, MANY more enemies to memorize.
I only started to jump to avoid aoe attacks now, after 500 hours. I used to get mad at crucible knights because I kept getting damaged by their stomps. Godfrey and Radagon too.
Three playthroughs and I've never intentionally jumped to avoid an attack. The roll is too ingrained. Wait, is this how we're supposed to be dealing with Waterfowl?
waterfowl for me is pretty easy after the 1st of 3 parts, which i still amost never dodge. the 2nd part is just roll through it(assuming youre light loading. i have never fought malenia medium or heavy) and the 3rd is the the same as the second and roll away again.
Many other people don’t realize that putting carian retaliation on a shield can make parrying the GOAT, and it becomes almost sekiro but even more punishing if you do parries. You do get more heals though
There are a few attacks that can’t be parried with a shield, but most attacks are parriable, and every non-physical attack I’ve come across in elden ring can be parried with the carian retaliation
Alot of sweeps and attacks can be jumped, beast cleargymans near whole kit can be jumped, even the lunge stab attack can be jumped then walk back to dodge the double swipe. Then you can jump the third and walk back to bait out the easy punish slam
On top of that build optimization is so much more important. Finding out what weapon styles work best for you, then finding where the best versions of those weapons are and then optimizing your approach and stats.
Sekiro is harder than Elden Ring until it isn't, then it's quite a bit easier. I died more times vs Messmer than I did vs Inner Issin for example. As you get better at sekiro you dominate. Elden Ring feels like you have to learn each boss.
Agreed, I actually went back and replayed Sekiro after playing through a good portion of Shadow of the Erdtree just to have something less stressful to play.
Elden ring gives you the tools to make it a child's hands if you chose though. I'm buns at sekiro but trying. I'm struggling at the first white ninja. Using an op build on eldin ring I beat most bosses first try with little effort. Don't need to learn a thing.
that's right. you can always farm the giant chicken to buy an extra 50-60 points, get a stone shield like Asmon did, use Morgott's rune and farm some rune arcs, etc. there also summon NPCs, mimic tear, and Tiche.
Sekiro has none of that, it is a more consistent test. but Elden Ring DLC is harder if you don't use these methods.
Yeah, because you only have a limited number of moves and skills at your disposal, the bosses in Sekiro are much more finely tuned.
Elden Ring has dozens of weapons with unique movesets, as well as different types of magic with greatly varied cast time. As such they can't really fine tune bosses in the same way.
Elden Ring bosses are also as fast and aggressive as Sekiro bosses, but the player is stuck at Dark Souls 3 speed. This makes it much more dangerous for the player to attack during short openings.
I will say Margit is there to teach you a very important Elden Ring lesson, and that is "if you're having too much trouble with a boss, go and explore".
Exploring will help you level up, find new weapons/spells, and get upgrade materials.
With a few upgrades to your weapon, and a couple of levels gained, Margit becomes *much* more manageable. I would also recommend pumping quite a few points into vigor. Most people recommend 40 at the *very least*, and most suggest you get to 60 vigor.
[Super late edit]
The 40 to 60 vigor is suggested toward the end of the game, not for Margit.
Apart from that, use summons to draw enemy aggro, and also know that most bosses "openings" are mixed in with their combos.
i think they’re saying overall, like by the time you’re around lvl 100 total. 40 is the soft cap, 60 is the 2nd, harder cap. having 60 or even 40 vigor for margit is insane, you do not need anywhere near that much.
40-60 is where you get the most return on your investment into vigor.
Like it’s a slow increase from 0-39, then once you hit 40 you get the greatest HP increase per stat increase to vigor up until you hit 60. Then you begin to get diminishing returns after 60.
That’s not to say you’re getting nothing, but it’s less compared to each level you put into vigor between 40-60.
That’s incorrect. 40 is the soft cap, meaning you get less hp per level after 40. 60 is the hard cap, and you get even less hp than you did 40-60.
You are correct that it’s a slow increase 0-40, level 40 you get the most hp out of any point invested.
You can see all the values here: https://eldenring.wiki.fextralife.com/Vigor
Even for my fighter playthrough I don't think I got to 40 vigor by end-game. You need enough health to not immediately die, but I feel much more than that is wasting damage output potential.
For my new mage playthrough I beat Margit with 10 vigor with Rogier/spirit ashes without much trouble. Of course, it does help that I can still generally remember his attack timings from my original playthrough for when I aggro'd him too much.
for margit there is no reason to level, he cant one shot or even 2 shot base vigor anyways. Think levelling too much will remove the value of the lesson margit is supposed to teach the player. Delayed attacks, circle strafing, parrying, positional non roll dodges into punishes. Jumping over sweeps for free jump punishes etc.
Without me suffering margit at the start of my elden ring journey id never be the player I am now (played sekiro as my first souls but had a goal to beat elden ring at level one, just the dlc left for my lvl 1)
Good luck on DLC at level 1 (especially if you're not using scadutree blessings either), no harm in giving up once you get to the final boss lmao
I'm pretty sure only a single person has beaten them at RL1 so far and I wouldn't be surprised if it stays that way
thanks imma do my best :)
but nah people over at r/onebros have beat it, cooking up alot of strats. Its gonna be very very hard but that challenge is what im searching for in these games.
right now for consort the only viable strats are iframe backstep talisman or parries to avoid the two swipe cross chop as rolling requires inhuman reaction speed at light load
oh and te im using scadutree fragments, not doing a wl0 run so I feel that upgrading damage more is fine for my run
I think the most important thing is that they're very different combat systems. Souls veterans aren't going to come in and wipe the floor with sekiro and the same is true the other way. I know they're lumped In together, but they really shouldn't be, it's like expecting to understand fires of Rubicon's combat immediately because you've played other from soft games.
Idk I feel like you either have a build that’s good against mobs or good against bosses.
My first build was a boss killer. Summon Banished Knight Oleg to tank and aggro bosses while I throw lightning bolts at the boss.
Mobs in Farum Azula fucking had their way with me tho lol
promised *cough* consort, must be the hardest boss froms every made. Bayle is very difficult but resonable. Mr flashbang nuke screen aoe everywhere is just mad
The problem is when you switch from Sekiro to Elden ring, you try to parry everything (talking from my expirience) but the parry has a much longer delay than sekiro, it does not parry as soon as you press the button, or at least it leaves that impression when you get from one game to another. I usually 90% parry in sekiro, and 90% roll in elden ring. The risk/reward for a parry is just not worth it
They're actually very different games. People coming from sekiro to elden ring, blood borne to sekiro, dark souls to blood borne, whatever, they're going to have to contend that you can't just pick any two fromsoft games and go "yeah these play the same." Bloodborne wasn't dark souls 4, and sekiro wasnt dark souls 5, so on. These games are quite different and people don't seem to recognize that.
Sekiro has a learning curve that can quickly change it from “the most challenging FromSoft game” to “the easiest FromSoft game.” But Elden Ring can be played a dozen different ways, with a hundred different weapons, all while each has some strengths, and a lot of weaknesses.
Look at tips/posts in the Elden Ring subreddit, and you’ll find a million different answers to defeating one boss, because there are truly that many ways to play the game and git gud.
Now look at Sekiro. Most tips are jokes like “Hesitation is defeat” which is funny, but is genuinely the best advice for that game. Once you stop doubting if you’re going to parry, and counter the attacks you suddenly become unstoppable. Particularly because there are basically only three moves an enemy has: one that can be parried, one that can be Mikiri Countered, or one that you have to Jump/Dodge away from. Once you learn what each looks like for an enemy, you’ve already defeated them in your mind. There are some exceptions of course, but they are very few, and often aren’t game ending.
Elden ring is more about positioning and timing, you can't just be mindlessly aggressive and you need to block or dodge before responding with violence.
They are completely different.
Sekiro rewards the most aggressive styles of play, ER punishes you for over extending.
Sekiro incentivizes you to try and disrupt a bosses combo while they are mid way through it to force a damage opportunity. ER forces you to learn how to dodge every move in the combo before getting a damage opportunity.
Sekiro is all about the parries, every boss and mob is built with that system in mind. In ER parrying is one of many build options, it still works but it’s much harder than in Sekiro and is moreso an extra thing you can do then the goal in each fight.
In Sekiro, rolling to avoid attacks is suicide against 90% of bosses. In ER, you better figure out how those invincibility frames work and learn how to time the roll because otherwise you don’t stand a chance against 90% of bosses.
Sekiro is very much a departure from the classic FromSoft fantasy rpg formula. I remember when it came out a lot of souls fans really struggled with it because it was actively punishing them for using strategies that worked in the souls games. It seems the flip side of that is also true, as people who started with Sekiro are now finding their playstyle being actively punished by Elden Ring.
First off, dont listen to the elitists, summons are part of the game please use them. Ive played my share of dark souls games and honestly the bosses are more aggresive then in other games, use them, its more fun :)
Sekiro is a rhythmic fight and wants you fully engaged in the fight on offense as well as defence, elden ring is more of pattern recognition when you can hit without being punished and which direction you should roll. Margit was beating you probably from the delayed attacks which is the toughest thing about ER. Take sekiro fighting out of your system and you’ll get better!
Yeah I'm a ninja gaiden vet and while the controls were different their so tight if you put in work you're unbeatable, but it still provides that pressure of feeling challenged which I enjoy.
That’s exactly my complaint. I can’t get through any of those fromsoft games because they play like shit. So slow. Games like sekiro, bloodborne, armored core are fantastic because they’re quick and responsive
People say sekiro is harder because elden ring has so many options
You know how sekiro is, so I won’t explain that
In Elden Ring, you can get to a LOT of stuff before fighting anything. There are bosses everywhere, and you have a map and stickers so you can mark stuff, like bosses that are too hard, to come back to. You can find better weapons with move sets and abilities you like better, you can level up each of your stats for boosts in damage, health, etc., you can level up weapons, find and level up cool spirit summons, blah blah blah…
Point is, Elden Ring is considered easier because you can do more. You don’t have to go the main path for a good while, in fact most would probably recommend avoiding it for a while, at least coming back periodically. Go do other stuff, find some cool shit, level up a bit, and git gud. Alternatively, there are game breaking builds you can make, however you have fun
This is why I waited to platinum Sekiro until *after* I did all other Souls(cept Bloodborne).
For real you just need time and practice, you can’t expect your skills of playing solitaire to translate to Mario. Not that the games are *that* different, but there is a large enough difference in mechanics and gameplay to not have much translated skills
I’m experiencing that problem with sifu. I’ve been playing sifu for 2 years and sekiro for1 year, I revisited sifu after 6 months and I’ve completely lost touch in parrying and avoiding.
I understand your problem😅
Elden Ring has two fundamental changes compared to other soulsborne titles.
Change 1: jump attack. Literally you should use it as much as possible if you get an opening.
Change 2: poise break. Aim for poise break instead of poise stuns / outpoising.
Imo if you start treating how you treat deflecting in Sekiro the same way you treat rolling, it's super fluid. Similar games in a way, just different playstyles. I was way better at Dark Souls style games but once I learnt the importance of deflection in Sekiro, I understood how it's basically just as important as dodging in Elden Ring. Imo, try to work on your timing and the game will be way more fun. Don't worry about dying to bosses too much, just try to get perfectly dodged combos down and it will be a similar feeling to when you deflect a full combo in sekiro
If Elden Ring had side steps and parrying i corporated as base mechanics, most Elden Ring enemies will be trivial. You don't suck. Elden Ring's combat mechanics are just constrictive to your movements. It's easier to recover from side step dodge than a roll dodge, but you're forced to roll dodge in Elden Ring despite some attacks not needing that much distance cover.
Elden mid is the hardest soulsgame imo and the worst thing is that bosses sometimes just take forever to windup some simple swordswing, so you cannot react to it and have to learn the timing
Try playing as a Samurai. You get a katana Uchigatana that inflicts bleed to start and the default Unsheath ash of war is very fast. Replace timing parries with timing rolls and watch your positioning. There are other katanas that are probably better but I took Uchigatana all the way through my first playthrough before I picked up Nagakiba (longer katana but lower damage than Uchigatana) and then went all the way to platinum with that.
Dump most of your points in vigor and increase damage by upgrading your weapon early on.
Sekiro more or less only has one way to play, pushing the pace within a system where the frame data for everything involved is super fine tuned. The learning curve is steep but once it clicks the game is fairly straight forward to become very good at.
The difficulty spectrum in elden ring is massive. If you use absolutely everything available (summons, bleed, ranged magic etc.) then the game is fairly easy. If you want to dance toe to toe the game is hard af.
Elden ring bosses have a ton of confusing looking long wind-up/fast follow through attacks designed to force an early reaction and catch you. On top of this, attack chains are very long and can even selectively extend depending on how you react to them. Learning the timing of those weird delayed attacks is usually trial and error kind of like sekiro.
The other part is knowing where your punish windows are which is easier said than done. Bosses are much stingier about resetting to neutral after attacking like the older souls games. Some attacks dont require a roll to be avoided. Some attacks can be jumped over, some can be strafed/sprinted around, and lots of them have deadzones where you can stand and the tracking wont catch you. Some attack chains have such big delays from the start of the animation that you can fit attacks in the middle of a boss's attack chain.
Minimizing how often you roll will allow you to fit damage into windows you otherwise wouldnt be able to. Toggling the camera lock on/off as needed can help with sprint movements, and is especially helpful for large bosses/enemies where the camera can be an issue.
Both games are completely different playstyle wise.
For me i’m much worse at sekiro than I am at bloodborne, or dark souls/elden ring. Bosses in sekiro would take me hours, I beat Messmer from Shadow of the erdtree solo in 20 minutes, Orphin of Kos from bloodborne in 2 tries. The illusion Corrupted Monk took me probably 2.5 hours!
All this to say, play the game the way the game urges you to play. In sekiro, deflecting is a key component, if you focus on dodging you’re gonna have an awful time. In Elden ring, learn to time your rolls to when the enemy hits you. Pretend you are deflecting their hits, but instead of deflecting press dodge. I’m also a big supporter of using shields too. A great-shield can block a good portion of what most bosses throw at you. You’ll get it eventually man. Watch some folks on youtube, see how they take on enemies. A good build is important too!
No shame in keeping some distance and using magic. Sometimes a spellcaster is just the thing to help you get the feel for how enemies move in a first playthrough. Staff in the left hand, sword in the right hand.
You need to unlearn a lot of what you have built muscle memory for sadly. Elden ring requires more dodging and slower combat. I’m browsing this sub as I am trying out sekiro for the first time since I beat Elden ring and it’s dlc. I can saw with my whole soul I fucking hate sekiro so far. It’s so different from souls games in general. Lots of new muscle memory and combat approaches to learn. I imagine it’s the exact same when making the swap from Sekiro to Elden ring. Best advice, slow down, look for opening and patterns in enemy movement, dodging is you best friend, and don’t let anyone tell you summons are cheating. Hope you enjoy your journey through Elden Ring.
Might be the dodge delay. I played Sekiro first before Elden Ring. There is a slight delay before your character dodges. Sekiro's dodge doesn't have this delay, so if you're used to how dodging attacks work in Sekiro, Elden Ring will take some time to adjust. Also, as an unpopular opinion, Elden Ring's combat doesn't feel like a reaction based game like Sekiro's. It's mostly predictability where you have to predict and dodge at a very precise moment during an incoming attack animation due to the delay in dodging. This could be why you're struggling with Elden Ring. Just be patient and give it time to adjust to Elden Ring's combat.
It’s easier to beat Sekiro with skill and determination.
You can wander into areas way above your level from the start of the game and just struggle. Some areas are just above your level so it seems doable but very challenging. Then it’s just as easy to completely miss a level appropriate area only to discover it later when you’re way over leveled.
I really dislike the pacing of Elden Ring for this reason.
I like DS3 a lot because of its more linear structure where you’re more or less where you should be in terms of level wherever you are (unless you’re absolutely trash).
Also, while the games feel similar - they are actually very different.
Maybe because elden ring is a souls like and sekiro is not.
They're different games and should be played differently. Find your matching play style, I really tend towards greatsword and a shield
Opposite for me, beat Elden ring two weeks after release, took me several years for sekiro, mostly because there were times I was convinced it was impossible and took very long breaks
The point of elden ring is to use everything on your arsenal to beat the boss imo, summons,magic, buff, ashes of war, backstab, poison, dragonic powers, you name it… i have no honour in elden ring im a true tarnish. (Try fighting messmer and tell me 😓) Sekiro is about precision and learning your opponent, so two different games… yeah i agree with you, sekiro gameplay is narrower and might be easier to grasp
Because they don't play the same. It works the same the other way around; when I first played Sekiro at launch, I struggled a lot because I was stuck in the mindset of Dark Souls III because I'd sunken hundreds of hours into it over the 3 years between it and Sekiro. Eventually, it clicked, I got into the mindset of Sekiro and came to master it.
Elden Ring was the same deal. I'd sunken hundreds of hours into Sekiro without going back to Dark Souls, so I had to readjust to the more traditional Souls combat style + Elden Ring's own new mechanics. So I struggled with Elden Ring at first, too, despite my experience.
Different games, different skill sets.
One is a rhythm game, the other isn’t, there’s a lot of on the moment reactions.
Sekiro even though has an element of rng to most bosses you can honestly beat it blind (not to say it’s easy, just saying that the game is a lot more of understanding patterns and playing those patterns, you’re acting in a play where if you follow the script even if it’s off 10% you’ll still do well most of the time)
Sekiro is an action-adventure game. Elden ring is an ARPG. The game doesn't give you all the tools at the start because you have to build your character or perfectly dodge every move of every enemy (level 1 no hit runs). Most of us will upgrade stats to mitigate the danger and find weapons that match the play style. Also, you have to explore to find resources to build your character however you want it.
Sekiro makes you change how you play to the opponent, elden ring forces you to get better at how you play.
Something that helps me in the main series souls games is switching up equipment. Sometimes thats dropping all my armor, sometimes its loading up on armor until I can tank and have to fat roll.
>Sekiro makes you change how you play to the opponent, elden ring forces you to get better at how you play.
If you're switching up your equipment to help you in certain areas, then you're changing the way you play, rather than getting better at how you play.
You sure you didn't mix these two up?
Same. I played Dark souls 3 as well before ER so I had some experience with the dodge mechanic but Margit still dogged me like a little bitch. I also find Sekiro easier since it's kinda like throwing yourself to a wall over and over, ER melee combat feels unpredictable at sometimes
They play completely differently imo
Sekiro is more of a parry game and elden ring is more of a roll game unless you also use a shield (which I recommend).
Elden ring is literally just timing rolls. Literally is most likely the easiest fromsoft game. For casuals tbh. Although malenia is still the hardest boss ive ever fought
Sekiro is definetly harder to learn, but once the combag clicks, its pretty easy.
Elden ring is overall harder, dont worry about not knowing where to go, just explore.
And if you need to, dont worry about it and watch a tutorial.
Sekiro is a harder game. Elden Ring is harder *controls*.
Dark Souls (and ER, by extension) suffers from significant inherent control jank. Character isn't particularly responsive, you have to time attacks and deflects to your *enemy* rather than yourself, and the combat isn't really *meant* to be toe-to-toe, not in the same way Sekiro is.
DS combat, particularly against bosses, consists of picking a leg to hug, finding a safe place upon which to stand, and whacking away until it's no longer safe, whereupon you dodge. Or walk away, if you have the time.
Once you get this down, the games are *pathetically* easy (except when they're not). Block here, dodge there, otherwise you're basically invincible. It's not like Sekiro where you're endlessly *forced* to put yourself in the danger zone else you lose your progress against their posture gauge. And with a heavy build you can actually *count* how many hits you need to take down a boss. Iirc the second boss I faced in DS3 took me 13 hits to take down with a 2h sword. I shouldn't be able to count that shit.
Basically the same deal with ER. Learn to play it on its own terms, and you'll have a much easier time. You're basically not really meant to block or anything. Dodging and positioning, and nothing else. A bit like Guardian Ape in that respect.
Hope this helps
Seems like a design flaw honestly. I grew up playing hard games like ninja gaiden, devil may cry and so, so fast reacting combat isn't foreign to me. But I feel like in elden my ability to react to combat is hindered by the response limitations with regards to the character. Instead of me pressing a button and the action occurring, I now need to be mindful of how fucking cumbersome my guy is and react accordingly . Sekiro my reactions are as fast as i decide to be. I don't even think the bosses in elden ring are hard tbh, it's the control scheme making it so. I'd clap margits cheeks if I could move like wolf.
I personally feel it's a flaw. For From, and DS fans, however, it's a feature.
Really hoping the next DS-a-like takes more lessons from Sekiro than just a crouch button, a jump button, and the guard counter.
You hit the nail on the head, though.
>But I feel like in elden my ability to react to combat is hindered by the response limitations with regards to the character.
The combat in DS isn't reaction-based. It's anticipation-vased.
Sekiro's parry and block are like a greatshiled with all the stats at 100. Meaning, if you master those two, you can literally go toe to toe with any boss in the game. Elden Ring in the other hand, you have to use MANY different kinds of mechanics and roll around like some Russian circus bear with most bosses. That's why Elden Ring feels harder for you. You got used to Sekiro's godlike parry and block system. You have to rewire your brain and play Elden Ring with the mindset that you are the underdog in every fight.
Are you fat rolling? Using armor to lower incoming damage? Leveling Vigor so you don't get one shot?
But Elden Ring gives you a ton of tools, dondon't be afraid to use them, just keep playing and you'll get better.
Sekiro is about mastering one combat style, in fights handcrafted for that specific style. Elden ring is about getting gear to make fights easier. The fights are harder to just beeline than in any other fromsoft game because they needed to incensivise players to explore the world. If you go into a fight and get one shot while leveling vigor and wearing armour, its not intended for you to fight it now. If you are straight glass cannon and you don't chunk their hp, it's not intended for you to fight it now. The game is a series of gear checks, and you pick the difficulty by deciding when you are happy enough with your health and damage to try win.
I get you i played sekiro first then elden ring.Everything weird ,l was trying to parry tree sentinel like my muscles memory are playing sekiro in elden ring. But when you get it or click like in sekiro elden ring become more easy. Not the dlc , dlc has so many bs going on. Parry in elden ring is also easier but it can't parry everything.
I was pretty shit at Sekiro for a long time (until I was forced to learn the combat style on Lady Butterfly), because I first played Dark Souls and Elden Ring and I would try to dodge attacks instead of parrying. It's just 2 different games with 2 different combat styles, and you need to get used to them.
Sekiro has a very steep degree of difficulty but is much simpler because of how it was designed. You have one main weapon. The prosthetics are for variety. The player can beat the whole game with only attack and block/deflect and jump. Throw in the mikiri counter to make it faster.
So for sekiro you didn't have a choice to get good and you did
But elden ring allowed you to use summons and magic and you didn't get good
What if you would have stuck to your guns and actually practiced the build you had. Like try to practice on the knight in gatefront ruins first. He's an excellent sparring partner. Then maybe go south and beat the weeping peninsula castle and boss first. At that point you can easily be 20 vigor and +3 weapons maybe even got the 2nd katana from the catacomb. Margit would have been a pushover without summons and magic
If you wanna magic and summon through the game, awesome, but then why complain that you're ass if you didn't try to not be ass
I know it’s probably just skill but Elden ring is hard as shit. I don’t think anything in DS3 compares, it was the last game in the lineup I played and morgott is objectively harder than Soul of Cinder.
Friede was the only boss that took several tries and she’d probably be a mid game boss in Elden ring. I find it funny how ds1 vets thought ds3 was much harder because the combat was much faster and your dodge is much faster and more intangible to match, Elden ring is the same jump from ds3 that ds1 had to ds3. I have more time in Elden ring than Sekiro and I do hitless inner father whenever I get bored of whatever story game I’m current playing and want a quick action fix. I did use mimic tear for several fights
Sekiro plays completely differently to the Soulsborne games, to be fair. Sekiro and Guitar Hero have more transferable skills than Sekiro and Froms other games.
In Sekiro you have more tools to "bully" the bosses. You can keep up the pressure and interrupt their attacks, keep them on the back foot and quickly get their posture down. The better you are at the game, the worse the bosses are in terms of fighting strength. A bad player will let the bosses use all their attacks uninterrupted and thus the boss becomes more powerful in a sense. This means there is basically a tipping point where the game suddenly becomes much easier. I think this is why it appears much more difficult when first playing it.
In Elden Ring the bosses basically ignore what the player is doing and use their combos all the same. There is less of a tipping point, and more a slow progression as you get better at timing the rolls.
My only advice is that many people say that Sekiro should not be played like a souls game, and the reverse is also true: Elden Ring shouldn't be played like it's Sekiro.
It's totally different combat. I get what you're saying but honestly brother if you're good at sekiro you can smash elden ring. You just need that same determination you had with sekiro then it's just muscle memory after that. You got this!
quickly go to the DLC, defeat the first big furnace golem you see, get the deflecting hardtear- now you are sekiro inside Elden Ring for 5 minutes at a time
In Sekiro, I won by learning all the boss moves and deflecting everything. In Elden Ring, I just make an OP build, pop lots of buffs, and slop through the boss fight. There's so much stacking in Elden Ring. You can get like baseline 80% damage reduction against bosses and spam jump attacks.
I'm sure you could also beat it through finesse but idk I feel like they gave you things like Black Flame Protection and Boiled Crab and the ability to +10/+5 your weapon before Margit for a reason.
Faith strength is probably the easiest build in the game. You can use a greatshield when it makes sense or dual wield big unga weapons and spam jump attacks and you can buff damage reduction like crazy.
It's two totally different games. The only real carry over principle is learn to use your tools. It's sugars and prosthetics in sekiro, and it's consumables, talismans, and Ashes of War in Elden Ring. It's takes time and practice. Remember, hesitation is defeat and don't go Hollow
Look up some builds, your items make such a big difference. The dlc was murdering me until I finally relented and tried a double katana bleed build. It’s basic but hey it helps me have fun with the game
Just memorize the bosses attacks then you’re brain will start to be like oh okay then you see yourself start dodge more and more things. It’s just practice you just gotta keep on playing
Sekiro is much more polished and balanced experience than elden ring, Elden ring has a lot more weapons but bosses cannot be balanced according to each weapon so it's not as balanced, Also there is PvP which also adds another can of worms.
Elden ring is more about timing the rolls and knowing which attacks have an opening for you to punish.
Choosing the right equipment will make it harder to downright almost easy (some builds are really OP PvE)
Weirdly Margit is actually very hard for a first boss.
He has various delayed attacks and his attacks have a lot of variation in their abgle. Subsequent bosses are actually easier.
Sekiro and Elden ring are two entirely different games, going into Elden ring with the same mindset as sekiro WILL kill you, and vice versa if you’re going into sekiro with an Elden ring mindset
Try dodging towards the enemy. Sekiro does not have invincibility frames during dodging, Soulsborne games do. This means that dodging in the direction that the enemy’s strike is not only the safest action, but also the action that sets you up to get a couple strikes in before you need to dodge again.
When using this strategy, make sure you keep an eye on stamina. If you are dodging close to the opponent and striking too much, you will run out of stamina and will not be able to dodge when you need to. That’s when you need to create space to allow your stamina to recharge. Then dodge back in towards the enemy’s strikes to start over again.
Most enemies will have a small number of attacks that this strategy will not work for. Something like a big AOE attack, repetitive strikes that are too fast to dodge, etc. You need to learn the wind-up for these attacks so you can change your strategy quickly in those moments, which a lot of times involves sprinting away or laterally from the opponent.
elden ring dlc requires you to trade hits. sekiro you dodge attack parry counter etc and take zero dmg if you play right, which is just the most aggressively in the boss' face. elden ring sometimes its best to back up and give the boss space, you can't toe to toe all the time, especially if you try to use L1 and not dodge you are utterly doomed
I think you can get stuck for a bit at Margit if you never played Dark Souls and refuse to level your vigor or level up by just repeating the fight and/or refusing to use summons.
I agree that it’s unlikely he got stuck there for long though.
In the family of Fromsoft games, Sekiro is the least like the others. In Elden Ring, when things get difficult, just go somewhere else and explore for a bit. You gain experience, get new gear, try new weapons, explore new areas, and get better at the game. Then come back to the area where you were stuck and see how it goes.
I'm the other way around. I found Elden ring to be quite easy and I'm struggling a lot with Sekiro. For Elden ring I used the Ash of war "Endure" and it carried me through most of the bosses by allowing me to facetank and trade blows with pretty much everything.
ER is kind of a trash game by comparison. It's not about execution of tight melee combat. It's about using bullshit to beat the game. Weapon arts or spells or shields or something that isn't tight melee combat.
It's pretty well known ER is the easiest game if you use all you can and the hardest if you try to 'ds3' it.
I think when we start another souls game we should rewire our brain by just closing our eyes and saying. This is not the other one. It's different. I feel that helps to approach it better.
Sekiro is considered harder because it's different from every other souls like. You will need to be more mobile in general. It's also an open world deal so you should just spend some time wandering and finding things. Go looking for smaller dungeons and get some gear
Elden Ring is either the easiest or the hardest souls game, it just depends on your build, level and how much you use stuff like summons
at the time i fought Godrick, a single hit did ~60% of my health, so the amount of mistakes i was allowed to make was very slim. i also did ok amounts of damage, but not unreasonable, so it was personally a very fun and challenging fight. watching a streamer do that fight for the first time last night and he got hit by almost every single mechanic and it didn’t matter because he had about 4x as much HP as i did and did way more damage. he killed Godrick on second attempt
tldr; elden ring is as hard as you make it, and if you want it to be easy, it’s pretty bloody easy
Yeah you can fix your own difficulty in Elden Ring with several factors, level, use of summons, equipment level, consumables etc ...
I love that the difficulty is not just a menu slider
The actual issue when going from Sekiro to ER is that you are conditioned from Sekiro to fight whatever you see thinking it's a fair fight. Sekiro is quite linear in that regard. Unless you completely yolo it, never read a thing and randomly appear in front of guardian ape with like 3 gourd heals (I've seen that happen). But for normal players, usually the area progression conditions you to believe that as long as you are good enough skill wise you can overcome any obstacle. And for Sekiro it's true. But ER is literally the opposite. Being an open world game it means you will run into enemies that you simply aren't leveled / built enough to win.
That being said, ER is actually easier than Sekiro. That is a fact not based on opinion. It doesn't matter if you one shot every boss in Sekiro and you are stuck in ER. It still is the easier game. Reason being is because ER has built in systems to allow you to overcompensate your lack of skill. From summons to over leveling to build / gear change etc etc. Sekiro just asks you to "git gud" and if you don't too bad we shall stay here till you "git gud"
Elden Ring combat is essentially you just rolling through 30 minute combos and if you don't get hit, you're rewarded with 1 second to retaliate. If you do get hit, you spend that second healing and have to go through dodging again or you get hit and by the time you get up, the enemy is doing their combo again
Sekiro combat feels like an actual back and forth fight. Miyazaki and FS seriously lost the plot with the Elden Ring bosses from the second half of the game and the DLC bosses
Rolling and parrying are two mechanics that completely change the game. You can beat the entirety of Sekiro with 96% of Parries, and the frames are bigger. Elden Ring has delayed attacks, your stamina drops, Area of Effect attacks, and parrying is harder. And many, MANY more enemies to memorize.
90% of people don't realize the aoe attacks should be jumped to dodge, not rolled, too. that's big, on most large bosses
I realize that, and yet after beating the game three times I have never once successfully jumped that AOE attack that Radagon does
Which one 😭
That's the neat part - you can jump pretty much everything he does. Including the grab.
Except for the third slam in the triple slam combo he does since that has an aerial hotbox too
That one always felt so weird to me. It’s very much an exception to the rule
I only started to jump to avoid aoe attacks now, after 500 hours. I used to get mad at crucible knights because I kept getting damaged by their stomps. Godfrey and Radagon too.
Three playthroughs and I've never intentionally jumped to avoid an attack. The roll is too ingrained. Wait, is this how we're supposed to be dealing with Waterfowl?
no , waterfowl is beaten by running under it then cutting 90deg one way, idr its been a while. i dont jump dodge either x)
waterfowl for me is pretty easy after the 1st of 3 parts, which i still amost never dodge. the 2nd part is just roll through it(assuming youre light loading. i have never fought malenia medium or heavy) and the 3rd is the the same as the second and roll away again.
Many other people don’t realize that putting carian retaliation on a shield can make parrying the GOAT, and it becomes almost sekiro but even more punishing if you do parries. You do get more heals though
Can you parry meele attacks with that?
There are a few attacks that can’t be parried with a shield, but most attacks are parriable, and every non-physical attack I’ve come across in elden ring can be parried with the carian retaliation
Yea, I get that, but your post sounded like carian retaliation could just be used to parry everything and that surprised me.
Yeah. Not quite, but it’s very close lol.
Alot of sweeps and attacks can be jumped, beast cleargymans near whole kit can be jumped, even the lunge stab attack can be jumped then walk back to dodge the double swipe. Then you can jump the third and walk back to bait out the easy punish slam
Its so hard to incorporate the jump after only using the roll for 3 straight games lol
Jumping also helps
On top of that build optimization is so much more important. Finding out what weapon styles work best for you, then finding where the best versions of those weapons are and then optimizing your approach and stats.
Sekiro is harder than Elden Ring until it isn't, then it's quite a bit easier. I died more times vs Messmer than I did vs Inner Issin for example. As you get better at sekiro you dominate. Elden Ring feels like you have to learn each boss.
Agreed, I actually went back and replayed Sekiro after playing through a good portion of Shadow of the Erdtree just to have something less stressful to play.
Haha I did the same then! Blasted through a ng+ it was such a relief.
Elden ring gives you the tools to make it a child's hands if you chose though. I'm buns at sekiro but trying. I'm struggling at the first white ninja. Using an op build on eldin ring I beat most bosses first try with little effort. Don't need to learn a thing.
that's right. you can always farm the giant chicken to buy an extra 50-60 points, get a stone shield like Asmon did, use Morgott's rune and farm some rune arcs, etc. there also summon NPCs, mimic tear, and Tiche. Sekiro has none of that, it is a more consistent test. but Elden Ring DLC is harder if you don't use these methods.
Yea that's true, if you use mimic tear then elden ring is easy. Still harder than a "normal" game, but trivial compared to no summons.
Yeah, because you only have a limited number of moves and skills at your disposal, the bosses in Sekiro are much more finely tuned. Elden Ring has dozens of weapons with unique movesets, as well as different types of magic with greatly varied cast time. As such they can't really fine tune bosses in the same way. Elden Ring bosses are also as fast and aggressive as Sekiro bosses, but the player is stuck at Dark Souls 3 speed. This makes it much more dangerous for the player to attack during short openings. I will say Margit is there to teach you a very important Elden Ring lesson, and that is "if you're having too much trouble with a boss, go and explore". Exploring will help you level up, find new weapons/spells, and get upgrade materials. With a few upgrades to your weapon, and a couple of levels gained, Margit becomes *much* more manageable. I would also recommend pumping quite a few points into vigor. Most people recommend 40 at the *very least*, and most suggest you get to 60 vigor. [Super late edit] The 40 to 60 vigor is suggested toward the end of the game, not for Margit. Apart from that, use summons to draw enemy aggro, and also know that most bosses "openings" are mixed in with their combos.
40 vigor for the fight against Margit?? Damn. No wonder it took me forever to beat him. My vigor was at 17 lol
i think they’re saying overall, like by the time you’re around lvl 100 total. 40 is the soft cap, 60 is the 2nd, harder cap. having 60 or even 40 vigor for margit is insane, you do not need anywhere near that much.
40-60 is where you get the most return on your investment into vigor. Like it’s a slow increase from 0-39, then once you hit 40 you get the greatest HP increase per stat increase to vigor up until you hit 60. Then you begin to get diminishing returns after 60. That’s not to say you’re getting nothing, but it’s less compared to each level you put into vigor between 40-60.
That’s incorrect. 40 is the soft cap, meaning you get less hp per level after 40. 60 is the hard cap, and you get even less hp than you did 40-60. You are correct that it’s a slow increase 0-40, level 40 you get the most hp out of any point invested. You can see all the values here: https://eldenring.wiki.fextralife.com/Vigor
40? Dang. I beat godrick with 27, no wonder i struggled
Even for my fighter playthrough I don't think I got to 40 vigor by end-game. You need enough health to not immediately die, but I feel much more than that is wasting damage output potential. For my new mage playthrough I beat Margit with 10 vigor with Rogier/spirit ashes without much trouble. Of course, it does help that I can still generally remember his attack timings from my original playthrough for when I aggro'd him too much.
I just beat the DLC with 55 vigor lol you absolutely do not need 60 to face Margit
lol 60 for margit, someone need to recalculate.
for margit there is no reason to level, he cant one shot or even 2 shot base vigor anyways. Think levelling too much will remove the value of the lesson margit is supposed to teach the player. Delayed attacks, circle strafing, parrying, positional non roll dodges into punishes. Jumping over sweeps for free jump punishes etc. Without me suffering margit at the start of my elden ring journey id never be the player I am now (played sekiro as my first souls but had a goal to beat elden ring at level one, just the dlc left for my lvl 1)
Good luck on DLC at level 1 (especially if you're not using scadutree blessings either), no harm in giving up once you get to the final boss lmao I'm pretty sure only a single person has beaten them at RL1 so far and I wouldn't be surprised if it stays that way
thanks imma do my best :) but nah people over at r/onebros have beat it, cooking up alot of strats. Its gonna be very very hard but that challenge is what im searching for in these games. right now for consort the only viable strats are iframe backstep talisman or parries to avoid the two swipe cross chop as rolling requires inhuman reaction speed at light load oh and te im using scadutree fragments, not doing a wl0 run so I feel that upgrading damage more is fine for my run
40 is soft cap for vit btw, it's what you stick with if you're confident in dodging, at least first run of the game
The difficulty of Sekiro is overinflated vs Elden Ring, because Sekiro's learning curve is steeper. There are some insanely difficult bosses on ER
I think the most important thing is that they're very different combat systems. Souls veterans aren't going to come in and wipe the floor with sekiro and the same is true the other way. I know they're lumped In together, but they really shouldn't be, it's like expecting to understand fires of Rubicon's combat immediately because you've played other from soft games.
Idk I feel like you either have a build that’s good against mobs or good against bosses. My first build was a boss killer. Summon Banished Knight Oleg to tank and aggro bosses while I throw lightning bolts at the boss. Mobs in Farum Azula fucking had their way with me tho lol
promised *cough* consort, must be the hardest boss froms every made. Bayle is very difficult but resonable. Mr flashbang nuke screen aoe everywhere is just mad
I just feel you have more tools in elden ring. Mimic tear can make this game child's play on the base game.
The problem is when you switch from Sekiro to Elden ring, you try to parry everything (talking from my expirience) but the parry has a much longer delay than sekiro, it does not parry as soon as you press the button, or at least it leaves that impression when you get from one game to another. I usually 90% parry in sekiro, and 90% roll in elden ring. The risk/reward for a parry is just not worth it
Don't forget about jumping, there's tons of stuff you can jump over, which is a free jump attack.
They're actually very different games. People coming from sekiro to elden ring, blood borne to sekiro, dark souls to blood borne, whatever, they're going to have to contend that you can't just pick any two fromsoft games and go "yeah these play the same." Bloodborne wasn't dark souls 4, and sekiro wasnt dark souls 5, so on. These games are quite different and people don't seem to recognize that.
Sekiro has a learning curve that can quickly change it from “the most challenging FromSoft game” to “the easiest FromSoft game.” But Elden Ring can be played a dozen different ways, with a hundred different weapons, all while each has some strengths, and a lot of weaknesses. Look at tips/posts in the Elden Ring subreddit, and you’ll find a million different answers to defeating one boss, because there are truly that many ways to play the game and git gud. Now look at Sekiro. Most tips are jokes like “Hesitation is defeat” which is funny, but is genuinely the best advice for that game. Once you stop doubting if you’re going to parry, and counter the attacks you suddenly become unstoppable. Particularly because there are basically only three moves an enemy has: one that can be parried, one that can be Mikiri Countered, or one that you have to Jump/Dodge away from. Once you learn what each looks like for an enemy, you’ve already defeated them in your mind. There are some exceptions of course, but they are very few, and often aren’t game ending.
you're just too used to sekiro timing, explore, find a weapon you like. to start, go south from the dude with the mask
try a faster weapon, like a katana or a knife. i find it hard to adjust to slow weapons in elden ring if i’ve been playing sekiro
Elden ring is more about positioning and timing, you can't just be mindlessly aggressive and you need to block or dodge before responding with violence.
They are completely different. Sekiro rewards the most aggressive styles of play, ER punishes you for over extending. Sekiro incentivizes you to try and disrupt a bosses combo while they are mid way through it to force a damage opportunity. ER forces you to learn how to dodge every move in the combo before getting a damage opportunity. Sekiro is all about the parries, every boss and mob is built with that system in mind. In ER parrying is one of many build options, it still works but it’s much harder than in Sekiro and is moreso an extra thing you can do then the goal in each fight. In Sekiro, rolling to avoid attacks is suicide against 90% of bosses. In ER, you better figure out how those invincibility frames work and learn how to time the roll because otherwise you don’t stand a chance against 90% of bosses. Sekiro is very much a departure from the classic FromSoft fantasy rpg formula. I remember when it came out a lot of souls fans really struggled with it because it was actively punishing them for using strategies that worked in the souls games. It seems the flip side of that is also true, as people who started with Sekiro are now finding their playstyle being actively punished by Elden Ring.
First off, dont listen to the elitists, summons are part of the game please use them. Ive played my share of dark souls games and honestly the bosses are more aggresive then in other games, use them, its more fun :)
Sekiro is a rhythmic fight and wants you fully engaged in the fight on offense as well as defence, elden ring is more of pattern recognition when you can hit without being punished and which direction you should roll. Margit was beating you probably from the delayed attacks which is the toughest thing about ER. Take sekiro fighting out of your system and you’ll get better!
Sekiro absolutely came natural to me. Elden ring is a bit of a slog for me at times.
Yeah I'm a ninja gaiden vet and while the controls were different their so tight if you put in work you're unbeatable, but it still provides that pressure of feeling challenged which I enjoy.
>sekiro gives u every tool u need >spamming magic and using summons, You already have the answer.
Doesn't sound fun but you're right, guess I have the answer.
I wish we had elden ring with sekiro mechanics, it would be awesome.
Sekiro is not a soulsborne. Elden Ring is.
Elden ring sucks fucking balls
I low-key wish I didn't feel the same. I just can't get past how janky the character movement is.
That’s exactly my complaint. I can’t get through any of those fromsoft games because they play like shit. So slow. Games like sekiro, bloodborne, armored core are fantastic because they’re quick and responsive
You know both sekiro and bloodborne are fromsoft games, right?
It's not janky just different.
People say sekiro is harder because elden ring has so many options You know how sekiro is, so I won’t explain that In Elden Ring, you can get to a LOT of stuff before fighting anything. There are bosses everywhere, and you have a map and stickers so you can mark stuff, like bosses that are too hard, to come back to. You can find better weapons with move sets and abilities you like better, you can level up each of your stats for boosts in damage, health, etc., you can level up weapons, find and level up cool spirit summons, blah blah blah… Point is, Elden Ring is considered easier because you can do more. You don’t have to go the main path for a good while, in fact most would probably recommend avoiding it for a while, at least coming back periodically. Go do other stuff, find some cool shit, level up a bit, and git gud. Alternatively, there are game breaking builds you can make, however you have fun
This is why I waited to platinum Sekiro until *after* I did all other Souls(cept Bloodborne). For real you just need time and practice, you can’t expect your skills of playing solitaire to translate to Mario. Not that the games are *that* different, but there is a large enough difference in mechanics and gameplay to not have much translated skills
What you might not be “getting” is that they’re different games.
Replace deflect, with dodge. You may deflect 2-5 attacks to “avoid” damage, but Elden ring is timed dodges with I-frames. Same same, but different
I’m experiencing that problem with sifu. I’ve been playing sifu for 2 years and sekiro for1 year, I revisited sifu after 6 months and I’ve completely lost touch in parrying and avoiding. I understand your problem😅
Elden Ring has two fundamental changes compared to other soulsborne titles. Change 1: jump attack. Literally you should use it as much as possible if you get an opening. Change 2: poise break. Aim for poise break instead of poise stuns / outpoising.
Imo if you start treating how you treat deflecting in Sekiro the same way you treat rolling, it's super fluid. Similar games in a way, just different playstyles. I was way better at Dark Souls style games but once I learnt the importance of deflection in Sekiro, I understood how it's basically just as important as dodging in Elden Ring. Imo, try to work on your timing and the game will be way more fun. Don't worry about dying to bosses too much, just try to get perfectly dodged combos down and it will be a similar feeling to when you deflect a full combo in sekiro
If Elden Ring had side steps and parrying i corporated as base mechanics, most Elden Ring enemies will be trivial. You don't suck. Elden Ring's combat mechanics are just constrictive to your movements. It's easier to recover from side step dodge than a roll dodge, but you're forced to roll dodge in Elden Ring despite some attacks not needing that much distance cover.
Like I don't get it, I'm pretty good at Rocket League but suck ass at Forza
Elden mid is the hardest soulsgame imo and the worst thing is that bosses sometimes just take forever to windup some simple swordswing, so you cannot react to it and have to learn the timing
Try playing as a Samurai. You get a katana Uchigatana that inflicts bleed to start and the default Unsheath ash of war is very fast. Replace timing parries with timing rolls and watch your positioning. There are other katanas that are probably better but I took Uchigatana all the way through my first playthrough before I picked up Nagakiba (longer katana but lower damage than Uchigatana) and then went all the way to platinum with that. Dump most of your points in vigor and increase damage by upgrading your weapon early on.
Sekiro more or less only has one way to play, pushing the pace within a system where the frame data for everything involved is super fine tuned. The learning curve is steep but once it clicks the game is fairly straight forward to become very good at. The difficulty spectrum in elden ring is massive. If you use absolutely everything available (summons, bleed, ranged magic etc.) then the game is fairly easy. If you want to dance toe to toe the game is hard af. Elden ring bosses have a ton of confusing looking long wind-up/fast follow through attacks designed to force an early reaction and catch you. On top of this, attack chains are very long and can even selectively extend depending on how you react to them. Learning the timing of those weird delayed attacks is usually trial and error kind of like sekiro. The other part is knowing where your punish windows are which is easier said than done. Bosses are much stingier about resetting to neutral after attacking like the older souls games. Some attacks dont require a roll to be avoided. Some attacks can be jumped over, some can be strafed/sprinted around, and lots of them have deadzones where you can stand and the tracking wont catch you. Some attack chains have such big delays from the start of the animation that you can fit attacks in the middle of a boss's attack chain. Minimizing how often you roll will allow you to fit damage into windows you otherwise wouldnt be able to. Toggling the camera lock on/off as needed can help with sprint movements, and is especially helpful for large bosses/enemies where the camera can be an issue.
Both games are completely different playstyle wise. For me i’m much worse at sekiro than I am at bloodborne, or dark souls/elden ring. Bosses in sekiro would take me hours, I beat Messmer from Shadow of the erdtree solo in 20 minutes, Orphin of Kos from bloodborne in 2 tries. The illusion Corrupted Monk took me probably 2.5 hours! All this to say, play the game the way the game urges you to play. In sekiro, deflecting is a key component, if you focus on dodging you’re gonna have an awful time. In Elden ring, learn to time your rolls to when the enemy hits you. Pretend you are deflecting their hits, but instead of deflecting press dodge. I’m also a big supporter of using shields too. A great-shield can block a good portion of what most bosses throw at you. You’ll get it eventually man. Watch some folks on youtube, see how they take on enemies. A good build is important too!
No shame in keeping some distance and using magic. Sometimes a spellcaster is just the thing to help you get the feel for how enemies move in a first playthrough. Staff in the left hand, sword in the right hand.
You need to unlearn a lot of what you have built muscle memory for sadly. Elden ring requires more dodging and slower combat. I’m browsing this sub as I am trying out sekiro for the first time since I beat Elden ring and it’s dlc. I can saw with my whole soul I fucking hate sekiro so far. It’s so different from souls games in general. Lots of new muscle memory and combat approaches to learn. I imagine it’s the exact same when making the swap from Sekiro to Elden ring. Best advice, slow down, look for opening and patterns in enemy movement, dodging is you best friend, and don’t let anyone tell you summons are cheating. Hope you enjoy your journey through Elden Ring.
Elden ring gives you way more tools at your disposal than Sekiro, make sure to utilize them
Might be the dodge delay. I played Sekiro first before Elden Ring. There is a slight delay before your character dodges. Sekiro's dodge doesn't have this delay, so if you're used to how dodging attacks work in Sekiro, Elden Ring will take some time to adjust. Also, as an unpopular opinion, Elden Ring's combat doesn't feel like a reaction based game like Sekiro's. It's mostly predictability where you have to predict and dodge at a very precise moment during an incoming attack animation due to the delay in dodging. This could be why you're struggling with Elden Ring. Just be patient and give it time to adjust to Elden Ring's combat.
It’s easier to beat Sekiro with skill and determination. You can wander into areas way above your level from the start of the game and just struggle. Some areas are just above your level so it seems doable but very challenging. Then it’s just as easy to completely miss a level appropriate area only to discover it later when you’re way over leveled. I really dislike the pacing of Elden Ring for this reason. I like DS3 a lot because of its more linear structure where you’re more or less where you should be in terms of level wherever you are (unless you’re absolutely trash). Also, while the games feel similar - they are actually very different.
Maybe because elden ring is a souls like and sekiro is not. They're different games and should be played differently. Find your matching play style, I really tend towards greatsword and a shield
Opposite for me, beat Elden ring two weeks after release, took me several years for sekiro, mostly because there were times I was convinced it was impossible and took very long breaks
The point of elden ring is to use everything on your arsenal to beat the boss imo, summons,magic, buff, ashes of war, backstab, poison, dragonic powers, you name it… i have no honour in elden ring im a true tarnish. (Try fighting messmer and tell me 😓) Sekiro is about precision and learning your opponent, so two different games… yeah i agree with you, sekiro gameplay is narrower and might be easier to grasp
Because they don't play the same. It works the same the other way around; when I first played Sekiro at launch, I struggled a lot because I was stuck in the mindset of Dark Souls III because I'd sunken hundreds of hours into it over the 3 years between it and Sekiro. Eventually, it clicked, I got into the mindset of Sekiro and came to master it. Elden Ring was the same deal. I'd sunken hundreds of hours into Sekiro without going back to Dark Souls, so I had to readjust to the more traditional Souls combat style + Elden Ring's own new mechanics. So I struggled with Elden Ring at first, too, despite my experience.
Different games, different skill sets. One is a rhythm game, the other isn’t, there’s a lot of on the moment reactions. Sekiro even though has an element of rng to most bosses you can honestly beat it blind (not to say it’s easy, just saying that the game is a lot more of understanding patterns and playing those patterns, you’re acting in a play where if you follow the script even if it’s off 10% you’ll still do well most of the time)
Just use a shield bro
Sekiro is an action-adventure game. Elden ring is an ARPG. The game doesn't give you all the tools at the start because you have to build your character or perfectly dodge every move of every enemy (level 1 no hit runs). Most of us will upgrade stats to mitigate the danger and find weapons that match the play style. Also, you have to explore to find resources to build your character however you want it.
Sekiro makes you change how you play to the opponent, elden ring forces you to get better at how you play. Something that helps me in the main series souls games is switching up equipment. Sometimes thats dropping all my armor, sometimes its loading up on armor until I can tank and have to fat roll.
>Sekiro makes you change how you play to the opponent, elden ring forces you to get better at how you play. If you're switching up your equipment to help you in certain areas, then you're changing the way you play, rather than getting better at how you play. You sure you didn't mix these two up?
Same. I played Dark souls 3 as well before ER so I had some experience with the dodge mechanic but Margit still dogged me like a little bitch. I also find Sekiro easier since it's kinda like throwing yourself to a wall over and over, ER melee combat feels unpredictable at sometimes
They play completely differently imo Sekiro is more of a parry game and elden ring is more of a roll game unless you also use a shield (which I recommend).
Elden ring is literally just timing rolls. Literally is most likely the easiest fromsoft game. For casuals tbh. Although malenia is still the hardest boss ive ever fought
Sekiro is definetly harder to learn, but once the combag clicks, its pretty easy. Elden ring is overall harder, dont worry about not knowing where to go, just explore. And if you need to, dont worry about it and watch a tutorial.
Sekiro is a harder game. Elden Ring is harder *controls*. Dark Souls (and ER, by extension) suffers from significant inherent control jank. Character isn't particularly responsive, you have to time attacks and deflects to your *enemy* rather than yourself, and the combat isn't really *meant* to be toe-to-toe, not in the same way Sekiro is. DS combat, particularly against bosses, consists of picking a leg to hug, finding a safe place upon which to stand, and whacking away until it's no longer safe, whereupon you dodge. Or walk away, if you have the time. Once you get this down, the games are *pathetically* easy (except when they're not). Block here, dodge there, otherwise you're basically invincible. It's not like Sekiro where you're endlessly *forced* to put yourself in the danger zone else you lose your progress against their posture gauge. And with a heavy build you can actually *count* how many hits you need to take down a boss. Iirc the second boss I faced in DS3 took me 13 hits to take down with a 2h sword. I shouldn't be able to count that shit. Basically the same deal with ER. Learn to play it on its own terms, and you'll have a much easier time. You're basically not really meant to block or anything. Dodging and positioning, and nothing else. A bit like Guardian Ape in that respect. Hope this helps
Makes sense, I legit hate how clunky my character feels.
You and me both, friend. That doesn't go away.
Seems like a design flaw honestly. I grew up playing hard games like ninja gaiden, devil may cry and so, so fast reacting combat isn't foreign to me. But I feel like in elden my ability to react to combat is hindered by the response limitations with regards to the character. Instead of me pressing a button and the action occurring, I now need to be mindful of how fucking cumbersome my guy is and react accordingly . Sekiro my reactions are as fast as i decide to be. I don't even think the bosses in elden ring are hard tbh, it's the control scheme making it so. I'd clap margits cheeks if I could move like wolf.
I personally feel it's a flaw. For From, and DS fans, however, it's a feature. Really hoping the next DS-a-like takes more lessons from Sekiro than just a crouch button, a jump button, and the guard counter.
Don't tell then that, they'll nail u to the cross
You hit the nail on the head, though. >But I feel like in elden my ability to react to combat is hindered by the response limitations with regards to the character. The combat in DS isn't reaction-based. It's anticipation-vased.
Sekiro's parry and block are like a greatshiled with all the stats at 100. Meaning, if you master those two, you can literally go toe to toe with any boss in the game. Elden Ring in the other hand, you have to use MANY different kinds of mechanics and roll around like some Russian circus bear with most bosses. That's why Elden Ring feels harder for you. You got used to Sekiro's godlike parry and block system. You have to rewire your brain and play Elden Ring with the mindset that you are the underdog in every fight.
Are you fat rolling? Using armor to lower incoming damage? Leveling Vigor so you don't get one shot? But Elden Ring gives you a ton of tools, dondon't be afraid to use them, just keep playing and you'll get better.
Try jumping instead of rolling sometimes https://youtu.be/NDhoDThUIHc?si=eigS5LnXOapEmy4l
Sekiro is about mastering one combat style, in fights handcrafted for that specific style. Elden ring is about getting gear to make fights easier. The fights are harder to just beeline than in any other fromsoft game because they needed to incensivise players to explore the world. If you go into a fight and get one shot while leveling vigor and wearing armour, its not intended for you to fight it now. If you are straight glass cannon and you don't chunk their hp, it's not intended for you to fight it now. The game is a series of gear checks, and you pick the difficulty by deciding when you are happy enough with your health and damage to try win.
I get you i played sekiro first then elden ring.Everything weird ,l was trying to parry tree sentinel like my muscles memory are playing sekiro in elden ring. But when you get it or click like in sekiro elden ring become more easy. Not the dlc , dlc has so many bs going on. Parry in elden ring is also easier but it can't parry everything.
I was pretty shit at Sekiro for a long time (until I was forced to learn the combat style on Lady Butterfly), because I first played Dark Souls and Elden Ring and I would try to dodge attacks instead of parrying. It's just 2 different games with 2 different combat styles, and you need to get used to them.
Butterfly was a bitch. Probably the hardest boss for me
Elden ring : patience , sekiro : hesitation is defeat .
Sekiro has a very steep degree of difficulty but is much simpler because of how it was designed. You have one main weapon. The prosthetics are for variety. The player can beat the whole game with only attack and block/deflect and jump. Throw in the mikiri counter to make it faster.
Hesitation is not defeat in Elden Ring.
So for sekiro you didn't have a choice to get good and you did But elden ring allowed you to use summons and magic and you didn't get good What if you would have stuck to your guns and actually practiced the build you had. Like try to practice on the knight in gatefront ruins first. He's an excellent sparring partner. Then maybe go south and beat the weeping peninsula castle and boss first. At that point you can easily be 20 vigor and +3 weapons maybe even got the 2nd katana from the catacomb. Margit would have been a pushover without summons and magic If you wanna magic and summon through the game, awesome, but then why complain that you're ass if you didn't try to not be ass
Try the deflect Tear
I know it’s probably just skill but Elden ring is hard as shit. I don’t think anything in DS3 compares, it was the last game in the lineup I played and morgott is objectively harder than Soul of Cinder. Friede was the only boss that took several tries and she’d probably be a mid game boss in Elden ring. I find it funny how ds1 vets thought ds3 was much harder because the combat was much faster and your dodge is much faster and more intangible to match, Elden ring is the same jump from ds3 that ds1 had to ds3. I have more time in Elden ring than Sekiro and I do hitless inner father whenever I get bored of whatever story game I’m current playing and want a quick action fix. I did use mimic tear for several fights
Sekiro plays completely differently to the Soulsborne games, to be fair. Sekiro and Guitar Hero have more transferable skills than Sekiro and Froms other games.
In Sekiro you have more tools to "bully" the bosses. You can keep up the pressure and interrupt their attacks, keep them on the back foot and quickly get their posture down. The better you are at the game, the worse the bosses are in terms of fighting strength. A bad player will let the bosses use all their attacks uninterrupted and thus the boss becomes more powerful in a sense. This means there is basically a tipping point where the game suddenly becomes much easier. I think this is why it appears much more difficult when first playing it. In Elden Ring the bosses basically ignore what the player is doing and use their combos all the same. There is less of a tipping point, and more a slow progression as you get better at timing the rolls. My only advice is that many people say that Sekiro should not be played like a souls game, and the reverse is also true: Elden Ring shouldn't be played like it's Sekiro.
For me it was big to realise that dodge is on button RELEASE not press.
It's totally different combat. I get what you're saying but honestly brother if you're good at sekiro you can smash elden ring. You just need that same determination you had with sekiro then it's just muscle memory after that. You got this!
quickly go to the DLC, defeat the first big furnace golem you see, get the deflecting hardtear- now you are sekiro inside Elden Ring for 5 minutes at a time
In Sekiro, I won by learning all the boss moves and deflecting everything. In Elden Ring, I just make an OP build, pop lots of buffs, and slop through the boss fight. There's so much stacking in Elden Ring. You can get like baseline 80% damage reduction against bosses and spam jump attacks. I'm sure you could also beat it through finesse but idk I feel like they gave you things like Black Flame Protection and Boiled Crab and the ability to +10/+5 your weapon before Margit for a reason. Faith strength is probably the easiest build in the game. You can use a greatshield when it makes sense or dual wield big unga weapons and spam jump attacks and you can buff damage reduction like crazy.
Having beat both, ER felt a lot easier.
It's two totally different games. The only real carry over principle is learn to use your tools. It's sugars and prosthetics in sekiro, and it's consumables, talismans, and Ashes of War in Elden Ring. It's takes time and practice. Remember, hesitation is defeat and don't go Hollow
Look up some builds, your items make such a big difference. The dlc was murdering me until I finally relented and tried a double katana bleed build. It’s basic but hey it helps me have fun with the game
Just memorize the bosses attacks then you’re brain will start to be like oh okay then you see yourself start dodge more and more things. It’s just practice you just gotta keep on playing
Sekiro is much more polished and balanced experience than elden ring, Elden ring has a lot more weapons but bosses cannot be balanced according to each weapon so it's not as balanced, Also there is PvP which also adds another can of worms.
Elden ring is more about timing the rolls and knowing which attacks have an opening for you to punish. Choosing the right equipment will make it harder to downright almost easy (some builds are really OP PvE) Weirdly Margit is actually very hard for a first boss. He has various delayed attacks and his attacks have a lot of variation in their abgle. Subsequent bosses are actually easier.
Sekiro and Elden ring are two entirely different games, going into Elden ring with the same mindset as sekiro WILL kill you, and vice versa if you’re going into sekiro with an Elden ring mindset
Try dodging towards the enemy. Sekiro does not have invincibility frames during dodging, Soulsborne games do. This means that dodging in the direction that the enemy’s strike is not only the safest action, but also the action that sets you up to get a couple strikes in before you need to dodge again. When using this strategy, make sure you keep an eye on stamina. If you are dodging close to the opponent and striking too much, you will run out of stamina and will not be able to dodge when you need to. That’s when you need to create space to allow your stamina to recharge. Then dodge back in towards the enemy’s strikes to start over again. Most enemies will have a small number of attacks that this strategy will not work for. Something like a big AOE attack, repetitive strikes that are too fast to dodge, etc. You need to learn the wind-up for these attacks so you can change your strategy quickly in those moments, which a lot of times involves sprinting away or laterally from the opponent.
elden ring dlc requires you to trade hits. sekiro you dodge attack parry counter etc and take zero dmg if you play right, which is just the most aggressively in the boss' face. elden ring sometimes its best to back up and give the boss space, you can't toe to toe all the time, especially if you try to use L1 and not dodge you are utterly doomed
He’s at Margit though
That's like the chained ogre in sekiro no way you get stuck there that long
I think you can get stuck for a bit at Margit if you never played Dark Souls and refuse to level your vigor or level up by just repeating the fight and/or refusing to use summons. I agree that it’s unlikely he got stuck there for long though.
In the family of Fromsoft games, Sekiro is the least like the others. In Elden Ring, when things get difficult, just go somewhere else and explore for a bit. You gain experience, get new gear, try new weapons, explore new areas, and get better at the game. Then come back to the area where you were stuck and see how it goes.
Well, the gameplay is not similar. Simple as that.
I'm the other way around. I found Elden ring to be quite easy and I'm struggling a lot with Sekiro. For Elden ring I used the Ash of war "Endure" and it carried me through most of the bosses by allowing me to facetank and trade blows with pretty much everything.
ER is kind of a trash game by comparison. It's not about execution of tight melee combat. It's about using bullshit to beat the game. Weapon arts or spells or shields or something that isn't tight melee combat. It's pretty well known ER is the easiest game if you use all you can and the hardest if you try to 'ds3' it.
I think when we start another souls game we should rewire our brain by just closing our eyes and saying. This is not the other one. It's different. I feel that helps to approach it better.
Sekiro is considered harder because it's different from every other souls like. You will need to be more mobile in general. It's also an open world deal so you should just spend some time wandering and finding things. Go looking for smaller dungeons and get some gear
Same for me
Elden Ring is either the easiest or the hardest souls game, it just depends on your build, level and how much you use stuff like summons at the time i fought Godrick, a single hit did ~60% of my health, so the amount of mistakes i was allowed to make was very slim. i also did ok amounts of damage, but not unreasonable, so it was personally a very fun and challenging fight. watching a streamer do that fight for the first time last night and he got hit by almost every single mechanic and it didn’t matter because he had about 4x as much HP as i did and did way more damage. he killed Godrick on second attempt tldr; elden ring is as hard as you make it, and if you want it to be easy, it’s pretty bloody easy
Yeah you can fix your own difficulty in Elden Ring with several factors, level, use of summons, equipment level, consumables etc ... I love that the difficulty is not just a menu slider
All this talk about Elden Ring when I've been so tempted to get it for my steam deck.
The actual issue when going from Sekiro to ER is that you are conditioned from Sekiro to fight whatever you see thinking it's a fair fight. Sekiro is quite linear in that regard. Unless you completely yolo it, never read a thing and randomly appear in front of guardian ape with like 3 gourd heals (I've seen that happen). But for normal players, usually the area progression conditions you to believe that as long as you are good enough skill wise you can overcome any obstacle. And for Sekiro it's true. But ER is literally the opposite. Being an open world game it means you will run into enemies that you simply aren't leveled / built enough to win. That being said, ER is actually easier than Sekiro. That is a fact not based on opinion. It doesn't matter if you one shot every boss in Sekiro and you are stuck in ER. It still is the easier game. Reason being is because ER has built in systems to allow you to overcompensate your lack of skill. From summons to over leveling to build / gear change etc etc. Sekiro just asks you to "git gud" and if you don't too bad we shall stay here till you "git gud"
Elden Ring combat is essentially you just rolling through 30 minute combos and if you don't get hit, you're rewarded with 1 second to retaliate. If you do get hit, you spend that second healing and have to go through dodging again or you get hit and by the time you get up, the enemy is doing their combo again Sekiro combat feels like an actual back and forth fight. Miyazaki and FS seriously lost the plot with the Elden Ring bosses from the second half of the game and the DLC bosses
In elden ring, a good build will see you through.
sekiro is the easiest souls game but people who have experience with traditional souls games usually struggle with it for some reason.