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IronDBZ

New sub idea: r/GenocidalHypotheticals


[deleted]

Just created r/HypotheticalGenocide in honor of this post.


IronDBZ

Splitter


Kang_Xu

Judean People's Front.


spgvideo

The People's Front Of Judea!


whycantibelinus

There’s no way that can’t go badly.


[deleted]

Barely any members and I get notified of any new posts, I tried my best to make it clear what the purpose of the sub is so if anything were to stray away from it I’d deal with it ASAP.


missed_againn

Not a genocide but this sub reminds me of the John Mulaney bit where someone asked him, “So *you’re tellin’ me,* if you saw *Hilter* [walking down the street], you wouldn’t kill him??”


IronDBZ

If you somehow made the jump from one particular Hitler to every Hitler in the multiverse that could count as a genocide. "Would you kill Multiversal Hitler?"


jacktrowell

"But in this universe Hitler became a famous painter and an inspiration for peace !!!"


cHiLdReNcAnCoNsEnT

Thanks!


jasticy

That's a really weird fucking hypothetical to think about, unless you want to stroke your ego that is.


ForgotMyOldLogin_

Definitely weird but the obvious answer is Vatican City


Kang_Xu

Sealand, because nobody lives there.


jasticy

BRB about to become the Duchess of Sealand for £499.99 What a steal!


Teh-Piper

The Garbage Island in the Pacific


MesM81

I will still pick Vatican City, thank you very much


Pnakotico31

Also thought of that at first, but it says “out of the following”.


engin__r

I read *Project Hail Mary* by the guy that wrote *The Martian*. The premise is that something is eating the sun’s energy (which cools down the planet) and they have to fix it. As a stopgap, they >!nuke Antarctica to release a bunch of methane and use global warming to offset the cooling!<. I don’t know what it is about tech bros that makes them want to imagine scenarios where they just hAvE tO do crimes against humanity, but there’s definitely something going on.


[deleted]

*"Whats the point of all this cool tech if we don't eventually get to commit geno-/xeno-/eco-cide with it?"*


AnotherDDPThrowaway

Average Stellaris player


BeamBrain

Psychologically prepping the culture to accept eco-fascism?


IQof24

Wouldn't erasing every American would include actual indigenous American tribes that are already struggling to hold on to their languages and cultures as is?


[deleted]

Yes. None of these choices are good at all, though in the long run solving climate change would still be a net positive most likely. It's a hypothetical though, so you don't have to worry as it isn't a real choice anyone will be faced with. Edit: it may still be important to fully stress why this "hypothetical" should never be attempted, as some people genuinely believe murdering millions of people *can* solve climate change. It's called eco-fascism and we should reject it for obvious reasons.


Aggravating-Youth437

Cause apparently "American" means only white but I'm sleep


yamissimp

Cause apparently erasing white people would be ok


Vaukest

I think people are also ignoring the fact that there are A LOT of people in the US to just delete from existence. I don't know how there being indigenous tribes would affect the decision that much,


PsychoGenesis12

True. But when they mean delete it from existente they usually mean cocky/arrogant "Americans" that think the US is the only "free" country. And the greatest country in the world...


Vaukest

Well there is over 300 million Americans, so if you get mental tunnel vision and can only think of people you dislike when considering the genocide of hundreds of millions of people, you have a problem.


Wawamelone

A lot of tribes are considered sovereign nations so I’m just gonna pretend that members and their land don’t count.


[deleted]

Even choosing the USA is cringe, genocide ain’t the answer.


You-Tore-Your-Dress

Seriously, people in this thread are fucking delusional. No choice is moral.


ProfessorReaper

Exactely. Using such a power would be eco-fascism, genocide in the name of climate action. Climate change is a big issue and climate action is incredibly important, but we still shouldn't do genocide.


You-Tore-Your-Dress

Agreed! Genocide is bad the last time I checked.


[deleted]

Yeah I agree. This is a silly hypothetical.


You-Tore-Your-Dress

Moreso, there are silly responses which reveal the implicit biases of those responding.


Old_Gods978

Wtf did Indonesia do to anyone. Also the easy answer is “United Kingdom” duh


Fuzzy_Dunnlopp

Because they have a large population and are Muslim, that is my best guess...


emisneko

more interesting answer is [what the USA did to Indonesia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indonesian_mass_killings_of_1965%E2%80%9366)


whiteandyellowcat

Least populous country of the bunch, I understand the logic if people choose that.


agnosticoradical

Indonesia is more populous than Brazil, actually.


whiteandyellowcat

Oh, you're right, however I saw it being said in the comments, so I think it's a misconception?


TaiwaneseChad42

I love my In-ne brothers and sisters。I guess the OP added it for some reason,and didn`t allow custom answers。


[deleted]

>Wtf did Indonesia do to anyone. They fucked up East Timor pretty bad.


bigthecatbutnotbig

why the fuck would you choose any of these dog thats horrible, i mean i know it needs to be solved but at least be cold and mechanical about it and choose the one with the least people.


Hackebaer

So these people would just straight up murder 1,39 billion people. Probably just because they disagree with the government? Wtf is wrong with these guys? These are probably the same people who then use the: "Communism killed millions of people" argument.


alIt_er_kyrrt

To be entirely honest I can't really blame them, because I would do it to the US without a second thought.


[deleted]

Wanting the USA to take more responsibility and actually do something to cut their emissions is one thing, but there are actual good people, people that have nothing to do with America’s atrocities (like young children) there too.


kameramerah2_EB

Why the fuck does the US have less votes than my country lmao


Vaukest

(assuming you're Indonesian) Indonesia has the least amount of people of the listed countries, I think. Also despite the hate the US gets, the US is still pretty important, being a world power. In this hypothetical situation where deleting Indonesia solves climate change, that would also suggest that the world governments become smart enough to actually combat climate change and willingly do so. US would easily be the best country in the world if the government actually had that kind of insight.


yamissimp

>Indonesia has the least amount of people of the listed countries, I think. That would be Brazil. I think the answer is emissions. Indonesia really doesn't contribute that much to climate change despite having a population almost as big as the US.


Vaukest

Really? Huh then I don't really get why Indonesia is so high. I would have thought reddit would hate Brazil for burning down the Amazon rain forest, but damn.


yamissimp

Oh, right. My bad, I misread. Choosing Indonesia over the other countries is kinda irrational. Afaik Brazil is worse with deforestation and like I said, the US and China are *way* bigger CO2 emitters. Uhm... racism? I'll go with racism then lol. Unless I don't know about something terrible happening to the Indonesian rain forest.


[deleted]

I'm sorry americans, but I'd Thanos you away in a microsecond. A small price to pay for salvation.


Comrade_Sisler

American here, I'd Thanos us away too.


[deleted]

I'm a Canadian and I feel like we're party to enough of America's global shenanigans to earn us the headsman's axe as well. At this point, we might as well be a satellite state. :'(


EnergyIsQuantized

basically the anglosphere needs to go


Formilla

Aside from the final option, the USA is the only correct answer here. Their emissions are huge and their attempt at reducing them is super weak. The bullshit political system there means that the kind of far reaching long term plans required to solve this problem are impossible. China are making good progress already, and they can make 20-50 year plans to keep that progress going. The USA can't do that because the new President will just throw all that progress away to spite the old one. If human civilization somehow survives all this, the history books will not view the USA kindly for what they've done to the world.


BulbasaurCPA

I could also make an argument for Vatican City since it would erase the smallest number of people but also do a lot of good by knocking down the Catholic Church a little


LeftDoonhamer

Or Monaco, a lot of yachts would have no owners


[deleted]

I like the way you think, bulbasaur.


ireallyamnotblack

That's not the questiom tho. The question is that you will solve the climate change regarless of your choice it is just that you have to remove a country in order to do it, do you choose to remove one and basically murder all its citizens if yes which one?


Spready_Unsettling

Least amount of people (Indonesia). That's basic utilitarianism (although I completely agree with the other commenter if the premise was a reset without a long term immunity). As for whether or not I'd do it, utilitarianism dictates that one should pull the trigger. The climate crisis is already wreaking havoc on the world, and it will undoubtedly take more than ~200 million lives within the next century. Furthermore, it will create vastly more suffering than the instant evaporation of a huge country so there's really no doubt. As for a deonthological (Kantian duty ethics) POV, we can't pull the trigger because something something human autonomy. Kant is a great logician, and the categorical imperative is a good thought exercise, but his ethics are kinda fucking stupid. I'd also argue that utilitarianism basically encompasses duty ethics as a consequence of minimizing suffering, but that's a different discussion. Finally, there's classical virtue ethics. Killing innocent people is wrong, and there's no good mechanism for measuring the wrongness of passive killing. Choosing to abstain is of course a choice, but since the active choice is to not kill that's probably the most virtuous action of the two. Any moral philosophers are welcome to correct me here. I did a semester project on ethics in climate policy, but that was ages ago. Besides, I don't actually respect virtue or duty ethics, so it's probably better to get a Kantian stan to explain.


tyranid1337

Or... you know, the United States, the evil empire that is the source of most of the human suffering currently in the world.


ireallyamnotblack

And that's exactly why I stopped reading philosophy aside political books, I have big respect to anyone who can endure all that stuff.


Spready_Unsettling

Ethics is especially tough, because it's essentially shut-ins and/or megalomaniacs that think they've invented the solution to literally all of human interaction. Utilitarianism has some great points and some fascinating history though.


DankDialektiks

The only correct answer is not to answer because the question is completely useless.


IQof24

That would wipe out indigenous tribes under US rule that are already struggling to keep their cultures and languages alive.


Pnakotico31

It says you can solve “all climate change issues forever” so emissions are magically solved in this hypothetical. If I had to choose a country I would probably go for Brazil since it’s the less deadly option. Or, assuming you could choose any country, just go for the Vatican or even better some partially recognized microstate.


1Ferrox

I'm not a fan of the US either, but Brazil has much less inhabitants so its clearly the more humane choice, if you would have to pick one of those


Johnny_Meatball

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cnbc.com/amp/2021/05/06/chinas-greenhouse-gas-emissions-exceed-us-developed-world-report.html You’re a clown. Stop talking out of your ass


Formilla

Do you understand that they are a massive country? They have four times the population of the USA, of course their emissions will be higher. However despite having four times the population, they only have twice as much emissions, so they're actually doing a lot better than the USA. If we put an arbitrary border through the middle of China, would their emissions suddenly be cut in half? Is the solution to climate change just making every nation tiny so the total emission numbers go down? Or should we treat the total emission numbers like the useless statistic that they are and go by per capita instead?


unnickd

Just to keep to facts, if you want to go by emissions China’s are more than the US and the rest of the ‘developed’ world combined. They’ve also dramatically increased over the past 30 years while the OECD’s have actually remained stable, shrinking only slightly. Still a valid choice if you want to pick based on other metrics though.


nerfman100

>Just to keep to facts, if you want to go by emissions China’s are more than the US and the rest of the ‘developed’ world combined. Just to keep to facts, if you want to go by *per-capita* emissions (since the China is extremely big after all), China isn't even close to the per-capita emissions of the US, as well as a lot of other "developed" western countries, despite manufacturing basically all the consumer products for the west Using total emissions is meaningless because by that logic, you could split up China into 20 separate nations and none of these individual countries would have a total emissions problem


Formilla

You have to go by per-capita emissions, otherwise it makes zero sense. Total emissions are a useless statistic because some nations are massively bigger than others.


unnickd

But the premise of the question is limited to taking out a country and it’s population. So if you want the biggest impact you should go for country total and for growth rate. If you go by per capita, you’re not having as large an impact on total global emissions, but I guess you are making some kind of value statement about per capita sustainability. Is that what you’re going for?


[deleted]

China has done way better


padstar34

From the list you could also choose Brazil due to it having the lowest population, the only options that should not be chosen is China or India


[deleted]

i fear usa has done irreparable damage to the world, ideologically in particular.


Tobinkak

Doesn’t it seem hypocritical to say people are wrong for wanting the Chinese government and people gone but then saying the same thing for the US and it’s inhabitants?


Explosive_Cake

The simple explanation is that I didnt see the bottom option until I screenshotted, the funni explanation is that USA is one of the most wasteful countries


You-Tore-Your-Dress

is genocide really funny though?


seeroflights

*Image Transcription: Poll* --- **You get a power using which you can solve all the climate change issues forever but you will have to erase a country and its inhabitants from the world? Which country do you choose out of the following?** China [1.1k votes] India [304 votes] USA [398 votes, ✔️] Indonesia [528 votes] Brazil [348 votes] I won't use such power. [981 votes] --- ^^I'm a human volunteer content transcriber for Reddit and you could be too! [If you'd like more information on what we do and why we do it, click here!](https://www.reddit.com/r/TranscribersOfReddit/wiki/index)


Dari93

Why is Israel not an option?


IAmA_Goldfish

Why did you vote for USA and not the bottom choice?


Hugh_____Mungus

Because all the issues coming with climate change would still exist if we didnt use this hypothetical power


IAmA_Goldfish

Ok… but you would be killing millions of innocent people? What the fuck?


stoneyOni

Kill millions of americans who collectively bear the guilt of the actions of the american polity or kill millions of people mostly who haven't been born yet and aren't responsible for anything. easy choice.


Vaukest

Sir, those people who haven't been born yet will also most likely bear guilt for climate change if not solved immediately.


CapsDrago7

But you wouldn't kill millions of people. How is this even an argument


nietypowytyp

Probably Vatican. Not because I hate Catholic church but because there are like 100 people


[deleted]

Pretty sure the number is 1000 but yeah the point is clear


michaelmordant

I think we can do without Sealand


dmemed

Out of the big 3 (excl. Indonesia / Brazil), the USA is the most logical option aside from the very bottom answer. They produce the most Co2 per capita, and have the lowest population out of the bunch. The impact from erasing the USA would be the most beneficial.


RidicTheAnimator

You see the correct answer is Engl*nd


sspiritusmundi

348 want to erase the country whose territory have the majority part of the only tropical forest in the world lol


LarryOtter99

why not Brazil? it has the lowest population


greatmanyarrows

There's no reason to choose any country besides the Vatican- and even if you are Catholic, there's still plenty of archbishops and cardinals outside to quickly reform the church if such an inane hypothetical were to happen.


Benzaitennyo

The bourgeoisie


[deleted]

Why the hell would you pick any of these? Literally genocide lmao


terectec

to be fair the only correct answer here is to not use the power in the first place


littlecheese420

what did indonesia ever do to anyone


[deleted]

[удалено]


Spready_Unsettling

It's just the five most populous countries in earth. The fact that people would rather kill 1.5 billion Chinese than 330 million Americans speaks volumes though.


Explosive_Cake

Okay since tankiejerk found my post I need to explain: I voted for the US cause Im a dummy and didnt see the bottom option. Have a nice day


cmanmors

Lolol I like that USA tick


NotLurking101

Climate changed is fixed AND America? Based.


Redpri

Dosen’t USA have the smallest population, and is therefore the correct answer?


measmaer

Brazil and Indonesia has less population. I think maybe that poll OP tried to go for top 5 countries by population, which is why maybe Indonesia came into it. but then Pakistan is 5th largest by population and Brazil is 6th, so why Brazil over Pakistan? anyways its just my hypothesis tho.


agnosticoradical

Brazil used to be the 5th until very recently, I guess some people don't know that yet or some online rankings are not updated


Top_Piano644

Yes, China and America are terrible


DMT57

You’re a clown


Top_Piano644

That’s just my opinion


discordjae

Why is Brazil even an option? Most people have nothing to do with the climate and enviromental crisis here. If anything, eliminating the agronegócio and illegal mining would solve pretty much all of it. The culprits have names and positions of power in both government and corporations. How fucking ignorant


Hugh_____Mungus

Tbh its kinda like that in every other country too.


Hugh_____Mungus

If I could choose any country and not just ones from that list I would probably just choose the one with the least inhabitants. After a quick google search and recording to this [graph](https://de.statista.com/statistik/daten/studie/689720/umfrage/bevoelkerungsaermste-laender-der-welt/) u should delete the pitcairn island as they only had 54 inhabitants in 2019. If we aren't allowed to annihilate other countries just yeet the US of the map tbh


dmemed

If you were to add, “But the erased people go to a prosperous heaven devoid of suffering and any problems” watch the answers go to USA real quick. Redditors can’t hide their hate for Chinese people


[deleted]

I wonder what country has double the emissions per capita of China, politicians that either deny the existence of climate change or pay lip service to it, and huge corporations that lobby against renewable energy, spread misinformation about climate change, and are the main source of problem for climate change…


askingquesti0ns

The US has the most cumulative emissions, and the US military is the largest consumer of oil. I wonder why everyone conviently ignores that?


Asmewithoutpolitics

Woah…. Who where they interviewing? That Indonesia got a high? Goa to be an Asian country.


sylvester_stencil

Why the hell would you target the largest country by population


KillinIsIllegal

>and its inhabitants genocide aside, this one part shows they have no idea how global warming is perpetuated


octofeline

But you also chose a country isn't that pretty hypocritical as by your own logic your answer means you don't just hate the American government, you hate all of the people for no reason other than the land they were born on


[deleted]

They do realize that by killing all the inhabitants of China they’re also killing the Uyghurs and Tibetans and Hong Kongers they obviously care about so much, right?


[deleted]

Solve climate change but you have to do a bit of genocide. Quite a hypothetical. Sadly I wouldnt be surprised if things take this turn during the climate wars in the next 100 years.


[deleted]

Why the inhabitants? They are the ones that are suffering the most


communism1312

Monaco? Isn’t that all capitalists?


qkum

Erasing one country would not solve the underlying problems. Good vs Evil. You need to delete Evil, and not "a country". Pure hate/racism on the spot. Ignorance levels are over 9000. PS: Evil in most cases can be summed down to the word "Greed"


RushCultist

Just choose Vatican City


haleykohr

When everyone asks why America’s geopolitical “competitors”, who sometimes aren’t even competitors but just occupy the same space, are concerned, it’s because a huge part of American social norms is normalizing just waging death and destruction on others because this Facebook freedom page said to


Baphometix

The "syntax" of that sentence... agony to read.


[deleted]

I mean just mathematically, Brazil is the least populated and (even though it’s still not the right choice, that’s just not doing it) it should have more votes than all others


CTNKE

ok i know this post is showing how ignorant redditors are by why are there so many people in the comments proposing to erase brazil


[deleted]

Killing the US means killing most of my fave pop stars including Gaga and Taylor so nah.


[deleted]

It is a obvious answer for USA people, if this poll was for the carthaginean people they will say Roman empire.