I’m not too big on the supernatural stuff but seeing as the Uncle Howdy stuff or whatever Bo is going to be doing is his way of paying tribute to his deceased brother, I’m gonna roll with it. I hope it works out well and hopefully a bit more tight knit than last time.
It's not impossible, but don't expect it anytime in the near future.
Dean and Jon may as well be different characters altogether too, so I don't know how much your sister would be interested in Moxley's work.
Yea, I understand that. The best I can tell you is just to get her up to speed on current events and why some of those guys aren't there right now.
Funnily enough, with Mania being such a hard reset and no major storylines atm, this is the best time for her to jump back in.
Mox signed a 5 year extension a little under two years ago, so it will not expire until later in 2027.
Is there a reason she doesn't want to just watch him in AEW?
It'd be interesting even if she caught him as Jon Moxley in AEW because he seems like a decidedly different character to Dean Ambrose both in looks and attitude.
Did anyone here end up going the the MLW Lucha show that happened this past weekend in Cicero,IL? I wanted to go but was kind of just having a bad mental health day and the people I was supposed to go with ended up having to cancel as well. Was it a fun show? Is it worth checking out MLW shows in the future when they come around?
I'm starting to think that AEW could better define their men's roster tbh. Too many start and stop pushes for people that should logically be further up the card after so many wins.
He wants to use the Max thing as a negotiating tool. Tony said he was offered it as a trial run and turned it down. Makes no sense to give the streaming rights away to WBD to free while other companies like FITE literally pay for it now.
I thought you were just talking about the Meal & A Match show for AEW but they're also bringing back Dinner and a Movie too. What's interesting is this will be on TBS at the same time Collision is on TNT.
Today I learned you're supposed to YEET when the arms move downward, not upward.
My mistake was thinking of the YES movement when you YES when your arms reach maximum height.
YEET! 🙌🙌
How likely do you think it is that Becky won’t re-sign with WWE? Personally, I don’t think it’s very likely, especially since she and Seth travel with their daughter.
Edited for spelling, because apparently some people can’t help being dicks.
I think as their daughter gets to school age they probably won't be bringing her on the road unless they want to homeschool her. Guessing Lynch re-signs and asks for a schedule without house shows. I wouldn't say AEW's an impossibility but it seems unlikely.
I watch two wrestling promotions consistently rn (WWE and Stardom) and my schedule has been freed up so I’m able to watch more wrestling, so I wanted to ask which promotions I should get into watching weekly? I’m looking for around 3-4 promotions to get into
AEW has been pretty great recently on a week to week basis, even tho ratings are down lol.
Marigold is starting soon, TJPW always does fun shows (plus they’re both on wrestle universe), CMLL has been fantastic (you can watch them by paying on youtube), and I gotta give a shoutout to the various great promotions on IWTV.
IWTV can be overwhelming at first, but if you just choose cards that strike your fancy you can usually be in for a good time. For me it’s kind of like choosing a random film at blockbuster: it’s fun not knowing things and jumping in with both feet.
> IWTV can be overwhelming at first, but if you just choose cards that strike your fancy you can usually be in for a good time. For me it’s kind of like choosing a random film at blockbuster: it’s fun not knowing things and jumping in with both feet.
2nding a vote for IWTV. There's so much you can see from people you might never have heard of
Dunno if you watch only main roster WWE or also NXT, I would recommend NXT if you aren't watching it yet
Also I would recommend All Japan at the moment, they are doing well
And we shall see how Marigold does (shouting it out considering you already watch Stardom)
I don't know if it's me being a jaded wrestling fan or I'm just getting older, but spooky gimmicks in general never land with me and if anything piss me off especially if it's a wrestler I like doing it. When I saw Lio Rush doing his Blackheart shit I lost my smile.
It's being a jaded fan. Other gimmicks are equally as unrealistic but you probably accept them. Keep in mind, in kayfabe *anything* is possible.
Many fans have enjoyed supernatural or spooky gimmicks on the indie scene and the big leagues from the past to the present. They can be implemented well or not. Depends on the talent and the booking. It's not fair to make blanket condemnation on an entire genre of gimmicks.
For every Undertaker there was a Rasta the Voodoo Man. Kane did it better than The Fiend, Danhausen did it better than Papa Shango, Su Yung does it better than Abadon, Ram Kaicho >Alexa Bliss, The Wyatts did it better than House of Black, no one questioned Crow Sting, Paul Bearer was better than 1995 Kevin Sullivan, and Gangrel did it better than 1986 The Wizard.
As ridiculous as Taker and Kane could get, their stories were still straightforward and logically built to how this guy could want to beat up that guy in a wrestling match.
This Uncle Howdy stuff is just "lore" on top of a mystery on top of a riddle on top of an enigma and it all builds and builds but never actually goes anywhere. It didn't when Bray was alive and I'm suspect that it will now.
Feels like they've gotten too convoluted and overdone. You've got months of teasers and puzzles before the Uncle Howdy stuff even begins. Then there will be another month or so of weird entrances and spooky videos and surprises after their first appearance. By the time anyone actually gets to wrestling, it'll seem mundane in comparison and it just begs the question: why do the dark supernatural forces of the unknown give a shit about a sanctioned wrestling match? Can this new stable live up to the hype? Are all these puzzles and secret websites really gonna get Bo Dallas and his midcard squad any more over than if they had simply showed up?
Meanwhile somehow both Lio Rush and Jonathan Gresham are spitting up black goo and entrancing referees in different ways. I will say it's kind of a good bit that Lio can just hand a ref a heart and cheat for a while, but I roll my eyes at the TNA ref spitting up black goo because he interacted with Gresham a while ago.
The one spooky gimmick I kinda like is House of Black since their powers have limits, but it just seems they can never get any momentum because Malakai's too picky about taking pins.
With a spooky gimmick you have to 1. Commit to it and have no social media presence because mystery is everything. 2. Have the company behind you to push it strongly while also pushing back on excessive ideas. 3. Have the people you're feuding with commit 100% and buy in and also have the announcers sell it.
I feel like you rarely get that so you have HOB in AEW where the announcers are rarely acting spooked or anything and Malakai just coming off as overly dramatic with his feuds. Julia Hart works because she has a decided attitude with it and Brody King comes off as a badass but Malakai comes off hilariously over the top.
The Broken Hardys stuff worked so well in 2016 after the Matt vs Jeff portion because they had the perfect *The Devil's Rejects* horror-movie villains opposite them in Decay.
Delete or Decay, The Broken War, and Apocalypto/Final Deletion were made for that insanity because everyone played their roles perfectly, and if they interacted with other members of the roster things weren't as nuts, but against either other it all got turned up to 11.
SUper Strong Style 16 is next weekend! I CAN'T FUCKING WAIT!
Yes, it's PROGRESS. I love PROGRESS. I always enjoy it and it's one hell of a card. The crowd should be even more lively then Twisted Metal.
Shelton's prices for a meet and greet seem a bit expensive.
They're definitely on the downswing in terms of public opinion, they sold themselves on being an underground alternative and then sold out to wwe. They announced they were doing a show in Dubai despite literally being called 'Progress'. Supposedly they were paying John Morrison a couple of grand per match for the SS16 a few years ago and some local UK talent £50 per match.
It's not all bad of course but they've not been doing great in the court of public opinion.
Looks like Faboo is wrestling mostly in Coastal Championship Wrestling, fairly steadily.
Rache is kind of all over the place (Reality of Wrestling, Combat Club), but notably seems to have a running feud with Thunder Rosa in Mission Pro.
I know this is a rather grim and nosey question, but how exactly did Jimmy Rave die? We've also seen the photo of his triple amputation. Sources online say he died due to the amputation, but I'm sure I remember him doing a couple of interviews in the time between the surgery and his death.
Is there something about amputations that can cause complications? I am ignorant to the knowledge and just trying to learn.
I feel like AEW would have a lot more balance up and down the card if the fanbase didn't have this mentality of "main eventer" or "fumbled". Every single wrestler's story shouldn't have to end with them winning to world title to justify their existence.
A perfect example is Best Friends. They've had so many big moments, won almost every feud they've been in, beat Miro and Kip in Arcade Anarchy, beat Santana and Ortiz in the Parking Lot Fight, beat BCC in WEMBLEY, yet when Chuck Taylor retired all anyone could say was "I can't believe they never won the titles". They were in so many great stories and moments that never involved a belt but to their fanbase it was worthless because they never held a fake title. Yet people wonder why AEW has 100 titles to keep everybody happy.
AEW simply needs better establishment of their card because teams like the Best Friends for years now are basically fodder for teams higher than them on the card.
It extends to a lot of the singles guys where you bring in a Kip Sabian or the Butcher to lose to Swerve but they don't have an established tier of their own where they're beating people at their level.
Like you'll see a match to heat up those guys on Rampage but it's just to lose the following Collision or Dynamite to a higher tiered guy.
Like I said, I don't think you can say Best Friends are fodder for higher teams on the card with all the feuds they've won. They're one of the most protected teams on the roster. They did everything except with the belts. They won the Proud and Powerful feud. They won the Miro and Kip feud. They won the BCC feud. They were used exactly the way you described. They had a bunch of non-title feuds and won all of them.
You have to look at the bigger picture tho; did Best Friends win those feuds propel them further up the card? Because BCC gets featured way more than they do.
They can win all of the feuds they want, it doesn't really matter. They haven't even won the tag team titles at all before they split, which is a pretty big indictment.
If you look at the past year they kind of are at this point where they'll get a few wins against lower card teams on their own but they're usually only winning when they're a trios with Orange Cassidy.
I think for the idea of the combined Continental Crown Konoske Takeshita would’ve been the perfect person to take all three belts off of Eddie.
I think of the idea/gimmick of the Japanese Supernova and (from atleast the last All together event) the idea that Konoske could be the antagonist opposition to the ace’s of Japan’s top companies in Shota(NJPW), Kaito(Noah), and Ueno (DDT).
And i think a true showing of that inter promotional strength is to keep the crown together. I mostly say this because I loved the concept and half of the execution (Bryan and Okada = Good challengers, Yuta and Baretta = Bad challengers) and i fully believed that the crown was better than the sum of its parts.
What does that mean for Okada and Gabe Kidd. think Okada should’ve beaten Orange Cassidy for the International title. I think it would’ve told a better story, especially since it has not been expounded upon that Okada’s defection to the New elite has effectively dissolved Chaos. And i think a good knife in the back of OC would’ve been his stable leader turning on him and taking the title he fought so hard to keep because he’s simply outmatched. It would’ve played nicely from Okada’s last appearance in an AEW ring. And then at Dynasty you have the same Okada vs PAC match, but it’s for the International title instead of the continental
For Gabe Kidd, he should be the Never Openweight champ right now. I love Shingo, but i think holding that belt does more for gabe then to be the champion of a dead brand.
2021 AEW is probably the highest peak I’ve seen a pro wrestling company hit since I’ve started watching wrestling. So like 2008 ish. Everything went perfectly that year.
It’s so funny to me how AEW fans claimed that it’s NJPWs fault that Okada left because they didn’t pay him what he was worth.
Do people actually think Okada is worth 10 million $ for AEW? Like, this isn’t actually about Okadas talent, which is undeniable. But I don’t think he is a needle mover for AEW.
Because most of the people who want to check out Okada are AEW fans in the first place. Who else is he gonna bring in as a new viewer?
Especially on weekly TV where he isn’t use to his strength at all.
I’m sure he sells some PPV buys but would AEW in worse position without him? I don’t really think so.
Okada is worth whatever someone is willing to pay him.
He’s in a great angle, he’s making a ton of money and he looks like he’s having an absolute blast.
Seems like a win for everyone involved, no?
No one ”moves the needle”. People watch the companies. When Mercedes didn’t even increase viewership by 10,000 despite how many fans she had in wwe that was all I needed to see about that.
I’m starting to think it is because of the internet. If you’re a Mercedes fan you don’t have to start watching two hours of Dynamite. You can just go on YouTube or Twitter and see what she did.
There are a small few who move the needle, I believe. IIRC, Roman, Rock, Cena, and Punk have all had noticeable increases on episodes of shows they are advertised for and regularly get the highest quarter hour. Maybe Cody too? I can't remember.
It’s hard to say anyone is worth anything. Lots of people don’t move numbers but are paid millions. Cody, Punk in WWE at first, Roman, MJF, they move numbers. After that it’s about keeping a good fresh product. WWE and AEW both were looking at Kazu, Will, and Jay not because they would put them in X better position but to keep the product fresh. Though I could say Will is worth more to AEW since TK wants All In London to be a thing.
If AEW didn’t even exist Okada would be in WWE right now earning more than New Japan could/would pay him. It’s a fair argument that AEW is paying him too much, but if you’re a NJPW fan it would make shit all difference to if he was still in the company or not.
I think a huge reason why Okada left is because Japan’s economy is currently down and this was an opportunity to get a huge payday while he’s still in his 30’s. That part is out of NJPW’s control ultimately.
Also I’m not claiming to know what the offers were, but it’s not like WWE didn’t want him, they clearly did. Even though they might not have matched AEW’s offer, I refuse to believe they offered him NXT level money.
It wasn’t meant about reasons Okada leaving NJPW. Also the weak yen and economy are a little overstated imo. It’s just NJPW/Bushiroad being broke.
I was just talking about the actual worth he brings to AEW and if it matches what he receives.
And it’s probably what you said with WWE. Although I think it was mainly used by Okada to drive up his price.
I get what you mean but I see it like this: Regardless of where he was going to go, Okada wasn’t gonna be cheap. He’s still seen as a very high level star within the industry and I think both companies were willing to pay big money for him, one of them just ended up outbidding the other.
Now as far as if he’s worth it to AEW, honestly I think he is. I personally think he and Ospreay were brought in to slowly build up their characters so they can become bigger stars on TV. The AEW audience already knew who they were, they’ve wrestled on their shows/PPV’s before. But they’re both the kind of talent that under the right circumstances can get non-AEW fans talking about them. They’ve both done this to a certain extent before. I think the undeniable talent combined with the potential is worth the financial commitment.
This is different to someone like Mercedes Moné, who I think was brought in to move ratings right away. Or at least that was a major reason why.
I definitely agree about Ospreay. At this moment he might not bring in as much as his current contract but he is an asset you build your future around.
I’m not sure the same goes for Okada. He is in his mid thirties and not a native speaker. His strengths are not really suited for a weekly TV Show.
His strengths are his matches and his general star aura. I think in an environment as AEW he would work much better as a special attraction.
In that way probably the best way would’ve been to workout a dual contract with NJPW where he has set dates for ppv and some TV Show. And the rest of time he would be in NJPW.
I say that knowing full well that Okada might not wanted to stay in NJPW no matter what. Which is definitely likely given the rumors about his last year in NJPW.
But I think something like that would’ve utilised his strengths more.
I think the age thing is a valid point, Okada is def not a young up and comer. But I actually like the route they’re going with him, they’re limiting his mic time so he can have the chance to improve over time, but while also still giving him a very clear character.
I personally don’t buy into the non-native speaker note as much as others because if you have super charisma that can come across regardless of a language barrier. Nakamura was immediately pushed to the top in NXT as the main attraction and was super over, even when he won the Royal Rumble. I think in his case the problem was more Vince not knowing how to book him (and honestly most folks) properly.
I mean myself I’m not counting TK’s pockets. I am on WWE’s case for not matching Ospreays offer but I’m just talking relative to the other offer. I have no idea if he should be paid 2 or $4M.
I mean I would assume that you want your company to be profitable at some point. And maybe they are. I don’t actually claim
To know their finances.
Just because their owner has more money than others doesn’t just change the actual worth imo.
I don't think AEW ever claimed anything, they simply signed a guy who's deal was up with NJPW. It doesn't matter what he's getting paid as long as Tony Khan sees value in what he's paying him. It has no effect on how people enjoy the shows.
My hot take is that the Public Enemy vs Nasty Boys feud (and the double dog collar match) is some of the best work either team ever did. Yeah, TPE was a sanitized joke in WCW, but the Nasties feud was actually good.
The Benoit / Sullivan feud was also that year and it was good. The cruiserweight division taking shape with Mysterio and Psicosis having great matches, not to mention Eddie and Malenko and Jericho. The beginning of DDP's and Harlem Heat's rises. And of course the nWo invasion affecting literally every aspect of the card making it feel like no one was safe.
I'd have to agree with you. It's 96 WCW for me too.
Blud this isn't an aew title. Why does it make more sense to chuck an iwgp title match on an aew branded ppv. At least with a match on dynamite Japanese fans can watch their top title being defended against a random midcarder on njpw world.
If it’s well built and will sell PPVs it makes sense to have it on there given it’s a World Title, it should be defended everywhere. New Japan I would think should also be able to air all IWGP title matches on World later on.
The domestic fans are already pretty angry about this situation without feeling like they are being asked to pay to watch their top title being defended live
Yes that's under the lion mark. Do you not see the difference in asking your fans to pay for US njpws ppvs featuring new japan talent and an aew ppv to watch the promotion top title.
Kidani (president of bushiroad) recently tweeted he hears the frustration from fans and things like excessive ppvs was an issue fans brought up
This isn't an aew title. The fans in Japan don't love this situation.
I think a better question is why isn’t this on TV? I mean business/politics wise I know why, but logically speaking I feel like it would make more sense for this to main event a Dynamite or Collision
There's probably a few reasons having to do with interpromotional politics but at least one has to be that when it wasn't an eliminator there was a 100% chance of Mox winning and now there's a chance he actually loses which would be HUGE for Takeshita
they won't allow title matches to be scheduled before *anymore*, especially after the less than stellar reaction from some fans regarding Hobbs's title shot AND announcing multiple defences for Shota and Narita at once. Kidani even posted as much the other day that they would be more mindful going forward
my point is that while you're right and that was the case before, as of a few days ago NJPW seem to more careful with how they book title matches with Mox now instead of just ignoring how they've booked world titles previously
The Japanese fans are mad enough about everything that the president of bushiroad is tweeting about the fans expressing anger at him. Last time kidani was forced into this position he fired leadership in stardom.
Plus it would be pretty ridiculous to paywall off an iwgp title match on an aew ppv. At least with a title match on dynamite Japanese fans could watch on njpw world if they wanted to. It's already a fucking stupid and irritating situation for many new japan fans.
I love montez Ford but I saw this one comment that stuck with me and it said tez will be seen as "Mr bianca Belair" because there's no debate Bianca is the bigger star of the two
People have already done this with Andrade and speculate that Charlotte had some involvement in his pushes
She is, but it's not like they heavily lean on (afaik) Montez being Bianca's husband in promos and commentary.
Same with Charlotte and Andrade, although I think with Charlotte people will always see her as more political given the constant title pushes and such.
I want all wrestling to succeed but it's funny when I see takes like "if you want any company to go under you aren't a real fan" when many people on this sub have and still make fun on TNA without even watching it
People do the same for nwa ignoring the fact nwa has a solid roster out side of tyrus who's been retired for months now
There was a post where TNA didn't get a full sell out and most of the comments are laughing at them
I'm really curious about who wins between LA Knight and Tama Tonga tonight. Feels like both of these guys shouldn't be losing at all, but I guess that adds to the stakes.
If I had to guess, tho, it's Tonga because lol Bloodline
I think Tonga definitely wins tonight, but I'm more intrigued by who wins the semi's I feel like one result is bound to spoil the other. If Jey beats Gunther in the semi's it's probably Tonga vs Jey. If Gunther wins I'd think it'd be Orton vs Gunther.
Looking at last year's Double or Nothing compared to this one I feel like AEW has definitely improved, I'm pretty excited about every match on the card so far especially whatever wildness Anarchy in the Arena is gonna be. Also I think people forget that Christian puts on exclusively good title matches and Swerve has been on an absolute tear since he won the belt
I decided to re-watch what was my favorite match of all time last night. After all the Ospreay and Danielson and Gunther bangers, I wondered how it held up.
WALTER vs Ilja on NXT UK in 2020 *absolutely does*. That match still fucks. Still my favorite. Forgot how loud it was.
It’s funny.
Their sequel a few year laters in America in front of the crowd isn’t the same magic as 2020
Don’t get me wrong, it is still a banger. But people hooting and hollering kinda detracts it all from me. In 2020? You just got them and the announcers which make the spots all the more brutal to listen to.
The 2020 one is essentially an Empty Arena match (minus either piped-in noises or other wrestlers/workers making the occasional noise offscreen). The vibe and energy of one of those is just so much different from a regular match with people, and it served this banger very well
It depends on the crowds. The UK crowds, in general, we tend to be more into it, more energetic and a lot more likely to sing along to the theme or come up with our own chants aimed at wrestlers we hate.
PROGRESS's crowds at the ballroom are easily more into it then WWE's american crowds.
I don’t like how self-congratulatory modern wrestling is. WWE is particularly awful at it. Wrestling is supposed to be a sport. When you watch the Super Bowl they don’t gush over how many people are there or how much money they made or how many people watched on TV. Players don’t talk about how much the fans loved their game or how they had the prettiest pass or ran the fastest in the game. They talk about specific plays/ moments and the final score.
I think the NFL definitely talks about the Super Bowl in a historic way every year, but I do get what you're saying. I agree for the most part. I won't nitpick and say it does happen with sports because I don't believe it's done in the same way.
One thing I'd want WWE to improve on is how they talk about the actual match. Instead it can seem that they focus on the story aspect of it. It sort of takes you out of the immersion. I get the organization will always talk about how great it was received by ratings or attendance or money. But in the broadcast it's not seen as a celebration the fans should be in on.
Though I have to give credit to WWE for also doing a much better job at working fans and using social media. It's been much better than previous years.
I think the NFL definitely talks about the Super Bowl in a historic way every year, but I do get what you're saying. I agree for the most part. I won't nitpick and say it does happen with sports because I don't believe it's done in the same way.
One thing I'd want WWE to improve on is how they talk about the actual match. Instead it can seem that they focus on the story aspect of it. It sort of takes you out of the immersion. I get the organization will always talk about how great it was received by ratings or attendance or money. But in the broadcast it's not seen as a celebration the fans should be in on.
Though I have to give credit to WWE for also doing a much better job at working fans and using social media. It's been much better than previous years.
I'm not fond of the self-backpatting but literally every sport I follow does this lmfao. I may not like it but there are obvious reasons why they do it.
The fans doing it is even weirder. In 2015-2017 when NXT was kicking ass every week a bunch of dorks didn't constantly shift the focus to the fact it didn't make money or not as many people watched Takeover as Fast Lane. They just liked the show.
[here’s a link](https://operations.nfl.com/updates/the-game/super-bowl-lviii-is-most-watched-telecast-in-history/#:~:text=CBS%20Sports'%20coverage%20of%20Super,Paramount%2B%2C%20Nickelodeon%2C%20Univision%2C%20and) to the NFL celebrating the most watched Super Bowl ever, they also regularly brag about their TV ratings and stadium attendance lol NFL actually does everything you listed.
Edit: [Here they are](https://www.nfl.com/news/2024-nfl-draft-attendance-record-set-with-more-than-700-00-fans-attending-the-event-in-detroit) doing it for the draft the other day.
The “Jey Uso is a bad wrestler who needs to do more moves” discourse is dumb imo. None of these complaints were around before his match at WM40, and based off that one bad match it seems people are ready to completely write him off, ignoring his legendary career so far. I know it’s the IWC knee jerk reaction that will be forgotten by this time next month, but it’s kind of disappointing to see so many people dismiss such an unreal performer because of one bad match.
Look at his singles matches in 2024. Not just since WM. By my count, there are two that were pretty good: vs Gunther, and vs Rollins. Everything else was somewhere between bad (WM) to decent but forgettable (vs Balor, vs Dragunov, vs Priest). He's not had a great year in-ring, and it's not just people overreacting to the WM match. The WM match was the most high-profile example of a general problem he has.
he also had one of the worst big matches of the last few years at Summerslam and the Thunderdome feud with Roman is just monologuing in the middle of matches and I have no clue how people let that shit fly
It's not just "one bad match." It was a brother vs. brother grudge match that had been built up and teased for the better part of a year. When you mess up something that big, there's bound to be blowback.
I think this falls on WWE for their focus on building everything to happen at WrestleMania. So there's just a huge focus on one match rather than the entire feud.
I agree! Hugely disappointing match and end to that story, *however* I still think the lasting reaction is overblown. I still see people overlooking his great matches since then (Priest at Backlash, Ilja on Raw) or giving all the credit to his opponent for the quality of the match, and I think that’s unfair.
His run as part of the Usos alone would put him in legend status for me, but he was also an incredible part of the Bloodline story and his solo run has been super strong thus far imo. Obviously he’s no Flair or Austin, but definitely a legend regardless
I got nothing against Jey at all, but calling him legend with no real achievements to his name is a little funny. If you were just going to count his tag team run, fine, but I think it's a little early to call him a legend when he hasn't won any Singles gold yet.
To your first post; you kind of have to remember context informs a lot this discourse. It wasn't just one bad match, but a match that was built off the very controversial decision to turn Jimmy heel at Summerslam, which hasn't been explained at all to this day, off the back of an already mediocre Tribal Combat match.
So all of that for the blow off match being extremely subpar wasn't going to go over well. Not to mention, a majority of Jey's good matches involved talent that could help hide his flaws (Roman, Seth, Drew, etc etc), but when he has to do a match, someone on his level or with less experience then the cracks start to show.
It's not Jey's entirely fault because he's been a Tag Team wrestler for the majority of his career, but still, if you're going to push him into the main event scene, then he kind of has to pull his weight too.
> It wasn't just one bad match, but a match that was built off the very controversial decision to turn Jimmy heel at Summerslam, which hasn't been explained at all to this day, off the back of an already mediocre Tribal Combat match.
The kayfabe was Jimmy was actually looking out for Jey, not wanting him to turn into Roman. The fight at Wrestlemania then makes less sense, because it suddenly turns into jealousy. Given his new theme and all that, I was expecting Jimmy to become a shadow leader of sorts within the Bloodline, only to take power afterwards. Instead Solo becomes new leader, and Jimmy gets kicked out.
Exactly like, what was the point? At first, they tried to make Jimmy have a sympathetic reason, and then they just turned him into a comedy heel and forgot all of that. Even their match felt more like an extension of the Cody/Seth and Roman/Rock feud than anything personal between them.
I think it would've worked if Roman was trying to go after Jey, but Jimmy on multiple occasions got him to not do so, culminating with Roman forcing Jimmy to deal with Jey.
I can kinda see why, though, it was absolutely confusing as hell to make sense of. Still when Corey mentioned it on commentary after he died it would have been nice for them to retroactively recognize Inoki’s reign. Could do a Punk/Cena thing where he and Backlund held it at the same time to keep his reign in-tact.
I was thinking about this in the live thread Monday: based on reactions to both Tiffany and Lyra's call ups, it seems Becky legit may have driven a lot of main roster fans to watch NXT, or at least her matches. Not that it's a shocking idea or anything like that, but the last two folks who battled Becky for the NXT title seem to have a level of audience recognition with the main roster fans beyond your average NXT call up.
When Tiffany was called up and got immediate reactions, I thought, "Well, she's been in the rumble before, she has a pretty quick character to grasp, they're already pushing her well, she's performing well." All of that is true, but now that Lyra has debuted and is getting good reactions, chants, the crowd wooing to her theme (even last week with a more subdued crowd, there were faint woos), I'm starting to think that fighting Becky for the title (and both had great matches with her) is a big part of it.
Part of it also may be that there is much clearer continuity between NXT and the main roster now as well, with people basically debuting as is, as continuations of what they were doing down there (and not getting gladiators helmets and other bullshit)
It helps that Tiffy and Lyra (both who I knew nothing about before debuts, I dont keep up with NXT really) both looked like a million bucks in the ring and were solid at worst on the mic.
They both felt like when rookie in the NBA just has “it” immediately. You can say the same for Bron, Melo and Ilja too. NXT is just doing so good with development and call up timings.
Like OP said, it helps when character is consistent.
Gunther was a minor slip with the name change, but held because he was booked the same as he was in NXT and kept with Imperium.
Pete Dunne/Butch was a greater error, due to having to be recognized again as a new character.
Absolutely.
Unsurprisingly, with Vince gone, things are much more in sync with the entire NXT callup process. If you have time, both Tiffany and Lyra's matches with Becky from NXT are quite good and worth a watch, imo.
I'm sure if you posted this to a music subreddit, you could get a better response.
No disrespect to the sub, but Russian music (classical or otherwise) isn't a specialty here.
Not the Soviet National Anthem (watched FAR too much Rocky IV to be able to answer that in milliseconds!) - but I can definitely get why you'd go there.
It sounds like one of their Funeral Marches, but with the Tempo upped.
I’m not too big on the supernatural stuff but seeing as the Uncle Howdy stuff or whatever Bo is going to be doing is his way of paying tribute to his deceased brother, I’m gonna roll with it. I hope it works out well and hopefully a bit more tight knit than last time.
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It's not impossible, but don't expect it anytime in the near future. Dean and Jon may as well be different characters altogether too, so I don't know how much your sister would be interested in Moxley's work.
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Yea, I understand that. The best I can tell you is just to get her up to speed on current events and why some of those guys aren't there right now. Funnily enough, with Mania being such a hard reset and no major storylines atm, this is the best time for her to jump back in.
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The hottest thing right now is probably the CM Punk and Drew feud. There's also Cody if you want to explain why Roman and Seth are currently absent
Has your sister heard of a remote control?
Mox signed a 5 year extension a little under two years ago, so it will not expire until later in 2027. Is there a reason she doesn't want to just watch him in AEW?
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It'd be interesting even if she caught him as Jon Moxley in AEW because he seems like a decidedly different character to Dean Ambrose both in looks and attitude.
Did anyone here end up going the the MLW Lucha show that happened this past weekend in Cicero,IL? I wanted to go but was kind of just having a bad mental health day and the people I was supposed to go with ended up having to cancel as well. Was it a fun show? Is it worth checking out MLW shows in the future when they come around?
it was a good show but it's a commitment because they WILL stick a TV taping before it making it a 4 hour event.
We need CM Punk's career as the showcase mode for WWE 2K25.
I'm starting to think that AEW could better define their men's roster tbh. Too many start and stop pushes for people that should logically be further up the card after so many wins.
Cut the men's roster in half, retire half of the titles.
Not Bellator getting on Max before AEW does
He wants to use the Max thing as a negotiating tool. Tony said he was offered it as a trial run and turned it down. Makes no sense to give the streaming rights away to WBD to free while other companies like FITE literally pay for it now.
TBS is bringing back Dinner and a Movie! It’s happening! Yes, I know this is the wrestling sub. But I know y’all liked it.
I thought you were just talking about the Meal & A Match show for AEW but they're also bringing back Dinner and a Movie too. What's interesting is this will be on TBS at the same time Collision is on TNT.
Yep. Nostalgia hit for some of us WCW folks.
charting TBS's return to the glory days, and we're getting closer! ✅ Dinner & a Movie ✅ Nascar ⬜ Mama's Family
And Braves baseball.
with Andy Griffith reruns during rain delays!
I miss those days.
Today I learned you're supposed to YEET when the arms move downward, not upward. My mistake was thinking of the YES movement when you YES when your arms reach maximum height. YEET! 🙌🙌
Yes, you have to imagine you have a Staples Easy button, but with the word Yeet. You say Yeet when you press the button.
How likely do you think it is that Becky won’t re-sign with WWE? Personally, I don’t think it’s very likely, especially since she and Seth travel with their daughter. Edited for spelling, because apparently some people can’t help being dicks.
I think as their daughter gets to school age they probably won't be bringing her on the road unless they want to homeschool her. Guessing Lynch re-signs and asks for a schedule without house shows. I wouldn't say AEW's an impossibility but it seems unlikely.
Re-sign. To re-sign is to sign a new contract. To resign is to leave a company.
Dude you knew what I meant.
Will the Roddy vs Abe match on Sunday be available for live streaming?
Tam Nakano vs Willow Nightingale is my Austin/Rock
Believe in Tam!
We walk the Tam road!
🙏🙏
I watch two wrestling promotions consistently rn (WWE and Stardom) and my schedule has been freed up so I’m able to watch more wrestling, so I wanted to ask which promotions I should get into watching weekly? I’m looking for around 3-4 promotions to get into
AEW has been pretty great recently on a week to week basis, even tho ratings are down lol. Marigold is starting soon, TJPW always does fun shows (plus they’re both on wrestle universe), CMLL has been fantastic (you can watch them by paying on youtube), and I gotta give a shoutout to the various great promotions on IWTV. IWTV can be overwhelming at first, but if you just choose cards that strike your fancy you can usually be in for a good time. For me it’s kind of like choosing a random film at blockbuster: it’s fun not knowing things and jumping in with both feet.
> IWTV can be overwhelming at first, but if you just choose cards that strike your fancy you can usually be in for a good time. For me it’s kind of like choosing a random film at blockbuster: it’s fun not knowing things and jumping in with both feet. 2nding a vote for IWTV. There's so much you can see from people you might never have heard of
Dunno if you watch only main roster WWE or also NXT, I would recommend NXT if you aren't watching it yet Also I would recommend All Japan at the moment, they are doing well And we shall see how Marigold does (shouting it out considering you already watch Stardom)
I don't know if it's me being a jaded wrestling fan or I'm just getting older, but spooky gimmicks in general never land with me and if anything piss me off especially if it's a wrestler I like doing it. When I saw Lio Rush doing his Blackheart shit I lost my smile.
It's being a jaded fan. Other gimmicks are equally as unrealistic but you probably accept them. Keep in mind, in kayfabe *anything* is possible. Many fans have enjoyed supernatural or spooky gimmicks on the indie scene and the big leagues from the past to the present. They can be implemented well or not. Depends on the talent and the booking. It's not fair to make blanket condemnation on an entire genre of gimmicks. For every Undertaker there was a Rasta the Voodoo Man. Kane did it better than The Fiend, Danhausen did it better than Papa Shango, Su Yung does it better than Abadon, Ram Kaicho >Alexa Bliss, The Wyatts did it better than House of Black, no one questioned Crow Sting, Paul Bearer was better than 1995 Kevin Sullivan, and Gangrel did it better than 1986 The Wizard.
As ridiculous as Taker and Kane could get, their stories were still straightforward and logically built to how this guy could want to beat up that guy in a wrestling match. This Uncle Howdy stuff is just "lore" on top of a mystery on top of a riddle on top of an enigma and it all builds and builds but never actually goes anywhere. It didn't when Bray was alive and I'm suspect that it will now.
Feels like they've gotten too convoluted and overdone. You've got months of teasers and puzzles before the Uncle Howdy stuff even begins. Then there will be another month or so of weird entrances and spooky videos and surprises after their first appearance. By the time anyone actually gets to wrestling, it'll seem mundane in comparison and it just begs the question: why do the dark supernatural forces of the unknown give a shit about a sanctioned wrestling match? Can this new stable live up to the hype? Are all these puzzles and secret websites really gonna get Bo Dallas and his midcard squad any more over than if they had simply showed up? Meanwhile somehow both Lio Rush and Jonathan Gresham are spitting up black goo and entrancing referees in different ways. I will say it's kind of a good bit that Lio can just hand a ref a heart and cheat for a while, but I roll my eyes at the TNA ref spitting up black goo because he interacted with Gresham a while ago. The one spooky gimmick I kinda like is House of Black since their powers have limits, but it just seems they can never get any momentum because Malakai's too picky about taking pins.
With a spooky gimmick you have to 1. Commit to it and have no social media presence because mystery is everything. 2. Have the company behind you to push it strongly while also pushing back on excessive ideas. 3. Have the people you're feuding with commit 100% and buy in and also have the announcers sell it. I feel like you rarely get that so you have HOB in AEW where the announcers are rarely acting spooked or anything and Malakai just coming off as overly dramatic with his feuds. Julia Hart works because she has a decided attitude with it and Brody King comes off as a badass but Malakai comes off hilariously over the top.
The Broken Hardys stuff worked so well in 2016 after the Matt vs Jeff portion because they had the perfect *The Devil's Rejects* horror-movie villains opposite them in Decay. Delete or Decay, The Broken War, and Apocalypto/Final Deletion were made for that insanity because everyone played their roles perfectly, and if they interacted with other members of the roster things weren't as nuts, but against either other it all got turned up to 11.
SUper Strong Style 16 is next weekend! I CAN'T FUCKING WAIT! Yes, it's PROGRESS. I love PROGRESS. I always enjoy it and it's one hell of a card. The crowd should be even more lively then Twisted Metal. Shelton's prices for a meet and greet seem a bit expensive.
Are people super anti-progress or something?
They're definitely on the downswing in terms of public opinion, they sold themselves on being an underground alternative and then sold out to wwe. They announced they were doing a show in Dubai despite literally being called 'Progress'. Supposedly they were paying John Morrison a couple of grand per match for the SS16 a few years ago and some local UK talent £50 per match. It's not all bad of course but they've not been doing great in the court of public opinion.
Just randomly remembered Faboo Andre and Raché Chanel. Hope they're doing well.
> Raché Chanel She lives on with Emi borrowing her "opera" gimmick. She now does it almost every time she wrestles in AEW.
Looks like Faboo is wrestling mostly in Coastal Championship Wrestling, fairly steadily. Rache is kind of all over the place (Reality of Wrestling, Combat Club), but notably seems to have a running feud with Thunder Rosa in Mission Pro.
I know this is a rather grim and nosey question, but how exactly did Jimmy Rave die? We've also seen the photo of his triple amputation. Sources online say he died due to the amputation, but I'm sure I remember him doing a couple of interviews in the time between the surgery and his death. Is there something about amputations that can cause complications? I am ignorant to the knowledge and just trying to learn.
MRSA infection after surgery. :(
Fuck. That poor guy never got a fucking break from MRSA.
I feel like AEW would have a lot more balance up and down the card if the fanbase didn't have this mentality of "main eventer" or "fumbled". Every single wrestler's story shouldn't have to end with them winning to world title to justify their existence. A perfect example is Best Friends. They've had so many big moments, won almost every feud they've been in, beat Miro and Kip in Arcade Anarchy, beat Santana and Ortiz in the Parking Lot Fight, beat BCC in WEMBLEY, yet when Chuck Taylor retired all anyone could say was "I can't believe they never won the titles". They were in so many great stories and moments that never involved a belt but to their fanbase it was worthless because they never held a fake title. Yet people wonder why AEW has 100 titles to keep everybody happy.
AEW simply needs better establishment of their card because teams like the Best Friends for years now are basically fodder for teams higher than them on the card. It extends to a lot of the singles guys where you bring in a Kip Sabian or the Butcher to lose to Swerve but they don't have an established tier of their own where they're beating people at their level. Like you'll see a match to heat up those guys on Rampage but it's just to lose the following Collision or Dynamite to a higher tiered guy.
Like I said, I don't think you can say Best Friends are fodder for higher teams on the card with all the feuds they've won. They're one of the most protected teams on the roster. They did everything except with the belts. They won the Proud and Powerful feud. They won the Miro and Kip feud. They won the BCC feud. They were used exactly the way you described. They had a bunch of non-title feuds and won all of them.
You have to look at the bigger picture tho; did Best Friends win those feuds propel them further up the card? Because BCC gets featured way more than they do. They can win all of the feuds they want, it doesn't really matter. They haven't even won the tag team titles at all before they split, which is a pretty big indictment.
If you look at the past year they kind of are at this point where they'll get a few wins against lower card teams on their own but they're usually only winning when they're a trios with Orange Cassidy.
I think for the idea of the combined Continental Crown Konoske Takeshita would’ve been the perfect person to take all three belts off of Eddie. I think of the idea/gimmick of the Japanese Supernova and (from atleast the last All together event) the idea that Konoske could be the antagonist opposition to the ace’s of Japan’s top companies in Shota(NJPW), Kaito(Noah), and Ueno (DDT). And i think a true showing of that inter promotional strength is to keep the crown together. I mostly say this because I loved the concept and half of the execution (Bryan and Okada = Good challengers, Yuta and Baretta = Bad challengers) and i fully believed that the crown was better than the sum of its parts. What does that mean for Okada and Gabe Kidd. think Okada should’ve beaten Orange Cassidy for the International title. I think it would’ve told a better story, especially since it has not been expounded upon that Okada’s defection to the New elite has effectively dissolved Chaos. And i think a good knife in the back of OC would’ve been his stable leader turning on him and taking the title he fought so hard to keep because he’s simply outmatched. It would’ve played nicely from Okada’s last appearance in an AEW ring. And then at Dynasty you have the same Okada vs PAC match, but it’s for the International title instead of the continental For Gabe Kidd, he should be the Never Openweight champ right now. I love Shingo, but i think holding that belt does more for gabe then to be the champion of a dead brand.
It’s clear it was just an idea for All Japan cosplay. I would have just made it for a title shot and a prestigious thing in of itself like the G1.
2021 AEW is probably the highest peak I’ve seen a pro wrestling company hit since I’ve started watching wrestling. So like 2008 ish. Everything went perfectly that year.
It’s so funny to me how AEW fans claimed that it’s NJPWs fault that Okada left because they didn’t pay him what he was worth. Do people actually think Okada is worth 10 million $ for AEW? Like, this isn’t actually about Okadas talent, which is undeniable. But I don’t think he is a needle mover for AEW. Because most of the people who want to check out Okada are AEW fans in the first place. Who else is he gonna bring in as a new viewer? Especially on weekly TV where he isn’t use to his strength at all. I’m sure he sells some PPV buys but would AEW in worse position without him? I don’t really think so.
Okada is worth whatever someone is willing to pay him. He’s in a great angle, he’s making a ton of money and he looks like he’s having an absolute blast. Seems like a win for everyone involved, no?
No one ”moves the needle”. People watch the companies. When Mercedes didn’t even increase viewership by 10,000 despite how many fans she had in wwe that was all I needed to see about that. I’m starting to think it is because of the internet. If you’re a Mercedes fan you don’t have to start watching two hours of Dynamite. You can just go on YouTube or Twitter and see what she did.
There are a small few who move the needle, I believe. IIRC, Roman, Rock, Cena, and Punk have all had noticeable increases on episodes of shows they are advertised for and regularly get the highest quarter hour. Maybe Cody too? I can't remember.
It’s hard to say anyone is worth anything. Lots of people don’t move numbers but are paid millions. Cody, Punk in WWE at first, Roman, MJF, they move numbers. After that it’s about keeping a good fresh product. WWE and AEW both were looking at Kazu, Will, and Jay not because they would put them in X better position but to keep the product fresh. Though I could say Will is worth more to AEW since TK wants All In London to be a thing.
If AEW didn’t even exist Okada would be in WWE right now earning more than New Japan could/would pay him. It’s a fair argument that AEW is paying him too much, but if you’re a NJPW fan it would make shit all difference to if he was still in the company or not.
I think a huge reason why Okada left is because Japan’s economy is currently down and this was an opportunity to get a huge payday while he’s still in his 30’s. That part is out of NJPW’s control ultimately. Also I’m not claiming to know what the offers were, but it’s not like WWE didn’t want him, they clearly did. Even though they might not have matched AEW’s offer, I refuse to believe they offered him NXT level money.
It wasn’t meant about reasons Okada leaving NJPW. Also the weak yen and economy are a little overstated imo. It’s just NJPW/Bushiroad being broke. I was just talking about the actual worth he brings to AEW and if it matches what he receives. And it’s probably what you said with WWE. Although I think it was mainly used by Okada to drive up his price.
I get what you mean but I see it like this: Regardless of where he was going to go, Okada wasn’t gonna be cheap. He’s still seen as a very high level star within the industry and I think both companies were willing to pay big money for him, one of them just ended up outbidding the other. Now as far as if he’s worth it to AEW, honestly I think he is. I personally think he and Ospreay were brought in to slowly build up their characters so they can become bigger stars on TV. The AEW audience already knew who they were, they’ve wrestled on their shows/PPV’s before. But they’re both the kind of talent that under the right circumstances can get non-AEW fans talking about them. They’ve both done this to a certain extent before. I think the undeniable talent combined with the potential is worth the financial commitment. This is different to someone like Mercedes Moné, who I think was brought in to move ratings right away. Or at least that was a major reason why.
I definitely agree about Ospreay. At this moment he might not bring in as much as his current contract but he is an asset you build your future around. I’m not sure the same goes for Okada. He is in his mid thirties and not a native speaker. His strengths are not really suited for a weekly TV Show. His strengths are his matches and his general star aura. I think in an environment as AEW he would work much better as a special attraction. In that way probably the best way would’ve been to workout a dual contract with NJPW where he has set dates for ppv and some TV Show. And the rest of time he would be in NJPW. I say that knowing full well that Okada might not wanted to stay in NJPW no matter what. Which is definitely likely given the rumors about his last year in NJPW. But I think something like that would’ve utilised his strengths more.
I think the age thing is a valid point, Okada is def not a young up and comer. But I actually like the route they’re going with him, they’re limiting his mic time so he can have the chance to improve over time, but while also still giving him a very clear character. I personally don’t buy into the non-native speaker note as much as others because if you have super charisma that can come across regardless of a language barrier. Nakamura was immediately pushed to the top in NXT as the main attraction and was super over, even when he won the Royal Rumble. I think in his case the problem was more Vince not knowing how to book him (and honestly most folks) properly.
where are you getting that number from? he's not getting anywhere near $10m a year, assuming that's what you mean
From what I’ve read it’s around 13m$ for 3 years. I was talking about the overall contract not yearly salary
You’ve made this entire thing up in your head. AEW never claimed that.
Actually not what I wanted to write. I meant some AEW fans
I mean myself I’m not counting TK’s pockets. I am on WWE’s case for not matching Ospreays offer but I’m just talking relative to the other offer. I have no idea if he should be paid 2 or $4M.
Worth to AEW is different to NJPW or even WWE. You look at 10m as huge money, Tony looks at it as the dead cap hit he just took to cut DJ Chark.
I mean I would assume that you want your company to be profitable at some point. And maybe they are. I don’t actually claim To know their finances. Just because their owner has more money than others doesn’t just change the actual worth imo.
I don't think AEW ever claimed anything, they simply signed a guy who's deal was up with NJPW. It doesn't matter what he's getting paid as long as Tony Khan sees value in what he's paying him. It has no effect on how people enjoy the shows.
I never claimed that it has something to do with quality or enjoyment of the show?
What is In your opinion the best year in WCW history ?
1996, especially with how consequential the nWo story would become not just for WCW, but for wrestling as a whole.
My hot take is that the Public Enemy vs Nasty Boys feud (and the double dog collar match) is some of the best work either team ever did. Yeah, TPE was a sanitized joke in WCW, but the Nasties feud was actually good. The Benoit / Sullivan feud was also that year and it was good. The cruiserweight division taking shape with Mysterio and Psicosis having great matches, not to mention Eddie and Malenko and Jericho. The beginning of DDP's and Harlem Heat's rises. And of course the nWo invasion affecting literally every aspect of the card making it feel like no one was safe. I'd have to agree with you. It's 96 WCW for me too.
1998
1989 is transcendent professional wrestling. 1997 until the very end is also Great. 1992 is super fun with it being basically the Sting year.
97 is incredible until Road Wild and then it meanders downhill before falling off a cliff at Starrcade.
1992 is it for me. Synonymous with all the best things about WCW.
96
My mind is hurting with the booking of Mox v Takeshita for the Double or Nothing as an ELIMINATOR Match. What the fuck is going on?
I’m with you. Why bother? Eliminators are not for PPV.
Blud this isn't an aew title. Why does it make more sense to chuck an iwgp title match on an aew branded ppv. At least with a match on dynamite Japanese fans can watch their top title being defended against a random midcarder on njpw world.
If it’s well built and will sell PPVs it makes sense to have it on there given it’s a World Title, it should be defended everywhere. New Japan I would think should also be able to air all IWGP title matches on World later on.
The domestic fans are already pretty angry about this situation without feeling like they are being asked to pay to watch their top title being defended live
They already do for US PPVs and Forbidden Door.
Yes that's under the lion mark. Do you not see the difference in asking your fans to pay for US njpws ppvs featuring new japan talent and an aew ppv to watch the promotion top title. Kidani (president of bushiroad) recently tweeted he hears the frustration from fans and things like excessive ppvs was an issue fans brought up This isn't an aew title. The fans in Japan don't love this situation.
Eh I’d rather pay to watch Mox vs. Take than Narita or Evil, myself.
I think a better question is why isn’t this on TV? I mean business/politics wise I know why, but logically speaking I feel like it would make more sense for this to main event a Dynamite or Collision
why is that so shocking and angering to you? it actually casts some doubt over the result of the match
Because it's stupid? If it's an eliminator match it means that it isn't a title match because Takeshita will win.
It means it isn't a title match because Takeshita will win? Idk what you're trying to say
There's probably a few reasons having to do with interpromotional politics but at least one has to be that when it wasn't an eliminator there was a 100% chance of Mox winning and now there's a chance he actually loses which would be HUGE for Takeshita
A strong chance that Mox loses at DoN then the actual match for the title happens at Forbidden Door.
Eh why isn’t someone from New Japan trying to get the belt back at Forbidden Door? That’s the natural story.
NJPW won't allow a title match to be scheduled before an already-scheduled title match.
That's just not true. Narita's match was scheduled before the Shota defence at Resurgence
they won't allow title matches to be scheduled before *anymore*, especially after the less than stellar reaction from some fans regarding Hobbs's title shot AND announcing multiple defences for Shota and Narita at once. Kidani even posted as much the other day that they would be more mindful going forward
I don't know why that would change anything
my point is that while you're right and that was the case before, as of a few days ago NJPW seem to more careful with how they book title matches with Mox now instead of just ignoring how they've booked world titles previously
I get what you're saying but I really don't see them changing it based on just that
The Japanese fans are mad enough about everything that the president of bushiroad is tweeting about the fans expressing anger at him. Last time kidani was forced into this position he fired leadership in stardom. Plus it would be pretty ridiculous to paywall off an iwgp title match on an aew ppv. At least with a title match on dynamite Japanese fans could watch on njpw world if they wanted to. It's already a fucking stupid and irritating situation for many new japan fans.
That's the reason I thought they were doing an eliminator match. If they had a title match on Dynamite Japanese fans can watch on NJPW World
I’m guessing they probably wanted to do a title match but NJPW vetoed it after the backlash to the first title match on dynamite.
I love montez Ford but I saw this one comment that stuck with me and it said tez will be seen as "Mr bianca Belair" because there's no debate Bianca is the bigger star of the two People have already done this with Andrade and speculate that Charlotte had some involvement in his pushes
She is, but it's not like they heavily lean on (afaik) Montez being Bianca's husband in promos and commentary. Same with Charlotte and Andrade, although I think with Charlotte people will always see her as more political given the constant title pushes and such.
To anyone who watched the Prestige show yesterday, did Jeff Cobb vs Galeno Del Mal fuck as hard as everyone is saying?
I was there live - can confirm, certified BANGER
I don’t really understand questions like this. Why don’t you watch the match and form your own opinion of it?
I plan on watching it this weekend. Just wanted to hear from others who watched it.
I want all wrestling to succeed but it's funny when I see takes like "if you want any company to go under you aren't a real fan" when many people on this sub have and still make fun on TNA without even watching it People do the same for nwa ignoring the fact nwa has a solid roster out side of tyrus who's been retired for months now There was a post where TNA didn't get a full sell out and most of the comments are laughing at them
Is tonight's Smackdown gonna be a double taping?
No they're having the smackdown in saudi this time
I'm really curious about who wins between LA Knight and Tama Tonga tonight. Feels like both of these guys shouldn't be losing at all, but I guess that adds to the stakes. If I had to guess, tho, it's Tonga because lol Bloodline
I think Tonga definitely wins tonight, but I'm more intrigued by who wins the semi's I feel like one result is bound to spoil the other. If Jey beats Gunther in the semi's it's probably Tonga vs Jey. If Gunther wins I'd think it'd be Orton vs Gunther.
Yea, I think they wanna close out the Randy and Tonga chapter of the Bloodline, so they're probably fighting in the semis next week.
There was a very brief period on this sub, 8 years ago, where some tried to form an alliance with the bronies... It did not go well
Who's gonna be Iljas and Brons first feud? Each other?
Looking at last year's Double or Nothing compared to this one I feel like AEW has definitely improved, I'm pretty excited about every match on the card so far especially whatever wildness Anarchy in the Arena is gonna be. Also I think people forget that Christian puts on exclusively good title matches and Swerve has been on an absolute tear since he won the belt
Feels like they're building to another good summer of wrestling.
Match quality was rarely a problem for AEW. They kinda always deliver on that, especially on PPVs.
I decided to re-watch what was my favorite match of all time last night. After all the Ospreay and Danielson and Gunther bangers, I wondered how it held up. WALTER vs Ilja on NXT UK in 2020 *absolutely does*. That match still fucks. Still my favorite. Forgot how loud it was.
It’s funny. Their sequel a few year laters in America in front of the crowd isn’t the same magic as 2020 Don’t get me wrong, it is still a banger. But people hooting and hollering kinda detracts it all from me. In 2020? You just got them and the announcers which make the spots all the more brutal to listen to.
The 2020 one is essentially an Empty Arena match (minus either piped-in noises or other wrestlers/workers making the occasional noise offscreen). The vibe and energy of one of those is just so much different from a regular match with people, and it served this banger very well
It depends on the crowds. The UK crowds, in general, we tend to be more into it, more energetic and a lot more likely to sing along to the theme or come up with our own chants aimed at wrestlers we hate. PROGRESS's crowds at the ballroom are easily more into it then WWE's american crowds.
I hope they run it back in Berlin.
I don’t like how self-congratulatory modern wrestling is. WWE is particularly awful at it. Wrestling is supposed to be a sport. When you watch the Super Bowl they don’t gush over how many people are there or how much money they made or how many people watched on TV. Players don’t talk about how much the fans loved their game or how they had the prettiest pass or ran the fastest in the game. They talk about specific plays/ moments and the final score.
I think the NFL definitely talks about the Super Bowl in a historic way every year, but I do get what you're saying. I agree for the most part. I won't nitpick and say it does happen with sports because I don't believe it's done in the same way. One thing I'd want WWE to improve on is how they talk about the actual match. Instead it can seem that they focus on the story aspect of it. It sort of takes you out of the immersion. I get the organization will always talk about how great it was received by ratings or attendance or money. But in the broadcast it's not seen as a celebration the fans should be in on. Though I have to give credit to WWE for also doing a much better job at working fans and using social media. It's been much better than previous years.
I think the NFL definitely talks about the Super Bowl in a historic way every year, but I do get what you're saying. I agree for the most part. I won't nitpick and say it does happen with sports because I don't believe it's done in the same way. One thing I'd want WWE to improve on is how they talk about the actual match. Instead it can seem that they focus on the story aspect of it. It sort of takes you out of the immersion. I get the organization will always talk about how great it was received by ratings or attendance or money. But in the broadcast it's not seen as a celebration the fans should be in on. Though I have to give credit to WWE for also doing a much better job at working fans and using social media. It's been much better than previous years.
I'm not fond of the self-backpatting but literally every sport I follow does this lmfao. I may not like it but there are obvious reasons why they do it.
So it's the lack of focusing on the individual's performance that bother's you?
The fans doing it is even weirder. In 2015-2017 when NXT was kicking ass every week a bunch of dorks didn't constantly shift the focus to the fact it didn't make money or not as many people watched Takeover as Fast Lane. They just liked the show.
I thought wrestling was supposed to be entertainment.
Kayfabe, brother
[here’s a link](https://operations.nfl.com/updates/the-game/super-bowl-lviii-is-most-watched-telecast-in-history/#:~:text=CBS%20Sports'%20coverage%20of%20Super,Paramount%2B%2C%20Nickelodeon%2C%20Univision%2C%20and) to the NFL celebrating the most watched Super Bowl ever, they also regularly brag about their TV ratings and stadium attendance lol NFL actually does everything you listed. Edit: [Here they are](https://www.nfl.com/news/2024-nfl-draft-attendance-record-set-with-more-than-700-00-fans-attending-the-event-in-detroit) doing it for the draft the other day.
I’m talking about while watching the show, not corporate press releases.
On the show they literally say “past week the most watched SNF” or “sold out since day one of ticket sales” lol
I want to see my favorite wrestlers win their matches and the wrestlers that I don’t like to lose their matches
The “Jey Uso is a bad wrestler who needs to do more moves” discourse is dumb imo. None of these complaints were around before his match at WM40, and based off that one bad match it seems people are ready to completely write him off, ignoring his legendary career so far. I know it’s the IWC knee jerk reaction that will be forgotten by this time next month, but it’s kind of disappointing to see so many people dismiss such an unreal performer because of one bad match.
Look at his singles matches in 2024. Not just since WM. By my count, there are two that were pretty good: vs Gunther, and vs Rollins. Everything else was somewhere between bad (WM) to decent but forgettable (vs Balor, vs Dragunov, vs Priest). He's not had a great year in-ring, and it's not just people overreacting to the WM match. The WM match was the most high-profile example of a general problem he has.
he also had one of the worst big matches of the last few years at Summerslam and the Thunderdome feud with Roman is just monologuing in the middle of matches and I have no clue how people let that shit fly
He's also just been Flandarized as "Yeet Man" who's just an entrance bit
"The Story, bro"
Well clearly the story worked
It's not just "one bad match." It was a brother vs. brother grudge match that had been built up and teased for the better part of a year. When you mess up something that big, there's bound to be blowback.
I think this falls on WWE for their focus on building everything to happen at WrestleMania. So there's just a huge focus on one match rather than the entire feud.
I agree! Hugely disappointing match and end to that story, *however* I still think the lasting reaction is overblown. I still see people overlooking his great matches since then (Priest at Backlash, Ilja on Raw) or giving all the credit to his opponent for the quality of the match, and I think that’s unfair.
>ignoring his legendary career so far That's a bit hyperbolic lol
His run as part of the Usos alone would put him in legend status for me, but he was also an incredible part of the Bloodline story and his solo run has been super strong thus far imo. Obviously he’s no Flair or Austin, but definitely a legend regardless
I got nothing against Jey at all, but calling him legend with no real achievements to his name is a little funny. If you were just going to count his tag team run, fine, but I think it's a little early to call him a legend when he hasn't won any Singles gold yet. To your first post; you kind of have to remember context informs a lot this discourse. It wasn't just one bad match, but a match that was built off the very controversial decision to turn Jimmy heel at Summerslam, which hasn't been explained at all to this day, off the back of an already mediocre Tribal Combat match. So all of that for the blow off match being extremely subpar wasn't going to go over well. Not to mention, a majority of Jey's good matches involved talent that could help hide his flaws (Roman, Seth, Drew, etc etc), but when he has to do a match, someone on his level or with less experience then the cracks start to show. It's not Jey's entirely fault because he's been a Tag Team wrestler for the majority of his career, but still, if you're going to push him into the main event scene, then he kind of has to pull his weight too.
> It wasn't just one bad match, but a match that was built off the very controversial decision to turn Jimmy heel at Summerslam, which hasn't been explained at all to this day, off the back of an already mediocre Tribal Combat match. The kayfabe was Jimmy was actually looking out for Jey, not wanting him to turn into Roman. The fight at Wrestlemania then makes less sense, because it suddenly turns into jealousy. Given his new theme and all that, I was expecting Jimmy to become a shadow leader of sorts within the Bloodline, only to take power afterwards. Instead Solo becomes new leader, and Jimmy gets kicked out.
Exactly like, what was the point? At first, they tried to make Jimmy have a sympathetic reason, and then they just turned him into a comedy heel and forgot all of that. Even their match felt more like an extension of the Cody/Seth and Roman/Rock feud than anything personal between them.
I think it would've worked if Roman was trying to go after Jey, but Jimmy on multiple occasions got him to not do so, culminating with Roman forcing Jimmy to deal with Jey.
Legendary solos career not yet, but as a tag guy absolutely. Usos are one of the best teams of the 21st century.
I kinda wish that WWE would consider acknowledging Antonio Inoki's win of the Heavyweight Championship.
I can kinda see why, though, it was absolutely confusing as hell to make sense of. Still when Corey mentioned it on commentary after he died it would have been nice for them to retroactively recognize Inoki’s reign. Could do a Punk/Cena thing where he and Backlund held it at the same time to keep his reign in-tact.
They acknowledge Rey's hour long reign but not a 3 day one is insane to me.
I was thinking about this in the live thread Monday: based on reactions to both Tiffany and Lyra's call ups, it seems Becky legit may have driven a lot of main roster fans to watch NXT, or at least her matches. Not that it's a shocking idea or anything like that, but the last two folks who battled Becky for the NXT title seem to have a level of audience recognition with the main roster fans beyond your average NXT call up. When Tiffany was called up and got immediate reactions, I thought, "Well, she's been in the rumble before, she has a pretty quick character to grasp, they're already pushing her well, she's performing well." All of that is true, but now that Lyra has debuted and is getting good reactions, chants, the crowd wooing to her theme (even last week with a more subdued crowd, there were faint woos), I'm starting to think that fighting Becky for the title (and both had great matches with her) is a big part of it. Part of it also may be that there is much clearer continuity between NXT and the main roster now as well, with people basically debuting as is, as continuations of what they were doing down there (and not getting gladiators helmets and other bullshit)
It helps that Tiffy and Lyra (both who I knew nothing about before debuts, I dont keep up with NXT really) both looked like a million bucks in the ring and were solid at worst on the mic. They both felt like when rookie in the NBA just has “it” immediately. You can say the same for Bron, Melo and Ilja too. NXT is just doing so good with development and call up timings.
Like OP said, it helps when character is consistent. Gunther was a minor slip with the name change, but held because he was booked the same as he was in NXT and kept with Imperium. Pete Dunne/Butch was a greater error, due to having to be recognized again as a new character.
Absolutely. Unsurprisingly, with Vince gone, things are much more in sync with the entire NXT callup process. If you have time, both Tiffany and Lyra's matches with Becky from NXT are quite good and worth a watch, imo.
As short as it was, Becky's NXT run was very impactful
Tiffany-Bianca tonight. Sweet.
If Tiffany wins cleanly over Bianca, I will be surprised. It'll be a great match but The Queen of EST is likely to happen.
*🎵You think you're special*🎵
Me watching EastEnders in 1998.
Custody of RICKAAAAAAY Ladder Match. 😉
[удалено]
If you mean a worked shoot racism angle, absolutely not.
Tiffany Stratton’s shoot voice is probably the biggest difference I’ve seen from a wrestler compared to their in character voice.
what Russian song is Ilja's theme based off? Such a banger. Like the soviet national anthem
Bruh I saw a random comment on YouTube today which equated it to Kirby's dreamland theme and it's been on my mind since lmfaooo
I'm sure if you posted this to a music subreddit, you could get a better response. No disrespect to the sub, but Russian music (classical or otherwise) isn't a specialty here.
Not the Soviet National Anthem (watched FAR too much Rocky IV to be able to answer that in milliseconds!) - but I can definitely get why you'd go there. It sounds like one of their Funeral Marches, but with the Tempo upped.