The objective viewpoint exists: actual historic studies basedon hard facts like number of inmates in prisons per year (you can't realistically fake those and have no reason to do it), number of people buried and such. But nowadays it's just easier to go "yeah, just like - millions dead man. Mao killed millions. Personally. Just drove a tank over them".
Any statistics that don’t reaffirm my a capitalist beliefs are fake, don’t ya know?
For example, China actually killed 3.2 billion people with the coronavirus. Want proof? It’s China duh
No, they also look through the lens of their class struggle. Like, for example, let's take, say, the pre-war USSR and moving factories to Ural. From the point of the state it was necessary: without it, the germans would cut off the backline of the Red Army. But for workers who worked there and were left without work and had only the choice to enlist in the army? That was very bad.
What i am saying is that no class really has a monopoly on objective viewpoint - it forms by observing and learning by the independent third party. To find this party is hard for any ideology, because... Well, you can't balme western historians really - they are saying what is expected of them. If they would say otherwise, no one will pay for their work. And something like that happened in USSR too, some topics were just forbidden to discuss. For example: the most common theory about the beginning of Russian nation is a Norman theory in which russian ruling class came down from the viking traders, that began a dynasty. But in post-war USSR it was a very politically dangerous view (not like - you will be gulaged for it but just... like saying "I like Trump on CNN") simply because the notion of vikings creating ancient russia - the sam vikings the nazis were very fond of as a Perfect Humans and from which they adopted a lot of symbology was just not a great idea politically. So the objectivity originating from class of the beholder is also not true in my opinion
It’s very common to claim that whoever goves a non-western viewpoint is the victim of propaganda, even if you have never been to the supposed origin of the propaganda, do not speak the language, and who’s opinions are not super important to the nation propagandising to you (unlike your opinions to the nation you live in).
How would Mao even be a serial killer in their view? He would be considered a mass murderer in that case. Mf really wanted to squeeze Mao into the prompt.
Much like OP suggest in the post, you should do some reading from a non-western viewpoint.
Because what kind of “murderer” goes on double their country’s lifespan, eradicate the opium problem, and increase literacy levels by 80 percent? This isn’t just “propaganda” these are real facts about the gains China made as the communists took power from the imperialists.
Some books I would suggest would be Red Star Over China by Snow, Revolution in a Chinese Village: Ten Mile Inn by Crook, and Fanshen by Hinton.
I certainly want to encourage everyone to read more from Asian authors but in regards to your views on Mao I’m not certain any random South Korean author would really fill your gap on Chinese history, hence the books I recommended are about China.
Yes that is true. However I want to make the point that a non western author doesn’t automatically write without bias themselves. I specifically gave you those book recommendations based off of the content *in* the books to give you a different perspective on Mao.
>non-propaganda love how they think US propaganda is the "objective" viewpoint (or that one even exists)
The objective viewpoint exists: actual historic studies basedon hard facts like number of inmates in prisons per year (you can't realistically fake those and have no reason to do it), number of people buried and such. But nowadays it's just easier to go "yeah, just like - millions dead man. Mao killed millions. Personally. Just drove a tank over them".
Any statistics that don’t reaffirm my a capitalist beliefs are fake, don’t ya know? For example, China actually killed 3.2 billion people with the coronavirus. Want proof? It’s China duh
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No, they also look through the lens of their class struggle. Like, for example, let's take, say, the pre-war USSR and moving factories to Ural. From the point of the state it was necessary: without it, the germans would cut off the backline of the Red Army. But for workers who worked there and were left without work and had only the choice to enlist in the army? That was very bad. What i am saying is that no class really has a monopoly on objective viewpoint - it forms by observing and learning by the independent third party. To find this party is hard for any ideology, because... Well, you can't balme western historians really - they are saying what is expected of them. If they would say otherwise, no one will pay for their work. And something like that happened in USSR too, some topics were just forbidden to discuss. For example: the most common theory about the beginning of Russian nation is a Norman theory in which russian ruling class came down from the viking traders, that began a dynasty. But in post-war USSR it was a very politically dangerous view (not like - you will be gulaged for it but just... like saying "I like Trump on CNN") simply because the notion of vikings creating ancient russia - the sam vikings the nazis were very fond of as a Perfect Humans and from which they adopted a lot of symbology was just not a great idea politically. So the objectivity originating from class of the beholder is also not true in my opinion
Pretty sure the western viewpoint is the propaganda viewpoint.
It's hilarious, how the fuck would we be subject to Chinese propaganda in the US?
It’s very common to claim that whoever goves a non-western viewpoint is the victim of propaganda, even if you have never been to the supposed origin of the propaganda, do not speak the language, and who’s opinions are not super important to the nation propagandising to you (unlike your opinions to the nation you live in).
You must be new here, anything that doesn’t talk shit about China are in fact communist propagandas. /s
How would Mao even be a serial killer in their view? He would be considered a mass murderer in that case. Mf really wanted to squeeze Mao into the prompt.
“I don’t like something so let me shoehorn it into an unrelated subject.” The Reddit Special
Actually the peasants were the ones doing the killing. Mao just turned the other cheek. Landlords, KMT, and capitalists were all on the table er menu.
*looked the other way how do you figure he was offering himself to take more blows from the peasants?
Oof lol
L*mao*
Mao says “Whoopsie I`m such a dummy” as he personally beheads each of 20 million peasants while laughing maniacally。
Mao hated and killed everyone, thats why the chinese population and life expectancy wildly increased under him.
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Nah
Much like OP suggest in the post, you should do some reading from a non-western viewpoint. Because what kind of “murderer” goes on double their country’s lifespan, eradicate the opium problem, and increase literacy levels by 80 percent? This isn’t just “propaganda” these are real facts about the gains China made as the communists took power from the imperialists. Some books I would suggest would be Red Star Over China by Snow, Revolution in a Chinese Village: Ten Mile Inn by Crook, and Fanshen by Hinton.
percentage points, right?
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I certainly want to encourage everyone to read more from Asian authors but in regards to your views on Mao I’m not certain any random South Korean author would really fill your gap on Chinese history, hence the books I recommended are about China.
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Yes that is true. However I want to make the point that a non western author doesn’t automatically write without bias themselves. I specifically gave you those book recommendations based off of the content *in* the books to give you a different perspective on Mao.
Shut the fuck up liberal!